Topic: Worried about Nintendo's games future...

[Torchwick1234]

Hello everyone. I need to talk about something that isn't brought up often, and given the circumnstances and my multiple personal experiences, I need to talk about it more than ever.

This is the thing: I feel Nintendo games are becoming more and more unfairly hated lately, and that the people who love them are seen as targets of fans of other companies on the web, especially Sony's ones. And I'm saying this after a lot of experiences of being attacked by hundreds of people on forums for the mere reason of expressing genuine appreciation over Nintendo games.

This really sucks, I cannot express appreciation over the games I love the most without being seen as scum, and most importantly, the reason of why this is happening sucks even more: to cut it short, the reason of why Nintendo games are becoming so hated and reviled by people, is not because of their quality (which remained really high for the whole Switch's lifecycle (aside some exceptions like most of the Pokemon games and the Mario sports games), but because of hate and false informations spredt by the fans of the competition. This really sucks and is ruining completely Nintendo's games reputation. This is growing exponentially, and I fear that if this keeps growing it will eventually make Nintendo and his games dying and vanish from the scenes. Nintendo's games are being destroyed by a mass of lies said by a mass of dirty fanboys of the competition, and there's NOTHING That can be don about to stop it...

Considering that all of this comes from personal experiences, I'm surprised nobody has talked about it at all in this place. Am I the only who sees this?

[Evan_B]

Brand loyalty to the point of making your fandom an essential part of you identity and warring against other groups is an immature perspective. The people participating in such behavior are morons.

Find a community that allows you to participate in measured discourse. If Nintendo were so reviled/subject to disinformation, the Switch wouldn’t have multiple million+ pieces of software. The picture you’re painting sounds like an insular and out-of-touch community. Don’t worry about it.

If you start to find yourself disliking the Nintendo products you consume, try to quantify that feeling and find a good discourse-centered to community to share your thoughts. Otherwise, just play and enjoy the games.

[Khushrenada]

Not sure if real or AI using the same talking points. Only instance of duplication I can find on the internet and even then it is written differently to suggest a person did just type up their thoughts again.

Let's say this is a real question or worry. First, this is something going on 20 years or more with MS, Sony, Sega, maybe PC gamers putting down the current state of Nintendo to promote their side/console as superior. Nintendo's been too kiddy, too casual and too behind in hardware power to name some of the various labels other fanboys have used to try and put down Nintendo and fans of their work. None of that has had any major effect on Nintendo or its business. They're still here and they've out out some of the most successful hardware and games in the past 20 years.

Second, Evan_B(rilliant) just pointed out, there's absolutely no evidence this is having any effect on Nintendo's business. Tears of the Kingdom has done incredible sales. I believe it is over 32 million copies sold. I think it may have outsold Breath of the Wild already or is close to it but its been awhile since I can recall some news on the sales figures. Pikmin 4 launched and is the best selling entry in the Pikmin franchise. If people were being influenced to hate Nintendo games then not enough people were getting that message. I fully expect Super Mario Bros Wonder will also do huge sales and business over the next couple months. Switch has a shot at surpassing PS2 for best selling hardware of all-time. If all the negativity from other fanboys was having an effect (especially with 20 years of negativity being thrown at them) then they should never have been able to accomplish this. They should have been slowly trickling down to a smaller and smaller market share.

Third, a lot of internet communities can be echo chambers, for good and bad. Sometimes, a minority voice can seem like a majority if that's the only community you engage in. It may be you just need to broaden out where you are talking to people on games. Also, it is extremely rare for people posting on message boards, chat rooms and a lot of other social media to actually have much of a real world effect on things. Is there something that you can actually see or point to that this "mass of lies" has caused any real world effect on people questioning the quality of Nintendo's games? Again, going back to Tears of the Kingdom, for a few months the posts I was seeing all over social media was from a lot of other game developers expressing amazement at what Nintendo was able to design and code for the game. It seems to me that the actual people in the industry making games recognize Nintendo is still a top-tier developer in the space. Heck, there was that recent leaked e-mail of how Phil Spencer at Microsoft wished upon a star of one day acquiring Nintendo as a way to conquer the videogames market. They likely wouldn't be bothering to think that if the perception is that Nintendo's software sucks. (And then you might see MS fanboys suddenly switch their mind to Nintendo games being awesome if they are part of this propaganda you are seeing which show just how meaningless it all is.)

You posted that you had "a lot of experiences of being attacked by hundreds of people on forums for the mere reason of expressing genuine appreciation over Nintendo games" and I guess at this point I'd like to see some actual examples of this to see what it is you are seeing because it is just not my experience. But again, the stuff I usually visit and post on is pretty much primarily Nintendo related so I'm in an echo chamber of my own. Which is fine by me since I usually don't have much interest or follow the competition too closely to be able to accurately talk about them anyways.

[Khushrenada]

On the other hand, the hate and reviling I'll see against Nintendo these days isn't about their games or quality of those games. It's about Nintendo protecting their copyright which has caused the more recent accusations that "Nintendo hates their fans" and that they're really greedy. Yeah, it's terrible that Nintendo spent all that money to develop, test, and ship those games and now they won't let you piggyback off that time, effort and expense by being able to freely copy those assets for your own game. It's this time of dumb attack that I find way more annoying and a twisting of facts or repeated with no understanding of the situation.

[Evan_B]

Torchwick1234 and the Nintendo haters have been real quiet since you blew through this thread, Khush…

Also, it seems they edited the post, which is weird for AI standards? I don’t know.

[Khushrenada]

Also, it seems they edited the post, which is weird for AI standards? I don’t know.

That's why I gave the thread a real answer. There's a few reasons to see this as a legit post.

Torchwick1234 and the Nintendo haters have been real quiet since you blew through this thread, Khush…

Aw nuts. I was really hoping to go to some other forums to beat up the people picking on Torchwick1234's Nintendo enjoyment and dunk on some fanboys. Where do these people keep going to hide when I come online?! 

[Torchwick1234]

Guys... I'm serious. I HAVE been attacked by several users on the web only for expressing appreciation over Nintendo games. I cannot provide any evidence because it's mostly italian places (I'm italian) or Twitter and Reddit. If you look up on the latters, you can find many people like that anyway. But really: those places ARE dreadful...

[Evan_B]

If that’s the case, then maybe it’s not the general zeitgeist, but rather, the sorts of people who frequent those sites that are the problem?

I had to delete my Twitter because I felt infectious cynicism and anger bleeding into the way I generally conversed about things I love. I’ve reduced my Reddit posting in order to avoid similar feelings, and also because people abuse the karma system on Reddit based on the strength of their bias and not the structure of a sentiment.

But here, on NintendoWorldReport, you can write tens of thousands of words on someone’s perspective of Zelda or Xenoblade without fear of judgment! It’s a lovely place.

[Torchwick1234]

If that’s the case, then maybe it’s not the general zeitgeist, but rather, the sorts of people who frequent those sites that are the problem?

I had to delete my Twitter because I felt infectious cynicism and anger bleeding into the way I generally conversed about things I love. I’ve reduced my Reddit posting in order to avoid similar feelings, and also because people abuse the karma system on Reddit based on the strength of their bias and not the structure of a sentiment.

But here, on NintendoWorldReport, you can write tens of thousands of words on someone’s perspective of Zelda or Xenoblade without fear of judgment! It’s a lovely place.

*sigh* Yes, I know that, infact I DID take the distances from them for now (althought, I will have to use Twitter one last time in December to do one last small thing I can do only with it regarding Christmas, but we're still far now, so I can stay away from it until then), but even so, I just can't get this out of my head anyway. I mean the thought of so many games I have to heart are being destroyed by deliberate hate and lies said by a mass of morons who do this for the sake of keeping other games at the top, and that there's nothing I can do to stop it. It's just unforgivable. I don't even know if I can just accept this happening and move one on my path, the fact that is happening is something I just can't ignore...

[Evan_B]

You can only control your own thoughts, and that’s only if you have the ability to mindfully reflect on them. Getting upset with how other people act is going to stress you out. It stresses me out. But there’s only so much control you have in your life, and if others aren’t willing to meaningfully engage with you and evaluate their own biases and the information that forms them, you can’t come to some sort of compromise or understanding.

[Torchwick1234]

You can only control your own thoughts, and that’s only if you have the ability to mindfully reflect on them. Getting upset with how other people act is going to stress you out. It stresses me out. But there’s only so much control you have in your life, and if others aren’t willing to meaningfully engage with you and evaluate their own biases and the information that forms them, you can’t come to some sort of compromise or understanding.

I guess that's all I needed to hear for now. I have no idea how hard it will be and how long it will take, but for now that's all I can do. Thanks for telling me this.

[Khushrenada]

I mean the thought of so many games I have to heart are being destroyed by deliberate hate and lies said by a mass of morons who do this for the sake of keeping other games at the top, and that there's nothing I can do to stop it. It's just unforgivable. I don't even know if I can just accept this happening and move one on my path, the fact that is happening is something I just can't ignore...

I think what I have a hard time understanding is what you mean by games getting destroyed. Like if some people want to trash a game in their opinions or out of ignorance then whatever. Everyone has their opinion on things whether right or wrong. But just because people might be dismissive or purposefully trolling of stuff, they can't actually destroy something by their words. Like you can still play these games you like and still enjoy them just like any other person could read their stuff and then play these same games and realize that they like them and they disagree with what those other people were saying. It's not like they can make these games disappear or can actually affect the code of the games to make them run worse or degrade their quality. So, what are they destroying?

If it is just your happiness or enjoyment then I'm sorry they are doing that to you but I'd also say that this shows something that you may need to work on in life which is to not let yourself get overly influenced or affected by other people. It's not easy and everyone will be affected by others in life but, forget just the aspect of Nintendo stuff, this will help you be happier in life in many other areas when you can learn to let things go especially when it comes to people saying negative things to you. You say there is nothing you can do to stop it but I don't understand why you feel you have to stop it or be the one to do so. You also say that you can't ignore it but I highly recommend that because when you stop engaging with it then it might make a difference in how you feel.

[Khushrenada]

I'll also mention a couple tidbits that I can think of which may be of relevance. Way back in the days of the GameCube, PS2 and XBox, you may know that the GameCube ended up being one of Nintendo's lowest selling consoles. Because of this, not a lot of people owned a GameCube during its lifespan so often when talking with people in school or others my age, it often seem like I was the only one to have and like it. People then were quite dismissive of the system and its games. I remember when meeting someone for the first time, the conversation had turned to games and he had a PS2 and I mentioned having a GameCube. He kind of snorted at that because as far as he was concerned, the system had very few games worth getting it for. I may have had around 7 games I owned for it at the time as I was still just beginning to get more of my own spendable money from working. He said he could probably guess three of the titles I owned and I let him have at it. He listed Super Smash Bros. Melee, Metroid Prime and The Wind Waker. Hilariously, I owned none of those as I wasn't into those series at the time and hadn't ever played any of the games in those series.

Yet, that was the perception of the GameCube then. It was just seen as this odd system with only a couple good games whereas PS2 had the vast library and DVD capabilities and XBox had Halo and online gaming matches for people to play together with. Many gamers just didn't embrace it and Nintendo games were called kiddie and Nintendo was seen as the next Sega and probably would soon be out of hardware and a secondary player in the games market. Personally, I didn't want that to happen because Nintendo games were the software that I was most drawn to and had played and continued to play at this point and didn't want that to end but there was nothing I could do to change that perception no matter how much I may have told others about games and experiences I liked with the system.

Oddly, the GameCube is now looked back on more fondly by many gamers. A few years ago, when talking with a relative about some Nintendo history and mentioning how the GameCube had been the worst console until the Wii U (leaving out Virtual Boy), he was shocked. He thought the GameCube was one of the best systems ever because of a lot of games he had played on. He played those games later on during the end of the Wii era but a lot of them still held up at that time. Even now, I'm still getting together with friends and we are playing the Mario Party games for that system. It continues to have relevance in my life. And Nintendo didn't fade away either. They came back strong with both the Wii and DS kicking butt at the same time. Despite not being able to change people's interest in the GameCube at the time, it really had little bearing on the future. In the end, I was happy with what I was playing and I just kept enjoying it for myself. I was glad to later join and be a part of this community in which I found many other people who did like the GameCube when that was the topic of this place and get many recommendations for other games to try out and grow in my gamer knowledge and find more new experiences I might not have on my own.

(As for that person who tried to guess what GameCube games I owned, we did still become friends. It probably helped that he wasn't trying to trash my taste in games and it was real life so people are usually a bit more respectful when face to face compared to online discourse. In fact, he's one of the people that will play some of those GameCube Mario Party games. Today, he's got a Switch and we'll play some games together on that even though he's still a bit more of a Sony fan. Might not be your experience if this is from random people on Twitter but just wanted to add this extra detail and to show that some people lose their bias over time.)

[Khushrenada]

One more thing.

Sometimes you just have to let people figure things out on their own as well. When I was a teen and young adult, I was dismissive of animated kid's movies. Stuff like The Lion King or Tarzan with breaking out into songs just seemed like kids stuff and I thought it was a lazy way to make movies. However, in my early 20s, I found myself really enjoying a lot of classic movies from the 40s and 50s and became interested in seeing stuff like Best Picture Winners and other films that were highly praised. This also meant a lot of musicals were listed among these works to check out. I had my doubts about those films but watched some expecting to find them sort of silly only to realize that I actually really like them. They've become some of my all-time favorites and I'll watch them again and again. It's sort of disappointing at how hard it seems to be for studios to make a really good musical these days.

Likewise, I remember seeing the trailer for Finding Nemo at the time it was coming to theatres and, for the first time in years, I actually wanted to see a kid's animated movie. This was doubly surprising because I also really don't like fish. But I did go and see it in the theatre when it came out and thought it was great. This caused me to re-evaluate the bias I had developed and self-imposed on myself about that type of movie. A few years before that, a relative had offered to take me to the theatre to see Toy Story 2 but I dismissed it because of it being a kid's movie. After Finding Nemo and The Incredibles, I went back to see some of the Pixar movies I didn't see and found it was a good movie. If I had taken up that offer, maybe I would have lost that self-developed bias sooner. Yet, even if they had told me it was good or they liked it, that probably wouldn't have caused me to go. I had to finally make myself be more open to that experience and work out that bias.

It may be the same with these other people you are trying to fight against to defend Nintendo games or change their mind. What you say will likely have little effect. Unless they decide to re-evaluate their stance or be more open-minded as they age and hopefully get wiser, it's highly likely you'll be ineffective now in your efforts to provide counter-arguments. In their mind, they're right and it is you that needs to change your mind whereas you see yourself in the right and they need to change their mind and thus neither side will like change because both think they are in the right no matter what the other says. Therefore, the best advice we can give you and that you seem to be getting is to just walk away from it and ignore it. There's so many better ways to spend your time than an online argument or dwelling on online hate. Please try and find other things find your mind to focus on and to spend your time with. You'll likely be happier by doing so.

[Torchwick1234]

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Heh. The thing is, many people will be blinded by the false words spredt by the haters, that they won't even bother of "figuring things out on their own". I'm not really counting on the fact that many people will realize that they've been lied...

Anyway, at this point, I'm kinda thinking of quitting gaming for good, after the end of Switch's lifecycle anyway. I just don't have intention of enduring this mess for another decade, especially since things are not going well for gaming in general, even thought Nintendo seems to be the company with the least dreadful situation right now (don't know if you read the news, but there have been multiple messes in terms of gaming lately between actors and voice actors strikes, development costs becoming higher and unsustainable, and layoffs in many software houses. Nintendo seems the be the only one that hasn't been affected by these... yet). And even so, I don't know if that would solve the problem, after all, even after taking the distances from socials, I still have trouble in forgetting what I've been throught. Seriously: the haters I dealt with in the last year were that many and really overwhelming...

All I can do for now is taking Evan_B's advice and trying to "take control of my own mind" in order to not think about it anymore, but I don't know how long it will take. And I don't know if I'll be willing to keep going with gaming as whole after that...

[Evan_B]

You can still enjoy gaming in a bubble, or even look for people who share the same interests and perspectives on games discourse as you. Greg Leahy of this site’s podcast Radio Free Nintendo doesn’t engage in social media, and hearing his perspectives on gaming news and games is very refreshing.

Find the community you want, or, if you’re really willing, make it yourself. Also, this site’s Discord is much more lively.

[Torchwick1234]

You can still enjoy gaming in a bubble, or even look for people who share the same interests and perspectives on games discourse as you. Greg Leahy of this site’s podcast Radio Free Nintendo doesn’t engage in social media, and hearing his perspectives on gaming news and games is very refreshing.

Find the community you want, or, if you’re really willing, make it yourself. Also, this site’s Discord is much more lively.

You make it looking like if it was easy... every single community I've been in was dreadful against Nintendo, so trying again could cause me only further trouble... also I no longer have Discord, so I can't join this site's server.

At this point, I feel quitting gaming for good at the right is the only option... of course that wouldn't mean I will not play ever again. I'm still going to revisit the games I loved throught the years anyway, no risk in doing that. But I will no longer buy any new game after Switch ends its lifecycle, and I will not buy its successors. Like I said, I'm not going to go throught this for another decade, so stopping at the right time is the only option. I just hope to not bump into many more Sony fanboys until then. I'm not going to give up on the remaining Switch games, but an entire more year like this IS going to be painful, even if I try to be careful (besides, like I said, I still have to return to Twitter one last time in December, to do a thing technically unrelated to gaming, but staying on Twitter could potentially bring me into other morons...)...

I will add only this: I find incredibly shameful that the Switch and its first party library, the best one you could ever find on a console since the PS2, is being ruined by a ton of hate and lies spredt by a mass of morons. I wonder how low the entire world will fall when those people will grow... if they aren't already grown up (yes because some of the people I had to deal with were 30s...)

[Evan_B]

I mean, I was close to not-gaming at the end of the Wii U’s lifespan, but that was because I was in grad school and had some personal tragedies occur in my life that are still present today. Then my friends chipped in and got me a Switch and I was suckered into another six years of gaming. Confound it!

If gaming really does feel like it is having a negative influence in your life, you have every right to cut it out. I have an addictive personality, so I found going cold turkey on anything difficult. However, if it comes down to being unable to play games because you literally don’t have a console to play them on, I guess it’s easier. In any case, gaming discourse is generally immature because it comes from a highly commercialized time period, and brands and brand loyalty were what many consumers were literally raised upon. Part of your perspective might also come from a bias, but it’s the ability to step back from emotional response and evaluate your feelings that can help you stay sane or result in concrete, final acts. Are the people who create this toxic culture worth engaging? Are their perspectives validated by critical or commercial reception? If you find the answer to be “yes,” then your position is understandable and your choices are valid. But sometimes it’s just as effective and important to put your own reactions into perspective.

In any case, I can’t change your mind. You have to be convinced of the possibility that this sort of behavior is absurd, and that there are alternatives, if you want to continue enjoying gaming. That it is ruining your enjoyment at all feels kind of antithetical to the purpose of the medium: challenging, but satisfying escape.

[Khushrenada]

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*Gasp* Cut my words out! Those were important words! 

I'm still going to revisit the games I loved through out the years anyway, no risk in doing that. ... I'm not going to give up on the remaining Switch games, but an entire more year like this IS going to be painful,

On a different note, I'd like to know what games you do like. What have you have been playing that you really enjoy and would try to talk about? Do you have a list of favorite Switch games, for instance? Rather than just hearing about the negative effect fanboys are having on you, it would be nice to at least hear about what it is that you have wanted to share and feel you haven't been able to up to this point when it comes to your actual gaming experiences.

[Torchwick1234]

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*Gasp* Cut my words out! Those were important words! 

I'm still going to revisit the games I loved through out the years anyway, no risk in doing that. ... I'm not going to give up on the remaining Switch games, but an entire more year like this IS going to be painful,

On a different note, I'd like to know what games you do like. What have you have been playing that you really enjoy and would try to talk about? Do you have a list of favorite Switch games, for instance? Rather than just hearing about the negative effect fanboys are having on you, it would be nice to at least hear about what it is that you have wanted to share and feel you haven't been able to up to this point when it comes to your actual gaming experiences.

I'm probably going to be crucified for this, but Xenoblade Chronicles 2 is my 1° favorite game on the console, not to mention my second favorite game of all time (after Kid Icarus Uprising on 3ds). I just love so many things about this game, especially the characters. Such a shame that it's hated so much. But I still played A LOT of games on the Switch, and I cannot list them all. Other personal favorites include Super Mario Odyssey, Zelda Breath of the Wild and Tears of the Kingdom, Super Smash Bros Ultimate, Mario Kart 8 Deluxe, Mario + Rabbids (both the games), Xenoblade Chronicles 3, Pikmin 4, Luigi's Mansion 3, Kirby and the Forgotten Land, Pokemon Legends Arceus, Fire Emblem Engage, Metroid Dread... Like I said, a lot. I have bought about 40 games on the console and greatly enjoyed them all (I just have some grudge for Bayonetta 3. A game with which I had such a blast with, but had an ending so atrocious that I can't tell anymore if I like the game as whole... no really, the ending was so awful for me that alone ruined my experience with the game). As I said, I consider Switch the best console in terms of first party exclusives since the second Playstation, and seeing that it and its games are getting a lot of hate because of a ton of lies said by online morons... just makes me really discouraged.

I can't tell it for certain yet, but at 90% I'm going to quit gaming after Switch ends its lifecycle next year. I have no intention of buying its successors and standing this hate for another decade. If to avoid and forget about all this mess I have to sacrifice future games, then I'll do what I have to do.

[Khushrenada]

Ah, I see. Yeah, XC2 can be a controversial choice although much of the criticism is usually leveled at the character design. One woman I know who highly recommended the first game to me back when it came out in 2012 (and really likes the series) said that she didn't think she'd care that much about it but she did end up feeling ticked off about some of the... artistic choices... that were made. Likewise, there is a lady who posts on the NWR Discord who is also a big fan of the series and she also finds XC2 a low point of the series for various reasons.

Personally, I can't comment on it as I have yet to play it but I do want to get to it particularly because it seems to have such mixed reaction and I want to see what I think of it. I did like its hook of having multiple living creatures that you explore over to differentiate from XC1's static two giant humanoids.

Evan_B(est in show) has written a very extensive review on the various Xenoblade games here on this forum. Perhaps you'll want to check it out by clicking here if you want some deeper thoughts on that game and the series by someone else who has played and really likes that series of games.

Likewise, there are a bunch of games that you've listed that I've played and enjoyed. Odyssey, MK8, Breath of the Wild, Metroid Dread, Kirby and the Forgotten Land. We've had some various threads and discussions on those titles also in the past. Breath of the Wild was probably the most robust. That was a fun time for many people because there was so much of that game we just didn't know about so we were all experiencing the world in different ways and finding new things and sharing that with each other in the thread at the time. I was wondering if TotK might cause that experience again but it doesn't seem to have. Probably because even though there's a lot of new things to see and changes to locations in BotW, it still has many of the same principles and make up to feel like everything is a fresh new discovery.

I'll also note that even though I've played a lot of these same games, I haven't often made much comment on them or discussed them that much. Part of that is because sometimes it just feels redundant or silly to just say "I liked this game" or start listing some of the events I liked even though anyone else playing the game would have probably also encountered those same events so why do they need me to list them again? I supposed it is the "Why" of it all that holds me back. If I'm going to post something, how much should I dig into and explain the why of what I liked or what I may not have liked? Why is a comment from me on a game necessary? As such, I don't often do much actual posting on my experience of playing on a game.

Yet, that doesn't hold me back from still playing Switch games. That's part of why I've mentioned that ignoring the hate and not engaging in comments with online morons may be help for you. I still enjoy my time playing this stuff even if I may not try to tell people about it.

That said, if you want to comment more on any of those titles you listed or something else then feel free to do so here. You may find others here who played those same games and liked them and perhaps they'll add their thoughts on what appealed to them about those games.

[Torchwick1234]

Regardless, I don't feel I should continue if that means putting my love for these games at risk. I will probably stop looking at gaming news as soon the next Nintendo console is announced. I'm still getting the remaining games  for the Switch, and watch the next Direct in February, but once the console is announced I'm quitting. I just hope yo not lose it until that day...

Also thank you a lot for making me feeling even more lonely in loving XBC2 by telling me that there are other people who hate it around here. Like if I hadn't heard enough hate for it already... no offence.

[M.K.Ultra]

my second favorite game of all time (after Kid Icarus Uprising on 3ds).

I really enjoyed Kid Icarus Uprising. That was one of the games that sold me on the 3ds. There were rumors of an HD version but I don't think we will see that. I have been meaning to replay it but I am in an inexorable playthrough of Etrian Odyssey IV.

[Evan_B]

Also thank you a lot for making me feeling even more lonely in loving XBC2 by telling me that there are other people who hate it around here. Like if I hadn't heard enough hate for it already... no offence.

I am trying to be sympathetic towards you, and while I’ve had my fair share of piteous outbursts on social media sites, this comment irritates me a bit. If you love Xenoblade 2 and are aware of the reasons people dislike it, you’ve likely asked yourself whether or not they were an issue to you, personally, and concluded that it doesn’t matter. Xenoblade 2 received a sequel, and Monolith Soft will undoubtedly make more games. Fan response to Xenoblade 2 doesn’t make it as a game any better or worse. Khush letting you know of other perspectives that he’s heard (including my own, which, for what it’s worth, is based on 400 hours play. It’s definitely the least of the Xenoblade titles) isn’t a personal attack on your beliefs, character, or your enjoyment of the game.

This honestly makes me feel that, judging by your post and your reactions to our replies, you have made video games an essential part of your identity. Your preference for certain types of games has led you to rub up against some of the more unsavory members of game discourse, and the way that they react to your tastes has been interpreted as some sort of attack on your identity. That you lament the perceived success of Nintendo and its products as something that puts your own mental health at risk is further evidence of this.

If this truly is how you feel, then I will say as kindly and gently as possible: if you are thinking of quitting gaming, I encourage you do so. Get some perspective on the ways of the world and the sheer stupidity of online discourse, get some other hobbies, and spend time with people you love. Agonizing over the state of video games is not healthy.

[Torchwick1234]

Also thank you a lot for making me feeling even more lonely in loving XBC2 by telling me that there are other people who hate it around here. Like if I hadn't heard enough hate for it already... no offence.

Fine. Then it's settled: I will quit gaming as whole, as soon Switch ends its lifecycle next year. However I'm not changing what I've said: I'm still going to get the remaining worthy games that will come on the platform by then (including all the remakes of the games I never played before... which are pretty much all of them except Luigi's Mansion 2, which I did already played, and also not a personal favorite game of mine). Until then I'm still going active on it. If it can help, I can leave this place right now, but don't expect that I'm gonna take easy the direction videogames and the people who play them are going to until I quit it... Nintendo games are being destroyed, and there's nothing I can do about it.

[Khushrenada]

Also thank you a lot for making me feeling even more lonely in loving XBC2 by telling me that there are other people who hate it around here. Like if I hadn't heard enough hate for it already... no offence.

No offense taken. I was just trying to highlight that from my personal experience, I've seen a lot of different reactions about the game which may be why you've had a hard time finding others who like it as much as you do. I also never said that they hate it. Just that there were elements about it that caused them to like that particular entry less than others.

I would caution that you may want to be careful to assume that because someone doesn't view something with the same emotion you do that this means they must hate it or are the opposite of your view. Let's use the example of a movie. A person can watch a movie and afterwards they may find that they liked some of the characters and specific scenes and moments but didn't like or care for others and they may give reasons why they felt that way. Meanwhile, you may have seen that same movie and liked everything about it and are surprised to find out that this person didn't feel that same way or has complaints about it. Yet, that doesn't mean they hated it. As mentioned, there can be a lot they did still like. To them, there was just other stuff they thought could be better. And that's just human nature. We all have our own likes and dislikes. It isn't necessary that everyone has to feel the same way about everything.

Going back to videogames, Super Mario Sunshine is nowadays often considered the "worst" 3D Mario game. I say worst because when people make a list of Best 3D Mario games it will often be the last entry on the list. Yet, even when ranking the games in this way, people will still mention that there is some good stuff to it. It's not like they are considering it the worst game ever made. Just that in this specific instance of criteria and judging that it is at the bottom. Yet, for me, Sunshine will always be a top Mario game. I recognize that it does have its faults and I can see why many people would put it at the bottom. It's just that the game came out during a time in my life where it could make a big impact and in which I could spend a lot of time with it and repeatedly play it.

Nowadays, it just seems hard to replay and revisit games like that when there is so much out there to play. That's why I've only played through Super Mario Odyssey once. I really liked it. It had a lot of great worlds to explore and challenges in it. It has some excellent music to it. I loved the ability with the hat to control different species and things. But after getting all the Moons and costumes unlocked, I moved on to other games to keep up with all the other stuff I'd like to try out and play. Perhaps if I went back and replayed it over and over again like I did Sunshine then it would become my favorite Mario game or I'd have the same feelings for it as I do for Sunshine. But that's probably not going to happen. That's why for my own list, I would still put Sunshine ahead of Odyssey if I was ranking the Mario titles. Doesn't mean I hate Odyssey or anyone would say Odyssey is a better game that Sunshine. I still like Odyssey and would highly recommend people play it. It's just that I have a greater fondness for Sunshine beyond just it's technical merits which will make it hard for any game to be able to overcome that longtime affection.

At one point, if I saw Mario Sunshine being ranked low on a list, I'd have commented about that and mentioned how I disagreed and why I thought other Mario games were worse than it or why it was better. However, my attitude on that has changed. Having read and listened to the viewpoints of others as to what they don't like about the game and why they don't rate it as highly as I do, when I've revisited and replayed Sunshine, I've since been able to appreciate and see that there is some validity to their points. There are things that haven't aged well. Yet, that hasn't destroyed the game for me. I still get great pleasure in playing it again. What I liked about the game, I still like and enjoy. And that's why I don't bother trying to "defend the honor" of Sunshine like I once might have. Why I don't try and tell other people that they're wrong and I'm right because what does it really matter? The game still exists. It hasn't been taken away. I can still play it and enjoy it. And other people can still play it and decide for themselves if they like it or not regardless of what I tell them. The only thing that's changed is I've gotten more perspective on the game (and life in general) to appreciate and understand other viewpoints beyond my own.

That's why we've been trying to tell you to not get so obsessed over whatever criticism you may being seeing directed at the games you like, whether that criticism is legit or lies. People have their own opinions. Yours is that you like XC2. You Luigi's Mansion 3 more than Luigi's Mansion 2. That's cool. That's great. Go on liking them and playing them. Just remember that you are under no obligation to have to defend them or your reasons for liking them. Unless something absolutely wild happens in which Nintendo is bought by another company or they experience crazy financial misfortune, they are most likely going to still be around and keep making these types of games you like for quite some time. And as for Nintendo being bought or crazy financial misfortune, neither of those things will come about from the mass of lies you are worried about which is, again, why you shouldn't view it as the major issue you are feeling it to be.

[Khushrenada]

Fine. Then it's settled: I will quit gaming as whole, as soon Switch ends its lifecycle next year. However I'm not changing what I've said: I'm still going to get the remaining worthy games that will come on the platform by then (including all the remakes of the games I never played before... which are pretty much all of them except Luigi's Mansion 2, which I did already played, and also not a personal favorite game of mine). Until then I'm still going active on it. If it can help, I can leave this place right now, but don't expect that I'm gonna take easy the direction videogames and the people who play them are going to until I quit it... Nintendo games are being destroyed, and there's nothing I can do about it.

As for this comment, again, it would be nice to get some context. Is there no way to copy and paste some examples of how Nintendo games are being destroyed and why you can't do anything about it? I'd love to be able to see what you are seeing and reading since it just isn't something I've encountered where I live.

In regards to whether you keep gaming or not when a Switch successor comes, that's up to you to decide. I just find it odd that you keep talking about how you are worried about the future of Nintendo and its games vanishing or no longer existing and being made in the future yet your solution is to quit buying their stuff in the future anyways. Isn't quitting Nintendo doing just what the fanboy lies are hoping to accomplish? Have people not buy and play their stuff? I just don't understand why not playing Nintendo stuff you still enjoy in the future is your main solution whereas not bothering to engage in online arguments with people that dislike Nintendo is an impossible solution?

Again, it is your time, money and mental health so make the decision that is the best for you in those areas. If that is the best solution than so be it. It just doesn't quite make sense to me.

[Torchwick1234]

Fine. Then it's settled: I will quit gaming as whole, as soon Switch ends its lifecycle next year. However I'm not changing what I've said: I'm still going to get the remaining worthy games that will come on the platform by then (including all the remakes of the games I never played before... which are pretty much all of them except Luigi's Mansion 2, which I did already played, and also not a personal favorite game of mine). Until then I'm still going active on it. If it can help, I can leave this place right now, but don't expect that I'm gonna take easy the direction videogames and the people who play them are going to until I quit it... Nintendo games are being destroyed, and there's nothing I can do about it.

As for this comment, again, it would be nice to get some context. Is there no way to copy and paste some examples of how Nintendo games are being destroyed and why you can't do anything about it? I'd love to be able to see what you are seeing and reading since it just isn't something I've encountered where I live.

In regards to whether you keep gaming or not when a Switch successor comes, that's up to you to decide. I just find it odd that you keep talking about how you are worried about the future of Nintendo and its games vanishing or no longer existing and being made in the future yet your solution is to quit buying their stuff in the future anyways. Isn't quitting Nintendo doing just what the fanboy lies are hoping to accomplish? Have people not buy and play their stuff? I just don't understand why not playing Nintendo stuff you still enjoy in the future is your main solution whereas not bothering to engage in online arguments with people that dislike Nintendo is an impossible solution?

Again, it is your time, money and mental health so make the decision that is the best for you in those areas. If that is the best solution than so be it. It just doesn't quite make sense to me.

It's just that I'm seeing WAYAYAYAYAY top much hate over Nintendo games in the last period, and this is not only killing my will of following new games, but also is putting my love for the games I already loved throught the years. Something that I really don't want to lose... and this fear is not coming from nothing...

Gaming is not the only thing I'm having this sort of problem... let me tell ya a story, a personal experience I had a really long time ago with another type of media: for an entire decade I've been a fan of the animated show My Little Pony Friendship is Magic, and despite it ended 4 years ago, it still remains as of now my number one personal favorite animated show. But its fandom REALLY gave me an hard time in following it because of it's really toxic behavior. During the times of the fourth season there was an episode I loved the first two times I watched it, but it got such a colossal amount of hate from the fandom that it overwhelmed me badly, to the point I came to hate the episode myself, and I considered it one of the worst eps of the series... then years later I snapped out of it, and I realized that I came to hate that episode only because the fandom did, and not because I did. But I still didn't want to rewatch it anyway, because I still freaked out at the thought of how the fandom messed me up on that, so for a while I refused to rewatch it and find an opinion on it. Only very recentely (a few months ago) I finally rewatched it and loved it like the first te times I watched it.

I told you this story to make you understand how fandoms can mess me up badly when it comes to loving things. If I'm overwhelmed by hate and negative opinion I can go in crisis... (and keep in your mind that this is not the only trouble the fandom of MLP made me go throught, but it doesn't matter in this discussion). I'm also kinda facing the same thing with The Owl House recentely (my second favorite animated show of all time): I love it with all my heart but it's getting a ton of unfair hate from online people and after my experience with My Little Pony, I won't let that happening again... which is why I've decided that aside one exception (Pokemon Horizons) I will stop following animated shows for good, after The Ghost and Molly McGee (another show I love) will end its run on January 13th next year. It's my only way to not risk to come to hate the shows I dearly love (well that and the fact that I don't have anymore animated shows to look forward to for the next three years anyway).

I know I'm going off-topic with this stories, but it's to make you understand that negative opinions on things I love can mess me up badly and can make me come to hate things I love dearly, if they overwhelm me too much. This is what's happening with Nintendo games lately, and I cannot risk to come to hate them. I even had to fight hard for years to preserve my love for XBC2 and I cannot fo it forever (the reason of why I got upset when you said about the people who hate it on this site) So if to preserve my love for them, I have to stop to play new ones. Then I have no other choice but to quit. I hope you understand.

I'm just sad that eventually the hate will spread to the point that no one will love the games again and I cannot do anything to prevent that...

[WiiUIVLife]

I don't think it's as bad as you think. of course, there will always be people that hate and love certain products. On top, I believe Nintendo will be pretty powerful many years ahead.

[ThePerm]

What is this a 2011 thread and the Wii U is about to drop?

[Evan_B]

What is this a 2011 thread and the Wii U is about to drop?

I was going to say, this reminds me of the doom and gloom I felt during/at the end of the Wii U’s lifespan, which was when this sort of perspective felt warranted.

[ThePerm]

It is cyclical. When Wii U was coming out here was this same sort of doom and gloom over the Wii U, which is surprising because Wii was such a hit. There was really nothing wrong with the Wii U. It just had a stupid name, and people thought it was an accessory. Had they called it the Ninja I bet it would have been a hit.