Topic: Ill-feelings towards SNES-era Nintendo?

[vudu]

Recently, I’ve been reading 1up's Essential 50 Classic Games.  All was good up until I got to the SNES/Genesis section.  Now I’m noticing lots of anti-Nintendo quotes such as this one from the John Madden NFL Football segment.

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As the 16-bit war progressed, Genesis quickly became the system of choice for teenage males. The Genesis was cool, while the Super NES (with its soft chunky greys and violets) was regarded as a "kid_die system." It was an image bolstered largely by Sega's new mascot, Sonic the Hedgehog, whose slick blue moves made Mario seem dumpy and childish by comparison. … Nintendo had a hammerlock on the surreal, candy-like, linear RPG-loving tastes of Japanese gamers, but the sleek black Genesis console and its no-nonsense approach to the art of video gaming appealed to the western teens who had grown up with the NES. It's become a cliche, but Nintendo refused to "grow up" with its gamers….

And then there’s this one from the Sonic The Hedgehog entry.

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[Sonic The Hedgehog] helped Sega claim victory in the 16-bit console war.

First off, when did the Genesis (or Mega Drive) win the 16-bit console war?  I know it was really popular in Europe, but didn’t the SNES beat the pants off it everywhere else?

Second, was the SNES really a “kid_die system”?  I didn’t think that term was used in reference to until the Nintendo 64/PlayStation era.

I remember the whole Mortal Kombat fiasco, but I was under the impression that that was an isolated incident and the general public didn’t think Nintendo was for younger players until much later.

Is 1up a bunch of clownboats who are just trying to rag on Nintendo, or did I completely miss something up until this point?  Are they just trying to say "we're so cool we knew Nintendo was for kids back when they were still on top"?

BTW, I have to use kid_die because if I turn off emoticons, links no longer work.  Great job PGC.

[Avinash_Tyagi]

Nintendo did edge out the Genesis in the 16 bit era.

As for the rest, its probably just 1up displaying hindsight bias.

[Ian Sane]

The SNES was considered the less "cool" system in the US at the time due to Sega making more realistic style games, having a better sports lineup, and having blood in the Genesis version of Mortal Kombat.  Compare the style of Virtua Racing and Stunt Race FX and you'll see the difference between Sega's and Nintendo's designs.  Nintendo's were always more childish looking but it wasn't seen as a huge deal then since most gamers at the same time were kids and Mario was seen more as surreal than childish.  Anyone who rags on the SNES is either a die-hard Sega fanboy, a revisionist history jerk, or an ignorant doofus who never played games in the 2D era.  Anyone with any serious interest in games considers the SNES one of the best consoles ever made.

Nintendo became "kid_dy" once people plugged in their N64 and were greeted with "Itsa me Mario".  That stupid voice pretty much killed Nintendo's image right there.  SNES-era Nintendo is like Rockstar compared to the Nintendo of today.

[Bill Aurion]

More like Charles Martinet does the best voice-acting ever...

[Savior]

I never considered the SNES less popular than the Genesis... the SNES Was cool because it had the best version of Street Fighter 2 at the time...  it wasnt seen as "tiku tiku tiku! " this magazine is stupid.  

[Artimus]

SNES owned the Genesis. Just look at how Sega struggled from the on. The article is way off.

[darknight06]

SNES if I'm not mistaken did get destroyed in Europe, but prevailed everywhere else with the huge winner for them being Japan.  I do recall the SNES having a bad period after the Mortal Kombat 1 fiasco where if I recall correctly Nintendo started losing a pretty decent chunk of sales to the Genesis.  I remember it getting bad to the point where I was going to go buy a Genesis because it seemed like everything good was going over there and that SNES ports were getting the shaft.   I remember Wolfchild being far more playable on the Genesis than the SNES.  Genesis had better level layouts, AI and autofire while the SNES version looked like it banked on graphics to sell itself since all of the meat of the game got sliced off for the competitor.  However, once the SNES got Super Mario All Stars as well as a few key third party titles like a certain Mortal Kombat 2 with BLOOD, Genesis days were just about numbered.  I believe the 3DO was out by this time and while Nintendo kept pushing the tech they already had (DKC, Stunt Race FX) Sega planted the seeds for the beginning of their demise with the 32X.

[S-U-P-E-R]

DKC (and to a lesser extent, KI) definitely put SNES way on top by the end. It sold a whole bunch of millions!

[Djunknown]

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the SNES Was cool because it had the best version of Street Fighter 2 at the time...

I dunno... The Genesis version had Champion Edition and Turbo rolled in one, whereas The SNES just released regular SFII and Turbo(To be fair, SNES had Street fighter to itself first). The controls were much closer to the arcade on the Genesis with its 3-button layout, it was perfect if you had the 6 button. As far as for Super Street Fighter 2, The SNES version seems to edge out its Genesis counterpart. The SNES version looked cleaner, had clearer sound, but fewer samples.

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Anyone who rags on the SNES is either a die-hard Sega fanboy, a revisionist history jerk, or an ignorant doofus who never played games in the 2D era

True dat as they say. I always pictured the 16-bit wars as a draw, two rivals who couldn't completely dominate the other until the next war. They played to their strengths to the fullest, and both had excellent 3rd-party support, even though it wasn't the greatest. Oh well, its not like I cared about market share, and how many units did X game pull off back in the day....

[darknight06]

Despite sound and graphics, the Genesis SF2SCE was superior to the SNES SF2T.  The Genesis game was made from the ground up and it shows in a much more accurate to arcade engine, whereas the SNES game was still off in a lot of the same ways SF2WW was.  However, this did get fixed when Super SF2 came out.  No contest, the SNES version was better.  Interesting little thing I remember from that time was that both versions of SSF2 were given 4s and 5s in EGM.

[Gamefreak]

Huh? Perhaps someone tampered with my memories, but I definitely remember the SNES being the "cooler" system. And it definately had more and better games (although I never passed up a chance to play Streets of Rage 2 on my friend's Genesis).

And I also definitely remember Genesis losing the console wars. It almost had as much as SNES market share in US.... but in Japan (the larger market at the time) it was owned almost as badly as Xbox. (mainly due to certain SNES exlusive RPG's....now PS2 exclusive. Funny how that works)

Also, SNES lasted way longer than Genesis, well into the PSX/Saturn period and even sold fairly well the year N64 was released (mainly due to the DKC trilogy and a few other late games like Killer Instinct).

Also, SNES completely owned the important 1994/1995 period (the last big hurrah before the new systems) with games like Super Metroid, DKC trilogy, Final Fantasy 6, Chrono Trigger, Killer Instinct, Earthbound, and so on.

[KDR_11k]

I don't recall the Mega Drive being the dominant system here. It existed but was still an also-ran. Maybe that's because the Mortal Kombat issue didn't exist here in Germany since they either had to cripple it like Nintendo did or get it banned.

[Ian Sane]

"The Genesis version had Champion Edition and Turbo rolled in one, whereas The SNES just released regular SFII and Turbo"

The SNES version of SFII Turbo has Champion Edition and Turbo rolled into one as well.

[couchmonkey]

I recall Nintendo's "childish" image becoming a pretty big deal in the Super NES era thanks to Mortal Kombat, and I felt that it carried over into the N64.  I don't think Martinet's voice acting helped, but I think it started long before then.
I think the quote from 1Up accurately reflects the feeling that Sega was "cooler" than Nintendo in the 90s, at least in North America, but it ignores the fact that the generation was very close.  Nintendo maintained a lot of popularity even though it lacked coolness.

Edit: HA HA HA!! I forgot that how much I used to love HALO 2.  But that was yesterday.

[Uglydot]

Sega wasn't as cool, SNES still raked in cash.  Nintendo needed to be nocked down a notch at that point, in my oppinion.  They had too much control.  

[skyfire]

That writers of that article clearly haven't got a F**king clue as to what they're talking about. I admit the genesis did give the snes a run for it's money BUT ONLY because of Sega's then "hip" and "cool" style of advertising.

That was the only thing that made the genesis popular, it's marketing campaign. Pound for pound the SNES just delivered while the genesis was just lacking. Lucky for sega most North americans are followers and like to be lied too (blast proccessing anyone?).

Funny enough, the only thing that I was jealous about the genesis being a SNES fan is that genesis games came in those plastic cases whereas we only got cardboard. I would have gladly paid more if it meant having my games in those kind of cases.

[Gamefreak]

Yeah but we got little plastic things to cover up the open end of the cartridge

[skyfire]

At first, but then Nintendo redesigned the carts and in so doing made those plastic sleeves rather redundant. Thus they stopped including them with games.

Footnote: If i recall correctly the reason why Nintendo redesigned the carts is because people were just pulling there carts out of the system instead of doing the smart thing and push the eject button. The 1st version of the snes has a latch that comes out and goes into that groove in the front middle of the carts when you turn on the power. So when these idiots were pulling there games out they were wrecking there SNES's. Serves them right for being that stupid.

[King of Twitch]

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If i recall correctly the reason why Nintendo redesigned the carts is because people were just pulling there carts out of the system instead of doing the smart thing and push the eject button. The 1st version of the snes has a latch that comes out and goes into that groove in the front middle of the carts when you turn on the power. So when these idiots were pulling there games out they were wrecking there SNES's. Serves them right for being that stupid.

I resent that comment. I went from having an Atari to SNES, it's not my fault the design was behind the times

Ah, now I know why the groove changed; I thought it was to make the Game Genie usesless on future games.


All I know is, is that I felt like someone shot me when the Games for Less clerk said there would be an Ultra 64 coming out to replace the SNES </3

[KDR_11k]

You know, here in Europe we had neither protective cases nor carts without the lock thing. The SGB had a shape that would allow you to pull it out without pressing the huge eject button but all the carts had those lock ridges. Maybe that's because it's impossible to miss the eject button on the PAL SNES and SFC. I've googled for some pics of the NTSC SNES, is that darker grey part in the center the eject button?

[Myxtika1 Azn]

Yes, that's the eject button.

I also remember reading on one of these forums a while ago that the reason why Nintendo changed the SNES carts was that some nobody went and got a patent on it.  Nintendo had to change it or get sued.

[KDR_11k]

Pfft. I'd have invalidated that patent easily, citing doors as prior art.

[Uglydot]

I never really had a problem seeing the eject button.  Always liked it more than just pulling the carts out.

[Nephilim]

Games like another world and flashback made Megadrive more mature then Snes, bring in mature gamers who at that time mostly still stuck by there multi floppy disk pc games.
while Nintendo was still living of the success of a updated port of a nes game.

[darknight06]

Flashback was on SNES too.