Topic: Wii U Must Bring it E3 2012?

[MorbidGod]

I think Nintendo needs to bring it this E3 2012. They need to bring tons of games, both by themselves and third party developers. They need exclusives. I don't want to see only ports. That wont make gamers buy a Wii U. These games also need to look AMAZING. Next Gen like graphics. Because you know Microsoft or Sony -- or both -- will be showing at least tech demos. And those ALWAYS look better then real time graphics. So they need to make sure their games LOOK nice.

They also need something else. Showing the Wii U Controller so early means Sony can do what they always do and copy Nintendo. They all ready talked about PS Vita and PS3 doing what Nintendo has done, So if they can do something else that will totally blow away the others -- that would be good.

One thing Nintendo needs not to do is talk specific specs. We don't need to know if it has 1ghz or 6 ghz. 1GB of ram or 10GB of ram. Nor should we know officially what GPU it is. Letting Microsoft or Sony to know this, it would help them to make their specs better if they do release late 2013 or 2014.

So what do you guys think Nintendo needs to bring with them to win E3 2012?

[BlackNMild2k1]

Tons of 1080p games with pretty graphics while still being DOOOOOMED!!! (all of the above)+1

[Shaymin]

• Other (A new 2D Mario game, hold the Miis)

[Chozo Ghost]

Wii U should bring a new name to E3 2012.

[nickmitch]

Games, games, games! That's the only answer. Games and solid release dates. Graphics don't mean **** on tech demo. We've already seen what the Wii U can do, now we just need to see it do. Nintendo needs to put out games whose art styles don't make them look like more Wii games. If more games come out looking like NSMBMii and the other Mii based games, no one is gonna take it seriously. Not to say that they don't have their place (they do) but Nintendo needs to remember that they sold Wiis to most of us before they sold to casuals and casuals are gonna be tougher to sell to this time around.

The 3DS's main problem was/is games. Nintendo can't afford to **** that up again.

[FloY]

they just need a mario or zelda or smash bros or mario kart game at launch...oh and a good price and they have to say all games run at 1080p...
it will sell!

[Kytim89]

Here are some of the games I see being announced for the Wii U at E3 2012:
 
Nintendo:
 
Dragon Quest X
Starfox Universe
Pikmin 3 (holiday title)
F-Zero Universe
Several new IPs
Windwaker and Twilight Princess HD collection similar to Ico and SotC HD Collection
 
Nintendo's third party support will be proven to be far superior this time than eve before.
 
Third parties:
 
Max Payne 3
Spec Ops: The Line
GTA V
Asura's Wrath
Skyrim
Castlevania: Lord of Shadow 2
Transformers: Fall of Cybertron
Soul Caliber V (with HD Link)
 
Demonstration of Wii U's online system with DLC for third parties.

[nickmitch]

they just need a mario or zelda or smash bros or mario kart game at launch...oh and a good price and they have to say all games run at 1080p...
it will sell!

It won't be Zelda since it's too close to SS, Mario will be there in the form of NSMBMii (sadly), Smash Bros hasn't even begun development and I don't Nintendo would release Mario Karts on top of each other like that. Nintendo's first party lineup may have to just be the second stringers. However, Nintendo can do well Starfox, Metroid and Pikmin in the launch window.

[FloY]

It won't be Zelda since it's too close to SS, Mario will be there in the form of NSMBMii (sadly), Smash Bros hasn't even begun development and I don't Nintendo would release Mario Karts on top of each other like that. Nintendo's first party lineup may have to just be the second stringers. However, Nintendo can do well Starfox, Metroid and Pikmin in the launch window.

NSBmii  ugh...epic fail nintendo...its a good game  but like we saw with nintendogs on 3ds... people wont buy the same game twice...at least i think they wont..


starfox was just released on 3ds too..


pikmin and metroid together...hmmm will that sell wiiU?  probably not...maybe with a lot of 3rd party mixed in...maybe
i wouldnt buy wiiU just for pikmin btw..i would for metroid though.

[NWR_insanolord]

People bought NSMBWii, which was buying the same game twice for everyone who bought the DS game. I think the real problem for Nintendogs on 3DS was that the kind of people who'd buy it weren't willing to spend $250 on a 3DS.

I would pay $300 for a Wii U at launch for Pikmin 3 even if it were literally the only game coming out for a year.

[Luigi Dude]

Once again people, the New Super Mario Bros Mii demo wasn't a real game.  Yes it'll eventually be made into a real game but what was shown at E3 2011 was just a tech demo using the NSMB Wii engine to show how the Wii U controller can stream games onto it's screen.

Seriously, there's a reason Reggie and every other rep for Nintendo kept repeating over and over again these are not real games and don't represent what the final games will look like. 

[MegaByte]

People bought NSMBWii, which was buying the same game twice for everyone who bought the DS game. I think the real problem for Nintendogs on 3DS was that the kind of people who'd buy it weren't willing to spend $250 on a 3DS.

NSMBW is a substantially better game than NSMB, has four-player co-op, which was new for Mario, was in a different format (console vs. handheld), and came to an established system. What's the incentive for Nintendogs + cats? The cats? Fur?


I don't think Nintendo needs to bring anything to E3. There isn't a huge need to "win" it. What they do need is to bring it to market.

[Dasmos]

Everybody loves cats. Or at least everybody should.

[MegaByte]

Yeah, but that's what real ones are for

[UncleBob]

People bought NSMBWii, which was buying the same game twice for everyone who bought the DS game.

Wha...?

[nickmitch]

Once again people, the New Super Mario Bros Mii demo wasn't a real game.  Yes it'll eventually be made into a real game but what was shown at E3 2011 was just a tech demo using the NSMB Wii engine to show how the Wii U controller can stream games onto it's screen.

Seriously, there's a reason Reggie and every other rep for Nintendo kept repeating over and over again these are not real games and don't represent what the final games will look like. 

That right there is the problem: there are no actual games. Whether Nintendo didn't wanna blow their load too soon or what, they have to bring the games. Tech demos are not gonna cut it.

[NWR_insanolord]

People bought NSMBWii, which was buying the same game twice for everyone who bought the DS game.

Wha...?

I didn't mean literally the same game, and that might not have been the best example to pick. I was just trying to argue that buying something that's very similar to something they already own is not a problem for a lot of people.

[ThePerm]

Yeah, for the most part last e3 was kinda lackluster, it offered a lot of promise though. Promises are never enough with the rampant media though, so..

Anyhow, this E3 should have a decent amount of stuff by default, and if it doesn't then WTF. They had since e3 last year to prepare for this e3 which isn't till June 7th. That is 8 months from now.

[Luigi Dude]

That right there is the problem: there are no actual games. Whether Nintendo didn't wanna blow their load too soon or what, they have to bring the games. Tech demos are not gonna cut it.

Well yeah, at E3 2012 they will bring the real games since the Wii U will actually be launching several months after it and they'll want to build up hype for the games that will be coming out for the launch window.  The whole point of E3 2011 though was to give people an idea of how certain features of the controller would work, but since the final hardware wasn't ready yet, Nintendo used modified Wii games instead because they didn't want people to get the wrong idea by seeing Wii U games on unfinished hardware.  Same reason why all the third party game footage was from the 360/PS3 versions, even though all the third parties have said the Wii U versions will look better.

[Ceric]

Think that ultimately Super Mario Bros Mii demo shouldn't had been ok.  If you aren't showing games keep it purely tech so people will walk out going that this was clearly just to show X or Y off.

I hope they do what they are doing with Super Mario 3D Land and Mario Kart 7 which is start to let the press get a feel little by little for it before E3.  I'm not saying all the games but pick 2, 1 First Party and 1 Third Party, that are of stellar quality and usage of the Wii U concepts and let the press play with them a little bit by bit leading up to E3.  Then at E3 bring out the other games for surprises plus the end system design (You can easily put a box or jus have it case-less during the Press Tries.)

I wouldn't mind some Cube Club style events either if they won't all be located only in the biggest city, (Lets see Nashville, Cincinnati, Portland, Kansas City, just a big city every state at the least.)  Get the system in people hands early.  Shoot use Club Nintendo to allow for an early day or VIP like access.  Those will be your evangelists.

[ThePerm]

my theory is to have a good e3 you need 2 things

Eye Candy
Genre Coverage

Nintendo has only provided Eye Candy in the form of Mario and Zelda

Genre Coverage
The Last time Nintendo had coverage of every genre was like 1998, they had fighters, shooters, surivival horror, rpgs(well Aidyn Chronicles ended up sucking hard), racing games.

Actually Wii had pretty good coverage on everything but Shooters, which ironically in the n64 days Nintendo was the only one who really had those genres covered. Stealth action wasn't really a genre people cared about in 1998 until MGS came out, and there was no Sandbox Crime games.

Heres What I hope happens

Resident Evil game
Square Enix RPGs
Sega support
Unreal, Valve, id, and Crytek shooting games
Konami's Fox Engine running a big Kojima Game
GTA
Activision and Ubisoft already support Wii U..so that's good.
Mass Effect
Mario and Zelda

sounds ambitious, but all these things are actually pretty likely. Very few of those would make the launch window. The Kojima thing, and id support being the least likely.

Also, despite Nintendo usually releasing in September-November, i've heard rumors they'll release at the end of August, which I could see as being a good time to launch. Its after e3, so it isn't long after the hype, but it isn't too long before the holidays, so it gives the fanbase some time to grow before that. Its also 3 months before november, so it will give time so that the people who have it fall in love with it and show it off to everyone who doesnt quite get it.

[Dasmos]

Like insanolord all I need is Pikmin 3. I actually can't wait to see what they do with it. It should be incredible.

[ThePerm]

Yeah, that game is a perfect fit for Wii U

Speaking of strategy type games
Starcraft 2 Port? Battalion Wars?

[Chozo Ghost]

Actually Wii had pretty good coverage on everything but Shooters, which ironically in the n64 days Nintendo was the only one who really had those genres covered.

Its also ironic because shooters are probably the best thing suited for the wiimote/chuck controls.

[Ceric]

Yeah, that game is a perfect fit for Wii U

Speaking of strategy type games
Starcraft 2 Port? Battalion Wars?

Battalion Wars, Yes.  Starcraft 2 Port, No.  I really loved the StarCraft 2 Single Player but it really is the Multiplayer that gives it the longevity.  Now that being said an updated remake of Warcraft would be cool.  A lot of people haven't played Warcraft 1-3 who play WoW.  Especially one.  Its not a bad game but, definitely dated.

[nickmitch]

There's always Advance Wars and Fire Emblem. Nintendo could set the example.

[Chozo Ghost]

I predict there will be a Battalion Wars 3 but NOA will refuse to bring it over here and they might cite the poor sales of BW2 as an excuse.

[ThePerm]

Who knows if Nintendo makes some strategy games, which are suited for the Wii U, and they are popular enough then others may follow.

[Lithium]

I'd like to see an RTS game for the wiiU launch window. thats probably the only genre that i can think of that will be substantially benefited by the new controller and will show hardcore gamers why they should want it.

In the end, Nintendo can have all the pretty graphics in the world but if no one is making games for the thing then it doesn't matter. To the hardcore audience who already have a 360 or ps3 HD wont matter to them, Nintendo needs to show them gaming experiences they cant get on the other consoles.

[ThePerm]

I wonder how a Battalion Wars game would benefit from graphic eye candy, even though the 2nd one did poorly the first one did well.  So theres that

[Ceric]

I wonder how a Battalion Wars game would benefit from graphic eye candy, even though the 2nd one did poorly the first one did well.  So theres that

Cleaner look.  Characters more pronounced.  More variety environment filled a bit more.  More interesting explosions. If Nintendo was doing 3D gaming for the TV Pikmin and Battalion Wars be wonderful showcases for that.

[the asylum]

New F-Zero, new f-zero, new f-zero, no whammy no whammy no whammy STOP

[ThePerm]

its actually been a long while since F-Zero game has come out, and OMG could it looks spectacular. Has any F-zero like game came out on PS3 or 360?

i guess the closest thing is Wipeout on ps3, but it doesn't look much better. Or better, it has better graphics, but not as good style.

[broodwars]

its actually been a long while since F-Zero game has come out, and OMG could it looks spectacular. Has any F-zero like game came out on PS3 or 360?

i guess the closest thing is Wipeout on ps3, but it doesn't look much better. Or better, it has better graphics, but not as good style.

I had mentioned Wipeout HD on the PSN replying to your other post, but if you take away the futuristic setting and up the explosions maybe Split/Second might interest you?

[ThePerm]

sorry about that, i had a lot of windows and tabs open, got confusing

[Ceric]

Yeah, WipeoutHD is F-Zero pretty much.  Plus it support 3D if you TV can handle it.  If it does that is one of the games I recommend in 3D because, the sense of speed in 2D isn't nearly there as it is in 3D.

[ThePerm]

there needs to be a mode with weapons, then it gets chaotic like MK

[the asylum]

F-Zero with weapons?

Blasphemy!

[nickmitch]

Wasn't there an attack button in GX?

[ThePerm]

you could turn on a shield and bump people, but i wouldnt say its blasphemy if it was an additional new play mode.
I can't see the game be the same game as the other games with better graphics, so there should to be some additions.

[Ceric]

I see F-Zero getting a better Story Mode before weapons. 

Wipeout HD has weapons and some of them are pretty powerfulish but in the end they amount to about squat.  The track is still your biggest opponent.

[Stogi]

Pikmin 3 and a graphically superior DQX. One will show how to use the Wii U tablet, the other how to use the Wii U graphics and online. Win fucking Win.

[Ian Sane]

What I want is to come away from E3 feeling that this time things are going to be different.  With both the Gamecube's and the Wii's last pre-launch E3 showing I did not feel any real optimism about the future.

Since the N64 what is the expectation of a Nintendo console?  The assumption is that the third party support will be **** and that Nintendo themselves will dedicate most of their focus to family friendly titles with some token efforts outside that here and there.  "Family friendly" just eventually switched from "for kids" to literally "for the entire family to play".  Another expectation is that the Nintendo system will be behind the times in some way like the past ones were regarding CDs, online gaming or HD graphics.

So what I want to see is healthy third party support from day one.  I want to see a wide variety of games, including ones from Nintendo themselves, that target all groups.  I don't just want to see kids games and casual games (though those logically should also be there).  I want to see hardware that comes across as cutting edge with no excuses or "well this should be good enough" crap.  I want to see a showing where I immediately think that all those issues that Nintendo never ever addresses will not be an issue this time.  And I don't mean like die-hard optimism is required.  I want it to come across like a big turnaround where the skeptics are instantly converted and everyone comes out of E3 with the Wii U (now called something else of course) on their lips.

What we'll actually see is some casual focused Mii title and sequels to the same franchise we've seen a million times.  We'll see a lot of emphasis on the screen gimmick and none of it will be all that interesting or impressive.  We'll get third party showings from Activision, Ubisoft and EA - the third parties that someone selling homemade consoles out of their garage could probably get support from.  All the big third party titles that generate legitimate excitement will not be on the Wii U.  And we'll leave E3 with serious concerns about some limitation in the hardware.  There will be lots of "I'm not sure about that" concerns.

The skeptics will have no reason to change their mind and the diehard loyalists will remain loyal.  The Wii U will be the status quo and that will be disappointing.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I guess we should prep ourselves for atleast a $399 system and completely ignore comments from developers about the titles they are working on and the rumors of all the titles Nintendo had 3rd parties prepare for E3 2011 then decided to not show at the last second.

I guess we should also completely ignore the comments Iwata has made about the focus of Wii U software, the leveraging of 3rd party efforts and the importance of not having another 3DS-like start for the next hardware release.

I know talk is cheap and Nintendo has done alot of it that has amounted to much less than the checks were written for, but eternal skeptic doesn't have to be your mantra all the time.

~~~~~~

I think E3 2012 will be Nintendowned with the sheer amount of software that will be revealed and shown off for not only Wii U but 3DS too. The Nintendo HYPE coming out of E3 2012 will be through the roof and will carry into the Wii U launch of no more than 90 days later. Skeptics will always remain skeptic and the Haters will continue to hate, but Nintendo will deliver at E3 2012 if for no other reason, because they have no choice but to.

[Chozo Ghost]

I guess we should also completely ignore the comments Iwata has made

Didn't he also say the Wii would not have a games drought? Plus he did say something about making games for the Wii U to bring in people who aren't interested in games. That sounds like more of the same strategy that was used on the Wii.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Well considering that the Wii is Nintendo's most successful home console to date, it would be quite foolish of them to abandon their record setting strategy to follow in the footsteps of the distant 2nd and 3rd place competitors (not only in consoles sold, but profit made).

Nintendo was also blind sided by a majority of 3rd party devs regarding the Wii support, so I hold Nintendo only partly responsible for the game drought. We shall see if it is a oversight they took the proper steps to make sure doesn't happen again this time around.

I'm not going in with blind optimism either, but considering we don't know anything yet, I'm going more with cautious optimism instead of bitter pessimism.

[nickmitch]

Ian has a point because we've heard all of this before. In fact, this time it's a bit worse because 3rd parties are promising games that are coming out now and will be old news by launch. That's not gonna be a winning strategy.

[NWR_insanolord]

BnM's right: we don't know anything right now. I'm trying to hold off on forming any real opinion of the thing until after next year's E3.

[nickmitch]

Yeah, because NOT having an opinion is an awesome way to keep conversation going.

[Chozo Ghost]

Well considering that the Wii is Nintendo's most successful home console to date,

In terms of hardware units sold and software sold, that's true. But what does that really mean to us consumers and fans? The Wii may be Nintendo's best selling console of all time, but I don't think most people would say its their favorite Nintendo console of all time.

The Wii did make shitloads of money for Nintendo a few years back, but apparently that's not true anymore. They apparently lost a lot of money recently, and while the currency exchange thing may be the main culprit in that the fact of the matter is Wii software has been very sparse lately. There hasn't been enough new software from either Nintendo or third parties to generate revenue to offset the losses of the currency exchange thinger.

The other systems are getting a mega ton of awesome kickass games this November such as Batman Arkham City, Skyrim, Battlefield 3, MW3 (the Wii is getting that too, I know), and so on. What is the Wii getting? Aside from Zelda and maybe a casual dancing rabbids game or two, absolutely nothing.

So the Wii is Nintendo's most successful console of all time in certain respects, yes, but who here or anywhere is going to say its their favorite Nintendo console of all time? Is it your favorite? I have to say it is bar none my least favorite Nintendo console ever, and probably the least favorite console I ever owned period.

[Ceric]

The Wii Burned out fastish.  Though whats more interesing is how it didn't just peter down it sort of dropped like a stone when it went out.

Nintendo didn't get the timing right on how long they could ride the Wii.  Who could really know?  Assuming next holiday season will be the release of the Wii U I honestly think Nintendo missed the sweet spot by about a year.

Another thing that is happening to gaming as it becomes more mainstream is that games are shifting from not  being viewed as equivalent to Movies and more equivalent to TV shows.  I was listening to How to Do Everything and they have an episode on TV Shows.  One of the things that they talk about for a successful TV Show is "Refillable Content." A concept that can be reused without getting stale.  There are games that are Refillable enough to bring in enough money to justify there existance (Hello, Annual Sport and Shooter games.)

While Movies work with a concept that can be fully realized in the course of a screening and would bore consumers over a longterm regular approach. (Hi, most Nintendo IPs.)

Nintendo has a few games that are essentially exclusive that fit that mold sort of (Hi, Layton and Pokemon.)  They could use more of them.
 
I just hope they can soon start leaking some info on the Wii U software.  Not even the system at this point.  Start some slow hype to build for there E3 announcement.  Hopefully to the point that Maintstream media cares.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Well considering that the Wii is Nintendo's most successful home console to date,

In terms of hardware units sold and software sold, that's true. But what does that really mean to us consumers and fans? The Wii may be Nintendo's best selling console of all time, but I don't think most people would say its their favorite Nintendo console of all time.

My point was, why would Nintendo abandon their strategy of expanding the blue ocean in favor of only seeking the same audience that they already share (the majority of) with Sony & MS.

Of course they are gonna continue to reach out as that strategy has given them more success over the past few years financially and in sales than ever before. Iwata also said they are bringing the everything else and by all appearances so far, they have fixed the major issue that caused the game drought over the last few years (modernized features and power in general). 

Lots of people only have 1 console in their homes, and when they find out that not only does the new wii play all the old games, but uses all the old accessories that they already own too and adds more on top of that with an iPad like tablet thing, it won't matter whether or not it was your favorite console this gen or not, as it will be the upgrade to the only console alot of people currently have and it will be better than that PS3 or Xbox that they have been contemplating buying for the last few years too.

Drop Just Dance 4, Wiifit U, NSMB Mii, GTA V and Madden 2013 near launch next year, and Nintendo will have the casual blue ocean audience locked up all over again and will have the attention of the core when more Multi-plat 3rd party titles start to hit too.

[Ceric]

Madden 2013 and GTA:V are game that really matter the when.  If the Wii U is out already when these drops that would be great but, if its after I would consider them a non-factor especially Madden.

[Ian Sane]

My point was, why would Nintendo abandon their strategy of expanding the blue ocean in favor of only seeking the same audience that they already share (the majority of) with Sony & MS.

The blue ocean group has no loyality.  For them videogames are a mindless distraction, not something they are specifically interested in.  So they'll gladly ditch Nintendo for the next big thing that grabs their fancy.  The core gamers will still buy product even if videogames aren't "in" at the time.  They're a market that is not going to disappear with the trends.  Plus the blue ocean market has lower standards of quality so if their iPad already plays games for them, that's good enough.  We all think the iPad and iPhone lack proper control options to really work well as videogames systems.  The blue ocean group doesn't care.  Nintendo doesn't own 100% of that market.  They're competing directly with Apple and any electronic device that can play something resembling a videogame.

And really the problem with the Wii is that it did not appeal to the core market.  It isn't so much that they targetted the blue ocean market but that they focused the Wii so much on that market that is turned core gamers off.  Sony and MS have since targetted casuals too but didn't lose the core market in doing so.  Kinect is total casual horseshit but it has not killed Microsoft's popularity with core gamers.  But that's because it's an optional accessory.  The Xbox 360 still comes with a conventional controller as a standard and it isn't a glorified original Xbox in a different shell.  The Wii from day one provided no benefit to a core gamer beyond what the Gamecube already offered.  Every new feature about it was aimed at casuals, so they just handed the core market (which was already impatient at them to begin with) to Sony and MS on a silver platter.

The Wii U can target the blue ocean market AND the core market like, you know, the Xbox 360 has done with Kinect.  But for the core market to even remotely give it a chance it cannot come across as strictly a casual console like the Wii was.  The name itself from the get go is doing a fantastic job of pigeon holing it as a casual console.  The suggestion that this is will continue the Wii legacy is a huge turn off.

Just don't target the blue ocean group at the expense of the core group and do not give the impression that that will be the case even if it is not the plan.  Though I don't trust Nintendo to be able to target both groups effectively.  They think making a console for "everyone" means each game has to be accessible to everyone which results in games that appeal to the lowest common denominator (kids in the past; casuals in the present).  I personally would like them to outright ditch the blue ocean market because it's the only way they'll be able to target core gamers.  Other companies can appeal to both groups, but not Nintendo... unless Nintendo changes.

[BlackNMild2k1]

That is ridiculous. Nintendo still makes all the same core games that they used to and then some. Now they also make the casual games ontop of that. I'm sure if you check the stats, Nintendo has to be outputting at least the same amount of games as last gen and even more so than the gen before.

The problem with the Wii was that all the 3rd parties abandoned it, and when they did decide to show support it was through mostly poorly constructed casual crap. That is what turned off the majority of the core audience. Nintendo couldn't carry the system by themselves, and if 3rd parties could have predicted just how popular the Wii was gonna be and for how long, then they might not have had to. If Wii had all the same games tailored to Wii's strengths, I'm sure the core audience wouldn't have been so quick to abandon the Wii regardless of the graphical difference.


Besides, Wii software was outselling the majority of PS360 software up until about a little over a 1.5 yrs ago.
and any major 3rd party multi-platform release still usually performs decently well on the Wii even though the core audience was ignored for so long.

[MaryJane]

What would be awesome from Nintendo, and would be the only way they could survive on 1st party only support, would be to have 12 original IPs and every other month, one game comes out. That would mean a new Zelda, Mario, Metroid, Kid Icarus, Earthbound, Donkey Kong, Kirby, F-Zero/Mario Kart, Pikmin, Animal Crossing, Pokemon, and SSMB game every 2years, along with some "minor" original IPs filling in the gaps.

You know what else I'd love to see? How about WiiUWare games that are just one world in Mario? Like if a Goomba stole and hid the Princess it shouldn't take Mario 8 worlds to find her, just one. Or, a bounty mission for Samus that takes place on one world and she just has to solve a few puzzles, track a few clues, and kill countless armies of space pirates? A simple game with Link (at the end of OoT) looking for more clues about the Sheikah? Or how about marrying that 100 Marios game demo to a Pikmin level or two? Games like that would keep the anticipation up for the next games in those series, especially if we could expect them with consistency.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Or small things like that could drain the creative pot for an actual next release. Not to mention drain resources towards pumping out AAA quality sequels on a 2 year (every other month) timetable.

It would be nice if Nintendo had unlimited resources, but they don't. But that's why they need to buddy up with 3rd parties to fill all those gaps so that they can take 4 years to do Zelda right and then take 3 years to perfect the new Mario and balance the next Smash Bros and tweak the next Mario Kart. 3rd parties are the key, I'm just glad Nintendo decided that they need them in the picture again.

[NeoStar9X]

Games are key. They will already look great. That should be obvious. I think we've reached a point where that can only get you so far. That no longer clouds people's judgement, at least I like to think it doesn't the way it did several years ago. I'm saving for the system now but I want there to be at least a few games I can pick up with the system on day one. I'm not looking for ports of games out now. Multiplatform releases that are a month or two old at the time of the release is acceptable. Collections with DLC are okay as that is a lot of content for the price.

They at least need to show some development on a new Mario, Zelda, and possibly Metroid. If not Metroid, F-Zero and/or Star Fox. If Pikmin is ready it needs to be there. If Animal Crossing is ready or close it needs to be there.  Wii U Fit should be there day one I think. I think if they added some social networking (if only through their online system) it could be a huge draw for those that loved the series on the Wii.

What I think would be great if they could partner with Capcom to rebirth Mega Man in 2D and 3D form. Leading up to his inclusion to Brawl. 

They don't need much in terms of 3rd parties I think overall but few key series are a must. There needs to be some shooter of some kind. Debuting the latest Call of Duty that year, would be Treyarch's, would be a huge get for Nintendo. It would be on other systems of course but to have "Pre-order for Wii U" after the commercial instead of Xbox 360 would go a LONG way in the west.

Ghost Recon Online if it is still on the system has to be fully playable and ready to go.
A Wii U version of GTA V is a MUST!
The latest Madden that takes full advantage of the controller for plays, etc is a MUST!

The Sims. There has to be a new one soon I think. It's quite possible those it's aimed at might not have the PCs to run it just yet considering what they did with The Sims 3. Which means debuting it on the console version might be ideal. The Wii U controller could provide enough options to do it well.  This is me being really wishful though. I'd personally love this.

Their online system must be there fully complete. 100%.There can be no doubt on anything regarding it.

[Ceric]

*shrug*
I don't think such quick fire releases be good on just the WIi U.  I think that the situation that Nintendo has gotten in with MK 7, SM3L, and Zelda Skyward Sword.  Just think its a lot at once sort of.  At least for the faithful .

[Chozo Ghost]

Nintendo couldn't carry the system by themselves,

Maybe, maybe not. We will never know because they didn't really put forth much of an effort, now did they? With the billions they printed from the DS and Wii over the last few years they could have expanded and opened up new studios or bought existing ones and put them to work to deliver the core games which the Wii was sorely lacking.

Hell, even games which were completed like Last Story and those other ones were never even brought here even though they easily could have. So how can anyone say Nintendo tried? They didn't try. They needed to have brought their A game this generation, and the fact is they didn't.

I am not saying Nintendo is superman and could do the impossible, but what disappoints me is that they didn't even try. If you are against unbeatable odds and you gave it your best and you lose at least you can say you tried your best. But Nintendo can't say that. They did not do the best they could have done this generation. I'm sorry but they didn't and that's not just my opinion, its also a fact because the fact they won't bring all those already completed games over proves it.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Generation isn't over yet.

Actually Reggie just said that Skyward Sword isn't the last great game for Wii and that we will hear more end of Dec. early Jan.

That could be NoA announcing Xeno & TLS for U.S. release to help fill the void between Xmas and Wii U. or it copuld be Reggie blowing more smoke... I guess we'll have to wait and see.

and like I've said before, Nintendo has output more games this gen than probably the last 2 before it, so I would hardly say that they didn't try. They are also supporting more formats at once that ever too. Wii, WiiWare, VC, DS, DSi/ware, 3DS, 3DSware & soon Wii U/ware.
They are stretched thin. That is why they need to lean a little more heavily on 3rd parties to provide the support and fill in some gaps.

[Adrock]

With the billions they printed from the DS and Wii over the last few years they could have expanded and opened up new studios or bought existing ones and put them to work to deliver the core games which the Wii was sorely lacking.

They did. Nintendo released just as many if not more games for the Wii than it did on any of its previous consoles and it did so while also supporting DS which didn't rely so heavily on remakes like GBA did. How do you think Nintendo accomplished that? A magic lamp? A monkey paw? Alchemy? What else do you want them to do? Open even more? You can't just create new teams overnight and expect them to perform at a high level. These things take time. On top of that, game development takes an average of 20-24 months to complete, longer if the game is something like Zelda. If Nintendo had created any new teams in the last year or two, they probably weren't put to work on Wii games. Maybe you disagree with that but Nintendo has to think about its future or people like you would just starting bitching about how Wii U doesn't have enough games.

And you clearly haven't been paying attention if you expect Nintendo to just buy up development studios.

So how can anyone say Nintendo tried? They didn't try. They needed to have brought their A game this generation, and the fact is they didn't.

Besides all of the amazing games they released this generation, Wii has practically outsold PS3 and 360 combined and it did so primarily on the strength of 5 glorified tech demos packaged into one disc. That's like slapping your arch enemy's mother right in the face... with your penis. How did Nintendo not bring its A-game?

I'm sorry but they didn't and that's not just my opinion, its also a fact because the fact they won't bring all those already completed games over proves it.

"This is my opinion which is fact because I say it is."

That's you. That's what you sound like.

Nintendo of America not bringing over 3 games that most people wouldn't have bought doesn't even remotely suggest a lack of effort.

[Chozo Ghost]

They did. Nintendo released just as many if not more games for the Wii than it did on any of its previous consoles and it did so while also supporting DS which didn't rely so heavily on remakes like GBA did.

Aside from the casual focused "Wii" series of games, what new games has Nintendo released on the Wii or DS in their lifespans? There are the usual assortment of Mario and Zelda and other games of the same franchises Nintendo has been milking for the last 20 years, but where is the new stuff? The GC had Pikmin, so that's something. Pikmin isn't a casual game, yet it is something new. There was Donkey Kong Country and Punch Out which I am thankful for because those franchises haven't seen a new game since the SNES era, so for those games its been so long that sequels were welcomed. But even though their presence was welcomed, they are still sequels and not new core franchises. That's been the problem with Nintendo since the N64 pretty much.

Meanwhile, Sony and Microsoft are pumping out new franchises left and right. Nintendo is more conservative and they focus whatever resources they have on sequels or casual games. There is absolutely nothing else, and the few exciting new core games that do come out are available in Japan only. Like Captain Rainbow and all those other ones. Why can't Wii have those? Wii would like to play, but Nintendo won't put forth the 2 cents worth of effort and bring the games over.

Wii has practically outsold PS3 and 360 combined

But it used to be that the Wii was outselling the competition (or the PS3 at least) by 5 times as much. Then it dropped to 4 times as much, then 3 times as much. So now you are going to boast that the Wii has sold 2 times as much? And it is still dropping. It may not reach the point where the competition ever overtakes the Wii, but let's face it the Wii is stagnant and pretty much at the end of its rope. The competition is going stronger now than it ever has, and the dominance the Wii had back from its launch to 2009 has faded a lot. I would expect both the PS3 and 360 to start overtaking the Wii in monthly and yearly sales, if they haven't already.

and it did so primarily on the strength of 5 glorified tech demos packaged into one disc. That's like slapping your arch enemy's mother right in the face... with your penis. How did Nintendo not bring its A-game?

Because Nintendo didn't go in for the kill. They won over the casual gamers with a glorified tech demo, as you said, but what did they do to capitalize on that? And what did they do to win over core gamers? That's why I say they didn't bring their A-game.

They slapped the competition in the face with their penis, but the penis was small and flaccid and while it was humiliating at first it was not a death blow to the competition. After the initial shock wore off, Kevin Butler and Bill Gates pointed at the tiny casual penis and laughed. Nintendo had nothing to follow it up with, especially this last year in particular.

[Adrock]

1. Yeah, way to change your argument from "why don't they open new studios? Wah!" to "why won't they create anything new? Wah!" The fact of the matter is that Nintendo has created new teams which is the very thing you were complaining that Nintendo hasn't been doing. So you want Nintedo to create new IPs in addition to releasing all the established franchises you love? What happens when/if you get both? You'll change gears and bitch about something else. I know this because you just did it.

Sony and Microsoft have been creating new franchises because they have to; they entered the console space much later than Nintendo and don't have the same rich history of characters. They're just as guilty of milking their franchises as Nintendo, far more in some cases. Since 2005, Sony has released 6 God of War games (including the mobile phone game) and 2 HD collections. That's 8 releases in the span of 6 years. Uncharted will have 4 installments once Golden Abyss comes out. Halo has 4 main installments with a 5th on the way, a remake to the original, a side story, and an RTS. So yeah, this isn't something that only Nintendo is doing. These companies know what sells and as long as people keep buying them, they'll keep making them.

2. It's called market saturation. There was no way to sustain the kind of sales Nintendo was getting because there comes a point where most people who want something already have one. Plus, PS3 and 360 have steadily become more and more affordable.

3. Nintendo makes their own core titles which admittedly appeals primarily to Nintendo's own fans. However, that said, there isn't a whole lot of Nintendo can do to convince people who don't like their games to start liking them. They need better 3rd party support. We all know this but they weren't going to get it on the Wii. On the bright side, Nintendo seems to be going in the right direction on the Wii U.

And Sony and Microsoft laughed off the Wii and casual gaming........ Then released Move and Kinect. I'm still curious what death blow you expected. They want from last place to first in a single generation. They make more money than both of their competitors combined (gaming division). Nintendo can't stop people from liking games that Sony and Microsoft make. There's no absolute victory to be had unless either competitor commits corporate suicide by releasing terrible products.

[BlackNMild2k1]

They did. Nintendo released just as many if not more games for the Wii than it did on any of its previous consoles and it did so while also supporting DS which didn't rely so heavily on remakes like GBA did.

Aside from the casual focused "Wii" series of games, what new games has Nintendo released on the Wii or DS in their lifespans? There are the usual assortment of Mario and Zelda and other games of the same franchises Nintendo has been milking for the last 20 years, but where is the new stuff? The GC had Pikmin, so that's something. Pikmin isn't a casual game, yet it is something new. There was Donkey Kong Country and Punch Out which I am thankful for because those franchises haven't seen a new game since the SNES era, so for those games its been so long that sequels were welcomed. But even though their presence was welcomed, they are still sequels and not new core franchises. That's been the problem with Nintendo since the N64 pretty much.

NEW Super Mario Bros.
Excite Truck/bots
Sin & Punishment
Xenoblade, TLS, Pandora, Disaster, Span Smasher, Battalion Wars,
but thats' just off the top of my head

Meanwhile, Sony and Microsoft are pumping out new franchises left and right. Nintendo is more conservative and they focus whatever resources they have on sequels or casual games. There is absolutely nothing else, and the few exciting new core games that do come out are available in Japan only. Like Captain Rainbow and all those other ones. Why can't Wii have those? Wii would like to play, but Nintendo won't put forth the 2 cents worth of effort and bring the games over.

Sony has
Uncharted 1, 2, 3
Ratchet & Clank (& the 1 or 2 sequels)
Resistance 1 & 2
LBP 1 & 2

MS has
Halo 3, Reach, ODST & soon Halo 4 in 2012
Kinect Sports 1 and soon 2 in 2012

Sony and MS are desperately seeking their Mario and Zelda's in this world. And honestly, who wouldn't. Every dev/pub would love to have an established franchise that could do almost no wrong as long as they kept the quality good. So now you're going to fault Nintendo for having and supporting the one thing that everyone else is jealous of?

Wii has practically outsold PS3 and 360 combined

But it used to be that the Wii was outselling the competition (or the PS3 at least) by 5 times as much. Then it dropped to 4 times as much, then 3 times as much. So now you are going to boast that the Wii has sold 2 times as much? And it is still dropping. It may not reach the point where the competition ever overtakes the Wii, but let's face it the Wii is stagnant and pretty much at the end of its rope. The competition is going stronger now than it ever has, and the dominance the Wii had back from its launch to 2009 has faded a lot. I would expect both the PS3 and 360 to start overtaking the Wii in monthly and yearly sales, if they haven't already.

Did you really expect Wii to keep up a record setting pace past the point of near saturation just so that it can say that held it's 5x the competition sales levels? Do you realize how many Wii they would have had to sell at this point? 250 million of them. Yes, a quarter BILLION Wii's would have had to been sold. That's almost double the amount of DS's & PS2's sold in the world. DO you really think anyone is ever gonna reach that number if they don't start pandering to the "people not currently interested in videogames" such as the vast Blue Ocean crowd that eats up quality "casual" wares?

and it did so primarily on the strength of 5 glorified tech demos packaged into one disc. That's like slapping your arch enemy's mother right in the face... with your penis. How did Nintendo not bring its A-game?

Because Nintendo didn't go in for the kill. They won over the casual gamers with a glorified tech demo, as you said, but what did they do to capitalize on that? And what did they do to win over core gamers? That's why I say they didn't bring their A-game.

They slapped the competition in the face with their penis, but the penis was small and flaccid and while it was humiliating at first it was not a death blow to the competition. After the initial shock wore off, Kevin Butler and Bill Gates pointed at the tiny casual penis and laughed. Nintendo had nothing to follow it up with, especially this last year in particular.

They "pointed at the tiny casual penis and laughed" all the way till releasing Kinect and Move in an attempt at being just like Nintendo....?

What did they do to capitalize on it...?
They outsold the competition almost 2:1 combined and made more money than the competition combined lost x4.
*Can you say Record Setting Profits that boosted them up to the #2 Company in Japan*
They followed up with blockbuster sales in games such as NSMB, WiiFit, WSR & WiiPlay and established the Wii____ series of games.

How did they win over core gamers? Are you a core gamer?
Do you own a Wii? SuperMario Galaxy 1 & 2? PunchOut? Excite Trucks/bots? DKCR?
will you be buying Zelda SS? Are you eagerly awaiting an announcement of Xeno and/or TLS &  Pandora? Did you happen to invest several dozen/hundred hours into any of those so called "casual" games I listed above?

Nintendo's main fault this generation was the 3rd party falllout, not their own output. Nintendo put out tons of great games this gen, but they couldn't support all the needs of every gamer all by themselves. If 3rd parties are onboard for Wii U, it will be a much different playing field when it comes to available software.

[Adrock]

DoppelgƤnger.

[BlackNMild2k1]

sorry I responded while the comments where fresh in my head (just now started reading your response LOL)


edit: Besides, the first quote I was responding to was basically you rewording something I had just in a previous post said where he chose to respond to you saying it instead. But I guess it's not hard to respond almost the same when we're both on the same page.


edit2: Wow, our responses were eerily similar. Get outta my head!!!

[Stogi]

The more I think about it, the more I want Nintendo to release an HD version of Skyward Sword at launch. If Pikmin shows how to use the Wii U tablet right, and DQX shows how to use the online and graphics, then Skyward Sword would show that Nintendo isn't joking about using Wii controllers on its new console.

[Ceric]

The more I think about it, the more I want Nintendo to release an HD version of Skyward Sword at launch. If Pikmin shows how to use the Wii U tablet right, and DQX shows how to use the online and graphics, then Skyward Sword would show that Nintendo isn't joking about using Wii controllers on its new console.

I'm hoping that Skyward Sword is like Wind Waker.  They pick an art style that can be fully achieved on the system.  Making an "HD" port of it essentially just moving it to another system because it will look very similar.

[Stogi]

Yeah but have you seen WW emulated at 1080p? It's absolutely gorgeous. It's a work of art.

[Ceric]

Yeah but have you seen WW emulated at 1080p? It's absolutely gorgeous. It's a work of art.

As TYP found out Wind Waker scales wonderfully with about anything.  I real testament to that game.

[Ian Sane]

Did someone honestly just use New Super Mario Bros. as an example of a new franchise from Nintendo?  Seriously?  How is that "series" any different then the Super Mario Bros. games on the NES?  If I suggested that Konami had gone stale would you point to Contra Rebirth as an example of something new?  Or Mega Man 9 to defend Capcom?

Pikmin really impressed me on the Cube because it was a new IP from EAD and Miyamoto.  This wasn't some niche title from a C-level dev that stayed in Japan.  It was their top guys and this was something that was supposed to stand alongside Metroid, Pokemon, Mario, Zelda, etc.  When I say I want new IP I don't mean some filler title or a Japan-only title.  I mean like EAD or IS or Retro doing it.  I mean something that is supposed to stand with their existing big franchises.  I mean something that would be marketed and positioned as a major release (and there is a difference between a major release and a supporting title).  The Wii series wasn't made by Nintendo's b-teams and games like Wii Sports and Wii Fit were given big marketing pushes and important Christmas time release slots.  They were expected to be big bread winners like they expect Super Mario Galaxy to be a big bread winner.  Span Smasher is never intended to be that kind of title.  Nintendo let Wii Music have a Christmas to itself (and got a lot of flack for doing so).  I want Nintendo to do that sort of thing with a core focused new IP.

Uncharted is one of the PS3's big hits.  It was made by Naughty Dog, one of Sony's main devs.  They already had a successful series with Jak & Daxter and could have just continued to milk that but they didn't.  They made something new and it wasn't treated as some filler title, it was designed to be a big title and marketted as a big title.  Sony didn't NEED to do that.  They could have just said "make us more Jak".  They could have told Insomniac to just make Ratchet & Clank titles but let them also make Resistance.  They could have told Sucker Punch to just make more Sly Cooper but instead we got Infamous.  These devs already had established IP and Sony did not have them just stick to the same thing when they easily could have.  Instead the PS3 has new series that have become hits.

When the hell does Nintendo ever do that?  IS makes Fire Emblem, Advance Wars and Paper Mario.  HAL makes Kirby and SSB.  EAD makes Mario and Zelda and now the Wii series (which is new but is clearly for casuals).  Retro made Metroid and now gets to make DKC.  God forbid they work on something new.  Better get them on some existing IP making a retro-style sidescroller platformer when Mario and Wario and Kirby are already doing the EXACT SAME THING.  But I guess we can't get enough retro sidescrollers.  Clearly the Wii needs FOUR franchises doing that at the same time.

[Ceric]

Did someone honestly just use New Super Mario Bros. as an example of a new franchise from Nintendo?  Seriously?  How is that "series" any different then the Super Mario Bros. games on the NES?
...

Its not as good?

Stupid Bowser Jr.  Ruining my Mario games.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Did someone honestly just use New Super Mario Bros. as an example of a new franchise from Nintendo?  Seriously?  How is that "series" any different then the Super Mario Bros. games on the NES?  If I suggested that Konami had gone stale would you point to Contra Rebirth as an example of something new?  Or Mega Man 9 to defend Capcom?

Well considering the person that "someone" was responding to and quoted used games that hadn't seen a sequel in a long time, NSMB fit with the examples given seen as a sidescrolling Mario hadn't seen a console sequel in quite some time. So let's keep things in context before you start trying to call people out.

Oh and NEW is in the title, so there is also that

[Caterkiller]

A new Nintendo IP seems to "count" if the franchise is made by Nintendo's best and the star of that game makes it into Smash Bros. That's my personal believe anyway. I love Wii Sports resort but hate that Miis were the only guys in Pilot Wings Resort. I wanted those old funny looking guys again, or some new guys with Mii as an option.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Uncharted is one of the PS3's big hits.  It was made by Naughty Dog, one of Sony's main devs.  They already had a successful series with Jak & Daxter and could have just continued to milk that but they didn't.  They made something new and it wasn't treated as some filler title, it was designed to be a big title and marketted as a big title.  Sony didn't NEED to do that.  They could have just said "make us more Jak".  They could have told Insomniac to just make Ratchet & Clank titles but let them also make Resistance.  They could have told Sucker Punch to just make more Sly Cooper but instead we got Infamous.  These devs already had established IP and Sony did not have them just stick to the same thing when they easily could have.  Instead the PS3 has new series that have become hits.

When the hell does Nintendo ever do that?  IS makes Fire Emblem, Advance Wars and Paper Mario.  HAL makes Kirby and SSB.  EAD makes Mario and Zelda and now the Wii series (which is new but is clearly for casuals).  Retro made Metroid and now gets to make DKC.  God forbid they work on something new.

So a bunch of relatively new studios trying to establish their own "Mario" gets to work on something that's not their main franchise to hopefully also find their "Zelda" is what Nintendo should be doing...

or are you trying to argue that since Nintendo already has their "Mario" & "Zelda" & "Kirby" & Donkey Kong" & "etc etc" that they should be trying to find their next "Mario" & "Zelda" & "Kirby" & "etc etc"?

Because I think that Nintendo cares more about the creativity of gameplay, and each IP was born out of the style of play. If new gameplay ideas fit within existing gameworlds, then why try to sell me on a new brand when you can reach more people by advertising that the brand they already know and love is getting something new and hopefully better?
If it doesn't fit an existing gameworld, then a new IP will be created to accommodate it.

Nintendo has a HUGE portfolio of successful IP the most recent of which is the Mii's, so to just abandon one to create a new one everytime someone thinks of a new a idea that would easily help build an existing one into a bigger brand would just be stupid.

All those other studios love being able to work on something new all the time, but I bet they would love it more if they had a hit franchise that they knew would sell 10million upon release everytime. They would love to get shoehorned into the "Hit Franchise A" studio who has that loyal fanbase which gives them job security and eventually enough clout to really branch out and potentially make other hit franchises just off the fact that people know they were involved.

Better get them on some existing IP making a retro-style sidescroller platformer when Mario and Wario and Kirby are already doing the EXACT SAME THING.  But I guess we can't get enough retro sidescrollers.  Clearly the Wii needs FOUR franchises doing that at the same time.

For a total of how many franchises that are doing it nowadays?
I suppose they could do the unique thing and make a game in full polygonal 3D, I don't think anyone else is doing that at the moment. Wouldn't want them to tap the nostalgia factor and try to breath life back into one of their many stagnant IPs by associating it with one of the best games in it's series.


I'm sure Retro will get it's chance to bring something new to the table pretty soon, but up to this point, they have been proving that they are capable of running with the ball on their own. I don't know what they are working on right at this moment, but I have heard that they have more than 1 team working on several different projects.

[Chozo Ghost]

Speaking of "finding their Mario or Zelda", Nintendo has a similar problem. They do not have their own Halo or Grand Theft Auto. This is what one of their studios should be working on finding. Retro would be the perfect candidate to do this.

[Ian Sane]

Finding the next Mario or Zelda is pretty much exactly what I want.  Not literally another platformer or adventure game but something else that also becomes established.  At some point these franchises didn't exist at all.  They had to start somewhere.  So why not work to create a new one?  Do you just want to play Mario, Zelda, etc forever and ever?  Do you think you won't eventually get bored of that?  I am bored of that.  Someday you will as well.  It's going to be different for different people.

Nintendo has very little that appeals to teens or young adults.  There is reason to create new franchises that appeal to these age groups.  There are many genres that Nintendo has never even sniffed at.  Wouldn't it be nice to see what Nintendo would do with these types of games?  How about something like Goldeneye/Perfect Dark?  It was a Nintendo hit on the N64.  Nintendo later sold off the devs and has never filled the void.  Nintendo gamers clearly liked FPS games on the N64 so why do we not get them now?  Nintendo saw the need to bring DKC back (largely superflous since it's just a Mario clone anyway) but they don't try to establish an FPS franchise to bring fill the void Perfect Dark left?  How about Eternal Darkness?  We can't get a sequel but how come no effort is made to fill the horror void?

Nintendo doesn't have to ditch existing IP (though they might as well ditch Star Fox if they're going to mistreat it the way they do).  Nintendo puts Mario into everything.  Do we need this many Mario sports games, especially incredibly generic ones like the cookie cutter baseball and soccer sequels we got on the Wii?  If Nintendo is going to essentially re-release Animal Crossing every time, couldn't they dedicate that effort to something else?  Do we need three Mario platformers on one system?  Do we need two Kirbys and two Metroids, in both cases by two different developers?

If on the Wii U Nintendo released one Mario platformer (or maybe two if we want a 3D and 2D one), one Mario Kart and one Mario RPG (Paper Mario or Mario & Luigi or whatever) would there really be much outrage about a lack of Mario games?  How about one Zelda, one Metroid and one Kirby and one SSB with no spinoffs?  No one would care.  You wouldn't even notice because we got the sequel we wanted.  Nobody really wants Link's Crossbow Training, they are merely given it.  They may like it but they wouldn't give a **** if no follow-up was ever released.  Zelda fans want real Zelda games and as long as you give them that, you don't have to bother with any spin-offs.  You can easily trim the franchise fat while leaving the big releases that everyone expects around, while freeing up resources to create new IP.

It isn't like I'm suggesting Skyward Sword shouldn't have been made.  We never got a "real" Wii Zelda until this point.  It makes sense to make that game.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I'll post this here instead of the Wii U thread since it relevant.
http://nintendoeverything.com/77443/reggie-talks-3ds-launch-mistakes/

Fils-Aime told Brazilian gaming site ā€œUOL Jogosā€:

ā€œThe launch of the 3DS was very interesting: the portable earned great impressions at E3 2010, had excellent pre-order sales, and sold more than any portable system in its first week. So, we had many successes with the 3DS.

ā€œBut in terms of lessons learned, we need to ensure that we have a strong lineup of games when we release hardware ā€“ especially titles from Nintendo. And, looking back, we may not have offered the best lineup of games that we could have brought to the 3DS. It is also important that the digital resources of the hardware are available right away. With 3DS, this came later.

ā€œAnd thatā€™s why sales werenā€™t so great, which forced us to make some drastic decisions and reduce the price. Since we did this, and with the release of ā€˜The Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time 3Dā€™ and the digital resources, our sales have been very good. And we have very high expectations for the 3DS this Christmas.ā€

Looking towards Wii U, the consoleā€™s launch should be much improved. After all, Satoru Iwata has said that Nintendo ā€œlearned a bitter lesson with the launch of the Nintendo 3DSā€. Hopefully weā€™ll see a few top-notch first/third-party titles, along with the digital download elements on day one.

original source: http://jogos.uol.com.br/ultimas-noticias/2011/11/01/em-visita-ao-brasil-presidente-da-nintendo-diz-que-empresa-tem-plenas-chances-de-liderar-o-mercado-local.htm

[Ceric]

"Hopefully" is not a word that should  be used by any Nintendo PR about the digital presence being day one.   They WILL have the digital Presence on day 1 or they should release the hardware at all.

[nickmitch]

"We learned our lesson, so hopefully we'll do better next time."