Topic: The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt*

[Kairon]

What you say is true Mr Turkey.  But we need ask just one question.  Why should we as a consumer care if they profited?  Yes it sounds selfish.  But that is the hard truth.  Why should we care if they make 100 Billion dollars or 1 million profit?  As long as they have enough money to keep pumping out the awesomeness, then who cares?

In actual fact, this huge profit is probably the reason why Nintendo would once again make a limp wristed system.  They made a toybox with a CPU for nigh on free, slapped a Wii badge on it sold it for a (knowing Nintendo probably substantial) profit and watched their bank account exponentially grow.  Why not do the same thing again?

As long as the dollars roll in, who cares about the loyal followers who were there through the hard times.  If the average joe will pay them for toybox 0.5 with a shiny new gimmick than thats fine.

That is what worries me the most.  We keep hearing that the true follower is getting looked after, but nothing ever materializes except for the expected sequels.

I guess it's different for everybody...

Myself, I suffered through the "hard times" of the GameCube so that I could experience an utter revolution in terms of game input, an eye-opening expansion of the types of people I could find myself playing games with, and a reinvigoration of a company without whom it would be hard for me to believe in a future where videogames continue to surprise me.

But seriously, it wouldn't make sense to buy the GC, Wii, or Wii U unless I feel confident I'll have fun with it as a consumer. I had a blast with the GC, Animal Crossing alone almost took over my life, so I guess that was an ok decision there. And I think I own more games for the Wii than any other Nintendo system before so... Now what about the Wii U? Will I have enough fun with the thing over the next 5-6 years to spend $300-$350 on the hardware at launch? Personally, I think I will.

I consider myself a pretty committed Nintendo fan, but I don't think Nintendo owes me anything. They've never listened to a thing I had to say before, and so far it's worked out pretty well for them... and me.

[Caterkiller]

Kairon, you're a true Nintendo hero!

http://www.nintendoenthusiast.com/whispers-of-the-wii-u-around-the-industry/

Say's Nintendo doesn't like the bad rumors going around.


This is a few days old did someone already post it?

[Shorty McNostril]

In all seriousness.  I think I enjoyed the GC generation over the Wii anyday.  I just seemed to have more fun with it.  I dont know why.  It was the only system I had.  I didn't need an Xbox or a PS2.  The cube was enough.  And I didnt have a good PC in those days either. 

For some reason I felt the Wii lacking.  Don't get me wrong, it has some excellent titles on there (Mostly 1st party but anyway). 

If I feel the Wii U satisfies me, I will most certainly partake.  If the tablet makes enough of a difference and isn't just shoehorned in I will be happy.   But the question I find myself asking is this:  Why would I buy the Wii U as my primary next gen console if the tablet is used as just a tacked on gimmick and the hardware is far less capable than its competitors? 

Aside from 1st party games I don't see a reason at all.  And if I wait a few years till the price drops, and can play all the first party releases in 1 glorious month.

[Kairon]

Personally, I think I enjoyed my N64 the most. Sure, I had a NES and SNES, but the N64 was just... everything was new and utterly never-seen-before since Nintendo was taking almost all their stuff into 3D. *sighs happily* Also, I love that controller.

Frankly, yeah, Nintendo HAS to sell the world on that tablet controller. They put so much effort into it, and it's such an expensive piece of the kit, if it doesn't pay off that's wasted money, effort, opportunity.... sort of bust. I mean, I'm excited for the potential it embodies, but I want there to be some games using it that actually frazzle my brain with how much the tablet adds to the experience... Or maybe it might just add to the experience because I'll NEVER have to fight for the TV again, or because I can play games from anywhere in my house, like my bed or the bathroom. That might be frazzle-worthy in and of itself for me personally.

And in all honesty, I can't argue against the logic of waiting for one or more years to buy. Getting stuff at launch is too exciting for me to miss out on, but you hands down save time, money, and effort if you can hold off on buying a console until you get a year or two of hindsight with which to evaluate it.

[Shorty McNostril]

Make no mistake.  If I love this thing, I will be there at launch.  I am most certainly not above paying for overpriced stuff at launch price.   I just hope that I will love it enough to do that.

[NWR_insanolord]

I don't get why you're putting so much stock into these anonymous rumors, when a lot more people, who have gone on record publicly as opposed to anonymously taking shots and include people who had all kinds of negative things to say about the Wii like Mark Rein, as well as the things they've already shown running on the hardware, say the opposite. I can understand being worried, but if you were feeling good about it before this I don't think they should have changed your mind.

Personally, I'm so hyped for Pikmin 3 that as long as I get that I'll be satisfied with my purchase.

[Shorty McNostril]

I mentioned this in an earlier post. 

It isn't the rumors for the sake of rumors.  It is the recent history combined with the rumors.  If the Wii was an capable opponent hardware wise to the other 2 consoles and Nintendo were giving their all for the benefit of  the consumer, than I dismiss them immediately. 

But does anyone here think that Nintendo have really been doing everything they can in order to create the best gaming experience possible for their consumers?  Have they been willing to spend an extra few dollars to buff the hardware without asking for thrice that money back from the paying customer?  Have they been diligent in getting as many quality games as possible onto their system for the benefit of the gamer?   

As far as I'm concerned, the answer to these questions is no.  Now I realise this is largely opinion so take it as you will.  But because the answer is no, and Nintendo have not been going all out for their clientèle, than I have no expectations that anything will change.  From a shareholders point of view, "Why change what isn't broken?"

When I say a company that goes all out for it's fanbase, I am referring to companies like Valve.  Look at everything they do for their games and fans.  TF2 is a great example.  They have a workshop, so all who want to can get involved and make something that may end up in that game.  The continue updating it even though it is quite a few years old now.  Still bringing out new maps and awesome weapons. 

To me, that shows a real relationship with their fans.  They listen to feedback and do something about it. 

When was the last time Nintendo did this?  It was us, the loyal supporters who kept them afloat through the GC days.  What did we get for our support?  A half baked attempt at a new console.  Do you as Nintendo fans really feel appreciated? 

Please don't think of me as the eternal pessimist.  I don't enjoy this at all.  But I don't want to get all excited and get crushed at E3.  I would so love to be wrong.

[NWR_insanolord]

But why is their past more important than what they showed last year at E3 and what people who have no reason to want to be kind to Nintendo have to say? Granted, talk is cheap, but everything we've seen and pretty much everything anyone who's actually played the thing or seen it in action has said indicates that Nintendo did this right.

Which is more likely: some random anonymous accusation, or the opinion of Mark Rein, a man who consistently went out of his way to criticize the Wii? Were all the demos we saw at E3 last year faked, when Nintendo has no history of that? Lots of actual developers have gone on record saying it's a step up from the current systems; are you suggesting there's some kind of pro-Nintendo conspiracy going on here?

[Luigi Dude]

But why is their past more important than what they showed last year at E3 and what people who have no reason to want to be kind to Nintendo have to say? Granted, talk is cheap, but everything we've seen and pretty much everything anyone who's actually played the thing or seen it in action has said indicates that Nintendo did this right.

Which is more likely: some random anonymous accusation, or the opinion of Mark Rein, a man who consistently went out of his way to criticize the Wii? Were all the demos we saw at E3 last year faked, when Nintendo has no history of that? Lots of actual developers have gone on record saying it's a step up from the current systems; are you suggesting there's some kind of pro-Nintendo conspiracy going on here?

I think we all know whats really been happening.

[Evan_B]

Mother of god...

[GoldenPhoenix]

But why is their past more important than what they showed last year at E3 and what people who have no reason to want to be kind to Nintendo have to say? Granted, talk is cheap, but everything we've seen and pretty much everything anyone who's actually played the thing or seen it in action has said indicates that Nintendo did this right.

Which is more likely: some random anonymous accusation, or the opinion of Mark Rein, a man who consistently went out of his way to criticize the Wii? Were all the demos we saw at E3 last year faked, when Nintendo has no history of that? Lots of actual developers have gone on record saying it's a step up from the current systems; are you suggesting there's some kind of pro-Nintendo conspiracy going on here?

That is probably the only thing that gives me hope, I don't put much stock in anonymous developers because they can range for being pure fabrications, to having older development kits (which supposedly were under-powered if I recall, but have since improved). Individuals with experience in getting the most out of hardware have nothing but positive things to say about it, including Epic Games.

I just worry about the cost of parts, unless Nintendo managed to get some kind of deal on it. One thing I want to confirm is if this rumor for $180 just for the console itself or the controller and console? If it is just for the console that sounds fine to me.

[Louieturkey]

In actual fact, this huge profit is probably the reason why Nintendo would once again make a limp wristed system.  They made a toybox with a CPU for nigh on free, slapped a Wii badge on it sold it for a (knowing Nintendo probably substantial) profit and watched their bank account exponentially grow.  Why not do the same thing again?

As long as the dollars roll in, who cares about the loyal followers who were there through the hard times.  If the average joe will pay them for toybox 0.5 with a shiny new gimmick than thats fine.

That is what worries me the most.  We keep hearing that the true follower is getting looked after, but nothing ever materializes except for the expected sequels.

Oh I agree here.  I got bored and fed up with the Wii 3 years ago.  Yes, I've bought the occasional game here or there, but nothing like what I buy for the PS3 or PC. 

I've always bought the Nintendo system each generation first.  This time, I am definitely waiting, especially if the system is only slightly more powerful than the PS360. 

I'm afraid Nintendo will only think about their profit margins and try to cater once again only to the "casual" demographic.  I'm worried they will still leave things out of the WiiU that are standard with the PS360 because it wouldn't benefit them monetarily.  I'm worried they will gimp the system to make sure they make a profit at launch on the system itself.

I'm also worried they'll never release a true Pokemon MMO for a home console (though I've only bought one Pokemon game, the original Blue).

But I'd still like to make money like they do, even when they are considered a failure.  The GC was the worst selling system for them and that generation, yet they made more money than Sony and M$ during those years (partly because of the GBA, but they weren't losing money on the GC either).

[Louieturkey]

Personally, I'm so hyped for Pikmin 3 that as long as I get that I'll be satisfied with my purchase.

I think this is where I will be when Pikmin 3 is set for release.  If it's not a launch title, and I haven't bought a WiiU by the time it's set for release, I think I will get the system for this game alone.

[GoldenPhoenix]

In actual fact, this huge profit is probably the reason why Nintendo would once again make a limp wristed system.  They made a toybox with a CPU for nigh on free, slapped a Wii badge on it sold it for a (knowing Nintendo probably substantial) profit and watched their bank account exponentially grow.  Why not do the same thing again?

As long as the dollars roll in, who cares about the loyal followers who were there through the hard times.  If the average joe will pay them for toybox 0.5 with a shiny new gimmick than thats fine.

That is what worries me the most.  We keep hearing that the true follower is getting looked after, but nothing ever materializes except for the expected sequels.

Oh I agree here.  I got bored and fed up with the Wii 3 years ago.  Yes, I've bought the occasional game here or there, but nothing like what I buy for the PS3 or PC. 

I've always bought the Nintendo system each generation first.  This time, I am definitely waiting, especially if the system is only slightly more powerful than the PS360. 

I'm afraid Nintendo will only think about their profit margins and try to cater once again only to the "casual" demographic.  I'm worried they will still leave things out of the WiiU that are standard with the PS360 because it wouldn't benefit them monetarily.  I'm worried they will gimp the system to make sure they make a profit at launch on the system itself.

I'm also worried they'll never release a true Pokemon MMO for a home console (though I've only bought one Pokemon game, the original Blue).

But I'd still like to make money like they do, even when they are considered a failure.  The GC was the worst selling system for them and that generation, yet they made more money than Sony and M$ during those years (partly because of the GBA, but they weren't losing money on the GC either).

The lack of true Pokemon RPGs on a home console system does bother me. I'd love to have them do one, if Game Freak is uncomfortable doing it, I'd give it to Monolith Soft to develop.

[Louieturkey]

The lack of true Pokemon RPGs on a home console system does bother me. I'd love to have them do one, if Game Freak is uncomfortable doing it, I'd give it to Monolith Soft to develop.

Monolith Soft would make an awesomely epic Pokemon MMO.

[GoldenPhoenix]

The lack of true Pokemon RPGs on a home console system does bother me. I'd love to have them do one, if Game Freak is uncomfortable doing it, I'd give it to Monolith Soft to develop.

Monolith Soft would make an awesomely epic Pokemon MMO.

I really want to see Monolith be successful with Nintendo, while I haven't played it, Xenoblade sounds like one of the best RPGs around, not just on Wii. With the Pokemon name you know it would sell amazing, people could care less who developed it as long as it appears to be a mainline Pokemon game.

[Caterkiller]

No real offense to people who are actually putting stock in the rumors(because I am just as guilty of getting excited over the good rumors) but some of you people are just sheep.

It's like when you watch the news and you hear "New study says if you take 1 fish oil pill a day, your risk of heart diseases will be lower." Fast forward 1 year later "New study says if you take 1 fish oil pill a day, your risk of heart diseases will be higher." And people just go "oh me of my!" They have no idea what is true! When all that technical jargon is being thrown at us, the majority of the time we can only take some scientists word for it. Even the reporters reporting on it and the whole darn news crew don't even know whats truly up. You can't just get frantic every time you hear some new rumor, because how the hell do you honestly know? Following random literal nobodies like it's gospel? Come on now!

The difference between the fish oil analogy and the Nintendo rumors is that we have actual facts and product to go by  to do actual research ourselves! Quit acting like you aint got no god damn sense! I can look at Aliens, Darksiders, that Ghost Recon, and even the word of Ubisoft who say's Assassins Creed 3 won't look any different on the Wii U and I can make my on intelligent assessment of the situation. Who has gone on record to say bad things about the Wii U other than analysts? Which developer who has even the oldest kits(assuming) has said it doesn't perform as well as the PS360? Weren't the first things we were hearing long time ago was that it was structured like a 360 so porting games was very easy?

[Chozo Ghost]

In all seriousness.  I think I enjoyed the GC generation over the Wii anyday.  I just seemed to have more fun with it.  I dont know why.  It was the only system I had.  I didn't need an Xbox or a PS2.  The cube was enough.  And I didnt have a good PC in those days either. 

That's how it was for me. People talk about the "dark times" of the GC era, but the GC was a system I loved deeply, and I never once felt I needed to get a PS2 or Xbox. Sure, the GC missed out on a lot of stuff, but it still kept me happy and satisfied.

The Wii is another story. This marks the first time I've ever felt the need to own another system because of Nintendo's system not being good enough.

So I don't understand when people talk about the GC being some dark time. If anything it was a bright and happy time, and now is the real dark time of Nintendo. Maybe the company has made record profits from it, but as a fan and a gamer this is without a doubt my least favorite Nintendo console. The GC may have had its issues, but I've had far more fun with that than I've ever had with my Wii.

[Evan_B]

I really want to see Monolith be successful with Nintendo, while I haven't played it, Xenoblade sounds like one of the best RPGs around, not just on Wii. With the Pokemon name you know it would sell amazing, people could care less who developed it as long as it appears to be a mainline Pokemon game.

Xenoblade is, by far, the best RPG of the past decade. There's no ifs, ands, or buts about it. It easily surpasses the trash that Square Enix has put out in the past few years in terms of gameplay and story.

If Monolith had to make a Pokemon game, I'd be okay with a similar battle system to Xenoblade, but instead have the arts be the moves that Pokemon normally learn. That would be sweet. And those environments. They would be massive.

BACK to the real discussion. I just feel that, as a company, Nintendo has made a statement that gives me plenty of hope- that they want to reconnect with the hardcore audience. I think that is a bold, but earnest thing to say, and it at LEAST implies that they know where they stand in the gaming community nowadays. Now, they dominate the casual market, and I believe they aren't just going to throw that away, but if you think about the Nintendo Network and the work that's gone into that concept, you can tell that there is an effort being made.

Honestly, I truly hope that launch provides something that is integrated with the Nintendo Network, because that's going to be a driving point of the system. But also, I think that Nintendo isn't going to say a thing about their specs at all, for reasons I stated in the talkback of today's article. They don't want Sony or Microsoft capitalizing on that- they want those companies to be as threatened as possible and blow as many resources trying to outdo them as possible and win out in the end. That's my opinion, though. Take it as you will.

[Kytim89]

Nintendo would be smart to not force their gimmicks onto third parties. This would have the advanatage of untying their hands when it comes to porting their games onto the Wii U.

[GoldenPhoenix]

No real offense to people who are actually putting stock in the rumors(because I am just as guilty of getting excited over the good rumors) but some of you people are just sheep.

It's like when you watch the news and you hear "New study says if you take 1 fish oil pill a day, your risk of heart diseases will be lower." Fast forward 1 year later "New study says if you take 1 fish oil pill a day, your risk of heart diseases will be higher." And people just go "oh me of my!" They have no idea what is true! When all that technical jargon is being thrown at us, the majority of the time we can only take some scientists word for it. Even the reporters reporting on it and the whole darn news crew don't even know whats truly up. You can't just get frantic every time you hear some new rumor, because how the hell do you honestly know? Following random literal nobodies like it's gospel? Come on now!

The difference between the fish oil analogy and the Nintendo rumors is that we have actual facts and product to go by  to do actual research ourselves! Quit acting like you aint got no god damn sense! I can look at Aliens, Darksiders, that Ghost Recon, and even the word of Ubisoft who say's Assassins Creed 3 won't look any different on the Wii U and I can make my on intelligent assessment of the situation. Who has gone on record to say bad things about the Wii U other than analysts? Which developer who has even the oldest kits(assuming) has said it doesn't perform as well as the PS360? Weren't the first things we were hearing long time ago was that it was structured like a 360 so porting games was very easy?

I think people just have gotten cynical. I honestly don't take much stock in the anonymous comments in regards its power, but a part of me can't help be a little worried considering how the Wii turned out power wise. On the flip side though there are people, like Epic, that have been saying positive things about the hardware's ability and they were hardly a fan of the Wii's power.

[Luigi Dude]

I think people just have gotten cynical. I honestly don't take much stock in the anonymous comments in regards its power, but a part of me can't help be a little worried considering how the Wii turned out power wise. On the flip side though there are people, like Epic, that have been saying positive things about the hardware's ability and they were hardly a fan of the Wii's power.

The thing everyone has to remember is the situation Nintendo was in when making the Wii and the Wii U is completely different.  The number one reason the Wii was as underpowered as it was is because the Gamecube was Nintendo's worst selling home console and Nintendo worried that their presence in the home console market was dying.  The whole point of the Wii was to see if they could do something radically different to try and become popular again, but in a way that wouldn't sink the company if it failed.  This is why the Wii was just a Gamecube with more RAM because if the system only sold 10 million units, the losses would be very minimal compared to what a way more powerful systems losses would be.  And in 2005, there was a real chance Nintendo's next system could have only sold 10 million or less.

These were the sales of Nintendo's home consoles before the Wii.

NES - 61 million

SNES - 49 million

N64 - 33 million

Gamecube - 22 million

Seriously, Nintendo didn't have a time machine in 2005 when they were making the Wii.  They had no idea the Wii would be as popular as it did.  If Nintendo had released the Wii with power similar to the 360/PS3 and it only sold 10 million units, it would have been a disaster that would have cost Nintendo billions of dollars.  People have to remember that Nintendo's home console brand had been severally weakened during the Gamecube era and so there's a reason Nintendo wasn't willing to risk a lot of money on their next home console because they worried it might do worse then the Gamecube.

For the Wii U though, it'll be the successer to the Wii which is Nintendo best selling home console by far.  By the time the Wii U comes out, the Wii will have sold around 100 million units, with it's top selling games managed to sell over 20-30 million copies each.  The Wii completely revitalized Nintendo's home console presence and made it stronger then ever, which is why Nintendo can afford to actually make the Wii U a more powerful system this time because the risks with the Wii U are way less then the risk with the Wii were.

[GoldenPhoenix]

I think people just have gotten cynical. I honestly don't take much stock in the anonymous comments in regards its power, but a part of me can't help be a little worried considering how the Wii turned out power wise. On the flip side though there are people, like Epic, that have been saying positive things about the hardware's ability and they were hardly a fan of the Wii's power.

The thing everyone has to remember is the situation Nintendo was in when making the Wii and the Wii U is completely different.  The number one reason the Wii was as underpowered as it was is because the Gamecube was Nintendo's worst selling home console and Nintendo worried that their presence in the home console market was dying.  The whole point of the Wii was to see if they could do something radically different to try and become popular again, but in a way that wouldn't sink the company if it failed.  This is why the Wii was just a Gamecube with more RAM because if the system only sold 10 million units, the losses would be very minimal compared to what a way more powerful systems losses would be.  And in 2005, there was a real chance Nintendo's next system could have only sold 10 million or less.

These were the sales of Nintendo's home consoles before the Wii.

NES - 61 million

SNES - 49 million

N64 - 33 million

Gamecube - 22 million

Seriously, Nintendo didn't have a time machine in 2005 when they were making the Wii.  They had no idea the Wii would be as popular as it did.  If Nintendo had released the Wii with power similar to the 360/PS3 and it only sold 10 million units, it would have been a disaster that would have cost Nintendo billions of dollars.  People have to remember that Nintendo's home console brand had been severally weakened during the Gamecube era and so there's a reason Nintendo wasn't willing to risk a lot of money on their next home console because they worried it might do worse then the Gamecube.

For the Wii U though, it'll be the successer to the Wii which is Nintendo best selling home console by far.  By the time the Wii U comes out, the Wii will have sold around 100 million units, with it's top selling games managed to sell over 20-30 million copies each.  The Wii completely revitalized Nintendo's home console presence and made it stronger then ever, which is why Nintendo can afford to actually make the Wii U a more powerful system this time because the risks with the Wii U are way less then the risk with the Wii were.

Fair point, and yeah I do realize it was likely necessary for Nintendo to do what they did with the Wii. I just think the more "core" gamer like those who are on this board are just a bit gun shy about it though. Wii U will probably be just fine, even if some of us may be kind of gun shy with some of the rumors floating around.

[Chozo Ghost]

The Wii completely revitalized Nintendo's home console presence and made it stronger then ever,

Game Informer magazine wrote in an issue a few months ago that the Wii is "irrelevant". That's their words not mine. But when you look at a list of upcoming games right now there's very little if anything for the Wii, but meanwhile there is tons of stuff coming to the PS360 and handhelds. The Wii is number one in marketshare by a wide margin, but you wouldn't guess that based on how little software support it is seeing.

[Mop it up]

I think this is a sign of the real damage that Microsoft and now Sony have caused to gaming. Since they broke the bank beefing up the hardware of their systems, people now expect every game system to be like that. Now, if there's even any profit margin on a Nintendo system whatsoever, the perception is that Nintendo is being cheap and conservative, and isn't giving consumers enough.

The game industry can't survive on this model. The only reason both Sony and Microsoft are still in the game is because they have other departments to draw profit from if their gaming division bleeds money. Now, Nintendo may have huge cash reserves thanks to the Wii and DS, but things aren't that simple because of shareholders. Nintendo cannot afford to create a machine that sells for a loss. They can't afford to go a generation losing billions of dollars, as they have no other division from which to pull money and stay afloat. If Nintendo doesn't make a profit, they go out of business. That isn't being cheap, that's doing what it takes to survive. It's as simple as that.