Topic: The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt*

[Chozo Ghost]

Nintendo could have made a Trading Places* bet with Sega on this generation for a total profit of $1 and still made more money than both Sony & MS combined.

That was true at one time back when both systems were selling at a huge loss, but hasn't both the 360 and PS3 moved into the black since then?

[Stogi]

Here is a good article on nine things the Wii 2 needs to be successful:
 
http://mediarushes.com/2011/05/04/nine-things-nintendo-needs-to-do-with-wii-2/

It's funny, even though Nintendo has continually made a profit off of every system they've made (sans the VB), we don't really consider many of them to be successful. I think we all hark back to the SNES days and recall how great everything was. The Golden Age in Gaming. That was when Nintendo was really successful. As a result, we try to build similarities and correlations as proof of what Nintendo needs to do to repeat that golden age, but I do not think we understand the underlying reason for that success in the first place. It was successful because it was exactly what people AND developers wanted. It was a rare time, where both type of consumers came together. It flourished both in sales and support, and Nintendo was making hand over fist from both sides of the equation. The only time this has happened again was during the PS2 era (another era we draw proofs).

So naturally, anytime we talk about Nintendo success, we talk about third parties, we talk about support. But third parties are only half the equation - the half we can't do anything about. So all the talk about new systems and wishful thinking boils down to what can Nintendo do to attract more third parties. It's like a magical solution that once that is resolved, we will again experience an SNES-like golden age of games. But if that truly was all they needed to do, then Nintendo would have became Apple a long time ago; with dirt cheap development costs, virtual market support, and instant sales data and gains. That is not Nintendo.

Nintendo is different. Out of every system maker, they do not have an ulterior motive. They don't want to take over your living room. They don't want to be your central media hub. They didn't even want you to play DVD's. All they want is for you to play games everyday. That philosophy isn't going to change. Everything else is an after thought.

So in keeping with Nintendo's philosophy, how do you build a system that both people and developers will enjoy?

The two are almost always at odds with each other and I don't think building a more powerful 360 with a dash of Nintendo, as that article implies, will do it.

[Ian Sane]

It's funny, even though Nintendo has continually made a profit off of every system they've made (sans the VB), we don't really consider many of them to be successful.

That's because we're not Nintendo shareholders.  We view "success" from our perspective.  A system is "successful" if it has great games, strong third party support, and is popular within gamer culture.
 
It's no different then how someone might say a sequel to a popular movie was a failure because it was widely panned and nobody likes it.  But it still made a profit.  To us that is irrelevent - if the film sucks it failed because from our perspective a film is successful entirely if it entertains us.  At the same time a film can be a huge financially flop but succeed at being a great movie.
 
Nintendo's post-SNES systems have been regarded as "failures" because from the perspective of quality, which is all that truly affects us, they were.  Their poor third party support ensured that those systems were going to overall have a weak selection of games, with a handful of really awesome titles.
 
In the end these systems all fade away into the past.  Nintendo doesn't make any money from N64s or Gamecubes anymore.  So now, without any financial context, when gamers look back all that remains are the games and the systems are historical judged by that criteria.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Nintendo could have made a Trading Places* bet with Sega on this generation for a total profit of $1 and still made more money than both Sony & MS combined.

That was true at one time back when both systems were selling at a huge loss, but hasn't both the 360 and PS3 moved into the black since then?

You would have to start 360's tally in 2005 & PS3's in 2006.


Nintendo could cover both of their losses (twice) and still have made a profit

[Adrock]

It's funny, even though Nintendo has continually made a profit off of every system they've made (sans the VB), we don't really consider many of them to be successful.

That depends on who you're asking. Nintendo consoles have always been very good to me, but I buy them for Nintendo games. Not that I don't buy 3rd party games, I do and I'd buy more if there were more I wanted available, but Nintendo releases great games and as long as they keep doing that, I'll keep buying hardware from them. Ideally, I would only buy one console. My issue with Nintendo is that they're often holding themselves back. They make some questionable moves which prevents me from being cheap and only buying 1 console for my gaming needs/urges. Despite that, I find them plenty successful.

[Stogi]

I agree. My favorite system wasn't the SNES, but the N64. Why? Because it was exactly what I wanted in a game system - four controllers and a way to metaphorically kill and humiliate my friends.

[Mop it up]

How come whenever Square Enix releases the old DQ games DQ IV is often left out?  Why not include all the NES games?  Yeah we got a remake recently but the old 8-bit DQIV is one of the most obscure NES games.

It's because the first three games all have a related story, while the fourth game is completely different. They make up the Erdrick Trilogy, so putting number IV together with them would make no sense outside of it appearing on the same system.

[Kytim89]

Isn't it true that if Nintendo were to include a Blu Ray drive without an HDD to install games onto then load times would increse? It appears to me that Nintendo being the keeper of efficiency that they are would be attracted to the ability to keep load times low when games are becoming biiger in terms of memory requirements.
 
Also, Nintendo would be smart to include an HDD into their console to appease third parties. The best way to appease third parties is to allow them to put as much of their DLC as possible onto a gamer's system. This has worked out well for both and Microsoft and has become a market trend, so Nintendo would be smart to adopt it as their standard in order to get more support from third parties.
 
The truth is that flash memory is still too cost prhibitive for the average gamer to use as a replacement hard drive. I agree with Nathan that a 32GB SD card is more expensive than a 320GB laptop hard drive. Nintendo would be smart to include support for all modern storage devices and let the consumer sort it out themselves.
 
If Nintendo want to be the market leader again with the Super Wii then they are going to have to adopt market trends. I can not stress this enough that things such as mass storage, adequate online and high definition graphics are no longer a luxery, but a mandatory features that when not given sufficient support can make or break a console. I respect Nintendo's business policies, but I may not buy thier next home console if I have to miss out on all the good DLC that is prolific on their competitor's systems.

Edit:

Wrong thread...again.

[Adrock]

Assuming Nintendo goes Blu-Ray, they could use a higher speed Blu-Ray drive.

Not sure Nintendo would include a HDD, but you never know. They should support it though. They should also consider supporting SSD. I recently read an article stating that consumer SSD cards are expected to be roughly $1 per GB in mid-late 2012 so the prices are dropping. If Nintendo included an SSD, the price would be even lower, but again, not sure they would include one, especially if they probably aren't willing to include a HDD.

[BlackNMild2k1]

8GB of onboard flash is basically an SSD, so if they then pack in another quality 8GB SD card (class 10), then the need for a HDD by >70% of the gaming populace has been satisfied.

But I am of the belief that not only will SDHC & SDXC cards be cheap enough by end of 2012 to not really trip at spending $30-$50 for 64-128GB (less than the price of a current HD game), but HDD support will be there from day one even if a HDD is not including in the base SKU.

I personally feel that 8GB onboard storage is enough space for 95% of developers to consider the space useful and use it as a standard feature for every game (8GB onboard should be reserved for data caching and game needs). Since I believe Nintendo will follow the 3DS lead and include an additional 8GB of flash pre-installed, every base SKU will come with 16GB of usable storage space and every Developer will know they have access to at least 8GB of space regardless of the system. (8GB pre-installed would be for game saves, DLC, VC/Warez and other stuff that the user fills it with)

And I feel like this has already been addressed before, but one of the main reasons for having a HDD in the first place, especially a large one like 250GB, was for game installs. But you have to ask why you would be installing games in the first place... the Bluray drive is really slow in the PS3 as it's a 1st gen drive. Installing of games was a way to overcome the bottleneck that was the Bluray drive transfer/read speed. Nintendo using a faster 6-8X drive would eliminate the need for HDD installs except for those that just don't want to deal with a disc period, for those people, I still believe HDD support will happen out of the box, you just have to supply your own HDD (which I'm sure any person is such a position would rather do than be charged a premium for lower HDD storage than what their dollar could actually buy).

[Chozo Ghost]

Even when you can install the game to the disc you are still always required to have the game disc in the drive in order to play the game. Its not necessary for any technical reasons, but the game companies don't want you to be able to just borrow your friends game and then copy it to the hard drive and return the game and basically have a free copy of the game which is playable from the hard drive. So that's certainly not going to happen.

[Sarail]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27758388&postcount=614


This comes from NeoGAF, who claims to have a source close to Nintendo. Grain of salt. Indeed.  Would be awesome, though! And I could really believe a good portion of that list, too. Crazy.

[Shaymin]

I know Tekken's a multiplat franchise, but I'm still questionable on anything Tekken coming to a Nintendo platform. Also, the poster's banned...

[BlackNMild2k1]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=27758388&postcount=614


This comes from NeoGAF, who claims to have a source close to Nintendo. Grain of salt. Indeed.  Would be awesome, though! And I could really believe a good portion of that list, too. Crazy.

I saw that earlier and it seemed even less likely than that 4chan list, so I just ignored it....
I mean it's possible, but since it couldn't be traced back to anybody with something to lose ("internet cred"), I just chose not to post it. Alot of the stuff on there would shut the internet down for so long that everyone, including Sony, would forget all about PSN.


edit: might as well just post it here

A personal acquaintance of mine sent me this list, saying it came from a source close to Nintendo. It's probably fake, but I figured I'd share anyway:

--First Party--
::Launch Games::
Extreme Sports Cafe ("New" IP, Combines 1080 and Wave Race + Other Sports)
Pikmin Cafe (Interfaces with Pikmin 3DS)
Endless Ocean Cafe
Nintendogs Cafe Kennel (Interfaces with Nintendogs + Cats)
Mii Explore (New IP, Multiplayer Adventure Game)

::Launch Window::
Kirby's Epic Yarn 2 (Launch Window, Multiplayer)
Wario Ware Cafe (Launch - Launch Window?)

::Future Games::
Super Mario Cafe (Late 2012/Early 2013, Paradigm Shift ala SM64)
Legend of Paper Zelda (Mid 2012, Paper Mario version of SNES Zelda)
Fire Emblem Cafe (Late 2012)
Retro Studios IP (Late 2012, New IP)
Project Sora IP (New IP)
Monolith Soft RPG (New IP)
Miyamoto Game (New IP)

--Third Party--
::Launch Games::
Battlefield 3 (Extra Content)
Street Fighter X Tekken (Timed Exclusive)
SSX
Super Monkey Ball Cafe
Tony Hawk Cafe
Ridge Racer Cafe
Mass Effect 3 (Possibly with ME 1 + 2?)
InVersion
Dragons Dogma
Tom Clancy's Ghost Recon: Future Soldier
Metal Gear Solid: Rising (Extra Content)
Silent Hill: Downpour (Extra Content)
PES 2013 Cafe (Timed Exclusive)
Trauma Center Cafe

::Launch Window::
Modern Warfare 3
Grand Theft Auto V (Launch?, Timed Exclusive)
Dead Space Spin Off
Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles Cafe
Soul Caliber V (Extra Content)

::Future Games::
Sonic Cafe (Sonic Generations?)
Platinum Games IP (Bayonetta 2?)
Phantasty Star Online 2 (Late 2012?)
SEGA Game (? ? ?)

The Amazing Spider-Man: The Game
Rockstar Game (New IP?)
BioShock Infinite (Timed Exclusive)
Red Steel III
Beyond Good & Evil 2
Doom 4
Madden 2013 (Timed Exclusive)
Tiger Woods 13
Fight Night Cafe
Need for Speed Cafe
Level-5 Game (New IP)
Kingdom Hearts Cafe (Possibly KH3)
Square Enix Game (New IP)
Square Enix Game (? ? ?)
Grasshopper Game (New IP or No More Heroes 3)
Valve Game (Possibly a collection set + new game?)
Epic Games (New IP, Bulletstorm 2 or New Gears of War Trilogy exclusive to Cafe)




Once again, I can't confirm the validity of this information, but I figured it may be worth discussing, on the off chance that it's real.

[/i]

[broodwars]

^The 3rd Party games list on that post is so utterly impossible and implausible that it's kind of funny.  With the exception of "Legend of Paper Zelda" and Kirby's Epic Yarn 2 (that would never be a launch window game), that 1st Party list actually feels pretty likely.

[Ymeegod]

"Fire Emblem Cafe (Late 2012)"  I wish . 

Project Sora sounds interesting though, I wonder if that has anything to do with Kingdom Hearts?

[MegaByte]

Project Sora is the joint venture between Nintendo and Sakurai's Sora Ltd.

[broodwars]

Project Sora is the joint venture between Nintendo and Sakurai's Sora Ltd.

Didn't they reveal that that was Kid Icarus 3DS?

[MegaByte]

Project Sora is a "company." They are working on Kid Icarus: Uprising.

[Dasmos]

lol Legend of Paper Zelda. Crazy kids.

[Ceric]

I thought that the 3rd party list was pretty realistic.  Though I really doubt there be a PSO2 because I like the Gamecube one soooo much. (I have an insane amount of hours in single player and I had a network adapter just for the game but, people wanted to talk to much online.)

[BlackNMild2k1]

lol Legend of Paper Zelda. Crazy kids.

http://nintendopapercraft.blogspot.com/2008/10/minish-cap-link.html

I would probably buy it

[Louieturkey]

I thought that the 3rd party list was pretty realistic.  Though I really doubt there be a PSO2 because I like the Gamecube one soooo much. (I have an insane amount of hours in single player and I had a network adapter just for the game but, people wanted to talk to much online.)

PSO2 is being made.  It's right now only a PC game in Japan, but it's official.

[Spak-Spang]

I would be happy with 16-32 SSD would be more than enough if 8GB of it is reserved solely for caching games, and helping games run smoother or whatever companies might want to use that data for.  Then another 2-5-GB reserved for the OS and expansion and updates. 

The rest would be used for saves, downloadable content and whatnot...with the OS allowing all of these things to be streamed from the SD card to the 8GB memory available for developers to use.

[Stogi]

I hate what Video Game Systems have become. Back in the day, I didn't know how any of my game systems work. They just worked.

Now I feel invested in checking specs, like I'm buying a new computer.

**** blows these days. /old timer