Topic: The PATHETIC state of the gaming 'media'

[Peachylala]

Of course it matters! God forbid a good fighting game not made by Nintendo with half decent online is made for Wii! HEADS WILL ROLL!
 

I do think that a game that features characters this niche could probably stand to be a multiplatform title just to try to get as much profit as possible.

No. It won't. The HD crowd already have Street Fighter IV, and Tatsunoko vs. Capcom would have to be re-developed for the HD systems thus costing more and on top of the licensing for the anime side would've hurt Capcom if the game failed.
 
Many people just don't realize that the original TvC arcade game was developed on the WII ARCADE BOARD in Japan.
 

Tatsunoko vs. Capcom is a great game. Too bad it's on the Wii.

I stopped reading there.

This might make a fun game.
 
Super Mario World is a great game. Too bad it's on the Virtual Console.
 
Damn it, Nintendo ruins games they don't make!

[Urkel]

The Wii getting a worthwhile 3rd party game is always a bad thing.
 
How will the trolls be able to make clever jokes about their Wii collecting dust or being in a closet with the board games if they're playing it? It was highly inconsiderate of Capcom to not think of what releasing TvC would do to such memes.

[broodwars]

I was bored, so I decided to write a rebuttal comment on that Gametrailers Tatsunoko vs. Capcom article.  We'll see if it holds, but I'll repost the lengthy thing here in case it doesn't.

Reading the article, it seems to me the Subhead would be better written as "Tatsunoko vs. Capcom is a great game. Too bad it's only on the Wii." That and some other choice language make it appear that you have a problem with the game even being on the Wii in general, as if the Wii isn't deserving of such games.

For the most part, I don't understand the complaints of the article.You ask "why put a major fighting game on a platform whose online system is crippled." Yes, the Friend Code system is a major annoyance on Wii and will remain so until Nintendo creates its next system. We get it. The problem is, as funky as the Friend Code system is, that shouldn't preclude the Wii from having a quality online experience even if it lacks the accessibility of something like Xbox Live. Smash Bros.Brawl had a solid online experience regardless of Friend Codes,hampered not by the system but by poor online coding that created major lag problems. The Conduit, as poor->mediocre as that game was, had a solid online system once again hampered only by poor coding leading to lag and abuse by hackers.

As for the complaints about "dumbing down" the controls, I really don't see the big deal. Granted, I'm not a big fan of fighting games,but that's largely because I find them impenetrable as a genre. The reason I love the Smash Bros. series is that for all the chaos that's happening on-screen, I only had to worry about 2 attack buttons combined with different analog stick combinations. It was simple and accessible, as opposed to throwing in a "true fighting game" like Street Fighter where there can be 4+ attack buttons and I just can't keep track of it all. The last major fighting game I enjoyed was BlazBlue, which also used a simplified fighting system with 2 major attack buttons and a character-specific special attack button, so this sounds like a game up my alley.

Next up, I agree that this game should have gone multiplatform to achieve the largest audience possible given the obscurity of half its cast, but there's nothing wrong with the Wii having a good exclusive game. Also, a beautiful game is a beautiful game regardless of whether it's in HD or SD if the art design is strong. I was just recently replaying Final Fantasy X on my PS3, playing an SD game on an HD console and the game still shines graphically from strong art design

Tatsunoko vs. Capcom does many things well, but none of them are related to the Wii. If anything, the fact that the game is on the Wii sours what is otherwise a terrific experience. Reviewers have largely praised the game, calling it a standout fighting game on a system lacking good fighters.

So because it doesn't do anything Wii-specific (presumably with motion controls) it doesn't deserve to be called a good game? What exactly about being on the Wii makes it a bad game? I don't think you've answered that question. Instead, I see complaints that there areaspects of the game that could be better with the features of the HD consoles. Indeed they could be, but that doesn't make the game on Wii bad in itself.

As for your final comment on the futility of bringing quality core games to Wii, developers need to keep trying. 3rd parties have treated core gamers on the Wii poorly since the Wii launched, tossing us a fewtable scraps every year while they chase the Casual Dream. The end result after years of cheap spinoffs (many in the lightgun genre) and quality products sent out into obscurity with no marketing whatsoever is a lack of trust in 3rd parties to deliver a quality core experience,and sales suffer. That won't change until 3rd parties show that they are willing to consistently put the AAA effort into their Wii titles that they would put into an HD title. How can there be a user base for quality core titles on Wii if 3rd parties do not release quality core titles on it?

Ok, I'm never trying that again.  The system just bunched together most of the words when I pasted my comment in here, so I had to go back and fix all of it.  Ugh...

EDIT: And I got a response.  The author of the original post admitted that he chose the wrong words to articulate his position in places.

[BlackNMild2k1]

good thing you didn't use stuff like bold and changing the size of text.
the system messes with that too..  it's a mess to clean up and sometimes takes multiple edits.

[Peachylala]

And I got a response.  The author of the original post admitted that he chose the wrong words to articulate his position in places.

I can imagine that if he decided to join our forums right now, he would have to be prepared for a Pro Daisy ass kicking.

[D_Average]

I always thought Craig Harris was a decent journalist, but I gotta call him out on this Sonic and Sega All Star Racer review.  Though its clear in his writing the review is supposed to cover the game on three different platforms, he hardly elaborates one any one of them.  Then to top it off, all three get the exact same score.  Just pure laziness.  At the very least, he could have had a different final break down for each one.

Review
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/107/1071572p1.html

[KDR_11k]

Why, do they differ?

[D_Average]

Why, do they differ?

I haven't played the Wii version, but like all other multiplatform games, the Wii version is usually significantly different than its HD counterpart.

[KDR_11k]

If the difference isn't in more than graphics it wouldn't really be necessary to mention in a review.

[Peachylala]

Why, do they differ?

I haven't played the Wii version, but like all other multiplatform games, the Wii version is usually significantly different than its HD counterpart.

If anything, Sonic Unleashed is basically this. Think the PS3/360 versions as Donkey Kong Country and the Wii version as Donkey Kong Land.

Do people still think IGN can properly review anything nowadays? WHY?

[vudu]

If the difference isn't in more than graphics it wouldn't really be necessary to mention in a review.

Motion controls?

[D_Average]

If the difference isn't in more than graphics it wouldn't really be necessary to mention in a review.

Motion controls?

Exactly.  Motion controls completely changes the experience.  On top of that, you have the online experience which is dramatically different on all three systems.  A separate review is completely necessary.  One review for all three is useless and a complete waste of everybody's time.

[Shaymin]

I wish I was making this up:
http://tinypic.com/view.php?pic=2hf18j6&s=6

[BlackNMild2k1]

I wish I was making this up:

Someone should tell him that he could probably get a body pillow of it made.

[D_Average]

IGN is part of the Internet. This is standard protocol.

[KDR_11k]

Lol Samus monologue. Yeah, that baby must've been the most shocking thing in your life, unlike, say, the entire species of your surrogate parents being wiped out.

[D_Average]

This guy isn't a real journalist, but enough people read him that I think posting his latest rant in here makes sense.
http://seanmalstrom.wordpress.com/2010/02/25/now-we-know-why-giant-world-wasnt-in-mario-5/

He's throwing a poop fit over Galaxy 2 getting the "giant world" and "Mario 5" allegedly nothing but getting table scraps.  Oh...where to begin....

[King of Twitch]

This guy isn't a real journalist, but enough people read him that I think posting his latest rant in here makes sense.
http://seanmalstrom.wordpress.com/2010/02/25/now-we-know-why-giant-world-wasnt-in-mario-5/

He's throwing a poop fit over Galaxy 2 getting the "giant world" and "Mario 5" allegedly nothing but getting table scraps.  Oh...where to begin....

I'll try.

Now we know why Giant World wasn’t in Mario 5

It is because Mario Galaxy Expansion Pack stole it.

I'm assuming Mario 5 = NSMBW? I guess he doesn't count the Super Mario Lands, Yoshi's Island, Super Mario Sunshine, Super Mario Galaxy, or NSMB DS as Mario? Only one of them is "Mario 4"?

For Mario 5, what we got instead was a generic mountain level or a generic ice level or something else like that.

I sympathize.

As for the rest, here's a summary: he assumes Nintendo began work on another 2D Mario after Super Mario World, only to delay it for 18 years and somehow turn it into New Super Mario Brothers Wii, which he calls generic.

He complains that a level design from Super Mario Brothers 3 wasn't shoehorned into New Super Mario Brothers Wii, though it appeared previously in Super Mario 64; but he considers 3D Mario a failure and probably never played it, and it wouldn't matter if he did since Nintendo "hasn't made anything ‘creative’ in terms of an imaginary universe since the 1980s".

So he wants Nintendo to be creative by ripping off Super Mario Brother 3 and take the development resources of the failed 3D games and putting them into orchestrated music and nice graphics for the next 2D Mario.

I'm assuming his parents went through a nasty divorce sometime around 1996 and associates 2D gaming with peace and happiness; a time when his parents still loved him... a time right before he destroyed his brain with illegal substances.

EPILOGUE: It doesn't matter, he's not going to be playing any more games since they went with the new DVD cases.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I take it the thread titled "The Smartest Man on the Internet" was made in jest?
I haven't really read through that thread nor about the person it was made about, but it must be a joke right?

[KDR_11k]

I'm assuming Mario 5 = NSMBW? I guess he doesn't count the Super Mario Lands, Yoshi's Island, Super Mario Sunshine, Super Mario Galaxy, or NSMB DS as Mario?

It's short for Super Mario Bros 5. Only console 2D Marios count (Land games never counted into the console numbering and 3D Mario is simply an entirely different game that shares some characters) and the Yoshi games don't play like SMB at all. SMW was subtitled SMB4 somewhere. He doesn't claim Nintendo actually worked on NSMBW for 18 years, just that it's been that long since the last console 2D Mario game (SMW). 3D Mario simply isn't the same series as 2D Mario, it's a completely different kind of game. What Malstrom does complain about is that NSMBW got treated like some kind of side dish with unimaginative worlds (compare the usual fire, ice, jungle, etc to something like SML2 with its giant house, tree, submarine and whale, ...) and Midi sound while Galaxy gets all the big ideas and a fully orchestrated soundtrack. Is there a real reason why NSMBW couldn't have had an orchestrated soundtrack too?

[NinGurl69 *huggles]

It was made on a strict budget and schedule.  It's old and new, what's old is now new, but can't make it too new just for the sake of being new new.

[BeautifulShy]

BlackNMild the topic you are talking about was made back in 2008. Alot of things happening back then he was on top of before it even happened. If you read what he has to say and frame it in the timeframe of when it was posted it makes lots of sense.

[Luigi Dude]

Is there a real reason why NSMBW couldn't have had an orchestrated soundtrack too?

Because the people doing the music for NSMBW didn't feel they needed one.  Seriously, the only reason Galaxy had an orchestrated soundtrack in the first place is because it's composer, Mahito Yokota wanted to have one and he had to beg Miyamoto to spend money on one.  Because of his dedication, he was able to convince Miyamoto to allow it.  Had Yokata not wanted an orchestra, then Galaxy's soundtrack would have been entirely MIDI. 

If the people working on NSMBW soundtrack really wanted an orchestra, they could have gotten one too.  But they were just fine with MIDI and so that's why the game has MIDI music.  Every time a Nintendo game doesn't have orchestrated music, people have to stop pointing at Mario Galaxy and saying there's no excuse when in reality there is.

Most of Nintendo's in house composers have always composed soundtracks with MIDI and prefer to use MIDI music in their games.  Yokota on the other hand, used to work for Koei and did music for games that used orchestrated soundtracks.  So it's no surprise that he would want to use an orchestra for games he does at Nintendo since he is use to using orchestra's for his games soundtracks.  Unlike a lot of Nintendo's in house composers who have only done soundtracks in MIDI and so have no problem continuing to do their soundtracks in MIDI.

[mac<censored>]

I don't understand the whole infatuation people seem to have with real orchestras in game music anyway... there's tons of great midi tunes.

Not that orchestrated music is bad, it isn't, it's just that there's nothing inherently superior about it, and yet many people seem to act as if there was.  I get the feeling it's more mindless "ooh, more expensive == better" than actual taste....

[Ok, so that puts it in line with most game criticism -- mindless dick waving by insecure people with no taste....]

[Kairon]

Honestly, with so many people buying GH3 for the Wii without noticing it only had mono sound... I doubt orchestrated music is a high-priority value amongst consumers.