Topic: PSP vs. DS ... Final Verdict (G4)

[RickPowers]

http://www.g4tv.com/xplay/features/51374/Verdict_Sony_PSP_vs_Nintendo_DS.html

The verdict (for those of you that are reading compared, is that the PSP wins out, though G4 admits that the comparison isn't entirely fair, because of the different markets they're aimed at.  Not unsurprisingly, the DS won in the Gameplay category only.  What was surprising is that the PSP won the VALUE category.  Why?  Because while the PSP costs more, the big-name exclusives they're getting, coupled with the inevitable price drop for the holidays makes it a really big deal.  As for the DS, while some big games are coming, the gameplay (Nintendo's hallmark) looks to be the same as what's already been done on the system ... meaning the "innovation" that the touchscreen was supposed to generate just isn't happening.

An interesting comment at the end of the article is what's pushed me to post this.  "The PSP's real competition will be the next iteration of the Game Boy, which is currently in the concept stages. And if rumors swirling around the industry are true, the PSP will have a tough fight on its hands when that day comes. But until then, the Nintendo DS is nothing more than a decent idea being used as a stop-gap to limit the sales of the Sony PSP until the next Game Boy is ready. But after people get Sony's slick machine in their hands, I question just how well the tactic will work."

What do you think about that?  Is the DS just keeping gamers busy (and attention diverted from the PSP) until the next GameBoy is released?  If it's really the third pillar, why add a GBA slot (a question Nintendo has never satisfactorily answered)?

[clevelandst124]

I can't believe that people judge the innovation of the ds after being out for almost 4 months after an extremely rushed launch.  A real judge of innovation should come after this holiday season.

Second gameplay is the only thing I actually care about.  I want a handheld to have the best games period.  If I want other multimedia accessories I'll buy the ones that are good, not an all in one shoddy package.

I also, don't think the next gameboy is coming out soon.  
1.  It'll kill the ds if this is true.  People will stop buying and developers will stop producing.
2.  It'll turn off Nintendo fans that forgave Nintendo for releasing the ds so close to the sp.  
3.  The next gameboy doesn't have as good of a chance to beat the PSP.  Maybe the ds doesn't have a good shot.  However, the next gameboy is 1 of 2 things.
1.The next $99 game boy.  If this is true, this is a sign that Nintendo is not trying to compete with the PSP.  Instead they are giving the high end hand held market to the PSP.  
2.It's an amazing console that we can guess will cost around the $250 that the PSP costs.  Then the question is why wait?  What would Nintendo bring to the table different than the PSP.  Sony has the third party support.  So if Nintendo brings out a direct competitor to the PSP it will probably be Gamecube vs. PS2 all over again.  A year late and third party support short.

That's why I think that Nintendo has to stay the course with the ds for now.  And the ds is doing well.  The PSP is currently leading in Japan, but prices are much closer in Japan.  I think the PSP cost about 25% more and games cost the same in Japan.  I'm surprised Nintendo is doing as well as they are given this.  In America, the PSP will cost about 67% more and games will cost 25% more.  I've been wrong before, but I think that is a very big deal and that Sony is overestimating thier good start in Japan.

[KnowsNothing]

Isn't one console just keeping us busy until the next one?  Even if the DS is just a "filler" system, it's a damn good one that Nintendo's obvioulsy cares about (otherwise they wouldn't be taking it online..)

"Honestly, the Nintendo DS is barely capable of displaying serviceable 3D visuals."

I think that Mario 64  has "servicable" 3d visuals, and it's a launch title that wasn't even built for the system...

I found this to be a pretty poor article, but whatever. What bugs me the most is that people complain that the touchscreen may not be used in more innovative ways than it is now.  First of all, it will, but second of all- why does it need to?  The DS has all of these special features to give developers options- why do we complain when one of them isn't used?  Even if devs use the DS in the most uninspired way and don't make use of ANY of the extra feautres, what do you have? You have what you've been playing- contently- for years (arguably a PSP game...)  

[Caterkiller]

I don't care what I read or what Nintendo said about the DS being a 3rd pillar and what not, I am pretty sure this is basicly our next gameboy. We won't be seeing a new Nintendo handheld for quite some time.

I didn't see what you saw but I did see how the Judgement Day guys compared the PSP to the DS at last years E3, and just made it seem like the DS was very poor in comparison to the DS. Im pretty confident that later on down the road the PSP will not be nearly as great as its cracked up to be. I would never pay 50 bucks a pop for any single handheld game, and I doubt that most folks who did/do buy handheld games often would be so willing either.

If future DS titles can be as cool and entertaining from the get-go like Yoshi Touch and Go, then I have no doubt that the DS will eventualy be the handheld system to own.  Though things are different now'a days, this is alot like the cool-color-screen-black Game Gear VS the ugly-no-colores-but-green/gray Game Boy.

[ruby_onix]

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...coupled with the inevitable price drop for the holidays...

It really seems surprising to me how many people are banking on that. Especially when most of the reports about the PSP's profitability (which is apparently of ABSOLUTELY no concern to any real gamer) suggest that it ain't gonna happen for quite a while.

The problem with the videogaming media is that they seem to have zero regard for price right now. And why would they? They're all hardcore types who will get both the DS and the PSP, no matter the cost.

I was watching the Electric Playground the other day, and Tommy and Vic had a face off between the DS and PSP. "Which one is better?" The PSP "is better", they concluded. But not once did they even mention the price difference. They touted the "amazing multimedia abilities" of the PSP. But they didn't mention that to take advantage of those abilities, you need to buy a Memory Stick that costs about as much as the DS does by itself.

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But until then, the Nintendo DS is nothing more than a decent idea being used as a stop-gap to limit the sales of the Sony PSP until the next Game Boy is ready.

Everyone seems to want to pidgeonhole the DS as merely a "stop-gap" device, saying that the PSP's philosophy (losing bucketloads of money to bring handheld technology even with consoles) is the "right" future, and that Nintendo knows it but won't admit it.

(BTW, I do agree that Nintendo timed the DS's release to be a "PSP spoiler", but I don't see anything wrong with that.)

Personally, I think the traditional GameBoy "inferiority" has a place in the videogame world. Rare is well-known for using their handheld team as a "training ground" for their "real" game development. GameArts' Lunar 3 has been in development-limbo on the PS2 for years. Now it's coming out for the DS. Because they can handle making a DS game, more than they can a cutting-edge one. The guys who made Shantae on the GBC had a GBA sequel in the works, but they couldn't get it published. They're trying again on the DS. Does anyone think they could possibly put together a PSP or Xbox2 game? Theoretically, more powerful hardware makes making any game easier, but everyone always raises the bar of what's considered "acceptable". Especially Sony.

The PSP is interchangable with the PS2. Except that you have to buy your games twice (GT4). And we've already seen at least one PSP "killer app" get quietly turned into a PS2 game (Project Melfes/Tales of Legendia). What's the biggest rumor regarding the so-called "next GameBoy"? That it's a portable GameCube. Sure, that'd be nice, but really, what's the point? Is it worth killing off the handheld industry as we know it?

IMO, the DS is the next GameBoy. We may or may not see some sort of "next GameBoy" in name, but the DS is the next GameBoy in spirit.

I'm really not trying to rag on the PSP. I think it's really nice. I'd get one if I had the money (although I'd get a DS first). But it just seems that the Sony hype-machine is running in overdrive. It's putting the PS2 launch hype to shame, and that's really saying a lot.

[SgtShiversBen]

I think the reason why we see the GBA cart slot in the DS is because they're finally going to kill of the cart thing in general.  Have you looked how thin the DS would be if it didn't include that?  Folded it'd be like 3/4 inches thick.  That's really tiny.  

Also I think that they next GameBoy will use some sort of different type of media but won't put the backwards compatibility with it because the DS already has it.  It is a third pillar in that it carries on the GBA media (which developers can still use to port games for cheap prices) or make innovations that wouldn't work on a conventional system.  While on the other hand the next GB could (and I think would be great) play old GameCube games.  Not only would the system already have an installed user base of 15 million (plus Revvie owners) it'd do what Nintendo has wanted to do all along, and that is make the GameCube last for like 10 years.

If they can do it, I see no harm (besides development costs and all that, but that was what I was saying the DS would be for).  It gives developers the option of making cheap games on the GBA.  Middle cost games with innovations on the DS, or powerful handheld games for the GameBoy Cubed.  It's all there and doesn't make people pick which one they want.  The get the DS and are satisfied cause it plays a giant collection, or the get the PGC and also get a giant collection.

It's foolproof to me (though I am a fool).  

[RickPowers]

"It really seems surprising to me how many people are banking on that. Especially when most of the reports about the PSP's profitability (which is apparently of ABSOLUTELY no concern to any real gamer) suggest that it ain't gonna happen for quite a while."

Sony isn't concerned about the profitability of the hardware.  Sony is taking QUITE a loss, actually.  Sony is going to make it up not only on games (royalties) but also on movies released on the UMD format.  Remember, the royalties come UP FRONT, not when the movies are sold.  If the movies do well enough to induce studios to continue releasing movies (and audio, from what I hear) on the format, Sony could move into profitability remarkably fast compared to the PS2.

Anyway, why are people so sure that Sony will drop the price for the holidays?  Simple ... there is a lower cost "standard" PSP pack available in Japan already.  Sony dropping the extraneous accessories and lowering the price to $199 (which isn't really a price drop when you remove the case, headphones/remote, strap, cloth, and free copy of SpiderMan 2 UMD) is really a no-brainer.  A perceived price drop is still a lower price to most consumers.  In fact, by not bundling in the accessories, Sony might even be losing LESS money at that price point, but I'm not entirely sure.

Anyway, to get the thread back on track, I think I see what the author of the article is getting at.  On cursory examination, the gameplay for many of the "touch" games on DS look incredibly similar.  Never mind that on most consoles, you're either moving the stick, pressing a button, or a combination of the two.  The DS touch games have you tapping the screen, or drawing a line.  For some reason (and I have to include myself in this), people are starting to wonder when something besides the obvious will be done with the touchscreen.  Remember, while there are still games coming, the press has already seen, and in many cases PLAYED the upcoming games, and the gameplay is the same.  What does it say that Feel the Magic is almost identical to Wario Ware: Touched, which is identical to the mini-games in Mario 64 DS, etc, etc?  From what we've been shown, the new games coming play very similarly, with the only difference being the interval between taps or lines.

That's a very simplistic view, I'll admit, but I think that's the problem ... the games might very well be innovative, but they don't FEEL innovative.  People are saying that the next run of games that are online will fix that, but how can they when the PSP will already have had online games on a handheld?  Once you get past online, the only real avenue for innovation is going to be in how the two screens are used, but it's not looking good there either.

I want to like the DS ... I really do.  Mario 64 DS was an impulse purchase, because I wanted SOMETHING to show off the system to people.  But I have yet to find another game that will do that BETTER.

[jromz03]

I'm somewhat agree with G4's verdict.

Unless Nintendo shows us fresh and not rehashed games, and a REAL innovative use of the touch screen, the DS is nothing more than a stop-gap to halt the PSP's momentum.

Looks like Nintendo just handed the handheld market to Sony

[Caterkiller]

Yoshi is an amazing show off game. And playing does feel innovative.  

[Ian Sane]

"What do you think about that? Is the DS just keeping gamers busy (and attention diverted from the PSP) until the next GameBoy is released? If it's really the third pillar, why add a GBA slot (a question Nintendo has never satisfactorily answered)?"

I think Nintendo added the GBA slot because people asked for it.  It's like the Cube controller's z button and d-pad.  The original design didn't have those, people complained, so they added them.  The problem is they just threw a z button on and added the GBA d-pad.  They didn't actually get what people were asking for.  People didn't want a button called "z" they wanted a gun-like trigger like the N64 had.  People didn't just want a d-pad they wanted a method of digital control.  Here I think Nintendo misinterpretted what people were really asking for.  They just threw the slot on without link cable support or GBC playback.  What people really were asking for was the next Gameboy with full backwards compatibility.  They weren't asking for a "third pillar" with GBA support slapped in.

I used to think the DS was the next Gameboy because logically it makes no sense for it not to be.  But Nintendo has been very insistent on calling it a third pillar, despite the fact that almost everyone regards it as the next Gameboy and that at this point releasing the "real Gameboy" would be a total public relations nightmare.  I think they do regard it as the third pillar because there would be no explanation for their weird behaviour otherwise.

I don't think however that it's just a stop gap until the next Gameboy.  I truly think they think they can have three systems going at once with two being only marginally different from each other.  Of course the problem now is that Nintendo's perception of the situation is completely different than everybody else's.  If they release a new Gameboy any time soon people are going to think the DS is a lame duck and that Nintendo was trying to rip them off.  If they don't release a new Gameboy soon they're stuck with the DS which is not going to be able to compete with the PSP if it's just a niche gimmick system.

Nintendo's only option is to make the DS the next Gameboy by giving it the support they would give to it if it was the sole portable.  That means they have to expand the library beyond quirky touchscreen games.  They have to focus on releasing great portable games, even if they don't make use of the DS features.  The goal should be to release as many great games as possible.  If they use the touchscreen that's great.  If they don't, well, next time don't put extra stuff on a system without thinking up any good ideas that use it beforehand.  They're still a little screwed in that they promised innovation and haven't delivered yet and may never do so but having a kick ass portable that has great games is more important.

[Pale]

Rick, it amazes me you are so into this PSP thing that you would post a G4 write up...god I hate that network...

Anyway...

The PSP is going to sell..... but UMD movies are gonna take off like like Minidiscs...  Fool me once Sony, shame on you...  I won't be fooled twice.

Isn't the rumor that one of the main reasons for the leadership change up was because of Sony constantly trying to create these new standards?  Its just stupid really.  Even the gameboy video sells like crap, and thats targeting a demographic that can't afford portable dvd players.  Anyone who pays good money for a UMD is just dumb, like I was when I bought studio produced MiniDiscs back in the day.

My conclusion... G4 is to video games what the current MTV is to music, and the PSP will sell well but many of the non-gaming related features will be quickly forgotten.  

[Pale]

Another thing I would like to say is that it will be interesting to see not how much the PSP sells, but how much less both the DS and GBA sell.  I still think that less that 20 percent of total psp sales is going to be attributable to a decline in DS/GBA sales.

[kennyb27]

I've never watched G4, as I don't receive it on my cable plan, but it's obvious to me now why they are so often complained about.

For Value section:

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While its software library is weak so far, it's only a matter of time until all the third-party exclusives like Grand Theft Auto start rolling in.

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. The Nintendo DS has a weak library now, and it really doesn't look to be getting any better anytime soon. Sure, there's Castlevania and Mario Kart, but those games look to use the touch screen abilities in the same way they've been used already.

How can he put these two sentences in the same article, much less the same paragraph.  He's saying "well, both systems don't have good software right now, but the PSP will eventually and let's face it, the DS won't.  I won't take into account the many games that aren't announced yet."  As I look at the rest of this year for the DS I get really excited (despite my complaints of a lack of games recently), I can't wait for Nintendogs, Kirby, MarioKart, Animal Crossing, Pokemon, and many more I can't think of off the top of my head.  Yet, he justifies these games' releases by saying they will use the touch screen in the same way?  What the hell?!  I bet alot of PSP games use the analog stick to move characters around too.

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Couple that with a likely price drop around the holidays, and the PSP will go from must-have status symbol to mass market smash.

This part really made me scratch my head.  Even if the PSP drops it's price at the holidays, how will that help its value now?  The article is focusing on recommending a purchase now, isn't it?

More on a personal pet peeve side:  I guess they are comparing the systems as more than game machines, but why?  It is a sad day in the industry where a gaming machine gets points off because all it does is --get this-- play GAMES.

[Don'tHate742]

It really depends on what the new GameBoy is.

If it's a completely new system that tears away from the Gameboy line and ventures into a different world (ie using disks), then I think the DS can survive. People will buy the new Gamboy, but it's the DS that keeps the backwards-compatibility feature that the Gameboy line is known for. I also think that anyway you look at, yes, the DS is just keeping attention diverted from the PSP. But, and this is a big but (no pun intended), the DS  with it's new founded attention will allow it to continue even after the Gameboy is released. Those developers that can't afford to develope for high-powered console/handheld hybrids, can develope for the DS; a good alternative that provides a unique gaming experience. It also really depends on what can become of the DS, in terms of this new gaming experience. The PSP and GBE will bring the type of play already seen in consoles today; this is the DS's key to survival. It must show us something incredibly fun that can't be replicated on other consoles; a killer app in different gameplay, of sorts.

My theory is the new GB will use the mini-disk employed in the GC. This allows for the DS to keep it's backwards-compatibility with the GBA as a main purchasing factor. Nintendo (I hope) really thought out including the GBA slot. It at first makes them appear like they were puffing smoke, calling the DS "third-pillar". The DS isn't a GB, but looking at it's BWC, it's looking like one. People un-aware will take it for a new GB, and buy it as such. In Nintendo's book, that's great. It attracts attention away from the PSP, and slows down the eating of their marketshare, while still allowing the GBA to live on. The PSP essentially did the samething, but used confusion to attract sales. People are making the mistake of thinking that the PSP is actually a Portable PS2. It's not, yet it's gaining sales because of it. Nintendo can claim console-capability as fact and use that to their advantage. Add this to the backwards-capable Revolution, and you have a very usable piece of hardware, unlike the PSP. Also, Nintendo needs to release the new GB to directly compete with the PSP to completely irradicate it, and soon for that matter. The PSP will keep eating the marketshare, and there's really nothing the DS can do about it. They don't want to kill the DS though, and releasing a beautiful piece of GB hardware too soon will. The DS needs to mature into a great alternate gaming experience, for it is the answer to a very important Nintendo-made question.

That question is: How can we (Nintendo) keep attention away from the PSP long enough to ready the launch of the new GB, and at the same time keep two systems alive, when one is incredibly more powerful than the other? The answer: Launch a handheld that provides a very unique gaming experience, so unique in fact, that it can't be replicated and that it'll survive the stress caused by new handhelds that are essentially a super-upgraded GBA. Nintendo evidently thought about this alot. What can provide such a unique experience that it'll attract attention regardless of the appereance of super-handhelds? DS was their answer and we've all ready seen it competing well against the PSP. It'll only grab more attention with new titles, online functionality, and *gasp* PDA functions. The DS can also expand the market, allowing for two handhelds to coincide. It was a great answer to Nintendo's own question. It all comes to how Nintendo markets both now. When, where, and what capabilities, are huge questions that need to be thought out very thoroughly. If Nintendo rushes the launch of the GBE, it'll kill the DS before it has grabbed enough attention, in other words, matured. Same is true if they wait too long, the PSP will eat away Nintendo's market share for every month they don't release detials about the upcoming handheld. Nintendo needs to blow away the competion with a stellar DS show. Show us everything it is capable of and give us examples (games and such) that use these functions. Make people want the DS, for only then can it really slow the PSP's market-share grabbing. The DS must thrive this year (christmas especially).

Your probably wondering why they didn't just ready a new GB to launch with the PSP. Why release a system who's main function is to take away attention away from the PSP? Why not launch the GB in the first place? If the PSP is any evidence, it would of been terribly in three categories: Battery Life; Controls; Durability. Nintendo (I think) is perfecting this system as we speak. They are trying to get the most out of the battery life, while trying to keep the controls akin to the GC-controllers. That is why I don't expect it to release for a while. I do think though that it'll be revealed either next year at E3, which may be too soon. Two years from this years E3 sounds right. The DS in actuality has three main goals: Attract attention from the PSP, weaking it; Expand the market; Provide a unique experience, to allow it to live side-by-side with the new GB. 2 down, 1 to go!

[Mario]

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PSP is better than DS, DISCUSS

OK, U R RONG DS IS BETTER

Why exactly do some people think the next Gameboy will be so great? Because it will be powerful? Because there is nothing known about it, and the only thing anyone can assume is that it will be more powerful, and that that's it's job. They don't care that it will probably have a port as a launch title? Nobody cares that PSP has 90% ports as launch titles, so I guess not, all that matters is how many specs and teraflops it has. Graphic whores annoy me, there is no reason to look forward to the next Gameboy, we have the current Gameboy to play, the DS, and I think it's the best damn portable gaming system ever.

If the next Gameboy is a portable GameCube then it will easily be able to co-exist with the DS. I hope this portable GameCube turns into a reality.

PSP? I have a PS2, and i'm not interested in playing the same games outside.. oh wait PSP isn't meant to be played outside, well i'm not interested in playing the same games in a room without a tv. One thing that pisses me off about the PSP is that it's taking developer resources away from the PS2, I might think about buying Lumines for PS2, but there's no way i'm getting the PSP version, there is no game on PSP worth $300 US, and looking at all the games coming soon, I doubt there ever will be.

[Mario]

About the touch screen feeling the same with every game, it's because you're using the same input device. Does every GC game feel the same because they all use the same controller? No. Then why do people think the DS does? It has buttons too, it's interesting how in Super Mario 64 DS you use two completely different control methods, for the minigames I can put the DS down on a desk and just poke the screen to play, when i'm playing the main game I have to pick it up and hold it. I like the touch screen only mini games much more. That's also a reason why I love Wario Ware Touched so much, it's so easy to play and be comfortable with for me.

Rick, why don't you use Wario Ware Touched to show off your DS? When I show that to people they are amazed and they think the game is hilarious. It's the DS killer app as far as i'm concerned.

[Savior]

Its X-Play though, they were never really anti nintendo until recently. To me its one of the few watchable shows on the network,

"intended for the Nintendo DS to compete with the PSP, but it's inevitable that people (like you and I) would compare the two anyway.

The PSP's real competition will be the next iteration of the Game Boy,"


This is 100 percent correct. I disagree with the idea that the DS was only made to hurt the PSPS launch, i trully belive Nintendo intends that the DS be a third pillar.  But realistically the Portable GCN, the Gameboy Evolution will be the real competitor. Better graphics, larger library and probably either an internal Hard Drive, or integrated Play Yan. It will take back all the marketshare that Sony will gain.

I am worried the DS will be the casualty. Especially since i own a DS and it wasnt cheap. But i guess Mario Kart DS, Metroid Prime DS, Animal Crossing Online, it will hold me till 2006.

[RickPowers]

"The PSP is going to sell..... but UMD movies are gonna take off like like Minidiscs... Fool me once Sony, shame on you... I won't be fooled twice."

I think that Sony WISHES that UMD takes off like Minidiscs.  Minidiscs were INCREDIBLY popular in Japan.  It was only in the US that they didn't take off.  You guys really need to broaden your horizons a bit.

"Rick, why don't you use Wario Ware Touched to show off your DS? When I show that to people they are amazed and they think the game is hilarious. It's the DS killer app as far as i'm concerned. "

Because I don't own it.  I won't buy it, because I'll get maybe an hour or two of gameplay out of it, and I'll be done.  I also don't see how the games are any different than the last Wario Ware game, which I bought and finished very quickly.  Using the stylus does NOT make the game more fun.

Right there ... that right there is where Nintendo made the mistake with the DS.  I think that somewhere along the line, someone at Nintendo thought that using something different to interact with a game would make it inherently MORE FUN than using buttons.  It doesn't.  In fact, it's kind of tedious.  That little thumb-nubbin on the DS strap is also tedious.  It just doesn't work.  I had great hopes, but all the games so far are the exact same variation of drawing a line or rubbing the screen.  It's not new, it's not innovative, it's just another METHOD.

Let's see if I can come at this a different way ... There are a lot of PC accessories that have been released over the years that have aimed to improve gaming, many of them geared towards the first-person shooter crowd.  For the most part, the further they stray from the mouse/keyboard combo, the worse they do, even if they make the feel of the game more immersive.  Gamers rejected them, sometimes because they slowed reaction time, sometimes because they just didn't want to learn something else.  But invariably, it's because the devices didn't add any fun ... they were just another method of doing the same thing.

It's called transparency of controls.  The controls have to become instantly intuitive and invisible to the player.  I think Jonny was dancing around this issue in his editorial ... the DS will never achieve transparency, because the touchscreen requires too much of the user.  Your hand or your stylus will ALWAYS obscure a portion of the screen.

I think I'll use this opportunity to reiterate what I think the true problem for the DS is going to be, and Nintendo's hope that the touchscreen is going to provoke innovation from the game design community: touchscreens aren't new!  The touchscreen has been used in Pocket PC and Palm devices for years, and there are a ton of games for them.  Not a single one uses the touchscreen in a way that I'd consider innovative.  Either the stylus becomes a mouse, or you're using it to draw lines or tap the screen ... everything we've seen the DS do already!

I would love to be proven wrong, and I hope I will.  I hope that there is a game coming that will make me eat my words, make me wonder how I could have ever doubted what the touchscreen could bring.  But I think that if such a game were indeed coming ... we'd already know about it, because that's all they'd be talking about!

[Mario]

Well i'll just have to disagree with you and leave you alone then, because I love the touch screen, more than buttons. You must also have a different way of looking at games than I do because i've put tons of hours (15-20) into Wario Ware Touched and haven't even started getting the ribbons yet. And the games are different, does what you see on the screen mean anything to you at all?  

[ruby_onix]

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Sony isn't concerned about the profitability of the hardware. Sony is taking QUITE a loss, actually. Sony is going to make it up not only on games (royalties) but also on movies released on the UMD format.

I think the thing most people are forgetting (or taking for granted) about the PSP is that it essentially had a massive price cut before the PSP ever launched. Is Sony going to try and catch their breath this Christmas, or are they going to push even harder, to try and keep the PSP going as a massive money-pit?

(BTW, I'm setting aside the idea of Sony nixing the Value Pack as their price cut, because I don't think that makes much sense, but... who knows? They just might do that.)

I can see that Sony would totally love it if UMD caught on, but I can't see them throwing endless money away to make it happen (especially now that Kutaragi's not in charge anymore), because I can't see it ever catching on, as it's plainly inferior to DVD.

That's why I don't think we'll see a (real) PSP price cut by Christmas.

IMO, if Sony was as forward-thinking as everyone wants to give them credit for, the PSP would be using mini-Blu-Ray.

[Bill Aurion]

Wow, I can't believe I'm going to say this, but Rick you are wrong...Wrong, wrong, wrong...And wrong because I know I'm right in saying that Wario Ware is an absolute blast, and yes, using the stylus DOES make it more fun...Because that's why we play games right?  We play games because they are FUN...Stylus play does that for me; pulls me into the game...Makes me feel like I'm actually playing the game rather than leading a character...THAT is what Ninty is doing, and if you want to play the same old generic games on the PSP go right ahead...I'll stick with games that actually do something different and are FUN...

(Gotta love asserting one's opinion, which this is my own...I don't like giving the feeling my opinion is fact)

[Galford]

Wow, another nugget of wisdom from the flaming wad of crap known as G4.
It's way to early to tell whether the DS on PSP will win.
Still, Nintendo needs to launch some more AAA titles for the DS.

[RickPowers]

"And the games are different, does what you see on the screen mean anything to you at all?"

I have yet to see anything on that screen that makes good use of it, so I have to say that right now, no, it doesn't.  Drawing a line to create a trampoline, and drawing a line to cut a carrot in half is still drawing a line.  Eventually I'm sure we'll see a spy game where you have to draw lines to connect electronic circuits, or draw a line to cut the connections to defuse a bomb.  But none of that is innovative, and doing it with your stylus doesn't make it more fun, just different.

I guess I just fundamentally believe that fun has to be in the game, not in the hardware.

Edit: I'm going to make a correction here.  I have seen ONE game that makes good use of the screen ... Metroid Prime: Hunters.  I have only played the demo, and I'd say that it's probably the only really innovative title I've seen, because you have to manipulate the stylus (or nubbin) and the controls at the same time in Stylus mode.  Using the stylus to aim, at the same time your other hand is moving and shooting is pretty intense.  Nintendo just needs to get the game released ...

[KnowsNothing]

But you're still just drawing lines on the screen!  Oh, and in Mario 64 I used the nub and the buttons at the same time too.  I fail to see why Hunters stands out.

[mantidor]

I disagree, I think that the touchscreen is the most transparent input device, its the most intuitive of them all. Weve been playing games with a D-pad for practically 20 years, so all the game reviewers everywhere are going to say its not intuitive, that its ackward, and that it plainly sucks, but thats only because we are already  very used to the old ways! all Im reading around all the internet is people that just hate games having an awesome time with the DS. In all honest and turth, can anything be more intuitive an accesible than touching your game? imo only Virtual Reality, and we are still far from it. The problem is again the old crowd of gamers, who would and will be happy with the same. Im sure most of us wouldnt mind at all playing with the same input device (for example, current controls) for twenty years and on, because we have happened to fall in love and in some cases to have an almost sick affection for games (yes, me ), but we are not enough to make the industry stay alive, the DS trully opens new gates, the hardcore gamers in general are the ones who dont want to cross them because they are pretty happy with what they have now. Im willing to try the DS when I can with a totally open mind.