Topic: Iwata: "Paradigm Shift"

[Djunknown]

Iwata sounds off about the Revolution and the DS. I put this here, since it slightly emphasizes the nex-gen.

Iwata-Get!

Here are some snippets that are 'interesting':

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Iwata said the Revolution will cause a "paradigm shift" in video gaming, and reconfirmed that details on the machine will be unveiled at the upcoming E3 in May. He added that the machine will most likely come out somewhere between 2005 and 2006, when Sony and Microsoft are expected to release their next-generation consoles. Currently very little is known about the Revolution except that it may not use a conventional controller and may be able to connect to a PC monitor as well as the traditional TV screen.

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"The concept behind our new console, tentatively named 'Revolution,' is the same as the DS. We want it to broaden the [video gaming] audience range, and we don't want it to be something that people will see as too irrelevant to them, too difficult to use, or as something that wastes space. We'll announce specific details at the E3 ... It will most likely come out between this year [and] next year, which is considered to be the transition period for home consoles," Iwata said.

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He added that his company will also attempt to avoid competing in the next-gen console market.

There you go. He also mentions the PSP in a roundabout way, and the usual spin. Anybody have a clue where he's going with this?

[Caillan]

This interview confirms that Iwata thinks like he's on another planet. Telling everyone that your next system will be so wildly different that it won't be competing with your current competitors will not get anyone excited; telling them it's going to be a billion times more powerful than the PS2 will.

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"In the past, the video game industry grew on high-quality graphics and data volume," Iwata said. "We decided to move into a different direction, since we believe that those days have ended.

It's hard to tell if he is just trying to hype the Revolution by making it look different or not. I severly hope he is: there's no way we've reached the pinnacle of graphical power or storage capability yet. Developers aren't going to welcome graphically dumbing down their ports for a technically inferior, experimental system.

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He added that his company will also attempt to avoid competing in the next-gen console market.

He had better still be bullshitting about this, like he is with the DS and the PSP. Not competing with the PS3 and XBox2 is a bad idea if they want to recapture the casual market. On the other hand, backwards compatability would demonstrate that it is possible to play normal games on the Revolution, something which would invoke confidence in third party developers..  

[Ian Sane]

"The concept behind our new console, tentatively named 'Revolution,' is the same as the DS."

This sounded like a good idea to me when we first saw the DS but now that the DS is real and has no games that interest me released yet this just sounds like a really BAD idea.  I mean the DS sounds great in theory but in execution has really disappointed me.  The DS can for now get away with sucking because right now people think it's the next Gameboy.  The Revolution can't get away with anything.  It's currently "Nintendo's next flop" in the minds of most gamers.

"We decided to move into a different direction, since we believe that those days have ended."

What does he mean "we decided"?  Nintendo isn't the market leader.  They don't decide sh!t.

Avoid competing?  What a load of crap.  Nintendo doesn't decide if they compete, gamers do.  People often buy one videogame console so that means they're competing.  Unless Nintendo is going in such a different direction that they're not even targeting gamers but if that's the case then they're sh!tting on their entire fanbase since their fanbase are gamers.

I have this terrible feeling that years from now everyone is going to point to Iwata becoming the head of Nintendo as the point where Nintendo "jumped the shark".  When Iwata talks he makes me lose interest in Nintendo and I'm a fan.

[Bill Aurion]

What does he mean "we decided"? Nintendo isn't the market leader. They don't decide sh!t.

How naive...Always change a losing game, never change a winning game...

"When Iwata talks he makes me lose interest in Nintendo and I'm a fan."

Fan of complaining about Ninty, I'll buy that...

[Mario]

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It's hard to tell if he is just trying to hype the Revolution by making it look different or not. I severly hope he is: there's no way we've reached the pinnacle of graphical power or storage capability yet. Developers aren't going to welcome graphically dumbing down their ports for a technically inferior experimental system.

Right... just like developers aren't welcoming the DS and PSP?

I have faith in Iwata and i'm not going to make up my mind about the Revolution until I see it.

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"The concept behind our new console, tentatively named 'Revolution,' is the same as the DS."

This sounded like a good idea to me when we first saw the DS but now that the DS is real and has no games that interest me released yet this just sounds like a really BAD idea. I mean the DS sounds great in theory but in execution has really disappointed me. The DS can for now get away with sucking because right now people think it's the next Gameboy.

It sounds like a bad idea because you don't like DS games? He didn't say ANYTHING about Revolution software, just the concept.

[Caillan]

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I mean the DS sounds great in theory but in execution has really disappointed me.

The only major problem with the DS is the lack of games early on, and I don't that has anything to do with the somewhat quirky technology that the Revolution might display. The DS wasn't revealed long before launch, so Nintendo is the only developer that has had much time to create something. The list of games in development is very impressive, and initial sales have been strong.

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Right... just like developers aren't welcoming the DS and PSP?

The DS and PSP are handheld systems, they are expected to be technically inferior compared to home consoles. Their main competitor is the GBA, which is graphically inferior. If I understand you correctly, your logic would imply that no developer would even consider making games for the DS or PSP while the GBA has an install base of roughly 20 times both of them combined. In fact, I'd say that it's pretty amazing they are sacrificing so much potential market for new technology in the first place. Of course the GBA still has games being made for it, but the DS and PSP both have pretty extensive lists of upcomming games. Games ported to the DS and PSP are from the previous generation, and if anything developers can improve upon them as they port.

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I have faith in Iwata and i'm not going to make up my mind about the Revolution until I see it.

Why? Nintendo's first E3 under Iwata pushed connectivity as it's major spectacle. I think Nintendo has been a lot better recently, but I see no reason to trust him yet. I haven't made up my mind about the Revolution yet either, but there has been a lot of emphasis placed on making it seem like it will be very exotic. New technology like the DS I'd be happy with, new technology such as connectivity I wouldn't.  

[Noble~Feather]

What he means is that Revolution will not be like any other console before it, so it would be silly to try to compete with the others. it's just like DS & PSP; they say that they're not competing, but they can't help it. Both are completely different, but both are game machines, and have no choice but to compete. They will be trying to market the hell out of it. Also, the Revo. does not have "quirky" technology.

Revolution is a very powerful system, and honestly, I can't wait to see the looks on people's faces when they see it.

I promise Revo. will be one of the greatest experiences you'll have for years to come.

[Mario]

ok thx 4 exclusive infoz mr nintendo

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Why? Nintendo's first E3 under Iwata pushed connectivity as it's major spectacle. I think Nintendo has been a lot better recently, but I see no reason to trust him yet. I haven't made up my mind about the Revolution yet either, but there has been a lot of emphasis placed on making it seem like it will be very exotic. New technology like the DS I'd be happy with, new technology such as connectivity I wouldn't.

Well, I don't know, I just do. What could they push at E3 2003 besides connectivity? They didn't really have anything spectacular, you can't really blame Iwata for that.

[Bill Aurion]

New technology like the DS I'd be happy with, new technology such as connectivity I wouldn't.

In the same interview, Iwata termed the DS as "a change," while the Rev a "paradigm shift"...I think it should be apparent that it won't be something like connectivity(which I love for Four Swords, thank you very much...)

[Savior]

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When Iwata talks he makes me lose interest in Nintendo and I'm a fan.

Loose interest? No. It makes me worry. I worry and yet im exited about the Revolution. Sometimes it seems like it can change the game and help Nintendo go back to Number 1. But sometimes when Iwata talks i worry its going to be a dumbed down graphically low two button bore fest to bring out the Non Gamers, and they will forget about us the Nintendo Faithfull... Im Exited and yet worried.  

[Noble~Feather]

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Loose interest? No. It makes me worry. I worry and yet im exited about the Revolution. Sometimes it seems like it can change the game and help Nintendo go back to Number 1. But sometimes when Iwata talks i worry its going to be a dumbed down graphically low two button bore fest to bring out the Non Gamers, and they will forget about us the Nintendo Faithfull... Im Exited and yet worried.

Read my post boy.

And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics.

[Djunknown]

What I got out of the interview is that Iwata and Co. are 'shifting' their model a little bit. Instead of trying to go pound for pound with MS and Sony, they're going for the Apple route. Apple computers aren't taking a significant chunk from the PC market, but yet they're still around. They may have cool gadgets like the iPod, but does the general public take Apple seriously? I doubt it. Its looking to be the same way with Nintendo accordoing to Iwata's logic.

So starting with Revolution, They'll be making taking that stance into account. Sounds to me they're willingly going off the fringe, and hope the Nintendo army will march with them, keeping them profitable enough to make games.  And if you want good 3rd party support, grab MS's or Sony's next machine. At least, that's what I'm getting out of it.


Noble feather, are you an insider? I'm guessing revealing too much will comprise who you are, but at least answer that.  

[SgtShiversBen]

I hope it's something different.  I think if it's anything the same like Sony and MS are doing, then what's the point of getting a new system.  There was a reason for the SNES (mode 7 and "3-D"), there was a reason for the 64 (completely 3-D) and a reason for the GameCube (perfect 3-D and better mechanics).  Now it just seems all they can do is get more aesthetically pleasing.  The GameCube might be that too, but at least somethings weren't possible.  With the newer ones it just seems we'll get Jack 6, GTA 6, GT: X Spec, Halo 6 and of course Madden 2026.  If they do change the formula though, it'd be great and something that I wouldn't mind spending money on.  But if it's just like "Well, here's more polygon counts for your 300+ purchase" then it can go to hell.  That goes the same for MS.  Maybe not Sony because the looks of some of their games look like they need another system that does that crap jsut so they can be up to date with the GCN and Xbox.

[Procession]

"And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics."

Oh, so you know about Xenon now as well?

Give it a rest, seriously. No one is falling for it, so you may as well keep your bragging and vague "hints" to yourself.

[Caillan]

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Instead of trying to go pound for pound with MS and Sony, they're going for the Apple route.

That's exactly what I don't want to see Nintendo do. Macs are at least as good as PCs in terms of hardware and interface, but they're ignored because they're too alien for most people who always use Windows. Apple is an example of a company with good products but no market share because of factors that have little to do with quality.

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There was a reason for the SNES (mode 7 and "3-D"), there was a reason for the 64 (completely 3-D) and a reason for the GameCube (perfect 3-D and better mechanics).

This generation is in no way 'perfect 3D'. The next generation may be premature in giving you nothing but more polygons, but there will have to be a significant graphical upgrade eventually, hopefully at which point the hardware will standardise. Look at these screenshots of the next Elder Scrolls game. There is a significant increase in graphical detail, even though they are pre-alpha.

[nickmitch]

Am I the only one that thinks of 'Big O' when they hear (or in this case read) the word 'Paradigm'. But that has nothing to do with this.
I am just going to trust Iwata on this. It's like this thing I heard in English 2 weeks ago about Political leaders always doing what's in the best interest of the state. I feel it's like that. If Iwata thinks that what he's doing is good for Nintendo and us gamers then we should just go with.

[ShyGuy]

You know, I saw those screenshots of Elder Scroll 4 a few months back in Game Informer Magazine and the graphics don't look like THAT much of a leap ahead to me.

I guess they're still pre-beta screenshots, but they don't look much better than Half Life 2 or Resident Evil 4 to me.

What I would like to see in this next generation is taking out the obvious "I'm playing a game moments"  stuff like NPC walking around in an obvious preset pattern, clipping (your hand going through part of a wall), explosions just adding burn mark textures to where they went off instead of deforming the enviroment, stuff like that.

[SgtShiversBen]

Yeah I've seen the Elder Scroll's screenshots and the Madden ones and all that, but I'm saying it hasn't done much what hasen't been done now.  With perfect 3-D I meant that things can't get any better with control (Mario Sunshine and WW come to mind), visual innovativeness (I'm being naive about this one since I don't know what the future holds [I would have never thought of cel shading back when the 64 was announced]) or alot of technical breakthroughs (online was one even though it's been around since the early ninetys).  What I said in my post was that all the changes now are just going to be aesthetc and just offer visual splendor.   The graphics I think look nice if all games are going to be like that, but that's not why I want a new system.  I want it so I can do things I haven't done before.  This generation's consoles I think have beefed up games far enough (IMO even though I know they still can make them wonderful).  I'm just saying I don't want to buy a new console with stuff I can basically do with this one.  GTA3 wasn't possible with the old gen, and San Andreas was too big.  Halo was possible but not Halo 2's online "elegance".  Smash Bros. was possible (dumbed down) but RE4 wasn't.  I don't want a game where it's 30 minutes to get to the next city or have 200 characters to pick.  To me that's pushing it.  But it's just my opinion. So yeah.

[PaLaDiN]

"there's no way we've reached the pinnacle of graphical power or storage capability yet."

That's not the point. The point is, is it really worth wasting development time getting better and better quality graphics?

I personally think not... looking at MP2's and RE4's graphics, I'm perfectly satisfied with what developers can currently create. Sure they could get better, but I don't really care. I want them to focus on actually making the games themselves as good as possible.

The way I see it 3D right now hasn't reached its pinnacle yet, but it has already reached the level beyond which I don't much care. It's like Zelda LttP and 2D... Sure there are better looking 2D games, but beyond that point I don't really care anymore, it's perfectly acceptable even today.

[Noble~Feather]

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"And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics."

Oh, so you know about Xenon now as well?

Give it a rest, seriously. No one is falling for it, so you may as well keep your bragging and vague "hints" to yourself.

The developer said, in terms of graphics & power, "Xenon will win in some places, Revolution will win in most places."

I can tell you this though. Nintendo has always known graphics are important, and Xenon is being rushed before it, so it's common sense that it will have better graphics.

You don't have to believe me, as most people don't. My efforts seem to be quite futile anyway.

[Mario]

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Originally posted by: Noble~Feather

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"And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics."

Oh, so you know about Xenon now as well?

Give it a rest, seriously. No one is falling for it, so you may as well keep your bragging and vague "hints" to yourself.

The developer said, in terms of graphics & power, "Xenon will win in some places, Revolution will win in most places."

I can tell you this though. Nintendo has always known graphics are important, and Xenon is being rushed before it, so it's common sense that it will have better graphics.

You don't have to believe me, as most people don't. My efforts seem to be quite futile anyway.

and if someone DOES know something, it's best for Nintendo if you keep your mouth shut, if someone leaks something about Nintendos future, Microsoft and/or Sony will be listening.

[nemo_83]

I can see polygon counts on the next consoles being about the same between Xenon and Revolution.  I can also see real time 3D lighting on both systems.  I'm sure both will be capable of photorealistic textures, but I believe MS will be the one to go for bump mapping.  I think Nintendo will aim for particle effects and cel shading.  The most important thing will be which system does ambient and reflective lighting.  Think of cel shading on the Cube and the way the colors are more vibrant, more graphic.  Nintendo's next system will most likely be focused on lighting effects.  I'm not just talking about the lighting effects that all three systems will have.  I'm talking about how moon light reflecting of a pool of water will illuminate Link's face blue.  I'm talking about how rather than trying to create a photorealistic picture Nintendo will create something interesting and beautiful.  Realism is boring.  I prefer impressionism and expressionism.  Would you rather have Walt Disney's Alice in Wonderland or that Final Fantasy cgi movie?  Doesn't matter how narely powerful those computers were that made Final Fantasy the movie, it comes down to pure artistry to create something that stands the test of time in the way that Disney does.  

[Noble~Feather]

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Originally posted by: Mario

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Originally posted by: Noble~Feather

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"And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics."

Oh, so you know about Xenon now as well?

Give it a rest, seriously. No one is falling for it, so you may as well keep your bragging and vague "hints" to yourself.

The developer said, in terms of graphics & power, "Xenon will win in some places, Revolution will win in most places."

I can tell you this though. Nintendo has always known graphics are important, and Xenon is being rushed before it, so it's common sense that it will have better graphics.

You don't have to believe me, as most people don't. My efforts seem to be quite futile anyway.

and if someone DOES know something, it's best for Nintendo if you keep your mouth shut, if someone leaks something about Nintendos future, Microsoft and/or Sony will be listening.

Alright, alright. It's just that the fanboy inside me is sick of hearing all these people say, "OMFg Ntiendo r teh doomde!!1!!!!".

[nemo_83]

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Originally posted by: Mario

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Originally posted by: Noble~Feather

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"And the graphics, believe me, are not "dumbed down".

In many ways, they are better than the Xenon's graphics."

Oh, so you know about Xenon now as well?

Give it a rest, seriously. No one is falling for it, so you may as well keep your bragging and vague "hints" to yourself.

The developer said, in terms of graphics & power, "Xenon will win in some places, Revolution will win in most places."

I can tell you this though. Nintendo has always known graphics are important, and Xenon is being rushed before it, so it's common sense that it will have better graphics.

You don't have to believe me, as most people don't. My efforts seem to be quite futile anyway.

and if someone DOES know something, it's best for Nintendo if you keep your mouth shut, if someone leaks something about Nintendos future, Microsoft and/or Sony will be listening.

I was sort of hoping that Nintendo's revolution would be original enough that even if the competition did know what it was they wouldn't be able to copy it in time for their own launches.  

[Noble~Feather]

They won't be able to copy. Especially Microsoft.