Author Topic: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?  (Read 132587 times)

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Offline Stratos

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #250 on: November 06, 2010, 08:07:42 AM »
Also, I have a hard time seeing gamers willing to pay extra to play online with console games.

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Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #251 on: November 06, 2010, 12:05:15 PM »
Also, I have a hard time seeing gamers willing to pay extra to play online with console games.

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I would not mind paying Nintendo 2000 Nintendo points for a godd online system. The director of Bioware just recently stated that free-to-play online games is going to become the norm.
 
http://www.1up.com/news/bioware-free-to-play-dominant-mmo-model
 
I recently read some where that said that PC gaming is on the decline and that console MMOs will replace the ones on PC.
 
I would like to see a LoZ MMO on the Wii 2 developed by Nintendo and would also like for Retro Studios to develop their MMO.
 
This whole MMO discussion is one of my ideas for the evolutionary step for Nintendo to do with the system.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #252 on: November 06, 2010, 03:16:49 PM »
Free MMOs are a bad idea. Because that would mean you pay money to progress like the games on facebook.

Also, people have been heralding the doom of PC gaming for over a generation. It's not going anywhere anytime soon. Plus as long as WOW is successful we will have MMOs on the PC.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #253 on: November 06, 2010, 04:43:02 PM »
We can all agree that Nintendo's next console has to have stronger online multiplayer and some kind of universal friend code system.
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Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #254 on: November 06, 2010, 10:02:40 PM »
Also, I have a hard time seeing gamers willing to pay extra to play online with console games.

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Not my point.  Xbox Live is a service to play all games online, and connect to a server to talk to all your friends.  MMOs you pay an online fee to play a single game.  VERY, VERY different.  Paying for a service to have a unified online experience for all your games is different than paying to play a single game...in addition to your fee to play online.

Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #255 on: November 06, 2010, 10:16:01 PM »
Also, I have a hard time seeing gamers willing to pay extra to play online with console games.

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Not my point.  Xbox Live is a service to play all games online, and connect to a server to talk to all your friends.  MMOs you pay an online fee to play a single game.  VERY, VERY different.  Paying for a service to have a unified online experience for all your games is different than paying to play a single game...in addition to your fee to play online.

Hasn't Nintendo's business model always been unified experience? If so, this leads me to believe they might very well try to pursue a better online structure with their next system. 
« Last Edit: November 06, 2010, 10:24:18 PM by Kytim89 »
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Offline DAaaMan64

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #256 on: November 07, 2010, 12:19:52 AM »
Free MMOs are a bad idea. Because that would mean you pay money to progress like the games on facebook.

ahahhahahahahahhahhaahahahhaa

No. Free to play MMOs are some of the biggest up and coming games right now. There are some excellent ones like Vindictus and Battlefield.

They just have to be smart about how they make their money back. Some companies do it just on customization of character or increased inventory size, etc. It works good.
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Offline Stogi

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #257 on: November 07, 2010, 01:49:55 PM »
I like the idea of the sensor becoming more robust with added functionality. Video camera, microphone and the ability to track wiimotes and body movements would make Sony and Microsoft look stupid.

I'd also like to see BC with the Wii, VC, and Wiiware. Anything beyond that is unrealistic.

The online system will probably mimic the 3DS's. So we'll have to see whether it uses a universal code (preferably tied to a username) or friend codes again (which would suck dick).

After that, there's not much more they need to do. Make a decently powerful console capable of HD and current gen like graphics, add a higher storage capacity (at least 32 gb) with the option to add more and call it a wrap.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #258 on: November 07, 2010, 02:08:02 PM »
I like the idea of the sensor becoming more robust with added functionality. Video camera, microphone and the ability to track wiimotes and body movements would make Sony and Microsoft look stupid.

I'd also like to see BC with the Wii, VC, and Wiiware. Anything beyond that is unrealistic.

The online system will probably mimic the 3DS's. So we'll have to see whether it uses a universal code (preferably tied to a username) or friend codes again (which would suck dick).

After that, there's not much more they need to do. Make a decently powerful console capable of HD and current gen like graphics, add a higher storage capacity (at least 32 gb) with the option to add more and call it a wrap.

The Wii 2 is most likely going to use universal friend codes for multiplayer and as for internal stoarage, Nintendo would most like offer a small amount of internal flash memory (8 GB) and then offer an internal HDD like the PS360.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #259 on: November 07, 2010, 02:43:38 PM »
Made a quick drawing for what I was thinking about with the Wiimote 2.0 and Sensorbar 2.0 so everyone could see what I was thinking.



I was gonna make one for the nunchuck too, but I gotta go run an errand real quick so I didn't have time right now.

Offline King of Twitch

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #260 on: November 07, 2010, 04:03:37 PM »
Heck yes it better have 4 face buttons, but aren't you forgetting the black and white printer built into the sensor bar?
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #261 on: November 07, 2010, 05:20:36 PM »
BnM, would it be possible for you to do a drawing of what the Wii 2 would look like if it were revealed? I figure that the device would be about the same scale as the 360 slim, so use that as a reference and then combine it with Nintendo's design aesthetic and some similarities to the current Wii.

For the exception of the N64, every Nintendo home console has taken on a flat square or rectangle shape to their design, so this leads me to believe that the Wii 2 going to be similar in shape and scale to the 360 slim because it kind of has a rectangular form.

I imagine that the actual Wii 2 as being something like a DSi with the hinges, camera and buttons removed and two portions molded together and about the size of the 360 slim. The disc slot would be in the same place as where the DSi opens in the middle. The ports for the console would be where the DS slot and charging port are located at on the DSi.

Wii + DSi + 360 slim (shape and scale) = Wii 2
« Last Edit: November 07, 2010, 05:54:06 PM by Kytim89 »
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #262 on: November 07, 2010, 07:21:16 PM »
I have no idea on what form factor a Wii2 would take so while it would be possible, it's not gonna happen.

But I did just try to do the nunchuck 2.0 and watched it evolve as I try to figure out how my idea was even gonna work.
I think it turned out ok for a rough draft and a rough idea. Oh, I also did a revision on the Sensor Bar 2.0 to future proof it a little bit and prep for some 3DS connectivity.




p.s. In case you couldn't tell, I'm bored.... (it's raining outside.)
I also left in the dimensions of the original nunchuck for reference.

Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #263 on: November 07, 2010, 07:34:54 PM »
I don't like the 4 face buttons.  The buttons would be too small to use.  I would prefer bigger 1 and 2 buttons.  Then move the -/+ buttons up (they could be renamed) to be a triangle button layout.  That would give you access to 4 buttons easily  A, B, +, -  and then you have 1 and 2. 

With the nunchuk you have 2 more buttons, and could add a button press pushing down the analog stick.  That is 6 or 7 buttons....plus better motion control would be a perfect controller. 

Also realistically you don't need the light bar on the back of the Wii remote.  You almost never hold it where those lights will be easily visible.  Instead, Just at the front would be good...and you probably don't need it to be a strip of lights either.  Just the edges of the controller. 

Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #264 on: November 07, 2010, 07:36:54 PM »
Drawing a hyptothetical gaming system is always a good way to combat bordom.  ;D
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #265 on: November 07, 2010, 07:51:45 PM »
Let me explain why I was thinking a strip and not just a light at the tip.

The main reason why it was a strip around the edge of the wiimote was that the IR camera is on the top and if the remote is pointing at the screen, then it obviously already knows where the remote is.

One of the main problems with Sony's approach with the Lollipop, is that the tip is perfectly spherical and the remote could have any orientation and the orientation isn't error correcting the sensors since it can't tell which direction the orb is facing since it's practically the same in every direction. It's just tracking the light it emits.

and that is also why I have it tracking the top and bottom of every remote. So that when there are wild moments of twisting, leaning & turning of the remote, the camera will be able to accurately track the remote regardless of what direction it's pointing or how ever you are holding it. They system won't have to guess where it is at while the gyro sensors are trying to get reorientated and this will take an approach done by Sony to the next level and actually perfecting the technology.

*edit: I also forgot to mention that having them on the sides will also allow the controller to be tracked while being held sideways.*

There will be no more improving of the pointer and controller tracking at that point from the competition and all that will be left is making sure there is enough horsepower to do decent head tracking and basic body motion camera stuff. Nintendo is then sitting back in the drivers seat while MS & Sony try to figure out how to push their tech further for their next console.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2010, 08:07:59 PM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #266 on: November 07, 2010, 10:35:35 PM »
Gotcha. I actually understood what you were saying, and your reasoning.  I wonder if having that many lights might hurt the effect from the light spreading? 

I could see using a band, but it seemed more practical to just have 5-6 lights on the corners and sides of the front of the remote.  I still can't ever see a reason for having it on the bottom. 

Also, I would not track the nunchuk at all in that manner, and just have Wii-motion+ level movements.  The reasons are pretty obvious.

1)Design of the Nunchuk is needlessly complex, and sliding your and into a a holder like that can be comfortable and may not fit for others.  Keeping It Simple is better. 

2) Games that are using the Nunchuk for the Nunchuk properties IE analog stick and additional buttons, and some movement won't need the same advanced movement options already in the Wiimote 2.0  However, if you did need that set up for a game 2 Wiimotes is already plausible. 

Yeah, I agree that Nintendo needs to perfect the controller with Wiimote 2.0  Though, I think it needs to be done in the smartest way possible.  Though the one thing that would be cool about your light strip idea is each new player could be given a different color light that would help identify the controllers easier, and look cool. 


Offline Stogi

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #267 on: November 07, 2010, 11:43:49 PM »
There is no reason for the Nunchuck 2.0 to not be tracked by IR light if the Wiimote 2.0 is using it. It's cheap, it's effective, and could do away with the need for a gyroscope entirely.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #268 on: November 07, 2010, 11:59:46 PM »
Gotcha. I actually understood what you were saying, and your reasoning.  I wonder if having that many lights might hurt the effect from the light spreading? 

I could see using a band, but it seemed more practical to just have 5-6 lights on the corners and sides of the front of the remote.  I still can't ever see a reason for having it on the bottom. 

Also, I would not track the nunchuk at all in that manner, and just have Wii-motion+ level movements.  The reasons are pretty obvious.

1)Design of the Nunchuk is needlessly complex, and sliding your and into a a holder like that can be comfortable and may not fit for others.  Keeping It Simple is better.


Well the nunchuck design was created as it was being drawn. originally I was thinking of just extending the top and bottom of the nunchuck, but that looked kinda stupid, so I turned it into a "brass knuckle" design in stead. it could be used to have a different IR strip set up to make separating the wiimote from the nunchuck easier for the camera.

Quote
2) Games that are using the Nunchuk for the Nunchuk properties IE analog stick and additional buttons, and some movement won't need the same advanced movement options already in the Wiimote 2.0  However, if you did need that set up for a game 2 Wiimotes is already plausible.
 
Think of a Sword and Shield game. Zelda 2011 (Wii/Wii2 game).
You are gonna want your analog controls still, so tracking the nunchuck properly would solve the need for having to shoose on whether you have a second pointer or having an analog joystick. The only time you should need to use a second Wiimote should be when you need a single player to use 2 pointers (dual wielding independent pistols maybe?) Having the Nunchuck tracked too is keeping it real simple for the user. You have everything you need out of the box.

Quote
Yeah, I agree that Nintendo needs to perfect the controller with Wiimote 2.0  Though, I think it needs to be done in the smartest way possible.  Though the one thing that would be cool about your light strip idea is each new player could be given a different color light that would help identify the controllers easier, and look cool.
Can you do differently colored IR lights? I have been assuming that you can, but I didn't really think about that aspect. I wasn't thinking of different colored LEDs that you can see, I'm talking about the invisible lights like in the sensor bar. If your not sure what I'm talking about, turn on your Wii and look at the sensor bar through your cellphone camera (there are 10 lights on there, 5 on each side).


although it lighting up in pairs would be pretty damn cool too. Especially if you can choose the color like on Move, but only having the color strips on each controller lit up, not a giant glowing ball.


There is no reason for the Nunchuck 2.0 to not be tracked by IR light if the Wiimote 2.0 is using it. It's cheap, it's effective, and could do away with the need for a gyroscope entirely.


gyroscopes still needed. could do with out the cord though.

Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #269 on: November 08, 2010, 12:34:58 AM »
Another question that is looming in my mind equally to the Wii 2 is what will happen to the Wii itself once the Wii is released. I would wager that the Wii has at the least fifteen months of its life cycle left. In fact, E3 2011 will most likely be its last year as Nintendo's major home console. By that time the Wii 2 will be fully revealed and on course for a release in Japan in either late 2011 or early 2012 and in the west by mid to late 2012.
 
Once the Wii is replaced on the market, it may still not go by the way side in the same way all consoles go when their successor arrives. Nintendo would most likely reveal a hardware revision in the same vein as the PS2 slim. We will call it the Wii slim and Nintendo would market it to parents will young children and casuals who do not want to move onto the Wii 2. It would retail for about $100.00 when it is released. I see them doing the same thing with the DS onc the 3DS gets strong on the market.

How would bluetooth motion control work?
« Last Edit: November 08, 2010, 12:58:54 AM by Kytim89 »
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Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #270 on: November 08, 2010, 07:40:54 AM »
I see.  Well.. if they can work it out.  I don't want to sound like a stick in the mud at all.  I just want to know how it can be made as simple as possible, without adding cost.

I like your ideas and it is very cool design.

Offline RABicle

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #271 on: November 08, 2010, 07:56:28 AM »
Another question that is looming in my mind equally to the Wii 2 is what will happen to the Wii itself once the Wii is released. I would wager that the Wii has at the least fifteen months of its life cycle left. In fact, E3 2011 will most likely be its last year as Nintendo's major home console. By that time the Wii 2 will be fully revealed and on course for a release in Japan in either late 2011 or early 2012 and in the west by mid to late 2012.
If anything Sony proved that backwards compatibility was not necessary with the PS3. Sure people bitched but seriously, who gets rid of their old consoles anyway? It's not like they have any resell value.
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How would bluetooth motion control work?
For all intents and purposes, the current wii remotes are bluetooth.

I don't think a nun chuck is necessary. Who doesn't own two wii remotes? Just give the Wii remote a thumbstick instead of a d pad.
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Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #272 on: November 08, 2010, 08:08:26 AM »
I got rid of my old system...and plenty of people want to save space when buying a new system.

I think Backwards compatibility is important with at least the prior generation.  But, if you notice PS3 is in LAST place, so I think Sony has made quite a few trip ups that show you can't say Sony did this and it was ok.

I like the cord, on my nun chuk and I don't want to get rid of it.  Perhaps a slightly and only slightly longer cord, but a cordless just means more and more batteries. 

Offline Kytim89

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #273 on: November 08, 2010, 11:01:06 AM »
Sony got slammed hard for removing backwards compatibilty from the PS3. I mean that I refuse to buy a PS3 until they resolve the issue of playing PS2 games on the console. This is why I like Nintendo, they know that BC is important, especieally when a new console is first released. I mean think about what would have happened to the DS if the GBA slot had been removed from the begining. The Wii 2 is going to be BC with the Wii and Gamecube.
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Offline King of Twitch

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Re: Wii Successor and Glassess Free 3D: How Will It Work?
« Reply #274 on: November 08, 2010, 11:09:34 AM »
Quote
This is why I like Nintendo, they know that BC is important, especieally when a new console is first released

Do you know that Wii is their first BC console?

And that

Quote
The Wii 2 is going to be BC with the Wii and Gamecube.

would be unprecedented and probably unlikely? Why do you make emphatic statements like this?
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