Author Topic: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread  (Read 125322 times)

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Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #175 on: April 09, 2020, 10:01:15 PM »
I would advice not reading the news, because the news thrives on negative news and that is bringing our culture and our minds to paranoia and breaking points.  This virus is scary, but it will pass eventually. 

The problem isn't the virus, it is people acting irrationally, selfishly, and frankly stupidly.  The supply chains are over taxed because people are being greedy and are buying too much stuff.  We are losing jobs, because the governments and news made choices that made people fear going outside, interacting with people, and basically having some sort of normal life.  Yes, Social Distancing is important, but there can be ways to social distance that don't cripple the economy.  (South Korea has done it.)  And there are ways to manage the supplies of masks, and equipment through regulation that prevents people from hoarding.  This virus is dangerous, but civilization itself is making it worse, and it is frustrating to watch. 

Manufacturing needs to come back to every country, and lets stop being foolish about buying everything from the cheapest country just because we can.  We can manufacture our own masks well enough.  Countries can invest in providing themselves which will create jobs, create energy solutions, create food solutions.  This is a chance for countries to realize that although the world is an international economy, it is time to value the local national workforce, even if it means a higher cost of living and sacrifice.

It means people need to learn to actually care for the neighbors again, and not live selfishly...not live in a manner that you think as long as I have my health and so do my loved ones it is OK.  This isn't even that hard, South Korea is fine...and I think other countries are handling this better too. 

But for America, we have to learn it isn't us vs. them.  Dems vs. Republicans.  Poor vs Rich.  Ethnicity vs Ethnicity or whatever stupid division you want to break the world into.  And we have to reclaim truth and fight against stupid fake news, opinions, and everything having an agenda. 

This has turned into a rant and I am sorry for that, but it is exhausting and stupid to see the world going this way.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #176 on: April 10, 2020, 12:33:28 AM »
 I totally agree. This is all very serious, but so many people are overreacting, others are under reacting, and that's fault of communication from the top and from the news.

It's all been handled poorly and never had to be this bad. and for the fact that it's continuing to be handled so badly, it will just drag on for much longer than it ever needed to.



Offline nickmitch

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #178 on: April 11, 2020, 02:54:20 PM »
The United States has passed Italy for highest COVID-19 death toll.

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Offline Ian Sane

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #179 on: April 13, 2020, 01:36:28 PM »
Looking at the US death toll there is 22,000 total with 9,300 in New York state.  Around 1,500 people died yesterday in America and half of them were from New York.  The second largest death toll is New Jersey with 2,300, and of course Jersey borders New York.  So what is specific about New York where the outbreak is exceptionally terrible compared to the rest of the country?  It is a very populated state but so are California and Texas and they're nowhere close.  New York City is the largest city in America and is densely populated but there are other large cities in America and they aren't as affected.  is New York's population density unique in a way that would make it more susceptible?  I know Manhattan is an island so it can't sprawl out into the countryside like other big cities can.

At the same time why was Italy hit so hard by the virus?  Is there something that was done incorrectly that caused the situation to spiral out of control that other countries avoided?  Is this all just bad luck?  Climate-wise Italy is much warmer than New York so there is no obvious common factor there.  Italy is a large peninsula with an obvious choke point from the rest of Europe.  New York City is also at the south end of a peninsula and has an obvious choke point from the rest of New York state.  Would any of that matter?  Does the geography "trap" the population in the infected area?  You would think Italy would be too large for that to matter.

If there is some sort of causation here then we can learn from it both in containing this outbreak and in dealing with future pandemics.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #180 on: April 13, 2020, 03:21:33 PM »
NY does have several International airports and is a major HUB to the US from all over the world.
That mixed with the not just the density of living, but travel, and just being out in public in general (NYC specifically) along with the delayed response partially in part to the downplaying of the seriousness of this situation early on, and the continued lack of testing, all lead to reasons why this has gotten so out of control.

I believe in California we aren't as condensed at the people in NYS and especially NYC, so the same exact response at the same exact time has led to far less devastating results. Not to mention we are a far large state (in physical size) so may have had more places to stockpile out own supplies and not rely so heavily on the lack of government assistance (that has been threatened to be taken away so many times and for so many reasons in these past few years).

Offline Discord.RSS

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #181 on: April 13, 2020, 04:42:57 PM »
At the same time why was Italy hit so hard by the virus?  Is there something that was done incorrectly that caused the situation to spiral out of control that other countries avoided?  Is this all just bad luck?  Climate-wise Italy is much warmer than New York so there is no obvious common factor there.  Italy is a large peninsula with an obvious choke point from the rest of Europe.  New York City is also at the south end of a peninsula and has an obvious choke point from the rest of New York state.  Would any of that matter?  Does the geography "trap" the population in the infected area?  You would think Italy would be too large for that to matter.

If there is some sort of causation here then we can learn from it both in containing this outbreak and in dealing with future pandemics.

I'm not an expert at all, so take this as pure opinion: but I think there's a case to be made for Italy and the U.S. to be regarded as outliers, and think they make a poor base of comparison for each other. (Inversely, it'd also be a bad idea to compare with countries like South Korea which seems to be handling COVID a lot more effectively.)

In addition to geography not really inhibiting air/shipping traffic, another factor to consider is age, too. Italy has one of the oldest populations on Earth. That's much less the case for the United States.
I think it's fair to say at this point that COVID is disproportionally dangerous/deadly to the elderly. Couple this with 23% of Italian 30-49 year olds sharing residences with their parents, and you could speculate the virus might've just reached the elderly population earlier through younger people picking the virus up unknowingly at work/social gatherings? More vectors of access, basically.

Offline Kairon

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #182 on: April 13, 2020, 05:37:38 PM »
I just think that the sooner you act decisively, the better. In CA, Bay Area counties announced shelter-in-place orders several days before the entire state did, and I just think that without that each additional day delayed means additional rolls of the dice on more people catching it, more events happening, etc. Knock-on-wood, but the Bay Area hasn't become the epicenter I thought it would given the travel that I assume happens through here and how early cases seemed to show up in California.

With something as big as this, you could really just be unlucky with a single birthday party, community event, concert, or other gathering being the catalyst that gets dozens, then hundreds infected. Even before the shelter in place orders I was arguing with my parents that they should get an extended family member of their generation to cancel her birthday party out at a bar. The person was being resistant, so thank GOD the shelter-in-place orders came down when they did so that guests had a legal reason to decline, and they legally couldn't hold that gathering even if they wanted to.

I'd like to think you could reduce the chance for those unlucky breakouts to happen by acting quickly, and in this case of exponential pandemic spread I do believe that even one or two days matter.
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #183 on: April 13, 2020, 07:34:50 PM »
Looking at the US death toll there is 22,000 total with 9,300 in New York state.  Around 1,500 people died yesterday in America and half of them were from New York.  The second largest death toll is New Jersey with 2,300, and of course Jersey borders New York.  So what is specific about New York where the outbreak is exceptionally terrible compared to the rest of the country?  It is a very populated state but so are California and Texas and they're nowhere close.  New York City is the largest city in America and is densely populated but there are other large cities in America and they aren't as affected.  is New York's population density unique in a way that would make it more susceptible?  I know Manhattan is an island so it can't sprawl out into the countryside like other big cities can.

Another major part is public transportation.  New Yorkers rely on public transportation, especially the subway more then any other major American city.  So in other parts of the country, somebody who's infected is more likely to drive themselves around, while in New York City, they're more likely to be on the subway exposing literally hundreds of others around them because of how crowded the area can get.

So in a way, America's lack of public transportation in much of the country probably helped us stop the spread in a lot of the other major metro area's during the early days before lockdowns started.
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Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #184 on: April 13, 2020, 07:49:08 PM »
I think New York is highly reliant on public transportation to get around.  If people were infected and didn't know about it on Subways will just infect everyone around them.  I also wonder about the homeless population in New York, the death toll may be higher because there are several hundred people with no insurance or not good insurance in New York?  I honestly don't know how the Affordable Health Care Act benefits everyone.

As for Italy, they are still highly touchy civilization.  Italy and Iran still greet with kisses on the side of the face.  So when it got to them it spread faster.  Iran also has several open markets that is a major form of commerce which helped spread it. 

Also, since this virus attacks the respiratory system, weaker people or anyone that may already have an illness becomes weaker and more suseptible do facing the worse of both illnesses...again really attacking the weak and poor people in countries. 

Offline RABicle

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #185 on: April 14, 2020, 03:53:04 AM »
What is the real US infection rate though? The John Hopkins Map https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html says you've only tested around 3,000,000 people for 500,000+ positives. Or a 18% positivity rate.
In Australia, only about 1% of people tested come back positive. Eitehr you guys have been really good at not wasting tests or really bad at testing enough people.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #186 on: April 14, 2020, 03:56:14 AM »
In spite of certain comments today from El president de Los estados divididos...

The West Coast (Cali, Oregon, & Washington State) have announced a COVID-19 Pact to work together in determining the re-opening of the economy in their states.
https://komonews.com/news/coronavirus/washington-oregon-california-join-pact-for-covid-19-collaboration

And not to be out done, a chunk of The North East Quadrant decided to do the same
(New York, New Jersey, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Delaware, and Pennsylvania)
https://thehill.com/homenews/state-watch/492559-northeast-governors-form-group-to-discuss-reopening-of-region-economies

It's good to not only see states rights being exercised, but to also just see powers that be group together to protect and serve the people they represent.

....I wonder if this will turn into little groups of states ganging up together.
« Last Edit: April 14, 2020, 10:06:53 AM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline stevey

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #187 on: April 14, 2020, 04:30:39 AM »
... but that's exactly what el hombre naranja wanted and was attacked for a few days ago. And the tri-state governors have been working together coordinating their response and lock downs since well over a month ago.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #188 on: April 14, 2020, 09:46:10 AM »
Well.... when the man in charge clearly has no plan, is picking and choosing where to send assistance on what appears to be based on his ego, consistently lies about and/or misdirects on pretty much everything, and then threatens to make decisions (he apparently doesn't have the power to do?) based on something other than the interest of the United States and the it's people as a whole (financial gain? re-election?).... it's dividing the country, and therefore the the states have no choice but to unite in direct defiance of any further ill-advised action (against counsel of experts, intelligence, and senior advisers) that would continue to cost more lives for the sake of "saving" the economy now, because it's an election year.

This is all quite the mess, but current circumstances have led to the exposure of so many problems in our system that was apparently just based on gentleman's code of conduct.
c o r o n a v i r u s  has brought us to a very dark spot in american (and world) history that is unfolding in real time right now.

I just wonder how far this uniting of divided states over corona response goes before there is some sort of either federal response or withholding of federal tax by the states themselves. I'm really hoping this doesn't escalate into something further and is purely motivated by and ends with the
c o r o n a v i r u s  pandemic.


Edit: Apparently MA has joined the North East Quadrant (Tri-State Coalition)

and MN, WI, and MI are working on a Pact of their own....
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/13/politics/states-band-together-reopening-plans/index.html
« Last Edit: April 14, 2020, 10:22:44 AM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline lolmonade

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #189 on: April 14, 2020, 10:51:58 AM »
What is the real US infection rate though? The John Hopkins Map https://coronavirus.jhu.edu/map.html says you've only tested around 3,000,000 people for 500,000+ positives. Or a 18% positivity rate.
In Australia, only about 1% of people tested come back positive. Eitehr you guys have been really good at not wasting tests or really bad at testing enough people.

We have no idea.  What's scarier is there could be untold number of people who have died from COVID-19 but we'd have no clue for sure because they never got tested either due to dying before being able to receive attention or because they didn't show severe enough symptoms before it was too late, and testing is too precious of a commodity to waste one on a post-mortem test.

There's still a shortage of testing, no antibody testing, no plan.  It's almost all been ad hoc with the states being told to get supplies themselves, but then there's also been various news stories about states getting a purchase in with a manufacturer only then for FEMA to come in and take them away.  One of the few times i've been grateful to live in Illinois as Chicago has forced the Governor's hand early and it should mean we will be in a better position than some states to start gradually easing some of the restrictions.

This is why it would have been nice to have a federal government that understood that while, no, you don't have direct control over when states decide to "reopen the economy" (lol), that a competent administration would have been able to coordinate with all the states, be the singular purchaser of goods for the entire country, and then collaborate WITH the states as a group regarding which states get supplies when in order to respond to peaks which each of them will have happen at different times.

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Offline Stratos

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #190 on: April 14, 2020, 12:15:35 PM »
An important thing to remember about Italy is they were an early contractor of the virus, so I suspect they didn't take the threat as seriously and suffered because of it from what I have read and remember from early reports of the outbreak. The rest of the world learned from this and acted much faster overall relative to Italy and other earlier impact zones.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #191 on: April 15, 2020, 08:37:32 PM »
« Last Edit: April 16, 2020, 02:48:18 AM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline Ian Sane

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #192 on: April 16, 2020, 11:56:23 AM »
Canada has been averaging about 1200 new cases a day and 60 deaths.  However over the last few days the daily death tool has been over 100.  The new cases figure staying around 1200 might be a cut off based on the amount of tests we're able to do daily.  Death toll is a more accurate figure.  Yesterday I was concerned about the jump in deaths but could pass it off as an anomaly but two days in a row now concerns me.  My pessimistic prediction is that by the 25th or so there will be an increase in cases due to people defying social distancing during the Easter weekend.

There was a report that social distancing may be required until 2022.  If that is truly the case then this is all going to go to hell.  People are not going obey for two whole years.  You would have to enforce lockdown with the military and after too long of that you'll get riots and revolts.  If that's the situation then all we can do is put off the inevitable.  Hope that social distancing can be maintained long enough to flatten the curve as intended before enough people defy lockdowns.  The dam is going to eventually burst.

Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #193 on: April 16, 2020, 03:52:52 PM »
If they would focus on getting quick and cheap test so we can test EVERYBODY and quarantine those that need to be quarantined, then we can get past this..... had we already taken that approach instead of denying it's happening or shifting blames (speaking on the US in general) then this really never had to get as bad as it is in the US.... as we are still probably not even near the peak with the limited testing and lack of a real plan or support from the Federal Government.

Projecting to 2 years of "Social Distancing" is kinda a scary thought, depending on what that means exactly. If it's just talking what Asian culture has been doing for years and walking around in public with face mask and using hand sanitizer.... i see some security issues with that, but that's not so bad.
If it's lockdown/quarantine and only "essential" businesses, then that's definitely not gonna work.

Offline nickmitch

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #194 on: April 16, 2020, 06:53:00 PM »
Yeah, I think if two years are needed, then we might be screwed.  I've been seeing events that were rescheduled to the fall get outright cancelled, which could reflect a number of factors.  But there's a Zuckerberg post going around where Facebook is cancelling all company events with 50+ people through June 2021.

I'm hoping things don't last that long and a treatment/vaccine comes around.  But who knows.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #195 on: April 16, 2020, 07:41:01 PM »
Illinois and surrounding states joining up to "govern" their own economic reopening in absence of a federal plan or assistance.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-coronavirus-regional-reopening-states-20200416-5cw7x5tkrbesdh6tpx2kwnxebq-story.html?utm_medium=notification&utm_source=onesignal

This could be a bad trend depending on how things progress.

Offline BeautifulShy

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #196 on: April 17, 2020, 12:29:13 AM »
I wonder if that sort of thing is going to happen with the 4 Corners states(Arizona, Utah, Colorado and New Mexico.)
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #197 on: April 17, 2020, 02:06:23 AM »
I can't speak to the validity of this report, but I figure it may be relevant...
https://www.timesofisrael.com/us-alerted-israel-nato-to-disease-outbreak-in-china-in-november-report/


edit: There's seems to be some promise in a treatment for the time being...
https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/16/health/coronavirus-remdesivir-trial/index.html
« Last Edit: April 17, 2020, 04:25:49 AM by BlackNMild2k1 »

Offline lolmonade

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #198 on: April 17, 2020, 09:36:04 AM »
Illinois and surrounding states joining up to "govern" their own economic reopening in absence of a federal plan or assistance.

https://www.chicagotribune.com/coronavirus/ct-coronavirus-regional-reopening-states-20200416-5cw7x5tkrbesdh6tpx2kwnxebq-story.html?utm_medium=notification&utm_source=onesignal

This could be a bad trend depending on how things progress.

As an Illinoisian, I think it's a good thing.  The Northeast with NY already started their own consortium.  The concerns I have are more around the long-term effect when it comes to the health of the country....tough to feel like we're all part of one nation if it ends up being 5-6 regions of the US basically competing and fighting each other for resources.

I sincerely worry about what is done to bring us back together after this is all said and done.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: The COVID-19 Virus is Coming For Us All Thread
« Reply #199 on: April 17, 2020, 10:35:10 AM »
That's my same concern.

The states are no longer "United" and instead divided into regions.
The Federal Gov no longer represents ALL the states, and can't be trusted to step in during a time of crisis to lead the nation.

What's happening with the banding together right now is necessary (because the states were literally told to fend for themselves), i just feel the people in charge are setting a bad precedent by allowing this to continue, especially under these conditions and for these reasons. It's not supposed to be like this at all.