Topic: Rate the last TV show you've seen

[Plugabugz]

American Gods has ended its first season, and is already renewed for the second. Both Gods and Westworld have had incredibly polished and gorgeous visuals in their debut seasons, but Gods had an incredible cast (especially Ian McShane and Orlando Jones) that gelled almost immediately and simply ramped up with a chemistry that improved over time - Gillian Anderson as Media as David Bowie was just an incredible sight.

[lolmonade]

Anyone here been watching Better Call Saul?  Won't go into details if no one else is, but wow. 


If you liked Breaking Bad, I think it's a fair guess you'll enjoy this.  At least, if you're ok with some parts being slower than others.  The best part is that it's not JUST focused on Saul, they devote a lot of good time developing so many of the characters in the show, and the season finale just ended with some pretty crazy closing imagery.


Definitely hope they come back with a season 4, there are so many questions I need answered by this show.  I haven't seen many other shows that I enjoy the way they handle character development like these shows do.

[Khushrenada]

I've been watching Better Call Saul since it first began airing. It's been a bit of an odd dichotomy at times with it's decision to also follow Mike's beginnings in New Mexico as they have been rather separate paths aside from some brief meet-ups here and there. It took a while to start building up its world in Season 1 but it's been so well put together that I've still enjoyed it while others were getting restless and wondering if there was a point to it during that time.

As well, knowing the future outcome for some of these characters can sometimes affect the viewing of this show. For instance, it was revealed that the writers were getting ready to introduce Gus Fring at the end of season 2 and they even had the anagram of the reveal hidden in the episode titles for Season 2 but decided to cut that meet thinking it might overshadow the latest development in the Chuck/Jimmy feud. That was fine. Even without the reveal, BB viewers knew the Don't probably came from Gus. When Season 3 started, it was well known that Gus was now going to be appearing again. In the first episode, though, they didn't just have Gus meet Mike. They showed the process of Mike trying to figure out how he was tracked. It was a logical story development and how Mike worked out how to turn the tables was an enjoyable process. But then in episode 2, we watch Mike follow someone else around and finally he come to the Los Pollos restaurant. Then he stakes out, uses Jimmy which results in his investigation being exposed and is confronted about it. In episode 3, he finally comes face to face with Gus and they begin their partnership, in a way. The difference is that unlike in episode 1, there was still the problem of how does Mike meet Gus which was solved in the tracking device solution. While episode 2's action makes sense perhaps in a logical progression of events, it wasn't as intriguing as episode 2. At that point, I just kind of wanted the show to get on with it. Mike has gotten this close just have him meet Gus already and let's get on to better action. The show seems really intent on showing the whole detailed process sometimes which can have this appeal/repeal reaction in me when watching. Sometimes it works and the process is engaging and sometimes it feels unnecessary and maybe the creative team is overdoing it.

Likewise, with Nacho, once it became clear early on this season that he didn't want Hector involving his father, a lot of viewers guessed that maybe he might be the reason Hector would end up in a wheelchair and that view was solidified even further when he started looking into capsules to replace Hector's medication. We know the end result for Hector but we don't know the end result for Nacho. Yet, even though we know the endpoint for Hector and can suspect where the story is going because there are unknowns in that we don't know what happens to Nacho nor do we know for sure that swapping the pills would be what brings down Hector, the moment when Nacho makes the swap is still a bit thrilling for the viewer. However, there's a bit of a letdown when the swap doesn't have an immediate effect. It probably makes sense and leads to Nacho's dad still getting involved with Hector a bit but, at this point, we are just waiting for Hector to have his stroke. It's getting dragged out almost too long.

Still, it is incredible to see more and more the interconnectivity of how all these various people are impacting one another more and more and how the reverberations of those actions pull us closer to the Breaking Bad versions and end result. In the end, though, this season's primary plotline was Jimmy vs Chuck and it was episode 5 that was the most powerful in that plotline. It felt like the climax almost of what the show had been building on and towards since episode 1 of season 1. After that, it was just a lot of characters dealing with the fallout of that clash and almost a new beginning as changes were made to the status quo of a lot of characters in Jimmy's orbit. The final episode of season 3 felt like the end of the process of stripping down Jimmy's old life (no more shared office, no more elder law, being told to embrace what he's good at, no more brother...) yet surprisingly there was an uptick in how things were going with him and Kim and they seemed to be in a better place than they had been almost all season. I was not expecting that.

That said, the real surprise was the ending of Chuck. Having been a real heel since about episode 9 of Season 1 and kind of taking the role of villain in the Jimmy portion of the show, it is surprising how well the writers were still able to generate sympathy for Chuck in the end. Kim being unhappy with what happened to him, his realization of his condition and trying to get better helped ease up the viewers dislike towards him. Yet, he then lashed out at the insurance agents and Howard and his further rejection of Jimmy or being able to recognize any fault on his part in their relationship lead to vilifying himself again. But then you saw the consequences and how that seemed to affect him. Unable or unwilling to seek forgiveness for what he said to Jimmy or even acknowledge any guilt for his behaviour, it seems to have manifested itself as the true reason for his disorder and causes his descent back into madness which doesn't bring about any sense of joy in the viewer. It would have been far preferable to see Chuck try to make amends rather than go out the broken man he is at the end. (Although some might disagree and feel he got what he deserved.)

Going back to my earlier point of this show sometimes foreshadowing or announcing its intent ahead of time and then we just watch and wait for it to happen, the final episode title this season was Lantern and it had been known for some 3 - 4 weeks before the episode aired. Thus, there was a lot of speculation that Chuck might meet his demise this episode in a fire by the gas lantern that was constantly referenced through this season and the previous ones. However, there was a lot of speculation and theories as to how or why. To my knowledge, no one predicted the path the show ended up making. Even when watching the episode, the cold open homes in on a gas lantern and then it's pretty much forgotten. When Jimmy visits Chuck, there seems to be no danger of him dying by a fire caused from the gas lantern he used to use. Even as we witness his mental breakdown, such an outcome still doesn't seem forthcoming. In fact, near the end, as Jimmy is making Kim breakfast, I suddenly realized the episode was almost over and the only lantern shown so far was in the cold open. Was this a trick by the writers after people figured out the Fring's Back anagram of last year? And then that ending scene happened and the realization of the fire trap that Chuck created for himself is instantly apparent and despite expecting this outcome for awhile, it still comes as a shock and tragedy.

I was thinking about commenting on Better Call Saul earlier but I was still processing that ending. In some ways, the show has almost been about Jimmy, Mike and Chuck. Chuck has had a huge impact on Jimmy's world and a major factor in a lot of his choices and now he's gone. I wonder how the writers are going to fill that void. It is sad to see Chuck go. I was actually secretly hoping that maybe Chuck might re-appear in the future and find Jimmy at Cinnebon and maybe even help him get out of the trouble he faces post-Breaking Bad as a way to make-up and re-do the assistance he could have offered Jimmy the first time he did that and Jimmy moved to New Mexico to show his thanks and turn his life around. But that potential happy ending is not to be.

It is a curious thing about this show. Where is it headed? Breaking Bad had a clear goal. The transformation of Walter White from law-abiding to criminal and his rise and fall. What is the story of Jimmy? Is there redemption at the end? Can there be redemption? A facing of his consequences? Each season gives us the glimpse of life after Breaking Bad and yet to what end?

Well, you got me posting all manner of thoughts I've had on this show and this season since I really haven't been talking about it much so I've got a lot to say. However, I'll just wrap up by saying that I hope the writers don't delay the transformation of Jimmy into Saul much longer. I've honestly enjoyed the Jimmy portion more than the Mike but the decision to have Jimmy on probation from practicing law for a year is a bit frustrating. I like to see Jimmy/Saul defending guilty clients. Episode 2 of season 2 where Jimmy helps the nerdy drug dealer ward off suspicion from the police with his Peach Cobbler story are what I was hoping to see more of when the BCS spin-off was first announced and I'd love to see various episodes with him coming up with such creative solutions to get out of legal entanglements. As Chuck said, Jimmy should do what he is best at and hopefully the writers will allow that to happen.

[Khushrenada]

And if Better Call Saul isn't your thing, I'm now 9 episodes into Season 7 of DS9. 17 to go! The end is near!

Even though we just had a bit of a discussion on it, there's some other things I'll mention now that more has developed.

Let's start with Keiko and Molly. Still don't get the dislike Keiko that came up last time. However, I recently saw the episode where Molly gets transported to the future and becomes a feral girl. This brought about some points. I've meant to mention but always forgot about it since it is a minor point but the child who plays Molly is a terrible actress. Ha ha ha. I mean, she is just a little kid so I'm not going really criticize the kid for it but when I watch her scenes, it ruins the illusion that you're watching something real and you suddenly become aware that you are watching some actors doing a scene. In my head, I'm imagining the director coaching Molly of where to look or what to say just out of view of the camera. It reached a perfect storm in the beginning when Molly falls into the time portal with cheesy effects and her "acting" scared. But then the episode had an older Molly and I thought that was the writers way of removing the younger Molly so they didn't have to use the young child anymore. But nope, they brought the young Molly back at the end.

However, on the other hand, I was impressed with Rosalind Chao who plays Keiko and how well she plays her part and does a lot of the emotional heavy lifting and concern despite not really being around much as this character. It's one of the odd things about DS9. When it started, the O'Briens were a big focus in the first couple seasons but then they had Keiko do her thing on Bajor and then she and Molly would pop up on a rare occasion. Then she came back and they did the baby thing with Kira which was a weird solution to incorporate Nana Visitor's pregnancy into the show. Then she disappeared again and I had become so use to Miles as a bachelor that when she reappeared in this episode it was this weird shock of why isn't Miles with his family more. It was mentioned that she came back because it was relatively safe enough after war broke out (and she may have also left when Dukat took over Cardassia with the Dominion as there were a lot of people fleeing from the coming Dominion invasion fleet.) As much as we take about the growth of a lot of characters over the course of the show and remembering and using elements of past episodes to build its lore and move its storylines, the disappearance and random appearances of Miles family does stick out. Sometimes it seems the Miles is just a bachelor like Julian and they can hang out all the time together and sometimes he's suddenly a family man with family responsibilities. Moreover, it just seems convenient that Miles can dump his family off here and there while you still have Jake and Benjamin sticking together and around the station through these tough times along with Quark, Rom, Nog and Leeta all together as well. To me, I think there could have been some interesting story and drama done with Miles caring for his family through this but maybe Rosalind was busy with other work or the writers just preferred not to think about and incorporate Miles family.

I learned the non-talking alien is called Morn. I honestly thought his name was Lorne. It always sounded like that was how people were pronouncing his name. It wasn't until an episode sort of about him aired that I learned how it was spelt and that was his name. I do like how the writers clued in to him and started making jokes around him by not having him speak or having characters talk about him and some of the antics he's supposed to have engaged in which we don't see on screen. When I was first watching this show, he always stood out in the background because of how different he looked from other aliens that were there and it made the show feel kind of cheap like they weren't able to find other costumes and just kept reusing this one. However, he must have caught the attention of a lot of other fans who must have asked about him causing the show to name him and start giving him little moments with other characters. That said, I think the show has reached past the point of keeping him silent. The Morn episode really made that silent ploy rather forced particularly at the end. It's like Link from the Legend of Zelda has come to DS9.

Since I'm at this point in the series, I want to know about this comment from oohhboy:

Bajorians are dumb but you will understand why when that character appears and you will hate them.

Alright. Which character are you referring to? Veddik Kai Winn? I don't get the statement because I've never found the Bajorans dumb nor have I hated them. (Well, the only thing I've hated about them is their clothing. I keep hoping Bajor would be inducted into the Federation so we don't have to see those beige uniforms anymore although it makes sense for a planet that was pillaged of resources for 50 years. There may not be a lot of fashion choices available for mass production.)

In all honesty, general comments I've often seen about Deep Space Nine before watching it are how the prophets subplot got old or was used a bit much yet I haven't had much of a problem with it until recently. Part of that is from leaving things about the Prophets/Wormhole Aliens a bit vague and part of it being that characters aren't recalling events from past episodes making some religious debates pointless.

On the other hand, the storyline which is often praised more was the Dominion storyline and while there are lots of plot points to like from it, I find it a bit lacking in some ways. Part of the problem is never having a clear understanding of just how strong or weak the Dominion is. It seems to vary all the time. Plus, it would help if there was clear understanding of just what the borders and territories of the Alpha Quadrant looked like to know just what kind of advances and retreats are happening. What is the situation actually like? Where are the alliances winning and where are they losing? It can be hard to appreciate the stakes of the situation aside from the broad terms of the Federation is in trouble or the Dominion is pushed back to Cardassian space. Moreover, there are still things about the Dominion that could use explaining. If they do take over the Alpha Quadrant then what? What is their goal or purpose? If the Alpha Quadrant was under their rule, how would that be bad? Cardassia has been under their rule but it's not like they are subjecting the Cardassians. In fact, they have made the Cardassians stronger than they were for some time. I keep hoping for a bit more fleshing out of their motivations and thinking but with few episodes remaining, I'm beginning to worry that such answers may never truly be given.

[NWR_insanolord]

Some of what you're saying in those last two paragraphs will be addressed in the remaining episodes.

Also, Morn's name was picked as an anagram of Norm, as in the character from Cheers, because he's always sitting there at the end of the bar, and there was the running joke that he never stopped talking, even though he never talked onscreen, and I believe the costume didn't allow for it.

[Khushrenada]

Ah, I never thought about flipping the name around. Makes sense. I like the reference.

A couple other things that I was going to mention but it was late and I'd already made a long post.

Kira and Odo. When the show first decided to start revealing that Odo had feelings for Kira somewhere in Season 3, I was against the idea. It didn't seem like a good match and I was hoping this wouldn't start down this path of them eventually getting together. And for a long time, it kept them separate and it just seemed like it was part of Odo's character to have this unrequited love that he was unwilling or maybe aware of Kira's feelings not to act on. Even when his love for Kira was revealed, it wasn't really reciprocated and nothing happened in them suddenly getting together and I was fine with that. But finally they forced the issue and have put them together and.... I'm still not really sold on it. While the characters seem happy enough with each other, I don't really see or feel much chemistry with them. The pairing of Dax and Worf worked out great but this Odo / Kira pairing is meh.

I honestly think the best match for Kira is/was Vedek Bareil. His personality, while a bit opposite of Kira's, meshed well with hers. There was an episode in which a Mirror Universe Bareil appeared on the station and, despite having been gone for about three seasons, having him and Kira reunite reminded me that they made a pretty good match and I was really hoping he'd stick around but back to the Mirror Universe he went. Of course, the start of Bareil and Kira's relationship was initially rather odd and seemed weird but I grew to like it so maybe I'll come around on Odo and Kira eventually but, considering some of the other events that have happened between them, I just don't see why they'd have ever hooked up. On one other brief aside, it's nice to see Kira promoted to Colonel, although it sounds a bit odd, but it would have been nice to get a reason or ceremony for her. We got to see Sisko celebrate his promotion, why can't Kira get a celebration?

[Plugabugz]

Yesterday marked one year since Person of Interest aired its series finale, so i decided to watch it again. Yes its still amazing, and since then only Agents of Shield's recent season is the closest in terms of narrative confidence that came close.

Preacher, Dark Matter, Killjoys and Doctor Who are all still on (or starting soon) so i still have things to watch.

[Stratos]

I really need to watch Person of Interest. Might make that my new non-humor show for the summer.

[broodwars]

Catching up on the DC CW shows' latest seasons. God, I hate Supergirl. I thought it was on the upswing last season towards the end, but this season has just been aggravating with its focus on pushing politics. I wouldn't mind it so much if it was done well, but political discussion requires a soft touch to come across as meaningful. See almost the entirety of The West Wing, and that show was written by one of the best writers in Television before he went nuts. These writers were hired to write a show about punching aliens & throwing cars, & they're not even particularly great at that, so they approach the complicated, argumentative world of politics with all the subtlety of a rocket launcher. They're simply not GOOD at this. I was ready to throw something heavy through a wall when I heard "Make Daxom Great Again", because it just immediately took me out of the show.

Around Ep. 17 of all the shows, except LoT, which I've finished. LoT was fine, overall. I have mixed feelings about this season of Arrow & Flash. Lot of characters just spinning in place repeating old character arcs on both shows.

[Plugabugz]

Flash was spinning its wheels over and over repeatedly this season while the sense of fun is still simply missing. Arrow at least had storylines away from Oliver which helped the rest of the cast look busy. Both shows suffer from too many episodes though.

"Make Daxom Great Again"

Which was worse, that line or the gun control episode in Arrow?

[broodwars]

Flash was spinning its wheels over and over repeatedly this season while the sense of fun is still simply missing. Arrow at least had storylines away from Oliver which helped the rest of the cast look busy. Both shows suffer from too many episodes though.

"Make Daxom Great Again"

Which was worse, that line or the gun control episode in Arrow?

That line. Arrow, to its credit, at least tried to have a debate on the issue, and in the end tackled the matter straight down the center. They even admitted that no gun control laws could have stopped the person who murdered the villain's family, since they obtained their guns immediately.

[lolmonade]

Khush, since we're the only ones on the Better Call Saul discussion, I'll spoiler my whole text just in case so I don't have to cherry pick where to block text.





If you aren't yet, I'd strongly suggest you give the Better Call Saul Insider podcast a listen.  While they'll often deviate into some of their set-up/planning a shot, they also dive deep pretty often into how they write the characters, why they go the pace they do, and more often than not, they CLAIM they write the story arcs more based on a basic premise of - who are these people?  what are their motivations? what are their obstacles?  what would they do to meet their objectives based in reality of who they are and the world they're in?  I think they largely follow that ethos in the actual storytelling, including the fact that there is generally a time lapse between when a person's motivation is established and when their efforts bear fruit. 


For Jimmy's transformation into Saul?  I'd argue Saul is more of "who he is" than the elder law premise/work he established himself doing.  His scheming in Chicago as a younger man, his lamenting his hard-working parents getting screwed for being hard working, helpful, honest people, and that being motivation that he's never going to allow himself to be the one getting screwed.  The seasons so far have largely him being tethered towards doing "good" by seeking his brother's approval and his interest in pursuing Kim as a love interest when she has been a straight arrow until she got caught up in him.  His handling of the sandpiper case is the perfect study for who he is - a smart legal mind who can't handle working in the normal procedure of law.  So with Chuck's apparent demise, I suspect season 4 would induce the kind of unraveling towards being his true self, with him burning his elder law bridges at the end of this season.


I took Chuck's downfall despite his progress more as a reality that it only takes one or two bad choice or outcomes to make someone with a mental illness relapse.  As he's trying so hard to get well so we can go back to practicing law, he encounters a Howard that has reached his limit to him, so much that he has taken money out of his own pocket and loans to buy-out Chuck's share of the practice.  He says the worst thing he can to Jimmy when Kim's accident makes him reconsider how important his brother still is to him - not that he hates him, even worse, he doesn't care one way or another about him.  That and Chuck's inherent unwillingness to admit fault bring him tumbling down to where his illness re-emerges to that awful sequence. 


Chuck's motivations I've never quite understood, other than a basic need to prove he's better than Jimmy.  They have a very clear older/younger brother relationship, because at the same time, the younger brother (Jimmy) wants nothing more than his brother's respect.  He gets a law degree, then tries to hold Jimmy down from getting a law degree.  He purposefully keeps Jimmy from being promoted within HHM as a practicing lawyer, sets a plan in motion to catch Jimmy in a trap, and uses a plea deal for him to relinquish his license.  I think you can think he's in the right for some of his actions, but still think he's a jerk.  Because of all of this, Chuck's end is pretty tragic, even if I generally didn't like his character.





I will say, while I understand some people don't like the slow pace some episodes have in this show, I've come to appreciate how they seem to slow-roll, let the story take its time. 

[broodwars]

Finished Arrow Season 5, and...wow, this season was a severe step down from last season. For one thing, it feels like everyone's character growth reverted a season. It feels like last season should have been a natural progression from THIS season. The flashbacks continued, even more tedious & pointless than ever, and Prometheus is so stupidly OP/ "such a master strategist" that it felt like I was watching mediocre dreck like Young Justice, where every episode ended with the villains saying "all according to plan."

Half the season was spent retreading character arcs from previous seasons, & the other half was was the characters fighting against a villain protected by plot armor. Lame. The entire season just felt joyless & repetitive.

[Stratos]

Thats a pity, as I had hoped S5 would be a great closure on Oliver's flashbacks from the island. One season for every year he was "stranded". I had even hoped for a nice finale/series type closure. Maybe not an end to the series, but a good closure where they could logically re-frame the show in a new era/style of sorts. But on all accounts, S3 sounds like a better "closing" than S5 was, which is a shame.

[ThePerm]

Girlboss 8/10 A pretty enjoyable show. It has unlikable characters(though, those type of personalities I find attractive), but that doesn't make the show less entertaining. Pity I was finally watching it just as they were cancelling it. It also has a pretty terrible name, which is why I didn't watch it at first. But, on the other hand I'm interested in entrepreneurial starting a business biopics.  It was like Ghostbusters, except Peter Venkman is selling dresses.

[Stratos]

Agents of Shield is on Netflix! Already started and loving the new season. Excited to see where it goes because of all the positive reviews on here.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Please post impressions and you progress. the season was so good, and just when you thought it peaked.... they switched it up, and it got even better.

The 3 arc format was amazing this season. really helped w/ the story and pacing of the show.

[Plugabugz]

Welcome back Preacher. THE SEARCH FOR GOD. DAY ONE cannot get any simpler than that.

Dominic Cooper and Ruth Negga have amazing chemistry together even when silent - but then it helps they've been together for 7 years.

[Stratos]

Please post impressions and you progress. the season was so good, and just when you thought it peaked.... they switched it up, and it got even better.

The 3 arc format was amazing this season. really helped w/ the story and pacing of the show.

We are on episode 3 or 4 and I'm really loving it so far. I like that there is some mystery, but not so much it bludgeons you over the head. Also happy to see Yo-Yo getting a more prominent role, as she is a favorite for my wife. Ghost Rider is awesome, though I miss his bike, hoping that makes an appearance down the road.


Any annoyance I had with Daisy in earlier seasons is gone, and I just love Fitz-Simmons and Mack.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Please post impressions and you progress. the season was so good, and just when you thought it peaked.... they switched it up, and it got even better.

The 3 arc format was amazing this season. really helped w/ the story and pacing of the show.

We are on episode 3 or 4 and I'm really loving it so far. I like that there is some mystery, but not so much it bludgeons you over the head. Also happy to see Yo-Yo getting a more prominent role, as she is a favorite for my wife. Ghost Rider is awesome, though I miss his bike, hoping that makes an appearance down the road.


Any annoyance I had with Daisy in earlier seasons is gone, and I just love Fitz-Simmons and Mack.

You're in for a treat.... I wish I could watch it again for the first time, AND binge it at my own pace without having to wait a week... or weeks inbetween eps and arcs. But I didn't have the patience to wait that long.

And even thought I think GR is a really good opening arc, IMO it just gets better from there.

[lolmonade]

Please post impressions and you progress. the season was so good, and just when you thought it peaked.... they switched it up, and it got even better.

The 3 arc format was amazing this season. really helped w/ the story and pacing of the show.

We are on episode 3 or 4 and I'm really loving it so far. I like that there is some mystery, but not so much it bludgeons you over the head. Also happy to see Yo-Yo getting a more prominent role, as she is a favorite for my wife. Ghost Rider is awesome, though I miss his bike, hoping that makes an appearance down the road.


Any annoyance I had with Daisy in earlier seasons is gone, and I just love Fitz-Simmons and Mack.

The newest season of Agents of Shield goes in a lot of weird places, in the best ways.  Any squabbles I had about it at the time of watching it were minor ones.  Definitely worth a watch.

[Spak-Spang]

I just started season 5 of POI.  It truly is a great show.  I can tell the show is better to marathon...and you could skip some episodes.  But starting with season 3 it is really great...even the cheesy campy parts work.

[oohhboy]

There isn't really any episodes you can miss as each one adds to the overall arc, builds characters and the world. Basically there are no "Irrelevant" episodes just some poorly made ones. IU really wish they had a full final season with a proper budget. There are a lot of things that get dropped or heavily sidelined that isn't helped by NBC(?) mandating continuing the serial format instead of letting them finish up the story free of that particular constraint.

Go watch Westworld after. It is a sort of spiritual sequel in they sense it has AIs, a lot of the same moral questions and it has Nolan behind it. Plus it is a stunning show with unbelievable Olympic level acting from just about everyone and oh gad you are going to love Ford.

Don't straight up marathon it. Watch a episode, let it brew a little then watch the next.

[Plugabugz]

I'd argue that there's some episodes in season 1 and 2 a few after Elias is introduced and a handful from season 2, but from season 3 onwards when you hit the first three parter of eps from there the show becomes almost continually serialised.

There are a lot of things that get dropped or heavily sidelined that isn't helped by NBC(?) mandating continuing the serial format instead of letting them finish up the story free of that particular constraint.

CBS forced them to keep the numbers of the week into late season 4 and beyond, which coupled with things around that time meant the show stumbled a little bit. Not having a full season 5 really hurt it badly too.

Plus POI is one of the few shows where it had a completely satisfying series finale, and even a year after it's ended some of its storylines are still coming true the virus in the finale causing worldwide damage happened last month.

[Spak-Spang]

See I think the numbers is whar ground the show.  There is a much bigger threat but the team has and should be protecting the individual first.  Once they stop doing that...they stop being the machines assets to protect humanity and stop showing the machine that all human life is valuable.  Plus you also begin to see the computer intelligently and covertly communicating and fighting the bigger fight through the numbers.  This is something it appears Samaritan can't predict.  It is like a blindspot.  Final thought the show even discusses this debate about the numbers with Root and Herald.  He always chooses the human equation even when it is a dangerous choice.  The numbers are never irrelevant...even if the audience wishes they were.