Author Topic: The curse of Brand Loyalty  (Read 14236 times)

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Offline rossi46

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The curse of Brand Loyalty
« on: July 01, 2006, 12:10:19 PM »
Do we all still suffer from it in 2006? I used to be such a Zealot, back in the day. As far back as the days of Atari STs versus Amigas, (ask your dad...) through Megadrive versus Snes, I was sometimes physically opposed to the counterpart to the machine I owned. more than once I ended up in a fist-fight in the playground (and once in a nightclub, FFS!) over 'which machine was better'. Latterly, I missed out on so many amazing games because I chose to have a Dreamcast over the PS2, talk about limited choice, but I never forgave Sony for the demise of the Saturn.

For the last few years, I've tried to redress that balance by buying all the machines and consoles I refused to have due to my own blinkered, narrow-minded stupidity. Now, 18 machines and 3000-odd games later I reckon I've satisfied my lust for past games and come to the conclusion that brand-loyalty is for losers and zealots. Surely it's the games that are important, not the machine?

Paul
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #1 on: July 01, 2006, 12:17:53 PM »
I've always been a multi system owner, but I do have a preference for Nintendo consoles due to their games.  Not to say I haven't played great games on other consoles, like the Kingdom Hearts series or Shadow of Collosus, because I have. I was an owner of an Xbox 360 but sold it because of the drought, and will probaly end up picking it up for Dead Rising when that comes out. With all that said, I can't blame for some being brand loyal, since people may not always have the money to get multiple systems. Not only that but I think it is very legitimate to "buy all" a system developer if you do not agree with what they are doing.
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Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #2 on: July 01, 2006, 01:27:56 PM »
One of my elderly relatives put it in perpsective for me one time. He came home and asked me if I'd be buying the game that he saw advertised on tv at his place of work and I said 'not a chance'. The game in question was Ridge-Racer on PS1 and after trying for a half hour to explain to him that, although it looked good and played well in the arcade, I wouldn't be buying it because I refused to have a PS1. My uncle thought this was ludicrous and asked me if I would do the same if a film I was dying to see would only play on a certain brand of dvd-player - would I just do without seeing the film? Would I hell..

Paul
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #3 on: July 01, 2006, 01:42:39 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: rossi46
One of my elderly relatives put it in perpsective for me one time. He came home and asked me if I'd be buying the game that he saw advertised on tv at his place of work and I said 'not a chance'. The game in question was Ridge-Racer on PS1 and after trying for a half hour to explain to him that, although it looked good and played well in the arcade, I wouldn't be buying it because I refused to have a PS1. My uncle thought this was ludicrous and asked me if I would do the same if a film I was dying to see would only play on a certain brand of dvd-player - would I just do without seeing the film? Would I hell..

Paul


I would if that DVD player was a Bluray, hehe .
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #4 on: July 01, 2006, 01:54:00 PM »
It would appear that you are a supporter of the "One Console Future" and didn't even know it. That is why we have brand loyalty at some level, we want to see all the games(that are worth anything) come to the console that we chose to support. I don't want to have multiple system laying around that have to be hooked up only to play certain games(space and money could be an issue).

Not all of us can afford to buy multiple systems and all the games we want for them, but we might be able to buy one system with all the games we want for it. Its just like this new HD format war, do I buy a HD-DVD and only be able to watch certain movies in HD or do I spend more and get a Blu-ray player and be able to watch a more but different titles in HD? I definately don't want to spend upwards of $1000 to buy both just so that I can watch all the movies in HD, I would just be better off with a decent DVD player with an upscaler for now, atleast until I can be assured that any movie I want to buy will be able to be played on the player that I have(HD-DVD/Blu-ray hybrid).

For now its too expensive to own all competeing systems($1200 for next-gen) and all the games that you want(priced from $20-$100?). So for now I continue to but my gaming $$$ behind Nintendo while other friends of mine may support MS or Sony(& Nintendo too), so that when we come together we can get the best of all worlds.

Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #5 on: July 01, 2006, 02:10:14 PM »
I do have a past as a flaming fanboy getting into repeated arguments in fourms here and there blasting angry rhetoric at other flaming fanboys... and I don't look back on those days with any pleasure at all.

But I don't regret the passion, nor the sentiment behind those days. I regret the actions I carried out in those days, but I can easily make the distinction between my own foolish actions, and the things I believed I was protecting by those actions. Otherwise, how could religion be justified at all? I believe in laying the blame for fanboyism and brand loyalty where it belongs: on the people who actually carry out their own (perhaps mislead) personal choices.

Besides, I still vastly prefer Nintendo's games, and Nintendo's game philosophy, to anyone else's. My views have changed a little since those days... well, I think the word "matured" is a little bit better.

The fact is that since those days, my understanding of Nintendo has matured. I mean, who really wants flaming brand loyalty anyways? Nintendo's never asked for that. What they want is to make games that they can believe in, games that they believe are high-quality, and that they believe push the medium forward. And heck, if another company makes that (in small or large innovations, from GTA 3 to Halo), there's nothing in a Nintendo's fanboy's beliefs that forbids them from playing that! In fact, as believers in quality and exploring videogames, it's almost a Nintendo fans duty to play and explore these games.

And of course, Nintendo's gaming philosophy IS beautiful, but it isn't nearly the only way, nor should it be. Nintendo would've never pushed for adopting cinematic sensibilities like Konami and Metal Gear Solid has, nor would they have ventured out and tested the boundaries of pop-culture violence and sex like DMA/Rockstar North has with GTA3. And of course, Nintendo doesn't make FPS', where do FPS fans get their fix without Halo, without Half-Life 2?

Yet, those games don't work for me. They don't make me believe in the medium, they don't make me believe in magic, and they don't inspire me to drop hundreds of precious dollars on the hardware I need to play them. (Also, the hardware they play on... the interfaces aren't to my tastes) So obviously, even though I have come to respect other games and other systems, I still can't love them.

But Nintendo... I've matured and gotten a better understanding of their philosophies, and I still believe in them, call myself a fanboi, and almost exclusively buy their systems. But I've come to believe that to be a fanboi of Nintendo, I have to believe in videogames the way Nintendo does, not to put down other games, but to see them critically. Not to merely enjoy videogames, but to see them as a field where innovation and quality should be striven for. Not to merely play them, but for gosh sakes to understand them.

So I believe that I AM a fanboy, that I do exhibit brand loyalty, and that I do still argue on the side of Nintendo. But I like to think that the fanboy that I am, and that I'm trying to be, is exactly the type of fanboy that Nintendo can be proud of.

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A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #6 on: July 01, 2006, 02:10:20 PM »
I'd worry that a 'one console future' descended us all into drudgery, mediocrity and a global 'Playstation-esque' flood of empty, meaningless and worthless games. I truly believe that having only one console would bring forward the date, by leaps and bounds, of the second Great Videogames Crash that we all know is going to happen.

I'm fully aware that this seems to contradict my earlier post, but I was originally berating the zealots, of which I was one, who would dismiss out of hand any machine other than the one they'd pleged alegiance to. Christ, I missed out on the best version of Streetfighter 2 on the Snes because I was a Megadrive (Genesis) fan. How stupid do you think I feel now? LOL.
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Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #7 on: July 01, 2006, 02:19:11 PM »
Thank god for the internet. I'm sure that someone's erased over any records of my..uh...past... by now.

~Carmine M. Red
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Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #8 on: July 01, 2006, 02:28:01 PM »
I heard EA are clearing a space in the desert to bury 10 million copies of 'Generic Racer 17' just in case...
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Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2006, 02:32:32 PM »
I heard that they actually FOUND the legendary landfill of Atari 2600 E.T. cartridges...

~Carmine M. Red
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Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2006, 02:35:48 PM »
I've read the (David Scheff) story of the event, but still thought it was an urban myth. Is there now concrete (no pun) evidence of proof??
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Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2006, 02:38:03 PM »
I don't know, I just heard it from my Game and Simulation Programming teacher. Maybe it still IS an urban legend... but god it's so cool!

~Carmine M. Red
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Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2006, 02:50:24 PM »
Oh to be the first person to throw a cart in Ebay's direction!

In David Scheff's book, 'Game Over - the Nintendo Story' he says the carts were all crushed before being encased in concrete then buried. Archaeologists of the future are going to think we were nuts.
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Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2006, 02:56:43 PM »
Let's stick a copy of "Game Over" down there too... not mine though!

~Carmine M. Red
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Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline Artimus

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2006, 02:58:55 PM »
I can only afford (or willing to pay for, I suppose) one system and its games. Nintendo has the most that appeals to me and the msot I know will satisfy me. That's why I'm a Nintendo loyalist.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #15 on: July 01, 2006, 03:05:27 PM »
That's a fair point. But, do you instantly jump on others who do not share your view? I used to. Now I look back in shame, tbh. It's a form of bigotry. I've managed, through the medium of car-boot sales (garage sales to you lot) and charity/thrift shops to obtain all the stuff I shunned in the past - yes, even a PS1! - and I've quickly come to realise that it's all gaming.  
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Offline Hocotate

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #16 on: July 01, 2006, 06:31:05 PM »
I know someone who tries so hard to not be a fanboy, he does his best to buy every console each gen (despite not liking Nintendo). If you ask me, doing that is more stupid then supporting a singe console. Don't buy a system just for the sake of owning it or for a 'few' good games. In this upcoming generation, $599 is a lot to waste...

Even if Sony gets the most/best 3rd party support, I refuse to purchase a PS3. I will quite gaming before I buy one. $600 is an outrageous price and Sony knows it, but if they can get away with it and continue to be market leader, it will show them that the price is ok. You can bet that if the PS3 takes a solid 1st, the PS4 will be $1,000+. I broke down this gen and bought an import  PS2 (mainly for my 2D fighters fix), but now that Nintendo has full SNK support, I have no need to purchase a Playstation...

I've always bought Nintendo and Sega systems, and that was enough for me. I've never accepted the big, non-gaming focused corperations (Sony, Microsoft).
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Offline Requiem

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #17 on: July 01, 2006, 07:08:41 PM »
I have never been a (complete) fanboy. Yes I grew up with Nintendo, so I happen to like them more; however, games are games no matter who makes them.

I can have just as much fun (or more) playing God of War on the PS2 as I can playing Super Mario Sunshine.

I wish I had an arcade because I love those as well. It really doesn't matter who makes the damn thing, just as long as it's fun and entertaining.

With that said, I have a preference to Nintendo simply because I like their games more. I'm not rich, I can't afford all three next gen consoles (though I do have all three current gen consoles). I don't have the luxury of sampling every console, so I have to make my decision through my preference which just happens to be Nintendo.
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Offline Arbok

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #18 on: July 01, 2006, 07:23:52 PM »
I used to buy both Nintendo and Sega's offerings, although with the latter gone I have focused just on Nintendo. I don't play console games enough now adays to really merit buying more than one in a generation anymore though, especially with how expensive they have become.

These days, I have been drifiting more toward the handhelds as they fit my schedule better, although SSBB might change that in a major way...
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Offline Mario

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #19 on: July 01, 2006, 11:41:43 PM »
If someone handed me a free PS3, i'd probably play it. If that doesn't happen, i'll just stick exclusively to Wii and DS.

Offline rossi46

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RE:The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #20 on: July 02, 2006, 12:25:53 AM »
None of the next-gen offerings are making me excited enough to part with my cash. Right now I have no plans to buy any of them. I'm a huge fan of racing games, which is why I bought a PSP, so when I eventually do buy a new console, I'll go with the one that can fill my racing game needs.
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Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #21 on: July 02, 2006, 12:57:12 AM »
Sounds like a plan rossi... hmm... how much does an arcade racing cabinet cost?

~Carmine M. Red
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Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline Requiem

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #22 on: July 02, 2006, 01:05:59 PM »
probably like $3000
"Hey....

I'm not a whore, ok? Really.....really, I'm not.

But, if she slips man....if she slips, I slide!"

Qoute of the Summer

Offline Kairon

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #23 on: July 02, 2006, 02:33:53 PM »
You'd think the darn arcade people would get together and make a "one size fits all" car racing cabinet, just like DDR cabinets are more or less "one-size-fits-all" and you can just plug new displays and songs in...

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Carmine Red, Associate Editor

A glooming peace this morning with it brings;
The sun, for sorrow, will not show his head:
Go hence, to have more talk of these sad things;
Some shall be pardon'd, and some punished:
For never was a story of more woe
Than this of Sega and her Mashiro.

Offline Spak-Spang

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RE: The curse of Brand Loyalty
« Reply #24 on: July 03, 2006, 06:39:08 AM »
When people say brand loyality I immediately think Coke or Pepsi, or Nike and Reebok or something.  

In most cases brand loyality is a preferrance, but one that does not hold people back from buying other products.

It only becomes obsessed brand loyality when the cost of investment rises...just look at cars, computers, gaming consoles ect.

Now, there is actually some logic to brand loyality.  If you can't afford both, then you have to choose.

Are you going to choose the system that has proven to have quality games you enjoy to play (or a quality car to drive) or are you going to risk another system?  

Gaming is very expensive.  I have to buy memory cards, 4 controllers, games, and the system itself.  I can't afford to do that for multiple systems.  I can't afford to figure out which games on ALL the systems I want to own.  When I limit myself I am actually happier.

With this new generation the above is even more true.  Who can afford to own a PS3 and Xbox 360?  Even the Wii360 owners are paying a pretty penny for two systems.  For now I stick with one portable system and one console system.  This generation it is going to be Wii and DS.  

The reason why is simple.  I enjoy Nintendo's in house games more any anyother games.