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Offline Halbred

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Making the Review Process Better
« on: January 03, 2009, 09:20:16 PM »
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/blogArt.cfm?artid=17476

  I have a friend who often asks me for advice about video game purchases. He has both a PS3 and an Xbox 360. Despite my lack of owning the latter, it doesn't stop him from asking me "what I've heard" or "what I've read." And that's fine. I like being the go-to guy for gaming-related decisions. He often calls me at the store, game in hand, and says, "What do you think of Mirror's Edge?" I liked the demo, I tell him, but published reviews have been all over the map. Game Informer, EGM, and Play liked it, but Edge hated it, and even among the publications who gave it high marks, they were quick to point out its faults. I rattle off a list of review scores I've seen, thus illustrating the bipolarity of the press regarding Mirror's Edge. Then he asks me a question that renders all of those scores irrelevant: "But is it fun? Will I like it?"    


Those are much tougher questions to answer. I daresay they are impossible to address in a standard number-based review format. Here's an example that hits close to home. Back when I first started here at NWR, my editors sent me Phantom Hourglass, a game I gave mediocre marks. The ensuing Talkback thread ballooned to eight pages of people yelling at me, proving beyond a doubt that enjoyment of ANY game, even one from a well-respected franchise, is completely subjective. Many people thoroughly enjoyed the very aspects of Phantom Hourglass that I criticized. And you know what? Nobody is wrong. I'm not wrong in giving the game a 7.5, and they're not wrong for giving it closer to a 10. The numbers don't mean anything.    


Here's another example: Beyond Good & Evil is one of my favorite all-time games. Were I to review it today, with my NWR reviewer hat on, I would give it average scores in all counts. The graphics are kind of all over the place, the music is good in places, the control scheme is a little floaty, partner AI is questionable, and the game just can't decide what it wants to be. However, even though each criteria (Graphics, Sound, Control, Gameplay, Lastability, Final) would get average marks, only the final score, which here at NWR we disconnect from the others, gives any indication of how great the game is. BG&E would get 6's and 7's across the board, but probably a 9 from me at the bottom. BG&E has an emotional core that, until I played it, I had not experienced in a video game (except the MGS series). Now the inverse: I gave Phantom Hourglass fairly high marks in each individual category, but a lower final score.    


Graphics, sound, control, none of this matters. What matters is whether the game is good or not. All you need is a final score. And even then, the final score is not definitive. I didn't like Phantom Hourglass, but many of my readers loved it. I love BG&E, but I know a lot of people who don't or wouldn't. I think Wario Land: Shake It! is one of the best games of 2008, but most publications barely gave it the time of day. It's all subjective, even the final score. It's just like my buddy asked me: "But is it fun? Would I like it?"    


These are not questions I can put into numerical form. Whether you, the reader, will like a game or not is not a question I can answer. I can tell you that I, personally, thought the game was great (or sucked). Hell, there might be a guy out there who really liked Homie Rollerz. Me? I hated it, and I think you good people would similarly despise it, so I told you not to waste your time or money. And that's all I can really do. Scores don't mean anything. All I can do is tell you what my experience with any given game was. You might agree or disagree, but ultimately you have to make that call.    


My feeling is that "scores" have stuck around to benefit aggregator sites, like MetaCritic and GameRankings. Review scores are collected at those sites and the resulting average affect things like stock prices, funding, and, ultimately, the consumer. It's a dirty business--one that leads to questionable situations like publishers allegedly bribing reviewers for higher numerical scores, or reviews being canned after giving a highly-advertised game a low score. Numerical values hold a lot of weight, more than I think they actually have.    


If it were up to me, reviews would simply be narrations of one player's experience with any given game. Play and Edge, two of the more progressive gaming publications out there, have dramatically reduced the number of numbers in their reviews. One of them gives a final score, and the other has done away with scores entirely, leaving readers with a short "parting shot," basically the text that would go under NWR's "Final" score. Think about it--would that Phantom Hourglass review have been so lambasted were it lacking numerical scores? I really doubt it. You can argue about subjective scores, but it's tough to tell somebody that their opinion is wrong. I didn't like the game, simple as that, but you might. Numbers are infinitely more concrete than language.    


The value of a game cannot be measured in terms of math, only experience and personal taste. What do you guys, as the readers, think of the standard review format? Do numbers help you? And if so, how?

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Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2009, 01:34:49 AM »
The worst thing about MetaCritic (not sure about GameRankings, haven't read their fine print) is that if you don't provide a score, they will MAKE IT UP FOR YOU.  So even reviews that don't provide number scores are given number scores based on, from what I'm assuming, the "tone" of a review.

MetaCritic is neat as an at-a-glance site, but I think it's lunacy that companies actually sit there and tie business objectives to MetaCritic scores because, as Zach points out, review scores are completely arbitrary.  One man's 6 is another man's 8, and while that's nice fodder for a discussion forum, basing your definition of success on those scores is simply not wise.
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Offline broodwars

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2009, 03:27:26 AM »
I highly recomend the GameCritics.com site for reviews, as their reviews seem to echo your sentiments.  There is a score at the end of the review, but if you didn't know to highlight the page to find it you'd never know it was there.
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Offline Deguello

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2009, 04:16:08 AM »
Quote
Think about it--would that Phantom Hourglass review have been so lambasted were it lacking numerical scores? I really doubt it.

I dunno, that whole part about Nintendo "changing the game for casual gamers" would have still drawn a lot of groans from the audience, being the tired canard it was in 2007.

The problem with releasing the hold of reviews on game quality stewardship is that you can then logically assume that anybody who enjoys X game, that makes it a 10 to them.  It's a short leap from there to sales figures and next thing you know whatever game that sells the most is the one enjoyed the most and therefore the highest quality.  I've been told that's bad... I think.

We, as reviewers, seem to have tricked ourselves into thinking we are necessary.  We really aren't.  After reviewing mountains of ****, I can say that my opinion of any of these games probably never influenced a single buying decision.  Even when I review the occasional anticipated release, I can tell my review might as well have been posted on the inside of a church bathroom.  And it's because of this, that I know every opinion I give is honest.  I dread the numbers part, sure.  But I do them anyway, without breaking out a slide rule and making sure I haven't given out too many 10s so I seem "credible."

The only real problem with numerical scores are the aggregator sites like you mentioned.  Nothing encourages and incites 1984-ish groupthink than "Oh yeah, well Super Blood Racing got 89% on GameRankings.  Take that, Wii Sports!"  That and it's probably work theft, too.

And they already have something like what you want.  User reviews on Amazon!  That's where you'll find heartfelt customer reviews of the games they own and how they enjoy them.  You'll find Mario Kart Wii has a 90%+ rating, besting Halo 3, and Wii Music, Wii Fit, and My Fitness Coach have higher scores than Call of Duty: World at War (which strangely has the same score as Wii Play.)  Bedlam to be sure, customers enjoying their games against the wishes of professional reviewers.
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Offline Nick DiMola

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #4 on: January 04, 2009, 11:15:34 AM »
It has long been my position that a review is more of a recommendation than a criticism. Perhaps it's just how I read reviews and how I see their purpose, but to me a review's purpose is to recommend a game for purchase. I don't truly believe that most readers are interested in its relative merit amongst all other games.

In a perfect world, I'd prefer my reviews without a score. But, as Lindy pointed out earlier, aggregation sites like Meta Critic and Game Rankings have forced the entire industry into a 1-10 grading scale. So if you don't provide a score, they'll give you one, without consultation. Naturally this provides a major problem.

Kotaku made a valiant attempt at removing scores, but in my opinion failed. They provide what is essentially a list of pros and cons, but never really qualify on the whole whether the experience is worthwhile or not. I think it's important to imply a number or guide your reader towards the game's worth in your text. Whether or not a a score is provided at the bottom, reading through the text, readers should be able to make a decent guess how good that game actually is.

But again, lack of a number gets back to our role as reviewers, are we critics (ala Roger Ebert) or just recommenders (suggesting or dissuading a purchase)? In my mind, most people read a review to determine what action they are going to take with a game. Will they Buy it now, or wait for a price drop, or rent it, or just avoid it all together? I'm guessing most people simply internalize a score from 1-10 and make that call. As such I've always believed that blatantly pointing this out is the best course of action.

I know most staff disagrees with me on our purpose as reviewers, but I'd like to hear what you guys think. How do you consider reviews? Do you read them to gauge purchase-ability? Or do you read them for other reasons?
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #5 on: January 04, 2009, 11:22:42 AM »
I think the subcategories aren't really worth having scores, their mandatory bit of text is a bit helpful since it acts as a checklist to make sure the review mentions these things but I don't think I put much value into the score that ends up there. The final score has often served as a crutch for the reviewer IMO, often a review fails to convey how much fun the game actually is (with too much mentioning of positive secondary features even a bad game can sound good without the score to indicate how thiose issues actually weight).

Final scores are also useful to pick a review based on its view (e.g. when looking for positive or negative reviews to see different points of view) or quickly sorting a list of games for their probability of being something you'd like.

Of course there's no way for a single reviewer to account for different tastes and I don't think a reviewer can correctly assess how a game would go down with a group he's not part of. For a proper score you'd probably need different reviewers with different mindsets (competitive, "casual hardcore", new market, social, antisocial, ...) so people can select the evaluation from the one that matches their own mentality. Multiple reviewers with the same mindset are probably redundant and not useful though (I don't think you could get a good score for "casual gamers" even if you put the whole NWR staff on one game because all they can do is guess what such a person might think and they're likely going to be wrong).

I never put much weight into Amazon reviews since I can't know if the reviewer might be a plant or something and I don't think the reviewers are an unbiased sample either (i.e. people with certain oppinions are more likely to review so the results are not statistically useful). Plus some people even post "reviews" before the game is out, just ranking it according to the amount of hype they received...

Yeah, to me reviews are nothing but purchase recommendations.

Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #6 on: January 04, 2009, 01:17:16 PM »
I think people mainly use game reviews like I use movie reviews.  If a movie gets a really good rating on Rotten Tomatoes (for example), I put it on my "probably worth checking out" list.  However, I go into it fully understanding that even though critics may have loved it/hated it, I will not necessarily love it/hate it.  A good gaming example is World of Goo.  I didn't know that game from a hole in the ground, and if it got mediocre reviews I wouldn't have blindly taken a chance on it (unless I was a fan of its genre/developer/franchise, or there was some other influencing factor that would make me pay attention to it).  However, it got rave reviews, which indicated that it's probably worth my time to investigate.  I might think it's OK, I might think it's the best game ever, but it probably something worthwhile if only to satisfy my curiosity.

It's the same old "game critique" vs. "buyer recommendation" argument.  They're really two different things.  Art vs. product.
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Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #7 on: January 04, 2009, 02:12:19 PM »
"art"? What art?

Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #8 on: January 04, 2009, 02:32:04 PM »
Reviewing something as a piece of art (or evaluating it as a successful/unsuccessful design) vs. reviewing it as a product.  It's like reviewing the design aesthetics of a Ford Mustang against other cars in the industry, vs. reviewing a Ford Mustang as a product in terms of how much value you get for the money you spend.
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #9 on: January 04, 2009, 06:40:31 PM »
I would say reviewers are still important, I know for myself I still use those reviewers who I trust to help me determine whether or not to buy a game. For example, here at NWR I tend to be more in line with Mr. Jack with his opinion on stuff so I tend to give his opinion much more attention, same with Greg.

But how would I make the review process better? Well that is easy, ban Lindy from ever writing another review!

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Offline Kairon

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #10 on: January 04, 2009, 07:06:39 PM »
Personally, i believe in deconstructionism. If a review can break its subject down into distinct values, successes, failures, responses, and most importantly discrete experiences, I think it can present a view of the game that can be read in such a way that the reader can make their own decision. It's not about if a reviewer had fun with the game. It's about HOW the fun was had, or HOW it might have been had, and what mechanisms bring about what experiences. The story is not about how the reviewer reacts, it's about how the game provokes a reaction, with no importance whatsoever on what that reaction might have been.
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Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2009, 07:51:30 PM »
But how would I make the review process better? Well that is easy, ban Lindy from ever writing another review!

INSTA-BAN
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Offline Peachylala

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2009, 08:29:25 PM »
Here's what you can guys could do for this site:

- Either just do the reviews you guys have always done for the past decade, like the pros and cons, but get rid of the ratings for each aspect (ie: graphics, sound, etc.). A scale rating of 1 to 5 for a final score could suffice too.
- OR... have no rating element what-so-ever and just have the "end of review" blurb.

The second option could work for many of the Touch Generation games that Nintendo releases (like Wii Music). Personally, maybe you guys should use the rating system for the Virtual Console games. I love that system. ;D

Whatever floats your boat, I suppose.
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Offline shammack

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2009, 08:55:26 PM »
I know most staff disagrees with me on our purpose as reviewers, but I'd like to hear what you guys think. How do you consider reviews? Do you read them to gauge purchase-ability? Or do you read them for other reasons?

Personally I read reviews to get information about how the game works and what the experience of playing it is like, so I can decide if it sounds like something I'm interested in trying for myself. If there are obvious problems like bugs, load times, or things that just don't work the way they're supposed to, I want to know about those too, but I pretty much ignore the reviewers' opinions.

Offline Kairon

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2009, 10:15:13 PM »
I know most staff disagrees with me on our purpose as reviewers, but I'd like to hear what you guys think. How do you consider reviews? Do you read them to gauge purchase-ability? Or do you read them for other reasons?

Personally I read reviews to get information about how the game works and what the experience of playing it is like, so I can decide if it sounds like something I'm interested in trying for myself. If there are obvious problems like bugs, load times, or things that just don't work the way they're supposed to, I want to know about those too, but I pretty much ignore the reviewers' opinions.

This. Exactly this. I don't depend on reviews to recommend games to me. I depend on reviews to provide me with the information I need to recommend a game to myself.

Whether that approach is common though I know not.
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Offline NWR_Lindy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2009, 11:35:35 PM »
Hmm, most readers seem to really like our VC Recommendations rating system.  Food for thought.
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Offline Kairon

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2009, 11:44:02 PM »
Hmm, most readers seem to really like our VC Recommendations rating system.  Food for thought.

Then again, those VC games cost $5-10, not $30, $40, $50, or even $90.
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Offline oohhboy

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #17 on: January 05, 2009, 12:18:01 AM »
The score helps me determine how much money I am willing to pay for a game. It doesn't decide whether I get the game. The meat of the review help me determine whether I get a game if I am on the fence about it. It helps a lot if the reviewer has a bit of history and the site has good editorial control.

Hmm, most readers seem to really like our VC Recommendations rating system.  Food for thought.

Then again, those VC games cost $5-10, not $30, $40, $50, or even $90.

Second this. VC reviews work because they are so cheap. Such a system would remove half the reason for even having a review for full priced games.
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Offline TheYoungerPlumber

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #18 on: January 05, 2009, 01:57:47 AM »
I agree with a lot of what has been said in this blog post and thread. I don't, however, agree with Zach's Phantom Hourglass review, even though I pretty much came to the same numerical score he distilled it to in my own review. Another example of why numbers don't mean a whole lot. Just looking at a final score comparable to believing that the ends justify the means.
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Offline Shift Key

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #19 on: January 05, 2009, 03:34:29 AM »
"art"? What art?

Oh no, its the Evan-signal. Now he's going to come in here swinging trashbags of rage about the old "games as art" debate!

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Offline Plugabugz

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #20 on: January 05, 2009, 04:01:05 AM »
I linked to IGN TV in Mario's thread about the gaming media about their "reviews" and they realistically can't be called that.

I reckon it can be done one of two ways:
1 - Three people group-review the game. I.E. NWR Review Podcast of Crimm, Yoshidious and a special guest reviewing Pokemon Dungeon again. The range of scores each present (with their own reasons) will help to even it out.
2 - Make no emotional/opinionated references to what you're reviewing and make only factual statements.  Not seeing crimm getting wound up over pokemon dungeon will be a BLAST

Offline KDR_11k

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #21 on: January 05, 2009, 04:44:47 AM »
I think emotional judgements are appropriate, many elements sound great on paper but in practice fall flat.

Offline TheYoungerPlumber

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #22 on: January 05, 2009, 07:03:05 AM »
What the heck are you talking about , Plug. There's no such thing as a game/movie/music/book review that is not opinionated. That's the whole point of a review! "Critical" in the definition, for crying out loud:

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/orexxview?view=uk

1 a formal assessment of something with the intention of instituting change if necessary. 2 a critical appraisal of a book, play, or other work. 3 a retrospective survey or report. 4 a ceremonial display and formal inspection of military or naval forces.


It's impossible to quantify "good graphics" or "good gameplay" in terms of purely "facts", with no opinion. Even if you start crunching polygonal numbers and number of music tracks, aesthetics for sound and visuals are always subjective. And even if you could, I don't think anyone would enjoy plodding through mathematicals proof of every bad aspect of a game. (Dissecting logically fallacies in game or control design can be fun in moderation, however.)

A review IS an opinion. But I can think of a simple solution for you: read multiple reviews. Regardless of entertainment medium, you should read multiple reviews unless you know your tastes align with a specific reviewer. I guess you could crack open a preview or FAQ if all you really care about are control mappings and game design, but even in those you'll find the author editorializes.

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Offline Flames_of_chaos

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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #23 on: January 05, 2009, 11:52:08 AM »
So then let's go to the F D C B A review scale and call it a day instead of flinging out arbitrary numbers call it a day and then wake up to a tsunami of bitching.
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Re: Making the Review Process Better
« Reply #24 on: January 05, 2009, 12:03:20 PM »
How is a letter grade system any less arbitrary than a 1-10 system?
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