Topic: As much as it pains me....

[ShreddersDojo]

I'm just going to have to give up 'RPG/Action' type games, along the lines of Zelda and Metroid.  I've had Zelda since the Wii was out, and I'm still only about 50% complete.  I'm just around the Zora area and what I think is the last of the 'phantom bug' hunts...

I still love these games, but I just don't have the time to wander around exploring, wondering what I'm missing.  And when I need to use a walkthrough, reading and playing at the same time is no fun at all.  Which is a shame.  The latest Zelda has some cool effects and game play.

These days I'm more into games that you can just pick up and go, and I'm hoping Super Paper Mario is one of 'em, because the demo I saw at a Best Buy made it look cool .

Anyone else in the same boat?

[Mario]

I agree, we should all ditch the slow non-games because Wii is capable of so much more.

[Kairon]

Well, in its defense (or villification, your choice), exploration isn't needed that much in Zelda:TP. I mean... the fortune teller tells you where you can find EVERYTHING except for bugs and ghosts, which have absolutely NO REASON for their collection besides completionist urges.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[Dirk Temporo]

If you think Metroid is RPG/Action, you really should stop playing games altogether.

[GoldenPhoenix]

Quote
Originally posted by: Dirk Temporo
If you think Metroid is RPG/Action, you really should stop playing games altogether.

Don't be mean.

[Hostile Creation]

If you're still collecting bugs, I'm pretty sure that's not 50% complete.  More like 30%.
Then again, it's been a while since I've played through.

Fantastic game, though.  Zelda and Metroid are two of my favorite series easily, so I could never imagine just giving up on them.  I'd forsake playing other games, just to dedicate more time to exploring in these games.

[Flames_of_chaos]

Well technically the super type genre metroid falls under IS action so cut him some slack dude. I do know what angle but for some people it takes days to beat zelda, weeks or even months since the good thing about zelda and metroid is steadily paced where there is a lot of optional things to do after the main quest and that in mind you can easily jump back in from your save point. Also this is a nice incentive to give to yourself especially if your in a budget because a lot of people don't get another game until they finish the one they are on.  

[Mikintosh]

I never do the unnecessary side-quests in the Zelda games (except for getting all the masks in Majora...after 6 years, I felt I should end it on a bang), and I think it makes the games more fun for me than if I was a completionist because I can get to the next part of the story without spending hours on one task. For me, at least, these things take so goddamn long as it is.

[Kairon]

I'd like to complete something if it was accessible, manageable, rewarding, and not an exercise in futility.

Golden Bugs? I'll collect them all. They make sense: where there's one there's another, there aren't too many of them, they're in major zones, I can see a screen fill up and feel like I'm making progress, I can just ride around listening for their distinctive sound... and I need some rupees early on in the game. GREAT!

...Now that OTHER collection quest... SCREW THAT! I got to the end and didn't feel like going back through the ENTIRE WORLD just looking for the 8 more I somehow, someway missed...

Heart pieces though... Fortune Teller makes those EASY.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[KDR_11k]

I don't bother much with collect quests because there's ALWAYS a few I can't find and when I have to find all 60 of them to get a reward I know I'm just wasting my time. Besides, it's not like TP is so difficult that you need all sidequest boni to stay alive...

[the1st_fret]

I totally agree with you ShreddersDojo. Hand me an oar, I'm in the same boat.

I got about half way, or 2/3rds of the way through TP. But it was long before that, that it stopped being fun and just felt like 'work'. I'm not really into that kinda fantasy stuff. But I picked up Zelda at launch because it was so hyped. Also it didn't look like a typical Zelda so it 'did' look like it was meant to appeal to more gamers, not just Zelda fans. Also the concept of the console is its for everyone so go figure.

I'm exactly the same. I like games that you can just 'play' Resident Evil 4 is the best example of what i'm talking about.

The Wii is a console for everyone. So when I see games coming like Zelda and Metroid, I feel like i'm being punished for not being a Nintendo fan.

I'm a SEGA fan from back in the day, so I can't enjoy an RPG like Zelda, but I can enjoy an RPG like Shenmue.

I am looking forward to paper mario, it does look like a pick up and go kind of game (I loved NSMB) and the puzzles are meant to be simple. There's nothing wrong with hard puzzles (in a game like resident evil 1 where the pace is slow) but in a game like Paper mario where you're running around alot you don't want to stop for a long time to figure out one puzzle. Which was probably my biggest gripe with Zelda.

This also happened with Secret rings -  you're running at high speed then you're brought to a crawl by either misplaced enemies or the horribly crippling collision detection. Developers need to think more on the pace of a game and how it plays at said pace.

Gamers like myself are in the worse possible spot. You're not a 'casual gamer' so you don't get all the kicks you should from games like Wii Sports or warioware, but i'm not a Ninty hardcore fan either, so I'm not into the stuff Nintendo are hyping and putting all their effort into like Zelda and Metroid.

Nintendo, you've made the console for everyone. Now make the games for everyone too!

[Shift Key]

Quote
Originally posted by: the1st_fret
Gamers like myself are in the worse possible spot. You're not a 'casual gamer' so you don't get all the kicks you should from games like Wii Sports or warioware, but i'm not a Ninty hardcore fan either, so I'm not into the stuff Nintendo are hyping and putting all their effort into like Zelda and Metroid.

You want Nintendo to make 3rd party games?

Don't worry, there'll be a lot of interesting news when E3 rolls around, from Nintendo and 3rd parties. Casual, hardcore, and the rest will probably find something fun to enjoy.
Personally, I'm hanging out for Super Mario Galaxy. There are some other games along the way but that's the one that grabbed my attention, especially after the average taste that Sunshine left in my mouth. Also Mario Strikers, and the prospects of quick online matches (this depends entirely on how long I am in queues on average - if its too long, it goes onto the Zelda pile).

As for my choice of games, I've definitely moved from the hardcore crowd into the casual crowd. I don't really see myself getting a DS anytime soon for the simple reason that it'll probably just collect dust. Games like Trauma Center and Phoenix Wright caught my eye, but that was the extent of it.

My gaming time has been sacrificed greatly these days by other commitments, and so when I find myself with a bit of time you're more likely to see me playing a bit of Wii Sports instead of Zelda. Maybe that will change down the track, but at the moment I definitely won't sit down for a long gaming session.

[Nintendawg]

It's never an easy thing to give up, but as you get older you find yourself having less and less time for the things you love.

For me, games like these ones have always been something special to me. I will never forget Ocarina of Time for as long as I live, and that's something I want my kids to experience as well someday.

Getting back on topic here, you decide what works for you in the end. But it does suck to give up something like that.

[Ceric]

If it wasn't for the forums I probably wouldn't have finished Twilight Princcess either.  I got to a point where I was stuck and didn't fill really motivated to go on because I had other games to play and by that time there was no story to motivate me along.  Hyrule was safe, I mean who cares about a lousy castle? I just didn't feel a need to move on.  I knew by that time exactly how the ending was going to be and after beating it I missed only a few of the exact details.

Now I really want to beat WindWaker because the ending is suppose to be great but I can't find my copy of the game and I'll have to start from scratch again.  That game needed less water and more dungeons.

[Kairon]

Wow, is everybody becoming lapsed/non-gamers here? C'mon guys! Buck up!

Actually, I think I'm in a very unique position to provide perspective here. I happen to straddle multiple camps of gaming. I'm a non-gamer (I just discovered the MAGIC that is Picross, and am a proud owner of Cooking Mama)  AND a hardcore gamer (Just ask Golden Phoenix, apparently I am a Halo/GTA/GearsOfWar/GodOfWar/TooHuman lover or something like that) AND a casual gamer (Did you see that new Harry Potter Trailer? OMG DROOLZ!!!).

And I've actually cut waaaay back on my gaming time even starting in High School. On hours per week playing... I have trouble thinking of any excuse to not check the "less than 4 hours a week" option. (Does the Everybody Votes channel count as playing?) And let's face it. I suck. I could put 100 hours into a game and STILL not beat it. I've given up trying to beat games on many occasions just because I've accepted reality.

And that's my secret, actually. Who says that you need to "beat" games in order to enjoy them, in order to play them, in order to get your money's worth? That's a lie, that's a psychological fallacy we have, a false dichotomy. I can have fun at games, be happy, consider myself a gamer and STILL not beat them! I mean, how many people beat GTA:SA? Not many I bet you, and they don't consider the game, or themselves, failures. They got what they wanted out of the game: they played it, enjoyed it, and treasured the time they had before they had to move on.

The measure of a gamer isn't how many games he beats, or if he beats any at all. It isn't how many hours a week she usually gets to play. Those are lies invented by Ub3R-pnw-N00|3-1337 heads who need to create an exclusive club for themselves in order to feel validated. SCREW beating Mario Sunshine (I never did, But I watched my younger brother do it), I enjoyed that game all the same. SCREW beating StarCraft (I always get stuck in RTS games), it doesn't mean I don't love the game and Blizzard to death.

A REAL gamer is measured by how much fun they have. Period.

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com  

[Artimus]

I'm confused. Does this thread have a point?

[The Omen]

The competitor in me makes me play games to beat them, even if I don't particularly feel like playing them.  This inevitably causes a self inflicted backlash for me in which case I usually set the game aside for months at a time.  It kills me in games like Zelda.  I am about %35 into TP, yet I haven't played it in over two months.  The problem then becomes do I remember enough about where I was in the game to pick it up again and enjoy it months later?  Often times I start over only to come to the same conclusion-I haven't the time nor the patience I once did.  I have fun while I'm playing, yet I have a hard time finishing games the size of a typical Zelda.  (the last one I beat was ALttP).  I love Zelda games, but part of me has come to accept the fact that I will probably never beat them from here on out,

So no, you're not alone.

[oohhboy]

Ohh, you just had to go there didn't you Kairon.

I can't play a game without finishing it. I find the time for it if I am busy, even if it is only a couple of hours. I don't feel good about leaving a game unfinished, it is like leaving a job half done. It's just not done. It allows me to get maximum utility out of my games. I feel more satisfied because it was hard, not just to play, but to get to play.

So man up you pansies. I am not asking you to go do everything in a game, I don't do that. Just concentrate on the main quest and be done with it.

Kairon, your just playing the game up to the point of maximum marginal utility. Just because you get less enjoyment of of the next hour of play doesn't mean you should stop there. Knowing that the game has an ending should be more than enough to say I can do this. None of these games are WOW. That game is a true evil in this world. I would know, I have delivered pizzas to them. Not a pretty sight.

[Kairon]

Quote
Originally posted by: oohhboy
Kairon, your just playing the game up to the point of maximum marginal utility. Just because you get less enjoyment of of the next hour of play doesn't mean you should stop there. Knowing that the game has an ending should be more than enough to say I can do this.

Games are entertainment. They're ALL about maximum utility oohhboy!

Anyways, I'm not against beating games. I'm against feeling the need to beat a game just to beat it. If you really want to see the ending then that's a good reason to keep playing. But if you've completely lost interest in what the ending holds, then there's no reason to keep playing past the point where it's no logner fun is there?

~Carmine "Cai" M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

[ShreddersDojo]

Even the main quest is way too long these days to have time to compelte it .  Like another poster, I had gotten at about 40-50% in the main quest in January. I had not picked it up again until April 9th.  I'm the kind of guy who likes to play one game at a time...  Plus, it's also tough to remember where you left off and what you where in the middle of doing.

Where as in the original Zelda, I can still beat it within a few days if I push it ).

[mottsc]

I have problems completing long games as well nowadays, and it led me to the realization that I would still enjoy them if there was a recap feature in games where I could get an animated summary of what has happened before so I know what I'm still trying to do.  

[oohhboy]

What you guys need is the sysnopsis feature that they have in Tales of syhponia. That was a real life saver even though I played the game pretty much continuosly. Sometimes after a couple of days I forget where I am going, so I just look it up.

[that Baby guy]

^I loved that.  It helped me and a friend play the game over the course of 6 months.

[ShreddersDojo]

What I would like even better, is a 'cheat' function if you would.  An arrow points you to where you need to go next in a main quest....and as you walk along, it tells you what you need to do, except in puzzle rooms.  That would give games like Zelda tons more replay.

[Ceric]

You know what I really would like is if games consistently made the ending worth it.  The ultimate test of my skills with a great wrap up.  Saddly many games just don't do that today.