Author Topic: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks  (Read 8947 times)

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Offline Flames_of_chaos

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A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« on: February 18, 2009, 02:41:37 AM »
And that company is..... Project Sora lead by none other than Sakurai.

Right now it's a brand new subsidiary of Nintendo and they are expanding maybe this is what the Kyoto R&D building is about.

They are hiring:

1. Game producer
2. 3D Character Artist
3. 3D Character Motion Artist
4. 3D Map Artist
5. Sound Artist
6. Game Planner

« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 03:13:11 AM by Flames_of_chaos »
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Offline NWR_pap64

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #1 on: February 18, 2009, 02:44:21 AM »
How ironic that Sakurai funded Sora after he left Nintendo, only to go back to Nintendo with the company.
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Offline Stogi

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #2 on: February 18, 2009, 02:50:00 AM »
Money talks....
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Offline Flames_of_chaos

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #3 on: February 18, 2009, 03:08:19 AM »
Here's something more interesting, it's actually a brand new company separate from Sora LTD. in Tokyo, Sakurai will be the director of software. And this is positioned as a joint venture between Nintendo and Sora since while Nintendo holds majority share, Sora will have a stake in the shares as well.
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #4 on: February 18, 2009, 09:58:22 AM »
After the success of Brawl and it's development it was pretty obvious that Sakurai would come back to Nintendo.

The reason Sakurai left in the first place is because he wanted more creative control in his games.  The straw that broke the camels back for him was how he was overruled during the development of Kirby Air Ride by the higher ups, resulting in the final product not being how he wanted.  Well with Brawl, Sakurai was now given full creative control and as a result his attitude toward Nintendo became much happier again.

I mean, just read some of the interviews with Sakurai back in 2006 and then compare them to the ones in 2008.  In 2006, he didn't sound very excited and talked about how he had to be convinced by others to come back to work on the game.  Not to mention he even said Brawl would be the last Smash Bros he worked on. 

Now fastforward to his interviews in 2008 with Brawl's release and Sakurai sounded like he was having the time of his life.  Not to mention he said he'd love to be involved in another Smash Bros now.

It kind of shows that over the course of Brawls two year development, Sakurai's view of working for Nintendo changed bigtime.
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #5 on: February 18, 2009, 01:31:39 PM »
So by giving him freedom, he ruined Smash Bros.

Do not want.
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Offline Peachylala

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #6 on: February 18, 2009, 01:44:15 PM »
Quote
So by giving him freedom, he ruined Smash Bros.

Do not want.
Correction. By not being under Miyamoto's control, he made some errors. I thought Brawl was fine, not Melee great, but fine. Online mode and Subspace sucked, Solid Snake appearence was completely un-needed.

All we need is Miyamoto, ot maybe Yoshiaki Koizumi, to whip Sakurai for the next Brawl installment?
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2009, 01:52:23 PM »
If classic styled joypads aren't banned in the next installment, they shouldn't bother with the next installment.

And Subspace is more than an error =D
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Offline NWR_pap64

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2009, 02:18:09 PM »
The biggest mistake Sakurai did was place emphasis on the single play mode. If he wanted to make an adventure game with the Nintendo cast it should have been independent from Brawl. Both games would have benefited greatly because the single player would have played much better and would have featured a more focused story while Brawl would have been a strictly multiplayer fare.
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Offline Ian Sane

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2009, 03:23:50 PM »
My biggest objection to Brawl is that Melee was such a huge advancement over the original SSB that it set the bar too high for any sequels.  To not be a disappointment Brawl would have to recreate that same type of jump and the law of diminishing returns is such that that wasn't really possible.  I still think it's a great game though and if I'm going to play SSB with my friends that's the one I pick.  I don't really relate at all to many of the complaints people have with the game (aside from online lag) but I figure what I like about the series is quite different than what most people like.

Considering Sakurai left over Kirby Air Ride and that's like one of the worst games Nintendo ever made I gotta side with him.  I'm glad they won him back.  He appears talented enough to do his own thing.  I know Miyamoto is a genius but we'll get more variety if he isn't involved in every project.  Sometimes we may get lesser games as a result but we'll get some different styles as well.  I think the Metroid series for example has turned out great and Miyamoto isn't involved with that (main series anyway).

Offline NWR_pap64

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2009, 03:32:17 PM »
I never played "Air Ride", but I've heard a lot of mixed reactions. You either love it or hate it, there's no middle ground it seems.
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Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #11 on: February 18, 2009, 03:44:42 PM »
Quote
I know Miyamoto is a genius but we'll get more variety if he isn't involved in every project.

Really. So Wii Fit, Wii Sports, Pikmin, Mario series, Zelda, and Metroid Prime aren't variety enough? Miyamoto is far from a one trick game developer and I think he is FAR more diverse then Sakurai as he has shown throughout his great career.

In regards to the studio I hope they come up with something good, but I do not have the highest expectations of Sakurai anymore.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 03:47:58 PM by GoldenPhoenix »
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Offline Flames_of_chaos

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #12 on: February 18, 2009, 04:01:08 PM »
Well I wouldn't discount Sakurai he is still a great developer and it's good that Nintendo is investing more into game development. I have a feeling that Project Sora will move into that new Kyoto building that Nintendo invested in.
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Offline Stogi

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2009, 04:12:08 PM »
There doesn't need to be a new Smash for a long long time. Brawl did everything right in my eyes (except for online). It plays, looks, and feels better than Melee. Plus, I have yet to unlock all the characters and I've been playing it for a whole year now. Crazy....


I hope Sakurai the best. Whatever he gets himself into, whether it's a new IP or a sequel, I'm sure it will be great.
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #14 on: February 18, 2009, 04:13:12 PM »
The problem with Brawl is the fact fanboys hyped it up so much with unrealistic expectations, that nothing Sakurai did was going to please them.

In order for Brawl to have been universally loved it would have had to have had over 9,000 characters, with all of these characters 100% unique.  If at least 1 of these characters had a move that was in anyway similar to another, the game would have been a total failure.

Oh and it'd have to be 1,000% balanced.  I say 1,000% because even 100% wouldn't please the fanboys.  If at least one character even has a remote advantage over another, then it means Sakurai is a baby eating Nazi.

Then there's the stages, anything less then 1 million that don't cover every single area ever in a Nintendo game, means Sakurai really caused 9-11.

Oh and finally the music.  Every single song ever made through human history needs to be in the game.  Of course it can't be the original version because that'd be lazy, but if it's a remix, even if the remix sounds 90% like the original, it's considered rape.

Since Brawl was in development since 1632, with the help of Jesus, Mohammad and Buddha, Sakurai has no excuse for all this stuff not being in the game then does he.
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Offline King of Twitch

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #15 on: February 18, 2009, 04:17:36 PM »
What more do you people want? I think it's interesting people burn out on SSB after 3 games while mario zelda and metroid stay on the 'great' lists.

Clearly, platforming games in the hands of miyamoto > all other genres
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Offline Flames_of_chaos

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2009, 04:36:17 PM »
Here's some more news:
Source

Quote
Masahiro Sakurai, creator of Nintendo character Kirby and designer of Super Smash Bros. Brawl, is creating a new title for Nintendo the company announced today.

On January 22 of this year, Sakurai's company Sora Ltd., a first party Nintendo developer, created a new company with Nintendo called Project Sora. Sakurai is serving as director for this new project.

Nintendo is the principal investor, owning up to 72 percent of the company.

About this project the new company is working on, Satoru Iwata assured that it's not another Smash Bros. game, saying, "It's not Smash Bros. I asked for." Sakurai added, "i can promise an experience that's different from anything [you've played] up until now."

Project Sora currently has 30 employees and is currently looking for "talented individuals."
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Offline Ian Sane

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2009, 05:20:23 PM »
Quote
What more do you people want? I think it's interesting people burn out on SSB after 3 games while mario zelda and metroid stay on the 'great' lists.

Clearly, platforming games in the hands of miyamoto > all other genres

I think it's more single player focused games vs. multiplayer focused games.  A single player game can get a lot of mileage out of offering a new story in a new setting to explore with new characters to meet.  But with something like SSB it still feels like you and your buddies beating the piss out of each other.  The game relies less on story or exploration and more on just the gameplay.  I got burned out on Mario Kart and F-Zero in around the same amount of time.  It's just harder to keep those types of games fresh.

Quote
Really. So Wii Fit, Wii Sports, Pikmin, Mario series, Zelda, and Metroid Prime aren't variety enough? Miyamoto is far from a one trick game developer and I think he is FAR more diverse then Sakurai as he has shown throughout his great career.

I actually like other developers besides Miyamoto.  Different people has slightly difference styles and Nintendo should encourage that diversity.  Miyamoto makes great games but I can usually tell if he was involved in the game.  There's value in Nintendo games that feel just a little bit different.  You think Fire Emblem would be Fire Emblem or Metroid would be Metroid if Miyamoto was all over them?  I think those franchises have turned out quite well and up to Nintendo standards of quality without Miyamoto's involvement.  They also feel noticably different than what EAD produces.  I think that variety is a good thing so if Nintendo is encouraging Sakurai to do his own thing we're going to benefit.  Miyamoto will eventually have to retire anyway so Nintendo can't use him for EVERYTHING.

Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #18 on: February 18, 2009, 05:29:44 PM »
Quote
Metroid would be Metroid if Miyamoto was all over them

Actually Miyamoto was all over Metroid Prime. You can't tell me that game "feels" like Miyamoto.

I don't mind diversity but I don't trust Sakurai to wow us. He was good with Smash Brothers and the Kirby games were fun, not the best designed level wise, but fun. Beyond that, what does he have? Meteos?
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 05:32:50 PM by GoldenPhoenix »
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Offline UltimatePartyBear

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #19 on: February 18, 2009, 05:38:16 PM »
Quote
Metroid would be Metroid if Miyamoto was all over them

Actually Miyamoto was all over Metroid Prime. You can't tell me that game "feels" like Miyamoto.

I don't mind diversity but I don't trust Sakurai to wow us. He was good with Smash Brothers and the Kirby games were fun, not the best designed level wise, but fun. Beyond that, what does he have? Meteos?

Potential.

Offline GoldenPhoenix

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #20 on: February 18, 2009, 05:39:53 PM »
Quote
Metroid would be Metroid if Miyamoto was all over them

Actually Miyamoto was all over Metroid Prime. You can't tell me that game "feels" like Miyamoto.

I don't mind diversity but I don't trust Sakurai to wow us. He was good with Smash Brothers and the Kirby games were fun, not the best designed level wise, but fun. Beyond that, what does he have? Meteos?

Potential.

We'll see. I hope it is good!
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #21 on: February 18, 2009, 06:25:22 PM »

I don't mind diversity but I don't trust Sakurai to wow us. He was good with Smash Brothers and the Kirby games were fun, not the best designed level wise, but fun. Beyond that, what does he have? Meteos?

Just because you haven't been a fan of Sakurai's work, doesn't change the fact that millions of others are.  Because last time I checked, Kirby's Super Star is as highly praised as the classic Mario titles, and Melee/Brawl are the two best selling fighting games of all time and both highly praised as well.  Not to mention Metoes is considered one of the best puzzle games ever made.

That's a pretty damn good resume if you ask me.  The fact that he's been able to make games in three different genre's that were all highly praised and considered some of the best in each genre, shows what an amazing designer he is.  This is an accomplishment that not many other game designers can claim to have done.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #22 on: February 18, 2009, 06:50:21 PM »
Quote
Metroid would be Metroid if Miyamoto was all over them

Actually Miyamoto was all over Metroid Prime. You can't tell me that game "feels" like Miyamoto.


To jump off of what Golden Phoenix said, Miyamoto was the reason that Prime is in the first-person view. Retro was originally making it in the 3rd and it was not clicking as a game. Then Miyamoto suggested the move to 1st. That's a big deal.
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Offline Adrock

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #23 on: February 18, 2009, 06:55:23 PM »
There's a lot of hype for Project Sora despite the complete lack of any real info. Hmm... I'm going to need more than Sakurai telling me this will be different than anything I've ever played before ever in the history of ever.
The problem with Brawl is the fact fanboys hyped it up so much with unrealistic expectations, that nothing Sakurai did was going to please them.
The problem with Brawl is that its Melee with a new coat of paint and another Fox clone. Even if they replaced Wolf with clone of a different character that didn't already have a clone (Daisy?), I wouldn't mind as much because I wouldn't see another version of Fox running around and f*cking things up.

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #24 on: February 18, 2009, 07:16:25 PM »
THE WORLD CRIES OUT FOR MY PRINCESS

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Offline Mop it up

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #25 on: February 18, 2009, 07:23:28 PM »
I sure hope Sakurai is never allowed near the Smash Brothers series ever again, it is clear his vision with it has changed over the eight years since its inception. I hope we do see another Smash game soon because the last game was nowhere near what I wanted. Personally I'd love a Smash game involving just Mario characters as there are tons who I'd love to take into the ring (or onto the floating platform I guess).

I don't think I had unrealistic expectations for Brawl. In fact, before its release I deliberately tried to avoid any information regarding it so I wouldn't over hype myself for it. The biggest difference I see in Melee and Brawl is that Melee felt like a tribute to Nintendo whilst Brawl feels like an advertisement for Nintendo. Rather than express what I wanted, I'm going to list what I didn't want:

-An expanded single player mode. Smash is a party/multiplayer game, and while things like Break the Targets and Multi-Man Melee are fun, I'd gladly trade them all for a few extra characters and stages.

-Dumbed-down gameplay. Smash is already a pretty simple game, there was no need to alter any part of it. No -L-cancel, no hit stun, infinite air dodges, too many powerful moves... oh and what is up with the random tripping? This game is random enough, no more of those elements are needed.

-A more serious art style and tone. This is a game where Nintendo worlds collide, most of which are pretty vibrant I might add. Don't try to create a story to explain how it happened, just let the insanity ensue.

-Contrived stages. Almost every stage in Brawl has some sort of hazard, such as wandering enemies, moving sections, or some other nonsense to interfere with everyone. There are very few traditional stages with no frills, and some of the ones which were included are too small. The Stage Builder is a way to create more traditional stages, but it is extremely limited and very bland visually; I'd gladly trade it for some premade stages that are actually well-designed.

-Too many powerful items. Lots of them are one-hit KOs or can KO at low damages. And I couldn't loathe the Smash Ball anymore than I currently do.

-Trophies and stickers. The trophy feature in Melee was interesting but I'd still have preferred that effort spent on more characters and stages. Brawl adds stickers to the mix of useless content, and almost all of the trophies and stickers don't go back farther than the GameCube era.

-No more unique stages for Break The Targets. They've been replaced by five uninspired levels that aren't designed around any character's specific strengths and weaknesses. The single-player adventure has this problem as well.

-Over half the music being ripped straight from the originals or original compositions created for the game. The original music doesn't fit the game at all.

-Masterpieces. What a waste of disc space, and a shameful attempt to sell VC games.

-No Toad and Birdo. Okay, now that's all me I know, but still...

-No third-party characters. I'm probably alone on this (and in disliking Brawl in general), but Smash is for Nintendo characters ONLY. At least Snake got his start on the NES, but Sonic is all wrong.

All of that is even before I get into what I did want to see, but this post is getting ridiculous as it is.

Basically, it isn't that Brawl didn't have enough content, it is that it went in a different direction than the things I wanted to see in a sequel.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 07:25:28 PM by Mop_it_up »

Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #26 on: February 18, 2009, 07:29:51 PM »
I can top that list:

-No Mushroom Kingdom Sky Stage from the original Super Smash Bros.

Really, they left out the greatest stage in the series, while they recycle Melee's Hyrule Castle?

AUUGH!! FLACCID!
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Offline Stogi

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #27 on: February 18, 2009, 07:31:11 PM »
This is the worst post I've ever seen,, and I should know because I'm the worst poster.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 07:50:19 PM by Kashogi Y. Stogi »
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #28 on: February 18, 2009, 07:32:20 PM »
sho nuff, you've got two commas.
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Offline Stogi

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #29 on: February 18, 2009, 07:49:30 PM »
That's my new punctuation mark. I call it the creek.

I'm surprised this is the first time you noticed it.
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Offline Mop it up

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2009, 08:09:16 PM »
This is the worst post I've ever seen, and I should know because I'm the worst poster.
Are you referring to my post? If you are, that was just something I've been holding back for a while now and needed to get out. I realize this isn't the best time or place for it, but I figured there would never be a good time or place for it. All things considered, it could have been a lot worse.

Note how I never claimed that SSBBrawl was a bad game, I simply stated it wasn't what I wanted. If anyone wants to ridicule me, I don't mind. In fact, I expect it and welcome it, and am disappointed if nobody does. :-[

Offline Stogi

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2009, 08:15:06 PM »
Quote
Are you referring to my post?

Yes, yes I was.

Your list is full of things that can easily be avoided and/or turned off.

You R fail
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Offline King of Twitch

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2009, 08:24:34 PM »
MY GOSH, IT'S FULL OF STICKERS
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Offline Mop it up

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2009, 08:40:01 PM »
Your list is full of things that can easily be avoided and/or turned off.
The dumbed-down gameplay can't be turned off.
Single-player can't be avoided to unlock everything.
The art style can't be changed.
If I were to turn off every contrived stage I'd be left with about five stages.
If I turned off every powerful item I wouldn't be left with much.
I could mute the sound and whistle my own music.
Uninspired Break the Targets stages can't be avoided.
Filler content takes up space which could be used for more... game.

Most importantly, the effort used to create many of these things was taken away from expanding the multiplayer mode.

What am I left with after all of that? Not much. Brawl contains almost nothing that I wanted. I suppose that deserves being responded to with generic "you fail" messages because it was everything you wanted. It's an opinion, it differs from yours, that doesn't merit a "fail" response.

MY GOSH, IT'S FULL OF STICKERS
Way to nitpick on a SINGLE complaint I have. I have hundreds more, and they all add up.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2009, 08:46:01 PM by Mop_it_up »

Offline Peachylala

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #34 on: February 18, 2009, 08:47:05 PM »
I can top that list:

-No Mushroom Kingdom Sky Stage from the original Super Smash Bros.

Really, they left out the greatest stage in the series, while they recycle Melee's Hyrule Castle?

AUUGH!! FLACCID!
Remember, Melee is when it became an "it" series. So stages in Melee are automatically considered better the B-grade wonderness of the N64.

Quote
Considering Sakurai left over Kirby Air Ride and that's like one of the worst games Nintendo ever made I gotta side with him.
So basically Nintendo pulled a Sega?

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #35 on: February 18, 2009, 08:58:10 PM »
Sorry, I just wanted a 2001 reference in this thread.
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Offline Mop it up

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #36 on: February 18, 2009, 09:03:43 PM »
A reference to what? 2001 the year itself, or 2001: A Space Odyssey?
In either case, sorry for not catching that.

Offline Adrock

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #37 on: February 18, 2009, 09:42:44 PM »
The least they could do is tell us something about this game. This might actually be less exciting when Nintendo came out last year and said, "Yeah, we're working on things." Thanks.

Offline Nick DiMola

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #38 on: February 18, 2009, 09:57:28 PM »
Let's keep it civil and on topic here. Go dig up some old Brawl threads if you want to vent about Brawl.

Anyway ...

I find this news pretty interesting, though not entirely surprising. I kind of expected Sakurai to work as somewhat of a commonly contracted, Nintendo third-party. Pop in to develop a random Nintendo IP, but mostly work on his own stuff separate of Nintendo entirely.

I'm fairly optimistic though, because as a Nintendo first party, Project Sora (Sakurai) will receive some light guidance putting that extra sheen on the title that might've been otherwise missing.
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Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #39 on: February 18, 2009, 10:50:55 PM »
Well considering how no ones talking about the interview, I might as well post the information from it.

http://www.andriasang.com/e/articles/2009/02/18/nintendo_sakurai_project_sora/

And if any of you were to lazy too read that, it pretty much says Sakurai and this team will be working on a new IP for Nintendo that'll be something people wouldn't expect from Nintendo.  The development of the game will begin in May, and is looking to have a 2 year development cycle.  Meaning it's on schedule for a 2011 release date.

And considering how Nintendo's new policy is to not reveal info until the games near completion, don't expect to hear anything new about this game for a long time.
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Offline Mop it up

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #40 on: February 19, 2009, 12:06:37 AM »
Go dig up some old Brawl threads if you want to vent about Brawl.
The Brawl board doesn't exist anymore, and I was under the impression that bumping old topics was at least frowned upon. In any case, I don't think any good would come from that, and I regret adding to the comments about Brawl in the first place.

it pretty much says Sakurai and this team will be working on a new IP for Nintendo that'll be something people wouldn't expect from Nintendo.
This has me curious as to what, exactly, this means. I wonder what Sakurai's idea of what that something is that people wouldn't expect from Nintendo. It could be a genre which they don't really touch up on with their various franchises, such as a more traditional RPG or a shooter. It could also be in the way the game is presented, such as having a more "mature" theme or something. Yes, this is very interesting indeed.

If I had to guess, I'd say it's an RPG of some kind.

Offline Dasmos

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #41 on: February 19, 2009, 12:24:24 AM »
I don't mind diversity but I don't trust Sakurai to wow us. He was good with Smash Brothers and the Kirby games were fun, not the best designed level wise, but fun. Beyond that, what does he have? Meteos?

So basically creating the best Puzzle game since Tetris Attack isn't good enough for you? Jeez.
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Offline Nick DiMola

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Re: A new developer joins Nintendo's Ranks
« Reply #42 on: February 19, 2009, 06:51:18 AM »
Go dig up some old Brawl threads if you want to vent about Brawl.
The Brawl board doesn't exist anymore, and I was under the impression that bumping old topics was at least frowned upon. In any case, I don't think any good would come from that, and I regret adding to the comments about Brawl in the first place.

Just wanted to address your points:

1) The Brawl forum's threads have all been moved into this forum, so nothing is gone, just the subforum itself.
2) Bumping old threads is ok if you have something relevant to say. Brawl is still kind of a hot topic considering the many awards it pulled down from NWR and elsewhere. Something like that massive post you had there would be just fine to bump a Brawl thread with, as long as everyone can stay civil.

Also keep in mind that I'm not chastising you for your opinion. I just don't think this thread has anything to gain by turning it into a Melee vs. Brawl discussion.
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