Topic: Wii U - e3 is over... now what?

[Sarail]

Huh. That's... nice. I'm surprised at how small it is, really. I remember all those complaints about the size. Do you mind if I use those pics as a size reference in a future blog post?

I'm very excited to see this controller in my hands, analog stick placement or not. After playing Resident Evil: Revelations, I've adapted to the dual-input control/trigger scheme nicely, so I want to see how well this fits in the hands.

I don't mind one bit. Go for it!

[tendoboy1984]

Ask and you shall receive. : : : : Also, ignore my rough sketch of analog sticks and buttons... I'm horrible at drawing circles freehand, BUT the actual width dimensions should be precise. Decent reference.


In relation to my hands.
Tablet screen to 3DS shell comparison.
Controller to 3DS size comparison.
Controller to Cube controller comparison.
Controller to CCP comparison.


Crazy that the 3DS fits perfectly into the screen size of the tablet - that should give you a reference as to where your hands will be placed. Also, it's not much bigger (wider?) than a 'Cube or CCP. Now you can shut the haters up. DOO EET. Seriously. I'm psyched for e3. Can't come quick enough!

So it's basically a giant handheld in terms of form factor and design. I like how you showed it in relation to your hands, but it still looks a bit too big for me.


However, I am very glad that the back of the controller will have some sort of hand grips, which should make holding it much more comfortable.

[tendoboy1984]

Slightly off topic:

Seeing as how popular touchscreen devices are, what if future game consoles only came with a touchscreen controller (no buttons at all)?

We all know how popular the iPad is for gaming, and many of those games use onscreen digital buttons.

[ShyGuy]

I just played The Batman Arkham Asylum game for the iPhone. It looks really great, but the controls are TERRIBLE. No touchpad only game consoles until we can get really good haptic feedback, like 3d morphing controls or something.

[TJ Spyke]

tendo, touch controls are good for certain types of games. The iOS App Store has lots of games that were designed with traditional controls and they play terribly with touch controls. It would be a terrible idea to have that as the standard.

[Kytim89]

Try playing that Dead Space game for the iPhone and you will soon learn the importance of buttons when it comes to gameplay. By the way, why is that game not on the eShop for the 3DS? I have always wanted a Dead Space game on the 3DS and this game would be a good addition until a better Dead Space is produced to rival Revelations.

[tendoboy1984]

Here's my take on the whole 3rd-party situation with Nintendo.


Developers like to make games for the most capable hardware, that is proven with all the support that the Xbox 360 and PS3 receive. Both the PS3 and Xbox 360 have similar hardware, so developers find it more convenient to make their games for those systems. And because the Wii is so underpowered compared to the Xbox 360 and PS3, developers don't want to bother with "downporting" their games to run on the hardware.


Developers also want to make games for the largest install base. Combined, the Xbox 360 and PS3 match the sales of the Wii, so of course developers see a larger market with those two consoles. And the fact that the Wii is so underpowered basically killed any enthusiasm from 3rd-party developers and "core" gamers. It's a lose-lose situation for Nintendo.


Despite Nintendo's best efforts, they failed to convince 3rd-party developers that making "core" games on the Wii was a cheaper and more viable alternative to the ballooning budgets of the HD consoles. Nintendo and their 1st-party studios made fantastic games on the Wii, ranging from Super Mario Galaxy to Zelda: Skyward Sword. 3rd-party developers could have tried to match Nintendo's standards, but they kept viewing the Wii as a casual-gamer's console, filled with party games and waggle controls.


This is partially due to Nintendo's early marketing campaign that showed families enjoying party-style games. Anyone remember the "Wii would like to play" commercials? But those aren't the only games Nintendo made. Games like Metroid Prime 3, Super Mario Galaxy, DKC Returns, and others proved that there could be more "core"-oriented titles on the Wii. And Nintendo even created the Classic Controller Pro so developers wouldn't have to shoehorn waggle controls into their Wii games, yet hardly anyone utilized that controller.


Nintendo's increased focus on motion controls and family-friendly games killed the Wii brand in the eyes of 3rd-party developers. They couldn't get that negative stigma from their minds, and kept thinking they had to create party games to cater to the casual crowd. As I said above, Nintendo showed how both casual and "core" games could work on the Wii, but 3rd-party developers were too jaded to catch on.


Microsoft and Sony saw the casual market that Nintendo had captured with the Wii and tried to replicate it. The results were Kinect and PS Move, respectively. Kinect was hugely successful, while Move was lackluster. Despite Microsoft and Sony's rampage into motion-control territory, 3rd-party developers continued to make "core" games for the PS3 and Xbox 360.

Long story short:
- Nintendo makes a console that focuses on casual family-friendly games, developers catch on and start making piss-poor waggle-fest games
- Nintendo comes out with the Wii Motion Plus that allows for more accurate motion controls, sdevelopers largely ignore it
- Nintendo makes the Classic Controller Pro to appease developers that hate motion controls, developers ignore it
- Metroid Prime 3, Wii Sports Resort, and Skyward Sword show how motion controls can greatly enhance gameplay, yet a majority of developers ignore them
- Nintendo then changes their stance and makes more core-oriented games, developers ignore this and instead keep making casual games
- Microsoft and Sony enter the motion-control market with Kinect and PS Move, developers ignore them


Developers seem to have this weird claim that they can't compete with Nintendo's games. Does this mean quality, or sales wise? In either case, they just need to be more ambitious with their games. Treat Nintendo consoles the same as the PS3 and Xbox 360. If they put the same effort into making games for Nintendo systems, then maybe they'd see more success. Many 3rd-party games are arguably more ambitious and complex than Nintendo games, yet those games hardly come to a Nintendo platform. Games like Uncharted and Metal Gear Solid prove that developers can make amazing games if they try, yet they hardly put the effort on Nintendo platforms.


And here's the main thing that bugs me: No matter how many times Nintendo tries to show how normal games are done on the Wii, developers ignore them and continue to make crappy kiddy/casual games with horrid controls. Nintendo just can't win, it seems.


This brings us to the Wii U. Nintendo has now decided to recapture the market that MS and Sony "stole", the "core" gamer. The Wii U console has all the HD power that developers have been clamoring for, and the controller has everything a normal controller has (in addition to the large screen in the middle). Whether this is enough to win back 3rd-party developers and "core" gamers remains to be seen, but early reports have been positive. The backwards compatibility with Wii Remotes and accessories shows that Nintendo hasn't forgotten about the casual market. With all of these things, hopefully casual and "core" gamers can all see the value and potential of the Wii U.

[Kytim89]

Classic Controller Pro + Gamecube controller + wireless technology + NES d-pad = The greatest controller ever created in the history of time.

[Evan_B]

Classic Controller Pro + Gamecube controller + wireless technology + NES d-pad = The greatest controller ever created in the history of time.

Are... are you implying that the Wii U controller has that?

Because it also has a nice touchscreen, which is reaaally nice for all the DS shovelware that's been hanging around. In all seriousness, Nintendo pretty much took everything that they've been working on innovating the industry with and packed it all into one console. Controller/screen connectivity with GCN's GBA link cable and controller options, DS touch screen, Wii Motion Control, NES d-pad... all wrapped up in shiny HD graphics. It's like they're begging developers to give it a try.

[tendoboy1984]

Classic Controller Pro + Gamecube controller + wireless technology + NES d-pad = The greatest controller ever created in the history of time.

Are... are you implying that the Wii U controller has that?

Because it also has a nice touchscreen, which is reaaally nice for all the DS shovelware that's been hanging around. In all seriousness, Nintendo pretty much took everything that they've been working on innovating the industry with and packed it all into one console. Controller/screen connectivity with GCN's GBA link cable and controller options, DS touch screen, Wii Motion Control, NES d-pad... all wrapped up in shiny HD graphics. It's like they're begging developers to give it a try.

Nintendo is catering to the demands of 3rd-party developers. This is the exact opposite of how Nintendo has behaved in the past. They usually think about how a new controller suits their own games first, and let 3rd-party developers work around that.

[nickmitch]

Classic Controller Pro + Gamecube controller + wireless technology + NES d-pad = The greatest controller ever created in the history of time.

Gamecube controller + wireless technology = wavebird

[Spak-Spang]

I think the Gamecube controller shell with the buttons like the Super NES.  The Trigger buttons like the Gamecube controller, but including 2 Z buttons that are more like the Classic Pro.  Is the best idea.

[nickmitch]

And a bigger D-Pad/second analogue stick.

[MegaByte]

I think the Gamecube controller shell with the buttons like the Super NES.

Oh, wait, that's not right...

Hori to the rescue.

[tendoboy1984]

How come Hori and other Japanese accessory makers never release their products outside of Japan? How are they going to build their brands if they stay confined to Japan?


Instead we get crap from Power A (I still have no idea where they came from), PDP, Nyko, Intec, DreamGear (where did they come from?), etc. Is Intec even still around?

[Spak-Spang]

Tendoboy:  That right there is the PERFECT controller.  Thank you.

[tendoboy1984]

Tendoboy:  That right there is the PERFECT controller.  Thank you.

Don't thank me. Thank MegaByte above me.

[Louieturkey]

Why isn't E3 here yet?  I'm taking that whole day off of work just so I can wrap my mind around the presentation.

[Chozo Ghost]

Why isn't E3 here yet?  I'm taking that whole day off of work just so I can wrap my mind around the presentation.

June is quicker than you think. We are already almost at the end of May, so...

[Louieturkey]

Why isn't E3 here yet?  I'm taking that whole day off of work just so I can wrap my mind around the presentation.

June is quicker than you think. We are already almost at the end of May, so...

Where is that hype train?

[Ceric]

Why isn't E3 here yet?  I'm taking that whole day off of work just so I can wrap my mind around the presentation. June is quicker than you think. We are already almost at the end of May, so... Where is that hype train?

[Louieturkey]

Why isn't E3 here yet?  I'm taking that whole day off of work just so I can wrap my mind around the presentation. June is quicker than you think. We are already almost at the end of May, so... Where is that hype train?

That's awesome!  Though I'm not sure the hype ambulance sends the right message.

[TeaHee]

My main complaint with Nintendo and we the fans is our definition of core or hardcore games.  Yes, Mario, Zelda and Metroid are the traditional core games for Nintendo, but they are not seen as hardcore by teenage gamers which is a very large market.  My son who is 14 won't hardly look at the Wii, even though he played it for years when he was younger.  For the past 3 years its been all about the 360.  He will dabble in Smash Bros. or Rayman, but it doesn't really hold his attention.  Along with my son's opinion I also have my student's opinions, and none of them talk about Mario, Metroid or Zelda (actually a few talk about Ocarina, but that is it).  It is all FPS, zombies, Mass Effect etc.  Most of them are unaware of Wii U.

So my concern is that Nintendo is not really going to focus on the next generation of core gamers.  There is nothing currently in their catalog that seems to appeal to teens or twenty somethings.  Some of you maybe listen to RFN and are aware that I asked the question about Metroid and a multiplayer mode.  I did not ask the question because I was unaware of previous multiplayer Metroids or because Metroid is too easy (as Jonny took it), but because the perception of Metroid with the teens I am around is it is either too hard, not fun or lacks multiplayer.  This feeling is pervasive across much of Nintendo properties.

What I am saying is Nintendo has nothing to appeal to the "Bro" gamers which is the epitome of this generation of gamers.  They either need to revamp one of their big hitters, like really pushing a great multiplayer FPS like Metroid, or come up with a new IP for the Wii U to be success and steal gamers back from 360 and PS3.

Just my opinion.

[Fatty The Hutt]

@teehee I totally agree with your observations and conclusion tht Nintendo has nothing that appeals to the typical bro gamer.
My response is: fu ck-em. If Nintendo gamers are the gaming elite, then so be it. We will suffer ignoramuses just like avid symphony goers. Our lives will be richer for it. Our job for the masses might be just to lead by example. Play only the best games, ignore games tht nothing more than merely popular, and extol the virtues of good games to whomever will listen.
Deal?

[NWR_insanolord]

I don't think there's any way Nintendo could win that demographic away from Microsoft without a colossal failure on their part. For Nintendo to succeed, they need to appeal to their base, a lot of whom might be upset with the way they've done things in recent years, hold onto as much of the family and casual market as they can, or as much of it hasn't moved on to Facebook/iOS, and take back a share of older so-called core gamers, the mid-20s and up crowd. Even if they went out of their way to pander to the teen market, I don't know that they could win enough of it to make it worth it.