Author Topic: Wiimote has limited angle of "pointer" detection? (Read 13482 times)

Kairon · « **on:** May 09, 2006, 08:57:13 PM »

Today I sat in on a couple of E3 workshops and I this morning I attended one where a cautious and skeptical game developer was commenting on the Wii controller in response to a question posed to him.

One of the things he said about the controller is that it only seems to have, I don't remember exactly, 30 degrees of pointing sensitivity. He rotated his wrist slightly to illustrate this. He also said that if something passed in front of the sensor bar the gameplay would get disrupted.

He may be wrong, but we'll find out soon enough anyways.

So, this implies that the sensor bar has the same limitations as the superscope: if something physically obstructs its line of sight it can't do its job.

Also, while his comment with regards to the small range of degrees the wii remote can sense when pointing may imply that as a pointer it doesn't really know it's location in 3D space, but uses some kind of other technology to determine its screen pointing position...

... He may have simply not had the chance to explore or test possibly fuller uses of the wii remote, or he was making small movements from his wrist because he had figured out a way to play the game that way instead of with big arm movements (much like IGN says Tennis can be played either with the big full-arm racket movements, or with smaller wrist gestures).

Anyways, I'm pooped. Gotta get up early tomorrow to finally hopefully get my hands on some Wii gameplay, and I also sorta want to write-up my experiences in full, ugh. Not enough hours in a day!

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

Avinash_Tyagi · « **Reply #1 on:** May 09, 2006, 09:05:16 PM »

well its your job to find out if this is true, let us know if you do

Shecky · « **Reply #2 on:** May 09, 2006, 09:11:52 PM »

Unless Nintendo has been fooling us to the actual contents of these remotes, the technology in these things makes the above false. I could potentially see a viewing angle problem in relation to the TV screen. AKA, playing at the far edge of the TV would be hard.

Bad ascii art....

--------TV-----------
X <-You

The Omen · « **Reply #3 on:** May 09, 2006, 09:59:11 PM »

As far as I have seen and heard, that is very false.

Kairon · « **Reply #4 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:03:30 PM »

Hopefully I can confirm it false tomorrow and this thread can die, but I'm especially interested to find out if his comments regarding the person-walking-in-front-of-it-disrupting-it are true or not.

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

Crimm · « **Reply #5 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:05:19 PM »

Did they have clear line of sight during the Red Steel segment today? I don't even know where the Wii unit was.

wandering · « **Reply #6 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:15:01 PM »

The controllers weren't wireless during the presentation, though, if I remember correctly.

Shecky · « **Reply #7 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:22:14 PM »

Yeah but the technology to position is based on RF no matter what. A wired wiimote still communicates with the sensor bar wirelessly. Other data that the wiimote has to transmit or receive is sent over the wire for the prototype wired models.

King of Twitch · « **Reply #8 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:24:36 PM »

Wiimote has limited angle of "pointer" detection?

I hate when this happens..

trip1eX · « **Reply #9 on:** May 09, 2006, 10:34:09 PM »

Well if someone walks in front of your TV while you're playing your Gamecube then your game is interrupted as it is.

Also the 30 degrees of pointing sensitivity means nothing more than you'll have a hard time playing while standing 1 foot in front of your TV. ie the closer you are to the TV the greater the angle (from your pointer or remote) to either edge of the TV screen will be. ie it will exceed 30 degrees. That's all. Nothing to see here. Move on.

IF this 30 degree number is true and you want to get an idea of how far you have to be far your TV to play then here's the calculation.

Measure width of TV. Tan 30 degrees ( or ~.577) = Width TV/2/X with X equaling distance you must be from the TV.

For the 23" standard TV in my office I would have to be at least 16.9 inches away from the TV.

If you have a 50" widescreen TV you have to stand at least a shade over 3 ft away from the TV.

edit: The above is done with the assumption that 30 degrees means in either direction of center. IF it's total then the numbers are doubled and then some.

Stimutacs Addict · « **Reply #10 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:37:38 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Nye
SCIENCE!

RickPowers · « **Reply #11 on:** May 10, 2006, 05:24:46 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Today I sat in on a couple of E3 workshops and I this morning I attended one where a cautious and skeptical game developer was commenting on the Wii controller in response to a question posed to him.

One of the things he said about the controller is that it only seems to have, I don't remember exactly, 30 degrees of pointing sensitivity. He rotated his wrist slightly to illustrate this. He also said that if something passed in front of the sensor bar the gameplay would get disrupted.

So, this implies that the sensor bar has the same limitations as the superscope: if something physically obstructs its line of sight it can't do its job.

Also, while his comment with regards to the small range of degrees the wii remote can sense when pointing may imply that as a pointer it doesn't really know it's location in 3D space, but uses some kind of other technology to determine its screen pointing position...

... He may have simply not had the chance to explore or test possibly fuller uses of the wii remote, or he was making small movements from his wrist because he had figured out a way to play the game that way instead of with big arm movements (much like IGN says Tennis can be played either with the big full-arm racket movements, or with smaller wrist gestures).

~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com

From what I understand the limited angle of pointing is a given. Look at the distance between the TV and the controller, and do the geometry.

In fact, the further away from the TV you are (and the smaller the TV, for that matter), the smaller the degree of sensitivity.

As for the "line of sight" issue, I expect that this will only be a problem for games that need to sense 3D position. The accellerometers should work fine regardless.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #12 on:** May 10, 2006, 08:01:19 AM »

"So, this implies that the sensor bar has the same limitations as the superscope: if something physically obstructs its line of sight it can't do its job."

That's kind of crummy. I figure we would find it if it was an issue very quickly from impressions from the floor. They couldn't "hide" something like that for long if it was a problem.

UltimatePartyBear · « **Reply #13 on:** May 10, 2006, 08:12:14 AM »

I can't remember who I saw propose it, but I've been wondering lately if the window at the front of the remote houses a light sensor that senses where the TV is. It's clear now that the dimensions of the TV are not indicated to the console through placement of the sensors, and a calibration step, no matter how simple, would be a technical barrier to people who can't program a VCR. Calibration would also have to be repeated if either the TV or sensor bar moved at all. If the remote can "see" the TV, though, then the Wii can do the math and avoid a need for calibration. I don't know why obstructing the view would be troublesome for a short time, though. It's not like it would forget where the TV was a moment before. It also makes me wonder if putting the TV in front of a window would be problematic.

I really need confirmation of how the controller actually works.

zakkiel · « **Reply #14 on:** May 10, 2006, 09:05:31 AM »

Quote
rom what I understand the limited angle of pointing is a given. Look at the distance between the TV and the controller, and do the geometry. In fact, the further away from the TV you are (and the smaller the TV, for that matter), the smaller the degree of sensitivity.

So far as we know, the controller has no connection to the TV. If it did, it would make the entire Wiisports package impossible, because golf and tennis both require sensing precise orientation while the controller is most definitely not pointing at the TV. I don't know what developer gave Kairon this information, but it sounds like he's completely off-base.

The Omen · « **Reply #15 on:** May 10, 2006, 09:14:14 AM »

If you can play games on the GC with the wavebird when you're in another room, I highly doubt this tech. will be a regression.

AnyoneEB · « **Reply #16 on:** May 10, 2006, 10:17:27 AM »

There is no need for calibration to be complex. It could be a simple "put the wiimote in front of the image of a wiimote on the screen and press A." Not that I really want to get into another discussion on how/if the wiimote will be calibrated.

RickPowers · « **Reply #17 on:** May 10, 2006, 10:25:00 AM »

According to Jonny, calibration takes place automatically if you simply hold the controller still.

Ian Sane · « **Reply #18 on:** May 10, 2006, 10:29:54 AM »

"According to Jonny, calibration takes place automatically if you simply hold the controller still."

I'm sure we'll all enjoy holding still while an enemy is killing the sh!t out of us. I think they need a method we're more in control of.

AnyoneEB · « **Reply #19 on:** May 10, 2006, 11:35:52 AM »

I am pretty sure that Rick meant that you hold the controller still during the calibration (probably when the console turns on). If that is true, then it is no different than how current consoles calibrate analog sticks (assume they are centered when the system is turned on).

vudu · « **Reply #20 on:** May 10, 2006, 11:58:41 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Ian Sane
"According to Jonny, calibration takes place automatically if you simply hold the controller still."

I'm sure we'll all enjoy holding still while an enemy is killing the sh!t out of us. I think they need a method we're more in control of.

Ian, I hate you so much.

zakkiel · « **Reply #21 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:03:35 PM »

If you read the MP3 impressions, you'll find he has a point.

RickPowers · « **Reply #22 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:03:35 PM »

Actually, what I meant is that if the controller loses calibration, you simply hold it still, and it syncs up again.

UltimatePartyBear · « **Reply #23 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:43:10 PM »

Well, after seeing the up close picture of the sensor bar, it seems possible that the thing really is just a pair of IR emitters that the remote picks up, though I don't know how it could work with any size TV without calibration if that's the case. My assumptions about how the remote works have been shaken, and I really want Nintendo to make an official statement on the matter.

The Omen · « **Reply #24 on:** May 10, 2006, 12:45:59 PM »

Quote
If you read the MP3 impressions, you'll find he has a point.

To think that's going to be the final product is quite foolhardy. There's 6 months of bug fixing and adjustments to clean it up. I expect Nintendo to make this a non issue.

News:

Author Topic: Wiimote has limited angle of "pointer" detection? (Read 13482 times)