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Going the Distance: Gaijin Games on Runner2, Sequels, and a Worse Name for Japan

by Tyler Ohlew - April 23, 2013, 11:55 am EDT
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We chat with Gaijin Games' Mike Roush about the past (BIT.TRIP), present (Runner2), and future (Bitroid?!). 

Bit.Trip Presents Runner2: Future Legend of Rhythm Alien serves as a perfect metaphor for Gaijin Games. Its hero, Commander Video, is ever pushing forward, besting whatever obstacles come his way. So too has Gaijin Games triumphed over adversity. Co-founded by Alex Neuse, Mike Roush, and Chris Osborn, the studio's debut effort was the BIT.TRIP series for WiiWare. While Nintendo pushed the service initially, it quickly became outdated and lapped by its competition. But, Gaijin Games stuck to its guns and continued to provide the service and Nintendo fans with their excellent series of titles. And just as Commander Video makes his return in Runner2, Gaijin Games continues to provide us with terrific content.

We spoke with Mike Roush on the development of Runner2, quirky Japanese subtitles, and what the future holds for the company.

Nintendo World Report (NWR): First off, congrats on finishing up Runner2! You followed up quickly with a patch, and just came back from GDC. Have you been able to relax at all?

Mike Roush (MR): We never relax! But finishing Runner2 has taken a lot of presh off the ole' mind tubes.

NWR: BIT.TRIP RUNNER released in May of 2010, at what point did you know and decide that this was the game you'd develop a sequel to?

MR: RUNNER was a lot of fun to make. We had talked about a sequel to a BIT.TRIP game a bit over the years, but we really wanted to spend a lot of time on a game. At that point we had been making BIT.TRIP games in 3 to 4 months each. This was quite limiting because, we wanted to make a full featured game. I think we were coming back from E3 2011 when we really decided on Runner2. At that point we just made it happen. We also knew we wanted to be on XBOX and PS3 - we have this amazing game engine that is basically a porting engine, so the more platforms we added, the bigger the game became.

NWR: What is important to you in a sequel?

MR: The main thing we wanted was that Runner2 feel just like RUNNER. We wanted those spot-on controls and we needed to keep that RUNNER feeling. Our take on sequels is fairly simple. They just need to be better than the previous version.

NWR: Runner2 packs a lot more content than your previous work on the BIT.TRIP series. Why did you decide to blow this game out, instead of continue along the path in the series prior?

MR: Developing the original series was just totally insane. I'm not saying it was bad, it was just insane. We had just a few months to start, make and finish a game. It was a great experience, but it also left us feeling like we shipped games that needed more polish. Runner2 is the bandaid that cured the wounds from those old days. We really wanted to take our time and make a nice polished experience. It felt really good to play test for months, polish, iterate, and even cut things that didn't work.

NWR: Runner2 was announced in late 2011, was it a nice change of pace to have a much longer development period (BIT.TRIP installments were generally four months apart)? Did this present its own set of challenges?

MR: We had to staff up a bit, so there was a different studio dynamic. We opened a studio in San Francisco, which is 80+ miles from our Santa Cruz location. It took some time to build relationships with the new team members, so there were some slow times when we started the project. I also think it took some time for us to come down off rushing all of the time, knowing we had time to think things out was a huge relief.

NWR: While the hard locks did not occur in the development kit builds of the game, were other issues (like leaderboard problems) also not known before the game shipped?

MR: These were two issues that we never got on our devkits - it's a real bummer. Steam is set up so you can upload and play the game whenever you want and you can share codes with anyone. If we could have done this with the Wii U - we would have found this issue right away. We have talked about making the Wii U more developer friendly and I think they have actually made changes with the eShop due to some of our suggestions. Maybe they will do this for some of the backend stuff on the Wii U too!

NWR: BIT.TRIP RUNNER had terrific sprite art, was there any deliberation over making Runner2 completely polygonal?

MR: Amazingly... The art in Runner2 was created using the same tools as RUNNER! Maya and Photoshop, with a sprinkling of Illustrator. But interestingly enough... The RUNNER Commander is made out of a bunch of polygons, as if they were pixels! 

NWR: Music is key when it comes to the series, what were your intentions with what you would hear in Runner2? What set it apart?

MR: We basically had the same theories behind the music as we did with the art. Bigger, grander, vaster and let's do whatever we want! I think Matt was able to express himself more with the music, because he had more freedoms.

NWR: I had heard that the leaderboards in BIT.TRIP COMPLETE played a factor in there being so many ways to earn points in Runner2, in an effort to prevent high scores essentially tying for first. Have you noticed any high score "walls" that masterful players can't best?

MR: We have not seen too much of this in Runner2, but we also have not looked! I do know that I am VERY good at Runner2 and people have blown my scores away, so something awesome is going on.

NWR: Edmund McMillen played a role in the instant re-starts found in RUNNER, were there any similar game changing ideas during the course of Runner2's development? Unkle Dill's checkpoint perhaps?

MR: We didn't have as much contact with Ed on Runner2, there was no real reason for this, we are just very busy dudes. The fans are responsable for the checkpoints. It was by FAR the biggest request. I think checkpoints are lame for a game with 1 minute levels.... but... we did it. We thought, if we were going to have checkpoints, we were going to make the best checkpoints ever and tie them into the game a bit. So we see the unlockable friends at the checkpoints!

NWR: Difficulty levels were introduced in BIT.TRIP COMPLETE, and we see them carried over into Runner2. What brought about this decision to provide the option?

MR: We knew we would have more people playing Runner2 - just having an audience is a reason to have an easier mode. I personally don't make games to make people frustrated, so I wanted Runner2 to be a place where anyone could play and enjoy the game from start to finish. Also, the easy mode gives an option to get through the harder sections. I look for a 9 hour game these days and we really wanted the game to be finishable in that time frame. 

NWR: What inspired you to have Charles Martinet narrate the game? Has there been any confusion from players less familiar with the voice of Mario?

MR: We just thought it would be rad, so we did it! He is the nicest dude on earth so it ended up being one of my favorite Gaijin Games moments. People seem to really love his narration. I think he added a lot of personally to the game.

NWR: Any other entries of the BIT.TRIP series you'd like to expand on and build a sequel to?

MR: I think we are going to move on. I am not sure there will be a Core2 - we have been talking about Bitroid - you can figure out what that would be.

NWR: Considering Runner2's full title, have you removed any chance of it being changed should it release in Japan? Or will a possible publisher be forced to get even wackier?

MR: HA! We have actually talked about this. We will be making it WORSE for Japan.

NWR: What's next for Gaijin Games? An HD collection of the BIT.TRIP series perhaps?

MR: I think we are going to grow and try and do another game with deeper meanings and rich story lines. We might do a little game we have been talking about for a long time called Laserlife. I made an animatic for this years ago - you can find the video online. Other than that, we are still talking about our next move. My guess is... 1 large project and 1 small at the same time.

NWR: Would laserlife be your smaller title, and Bitroid be the bigger one? Is the Wii U in your plans for the future?

MR: That is a great question. If we do laserlife. It will not be small. I am not sure we are going to do a Bitroid. But I can't imagine that being small either! Maybe we will do something like an original BIT.TRIP game - 3 or 4 month dev cycle!

We will probably be on Wii U with laserlife if we do it!

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