Post by: Mario on September 10, 2003, 12:37:19 AM
Horray for another crappy article written by dumbasses who know nothing about the games industry! So much BS in that article i cant be bothered pulling it all apart. Sadly this is how most people view the GC as anyway.
EDIT: Now with pic, Clicky!
Post by: PIAC on September 10, 2003, 03:05:53 AM
this 'analysist' contradicts her self at every turn, nintendo will do a sega and drop support, nintendo have top class selling franchises, whether nintendo will create a new console is debateable, nintendo have confirmed a new console
and so forth, yipee nintendo bashing is tired work! *orderes a tab* no time for that now! the computer is starting!
Post by: nitsu niflheim on September 10, 2003, 03:23:06 AM
Quote
"Right now the jury's out on whether they will create a next-generation system," she said. [.q]
A LIE!Quote
Eidos is the second software maker to abandon the GameCube. Acclaim, producer of titles like "NBA Jam," dropped the system in June. Olhava said other smaller producers could follow suit if the incremental costs of developing for three systems prove too high.
A LIE. Acclaim never dropped GCN all together, and neither has Eidos.Quote
The GameCube library will expand to 320 games by year-end, the biggest support for any Nintendo console ever," said George Harrison, the company's senior v.p. for marketing.
SOUNDS FABRICATED. I am pretty sure the Gameboy has a lot more that 320 games in it's library, just for the old black and white Gameboy.
Post by: iTZKooPA on September 10, 2003, 04:06:35 AM
now ya gotta realize its not doing as well as Nintendo hopped but they did already announce a new system for GBA and a new console and they also announced theyd never drop support, but instead just leave the industry
Post by: iTZKooPA on September 10, 2003, 04:14:28 AM
Star Wars?! Thats what they point out? What about Eternal Darkness or Resident Evil or something with ACTUAL ADULT CONTENT?!
Post by: Perfect Cell on September 10, 2003, 05:28:21 AM
Post by: iTZKooPA on September 10, 2003, 06:20:27 AM
Post by: The Omen on September 10, 2003, 06:55:09 AM
Quote
Although it has supported more "adult" games (including the "Star Wars" titles), the average Nintendo buyer is about 10 years younger than the owner of a PlayStation 2.
Now, that is BS. Truthfully, i have no idea why i'm surprised. One has to wonder if she was 'asked' to do this 'article', and by whom.
Post by: Perfect Cell on September 10, 2003, 07:18:37 AM
Post by: joshnickerson on September 10, 2003, 07:32:58 AM
I guess this is what Nintendo gets for being honest about it's inventory. No wonder they've been so secretive as of late.
Post by: iTZKooPA on September 10, 2003, 08:52:40 AM
Nintendo has ALWAYS been very secretive. I think the media is just being stupid. If they would look a the number they would see that Nintendo isn't losing tons of money or anything, they are just losing the race. That doesn't mean they are screwed financially (because they aren't). Instead they just go with whatever people tell them. Eidos said it was decling business so they took it at face value instead of looking into things themselves (we already have questions Eidos' comments about N in another post to death). Reporters, and even website reporters should look into stuff, unless the guy was being objective (such as if he simply reported Eidos' decision, instead of using some analyst and only one and formulating a "report") which he certainly wasn't.
Post by: NintendoFanGirl on September 10, 2003, 09:31:19 AM
Post by: Berto2K on September 10, 2003, 10:11:51 AM
Post by: AgentSeven on September 10, 2003, 10:25:17 AM
Here's something many of you do not probably know. The NY Post is one of the worst, most biast newspapers in the country. They are owned by NewsCorp (FOX), and Fox has special ties to..(drum roll please...)$ONY! For God sakes!!! This sort of crap really pisses me off.
$ony and FOX have had a special relationship for years. I work and live in Los Angeles. I briefly worked for $ony, a.k.a. Columbia/TriStar Pictures in early 1995. Even back then FOX and $ony were close. Now one of my closest friends and my agent both work for FOX studios. $ony and FOX are practically in bed together. They share production space on their studio lots, they help to promote each others films, and most of the TV advertising you will see for a $ony picture will be on FOX stations. (and in their newspapers.)
This is article is EXACTLY the sort of mind control B.S. that I am out here to fight in the first place.
This is why I say "Bringing you the fight for freedom." Do you know how many underinformed idiots will read this article and believe it without question. That is the power of ignorance and yellow journalism.
I think the REAL story behind this peice is this. $ony is really starting to feel the pinch from both Nintendo and Microsoft. Their online plans have failed. (some retailers have stopped ordering online bundles, like the one I work for.) Also many important business analysts predict that $ony will lose %60 of it's installed user base during the next round of console wars. $ony may not act like the are in trouble, and they will never admit that very same fact. So instead, what's the best thing they can do to distract the public from their woes? Cook up some BS story about Nintendo being doomed.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 10, 2003, 12:07:21 PM
Post by: egman on September 10, 2003, 01:51:14 PM
I hope for Nintendo's sake they have a tremendous Holiday season. I want EAD to shut the haters up with MK: DD. I want SK to silence their critics with MGS. I want Viewtiful Joe to explode in the west in ways Capcom may not have imagined. I want Factor 5 to show the fanboys how to make a Star Wars game. Every time I see crap articles like this it just makes me wish even harder for Nintendo and its true supporters to come out swinging. Nintendo's has its problems, but even when they have done something good there are people who will find a way to spin it in a negative light. There just seems to me that much stupidity and vitrol being lobbed at Nintendo right now.
I'm now at the point where I'm seriously not interested in getting any of the next gen consoles. This industry is turning to trash in my eyes, and I rather not fund it. Video games are quickly becoming just bad as the music and movie industry.
(Sorry for the ranting, but there are days when I come online to read the news and just wonder about the direction of the video game industry and Nintendo. In spite of Nintendo's issues, I feel that they nearly solved all of their big problems from the N64 days and overall I'm by far more satisfied with the GC than any other system this gen. I just find it ridiculous that the press and some of 3rd parties can't seem to get beyond the family image and see the improvement and the effort.)
Post by: AgentSeven on September 10, 2003, 01:51:37 PM
However, the writers are not autonomous as you say, and often times, they are told what to write and how to say it. It's not a conspiracy, just the every day happenings in the world of publcisits and tabloid writers. (The NY post is a filty tabloid.)
Post by: Marcus Arillius on September 10, 2003, 02:21:10 PM
They write what their told if it helps out their corporate buddies.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 10, 2003, 03:22:16 PM
Post by: Berto2K on September 10, 2003, 09:51:38 PM
Post by: PIAC on September 10, 2003, 10:44:11 PM
Post by: Deguello on September 10, 2003, 11:29:43 PM
Why does this article even exist? The contents aren't "news", per se. Everything in it has already been reported, except for the highly editorial comment of an analyst, who is just repeating the idée du jour.
Post by: The Omen on September 11, 2003, 01:33:06 AM
Post by: Gamebasher on September 11, 2003, 07:22:54 AM
SONY are crap, have been that since the beginning and will one day soon perish!
If you don´t believe me, let me tell you that corporations that make a living from ripping off other people through hardware made faulty on purpose to increase profit, and corporations who thrive on selling machines that are easily modded to play piracy software will pay through the termination of their business! The amount of damage SONY has inflicted on the industry is beyond measure right now, but the very way they assume "no responsibility" is appaling and only shows even more clearly what they are. They won´t be smiling for much longer! For their joy is unrighteous joy!! SONY had a considerable share in the destruction of the SEGA Dreamcast even though they didn´t have to, as they knew they were going to win (no need to beat somebody who´s already lying down) anyway, and they have used every means to bully anybody else where they could, including Nintendo! They did nothing to prevent their machine from being used for counterfeit software. They could have done something, but didn´t!
The very means through which they gotto where they are, therefore makes me shun!! them completely - because they should NOT dominate an industry they´ve started the destruction of! Piracy should be fought and destroyed as quickly as possibly and never overlooked in any way whatsoever. It simply takes all the creativity out of the industry and stagnates the market indefinitely as no new players are even allowed to enter! Absolute power corrupts, and causes the fall of those holding it as corruption will not be tolerated.
I don´t know how many developers have perished because of the ongoing piracy problem, but I know it is MANY and I know that SONY has a huge stake in creating this situation in the first place.
So rest assured that one day SONY will pay their Karma! NOBODY, nomatter how great or rich or invulnerable they think themselves to be, will escape the natural balancing from the side of Nature! God is supreme Ruler and holder of Power and His Eternal Laws laid down in All things from the Foundation of the Void ensures all the time (!!) that criminals get their punishment. No longdrawn courtbattles, stalled by full intent. They just pay - BANG! - and then they f*** off! BWA-HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
Books like "The Rise and The Fall of the Great Powers" (Forgot the authors name) will tell you exactly about the cycles of birth and destruction of things, including dumb SONY´s!!
The only thing I am annoyed about right now, is the time it takes until they´ve received their punishment! But I think we´re getting c-l-o-s-e...heheeee!!!
GameBasher.
Post by: KDR_11k on September 11, 2003, 07:45:13 AM
Post by: Infernal Monkey on September 12, 2003, 09:21:38 PM
*Sighs ever so slightly*
Post by: MeddmaWamm on September 12, 2003, 10:24:48 PM
And speaking of dreamcast.. it's easier to pirate dreamcast games than ps2 games! so you really shouldn't be mad at sony for getting rid of dreamcast! you should be congratulating them! because sega allowed evil piracy!!!
Post by: Kyosho on September 12, 2003, 11:56:34 PM
As for the article, keep in mind... few good mature games are not going to make up for the bulk of nintendo's library for a younger audience. Personally I dont care, i have the Gamecube for those 1st party games. If i wanted mature games, i'd just play the PC.
Quote
the average Nintendo buyer is about 10 years younger than the owner of a PlayStation 2.
I can see this being partially true as like I said I used to work in a software store. Sales for the Gamecube were mostly 10-16 year olds whereas PS2 range was mostly 12-30+
lastly, concerning Nintendo's fazing out... I doubt it. They still make profit.. and even if the audience is less than that of PS2 or Xbox, profit is profit.
Post by: PIAC on September 13, 2003, 12:14:15 AM
Post by: Ocarina Blue on September 13, 2003, 12:58:24 AM
Post by: PIAC on September 13, 2003, 01:42:37 AM
Post by: oohhboy on September 13, 2003, 02:34:10 AM
Post by: Mario on September 13, 2003, 04:14:00 AM
PS2: 24.3 million
GC: 5.7 million
XB: 9.3 million
hmmmmmm, i find that very strange, considering as of now XBOX's userbase is at approx 5,682,075 and GCN is at 4,429,746. Xbox will have to sell an average of 723,585 consoles a month (AUG, SEP, OCT, NOV, DEC) to get to 9.3 million, which is NOT HAPPENING. Also, if they think GC will only have a userbase of 5.7 million by the end of the year, then BUPBOW, my bs-o-meter is tingling. GC would have to sell an average of only 254,051 units each month to only sell that much, and i dont see that happening, especially with the holiday season EXISTING.
And they list PS2's signature title as "Grand Theft Auto", fair enough. XBOX's is "Halo", fair enough. But for Gamecube, it says the signature title is "Pokemon"?! WTF?! There isnt even a Pokemon game out yet in the US, that just proves how little research this stupid person or people have done on the Gamecube. I think they just put Pokemon there to reaffirm Nintendos position as a kiddy company, and back up thier 'fact' that only kids buy Gamecube's, despite it not actually having a Pokemon game.
Another thing, what the hell is up with that picture at the top right? With Angelina Jolie as Tomb Raider? Is it trying to suggest that "Nintendo will no longer be getting Tomb Raider movies?". Retarded.
Argh, i could go on longer if you wanted me too, but you get the point. This article is full of crap, i wonder who's doing this was, Sony's or Microsofts? -__-
Post by: Super Mekman on September 13, 2003, 05:14:38 AM
I find that most people read that filthy rag is simply because it has "color!"
It's catered more toward folk from the Hamptons and Long Island, where most of the Republican fascist trash in New York City tends to live.
I'd never take their words to heart. Let alone about the Gamecube.
Post by: KDR_11k on September 13, 2003, 07:26:49 AM
Post by: Grey Ninja on September 13, 2003, 09:30:37 AM
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 13, 2003, 10:35:00 AM
Post by: iTZKooPA on September 13, 2003, 12:49:18 PM
Post by: nolimit19 on September 13, 2003, 10:11:45 PM
Post by: Termin8Anakin on September 14, 2003, 01:27:50 AM
Or get Gee Dubya Boosh to make a law that:
'Anyone who doesn't buy a Gamecube 2 will be sent to the army for life'
Following the launch of Gamecube 2, enlistments increase by 1000000%, and no one knows why. After that, the US invade every single country on earth, with Miyamoto crowned King of Tasmania.
Post by: nolimit19 on September 14, 2003, 06:06:57 AM
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 14, 2003, 06:13:54 AM
Termin8 makes much, MUCH more sense than that article.....
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 14, 2003, 06:50:08 AM
Post by: AgentSeven on September 14, 2003, 11:22:10 PM
Or how about the fact that the online plans for both X-box and Ps2 have failed, and that some retailers refuse to re-order online kits for both systems? In fact both $ony and M$ have an online user base no bigger than the Dreamcast did during it's peak, over two years ago.
Why don't you hear these stories? Well, $ony owns tons of syndicated t.v. shows and movies. They have their own movie studio as well. They then sell their shows and movies to your local t.v. station. So being one of the biggest providers of "entertainment content," they have close ties with literally thousands of TV stations and news deptartments across the country. Not to mention the fact that Newscorp (FOX,NY Post) and $ony have always been "buddy, buddy."
As for Microsoft, well to say that they have considerable pull with the media would be an understatement.
Now before you call me a paranoid fanboy. (Well informed fanboy is more like it.) Let me say for the 1000th time that I own a ps2 (regretably) and that I have an X-box that I love. I'm just speaking the truth.
I just had to rant for a moment. Thanks for listening.
Post by: PIAC on September 14, 2003, 11:26:35 PM
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 15, 2003, 03:28:54 AM
Off topic, but doesn't Steve Kent work for MSNBC as well?
Post by: Shift Key on September 15, 2003, 03:42:12 AM
AgentSeven: The article actually mentions MS losing $3 billion to get into a $27 billion industry. Three paragraphs down. For saying a lot of stuff, you need some facts to back it up.
As for on-line, I've heard XboxLive has been successful in the USA, and that's about it.
I particularly like the part where the signature title for the Gamecube is "Pokemon" when there actually hasn't been a Pokemon title released, apart from possibly Japan. That there signals the lack of research, or presence of ignorance.
Either way, they are showing an opinion, which is their job. No matter how mis-informed it is.
To the whingers here, take this article with a grain of salt. The fact that they say "the jury's out" about Nintendo's next console, when Nintendo have said otherwise, means the article does not tell the full story.
Nintendo aren't leaving the console business. Being the only company able to make a profit out of consoles (even up to the GC) means they know how to make a viable business. Now its only a matter of getting back that market share, which they seem to be actually acting on by getting the N5 ready BEFORE the competition.
It shall be interesting.
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 15, 2003, 04:18:54 AM
Post by: KDR_11k on September 15, 2003, 08:46:01 AM
Post by: NintendoFanGirl on September 15, 2003, 01:53:52 PM
solhava@idc.com
Post by: AgentSeven on September 15, 2003, 02:44:51 PM
As for whoever said that "X-Box live was a success in the USA," you are grossly misinformed. Also do your'e own fact checking. 99% of what I say can be confirmed with very little searching. I'm not here to help the lazy and the underinformed.
As for the other %1 of what I say, well my track record is good, so you'll just have to take the "leap of faith." Informed readers know, I only speak the truth.
The real loser here is the X-box. (Even though I love mine.) It's lost billions and it's online plan is a joke. I won't even get into how well the system has been cracked by hackers and pirates. Not to mention the fact that the PC divsion of M$ hates the X-Box and they see it as "Mircrosofts Vietnam."
One M$ rep I spoke with at E3 actually said "F*** the X-box!" I don't mean to use that language, but that's what he said.
Meawhile, GameCube has NOT been hacked. The cost of goods per system is LESS than $50 a unit and they have made nothing but profit from day one.
Whose the real winner here? Let's not even count the MASSIVE sales of the GBA..
(I guess I won't even mention the serious production problems the PSP is having. Expect those "Disc read errors" to start pouring in just after launch....)
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 15, 2003, 03:49:10 PM
Post by: Shift Key on September 19, 2003, 03:42:16 AM
I read an article here about how Microsoft has gotten around the Linux hacking of Xbox very easily. Basically, an update done through the Live network closes the loophole that enables Linux to run. While it is very hard to fix modded systems (which is their own fault since they went with the DVD-ROM format), it shows they can keep up with their opponents.
I wouldn't exactly call Xbox the 'big loser' - sure it has lost Microsoft billions of dollars, but the money isn't a problem. You ever heard of the saying, "Sometime you've got to spend money to make money"? This is what Microsoft has had to do to get a footing in the industry.
Sony did the same thing with the PS1, and look where they are.
Quote
The cost of goods per system is LESS than $50 a unit and they have made nothing but profit from day one.
FALSE: Nintendo had to make a small loss ( < $10 per unit) at launch because of these price wars. But over time, the costs went down and so they managed to make a profit.
I could find you a link, but frankly i can't be f***ed.
And I said "I've heard XboxLive has been successful in the USA, and that's about it." because:
1. I don't live in the USA.
2. I don't care much for the XBOX outside of gaming news and occasional playing a friend's system.
3. I have better things to do then hunt down stats.
Just letting you know
Post by: ghostVi on September 19, 2003, 05:40:09 AM
Same point about the xbx hacking - they patched only online users, that's nowhere like putting xbx Linux out.
Post by: AgentSeven on September 19, 2003, 01:12:40 PM
I hate to dump on the box, it's superior to the "Crap-Station 2" in almost every way, but still, it's the clear loser in this three way race. In the end, business is about profit. Nintendo has made the most profit so far, so in my book, they win. GBA Sales, GC sales, and don't forget but the N64,GBC, and the SNES are still making money for Nintendo. You can say $ony has it's other electronics and that M$ has Windows, but they don't count. We're only talking about video games.
By the way, GameCube's cost of good is indeed LESS than $50. It's not common knowledge and often times, companies will claim that their cost off goods is higher than it actually is.(For Tax purposes, they do this even in Japan.) However in reality the GC costs Big N LESS than $50. It's not the sort of thing you'd read in Barron's or the WSJ, but it's true.
As for the Linux exploit, I've actually seen Linux hacked X-Box's running bootleg software without the need of a mod chip. That's a serious problem. I also want to be on the record as saying that I am %100 against piracy. It has substantially hurt this industry. Fixing this problem through X-Box live isn't going to do much, especially when %90 of X-Box owners don't even use X-Box Live. The article Shifty quoted was "damage control."
I also stand by my earlier statements that X-Box Live and the Ps2 online campaigns are complete and utter failures. The retail chain that I work for, which is a susbstantial one with locations around the world, has discontinued all future orders of LIVE Kits and PS2 modems. This summer a friend of mine was able to pick up a ps2 modem on clearance at Wal Mart for $10!! We also know about the X-Box live 2.0. They are calling it an "upgrade" but what it is really is a product re-launch. Gee, successfull
products don't often require relaunches, do they?
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 19, 2003, 01:47:15 PM
I think I remember the percentages being low for Xbox live nd Ps2's modem, but I think it was still mariginally succesful. They managed to hook players by at least offering games with the capabilty, and although the percentages were low, it was still succesful for a first online attempt on both parts.
They were not "complete and utter failures" IMO.
Post by: Matrix on September 19, 2003, 03:37:59 PM
Post by: the_zombie_luke on September 19, 2003, 10:22:48 PM
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 20, 2003, 08:59:27 AM
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 20, 2003, 09:06:40 AM
Post by: Plugabugz on September 20, 2003, 11:50:48 AM
50k against the UK alone (which is 'apparently' the biggest country for sales minus Japan and America) is still disappointing.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 20, 2003, 12:27:37 PM
Post by: AgentSeven on September 20, 2003, 12:35:12 PM
Not hardly. That's just like the lie that says are 50 million Ghey-Station 2's worldwide. Also quite laughable. (Maybe 50 million shipped, but certainly not sold through.)
As we know, X-Box live is "re-launching" it's product line with the new 2.0 version. A re-launch in not something a successfull product needs.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 20, 2003, 01:01:01 PM
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 20, 2003, 01:04:46 PM
Would I go online and risk having a failed attempt with losses? Or would I wait for Sony and MS to test it, and have my first try succesful? dunno.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 20, 2003, 01:08:18 PM
Post by: AgentSeven on September 20, 2003, 01:39:48 PM
As for the 500,000, that's total BS. It's a marketing figure. Until you can prove it with a verifiable number, I just don't believe it. My store chain has barely sold 5% of the X-Box live kits we ordered. In fact many we're sent back to our vendors. I have spoken with other buyers who have had the same troubles, including some who work for Toys R us, one of the biggest retailers of video games world wide.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 20, 2003, 01:49:56 PM
Also, I never said Sony's network was wholey original, just that Nintendo would benefit from not having to work the kinks out of it themselves.
Post by: MadMan on September 20, 2003, 04:33:11 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
When you include Europe and Japan
So at most 150,000 from Europe, and 2 from Japan. That still undoubtedly puts them at revenue way below the line of what it takes to maintain XBox Live. And the more people who buy it, the more games that use it, the more servers Microsoft has to make and maintain. It will take them a long while to even break even on the project. They probably won't even make any money off of it this generation.
Post by: Plugabugz on September 21, 2003, 01:54:29 AM
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 21, 2003, 09:22:35 AM
Post by: Shift Key on September 24, 2003, 03:42:28 AM
Quote
Good games will stand the test of time, while Sony and Microsoft won't.
I can think of at least two things wrong with that statement.
1. Good games DID stand the test of time. They stood out and above the other games. And you didn't see ads for these games splashed across magazines or the TV. You heard about them from word-of-mouth. And that's why they don't stand the test of time today. You ask the average PS2 gamer or XBOX gamer about, say Duck Hunt, and you'll get a very puzzled look from 95% of them (that's an estimate AgentSeven, get a life). They get lost among the hype for the next Rockstar game, or the next Halo game. Because good games don't always come from sequels. Usually sequels are a lot like the originals except better graphics or more stuff. Just look at movies. I could list off sequels that shouldn't have been made from off the top of my head, but that's another story.
2. Sony and Microsoft won't stand the test of time.
That's awfully optimistic talk. Blinded fanboyism methinks.
Sony and Microsoft aren't going anywhere. Sorry for the blunt truth, but both companies make billions of dollars profit each year and aren't likely to change. Sure, one is making a loss, but for a first attempt in a market with two seasoned rivals, i'm sure they didn't expect to make an initial profit, particularly from the XBOX console. They're going head-on in a cut-throat market, attempting to get into the living rooms of families in the place of a PS2 and a GC.
They made some mistakes, big deal? Remember Radarscope? The ill-fated arcade game Nintendo made, then pulled because it bombed. And what did those cabinets become? Donkey Kong. The game that gave Nintendo its first big hit in an industry dominated by an Atari console and other big developers. Now you can't tell me Microsoft isn't allowed any optimism at all. That's stupid.
And Sony? Why would Sony want to leave the industry that they changed forever. Sure, you may not see that it is all for the best, but what is? The industry surely wouldn't be worth $27 billion annually without Sony, and this revolution has breathed life into the industry and is producing some real gems.
These are my opinions. Sometimes sitting on the fence is best if you want to see both sides of the field.
Flame away.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 24, 2003, 12:42:26 PM
Post by: AgentSeven on September 24, 2003, 01:17:01 PM
Microsoft is screwed, there's no other way to put it. They have lost OVER 3 Billion dollars on the X-Box. Plus there is a "Civil War" going on inside the company over M$'s future, and whether or not it should include future "X-Box" systems. I've said this before, when I was at this years E3, I spoke to a Microsoft Rep from the companies PC division. His words concerning X-Box we're, "F*** the X-Box!"
Again, I appologise for the language, but this is exactly what he said. That's not exactly what I would call "towing the company line."
(Now I hated saying all of that, even though it was all true. I love my X-Box and it is a nice compliment to my GameCube.)
As for $ony, they are the single reason that we are headed for an enourmous video game industry crash. Their policy of "style over substance," "dump bin games," and "endless clone games and sequels" has seriously dilluted this market. The industries numbers are down, people are being laid off, and companies like Square are posting their biggest losses ever. (Some people blame $ony's involvement with Square for those losses.)
There was a time when the PSX was the retailer's "darling." My own company bought so deep on PSX games that we still have dump bins FILLED with even some of the most popular titles. Now, the image of $ony being the "Cash Cow" is starting to change. Everytime I visit one of my companies stores and I see those dump bins, I'm starting to understand why.
Now, neither company is just going to dry up and blow away. Still it will be interesting to see who survives the crash. Now maybe people will understand why Nintendo has taken such a conservative approach to the game industry over the past 5 years. They can see the writing on the wall. When you are a 115 year old company, you tend to think in terms of decades rather than just years.
Post by: mouse_clicker on September 24, 2003, 02:29:48 PM
And while I may have respect for Sony in what they HAVE done for the industry, like Shifty said, I do also agree that a crash will inevitably result, largely through their actions. It's not necessarily a bad thing, though, for reasons I've stated in other threads (mainly that it'll weed the bad from the good, as the last crash did).
Post by: Robageejammin on September 25, 2003, 09:10:00 PM
Post by: Top Ramen on September 25, 2003, 11:05:23 PM
Make no mistake, the next Nintendo console will most assuredly have built-in ethernet for LAN and online capabilities, and the recent strategic moves demonstrate that (AOL deal). People shouldn't be so quick to put down online gaming when in 2 short years, Nintendo will also be online. The next frontier of gaming is shaping up to be multiplayer -- as in online and wireless, and when I say next frontier, I mean as significant as 3D gaming turned out to be. Profitability? It's all about finding a market model that works. Sony has 750k+ subs and Live has 500k+ subs according to the latest numbers out there. 1.25 million online gaming fans this early in the online console gaming's infancy is nothing to sneeze at. All three hardware makers need to invest in building a base now, to prepare for the future.
In a couple years, we'll be playing the next FZERO and Mario Kart online. I know everyone here would love that.
Top Ramen
Post by: Uglydot on September 26, 2003, 01:04:17 AM
Post by: KDR_11k on September 26, 2003, 06:24:23 AM
*) Sony reported 60M shipped PS2s lately.
Post by: Yogurisimo 2 on September 27, 2003, 04:57:30 PM
Post by: honda_insightful on October 02, 2003, 01:57:58 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: nitsujdarkQuoteQuote
The GameCube library will expand to 320 games by year-end, the biggest support for any Nintendo console ever," said George Harrison, the company's senior v.p. for marketing.
SOUNDS FABRICATED. I am pretty sure the Gameboy has a lot more that 320 games in it's library, just for the old black and white Gameboy.
The Gameboy is a PORTABLE or HANDHELD, not a console.
Post by: honda_insightful on October 02, 2003, 02:14:00 AM
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Originally posted by: AgentSeven
That's just like the lie that says are 50 million Ghey-Station 2's worldwide. Also quite laughable. (Maybe 50 million shipped, but certainly not sold through.).
Yes, SHIPPED. Sony claims 60 million PS2 were SHIPPED to stores, not sold.
Also, why do you find that number so hard to believe? The PS1 sold 110 million consoles worldwide... doesn't it make sense for its sequel, the PS2, to do just as well?
Post by: mouse_clicker on October 02, 2003, 03:32:07 AM
Post by: PIAC on October 02, 2003, 10:11:47 AM
you have to factor into the equasion that gaming has become more popular since the n64/psx generation, hence ps2 could very well outsell psx.
Post by: Yuji Miyamoto on October 02, 2003, 09:25:29 PM
ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha! ha!
does anyone really belive that hype? this number comes from a company well know for lying about it's sales numbers.
the agent was the only one who knew what he was talking about
i enjoy his post more than i do whats written on the main page
too bad
Post by: Mario on October 02, 2003, 09:40:55 PM
Post by: mouse_clicker on October 03, 2003, 11:37:44 AM
Post by: PIAC on October 03, 2003, 02:58:40 PM
Post by: KnowsNothing on October 03, 2003, 03:08:59 PM
Huh? Wha- HEY! How'd you know?
Using facts in arguments is notorious for causing logical and important debates. Something which we don't want, obviously. Being correct isn't the most important thing, as long as we get people confused while trying. Now we should all sit down and listen to Agent7, becuase apparently he has something good to say. Oh wait, I guess he was banned for saying TOO many good things. He must've just made soooooo much sense, he over loaded the mods with logic, causing them to immediatley ban him becuase their brains were about to leak out their ears and onto someone's shoe.
Note: I haven't read this entire thread and have no clue what Agent7 made sense about. But due to prior knowledge and psychic abilities, I am almost 100% sure that he was wrong.
[/rant]
Post by: Darc Requiem on October 03, 2003, 10:19:38 PM
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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
Sony's not stupid enough to lie by several million units- they could easily be broguh up on charges for that. It's not so cut and dry "the number's high so Sony must have lied". 110 million sounds about right to me- I know the PSX sold between 70-80 million units in the US alone, so it shouldn't be hard to believe another 30-40 million units could be split among Japan, Europe, and Australia. Just because the number is higher than Nintendo's doesn't mean Sony lied.
Yes it is like Sony. Sony is known for making their sales numbers artificially high. Unlike Nintendo and even MS. Sony has no buy back program. Once a PS or PS2 unit is sent to the store they consider it sold. If the store can't sell it....then tough...they are stuck with it. Thats not the case with MS on Nintendo. Sony counts refurbished and repaired units as new sales. If my PS2 breaks and I sent it to Sony for repair and they send it back. They consider it a sale. Thats in addition to all the PS1 and PS2 owners that have had to buy second and third units due to poor product quality. My brothers best friend is already on his 2nd PS2 and I don't have the space to name the number of people that have had to by multiple PS1's. if Son'y says they sold 110 million PS1's it more like 70 to 80 million once you take out all the artificial sales. The PS2 has supposedly sold 60 million units. Its probably more like 40 million. I don't understand them when you are that far ahead do you really need to ly. Ah well...thats Sony for you.
Darc Requiem
Post by: PIAC on October 03, 2003, 10:22:48 PM
Post by: honda_insightful on October 05, 2003, 02:28:30 AM
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Originally posted by: Yuji Miyamoto
110 million Playstations?!
YES. WORLDWIDE STATS:
Atari 2600 = 40 million
Original Nintendo = 60 million
Super Nintendo = 70 million
Nintendo64=30 million ; Playstation = 100 million (1996-2000)
If the Atari, NES, and Super NES can sell 40, 60, and 70 million respectively, then it's entirely reasonable to believe PS1 sold ~100 million. The videogame industry continues to grow larger and larger.
It's also entirely reasonable to believe that PS2 will equal or better its ancestor.
Post by: KDR_11k on October 05, 2003, 07:42:40 AM
Post by: mouse_clicker on October 05, 2003, 07:55:10 AM
Darc: But not by MILLIONS of units. Like I said, Sony could face a major lawsuit were they to distort the facts that much. Believe me, I know Sony and Microsoft have fudged the facts many times, but not by millions.
Post by: honda_insightful on October 09, 2003, 03:59:55 AM
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Originally posted by: mouse_clicker
You mean predecessor...
Predecessor... ancestor... same difference.
Anyway, round-and-round we go. The point is that the PS1 sold ~100-110 million consoles, and that it's an entirely believable stat. Anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot. (Also, if Sony lied about it, then Sony would be in serious trouble with the government.)
