Nintendo World Report Forums

NWR Interactive => Podcast Discussion => Topic started by: Jonnyboy117 on March 15, 2015, 03:58:31 PM

Title: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on March 15, 2015, 03:58:31 PM

So many Nintendo games! So much quasi-Metroid! So great Listener Mail! Such grammar!

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/39856/episode-421-eat-that-frog

Hey friends, get hyped for this bulging episode of RFN! We start with lots of New Business, as Jonny checks out the trippy Proun+ for 3DS eShop, a game that evokes F-Zero, yet replaces butt-rock with jazz-rock. He also goes over the moon for Axiom Verge, a superb independent tribute to Metroid coming soon for PS4 and PC, coming maybe one sweet day for Wii U. After that, James cools us down with his ongoing sojourn into Persona Q, just one of an ongoing onslaught of Etrian Odyssey games on 3DS. Lindy follows up with his own Metroid-like game, the gorgeous Ori and the Blind Forest (Xbox One and PC, probably never coming to Wii U). It sure is a great time to be a fan of Metroid gameplay, unless you're stuck with only Nintendo systems! But even if you are, Guillaume can advise you on Mario vs. DK: Tipping Stars (on both Wii U and 3DS). He also reports of trying Monster Hunter 4 Ultimate local multiplayer, with actual experts!

Listener Mail jumps off and butt-slams into a status update on everyone's favorite greedy slob, Wario, and we might spend some time on his rival/buddy Waluigi, too. For something more serious, we try to help a listener determine if games are keeping him from living the life he wants. After all that earnestness, it just made sense to swing hard the other way. The last email concerns that guiltiest of all pleasures, the Dynasty Warriors franchise, and we consider which silly franchise spin-offs might get us to play one. We'll have more emails next week, and yours could be one of them!

It's not mentioned on this show (we settled the nominees just after recording), but we're already starting the next RetroActive! This one is called "Clash of the Titans" because you get to choose among Mario, Zelda, and Metroid -- whoever wins, we all win! We're trying another new survey method that should be better, so get your Google account ready (or make one, as you'll have to some day regardless) and vote now for RFN RetroActive #32!

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: ClexYoshi on March 16, 2015, 01:32:02 AM

I'm making you jackasses play Super Mario Sunshine in English s you finally know the english names for this ****. >_>;;

also, blue coin funtimes!

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: TheYoungerPlumber on March 16, 2015, 03:40:52 AM

Quote from: ClexYoshi on March 16, 2015, 01:32:02 AM

I'm making you jackasses play Super Mario Sunshine in English s you finally know the english names for this ****. >_>;;

also, blue coin funtimes!

At $25+ used, I think I'll wind up playing my Japanese copy again if Mario wins.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: MASB on March 16, 2015, 04:39:05 AM

I haven't listened to the episode yet, going solely off the show notes, which is probably always a bad idea, but using James Jones as inspiration, I'll speak off the dome as it were.

The last RetroActive poll got its ripcord pulled too late, now everyone has to sign up for Google to vote in the poll? Why not Twitter, Facebook or VK while you're at it. Did some unspeakable tragedy happen to the message board's ability to do polls?

I know the justification was to make the voting more open. You can already log onto the NWR forums via Facebook which most people already have. There may be more options, but that's the one I remember. It can't get much easier to vote in the poll. If it's too much trouble to sign in to the message board to vote, signing into Google is probably a bridge too far as well.

You'd think it would be a way to steer people to the website (if for some reason they listen to the podcast, but have never visited the site) and foster even more community. Rather than saying go anywhere but here to vote in a poll for a podcast on a website they probably visit anyway. Might as well get rid of Now Playing, just tell them to go to NeoGAF. Next time the telethon comes around, get rid of the site chat and tell everyone to sign up for Twitch chat instead.

It just seems like a solution looking for a problem. If the problem truly is having to be a member of the NWR board, then have a poll on the site via a stickied article that people can vote on, independent of the message board. If the site is somehow technologically incapable of doing that, then my esteem for Neal has risen even more, considering the site's backbone must be ever so delicate that every article posted is a ticking time bomb waiting to wreck havoc. If the site is capable of that and people still somehow can't be arsed to vote, then **** them. If a single click on a website is too much for them, then they don't care enough anyway (certainly not enough to invest the time to play along, presumably something you'd hope many of the people voting would do, if they haven't already done so in the past).

So I guess what I really want to ask about these polling methods is: Why? :p If my site poll suggestion is infeasible, then Google or Twitch away in good health.

Just to say you guys are great and I think the podcast may be reaching new peaks of high quality, but the RetroActive bit just set me off for some reason, as you've already surmised. :p

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: Enner on March 16, 2015, 06:57:16 AM

During the Axiom Verge segment, Jon mentioned Nintendo has said a new Metroid game would require a new control method. Did you mistake that for the news bite of Miyamoto on a new F-Zero game?


http://nintendoeverything.com/miyamoto-says-a-new-f-zero-might-be-possible-if-nintendo-finds-a-new-and-suitable-controller-interface/ (http://nintendoeverything.com/miyamoto-says-a-new-f-zero-might-be-possible-if-nintendo-finds-a-new-and-suitable-controller-interface/)


The last I heard of Nintendo talking anything substantial about Metroid was at E3 2014 where Kotaku ran an article stating Miyamoto, Iwata, or some high-level Nintendo employee talking about the 2D and 3D styles of Metroid and implying they should do one of each.


http://kotaku.com/nintendo-is-planning-a-future-for-both-2d-and-3d-metroi-1590142491 (http://kotaku.com/nintendo-is-planning-a-future-for-both-2d-and-3d-metroi-1590142491)


As an aside, I find it hard to determine how to take Miyamoto's comments on the future of F-Zero. Is it pie-in-the-sky talk and his answer is some high-concept spit-balling? Is it his hard stance on F-Zero as of now and means that F-Zero will most likely never grace the 3DS or Wii U? Is it a crazy smokescreen for an F-Zero in development now?

The last is a pipe dream; I hope it is the first.


On the Hyrule Warriors discussion: There are four Gundam Musous in the wild and all are available in English. The fourth title, Dynasty Warriors: Gundam Reborn, is a PS3 PSN-only title.


Hyrule Warriors plays much faster and crazier than past Musou games I've played (Samurai Warriors 1 and Dynasty Warriors 4). Looking at current Dynasty and Samurai Warriors games, they still aren't as fast, crazy, or pretty as Hyrule Warriors. Hyrule Warriors still plays like a Musou game as 80-90% of my thought processes in Samurai Warriors 1 applies to Hyrule Warriors.


The upcoming English release of Dragon Quest Heroes is interesting. Not only does it look much prettier than the sorry-looking PS4 up-ports of Warriors Orochi 3 and Dynasty Warriors 8: Empires, but it also changes up the structure by not having enemy keeps. Going on early reports, Dragon Quest Heroes is structurally more like an Action-RPG as opposed to the faux-battlefield scenarios of Dynasty Warriors.


Lastly, I can attest to the absurd time-sink of Hyrule Warrior's Adventure mode as I have currently spent 93 hours in the game to complete Legend Mode's story and finish ~85% of the first Adventure map. The scary thing is that the DLC season pass adds 3 more Adventure maps to grind through.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on March 16, 2015, 09:40:01 AM

A small fraction of our listeners vote on RetroActive polls, and we are experimenting to see if the NWR forums are a limiting factor. It's as simple as that. Partial results from last time were very encouraging, but the unforeseen response quantity limitation cut us off early. I could have allowed voting on Google Forms without a login, but apparently they don't offer an IP tracker or cookie option, so someone could have easily exploited the system. Requiring Google is a small limitation (it is the world's most popular website) but if this causes too many issues, we won't use it again. Your complaint is duly noted.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: NWR_Lindy on March 16, 2015, 11:43:34 AM

Quote from: Enner on March 16, 2015, 06:57:16 AM

During the Axiom Verge segment, Jon mentioned Nintendo has said a new Metroid game would require a new control method. Did you mistake that for the news bite of Miyamoto on a new F-Zero game?


http://nintendoeverything.com/miyamoto-says-a-new-f-zero-might-be-possible-if-nintendo-finds-a-new-and-suitable-controller-interface/ (http://nintendoeverything.com/miyamoto-says-a-new-f-zero-might-be-possible-if-nintendo-finds-a-new-and-suitable-controller-interface/)

Yep, I mixed these up, my bad. Sorry, I was thinking of the OTHER unjustly neglected Nintendo franchise.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: Pandareus on March 16, 2015, 01:16:09 PM

This reminds me: I should have protested when Jonny said Nintendo doesn't work on the franchises the fans want them to work. They just released a sequel for Canvas Curse, which many fans had been asking for. Before that, they gave us a Captain Toad game: again, something I've seen people demand. Starfox Wii U is apparently a thing that will exist.


So yeah. Nintendo can't work on everything at all times. But they definitely cater to their fanbase.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: K-S-O on March 16, 2015, 08:45:57 PM

Quote from: Jonnyboy117

Listener Mail jumps off and butt-slams into a status update on everyone's favorite greedy slob, Wario, and we might spend some time on his rival/buddy Waluigi, too

(http://s12.postimg.org/3u4v2qgt9/waluigitime.jpg)

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: azeke on March 17, 2015, 12:03:38 AM

Actually Sengoku Basara is considered to be THE most technical out of all musou games:

It has combat system reminiscent to DMC games (some of shared Capcom staff worked on it). It's kinda wasted during the bulk of the game where you're just slashing at armies of mooks, but it gets very interesting during mini-boss and boss battles.

And yeah, it's definitely much funnier than your regular musou:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxkKafIvqiA&t=2m54s

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: MASB on March 17, 2015, 10:05:12 AM

To Jonny: The more I thought about it, the more it's apparent that there isn't any one size fits all solution to polls. If you could trust people not to be jerks on the Internet (cue "The Impossible Dream" music), you wouldn't have to mess with IP tracking or cookies (though both can be easily gotten around if someone wanted to, I assume with Google the important thing is the account itself. Once that is voted with, IP addresses don't matter as it can't be voted with again).

I suppose one could truly get around those restrictions by making multiple accounts and voting in that manner (though why would anyone be that lame). In that extreme case I would say that would be a point in favor of the NWR Forums. After all, if suddenly 60 accounts were registered on the forums in a week and they all voted for Choaniki in RetroActive, that kind of suspicious activity would be easy to detect. ;) But at some point you just have to use whatever method you deem the most necessary, since people intent on mucking up the vote will do so if they are sufficiently lacking in life. And besides, this is voting for what videogame to play, not the Presidency, so it's not worth it to plan for every possible contingency anyway.

To Jon: There are enough neglected Nintendo franchises to choose from, it's easy to be confused. Just imagine if you were a huge Capcom or Namco fan. Throw a dart at the board and you'd land on a neglected franchise with those two.

Though to echo Gui's point, while there may be neglected IP, Nintendo will sometimes surprise you by what they choose to bring back. Talking about F-Zero, I agree with what Gui said in a past episode discussing Nintendo waiting until a new control or new way presents itself before they make another. Just make the game! Just update the graphics, use your creativity for the tracks, characters and get on with it. I could see being concerned with freshness if you were pumping the games out, but it's been over 10 years. Just making a F-Zero game at this point is the refreshing bit, no matter how it controls!

No one in power at NDCube is that concerned about freshness in the Mario Party series. Why are some series held to such high standards and others not? If it's a question of finances, then just say that to the fans and cut bait. Don't talk about waiting for control schemes that will suddenly make the game worthwhile.

I can understand not wanting to repeat yourself (though this is Nintendo we're talking about), but when a decade passes between releases, if there is fan demand for it, you just have to give it your best creative shot and not wait for control schemes to bail you out. We already see how that works out with Rainbow Curse, not being able to look at the pretty graphics on the TV while you're playing. New doesn't always mean better and it's best to stay with tried and true than to shoehorn in controls just for the hell of it, which Nintendo has guilty of more than once.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: geckog7 on March 22, 2015, 08:17:10 PM

Just finished last week's episode. I enjoyed the discussion about video games sometimes being a distraction to getting your **** done. I gave up video games for five years as I spent every waking hour pursuing an engineering degree. missed out on the entire wii generation of games.

I am currently battling a new gaming related problem in that now i can comfortably afford any game I want. I have a WII U and PS4 with impressive libraries for both and have not even played 80% of the games I've purchased. My new years resolution this year is to quit buying games, but there are a few must haves that I will end up getting.

Has anyone else gone through something similar?

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: pokepal148 on March 23, 2015, 01:14:41 AM

So I like how James mentions the idea of a crossover with the Etrian Odyssey series. What if we threw Pokemon into the mix, maybe have a bunch of Pokemon exploring caves or something, a Pokemon Mystery Dungeon if you will.

Title: Re: Episode 421: Eat That Frog
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on March 23, 2015, 03:18:17 PM

Quote from: geckog7 on March 22, 2015, 08:17:10 PM

Just finished last week's episode. I enjoyed the discussion about video games sometimes being a distraction to getting your **** done. I gave up video games for five years as I spent every waking hour pursuing an engineering degree. missed out on the entire wii generation of games.

I am currently battling a new gaming related problem in that now i can comfortably afford any game I want. I have a WII U and PS4 with impressive libraries for both and have not even played 80% of the games I've purchased. My new years resolution this year is to quit buying games, but there are a few must haves that I will end up getting.

Has anyone else gone through something similar?

yes, for about the last 8 years! Before that I had basically quit most gaming for about 10 years or so. Now I have a rather large "backlog". But I don't really think of it like that. To me, games (and movies that I buy on Blu Ray or DVD) are like spices on the shelf. I like to have a good variety on hand to suit my tastes at any given time. I don't use all of a spice in one recipe. I don't necessarily play all of a game in a linear way. If I have time for gaming (limited, as yours is) I decide what I want to pursue at that time. Sometimes I will go back to games after very long hiatuses and that's just fine as far as I am concerned. Sometimes I will stick to the same game for a good long while. It depends on so many factors, especially my mood.