Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Caterkiller on April 06, 2013, 12:08:22 AM
It's all we can do and all we ever did.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: broodwars on April 06, 2013, 12:21:50 AM
Miyamoto & Co. have been asking us to give the Wii U "some time" for going on 2 years now, because "people just don't understand the Wii U yet" or some such excuse. It's getting old, especially in light of how much Nintendo's competitors seem to have their act together right now. At some point, they're going to have to hold up their end of the bargain and release some games for the thing, as well as ensuring that other companies release games for the thing. So far that hasn't been the case, but we'll see what comes of E3.
Right now, my Wii U isn't even hooked up right now and I never have a reason to even consider thinking about it in light of all the games the other consoles and handhelds are getting right now. The longer Nintendo takes to release worthwhile software on the thing, the harder it will be to convince a multiconsole owner like myself to care about the next "big" thing coming out for Wii U. Time isn't something Nintendo has the luxury of begging for, so E3 had better be ****ing amazing this year.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Phil on April 06, 2013, 12:32:25 AM
I'd say the one-two punch of LEGO City and Monster Hunter are well worth hooking it back up, unless you have no interest in those genres/series.
I know with LEGO City I've had 55 hours with it, and soon I'll be getting MH3U to enjoy. Sorry you're not finding the system as enjoyable. :/
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: broodwars on April 06, 2013, 12:36:17 AM
I'd say the one-two punch of LEGO City and Monster Hunter are well worth hooking it back up, unless you have no interest in those genres/series.
Well, don't get me started on Monster Hunter. I've mocked that series enough elsewhere, & I feel I've said all I need to say about it. I don't generally have an interest in the LEGO games, but I do have LEGO City and it's...ok. I found the open world rather weak and progression oddly grind-based. As a result, I haven't felt compelled to go back to it in a while, especially in light of better games elsewhere, but it's a solid "B" title (much like the rest of the "better" titles on Wii U). However, Nintendo needs big name, system-selling "A" titles right now and so far all they'll say on that is "we need time!" Translation: "We diverted all our teams away from Wii U titles to save the 3DS and now we have nothing ready!"
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Pixelated Pixies on April 06, 2013, 02:18:14 AM
There are two consoles launching later this year. So unfortunately, I don't think Nintendo have a lot of time to work with here. I think we're rapidly reaching an inflection point where those people who have not yet bought a Wii U, but were open to the prospect of buying one, are now beginning to look at what Nintendo's system offers in comparison to it's soon to be competitors. Honestly? It's not a flattering comparison.
The Wii U doesn't need more time. It needs a shot in the arm. It needs a Mario Kart.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: ShyGuy on April 06, 2013, 02:37:06 AM
Miyamoto has a different concept of punctuality than some.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 06, 2013, 03:47:26 AM
There are two consoles launching later this year. So unfortunately, I don't think Nintendo have a lot of time to work with here. I think we're rapidly reaching an inflection point where those people who have not yet bought a Wii U, but were open to the prospect of buying one, are now beginning to look at what Nintendo's system offers in comparison to it's soon to be competitors. Honestly? It's not a flattering comparison.
Until they find out the next Xbox won't play used games and the PS4 is over $500. Then suddenly the Wii U looks a whole lot better.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Shorty McNostril on April 06, 2013, 07:13:55 AM
I never thought I would say this, but Nintendo has pretty much lost me as a customer. At least one who is willing to pay anything over a budget price for their products. I find it sad to say that pretty much anything available on Wii U is (or will be at some point) is also available on 360 or PC.
And to rub more salt into the wound, looks and performs just as well on a 7 (?) year old system. What possible reason do I have to pay Nintendo money for a system that does not give me any useful functionality that I don't already have? The only possible reason I can think of is first party titles.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 06, 2013, 07:28:02 AM
First party titles have been the primary reason to own Nintendo hardware (consoles, at least) for almost twenty years now. I'm not sure how you're only realizing that now.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Shorty McNostril on April 06, 2013, 07:54:26 AM
Oh I realize that. But aside from the Wii, they have not been the ONLY reason.
Miyamoto says give them time. I think it's far past that already.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: smallsharkbigbite on April 06, 2013, 08:17:03 AM
I get that Nintendo has done a poor job communicating that this is a different console. They shouldn't have used the Wii name. People at my work who have a Wii don't even know this console exists or how it is different than a standard Wii.
I get that it's disappointing that there hasn't been many games recently and Xbox/PS3 are getting exclusives. The next consoles from them are going to struggle as well. Those systems will have game lulls up front as well. And will probably struggle to get off the ground at the $400-$500 price points. I know Wii U sales have been historically bad, but I'm not convinced this isn't the new norm.
What I don't get is that Wii U, while not necessarily great support, has better 3rd party support than the Wii had. Batman, Deus Ex, Assassins Creed, Ninja Gaiden? These may be ports but they are great ports of great games. When sales pick up, it'll be hard for 3rd parties to ignore the Wii U. It's just the nature of the industry now that exclusives only come with moneyhats.
The Wii U has standard control scheme which was my big issue with the Wii. NSMBU was 10x better than NSMB Wii just for the fact that I could play it without motion controls.
Maybe I'm just older and have less time for video games, but I'm not that disappointed in the Wii U. The games I've played for it are top notch. It looks amazing. I'm not sure if the PS4/Xbox720 will have better physics engine, but once you're at 1080p there isn't much to be had on a graphical level. I won't own a 4k TV anytime soon so owning a 4k capable console isn't going to help me now.
It seems to me that the return of standard controls and HD Nintendo games are worth the price of admission to me. You know there will be more Mario 2D and 3D. You know there will be Zelda, Metroid, Mario Kart, other Nintendo games exclusive. If you still are a Nintendo fan after all this time, it seems to me like you shouldn't have expected what the last few consoles have not produced. That being the best 3rd party experience amongst the consoles. The games will come, they just aren't there now.
The Gamecube is one of my favorite consoles of all-time. The games were just fun on it. Their were some great 3rd party exclusives and the Nintendo games were excellent. It sold like crap, was a running jokeline, and missed most 3rd party games. So what? I just want to have fun and I can have that with the Wii U. It's a video game system, it's not the cure for cancer.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Ceric on April 06, 2013, 09:37:52 AM
Yeah Broodwars is a Monster Hunter hater just to be a hater of hater series. Its hip of him like counterculture hippies with hats and Bongos at a coffee club.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 06, 2013, 10:04:58 AM
Oh I realize that. But aside from the Wii, they have not been the ONLY reason.
I would actually argue that the Wii was the system where it was the least of a problem. It had far more worthwhile third party exclusives than the N64 or GameCube. Granted, that's not saying all that much, but I'd argue with your singling it out.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Caterkiller on April 06, 2013, 11:39:39 AM
I know hardware wasn't finalized for sometime but with the huge drop off in titles from 2011 and 2012 I completely expected something more by now. At the moment my U is getting used like crazy with Monster Hunter and Lego. They are both very satisfying games so I'm content for now.
The jump to HD and trying to surpass the visuals of Sony's and Mincosofts last machines could be playing a huge role. It just seems like a lot of time has passed in the last 3 years with very few major home console releases. I really believed we'd be playing Pikmin by now. Now I'm upset somewhat about all that but when it comes down to it, if they don't think the games are ready then I'm personally more than happy to wait. In this world of instant everything that just doesn't fly after nearly 5 months of being released.
Of course if Rayman was released in February like it was supposed to would people be complaining of no games period or just switch it over completely to no Nintendo games?
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: alegoicoe on April 06, 2013, 11:51:56 AM
Nintendo just needs to release some games, the Wii U is a very nice system with a lot of potential, but without games is just another machine sitting in peoples houses. Also, Nintendo needs to have a kickass E3 and show early and future adopters reasons to hold on to their systems and not look towards other systems for gaming needs.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Retro Deckades on April 06, 2013, 12:06:08 PM
There are two consoles launching later this year. So unfortunately, I don't think Nintendo have a lot of time to work with here. I think we're rapidly reaching an inflection point where those people who have not yet bought a Wii U, but were open to the prospect of buying one, are now beginning to look at what Nintendo's system offers in comparison to it's soon to be competitors. Honestly? It's not a flattering comparison.
Until they find out the next Xbox won't play used games and the PS4 is over $500. Then suddenly the Wii U looks a whole lot better.
I agree, Luigi dude. So many people seem to be putting all of this faith into these future unreleased systems from Sony and Microsoft, when there is no telling how they will actually function or be priced. Neither Sony or Microsoft have spotless records, and it seems to me that people seem to forget that when discussing Nintendo's mistakes (and vice versa).
Personally, I won't have any problem waiting for new forthcoming games because there are many titles being released on the Wii U that I haven't played before. I'm currently playing through NFS: MWU, then I'm moving onto Batman: Arkham City, Darksiders II, and then Deus Ex: Human Revolution. I'm also someone who will play through a game until completion (usually 20 - 40 hours), so I don't find myself buying a new game every week. I hope that those who say they don't have enough games to play on the Wii U are at least giving different kinds of games a chance. However, if they are only waiting for Nintendo-developed games to play, then they shouldn't be surprised since Nintendo usually only releases one or two games per quarter on a given system anyway, no?
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Pixelated Pixies on April 06, 2013, 08:38:22 PM
Sometimes I hate Nintendo fans so much.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: rlse9 on April 06, 2013, 08:53:55 PM
Nintendo can have all the time it wants to make the Wii U a great system with a great library of games. Take all of the time they need. But until they get to that point, I'm going to hold off on buying one. And the problem is, I think that's how most people are looking at it.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: pokepal148 on April 06, 2013, 09:30:08 PM
There are two consoles launching later this year. So unfortunately, I don't think Nintendo have a lot of time to work with here. I think we're rapidly reaching an inflection point where those people who have not yet bought a Wii U, but were open to the prospect of buying one, are now beginning to look at what Nintendo's system offers in comparison to it's soon to be competitors. Honestly? It's not a flattering comparison.
The Wii U doesn't need more time. It needs a shot in the arm. It needs a Mario Kart.
what we know of the PS4's processor isn't that pretty either, an 8 core processor that, if it's as stock as we have been lead to believe, will get its ass kicked by an i5 from early 2009. the Wii U architecture(as stock) dates to 2008 i believe so the comparison isn't that big(and the Gamecube has shown us how much specs add to preformance(they don't)), the Wii U,(or the PS4,) may have some suprises for us, this next gen will be about running in native 1080p(at 30fps most likely), something the Wii U has proven itself with, the deciding factor for the Wii U being next gen is a game like watchdogs, is it closer to the version launching with the PS4 or are we looking at the 360 version with a touch screen...
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: RABicle on April 08, 2013, 08:07:33 AM
especially in light of how much Nintendo's competitors seem to have their act together right now.
HAHAHAHAHA. Man this is as funny as the time you said Sony should make a kickstarter for Lara Croft in Sony Allstars
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Adrock on April 08, 2013, 09:51:45 AM
It's interesting that Miyamoto once again mentioned Wii U not needing to be the center of entertainment. I get it even if it's misguided. I haven't really been playing games on my PS3 either, but it's my DVD/Blu Ray player therefore it's always plugged in (and Netflix is better on PS3 because I can't turn off the GamePad when watching on my TV unless that has changed). That could have been the Wii U for the past few months. I'd be more inclined to dick around Miiverse or play some games if I was already using the console. Out of sight, out of mind.
And while I know Miyamoto is specifically talking about the GamePad here, I think people would be far more patient with Wii U if Nintendo didn't bungle almost everything about the console thus far. He talks about making the console "more stable" over the next few months. Why was that even a problem? The egregious updates, long load times, lack of TVii at launch are forgivable even if they should have been avoided to begin with. Nintendo is just getting around to fixing the first two some five to six months after launch. Continuing to tell people to pay $25 for a first party LAN adapter when building it into the console would have cost Nintendo a handful of lint makes me feel like they just don't get it at times.
I saw a white Wii right next to a white Wii U for the first time on Saturday and I had to do a double take. I've had a Wii since December 2006 and a Wii U since launch and I still almost confused the two. I still maintain that this and the name won't be problems in the long-run, but again, they should have been avoided. It's like Nintendo saw a road full of potholes and said, "**** it," then slammed on the gas pedal. It's not that Nintendo is in a heap of trouble because once they start actually showing their games, most of us will have to wipe the drool from our chins. However, for Nintendo to ask everyone to be patient when they've done everything to make everyone skeptical about the console as a whole is, what's the word I'm looking for? Sad? Ridiculous? Bullshit? Pick one. They seem so unprepared and they really shouldn't be. I can buy that we haven't seen a fraction of the GamePad's potential, but for everything else, get your damn act together.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: broodwars on April 08, 2013, 11:16:32 AM
Man this is as funny as the time you said Sony should make a kickstarter for Lara Croft in Sony Allstars
Yeah, you get back to me when you actually know what you're talking about. I'll know that Hell has frozen over.
I asked a hypothetical question on Twitter if people would be willing to fund some sort of Kickstarter effort to get some of those 3rd party characters into PSASBR (Cloud Strife, Crash Bandicoot, etc.), considering folks' main complaint w/ the game was those characters' exclusion. I didn't say Sony should do it. I didn't say they were going to do it. I didn't say the 3rd parties would agree to it. I was just interested in gauging interest.
But hey, that's what happens when I try to talk calmly and logically to someone like you. And that's why I blocked you on my Twitter feed after you spammed me with idiotic insults. Pity I can't do the same with you here.
Now that that bit of derailment is DONE, I'll put up the on-topic reply...
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: broodwars on April 08, 2013, 11:32:27 AM
especially in light of how much Nintendo's competitors seem to have their act together right now.
HAHAHAHAHA.
Yeah, that's right. Sony has their act together. The PS3 continually sells at least double if not 3-4x what the Wii U sells every month, 3rd parties aren't reluctant to actually release software on the PS3, and there has been a great deal of positive buzz (especially among the Indie community) for the upcoming PS4. And while the PS4's social features don't appeal to me and we had an entire NFR episode where I criticized the hell out of their February reveal (and their handling of the Vita), there does seem to be excitement for what the device offers.
Then there's Microsoft. The 360 is the best-selling console every month in recent memory (typically 4-5 times what the Wii U sells), and although the Kinect has only ever properly worked in the Dance Central games, it has maintained public interest in the 360. Microsoft didn't "win" this last console generation in terms of console sales, but they sure seemed to win it in terms of software and public perception. They are THE platform for the most popular series released every year in many people's eyes, especially if there's online multiplayer. The rumors about the Durango aren't promising and Microsoft seems to be chasing the Indies away right now, but right now they have THE dominant games platform by a wide margin.
Then there's Nintendo. You all know how badly Nintendo has ****ed-up the Wii U so far: almost no 3rd party support, no big console-selling games since launch, no consumer confidence, and extremely poor console sales every single month this year. As for the console itself, it barely works right now and is well-known for crashing, leading to twoSTILL-upcoming firmware updates this year to try to fix it. The 3DS and Wii U are still largely separate entities, especially when it comes to their eShops. We're going to be spoon-fed fee-locked updates to a portion of Virtual Console games we've already purchased, with Nintendo completely silent on their handling of new VC titles once the service officially launches. There is next to no excitement for the thing, and no one wants to make new games for it right now outside of a handful of ports and LEGO City.
So yeah, I have said and I will say that Nintendo's competitors have their act together right now, and Nintendo does not in any way; shape; or form when it comes to the Wii U.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Adrock on April 08, 2013, 11:47:43 AM
I think Sony and Microsoft have their act more together than Nintendo currently as long as we're talking about PS3/360. None of them have gotten it right, just less wrong. The comparison also isn't especially fair considering how much longer both consoles have been on the market than Wii U. What Sony announced and Microsoft is rumored to be announcing soon makes me terribly skeptical of both PS4 and Durango. Even with Wii U's current issues, it's still (currently) the least shitty choice to me compared to PS4/Durango.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Ceric on April 08, 2013, 01:42:43 PM
360 is THE console only here in the States. I'm fairly sure without having to go check the numbers that over all the PS3 is the stronger of the two because of Europe and Japan, neither really like the XBox brand.
I do think Sony is handling the PS4 much better then all the recent Hardware launches at this Stage. We'll see if that changes the second half of the year.
As for the Wii U... As I've said before even the video of the Improved load times are too slow because I can boot into Windows 8 from a cold start in the same amount of time. The Friends system while better is really limited if you want to you know actually interact with your friends. I wanted to play with Caterkiller on MonHun and he's in Local Mode; We're Friends, I can see him online, but I have no good way to communicate to him that I would like to hunt together. Generic Blue light blinks for anything. We're even in the same game but, it should matter.
I do have to say though, I haven't gotten a hard lock in the last few months.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: TJ Spyke on April 08, 2013, 01:56:47 PM
Actually, in Europe it depends on the country. For example, the Xbox 360 easily kicks PS3's butt in the UK (the biggest and most influential market in Europe).
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Ian Sane on April 08, 2013, 02:26:03 PM
What really keeps me from buying the Wii U is the Wii itself. I found that to be an incredibly disappointing system to own and it felt like Nintendo didn't even want me as a customer, like they were focusing on my parents or my girlfriend and either didn't want my business or just felt that because I had supported them before they could take me for granted. The Wii U just looks like more Wii and I hate the Wii so until the Wii U demonstrates itself to not be another Wii I'm not buying it.
It looks to me like a PS3 being released a year before the PS4 comes out with the DS's control scheme, which the DS did a fantastic job of demonstrating as a dumb useless marketing gimmick for rubes. I figure the touch screen will just be a annoyance when it I'm forced to use it, like with DS games that forced its usage, and aside from that it's just Nintendo being a generation behind AGAIN. And the games out thus far is the same sort of casual focused Mii title I hated on the Wii and an NSMB, which I'm sure is fun and all but won't offer me anything new enough to justify a new system for. NSMB Wii and my old Super Mario All-Stars + Super Mario World cartridge already fill my 2D Mario void.
I think what really did in the Gamecube was that after the N64 Nintendo needed to demonstrate that things were going to be different this time... and they didn't. If anything they played specifically into their detractors' hands. It's like they didn't realize that the N64 was largely seen in a negative light and they needed to respond to that. Casuals liked the Wii (thought NO ONE liked how Nintendo abandoned it for its last two years) but a big chunk of the core gaming market did not. If Nintendo was even remotely interested in that audience they needed to demonstrate that things would be different and they didn't. The second it was called the Wii U and they put attention on some gimmick controller they lost anyone that didn't like the Wii. At the very least there was no way this was going to break out of the Wii's image as a casual system or one that third parties see as not worth supporting.
Sometimes you have to subtlety admit you were wrong and position your next product as getting back on track (think of Microsoft's ad campaign for Windows 7 which more or less acknowledged that Vista sucked). You don't have to say "we fucked up" but just show that the same problems and mistakes are not being repeated. Nintendo acted like the N64's cartridge **** up and losing all the third party support was no big deal and have just kept on going like they're perfect the whole time. Of the three consoles they have released since then, none of them have really suggested that Nintendo has made mistakes and frankly I truly think that they have not learned a damn thing as they constantly **** up routine stuff. Like, internally, I don't think Nintendo admits to any fault of responsibility whatsoever. Realistically you should go into a new console analyzing what you did right and wrong so as to improve the product. I don't see that. Hell the Wii's whole attitude was like how the gaming market was just super mean to innocent Nintendo and the whole situation is hopeless so let's focus on casuals.
For this upcoming gen the PS4 is the only one that has not outright scared me away yet, but I'm not particularly optimistic about it either. The Wii U is "no buy" until I see a different Nintendo but I figure the system is stuck in last gen hardware anyway which pretty much fucks it. Nintendo will probably have to can it quickly and replace it to set things right. The Xbox 720 is a "no buy" if it's always online. Frankly Nintendo has been such a key part of my videogame experience that without them, there isn't much point. I like third party games but as a compliment to the Nintendo releases, not a replacement. Last gen felt to me like a Nintendo-less videogame market and it sucked. I'll probably just go retro as there are tons of old games I've never put much time into. I don't need to buy a current videogame system so no one will win by default.
I seriously think the Wii U is fucked as it sure as hell isn't for core gamers and casuals are now on smartphones. But then I thought the DS was fucked, and based on how things were like the first year that prediction made tons of sense, but it really managed to turn things around. So we'll see if Nintendo gets out of this one. Third party support is really important because game development just takes too long these days. You can't just hammer out some game in a few months to fill a gap. Ironically the time period when you could do that, Nintendo didn't have to because their third party support was awesome.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Stogi on April 08, 2013, 06:39:00 PM
How quickly things turn sour on this forum where there is nothing to play. I wonder if Retro can single handily shut everyone the **** up.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: pokepal148 on April 08, 2013, 07:14:11 PM
i would like to analyze the following statement made by forum user Ian Sane
What really keeps me from buying the Wii U is the Wii itself. I found that to be an incredibly disappointing system to own and it felt like Nintendo didn't even want me as a customer, like they were focusing on my parents or my girlfriend and either didn't want my business or just felt that because I had supported them before they could take me for granted. The Wii U just looks like more Wii and I hate the Wii so until the Wii U demonstrates itself to not be another Wii I'm not buying it.
thats a fair assertion(a bit harsh) but you really should keep an open mind on this... has the Wii U ever been marketed towards grandma at this point, the only casual game nintendo has announced is wii fit.
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It looks to me like a PS3 being released a year before the PS4 comes out with the DS's control scheme, which the DS did a fantastic job of demonstrating as a dumb useless marketing gimmick for rubes.
And i think we can all disregard Ian's statement after this ignorance/closemindedness on the DS but i'm going to continue to analyze it... i will say i don't recall the DS coming out with (clicking)dual analog and a set of triggers
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and aside from that it's just Nintendo being a generation behind AGAIN.
Honestly while the Wii U's components date to 2008, the anounced specs for the 720, if they are as 'off the shelf' as they claim, will, as PC gamers will love to quote, get their asses kicked by an i5 processer from january of 2009... is sony a generation behind now?
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And the games out thus far is the same sort of casual focused Mii title I hated on the Wii and an NSMB, which I'm sure is fun and all but won't offer me anything new enough to justify a new system for.
gee, thank you for your open-mindedness, and i'm going to say this now nintendo land is about as much of a minigame collection as Kirby Super Star
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For this upcoming gen the PS4 is the only one that has not outright scared me away yet, but I'm not particularly optimistic about it either.
you've already stated that a touchscreen is a gimmick, to me it seems like without the functionality of a second screen a touchpad would be even more of a "dumb useless marketing gimmick for rubes." so given we have already established Sony is "a gen behind" why would you choose them
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I think what really did in the Gamecube was that after the N64 Nintendo needed to demonstrate that things were going to be different this time... and they didn't. If anything they played specifically into their detractors' hands. It's like they didn't realize that the N64 was largely seen in a negative light and they needed to respond to that. Casuals liked the Wii (thought NO ONE liked how Nintendo abandoned it for its last two years) but a big chunk of the core gaming market did not. If Nintendo was even remotely interested in that audience they needed to demonstrate that things would be different and they didn't. The second it was called the Wii U and they put attention on some gimmick controller they lost anyone that didn't like the Wii. At the very least there was no way this was going to break out of the Wii's image as a casual system or one that third parties see as not worth supporting.
Sometimes you have to subtlety admit you were wrong and position your next product as getting back on track (think of Microsoft's ad campaign for Windows 7 which more or less acknowledged that Vista sucked). You don't have to say "we fucked up" but just show that the same problems and mistakes are not being repeated. Nintendo acted like the N64's cartridge **** up and losing all the third party support was no big deal and have just kept on going like they're perfect the whole time. Of the three consoles they have released since then, none of them have really suggested that Nintendo has made mistakes and frankly I truly think that they have not learned a damn thing as they constantly **** up routine stuff. Like, internally, I don't think Nintendo admits to any fault of responsibility whatsoever. Realistically you should go into a new console analyzing what you did right and wrong so as to improve the product. I don't see that. Hell the Wii's whole attitude was like how the gaming market was just super mean to innocent Nintendo and the whole situation is hopeless so let's focus on casuals.
thank you for your wonderful history lesson here,
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Of the three consoles they have released since then, none of them have really suggested that Nintendo has made mistakes
so nintendo hasnt made any mistakes
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I seriously think the Wii U is fucked as it sure as hell isn't for core gamers
you have not justified that belief... please enlighten me
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and casuals are now on smartphones. But then I thought the DS was fucked, and based on how things were like the first year that prediction made tons of sense, but it really managed to turn things around. So we'll see if Nintendo gets out of this one. Third party support is really important because game development just takes too long these days. You can't just hammer out some game in a few months to fill a gap. Ironically the time period when you could do that, Nintendo didn't have to because their third party support was awesome.
And how do you propose getting third party support? no matter what you say you have to remember, you can lead a horse to the river but you can't make him drink from it
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: alegoicoe on April 08, 2013, 08:00:33 PM
I think Sony and Microsoft have their act more together than Nintendo currently as long as we're talking about PS3/360. None of them have gotten it right, just less wrong. The comparison also isn't especially fair considering how much longer both consoles have been on the market than Wii U. What Sony announced and Microsoft is rumored to be announcing soon makes me terribly skeptical of both PS4 and Durango. Even with Wii U's current issues, it's still (currently) the least shitty choice to me compared to PS4/Durango.
But let's not forget that it took Sony almost three years and tons of money poured into marketing for the system to pick up sales and establish a strong software library. Let's not forget also the countless firmware upgrades the PS3 has had since launch, improving the system little by little the same as Microsoft with the 360, so I wouldn't say that Nintendo is doomed. True they had a terrible launch followed by a software drought that should end once September comes by, until then there is nothing based on the track record of the other systems that tells me the Wii U is going to fail or that it had the worst system launch in recent history. If I remember correctly the only good game the PS3 had in the first few months after launch was Resistance, other than that everything else was garbage.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Adrock on April 08, 2013, 08:16:49 PM
How quickly things turn sour on this forum where there is nothing to play.
Games, specifically those made by Nintendo, are the entire reason this forum and others like it exist. No games, no discussion. How else would you expect people to react?
I think Sony and Microsoft have their act more together than Nintendo currently as long as we're talking about PS3/360. None of them have gotten it right, just less wrong. The comparison also isn't especially fair considering how much longer both consoles have been on the market than Wii U. What Sony announced and Microsoft is rumored to be announcing soon makes me terribly skeptical of both PS4 and Durango. Even with Wii U's current issues, it's still (currently) the least shitty choice to me compared to PS4/Durango.
But let's not forget that it took Sony almost three years and tons of money poured into marketing for the system to pick up sales and establish a strong software library. Let's not forget also the countless firmware upgrades the PS3 has had since launch, improving the system little by little the same as Microsoft with the 360, so I wouldn't say that Nintendo is doomed. True they had a terrible launch followed by a software drought that should end once September comes by, until then there is nothing based on the track record of the other systems that tells me the Wii U is going to fail or that it had the worst system launch in recent history. If I remember correctly the only good game the PS3 had in the first few months after launch was Resistance, other than that everything else was garbage.
I'm confused. You quoted me, but did you read all of it? Specifically:
The comparison also isn't especially fair considering how much longer both consoles have been on the market than Wii U.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: alegoicoe on April 08, 2013, 08:56:27 PM
I am referring to launch similarities and why it is a mistake to judge Wii U based on its weak launch, when the other two systems had similar launch problems.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Ian Sane on April 09, 2013, 02:50:28 PM
I am referring to launch similarities and why it is a mistake to judge Wii U based on its weak launch, when the other two systems had similar launch problems.
What comparison is the market making though? Does the average guy on the street take into account historical launches when he sees the Wii U or does he just see that it has very few games compared to the PS3 and Xbox 360? Now every new system has that but it comes along with a new generation. When the Playstation launched it wasn't getting compared to the Super Nintendo because it was clear that this was a new generation. But has Nintendo made it clear that they've started a new generation? The Wii U looks more comparable to the current generation. I'm not even sure exactly what consoles Nintendo intended the Wii U to compete with and I follow Nintendo news. I think it looks too much like Nintendo finally released an HD console and it has a mere fraction of the games the other HD consoles have, and it's fighting against rumours and whispers (and in the PS4's case, outright announcements) about new Sony and Microsoft consoles that will replace the PS360 and presumably other products of the same generation.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: pokepal148 on April 09, 2013, 04:42:54 PM
I am referring to launch similarities and why it is a mistake to judge Wii U based on its weak launch, when the other two systems had similar launch problems.
it looks too much like Nintendo finally released an HD console and it has a mere fraction of the games the other HD consoles have, and it's fighting against rumours and whispers (and in the PS4's case, outright announcements)
You mean like the announcement that the PS4 is using a CPU based on the Jaguar processor that was pretty much designed for !@#$*&% cellphones... those ones ;) ;) at least the Wii U uses real PC components...
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: lolmonade on April 09, 2013, 08:38:08 PM
Most gamers are being patient, by not purchasing a Wii U until there are enough compelling titles to justify purchasing a console. It's really the hardcore Nintendo fans that they're poisoning the well with by taking their sweet time on releasing 1st party games.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Adrock on April 09, 2013, 10:46:16 PM
It's good and bad. I bought a Wii U at launch which I only regret because of the ZombiU bundle. I'd rather Nintendo take their time on releasing games until they're ready. If Nintendo stopped doing that, I'd consider giving up on video games. They already launched a console before it was ready which is disconcerting, but releasing actual games in that manner is a different story. I don't want to be a gamer anymore if Nintendo adopts a "just release it, we'll patch it later" attitude.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: BranDonk Kong on April 09, 2013, 11:43:02 PM
Still it would be nice if third parties would release games on Wii U...period. Although, I have no time to play games so I wouldn't buy any right now anyway.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: alegoicoe on April 10, 2013, 12:14:34 AM
I am referring to launch similarities and why it is a mistake to judge Wii U based on its weak launch, when the other two systems had similar launch problems.
What comparison is the market making though? Does the average guy on the street take into account historical launches when he sees the Wii U or does he just see that it has very few games compared to the PS3 and Xbox 360? Now every new system has that but it comes along with a new generation. When the Playstation launched it wasn't getting compared to the Super Nintendo because it was clear that this was a new generation. But has Nintendo made it clear that they've started a new generation? The Wii U looks more comparable to the current generation. I'm not even sure exactly what consoles Nintendo intended the Wii U to compete with and I follow Nintendo news. I think it looks too much like Nintendo finally released an HD console and it has a mere fraction of the games the other HD consoles have, and it's fighting against rumours and whispers (and in the PS4's case, outright announcements) about new Sony and Microsoft consoles that will replace the PS360 and presumably other products of the same generation.
You make a fair point, but i think Nintendo can capitalize on the launch struggles of both coming consoles are going to have in order to gather momentum and at least move some unts past 10 mil. That would surely help them and boost software production. In the end its just a matter of how well Nintendo manages the situation, if they rectify their flaws as well as they did with the 3ds, then WiiU might just have a chance to prove the market wrong.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Evan_B on April 10, 2013, 12:30:20 AM
I swear, it's like I seriously WANT to post in these forums, but broodwars and his constant, highly-opinionated railing on Nintendo prevent me from doing so.
In the end, the fanbase needs to understand that they are a single, individual entity in the massive collection of people who like Nintendo for a bunch of different reasons, and the best thing that they can do in order to get the "Nintendo experience" they long for is by supporting their hardware and software. I understand that not all titles are for everyone, but again, we're not at a period in time where a variety of games is something we can ask for, or demand, of the company. If you think there's no excuse for this, you obviously have no knowledge of the development cycles that we're currently going through (and even if you feel that "Nintendo brought it upon themselves", look at how they've handled previous consoles) and that there's not much of an understanding of the current industry. No company, and very few developers, are actually doing well. If you want to own quality games from developers, you sure as hell better support them now or you won't see much of them in the future. While the Wii U isn't selling well right now and hardly has any games, we are at a point where people bash on Nintendo because it's the easiest thing to- because we're pre-E3 and Nintendo is very discreet at this point.
And if you find nothing appealing from the current selection of games, surprise- you're in the minority. Software releases are based on popular trends and the "good old fashioned" view of Nintendo, or video games in general, is no longer the popular opinion- because this is a consumerist market and companies are developing for what trends are popular. So however badly you want Nintendo to return to their roots, or whatever- it's probably not going to happen, because the market is ever-changing. Video game enthusiasts seem to have very little understanding of this, because they're generally a group of entitled pricks- us included. And while it's all fine and well to be so, just think of how influential these few people are in the majority the market is trying to reach.
Whoooooooooosh.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: broodwars on April 10, 2013, 04:29:41 AM
I swear, it's like I seriously WANT to post in these forums, but broodwars and his constant, highly-opinionated railing on Nintendo prevent me from doing so.
"Constant?" Aside from a handful of forum threads, I'm usually content to just lurk on the forums these days. It's so much more entertaining just watching the rest of you kill each other over something stupid. But hey, it's all part of the service if it makes you learn to think for yourself and stand up for your own opinion. ;)
And if you find nothing appealing from the current selection of games, surprise- you're in the minority.
Actually, considering how poor the Wii U's sales have been month after month, I'd say you're in the minority if you find the current selection of Wii U games appealing. That's not opinion. That's a completely prove-able fact based on the Wii U's market penetration and software sales compared to its competitors'.
Quote
Software releases are based on popular trends and the "good old fashioned" view of Nintendo, or video games in general, is no longer the popular opinion- because this is a consumerist market and companies are developing for what trends are popular.
While I would certainly say that was the case with the Wii, if the Wii U was truly capitalizing on a popular trend it probably would be selling much better than it actually has. Instead, it seems to be capitalizing on a trend that very few people buying game systems really seem to give a **** about, at least without a compelling software library to go with it. *shrugs*
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: bustin98 on April 10, 2013, 01:25:23 PM
Actually, considering how poor the Wii U's sales have been month after month, I'd say you're in the minority if you find the current selection of Wii U games appealing. That's not opinion. That's a completely prove-able fact based on the Wii U's market penetration and software sales compared to its competitors'.
No, it's conjecture. It could be insufficient funds. It could be a lack of education on available games, or the lack of knowledge on features of the games that are available.
That said, Nintendo should have had their **** together when they launched the WiiU. "Give it time" shouldn't be an excuse to fall back on.
Title: Re: Shigeru Miyamoto asks the gaming public and media to give the Wii U some time
Post by: Ian Sane on April 10, 2013, 02:09:15 PM
In the end, the fanbase needs to understand that they are a single, individual entity in the massive collection of people who like Nintendo for a bunch of different reasons, and the best thing that they can do in order to get the "Nintendo experience" they long for is by supporting their hardware and software.
See I think it can go both ways. During the Gamecube years I supported Nintendo very loyally and wanted them to succeed, even despite their numerous annoying screw-ups, because I felt that their approach to game design was the best and I wanted them to have enough standing in the industry so that they would have good influence on the industry as a whole. We had just had a bunch of kids getting raised on the Playstation that thought Nintendo was just for babies. Some of those kids were going to make the games of tomorrow and videogames would be worse off if they were ignorant of Nintendo.
But I don't care for the current "Nintendo experience" so I am specifically NOT supporting the Wii U to voice my displeasure. I now have the opposite view of Nintendo where I see them as a bad influence that I don't want the developers of tomorrow to learn bad habbits from. The Wii U's poor sales are how I feel things ought to be as I always saw the Wii as an overachieving fad that succeeded on the ignorance of casuals and non-gamers.
Support with your dollar that which you feel is worth supporting. If you feels like an obligation, then it probably isn't worth supporting. A Nintendo I want to support and encourage is one that would make a console I would immediately WANT to buy. I could live with a Nintendo console that is slim on games around launch if those games were ones I felt I had to play and were the sort of games I wished to encourage the creation of. But that is not the case so they don't get my money. I will reward Nintendo for that which deserves rewarding. I would not expect Nintendo to be perfect but I just have a minimum expectation and Nintendo has to be above it.
