Post by: Webmalfunction on January 25, 2013, 07:19:50 PM
Alex anti-hypes the heck out of the new Yoshi game.
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/blog/33146
During the recent Nintendo Direct, when the new Yoshi game was announced, there was some rejoicing. Some people were insanely happy that Good-Feel wanted to take on a Yoshi's Story follow-up, while another, significantly smaller camp was disgusted that the Yoshi series was being handled by a group that has already proven incapable. I am in the latter.
I guess the largest issue is that the studio making this game is the same one that developed Kirby's Epic Yarn on the Wii a few years back. Despite the game’s (then-) creative art style and excellent music, its difficulty was insanely low and static (yes, even counting collectibles). And when style is taken out of the equation, the game as a platformer just isn't creative or high quality. The vehicle segments ranged from OK to not very fun, and the boss fights were a yawn. Moreover, should the new Yoshi game be developed in a similar style (and it already includes those gems), I can promise that what we're going to get is another blatant case of style over substance (and a potential rehash, for that matter).
And yes, Takashi Tezuka is taking some kind of reins on the project, but I wouldn't get my hopes too high. While there is always a chance he could “Miyamoto” it and improve (well, not always) or change direction as he sees fit, he could instead pull a Tarantino, having his name attached as producer while only doing basic consulting. Furthermore, even though he was the director of Yoshi's Island, he also produced the most disappointing follow-up to a game ever, which is also the basis of this game.
Oh, yeah. And as I've touched on, I reckon there won't be anything here for Yoshi's Island fans. No Baby Mario, and no crayon art style. Instead, this game is almost assuredly both a follow-up to Yoshi's Story and the apparently established Yarn franchise.
The reason why I'm upset, though, is that Nintendo seems to be ruining everything the original Yoshi's Island did right. While easy, at least the boss fights were creative, it was possible to lose, the platforming was masterfully designed, and the difficulty actually existed for those who wanted it. If this game turns out how everyone expects it to, I fear it will be years before we actually get a proper Yoshi game.
Post by: ShyGuy on January 25, 2013, 07:30:17 PM
Doomed
iPad
99 cents
Third Party
Narrative
edit:
Click Bait
Inflammatory
Post by: Ian Sane on January 25, 2013, 08:00:33 PM
I have long ago given up on Yoshi and Star Fox (and probably Metroid now, unfortunately) so I don't really care what Good Feel does with this. It isn't like I'm expecting some great modern take on Yoshi's Island. What I don't like is the resuing of the yarn look. This just reaks of a company not getting it. Everyone liked the style of Epic Yarn because it looked so unique and original. Their response to that "so we'll make MORE yarn games"? Any points you earned for creativity are taken away when you decide to take your interesting visual gimmick and apply it to everything. First Kirby, now Yoshi, is Wario or Donkey Kong next? Is this going to be Good Feel's thing; taking a Nintendo IP and putting it in yarn graphics?
It was never the yarn graphics. If that's what Good Feel thinks then they're idiots that fluked out and if Nintendo thinks that they're fuddy-duddies that are missing the point. It was that Epic Yarn had a creative and different look that mattered. The uniqueness was the selling factor not the specifics of yarn graphics. I don't trust the game will be all that great simply because "we should make ALL our games look like yarn" is such a DUMB and misguided conclusion to come to. Good videogame minds would never come to such a conclusion so those that came to that conclusion would likely not be capable of delivering anything truly interesting.
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 25, 2013, 08:10:54 PM
Post by: lolmonade on January 25, 2013, 08:30:48 PM
Yoshi games have always seemed to been open to a lot of experimentation and varying play styles. I'd temper your anger and disappointment and wait for more details before declaring it DOA to you just because it follows a similar art style to Kirby's Epic Yarn.
Edit: Within 2 minutes of posting this, I get smited. Someone's touchy. The fact is there are a lot of logical leaps being taken in this article with very little information to go off of. Kirby's Epic Yarn isn't the only game Good-Feel has made, and I don't see any reason to believe why everyone should assume they are a one-trick pony.
Nintendo
Doomed
iPad
99 cents
Third Party
Narrative
edit:
Click Bait
Inflammatory
I'm inclined to agree with you.
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 25, 2013, 08:36:06 PM
Post by: Caterkiller on January 25, 2013, 08:37:58 PM
I'm going claim that this game is extremely early and not intended to be shown yet but because of the leak they did anyway. In the actual video footage it looks like they took epic yarn and just added 2 characters, Yoshi and Shy guy. I'm betting the final game look more like Yoshis story and that pic that looks like Nintendo Lands Zelda.
Post by: Shaymin on January 25, 2013, 08:43:17 PM
Still, as someone who tried to ace most of the Epic Yarn levels he tried, they can shut up and take my money for Yoshi Yarn.
Post by: UncleBob on January 25, 2013, 08:52:36 PM
Post by: Pixelated Pixies on January 25, 2013, 09:27:50 PM
Post by: TJ Spyke on January 25, 2013, 09:28:35 PM
Am I the only one who doesn't like Yoshi's Island?
Yes
Post by: UncleBob on January 25, 2013, 09:36:53 PM
Am I the only one who doesn't like Yoshi's Island?
In spite of the fact that I own virtually every version of it, I've never been a huge fan of it. I wouldn't say I don't like it, but it's never managed to keep my attention for a full repeat playthrough.
Post by: MegaByte on January 25, 2013, 10:10:29 PM
Tezuka being involved is my main counter to the arguments made here. This isn't just Good Feel; they've got one of Nintendo's best guys working on it with them, a guy who was involved in the original Yoshi's Island.Tezuka was also listed as producer on Yoshi's Island DS, Yoshi Topsy Turvy, and tons of other games good and bad, so it will depend exactly what kind of involvement he has.
Post by: MegaByte on January 25, 2013, 10:13:28 PM
Ditto. It was a good game, but I don't think it deserves the praise it gets from a gameplay perspective.Am I the only one who doesn't like Yoshi's Island?
In spite of the fact that I own virtually every version of it, I've never been a huge fan of it. I wouldn't say I don't like it, but it's never managed to keep my attention for a full repeat playthrough.
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 25, 2013, 10:43:42 PM
Tezuka being involved is my main counter to the arguments made here. This isn't just Good Feel; they've got one of Nintendo's best guys working on it with them, a guy who was involved in the original Yoshi's Island.Tezuka was also listed as producer on Yoshi's Island DS, Yoshi Topsy Turvy, and tons of other games good and bad, so it will depend exactly what kind of involvement he has.
I doubt they'd make a big deal about his involvement in the Nintendo Direct if he weren't hands-on to at least some extent.
Post by: ResettisCousin on January 26, 2013, 12:05:48 AM
With that said, I was HUGELY disappointed to see that the new Yoshi game is... Yoshi's Epic Yarn. The ONLY way this could be saved is if each of the worlds feature a completely unique set of textiles so that you move from foam world to felt world, etc (maybe branch out and include construction paper world, fur world, who knows). But if Yoshi remains a yarn ball throughout, that seems less likely. And what was with them showing almost identical gameplay and animation of Yoshi's tongue vs KEY's whip? And what was with the gemstone beads in the opening sequence directly ripped from KEY? That looked so incredibly cheap. If we're lucky this was Nintendo being uncharacteristically desperate and showing pre-alpha concept footage far too rough to be seen by even the entire dev team let alone all the world.
Post by: azeke on January 26, 2013, 12:37:01 AM
This time around -- yarn isn't new and there is no music.
And what little they showed it looks like they're incredibly early in development. Like, they "didn't even chose the artstyle" early.
I really really hope we get a great game though.
Out of all new direct announcement it seems only Wii Party U and maybe X (Xenoblade was done more than two years ago, plenty of time) are arriving this year.
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 26, 2013, 12:41:17 AM
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 26, 2013, 06:07:19 AM
What I don't like is the resuing of the yarn look. This just reaks of a company not getting it. Everyone liked the style of Epic Yarn because it looked so unique and original. Their response to that "so we'll make MORE yarn games"? Any points you earned for creativity are taken away when you decide to take your interesting visual gimmick and apply it to everything. First Kirby, now Yoshi, is Wario or Donkey Kong next? Is this going to be Good Feel's thing; taking a Nintendo IP and putting it in yarn graphics?
Or it could be that there were things Good Feel wanted to do with Kirby's Epic Yarn but couldn't because the Wii wasn't powerful enough, so they want to do another game like it on the Wii U since it's powerful enough to do everything Good Feel originally envisioned. Then they'll move on to something different for the next game, similar to how Tokyo EAD made Galaxy 2 because they still had a lot of idea's left over from Galaxy 1 but then made something completely new with 3D Land after.
Here's a thought, why don't you wait til you know more about a game before declaring it an unoriginal rehash based on 10 seconds of early footage.
Post by: Adrock on January 26, 2013, 07:22:49 AM
Anyway, based on what I know of Kirby's Epic Yarn, what I think can "save" Yarn Yoshi is if Good Feel subverts people's expectations of it. Everyone thinks it'll be super easy; it should be really difficult. Everyone thinks the graphics are a rehash of Epic Yarn; Good Feel should make the levels progressively more experimental and abstract. They can do a lot with yarn art (google it). Unfortunately, the game looks just as basic as Epic Yarn. Boo/hiss
I remember seeing screenshots of Yoshi's Island and thinking that I wouldn't like it because the graphics looked like a kindergartener's scribbles (oh, to be 11 again) which is exactly what Nintendo wanted and it worked. The game used its art style to its advantage. That said, I don't think reusing the art style is inherently a problem. I don't think anyone would be complaining if Good Feel made a 2D Mario game with the look of Wario Land Shake It! so that's a double standard. Rather, the problem is I don't think Epic Yarn quite reached its potential in using the yarn art style (though it certainly used it in creative ways). Yarn Yoshi could however. Good Feel just has to really commit to it
Start by making it feel like a Yoshi game that has that art style. Epic Yarn axed Kirby's copy ability. It wasn't Kirby anymore. There has to be some fidelity and keeping Yoshi's main abilities is important. After that, all bets are off. Good Feel could make a game that really challenges people's thinking. I don't think it's going to happen, but it sure would be cool if it did.
Post by: smallsharkbigbite on January 26, 2013, 09:56:44 AM
Am I the only one who doesn't like Yoshi's Island?
In spite of the fact that I own virtually every version of it, I've never been a huge fan of it. I wouldn't say I don't like it, but it's never managed to keep my attention for a full repeat playthrough.
I like Yoshi's Island, but I don't think it deserves to be up there with SMB3/SMW or some of the other games that I would consider to be the best 2D platformers ever. So I've never understood that type of praise for the game.
Post by: broodwars on January 26, 2013, 10:16:36 AM
Post by: LudicrousDa3ve on January 26, 2013, 10:26:03 AM
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on January 26, 2013, 02:00:34 PM
But I shall defend to the death your right to say it, sir!
Excelsior!
Post by: VickiL on January 27, 2013, 09:00:28 AM
Post by: Pixelated Pixies on January 27, 2013, 09:26:45 AM
Maybe the beads are both your currency/score and also your projectiles. Perhaps instead of throwing eggs Yoshi can throw the beads you've collected. That would bring a certain balance to it, because by over using your projectile attack you would be minimising your potential score.
Just a thought.
Post by: Mop it up on January 27, 2013, 03:39:32 PM
Yoshi games have been few and far between, and besides the DS remake of Yoshi's Island, haven't the games been varied in their playstyle?Is Yoshi's Island DS really a remake? I thought it was a direct sequel in the same style, but I haven't really played enough to figure that out.
Post by: TJ Spyke on January 27, 2013, 04:44:41 PM
Post by: NWR_Neal on January 27, 2013, 07:34:15 PM
Alex, I disagree with everything you say here.
But I shall defend to the death your right to say it, sir!
Excelsior!
As someone who wrote the antithesis to his article above, I concur. You might call it linkbait, but Alex really hates the **** out of this game.
For me, Kirby's Epic Yarn was one of my favorite games the year it came out, and when pushes come to shove, probably one of my personal favorite Wii games. It might be easy, but it's freaking magical. It was a constant shot of happiness and joy for the 8-10 hours I spent with it.
I am eagerly anticipating Yarn Yoshi or whatever it will be called. In Good-Feel I trust.
Post by: Caterkiller on January 28, 2013, 02:36:36 AM
Alex, I disagree with everything you say here.
But I shall defend to the death your right to say it, sir!
Excelsior!
As someone who wrote the antithesis to his article above, I concur. You might call it linkbait, but Alex really hates the **** out of this game.
For me, Kirby's Epic Yarn was one of my favorite games the year it came out, and when pushes come to shove, probably one of my personal favorite Wii games. It might be easy, but it's freaking magical. It was a constant shot of happiness and joy for the 8-10 hours I spent with it.
I am eagerly anticipating Yarn Yoshi or whatever it will be called. In Good-Feel I trust.
Man I really got to finish that game.
Post by: Blick on January 28, 2013, 03:52:53 AM
[/size][/color]
[/size]So it was just like every Mario, Zelda, Pokemon, Star Fox, etc...[/color]
[/size][/color]
[/size]That's how Nintendo works. They only release super easy games for morons.[/color]
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 28, 2013, 04:52:25 AM
Post by: Ian Sane on January 28, 2013, 01:20:37 PM
Of course this is the forum where I found someone who dislikes Super Mario World, so nothing is universally liked.
Post by: Khushrenada on January 28, 2013, 01:55:38 PM
Am I the only one who doesn't like Yoshi's Island?
In spite of the fact that I own virtually every version of it, I've never been a huge fan of it. I wouldn't say I don't like it, but it's never managed to keep my attention for a full repeat playthrough.
I will say that I think some of the charm of that game has worn off. When it came out, it was an amazing game full of all sorts of new wonders. Bosses were common enemies grown to gigantic proportions, Touch Fuzzy Get Dizzy was amazing, being chased by a giant Chain Chomp devouring the level behind you. Even seeing Baby Bowser wanting to ride the Donkey was charming and fun. But for me that charm has worn off now.
When I received another copy of this game via the Ambassador program, I played it through and beat it 100% for maybe the 4th or 5th time and I felt to myself, that's it. I don't need to play this game again. It has sadly become a bit of a bore. I think it's a masterpeice of its time and if you haven't played it before, it's definitely worth a go around but over time a lot of what was original and new has been thrown into other games and nowadays, it just feels like I'm playing through some long/unending levels.
Also, I found this thread's title funny.
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 29, 2013, 01:46:57 AM
The actual game I found weirdly unfulfilling. A straight playthrough would be super easy, but I am OCD about collecting stuff (or used to be), and completing the levels 100% was a major chore, given how easily you can blow it by losing the stars. Playing the game the "right" way felt like there was way too much juggling/chance.
I actually prefer Yoshi's Story, based on the art/weirdness of that game. There's no reward for doing so, which is a major flaw, but getting straight melons in that game for all levels is extremely hard.
Post by: Caterkiller on January 29, 2013, 02:11:13 AM
I will say this though, replaying the game with a new file is a little difficult when all you want to do is run through every stage as fast as you can. The urge to collect in that game is hard to resist and if you do you end up with that yucky 30%.
Besides that though its just a joy to play through. Bouncing eggs off of walls, shooting enemies out the sky, tongue lashing horizontal and vertical, hovering and an amazing asortment of Shyguys and other enemies.
I guess I just want the collecting toned down a bit, exploding eggs and ricocheting eggs, the helecopter replaced with SMW/SSBB style wings, koopa shells that add abilities, and what ever other new and fresh things they want to do.
Oh yeah, this needs to be co-op as well.
Post by: TJ Spyke on January 29, 2013, 03:13:47 AM
Post by: lolmonade on January 29, 2013, 12:19:17 PM
It's a sequel, not a remake.
Wow. Just wow. It was like, 3 seconds of footage...Yoshi games have been few and far between, and besides the DS remake of Yoshi's Island, haven't the games been varied in their playstyle?Is Yoshi's Island DS really a remake? I thought it was a direct sequel in the same style, but I haven't really played enough to figure that out.
I stand corrected. Thanks for the clarification.
Regardless, I don't think there's enough information to go off of this game to just simply assume the gameplay will be painfully easy.
Post by: Nemo on January 29, 2013, 12:33:41 PM
Post by: Pixelated Pixies on January 29, 2013, 04:53:17 PM
Also, I've never really enjoyed playing as Yoshi (even in SMW). The trade off was never worth it for me. I'd much rather be more nimble, and Yoshi always felt like a weight around my ankles.
I do appreciate Yoshi's Island's approach to art design, which I feel holds up to this day, but I just don't get why it's so beloved by some people. I thought, in gameplay terms, it was a step backward from SMB3 and SMW.
Post by: Khushrenada on January 29, 2013, 05:04:34 PM
The actual game I found weirdly unfulfilling. A straight playthrough would be super easy, but I am OCD about collecting stuff (or used to be), and completing the levels 100% was a major chore, given how easily you can blow it by losing the stars. Playing the game the "right" way felt like there was way too much juggling/chance.
I'm the same way. When I'm playing I try to get the 100% the first time or if I'm close replay a level again to finish it off. However, I won't hold myself up on it forever either. If there were a bunch of items I couldn't find the first time, I'll come back and explore it more after beating the game.
Fortunately, a big help is the cards/items you can win including +10 or +20 stars in which case you don't have to worry about avoiding damage and just need to get the flowers and red coins. Then before hopping through the flower ring, use one of those cards and max out your stars getting you the 100%. And from the playing the game before, I know that if you can unlock the Match Game minigame, then all you have to do is play it and watch for the star cards and make sure to match them and bulk up on that either making the task easier.
Post by: Ian Sane on January 30, 2013, 01:00:26 PM
But I think of stuff like that as an optional bonus and it really only bugs me when it's mandatory. It all depends on how you feel about getting 100% in games.
Post by: Caterkiller on January 30, 2013, 01:30:50 PM
I never really played Yoshi's Island while being so preoccupied with getting 100% on each level. My first time playing it, my sole goal was to complete it and only afterwards did I go back to try to 100% it. I never have and, yeah, I'll admit the game is quite unrelenting in that regard.
But I think of stuff like that as an optional bonus and it really only bugs me when it's mandatory. It all depends on how you feel about getting 100% in games.
You never played the secret stages or the vs mode? Ian you gotta try those secret levels, they are super hard! Then the gba version added 8 more and they were just as relentless.
