Post by: S-U-P-E-R on April 23, 2003, 01:33:44 AM
Nintendo has revealed details and images of Mario Kart on the GameCube, which will be called Mario Kart: Double Dash.
The images reveal 16 characters riding in pairs on their karts. One character drives, and the other throws weapons. Characters include Mario, Luigi, Peach, Baby Mario, Baby Luigi, Yoshi, Birdo, Wario, Waluigi, Donkey Kong, Diddy Kong, Bowser, Bowser Jr., Koopa, and Paratroopa.
We'll have some more details shortly. In the meantime, eyeball what NOA has revealed.
Update: Famitsu says the game WILL work with a LAN adapter; 8 players can play!(with two GameCubes and two copies of the game)
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on April 23, 2003, 01:58:51 AM
I love the new karts! DK in a barrel!
Post by: JB on April 23, 2003, 02:11:39 AM
If the game supports LAN-play it will only be a matter of time before someone writes a program that enables you to play over the internet!!!!!!
Post by: mrcivic on April 23, 2003, 03:03:39 AM
I've stumbled upon some high-res version of the screens;
Direct linking to images is bandwidth theft and is prohibited on PGC Forums. -Bloodworth
Post by: joshnickerson on April 23, 2003, 03:22:00 AM
Oh yes.... HOLY SHNIKES!!!
Post by: Fammy2000 on April 23, 2003, 04:01:43 AM
Awesome, just wish it supported internet play out of the box (err, case, Cube, etc...)
Post by: Jdub03 on April 23, 2003, 04:20:57 AM
Post by: JB on April 23, 2003, 04:45:01 AM
Post by: DRJ on April 23, 2003, 04:45:26 AM
Oh well it does have wario and paratroppa. I like the idea of specialized weapons and co-op play.
I am glad that the did not add Sonic since it is Mario Kart and not Nintendo Kart.
Now for the important question: What is the release date. Dont say christmas 'cause I want it now. I can wait until July.... Maybe
Nintendo is getting a lot of momentum for their little cube. Mario Kart, FF:CC, F-Zero, Pikmin 2 this year and maybe another Mario, Zelda, Metroid, Pokemon RPG next year. Time to take back some serious market share from Sony, and forget about Microsoft, 'cause they're finished IMO.
If Nintendo keeps giving away free primo title with a cube purchase, nobody else can compete.
Post by: Illini4 on April 23, 2003, 06:03:54 AM
Post by: Ninja X on April 23, 2003, 06:05:03 AM
It'll be one of the best games of the year...
But I'm still disappointed that no official online will look likely considering the game has LAN play connected to it.
Post by: vudu on April 23, 2003, 06:10:07 AM
and even though they're not mario characters, i can't help but wish for a link/zelda kart. w00t.
Post by: Gamer1982 on April 23, 2003, 06:55:15 AM
Post by: Ian Sane on April 23, 2003, 07:11:49 AM
It's nice to see EAD is continuing their "give all of our Cube titles stupid names" trend. Double Dash?! It's not Mario Sunshine bad but it's still a pretty dorky name.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on April 23, 2003, 07:18:38 AM
What the hell do you expect out of MARIO characters in KARTS, anyway?
Super Mario Airborne Vehicular non-Kart Space Combat: Rogue Mushroom III, featuring the ability to exit your kart and gut the other guy's kart using your Jedi light saber?
Given time, GameSpy will come up with an internet/LAN tunnel for use with GameCube.
Post by: DRJ on April 23, 2003, 07:36:10 AM
Post by: Rambozo on April 23, 2003, 07:41:53 AM
Post by: Koopa Troopa on April 23, 2003, 07:51:04 AM
Post by: Radison on April 23, 2003, 07:53:53 AM
Post by: DDeath666 on April 23, 2003, 07:56:53 AM
Post by: sycomonkey on April 23, 2003, 08:58:18 AM
And any cooperative play, in anything, is almost alway good.
Post by: Ian Sane on April 23, 2003, 09:55:46 AM
How is not even having the option for online play a good idea? All of you who are against online don't seem to realize that online Mario Kart would merely be an option; you don't have to play it. Split screen and LAN multiplayer would still be in the game. Online multiplayer would just be another option. Many of you anti-online people have this idea that if Mario Kart went online then you would have to play with "stupid people who think they're 'l33t'". You DON'T so why can't those of us who do be given the option?
Post by: WuTangTurtle on April 23, 2003, 11:19:00 AM
First off lan is a great way to sell more systems, trusts me when younger people play this game they will practicly peer pressure all of their other friends to get it. For example, pokemon (system link) sole reason why GBC sold so well. Heck it worked for halo, I know like 2 friends that bought xbox cause they played halo at my friends lan party.
Also I remember PGC posting something about GameSpy being a current Nintendo developer or partner or whatever which means they are prolly getting GameSpy to set up all of nintendo's games for free just like nintendo said before about online plans.
Seems like thier plan is unrolling quite well.
Post by: joshnickerson on April 23, 2003, 11:42:19 AM
Post by: SirX-Wolf on April 23, 2003, 11:48:51 AM
Post by: Robageejammin on April 23, 2003, 12:30:15 PM
seriously, you ppl make me laugh sometimes
just wait until you hold the game in your hands. If you're having fun, then Kudos for Nintendo! They've done their job!Have FUN!
Post by: Artimus on April 23, 2003, 12:33:21 PM
Post by: "Sky" on April 23, 2003, 12:37:20 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: DDeath666
They held out, and made us wait for so long..........to show us the gayest idea i have seen since cell shading. I like the idea about the double seated karts, but the karts look stupid. Take the original kart, and make it extra wide so it fits two and then it would be the best game ever. But anyways, if you can play it on LAN, I'm pretty sure it will be online too.
Umm.. don't think that'll work considering most likely the person in the back seat can place items left or right, it'll be quite difficult to reach over the other driver
. Besides, making the Kart wider will affect the gameplay as the Karts will take up more area space. Doing it in the fashion that they did doesn't create that effect.I really like the changes they are making, and boy am I glad that they are changing the formula so that it doesn't feel exactly like Mario Kart 64.
Post by: couchmonkey on April 23, 2003, 12:44:58 PM
I have to admit that some of the new Karts do look pretty lame. I like the added personality, but I could really do without the stroller-kart and the shell-kart. But it's a small price to pay for the awesomeness that is Bowser's kart! I can't wait to drive that baby...
As for online, I do wish Nintendo had included an out of the box online option, but only because the average consumer would like it. Only nerds like us will go to the trouble of setting up our own online games and I can't afford to pay fees for online gaming anyway.
Post by: Kulock on April 23, 2003, 01:06:13 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Radison
Those larger pics are great. Thanks for posting them. The one thing I noticed is that it doesn't look like the pairings are set. For the most part, Mario drives and Luigi attacks. But in the last picture, Peach is riding behind Mario, and in another, Peach #2 rides with Luigi. (What's the other ditz's - I mean woman's - name? Daisy?) I wonder how that's going to work. It'd be strange if Mario drives and Bowser's on the back.
Yup. Quoting from Nintendo's E3 site:
Quote
so choose from Mario, Luigi, Peach, Baby Mario, (...), and pair them up any way you see fit.
Apparently they forgot to list Daisy too, despite the fact she's blatantly visible in the shots. (Interestingly, Peach has got her hair up in her Sunshine-style ponytail.)
I have to admit, this is a little weird-seeming so far. Definitely innovative, but what benefits will you get from choosing one partner over another? Do they automatically handle the weapons now, or can you tell them to shoot but they'll shoot how they see fit, or what? I also actually preferred more generic karts over these, they're a little too kitschy for my taste. Come to think of it, I wish this game didn't seem to be taking a few too many design cues from Sunshine. ^_^; If even Miyamoto said, "I'm going to take the next game in a different design direction than Sunshine," I kind of expected this to be more of a teaser towards Mario 128's style.
Wish they had still shocked us with online play, although LAN is a good start, I guess.
...Oh, hey, I didn't see this, and I don't think most of the people in this thread did either, from the way we're talking. The advantage to a partner is the special items they can use unique to themselves, and you can SWITCH RACERS at any time, which changes what items you have access to. Now I'm more interested...
Post by: Gamefreak on April 23, 2003, 01:39:45 PM
I don't like the karts...except bowser's...but who cares. Looks fun as heck. I'd still prefer Super Mario 64/World looks over Sunshine crap...
Also, water racing would be cool too. Like the hovercraft in Diddy Kong Racing. Same as ground, but with different physics of course....and water weapons!
Post by: couchmonkey on April 23, 2003, 01:46:28 PM
Donkey Kong riding a barrel? Koopas riding a shell? Did Nintendo think for more than 10 seconds in designing these? I think the themes fit well with their characters, but it seems like Nintendo did the bare minimum amount of work to take the ideas and turn them into cars. The shell kart really is just a bunch of shells, I think it would be nice if they had taken the shell theme and matched it up with a cool car design. Mario and Bowser's vehicles look great, partly because they look like they might actually work as real kart designs. As it is, the "theme" karts are a little too heavy on theme and a little too light on kart.
I really hate spelling cart with a k.
Post by: DDeath666 on April 23, 2003, 04:02:58 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: couchmonkey
With respsect to the different karts (I'm obsessed with them!) I would have liked to see more of an attempt to reconcile the designs with "real" go-cart designs. In other words...
Donkey Kong riding a barrel? Koopas riding a shell? Did Nintendo think for more than 10 seconds in designing these? I think the themes fit well with their characters, but it seems like Nintendo did the bare minimum amount of work to take the ideas and turn them into cars. The shell kart really is just a bunch of shells, I think it would be nice if they had taken the shell theme and matched it up with a cool car design.q]
I'm glad that I'm not the only one that feels that way, its not Mario Kart without a real go-karts
Post by: oSiRiS on April 23, 2003, 04:34:53 PM
Every old franchise on Gamecube has sucked except Metroid Prime.
Sorely disappointed.
Post by: "Sky" on April 23, 2003, 05:00:48 PM
The troll part is so on the mark
Post by: oSiRiS on April 23, 2003, 05:08:11 PM
Post by: oSiRiS on April 23, 2003, 05:09:29 PM
{edited for content}
Post by: VideoGamerJ on April 23, 2003, 07:37:02 PM
1. There has been no confirmation that this game is NOT online, so don't get all crabby saying Nintendo is stupid, yadda, yadda, yah.
2. There is only a couple of pictures, how does this rule out so much for you guys. Example, just because you don't see Sonic, doesn't mean he's not in the game. Example, you DON'T know when this game is coming out or if a lot of things will change. I am sure if there is SO much negitive influence on the style of the karts, they'll reconsider it, depending on how far along the development is.
3. All you grumpy people need to take a nap, E3 is coming, Mario Kart pictures have been released, be happy, not angry. *Almost* everything happens for a good reason (at least when it comes to Miyamoto and his crew ^_^).
Post by: Bloodworth on April 23, 2003, 08:13:23 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: oSiRiS
But it's not really the kiddy style that gets me either, it's the crappy kiddy style. Monkey Ball is of course, the ... game in my library, but also my favorite.
I'd seriously like to know what Mario Kart games you thought you were playing before. The only differences graphically so far are that there are more creative shells over the karts (plastic molding doesn't keep it from being a go-kart) and there's a Super Mario Sunshine themed track. Go back and play Mario Kart 64 again and try telling me it was mature with all the voices and stuff. Mario Kart was never cool, it was just so fun that most of the self-conscious people stopped caring when they picked up the controller.
Post by: "Sky" on April 23, 2003, 08:38:53 PM
I think the problem is that some people are against change. Zelda doesn't have a "crappy" style. It's style is "unique" and "different". I mean, think about this: the only Nintendo franchise that hasn't gotten backlash thus far was F-Zero, and even though I believe it will still turn out great and do the series justice, it also at the same time doesn't seem to do anything to ADVANCE the series gameplay wise. Nor does it seem any different than the same-old just for new consoles. I'm not against F-Zero GC at all BTW, I'm just using it as a point.
Now we have Zelda, which got complained for having a new style. Now with Mario Kart having some new features to keep the series "fresh", "unique", and "new" and then we have people complaining about it. Makes me wonder where this industry and its audience is heading.
If the direction of video games is going the way of games not distinguishing themselves anymore and being "unique" then it would indeed be very disappointing. I want changes, and I'm sure others do too. If you are against change then I think you have to perhaps understand that there's a certain concept called "creativity" that happens to be a vital part of something called "art" that does indeed play a part in this industry.
Post by: GoldShadow1 on April 23, 2003, 09:27:39 PM
Yeah, I saw it. Two people in a kart. Is that the big secret? Sure, it might be a bit fun, but I was hoping for something really amazing, even though I had no idea what it could be. Mario Kart has yet to change or evolve as much as Mario or Zelda over the years. The graphics aren't great, either. I just don't see what people are getting so excited about.
Post by: nu_world on April 23, 2003, 10:13:31 PM
graphically, it looks only slightly better than an N64 game (Diddy Kong Racing is indeed a good comparison)
a dissapointment after the E3 demo we saw a little while back, which looked very nice
I'm also not liking the new karts. they look silly, predictable, and appear as if they handle very differently (they also sit much higher).
What I want to know, is the pair up compulsary? I'm hoping for some kind of "classic" mode, with only the driver.
and what's with some of the characters? baby luigi? koopa troopa (yay!) AND paratroopa? daisy? birdo? surely the likes of toad should have come first.
And what about info on battle mode? surely that's the most important!
Post by: Ocarina Blue on April 23, 2003, 10:37:39 PM
Post by: Mingesium on April 23, 2003, 11:04:45 PM
I think that the two characters changes a lot to Mario Kart. If you have a team with koopa troopa and bowser, you can use koopa troopa where there is a lot of turns and then switch over to bowser to get max speed on the straight aways. Also, each character has their own items which adds more to the strategy.
Post by: Gamer1982 on April 24, 2003, 01:24:17 AM
Post by: Kulock on April 24, 2003, 06:04:50 AM
Post by: "Sky" on April 24, 2003, 06:08:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Ocarina Blue
It looks good........... but how on earth will the single player work?
Umm... the same way it has in the past? You control both characters you know and it isn't even confirmed that two players will control one kart. The game will play the same as always only that the second character is added in for more strategy w/ the usage of character exclusive items.
And since I know people will probably overlook this (they have in the past)... I'll just repeat...
ONE PERSON CONTROLS BOTH CHARACTERS ON THE KART!
Quote
Originally posted by: nu_world
I'm personally not overly impressed
graphically, it looks only slightly better than an N64 game (Diddy Kong Racing is indeed a good comparison)
a dissapointment after the E3 demo we saw a little while back, which looked very nice
I'm also not liking the new karts. they look silly, predictable, and appear as if they handle very differently (they also sit much higher).
I really would like to have that super damn good looking N64 game
And the E3 demo was placed against a black background w/ no AI and only two characters in movement. Not a fair comparison.
To me the new karts look more homely to each character. And seriously... predictable? Wouldn't the old karts be far more predictable? I mean these new karts came as a complete surprise no?
And you seem to remind me of someone who was bashing Eternal Darkness and saying that he can tell that the person was struggling with the controls for the game, your claim on the controls seem just as absurd although perhaps moreso since you are basing it off of screenshots rather than videos.
Quote
Originally posted by: Gamer1982
How cool would it be if you could knock the second played OUT of the competitors Kart and hijack that kart! Now we're talking strategy and fun!!!
This isn't Grand Theft Mario
When Gran Turismo starts letting you jump out of your car and hijack an opponents car then I'll think about your idea being plausible
Post by: Gamer1982 on April 24, 2003, 06:58:50 AM
Quote
This isn't Grand Theft Mario
When Gran Turismo starts letting you jump out of your car and hijack an opponents car then I'll think about your idea being plausible
Gran Turismo is realistic...Mario Kart most certainly isn't. I think it would be really cool to hop Karts mid race. Not the first player, but the person attached to the back.
Post by: Robageejammin on April 24, 2003, 08:25:51 AM
Post by: couchmonkey on April 24, 2003, 11:38:50 AM
But it's true that the game will be fun anyway. I still like most of the new karts better than generic ones and I have absolutely no problem with the game's "kiddie" style. No matter how the game looks it will still be the best kart racer available. I can't wait to play it!
Post by: vudu on April 24, 2003, 12:13:55 PM
Quote
I'm also not liking the new karts. they look silly, predictable, and appear as if they handle very differently (they also sit much higher).
...um...anyone care to tell me how you can judge how a vehicle handles by looking at a few screen shots? if they released a video, maybe.... but you can't tell from a picture how something moves.
Post by: thepoga on April 24, 2003, 01:54:39 PM
MARIO KART IS THE BEST! NST PLEASE MAKE THIS ONE GOOD!
Post by: Kulock on April 24, 2003, 07:27:12 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kulock
Hm, it looks like the whole E3 site, including the Mario Kart section, was taken down or moved to an unknown location. I'm getting a 404 now for several different URLs provided at PGC. (...)
I'd edit my post, but you can't really do that in Talkback. I saw it does work again, but it was in fact down for a period of time earlier today for whatever reason. Just so I don't seem like a COMPLETE idiot... ;P
Couchmonkey does have a point about the karts sitting much higher than before (actually, at varying heights, thanks to the "quirky design"). I know, I know, it's "Nintendo quirky", but while having themed tracks might be cute, themed karts could get tiresome, especially since you'll be seeing them _all the time_. You get tired of a level, you don't play it for a while. But if you like racing with two specific racers, both of which have karts you hate (I assume you can pick which one you use the kart from, probably depending on who you pick first), you're kind of stuck.
Post by: "Sky" on April 24, 2003, 08:02:21 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: KulockQuote
Originally posted by: Kulock
Couchmonkey does have a point about the karts sitting much higher than before (actually, at varying heights, thanks to the "quirky design"). I know, I know, it's "Nintendo quirky", but while having themed tracks might be cute, themed karts could get tiresome, especially since you'll be seeing them _all the time_. You get tired of a level, you don't play it for a while. But if you like racing with two specific racers, both of which have karts you hate (I assume you can pick which one you use the kart from, probably depending on who you pick first), you're kind of stuck.
I'm sick and tired of having the same old karts all the time, and I can't switch characters to change it either
BTW, that's not true. But just wanted to make a statementQuote
Originally posted by: Gamer1982
Gran Turismo is realistic...Mario Kart most certainly isn't. I think it would be really cool to hop Karts mid race. Not the first player, but the person attached to the back.
Very well then... when Need for Speed allows you to hijack opponents cars then
Post by: oSiRiS on April 25, 2003, 12:18:28 PM
Also, regarding it not being 'bad' but 'new' and 'different'...
I'm all for new and different games. But I'd also like straight updates of my favorite franchises. I'd rather they leave the innovation to brand new franchises instead of screwing around with old franchises.
Post by: Locke Cole on April 25, 2003, 05:09:50 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: oSiRiS
I'm mostly complaining about the kart design style. The designs of old were cool, these are stupid.
Also, regarding it not being 'bad' but 'new' and 'different'...
I'm all for new and different games. But I'd also like straight updates of my favorite franchises. I'd rather they leave the innovation to brand new franchises instead of screwing around with old franchises.
So basically your saying that they should never mess around with anything. That means Mario should be in 2d still right? Metroid should stay side scrolling as well. If they don't innovate any games it gets boring and reptitve. You might as well just keep the older game. The kart designs are better, but that's my opinion. I'm also glad that you can change drivers at anytime. Might be some strategy in that....
Post by: "Sky" on April 25, 2003, 09:35:28 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: oSiRiS
I'm mostly complaining about the kart design style. The designs of old were cool, these are stupid.
Also, regarding it not being 'bad' but 'new' and 'different'...
I'm all for new and different games. But I'd also like straight updates of my favorite franchises. I'd rather they leave the innovation to brand new franchises instead of screwing around with old franchises.
In other words... Zelda should stay bird eyes view, Mario should stay 2D, Super Mario Bros. 3 and Super Mario World shouldn't have had the world map concept, Metroid should stay 2D side scrolling, Metal Gear should stay bird eyes view rather than 3D, Rayman should stay 2D, Doom shouldn't incorporate mission styles in Doom III and rather should continue the "find key, look for exit" tradition, Warcraft shouldn't have included the concept of "heroes", "RPS" strategy, or even sea battles of Warcraft II, Dragon Quest shouldn't have included the class system, Final Fantasy should've just stayed with choosing a set character class and playing him through the whole game, Mortal Kombat shouldn't have included the combo and fighting style systems, Dead or Alive shouldn't have included the concept of tag-teams, A Link to the Past shouldn't have included the concept of Light and Dark world, Ocarina of Time shouldn't have had time traveling, and of course many more but I think I've sad more than a mouth full already.
Post by: VideoGamerJ on April 25, 2003, 09:47:17 PM
Post by: WuTangTurtle on April 26, 2003, 12:57:50 PM
Great post man, just brilliant
Post by: Kulock on April 28, 2003, 06:03:24 AM
Quote
I'm mostly complaining about the kart design style. The designs of old were cool, these are stupid.
Now unless the karts are ALSO going to have specific, themed powers (which would be an even further rip from Wacky Races), but the minute you say "concept," "mechanic," or "system," there's no way you can compare the two. It's purely an artistic design question.
Post by: Kulock on April 28, 2003, 06:49:58 AM
At any rate, though, I still think he has some point. (I also think something like the jump from 2D to 3D is semi-excluded from this, that was kind of a given phase that game makers would experiment by putting things from the character's perspective now that it was far easier to do.) Not entirely, mind you, but there is some point.
I've got to say it, I know I'll be jumped for it, but maybe with the exception of Melee (and, post-dating, F-Zero), Nintendo hasn't really put out a GC sequel to a series that doesn't have SOME odd twist to it. It's strange that for all these franchises, not one of them has really had a traditional update yet. I mean, let's do a quick roll-call (this is observational, whether or not you agree with these choices is opinion). Luigi's Mansion, that's a given. Star Fox Adventures, Nintendo basically brow-beat Rare into altering Dinosaur Planet, an original adventure title into using Starfox characters and some mini-Arwing missions. Metroid Prime, HUGE controversy about taking it to an "in the helmet" perspective. Super Mario Sunshine, FLUDD as a persistent element and setting it on a tropical island, specifically keeping some level "themes" away from the game. The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker, a dramatic stylization change compared to the last two multi-million selling N64 releases and teased GC style and an ocean overworld (Not to mention a plot difference to pretty much every other Zelda game that I can't really say without spoiling). And now, Mario Kart: Double Dash, with dual character play being a central theme. Nintendo seems to be so scared of getting tagged with a comment like "It's XX, except in 3D" or "It's XX but with prettier graphics" that they're throwing some strange twist into EVERY game we're clammoring for a sequel for. (Some to the point where a lot of gamers get shocked by it, step back and reevaluate how much they want that sequel, like for Metroid Prime or The Wind Waker.)
I'm not an overly negative person about Nintendo games, in fact, I'm often very positive and optimistic. The trouble is some people act like it's a crime to EVER be negative about a new aspect. If you don't like something and you say it on an open forum, you're an idiot flamer troll who just can't see the brilliance behind it. It's especially true when Miyamoto is involved with the game's development. A golden example is The Wind Waker's dramatic style shift. You were simply not allowed to nay-say this new design choice, you were automatically an idiot with a worthless opinion for even THINKING negative of it. Miyamoto is a human. He can and may have (depending on your view of the item in question) designed, decided, or given his approval to things that turned out poorly. I think he's a brilliant game designer, but that doesn't mean I don't think he's made a few major choices I personally thought were bad for a game. (I'm not talking smaller implementation designs, but grander, "Here's what the series will do this time around" choices.) It's not a crime to feel that way, nor to say that you do.
Personally, I'm interested in the dual-person setup of Double Dash, although I have questions as to how much it'll really add to the gameplay (if it really will change things around while being fun, or end up just splitting up the chores "between" two people who'll still act as one). But someone's allowed to say they don't like what they see so far.
Post by: highenergyboy on April 28, 2003, 08:42:40 AM
I fail to see anything wrong with the current kart designs they are implementing. To me they seem to add a certain personality to the drivers that the pedestrian go-karts in Mario Kart 64 didn't convey. Its not all that surprisingly that some people here would have a problem with driving a pink kart just like Luigi is seen doing in one of the screens. If you don't like it then fine, don't choose it then. No one is forcing you to.
I can tell you though it wouldn't bother me one bit. In fact I will probably choose that type of vehicle just because of all contraversy being generated right now. I have this tendency of liking what others wouldn't whether it be an indigo colored Gamecube or pop music (this is a biggie considering i'm a 20-year old male who should be listening to punk rock, heavy metal and other music of that type, but alas that just isn't the case).
