Community Forums => General Chat => Topic started by: Nile Boogie on March 20, 2008, 10:30:26 AM
Title: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Nile Boogie on March 20, 2008, 10:30:26 AM
In which order should we watch them?
OT first then the PT 4,5,6,1,2,3? or
PT first then the OT 1,2,3,4,5,6?
And before the haters come, WE ARE GOING TO WATCH ALL SIX MOVIES AND MAYBE EVEN THE CLONE WARS TOO.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on March 20, 2008, 10:46:57 AM
That depends. Does she already know all the big reveals, i.e. Jedi Master Yoda is the weird little green dude, Darth Vader is Luke's father, Luke and Leia are siblings? If she doesn't, then you should definitely watch the OT first so those moments maintain their impact.
Personally, I'm a fan of the order 4 5 1 2 3 6, which gets you started with a bang, takes you through most of the big reveals, then flashes back to how it started before ending on a high note.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Nile Boogie on March 20, 2008, 10:57:35 AM
I thought everybody knew the big reveals without seeing the movies. Maybe I should find out huh? I really liked episode III being the last one, greek tragedy feel and all. Seems to give hopelessness and hope all in the same movie.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Nick DiMola on March 20, 2008, 10:58:52 AM
Watch 4 5 6, and then watch 1 2 3 because she will hate them like the rest of us. Plus 1 2 3 ruin 4 5 6.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: RABicle on March 20, 2008, 11:03:43 AM
Yeah the whole, Vader being Luke's Dad would have no where near the effect if you saw 123 first. Also, little things like "I've got a bad feeling about this"
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: vudu on March 20, 2008, 12:04:32 PM
2 6 3 1 4 5
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 20, 2008, 02:06:03 PM
1 2 3 Clone Wars(Cartoon Network show) 4 5 6
That is the order we watched it in. Although some of your guys' reasoning isn't to bad.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 20, 2008, 03:19:11 PM
That is the order we watched it in. Although some of your guys' reasoning isn't to bad.
Wouldn't it make more sense to watch Clone Wars between 2 and 3, as the Clone Wars start at the end of 2 and end in 3? I would also argue that you should watch the movies in the order in which they were released.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 20, 2008, 03:32:25 PM
ah your right, got that backwards, insanolord is right.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 20, 2008, 07:40:18 PM
That depends. Does she already know all the big reveals, i.e. Jedi Master Yoda is the weird little green dude, Darth Vader is Luke's father, Luke and Leia are siblings? If she doesn't, then you should definitely watch the OT first so those moments maintain their impact.
Personally, I'm a fan of the order 4 5 1 2 3 6, which gets you started with a bang, takes you through most of the big reveals, then flashes back to how it started before ending on a high note.
Wow, that's a great idea, narratively. Only problem is that you're ending with the worst three movies.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 20, 2008, 09:30:35 PM
I never though of watching them in that order PartyBear. Hmmm.... and 6 is my favorite move to watch too!
But uh... which versions of 4, 5, 6 are you gonna watch? The theatrical release or the special editions where greedo shot first?
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 20, 2008, 09:30:57 PM
That depends. Does she already know all the big reveals, i.e. Jedi Master Yoda is the weird little green dude, Darth Vader is Luke's father, Luke and Leia are siblings? If she doesn't, then you should definitely watch the OT first so those moments maintain their impact.
Personally, I'm a fan of the order 4 5 1 2 3 6, which gets you started with a bang, takes you through most of the big reveals, then flashes back to how it started before ending on a high note.
Wow, that's a great idea, narratively. Only problem is that you're ending with the worst three movies.
Wait, you're saying that you think Phantom Menace is better than Return of the Jedi?
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 20, 2008, 09:57:56 PM
1 and 3 aren't that bad, 2 never happened.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 20, 2008, 10:27:00 PM
Wait, you're saying that you think Phantom Menace is better than Return of the Jedi?
not that I want to start an argument, debate, or a fight, but: yes.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: oohhboy on March 20, 2008, 11:12:00 PM
Definitely 456 123. Classic editions if you can manage over the special ones. Although this order will end the series with the bad movies, it will allow the originals full impact to be felt. The new movies simply aren't good enough to watch first as they trash the originals.
Ignore the other stuff for the time being. Go watch those if this experiment goes well. We damand reports.
P.S. Dude PM over ROTJ?!? Well you may have a point if you were to invoke the Ewoks. Still, ROTJ is a better movie overall.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 20, 2008, 11:16:30 PM
Lucas could make a new version of the movie with an Ewok piloting the Millenium Falcon in the Battle of Endor and it would still be 10 times the movie Phantom Menace was.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 20, 2008, 11:27:35 PM
I loved Phantom Menace, but not as much as I loved Empire and Revenge of the Sith.
I like to watch them in the numeric order, 1,2,3,4,5,and then 6, but when I am showing them to someone for the first time I do start with 4, 5, and 6. I just wish I could erase Attack of the Clones from my memory completely. It is the only one of the movies I hated. But for some reason all my Star Wars hating friends/family all liked 2 the most. Go figure.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 20, 2008, 11:40:54 PM
I LOVED the Ewoks! T_T When they took out the ewok ending and the ewok music, it was the saddest day in my life!!!
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Svevan on March 21, 2008, 12:17:15 AM
this says more about your taste than simply saying "RotJ is better than PM"
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on March 21, 2008, 12:23:00 AM
I loved ROTJ, in fact it is my favorite out of the first 3 films (though they are all great).
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 21, 2008, 12:26:15 AM
this says more about your taste than simply saying "RotJ is better than PM"
People who can't get over the fact that someone out there, in the galaxy, there's a race of pygmy fuzzy wuzzies, who are sentient, intelligent, and competent within their nature habitat... well, such people don't deserve to call themselves sci-fi fans.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 21, 2008, 12:37:38 AM
I had nothing against the Ewoks, I even watched the Ewok movies, the only thing I didn't like about Jedi was the conversation Luke had with Leia. It's funny every time I watch Pirates of the Caribbean 2, I always think of Return of the Jedi and it always makes me wish I was watching that instead.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 21, 2008, 12:45:52 AM
I loved ROTJ, in fact it is my favorite out of the first 3 films (though they are all great).
Return fo the Jedi is the best in the series for me. :)
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: oohhboy on March 21, 2008, 05:35:53 AM
I don't think there was anything inherently wrong with the Ewoks. It was just that they weren't used effectively. If Lucas was more willing to slaughter more of them to invoke how one sided the conflict was, it would have made a far more effective turnaround. It was so black and white. One moment the Ewoks are being killed, the next the stromtroopers are being hammered. There was no struggle. It just happens.
The space battle on the other hand was excellent, as was the light saber duel on the death star. There was no jedi light-saber kung fu. It was a contest of wills, not strength. No need to be flashy. That was saved for space.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: EasyCure on March 21, 2008, 09:54:26 AM
i have a confession to make. i dont love star wars
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Nick DiMola on March 21, 2008, 09:59:26 AM
i have a confession to make. i dont love star wars
Me either, however 4 5 6 are at least tolerable, unlike 1 2 3 which are just god awful.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: UncleBob on March 21, 2008, 11:32:24 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBM854BTGL0
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: EasyCure on March 21, 2008, 11:35:40 AM
maybe its still early but i thought there'd be a big uproar. I like the first (original) 3 films but i never got why people get so worked up about them the way they do. Maybe if i grew up and saw them in theatre's i'd feel differently but thats not the case, its just a really good sci-fi flick that i know was ahead of its time, but not THAT special (to me)
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: THE Princess on March 21, 2008, 12:30:28 PM
Aw that must mean she really loves you! :o
Because Star Wars sucks.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 21, 2008, 12:57:51 PM
I don't think there was anything inherently wrong with the Ewoks. It was just that they weren't used effectively. If Lucas was more willing to slaughter more of them to invoke how one sided the conflict was, it would have made a far more effective turnaround. It was so black and white. One moment the Ewoks are being killed, the next the stromtroopers are being hammered. There was no struggle. It just happens.
Slaughter MORE of them? What about that one scene where an explosion knocks two of them down, and the one who gets back up doesn't realize the other one is dead until he/she/it tries to roll him/she/it over? That scene was very painful to watch as a kid, and even now a little.
And then there's that ewok in the glider who's pitifully trying to drop rocks on AT-STS, is shot down, then stepped on by an AT-ST...
The space battle on the other hand was excellent, as was the light saber duel on the death star. There was no jedi light-saber kung fu. It was a contest of wills, not strength. No need to be flashy. That was saved for space.
Thank you. THANK YOU. God, Lightsaber battles were boring in the prequels. Not enough drama, not enough character, not enough emotive force in the fight. The lightsaber battles in the originals weren't about gee-whiz-fast, they were about ideological conflicts.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 21, 2008, 04:06:33 PM
AOTC was the love story, thats' the lame excuse they always give me, that and for some reason most girls I know had a thing for the homo who played the lead role.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 21, 2008, 04:29:48 PM
Dude, Haydyn Christensen is a competent Actor. Life as a House, Shattered Glass, good work from him. It's just that even if he wanted to, he couldn't do much with the role because Lucas wanted the role played that way.
So remember kids, if you're a whiny angstsy teenager, you'll grow up to be darth emo vader.
You knowm I used to think that I liked AOTC the most out of all the prequels, primarily because of the big war scenes and seeing the clones be like, totally awesome. I dug the military clashes in star wars, and AOTC seemed to deliver the most out of the three prequels... but now...eh. I don't really know. I am going to have to say that Phantom Menace was the best prequel simply because it's story didn't fall as flat as the other two. AOTC and ROTS just.... they just feel less interesting upon re-watching.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on March 21, 2008, 04:40:06 PM
I enjoyed ALL the Star Wars movies. The 3rd Prequel was my favorite and I thought Hayden improved 100% for that movie, he was terrible, IMO in AOTC.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 21, 2008, 04:45:40 PM
There's this one scene in ROTS where Haydyn Christensen is actually able to show that he can act. He's trapped within the role that Lucas has designated for Anakin throughout the movies, but to me, his breakdown and outburst on tatooine offers a glimpse of the energy that Christensen could've brought to the role, if there had been opportunity to.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 21, 2008, 04:57:57 PM
There's this one scene in ROTS where Haydyn Christensen is actually able to show that he can act. He's trapped within the role that Lucas has designated for Anakin throughout the movies, but to me, his breakdown and outburst on tatooine offers a glimpse of the energy that Christensen could've brought to the role, if there had been opportunity to.
I have heard that it is largly Lucas' tyranical directing that affects his actors.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: vudu on March 21, 2008, 05:03:53 PM
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 21, 2008, 05:10:49 PM
Yuck, I hated all those movies you listed. He did ok in Episode III, but was terrible in AOTC. He just looked, I don't mean to sound bad, but he looked gay. I admit his one scene on Tatooine, right before he slaughtered the Sand People, he had me convinced, but he killed it the next scene he was in with Padme. Maybe it's easier to blame Lucas, but I don't Harrison Ford was an excellent Han Solo and Lucas didn't even want him for the part.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 21, 2008, 06:02:21 PM
What? He was great in Shattered Glass! But... yeah. I don't... I have strong suspicions that Lucas' direction in particular made the prequels what they were, for better or worse. I totally get what he was going for, some mythic back story, but I also have to acknowledge that I don't think they come near what was achieved by other directors with the ESB and ROTJ.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: wandering on March 22, 2008, 01:52:30 AM
Start with the one about the whales.
Serious answer: Start with 4, 5, 6. The prequels would ruin a bunch of stuff about the originals (see: this article (http://web.archive.org/web/20051223004030/http://www.plinkomedia.com/showarticle.php?articleID=119).) Of course, you could turn that around, and say the originals would ruin a bunch of stuff about the prequels (imagine watching the prequels without having any idea what Anakin's going to turn into.) But...well...you can't ruin something that already sucks.
Dude, Haydyn Christensen is a competent Actor. Life as a House, Shattered Glass, good work from him. It's just that even if he wanted to, he couldn't do much with the role because Lucas wanted the role played that way.
Yeah, I wish people would stop saying Hayden Christiansen and Jake Lloyd are bad actors. Giving a good performance in a Lucas movie is nearly impossible. Just because extraordinarily talented people like Samuel L Jackson managed it doesn't mean others are bad because they didn't. Think about what the actors had to deal with:
1) Lots of green screen. It's hard to give a good performance when there's not much to play off of.
2) Lucas' horrendous dialogue. You try saying "I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough, unlike you." without sounding ridiculous.
3) Lucas' horrible direction. The guy just has no idea how to work with actors. In a behind-the-scenes documentary, I watched Lucas direct Christensen. "No, no," said Lucas. "Say the line more forcefully." And then Lucas gave an awful, over-the-top reading: "'I WILL NOT betray the republic.' Say it like that. I WILL NOT betray the republic." (He repeated the line a couple more times.) Gah. One of the cardinal rules of directing is never to demonstrate how you want an actor to say a line by saying it yourself.
4) Lucas' terrible taste. Let's say you're an actor in a Lucas movie, and, in spite of all the things conspiring to make you give a terrible performance, you manage to play a scene well 9 out of 10 times. Even then, you might be out of luck. Because Lucas doesn't know what good acting looks like, he might decide to put the one take where you gave a bad performance into the film.
So yeah. Don't assume someone is a bad actor just because he/she couldn't give a good performance in a Lucas film.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 22, 2008, 03:18:58 AM
I totally dig Lucas and respect his right as the creator of Star Wars and the movies. But I totally blame him as much as credit him for the results.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on March 22, 2008, 04:07:52 AM
::rolls eyes at Lucas bashing::
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 22, 2008, 05:12:43 AM
The man made Greedo shoot first. He deserves what's coming to him.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 22, 2008, 05:22:22 AM
So yeah. Don't assume someone is a bad actor just because he/she couldn't give a good performance in a Lucas film.
Is it safe to assume they have poor judgment just because he/she is in a Lucas film?
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 22, 2008, 11:13:56 AM
Hey I *love* George lucas and EVERY movie he has ever made, except American Graffiti, but that's besides the point.
Jennifer Connelly gave a pretty good performance in Labyrinth, um, I can't think of any good acting in Willow besides the Brownies, The Indiana Jones movies DID NOT suffer the same horrible acting and cheesy dialog as the Star Wars Prequels (of course the had Spielberg on board who is thousands times better than Lucas IMO) and let's see, Radioland Murders, well they had better actors all the way around and it didn't suck, (Even if the dialog was cheesy *that* was a comedy and you can forgive cheesy dialog and bad acting in a comedy)
The idea that the actors were bad *because* they were in a Lucas film, is ridiculous and tells me you haven't seen *ANY* other movies made by Lucas except Star Wars (and if you tell me Howard the Duck was any good were done talking)
Now Lucas wasn't always Director on all of those movies, so maybe that might have had something to do with it, but Star Wars, the original, was damn good and look what he had to work with.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: oohhboy on March 23, 2008, 12:17:50 AM
I believe that Lucas was effectively insane by the time the prequels came round. Driven mad by his own Ego. The fact that he financed those films himself gave him absolute total control. There wasn't anybody left to say No.
There is no doubt he was talented, as evidenced by his previous work but there has to be some one to say "STOP! That's stupid". Look at the PS3. Ken kicked up a storm of stupid quotes and ideas. The father of the Playstation.
The problem I had with the battle of Endor on the ground was that the turn around was so sudden. Chewbacca steals the AT-ST and suddenly everything is over for the stormtroopers. The troopers go from shooting up bears at an amusement park to OMG the soft toys are after me!!
Look at the space battle. The rebels are on the verge of blowing up the death star and they are still losing people. they only needed a couple more on screen Ewok deaths.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 23, 2008, 03:50:41 AM
Now Lucas wasn't always Director on all of those movies, so maybe that might have had something to do with it, but Star Wars, the original, was damn good and look what he had to work with.
Yeah. Lucas didn't direct either Empire Strikes back or Return of the Jedi. It's no coincidence that those movies are beloved.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on March 23, 2008, 04:10:59 AM
The way I see it, Star Wars is Lucas's world, it is his creation, it is his baby and to show an extreme lack of respect to the man is showing a lack of respect for his creation, especially over stupid childish stuff like "Oh noes, Greedo shot first!".
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: wandering on March 23, 2008, 04:31:24 AM
The way I see it, Star Wars is Lucas's world, it is his creation, it is his baby and to show an extreme lack of respect to the man is showing a lack of respect for his creation, especially over stupid childish stuff like "Oh noes, Greedo shot first!".
Err...so what if I don't respect Lucas or his creations? You talk as if Lucas's films were handed down by God and are therefore beyond reproach. What do you think Star Wars is, Shadow of the Colossus?
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on March 23, 2008, 04:33:42 AM
The way I see it, Star Wars is Lucas's world, it is his creation, it is his baby and to show an extreme lack of respect to the man is showing a lack of respect for his creation, especially over stupid childish stuff like "Oh noes, Greedo shot first!".
Err...so what if I don't respect Lucas or his creations? You talk as if Lucas's films were handed down by God and are therefore beyond reproach. What do you think Star Wars is, Shadow of the Colossus?
Well at least you'd be consistent if you dislike both. My point of contention is how people can be so disrespectful to a man who created a franchise they love. I may not like everything about his Star War films but I respect that it is his creation, not mine, and he can do what he wants to it. Now if someone else came in and took over, I"d be far more critical.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 23, 2008, 12:39:13 PM
I don't discredit him one bit, read my above post. But the truth is he subjected me to horrible acting and cheesy dialog that hurts my ears when I listen to it. Never mind how I come off on the forums, here I'm a joker, but Star Wars is serious business man.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 23, 2008, 02:42:41 PM
I don't know I can think of plenty of guys that have made me materials that I like that I think are douche bags in real life. Roger Waters of Pink Floyd for example is a douche bag, but he probably created and heavily influenced the best band ever, so I just don't care enough.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: animecyberrat on March 23, 2008, 03:38:54 PM
It's different with music.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Kairon on March 23, 2008, 04:40:56 PM
The way I see it, Star Wars is Lucas's world, it is his creation, it is his baby and to show an extreme lack of respect to the man is showing a lack of respect for his creation, especially over stupid childish stuff like "Oh noes, Greedo shot first!".
I respect the guy. Doesn't mean I have to like it though, &P.
Title: Re: So my Girl wants to watch Star Wars for the first time!
Post by: Ceric on March 24, 2008, 05:02:03 PM
