Post by: Smash_Brother on March 29, 2006, 05:34:23 PM
For the lazy, he loved it.
Also, this REALLY sparked my attention...
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Reggie Fils-Aime, executive vice president of sales and marketing for Nintendo of America, said he hopes to see another type of game really take off with the Revolution.
"I hope [massively multiplayer online games] are really explored on this system," he said. "That's a genre, from the home console standpoint, that really hasn't been explored very well."
I have to admit, I didn't see that coming. I wonder if Reggie was hinting at things to come...
Post by: Kairon on March 29, 2006, 05:42:31 PM
~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Post by: jasonditz on March 29, 2006, 05:42:52 PM
Post by: Kairon on March 29, 2006, 05:45:49 PM
~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Post by: Smash_Brother on March 29, 2006, 05:53:10 PM
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Originally posted by: Kairon
um...look at the date on that article?
Umm, look at the title where I said "(old article)"?
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He mentions MMOGs, not MMORPGS.
The difference being, what? Levels?
One way or another, I never expected Reggie to say anything like that. MMOs always seemed like a genre which Nintendo would never touch.
Maybe we'll be using our Revmotes to toss Pokeballs at some point in the future...
Post by: jasonditz on March 29, 2006, 06:27:33 PM
Post by: Smash_Brother on March 30, 2006, 10:50:02 AM
Though, I think holding down a button and then releasing it will be the extent of hurling items in most any game.
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 30, 2006, 11:21:13 AM
It would be a more generic term than MMORPG which indicates that the game will be mainly an RPG.
MMOG could be used to describe pretty much any online game which focuses on multiplayer interact over the internet.
It does bring the question up, what other types of MMOGs could there be besides the obvious RPGs?
Post by: Caliban on March 30, 2006, 02:56:21 PM
Post by: blackfootsteps on March 30, 2006, 04:01:42 PM
Post by: Smash_Brother on March 30, 2006, 04:48:27 PM
There's a MMORPG racing game coming out by NCSoft but it's still a MMORPG in the sense that you have a character with skills which can be increased over time put into the game.
Unless Nintendo has a new idea, I just can't think of any workable MMO concepts which aren't also RPGs
Personally, I'd love to see an F-Zero MMORPG. The universe is so ripe with possibilities: take a job to finance your car and race for glory.
Post by: wandering on March 30, 2006, 07:23:22 PM
Didn't work out, which is a shame, because I was really looking forward to it.
Post by: jasonditz on March 30, 2006, 07:54:17 PM
Post by: IceCold on March 30, 2006, 08:05:55 PM
Post by: vudu on March 31, 2006, 08:16:29 AM
QuoteI'd like to see a MMO remake of the Mario Bros acrade game (see below).
MMO 2D platformer
You could have just one big square room with 10,000 Marios running around at any given time.
Post by: Smash_Brother on March 31, 2006, 08:47:25 AM
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Originally posted by: wandering
Well, there was a mmo adventure game in development once. You know, the Myst one.
Didn't work out, which is a shame, because I was really looking forward to it.
I have a friend who's a huge Myst fan who beta-tested it and he loved the game.
Like I said, if Nintendo can make a genre other than RPGs work under the MMO concept, then the Rev TRULY has my interest piqued.
Post by: Renny on March 31, 2006, 02:24:29 PM
Post by: jasonditz on March 31, 2006, 02:50:49 PM
Post by: Pale on March 31, 2006, 03:23:39 PM
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 01, 2006, 08:36:37 PM
Post by: Kairon on April 01, 2006, 10:34:03 PM
~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 01, 2006, 11:26:02 PM
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Originally posted by: Kairon
I think a Pokemon MMO poses so many game design problems and opportunities for child endangerment and vulgar language being spout to 6-year olds that it should obviously not be made.
I think it amazing that you've managed to somehow flat out ignore all of the child-safing Nintendo has meticulously designed for its online games.
What's to stop friend codes from being used in MMORPGs like Pokemon? You swap friend codes with another player, then you can communicate with them just like in any other MMORPG.
Haven't swapped friend codes? Then you're relegated to a list of succinct phrases like, "Hello.", "Want to battle?", "Want to trade?", etc. Phantasy Star Online did this perfectly, even allowing language barriers to be crossed because when you selected "Hello", players across the world would see "Hello" in their own language.
Ever played an MMORPG like WoW or Lineage? Most players don't talk to each other anyway. With Pokemon's battle-heavy gameplay, socialization takes a serious backseat with the exception of the friends you want to level and battle with on a regular basis.
Or, as someone suggested, they could easily have a parental unlock which only allows players to communicate freely (say and hear) if the parental code has been unlocked.
Either way, it's perfectly feasible, child-safe, and would be a huge seller.
Post by: Pale on April 02, 2006, 08:32:47 AM
With toontown online, you can turn free chat on and off with a password... So parents would have that ability. If free chat is off, people can only communicate with you by forming sentences with a preset bank of words.
Either way though, Toontown is an example of a kid friendly MMO that was semi successful.
Post by: Garnee on April 02, 2006, 08:38:17 AM
Post by: wandering on April 02, 2006, 08:18:23 PM
Good to hear Reggie is interested in mmoes. mmo's. moos. mmos. Whenever he shows interest in something, that's usually code for 'that's in development, but I can't talk about or confirm that right now.' At least I think that's what that's code for.
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Does anyone else think of Chuck Norris when they hear "Chris Morris?" Nobody?
Of the 2 people in the interview, I don't think the interviewer was the one who could kick ass.
Post by: IceCold on April 02, 2006, 08:20:14 PM
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 03, 2006, 07:48:28 AM
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Originally posted by: wandering Whenever he shows interest in something, that's usually code for 'that's in development, but I can't talk about or confirm that right now.' At least I think that's what that's code for.
That's what ran up the red flag for me.
Reggie wouldn't mention it unless he knew that MMOs would indeed be explored at some point in the Rev's lifetime.
Post by: Kairon on April 03, 2006, 10:22:16 AM
And I did actually know of Toon town. It's just that Pokemon has gamers who are older and more hardcore as well, and they'd be outraged to be handicapped in an MMORPG to the extent that ToonTown handicaps you. I mean, you see all the hubbub they make over friend's codes and no voice chat, imagine that amplified through Pokemon's popularity, through the expectation of text chat, and through the genre of "RPG."
Although I will say that I didn't know you could unlock freechat in ToonTown. I thought the entire game was done through prearranged emotes and phrases! So thanks on enlightening me on that account.
BUT, there are still MANY other issues.
For instance, Pokemon is a PvP game. Can you imagine the sadistic griefers, ages 7 and up, who will ruin the experience for anyone they bully into a duel through vicious name calling? And Pokemon emphasized levels, it's not exactly a lowbie-friendly game. AND Pokemon would need an all new monetary system, the only way you earn money now is to beat the **** out of other hapless trainers who willingly fork over thousands of Pokedollars at the drop of a hat. AND Pokemon has never been a super-balanced game, they'd need to make huge advances on that area as well.
Up until now, Pokemon has been a one-player experience, shielding players from the essential inequality and brutality of the Pokemon world.
AND they'd need to have seamless interfaces, seamless experiences, and servers...
I'm sorry, but there are so many daunting aspects of a Pokemon MMORPG that I doubt it should be attempted at this point: it would prove to be a headache and a sales success but an online disaster.
~Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Post by: Strell on April 03, 2006, 10:31:22 AM
Unfortunately no one wants to take the responsibility, and subsequently charge game makers with endangering their children.
In all reality we should have full voice chat in all MMO games for the Rev, but some idiot will go into an uproar when little Jimmy starts telling a pedo he loves ice cream and would absolutely meet him for some.
I don't know if parents are lazy, don't udnerstand the technology, don't care for their children's well being, etc etc. I don't know the source of the problem. Doesn't change the fact that it is almost solely their fault. When I was a kid, I was told to never talk to strangers. When I went online in middle school, I hardly did chat rooms, and I was sure to never divulge any kind of personal information. I went by my online name only and didn't respond to anything else, never mentioned where I live, etc. And (if) when I have kids, I can damn sure bet they will know the rules and will not even begin to broach that sort of information.
It's a real shame gamers have to suffer for the actions of idiot parents with no clue.
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 03, 2006, 11:40:18 AM
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Originally posted by: Kairon
Actually, I don't really put stock in what Reggie says. He's a PR guy, he's from marketting, he's just there to say whatever gives Nintendo good PR and makes us feel good.
Just like how he suggested that adding Rev support to TP would be "truly magical" and then a few months later they announce Rev support for TP?
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And I did actually know of Toon town. It's just that Pokemon has gamers who are older and more hardcore as well, and they'd be outraged to be handicapped in an MMORPG to the extent that ToonTown handicaps you. I mean, you see all the hubbub they make over friend's codes and no voice chat, imagine that amplified through Pokemon's popularity, through the expectation of text chat, and through the genre of "RPG."
Then the parental control option would have to be in there to unlock full-blown chat, but I still wouldn't see it as an issue even if that option didn't exist. Pokemon isn't a social RPG, it's a battle RPG, and as such, battles are what truly make the game enjoyable, especially with other players.
The franchise could still work online with or without free chat.
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BUT, there are still MANY other issues.
For instance, Pokemon is a PvP game. Can you imagine the sadistic griefers, ages 7 and up, who will ruin the experience for anyone they bully into a duel through vicious name calling? And Pokemon emphasized levels, it's not exactly a lowbie-friendly game. AND Pokemon would need an all new monetary system, the only way you earn money now is to beat the **** out of other hapless trainers who willingly fork over thousands of Pokedollars at the drop of a hat. AND Pokemon has never been a super-balanced game, they'd need to make huge advances on that area as well.
So are you discounting Nintendo's ability to adapt a popular franchise to work in a MMO setting? If Blizzard can do it with Warcraft, I fail to see why Nintendo cannot do it with Pokemon.
I cannot imagine sadistic griefers because all of PvP in Pokemon is consensual. If communication is not permitted unless they've opened it up or used a friend code, then no name calling will ever happen. There could even be an option saying "_____ wants to speak to you. Will you talk to ____?" if name calling would truly be that bad.
A monetary system would be more than easy enough to do, as would balance to ensure players only fight other players around their same levels.
Seriously, do you think such simple alteration and game design is beyond HAL Labs or whichever dev would design the game?
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Up until now, Pokemon has been a one-player experience, shielding players from the essential inequality and brutality of the Pokemon world.
I absolutely have to hand it to you: I never thought I'd see the words "brutality" and "Pokemon" in the same sentence.
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AND they'd need to have seamless interfaces, seamless experiences, and servers...
I'm sorry, but there are so many daunting aspects of a Pokemon MMORPG that I doubt it should be attempted at this point: it would prove to be a headache and a sales success but an online disaster.
"Daunting" would be designing a console and controller which elevate gaming with a completely new and unique user interface and place it in the hands of people who would otherwise never DREAM of owning a console, yet Nintendo is tackling that task full-on.
THAT is daunting. Redesigning an existing franchise into a MMORPG is not.
Have you ever even PLAYED a MMORPG? The game concept itself is rather simple. It's not even something which I would consider to be a hurdle in Nintendo's development of a Pokemon MMO.
And as for popularity, a while back, I found an online web-based Pokemon game which was shoddy and horribly designed. It took me two hours of searching, google and all, before I stumbled across it by luck.
Keep in mind the game was terrible, using a click interface which didn't often work, and yet this craptacular little game had 180,000+ players.
If a silly PoS web-based Pokemon game which barely even works and is difficult to find can garner over 180,000 players, I'm quite confident that the real-deal running on a Nintendo platform on Wifi would be immensely popular.
Post by: Kairon on April 03, 2006, 12:08:00 PM
Smash, you're right. All those problems could be solved and text chat can be virtually crippled or not included at all. I'm just of the opinion that not only does Nintendo not want to set up persistant servers for an "MMO" type game, but that they don't have their resources allocated in such a direction. Not only do they have limited experience in RPGs, but the Pokemon team, GameFreaks and Creatures, is very small and not that technically ambitious.
Oh... In fact, you've given the best reason why a Pokemon MMORPG shouldn't be made: it isn't a social RPG at all, it's a battle one. Just give us player-matching and be done with it. Anything else is a waste of money and an unnecessary risk.
~Sallow
Philanthropist of The Black Cross
Lvl 60 Undead Warlock
Shadowsong (PvE)
Post by: jasonditz on April 03, 2006, 12:38:58 PM
You can solve the money issue the way a lot of games do: tradeskills. Make it possible to become a Pokeball manufacturer, a berry farmer, etc. maybe high level skilled Pokeball makers can make Pokeballs that have a better chance of catching wild pokemon.
I just dream of one day walking around a 3D first-person perspective world and seeing a Pidgey or a Zubat go flying past. The Pokemon world has a huge amount of characters and backstory to it at this point, there should be an all-immersive experience like that.
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 03, 2006, 12:56:23 PM
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Originally posted by: Kairon Smash, you're right. All those problems could be solved and text chat can be virtually crippled or not included at all. I'm just of the opinion that not only does Nintendo not want to set up persistant servers for an "MMO" type game, but that they don't have their resources allocated in such a direction. Not only do they have limited experience in RPGs, but the Pokemon team, GameFreaks and Creatures, is very small and not that technically ambitious.
I think they could hire the extra talent to build the MMORPG world (it's always what happens with designers).
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Oh... In fact, you've given the best reason why a Pokemon MMORPG shouldn't be made: it isn't a social RPG at all, it's a battle one. Just give us player-matching and be done with it. Anything else is a waste of money and an unnecessary risk.
That's fair, but I'm betting that a full immersive world to explore, teeming with Pokemon and trainers eager to rise in the ranks, would be a smash hit.
Truth be told, though, that's a question only market research could likely answer: would it be better to turn the Pokemon world into a full-scale MMORPG or would it be better to leave it as a matchmaking system?
I like the idea of a consistent world because the Pokemon games always reflected a world as such, with more than enough islands and the like that you could keep the world large and growing. I think it would be more popular than a simple matchmaking system, but we'll just have to wait and see what Nintendo decides to do.
I also did my time in WoW., though this is inaccurate because I retired with 3 level 60s.
Post by: jasonditz on April 03, 2006, 01:19:59 PM
Post by: Kairon on April 03, 2006, 02:09:09 PM
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Originally posted by: jasonditzI just dream of one day walking around a 3D first-person perspective world and seeing a Pidgey or a Zubat go flying past. The Pokemon world has a huge amount of characters and backstory to it at this point, there should be an all-immersive experience like that.
Such an experience exists in my most favoritest Pokemon game of all time: Pokemon Snap!
~Dete
Bug Trainer Extraordinaire!
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 03, 2006, 02:34:19 PM
And I'm telling you, a predefined list of words and phrases you can string together, especially in the event of players of different languages, would suffice for most play, including a list of favorite phrases you could select from quickly. Ideally, friend codes would allow voice chat, making communication with friends even easier.
I just think that Pokemon is just too big of a franchise and too big of a world for anything but a full scale MMORPG to do it justice.
I mean, for the first time ever, someone WILL be crowned Grand Champion Pokemaster of the entire world.
I just don't see how Nintendo could pass it up.
Post by: Ian Sane on April 03, 2006, 02:48:21 PM
How do you prevent people from cheating? If you just use a Gameshark to get all the Pokemon and thus get an unfair advantage then what? I love the idea of an actual champion but it would be hard to keep things legit.
Post by: Smash_Brother on April 03, 2006, 04:38:01 PM
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Originally posted by: Ian Sane How do you prevent people from cheating? If you just use a Gameshark to get all the Pokemon and thus get an unfair advantage then what? I love the idea of an actual champion but it would be hard to keep things legit.
A gameshark only edits save game data. In the case of MMORPGs, none of the character data is stored client side (on the Rev), it's all server side.
It has to be in order to maintain consistency. Otherwise, people would cheat in WoW like they did in Diablo.
