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Gaming Forums => Nintendo Gaming => Topic started by: nemo_83 on June 07, 2005, 10:41:43 PM

Title: The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 07, 2005, 10:41:43 PM: So I'm setting out on the task of making a thread worth reading about the rumored (or is it confirmed?) new IP launching with REV. We started in on an argument in another thread about what makes something a game, a toy, a gamer's game, a nongamer's game, an original game, a game that is epic, or a game that is not epic or even has a story. There are many facets, no black and white. It can be cut many ways. Many questions to be asked, and I can't do it all in this first post. I'll start by linking to a new article up on cube.ign.com.

http://cube.ign.com/articles/622/622870p1.html?fromint=1

"The Revolution, Iwata revealed at the press conference, will actually feature simple titles like Otona no DS Training. But don't worry -- you'll also get big, epic titles like Zelda."

I want to say that what I want in a new IP is an epic game. I'm sorry, but that is my expectation from the new IP on REV. The purpose of making a new IP for me is to have a new character for a new character driven game. The purpose for me of a new IP is to tell a new story. Nintendo has shown in recent years they are not afraid to slap Mario on any gameplay oriented game completely unrelated to the gameplay found in real Mario Bros games. If they are making a new IP that is essentially a small, less traditional game like Animal Crossing centered less on story; they are not going to expand markets. The game needs to expand their user base to the gamers who own PS2 or Xbox. They need a new big character, with a new world with new rules. I expect the next Zelda games on REV, if there weren't any then I wouldn't even be thinking about buying a REV; but Zelda games are a given and I expect the next Zelda equivalent in the industry to be on REV. I don't care if it isn't a launch title as much as I care that it be a new original story in an original universe that tradtional gamers find palatable. Can it really be so hard to imagine a new epic game? Its not enough to put out an epic sequel anymore, you have to make a new epic. The NES saw the launch of so many original IPs compared to every system since it that it is unbelievable.

So I'm not just going to bitch; I'm going to be constructive and offer what I can. Here is an idea for an epic adventure game.

First I will give you as brief of a summary of the legend that inspired my idea as I can. And hopefully it will tickle your curiosity enough to read on. I live close to New Orleans and there is a legend that vampires were brought to New Orleans from France by 88 Casket Girls. France offered many female prisoners the opportunity to avoid their prison term by going to America to help colonize the territory. The 88 female prisoners were escorted by nuns on a boat and were to stay at the nunnery in New Orleans until husbands were found for each of the 88 women. When they arrived they each carried with them a trunk or luggage case that was shaped like a small coffin/casket. They became known as the 88 Casket Girls. Following their arrival the rate of violent crime in the city of New Orleans has historically been one of the highest in the nation. The legend is that there were vampires in their caskets that they brought with them, but when the caskets were opened they were empty. They say that the caskets are still kept on the top floor of the nunnery where all the windows are nailed shut with 88 blessed nails; and the windows still blow open. I would like to fit that story into the following.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/nosferatu.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/nosferatubw.jpg

My idea deals with a nosferatu vampire game. The above pictures are concepts for a rat like vampire character that has been thrown together by a group of scientists and necromancers Frankenstein style with parts from different monsters including a vampire and a werewolf. It would open before the character’s resurrection with the main character being impaled with a blade, dragged behind horses in sunlight (you have to worry about sunlight until you gain magic or cover to protect yourself as prolonged exposure will burn you like an ant under a magnifying glass), then you body is hung and you are torn limb from limb. The game would be focused on one large city and the surrounding country side (imagine rolling green hills with shepards watching over flocks of sheep grazing) similar to how The Legend of Zelda Majora's Mask is focused on one city and the people who live there. Also like Majora's Mask the character's abilities are centered on transforming, but into shadow, fog, bats, a wolf, a werewolf, rats, and finally two evolutions of a dragon in the end. It would be similar to GTA staring a hideous monster who is seen as a plague upon humanity yet it would take place in a fantasy world with super deformed characters. The design I created is based on my want to see a vampire that is not glamorized. I want a vampire that is more like the one found in the silent film Nosferatu. I like the idea of a vampire that is more animal than man. I have been brainstorming with ideas for making the character more rat like, more bat like, more leach like, and more serpent like.

Combat would be as simple as possible partially like how in Mario you use your body to kill enemies; but like in Zelda too how you can pick up enemy weapons and use them. As a monster you have many enemies, but most are humans who don’t like you picking off their sheep or people for food. You are able to jump at all times in the game unlike Zelda and use your transforming abilities for stealth like certain areas in WW you have to sneak or how you use your surroundings to hide in shadows like MGS or Splinter Cell. You may be able to take out individual humans being a vampire and all, but if one has a fit and attracts a crowd you could be killed by a mob. There would have to be definable AI in humans who lack the physical ability to defend themselves so they need to be able to strategize against you in the game. As you progress you would gain new transformations. I see no reason the game couldn’t already be done on Cube hardware with Cube controllers. In the beginning of the game you would not be able to control your transformations or yourself as you transform into a wolf under the moon until you gain power in the game. You will be able to transform into a wolf and run faster over great distances and jump high and far. As a vampire you will be able to glide in the beginning of the game gaining your wings later. Until then you can turn to vapers, shadows, leaches, or rats and make your way to hard to reach places. You would be able to stretch your arms out like shadows and grab people from the darkness of an alley way. And your tail would be prehensile like a opposum's or new world monkey's allowing you to grab objects or characters or just hit them with the tail. You could suspend yourself with your tail while the character uses its arms. Many things are possible.

As you progress through the game you find out more about your past life and origins; and you must seek out the Garden of Eden to eat the fruit of the Tree of Death, the Tree of Knowledge. There you find you were Cain, the bad seed, the child of Satan and Eve. Even later you find more about how things work when a devine being like an angel like Satan or God himself does something such as makes offspring they themselves are placed into the body of the offspring. Therefore the angelic body of Satan ceased to be, he was trapped in the body of Cain, the son of the woman he had fallen for. The final transformation in the game is into a great black dragon, with serpent like Chinese style body without limbs, there would be three jaws, and when the mouth opens seven serpent like heads come out. Before the final battle the seven heads would mock the Bible before to the armies of men at the place called Armagedon. Some heads would creepily sing Latin or Italian castrado gospels while other heads recited the words of Christ at the last supper.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/beastbw.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/demononbw.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/demon2bw.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/demon1bw3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v695/nemo_83/angelblack.jpg

Edit: So I'm going to add some stuff in, including a sequel idea. Later I'll try to figure out how to turn those addresses into links.

I guess I'll explain more about how I created the character. I saw the shape, the silouete of the character in a shadow one day; I see inspiring things in simple shapes like shadows or splashes of water. I began thinking of what the character was, who it was, if it was female or male, what it could do, etc as I furthered the design along trying to make it simple like Sonic or Mario, but with an adventure like Zelda. This was back before GTA and Halo showed that a mature game could be a system selling franchise. (By the way did I mention I want the game to be cel shaded with mostly grey scale coloring like A Nightmare Before Christmas so that the colors really pop, like the black and white scenes in Zelda TP) As I drew more on what the game was going to be about I began invisioning the character running through woods at high speeds with trees flying by at 90 mph, the character auto dodging anything in the way; and then the character comes to a high cliff over a valley and dives off turning into a stream of bats. Do you see how this game is inspired by gameplay elements from past games. The speed of Sonic, the jumping of Mario, the sword fighting of Zelda, the transformations found in SotN, Blood Omen, and Majora's Mask, the adventure of Zelda, the communication of Abe's Oddyssey, the stealth of MGS and Zelda, etc. You would be able to kill someone in the alley, take their clothes and skin (ala Leatherface or Buffalo Bill) then enter a human party in the guise of a wealthy gentleman. You could hear everyones thoughts so you don't have to stop to talk, you just look at the bubble above their head to read their feeble human minds. I really want to portray this as a very Milton esque anti hero; after all it is the devil himself, but there must be some tragedy involved in his story that makes us sympathize with him. Like, why would the god's greatest creation fail? Maybe the angels in the story were jealous of humanity. Why? Because the angels are all children forever. They will never grow old, they will never die. Is it the ultimate reward or the ultimate sin, at least in the eyes of Satan. Speaking of his eyes, when were they originally opened to all of this; that humanity was given something the angels felt they were deprived of (some humans would argue that after they die that heaven could be interpreted as getting your childhood back, to be a child again, perhaps forever)? I would make it so the story leads back to the beginning. The whole game you are searching for who you are; who you were, who you will become. The closer you get to the end the closer you get to the past. You find out that before you seduced Eve you yourself ate from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil within the garden of Eden. Thus there is supplied the reason the fruit is already forbidden in Genesis. When you ate the fruit the first time you were opened to the realization that you were the oldest of God's creations yet you had aged not past your first teenage years, sort of a tragic unwilling Peter Pan. And like Peter Pan; I don't remember if I already mentioned this but the world the game would take place in would be an imaginary land similar to Never Never Land, or Oz. I like stories like that, in which the world is seperate from our world and its rules, but at the same time completely inspired by our world though wholy symbolic in nature at times. That is how I think of Zelda some times to help me suspend my disbelief. Even though I would want the continent and surrounding islands to represent certain real world places like Venice, Paris, London, or New Orleans I would not try to replicate our world, only the spirit of it.

The casket girls also come into play one time when he transports himself along with other vampires to a new continent in small caskets filled with black dirt carried by the 88 casket girls. Vampires can't go in the water, so cel shading would work well with this game. Later in the game as you are able to fly the distance you won't need a boat ride to get from island to island. For most of the game though you will spend time underground during the day sleeping in dirt. You can use this ability to dig beneath the ground in combat too, pulling enemies under ground like in the movie Tremors.

So I have two sequel ideas, but they would actually be prequels, the first one staring Satan's most recent love interest and mother of his only child who you play as in the second sequel, er, prequel. The character he becomes smitten over is Little Red Riding Hood, who is a witch (and so is her grandmother). In the end Little Red Riding Hood is burned for being a witch by the people she grew up with. This ties in with the first game because the way Satan is caught, drug behind the horse, hung, burned, and mutilated is because he is getting his buisness on with Red. He has lost track of time, the sun has come up, and the villagers are out to "save" Red from the monster; and then Satan is destroyed, temporarily. Red absorbs some of his power making her even more potent; and she also carries his child. The action would be similar to the first game with simple combat, though you can carry multiple items/weapons, you can only have two out at all times, and you can only use one weapon at a time (technically you could use your broom stick as a third weapon you can have out at all times too). Red would be able to fly on her broomstick as if it were a hover board (but you can also sit on it like a bike), so you can be stylish while you play. Her greatest attribute would be her black magic powers. She could use witchcraft and vodoo to necromance raising and commanding armies of hundreds of the dead (like Pikmin). The second prequel staring their daughter is more of a western, leading up to the events of the game staring Satan. She would ride a mechanical horse and wear silver armor that gleams in the sunlight. The armor though is like Satan's shadow skin; it is her skin, it is alive and it evolves as the game moves forward. Rather than carrying a lance she carries a long wood and brass riffle with a leather shoulder strap and a blade attached to the end. She is a werewolf, her story taking a path more along the lines of Native American mysticism. Her powers would escalate to the point where she becomes a werebear. But it is her armor that transforms around her body, her helmet's vents become like metal teeth. Think, Once Upon a Time in the West meets An American Werewolf in London. Also I am trying to draw the three IPs around Arthurian legend, Christian mythos, Joan of Arc, the story of Beowulf and the dragon, and the story of Thor and the serpent.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: pudu on June 07, 2005, 10:51:29 PM: Cool some creativity going in PGC forums! I'm avoiding some work right now but I'll read through this and try to add what I can tomorrow I do some computer art so maybe we can have a little fun with this.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 08, 2005, 03:29:06 AM: Your storyline there seems to mix up a few things about the whole angel/demon stories...

I've got a few ideas (i.e. design docs), should I translate them?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Dirk Temporo on June 08, 2005, 03:34:54 AM: What is "IP"?
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Talon on June 08, 2005, 03:39:42 AM: Intellectual Property - A product of the intellect that has commercial value, including copyrighted property such as literary or artistic works, and ideational property, such as patents, appellations of origin, business methods, and industrial processes.

Any nintendo character (ie mario, peach, captain falcon...etc) is intellectual property because they have commercial value to the company and its not only characters but it could be the way Nintendo implements the camera system in mario sunshine or could even be the process they use to develop games.

The only downside to IP is most companies that you work for will make you sign an agreement that says all your IP belongs to them while your an employee of that company. That means if you come up with an entire new franchise be it at work or at home while you work for that company it belongs to them. You might come up with a new way of compressing data that has never before been used again as long as your working for that company it belongs to them and not you.

There was an incident not that long ago at a university (i wont name it) where a couple of guys developed some new technology whislt they were students at this particular university. After they had left the university they decided they would become entrepreneurs and sell this technology. Now they ended up becoming millionares after selling this new technology. But the university turned around and said they came up with the ideas while they were studying there and therefor it belongs to the university and sued them. Im not sure of the outcome of the court case, im just glad that the university im studying ats policy for IP is that it belongs to the student. Im currently researching technology's for a company outside of the university as part of my degree and the company has tried to take our IP but the university turned around and said no and their was a bit of legal crap that sill needs to be worked out. But anyway you just have to be careful with IP.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 08, 2005, 07:25:18 AM: Uh... isn't Miyamoto supposed to be working on this IP?

You can forget anything bloody.

As for epic... let's all take a moment to remember Mario's storyline.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Bill Aurion on June 08, 2005, 07:44:47 AM: I don't expect anything epic, I expect something FUN...Which is what everyone should expect, considering Miyamoto is at the helm...
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 08, 2005, 08:23:02 AM: Talon: I think the decision was that whatewver you do at company time belongs to the company and whatever you do at home belongs to you.

Paladin: Who says only Miyamoto is allowed to come up with ideas? This is basically a post your game idea thread so...

Well, one idea:

Story:
Some time in the future. Most parts of the world were annihilated during a nuclear war and are known as the "wastelands". The US and Japan survived the nuclear barrage somewhat. The US doesn't interest us here. Japan broke up into two different nations, located in the north and south. The Empire and the Combine. They are at war. For quite some time the war went nowhere, the front didn't move for years. The Empire digs up old manuscripts detailling the ancient "Thule" treasure that might swing the war into their favor. Combine spies relay that information to their homeland so when the Empire sends troops to Europe to retrieve Thule, Combine forces are already waiting there.
The war has brought forth a new weapon: The dragoons. Large combat robots multiple stories high that are driven by human pilots (as opposed to the rest of the armies which is AI driven) and nearly invulnerable to conventional weapons. They do this by amplifying the soul's influence in the physical world and projecting a spirit field that cannot be penetrated as long as it doesn't overlap with an enemy's spirit field (you see where this is going?).
Somewhere in imperial territory, a few years earlier: A girl known as Eva Merz wakes up from a nightmare. She saw the destruction of Mankind at the hands of an alien race. Now she's insane, a salivating wheelchair bound wreck. Not able to speak, walk or even perceive her environment. However, when you put her in control of a dragoon she becomes the deadly fighter known to her enemies as "the devil". Dodging impossible to dodge attacks, striking targets with incredible precision and moving faster than the eye can see. So she was put into the imperial army.
Two other children get drafted at roughly the same time: Lilly, known by the nickname of Lilith and a boy who is only known as "Salomon" (he didn't want to say his name so Lilith picked one for him, he rejectewd her first proposal of "Adam"). While Salomon is an awesome fighter all around, Lilith can hit any target she aims at. Now those two get put into one team with Eva and shipped off to Europe to ensure the imperial victory.

Later:
Thule turns out to be an observation center by an alien race known as Nephilim. They created mankind back then and monitored their progress. Now that man reactivates the outpost the Nephilim remember their abandoned creation and see that not ewverything went the way they wanted. So they come back with plans of a human Mk.II to replace mankind. Obviously that requires removing mankind first. They start with wiping out the Empire and large parts of the Combine. Now what is left of both sides has to unite to fight the alien menace. Since Eva, Lilith and Salomon are Earth's best pilots they are the only ones who can hope to stop the Nephilim.

Gameplay:
I'm thinking big mech combat game here, somewhat slow and tactical. You operate in modes, which include general defense, sprint (run fast, hard to hit), ranged combat and melee. Melee is like a 3d fighter, side view and everything. Ranged is mostly useful against vehicles since dragoons have their spirit fields. Well, unless one of your allies is engaging them in close combat, that is . Dragoons can take quite some damage so it's not "bang, you're dead".
The player obviously controls either Eva, Lilith or Salomon, whereby Eva is melee focussed and Lilith better at ranged combat (her weapons also do more damage even to shielded targets). Salomon is one of those nerdy anime boys, the main character type of character. You know, the pathetic kind of guy the audience can identify with. Lilith lacks a left arm, lost it to a cupboard that fell over.

Since the dragoons use a neural interface (that's required so the pilot can identify with the dragoon and project the spirit field) you see the world in third person with your chosen character instead of your dragoon. Other dragoons appear normally, though.

I suppose that survival horror game for the DS I posted in the DS game idea thread won't be possible on the Rev (at least not very well)...
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 08, 2005, 08:42:27 AM: "Paladin: Who says only Miyamoto is allowed to come up with ideas?"

I assumed that which IP this thread was about, the one that was born out of one of Miyamoto's ideas.

It seems you're thinking of a slower Zone of the Enders except with a storyline that isn't stupid.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: jasonditz on June 08, 2005, 08:44:57 AM: Shiggy thought up Pikmin while wandering around in his yard. Any news on where he's been wandering lately?
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Renny on June 08, 2005, 10:33:54 AM: He was last seen picking up Western game journalists. Rated E for everyone, nonetheless.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: King of Twitch on June 08, 2005, 11:02:04 AM: It's hard to guess without some specs and not knowing what special features the controller might have.

I think someone should make a MMORPG and recreate areas out of real life like Mammoth Mountains, Yosemite, New Zealand, whatever. I guess it would be like a castaway sim and I don't know... you would have to catch your own food, build your own house and weapons. Fight off mountain lions or bears. Something like that.

Or a pirate game.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Ian Sane on June 08, 2005, 11:43:49 AM: Like probably anyone who has an interest in games I have lots of ideas. The one I would like to make the most though would be a wrestling game. Fortunately it's also the least creative idea I have so it's not that big of a deal if anyone steals it.

I'm thinking like the Gran Turismo of wrestling games in that it would strive to be the most detailed and accurate wrestling game ever made. It wouldn't have real leagues and wrestlers in it though because the WWE licence would limit what I would be allowed to do, would enforce a strict release date regardless of quality, and would force annual sequels. The moves and the AI would all be authentic though and the Create-a-Wrestler mode would allow you to create your favourite real wrestlers. Naturally some of the pre-set characters would have the same movesets as some real wrestlers to allow for an easy appearance edit. I would try to have as many gimmick matches as possible but I wouldn't have exploding bed of nails death match stuff so that the game doesn't get an 'M' rating.

The game would largely combine elements from WWF No Mercy and Fire Pro Wrestling. The controls would largely be from Fire Pro since I like how the game allows you to do any move at any time if you want but increases the chances of tougher moves being reversed when the opponent is at full strength. In Fire Pro there are two attack buttons. One is for weak moves, one is for medium moves, and you push them both together for strong moves. I really like that system since the "hold the grapple button for 1 second to perform a strong grapple" method in No Mercy really slows things down. Fire Pro however has no grab button. Grabs are performed by getting close to an opponent and a successful move is performed by having perfect timing. I find this method unintinuative so I would have a grab button like No Mercy. Fire Pro also has no pin button as ground attacks are assigned pins. Since this limits how many moves a person has AND allows characters to have no pin I want a pin button. The face buttons would be weak attack, medium attack, grapple, and multi-function (ie: picking up chairs, tagging, and stuff). The shoulder buttons are used for reversals and pins. Running is performed by double tapping in the appropriate direction. I find that method easier to use then having a run button.

The pin button can be used in the middle of moves to make the move automatically go into a pin. In most wrestling games a release german suplex and bridged german suplex are counted as two different moves thus eating up two spots. This makes no sense since in real life any wrestler that regularly does german suplexs will likely mix up both variations in a match. So this way the move is just "german suplex" and the player decides if it bridges into a pin or not. This also works with other variations of moves. Like if you wanted to chain multiple suplexes together you would push the misc button as you did the move and would time it so that you chained them together. The pin button would also be used for rollups and school boys. It makes no sense for rolling someone into a pin to be an assigned move. Every wrestler should be able to do so and here you can by doing a front grab and pushing pin.

Submissions moves would use button tapping to keep opponents in the move. In most wrestling games a submission is applied for a few seconds and then removed. I've never seen that in a real life wrestling match EVER so it shouldn't work that way. The attacker and opponent have to fight to escape or keep the move on. Plus the attacker can switch into different submission moves on the fly to keep the opponent trapped.

Other ideas:
- Under this control scheme wrestlers would only have three top rope moves. Many high-flyers so several moves off the top. So in the CAW you can assign several moves to the same button press and it randomly picks one for you since all flying moves have pretty much the same "land on the guy" result. The flips are all for show anyway so who cares if it's random.
- Moves sometimes f*ck up randomly like in real life. This is based on the complexity of a move and the stats of the character. Bodyslams pretty much never mess up. Backflip ranas to the floor have a much higher chance though. Plus the game takes into account size and stats. So if you're 400 pounds you're going to screw up agile moves 90% of the time and a 150 pound guy is pretty much never going pull off powermoves on a huge guy (he can pull off power moves on other small guys however). This way you can't just give your character all the best moves. You have to balance stats, special abilities, size, endurance, flexibility, etc.
- In story mode your character can become fatter or buffer, change their outfit or name, and add moves and abilities as they learn and progress.
- Injuries are taken into place in regards to what you can do. If your arm is f*cked clotheslining a guy isn't going to be as effective and will hurt you.
- I'm hoping to get at least 8 characters plus a ref on screen at once. The game allows online play and LAN play naturally along with four player support.

And the games wouldn't just be competitive because wrestling isn't a real sport. It's about performance and hardcore wrestling fans know that. So the game has two modes of play. One is like a fighting game where the goal is to beat your opponent. The other is the sim mode where you're an actual wrestler and the goal is to have an entertaining match. In this mode reversals require no special timing, you can kick out of any pin if you want to, and you can choose when to act hurt and when to bleed. The goal is for you and a friend to put on a great match. Plus when you fight the computer the game works like a rhythm game where the computer tells you what spot to do next and you have to make sure to do the right moves at the right time.

Of course there are a lot more details but I could go on for pages so I won't.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: TMW on June 08, 2005, 12:15:48 PM: Nintendo hires Ancel and buys the right to BG&E, securing the franchise as a Nintendo only IP.

Hey, I can dream, can't I?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 08, 2005, 12:53:20 PM: Quote
Originally posted by: TMW
Nintendo hires Ancel and buys the right to BG&E, securing the franchise as a Nintendo only IP.

Hey, I can dream, can't I?
I like that idea (not sure who Ancel is & too lazy to look it up).

I just have one small request
"Hot Links" - >>CLICK HERE<< is a link already prepared for you, just click and refer to link while still reading post w/o losing your place

"Cold Links" - http//:www.justhighlitecopyandpaste.com is a hassle and I often end up closing the browser on accident.

just a small request that makes everything easier for everyone
especially me
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: thepoga on June 08, 2005, 06:04:02 PM: Quote
Originally posted by: Talon
Intellectual Property - A product of the intellect that has commercial value, including copyrighted property such as literary or artistic works, and ideational property, such as patents, appellations of origin, business methods, and industrial processes.

why don't you just say franchise?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: TMW on June 08, 2005, 07:32:19 PM: Quote
Originally posted by: BlackNMild2k1]I like that idea (not sure who Ancel is & too lazy to look it up).

Micheal Ancel is the creator of Beyond Good and Evil.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 08, 2005, 08:33:22 PM: Bleh, Ancel can keep his weaksauce Zelda-Starfox ripoff. I played through the whole game and wasn't impressed. I also seem to remember some impressive features that got canned.

What I want instead:

Hire Tim Schafer/ Buy out Double Fine and get to work on a damn adventure game.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: ShyGuy on June 08, 2005, 09:10:29 PM: What Impressive features?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Dasmos on June 08, 2005, 09:16:25 PM: I think they should make a music type game...........not like Donkey Konga, but more of a game like gitaroo man........maybe even create a nintendo guitar.....
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 09, 2005, 02:53:30 AM: It seems you're thinking of a slower Zone of the Enders except with a storyline that isn't stupid.

Probably. What is Zone of the Enders? (j/k, I've seen the name a few times before and know it's a mech combat game)
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 09, 2005, 04:11:55 AM: Impressive features, like being able to leave the planet's atmosphere in a spaceship seamlessly, if I remember correctly... the game engine was supposed to contain an actual universe with multiple planets. That would have been slightly cool.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: couchmonkey on June 09, 2005, 08:09:53 AM: I've got some ideas, but I'm too lazy to remember them and explain them. Instead I'll say what I'd like to see for original games:

- something crazy and different that takes advantage of the Rev hardware - I don't care too much about the theme or story for this one.
- an exclusive RPG...could be Nintendo-developed or maybe Camelot...it should be something fairly traditional, and it would be cool if it made use of the internal memory to create a world that evolves over time.
- speaking of an RPG world that evolves over time, I'd love to see Earthbound return, though it's not an original IP.
- a relatively traditional FPS, I'd like it to offer some new ideas and gameplay, but it shouldn't stray as far away from regular FPS territory as, say, Metroid Prime. Try a new theme, come up with some neat gameplay tweaks, but still let me run around and shoot crap most of the time. For example, how about an FPS set entirely in the Old West, with some horse-ridin', train-robbin' action? It could borrow some horse-riding mechanics from Twighlight Princess.

I'll stop there for now.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 09, 2005, 11:08:43 AM: I want to make a good reply, but I still havn't had much time and right now I'm about to eat so this won't be that good long reply I was wanting to make.

I'll start by saying there have been some good ideas so far and I'm going to comment on some of them later, but right now I really want to reply to Bill who mentioned fun factor. Later I'll explain further how fun factors into my IP idea; but I wanted to say that regardless of whether the game Nintendo makes is epic or not I hope it is fun. Fun factor has been forgotten by Nintendo this generation and thus games like Halo and GTA have outsold Nintendo's most polished products. WW is so emaculate, yet there have been three GTAs that have all three sold more and generally been far more accessable(except GTA controls are the pits). Anyone at any time can sit down with GTA kill some police and get a juckle. When I get the urge to jump back into WW I find myself sailing for about ten minutes before I get bored and put it down.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: OptimusPrime on June 09, 2005, 11:18:19 AM: I have been tinkering of a kind of GTA but in the Wild West. You would be able to be a sherrif (from very strict to a dirty one and everything between), a mercenary, join gangs and challenge the leader or join gangs as a bounty hunter and put a knife in their back or join gangs and let them split (with a huge firefight) or you can just be a lonesome cowboy.
You would be able to use everything as a weapon: from chairs to your shotgun (baseball style) to boozebottles (and light up your opponents afterwards). Your allowed to shoot everyone except the paino player which would result into a nuclear explosion and a Game Over. And offcourse dueling.

The Horse would be very important, the longer you have him the more tricks he can do like walking under the window when you whistle or use his backlegs on enemies when you whistle different and such.

And the hookers have guns, those small ones they can attach on their thigh, and they're deadly.

And probably someone is going to make this in about 5 years... i always have that, i get a good idea and 5 years later they make it.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KnowsNothing on June 09, 2005, 11:32:05 AM: Quote
Fun factor has been forgotten by Nintendo this generation and thus games like Halo and GTA have outsold Nintendo's most polished products.

You're insane, Nintendo is one of the only developers that include fun into their games. The Mario Sports titles, for example, are like sports games - boring stats + fun. Wario Ware Touched and Yoshi's Touch and Go are titles that are like pure fun rolled into a ball and thrown at your face.

I haven't really been paying attention to this thread since most of the ideas that spew forth from threads like these are usually garbabge (not saying all of these are, I haven't read them ) As for my own ideas, I've had plenty of epic adventure type ideas, but I really want to come up with the next huge puzzle game. I haven't come up with anything awesome yet, but I WILL be the creator of the next Tetris, just you wait and see >=o
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 09, 2005, 12:32:24 PM: People have been trying to make the next big Tetris type puzzle game for years, but the truth is the best way to pay tribute to puzzle games would be to simply implement puzzles into your epic game idea. Zelda has many parts to its gameplay such as combat, transformations, magic, stealth, exploring, and of course puzzles woven throughout the adventure (macro and micro puzzles). You could think of every action and reaction when designing a game as a puzzle. Its about simple logic. You may use an item as a reward and motive to get the player to work their way through a dungeon solving puzzles to unlock new areas, beat a boss which can be another puzzle, and then you use the new item in another puzzle later to acess a new dungeon or gain another item to solve another puzzle and so on.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 09, 2005, 12:41:35 PM: Quote
Originally posted by: PaLaDiN
Bleh, Ancel can keep his weaksauce Zelda-Starfox ripoff. I played through the whole game and wasn't impressed. I also seem to remember some impressive features that got canned.

What I want instead:

Hire Tim Schafer/ Buy out Double Fine and get to work on a damn adventure game.

I too was not impressed by BGE, it was a quality game with tight controls and graphics, but the fact that it was not an established franchise alone was not enough to cover up the Mtv VJ for the main character. The game felt like a Sony character game more than a Nintendo character game. And it did feel too much like StarFox with the combat (StarFox, another illfated adventure game with pretty graphics), and the picture taking felt too much like scanning in Metroid. I don't want to bash the game, but I feel it was unfairly given more credit than it deserved from critics simply because they, like myself want to see original games do well so there will be more of them. I though would not give up my credibility, basically I wouldn't lie about how I personally feel just to push a game hoping it will mean something better down the line.

Ian: I have always felt that you need a liscence for a wrestling game. At the same time I have quit playing wrestling games because they control so clunkily as if the controls were put together by the people who do Madden. I want a wrestling game that controls as well as Mario with full analog control and free jumping.

KDR: I would think that fully 3D cities with sky scrappers and cars would work great with mechs. You could hide behind a building or in a lake; and spring forth as an enemy approaches. I would never want a slow moving mech game. I am thinking GTA with big buildings and urban warfare between tanks and mechs.

I like some of the horse back riding/western game ideas. At first when couchmonkey brought up a new FPS I imediately thought something sci fi with characters with extra robotic arms (four arms for shooting, it would make a serious advantage in a gun slinging scenerio like the old west, think Trigun). Also as Prime said, I would like any new shooter to involve aspects of GTA. For me that means being able to steal others' rides or be chased by cops.

PS I'm adding some stuff into my original post for my IP including a sequel idea if anyone wants to read.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 09, 2005, 12:57:17 PM: BG&E is one of my favorites this generation for GC, which means it is one of the few games that I own (I own about 45+ games) that actually kept my attention long enough to actually finish the game. Not only did I finish the game but I wanted more at the end, I was mad that it was over.

So what if it was a little Zelda meets SFA meets Metroid, is that a bad thing? I want a sequel.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: ThePerm on June 09, 2005, 01:02:44 PM: 1 halo killer.....
2 new platformer...
3 new big ass rpg....
4 some sort of fighting game

new ips there you go
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 09, 2005, 09:43:27 PM: Why does everybody say "GTA" when they mean freeform? Seriously, an RPG like Gothic, Elder Scrolls, etc would be much better for that freeform wildwest style. A world needs character interaction, not just "cool stunts" and random people to kill. Come to think of it I'd rather have Fallout 3 than a wildwest RPG...

BGE didn't hold my interest. Too much stealth, at some point I was so annoyed I stopped playing.

Nemo: Yes but where does GTA come in with mech combat? GTA would mean you're a mercenary or something, not working for anyone. In GTA an important element was stealing cars and stuff, not possible in a mech game (sure, throwing cars would be but that's not GTA). Urban warfare is definitely not GTA. I was thinking mission-based. City scenarios would be in there of course but so would open areas.

Perm: That's not IPs. IP means detailling the characters and stuff.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: ThePerm on June 09, 2005, 09:47:32 PM: oh kdr...i couldnt divulge any of my ip ideas....iv spent too much time researching things....and have a half gig of just reference material.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 09, 2005, 10:07:03 PM: Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Why does everybody say "GTA" when they mean freeform? Seriously, an RPG like Gothic, Elder Scrolls, etc would be much better for that freeform wildwest style. A world needs character interaction, not just "cool stunts" and random people to kill. Come to think of it I'd rather have Fallout 3 than a wildwest RPG...

BGE didn't hold my interest. Too much stealth, at some point I was so annoyed I stopped playing.

Nemo: Yes but where does GTA come in with mech combat? GTA would mean you're a mercenary or something, not working for anyone. In GTA an important element was stealing cars and stuff, not possible in a mech game (sure, throwing cars would be but that's not GTA). Urban warfare is definitely not GTA. I was thinking mission-based. City scenarios would be in there of course but so would open areas.

Perm: That's not IPs. IP means detailling the characters and stuff.

When I brought up GTA to splice with a mech game I was thinking open cities with people, buildings, cars, and other explorable and destructable things. Look at how Destroy All Humans borrows from GTA without being a car stealing stereotype pedalling piece of profanity. I guess I'm just thinking of the game as more of a sci fi fps adventure game like Metroid or Halo with a very expanded vehicular arsenal in the form of mechs with open human urban enviroments like GTA.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: vudu on June 10, 2005, 09:08:24 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: ThePerm
oh kdr...i couldnt divulge any of my ip ideas....iv spent too much time researching things....and have a half gig of just reference material.
Is that a round-about way of saying you have a bunch of ROMs on your PC?
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 11, 2005, 12:07:39 AM: I think he's one of those paranoid wannabe-mod leaders that have the "greatest idea ever" and they're not sharing it because someone might steal it! Realistically, the only one who has to fear his ideas being stolen is Miyamoto because that's the only guy who can be trusted to consistently have good ideas.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 12, 2005, 02:02:24 PM: I added some more thoughts on a third game in my first post last night inspired by the talk about western games.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: ThePerm on June 12, 2005, 04:58:52 PM: its a way of saying i have 6,809 picture files or documents
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Talon on June 12, 2005, 09:29:12 PM: This thread just highlights the reason why we arent game developers. Basically all the ideas people have brought to the table are clones of other games or genres that have been combined and mashed together. You want to push the envelope and create games that are unique and different, or a fresh take on an existing genre. There is only so many times i can play the same game before it gets boring.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Dasmos on June 13, 2005, 12:59:40 AM: How about this:

A man named Gregorio, a italian heavy-weight dancer, sets out in search for his father AT SEA! His father got lost many years ago on a small fishing boat. Gregorio has a high-priced yacht with a seasoned captain, he also brings his girlfriend along. He sets sail only to find himself and his crew tangled in a huge storm......their boat capsizes....

Everyone is safe and they find themselves stranded on what the think is a deserted island, they set up camp for the night.....when gregorio awakes he finds tghat his girlfriend is gone.....he and the captain search the island until they find her.....she is being held captive by natives, and they are seemingly going to eat her. They wait til night so that they can steal her away. Whilst they are trying they are caught.......they are thrown into jail.

Gregoria bargains with the natives to let his girlfriend free, the tribal cheif who doesn't speak any english cannot understand him. Gregorio starts to get angry and the tribe sees this a form of attack against them, they eat gregorios girl and put the two to work.....you cook, hunt, build, entertain them with dance, basically you are slaves for the tribe. As you progress to start to become friends with the tribe members and start to learn their native tongue, but you still harbour a great hatred for them... you gain more trust, you become a part of their tribe......this entail many of the same aspects of gameplay but you can also interact with other tribes on the island, make allies, make enemies, create a proporous tribe, or create havoc.

Throughout all this you are just biding your time, building your boat back with skills learnt from ceratin villagers or tribes once you become their friends. Once you finish building your boat you can set sail back home, or at least to civilisation..........

This could be played co-operatively with someone acting as the captain, he would have different skills and jobs to perform. I guess I could work on the ending a little more......... or maybe alternate endings..
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 13, 2005, 01:00:00 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: Talon
This thread just highlights the reason why we arent game developers. Basically all the ideas people have brought to the table are clones of other games or genres that have been combined and mashed together. You want to push the envelope and create games that are unique and different, or a fresh take on an existing genre. There is only so many times i can play the same game before it gets boring.

Like I've said before, there are only two or three stories in the world. It doesn't matter how different your story is, it is still going to be a retelling of a past story. Beowulf is a retelling of the story of Christ. Arthur is a retelling of both Beowulf and Christ. Star Wars is a retelling of the same story. Dune, Zelda, Metroid; you see what I'm saying. Same basic story, different characters, different worlds, and different journies.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Dasmos on June 13, 2005, 01:04:17 AM: I don't understand what you mean Nemo....
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 13, 2005, 01:22:29 AM: Just think of it very simply as good vs evil. Some farm kid comes along, pulls a sword out of a stone, and saves his people. Prophecies of "the one." Just like Star Wars is a twist on the story of Christ; that is how I want my story for my IP to be. Rather than a Christ like figure such as King Arthur though; I would have the direct opposite as the main character.

Look at the psychology involved in The Last Temptation of Christ staring William Defoe. Christ is portrayed as a human strugling with his destiny to be the savior, the hero. His destiny sees him taking upon the burden of blame for all man's sin so that man might be forgiven, he is tempted to use his will for personal gain; but he choses the path he knows will lead to his own death. To say the least, to know you were the son of god, would be stressful; there are certain expectations upon you. I want to have a story with a main character wrought with confusion over his own destiny because his destiny is to be the ultimate evil rather than the ultimate good. I want to explore through the story what it takes to push a person to fullfill such a destiny of destruction.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Shift Key on June 13, 2005, 01:52:13 AM: Quote
Just think of it very simply as good vs evil.
ARG BRAIN ANEURYSM! How awfully generic to pidgeon-hole the history (and fiction) of the world into one category. Ugh.

Quote
I want a wrestling game that controls as well as Mario with full analog control and free jumping.
Because quite clearly all wrestlers jump around like a Mario game Think of a wrestling game more like a fighting game with spandex and you'd probably enjoy it more. Analog controls would make pulling off specific moves impossible.

Quote
BG&E is one of my favorites this generation for GC, which means it is one of the few games that I own (I own about 45+ games) that actually kept my attention long enough to actually finish the game. Not only did I finish the game but I wanted more at the end, I was mad that it was over.
YES! BG&E was one of the few new RPGs this gen that I picked up and got hooked on easily. A great story, pity it ended so quickly. And no sequel either. Boo-urns.

Quote
Or a pirate game.
More Guybrush, I say. I tried playing Galleon a while ago on a demo Xbox and got angry at the controls. For some reason the decided to over-complicate movement of the hero. The first few minutes almost caused me to cry in pain. Moving on, I wonder what Lucasarts are up to these days (apart from counting all the takings from RotS)?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 13, 2005, 02:05:59 AM: No! No more Threepwood until Lucasarts gets its head out of its ass and finds its sense of humor again. Escape was nowhere near as good as the other three. Even more monkeys couldn't save it.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 13, 2005, 03:34:48 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: ThePerm
its a way of saying i have 6,809 picture files or documents

It's a porn game, isn't it?
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Ian Sane on June 13, 2005, 07:38:09 AM: "This thread just highlights the reason why we arent game developers. Basically all the ideas people have brought to the table are clones of other games or genres that have been combined and mashed together. You want to push the envelope and create games that are unique and different, or a fresh take on an existing genre. There is only so many times i can play the same game before it gets boring."

Well realistically who is going to reveal their awesome original ideas on a public forum where anyone could just steal their idea? I intentionally posted my least creative game idea.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 13, 2005, 08:18:27 AM: Me? Seriously, I know how likely it is that anyopne who reads a forum will appreciate that idea and even if that he'll have the leverage to make someone actually make a game. Seriously guys, when you can't even get a publisher to sign you on unless you have a license to a movie or something you will NEVER find funding to make a game some random idiot suggested on a forum (never mind that most will simply think your "great idea" sucks). How likely is it that you could EVER turn your ideas into a game? Wouldn't you like it if someone did that job for you (forget it, not gonna happen)?

Anyways, there's such an abundance of ideas, good and bad, on the web that someone stealing YOUR idea is less likely than winning the lottery.

So I maintain that anyone who fears that a professional game developer would rip off his ideas AND manage to put them into a game is a paranoid nutjob and in 90% of all cases these ideas are just CS clones or somethig comparably inane.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 13, 2005, 08:42:35 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: Shift Key
Quote
Just think of it very simply as good vs evil.
ARG BRAIN ANEURYSM! How awfully generic to pidgeon-hole the history (and fiction) of the world into one category. Ugh.

Quote
I want a wrestling game that controls as well as Mario with full analog control and free jumping.
Because quite clearly all wrestlers jump around like a Mario game Think of a wrestling game more like a fighting game with spandex and you'd probably enjoy it more. Analog controls would make pulling off specific moves impossible.

Quote
BG&E is one of my favorites this generation for GC, which means it is one of the few games that I own (I own about 45+ games) that actually kept my attention long enough to actually finish the game. Not only did I finish the game but I wanted more at the end, I was mad that it was over.
YES! BG&E was one of the few new RPGs this gen that I picked up and got hooked on easily. A great story, pity it ended so quickly. And no sequel either. Boo-urns.

Quote
Or a pirate game.
More Guybrush, I say. I tried playing Galleon a while ago on a demo Xbox and got angry at the controls. For some reason the decided to over-complicate movement of the hero. The first few minutes almost caused me to cry in pain. Moving on, I wonder what Lucasarts are up to these days (apart from counting all the takings from RotS)?

All of fiction can be summed up into a handful of stories. I tried to simplify it to its most bare essential. Good vs evil. You could say another more specific is forbidden love. Never was there a story of more woe, than of Juliet and her Romeo.

What I meant by my comment on Mario and wrestling is that wrestling games are always punch in unrelated button command to do a move. In a Mario game you are in direct control of the character, you don't have to double tap or hold another button to run. You simply use the analog stick to move at the desired speed. When you want to jump in Mario you jump. In a wrestling game you have these specific moves, maybe yours is a jump, maybe not; maybe its a dive but it could be just a clotheline. I want the wrestling game to be more like a Mario game so I jump when I want and then decide whether I want to turn that into a move, dodge, or let myself fall on my face. Mario is the most pure character control game. Mario games are about being the best games at moving the character. That is what wrestling is about. Wrestling is about position more than special moves.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Ian Sane on June 13, 2005, 10:10:11 AM: I see what you're getting at with controlling a wrestling game like Mario but the problem is with Mario they only have one character so the controls and everything can be customized to that one character. Wrestling games not only have several characters but often allow you to create your own. The controls have to be more open to allow for that kind of flexibility.

I think that kind of design would work better for a Final Fight style beat-em-up where you're just fighting a bunch of computer guys and the game doesn't have to take into account a lot of customization or even worry about two human players fighting each other.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: TMW on June 13, 2005, 11:50:24 AM: Whats this I hear about the IP Miyamoto is working on -maybe- being a horror franchise?

Does this make you all warm and fuzzy inside like it does me?
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: PaLaDiN on June 13, 2005, 12:27:33 PM: No, I can't see Miyamoto working on horror.

I can't actually see him working on any existing genre, actually. He usually does his own thing with reckless abandon.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 14, 2005, 01:52:42 AM: Well, horror is a theme, not a genre. He could make a completely new kind of game that still scares the user.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: OptimusPrime on June 14, 2005, 03:58:29 AM: Didn't Iwata say at E3 that Miyamoto was pushing his teams to make something completly new? As i see it Miyamoto isn't going to thinker the new IP from zero on is own but all the creative people behind the scene are tinkering of something and Miyamoto just has to approve them (the "use the approve stamp" job shigsy had once) and help with the final concept of the new IP.
So if it is the team thats making the new IP and Shigsy just putting a close eye on it it could be anything. I remember Acclaim receiving help from Shigsy and a few core-EAD pleople with the making of Shadowman (when Acclaim was actually good in the N64-era). If shigsy was really in charge of the game from zero don't expect nothing violent.
But it seems its not the case, shigsy just told a team to make something new and he'll support that, even if it is violent. So bring on my real-time turned based mecha tactical RPG that also involves magic and airpirates! (Not going to give details on that, i send a few rpg-ideas once about 6 years ago to a small team and bam 2 years later they used it, not us deep or complex as i proposed but it was half there).
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 14, 2005, 09:42:28 AM: Optimus Prime: Don't think anything of that, most developers will throw game ideas that reach them into the circular filing cabinet without reading them. The reason is that you can't claim they've made a derivative of your idea which would mean you're entitled to royalities. IOW they'd open themselves up to lawsuits if they read these ideas and implemented them, even if they had thought of it before.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 14, 2005, 10:58:50 AM: I look at the industry and what it has become in only a short period of time.

The game industry is selling out to the movie industry like Native Americans giving up their land to early white settlers for liquor.

No, a better analogy can be found in Revenge of the Sith. The game industry is like Skywalker, destined to become stronger than all who have come before; and the movie industry is like the learned Palpatine, using its forked tongue to play the powerful young apprentice like a harp. Following this logic one could forsee that the apprentice will befall a tragedy soon becoming more machine than man. Their is hope though.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Kairon on June 14, 2005, 11:07:01 AM: Does this mean that the gaming industry will eventually after a period of darkness fulfill the prophecy and brince balance to the many mediums of entertainment?

Carmine M. Red
Kairon@aol.com
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: Robotor on June 14, 2005, 03:01:50 PM: Nemo I like your idea of a game focusing on an evil antagonist, but your analogys need some work.

My dream game would be a perfectly balanced beat-em up, with a character creation system so large every single person could look different. It would have RPG elements much like River City Ransom, but would be a bit more complex. There would be a special move creation system, that uses the 100's of preset moves in different combinations. The stats would grow in a way similiar to a racing game, whereas you are either fast and weaker, or a giant tank of a man. The graphics would be cel-shaded, with slight manga overtones. The game would be overly violent, much like Kill Bill.

The game would have a massive single player game, that allows for co-op. The single player game would have HARD puzzles, great platforming sections, and intense boss fights. There would also be an online game with a turf wars style set up. It would use the city from the single player game and have a turf war system. You could join different gangs, and try to hold the most turf. Or act as a free agent, and help other gangs for money. Or you could be a lone rider, and simply kill all in your path.

The story line of the game would involve demons and the yakuza. It would be cheesy, and the dialouge would be similiar to old kung-fu moviesand old gangster films. The soundtrack would be jazz. No Rock, no orchestration. I mean a sound track of nothing but hard swing, bop, funk, and afro-cuban jazz. This would lend itself very well to the style of the game.

Also no guns, its all hardcore hand to hand combat. Or sticks, rocks, or whatever else you find lying around.

I might be able to get some character sketches up if this thread isnt dead by the time my arm heals.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: blackfootsteps on June 14, 2005, 04:18:43 PM: I'd rather a story of 'Good v Neutral'
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: ThePerm on June 14, 2005, 06:37:25 PM: mostly pictures of architecture...some naked harem dancers creeped up in there however
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 14, 2005, 06:52:18 PM: In an interview George explained how when he wrote the original trilogy he imagined Luke as representing himself, the independent film maker. He thought of Vader as the machine that fathered him, the big movie industry.

When he wrote the new trilogy he went back to this analogy viewing himself this time as Vader and Palpatine as the temptor. You could say he took it all a bit far in that he has adopted a method for this. To further put over that he has become the machine he once fought against he made the new trilogy mechanical, stiff, and flat. He made the new trilogy in computers. Like I said he took the method too far. He almost screwed up the new trilogy if you ask me.

Look at E3, there were many pieces of hardware and very few games. The industry is in a race to quit trying to make games and create the system with the most unrealized potential. Power is viewed as the solution to fix games right now, but it is not right. My NES has the greatest games of all time despite its lack of hardware and entertainment features unrelated to games. Power is not going to make games fun. Imagination will. I say there is still hope, but they may mean the hope is years down the road. We may be facing another crash.

How it happens is it begins with the industry becoming more focused on numbers sold rather than money made. Sony is in debt up to its eyeballs and not generating profit fast enough. They may seem on top of the world, but their game devision has generated only half the profits Nintendo has in the past five years. MS is not making any money and even if the 360 does make them money it will never fill the hole Xbox left in shareholder pockets. The only hope, Nintendo, is looking like they don't care about early adopters or hardcore gamers anymore. They're holding Zelda hostage. People don't buy Nintendo consoles to get Mario Party games. They buy Nintendo consoles for one of the three big franchises like Zelda and the hope that they will not only get the next Zelda installment, but the next Zelda from Nintendo. Basically I'm saying Nintendo is preventing themselves from moving forward. Either they start making original stuff to go along with Zelda rather than filler like Mario Pinball, or gamers are going to not buy Nintendo and Nintendo will finally have to free Zelda. They are going to force themselves to have to go third party. This is one industry where loyalties and trust can take you far, but if you lose that trust you may discover you have nothing left to keep you afloat. Nintendo fans may not like the idea of Nintendo as a third party but a lot of people will give a resounding, "YES!" Gamers will nolonger have to buy a Nintendo console and search their butts off for a game to keep them busy just so they can eventually play Zelda. Gamers will only buy the big games from Nintendo then, and man, I don't think that is what Nintendo wants (they like selling rehash Mario sports games so much they'll probably port them all over to REV with better graphics even though we'll already be able to get them for cheap on N64 and Cube). It seems Nintendo would rather make several small safe games rather than make one new epic that has potential to outsell everything else they put out. They would rather sell a couple hundred thousand copies of several cheaply made games rather than make one risky game that could possibly sell ten million copies.
Title: RE: The original IP thread
Post by: KDR_11k on June 14, 2005, 11:41:23 PM: The industry is in a race to quit trying to make games and create the system with the most unrealized potential.

Bip-Bip-BIPBIPBIPBIP *boom*
Crap, there goes my bullshit detector.
Read that again and think about what you are implying. The games industry isn't homogenous, EA isn't Microsoft, etc. When the MS hardware department stuffs in bigger specs, does that mean, say, Ubisoft will just sit back and expect the specs to make the money for them? No, Ubisoft makes games. The games must sell to keep the company afloat. The specs merely mean stiffer competition and more possible game ideas. Graphics are a part of a great game, not the great game itself. Look at Doom 3 vs. Half-Life 2. HL2 sold a LOT more than Doom 3 despite being technically inferior because many people believe it's fun. Making a fun game still is a high priority at games companies because a good game will make them come back for more. Which means a franchise opportunity.

MS and Sony aren't the games industry. They are hardware providers that make the occassional game themselves. Their goal is to make the best possible hardware. Supplying it with games is the job of the games companies. A researcher in Sony's hardware division (or even one at IBM) will not think "well, yes, great specs but where are the games?", they'll think "I'll make sure it runs as fast as possible, where the missile comes down isn't my department".

Nintendo has no wiggling room. The only people who buy their consoles want to buy the games they regularly produce, making new kinds of games runs the risk that these might not appeal to the standard Nintendo fanbase. If they had a huge userbase that has fans of every genre they'd risk much less by making a game that is not a "safe bet" because as long as the game is good they know enough people will like it.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 15, 2005, 02:53:09 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: OptimusPrime
Didn't Iwata say at E3 that Miyamoto was pushing his teams to make something completly new? As i see it Miyamoto isn't going to thinker the new IP from zero on is own but all the creative people behind the scene are tinkering of something and Miyamoto just has to approve them (the "use the approve stamp" job shigsy had once) and help with the final concept of the new IP.
So if it is the team thats making the new IP and Shigsy just putting a close eye on it it could be anything. I remember Acclaim receiving help from Shigsy and a few core-EAD pleople with the making of Shadowman (when Acclaim was actually good in the N64-era). If shigsy was really in charge of the game from zero don't expect nothing violent.
But it seems its not the case, shigsy just told a team to make something new and he'll support that, even if it is violent. So bring on my real-time turned based mecha tactical RPG that also involves magic and airpirates! (Not going to give details on that, i send a few rpg-ideas once about 6 years ago to a small team and bam 2 years later they used it, not us deep or complex as i proposed but it was half there).

Bwahahaha! I knew Shadowman had something special. I never knew Shig lended a hand on that game, but I have always thought it was one of the most original games on the N64. God, that game was awesome. The moment I saw lips moving in in-game graphics on N64 along with the voice acting in that game I was hooked. Most people never picked it up. It was like Zelda meets the movie Seven.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 15, 2005, 03:06:20 AM: Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
The industry is in a race to quit trying to make games and create the system with the most unrealized potential.

Bip-Bip-BIPBIPBIPBIP *boom*
Crap, there goes my bullshit detector.
Read that again and think about what you are implying. The games industry isn't homogenous, EA isn't Microsoft, etc. When the MS hardware department stuffs in bigger specs, does that mean, say, Ubisoft will just sit back and expect the specs to make the money for them? No, Ubisoft makes games. The games must sell to keep the company afloat. The specs merely mean stiffer competition and more possible game ideas. Graphics are a part of a great game, not the great game itself. Look at Doom 3 vs. Half-Life 2. HL2 sold a LOT more than Doom 3 despite being technically inferior because many people believe it's fun. Making a fun game still is a high priority at games companies because a good game will make them come back for more. Which means a franchise opportunity.

MS and Sony aren't the games industry. They are hardware providers that make the occassional game themselves. Their goal is to make the best possible hardware. Supplying it with games is the job of the games companies. A researcher in Sony's hardware division (or even one at IBM) will not think "well, yes, great specs but where are the games?", they'll think "I'll make sure it runs as fast as possible, where the missile comes down isn't my department".

Nintendo has no wiggling room. The only people who buy their consoles want to buy the games they regularly produce, making new kinds of games runs the risk that these might not appeal to the standard Nintendo fanbase. If they had a huge userbase that has fans of every genre they'd risk much less by making a game that is not a "safe bet" because as long as the game is good they know enough people will like it.

You got me; when I was saying the industry was in a race to create the most powerful hardware I was talking about Sony and MS. I guess because in America they hold the confidence of the mainstreme. But I cannot ignore that the rest of the industry including Nintendo is not focusing on original software. Nintendo seems to have led the software industry (despite the fact they didn't lead the hardware industry this gen) down a path of safe franchises. Even now I am wondering if the MS that supported original games this gen will support original games next gen. All have seen how profitable Nintendo has been in recent years. Has Nintendo really won? Has Nintendo proven their conservativism is the right way? Are we hardcore gamers doomed to a future of waiting ten years between trully phenomenal games?

PS since when has the word bullshit been uncensored on the boards?

Edit: If what I just said makes no sense ignore it. Its seven in the morning and I'm drunk.
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Dasmos on June 15, 2005, 03:51:36 AM: Drinking in the morning.............the best hangover cure..
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: Shift Key on June 15, 2005, 04:52:53 AM: Quote
Its seven in the morning and I'm drunk.

Posting on PGC would be the last thing on my "Things to do while drunk early in the morning" list.
Top three things would be eating, more drinking and watching old-school Transformers.

Quote
But I cannot ignore that the rest of the industry including Nintendo is not focusing on original software. Nintendo seems to have led the software industry (despite the fact they didn't lead the hardware industry this gen) down a path of safe franchises. Even now I am wondering if the MS that supported original games this gen will support original games next gen. All have seen how profitable Nintendo has been in recent years. Has Nintendo really won?

The whole "safe franchise" idea cannot be blamed on the industry alone. Its more of a vicious cycle, where the gamers will buy a few games like hotcakes because it is a popular game, and the industry will react by producing more games that are similar to the 'hotcake-selling' titles, because there is little R&D required and there is a known interest/demand for that kind of game.

The cycle repeats over and over and over. There is no real motivation to make original software outside of "We'd like to make a game of style X, which there isn't much of currently on the market" because there is a big risk involved if it fails. And with the costs of developing a game rapidly increasing, fewer original software is going to appear on the shelves. Catch 22 anyone?
Title: RE:The original IP thread
Post by: nemo_83 on June 15, 2005, 11:28:00 PM: I got drunk playing questions last night. My friend's girlfriend kept asking questions like, "do you have a *** *****?" and "do you want to ***** **** ***** ** ** ***** ***** tonight?" so I would have to drink because I couldn't concentrate on trying to ask someone else a question with her teasing me; it was cruel. Later I came home, drank some tea, ate a hotdog for breakfast and got online to spend the time until class. I sat through three hours of anthropology and got dehydrated. By the time I got home my head felt like it was going to explode. Then I puked in the toilet and went to sleep for the rest of the day. What a waste. I didn't even see Batman. At least I aced my test this morning.