Post by: JDMJOSH on March 21, 2005, 05:24:23 AM
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on March 21, 2005, 05:37:50 AM
Post by: Bill Aurion on March 21, 2005, 05:47:08 AM
Post by: nitsu niflheim on March 21, 2005, 06:08:52 AM
Post by: JDMJOSH on March 21, 2005, 06:18:10 AM
Post by: Bill Aurion on March 21, 2005, 06:22:04 AM
And *I* find it "absolutely hilarious" that some (okay, more than some) people are so pathetic to go trolling on other forums...Don't you have anything better to do?
Post by: KDR_11k on March 21, 2005, 06:36:19 AM
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on March 21, 2005, 07:00:27 AM
Quote
absolutley hillarious to see DS fanboys complain about a crappy launch for the PSP. If that's true, then the DS has beyond a shadow of a doubt the worst launch game wise in the history of video game consoles. God you guys are so dellusional
Seems someone is trying to convince themselves they made the right Pre-order.
Post by: Noble~Feather on March 21, 2005, 10:50:47 AM
What the hell are you doing on a Nintendo board for? ... Trolling, maybe? <_<
Post by: darknight06 on March 21, 2005, 11:03:45 AM
Post by: RickPowers on March 21, 2005, 11:28:19 AM
As for the games, I've said this elsewhere, but the one I'm eagerly awaiting is Mercury. Especially if a tilt sensor is released shortly (which supposedly the game has been designed to use) ... that could be the "killer app" that the PSP needs.
Or it could be something else. A keyboard with software to turn the PSP into a PDA. An accessory to turn the PSP into a cell phone (also rumored). Any one of those things could push the PSP over the edge. True, it's not available just yet, but who says you have to have a killer app at launch? That's old-school thinking. These days, the launch of just about any product is practically guaranteed to sell-out, so why not save the killer app for when you need to boost sales later?
Post by: boggy b on March 21, 2005, 11:55:50 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
So, if that launch is so phenomenal, where's the killer app? You know, the Mario 64, the Halo...
Well Ridge Racers, Lumines and WipeOut Pure are all arguably killer apps, and even if you don't view them as such they're still three great games, well worth owning a system to play.
PSP's launch is undoubtably stronger than DS's. Best launch ever? Nah, that would be Dreamcast's. Worst? Hmmm, hard to tell. PS2 and DS are probably on the shortlist, though.
Post by: RickPowers on March 21, 2005, 12:26:59 PM
Post by: clevelandst124 on March 22, 2005, 12:54:09 AM
A do everything gadget is not sexy. It's a geek toy. If you like the games fine but I just don't see how anybody can buy the PSP for being a multimedia machine. If the PSP becomes a cell phone, it'll be like going back in time when we had huge cell phones. Not withstanding that you will probably get a free cell phone if you sign up for cell service with a company.
If a keyboard turns the PSP into a PDA, it will make it less portable thus defeating the purpose. I think everyone would agree the DS has more potential in being a pda because of the touch screen. A keyboard would make the PSP more like a badly designed labtop.
UMD movies are useless. Movies on memory stick are not good either. You'll need to get the 1 GB card ($120) and then you can have one movie with you at all times. A portable DVD player ($100) comes with a nicer 7" LCD screen and uses your entire DVD library.
A PSP is pointless as an MP3 player as well. You'll need another 1 GB card which will put you on the low end of the MP3 market. Then are you really going to strap a PSP to your waiste and go running or lift weights? If I was going to sit there and listen to music I would have it playing on a static player.
Post by: KDR_11k on March 22, 2005, 01:18:00 AM
But then again Sony doesn't need a killer app until much later since the system will sell on hype alone and the hype will increase as a result of its scarcity, only when the hype fades away they need good games. I mean, that worked for the PS2, right? No doubt they can pull that off against Nintendo or Sega but if that's their strategy for the PS3 as well I see them losing their heads to Microsoft, the master of lies.
But whether the system sells or not isn't the deciding factor for the launch quality. We are gamers, what we want is games and currently I don't see the PSP fighting in that arena any better than the DS.
Post by: Pale on March 22, 2005, 03:55:56 AM
Are any of the PSP launch titles worth 250 bucks? Doubtful.
Is the PSP without any games worth 200 bucks? Some may say yes.
Post by: boggy b on March 22, 2005, 07:02:24 AM
Post by: Savior on March 22, 2005, 07:13:59 AM
yes it is. Just ask Apple.
Post by: KDR_11k on March 22, 2005, 09:07:34 AM
Savior: Do everything? I don't remember Apple's computers selling well and the iPod is far from do-everything. The N-Gage, on the other hand...
Post by: SgtShiversBen on March 22, 2005, 09:23:43 AM
Post by: Savior on March 22, 2005, 10:04:17 AM
Post by: RickPowers on March 22, 2005, 11:32:55 AM
Actually, the first Wipeout was great, and the series started going downhill. They made a LOT of major changes, most of them not for the better. As should be clear from the name, Wipeout PURE is a return to the previous style that so many people loved. It's been rated higher than Ridge Racer, higher than Need for Speed Rivals, and right now, is the highest rated game on the system, IIRC. And yes, some people would consider it a system seller.
Post by: clevelandst124 on March 22, 2005, 12:36:24 PM
However, the iPod is starting to lose market share. That's always the story with Apple. Come up with a great idea, let others in the industry catch up, and end in the crapper.
That's my biggest problem with the PSP. It wants to be a do everything. But it does everything poorly. It doesn't want to be great at games. It wants to poorly replicate the home console experience. PSP will sell because of the cool factor but it better show up with some great games because the cool factor wears off after a couple of months.
Post by: Pale on March 22, 2005, 02:08:01 PM
Post by: Don'tHate742 on March 22, 2005, 03:12:40 PM
The PSP is sexy, and powerful. Is it functional though? Not as far as I can tell.
Post by: clevelandst124 on March 23, 2005, 02:11:50 PM
The launch is almost here. I'm really interested to see if there is a market for high end handheld gaming. Back to the original topic, I don't think the PSP will sell out this week. 1 million systems is alot of systems. There is also still places that you can preorder, which doesn't count the Walmart-Meijer's where you can't. It may set the record, which I think is 650,000 in a week from the gamecube. It'll be a failure if it doesn't sell at least the 500,000 that the ds sold. I'm gonna guess 700,000 so Sony can claim that thier system is the quickest selling ever.
On another note, the cube-europe forums are saying that Sony will not replace systems that have dead pixels. Is this true? I can't find any info on it. And if it's true, what do you think of this bold move?
Post by: KDR_11k on March 23, 2005, 11:33:13 PM
Post by: huskyla24 on March 24, 2005, 08:15:14 AM
Post by: KDR_11k on March 24, 2005, 08:28:59 AM
Post by: Don'tHate742 on March 24, 2005, 11:04:02 AM
KDR_11k -- Your bit about what a Killer app really is, is true. I've always thought Nintendo should focus on new franchises, because hey....if anyone can make a killer app, it's Nintendo. All they need is to stop re-using their franchises. I understand that people will be furious if Mario, Zelda, Metriod, Pokemon and such aren't made, but the fact of the matter is, they can develope new titles with old titles still available. Look at Pikmin and Animal Crossing. It can be done, hopefully a new franchise is in the works already (Raven Blade O.o).
As for the PSP not having a killer app.......that's so true. I bought the PS2 because of GTA and some other titles. I can't see myself buying the PSP for GTA; it's nothing new. Lumines is interesting, but I can see it being ported to the PS2 in about 6 months or so.
NDS is looking more and more like the console to own. They have 8 titles (maybe less, more) coming from Namco alone. I can't wait to see what Capcom, Konami, and others have to offer.......not to mention NINTENDO! E3 will speak louder than a million words, and personally, I think Nintendo has the advantage going in.
Post by: KDR_11k on March 24, 2005, 10:44:44 PM
Post by: nickmitch on March 25, 2005, 06:52:18 AM
Post by: Artimus on March 25, 2005, 07:02:36 AM
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on March 25, 2005, 08:31:33 AM
Post by: RickPowers on March 25, 2005, 08:43:50 AM
There is also the idea that $199 is the "mass-market" price for any electronic gadget, and Nintendo came in under, Sony came in over. The reason is likely because Nintendo is aiming for families and casual gamers, Sony is aiming (for the time being, anyway) for the early adopters for whom the price delta rises to roughly $399. The numbers of the sales currently support the theory as well.
So this begs the question ... does Sony know what they're doing? I'd have to say yes. It's classic Sony (and Apple) pricing strategy, price the device ever so slightly out of the price range for the mass-market, but well under the early-adopter market. That will ensure brisk (but not overwhelming) sales at launch, generate the buzz necessary to create mass-market demand, and then drop the price in time for a major buying season and capitalize on the demand.
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on March 25, 2005, 08:52:46 AM
Post by: RickPowers on March 25, 2005, 09:24:55 AM
How's that? Sony's online network for the PSP is up NOW. All Nintendo launching their online service will do is satisfy CURRENT owners. I fail to see how Nintendo launching a service Sony already has hurts Sony in any way.
Just a warning, but your rhetoric is coming dangerously close to crossing the line into Trolling. Be aware of that.
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on March 25, 2005, 09:49:30 AM
Quote
Just a warning, but your rhetoric is coming dangerously close to crossing the line into Trolling. Be aware of that.
How so? I'm not saying anything against Sony by stating that Nintendo's online plan will make a difference, a game like Animal Crossing with Online play is going to do more than just satisfy current owners Rick, seeing as how the GC version was popular with people who usually don't play video games as well as hardcore gamers. The lack of a true system seller has hampered the DS, Animal Crossing with Online is likely to be a system seller.
Post by: Pale on March 25, 2005, 10:40:45 AM
My predicted timeline for Nintendo is having Animal Crossing out early September to launch the whole DS Online thing, and then have Mario Kart with Online support as the big DS holiday game. That is quite a ways a way and I am still quite nervous as to what Square Enix has in the pipe for the PSP... Their PlayOnline GUI lends itself nicely to that little screen and I think they are the only company that could get me to buy a PSP... Hell, they are the sole reason I got a PS2.
Post by: Tanookisuit on March 25, 2005, 04:49:26 PM
Post by: vudu on March 28, 2005, 11:46:01 AM
QuoteAll signs point to Sony is currently losing money on the PSP. If they drop the price down even further, they'll lose more money. That's enough of a math lesson for today.
At $199, they'll probably move far faster, which is why every analyst worth their salt is predicting a holiday price drop. There is also the idea that $199 is the "mass-market" price for any electronic gadget
My question is (mainly for Rick), how will Sony make a profit on the PSP if they're losing so much money on the console? In the home console world, systems are typically sold at a loss, but 1st parties make it back from game sales. Historically, game to system tie ratios for portables are dramatically lower than for home consoles. I, as many here, doubt UMD movie sales are going to be a big seller. So can Sony sell enough games per system to make the entire PSP endeavor profitable?
Post by: Don'tHate742 on March 28, 2005, 12:51:59 PM
Post by: ruby_onix on March 28, 2005, 01:58:05 PM
Sony is basically losing lots of money on the PSP (despite Kutaragi's efforts to cover it up), because they want to knock Nintendo out of the handheld arena, and win a "mindshare" victory, which will give them an advantage in future handheld generations, even though Sony's saying that they want the current PSP to hang around for two generations. (The PSP's a currently-shiny "ghetto in the making"). If UMD takes off and is embraced by someone other than Sony Pictures, then Sony will have won dominance over another market.
Personally, I think Sony is primarily focused on the handheld market, and is pulling out all the stops to get it, but it looks less insidious when you think they're trying to go after DVD too. Which is strange, because success with UMD translates into more of an advantage against the handheld market.
The price drop Rick is talking about is a perceived price drop. Stop offering the $250 "Value Pack". Start offering the $200 "Base Unit". You get less, but the smaller number looks better in the eyes of casuals (the group that Sony appears to be failing to reach).
Post by: Don'tHate742 on March 28, 2005, 02:29:17 PM
Post by: Artimus on March 28, 2005, 03:41:43 PM
Post by: huskyla24 on March 31, 2005, 03:10:29 PM
Only 50 of 150 retailers surveyed by American Technology Research reported sell-outs of the PlayStation Portable in its first week. Analyst P. J. McNealy described the launch as "solid but not spectacular".
Of the 100 stores AmTech surveyed that were not sold out of PSPs, 15 reported having three units or less. Others reported higher levels, with some having as many as 100 in hand.
"We believe that the PSP has come close to shipping its target 1 million units in North America, with a range of 475,000 to 575,000 sold to date in the U.S. with roughly another 250,000 to 300,000 in the channel,"
Post by: AgentSeven on March 31, 2005, 03:54:24 PM
Post by: huskyla24 on April 02, 2005, 03:51:21 AM
Post by: PaLaDiN on April 02, 2005, 09:31:58 AM
Sony might already have won, as far as public perception is concerned. The reason it isn't selling could be that it's that new toy everybody wants to buy but they can't afford. If and when the price drops... who in here doubts that PSP sales will go through the roof?
Post by: darknight06 on April 02, 2005, 05:54:17 PM
Post by: oohhboy on April 03, 2005, 04:19:40 AM
They have alreay gutted the other divisions for PSP parts to be made at cost. Although at cost doesn't mean free. It takes time and logistical resources to produce those parts for no real compensation to said divisions. Time is money. Now that Katigua is not the CEO, I doubt this would continue any further.
Regardless if the PSP is beening sold at cost or at a loss on the retail front, Sony as a whole loses money on each unit. Since each part is at cost (With the exception of the screen), PSP price is not going to drop short of some technological miracal during this year.
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on April 08, 2005, 07:06:22 AM
Rob Fahey 10:26 08/04/2005
600,000 units in week one, leaving plenty of stock on the shelves
Sony Computer Entertainment America has announced official sales figures for the PlayStation Portable launch last month, confirming analyst reports that the system only sold through just over half of its shipment in the first week.
Over half a million units were sold in the first weekend, while first week sales of the PS2 value pack are reported to have driven $150 million through tills - accounting for around 600,000 units, which is in line with estimates from companies including Credit Suisse First Boston.
The figures are healthy by comparison with previous product launches in the space - the Nintendo DS, for example, shipped half a million units in North America before Christmas and took over a week to work through that initial shipment.
However, Sony - used to sell-out launches for all of its new console hardware - may be somewhat disappointed that the PSP failed to sell through more of its initial allocation of a million units.
News that 400,000 PSP units remained on US retail shelves in the week after launch will also rankle with European consumers, who saw the launch in this territory shoved back to ensure that the USA was well-stocked at launch. Europe may now have to wait until September before the system arrives here.
SCEA boss Kaz Hirai dismissed any notion that the launch had been disappointing, however, stating that "the launch of PSP was everything we hoped for, with extraordinary consumer demand driving sales of hardware units alone upwards of $150 million in first week sales, far and away above those generated by any other product in the space."
"In only two weeks, PSP is having an immediate impact across the entire industry as consumers are clearly voting it the product of the year in 2005," he concluded
Gamesindustry.biz
well its official the PSP launch was a relative flop
Post by: Grant10k on April 08, 2005, 07:42:24 AM
Quote
"In only two weeks, PSP is having an immediate impact across the entire industry as consumers are clearly voting it the product of the year in 2005," he concluded
oh, yeah, clearly...it's only a 1/4th the way though 2005 but obviously it's the product of the year. The must-have handheld that is going to blow away every other product out there for the rest of the year in every field.
Quote
SCEA boss Kaz Hirai dismissed any notion that the launch had been disappointing, however, stating that "the launch of PSP was everything we hoped for
That's not bending the truth, that's flat out lying. Everything they hoped for would be to sell out of every unit, and every game. If it was really everything they had hoped for, then they would have only shipped 600,000 units in the first place.
Post by: Ian Sane on April 08, 2005, 07:59:47 AM
Well have any other game systems been introduced this year yet? Technically it's at least so far the best new videogame hardware of the year.
I think the PSP is just too expensive. Adding all that extra crap like UMD movie playback was a mistake. The PSP has a pretty good launch lineup of games and it has that "Playstation" name brand. Realistically if it was a games only machine and cost the same price as the DS I think it would have had no problem selling out. You hear people saying things like "the PSP has some games I'm really interested in but I can't afford it" all the time. The price isn't set for gamers, it's set for gadget freaks. The problem is the PSP SUCKS as a gadget (UMD movies only) but is good as a gaming machine. The target market that wants the PSP and the target market the PSP is priced for are different.
Post by: Avinash_Tyagi on April 08, 2005, 08:13:59 AM
Post by: Darc Requiem on April 09, 2005, 04:10:46 AM
Post by: couchmonkey on April 12, 2005, 07:02:00 AM
I think it's way too early to say that Sony is TEH DOOMED. It's not like the company is going to give up any time soon and the initial sales are solid even if they are below Sony's expectations. We've barely scratched the surface of the tens of millions of handhelds that Sony and Nintendo could potentially sell worldwide. Sony may be surprised that it can't just march in and take the market away from Nintendo, but I don't think it's going to give up. Sony is in this for the long run and a shaky launch doesn't mean much in the long run.
Post by: darknight06 on April 12, 2005, 07:16:12 AM
Yeah, especially EA and Activison since they both actually created another studio just for PSP development.
Post by: Darc Requiem on April 12, 2005, 01:32:43 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: couchmonkey
It will likely take 1-2 years to develop a game for the PSP. I highly doubt third parties are going to suddenly pull the plug on games that they've already invested 8-12 months in for the PSP unless the system is a REAL flop. And 600,000 units is not a real flop. It's just not as super-amazing as Sony hoped.
I think it's way too early to say that Sony is TEH DOOMED. It's not like the company is going to give up any time soon and the initial sales are solid even if they are below Sony's expectations. We've barely scratched the surface of the tens of millions of handhelds that Sony and Nintendo could potentially sell worldwide. Sony may be surprised that it can't just march in and take the market away from Nintendo, but I don't think it's going to give up. Sony is in this for the long run and a shaky launch doesn't mean much in the long run.
I'm hardly saying the Sony or the PSP are doomed. I'm just saying that the longer the DS continues to lead in both hardware and software sales the more difficult it will be for Sony. I think the media and third parties assumed that the PSP would run away with the market once it launched at a lower than expected MSRP. The DS continues to sell well and its software has far outpaced the PSP titles thus far, particularly in Japan. One title for either system could change things. But if things continue this way Sony will have X-box like success. They'll move a good amount of systems but lose money because their software sales won't make up for their losses on hardware. I think the DS and the X-box 360 will put a big squeeze on SCEA's profits. The Revolution launching along side the PS3 will tighten the vice even more. Sony can't afford to make the mistakes they did with PS2, they'll have to run a PS1 gameplan to maintain their dominance. If they continue down the arrogant path that Nintendo did, they'll end up at bottom looking up....just like Nintendo did.
Post by: cronotrigger913 on April 13, 2005, 06:20:54 AM
It also angers me that EA loves to put $10 more dollars on the MSRP for all its handheld games. $40 for DS games is annoying. I really want to get Rogue Agent becuase of its touch-pad gameplay, but I know its going to be too expensive.
Post by: KDR_11k on April 13, 2005, 08:03:39 AM
You're never playing your handhelds at home? I do. When I want to play that GBA game I just do. The only reason GBA games are cheaper is because they're seen as inferior, people won't pay as much for them. And to people complaining about handheld prices: Try comparing the prices of portable DVD players or laptops with their home counterparts, notice which one is more expensive? Battery and screen factor into the price.
Hehe, I just remember what we were told in university: Battery life is the most important thing! Whatever you do, do it with the least battery usage possible. Underclock processors, disable components, use only as much power as you absolutely have to. Sony should have paid attention.
Post by: ruby_onix on April 15, 2005, 02:58:29 PM
The latest NPD apparently says that the PSP sold 620,000 units in March. It launched on the 24th, so that's an 8-day total. It sold 1.1 million games, so that's an attach rate of about 1.77 games-per-system.
IMO, that is a really impressive number. Possibly record-breaking. When taken by itself.
But Sony really shot themselves in the foot, by saying and demonstrating that they expected it to sell over a million units in "a day or two". And it's not just that the PSP was an "unreasonable disappointment" by shipping one million units. They clearly illustrated that the PSP sold amazingly well to hyped-up hardcore gamers (500,000 in the first day or two), but then it ran face first into a brick wall.
There's currently "something wrong" with the PSP. Most obviously, that it's too expensive to appeal to regular people. And everyone seems to know it.
If Sony had shipped 500,000 units, they would've been sold out, and Sony might have been able to spin the results and try to attract casuals with the allure of success, despite the high price tag (I think they're still gonna try doing that anyways). I'm not one to advocate artificial shortages, but with the PSP's launch, it seems clear that they would've helped.
IMO, the PSP was simply overhyped.
But then again, if Sony wasn't talking about getting ready for record-smashing million unit launches, it's possible that it might not have even sold 500,000 at launch.
Post by: clevelandst124 on April 16, 2005, 02:57:29 AM
The short jist is nobody can acurately guess who's going to win the overall battle. This upcoming Christmas season is the most important toward determining a winner.
However, sony can't be happy with this. The ds sold over 1.2 M last year. It was over about five weeks but the difference is that you couldn't find a ds anywhere. That's not the same with the psp. I see them everywhere not withstanding I could order one online. The psp is even going for cheaper than the $250 price brand new on ebay. The ds would have been worth over $200 used if you had one to give in dec last year. Sure different seasons play a part but I think Sony is the only current generation system that has not sold out at launch week.
Also, I'm glad that the EA titles did relatively poorly on the psp. I was really worried that the support ea was giving the psp would help push the psp with the casual gamers. It looks like NFS sold over 100k but that none of the other ea titles managed to break 50k. They may think twice before offering all of thier games to the psp. And I know it's only been out for a week, but I thought ridge racer was the flagship title for the psp. And I do believe that the ds ridge racer has sold more US copies than the psp.
Post by: KDR_11k on April 16, 2005, 10:05:50 AM
Post by: clevelandst124 on April 16, 2005, 11:47:51 AM
Numbers may not be entirely accurate because I'm going on memory.
Gamecube 650,000 complete sell out.
xbox 600,000 complete sell out.
ps2 400,000 complete sell out.
ds 500,000 complete sell out.
psp 620,000, 62% sell out.
I concur this is only a battle and psp may be on top by the end of the year, but this is definately not a very positive thing for sony. All the others, not psp, were impossible to get for at least 2 months. Also the psp game ratio being less than 2 is not something to brag home about. At least ds had the excuse that it was backward compatible and it only launched with 6 games.
