Author Topic: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise  (Read 5556 times)

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Offline alexosborn

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Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« on: December 04, 2014, 04:14:02 AM »

The intense development process took a lot out of Mr. Sakurai.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/39151/super-smash-bros-creator-likely-done-with-franchise

Super Smash Bros. creator Masahiro Sakurai doesn't think he'll work on another game in Nintendo's popular fighting series.

"I can't positively declare there won't be [another Smash Bros. game]," he said in an interview with Game Informer. "With both Melee and Brawl, I made those games with the thought that there wouldn't be any more sequels. Thus, I really can't deny the chance for another. However, as for myself, I don't think there will be."

The development of Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS was an intense experience, and one that apparently Sakurai isn't all that eager to go through again.

"Our intention [with Super Smash Bros. for Wii U] was to provide extra merits to the game which go far beyond the sale price," Sakurai added. "In terms of scope, and in terms of sheer number of characters, we went beyond our limits long ago. And yet, if we cut the number of fighters or modes in a future game, I'm sure there would be complaints."


Offline kokumaker

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #1 on: December 04, 2014, 12:56:23 PM »
Lots of gamers are whiny, self-entitled little bitches. There will be complaints either way.

Offline Triforce Hermit

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2014, 01:04:02 PM »
I don't blame him for leaving it at that if he does. He did a good job and he can be proud of it.
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Offline Soren

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2014, 01:08:14 PM »
He's earned his SSB retirement. The only thing I'll miss is his genius trolling. No successor will be able to replicate it.
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Offline UncleBob

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2014, 01:15:28 PM »
Didn't he say he was done after Melee, ten again after Brawl?
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Offline Khushrenada

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2014, 01:31:43 PM »
It would make sense after Melee since he left Nintendo like 2 years later and did no work on a follow-up until approached at E3 when the Revolution was announced and begged to work on Brawl. Why he did another one after Brawl I'm not sure on but considering the amount of time he's spent working and making these games, it is not surprising he feels that way. It's an insane work schedule.

Offline Luigi Dude

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2014, 02:39:36 PM »
Well with Brawl since the Wii sales were insane at the time, he was allowed to develop at his own pace since the system really didn't need Smash Bros to help boast sales at any time.  Hell, Brawl was even allowed to be delayed until early 2008 when it was originally planned for late 2007.

So I imagine Sakurai had more fun developing Brawl so when offered 3DS/Wii U he had no problem since he was expecting a more relaxed dev cycle like Brawl.  Instead **** happened and the Wii U's poor sales kind of required both games be released before the end of 2014 with the 3DS version needing to come first since it was inferior and Nintendo worried less people might buy it if the Wii U version came first.

Considering the amount of content between both games, the development was probably Melee on steroids for Sakurai, made worse by the fact he in his 40's now, making the process even more harmful to his body.  So yeah, not hard to see why he doesn't expect himself to go through with directing another Smash Bros again.  Of course knowing Iwata, I doubt Sakurai won't have any involvement in future Smash Bros.  I'd imagine Iwata will still let him be a producer for the series, to check up on development to ensure things are going well.
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Offline Adrock

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2014, 04:26:16 PM »
Sakurai says this now, but the experience of developing a new Super Smash Bros. is still fresh. He may change his mind as people often do once he's more removed from it. I can't imagine Super Smash Bros. without any involvement from Sakurai so if nothing else, I'd expect at least a Miyamoto-esque supervisory role where he keeps the team focused and nixes ideas that aren't in the spirit of the series.

It would likely also help if he didn't develop two games concurrently, even if they share some content. I doubt Nintendo would give up on a portable Super Smash Bros. since it sold so well. Super Smash Bros. for 3DS was fine for what it was, but Nintendo definitely needs to be more mindful of the hardware. Given how the 3DS version shuts almost everything off just to play on a standard 3DS, Sakurai certainly ran into situations where he fought with the hardware in order to include things. Having that not be an issue would make things easier for him.

Offline Ian Sane

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2014, 04:40:41 PM »
Interesting that he says "I can't positively declare there won't be [another Smash Bros. game]" like he ultimately decides that.  SSB is a very popular Nintendo series and Nintendo isn't going to end it as long as it's profitable.  There will be a new SSB on the Wii U successor (and maybe the 3DS successor as well) and if Sakurai doesn't want to be on board, the game will be made without him.  I'd prefer that not be the case but I know how the videogame business works.

His comments on how he made Melee with the thought of it being the last sequel probably explains why I loved it so much but was never that enthusiastic about Brawl (I haven't played the new game enough to have a fair opinion on it).  With Melee it felt like Nintendo was trying to make the ultimate SSB game.  It felt like the N64 game was the rough draft and Melee was the concept fully realized.  Aside from online play I couldn't conceptualize where else the series could go after Melee.  When I played Brawl it felt unnecessary to me, like it really didn't offer much that Melee didn't already have.  It seems like Melee is the game Sakurai wanted to make and everything since then exists for business reasons.

From an artistic perspective it would nice to see a company recognize when a concept has gone as far as it can and move on to new untapped ideas.  The overall quality of the company's output would probably improve but it would be leaving money on the table.  A series can lose its sales potential but it doesn't do that immediately after the peak.  You can always get a couple more hits in.

But wouldn't "assume this is the last game" be a good approach to development, to encourage ambition and quality?  You won't sleepwalk through an unessential entry if you're thinking like that.

I think the ideal future of SSB is a full-on crossover.  How about Capcom vs. Nintendo where they make two games?  Nintendo makes an SSB game while Capcom makes a game that plays like Marvel vs. Capcom?  Both companies have tons of iconic characters and both gameplay templates are distinct from each other.

Offline Adrock

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2014, 05:04:40 PM »
Interesting that he says "I can't positively declare there won't be [another Smash Bros. game]" like he ultimately decides that.  SSB is a very popular Nintendo series and Nintendo isn't going to end it as long as it's profitable.  There will be a new SSB on the Wii U successor (and maybe the 3DS successor as well) and if Sakurai doesn't want to be on board, the game will be made without him.  I'd prefer that not be the case but I know how the videogame business works.
I believe Iwata previously stated that Nintendo would not make any more Super Smash Bros. games without Sakurai's involvement. There is precedent for this. Shigesato Itoi has stated he will not make any more Mother games, that the series is over for him, and Iwata appears happy to leave the series alone (also, with the way Mother 3 ended, you'd have to ask yourself why a sequel should be made). Granted, Mother is no where near as popular as Super Smash Bros. However, it's difficult to imagine both series without their respective creators.
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From an artistic perspective it would nice to see a company recognize when a concept has gone as far as it can and move on to new untapped ideas.
As previously stated, the Mother series.

Offline Ian Sane

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2014, 05:15:43 PM »
Mother doesn't have SSB's sales potential.  It is nice that Nintendo has respected the creator's decision regarding that series.  If they could do the same for SSB, great, but I think it's just too valuable of a series for Nintendo to want to sit on it.  Remember that Brawl was announced without Sakurai's knowledge.  They then asked him to work on the game but had he declined do you think they would have just cancelled it?  I'm assuming they were making an SSB game, period, and if Sakurai wasn't on board they would have just made it without him.

Offline Mop it up

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2014, 05:42:57 PM »
I get the feeling he wasn't happy about having to develop two games at once. That was probably forced onto him after he agreed to do the Wii U game, and it's the vibe I get from his comments and comparisons to the 3DS version. And honestly, I feel both games suffered from it.

I also agree that Nintendo will continue the series with or without Sakurai, it's just too huge. The template's already been well-established anyway, so there's a formula to follow.

Offline Adrock

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2014, 07:14:28 PM »
Mother doesn't have SSB's sales potential
Granted, Mother is no where near as popular as Super Smash Bros.
Sigh. Yes, I know. However, I was specifically responding to your skepticism that Sakurai would ultimately decide whether there's another installment. Objectively speaking, we know this has happened before and Iwata respected Itoi's decision to end the Mother series.

In this particular situation, we have the president of the company stating (many years ago) he didn't feel Super Smash Bros. could continue without the series creator's help, and the series creator stating he doesn't know if he'll make another installment. Reading between the lines, it doesn't sound like Iwata has faith in anyone else to direct the series, possibly due to the commitment necessary to do it justice. Couple that with Nintendo's habit of outright canceling games that do not meet certain standards and I don't believe it's too farfetched to think the series ends here if Sakurai chooses not to be involved at all.

I agree that Nintendo probably doesn't want to give up the series due to its popularity and profitability. However, we've seen many companies try to emulate the style and concept and they don't touch Super Smash Bros., like not even remotely. Super Smash Bros. is a big investment for Nintendo in terms of both development and marketing cost, and I can't imagine it's too eager to leave the series in incapable hands. Iwata sees Sakurai as the heart and soul of the series. To expand on what I said previously, if Nintendo (or Iwata, specifically) could get Sakurai to oversee a sequel and act more as more of a supervisor to the new director, guiding and prepping this person to inherit the series or so to speak, that would be a compromise I could see.
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Remember that Brawl was announced without Sakurai's knowledge.  They then asked him to work on the game but had he declined do you think they would have just cancelled it?  I'm assuming they were making an SSB game, period, and if Sakurai wasn't on board they would have just made it without him.
According to the Super Smash Bros. Brawl's Iwata Asks:
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Iwata: Well, I had considered what I would do if you turned me down and decided that I would need to take the existing Smash Bros. title, Super Smash Bros. Melee for the Nintendo GameCube, and try to make it Wi-Fi capable while preserving as much balanced game play as possible in the event you didn’t want to get involved. Maybe it’s more appropriate to say that I realized we wouldn’t be able to add any new elements to the game without your help and I think I said as much when we discussed it at the hotel. It wasn’t right, but you might even say I used it as a threat of sorts.
And there's your answer. We wouldn't have Brawl; we would have had Melee Online. Considering Melee's religious following, that would have been enough for some people.

Offline Spak-Spang

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2014, 08:45:32 PM »
I personally wouldn't mind if someone new stepped into the role of making the game.  The frame work and design principles are in place.  The concept of what the game is and isn't has been established.  I think find fresh blood to help make it something new and interesting while still keeping it Smash would be great.


So I hope Sakurai does step away from the series.  I also hope Iwata isn't stupid enough to drop a franchise because the original creator isn't directing it anymore.  Would Nintendo stop making Mario and Zelda games without Miyamoto's direction?  Of course not.  And I am also pretty sure Iwata didn't mean that quote, that he was just flattering Sakurai.


No I expect Smash Bros to show up on the next Nintendo System, and I expect it to be handled by a new team and new director, and I predict it will be great, possibly better than any previous Smash, because the new director will have something to prove. 

Offline Shaymin

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2014, 10:43:25 PM »
Sakurai to Metal Gear, Kojima to Smash. Problem solved.
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Offline Evan_B

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2014, 10:46:49 PM »
The best possible solution I see is getting a new director with Sakurai as a producer- he says he can't rely on others to do the work in Smash Bros for him, but if he were keepin a close eye on a new director I think he could find a delicate balance.

I would like to see Smash Bros evolve with a new director, but I don't want someone who is eager to change the fundamentals of the series.
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Offline ClexYoshi

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2014, 02:10:20 AM »
I get the feeling he wasn't happy about having to develop two games at once. That was probably forced onto him after he agreed to do the Wii U game, and it's the vibe I get from his comments and comparisons to the 3DS version. And honestly, I feel both games suffered from it.

I also agree that Nintendo will continue the series with or without Sakurai, it's just too huge. The template's already been well-established anyway, so there's a formula to follow.

Sorry, Mop, I have trouble buying a lack of gusto and enthusiasm diving into this project.

While my google-fu is failing me, I distinctly remember in the interviews right around Kid Icarus Uprising's release that Sakurai stated that he had a very clear idea of "maybe" doing two versions of smash bros. The 3DS now has an analogue input device, so he would want a more "personal" experience due to it being harder to achieve multiplayer on a portable, while he wanted the console experience to be shared with friends. the idea he gave specifically was the idea of some sort of fighter personalization that could be moved up to the console, and... I feel that this makes sense considering the amount of custom character swag one can achieve with farming the 3DS' easier classic mode and Smash Run. on the overall, I've had a MUCH easier time getting equipment I want on the 3DS version, and that funnels back into that original statement, especially considering that tournaments allowing the custom moves or a limited range of equipment would be able to easily cycle through custom fighters by transferring them through personal 3DSes rather than having it all unlocked on every copy of the game being used for the tournament as well as having folks making these custom sets before every match.

He went into it with the ambition of two games, never minding Nintendo's desire to reach out to the Japanese public who are abandoning console gaming. Kid Icarus got him used to the 3DS hardware and he liked it, and Nintendo gladly gave him all the resources their coffers could afford, and then some of Namco's as well.

Offline Mythtendo

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2014, 02:13:25 AM »
Sakurai ALWAYS says he won't work on another Smash game, then he ends up coming back. Odds are that Sakurai will be the director of Smash 5 too.


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Offline Mop it up

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2014, 05:07:29 PM »
Sorry, Mop it up, I have trouble buying a lack of gusto and enthusiasm diving into this project.
I didn't say anything about a lack of gusto or enthusiasm, so that sounds like a misunderstanding. Even if he had an idea for a handheld Smash Bros game, I have my doubts that he wanted to create both at the same time, and especially on such a strict schedule.

Offline broodwars

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Re: Super Smash Bros. Creator Likely Done With Franchise
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2014, 08:41:19 PM »
Honestly, I'm glad he "might" be gone now. As much as I like the new Smash & Brawl, there is a feeling of just utter creative fatigue about them that probably has a lot to do with Sakurai constantly getting dragged back to such a massive project.
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