Topic: Microsoft's Xbox Kinect - Nov 4th 2010

[KDR_11k]

I think with Kinect we have to see what happens in the following months. The game library is still extremely fragile with nothing but shovelware on the horizon and the usual suspects screwing up motion control even worse than they used to.

Didn't Epic Games say they didn't think GOW could work with Kinect?

That doesn't mean they won't do it anyway.

[Stratos]

I loved how they were trumpeting that western/sci-fi rail-shooter while those have gotten as boring as PB&J or bologna sandwiches every day at school for 5 years straight on the Wii. Be interesting to see how rail shooters get accepted on Kinect. I will especially LOL if GOW Kinect is a rail shooter.

[Luigi Dude]

The thing I think is going to hurt Kinect's legs the most still the fact your required to stand up and actually interact with all the games.  Most people when they play videogames like to sit down and relax, not jump up and go crazy.  This is why all the motion controls on Nintendo games for the Wii only requires you to do very simple movements to do them so that anyone can play the system.  Now yeah, there are some people who might get up and swing the controller around, but for everyone else, a simple flick of the wrist can do the same thing.

Now I do expect Kinect to sell well for these early months based on all the hype Microsoft generated, but after the holidays season is done I expect a lot of people to start getting sick of the thing rather quickly and the word of mouth to get poor.  I knew people who when Wii Sports came out, would stand up and play it all the time for the first few weeks because of the early excitement.  After a while though, even though they still liked the game, they started playing it sitting down because the original excitement of pretending to be a real Baseball or Tennis player wore off and they just wanted to simply play the game for the gameplay and didn't care about the novelty of pretending your a real person anymore.  This is why when Wii Sports Resort came out, they still bought it because they liked the first Wii Sports but played all the games sitting down when they first played it, even though a few years earlier they were jumping all over the place when they first played the original.

This is why I see this being a major problem for Kinect.  With the Wii, once people got tired of playing while standing up and waving their arms around, they had the option to sit down and still enjoy the games in a more relaxing and simple setting.  With Kinect on the other hand, once people get tired of moving around, they'll have no such option and so will be unable to play and just stop playing the games altogether.  As a result owners of Kinect will stop buying software because they don't care about standing to play anymore and they'll tell their friends that the system gets old fast which will kill the momentum.

[Chozo Ghost]

Maybe someone can develop a game for Kinect that will recognize a chair or a couch, and so in the game its like the chair or couch becomes like a tank or a vehicle and you are the driver, and you can move your arms like you would with a steering wheel and that will make your Couch Tank drive around on the screen, and then you can make like you're loading an imaginary cannon and then use that to fire at other Couch Tanks in the game.

So that way you can be able to sit down and also be able to play Kinect, because this way you're bringing your sitting thing into the game with you and it becomes your command ship. Oh yeah, speaking of that, how about a Star Trek  simulator for Kinect where you can pretend you're sitting in the Captain's chair and issue commands via hand gestures or voice recognition? You can be like "Make it so!" while you just sit there and sip on a cup of Earl Grey tea, and not actually have to get up or do anything. And also just like in Star Trek, you can hail alien ships and talk to them through the TV as if that were your ship's viewscreen. "Red Alert! Arm the Photon Torpedoes!"

[KDR_11k]

Remember that voice recognition is only available in a small number of areas (not just languages, accents!)

[King of Twitch]

That would be awesome.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I found this too funny to not post it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWbLOFGSEDo


talking about sitting around and doing nothing while you play...

[BeautifulShy]

I found this too funny to not post it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWbLOFGSEDo


talking about sitting around and doing nothing while you play...

Okay thats pretty wierd. Is the gameplay built in to the game so that it looks like you are doing a good job when you possibly are not?

[BlackNMild2k1]

I have no idea, but between this video and the one I posted in the Black Ops thread,I've had a good laugh at gaming becoming a little too accessible (even if the CoD video was just the first level. It was still on the hardest setting).

[KDR_11k]

And people complain that Nintendo makes games that play themselves...

[BlackNMild2k1]

Xbox 360 Surpasses 2.5 Million Kinect Sensors Sold
http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/2010/nov10/11-29msxboxblackfridaymopr.mspx

Microsoft Corp. today announced that strong demand over the Black Friday weekend has propelled retail sales of Kinect for Xbox 360 to more than 2.5 million units worldwide since it launched just 25 days ago.

“We are thrilled about the consumer response to Kinect, and are working hard with our retail and manufacturing partners to expedite production and shipments of Kinect to restock shelves as fast as possible to keep up with demand,” said Don Mattrick, president of the Interactive Entertainment Business at Microsoft. “With sales already exceeding two and a half million units in just 25 days, we are on pace to reach our forecast of 5 million units sold to consumers this holiday.”

“Kinect on Xbox 360 was a top performer at Target this weekend,” said Nik Nayar, vice president, merchandising, Target. “We expect Kinect will be a must-have gift this holiday season, so Target will continue to receive consistent shipments of Kinect throughout December. The hands-free, active gaming experience that Kinect offers is something that everyone in the family can enjoy.”

http://majornelson.com/archive/2010/11/29/kinect-sells-2-5-million-in-first-25-days.aspx

That is sold through to customers and not shipped numbers BTW.

[TJ Spyke]

I wonder how many of those are through the hardware bundles. $150 is too much for it.

I may be getting an inheritence soon and am thinking about getting one, although I may have to rearrange my room for it.

[Mop it up]

I found this too funny to not post it
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KWbLOFGSEDo
talking about sitting around and doing nothing while you play...

This is getting ridiculous. Mario Kart Wii had the right idea with its option to use automatic or manual drift, which allows it to appeal to both newcomers and fans. Also, those constant control pop-ups would drive me insane.

[BlackNMild2k1]

So I saw Kinect in motion for the first time earlier today (picking up my Logitech Z-5500 from Fry's ) and I can't say I was very impressed. I can see how it could be fun and how it might make a great gift for family members who are either young or not all that much into gaming, but I'm not sold on it.

It had a little bit of lag, not so much that you wouldn't forget about it if that were it's only issue, but it's not, so it is very noticeable while watching from the sidelines.

The main fun killer was the detection was kinda poor at times. There were 2 players playing and while one was being detected just fine, the other one would jump and nothing would happen, then he would duck and 2 seconds later after he had already run into the obstacle, the character would duck. He was audibly frustrated even though he wasn't even losing (going by points) but the girl next to him was just jumping away and several layers ahead of him (I think they were playing Kinect Adventures - they were on the rail game where you have to punch walls and duck or jump over things in your way.) They looked like they were having fun most of the time, and the girl that was playing told me she was soo tired and sweating like crazy playing that game.

I can see why this will be a BIG seller throughout the holidays, but I'm taking the wait and see approach as I think HYPE for this device might take a significant nose dive once the dust settles, and I think that may be rather quickly if they don't show more games with than clones of what has already been shown.... but that sound vaguely similar to what people said about Wii 4 years ago.

[TJ Spyke]

Remember that store demos are poor indicators of how good or bad something is, especially something like Kinect that has to be calibrated.

[Ian Sane]

The main fun killer was the detection was kinda poor at times. There were 2 players playing and while one was being detected just fine, the other one would jump and nothing would happen, then he would duck and 2 seconds later after he had already run into the obstacle, the character would duck. He was audibly frustrated even though he wasn't even losing (going by points) but the girl next to him was just jumping away and several layers ahead of him

The thing is I encounter this with the Wii all the time.  Even playing Wii Sports Resort using Motion Plus I find that the accuracy is the shits and it drives me nuts.  I cannot enjoy a videogame if I don't feel like I'm in control.  But that's just me.  If it mattered that much to everyone else then the Wii would have been in bargain bins within a year.  Instead we got Wii-mania.  For the target market of motion control I don't think responsiveness and accuracy matter.

[BranDonk Kong]

They probably weren't standing in the right places. I played Kinect Adventures (I own it), and it was *very* accurate. Dance Central is also extremely accurate. My daughter plays Kinectimals, and if she does the right motions (you do need to be somewhat precise so that the game understands that you're actually trying to do the action), it detects them perfectly. It's actually kind of funny watching her lay on the ground and then her on-screen cub plays dead.

[BlackNMild2k1]

It's time to pack it up Nintendo, you've had a good run....

A Real Threat Now Faces the Nintendo Wii
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/03/technology/personaltech/03KINECT.html?_r=1

THE question can now be asked: Does it make sense to buy a Nintendo Wii anymore?
Enlarge This Image

For four years, there has been no question.[...]
[...]
Until now.[...]after the introductions this fall of the Move system from Sony for the PS3 and the brilliant Kinect from Microsoft for the Xbox 360, the Wii no longer does anything important that the PS3 or Xbox 360 cannot do even better.
[...]
On the one hand (so to speak), the Move basically copies the Wii’s wandlike controller, although it feels slightly more accurate.[...]
[...]
Moreover, the PS3 plays Blu-ray movie discs and can display 3-D images, two things the Wii cannot do. And the PS3 has a full lineup of great traditional games if you want to pick up a real controller. So with the Move, Sony gets zero points for creativity but full marks for successful imitation.
[...]
Then you have what deserves, as far as I am concerned, to be the technology hit of the year: the Kinect from Microsoft. If you have not heard by now, Kinect takes the concept of the Wii (and the Move) and pursues it to its natural culmination, getting rid of the electronic game controller altogether. The Wii rescued gaming from being in a perpetual niche by introducing a controller that was simple to use. Kinect is driving gaming into the future by literally seeing and listening to you.
[...]
So the real threat to Nintendo and the Wii is not Sony, it is Microsoft and Kinect. Kinect is even easier to use than the Wii, and it brings your whole body into an electronic entertainment experience in a way that has never existed before.

Does it make sense to buy a Wii anymore? If price really matters or you just need your Nintendo fix, then sure. But there are more innovative and exciting options these days.

[Kytim89]

It's time to pack it up Nintendo, you've had a good run....

A Real Threat Now Faces the Nintendo Wii
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/03/technology/personaltech/03KINECT.html?_r=1

THE question can now be asked: Does it make sense to buy a Nintendo Wii anymore?
Enlarge This Image

For four years, there has been no question.[...]
[...]
Until now.[...]after the introductions this fall of the Move system from Sony for the PS3 and the brilliant Kinect from Microsoft for the Xbox 360, the Wii no longer does anything important that the PS3 or Xbox 360 cannot do even better.
[...]
On the one hand (so to speak), the Move basically copies the Wii’s wandlike controller, although it feels slightly more accurate.[...]
[...]
Moreover, the PS3 plays Blu-ray movie discs and can display 3-D images, two things the Wii cannot do. And the PS3 has a full lineup of great traditional games if you want to pick up a real controller. So with the Move, Sony gets zero points for creativity but full marks for successful imitation.
[...]
Then you have what deserves, as far as I am concerned, to be the technology hit of the year: the Kinect from Microsoft. If you have not heard by now, Kinect takes the concept of the Wii (and the Move) and pursues it to its natural culmination, getting rid of the electronic game controller altogether. The Wii rescued gaming from being in a perpetual niche by introducing a controller that was simple to use. Kinect is driving gaming into the future by literally seeing and listening to you.
[...]
So the real threat to Nintendo and the Wii is not Sony, it is Microsoft and Kinect. Kinect is even easier to use than the Wii, and it brings your whole body into an electronic entertainment experience in a way that has never existed before.

Does it make sense to buy a Wii anymore? If price really matters or you just need your Nintendo fix, then sure. But there are more innovative and exciting options these days.

BnM, at this point if you had to choose between the three motion controllers, which would you choose?
 
I still can not shake this feeling as though Sony and Microsoft's motion control system will eventually fizzle out.

[Ian Sane]

the Wii no longer does anything important that the PS3 or Xbox 360 cannot do even better.

Well, yeah.  That was obvious back when Move and Kinect were mere rumours.  Motion control was all the Wii ever had going for it.
 
But Nintendo does honestly make the absolute best motion control games.  And if motion control is all you are interested in the Wii is the most affordable.  But as an overall package the other two are way better buys.  But if you cared, you already knew that.  It's nothing new.
 
So, now it is time for a new console from Nintendo.  Sony and MS have succeeded with their motion control so now they're competition.  This "well, we're not competing with them" bullshit no longer flies.  Same type of product, same audience.

[Luigi Dude]

the Wii no longer does anything important that the PS3 or Xbox 360 cannot do even better.

So, now it is time for a new console from Nintendo.  Sony and MS have succeeded with their motion control so now they're competition.  This "well, we're not competing with them" bullshit no longer flies.  Same type of product, same audience.

Only they haven't yet.  The Move has already failed at capturing the casual audience and isn't doing too hot with the traditional audience either so unless Sony releases some magical killer app in the coming months, it's basically a non factor in the motion wars.  Kinect on the other hand might be doing well right now, but just because something has a successful launch doesn't mean it's going to continue doing well.  We all have the remember lots of games and systems have had successful launches and yet that didn't mean much for them several months later when they failed to have any legs.

Not to mention we still have no idea if most of Kinects sales are coming from the device by itself or the Xbox bundle.  Now if it's the bundle that's making up a lot of the sales, then Nintendo might have something to worry about if it continues doing well.  But if most of the sales are coming from the device by itself then that doesn't really effect Nintendo since it's just current 360 owners buying the device which means Microsoft has failed at really stealing away the casual audience from Nintendo.

[Chozo Ghost]

Motion control was all the Wii ever had going for it.

Um, excuse me. I do believe the Nintendo 1st party exclusives meant something.

But hey, maybe its just me.... (along with the millions and millions of others)

[Stratos]

The N64 had a great launch. We all know how that turned out.

[Chozo Ghost]

I think well before Kinect and Move start to gain momentum Nintendo is going to pull something else out of their sleeves. Well, 3DS isn't far off and that's going to steal attention and that's going to end up being the hot item for quite some time. I know that comparing consoles and handhelds is like comparing apples and oranges, but they're both fruit and they both satisfy your hunger. 3DS is something you can sit on the bus and play, can the same thing be said about Kinect?

[nickmitch]

Well, the 3DS and the Kinect aren't exactly in the same market. I mean, I can't play Wii on a bus either. In terms of taking away mindshare, 3DS should help tone down Kinect and Move sales. However, there will still be a market for motion controlled console gaming, and if Nintendo is being outclassed by its competition, then that's still problematic.