Author Topic: The Matrix Reloaded!!!!!!!! Spoilers ahead!!!!!  (Read 24982 times)

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Offline Termin8Anakin

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The Matrix Reloaded!!!!!!!! Spoilers ahead!!!!!
« on: May 15, 2003, 02:34:21 PM »
Ok, I went and saw the midnight session with a bunch of my friends. And to say the least, it's much less 'anime' than the first one. Here's my comments, in spoiler form:

OK, what I thought was weird was how Zion's scenes are akin to Star Trek or even Star Wars. WHat I found was a real revelation was how the 'Architect' said that the role of 'The One' was not to actually save the world, but to be the one that ends the current version of The Matrix, choose 6 women and 7 men, then The Matrix starts over again, with a 'new' Zion. Apparently, the Matrix we know is the 6th version. What was also cool was how there were other 'Ones' before Neo, who did the same thing, and that the current version of the Matrix was how it is because people were able to choose their world, which was the peak of human civilisation. I also like how they explain that everyone who has a key role to play in the fate of mankind has a specific programming. For example the Oracle, the Key Maker (go little Asian man!), even Neo as 'The One'.
I think the movie belongs to Smith. No longer an Agent. "Me, me, me!" "Me too!" Haha. That fight scene was just mind blowing. I don't think that any fight scene can top it. The chase on the highway was awesome. And how cool is it how Neo can create EMPs OUTSIDE of teh matrix eh? And man, that Bane (or something) guy, the other survivor. Ooooooh. He was turned into a copy of Smith, and Smith actually got into Zion!


I think someone else can explain this better than I did, but man, I'm too tired to boter re-writing it. I got out of the cinema confused a bit like I was when I saw the first one, so I'll have to see this again. And man! I was holding my bladder all throught the movie! I got out of there, and I was into the toilet in a flash. Damn Jumbo size coke.
I also think that this movie is a little less 'anime' and 'mysterious' than the first one. It's more like a sci-fi now.

EDIT: I guess no one here seems to have seen it then.
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Offline nolimit19

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« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2003, 12:14:38 PM »
*SPOILERS*

i can honestly say i was a little disapointed.....it seems like they added sexual parts just for the sake of adding sexual parts. like there was no real use for that, and to me it kind of ruined hte credability of the movie. like they sold out kind of....maybe its just me. i loved the story twists and al lthat. i thought it was great, but another thing i didnt like is that neo didnt kill enough people....like when he was fighting agent smith there was no finishing moves....all it was, was back and forth hitting, and nothing was ever accoplished. i really wish they would have cut out that 20 minute dancing scean. it was so boring and they did it just to show tits. i am just kind of pissed that instead of using that time to explain more of the story, they used it to show breats....AND THE WHOLE DIGITAL ORGASM THING WAS HOMO!!! dear god....i swear.....parts of the movie were wonderful, but others just turned it into some triplex wannabe or something. to me the turned the matrix from a legend to just great or maybe even less then great with this movie.....some people say that its impossible to top the first one, but i think that it was very possible....i just think they made it too sexual, and for no apparent reason....it just reminded me of seeing a mindless action movie.  
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Offline Grey Ninja

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« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2003, 12:22:09 PM »
I'm going to see it tonight.  I'll write my thoughts after I see it.  
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Offline manunited4eva22

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2003, 02:03:17 PM »
God I am so tempted to look in that spoilers.....guess I wont.

Offline Berny

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« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2003, 04:55:49 PM »
Yeah, nolimit, I agree. They didn't develop the plot to the extent that i KNOW they're capable of; instead, they put in that WEIRD scene you mentioned earlier. The action sequences saved the show though. They were SPEC–TACULAR.
I'd also like to thank you, anakin. I guess Igot distracted by the tvs in the background so I TOTALLY missed everything he said. So...thanks!    
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Offline Matt

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« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2003, 05:57:15 PM »
The Matrix Reloaded is a great film, with plenty of action and excitment, as well as mystery.

The film's action is great, and the digital effects are excellent.  

Sound is great as well, but make sure the movie theatre has Dolby Digital EX Surround, or you won't get the full effect.

The movie is excellent, but after seeing it, you better be ready for REVOLUTIONS in NOVEMBER!
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Offline aoi tsuki

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2003, 06:53:33 PM »
i did like the Zion rave scene, just not for the movie. i would've like it better as an extra on the DVD. Granted, it did segue to Neo and Trinity in their intimate love scene, which begs me to ask "why are they so horny?" i understand they're in love, but for the first half of the movie they act as though they had been separated for months, just as their lust for one another picqued.

Perhaps i shouldn't have watched the trailers, because the fights were, for the most part, umimpressive. If you've seen all the trailers, you've seen all the fights, which is one of the things that made the original so hot. There were too many slow-motion shots for scenes that didn't need to have it. Given the fact that the characters can alter the physics of the Matrix, i was expecting way more in the way of mind-blowing tricks like reversing gravity, altering object properties (steel shatters like glass), etc. If the Matrix is all ones and zeros (and upside-down katakana), why not fully exploit that?

The story itself was easily the best single element to the movie. i would've like more revelations about the Matrix or backstory on Niobe and Morpheus (and her current man), but i'm hoping to get more via Enter the Matrix (which i've barely played). The scene with the architect was great, as was the last 30 minutes of the movie. If i could pay just to see that, i would, but in any case i'll see it again to catch the bits i missed.

Matrix Reloaded reminds me somewhat of Star Wars: Episode II; not as good as the first movie that was released, and it makes you put your hopes in the sequel that will hopefully return the series to glory. Matrix Revolutions looks really good. The desparate attempt to save Zion makes it look even more tense, and the shot with Neo and Smith in the rain looks great. i can't wait to see what effects they do in the rain. i'll try my best not to watch any trailers for it.



Termin8Anakin: i had a huge Coke as well. i made the mistake of sipping it thirty minutes before the movie actually began.  
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Offline Infernal Monkey

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The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2003, 07:51:26 PM »
Quote

Originally posted by: nolimit19
AND THE WHOLE DIGITAL ORGASM THING WAS HOMO!!!


... That statement... Makes... No... Sense. At all.

Anyway, I thought it was a wonderful movie. I'm going to see it again on Monday, to pay more attention to the story. Once again the movie managed to give me a royal brain f**k.

My only gripes is that rave scene, not for the sex part, but because.. It.. just wasn't needed. Well, for not that long, anyway. If I want to watch people dance for five-ten minutes, I'll go laugh at people playing DDR at the arcade.


Offline ThePerm

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« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2003, 08:20:40 PM »
yes..the rave scene was a little weird..but ill tell you i thought it was a fucking awesome movie...however there are a bit of plot wholes..i felt there was little point in them really being inside the matrix...and why aren't they making mroe of an effort to controll their reality.
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Offline Termin8Anakin

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2003, 08:40:46 PM »
Hahaha! The digital orgasm! That was f**king awesome! In a funny way. I don't think it was there for the sake of being there. It was there as a means to explore that french dude's (what's his name?) mumbo jumbo about everyone in the matrix having specific programming or something, and that the core is a desire for, well, desire and love. He programmed the cake to make the blonde chick feel that way. But man, everyone was like 'Whoa-ho!' and laughing when she just *burst*.

The rave scene was a bit too long, i agree.

Hey Berny: I loved the part where all the Neos in the TVs all started cussing and making rude signs. That was f**king funny. BUt if you were listening, I think that meant that everyone in the Matrix, the 6th version, was actually given the freedom of choice. That explains why Neo, being told that he wasn't THE ONE by the Oracle, actually chose to become THE ONE, because what he did in the first movie (save Morpheus, Trinity, and fight Smith in the train Station) was deemed impossible. It's also why he chose the door on his left rather than on his right.
Which is why now they only have 24 hours to save the world in Revolutions.

I'm seeing it again tonight. Just to understand the story a bit more, and to see the Revolutions trailer at the end.
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Offline AdvancedGamer

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« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2003, 04:47:24 AM »
I don't really think this is a spoiler since everyone knows there's a sex scene but don't read if you don't want to.

( minor spoilers)

I think there is a significance for the sex scene. Doesn't Anyone think that because of this sex, Trinity will have a baby?????? That's why I think they put it in, it must have been really important to the next movie. Also they wouldn't have put it in if it meant nothing because more parents would of let their kids see it and they would have made more money.


(End Spoilers)

Also that movie must have cost a shitload too make. It was the best damn movie I've ever seen.  
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Offline oohhboy

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2003, 05:32:58 AM »
They only have another 24 hours unless they have some kind of aftermath thing coming the sex scene would have been totally unessercary. But once the third movie comes out, I am sure that we will find out if it was even relavent or not.

The movie was crazy. Plot, excution, graphic, script, Smith. All high marks. As mentioned before, Rave scene too long, seemingly pointless sex scene, Morphious's speech delivery could have been better if he did not try to shout. He just sounded bad when shouting. Some fight scenes unessercary long. Excellent movie. Giving LOTR some stiff competition. MOTY anyone?
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Offline nolimit19

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« Reply #12 on: May 17, 2003, 11:51:24 AM »
Quote

Originally posted by: oohhboy
They only have another 24 hours unless they have some kind of aftermath thing coming the sex scene would have been totally unessercary. But once the third movie comes out, I am sure that we will find out if it was even relavent or not.

The movie was crazy. Plot, excution, graphic, script, Smith. All high marks. As mentioned before, Rave scene too long, seemingly pointless sex scene, Morphious's speech delivery could have been better if he did not try to shout. He just sounded bad when shouting. Some fight scenes unessercary long. Excellent movie. Giving LOTR some stiff competition. MOTY anyone?


yea i agree with the morpheus thing.....i think the movie started out pretty bad....the second half was great, but the 1st half sucked...also i agree that some fight scenes got boring....neo should have been finishing off the smiths....but instead all it was, was hitting him in the face repeatedly.....i mean how many times can u see someone hit in the face and enjoy it. and the scene where u see neo and the moon in the background(he is flying when this happens) he looks like a cartoon.....for the most part the special effects were great in this movie, but at parts u could really tell when it was a computer generated neo. what sucks imo is that this movie could have been twice as good if they just did a few things a little differently. but it still is good enough for me not to go on a killing spree.
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Offline aoi tsuki

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #13 on: May 17, 2003, 12:22:28 PM »
Quote

and the scene where u see neo and the moon in the background(he is flying when this happens) he looks like a cartoon...


i considered it a tradeoff for more spectacular stunts. Doing stunts by wire will only get you so far. Luckily most of the CG was well done and not apparent, at least not on the subpar screen i saw it on.

i completely forgot Morpheus. His voice when he was shouting in the Zion cave didn't sound quite like him, at least not as good as the scream when he breaks the chains in the office building in the first movie, if my memory holds correct. The way Fishburne delivered some of his lines seemed off; he seemed a little too smug and as if he didn't believe what he was saying.  
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Offline Grey Ninja

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« Reply #14 on: May 17, 2003, 12:22:40 PM »
It wasn't as good as the first movie.  And I thought the digital orgasm was the highlight of the movie.    I don't care what you guys say.    I saw that and I was like:  "WHOA!!!  I have GOT to program some of that cake!"

I really think that what doomed this movie though was all the plot-holes that carried over from the first movie.  It just wasn't well thought out, and since they are building on that... it's starting to crumble.  Things that seem immediately obvious to me just don't happen in The Matrix.  I can go into detail on many things about it that bother me, but I don't really feel like it right now.  

I thought it was a good movie and worth a watch, but it just wasn't a classic.  I do want to see the last movie though.
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Offline ThePerm

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« Reply #15 on: May 17, 2003, 03:21:43 PM »
oh she had an orgassm...i was thinking it was either an orgasm or she got the feeling she needed to pee.

also...the morpheus thing..they didnt have microphones in the cave..he had to shout otherwise no one would hear him.....

and (BIG SPOILER)
i thought it was funny the oracle was actually a distraction..because i was wodnering what the hell their doing constantly going into the matrix...
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Offline aoi tsuki

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #16 on: May 17, 2003, 04:39:13 PM »
Quote

also...the morpheus thing..they didnt have microphones in the cave..he had to shout otherwise no one would hear him.....


Odd acoustics in that cave... virtually no echo (to my recollection), and he was able to be heard even in the back.

Regarding the cake scene (as it should be referred to in keeping with the rules), i've gotta say that was an awesome closeup of the cake, and it was equally as stimulating, if not moreso, than the woman eating it. It's absolute darkness and matted look, combined with the fineness of the cake's texture, made evident in the side view as it gave way to the utensil that forced itself upon it...

As i saw that, i felt what the woman did.
 
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Offline nolimit19

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« Reply #17 on: May 17, 2003, 11:08:54 PM »
its weird......when i posted here the first time i had just seen the movie.....and as u can tell i was really disapointed....but i just got back from seeing it a second time....and although i stil lwish they had done things differently, i liked it muhc better this time. EVEN THE CAKE SCENE DIDNT BOTHER ME AS MUCH!!! but as many have said there are some gaping holes in the story line.....i just hope that they fill them in somehow someway. for one....how do NEW humans ome about in the real world??? i mean people have sex in the matrix, and a new baby is born, but wouldnt those 2 bodies have to come together in reality to form a baby with the correct genetic code and all that.....thats just one of them...AND WHY DOESNT HE KILL THE ARCITCECH!!!! I AM CONFUSED!! also the morpheus speach didnt seem to be his fault....i mean....these people have space ships, but no microphones!!! REMEMBER THE SCENE WHEN THEY FIRST ENTER ZION!?!?!? ITS AN ALL WHITE ROOM WITH ALL THIS HI TECH STUFF!!! if they just gave him a mic and some decent lines(he had to say some cheesy stuff that must be near impossible to pull off), that scene would have been so much better.  
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Offline oohhboy

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #18 on: May 18, 2003, 01:07:35 AM »
Killing the Arcitech woudl kill the matrix on the spot without with Neo in it. In the cave, the Councile leader had no problems addressing the crowd. It was just that Fishburn tried too hard in that scene when he didn't need to, therefore giving a bad preformance.

There were not really any plot holes as such. You have to remeber, it is written to be a trilogy. The brothers were probaly not sure whether they were going to be allowed o finsh the movies, so the first movie seemed more complete than Reloaded. The martix has to be some of the tightest movies written for yearssss...

My favarite scene has to be with the aritect, especially when you have like 100 Neos cussing. Sort of a reversion back to has uncalm self.

I think what happened was that the brothers did not quite write their scenes quite as tightly in Reloaded as the first matrix.
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Offline NinGurl69 *huggles

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The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #19 on: May 18, 2003, 01:55:47 AM »
KEANU REEVES CAN FLY!?

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Offline Termin8Anakin

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #20 on: May 18, 2003, 04:08:32 AM »
Nolimit19: Regarding the entrance to Zion and the people in the white room, didn't you see their bodies lying on the seats connected to the matrix?
I agree with you on all your other points though, cause I saw it again last night. The rave scence wasn't really THAT long. I think the sex scene symbolises the love between two humans NOT connected to the matrix. I think this is shown at the end of it when you see Neo's back. I like Link. Cool name. Haha. I like how his wife/girlfriend is Tank and Dozer's sister. I guess Tank was killed then.

I think the reason why Morpheus is so confident is because he has put so much time and effort into making the 'prophesy' come true that he believes that it will come to pass. He looks really heart-broken when he finally has to accept that it's not true, and when the Nebechednezzer (that how u spell it?) is destroyed.

And Professional, yes, Neo can fly. Didn't you see the end of the first movie? I like how he goes up above the clouds. That was bloody awesome. Especially how he just rushes to the top of Oracle's building, and when he's rushin in to save Trinity. Man, see all the wreckage behind him?

And who saw the Matrix Revolutions trailer? Wow. This is gonna be awesome. I saw pics of teh Neo-Smith fight on FilmForce, and I was wondering what happened to them in Reloaded. So i guess it' here.
I think Revolutions is going to have a very anime-like ending, wher everyone is destryoed and the Matrix starts over. But then again, it's Hollywood, so I guess Neo saves the world.
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Offline Vanilla Thunder

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« Reply #21 on: May 18, 2003, 04:11:59 AM »
Personally, I believe the "rave" scene was very justified.  The Wachowski Brothers are very raw and realistic in their explanation of things.  They used the sex scene to accomplish a couple of things important to the storyline.  

First of all, it shows that Neo is not some god, but that he is still very human, and as human he is still susceptible to human urges, feelings, and emotions.  This makes his character just as vunlerable as he is strong.  Then, second of all, it explains, in a very direct way, why Neo is so emotionally attached to Trinity, to the point where he sacrifices Zion to save her at the end.  The sex helps to explain why their love is so intimate without covering all of the character development in their relationship (you know, the sweet talking).  Neo and Trinity loved each other to begin with, but then this new expression of love sealed the commitment.  And finally, this scene foreshadows a number of possibilities, from a dramatic and unexpected separation in the third movie (maybe one of them dies, or one is left behind in the Matrix while the other is free), or, more likely, the birth of a child.  In most modern myths, the legendary hero falls in love and has a child that'll go on to accomplish even greater things.  Any such things may apply here.

Anyways, there's nothing "dirty" about that sex scene.  It was very clean, and they love each other, so I suppose their passion was justified.  The dance scene was simply to show how high the spirits of the Zionists were, how hopeful and fearless they were despite the circumstances, and, in the end, create irony when those same bold people are slaughtered by the Machines.  It all plays into the storyline on so many levels that it's incredible, and is in no ways stooping to some level.  It's all in how you interpret it.

And with the cake and woman, you can take that as a sexually-oriented joke --- after all, that French guy is pretty funny --- or as dark symbolism for just how much power the Matrix has over the poor, helpless people trapped inside of it.  That woman was being preyed on by the French dude, and though you couldn't help but like it in some ways (she was hot), you also can't help but feel sorry for her.  Once again, playing into the story, as long as you look at things in the philosophical sense that this movie is geared towards.

Anyways, it was a GREAT movie!  Did anyone catch the monster references?  The Oracle spoke of vampires, ghosts, and werewolves being the product of programs doing things they're not supposed to.  I saw examples of all such.  The ghosts were the Twins, obviously, the werewolves were those older versions of the agents who fought with swords and daggers (remember, they could only be killed with silver bullets, which is what you kill a werewolf with), and Persophone and the Merovigian were vampires in a symbolic sense (ever hear the term "vampire of the emotions").  Also, there's a vampire movie playing on the big screen when Persophone walks into that one room with the two older agents.  Very cool stuff.    
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Offline Termin8Anakin

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #22 on: May 18, 2003, 04:45:41 AM »
Yeah. You've a very keen eye Vanilla. Very cool.

I think what you and DRJ said in the other thread was very understandable. I got WHY there needed to be different versions of the Matrix. After readin your posts, the Wachowski bros' script seems more intelligent.

Quote by DRJ
--------------------------------------------
Think about this. Only 99% of humans will except the matrix so 1% know that there is something wrong. The people in zion help remove these people from the matrix thinking that they are freeing them, but really they are just enterring another matrix. The "real world" is acceptable to these people and so the matrix is stable. Eventually there are to many anomalies (in this case 250,000) and so The One is created. Zion is destroyed and then rebuilt. The matrix starts all over again...
--------------------------------------------

And this:

Quote by DRJ
--------------------------------------------
I think the machines allow zion to survive because they (the people of zion) unknowingly do the work for the machines. They seek out people in the matrix that are anomalies (people that will not accept the matrix). They free them and so the matrix is stable.
---------------------------------------------

The first explanation, I think is right, but I don't agree on the middle bit. Your second explanation made more sense though. But the people in Zion ARE in the real world. But because they believe that they are in persecution from the machines, they believe that they have to free everyone. But, in a quote from the Animatrix, 'Only the most exceptional people become aware of the Matrix'. These people are the anomallies. Yes, DRJ, you're right about that. They believe something is wrong, and they are the ones that are ready to be 'freed'. They are in fact the ones that will help the machines create a 'better reality' - so that 100% of the humans will accept the reality. The ones who are not anomallies are the ones who accept it. When all the anomallies will have been collected, The One is created. He will be a collection of these anomallies, go back to the Source, and the machines can create a new reality.

Quote by DRJ
--------------------------------------------
The machines dont care if a few humans break free since they have billions locked in. When zion grows to a level that could be a threat they destroy them and start over.
--------------------------------------------
I totally agree with this.

Does anyone have anything else to add? This is just what I think.

EDIT:
Oh hey! Does anyone remember this quote form Morpheus?
'When the Matrix was first created there was a man born inside. It was he who freed the first of us'.
That not only gives us a back story to the creation of this version of the Matrix, but I think 'the man born inside' is the One from the previous version! 'The first of us' refers to the 23 other people!
At first I thought guys like the Merovigian was one of the people who were carried over to the next version, but I guess he was a program who chose exile over deletion as well, like the werewolves, the twins, and the goons who does his dirty work who get shot with silver bullets. Smith is one of these exiles i gather as well.
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Offline oohhboy

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RE: The Matrix Reloaded......Anyone seen it?
« Reply #23 on: May 18, 2003, 05:20:56 AM »
I don't think anyone is arguing that the rave scene and Neo + trinity was not needed. It was simply too long. I think Smith was going to be an exile regardless of whether Neo came about or not. In the first movie he was already showing signs of maddness. In reloaded, Smith does not seem to pose much purpose except to be a general pain in the butt to every body else. Of course he did say that he has lost his purpose.
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Offline DRJ

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« Reply #24 on: May 18, 2003, 08:28:40 AM »
I think that the rave scene was not necessary, but the love scene was. It shows us how deeply in love Neo and Trinity are. In the end Neo chooses to save trinity and sacrifice the whole world (The matrix, zion, everyone will supposedly die) and he chooses to save one person. It is because of love that he is blinded from the logical, the only choice. As the Architech states. The love scene is there to show us just where Neo's priorities are.

After The One is created he decides to help destroy and rebuild zion. He goes to the source and his code is analyzed, them he helps make a new matrix, and the always choose the hight us human society. Then he chooses 23 other people to help repopulate zion. This is all acceptable to me, but what I cant get is how doe Neo stop the robots at the end if he is in the Real World. Does he have a wireless moden in his head and can tap into the matrix...

One other thing I found odd was during the conversation between Neo and the Architech. The Architech states: "Denial is the most predictable of all human responses. But, rest assured, this will be the sixth time we have destroyed it. And we have become exceedingly efficient at it. The function of the One is now to return to the source allowing a temporary dissemination of the code you carry reinserting the prime program after which you will be required to select from the matrix 23 individuals, 16 female 7 male, to rebuild Zion. Failure to comply with this process will result in a cataclysmic system crash killing everyone connected to the matrix. Which, coupled with the extermination of Zion will ultimately result in the extinction of the entire human race."

The Architech states that Neo must select 23 people from the matrix to rebuild zion. Not 23 people from zion to survive and help rebuild it. Does this mean that he could select anyone from the matrix and the machines would free them and set place them in zion, or does it mean that anyoone from the matrix can be placed in zion because it simply is another matrix.
Ralph: Hi, Principal Skinner! Hi, Super Nintendo Chalmers!