Author Topic: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held  (Read 40151 times)

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Offline Kytim89

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What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« on: February 13, 2010, 11:42:52 AM »
This information is from Kotaku.com and it talks about what they want from the next DS hand held and I could not agree more.
 
Yesterday, Nintendo president Satoru Iwata made the first public mention of the company's plans for a successor to the wildly-popular DS handheld. So we know, vaguely, what Nintendo want from the console. That's fine. Here's what we want.
But first, some caveats! This isn't pure fantasy. We're not going to be asking for HD graphics with simulated surround sound speakers and a wholly digital shopfront. Those are things Nintendo just will not bring to the table, at least not over the next few years.
Instead, we're going to say what we want, but within the parameters of what we believe Nintendo, a company as conservative as it is successful, could actually deliver.
NOTE: The picture above is not intended as a true "concept", or mock-up. It's just a DSi XL, modified to give you an idea of where we're headed with all this.
GRAPHICS
Iwata says the next Nintendo handheld will have "highly detailed graphics". Now, this doesn't mean "high definition"; that would be far too costly and tech-savvy than Nintendo have shown themselves willing to be in recent years. And besides, on a small handheld screen, you're not going to notice (or care) whether something is really 720/1080p or not.
It just means "highly detailed", something the Nintendo DS was not. It was a Nintendo 64 on a smaller screen. Just like the Game Boy Advance was a Super Nintendo. And the Game Boy a NES. Put the dots together and it's not hard imagining the DS's successor having the graphical punch of, say, a GameCube. Or, for that matter, a Wii.
A GameCube in your hands? That's something we'd like to see.
CONTROLS
A big reason for the success of the DS was the accessibility of its touch-screen controls. Nintendo are also (usually) big on backwards-compatibility. So we'd say it's a lock that the next handheld will have some form of touch-screen interface.
But! We'd like to see some changes to the rest of the controls. Namely, the introduction of not just one thumbstick, but two. Sony had kind of the right idea including a nub on the PSP, but then blew it by only having one, meaning direct ports of not only PS2 games, but many successful PS2 control schemes, were out of the question. And the PSP has suffered from this ever since.
Including two thumbsticks might not be as aesthetically pleasing as Nintendo's Apple-copying designers may like, but sometimes you need to trade beauty for functionality. Plus, it would let Nintendo do what they're enjoying so far on the Wii, and that's re-release a ton of old GameCube games.
DISPLAY
It's 2010. Time to cut your ties with the 4:3 aspect ratio, Nintendo. Widescreen is the industry standard these days, so the DS's successor needs to stretch its screens out a little. Those screens also need to be of a slightly better quality, especially the "spongy" bottom screen, which on the DS sometimes looks a little washed out.
And yes, we said "screens", not screen. The two-screen gimmick worked well on the DS when developers made proper use of it, and with Nintendo on top of the world and in no need of further zany attempts at differentiation (as the dual-screen layout was thought of when first unveiled), we're fine with the company's next handheld again coming with two screens.
Though, if costs could be kept down, two touch screens would be nice...
APP STORE
We're only copying Apple's name for the thing so we're all on the same page. Nintendo have shown with the DSi that they're finally comfortable not only with downloading games directly to a handheld, but downloading non-gaming applications as well. Thing is, with these games and apps available only for the DSi and DSi XL - and not the more numerous DS Lite - it's more a niche service than a full-blown aspect of Nintendo's handheld strategy.
But on a new platform, they can step things up a little. Really integrate it, make it a cornerstone of the device. Applications, small games, retro re-releases, even communications (with Nintendo unwilling to make a phone, a Skype application could plug the gap), they could really go to town. The only limits would be that Nintendo would of course control the store (so it wouldn't be flooded with crap), and there's always a question of size...
STORAGE
Ah, a tricky one. Adding a considerable piece of onboard storage would drive the price of the device up, and Nintendo don't traditionally release pricey devices. But it's got to come with something. A continuation of the trend set with the DSi would be fine; a small amount of onboard storage (though 1GB would be nice instead of the DSi's paltry 256MB) built into the handheld, then the option of inserting an SD card for more space, or for transferring stuff off the internal memory.
Nintendo should also learn a lesson from the Wii's early problems, and support the running of applications and smaller games directly from an SD card.
MEDIA
Nintendo have traditionally shied away from multimedia convergence with their devices, but this is gradually giving way, particularly with the more recent editions of the DS, which can do things like play music.
This new device, then, needs to have some sort of media functionality. Though nothing fancy; a basic mp3 player, a basic movie player, and we're good to go. I should be able to insert an SD card with music or movies saved in a basic format (.wmv, .mov, .avi), and the handheld can play them. Same goes for photos, too.
In essence, then, what they've "trialled" with the DSi, only refreshed and improved for an all-new console.
MEDIUM
While the PSPgo has set a trend by going wholly digital, it's one we can't see Nintendo following just yet. Their #1 priority is accessibility, and since casual gamers aren't likely to be as comfortable making digital purchases as they are bringing a box home from a store, the next handheld's games should still come on a physical medium.
A cartridge similar to that used by the DS, only with a larger capacity (at least 4GB) would be fine, as it would provide the added bonus of making it backwards-compatible with the DS. It may not alleviate the rampant piracy issues currently afflicting the DS, but until the world becomes more comfortable with digital downloads, that's something Nintendo are just going to have to live with.
MOTION CONTROL
We've covered some possibilities on this already, but here's what we want: we want motion control with the precision of Wii MotionPlus, but used sparingly. This is a handheld device, used primarily while people are travelling or away from their homes. Games can't, and shouldn't, require people to go jumping around or waving them madly in the air. The odd tilt or lean would be fine.
Basically, learn from the Wii's mistakes: unless you're Nintendo, don't go motion-crazy for the sake of it.
One area motion control would be beneficial to Nintendo's new handheld is when you combine it with the App Store. Like, literally. If the new device has a touch-screen and motion sensing, developers could easily port the more successful iPhone games to Nintendo's handheld.
CONCLUSION
So, a quick run-down:
- GameCube-quality graphics
- Dual thumbsticks
- Improved Dual display (bonus: dual touch-screen)
- 1GB onboard storage space
- SD card compatibility
- Music & movie playback
- Advanced motion-sensing, equivalent to Wii MotionPlus
- Backwards compatible with the DS
And a few more things to finish off with:
- A free, integrated web browser
- NO MORE FRIEND CODES; a single user ID, like every other company uses, should suffice
- A telescopic stylus; the DS ones are too short for prolonged play
- Keep the microphone; some games use it well, while applications like Skype would find it just as useful
- A Mini-USB charger; when everything else you own is charged from mini-USB, using proprietary Nintendo chargers is stupid
- The camera on the DSi seems to be going down OK; if it's cheap, may as well stick it on the new handheld, let developers plan to actually release games that support it
- The systems and games must be region-free
- All that for $199 at launch would be just fine
So, there you have it! That's what we want from the new Nintendo handheld. It might not be fancy, it might not be terribly daring, but remember, this is Nintendo we're talking about. Now they've taken the plunge with dual-screens in the portable space and motion control at home, it'll be time for a little consolidation, which is why we see this device being to the DS what the Game Boy Advance was to the Game Boy: more of the same, just better.

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Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2010, 12:11:45 PM »
Everything in this list I would like to see implemented for the next DS system. However, I do not want a handheld game cube because it is too close to the current home console and that is why I do not like the PSP. Perhaps some thing slighty beyond the N64 in graphics, but lower than the gamcube. Playstation one or PSP style graphics would not be too bad, either.
 
Nintendo could go the Microsoft route and release three versions of the system like Xbox 360 Elite, Pro and Arcade. Each version would have slightly more bells and whisles than the one preceding it. Imagine a DS 2 elite, pro and arcade models. However, the DS Elite would bare the brunt of the hard ware wishlist compiled by Kotaku.com.
 
As far as storage goes, the elite model would have 1 GB or more of internal memory. The pro would have slighty less and the arcade would have the lowest. 
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Offline Kairon

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2010, 01:37:17 PM »
I don't think Nintendo should make manufacturing difficult by having several different SKUs Kytim98. If people really want more memory space, they shouldn't have to hunt down a different model of the device, just add an SD card.

Also, I don't agree with the suggestion that the next DS have analog nubs. Ugh. It's a nice idea, but I think it complicates things on the DS way too much, and part of the handheld's charm is its simplicity and accessibility. Instead, I think that we should be asking for a multi-touch touch screen ala Apple...

Oh, and personally, I want built-in e-book functionality in a proprietary, no frills Nintendo e-text format. I don't think it needs to use anything special like e-ink or be fancy or anything, but a built-in 100 Classics for DS type software, with downloadable text-only e-books right from day one.
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Offline MegaByte

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2010, 01:48:31 PM »
Oh, and personally, I want built-in e-book functionality in a proprietary, no frills Nintendo e-text format.
WHY?!?!
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2010, 02:27:21 PM »
Higher resolution multi-touch screen(s)
Brighter resolution cameras
2GB+ of on-board storage with SDHC compatibility
Obviously backwards compatibility
GC level graphics (preferably using the Tegra(2) chip)
Direct from SD card play
VC/Virtual Handheld tied to an online account (My Nintendo) not a specific DS2 unit.
Free Media playback. (music, movies, photos)
built in web browser with flash & html5 support
System code in place of game by game codes.
Increased inter-interoperability with the Wii2 (possible usage as Wii2 game controller for linked games)
e-book reader (non-proprietary) and e-book store added to the DS shop.
-big plus for the next DS is that it plays DS/DSi/DS2 games and reads any e-book, plays your music, movies and takes/displays your photos.
Blue-tooth
-headphones, earpiece, Wii2 connectivity
USB connection.
-can be proprietary port on the DS2, but have a standard USB connector on the other end of the cord. Then have a USB plug for the wall socket and a separate one for car charger.
Gyroscopes built in
Back ground OS with update-able firmware that can add functionality to all games and protect from piracy when needed.

That's what I expect out of the next DS. Nothing too fancy but definitely built with future functionality and non-gaming applications in mind yet gaming as a focus. I expect all of this at a price of $179.99 (as long as it's under $200) and want Nintendo to think about everybody using this device on a daily basis. Whether it's for gaming or not.

Offline Kairon

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2010, 02:55:25 PM »
Oh, and personally, I want built-in e-book functionality in a proprietary, no frills Nintendo e-text format.
WHY?!?!

Well, I just assumed that a proprietary format would be used due to the unique form-factor and capabilities of the DS2.

But I guess if Nintendo could solve those issues with a non-proprietary format, and prevent piracy, that would be fine too.
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Offline Chozo Ghost

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2010, 05:52:40 PM »
The one thing I would like to see is a stylus that also works like a motion controller of sorts. That way you can not only waggle, but also touch as well. Waggle and touch.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2010, 05:59:52 PM »
The one thing I would like to see is a stylus that also works like a motion controller of sorts. That way you can not only waggle, but also touch as well. Waggle and touch.

That could be great for a new Trauma Center game among other uses. Though how small can they make the gyroscope/motion technology?
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Offline NWR_insanolord

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #8 on: February 13, 2010, 06:01:30 PM »
I don't think Nintendo should make manufacturing difficult by having several different SKUs Kytim98. If people really want more memory space, they shouldn't have to hunt down a different model of the device, just add an SD card.

Also, I don't agree with the suggestion that the next DS have analog nubs. Ugh. It's a nice idea, but I think it complicates things on the DS way too much, and part of the handheld's charm is its simplicity and accessibility. Instead, I think that we should be asking for a multi-touch touch screen ala Apple...

Oh, and personally, I want built-in e-book functionality in a proprietary, no frills Nintendo e-text format. I don't think it needs to use anything special like e-ink or be fancy or anything, but a built-in 100 Classics for DS type software, with downloadable text-only e-books right from day one.

While I agree that at least one of the screens should be multi-touch, that is not at all an acceptable substitute for physical analog control on a device that is primarily a gaming platform.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #9 on: February 13, 2010, 06:29:28 PM »
Higher resolution multi-touch screen(s)
Brighter resolution cameras
2GB+ of on-board storage with SDHC compatibility
Obviously backwards compatibility
GC level graphics (preferably using the Tegra(2) chip)
Direct from SD card play
VC/Virtual Handheld tied to an online account (My Nintendo) not a specific DS2 unit.
Free Media playback. (music, movies, photos)
built in web browser with flash & html5 support
System code in place of game by game codes.
Increased inter-interoperability with the Wii2 (possible usage as Wii2 game controller for linked games)
e-book reader (non-proprietary) and e-book store added to the DS shop.
-big plus for the next DS is that it plays DS/DSi/DS2 games and reads any e-book, plays your music, movies and takes/displays your photos.
Blue-tooth
-headphones, earpiece, Wii2 connectivity
USB connection.
-can be proprietary port on the DS2, but have a standard USB connector on the other end of the cord. Then have a USB plug for the wall socket and a separate one for car charger.
Gyroscopes built in
Back ground OS with update-able firmware that can add functionality to all games and protect from piracy when needed.

That's what I expect out of the next DS. Nothing too fancy but definitely built with future functionality and non-gaming applications in mind yet gaming as a focus. I expect all of this at a price of $179.99 (as long as it's under $200) and want Nintendo to think about everybody using this device on a daily basis. Whether it's for gaming or not.

I agree with all of this, but how could a gyroscope fit into something so small? Also, I would like for the device to half as thick as the DSi. How about the memory for the game carts be raised to to 4 GB this way we could have bigger and better games on the system.
 
 
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Offline Stratos

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #10 on: February 13, 2010, 06:32:23 PM »
I think we already could have 4gb game cards but they cost too much to be used at a reasonable final price. I think one of the reasons some games cost $35-40 is because they are using larger cards so they have to offset the price.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2010, 06:40:46 PM »
This new machine is not going to be released over night. Nintendo will probably release it sometime in 2011 and by then 4GB will be cheaper.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2010, 06:55:11 PM »
You guys are confusing terms
DS cards are measured in Gigabits and not Gigabytes

8 bits = 1 byte
8 Gigabits (Gb) = 1 Gigabyte (GB)

If the largest DS card is 4Gb then that only measures up to a 1/2Gigabyte (~500MB) or about a little more than 1/4 of a GC disc which is 1.8 GB.

We want the DS2 game cards to measure at minimum 1GB in size and be expandable indefinitely for whatever is needed. But new games have to be priced in the range of $30-$40 New with average game cost being about $35.

A standard 4GB SD card cost around $10 today so for Nintendo to have a modified and proprietary version mass produced with 1GB-2GB in mind 1 year from now, getting game cards at pennies on the dollar should not be an issue.

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2010, 07:04:29 PM »
That could be great for a new Trauma Center game among other uses. Though how small can they make the gyroscope/motion technology?
Quite small.  3-axis accelerometers are a few cubic millimeters (the smallest I've seen is 2 x 2 x 0.95 mm).  Gyroscopes are a bit larger.  Bluetooth transmitters are also small.  Power would be a concern, but I think it would be pretty easily doable.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2010, 07:05:29 PM »
If 4GB is $10, then why are 8 an 16 GB cards above 20 and 30 dollars?
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #15 on: February 13, 2010, 07:08:55 PM »
because they are 2x - 4 x the space?

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #16 on: February 13, 2010, 07:10:51 PM »
If 4GB is $10, then why are 8 an 16 GB cards above 20 and 30 dollars?
Because newer technology (e.g. fitting more storage space into the same physical card space) costs more.  There's always an optimum price/space point, and it's never at the maximum capacity currently available; it's usually a couple steps down.
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Offline Kairon

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #17 on: February 13, 2010, 07:36:23 PM »
I don't think Nintendo should make manufacturing difficult by having several different SKUs Kytim98. If people really want more memory space, they shouldn't have to hunt down a different model of the device, just add an SD card.

Also, I don't agree with the suggestion that the next DS have analog nubs. Ugh. It's a nice idea, but I think it complicates things on the DS way too much, and part of the handheld's charm is its simplicity and accessibility. Instead, I think that we should be asking for a multi-touch touch screen ala Apple...

Oh, and personally, I want built-in e-book functionality in a proprietary, no frills Nintendo e-text format. I don't think it needs to use anything special like e-ink or be fancy or anything, but a built-in 100 Classics for DS type software, with downloadable text-only e-books right from day one.

While I agree that at least one of the screens should be multi-touch, that is not at all an acceptable substitute for physical analog control on a device that is primarily a gaming platform.

I'm not convinced, at least not with what I've seen with the analog nub. I have concerns that an analog nub will actually be a negative formost handheld gamers (who skew noticably younger or more blue ocean in my opinion, and thus have less of an inclination to develop the motor skills for an analog nub). I have concerns about durability, whether such an input device will stand the higher rigors of use in a handheld device. And I have concerns over what one, much less two, handheld nubs will do to increase the unfirendly visual complexity of the device, and increase the unfriendly visual complexity of the games on it.
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Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #18 on: February 13, 2010, 09:26:08 PM »
If the next DS will pla movies, how will they get onto the system? Maybe some kind of downloadable app store or maybe movie companies can release SD card movies like the UMDs for the PSP.
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Offline BlackNMild2k1

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2010, 09:31:16 PM »
Off the SD card.
you can format your own media and the DS2 should be able to play it.

Nintendo themselves probably won't be selling the movies or music, but that's no reason to not let my DS2 be my all day everyday everything device.

Offline Kytim89

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #20 on: February 13, 2010, 09:41:01 PM »
I think consumers now-a-days are attracted to the swiss army knife style gadgets. You know the ones where it is a phone, TV, radio, game console, etc. So the nest DS system will have to capitalize on this in some manner, regardless of Nintendo's stance on multimedia devices. I would not mind having a radio player for the next DS, something like how the Zune HD plays radio.
 
Second, if the new DS had a superior graphics engine and more memroy storage in the game carts, I would like to see a 3D version of No More Heroes, Mass Effect, and Dead Space. The gameplay would be like COP: The Recruit, but better. I think the new DS would help make this dream a reality.
 
The new DS should have a stronger internet browser. Perhaps with faster sppeds and load times. Being able to play youtube would be a plus as well.
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Offline Stratos

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #21 on: February 14, 2010, 04:30:25 AM »
I predict it will be designed like a phone where you can go online all the time with it. No need for a Wi-Fi point like with the DS, Wii or a laptop, it just matters on if you are in a service area or not.

I believe that Nintendo has hinted about looking into ways of pulling this off in the future.

The only limits would be that Nintendo would of course control the store (so it wouldn't be flooded with crap), and there's always a question of size...

The WiiWare and DSiWare shops say 'high'. Crap heaven there.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2010, 04:32:30 AM by Stratos »
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Offline Stogi

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #22 on: February 14, 2010, 12:02:42 PM »
I really like the idea of a gyroscope embedded into a thicker stylus. It would be interesting if you could then "plant" the stylus into the system and use it as an analog stick.
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Offline GearBoxClock

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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #23 on: February 14, 2010, 12:24:11 PM »
I don't know if dual analog would work all that well. It would be cramped as far as buttons go. But a single analog, and a better touch-screen/motion-control would be great.
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Re: What we Want From the Next DS Hand Held
« Reply #24 on: February 14, 2010, 01:27:11 PM »
while i agree with the idea of the numbs, sony did a poor job with the psp. the numb was not very well designed or placed on the device. i know nintendo can do better, but still i'd be concerned.

i'd love touch tech to be the point where the entire bottom part was a touch screen so controls and buttons could be placed on the screen as needed. i relaize there is a tactile loss by not having a physical button for your fingers to touch, but it would make for controls specific to the game.

yes yes and yes to the app store. i should be able to check facebook, twitter, etc. from my dsi. and if we had an app store both amazon  kindle and bn ebook readers could be ported over. (ebook is a txt format and will shape itself to the screen, doesn't need to be 'formatted')

and more importantly, i should be able to get my pikachu with the DSi even if i have left pearl at home.

the new opera is fast, and well made, so it would seem to me there is only a matter of time before that tech is translated to the dsi and wii.

i want the gamecube level graphics. current gen battery life. or better. i want online to be just a given, but don't force 3g subscription on me. especially AT&T. make the damn thing sync its calendar and notes with my computer, or google or yahoo, or something.

and since it will have GC graphics, i want metroid, starfox adventures and mario sunshine to be launch titles.