Topic: MS Vice Presidents Comment on PSP vs DS

[TheYoungerPlumber]

Microsoft is happy to see Sony spend energy on its PSP, but predicts that its Redmond neighbors have the advantage.

Microsoft’s Home & Entertainment vice presidents Robbie Bach & Peter Moore presented Microsoft’s perception of the handheld market and, more specifically, Sony’s PSP, when questioned during a Halo 2 launch event.

Microsoft’s representatives reinforced the company’s stance that the handheld gaming market is distinct from the console market.  Bach alluded to Nintendo’s failed GameCube-GBA connectivity movement to support Microsoft’s belief that handheld gaming is a completely different market.

Bach coyly stated MS will not complain if Sony is distracted from its console business in a handheld war with Nintendo; Microsoft is not convinced Sony can succeed with Nintendo’s strong history in the handheld sector.  He explained that the situation is analogous to "developing your own little operating system and saying, 'Well, I'm going to challenge Windows.' ".

[KnowsNothing]

Well, I do agree that Nintendo will remain first in the handheld market, I don't agree with his analogy.  Sony is first in the console market, and although the handheld market has alot of people uninterested in consoles, most of the market owns  a console, which means that a large portion of them own a Playstation.  Sony already has the street cred.

[nemo_83]

I feel like the DS and PSP can do basically everything that current consoles can do (minus dual analog, plus touch screen and wi fi) so MS better look for a way to define themselves in the console market.  Nintendo is pushing the idea that consoles should be able to do more than handhelds with the DS and Revolution.  MS could get left behind if they just release a Xbox 2 while Nintendo launches full scale revolution.  I could be wrong this could all mean that MS and Nintendo are joining forces.  It just seems confusing who in that scenerio is being brought to their knees, MS or Nintendo?

[Bill Aurion]

I think it has to do more with MS not wanting to support Sony's console(since they are first) so they are going to help Ninty(who is currently behind them)...Fairly simple strategy, and how Ninty does in the handheld industry really doesn't affect how they do in the console industry...So in other words, helps MS, helps Ninty, hurts Sony...(at least, that's what they are hoping)

[Darc Requiem]

Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
I think it has to do more with MS not wanting to support Sony's console(since they are first) so they are going to help Ninty(who is currently behind them)...Fairly simple strategy, and how Ninty does in the handheld industry really doesn't affect how they do in the console industry...So in other words, helps MS, helps Ninty, hurts Sony...(at least, that's what they are hoping)

Excellent observation Bill. Its the classic..."the enemy of my enemy is my friend stance" MS is right though. Sony is really gonna have to energy and time on PSP if they hope to unseat Nintendo in the handheld market. The more time they spend on PSP the more vulnerable they will be to Xenon and Revolution. At least in the US, the X-box has been beating the PS2 for the last 6 months or so.

Darc Requiem

[nemo_83]

The PSP is the greatest weapon against Sony that could be imagined.  It puts a target on Sony.  Sony is already going to lose a lot of American market share to MS's reputation amongst graphic whores liking sports games, graphics, and online.  When the PSP goes head to head with the DS which is going to have an established library of not only DS games but also GBA games, the DS is going to kill the PSP.  The PSP's defeat will make Sony look bad in the console market leading to their downfall.  MS will gladly endorse DS, if only in word, if it helps them defeat Sony in the console market.

[TheYoungerPlumber]

Well, there's another side to this, too.  One that isn't as vicious.

In some crazy way, Nintendo and Microsoft are monopoly buddies.  Nintendo's stranglehold on the handheld market is like a funhouse mirror reflection of Microsoft's grip on operating systems and standard business applications.  If Nintendo can't hold its own with 14+ years of domination in the handheld market, that could disturb Microsoft.

By saying "Nintendo will stay strong b/c of its history as #1" it is also saying "Microsoft will stay strong b/c of its history as #1."  That's what Bach was saying.

[Djunknown]

As mentioned in the news post, MS is probably taking a jab at Linux at the same time. They just recently settled all their Lawsuits in the US, maybe they're starting to feel a bit cocky and untouchable (well, more than usual.)?

Now if MS somehow 'lets' Rare do a DS title

[Mario]

PSP targets a whole different audience though, it will sell to people who own PS2s and have never played a Nintendo game and never gave a second thought to getting an underpowered Gameboy.

Oddly enough i'm starting to gain a little more respect for the Xbox and MS. As far as i'm concerned Sony are the real bad guys in videogames, while MS are pouring billions into making sure their Xbox system is satisfying gamers. The only reason I own a PS2 is because it has lots of third party games I want that are only on there because of the huge userbase. I'd much rather have bought them on an Xbox..

[VideoGamerJ]

NOA and Microsoft are so close together. Why not work out a deal? Hmm. Age of Empires on the DS? COME ON!

[The Omen]

Quote
PSP targets a whole different audience though, it will sell to people who own PS2s and have never played a Nintendo game and never gave a second thought to getting an underpowered Gameboy.

Disagree completely.  Millions of PS2 owners already own the NINTENDO GBA.  They trust Nintendo handhelds as much as they trust Sony as their console.  I think many will go for the DS and not the PSP.  If you have a PS2, why would you want the same games on a portable that has 2 hours of battery life with all options utilized?(CONFIRMED by a Sony head honcho recently.)

And yeah, now if MS would give the DS some Rare games to beat up on the PSP, that would be sweet.

[KDR_11k]

I don't think the PSP can weaken Sony, they have no first party development that would be split by another system to support, all they have is third parties. Of course that's going to be a major problem with PSP vs. DS where the DS is the one with the big third party support but it's not going to weaken their stand in the home console market. Microsoft gaining momentum might be enough to throw Sony off next round but I'm sure the PSP will have zero to do with that.

[Nephilim]

well its kinda different, cause when a new linux comes out, stores dont even stock it. lol
were psp will be in all stores, and in the end will be marked down and will sell the stock they orginally got

[Bill Aurion]

"I don't think the PSP can weaken Sony, they have no first party development that would be split by another system to support, all they have is third parties."

If it does poorly enough at least some 3rd parties will decide it's not worth the time and expense to do PSP games...

[Spak-Spang]

Are we Nintendo fans getting cocky?  

Once upon a time.  We never heard of Sony and gaming together...and they managed with an inferior system (that appeared to be far superior) take down Nintendo which had huge marketshare and creditability.

PSP is positioned itself to be the system that takes down Nintendo in the handheld market.  And it isn't a question of if it will sell, IT WILL SELL.  The question is will the loses they make this generation with the PSP be worth the next generation portable battle for Sony.  Will losing millions of dollars on the PSP make the PSP2 worth it when Sony now has the popular image for the handheld market?  I dunno.  It really depends on investors and how the PS3 goes.  

If the PS3 goes well, and they get the number 1 console spot again, then the investors will probably be glad that the PSP2 will be made and hopefully continue the Sony dominance.  However, if the PS3 is struggling with Xbox2, or Revolution then investors will look at the PSP as a waste of money, that spread their resources too thin.  

Nintendo is willing to fight, and fight hard for their handheld market.  It is what has kept them afloat and very profitable.  Nintendo launches Pokemon DS, and the handheld war is over in Japan.  

NOA is positioning the DS Metroid to have a killer multiplayer experience.  Are they looking for that "DS Halo" effect with this game.  A game that is so good people will buy the system just for that?  Yeah I think they are.

Basically, Nintendo isn't in good shape with the DS batting the PSP, but neither is Sony in a great shape battling Nintendo, and eventually MS.

[Lokno]

My opinion on the DS and the PSP are that they are both consoles of excess: you don't have to shell out for these things if you, like the average gamer, already own a GBA and PS2. I originally thought that the DS is port-proof what with it's abstract features, but it is quite the opposite; just look at Nintendo's first launch game, Mario 64 DS, a expanded port. As for the PSP, it's a tiny PS2, if not a little weaker. Any games exclusive to it will be a waste of a developer’s money. Both these consoles are for the gamers who have everything.

So, that said, both fo these console are risky, and when all is said and done, and as Bach said it, the GBA is still king in this market. Do not confuse what's going on here and Nintendo 64 vs Playstation, be it similar. The portable market is a 2D market, with simple graphics and low developer costs. A switch to disk media isn't the golden key here, when battery life and skipping problems will no doubt be packaged with it. I agree they will both sell, but it's not going to be anything to write home about.    

[couchmonkey]

I disagree, Lokno.  I think that the Gameboy Advance will enjoy a long, profitable retirement much like the NES and Playstation had, but I think it's on the way out.  We'll still see Gameboy games on shelves for years to come, and new games will probably be released through next year and into 2006, but like the NES and the PSOne, the GBA will be taking a backseat to the new systems by next Christmas.  I believe this because I think the market is ready for more expensive handheld game systems...just look at the popularity of PDAs, iPods, digital cameras, cel phones and other handheld gadgets.  Some of these are a lot more expensive than a DS or a PSP.

As for Microsoft's comments, I think the company is strategizing.  If Nintendo loses the handheld part of the industry to Sony, that makes it that much harder for Microsoft to win.  If Sony is #1 on the console side and Nintendo is #1 on the handheld side, that creates a balance of power that Microsoft can use to weaken both sides.  Coincidentally, it's like playing Halo.  When two armies of aliens are fighting each other, it's best to hide in the shadows while they take each other down, and then run out shooting at the winning side when you see that the losers are almost done for.  Right now, Microsoft is still hiding in the shadows, but they just poked out to throw a grenade at Sony.  

[Spak-Spang]

Lokno:  I disagree.  I don't think people view portable gaming as a luxury device for gaming.  I think quite differently.  I think many people buy portable gaming as something to do on the go when they are bored.  People that normally wouldn't play video games will invest in portable gaming.  This is why Nintendo has always approached portable gaming with an older audience market strategy.  

I am not looking at portable gaming for the first time as potentially my main gaming.  I find myself playing the Gamecube less, and playing the GBA more.  Now, I want to play my DS more then any Gamecube games and I don't even have the system.  I am hoping I can find DS parties to play wireless and such, and I never desired that kind of gaming.  

Portable gaming is very different, in the means it attracts any person that will have to be waiting, and or traveling as a normal routine.

couchmonkey:  I don't think Microsoft is even thinking that Nintendo is a threat.  Nintendo is so drastically different in behaviors and marketing than Microsoft I think MS believes Nintendo a nonissue.  Where Sony is aggressively marketing the same audience that they are.  They are competing for the same exclusive games and marketshare.  

Anything Microsoft can do to hurt Sony they will.  Where they won't do that to Nintendo until they become a greater threat, or actually even a risk of threat.

[Lokno]

Quote
Originally posted by: couchmonkey
I disagree, Lokno.  I think that the Gameboy Advance will enjoy a long, profitable retirement...

Again, I think it's a mistake to imply history here, when the Gameboy has never been replaced. The NES and PS1 ( Not PSOne, that's that silly smaller Playstation that replaced it) were replaced. I'm saying the DS is not a replacement for the SP, and you didn't do a lot to refute that here. If people are in fact interested in more and more portable devices, then they can certainly handle the GBA and the DS and the PSP all in the same market together.

[SgtShiversBen]

They could, but they won't.  People are just going to be like "OH!! BEN AFFLACK HAS ONE!! I MUST GETONE!!"......that's what happened with the PS2.  But I don't care, I'm happy with what is coming out, and if I figure the PSP to be worth my admission, of no more than 100$ (I have alot of waiting to do), then I'll get it.  But the DS is already worth that, MUST HAVE ANIMAL CROSSING DS!!!

[Lokno]

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
Lokno:  I disagree.  I don't think people view portable gaming as a luxury device for gaming...

Well, I guess I'm not going to get an agreement anytime soon, eh? You may disagree with me, but I'm not going to disgree with anything you said. In fact, I'm only trying to say that I don't believe the GBA fall out of use because of these new consoles, and I don't think you disagree with me there. Reggie has recently stated that Nintendo is marketing the GBA to gamers around the age of 14, and the DS to 17 year olds. They expect these console to survive to together, and so do I.

[Spak-Spang]

Lokni:  Ok.  For average gamers I can see how portable gaming is a luxury...but portable gaming also has a second market.  The one I tried to describe.  Its an interesting market.  Right now its the market that is willing to play crappy games on cellphones.  They just want something to do with their down time.

[nolimit19]

all i know is that i want N5 to trounce xbox2.

[ChaNoKin]

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
Lokni:  Ok.  For average gamers I can see how portable gaming is a luxury...but portable gaming also has a second market.  The one I tried to describe.  Its an interesting market.  Right now its the market that is willing to play crappy games on cellphones.  They just want something to do with their down time.

I think that market will go for the DS because of the price, I would rather get a DS and a game than a PSP alone.

For a geek like myself wi-fi is what makes it really interesting, i can only imagine what can be done with wifi-able console, no more wiring, and also if Nintendo includes wifi on N5 yum, no more messy cabling to do, thats what keeps me from pluggin my gamecube to the net or doing some piracy