How in the world can digital copies cost retailers more than packaged copies?
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/blog/31190
The next wave of a completely digital Nintendo future has just started in the Land of the Rising Sun. The release of both New Super Mario Bros. 2 and Oni Training on the Nintendo 3DS have helped usher in this era but not without a few hiccups. When it comes to the price difference between the physical versions and the digital version, there is a disparity. Probably not in the way that you would assume, either.
I used to live in the United States, so I have a pretty good idea of how pricing on game software usually works there. Games are typically what the suggested retail price is and that’s that. In Japan, it’s a completely different ball game. For example, the list price for New Super Mario Bros. 2 is 4,800 yen ($61) and Oni Training is 3,800 yen ($48). If you purchase the titles directly from the eShop, you’re going to be paying the exact price no matter what. If you opt to get the packaged versions, you will typically be paying less money. At my favorite local electronic store in town, I can go out and buy NSMB2 for around 4,100 yen, 700 yen less than the list price! You would think that this would also apply to the digital download card that the store carries as well, right? WRONG! From my experience today, I can tell you that definitely is not the case. Of course, I can only report on the store that I went to, but from other articles I’ve read online, this is not just a local issue at my store, but an issue occurring all around the country.
Finding the digital download card for Oni Training was no easy feat for me. After walking into the store, it was easy enough to find copies of the game sitting on the shelf. After scanning the entire handheld gaming section of the store for about five minutes, I had no idea where they were keeping the download cards or even whether or not they had them. Instead, I just took the physical copy up to the counter and asked there. At first, most of the workers didn’t seem to know what I was talking about, but after some searching (apparently in the same area that I previously investigated), they managed to procure one and brought it to me. I noticed that the price on the download card was different than what was on the packaged version. The packaged version was right around 3,100 yen while the card was 3,600 yen. Begrudgingly, I pulled out my wallet and forked over the cash. For a moment, I thought about asking the clerk who was assisting me why there was a difference in the price between the two but decided against it. A part time high schooler probably doesn’t know much about financial decisions for that chain of electronic stores anyway.
I had been reading news about this for the latter part of the week. A digital card for the same damn game costs slightly more than a packaged version. I don’t even need to go into details as to why this is ridiculous. The digital distribution of all of Nintendo’s first party titles is perhaps one of the most forward thinking decision the company has made in years but aside from people like me (and you, too), who is going to choose a more expensive version of the same game? There should be absolutely no reason why the download card for either of these games should be sold at a higher price than the packaged versions. I mean, why in the world are they? If Nintendo were to be giving some kind of a kickback to the retailers for selling the physical copies, that would kind of make sense, but at the same time go completely against Nintendo’s new initiative. None of this makes any sense to me. For the retailers, it doesn’t really matter either way which version of the game they sell, just as long as they sell SOMETHING. Even though Nintendo has control whatsoever of retailers’ software prices, this is not a good start toward a digital future in Japan.
Stuff
You're only in high school? What made you move to Japan? Is the gaming culture in Japan radically different than the West (Europe and North America)?
One important note is that manufacturers arn't allowed to sell items below MSRP to customers.
There just aren't nearly enough pros compared to physical.
Do you need a card to download or is it just available for purchase in the e-shop catalogue? If its just on the e-shop too, is the price there the same as the download card?
I wish there was a premium bundle where you could buy the cartridge and for $10 extra get the option to download too.
That's probably the answer right there. Digital means the end of going to the store to buy a game, and the card is Nintendo throwing the store a bone. The stores know that's only a temporary situation, and that once most people become accustomed to downloading, they'll just do it from home. If they can make the cartridges cheaper, they'll continue to encourage their customers to buy from them.
One important note is that manufacturers arn't allowed to sell items below MSRP to customers.
Is that a Japanese thing? Because here in America, that's called price fixing and will get you in trouble.
As Nintendo found out years ago. I have the coupon hanging on my wall to prove it. :D
One important note is that manufacturers arn't allowed to sell items below MSRP to customers.
Is that a Japanese thing? Because here in America, that's called price fixing and will get you in trouble.
As Nintendo found out years ago. I have the coupon hanging on my wall to prove it. :D
I was talking about laws here in the US. I understand that when manufacturers make a product (Nintendo). They assign an MSRP or Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price to that item so when retailers like GameStop or Walmart sell the item, they usually sell that item at that price. As I understand it a manufacturer, in this case Nintendo, could sell that item to the public too, but they are not allowed to sell it for less than the MSRP that they have set. Since, the ability to do so would allow them to undercut retailers and put them out of business. Retailers don't have to follow this rule of course.
This reason is why I was saying I don't think we will ever see retail eShop games be any cheaper than they are in stores
Since that happens on Steam all the time I don't think it means that.
EDIT: Although, since sales are usually on Nintendo software, and Nintendo never discounts their retail software, I wouldn't expect sales on the eShop either way.
Since that happens on Steam all the time I don't think it means that.
EDIT: Although, since sales are usually on Nintendo software, and Nintendo never discounts their retail software, I wouldn't expect sales on the eShop either way.
But Steam isn't the manufacturer?
Newspapers are going the way of the dodo. The music industry is virtually digital - CD sales don't even compare to what they used to.
As for pros, depending on the particular service - the ability to easily back up the media, the ability to play on multiple setups easily, the ability to carry your entire collection on a tiny chip (seriously, I would have *loved* to have been able to carry my entire music collection on me in high school/college)...
Of late, I picked up Heroes of Ruin - but I have to bring Mario Kart with me to work daily to play against coworkers. I'd love the ability to have it "installed" on my system so I can be more mobile with Heroes of Ruin without having to carry multiple cartridges with me.
many, many pros to a digital download.
Also, Pandora is a radio service. It is even sometimes called "Pandora Radio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora_Radio)!" It's not that those things aren't allowed to evolve. It's that there is a big difference between evolving and dying out.
Neo, I don't think any such law exists. You see video games, books, DVDs, cars, etc. all sold below MSRP all the times. After all, it's just the manufacturer's SUGGESTED retail price. They can't force retailers to sell it for that. A retailer could sell a new $50 game for $1 if they wanted, but they would only be hurting themselves. A retailer pays the publisher for the game, then sells it for what they want. The lower that the retailer sells it for, the less profit they make. So whether Target sells NSMB 2 for $10 or $40, Nintendo makes the same amount of money since Target already paid them for it.
Neo, I don't think any such law exists. You see video games, books, DVDs, cars, etc. all sold below MSRP all the times. After all, it's just the manufacturer's SUGGESTED retail price. They can't force retailers to sell it for that. A retailer could sell a new $50 game for $1 if they wanted, but they would only be hurting themselves. A retailer pays the publisher for the game, then sells it for what they want. The lower that the retailer sells it for, the less profit they make. So whether Target sells NSMB 2 for $10 or $40, Nintendo makes the same amount of money since Target already paid them for it.
Wait, if the retailer pays the publisher for a game, then ultimately consumer sales don't matter. Nintendo has their money.
Neo, I don't think any such law exists. You see video games, books, DVDs, cars, etc. all sold below MSRP all the times. After all, it's just the manufacturer's SUGGESTED retail price. They can't force retailers to sell it for that. A retailer could sell a new $50 game for $1 if they wanted, but they would only be hurting themselves. A retailer pays the publisher for the game, then sells it for what they want. The lower that the retailer sells it for, the less profit they make. So whether Target sells NSMB 2 for $10 or $40, Nintendo makes the same amount of money since Target already paid them for it.
Wait, if the retailer pays the publisher for a game, then ultimately consumer sales don't matter. Nintendo has their money.
The retailer only pays for each shipment as it comes in, and Nintendo only makes real money if they order more shipments. Also, if the games stop selling, retailers will stop even ordering the first shipment.
I can't speak for the entire population of the world, but I don't think anyone with any credibility ever said radio would be dead because people wouldn't want random/unknown music.
As per your other points - some are correct, some are opinion...
Digital releases have the potential to allow you instant access to the media with little wait (depending on your broadband speed), no going to a store and hoping it's in stock, no worries about it going "out of print", no concerns about pricing of second hand sales - and, as a salesman, no concerns about shoplifting and no concerns about taking a loss on markdowns if the product flops and doesn't sell.
No going to a store / Immediate access upon release.
No. Online ordering means you can get games on release day w/o leaving your home.
No "out of print" worries.
YES!!!
No concerns about second hand pricing.
Sorry, that works both ways. And way more often than not, games go DOWN in price and not up. So, for the vast majority, nope =\
No headaches for salespeople.
Also, no since those folks would be too busy being out of business to care if there were no more physical versions. But then there wouldn't be good places to sell hardware, which is why the manufacturers wouldn't be happy, which.. again... is why it ain't happenin'.
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So, barring your identification of those "opinions," we have reached a total of 1 absolute advantage. Which brings the score to 1 vs at least 1 (actually OWNING the media).
Now, even that advantage falls a bit flat when you consider the following ...
A) The vast majority of games are not hard to find within about 5 years of their release unless there is some REASON for it (poorly accepted, very obscure, some kind of controversy or legal issue).
B) After a game generation has passed, we still have to hope those same issues are not in play AND the service provider still feels like offering that game. After all, even in digital services, games are sometimes taken down, are they not?
And yet, many people did. Just Google "death of radio" or any similar doom-inciting phrase.I don't think that means what you think... Quick look brings up articles talking specifically about terrestrial radio or articles talking about the current "commercial radio" business model. Both of which will need to change and adapt or be destroyed.
Where is the opinion in saying those same things are possible w/ physical media?
No. Online ordering means you can get games on release day w/o leaving your home.
No concerns about second hand pricing.
Sorry, that works both ways. And way more often than not, games go DOWN in price and not up. So, for the vast majority, nope =\
Also, no since those folks would be too busy being out of business to care if there were no more physical versions. But then there wouldn't be good places to sell hardware, which is why the manufacturers wouldn't be happy, which.. again... is why it ain't happenin'.
A) The vast majority of games are not hard to find within about 5 years of their release unless there is some REASON for it (poorly accepted, very obscure, some kind of controversy or legal issue).
B) After a game generation has passed, we still have to hope those same issues are not in play AND the service provider still feels like offering that game. After all, even in digital services, games are sometimes taken down, are they not?
Also, I'm confused - why are MP3 Players sold in stores when the stores don't sell MP3s?
... the ability to carry your entire collection on a tiny chip
not sold on digital yet. Neither am I =)
But, ultimately, the root of our conversation was whether or not digital would make retail extinct in the near future. I just don't see that happening for a very long time. What do you think? After the next gen? After two?
Hardly anyone complains about buying music or movies on iTunes (or a similar service), so why would they complain about having digital games?Well the one difference right now is that games are still tied to proprietary systems, whereas music and movies are relatively standardized or universalized.
Hardly anyone complains about buying music or movies on iTunes (or a similar service), so why would they complain about having digital games?Well the one difference right now is that games are still tied to proprietary systems, whereas music and movies are relatively standardized or universalized.
1. Having all the games on a tiny chip AND on 400 CDs is still having them on the tiny chip. One doesn't negate the other. If you're purely worried about saving space you can throw them out if you really need to =P
2. As for immediacy, yea, I suppose most games would release digitally by noon and most mail trucks deliver around 3 or 4pm, right? So, boom, there's 4ish hours of advantage for digital release. Whoopetydoo! =PNow, factor in the increase in price to get release date delivery as applicable...
4. I don't care about keeping those jobs around =P But if manufacturers don't want their hardware/accessories/merch relegated to general electronic stores they would want GAME stores to stay in business =P
[...]@tendoboy
Exactly. His analogy falls flat because those are general electronic stores. Not "MP3" stores.
Also, I'm confused - why are MP3 Players sold in stores when the stores don't sell MP3s?
I love this rhetorical question, and I'm going to answer it anyways:
You need the hardware to use the software.
I'm pretty sure that current copyright laws require to you retain possession of the original media in order to retain copies... so if you get rid of the original, I don't think you get to keep the copies.
Um... stores that sell MP3 players don't really tend to sell much in the way of MP3 software...?
I'm surprised that no one's mentioned yet that digital releases allow you to access your games immediately without the inconvenience of having to locate and switch out a physical copy.
I'm pretty sure that current copyright laws require to you retain possession of the original media in order to retain copies... so if you get rid of the original, I don't think you get to keep the copies.
Actually, you can legally copy music to and from CD's through iTunes and Windows Media Player. It's built into the software.
Well of course not. You buy the MP3 player (iPod) at the store, then download all the music through your computer.
NinSage is trying to argue that console makers won't be able to get their hardware in stores if they don't let stores sell the games.
I think that iPods and iPod touches are sold "everywhere" because they are actually designed to have a sizable retailer margin. Game consoles, on the other hand, aren't.
I think that iPods and iPod touches are sold "everywhere" because they are actually designed to have a sizable retailer margin. Game consoles, on the other hand, aren't.
The margin isn't that great. The margin on off-brand MP3 players is better - and even then, the margin still sucks. That's why stores try to push POS headphones, cases and service plans on you at point of sale.
Regardless, if retailer margin is the issue, then console manufacturers can simply lower their sell price to the retailers. After all, they'll be more than making up for it in software. :D
I think that iPods and iPod touches are sold "everywhere" because they are actually designed to have a sizable retailer margin. Game consoles, on the other hand, aren't.
The margin isn't that great. The margin on off-brand MP3 players is better - and even then, the margin still sucks. That's why stores try to push POS headphones, cases and service plans on you at point of sale.
Regardless, if retailer margin is the issue, then console manufacturers can simply lower their sell price to the retailers. After all, they'll be more than making up for it in software. :D
True, retailers don't make a ton of profit from iPods, Apple makes most of the profits (a huge markup) while retailers get very little. But retailers sell huge amounts of them (over 300 million sold since the original iPod launched in October 2001).
Has anyone mentioned the fact that music/video stores sell iTunes cards? They don't usually sell iPod/iPads at those places either, as Apple has severe restrictions on how their products are displayed/sold.
A $10 iTunes card costs $10. I wonder if the store makes any profit at all on those things?
No. Online ordering means you can get games on release day w/o leaving your home.
I tell you what - you place a pre-order for NSMB2 from GameStop. I'll download it from the e-Shop. We'll see who gets our copy first and the other pays for it. :D
2. As for immediacy, yea, I suppose most games would release digitally by noon and most mail trucks deliver around 3 or 4pm, right? So, boom, there's 4ish hours of advantage for digital release. Whoopetydoo! =P