Topic: Xenoblade Chronicles X: Life on Mira.

[Soren]

(Please, let me dream for a moment before I wake back to reality.)

Wake up call!

[Enner]

http://www.gameinformer.com/games/xenoblade_chronicles_x/b/wii_u/archive/2015/09/29/xenoblade-chronicles-x-feature-preview-game-informer.aspx

The Game Informer preview from issue #270.

Nothing much new that hasn't been covered by the Japanese PVs and news before hand. Still, a nice overview of the game.

[Enner]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ix87NDXnM_w

The second of five Survival Guide episodes from Nintendo of America is now available. This one talks about the battle systems of Xenoblade Chronicles X.

From enjoying the combat of Xenoblade Chronicles very much, this short video had me very excited over the additions and changes Xenoblade Chronicles X is bringing. However, I couldn't help but imagine how bewildering this video will be to anyone unfamiliar with Xenoblade or hotbar-style combat systems.


EDIT: Also, for those that hoped that Xenoblade Chronicles X would cut down on the non-stop combat barks (in-battle voice work) of Xenoblade Chronicles, I fear that the new game is just as chatty judging from the video.

[Evan_B]

I loved the chatty nature of the first game. However, I hope this game adds more lines (with more party characters, I would hope so).

[Mop it up]

It just needs an option to turn off battle voices, like what Tales games do.

[Enner]

NA/EU review copies of Xenoblade Chronicles X are out. Time for me to get extra anxious.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/the-x-button/2015-11-05/long-division/.95022
In the first section of the column, it appears the inevitable has come to pass with Lin's JPN bikini-thong clothes being edited/censored.

While I default to Japanese games to keep everything as they go through localization, I'm not upset in this specific case of 13/15-year-old Lin's titillating costume sets.

[ejamer]

NA/EU review copies of Xenoblade Chronicles X are out. Time for me to get extra anxious.

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/the-x-button/2015-11-05/long-division/.95022
In the first section of the column, it appears the inevitable has come to pass with Lin's JPN bikini-thong clothes being edited/censored.

While I default to Japanese games to keep everything as they go through localization, I'm not upset in this specific case of 13/15-year-old Lin's titillating costume sets.

Exciting news, right? I know reviews won't be out for a while... but at least people are getting to play. I kind of pity the reviewer who has to rush through the game though. If this experience is as epic as the previous game, playing to completion in a month isn't really that much time.




Re: censorship


I care much less here than with Fatal Frame. Maybe that's not reasonable, but to the games have different ratings (I don't expect any censorship in M-rated titles) and there is also a different social stance in the West when it involves characters who clearly look underage wearing appropriate clothing compared to what adults are portrayed wearing.


That said, I hope they haven't gone hog wild with changing outfits for all characters. It's not really a big deal, but beyond adding some modesty for extremely young characters there isn't really a good justification (for the time and effort spent) in making those kind of changes to a T-rated game.

[TOPHATANT123]

Lin is actually 13 in both versions according to John and the aging up was misinformation. The lack of bikinis doesn't offend me but for whatever reason religious references are also being removed, words such testament and Lucifer. It feels like we have regressed back into the days of removing crosses from Dragon Warrior on NES. Regardless I'm still incredibly excited for X, I've been going through Xenoblade 3d before the new one comes out although it doesn't look like I'll be able to finish it in time. I thought playing it again might get boring but in reality it has only deepened my appreciation for it and reaffirmed to me that it is my favourite game of all time.

[Ian Sane]

I didn't know religious references were being changed.  That's a little annoying.

I look at it like this - has anything been changed to the point where you would prefer the alternative of the game not being localized at all?  Odds are the main feel of the game is not going to be all that different because a 13-year old girl can't wear skimpy clothes.  It isn't like sweat in Mortal Kombat or people getting intoxicated on root beer.  Also we do now live in the internet age.  If you really want to see this girl uncensored I'm sure you can find screenshots and movies easily.  This isn't like when I was a kid and I wouldn't even know if a game was altered and couldn't see what I was missing even if I did.

[Enner]

The removal or editing of religious references and allegories I can be okay with because Japanese anime/manga/video games cares less about such religions than what North American/European/etc. are used to. There is a high probability that the Japanese creators did not treat the religious references with the sensitivity non-Japanese audiences would like.

Also, it's not uncommon for such religious stuff to be thrown around as cool window-dressing. Granted, executive director Tetsuya Takahashi might be trying to say something with the use of religious references, but it's possible he is biting more off than he can chew. I'm curious to read detailed comparisons between the Japanese version and English version.

[Evan_B]

All the while, Shin Megami Tensei sits there with a big middle finger flipped at European religion.

Just another reason to keep learning japanese.

[ejamer]

Minor religious references removed from the game?  Curious to hear exactly why they felt those changes had to be made...  would love to give the localization team benefit of the doubt, but don't feel like they deserve it.


(Yeah, yeah. They know more than me. They are professionals. They have rules they have to follow. The excuses go on. It still sounds like another unnecessary and unproductive decision that gets made to appease people who aren't even going to play the game. I mean, think about the themes in Xenoblade if you play through to the end. Now explain to me why we can't handle the name Lucifer or calling something a testament. Seriously?)



Also, I disagree with Ian Sane's comment above. This isn't an "all or nothing" situation where we need to just be thankful the game gets released at all. If Nintendo is consistently making decisions that fans don't like during the localization process, I think it's perfectly valid to speak out about it - especially if that feedback gets back to NoA.

[Enner]

All the while, Shin Megami Tensei sits there with a big middle finger flipped at European religion.

Just another reason to keep learning japanese.

Given that the Shin Megami Tensei series is about Hell (as in the Hell) spilling forth on to Tokyo (or what have you), the religious stuff is a strong theme.

(Yeah, yeah. They know more than me. They are professionals. They have rules they have to follow. The excuses go on. It still sounds like another unnecessary and unproductive decision that gets made to appease people who aren't even going to play the game. I mean, think about the themes in Xenoblade if you play through to the end. Now explain to me why we can't handle the name Lucifer or calling something a testament. Seriously?)

I think it's important to consider that the in the Japanese version the religious references are just plain stupid to western audiences. Perhaps they maybe as stupid as naming a random assortment of proper nouns using names from the Bible or the Koran with no strong rhyme or reason.

From what little I got of impression of Takahashi's previous work, Xenoblade Chronicles was very light compared to the weeds the three Xenosaga games went in to. Maybe Treehouse and 8-4 are making the better judgement call in cutting that stuff down. Since I have so little information to go on, I can only hope for a detailed article in the future that details what was changed.

[oohhboy]

Most Japanese religious references are nothing more than flavouring. Look at Evangelion for example, full to the brim with references, but almost none of it is structural or follow any real theme. It's there because it is cool. They do it with any religion.

It's stupid for western audiences because it is nonsensical, intentionally so. Trying to draw anything out of nonsense is going to drive you nuts.

[Ian Sane]

Doesn't the Shin Megami Tensei series actually have stuff where the Judeo-Christian God is portrayed as a villain. THAT I can see offending people and I can see why Nintendo would want to clear of something like that.  But name dropping some religious reference is pretty minor.  Think about things like the Lazurus Pits from Batman or Archangel from X-Men.  Those are bible references.  Sega called their console the Sega GENESIS for crying out loud!  Any controversy from those, if they exist, were so minor that I've never heard of any.

But then I'm a pretty reasonable person and I have noticed that there are a lot of people that aren't.  I'm a Christian but if you call something Lucifer or testament I will at worst roll my eyes.  In some cases you could be doing something that makes perfect sense.  Call the main bad guy Lucifer?  That's such an obvious parallel that it's almost too easy to the point of being corny.  But there are people that throw a fit over the tiniest reference to their religion and I can see why a company doesn't want any bad publicity that could come from that.

Now the only people that will ever play Xenoblade Chronicles X or frankly will even know it exists are not the types that would throw a fit over religious terms.  But then I think they probably wouldn't care about jailbait in bikinis either.  I think Nintendo is over-reacting but they do care a lot about being seen as a family-friendly company and it just takes one nutbar to make a big thing about this stuff.  A company like Atlus wouldn't give a **** because their image is of this Japanese hardcore games company and their target audience would actually be more turned off if they changed the content.  But Nintendo is trying to sell Pokémon and doesn't want to be associated with "blasphemy" or "pedophilia" which would be the worst-case scenario here.

I don't want to get the point where Nintendo is back to root beer in bars and people threatening to "destroy" someone rather than "kill" them.  But I get why they have some concerns.  There is a point where the game's themes are being seriously compromised but I can live with some sanitizing if it doesn't have much impact on the experience.

[Mop it up]

This is why it's called "localization" and not "translation," some things get altered to better fit the culture upon which it's being released. This has been going on for decades, and it isn't just Nintendo either. There have been plenty of Sony system games changed for the US, including recent ones on Vita and PS4. People are complaining about this simply because it's Nintendo.

[TOPHATANT123]

Gamexplain has some videos up of the English review copy. I only watched a bit of the battle one but from what I understand the preview video has some spoilers in it so I would advise avoiding that one. I like Elma's VA as well as Lin's who is surprising not annoying, oh and Fiora is back in spirit as a voice option for the protagonist. Tatsu though from what little I heard sounds terrible.

[ejamer]

... People are complaining about this simply because it's Nintendo.

Maybe, but if so I'd argue that it's partly because Nintendo has a history of going overboard with these decisions.


Localization vs translation is a fine point, but there needs to be a balance between trying to make the game more culturally relevant and needlessly changing content. Worse yet, sometimes localization is used to justify bowdlerization. I'm not saying that's the case here, but removing any religious references might fit that description and does seem out of place for a game in the Xeno line.


When a change is made that doesn't add value, and (arguably) doesn't make it more culturally relevant or acceptable, then I think we should question why the change is made.


(And for perspective, this is all tempest in a teapot stuff. It doesn't sound like any of the changes really matter in this case, even though I wonder if some are actually valuable changes or just arbitrary decisions. They certainly aren't going to affect my decision to buy, play, and enjoy the game.)

[Mop it up]

Maybe, but if so I'd argue that it's partly because Nintendo has a history of going overboard with these decisions.

That was like 20 years ago, though. Time for people to let go.

Things like names might not change because of being a religious reference or something, it could also just be to create better names or instill more personality. For example, Ted Woolsey changed a lot of things about games like Final Fantasy VI and Chrono Trigger, and after seeing the original stuff I felt like he did make certain things more fun and chose better names.

I do agree it is okay to wonder why changes are made, but that isn't really what's happening. Especially on a place like GameFAQs or something, where it's being called "censorship" and any change is automatically assumed to be bad. I swear, some people aren't satisfied unless a game has directly-translated, broken English lines.

[Stratos]

People need to understand that translation is an art, not a science. The goal is to carry over the spirit of the message. Certain jokes can only be conveyed in the language it was created in.


Woolsey was a quality translator and did a fantastic job with some major projects.

[Evan_B]

From all that I have played and read in the Xeno series, the stories have had some sort of religious theming. Maybe not direct references to European religion, but talk of godhood, etc. I think this is interesting, but then again, many JRPGs have themes of destroying gods and such.

With Xenoblade Chronicles X, the story seems to be more evocative of Space Opera or hard Sci-fi, so maybe religious themes would be downplayed, or at lead relegated to philosophical musings made by characters. But I do agree that naming something with a religious title just for the sake of it isn't necessary. If you strip a character of their own beliefs for the sake of remaining family friendly, however, I'm not too keen on that.

[michaelbaysuperfan616]

wasn't Bayonetta a religious themed game and it was pretty hard core.

[Luigi Dude]

wasn't Bayonetta a religious themed game and it was pretty hard core.

Bayonetta is so ridiculously over the top it's hard for anyone to take it seriously.  When Angels are portrayed as mechanical bird monsters and God is a giant naked women you fight in outer space, it actually becomes less likely to offend anyone just from how silly the whole story is. 

Something like Xenoblade which is trying to be more serious and dramatic, has a finer line to walk since misuse of religuous names and themes can be a lot more annoying to a Western audience since they're expecting more from the story.

[ejamer]

wasn't Bayonetta a religious themed game and it was pretty hard core.

Bayonetta is so ridiculously over the top it's hard for anyone to take it seriously.  When Angels are portrayed as mechanical bird monsters and God is a giant naked women you fight in outer space, it actually becomes less likely to offend anyone just from how silly the whole story is. 

Something like Xenoblade which is trying to be more serious and dramatic, has a finer line to walk since misuse of religuous names and themes can be a lot more annoying to a Western audience since they're expecting more from the story.

I call BS on this. Xenoblade might be trying to be more serious, but it's still very clearly a fantasy setting with huge mechs and giant dinosaur-like creatures.


People who might get offended over religious themes would get offended either way.
People who might get offended aren't the target audience in either case.

[ShyGuy]

What are we talking about? Japan's hipster-ising of the Abrahamic religions? Welcome to Anime.



I was considering getting this game, but I'm afraid it would cut into my Devil's Third time.