Author Topic: Mafia GX: Scrapheap (Read 44163 times)

decoyman · « **Reply #150 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:03:22 AM »

Ceric, you can't reject being recruited. Recruitment is supposed to be one of the ways the mafia is evened out with the uber-powerful townies and their librarian and the myriad roles they have. Yes, the townies also had a cop, the mole, and the magician (if used properly) to tell them who mafia were. This game, at least with the addition of the 2nd mafia, was stacked for the townies.

And now you're denying a legitimate action that was basically only one small way that the mafias could hope to even out with the townies. Sorry, Shy, but that's just not cool. As a mafia member (which you were, whether you agreed with it or not), your allegiance changes. You don't like it? Too bad. It's called playing fair.

BigJim used a mafia power and, with some luck, made the play of the game. And you won't honor that great bit of strategy? It's like playing chess, and someone gets their pawn all the way across the board, but you won't give them a queen. In fact, you take the queen they should've been given, change its color to your own, and set it up to checkmate him. Does that seem fair? Because that's basically what you did.

So, congrats, townies. Revel in the sacrifice your friend made. You may think I'm a sore loser or something, but in my book, the first sore loser was Shyguy.

ShyGuy · « **Reply #151 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:10:26 AM »

Hey, I didn't make up the rule that I could choose to be recruited or not, Khush did. Plus, for what it's worth, I tricked BigJim into revealing himself to me.

Furthermore, it wouldn't have mattered if I was recruited, because I would have still killed BigJim (because the killer's motives remain intact even after recruiting, check the rules)

After that, the townies would have still voted the killer out, because that plan was set in motion days ago.

mantidor · « **Reply #152 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:12:18 AM »

Great game, winning or losing isn't as good as the way one follows to the conclusion, even if the townies won, my favorite moment wasn't that, it was changing with perm his doctor role and protecting him right before he was targeted, which left the mafia all confused and weirded out, thinking they had a hit on the doctor ^_^

stevey · « **Reply #153 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:23:13 AM »

Since game is over it wouldn't matter if I'll start talking. First, I DID NOT PM THE WRONG PEOPLE! 18 days should be ban from the next mafia game for cheating! and if you wondering why I'm replying to it so late is because I couldn't got IM to talk to me (and still cant

) and wasn't sure if he was planing something or khush forgot to PM him his role...

Quote
Posted by khush
Anyways, as I waiting for the packages, it suddenly hit me. What if Decoyman wanted the mole to reveal himself and just have the mole send his package to mafia members. I checked back through my rules to see if I had posted anything on who the package could or could not be given to but I hadn't. And when sending out my instructions, I realized that I had never specified that either. So, then I started sweating. If that happened would I deny it or not? Technically, it was a fair move. It negated the reason for the mole but if a mafia picked up on it and I hadn't said anything yet, should I deny them their brilliant gameplay? And the truth is, after thinking about, I would have allowed it. Yes, the mole was supposed to give away the mafia and this would have been contrary to the role but at the same time, the person could be playing to get back in the mafia and therefore keeping them strong to allow that. Because of the ambiguity on the mole's true alliegience, (remember, he's being blackmailed against his will) it could still be argued that he is playing within his parameters. However, that never came to pass and I didn't have to worry about that thorny issue. Plus, Pale pretty much forced Deg to send him the packages. Still, that would have been brilliant strategy.

while thank you

, that was pretty much my plan from day 1, and it worked when AZ pm me tell me about getting the mole role on day 3 too bad everyone died before it could be used...

Ceric · « **Reply #154 on:** October 15, 2006, 10:34:31 AM »

Thats right Khush. Where in the rule does it state that the Killer had a say in the matter?

Quote
The Killer

The killer works alone. He is out for himself and himself only. He can only win by being the last one standing. The killer has a small advantage. Because he is an expert at what he does, he is the only one who can safely kill a time bomb or the bomber and not die. He can a make a hit every night against anyone he chooses. If he is corrupted, he does the propagandist's bidding. If he is recruited, he may win with a mafia victory.

Just like anyone else recruited.

Overall it was a good fun game but deviations from posted rules... Should be explained.
(I especially like the story.)
I mean I'll play in another Khush game no problem. I'll just have to pick the rules more then I thought I should have.

decoyman · « **Reply #155 on:** October 15, 2006, 01:25:42 PM »

I agree with Ceric. And, Shyguy, you say you would kill BigJim the next day anyways... but if you're a member of the mafia, how does it make sense to kill one of your own members? You could've won this game, and instead you shot it down.

P.S. - Mantidor: that was you, eh? Nice one, I just thought Perm was being careless, and I had pretty much forgotten about the magician

I think it's obvious that I greatly underestimated the impact that role could have on the game.

EDIT: This is my last sour post on the end of this game. I really had a fun time leading my mafia to at least a chance at the win. If the ball had bounced a different way in even just one of our difficult situations (Deg leaving after the blackmailer was dead, Pale not getting killed the next day after he was recruited (how did the townies find out anyways??), or Shyguy actually joining us with his powers), we might've pulled it off. For what it's worth, I do think the townies played a great game: aggressive and smart.

BigJim · « **Reply #156 on:** October 15, 2006, 01:35:46 PM »

Quote
it wouldn't have mattered if I was recruited, because I would have still killed BigJim (because the killer's motives remain intact even after recruiting

The Killer's motives are to kill and win. This was your chance to win. Even joining me for just one day and killing me the next would have led you to victory. You wanted to shank me deliberately so the townies would win. That's not consistent with the killer's motives. It's your choice, but call a spade a spade.

BigJim · « **Reply #157 on:** October 15, 2006, 02:02:40 PM »

I have to applaud Khush for all of his effort as the host. The storytelling, answering the questions, working on actions, and everything seemed to go really smoothly, and it was fun.

I have some general suggestions about how to maybe tighten up the rules a bit.

I think that the mafias were slightly disadvantaged because even though there were 2, it was 29 vs. 5. That's a LOT of spying to find out any useful info, and only about 5 chances tops to do it… As this game sorta showed since almost all of the big townie rolls were among the last. Part of it was luck for them, but part of it was also the large number of regular townies to weed through. Had there been a more active cop, mafia would have been toast.

In hindsight, strategically the mafias may have wanted to team up for an agreed amount of time, and not try to bump each other off. I'd probably suggest either a mega-mafia when there are this many players, or at least grant nightly spy actions.

Pale's all-mafia idea sounds fun. That might be worth a shot.

Shift Key · « **Reply #158 on:** October 15, 2006, 03:22:04 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: BigJim

I think that the mafias were slightly disadvantaged because even though there were 2, it was 29 vs. 5. That's a LOT of spying to find out any useful info, and only about 5 chances tops to do it… As this game sorta showed since almost all of the big townie rolls were among the last. Part of it was luck for them, but part of it was also the large number of regular townies to weed through. Had there been a more active cop, mafia would have been toast.

In hindsight, strategically the mafias may have wanted to team up for an agreed amount of time, and not try to bump each other off. I'd probably suggest either a mega-mafia when there are this many players, or at least grant nightly spy actions.

You mean 5 vs 24 vs 5, right?

But yes, the large volume of townies to go through certainly hindered the mafia. There was a point where MaxVelocty were still 4 strong that I thought, "Man, we're screwed". The townie alliance wasn't as strong as the mafia had thought either, the bandwagoning of votes hid the fact that there were only a few of us which were actually organised behind the scenes. Some of the mafia did an excellent job of avoiding suspicion. It was a good game all up.

I would also increase the amount of spying that each mafia can do if we ever do a multiple-faction game again. Aside from working with the librarian for a bit, I had little actual info to work with for the majority of the game. I had to rely on pumping others for information, which has its risks.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #159 on:** October 15, 2006, 03:23:10 PM »

Hmmm, interesting debate. If someone is recruited to they shouldn't be able to keep there special abilities then.

Reading the Mafia recruitment, I think that it was alittle too difficult to recruit. I would simply put that when you attempt to recruit a die is rolled and if a 5 or 6 comes up then they are recruited. The odds are 1/4 instead of 1/6. I would balance that by making the Mafia choose to recruit or kill on their action. And if someone is recruited...it should be announced in the story that recruitment happened. Not who...just that a successful recruitment was made. Then people know to be suspicious, and will began questioning allegance.

Just some random thoughts.

Shift Key · « **Reply #160 on:** October 15, 2006, 03:30:23 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
Hmmm, interesting debate. If someone is recruited to they shouldn't be able to keep there special abilities then.

Reading the Mafia recruitment, I think that it was alittle too difficult to recruit. I would simply put that when you attempt to recruit a die is rolled and if a 5 or 6 comes up then they are recruited. The odds are 1/4 instead of 1/6. I would balance that by making the Mafia choose to recruit or kill on their action. And if someone is recruited...it should be announced in the story that recruitment happened. Not who...just that a successful recruitment was made. Then people know to be suspicious, and will began questioning allegance.

Just some random thoughts.

Dice roll? Needs more paper-rock-scissors I think. If the target's move beat the recruiter's move, then the recruitment fails. Otherwise the recruitment is successful. How about that? Rather than go for pure probability give the event some interaction...

And yes, if someone is recruited I'd like to hear mention of it in the story. No names, just facts so I can start up some baseless accusations! Huzzah!

PS Rolling a 5 or a 6 on a die is a 1 in 3 chance, not 1 in 4.

KnowsNothing · « **Reply #161 on:** October 15, 2006, 03:36:07 PM »

Mafia needs more rocks-paper-scissors. EVERYTHING needs more r-p-s.

MY ORDER OF WORDS IS THE CORRECT ORDER OF WORDS

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #162 on:** October 15, 2006, 04:33:47 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Shift Key
Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
Hmmm, interesting debate. If someone is recruited to they shouldn't be able to keep there special abilities then.

Reading the Mafia recruitment, I think that it was alittle too difficult to recruit. I would simply put that when you attempt to recruit a die is rolled and if a 5 or 6 comes up then they are recruited. The odds are 1/4 instead of 1/6. I would balance that by making the Mafia choose to recruit or kill on their action. And if someone is recruited...it should be announced in the story that recruitment happened. Not who...just that a successful recruitment was made. Then people know to be suspicious, and will began questioning allegance.

Just some random thoughts.

Dice roll? Needs more paper-rock-scissors I think. If the target's move beat the recruiter's move, then the recruitment fails. Otherwise the recruitment is successful. How about that? Rather than go for pure probability give the event some interaction...

And yes, if someone is recruited I'd like to hear mention of it in the story. No names, just facts so I can start up some baseless accusations! Huzzah!

PS Rolling a 5 or a 6 on a die is a 1 in 3 chance, not 1 in 4.

I am ok with Paper Rock Scissors. Interaction is good. The problem with that is cheating. You could tell somebody you are trying to recruit them, and let them know what to pick. Who wouldn't want to be in a Mafia and know more of what is going on. That is the only reason I thought bad on that.

And you are right...1/3 Opps. I dunno why I was thinking 8 in my head.

vudu · « **Reply #163 on:** October 15, 2006, 04:37:31 PM »

I demand that instead of Rock-Paper-Scissors people start saying Swords-Axes-Lances.

KnowsNothing · « **Reply #164 on:** October 15, 2006, 04:46:40 PM »

NERD LOL

decoyman · « **Reply #165 on:** October 15, 2006, 07:09:27 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Khush in Day 3 Thread
So, Antonio went over to James. "Here. I have some love letters from your girlfriend," he said, tossing over the letters. James looked at them. "He's not my girlfriend! And I have a wife!" said James, defending himself. "Then how come none of us have seen her?" asked Antonio, "As far as I'm concerned, your "wife" is just something you made up to keep people from knowing what your really up doing or thinking." "Well, at least my wife doesn't have a mohawk," retorted James, "and her name isn't Antonio Guster aka KnowNothing!" "How did you know? I hate you!" yelled Antonio, running away from James. But as Antonio ran across the scorched desert, he ran into a MaxVelocity trap! MaxVelocity wanted the papers Antonio had on Captain Falcon's mind control, hoping it would give them clues to the identities of the other Legends Mafia members. And so Antonio ran right into a minefield and was blown to bits. The papers he had were scattered everywhere in the air. The noise of the explosion brought many racers to the scene. "Drat!" thought decoyman, the MaxVelocity godfather, "Next time, I must kill my victim more quietly." The hitman ran over to Antonio's room at the hotel and searched through it. But there was nothing to be found there. It seemed Antonio was just a regular racer or townie who got mixed up in this crazy business.

Hehe, um, yeah, sorry about that, KnowsNothing.

MattVDB · « **Reply #166 on:** October 15, 2006, 07:54:41 PM »

Now, I gotta wonder, did my talking all at the beginning get the townies together, or was I just killed off for talking? It looked like it helped, but honestly, after I died, I didn't follow it nearly as much as I did before.

Next game, I promise you all that I will read through my role more carefully. That was my bad, and I'm sorry for ruining the game for people early in the game.

ThePerm · « **Reply #167 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:00:46 PM »

having been in contact with you, it didnt help much...we didnt get a real aliance going till about day 6..after that happened it was all gold

ShyGuy · « **Reply #168 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:33:11 PM »

Yeah, I didn't really trust MattVDB until after he was dead.

By the way, Matt didn't really share anything about the situation with Stabby and Khush, it was simply alluded to in his PM to me that something was going on. I got more info through some cleverly worded PMs to Khush and Stabby, causing them to fill me in.

ThePerm · « **Reply #169 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:36:12 PM »

also, anyone saying shyguy is stupid...forgets one thing...between Shyguy, Mantidor, Shiftkey, and me...we kept switching positions. The killer wasn't one person. Neither was the magician.

Shift Key · « **Reply #170 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:41:46 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: ThePerm
also, anyone saying shyguy is stupid...forgets one thing...between Shyguy, Mantidor, Shiftkey, and me...we kept switching positions. The killer wasn't one person. Neither was the magician.

Except no-one actually wanted to swap with me. So I became the mouthpiece, expecting a hit on me anyday for bandwagoning those mafia hits.

ShyGuy · « **Reply #171 on:** October 15, 2006, 08:53:49 PM »

Shift Key was the kiler at one point too, right?

ThePerm · « **Reply #172 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:02:54 PM »

I was Doctor, Magician, Killer, and Regular Townie lol

Shift Key · « **Reply #173 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:10:29 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
Shift Key was the kiler at one point too, right?

Sent By: Khushrenada
To: Shift Key
Date: 10/05/2006 03:00:46 AM
Hey Shift Key. Thanks to your steal as the drifter you are the killer.

================================================================================================================

Sent By: Khushrenada
To: Shift Key
Date: 10/05/2006 03:07:15 AM
Uh oh. Bad news. The magician used his ability. You are no longer the killer. Your role has been switched. You are now the townie idiot.

================================================================================================================

SEVEN MINUTES!! SEVEN FREAKING MINUTES!!!!

Svevan · « **Reply #174 on:** October 15, 2006, 09:29:09 PM »

It's funny how easy it is to be mafia - I sat back most of the game waiting for my power to unlock, did some dirty behind the scenes dealings, but had generally no action. I know the other mafia did a lot more work, but I think those of you townies with abilities did a ton more than all of us this game.

News:

Author Topic: Mafia GX: Scrapheap (Read 44163 times)