Poll

In general across all platforms, which control method do you like to use when playing FPS games?

Motion/pointer controls all the way
21 (75%)
Classic controls every time
4 (14.3%)
Motion/pointer controls for the single player campaign, classic for multiplayer
2 (7.1%)
Classic controls for the single player campaign, motion/pointer for multiplayer
1 (3.6%)

Total Members Voted: 28

Author Topic: Classic Controls Vs Pointer/Motion Controls for FPS's - let battle commence!  (Read 8926 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline famicomplicated

  • The OG Japan Correspondent
  • NWR Staff
  • Score: 5
    • View Profile
With the release of Goldeneye 007 on Wii, the debate of which control setup works best for first-person shooters is yet again a topic of discussion.
This is the forum thread to vote and discuss which is your favourite.


This may be decided on a game-by-game basis for some, but I'm looking for a general opinion, which do you tend to lean towards and why?


If you swear by classic controls, what puts you off pointer controls? (and vice-versa)


In games that allow both control methods in multiplayer mode (like Goldeneye), do you find more success using one method over another?


Keep it clean and stick to the FPS genre, thank you please  :D

I am your (Fami)father.
Follow me on Twitter for some #hypertrollGET fun.
Troll with love, not hate.

Offline Sundoulos

  • My mascot is a type of toxic algae
  • Score: 27
    • View Profile
What, no option for a keyboard and mouse?   ;D
"A creature revolting against a creator is revolting against the source of his own powers--including even his power to revolt...It is like the scent of a flower trying to destroy the flower." - C.S. Lewis, in a preface to Milton's Paradise Lost

Offline Spak-Spang

  • The Frightened Fox
  • Score: 39
    • View Profile
    • MirandaNew.com
I said motion control for classic games, and Classic Controller for online, but the reason is I play multiplayer split screen in the same room.  So I think classic controller is more simple.  However, if I was playing online, I would want to have pointer controls even for multiplayer.

Offline Morari

  • 46 DC EA D3 17 FE 45 D8 09 23 EB 97 E4 95 64 10 D4 CD B2 C2
  • Score: -7237
    • View Profile
The IR pointer is vastly superior to any gamepad. It allows for (more) accurate aiming and quick turning if setup correctly. That said, it still feels sluggish and dependent upon auto-aim if you have any kind of experience with first-person shooters. Nothing can replace a good mouse and keyboard, especially for competitive multiplayer.
"This post has been censored for your protection."

                                --Bureau of Internet Morality

Offline TJ Spyke

  • Ass
  • Score: -1350
    • View Profile
    • Spyke Shop
I haven't played a real FPS using pointer controls, I did love playing Metroid Prime 3: Corruption with pointer controls though. To be honest though, I am fine with either option.
Help out a poor college student, buy video games and Blu-ray Discs at: http://astore.amazon.com/spyke-20

Offline ejamer

  • Does he even know Khushrenada?!?
  • Score: 24
    • View Profile
Tough question.
 
Most people are naturally biased towards control schemes that they are already familiar with, so opinions often vary depending on whether the gamer has:
- experience playing FPS games on console (ie: dual-analog)
- experience playing FPS games on computer (ie: mouse and keyboard)
- no previous FPS experience
 
 
I voted for always using pointer controls for several reasons.  First, it doesn't make sense (for me) to change preferred control methods for different types of gameplay.  Second, as someone who has limited experience playing console FPS tiles but moderate experience with PC shooters, pointer controls feel closer to the mouse-and-keyboard setup that I am most familiar with.  Finally, the increased speed and accuracy provided by well-designed and configured pointer controls simply seems more natural to me, creating an experience that can't be matched by dual analogs (although it can be approximated with experience).
 
That certainly doesn't mean that others will, or should, agree with my opinion... although hosting this poll on a Nintendo fansite probably means the sample taken will be biased.
 ;D
NNID: ejamer

Offline KDR_11k

  • boring person
  • Score: 28
    • View Profile
I have SIGNIFICANTLY higher speed and precision with the pointer. Aiming with an analog stick feels stiff and makes it much harder to keep an overview of your surroundings by having a quick glance at something and when you need to aim for a head (as you do in 95% of the games involving guns) the extra time needed to precisely move the aim cursor with the stick is deadly.

Offline Sundoulos

  • My mascot is a type of toxic algae
  • Score: 27
    • View Profile
True story...I have an electrical engineering friend who was a PC gaming apoloist. :)  He tried to cannabalize an N64 controller to sort of jerry-rig it to a mouse interface to play the original GoldenEye in one our gaming nights.  The results didn't turn out too well; I think it had more to do with the implementation than the concept.  :Q
« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 10:25:48 AM by Sundoulos »
"A creature revolting against a creator is revolting against the source of his own powers--including even his power to revolt...It is like the scent of a flower trying to destroy the flower." - C.S. Lewis, in a preface to Milton's Paradise Lost

Offline Retro Deckades

  • Score: 8
    • View Profile
I picked up a CC Pro when I purchased Goldeneye. It's been several years since I've used a controller for an FPS (the last time was probably for Timesplitters 3). I was actually surprised to learn that I have to acclimatize myself with the CC Pro -- it didn't exactly feel completely natural to use when I briefly tested it. I've been playing the online mode in Goldeneye using the pointer controls exclusively, and it sure does help to make it quick to aim and therefore get the drop on others.

Offline NWR_insanolord

  • Rocket Fuel Malt Liquor....DAMN!
  • NWR Staff Pro
  • Score: -18987
    • View Profile
I will always use pointer controls if given the option, but I'm fine with dual analog if there's a shooter on 360/PS3 that I want to play.
Insanolord is a terrible moderator.

J.P. Corbran
NWR Community Manager and Soccer Correspondent

Offline Ian Sane

  • Champion for Urban Champion
  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
The Wii ain't exactly abundant with the great first person shooters.  So realistically Metroid Prime 3 is my sole experience with pointer controls.  What I don't like is that I have to keep my hand still.  It's very easy to start bouncing all over the place.  At least with dual-analog if I "rest" I just do nothing.  It's like I can't rest with pointer controls for I have to keep that pointer facing forward.

Is it more accurate?  Yeah, but it's more work on my part.  Maybe it's something I could get used to if more games used it.  But right now if I want a good FPS I'm going with my PS3 where I'll be using dual-analog.  That's just how it is.

With Metroid Prime 3 there was also the problem that I was used to the original Metroid Prime controls and unlike a lot of people I was content with them.  The new controls were fixing a problem I never really felt was there.

The sample size has just been too small.  We'll see how I feel as FPS games with these style controls become more common.

Offline broodwars

  • Hunting for a Pineapple Salad
  • Score: -1012
    • View Profile
I'm somewhere in the middle, and whichever I prefer depends on the game.  For example, I prefered pointer control in Resident Evil 4 Wii, but classic control in Goldeneye Wii.  I really have two big issues with pointer control:
 
1.  My natural inclination is sniping.  It's what I enjoy most in shooting-style games, and it's something I have a great deal of difficulty doing with pointer control because the slightest twitch of my wrist throws my aim completely off.  Sure, it's realistic, but if I wanted realism I wouldn't be playing a game.
 
2.  When I pop in a game, I don't want to have to spend 10 minutes - 1 hour calibrating and recalibrating bounding boxes, sliders, etc. to customize the controls for my particular UI quirks.  My OCD won't let me move on until it's "just right".  I just want to put in the game, grab a controller, and go and after Conduit you really can't do that anymore with pointer control.  That's why I liked using it for RE4 and Metroid Prime Trilogy: they got the controls right the first time and I didn't need to waste time recalibrating everything.
"It's time to play...JAZZ...BASKETBALL!"

Offline ShyGuy

  • Tom Nook - Like a Boss!
  • *
  • Score: -9660
    • View Profile
I'm very pro pointer controls, it's probably the main reason I bought a Wii. I grew up on early PC first person shooters, and I've never been a big fan of dual analog controls for FPS, The movement is slower and auto aim is annoying.

When I got my Wii on Launch day, I practiced with Red Steel until I got the controls down. I was determined to learn it, because Wii pointer controls looked like my only viable choice if I wanted to play console shooters

I can play a dual analog shooter, I went through a couple Halos, Black, and I actually enjoyed the Left 4 Deads on the 360.

I think since the age of the average game keeps going up, gamers have become more and more resistant to change. If Move and Kinect are bigs hits, a significant chunk of gamers will refuse to adapt.

Pointer controls are much quicker and accurate than dual analog. Try doing something like Wii Play shooting gallery with dual analog.

Sadly auto-aim has crept into Wii pointer FPS as well. Apparently, it shows up in some PC FPS today too. I think this comes from the 360 being the #1 targeted development platform.

Offline ThePerm

  • predicted it first.
  • Score: 61
    • View Profile
hmm, if i were to create a control setup

A = context sensitive
+ & - switch weapons
B = shoot
Z = move/aim/turn
c = stop and aim
d-pad = strafe/ look up and down

this way you have the ability to switch from a goldeney n64 setup, to a halo setup, to a wii setup on the fly
« Last Edit: November 10, 2010, 03:07:49 PM by ThePerm »
NWR has permission to use any tentative mockup/artwork I post

Offline ejamer

  • Does he even know Khushrenada?!?
  • Score: 24
    • View Profile
...  What I don't like is that I have to keep my hand still.  It's very easy to start bouncing all over the place.  At least with dual-analog if I "rest" I just do nothing.  It's like I can't rest with pointer controls for I have to keep that pointer facing forward.
...

I don't really understand this line of reasoning.
 
Can't you just rest your arm/elbow on something?  A chair/couch handle has always worked wonderfully for me, and then you just need to make small wrist movements to adjust your aim.  Very stable with virtually no effort required!
 
Almost all games have some type of cursor visible, so it's not like you need to have your arm extended and actually aiming at the screen.  There are a few on-rails shooters that ask you to actually aim using a zapper-like peripheral and no on-screen indication of where you are shooting... but they aren't the norm, and playing that way is usually optional anyway.
NNID: ejamer

Offline NWR_insanolord

  • Rocket Fuel Malt Liquor....DAMN!
  • NWR Staff Pro
  • Score: -18987
    • View Profile
Yeah, I hate when people complain about having to hold their arm up to aim, as if that were the only way to do it. Rest your arm and pivot your wrist!
Insanolord is a terrible moderator.

J.P. Corbran
NWR Community Manager and Soccer Correspondent

Offline Ian Sane

  • Champion for Urban Champion
  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
Quote
Yeah, I hate when people complain about having to hold their arm up to aim, as if that were the only way to do it. Rest your arm and pivot your wrist!

But then I still have to rest my arm on something.  It's still adding extra restrictions that never existed before.  I actually move around a lot when I game.  I'll start of sitting and then maybe slouch, maybe lie on the couch, and then sit on the floor.  Before the Wii I could just do this and my guy on the screen doesn't start staring into the heavens or spin-jumping or anything.  It's very easy to make those adjustment with a normal controller.  I just don't like tying in controls with moving the controller.  There is no real neutral position to allow you to scratch your cheek while you play or change positions.  The controls become fragile in a way.
 
I wonder if one's FPS control preferences are based a lot on their general FPS preferences.  I liked how in DOOM you couldn't aim and the game was designed so that you didn't have to.  Once they added looking around and aiming to the genre the controls had to become much more complicated.  It was easier when it was just simple moving or strafing.  I'm not bothered by auto-aim, I kind of prefer it.  I think more in a "dodge bad guy/shoot bad guy" mentality where specifically aiming is of little concern.  But I don't play deathmatch very much.  I like single player for FPS games or co-op against the computer.  I can see how that could make a big difference.  When you're up against the computer it's you against a whole army.  You kind of want that extra handicapping in your favour like auto-aim.  But against another human you want the truly skilled to win.  You don't want to lose because the game helped the guy with his shot.
 
I think that's why I was so cool with Metroid Prime's controls.  I just want to kill the bad guys and explore the world and find new abilities.  Lock-on aiming is cool for me because it suits my desires.  I don't need to work to shoot the bad guys.  It's just dodge, shoot, solve puzzle, continue to explore.  But I can imagine that if you're more into deatchmatch multiplayer in FPS games you've conditioned yourself to be expecting and wanting that sort of precision aiming, even though the game was not really designed to require it (Metroid Prime 2 last boss being the frustrating exception).
 
It's kind of like having a jump button in Zelda.  Some people really could not adapt to that and it took me a little while to get used to the auto-jump.  I was too used to Mario where you need that precision jumping.  The whole thing is kind of like Ridge Racer vs. Gran Turismo where they're both car racing games but the target audience is such that one audience demands considerably more precision in the controls while the other would find it needlessly complicated.
 
So when you state your preference maybe you should also state what you want to get out of an FPS game.

Offline King of Twitch

  • twitch.tv/zapr2k i live for this
  • Score: 141
    • View Profile
What a bunch of sissies. How do you think Samus Aran feels? Running around the galaxy all day, backtracking all night, risking her life so you can have the FREEDOM to live without fear of the Space Pirates? And you just sit there on your couch complaining about moving your arms, eating mac donald's, able to hit pause anytime you want. Ingrates.
"I deem his stream to be supreme and highly esteem his Fortnite team!" - The Doritos Pope and his Mountain Dew Crew.

Offline Killer_Man_Jaro

  • NWR Staff
  • Score: 22
    • View Profile
As a general rule, I will use the pointer controls to begin with and most of the time, I'll stick with them, unless something about it feels wrong. Although to be honest, if we are discussing the first person shooter specifically, there aren't many pointer & motion FPS's to speak of. The only first-person games I have on Wii are Metroid Prime 3 and Eledees, neither of which really qualify in the traditional sense. If we expand the frame of reference, I have really enjoyed using the pointer in favour of classic controls for several games - Battalion Wars II is one of the lesser known examples that comes to mind.

Ian Sane, I'm not sure what you're getting at - "you should also state what you want to get out of an FPS game". I would have thought you'd be playing to have fun; what could you want to get out of playing a game that would influence your choice of control scheme as well?
Tom Malina
UK Correspondent
-----------------------------
"You'll have to speak up, I'm wearing a towel."

Offline broodwars

  • Hunting for a Pineapple Salad
  • Score: -1012
    • View Profile
Ian Sane, I'm not sure what you're getting at - "you should also state what you want to get out of an FPS game". I would have thought you'd be playing to have fun; what could you want to get out of playing a game that would influence your choice of control scheme as well?

Considering he used Doom as an example, I'm going to hazard a guess that "what you want to get out of an FPS game" means "the style of FPS you enjoy playing."  For instance, if you just like playing an FPS where you run & gun, precision isn't altogether necessary so you might prefer a control scheme that trades away precision for immersiveness.  If you, like me, prefer playing an FPS that's somewhat stealth-based (or heavy on sniping) like the new Goldeneye, perhaps you want that extra bit of precision that comes with using a dual-analog stick (since it's harder to muck up your aim).
 
As for the whole "why don't you rest your arm?" thing, I can't do that in fast-paced FPS games.  It limits the movement of my wrist too much to not have some amount of free space around my wrist so it has to be somewhat elevated in the air.  In slower-pace First-Person games like Metroid Prime 3 or titles like Twilight Princess, there's a lot less rapid movement so it isn't really an issue.
"It's time to play...JAZZ...BASKETBALL!"

Offline kraken613

  • tinyurl.com/2lrx46
  • Score: 5
    • View Profile
Keyboard and Mouse>>>>>>>>>>> Wii Controls>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dual Analog

I play atleast 75% of my games on PC and it's all because of the controls. If I am on Wii NO WAY I am using dual analog.
~David~
3DS: 5214-9250-6646 - David
Playing Now: Animal Crossing: New Leaf

Offline NWR_insanolord

  • Rocket Fuel Malt Liquor....DAMN!
  • NWR Staff Pro
  • Score: -18987
    • View Profile
Ian Sane, I'm not sure what you're getting at - "you should also state what you want to get out of an FPS game". I would have thought you'd be playing to have fun; what could you want to get out of playing a game that would influence your choice of control scheme as well?

Considering he used Doom as an example, I'm going to hazard a guess that "what you want to get out of an FPS game" means "the style of FPS you enjoy playing."  For instance, if you just like playing an FPS where you run & gun, precision isn't altogether necessary so you might prefer a control scheme that trades away precision for immersiveness.  If you, like me, prefer playing an FPS that's somewhat stealth-based (or heavy on sniping) like the new Goldeneye, perhaps you want that extra bit of precision that comes with using a dual-analog stick (since it's harder to muck up your aim).
 
As for the whole "why don't you rest your arm?" thing, I can't do that in fast-paced FPS games.  It limits the movement of my wrist too much to not have some amount of free space around my wrist so it has to be somewhat elevated in the air.  In slower-pace First-Person games like Metroid Prime 3 or titles like Twilight Princess, there's a lot less rapid movement so it isn't really an issue.

I strongly disagree that analog aiming is more precise than pointer aiming. When you rest your arm, you rest the back of your forearm on a chair arm or your leg and you have full motion in your wrist and a much steadier hand than if you just hold it in the air.
Insanolord is a terrible moderator.

J.P. Corbran
NWR Community Manager and Soccer Correspondent

Offline Ian Sane

  • Champion for Urban Champion
  • Score: 0
    • View Profile
Quote
Ian Sane, I'm not sure what you're getting at - "you should also state what you want to get out of an FPS game". I would have thought you'd be playing to have fun; what could you want to get out of playing a game that would influence your choice of control scheme as well?

What kind of experience do you want?  Do you just want to play deathmatch multiplayer or do you prefer the single player campaign or do you like both equally?  Do you like a mindless shooter or one where you have fulfill mission objectives or solve puzzles?  Do you want a lot of emphasis on precision aiming or do you want to just fire at an enemy in your general sights?  It's a complicated genre with a lot of variations and I'm guessing that that plays a part in what sort of controls a person prefers.

Offline Morari

  • 46 DC EA D3 17 FE 45 D8 09 23 EB 97 E4 95 64 10 D4 CD B2 C2
  • Score: -7237
    • View Profile
It's a complicated genre with a lot of variations and I'm guessing that that plays a part in what sort of controls a person prefers.

No, not really. I want quick, responsive controls regardless of what I'm doing within my game.
« Last Edit: November 11, 2010, 02:46:39 PM by Morari »
"This post has been censored for your protection."

                                --Bureau of Internet Morality

Offline famicomplicated

  • The OG Japan Correspondent
  • NWR Staff
  • Score: 5
    • View Profile
Interesting comments so far guys, thanks!
If I could throw in my 2 cents. I'm a pointer-man myself, I always think that when I'm using dual analogue controls it feels like I'm steering a dumper truck with 2 chopsticks attached to my thumbs. (unnatural)

I'm from a mouse/keyboard background, when I first moved to console FPS's (Goldeneye) I tried the dual analogue option in that (the first console shooter to have it?) and didn't like it even back then.
I loved the default setup that Rare chose, the birth of the "stop n' shoot with a cross-hair for accuracy" era was born right there.

That lasted me fine until the following dual-analogue-only era, where aiming was now done in sync with movement, playing games like TimeSplitters, Halo 1 etc never sat comfortably with me, just felt too "twitchy" aiming with my right thumb.

When the Wii came along, I felt that with the pointer controls gave me a happy medium that sat nicely somewhere between the analogue movement of GE64 and the super-accuracy of a mouse pointer, (my 2 favourite control options of yore) without the negatives that those controls had (digital strafing in GE and digital movement with a M/KB setup)

The ideal setup would be a USB nunchuck attached to a PC, but I think the Wii is a fantastic (and more realistic) alternative.
I am your (Fami)father.
Follow me on Twitter for some #hypertrollGET fun.
Troll with love, not hate.