Topic: Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE - 2016 Wii U GOTY by default

[Ian Sane]

Having completed Chapter 2 now I got to say it really is pretty ridiculous that they removed the bikinis.  The same exact dialog would work fine with the original outfits.  I think someone would have to be REALLY overly sensitive to find it offense if that same plot had bikinis.  All this modelling talk and yet every photo has the model really fully clothed, like to the point where it wouldn't come across as sexy in the 50s, let alone today.  Tsubasa's normal Pegasus Knight costume shows more skin than her "censored" one!

The story still makes sense for the most part and the gameplay isn't affected so it's not the end of the world.  Still it doesn't come across as seamless.  Is Nintendo the most uncool company in videogames?  They must be, right?  If they didn't change these outfits no one would care but instead have created controversy by changing them.

If I was calling the shots I would age up the characters to 18 to avoid any underage controversy, would axe anything that could bump a game that is intended to be a 'T' game up to an 'M', and cut anything that might not matter in Japan but would clearly offend most Americans.  There are Japanese games that depict black characters in a blackface style for example and that would obviously not fly in America.  That Fire Emblem game had something where a lesbian was being tricked into a heterosexual relationship by being drugged or something like that.  NOA would be stupid to keep that in the game.  There are really obvious things that will trigger a PR disaster but an 18 year old modelling in a bikini is not one of them.  There are fighting games with younger characters in skimpier outfits that have been released here for years to virtually no controversy.  All NOA is doing to maintaining a fairly accurate image of a company that is out-of-touch with their customers.

[Triforce Hermit]

Seemed more like they wanted it to have a T rating instead of a Mature one to try and "convince more people to buy." And this wouldn't have been the first time a game has been censored just for that reason.

[Shaymin]

Or the game was originally rated B (12+) in Japan and god forbid the ESRB let boobs through.

[Soren]

In the original 2015 E3 trailer the game was expected to get a M rating, FWIW.

[ejamer]

Seemed more like they wanted it to have a T rating instead of a Mature one to try and "convince more people to buy." And this wouldn't have been the first time a game has been censored just for that reason.

Deadpool.  They should've modifed content to go for a lower rating. That would've helped it be successful.
I don't buy that a T rating instead of M would be significant to sales, but I have absolutely no data to back that up.

[Stratos]

With games it is a different market than movies. Deadpool is far more popular than FE/Wii U. Couple that with the firecracker that Marvel films have been and it becomes more believable that they could get away with an R and make a big profit. Remember they were still taking a risk with an R rated Marvel film and it defied expectations.


TMS#FE is already a niche title so it has the odds stacked against it. For a game like that you need as many balls in your court as you can to tip the scales.

[Soren]

Making an M-rated Fire Emblem game is like trying to make a PG-13 Deadpool.

[Ian Sane]

Are you guys serious about this being threatened with a potential 'M' rating?  It has no blood and gore, no nudity, and no swearing beyond the one word I've encountered thus far (and I've seen that word in 'T' games before, the f-word is usually what moves something to 'M').  Unless they're showing bare tits in the Japanese version I don't see how this game could get an 'M' rating.  There doesn't appear to be anything here that wouldn't fit fine in a Final Fantasy game and none of those get 'M' ratings.

[Enner]

If I was calling the shots I would age up the characters to 18 to avoid any underage controversy,

Tsubasa and other characters have already been aged up. Tsubasa was originally 16/17 years old, I think.


Having just completed the infamous and contentious Chapter 2 myself, I can see the holes and seams of the edits and why Nintendo (and maybe Atlus) decided to go through with the edits.

Ultimately for me, a bikini shoot in the middle of Shibuya doesn't jibe with me at all (and if something similar has been done, then egg on my face). More so is getting in to a bikini for the sole purpose of ejecting a mirage out of a human. If the Japanese scenario had edged in to the dark nature of Japan's gravure idols, had earned showing those bikini idols in a narrative that goes beyond an excuse to show T&A, then maybe that would have been interesting. I assume that wasn't the case given how TMS#FE carries itself. And clearly Nintendo felt it didn't make sense or good taste to drop Tsubasa in to the Maxim Magazine/Girls Gone Wild video in the second chapter of the game.

I wouldn't have minded much if the Japanese scenario was intact. I'm not gonna lie to myself and say I didn't fiddle with the camera around Quiet in Metal Gear Solid 5: The Phantom Pain. Between the Japanese and the Worldwide scenarios, both are silly and kinda dumb episodes in a delightfully silly game. However, one version of the scenario has a creepier edge to it. If not by what is said and shown, then by what isn't said or shown.

(I don't know if it's irony or poetic coincidence, but as I'm typing this ads for League of Angles II are being shown in the ad spaces for the forum. This post is being made while being flanked by fantasy women in bikini cloth armor.
...
They look pretty~
Wait, What!)

Now that I'm past this chapter, I have all the edited costumes to look forward too.

Something I'm not looking forward to is getting new weapons with new skills that are contributing to the sinking feeling that I'm developing my characters all wrong.

[broodwars]

I'm less bothered by the changes now than how half-assed they are. They went to all the trouble of creating that terrible-looking dark cloud effect over the 2nd boss' cleavage in the FMV, yet it's perfectly visible in the fight itself. They created a completely new outfit for Tsubasa in Chapter 1 (and covered up the girls in the 2nd dungeon background) so she wasn't in a bikini, yet one of her Diva outfits shows almost as much skin AND she's still IN that bikini in both the Amrita Girl FMV and the Ad-Lib attack itself. What was the point of these changes besides lying to the ESRB?

[Enner]

What was the point of these changes besides lying to the ESRB?

(By 2nd boss, you mean Aversa, right? I didn't notice the cloud in the FMV. I must have been busy looking at the subtitle space or it went by too quickly for me.)

(Also, Nintendo isn't lying to the ESRB. The ESRB rated Dragon's Crown with a T rating. In Dragon's Crown there is a half-naked nymph chained to a bed that you can poke to make moaning sounds.)

I know I'm giving too much credit to Nintendo for reiterating this, but I really think some of the changes are coming from context rather than content. It's more about the angles, rather than the shapes. It's probably a small difference, but there is a difference between a bikini in gravure modeling and a bikin in a summer soda commercial. How I understand it, the former is basically softcore pornography while the latter is... a Carl's Jr's/Hardee's commercial, I guess.

Hey, I wasn't kidding when I said the difference might be small!

[broodwars]

What was the point of these changes besides lying to the ESRB?

(By 2nd boss, you mean Aversa, right? I didn't notice the cloud in the FMV. I must have been busy looking at the subtitle space or it went by too quickly for me.)

Here's a good video rundown of all the changes, some easy to understand...others less so:

[TOPHATANT123]

Can anyone explain what exactly Strike A Pose does? The description is "Grants each party member one turn" although I don't really understand what that means.

[Shaymin]

It brings all your party members to the front of the turn queue, even if they've attacked that turn.

[Enner]

Here's a good video rundown of all the changes, some easy to understand...others less so:

Forgive me if I skim through this on mute. It's just that... I don't think I have the mindset or stomach to watch and listen to a detailed and narrated video on a subject where my beliefs and opinions are pretty solidified at this point in my life. (This is all dumb and silly, there's a strong undercurrent of FOMO, I assume there's a strong and specific direction of taste in the localization leadership, I don't like how severe the fan persecution complex can get, but Nintendo should stop hating the boobs it orders to be made, I wish Nintendo would better know and anticipate the needs of different segments of their audience hah hah that's a pipe dream, blah blah blah.)

Oh wow, I just... like totally blanked Aversa's chest in that FMV. Like, I vaguely remember it, but it didn't stick to my mind.

-----

The edges of the budget for this game is becoming more apparent to me as I'm noticing and tracking how much time I'm spending in menus for... everything, really. It's not a knock against the game, but I think it's interesting to think about where the money was and was not spent.

I'm starting to fill in the skill slots for my characters and am getting super anxious over the builds. Granted, I've heard there's reforging, and I have the Skill grinder DLC dungeon to make things go fast. However, the tension over picking active skills is really heating up for me. I can imagine all these skills I'm forfeiting being useful!


EDIT: Ugh, my first wipe. And from a side quest that I got cocky with. Don't let off on a good saving habit, people!


It does make me wonder if Persona 5 will have an autosave. Probably not?

[Ian Sane]

I just beat the fourth dungeon.  Things got really hard with the mid-boss as it kept getting sessions off and wiping out my team in a few turns.  Took some serious grinding, and frankly a well timed ad-lib performance (ie: fluke), to get by him.  Ironically the actually boss of the dungeon was easy in comparison and took only one try.  The big problem with that midboss is that he's a spear user which means that Itsuki is weak against him so he and his minions can easily kill him with sessions.  With other characters I can try to optimize my team so as to not use those that are weak to the enemy's attacks but you can't swap Itsuki out.  Around the same time I was also trying to complete one of those side quests where some random person's Performa has been taken my one of those "flaming" mirages.  That one was also a spear user and also was royally kicking my ass because of Itsuki being a sitting duck.  Kind of poor timing to have two spear related roadblocks at the same time so my game kind of grinded to a halt until I could, well, grind enough to beat them.

The game started off pretty easy frankly but now it seems that you have to really think about your strategy to avoid having the enemies session against you (defending prevents a session chain from occurring so don't be afraid to use it).  Savage encounters have also become quite dangerous and can easily kill your team so I find I'm saving much more frequently.

[Enner]

(defending prevents a session chain from occurring so don't be afraid to use it).

Oh man, I did not know that. This is super useful. I've just been bull-headed with trying to kill as fast as possible.

I'm mulling about in the beginning of the third chapter. Already, I'm feeling pressure in making good session set-ups. If I can't get a three person session in, I feel as if I'm doing something wrong.

[Enner]

The game has changed! Well, not really, but the damage will be higher.

Once your fighting cast reaches Stage Rank 8 or 9 (game tells you little about raising Stage Rank other than it being tied to battle participation), they will unlock the Open Audition Radiant Skill. Let those Sessions rain!

I don't know if this changes between difficulty levels, but I'm doing well so far in picking high-damage single target skills. I've been forfeiting any healing skill that can be done with an item (i.e. status aliment relief). Haven't had that bite back at me so far. 29 hours in and I just wrapped up Chapter 3.


EDIT: From @ZhugeEX on Twitter, Tokyo Mirage Sessions #FE sold about 50k in June.
A fair number, considering the challenges facing the game.

[Soren]

It did about as well as NoA was expecting. If you're still interested in the game you should probably get it sooner rather than later. This was probably a low shipment.

[Shaymin]

That's roughly double what it did in its first week in Japan, btw (which although shorter, was also kitty corner to Christmas and New Year's).

[The Lucky Moose]

So far probably my GOAT. Pokemon is still coming, which'll probably overtake it, but damn it I like this game, flaws and all. It just hit me at the right time.

[Enner]

Session Complete!



The game has bundle of problems that I mostly attribute to what I believe to be a short (<3 years) production time. Still, I just loved spending a little time each week on my days off playing this game. It was like playing an anime! Except it took way longer than the one cour shows that I neglected to watch as I was too busy playing this game.

The game is full of cliches and tropes, but I love the game's style so much. It is a joy for me to walk around the game's tiny slice of Shibuya. And now I've done nearly all the game has to offer and the story's done with many goodbyes said. I will dearly miss it, and will cherish the time I spent with it.