Topic: NBA Thread: Brought To You By The Tampa Bay Raptors Of Toronto

[nickmitch]

AD signs a 5 year 190 mil deal to stay with the Lakers.  Lakers are having a dynasty now!!!

Whoa, settle down, miss. The Lakers have to win more than one to be a dynasty.

I'm both surprised and not surprised Anthony Davis signed a five year deal even with the opt out. If he signed a two-and-one, he could have opted out and signed the 10-year veterans max which the Lakers would have gladly offered. At the same time, this mofo spent all of the last season repeatedly either falling to the floor, doubled over in pain or getting poked in the eye. In that case, secure that bag.

I think it was the smart play for AD to secure that mid-term bag.  The risk of injury is looming over his head, so that 10 year deal may not have panned out for him.  Getting titles now (assumption) and letting the resume speak for itself could work out better for him.  And who knows? Maybe he'll come back to New Orleans to end his-- nevermind, this sentence isn't realistic enough to finish.

[Adrock]

I think it was the smart play for AD to secure that mid-term bag.  The risk of injury is looming over his head, so that 10 year deal may not have panned out for him.  Getting titles now (assumption) and letting the resume speak for itself could work out better for him.  And who knows? Maybe he'll come back to New Orleans to end his-- nevermind, this sentence isn't realistic enough to finish.

True, but also consider:

• Kevin Durant scored a max contract coming off a torn Achilles, the worst injury an NBA player can get, and every team would have offered him a max contract to miss an entire season except apparently the Knicks (but thatā€™s also why theyā€™re the Knicks)
• The Lakers made a point in 2013 to sign Kobe Bryant to a $48 million extension coming off a torn Achilles. It was largely considered symbolic and a make-good deal for his years as a Laker as the team was going nowhere (like most superstars, he was underpaid compared to the revenue he brought in)

If Davis got injured, I have no doubt most teams and especially the Lakers would still offer him a max contract. Generational players donā€™t grow in trees so teams will take that chance even with an injury.

Anyway, if Anthony Davis ever leaves the Lakers, Iā€™d expect him to sign with the Bulls to play for his hometown. Then again, Dwyane Wade did that, and it sucked for him so maybe not. šŸ¤·ā€ā™€ļø

[Adrock]

The NBA released the first half of the season schedule including televised games. The Heat, who were Eastern Conference champions, have fewer nationally televised games than two teams that didnā€™t make the playoffs last season. I get the Warriors shouldnā€™t be a dumpster fire this year and the NBA really wants to push Zion Williamson (who is probably load managing several of those 14 games), but this still makes me irrationally angry.

Also, whose idea was it to put the Knicks on nationally? Jebus, man, the Wizards are least have Bradley Beal and Russell Westbrook...

Number of National TV games per team (not including NBATV)

For the first half of the schedule
Lakers - 16
Celtics - 14
Mavericks - 14
Pelicans - 14
Warriors - 14
Nets - 13
Bucks - 12
Clippers - 11
Heat - 10
Sixers - 9
Suns - 9
Rockets - 7
Nuggets - 6
Blazers - 5
Jazz - 4
Raptors - 4
Grizzlies - 3
Pacers - 2
Bulls - 1
Hawks - 1
Hornets - 1
Knicks - 1
Wolves - 1
Cavs/Kings/Magic/Pistons/Spurs/Thunder/Wizards all have 0

[BlackNMild2k1]

Damn, if we thought Russ had a chip on his shoulder before... šŸ˜¬

New triple double record incoming!?
Or do you think he will adopt to a more winning strategy? šŸ¤”

[broodwars]

As usual, the Jazz get the shaft when it comes to National TV coverage. Somewhat bewildering considering the squad they have assembled, but it's nothing new. They'll find their interest if the Jazz actually perform up to their potential this year.

[Adrock]

Giannis Antetokounmpo, Milwaukee Bucks reach five-year, $228M supermax extension

Giannis Antetokounmpo would have to play one season under the extension before being eligible for trade. I believe Brian Windhorst said in the Hoop Collective podcast that Russell Westbrook had a wink-wink deal with the Thunder where he signed the supermax contract but the team would work with him on a trade if he wanted to move on. That way, they would get something in return while Westbrook still gets paid. Windhorst floated this as an option for Antetokounmpo. Letā€™s say he requests a trade in 2022. He would have four years left on the deal with an option on the final year. If Paul George netted five draft picks and two pick swaps on top of Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, imagine what Antetokounmpo would go for with an additional year.

Sam Presti is licking his lips in anticipation of sending 15 draft picks to the Bucks for Antetokounmpo and still having 27 more.

[nickmitch]

Sam Presti is licking his lips in anticipation of sending 15 draft picks to the Bucks for Antetokounmpo and still having 27 more.

This sentence is hilarious because it is accurate.

Happy for Giannis. Money over everything.

[broodwars]

The Jazz finally signed a $205 5 year extension with Rudy Gobert.

Well, he'd better be worth it, since we're putting everything on this squad to win a championship. He kind of gave up last year after getting picked for the All Star game

https://www.slcdunk.com/latest-utah-jazz-news-recent/2020/12/20/22191607/rudy-gobert-re-signs-with-the-utah-jazz-nba-max-extension-contract

[Adrock]

Yeah... I wouldnā€™t want to pay Rudy Gobert $205 million to be a non-factor on offense. While heā€™s an elite interior and team defender, heā€™s easily exploitable on the perimeter. At the same time, this was the best and only option for the Jazz. His skill set isnā€™t replaceable, and Utah isnā€™t an especially attractive free agency destination. Someone would have offered Gobert a max contract next off-season. Better to make this not a distraction all year.

I read an article in which Gobert stated he wants to be more involved on offense.

Admittedly, Iā€™m not super-familiar with the Jazz. Why would Snyder ever run anything for Gobert over Mitchell, Conley, Bogdonovic, or even Ingles? I mean, other than to shut him up for a bit. Everything goes through Mitchell if the Jazz want to win games. Heā€™s the teamā€™s leading scorer and best player. GTFO with Gobert being more involved on offense unless itā€™s to set screens then go away.

[broodwars]

Yeah... I wouldnā€™t want to pay Rudy Gobert $205 million to be a non-factor on offense. While heā€™s an elite interior and team defender, heā€™s easily exploitable on the perimeter. At the same time, this was the best and only option for the Jazz. His skill set isnā€™t replaceable, and Utah isnā€™t an especially attractive free agency destination. Someone would have offered Gobert a max contract next off-season. Better to make this not a distraction all year.

I read an article in which Gobert stated he wants to be more involved on offense.

Admittedly, Iā€™m not super-familiar with the Jazz. Why would Snyder ever run anything for Gobert over Mitchell, Conley, Bogdonovic, or even Ingles? I mean, other than to shut him up for a bit. Everything goes through Mitchell if the Jazz want to win games. Heā€™s the teamā€™s leading scorer and best player. GTFO with Gobert being more involved on offense unless itā€™s to set screens then go away.

The problem with Gobert on offense is that his skillset is so limited he pretty much requires a high-quality passer to set him up. For the Jazz, that's basically Ingles and sometimes Mitchell (though I've seen Bogdonovic thread some incredibly tight passes). Mitchell prefers to take his own shot most of the time, or to feed a perimeter player. Ingles will lob passes to Gobert and Favors all day, and they'll be excellent plays. The problem is that Gobert has never learned how to run the Jazz offense with anyone other than Ingles, so he's completely flat-footed when Ingles isn't on the court.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Chef Curry cooking with a career high 62 tonight
8-16 from 3, and victory over the Trailblazers tonight!!
(Steph is 48 three's from #2 on the All-Time list)



Hate to see this man have to work so hard to carry this team on his back, but it makes for a good show. Now is someone else can become effective with a shot, Curry can maybe get some open looks again.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Checked in on the Warrior have last night!!!

Some team appears to have found some sort of groove.
It was raining 3's from practically EVERYONE in the Dub Squad  last night.

Oubre was 4/6, whoever Mulder is was 4/4
Paschall and Poole were 2/3, and it out keeps going down the list. Wiggins had 2, Draymond had 1. etc etc

Curry was the outlier being 5/14.

Anyway, Kings got cooked. Hopefully the Warriors can keep this up and it ain't just a flash in the pan.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Nobody wanna talk about (one of) the worst shooting performance in Steph Curry's NBA career, but somehow still beat the Raptors by 1?

No.... no one?
ok.

I think we found a little juice here. I don't know how long it last, or how potent it may be, but we got something going. Wiggins gaining his confidence.... if only we can get Oubre on the Curry gameplan for screens in the corner and general rotations and movements around the court, we might be able to make quite the stew going forward.

Curry can't carry them every night, and Draymond gotta figure out how to be more effective in scoring the ball himself on a regular basis while still doing all the traffic directing, defense, and all the other little things, but there is no reason he shouldn't average 7-10 pts a night. It would honestly make his assist game more effective if they didn't anticipate you to pass it 120% of the time, even when you're at the rim.

[Adrock]

Nobody wanna talk about (one of) the worst shooting performance in Steph Curry's NBA career, but somehow still beat the Raptors by 1?

No.... no one?
ok.

I'm down to talk about NBA games, news etc. However, I have spent huge swaths of the last few months mostly talking to myself in this thread. It just seems like no one wants to discuss anything unless it's about their team. That's fine and all, but it makes me less interested in taking time to start discussions. For example, I've wanted to bring up the James Harden situation (short version: his behavior was unacceptable), but I figured no one was interested so I just let that go.

As for the Warriors, they're going to live and die by Steph Curry's play on most nights. They squeaked by a struggling Raptors team that is sorely missing Serge Ibaka and Marc Gasol. Personally, I thought the comeback win against the Clippers was way more impressive. They trailed by 21 late in the third quarter then somehow won by 10.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Honestly, I was just amazed they won the last game considering Curry wasn't scoring at all.

As for Harden...
I didn't exactly follow everything that was going on with him.
he threw a tantrum, risked his team exposure on purpose, late to training camp, assaulted a team mate, and requested a trade.... as if all of that was going to make him attractive to another team.

I also noticed that the Pels Mavs game was postponed. Was there a reason for that?
I see the last Celtics game, and the next Celtics game today are postponed as well, but that's listed for contact tracing reasons.

and how about Melo Ball....
showed up his older brother head to head. Now the youngest to have recorded a Triple Double
and he's been a solid producer on his team when it comes to points and other stats as well.
Could he be running for Rookie of the year if he keeps this up?

[broodwars]

Nobody wanna talk about (one of) the worst shooting performance in Steph Curry's NBA career, but somehow still beat the Raptors by 1?

No.... no one?
ok.

I'm down to talk about NBA games, news etc. However, I have spent huge swaths of the last few months mostly talking to myself in this thread. It just seems like no one wants to discuss anything unless it's about their team. That's fine and all, but it makes me less interested in taking time to start discussions.

Yeah...even if I was inclined to follow news about other teams, I don't have Cable anymore and my family cut our League Pass subscription after last season to save money, so I can't even watch the Jazz play anymore, let alone any other team. Makes it difficult to follow basketball right now.

[Adrock]

As for Harden...
I didn't exactly follow everything that was going on with him.
he threw a tantrum, risked his team exposure on purpose, late to training camp, assaulted a team mate, and requested a trade.... as if all of that was going to make him attractive to another team.

You guys know where I stand on player empowerment. I have a line though. I'm fine with players requesting a trade. I'm even fine with players doing so publicly if they don't mind paying the $50,000 penalty. However, go to work. That is what the contract is for. A person doesn't have to be happy with their employment situation, but they are still obligated to do their job so long as they're getting paid. The Rockets should have fined Harden several times for conduct detrimental to the team. Instead, they bent over the coffee table to hopefully convince him to stay even though the writing was all over the wall. Harden handled this as poorly as someone could have, and not that it matters, but it makes me dislike him as a player even more.

Looks like Harden got his wish: Sources: Houston Rockets trade James Harden to Brooklyn Nets in 4-team megadeal sending Caris LeVert to Indiana Pacers

Good on the Rockets for the haul they got: Victor Oladipo, broodwars' favorite former Jazz (Dante Exum), Rodions Kurucs, three unprotected first round picks from the Nets, four pick swaps from the Nets, a first found pick from the Cavaliers via the Bucks, and a second round pick from the Pacers. Personally, I felt like the Nets gave up too much for somehow even less defense especially given Harden's recent behavior and unprofessionalism, including coming into the season out of shape.

Hard to ignore how many all-star players left the Rockets disgruntled after playing with Harden. Dwight Howard, Chris Paul, and Russell Westbrook looking at the Nets like:

I also noticed that the Pels Mavs game was postponed. Was there a reason for that?

Mavericks game against Pelicans postponed due to COVID protocols

and how about Melo Ball....
showed up his older brother head to head. Now the youngest to have recorded a Triple Double
and he's been a solid producer on his team when it comes to points and other stats as well.
Could he be running for Rookie of the year if he keeps this up?

Right now, he would be Rookie of the Year. The season is still early so we'll see.

Yeah...even if I was inclined to follow news about other teams, I don't have Cable anymore and my family cut our League Pass subscription after last season to save money, so I can't even watch the Jazz play anymore, let alone any other team. Makes it difficult to follow basketball right now.

If you don't mind being a little unethical, you can probably find free streams online. Not saying you should, but you can.

[broodwars]

It's nice to see the Corpse of Dante Exum used for his usual purpose: as trading fodder.

It's funny...I guess this trade was in the works at the time so that was why, but last night the Jazz absolutely annihilated the Cavs, and it struck me how the Cavs never played Exum despite them being short-handed by 3-4 people.

As for Harden, I've never liked the guy. He has great skill, no doubt about it, but the stuff the refs let him get away with every game just irritated me to no end. I guess that's ironic considering Karl Malone's history of flying elbows, but seeing Harden get away with fouls or generating phantom fouls on other players every single play just irked me to no end.

And yeah, I definitely think Brooklyn was overcharged for what they're getting. I'm not sure a team with Durant, Irving, & Harden can even function together. That's a lot of primary ball-handling ego there.

[Adrock]

I still don't see the Nets as being better than the Sixers, Bucks, or Heat. I'm also kind of tired of Kyrie Irving being a weirdo (i.e. flat-earther, burning sage etc). His current antics of just not playing because šŸ¤·ā€ā™€ļø doesn't inspire much confidence in me either. While the Nets gave up a ton of assets, they have shown an incredible ability to bounce back (i.e. recovering from Danny Ainge's pillaging of the their assets in 2014). Trading for Harden just seemed like a panic move that absolutely did not need to happen right now. If they were going to panic about anything, maybe get some f-ing defense.

Side-note since broodwars brought him up: If we're talking about just basketball, Karl Malone was hard to like because of dirty play masquerading as being part of a tougher era in the NBA. For me, Malone is hard to like because his personal life is fraught with what-the-****. Normally, I don't really care about professional athletes' personal lives as long as they aren't hurting others. Malone's personal history is just so egregiously what-the-****. The short version for everyone else: at 17, he abandoned his first two kids (twins) for nearly two decades then sired a child with a minor (he was 20; she was 13) who he subsequently abandoned for three decades. Malone has since apparently mended those relationships. Still, just seems like if you score nearly 37,000 points in your career, you can get a statue no matter how much of an asshole you were.

[broodwars]

I still don't see the Nets as being better than the Sixers, Bucks, or Heat. I'm kind of tired of Kyrie Irving being a weirdo (i.e. flat-earther, burning sage etc). The Nets gave up a ton of assets though they have shown an incredible ability to bounce back. Trading for Harden just seemed like a panic move that absolutely did not need to happen right now. If they were going to panic about anything, maybe get some f-ing defense.

Side-note since broodwars brought him up: If we're talking about just basketball, Karl Malone was hard to like because of dirty play masquerading as being part of a tougher era in the NBA. For me, Malone is hard to like because his personal life is fraught with what-the-****. Normally, I don't really care about professional athletes' personal lives as long as they aren't hurting others. Malone's personal history is just so egregiously what-the-****. The short version for everyone else: at 17, he abandoned his first two kids (twins) for nearly two decades then sired a child with a minor (he was 20; she was 13) who he subsequently abandoned for three decades. Malone has since apparently mended those relationships. Still, just seems like if you score nearly 37,000 points in your career, you can get a statue no matter how much of an asshole you were.

Yeah...there are many reasons why Stockton is my all-time favorite NBA player & not Malone.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Wow at the Malone summary.... I had no idea.

Craziness though that the Harden trade finally materialized.
I wonder if it's what KD and/ Kyrie asked for.

I don't really see it working out. Kyrie already likes to be a 1 man show. And Harden likes to dribble the air out the ball before creating a BS foul.
KD's best scenario wouldn't been to stay with the Warriors as you have an unselfish PG who will gladly catch and shoot, but can also draw double and triple teams to leave to you open.
Truly coulda been an easy money sniper.
That boat sailed away though.

Who else came up in the 4 team trade?

[Adrock]

Craziness though that the Harden trade finally materialized.
I wonder if it's what KD and/ Kyrie asked for.

Absolutely had to be, or at least what Kevin Durant asked for. The Nets may end up trading Kyrie Irving at some point due to what a weirdo he is. If they can use James Harden to keep Durant past his current contract, this trade will have been well worth it.

I don't really see it working out. Kyrie already likes to be a 1 man show. And Harden likes to dribble the air out the ball before creating a BS foul.

Normally, Iā€™d say superstar players can figure it out by understanding the hierarchy of who is the first, second, and third option, but Irving is the problem. He was on a championship team with LeBron James and thought he was the first, second, AND third option. GTFO, man. Perhaps a bigger problem is two out of the three are minus defenders, and the other one is coming off a torn Achilles. Durant has looked good this year all things considered; thereā€™s just no way he is or ever will be pre-torn Achilles level Durant again.

The Nets also gave up Jarrett Allen AND Caris LeVert except without the benefit of the offseason/free agency to fill those roster holes. The current analyst takes are the Nets are suddenly championship favorites. I donā€™t know, man. Seems like an overreaction based on individual talent. Reminds me of the Clippers last year. Everyone thought itā€™d be a cake walk to the Finals due to the sheer amount of talent on the team then Jamal Murray and Nikola Jokic happened.

Who else came up in the 4 team trade?

Normally, Iā€™d post a Let Me Google That For You link (even though I already posted a link to an article), but I can appreciate laziness, and Iā€™m feeling charitable.

• Nets receive: James Harden and the Cavaliersā€™ 2024 second-round pick (unsure of any protections)
• Rockets receive: Victor Oladipo, Dante Exum, Rodions Kurucs, the Netsā€™ first-round picks in 2022, 2024, and 2026 (all unprotected), the Netsā€™ first-round pick swaps in 2021, 2023, 2025, and 2027 (all unprotected), and Cavaliersā€™ first round pick in 2022 via Bucks (unsure of any protections)
• Cavaliers receive: Jarrett Allen and Taurean Prince
• Pacers receive: Caris LeVert and the Rocketsā€™ second-round pick in 2023 (unsure of any protections)

The Cavs low-key did really well here for just being present to make the salary work though they currently have like 18 centers now (actually only five). Two or three of them probably wonā€™t be on the team next year.

As long as Tillman Fertitta remains the leagueā€™s thriftiest billionaire, the Rockets project to be worse than the Nets so those pick swaps probably wonā€™t matter. The Nets flat-out have a better front office so even if they lose some combination or all of Durant, Harden, and Irving, I expect them to put together a competitive team so the Rockets better learn how to draft well in the middle of the draft.

[BlackNMild2k1]

TBH, after i asked here, I saw the trade tweet that stated who got what.

I was shocked to see that the Nets gave up Jarrett Allen, as I thought he was a solid rim protector.
and also Caris LeVert, as I heard he was decent producer, but I guess you gotta give something to get something, especially when it's as "high value" as a James Harden.

But really what I was looking for was a little insight to what it all means from someone informed enough to have an opinion their willing to share on who actually made out good in this. So I appreciate the breakdown. Cavs getting Allen and Prince may definitely be a net positive for them.

I really am not sure if this Big 3 works as intended though.
Although i saw some speculation online that everything Kyrie has been doing up to this point was to dissuade the Rockets, or any other team from requesting him as part of the trade for Harden. Some real 4D checkers moves. LOL
Now they just gotta get Harden back in to shape, get Kyrie in the mood play and realize he just became a third option. This experiment is gonna be interesting, not necessarily to watch (i hate watching Harden play), but to see the results of.
2nd round exit, off season explosion?
finger pointings and burner accounts all around?

[Adrock]

TBH, after i asked here, I saw the trade tweet that stated who got what.

I guess you gotta give something to get something, especially when it's as "high value" as a James Harden.

Thatā€™s the extent of it, Iā€™m sure. Itā€™s strange the Nets seemed to be negotiating from a weaker position as if they needed Hardenā€™s talent more than the Rockets had to shake off a malcontent primadonna. Everyone knew Harden didnā€™t want to be in Houston, was sulking like a child despite the Rockets literally doing everything he asked for, and is currently out of shape. On top of that, there were no other viable trade partners except the Sixers who the Rockets didnā€™t want to deal with due to Daryl Morey. If I were the Sixers, I wouldnā€™t trade Ben Simmons for Harden. If I were the Rockets, Iā€™d rather have Ben Simmons locked in until 2025 and fewer picks than what they got.

Then again, I read speculation the Nets prioritized the Harden trade because Irving is being such a butt lately so maybe they were negotiating from a position of weakness.

I really am not sure if this Big 3 works as intended though.

Depends on whatā€™s intended. Win a championship? Probably not. Brute force wins in the regular season by overwhelming opponents with offense? Sure.

Although i saw some speculation online that everything Kyrie has been doing up to this point was to dissuade the Rockets, or any other team from requesting him as part of the trade for Harden. Some real 4D checkers moves. LOL

Sounds like Irving. Was he ever on the trade block? He wouldnā€™t make sense on the Rockets who already have Irvingā€™s post-torn Achilles doppelgƤnger, John Wall. Then again, Iā€™m not sure the Rockets really know what theyā€™re doing yet.

[BlackNMild2k1]

It sounds like Olidipo may be looking to be moved as soon as possible, from what I saw yesterday.

I'm sure Kyrie just wanted to make sure he wasn't even part of the ask from any team to make this trade work.

and there's so much going on right now, I don't even have time to keep up with NBA news on a whole.
There are still players on the Warriors that I don't even know who they are!! LOL
(I heard we had Linsanity in our G League.... I don't know if he still "has it" or whatever, but Curry needs some help out there.)