Author Topic: On Emulation on the Rev (Read 8905 times)

BlackGriffen · « **on:** May 21, 2005, 10:58:39 AM »

I don't know how much the audience knows about the emulation, but it's not necessarily just a matter of drawing the game on the screen. Modern hardware has enough power to, in spite of all the overhead of emulation, actually improve the quality of the sprites and bitmaps using a lot of different smoothing techniques. A good example is HQ2X, a filter for scaling an image up by double. Another example would be adding anti-aliasing to all N64 games.

Do you suppose Nintendo will implement this sort of thing? If they do, will they make them optional?

BlackGriffen

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 21, 2005, 11:06:30 AM »

I'm hoping that not only will Nintendo visually upgrade their old library but also add an online option to all multiplayer modes

online bubble bobble, secret of mana, goldeneye and Mario Kart 64 = killer app

jasonditz · « **Reply #2 on:** May 21, 2005, 11:31:38 AM »

the amount of design effort a lot of that would take would be prohibitively expensive. Its like putting a team of translators on some old SNES RPGs that never made it stateside.

If they can offer a cookie-cutter visual upgrade without breaking the compatibility (the way Sony's PS2 backward compatibility broke a lot of games), then that's probably worthwhile.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #3 on:** May 21, 2005, 11:34:02 AM »

I personally don't want Nintendo do any of that. I would rather Nintendo not waste valuable time in enhancing games and would rather have as many games as is, as possible.

Remember, Nintendo isn't going to just release all games. They said they will make certain games available.

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #4 on:** May 21, 2005, 11:40:54 AM »

No, I don't expect Nintendo to physically upgrade the visuals, I expect the hardware to do it automatically. I also don't think it would take much work to make a universal program that turns all multiplayer online capable.

jasonditz · « **Reply #5 on:** May 21, 2005, 12:15:10 PM »

that's true, some of the generic NES emulators had online multiplayer to them. They'd still have to put together some kind of matchmaking service though.

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #6 on:** May 21, 2005, 12:17:30 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: jasonditz
that's true, some of the generic NES emulators had online multiplayer to them. They'd still have to put together some kind of matchmaking service though.

Its called Nintendo ON ' Nintendo Online Network '

BlackGriffen · « **Reply #7 on:** May 21, 2005, 04:01:46 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: jasonditz
the amount of design effort a lot of that would take would be prohibitively expensive. Its like putting a team of translators on some old SNES RPGs that never made it stateside.

If they can offer a cookie-cutter visual upgrade without breaking the compatibility (the way Sony's PS2 backward compatibility broke a lot of games), then that's probably worthwhile.

Of course. Everything I've described are literally just image filters that are put in after the emulator but before the images are displayed.

BG

Pale · « **Reply #8 on:** May 21, 2005, 05:09:10 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: BlackNMild2k1
Quote
Originally posted by: jasonditz
that's true, some of the generic NES emulators had online multiplayer to them. They'd still have to put together some kind of matchmaking service though.
Its called Nintendo ON ' Nintendo Online Network '

I seriously hope the use Marionette for the name cause thats awesome....

As far as adding online support, I don't really see it happening. In all honesty, if the Rev is as online as its supposed to be, I don't think the market would be there. Why pay Smash Bros 64 online when you can play the new one?

Noble~Feather · « **Reply #9 on:** May 21, 2005, 05:43:42 PM »

That would be awsome... imagine a prettier Ocarina of Time.

wandering · « **Reply #10 on:** May 22, 2005, 02:40:58 PM »

Meh.
Blind smoothing-over/prettifying...OSX does that, and I don't like it. I also thought increasing the resolution (or whatever they did) on OOT on GameCube made the game look worse.
Let the games be.

orfanotna · « **Reply #11 on:** May 22, 2005, 02:57:30 PM »

I know some PC SNES emulators have some "antialiasing" options to smooth out the huge pixels due to the low resolution of SNES games, i.e. make it look more like the TVs that most people were using at the time (blurry RF/composite graphics). I think they should add that option to emulators on Rev, because now a lot of people have large TVs with good (S-Video/Component) inputs.

WindyMan · « **Reply #12 on:** May 22, 2005, 05:02:24 PM »

The best you could hope for in terms of "improved" graphics is about what you saw with the N64 Zelda games on the GameCube. There's no question that the GC is leaps and bounds more powerful than the N64, but Ocarina of Time on the GC doesn't look like Twilight Princess.

We're going to get maximum resolution out of all these old games, but as for graphical improvements, not really. They'll just run better on the Rev hardware, provided the emulation is solid.

BlackGriffen · « **Reply #13 on:** June 22, 2005, 06:36:03 PM »

Here's relevant news

Looks like it's settled: it will happen. It's just a question of extent.

BG

Ian Sane · « **Reply #14 on:** June 22, 2005, 07:42:00 PM »

Hopefully the "enhanced classics" will allow you to play the games as they originally were as well. I say this mostly because I don't trust Nintendo with enhancing classic games. Super Mario All-Stars was awesome but on the GBA that had a nasty habit of adding incredibly annoying sound effects and dumbing down already easy games. I want the "real" versions of the classics as the Nintendo of the time made them.

The possibility of enhancing stuff though is good in theory since it could improve arcade ports and add features that other console ports had but the SNES didn't. Capcom could include the death match mode for Slam Masters that was only included on the Genesis version, at the expense of the amazing team battle royale mode. That's one of my favourite games ever but because of the different modes offered in the two different home translations a definitive version doesn't exist.

Nonetheless a bare bones unaltered version should always be available. There are just too many examples of ignorant developers ruining a classic game with poorly planned enhancements.

Darc Requiem · « **Reply #15 on:** June 22, 2005, 07:48:58 PM »

I like your line of thinking Ian. Capcom could also add back Guy to Final Fight and maybe throw in a two player mode as well. Or just use the extra processing power to get rid of the slow down in some games. I do agree that an original mode should be included as well.

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #16 on:** June 23, 2005, 04:57:17 AM »

Darc: They inventually released another version of Final Fight with Guy back into the game for the SNES. It was a few years later, and perhaps only a Japanese game...but I think it could have made it to the shores of America. I think it was called Final Fight Guy Edition or something. So yeah, the code is already there to add him back.

I agree with Ian as well. Enhancements shouldn't just be to add new graphical flair to the game. I would imagine that would cause more trouble than anything else. I would just want modes missing, perhaps added animation for Capcom fighting games and such.

(I can't wait to get my hands on the SNES Super Street Fighter 2: Turbo Edition...or whatever the last one was called.)

stevey · « **Reply #17 on:** June 23, 2005, 05:14:59 AM »

I think this my be good or bad. If they make the resolution beter on the 2d game a better bitmap on the 3d than that be good but if the take out thing, make easy, or adding diffent color it be bad and I just hope they DO NOT DO ANYTHING TO THE LEGEND OF ZELDA A LINK TO THE PAST hear that reggie don't f*ck with lttp or I kill you!

ThePerm · « **Reply #18 on:** June 23, 2005, 05:54:55 AM »

well with my dabbling with emulators i played river city ransom online with a friend and it kicked ass. They just need to make the emulator send the control feed to the other rev and memory synch the game(so random activators in the game dont show you one thing on one side and your friend another).....

it worked great with river city ransom...iv never really dabbled with n64 emulators because at the time of interest they were slow...i remember they improved the resolution a greeat deal....but some games like banjo tooie need their framerates upped.
It be nice to online multiplayer goldeneye or perfect dark...or for that matter any other 4 player game.

Famicom · « **Reply #19 on:** June 23, 2005, 09:39:07 AM »

Quote
Originally posted by: ThePerm
It be nice to online multiplayer goldeneye or perfect dark...

My ultimate dream.

Guitar Smasher · « **Reply #20 on:** June 23, 2005, 10:11:27 AM »

Maybe it could even improve the framerates in PD? I dream of fluid 4-player + 8-sim PD. Online? That's a whole other kind of dream...

Spak-Spang · « **Reply #21 on:** June 23, 2005, 12:32:12 PM »

If Emulators can do it. I am sure Nintendo's techs can simulate the same thing...if they want to. The question is Do they want to?

And if it is something that after its released they forgot to include and its a big request the Firmware could just be updated to allow it to have online gaming.

Personally I think if Nintendo was to include online gaming for ALL classical games by using sync technology, and then allow the emulator to use a built in MIC for communications you could sell this system with ZERO Revolution software. Who wouldn't play classic Bomberman, Mario Kart, and such online.

And The firmware could even allow you to ZOOM in on a section of the screen to allow for Single Screen Split Screen gaming. That could be a cheap fix than to create new code, and if the graphics upgrades can smooth the framerate and graphics the zoom effect may not be that bad.

BlackNMild2k1 · « **Reply #22 on:** June 23, 2005, 12:42:39 PM »

Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-Spang
And The firmware could even allow you to ZOOM in on a section of the screen to allow for Single Screen Split Screen gaming. That could be a cheap fix than to create new code, and if the graphics upgrades can smooth the framerate and graphics the zoom effect may not be that bad.

I've never really messed with an emulator b4 (just a GB emu an eternity ago), but a ZOOM in feature is a great idea that I hadn't even thought of, I don't know if that is standard on emualtors or anything, but I think if you were to zoom in on those little split screens you start having a game that looks like a supersized Wolfenstien 3D. All pixelated and ugly.

why do I suddenly get a feeling that we've had this conversationt before? DeJaVu?

nickmitch · « **Reply #23 on:** June 23, 2005, 08:55:48 PM »

Isn't it déjà vu?

Pale · « **Reply #24 on:** June 24, 2005, 04:01:14 AM »

http://www.joystiq.com/entry/1234000003047930/

Another article about upgrading the classics.

News:

Author Topic: On Emulation on the Rev (Read 8905 times)