Topic: Episode 254: Silk the Shocka

[Yoshidious]

Jon is back with treasures from his backlog!

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/rfn/27449

The Lindy-Man is back after a month-long absence, and he got game. Three games, in fact. First up is Final Fantasy 3/6, one of his all-time faves (and yes, he lords over Billy in classic RPG cred). He also revisits the balls-hard Contra 4 and renews a commitment to play both Mass Effect games before the third hits early next year. Let the Massathon begin!

Greg queues up Mighty Milky Way, the last WayForward download title before they transition to 3DS with Mighty Switch Force. Jonny evaluates a pair of so-called Metroidvania titles on XBLA: Outland (which isn't really, but still rocks) and Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet (which nails the formula in the best way possible). James wraps up with Borderlands, this MMO-like shooter whose sequel was just announced.

Unfortunately, Jonny had to leave us before the second part of the show began, but the rest of the crew gets on with the task of answering your Listener Mail nonetheless, beginning by rating the odds of a comeback for '80s cartoon creation Captain N. Next, there's provocative questions on whether Nintendo "hates" 2D Mario and what lies ahead for the Mega Man franchise in the wake of recent cancellations, before the show concludes with an emphatic restatement of James' disdain for the name "Mario Kart 7." 

Don't forget to play Killer 7 and join the forum discussion! Your comments could become part of the show when we pick up RetroActive in the coming weeks. We also love to get your emails -- this handy form is equivalent to typing in the address!

[KDR_11k]

ITSP is a good game but really short (probably because they have to add a lot of art to each area) and it doesn't really have the Metroid backtracking effect where your new gear just obliterates everything that gave you trouble before, especially against the annoying enemies with front armor that you have to let charge past you to hurt. Those guys take a while to fight no matter how far you are in the game and how quickly you want to move through the area.

I didn't like Borderlands much, it just got boring. The sniper character is still better than the Soldier I took into the game, at least he has an active skill that doesn't take two minutes to recharge. Weapons don't really grow more distinctive which is a problem IMO, you pretty much always get guns that straight up fit into the fixed categories except they're more or less damaging, accurate, etc so they don't feel much different. And when you find one you like you still ditch it the moment something better comes along. Hellgate London did that much better, it had a Diablo-style loot attribute system so your gun could have effects like causing novas on impact, draining health, giving you various stat boosts, etc while even the base gun types were more varied (napalm rockets, cluster bombs, flamethrowers, buzzsaws, etc) and if you found a gun you particularly liked you could stick add-ons on it and upgrade its base stats so I ran with a napalm rocket launcher when the things had long since stopped dropping. Also Hellgate had many different active skills you could take, unlike Borderlands where you get exactly one skill and can stick some additional passives on there. HG has real stats, not just "he's two levels above you so you do less damage" which makes the whole RPG aspect of Borderlands feel like an excuse to make you grind (or ends up making the game too damn easy if you're diligent with sidequests as you end up vastly overlevelled).


EDIT: The Insanely Twisted Shadow Planet has been found!

[ShyGuy]

Good to have Lindy back. His gaming tastes are probably the closest to my own. Really, if you look at the rest of the cast, you guys don't approach games in a typical way. It helps you stand apart, but it can be weird.

[Shaymin]

I've always wondered how much of the 3.8 MILLION Wiis that got sold in December/09 was the result of NSMB Wii, and how much was the first price drop in the history of the system.

Also, since they cut the line from my original email, I'll ask it here: Did the Miis stop being relevant two global economic meltdowns ago? Yes. Or to be more precise, hell yes.

[lolmonade]

I'm in the same boat as Lindy: I have owned the Mass Effect games for a long time (for me, its due to Steam sales), and despite the praise the games get, I can't bring myself to play beyond the 2 hour mark.  Maybe it's just that the game seems too daunting/big during a point where my free time is precious, but I have to be able to play a game that I can sink my teeth into an hour every other night and still feel like I accomplished something to make it worthwhile at the moment.

[Fiendlord_Timmay]

Hmm, I have a lot to say, so I might have to pull a NinSage and do a play-by-play.

1. Never again Jon, never again. First the DK rap on the live show, then the 226 interlude, now this. My ears can't take it anymore!

2. Ack! Don't call it Final Fantasy 3! It's insulting to FF6 to refer to it by the same name as this pile of crap: http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy/images/4/47/IiiDSus.jpg

Come to think of it, I don't think you've explained the story of the early FF naming snafu on the podcast. It might be beneficial to the listeners who are not familiar with the history.

All that aside, I love the discussions on FF6. It's one of my favorite games ever, and it's good to hear some discussion from people who can appreciate it.

3. I think I'm having a Jonny moment, here. JAMES, YOUR OPINION IS WRONG! The sniper in Borderlands is easily the best weapon in the game. It's almost broken how good they are. They're excellent for both long range and short range combat, and it's almost too easy to get headshots with them. Most have near 100% accuracy and oftentimes secondary effects like fire. You must have had terrible luck with the loot generator if you can't find a good sniper.

There's not a lot of balancing between the weapon classes. Some are objectively better than others, (like Jonny said, rocket launchers simply suck) and I haven't ever found the need for situational weapon switching. I've never felt the desire, let alone the need, to switch any of my main 4 weapons out.

I agree with KDR's point that the weapons basically never change much within their class, and that is kind of boring. But functionally, I prefer it that way because I don't like carrying too many weapons around in my backpack. I'd rather find the best weapon of each class and stick with one of each.

I completely agree that the loot system is cumbersome and should be seriously streamlined for the second game.

Also, KDR, you haven't played online much, have you? The Roland's turret is a godsend with the right abilities. It provides extra firepower, a shield to duck behind as cover, and it has Area of Effect health and ammo regeneration for all of your allies. It would be very overpowered if it recharged more quickly than every two minutes.

Wow, sorry I rambled a lot there. I just don't get a chance to discuss Borderlands very often. :

4. WELL EXCUUUUUUUUUSE ME PRINCESS! That's all you need to know about the Zelda cartoon. >_>

Those cartoons are priceless for memes and youtube poops though.

5. The Mario Kart discussion whetted my appetite for a James rant. We haven't had one since Hawx 2. We need some snarky hilarity on the show again!

[TJ Spyke]

1. I actually think he does the DK Rap pretty good.

2. The name of the game is Final Fantasy III outside of Japan. Whether you like it or not, that is the case.

The naming is not really a snafu. Square Soft didn't want to bring some of the games outside of Japan, and thought it was better to just re-name the ones they did bring over. LOL, I have never actually played any FF game other than Final Fantasy Tactics Advance. Also, the DS version of FF 3/6 got pretty good reviews.

3. I bought Borderlands: Game of the Year Edition for $10 from Best Buy, but haven't touched it. The reason being that I have just had very little interest in playing video games for the last 6 months or so. I still love reading about them and watching videos of them, just not playing them.

4. The Legend of Zelda cartoon was a little stupid, but I enjoyed watching them in a MST sorta way. I actually liked The Super Mario Bros. Super Show, even The Adventures of Super Mario Bros. 3 was not that bad (though I hated that they changed the names of the Koopalings). Super Mario World was meh, and I hated Yoshi. Captain N: The Game Master was sometimes good, though I hate how they butchered almost every character they used (Mother Brain's looks and voices, calling Pit "Kid Icarus" and making him annoying, making Simon Belmont a egotistical coward, etc.)

5. I don't think it makes sense to call the game Mario Kart 7, though not for the 2 Arcade games reason. Other than the GCN one, every game in the series has had their name based on the system (in Japan, the GBA game differed outside of Japan). Logically that means the new one should have been called Mario Kart 3D.

[NWR_Lindy]

@NinSage - Hey, that was OFF THE DOME too. Just wait until I come with those writtens!

[NWR_Neal]

Lindy should have a freestyle rap podcast called Off The Dome.

[broodwars]

2. The name of the game is Final Fantasy III outside of Japan. Whether you like it or not, that is the case.

It was when the game was released, but starting with Final Fantasy VII, Square ret-conned the entire series into the Japanese numbering continuity.  And whenever these games have been re-released or sequels to them have been released (aka Final Fantasy IV: The After Years), they've used the official Japanese numbering.  So yeah, "Final Fantasy VI" is the game's official name now, and considering how terrible the real "Final Fantasy III" is on the NES/DS it bugs me as well to see FF VI go by its old name.

[zachs1997]

was ff3 on the ds the American ff3 or is it the japan ff3

[TJ Spyke]

was ff3 on the ds the American ff3 or is it the japan ff3

The Japan one. It got a lot of attention because it was the first time the game was released outside of Japan.

[broodwars]

was ff3 on the ds the American ff3 or is it the japan ff3

The Japan one. It got a lot of attention because it was the first time the game was released outside of Japan.

Yep, while meanwhile the GBA port of what was formerly known as "Final Fantasy III" on the SNES was released as "Final Fantasy VI Advance", using the modern Final Fantasy numbering scheme.  The fact that that can be confusing is exactly why the series was renumbered outside Japan.  They needed an understandable continuity worldwide instead of just continuing the NES->SNES NA numbering.

[zachs1997]

uhg i passed crono trigger for this peice

[Fiendlord_Timmay]

Haha Jon, I'm not actually NinSage. I'm just following his formatting from previous threads to organize my thoughts.

I was kinda kidding about the rap thing. I appreciate the effort, but I'm not the biggest rap fan. You can't blame me for cringing. :

I guess the FF naming thing isn't THAT complicated, but it's still a rather unique story that warrants telling. One of my friends who listens to the show was confused last week when Jonny used the name FF3 and FF6 interchangeably to refer to FF6j. I guess I'm just a new school gamer who grew up when it was called FF6. So sue me.

Also TJ, I'm not sure what you're talking about. FF6/FF3US was remade as FF VI Advance for the GBA in 2007. That received good reviews. But the remake of FF3j for the DS got somewhat mixed reviews.

Well, whatever. I was only joking about the FF thing anyway. It's hard to be facetious on the internet.

[TJ Spyke]

The DS game that get pretty good reviews, not great but still good.

[zachs1997]

its good but it is really hard

[Fiendlord_Timmay]

It's hard in a bad way though. I'm actually playing through it right now, so I could write a whole essay on my problems with it. I figure I'd bore most of the people here though. It's pretty funny that both my favorite and least favorite Final Fantasy games are both called FF3 in some form.

[zachs1997]

lol

[zachs1997]

I Was listening to ssbb music and this made me think of RFN now playing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qlm7c1GwA8Q&feature=related

[KDR_11k]

Also, KDR, you haven't played online much, have you? The Roland's turret is a godsend with the right abilities. It provides extra firepower, a shield to duck behind as cover, and it has Area of Effect health and ammo regeneration for all of your allies. It would be very overpowered if it recharged more quickly than every two minutes.

No, I only played online once or twice and it was laggy as hell (Unreal Engine 3) and no fun. Besides I always have health and ammo regeneration on my character, regardless of any turrets.

[Fiendlord_Timmay]

Really? I've never had any problems with lag, and I play the game exclusively online with my friends. I have had some other bizzare issues though, like quest rewards disappearing for no reason. It really is a messy game, as the crew said. I'm with Jonny; I love it despite its faults. But I can see how someone would dislike the game. To each his own.

[KDR_11k]

I wouldn't say the revivals of Mario, Mega Man and Street Fighter are cyclical, they're just a result of the developers exhausting all the wrong options until they arrived back at the original design. I also wouldn't call the 2D platformer burnt out. Back in the 8 and 16 bit era that genre was the industry. Now we're seeing dozens of first person shooters every year and people aren't calling that genre burnt out.

For an NSMB sequel you wouldn't need any big headline features, you'd just need more quality. As far as 2D Mario goes the NSMB games are pretty much the bottom tier. SMB3 and World are still seen as the apex of the series. They'd just need to make NSMB3 on par with the original SMB3 and people will flock to it (works fine for Mario Kart, after all) without any big bullet points on the box. That new feature thinking brought us Sunshine and we know how that ended.

[marty]

I wouldn't say the revivals of Mario, Mega Man and Street Fighter are cyclical, they're just a result of the developers exhausting all the wrong options until they arrived back at the original design. I also wouldn't call the 2D platformer burnt out. Back in the 8 and 16 bit era that genre was the industry. Now we're seeing dozens of first person shooters every year and people aren't calling that genre burnt out.

yes. yes. yes. The FPS has even been popular for 20 years.  People can't seem to get enough CoD; it's kinda crazy.  Racing/ Sport sim have been around longer and are still top sellers year after year.  Why companies like capcom and nintendo, decide to throw away tried and true game-play in favor of unsuccessful projects is really, really weird.

For an NSMB sequel you wouldn't need any big headline features, you'd just need more quality. As far as 2D Mario goes the NSMB games are pretty much the bottom tier. SMB3 and World are still seen as the apex of the series. They'd just need to make NSMB3 on par with the original SMB3 and people will flock to it (works fine for Mario Kart, after all) without any big bullet points on the box. That new feature thinking brought us Sunshine and we know how that ended.

NSMB (both of them) seem to suffer from kind of crappy controls--very un-Super Mario.  Also, all the worlds were rehashes, it seemed awful lazy.  Those games could have both been much, much better.  Better art direction and orchestral score would have been nice, too.

[mr_lakitu]

Awesome show as always. Hope Johnny's family member/s is ok?!?


I really want to play Mighty Milky Way(forward). I will look into acquiring this.