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Gaming Forums => Nintendo Gaming => Topic started by: Soren on June 28, 2015, 11:46:35 AM

Title: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Soren on June 28, 2015, 11:46:35 AM
Updated to encompass all news and speculation regarding the NX.

This thread originally started out as a discussion on NX and third parties, the original post is below.

Via Fortune:
https://fortune.com/2015/06/23/shigeru-miyamoto-wii-u/ (https://fortune.com/2015/06/23/shigeru-miyamoto-wii-u/)

Quote
The problem for Nintendo is the NX’s launch is at least a year away—likely more, as the company reportedly just started talking about it with third party partners at this year’s E3. (The reception, say insiders, was positive.) That means the company has to rely on the Wii U a little while longer. And while many gamers may have chosen to focus instead on console offerings from Microsoft and Sony, Miyamoto says he regrets the system will likely never live up to its full potential.

Unfortunately there's not much else in the form of details. Is this just a pitch of what Nintendo is doing or is this the start of a collaborative process with 3rd parties? Was 3rd party response positive in the form of them being able to pitch back ideas about specs or functions, or was this just more of the same one-sided communication by Nintendo?

There needs to be more communication.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on June 28, 2015, 12:02:43 PM
Do we know for a fact that this video is fake? https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=bChBid9pHsE The concept is dumb as hell but it would fall in line with what they said about showing it off to select 3rd parties and having a positive reception. Has anyone been able to trace that Bill Trinen sound clip? If not I think the NX has already leaked right under our noses.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on June 28, 2015, 12:15:38 PM
That video is so blatantly fake it's funny.

First of all, the features it showed off are simply not possible. Wii U games on the go? On a console that thin? Not likely. The swivel screen is also not likely either.

This topic existing after one news article about the NX with little-to-no hard facts is also pointless. There's nothing to discuss about the NX.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Triforce Hermit on June 28, 2015, 12:20:41 PM
Wasn't the third party reaction to the Wii U positive as well?
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: pokepal148 on June 28, 2015, 12:21:08 PM
BUT POINTLESS SPECULATION IS WHAT MAKES NINTENDO FANSITES GO ROUND even if most of us are just jaded, snarky, assholes
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 28, 2015, 02:50:08 PM
That video is so blatantly fake it's funny.

First of all, the features it showed off are simply not possible. Wii U games on the go? On a console that thin? Not likely. The swivel screen is also not likely either.

This topic existing after one news article about the NX with little-to-no hard facts is also pointless. There's nothing to discuss about the NX.

I agree that the video is completely fake - but Wii U games on a system that size? Totally possible, even right now. Battery life would be a question in that size of a system. But anyway, look at the Nvidia SHIELD Android TV. It's more powerful than the Wii U, and it's barely larger than a Blu-Ray case - and that's with a 2.75" x 4" HDD inside, microSD slot, 2 USB 3.0 ports, MicroUSB, power adapter port, ethernet port, and HDMI port.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on June 28, 2015, 03:08:16 PM
That controller is a handheld. It needs a battery of its own. It looks insanely thin.

I'm not talking about a console, here.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: nickmitch on June 28, 2015, 04:31:20 PM
Wasn't the third party reaction to the Wii U positive as well?

That's exactly what I was thinking.  I think they said the same for Wii as well, but we still ended up with well, the Wii lineup.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on June 28, 2015, 05:37:10 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VUKcSiAPJoQ

Well hope they get unreal engine 4 to run on NX. Obviously you would want the environment to be more Mario, but this is pretty cool looking.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 28, 2015, 07:15:59 PM
You know I never thought a realistic Mario game would work, but that changed my mind. For the most part he doesn't look all that out of place in the video.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Soren on June 28, 2015, 10:04:02 PM
This topic existing after one news article about the NX with little-to-no hard facts is also pointless. There's nothing to discuss about the NX.

When's the last time hard facts stopped a thread from existing? I'm pretty sure we can post blatant speculation here safe in the knowledge that we can parse it out. Also, given the state of Nintendo and 3rd parties currently, there will be plenty to discuss about the subject as development on the NX starts to bubble up.

Well hope they get unreal engine 4 to run on NX.

Unreal 4 can run on Wii U. Armature's port of Bloodstained will be the first UE4 game on Wii U and Epic always said anyone was welcome to ship an UE4 game on Wii U even if they weren't officially supporting it.

Wasn't the third party reaction to the Wii U positive as well?

Yup, I really don't want a repeat of this (https://youtu.be/lKwldXyhSzU?t=18m30s) (skip to 18:30 if the video doesn't take you there immediately). Knowing what we now know of how Nintendo treated these guys and how they still kinda wanted to buy in to what was being sold, Nintendo now has to do way more to win everyone back. I really they don't just take these "positive" receptions with them back to Kyoto and that's it. I really want to know there's a open dialogue back and forth throughout NX's development.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: nickmitch on June 28, 2015, 10:46:20 PM

Yup, I really don't want a repeat of this (https://youtu.be/lKwldXyhSzU?t=18m30s) (skip to 18:30 if the video doesn't take you there immediately).

LOL: "We couldn't me more excited to be able to bring the power of EA Sports to Nintendo's new console."

I guess the enthusiasm had nowhere to go but down.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 28, 2015, 10:59:03 PM
Nintendo will never have third parties again.  They realized the big Elephant in the room.  It is not the Console makers that are in control, it is the third parties.  They can drive the boat and force the issue.

If your console isn't thought to be worth porting the game over for, then it won't be ported...and honestly, 3rd parties realize true gamers have one or two systems...so they only truly need to support 2 consoles to reach the highest potential buyers.  The marginal increase in sales from supporting 2 systems to 3 systems is probably not worth it...unless the porting process is extremely easy and cheap. 

This is a reason why Nintendo needs to pull its resources and just be branded as a single console experience.  Portable games and console games together.  Do not split talent creating games for two separate systems but realize that releasing more games throughout the year for a single system will attract the most attention and audience. 

If Nintendo could realize the same number of 3DS and Nintendo Wii U games a year, but all that output is for a single system, then 3rd parties are less of a problem.  People would buy Nintendo consoles for the reason Nintendo truly wants them to buy Nintendo consoles to buy Nintendo games. 

Nintendo can never rely on 3rd parties again.  They are never coming back.  Period.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on June 29, 2015, 12:29:41 AM
That's my mindset, essentially. Nintendo struggles with software droughts on their handhelds and their home consoles- it's just an unfortunate truth of splitting resources. Putting them all under the same roof would help with that issue and cause Nintendo to think of less iterative experiences.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on June 29, 2015, 12:54:09 AM

Well hope they get unreal engine 4 to run on NX.

Unreal 4 can run on Wii U. Armature's port of Bloodstained will be the first UE4 game on Wii U and Epic always said anyone was welcome to ship an UE4 game on Wii U even if they weren't officially supporting it.

I don't think Bloodstained would crash the Wii U though. I think most all the other lighting and shader nonsense would crash it. They could probably move it on over to wii or gamecube(i kid) if they scaled the engine down enough for 2d.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Enner on June 29, 2015, 05:19:26 AM
Quote from: https://fortune.com/2015/06/23/shigeru-miyamoto-wii-u/
“For us, the next step is to think about what is going to be that element that is really going to catch the attention of a large number of players again and get them excited,” says Takahasi. “We’re constantly thinking about this idea from the perspective of the players and the needs of the players in terms of what can we can do with our ability and our technology to capture that excitement and passion.”

I'm singling out this quote because on the surface it is all well and good. But then you start asking question such as what players do they exactly have in mind, what is their perspective of the players they have in mind, what are Nintendo's limits in its abilities and technology, etc.

This dovetails nicely with:
Yup, I really don't want a repeat of this (https://youtu.be/lKwldXyhSzU?t=18m30s) (skip to 18:30 if the video doesn't take you there immediately).

I hope I'm not too dire or pessimistic in saying that company men and women will say sweet nothings to each other and to us all day and night. Their actions and results can and are very different things. A part of me believes that the third parties in that video are genuine in their enthusiasm for the prospects of the Wii U; that the Wii U was a viable platform for third parties until it wasn't.

The NX isn't real yet, and all we have is (cheap) talk of hopes, fears, rumors, and speculations from anyone and everyone. It should be a fun couple of years as long as we keep that in mind.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: lolmonade on June 29, 2015, 08:39:41 AM
Don't believe a word that's being said/written about 3rd party support interest.  That's a vague statement, number one, so we could be talking about the same slate of 3rd party support they've had for Wii U in being interested (Platinum, Sega, Ubisoft).  Number two - it's the same thing that was said of the Wii U before it fell flat, and given how 3rd parties have continued up to this point to support Xbox 360/PS3 with downports, the decision to not support Wii U clearly wasn't due to them not being capable to.
 
You gotta go into a Nintendo platform expecting it to be your "Nintendo Machine" for the time being, let them prove you wrong if you're wanting to rely on one console for your Nintendo & 3rd party needs. 
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on June 29, 2015, 09:14:31 AM
This is primarily why I believe the NX will be a 2016 reveal, 2017 release. They need to support the latest "Nintendo machine" as much as possible before they ditch it, which would leave the (small) Wii U fanbase bitter and unresponsive towards their next console- that is, if it is a new home console. If it's a handheld, they can be a bit more lenient, even though the New Nintendo 3DS community is hurting for exclusive games, in retrospect.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Ian Sane on June 29, 2015, 05:01:01 PM
Positive things were said by third parties prior to the Wii U launch and that makes sense.  Any third party with a game coming out naturally wants you to buy it.  EA and Ubisoft wanted the Wii U to be somewhat successful or the games they released on it wouldn't make any money.  They just didn't have any really strong investment in it.  EA in particular put in a very token effort.  They hoped it sold well enough for their games to be successful but they were cautious enough in their investment that it wouldn't bite them in the ass if the Wii U flopped.

If third parties think they can make money off a Nintendo console they'll support it.  But they don't give a **** either way.  If the NX can make them a buck, great, but they're not going to jump in with both feet and risk the possibility of failure.  Whether or not the NX succeeds is on Nintendo alone.  The only way a third party is going to take on any responsibility for the system's success is if Nintendo takes on the risk.

So Nintendo can show third parties it but that doesn't mean the third party support will improve.  These companies may just take the approach that if it isn't too much trouble they might port games if they stand to make a buck off it.  Most likely they'll probably consider supporting it if it sells well, which it of course won't if the third party support is too sparse at the beginning.

Nintendo needs to make it easy to bring a game to their system (so no underpowered specs, unfamiliar architecture or unhelpful development tools) and they probably need moneyhats.  After the Wii U I don't see anyone supporting the NX until the userbase is a good size and the userbase won't achieve that size if there are too few games.  Early on Nintendo is going to have to take on that financial risk.  Either that or somehow bust out a mega killer app that sells the console on its own.  Personally I think a proper console Pokémon RPG would be the best bet.  And of course if that somehow happens Nintendo needs hardware that is actually compatible for multiplatform development.  The Wii's large userbase did jack **** for third party support.

Though there is a big part of me that has serious doubts.  Even if Nintendo has learned from their mistakes and do everything right will the market give them a chance after a flop like the Wii U?  In particular with the third party support if I don't see it at launch I'm going to assume it won't come at all.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on June 29, 2015, 05:28:32 PM
Kinda weird third parties wont jump in feet first for Nintendo, but they'll do the same for Sony and Microsoft. Microsoft isn't doing nearly as well as Sony, Sony last generation wasn't doing nearly as well as Nintendo. Support is what actually makes or breaks a console, not graphics, not hardware, not even market share(the only logical thing that should matter).
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: NWR_insanolord on June 29, 2015, 05:36:04 PM
Kinda weird third parties wont jump in feet first for Nintendo, but they'll do the same for Sony and Microsoft. Microsoft isn't doing nearly as well as Sony, Sony last generation wasn't doing nearly as well as Nintendo. Support is what actually makes or breaks a console, not graphics, not hardware, not even market share(the only logical thing that should matter).

The difference is third party games sell on those platforms, and they don't on Nintendo's. Regardless of how much Nintendo improves their relationship with third parties, they need to find a way to change that if they want them to really stick around.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on June 29, 2015, 05:54:41 PM
maybe if they don't release the games extra late(watchdogs), or change the gameplay by removing jumping(dead rising)....or make that one exclusive so boring that it doesnt have legs to be a continued purchase(zombiu), or release a game out of sequential order when they should have made a trilogy pack(mass effect)
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Ian Sane on June 29, 2015, 06:32:40 PM
maybe if they don't release the games extra late(watchdogs), or change the gameplay by removing jumping(dead rising)....or make that one exclusive so boring that it doesnt have legs to be a continued purchase(zombiu), or release a game out of sequential order when they should have made a trilogy pack(mass effect)

I agree.  I think the idea that third party games don't sell on Nintendo consoles is flawed but nonetheless that is the stereotype and Nintendo needs to fight against it.  It's kind of like back when Nintendo was "kiddy" WE knew better but Nintendo was not able to convince others of that.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 29, 2015, 08:51:54 PM
The big problem I can't solve for the 3rd parties is the fact that eventually the number of new customers they can actually rich with a port becomes quite small.  If the Xbox One and PS4 have your game and both systems have a user base of around 2 million + users each.  Adding a third system that has 2 million users will not earn you 2 million more sales.  In fact you have to think about the demographics and see how many of those 2 million users could buy the game in another form be it Xbox One, PS4 or PC...because they might own one more more of those systems.  Then you have to think about the demographics of each particular system market.  Nintendo has a very special audience and market, they are gamers, but if they are hardcore gamers they most likely have another system.  If they are Nintendo fans only, your game may or may not appeal to them.  If it does it is worth the effort to port the game over...if it won't it isn't worth the effort. 

Porting games can be expensive and gamers do not like lazy ports, specially if the console you are porting to has unique feature they want to use.  This is why I think the power has left the hands of the console makers and are in the hands of the 3rd parties...they are only looking out for themselves, and supporting a larger number of systems does not make financial sense unless that port is quick and easy, and guaranteed profit.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Luigi Dude on June 29, 2015, 09:11:27 PM
The problem is third parties basically expect Nintendo to give jump through hoops like Microsoft and Sony do.  Microsoft and Sony lost billions last gen in part, because third parties wanted these insanely powerful consoles that both companies had to sell at a huge loss.  Hell even after many third parties either closed or have reduced in size since last gen because of these high cost they wanted in the first place, they still want more this gen.

This is why I don't expect any major third party support to ever hit a Nintendo home console until we get another industry crash that forces third parties to rethink the way they do business.  They want Nintendo to be willing to take huge losses just to show they care about them, which Nintendo isn't going to do.  The Wii U might have lost Nintendo some money but it pales in comparison to what Microsoft and Sony lost keeping third parties happy last gen.  This is why even after the Wii U, Nintendo has no real reason to really make a major change in their third party relationships when many of these third parties aren't the most profit friendly friends to have.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Soren on June 29, 2015, 10:19:05 PM
The problem is third parties basically expect Nintendo to give jump through hoops like Microsoft and Sony do. 


I think they'd settle for the decent stuff. You know, like not having to wait over 2 weeks for a game-of-telephone-type answer to their dev kit questions. Or actual documentation. Not having to almost reverse engineer the console to their games running on them.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: broodwars on June 29, 2015, 10:52:29 PM
The problem is third parties basically expect Nintendo to give jump through hoops like Microsoft and Sony do. 


I think they'd settle for the decent stuff. You know, like not having to wait over 2 weeks for a game-of-telephone-type answer to their dev kit questions. Or actual documentation. Not having to almost reverse engineer the console to their games running on them.

Or, you know, Nintendo actually taking their input on the new console before they make it, rather than just make something that suits Nintendo's needs alone & then expecting 3rd parties to just support it.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 29, 2015, 11:52:07 PM
Money hatting 3rd party support is kinda foolish in my opinion.  You get a timed exclusive or a port with extra features.  Instead, Nintendo is doing something I think is better.  Allowing 3rd parties to make Nintendo games.  This is basically money hatting a 3rd party game that WILL be a true exclusive, and keeps your teams open to make different games. 

If Nintendo could have one single system not a portable and console, and consolidate their teams and release a new game almost every month of the year...they wouldn't really need 3rd party support.  If I could get 12 great games a year...or even 10 great games from Nintendo a year...heck...even 8 great games a year, that would be enough to support the purchase of a Nintendo console. 
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Soren on June 30, 2015, 12:10:06 AM
If Nintendo could have one single system not a portable and console, and consolidate their teams and release a new game almost every month of the year...they wouldn't really need 3rd party support.  If I could get 12 great games a year...or even 10 great games from Nintendo a year...heck...even 8 great games a year, that would be enough to support the purchase of a Nintendo console.


That is totally unrealistic, first because Nintendo will still release a console and a handheld follow-up, and second because no single company can fulfill the software demands for a piece of hardware. Unless you like more games like Animal Crossing Amiibo Designer and lukewarm updated Mario Sports Game.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 30, 2015, 02:07:03 AM

    Wii Fit U
    Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze
    Mario Kart 8
    Wii Sports Club
    Hyrule Warriors (Published by Nintendo outside of Japan)
    Just Dance Wii U (Japan only)
    Bayonetta 2
    Bayonetta
    Super Smash Bros. for Wii U
    Captain Toad: Treasure Tracker
    Fatal Frame: Maiden of Black Water
    NES Remix Pack

    Yoshi's New Island
    Inazuma Eleven 3: Team Ogre Attacks! (Published by Nintendo in Europe only)
    Professor Layton vs. Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney (Published by Nintendo outside of Japan)
    Disney Magical World (Published by Nintendo outside of Japan)
    Kirby: Triple Deluxe
    Mario Golf: World Tour
    Tomodachi Life
    Wagamama Fashion: Girls Mode Yokubari Sengen! Tokimeki Up! (Japan only)
    Super Smash Bros. for Nintendo 3DS
    Pokémon Art Academy
    Fantasy Life (Published by Nintendo outside of Japan)
    Pokémon Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire
    Ultimate NES Remix

These are the 2014 releases from Nintendo that were retail releases for the 3DS and Nintendo Wii.  Not all these games were developed in-house, but they were published by Nintendo.

I did add a big IF, Nintendo would make only one system...which is the whole point I was discussing.  Nintendo should look at a means to develop one system that could be both a portable and console.  I don't know what that would look like...either a hybrid system, or just two systems that are close enough together that every game can be played on both...but the point is IF Nintendo was able to do that...they would have a compelling video system with enough exclusives to warrant a purchase and attention from the industry.

Am I saying every gamers needs and every type/style/genre of game could be created.  Nope.  I am just saying if Nintendo was able to get there act together and release a console with compelling new monthly content that the industry would look at Nintendo seriously again.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Ian Sane on June 30, 2015, 01:41:23 PM
Exclusives don't matter anymore.  The Wii U has probably the best list of exclusives by a mile and that is doing jack **** in selling it.  What people want is the games they want to play being available on their console of choice.  So Nintendo can get Bayonetta 2?  Whoop dee do.  So that's one game vs. a good 20 or so titles of comparable quality that literally everyone else but Nintendo gets.  The Wii U has anti-exclusives - games that are only NOT on the Wii U.  For Sony and MS the exclusives are just to tip the scales one way or another.  Nintendo is treating this like the NES years where almost every game is exclusive, except they're stuck playing the Sega Master System role this time.

This idea that Nintendo can't afford to cater to every demand of third parties would have more weight if Nintendo came across as doing all they feasibly can.  They don't.  They don't come across like they're trying at all.  That list of things Soren mentioned?  I work in software development.  I wouldn't work with a company like that in a million years.  That is outright unacceptable support.  You can't afford to waste time in development dealing with that kind of crap.  Inefficient development time eats up salary costs which are the biggest costs a company takes on.  If you have to **** around for an extra few weeks just to deal with Nintendo's nonsense that eats significantly into your profit margin even for a port, assuming a port is even feasible since Nintendo is going with last gen hardware.  Oh and what is the selling point for your port if the Nintendo version is clearly the worst one every time?

I would be thrilled if Nintendo just made a reasonable effort and the third party support would probably significantly improve just if they did that.  Pretty much ANY level of support is better than this.  We're like one step above having literally no support at all.  And this is a business.  If Nintendo can't afford to properly cater to third parties they also cannot afford a console that doesn't sell worth a **** because it gets like five games a year because Nintendo is the only company supporting it.  The market has certain demands and if Nintendo fails to meet them they don't sell their product and make no money.  Nintendo can make all the excuses they want but they still have to make a sellable product and regardless of how feasible this or that is if they don't make something that sells they're fucked.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: lolmonade on July 01, 2015, 04:06:43 PM
Exclusives don't matter anymore.  The Wii U has probably the best list of exclusives by a mile and that is doing jack **** in selling it.  What people want is the games they want to play being available on their console of choice.  So Nintendo can get Bayonetta 2?  Whoop dee do.  So that's one game vs. a good 20 or so titles of comparable quality that literally everyone else but Nintendo gets.  The Wii U has anti-exclusives - games that are only NOT on the Wii U.  For Sony and MS the exclusives are just to tip the scales one way or another.  Nintendo is treating this like the NES years where almost every game is exclusive, except they're stuck playing the Sega Master System role this time.

This idea that Nintendo can't afford to cater to every demand of third parties would have more weight if Nintendo came across as doing all they feasibly can.  They don't.  They don't come across like they're trying at all.  That list of things Soren mentioned?  I work in software development.  I wouldn't work with a company like that in a million years.  That is outright unacceptable support.  You can't afford to waste time in development dealing with that kind of crap.  Inefficient development time eats up salary costs which are the biggest costs a company takes on.  If you have to **** around for an extra few weeks just to deal with Nintendo's nonsense that eats significantly into your profit margin even for a port, assuming a port is even feasible since Nintendo is going with last gen hardware.  Oh and what is the selling point for your port if the Nintendo version is clearly the worst one every time?

I would be thrilled if Nintendo just made a reasonable effort and the third party support would probably significantly improve just if they did that.  Pretty much ANY level of support is better than this.  We're like one step above having literally no support at all.  And this is a business.  If Nintendo can't afford to properly cater to third parties they also cannot afford a console that doesn't sell worth a **** because it gets like five games a year because Nintendo is the only company supporting it.  The market has certain demands and if Nintendo fails to meet them they don't sell their product and make no money.  Nintendo can make all the excuses they want but they still have to make a sellable product and regardless of how feasible this or that is if they don't make something that sells they're fucked.
You make some statements here that are more valid with corrections.  Please see below:
Quote
Exclusives don't aren't the only things that matter anymore.  The Wii U has probably the best list of exclusives by a mile and that is doing jack **** in selling it to anyone other than Nintendo fans.

Quote
This idea that Nintendo can't afford to cater to every demand of third parties would have more weight if Nintendo came across as doing all they feasibly can to the point of burning cash without any feasible way to get a return on investment.  They don't.  They don't come across like they're trying at all to offer partnerships to developers with no interest in sending out shoddy ports to die..

Quote
If you have to **** around for an extra few weeks just to deal with Nintendo's nonsense that eats significantly into your profit margin even for a port, assuming a port is even feasible since Nintendo is going with last gen hardware despite most 3rd party games up until recently also having ports done for PS3/Xbox 360.

I get we're all here to discuss a company/game we love, and part of that includes sometimes playing armchair CEO, but the 3rd party problem for Nintendo is one years in the making, and it's always easier to burn bridges than to build them.  Frankly, I don't see how this can be perceived as an easy or clear route to fixing it.  Nintendo can't afford to bribe help finance every 3rd party game that goes to other consoles.  Even with Wii at the height of popularity, it was clear that the market for Nintendo games are simply different than those who buy-in Sony/MSFT systems.
 
Whatever the solution is for Nintendo's 3rd party problems, it'll have to be multi-pronged, multi-year, and costly.  You don't just flip a swtich and suddenly everything is hunky dory.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on July 01, 2015, 06:13:21 PM
Well, i think most of us are just disappointed Nintendo hasn't gotten much better at 3rd parties over the years, but at the same time it doesn't look like third parties are making much of an effort either. Nintendo does things to improve third party support every generation short of funding third party releases. I think Nintendo should spend a couple million to make a couple billion when it comes to third parties.

Another thing that annoys me is Nintendo has been around forever, but if you go into a gamestop, or if you work for Verizon and read the scripting its always Sony and Microsoft, as far as most people go Nintendo doesn't exist or is irrelevant.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: broodwars on July 01, 2015, 06:17:51 PM
Another thing that annoys me is Nintendo has been around forever, but if you go into a gamestop, or if you work for Verizon and read the scripting its always Sony and Microsoft, as far as most people go Nintendo doesn't exist or is irrelevant.

Right now, my local GameStop's Vita section is larger than their Wii U section, in terms of New Games. It's like 5 shelves of spine-facing Wii U used games, 1 shelf of cover-facing New Games.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: lolmonade on July 01, 2015, 07:07:22 PM
Another thing that annoys me is Nintendo has been around forever, but if you go into a gamestop, or if you work for Verizon and read the scripting its always Sony and Microsoft, as far as most people go Nintendo doesn't exist or is irrelevant.

Right now, my local GameStop's Vita section is larger than their Wii U section, in terms of New Games. It's like 5 shelves of spine-facing Wii U used games, 1 shelf of cover-facing New Games.


My gamestop's Wii U is about your size, but the Vita is relegated to one of those tiny middle shelves where they usually store the funco pop bobble heads and other plastic garbage.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on July 01, 2015, 11:33:03 PM
The thing is, people hold third party titles on Nintendo platforms to the same standard that they hold first party games, and I think that developers fear that for sales reasons and critical reception. Obviously, they're performing against a so tired company that has made many great titles, and I think that people frown on games that don't offer the same level of polish. It's why Wayforward games sell well on Nintendo devices- despite the overall quality, they out out material that's polished from many aspects and have been accepted by fans in that sense.

I know the games I wanted to play the most on Nintendo consoles were titles that seemed comparable to Nintendo titles- Bayonetta, No More Heroes, Sonic Colors, Fluidity- things that you didn't feel like you could get on other consoles. Of course, some of those games are found elsewhere an garner cult followings, but I see Nintendo platforms as "cult" platforms more than any other. Especially considering their core fanbase is pretty much a cult itself. If you're like me, you look for what is different and appealing in a console rather than what's the same. Unfortunately, that mindset isn't profitable and it's clearly not what people what judging by the opinions I've seen here and elsewhere.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on July 01, 2015, 11:54:06 PM
Do we know for a fact that this video is fake? https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=bChBid9pHsE

That's basically the system I designed a few years back. Now I have to find the thread where I posted all the schematics/drawings.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on July 02, 2015, 01:46:19 AM
I was thinking the other day...what if there was no edge to the screen for a controller? I'd get rid of the edge of the screen. It would just look like joystick and d pad sticking out of the screen. Buttons would have color changing leds.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on July 02, 2015, 03:06:37 AM
I was thinking the other day...what if there was no edge to the screen for a controller? I'd get rid of the edge of the screen. It would just look like joystick and d pad sticking out of the screen. Buttons would have color changing leds.
Wouldn't you just get the edges of the screen all fingerprinty and dirty from where you have to grip on?
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ThePerm on July 02, 2015, 04:10:35 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/9HLMZ7r.jpg)

Kinda like this. IT would make the physical size of the controller smaller, the screen bigger, but you would have effectively the same setup. Its would be the same thing as wii u, but higher resolution, possibly 3d, multi touch.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Evan_B on July 02, 2015, 02:42:35 PM
Ehhhhhh... for what purpose?
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ShyGuy on July 04, 2015, 04:36:55 AM
It would certainly look slick. Wasn't there some mention of screen with non-standard shapes in the recent Nintendo past?
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Shaymin on July 04, 2015, 08:57:49 AM
Those were round screens, but I think the implication was they would be for QoL.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: broodwars on July 04, 2015, 09:31:58 AM
So, this story's making the rounds this morning, but apparently we now finally know what happened to Project H.A.M.M.E.R. on the Wii, and it seems to have had long-reaching implications for Nintendo's software development.

Suffice it to say, the story's pretty ugly, boiling down to the Western Developers getting shut out of creative decisions, leading to a game that had no direction and accusations of racism/nationalism against the Japanese project heads at NST.


The reason I bring this video up is that I wonder if a similar situation played out between EA & Nintendo in the lead-up to Wii U's release, leading to that complete & sudden split only a year after the "Unprecedented partnership" announcement.  Also, I wonder if this attitude is something that Western devs still see from Nintendo, and that's partially why Nintendo 3rd party support is how it is. If that's the case, can we possibly hope for better relationships going forward with NX?

Yeah, there's a lot of "If"s in there, but it's definitely food for thought.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: ShyGuy on July 04, 2015, 11:24:14 AM
The cancellation of Project HAMMER still makes me sad. Looking back, it did need another angle or hook though.


Back on topic, I think somebody needs to start a NX News & Rumors thread or upgrade this one to be more encompassing.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: rlse9 on July 04, 2015, 01:23:27 PM
Just watched that video and was going to post a link here.  That really makes Nintendo look like a complete trainwreck of a company to work with.
Title: Re: NX and Third Parties
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 04, 2015, 01:57:58 PM

Back on topic, I think somebody needs to start a NX News & Rumors thread or upgrade this one to be more encompassing.




I agree because The NX is starting to look  more and more like a Wii U Handheld with a Chromecast Dongle. Add those Sharp Boundless screens and its looking like we have a solid hypothesis of the future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 04, 2015, 03:02:16 PM
Ask and ye shall receive.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ceric on July 04, 2015, 08:44:39 PM
There is a rumor going around that some of the media is taking up that the NX will be less powerful than the XBox One.  At this point even if its a handheld I would want it more powerful than the PS4.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 05, 2015, 01:35:37 AM
At this point even if its a handheld I would want it more powerful than the PS4.


Is that even possible with todays Technology? The heat alone would fry an egg no doubt. And with a screen, you're talking $500 bare minimum.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 05, 2015, 06:37:26 AM
Not to mention trying to get media with the capacity to hold that kind of game at that size. They'd be back to the N64 situation of the media eating up a huge cost.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 05, 2015, 06:32:39 PM
I'm still wondering how they are going to get a Wii U equivalency in a handheld. Maybe, just maybe there is more truth in that Nintendo XDS. Not saying that the video is correct but Nintendo seems to try and get the most out of their hardware architecture. Wii U with more RAM is what the damned thing needed from jump street.



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 05, 2015, 09:06:47 PM
As I've said before, a portable Wii U (sans drive) would be easily doable. Having said that it would also be a terrible idea.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: broodwars on July 05, 2015, 09:32:23 PM
With how rapidly smart phones are catching up to dedicated platforms, I'm not sure merely Wii U-level capabilities will be enough. At the rate they're advancing, give them a few more years and they'll be at least at PS3-level, if not PS4.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 05, 2015, 10:05:47 PM
Even if smartphones are capable of that, nobody's going to do it there because you can't make back the budget it would take off 99 cents and microtransactions.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 05, 2015, 11:32:20 PM
I just had a thought: I've been wondering why Nintendo haven't put out a new Wii U color or GamePad Pro. Then I got to thinking that maybe the NX is really just the "NEW" Wii U?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Enner on July 06, 2015, 04:45:53 AM
They haven't put out a new Wii U color or a new GamePad because the sales and prospects are that low.

As for NX being the "New" Wii U, that seems too straight-forward for Nintendo, regardless of the Wii U's sales.

There was that Digitimes article that reported that the NX is coming out July 2016 along with some other dates and names of parts providers (think Foxconn). Not linking it since what the article reports sounds absurd.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: rlse9 on July 06, 2015, 11:01:09 AM
There's no way it's the New Wii U.  It just can't be.  They couldn't possibly tease something that far in advance and be so secretive about it for it to be the New Wii U.  Then again, it's Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 06, 2015, 11:17:40 AM
Wii was only a " Super GameCube Plus ex Alpha" at the end of the day.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Evan_B on July 06, 2015, 01:38:09 PM
There is no way in hell the NX is an upgraded Wii U.

That would be the worst possible choice for Nintendo moving forward... Ever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 06, 2015, 01:45:42 PM
That would be the worst possible choice for Nintendo moving forward... Ever.


I am more convinced than ever the NX is an upgraded Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 06, 2015, 02:04:31 PM
Sadly I am at the point where I'm assuming the NX will be the exact opposite of what it needs to be.  That's pretty much where my faith in Nintendo in general is at.  "New" Wii U?  That's idiotic and would probably destroy Nintendo's console presence for good so, yes, they are totally doing that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 06, 2015, 02:47:37 PM
Like I just said in the other tread, anyone expecting Nintendo to go all out in power for their next system is going to be very disspointed.  Nintendo is not going to jump through hoops to please the remaining third parties that haven't bankrupt themselves yet because of insanely high development cost that just keep rising.  Any new Nintendo home console will have to rely entirely on Nintendo's own lineup, which they gain nothing from suddenly jumping to more powerful PS4 level tech.  After all the time and money Nintendo spent to get their Wii U engines finally running, no way they're going to suddenly just jump to PS4 level.  Even Sony's studio's who had a lot more experience with this level of tech, are having trouble with the PS4 which is why Sony's first party lineup has been incredibly weak since launch.

Just like those Gamecube engine for the Wii, Nintendo is going to get the most out of everything they just did for the Wii U to ensure their next home console can get the strongest 1st year lineup as possible.  The only way that can happen is if they're able to reuse their Wii U assests the same way the Wii was able to reuse the Gamecubes which is why the Wii had the strongest 1st year lineup in Nintendo history.

This way, Nintendo can also release their next home console at a healthy profit so even if they get Wii U levels sales, it won't cost them much.  This is once again, the real reason the Wii was as underpowered as it was because after the Gamecube, Nintendo wasn't willing to take a huge financial risk.  Yes the Wiimote itself was a risk because of how different it was, but had the Wii been a failure, it's wouldn't have bankrupt the company which a 360/PS3 level device would have had it been a failure.  Sony lost over 5 billion off the PS3 and that system eventually ended up selling over 80 million units.  Had the Wii sold less then the Gamecube with PS3 level tech, Nintendo would be a Japan only Pichinko making company right now.

Anyone who thinks Nintendo will ever be willing to take a 5 billion loss on a product let alone anywhere close to 1 billion is just delusional.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 06, 2015, 03:02:48 PM
The Wii U with 4GB of RAM and 25% more in both cpu and gpu would be more than capable of competing in the new "Hybrid Market" I haven't done the hard math but I'm  sure with these specs (and no 2x screen rendering) the NX would be able to do DX11 (can almost do it now), Unity 5, Unreal 4 and CryEngine (4) with no compromises.


From a pricing structure I'm also fairly sure you can pull this off in a tablet for $200 US. Add the HDMI Dongle and Dock for another $30 more and boom, another classic Nintendo Winner!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 06, 2015, 03:08:51 PM
Like I just said in the other tread, anyone expecting Nintendo to go all out in power for their next system is going to be very disspointed.  Nintendo is not going to jump through hoops to please the remaining third parties that haven't bankrupt themselves yet because of insanely high development cost that just keep rising.  Any new Nintendo home console will have to rely entirely on Nintendo's own lineup, which they gain nothing from suddenly jumping to more powerful PS4 level tech.  After all the time and money Nintendo spent to get their Wii U engines finally running, no way they're going to suddenly just jump to PS4 level.  Even Sony's studio's who had a lot more experience with this level of tech, are having trouble with the PS4 which is why Sony's first party lineup has been incredibly weak since launch.

Don't think of it as jumping through hoops for third parties but rather for consumers.  People expect third party support.  The only people that will tolerate a console with nothing but Nintendo games are the same die-hard Nintendo nuts that bought the Wii U.  And if Nintendo is only going to target that group why they hell even release the NX?  Why not just stick with the Wii U?  What does anyone gain from Nintendo doing some ticky-tacky minor update that ensures that the only people that will buy it are the existing Wii U userbase?  And what purpose does this serve for the Wii U userbase?  Isn't it just buying a new console for arbitrary reasons?

Any sort of "New" Wii U has no purpose to exist.  It will not sell to anyone that isn't already on board and will not offer anything distinct enough from the Wii U to even offer any real value to that userbase.  So they don't grow the userbase and risk pissing off the small userbase they do have by forcing them to upgrade to a new console that offers no real upgrade?  What the ****?  I don't understand the hypothetical strategy behind such a move.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: UncleBob on July 06, 2015, 06:05:39 PM
I, too, want to get overly emotional on the internet over unsubstantiated rumors printed by random people on the internet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: broodwars on July 06, 2015, 06:33:55 PM
I don't really see the value of a "New" Wii U when so far less than 10 million people even bought the 1st Wii U, and I doubt even all of those 10 million would be willing to sign on for more of the same. Assuming that the NX is a console (and with Nintendo's handheld obsession that's certainly not guaranteed), it needs to be at bare minimum as capable as the Xbone to even be a player in the console space. Handhelds are a different story, though. They could probably get away with Vita-quality visuals on a new handheld, at least for a little while.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 06, 2015, 07:06:38 PM
There was that Digitimes article that reported that the NX is coming out July 2016 along with some other dates and names of parts providers (think Foxconn). Not linking it since what the article reports sounds absurd.
This doesn't gel with a recent statement from Nintendo that it does 60% of its business from October to December. Nice try, rumor mill.

Nintendo shouldn't be in a rush to replace Wii U. It can't afford to whiff on a successor. That doesn't mean Nintendo shouldn't have a sense of urgency. Rather, make sure it's ready and no sooner.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: broodwars on July 06, 2015, 07:20:21 PM
Nintendo shouldn't be in a rush to replace Wii U. It can't afford to whiff on a successor. That doesn't mean Nintendo shouldn't have a sense of urgency. Rather, make sure it's ready and no sooner.

I don't really see that Nintendo has much of a choice, given how poorly Wii U has sold, alongside a gradually slumping 3DS. If Nintendo had any real intention of supporting the Wii U anymore, I think we would have seen it at E3 or at any of the other Directs Nintendo's posted this year. Instead, we're seeing a bunch of games Nintendo announced years ago finally coming out, followed by Shovelware like Mario Tennis & Animal Crossing: Amiibo Festival. It's not an encouraging sign that the Wii U has any life left in it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 06, 2015, 07:29:40 PM
I don't really see that Nintendo has much of a choice, given how poorly Wii U has sold, alongside a gradually slumping 3DS.
You're right considering the choices here essentially are:

1. Release the new console when it's ready and have a chance at success.

2. Rush out a broken mess and be stuck with two consecutive duds.

That's not much of a choice if Nintendo hopes to ever be competitive again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 06, 2015, 07:53:58 PM
I don't really see that Nintendo has much of a choice, given how poorly Wii U has sold, alongside a gradually slumping 3DS.
You're right considering the choices here essentially are:

1. Release the new console when it's ready and have a chance at success.

2. Rush out a broken mess and be stuck with two consecutive duds.

That's not much of a choice if Nintendo hopes to ever be competitive again.

They can't wait too long though.  The Wii U's poor reputation will further damage Nintendo's brand as a console maker the longer it is out.  Each year Nintendo is more and more of an afterthought and that will just make it harder to sell the NX.  I'm of the idea that the quicker the Wii U is swept under the rug the better.  Nintendo needs to be ready and not rush the NX but if they knew what they were doing they have started their Wii U exit strategy a while ago.  They'll only be rushing it if they took too long to admit the problem (so in other words they're probably rushing it).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 06, 2015, 08:28:16 PM
There would be no reason to go up to 4GB RAM with 25% more CPU and GPU power. Those will be the specs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ThePerm on July 06, 2015, 08:37:52 PM
The way hardware manufacturing works: Nintendo can probably make something more powerful than the ps4 at a lower price around x-mas next year. *though xmas 2017 sounds more likely in my book(i dont think Nintendo will have its act together by xmas 2016.)

Nintendo should really just make nx be three things. Powerful as ps4(or better), be able to use 4 controller screens, have multi touch screens.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ceric on July 06, 2015, 08:56:58 PM
I, too, want to get overly emotional on the internet over unsubstantiated rumors printed by random people on the internet.
This is why we can't have Nice things or UncleBob on NFR. (Open Invite)

At this point look a the  PC gaming space.  There has been machines that would ran circles around the PS4 for the Die Hard years before the PS4 came out in raw power.  The tech has been shrinking and getting better.

The Wii U is limping along.  I'm actually more concerned for the 3DS myself.  Even the New 3DS with New 3DS games.  That system is really not aging well at all.  Wii U still has more untapped power.  I'm sure of it.  The 3DS is totally tapped out.

If they are going to combine the Sku's that will be the main reason.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 06, 2015, 09:03:58 PM
There would be no reason to go up to 4GB RAM with 25% more CPU and GPU power. Those will be the specs.




I'm not sure I follow.


 I'm saying the NX should essentially be an Overclocked Wii U if Nintendo wants to come in at aggressive price point as recent comments suggest (also be a handheld). And those humble estimations I came with should place the NX firmly in the range of using the current farm of scalable graphics engines.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Shaymin on July 06, 2015, 09:09:21 PM
To answer the three questions in the thread title: No, ideally $170 with a full game, and ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 06, 2015, 09:58:17 PM
It has a 32-bit processor. Yes, 32-bit processors can use 4GB RAM (just not Windows), but it would be almost pointless. The next console needs to use modern technology, not an overclocked GameCube CPU and GPU. It needs to be built from the ground up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Evan_B on July 06, 2015, 11:17:05 PM
I wasn't considering the hardware architecture, but yeah, I can see the NX having some semblance of the Wii U's hardware in it.

All the more exciting, since it's going to be one of those "third pillar" handhelds they claim won't interfere with the sales of their first two pillars, but will sell pretty well so they'll drop it entirely. Making a doom prediction here.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 07, 2015, 12:19:59 AM
It has a 32-bit processor. Yes, 32-bit processors can use 4GB RAM (just not Windows), but it would be almost pointless. The next console needs to use modern technology, not an overclocked GameCube CPU and GPU. It needs to be built from the ground up.


True, however i always thought the Wii u was closer to a G5 which is scalable to 64bit and by extension, 8gb of ram. but even that would be overkill without faster cpu/gpu. Still the point I'm trying to make is that I don't for a sec believe Nintendo is building this thing from the ground up. The approach vector seems focused on price, mobility and the fruition of the thought process that started with the Wii U platform and architecture.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 07, 2015, 07:54:44 AM
They can't wait too long though.  The Wii U's poor reputation will further damage Nintendo's brand as a console maker the longer it is out.  Each year Nintendo is more and more of an afterthought and that will just make it harder to sell the NX.  I'm of the idea that the quicker the Wii U is swept under the rug the better.  Nintendo needs to be ready and not rush the NX but if they knew what they were doing they have started their Wii U exit strategy a while ago.  They'll only be rushing it if they took too long to admit the problem (so in other words they're probably rushing it).
What constitutes as too long?

A July 2016 launch is about three and a half years after Wii U launched, and this would be during a time Nintendo admitted it does less business. Three and a half years isn't without precedent. Nintendo launched DS roughly three and a half years after GBA, third pillar be damned. Four years is better though. Microsoft launched 360 four years after the original Xbox so I think Nintendo can get away with that as well granted its ready to launch a successor.

Sweeping Wii U under the rug as fast as possible is the worst thing Nintendo could do. In fact, that's the opposite of what Nintendo has done so far since it's still supporting the console. It towed the line and kept releasing quality software which is the best case scenario for an underperforming product. Nintendo shouldn't alienate existing users. Without openly admitting it, Nintendo has admitted it has lost. That's fine because there's no way to reverse it. Forge ahead on a successor while trying to build momentum with the current product for a smoother transition.

I think Nintendo is launching NX in November 2016. If Nintendo insists on remaining silent until next year, a November launch makes more sense than a July launch. Nintendo can start discussing details around March, have a full reveal at E3 in June, then ride that momentum until launch with a few Nintendo Directs. That gives Nintendo almost a full year to get the message out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: UncleBob on July 07, 2015, 10:09:06 AM
I, too, want to get overly emotional on the internet over unsubstantiated rumors printed by random people on the internet.
This is why we can't have Nice things or UncleBob on NFR. (Open Invite)

Dude, I have the face for radio and the voice for newsprint.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 07, 2015, 10:45:03 AM
I, too, want to get overly emotional on the internet over unsubstantiated rumors printed by random people on the internet.
This is why we can't have Nice things or UncleBob on NFR. (Open Invite)

Dude, I have the face for radio and the voice for newsprint.

But the nipple for the Internet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: alegoicoe on July 07, 2015, 12:12:02 PM
A mid-tier Steam machine with the ability to play Nintendo games made by Nintendo would be a great idea for NX ::) ::) ::)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 07, 2015, 02:28:54 PM

I think Nintendo is launching NX in November 2016. If Nintendo insists on remaining silent until next year, a November launch makes more sense than a July launch. Nintendo can start discussing details around March, have a full reveal at E3 in June, then ride that momentum until launch with a few Nintendo Directs. That gives Nintendo almost a full year to get the message out.

I am more and more thinking that they're targeting November 2016, but I also think they might not have their **** together in time and have to end up delaying. A full year further might be out of the question, though, given that we've probably seen just about the last of WiiU's lineup announced already. They could get away with a dead back half of 2016 for the Wii U if the new console was rolling out in November, but they'd really be on the skids if there was over a full year of nothing leading up to a Fall 2017 launch. This also brings up questions about Zelda timing . . .
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 07, 2015, 03:27:38 PM
Reveal in January: No price or Name


Blowout in April: Price, Name and Launch Window


E3 2016: EVERYTHING


"Zelda Wii U March 2016"



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Shaymin on July 07, 2015, 07:56:39 PM
Your timeline's off by a couple of months. More realistically, it's Nikkei leak in March, blowout at E3, new handheld November 2016.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on July 07, 2015, 10:37:09 PM
If the NX is releasing in the 2016.  That means we will not be getting a Zelda for Wii U unless it is duel released on the Wii U and NX.  For Nintendo to release in 2016, means that all development for games that were going to be released on the Wii U by Nintendo's in house development teams (First Party) need to be focused on converting those games for the NX to have a good launch line up.  That means perhaps Retro really is working on a launch NX game. 

However, I still believe 2017 will be the release year of the Nintendo NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Evan_B on July 07, 2015, 11:27:00 PM
I Nintendo is unwise, which I fully believe, they will show the NX for two years at E3. Their current plan of "satisfying Wii U owners" makes me think they aren't dropping it before the end of 2016. I also find it strange that people are still convinced this is gong to be a home console and not a handheld- the 3DS has pretty much maxed out its longevity and the amount of "game" people can put on it. It's time to lay that to rest. Nintendo can have a mediocre home console like Wii U continue to make money (the fact that they haven't price dropped it yet shows that they don't feel too desperate for sales) while they release a new, big handheld. Maybe it's a handheld with Wii U architecture. But I am not certain the NX is a home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 08, 2015, 12:25:02 AM
I Nintendo is unwise, which I fully believe, they will show the NX for two years at E3. Their current plan of "satisfying Wii U owners" makes me think they aren't dropping it before the end of 2016. I also find it strange that people are still convinced this is gong to be a home console and not a handheld- the 3DS has pretty much maxed out its longevity and the amount of "game" people can put on it. It's time to lay that to rest. Nintendo can have a mediocre home console like Wii U continue to make money (the fact that they haven't price dropped it yet shows that they don't feel too desperate for sales) while they release a new, big handheld. Maybe it's a handheld with Wii U architecture. But I am not certain the NX is a home console.

I would have thought it would be the new handheld, but even though the 3DS is whiffing compared to the DS, it's still doing a hell of a lot better than the WiiU. It could survive for longer on a drip of low-budget projects (hello Paper Jam) in a more profitable fashion than could the WiiU, whose low-budget projects would still be significantly more expensive than 3DS projects for a much lower userbase. I think the only wild card is if the whole NX project is fairly out of left field and doesn't fit into the current scheme of things, which some of the rumors tend toward. The rumblings (allegedly trickling down from early sharing with 3rd parties) are pointing toward a device that is not radically more powerful than a WiiU. I would agree with people here that replicating the Gamecube to Wii hardware pivot would be a real disaster for a standard home console, barring some black swan event like the Wiimote, and now that the Wiimote has happened and VR isn't on the table, it's hard to imagine what that could possibly be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 08, 2015, 12:52:42 AM
I would have thought it would be the new handheld, but even though the 3DS is whiffing compared to the DS, it's still doing a hell of a lot better than the WiiU. It could survive for longer on a drip of low-budget projects (hello Paper Jam) in a more profitable fashion than could the WiiU, whose low-budget projects would still be significantly more expensive than 3DS projects for a much lower userbase. I think the only wild card is if the whole NX project is fairly out of left field and doesn't fit into the current scheme of things, which some of the rumors tend toward. The rumblings (allegedly trickling down from early sharing with 3rd parties) are pointing toward a device that is not radically more powerful than a WiiU. I would agree with people here that replicating the Gamecube to Wii hardware pivot would be a real disaster for a standard home console, barring some black swan event like the Wiimote, and now that the Wiimote has happened and VR isn't on the table, it's hard to imagine what that could possibly be.

The thing is the 3DS has been out longer and already hit it's ceiling and has been dropping the last few years now, especially in Japan.  The New 3DS which people were saying was going to prolong the lifespan hasn't done **** for the system outside of the launch month, which makes a successor more important then ever now.  With smartphones gaining steam and eating away much of the handheld market, getting a new handheld out first is more important then a home console since handhelds have been their most successful market for the last 20 years now.  Even when the Wii was in it's prime as an insane global mass media icon, the DS was still the better selling system. 

See this is the thing, if Nintendo released a new home console first, especially if it's PS4 level like many of you want, that would eat away at resources for the next handheld.  Suddenly, major titles that should have been available around launch might be delayed because the studio's home console project ended up taking more time and employees then expected.  If the system has a terrible post launch period like the DS and 3DS both had, Nintendo might not be able to get the big guns they need to release like they managed too on time with the previous handhelds to turn them around because the next home console project took longer then expected.

This is why I still believe the NX will be a handheld since I doubt Nintendo will risk any thing that could jeopardize making sure it's a success its first year, especially with how popular smart phones keep becoming.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 08, 2015, 11:18:42 AM
GBA 2001
GBA 2001

Gamecube 2001

DS 2004


Wii 2006

3DS 2011


Wii U 2012


NX 2016 :confused; ?




History tells us that this will be a handheld with possible console functionality.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 08, 2015, 12:42:09 PM
Nintendo can't stick with the Wii U for much longer so I just assumed the NX was its successor unless it is a hybrid (which is the only way barely updated specs would fly).  Perhaps Nintendo can putter along and make a profit on the Wii U but that's just going to chip away at their mindshare in the console market.  Next time they do release a console they shouldn't want people to think that it will be another Wii U.  You think every Wii U owner is satisfied with the console's problems?  They may own one and buy games for it but still not be content with it and thus may be turned off of buying Nintendo's next console for fear of the same thing.  You think the Gamecube's weak sales was entirely because of the Cube itself or was it partially that a lot of N64 owners, who bought it expecting another SNES, were turned off by the console's problems and were quick to write off the Cube for fear of another N64?

The third party support is just going to get worse.  We're almost at the point now where Nintendo is the only publisher.  So if the Wii U sticks around and gets to the point where there are literally like six games a year how do you think the existing Wii U userbase is going to feel about continuing with Nintendo next time around?  And how strong of a mindshare will Nintendo have as a console maker with non-Wii U owners who they logically will be trying to win over?  The game releases will become less frequent so there will be a lesser Nintendo presence at stores, less games getting coverage on web sites, less ads in public places.  Nintendo as a console maker will be out-of-sight and out-of-mind.  They NEED to replace the Wii U or they're just going to fade away further into irrelevance.

Best case scenario: the Wii U is seen as an anomaly and not a typical Nintendo product.  Why do you think they killed off the Virtual Boy so quick?  They didn't want the Nintendo brand to be associated with subpar products.  The longer the Wii U is on the market the more Nintendo will be associated with that kind of unsuccessful product.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: nickmitch on July 08, 2015, 01:00:22 PM
Nintendo has so little mindshare as a console maker currently, it's an uphill battle either way.

A new home console launch could be the best thing for them especially if current PS4 and XB1 owners are looking for a second console.  Both systems have strong lineups, but a lot of those releases are far off or lackluster enough that a new system with Nintendo's marquee (or at least underserved) franchises at launch could be seen as a hold over.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Evan_B on July 08, 2015, 02:01:47 PM
Blah blah blah Wii U owners hate the Wii U.

Best case scenario: the Wii U is seen as an anomaly and not a typical Nintendo product.  Why do you think they killed off the Virtual Boy so quick?  They didn't want the Nintendo brand to be associated with subpar products.  The longer the Wii U is on the market the more Nintendo will be associated with that kind of unsuccessful product.
Nintendo is going to try to make a bid for the worldwide market with their next console, and the market that is most likely going to buy is the handheld market. I the Wii U is such a **** show like you say, why would they attempt an other console so soon, with so little time to dwell on what a console actually needs?

Then again, you're commenting on modern day Nintendo, which makes no fucking sense anyway, but despite that, you're presenting a wildly ignorant mindset, even for Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 08, 2015, 02:19:52 PM
The third party support is just going to get worse.  We're almost at the point now where Nintendo is the only publisher.  So if the Wii U sticks around and gets to the point where there are literally like six games a year how do you think the existing Wii U userbase is going to feel about continuing with Nintendo next time around?  And how strong of a mindshare will Nintendo have as a console maker with non-Wii U owners who they logically will be trying to win over?  The game releases will become less frequent so there will be a lesser Nintendo presence at stores, less games getting coverage on web sites, less ads in public places.  Nintendo as a console maker will be out-of-sight and out-of-mind.  They NEED to replace the Wii U or they're just going to fade away further into irrelevance.

Best case scenario: the Wii U is seen as an anomaly and not a typical Nintendo product.  Why do you think they killed off the Virtual Boy so quick?  They didn't want the Nintendo brand to be associated with subpar products.  The longer the Wii U is on the market the more Nintendo will be associated with that kind of unsuccessful product.

You make it sound like the rest of the industry is doing much better when the reality is far from it.  We have less retail third party games then ever before because of how high development cost have become.  Most studio's are just one game under-performing from being shut down, and under-performing means only selling 3 million copies because you needed to sell 5 million just to break even.  For fucks sake, before last gen, most major videogame series would be considered a huge success at 3 million, and many long running series got dozens of installments with sales that never even reached half of that.

Plus there's a good chance Microsoft will sell the Xbox division after this gen considering the One has been a complete disaster for them that's basically lost all money they made off the 360 and reduced their market shares back to original Xbox levels.  Yes Microsoft has the money to take losses, but considering shareholders in that company haven't been happy with all the money and resources they've spent on that division, you think they're going to be happy selling less then half of what the 360 after all the money they spent?

Yeah Sony is the only one doing good in the console market right now but the rest of the company is still in terrible shape.  What happens if Kaz gets fired because he's unable to turn about the rest of the company and the new President doesn't feel the same way about the games division that Kaz did and decides too makes some changes that don't go over very well.

Point is, Nintendo doesn't need to really rush a new home console out the door since the danger of being irrelevant doesn't mean anything when the rest of the industry is in real danger of collapsing.  Nintendo's long term strategy is about just surviving, which they've done for over 100 years now and right now they're the only major company in the videogame industry that has the best chance of still being a part of that industry 10 years from now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 08, 2015, 02:49:22 PM
I think the idea that the 3DS is in need of replacing comes from a Nintendo mentality that selling hardware is where the money is.  So what if the 3DS isn't selling systems like it used to?  Does it not have a decent sized userbase and are they not buying games?  What are the games sales for the 3DS?  If they're healthy then what's the problem?  Also the 3DS's competition is the Vita.  Where is a 3DS owner going to jump ship to?  The Vita is finished and if you own a 3DS you certainly aren't going to think that phones are a valid alternative.  You wouldn't have bought a 3DS if you felt phone games were good enough.  Odds are you already have a smart phone anyway.

But the Wii U faces stiff competition and has no chance to get out of last place.  To me that's a problem.  The Wii U is a problem so you fix it.  The 3DS isn't really a problem so it takes a back seat.  There is always the threat of Wii U owners switching consoles as the generation goes on.

I also think the handheld market is the much more vulnerable one.  For longterm success in the videogame hardware field I feel consoles are the market with more security.  Casual gamers are gone because there are enough consumer electronics now that people own anyway that are capable of playing games so only the enthusiast will buy a dedicated videogame system.  Handhelds were always more of a casual experience - you put up with a shrunken down experience to experience gaming on the go.  Much of the appeal was to have a fun distraction on the go.  Phones now provide that fun distraction.  That leaves the more dedicated gamer as the remaining target audience but dedicated gamers are more likely to go for the higher end experience which is the console.  So that's the safer longterm market.  I get why Nintendo would prioritize the handheld market because that's what they've had more success in but it's much more vulnerable.

Now the hybrid idea targets both markets so I'm pretty cool with that idea but for Nintendo to replace the 3DS while letting the Wii U continue to putter around makes no sense to me at all.  Besides the writing is on the wall for the NX to be a Wii U successor.  A Nintendo exec said that at this point it makes more sense to make a new Metroid Prime on the NX instead of the Wii U, Zelda mysteriously disappeared from E3 and the Wii U showing at E3 showed nothing beyond the present year (Nintendo's usual policy according to Reggie, despite them doing the exact opposite the year before).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ThePerm on July 08, 2015, 03:40:28 PM
well Whenever this Nintendo X box comes out I hope it has Halo. :D

What if Nintendo had already bought percentages of the Xbox division over time, and wont finalize the transaction till e3 2016? There have been rumors for a while, The chairman of microsoft has said on multiple occasions publicly that he wants to sell the division, Nintendo needs a stronger American division, why hasn't microsoft publicly announced they have sold it to some other company that wants it? Isn't it conveniently located(if you recall noa was originally across the street from MS campus?

http://www.gamespot.com/articles/xbox-boss-thinks-banjo-as-a-super-smash-bros-dlc-c/1100-6426396/

http://attackofthefanboy.com/news/microsoft-will-spin-off-sell-xbox-division-2015-says-analyst/

http://www.cheatsheet.com/technology/will-microsoft-sell-its-xbox-division.html/?a=viewall

Also, Rare.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 08, 2015, 03:54:22 PM
I'd imagine the amount of money Microsoft would want for Xbox would be way too much then Nintendo would be willing to pay.  Of course I wouldn't be surprised if they tried to make a play for certain things related to Rare during said sale.  We know there's copyright issue's involving the Donkey Kong County games (that's why they got pulled suddenly off the Wii's Virtual Consoles after a few years) and DK64 so I'd expect Nintendo to ensure they own all they need so they can re-release everything Donkey Kong Country related whenever they want again.

Plus Iwata has said he wishes Nintendo would have tried to keep the Banjo/Kazooie series so I wouldn't be surprised if Iwata tried to see if he could get that as well.  Since Rare games were a major part of the N64's library, getting the rights to as many Rare games as possible would make sense for Nintendo since it was vastly improve the N64's Virtual Console lineup for all future Nintendo systems.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ThePerm on July 08, 2015, 04:05:17 PM
What if Microsoft still wants to have some chunk in the company? What if they don't sell it enterely, what if they want to keep 50% ? Microsoft could see it as a way to make money off Nintendo that would work for both the companies in a mutually beneficial way. The xbox division is not a separate entitiy at the moment, so technically it doesn't have a real valuation. Once xbox money is made it goes to the rest of microsoft. As low ball as it sounds 6 billion for half of the company sounds like a good valuation.

Then all Nintendo has to do is make the wii u controller compatable with the xbox, and move its games to xbox one, its like if they went third party without going third party. It would also make Sony look really bad, which im sure Nintendo would love.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 08, 2015, 04:56:47 PM
I seriously doubt Nintendo would by the Xbox division anyway.  It doesn't seem like their style.  But wouldn't that be kind of futile?  Nintendo's problems stem from their own questionable decisions.  Any value in the Xbox brand comes from the people involved.  Take out the MS people that have some idea of what they're doing (thought they're not that great; mandatory Kinect blew up in their face) and replace them with Nintendo and I guess you get a more current console for the rest of the generation but it's all still being run by Nintendo.  Something like their sudden hatred of voicechat doesn't go away.  The Xbox third party policies would probably get all Nintendo-ized and start to turn third parties off.

The best thing it offers is for Nintendo to jump in partway through a generation with a product that is sort of successful and is at least a lot more contemporary than the Wii U.  It has a pre-existing userbase and lineup of games and online infrastructure.  There is no risk in a new console flopping since there is already a foothold.  That brings Nintendo more or less up to speed which would be good.  But then how does Nintendo not fudge the follow-up?  They need to learn what they're doing wrong.

Now if you had some company that had the best traits of both Nintendo and Microsoft's games division, you would get a pretty damn good company.  But that isn't what Nintendo gets unless they're so smart enough as to take everyone in and be willing to keep MS people over Nintendo people if the MS person is more valuable.  We all know they would probably lay most of the MS people off and institute a Nintendo way of doing things at all levels.

It's a good way to make up ground overnight but only if you know what you did wrong in the first place and what to do in the future.  Without that it's a lot like MS buying Rare where they quickly realized that Nintendo's involvement was a big part of the Rare magic and without it they just had a company name and some IP.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: nickmitch on July 08, 2015, 07:26:18 PM
There are enough ways to get around MS's potential asking price for the Xbox division; Nintendo has some pretty valuable stock to offer.  But their EBITDA is positive for the first time in YEARS, and I'm not sure if they want to risk a hit to their credit rating with such a sizeable bond they would also have to put up.

But Nintendo would really want to change their corporate structure to make buying the Xbox division worthwhile.  Their voice chat policy and general attitude towards online play would have to change.  Also, Iwata would need to give up a lot of power.  You'd basically need his equivalent running the Nintendo Xbox Branch (which I guess would be NOA?) and letting that person make the decisions about what games get made.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 08, 2015, 07:37:47 PM
In this hypothetical Nintendo Xbox situation how do things roll in Japan?  The Xbox One has pretty much no presence there.  It seems that a big part of it is that Japanese consumers don't want to buy a non-Japanese console.  So if Nintendo bought it is it now Japanese or is it still seen as American?

And this also should be reason number one why Nintendo wouldn't do this.  The Wii U is kicking the Xbox One's ass in Japan.  So in Nintendo's mind the Xbox One is an inferior and less successful product.  MS could sell 10 billion XB1's worldwide but if it didn't outsell the Wii U in Japan Nintendo would thumb their nose at it.  The only way I see it happening is if they make a conscious effort to differentiate the market where they focus the handheld on Japan and the console on the West.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 08, 2015, 08:27:14 PM
Guys, Nintendo's not buying Xbox. Unless Nintendo wants to add a third pillar to hemorrhage money from.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ceric on July 08, 2015, 09:30:03 PM
I think the time is ripe for a true Handheld.  Look at the Vita.  It's pretty darn close to a portable console.  Think about the time the Vita was released.  Screen tech.  Portable chip tech.  Touch Screen Tech.  Wireless Tech.  All of it has jumped leaps and bound.  This is the time to release a true Console in your Hands experience.  With no compromises.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 08, 2015, 09:37:06 PM
This is the time to release a true Console in your Hands experience.  With no compromises.

Except development costs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: broodwars on July 08, 2015, 09:46:51 PM
I honestly wonder if a "console in your hands" can be financially successful. Sony's tried it twice with the PSP & Vita, both excellent handhelds that never quite found an audience despite having excellent libraries. The Japanese handheld companies are dropping like flies as they collectively flee TO the sinking ship that is mobile, and meanwhile the Western developers don't develop for handhelds at all. The only way it could draw 3rd party support was if it had the technical prowess to compete with the current generation consoles, if not better, but that would require an absurdly strong battery that Nintendo has proven to be not the least bit capable for making (especially with the 3DS).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 08, 2015, 10:21:12 PM
These arguments are precisely why a Hybrid Console makes the most sense. You cut development cost by as much as 35-40%. You can foster both markets with ONE device that has accessibility and accessories.


Example point:


The Microsoft Surface Tablet.




10 hour battery, Touch screen, usb in for 360 controller support, HDMI out to TV.


I have played Halo on the subway coming home from work, walked in the house and plugged in the HDMI and played on the big screen and played it seamlessly.  Its very easy and the process hasn't been refined yet. Simple improvements for a dedicated gaming device and you have a true trojan horse of gaming (sorta).


Nintendo must take this route if there is any hope of a true home console with ps4 or greater level specs (I for one don't need that but it would be foolish to deny its appeal)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ThePerm on July 09, 2015, 12:02:59 AM
In this hypothetical Nintendo Xbox situation how do things roll in Japan?  The Xbox One has pretty much no presence there.  It seems that a big part of it is that Japanese consumers don't want to buy a non-Japanese console.  So if Nintendo bought it is it now Japanese or is it still seen as American?

And this also should be reason number one why Nintendo wouldn't do this.  The Wii U is kicking the Xbox One's ass in Japan.  So in Nintendo's mind the Xbox One is an inferior and less successful product.  MS could sell 10 billion XB1's worldwide but if it didn't outsell the Wii U in Japan Nintendo would thumb their nose at it.  The only way I see it happening is if they make a conscious effort to differentiate the market where they focus the handheld on Japan and the console on the West.

Wouldn't the Just brand xbox as Nintendo NX in Japan? And why buy the whole company? It would make more sense to create partnership than a full acquisition.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on July 09, 2015, 03:23:48 AM
Nintendo has to be looking at costs to develop HD games, and wonder if it is worth it.  After all, they have to supply content for 2 different devices reaching 2 different markets and needs.  However, as development costs increase for both devices, the writing is on the wall, that Nintendo can't keep the same level of output as years before.  Nobody really wants to jump to the next level which some feel might have to be 4K to get a big splash from players...but Nintendo has been the most reluctant, and who can blame them honestly...they are a toy company that just happens to make video games as their toy of choice. 

So, Nintendo really needs to refresh 2 products soon, and they need to do so in such away they can begin to share resources with both systems.  There are really only a few options for this:

1) A scalable Operating System.  Making a great OS that is scalable for both systems would do wonders to help develop games cheaper for both systems.  Specially if the OS has built in functions like voice chat, video chat or whatnot...

2) Hybrid System:  This hybrid system can take many forms, but the important aspect of the system is that there is only console games are released for...the hybrid system, and you can play everything from that single game. 

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Enner on July 09, 2015, 04:55:35 AM
Gathering from the investor Q and A, it is highly likely that Nintendo is going with a scalable operating system, application programming interface, etc. that can be applied over different but similar architecture. Iwata has compared their technology goals to how iOS and Android is applied over different hardware forms yet can have software be portable due to shared foundations. Compared to Nintendo's current systems, there is little shared between the 3DS (ARM based) and Wii U (PowerPC based).

I'm still holding on to the NX and Nintendo's next handheld console being separate things you can buy. One, because Nintendo will try to sell us two pieces of hardware rather than one. Two, because there are different fidelity and energy expectations and realities for home and handheld consoles. Adding to that, I will be surprised if there is any sort of cross-buy or discount between home and handheld software. I'd sooner expect Nintendo making it significantly cheaper to port code and assets and keeping the savings for themselves before making games cheaper for their audience.

Of course, maybe the cost of goods, R&D, and whatever is not what I think it is and it makes more sense for the NX to be one hybrid console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 09, 2015, 05:24:49 AM
I think Nintendo is getting to the point where it's realizing that it can't support two separate platforms even if there's merit in having both a console and a handheld for different kinds of consumers. I touched upon how this could work in a thread I started. I didn't post it here as it's fairly lengthy and I didn't want to disrupt the flow of this discussion.

While it would be a completely typical and short-sighted Nintendo move to keep all those savings to itself, Nintendo has already experimented with cross-buy with Mario and Donkey Kong: Tipping Stars so I think that's the direction the company is going. This does benefit Nintendo more than anything. It gets to consolidate its resources and sell to the widest audience available. Keeping console and handheld separate stands to hurt Nintendo more than help even with shared resources so I hope it doesn't get too greedy.

I believe there's enough evidence to put a pin in the hybrid idea. I was never fond of the idea and I'm glad Nintendo seems to feel the same way. Consoles and handheld excel a different things so I'd prefer each be built to its individual strengths. Even though I prefer consoles, if Nintendo released a console capable of playing handheld games out of the box, I'd probably buy the handheld too because despite being cheap, I like new hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on July 09, 2015, 06:17:22 AM
Could Nintendo sell a scalable home console and portable.  Then take an idea from PC gaming and have scalable gaming assets and effects.  Then gamers can buy the game foe either the portable or console.  Think of it like Smash Bros this generation, then if you buy both you can get a 50% discount on the second purchase.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 09, 2015, 06:47:56 AM
That's what I'm suggesting except Nintendo sells one game that can be played on both console and handheld. This wouldn't be a scenario like Super Smash Bros. for Wii U and 3DS. It would be literally the same game that scales to the platform you play it on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: nickmitch on July 09, 2015, 09:08:05 AM
In this hypothetical Nintendo Xbox situation how do things roll in Japan?  The Xbox One has pretty much no presence there.  It seems that a big part of it is that Japanese consumers don't want to buy a non-Japanese console.  So if Nintendo bought it is it now Japanese or is it still seen as American?

And this also should be reason number one why Nintendo wouldn't do this.  The Wii U is kicking the Xbox One's ass in Japan.  So in Nintendo's mind the Xbox One is an inferior and less successful product.  MS could sell 10 billion XB1's worldwide but if it didn't outsell the Wii U in Japan Nintendo would thumb their nose at it.  The only way I see it happening is if they make a conscious effort to differentiate the market where they focus the handheld on Japan and the console on the West.

Wouldn't the Just brand xbox as Nintendo NX in Japan? And why buy the whole company? It would make more sense to create partnership than a full acquisition.

I don't think Nintendo would want to partner on a new console.  They wouldn't want to give up that much creative control.  They would have to buy out at least 51% of the division or license out the relevant technologies.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 09, 2015, 01:00:16 PM
I fear if they make things scalable it just means that all console games are compromised so that they can be done on the handheld.  It isn't just graphics.  Something like the size of an open area can be dictated by the hardware.  Sure you can have the models look nicer on the console but you can't change the layout of a level.  If you're going to make an open area it will be as big as you can do on the lowest hardware.  Unless in this situation Nintendo lets someone make something JUST for the console that makes full use of the hardware.

And if they don't then the third party issues where certain games just cannot be done still comes into play.  Maybe the NX console is capable of handling Game X but the NX handheld is not.  If Nintendo insists that the game plays on both models then we just don't get it.

You can debate whether Nintendo feels it is worth it to bother with HD but it doesn't matter.  The genie is out of the bottle and the market expects it.  Consumers don't give a **** if it's too expensive.  They see all these high budget HD games on the shelf so that's the standard.  Complaining about it is like complaining that games went from one screen to scrolling or 2D to 3D.  Someone raised the bar and set new expectations and you meet them or your product looks out-of-date and doesn't sell.  It may not seem fair and it has put some companies out of business but it's reality.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on July 09, 2015, 01:25:06 PM
Why does it have to be both a handheld and a console? Why not just strictly a handheld that you can also happen to play on a TV, it doesn't even have to be HD either so they can keep development costs down, it worked for vita TV atleast on a technical scale. Nintendo's portables have always been more successful than their console counterparts, the market have spoken they do not like traditional Nintendo consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 09, 2015, 01:46:28 PM
You can debate whether Nintendo feels it is worth it to bother with HD but it doesn't matter.  The genie is out of the bottle and the market expects it.  Consumers don't give a **** if it's too expensive.  They see all these high budget HD games on the shelf so that's the standard.  Complaining about it is like complaining that games went from one screen to scrolling or 2D to 3D.  Someone raised the bar and set new expectations and you meet them or your product looks out-of-date and doesn't sell.  It may not seem fair and it has put some companies out of business but it's reality.

And this reality continues to destroy much of the industry.  We have less games then ever before, with the remaining third parties focusing most of their efforts on the 2 or 3 yearly mega hit franchises the company has with everything else being cheap mobile games.  The reality that they created is what's going to cause them to eventually crash since the smaller variety of games is going to cause the audience to keep shrinking until you're left with something that can't sustain the high level of cost anymore.

That's the whole point, the rest of the industry is driving a bus with no brakes and when it crashes, it's going to be a disaster.  Nintendo the only one with any common sense to realize this is a dangerous and unsustainable future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 09, 2015, 01:51:06 PM
I fear if they make things scalable it just means that all console games are compromised so that they can be done on the handheld.  It isn't just graphics.  Something like the size of an open area can be dictated by the hardware.  Sure you can have the models look nicer on the console but you can't change the layout of a level.  If you're going to make an open area it will be as big as you can do on the lowest hardware.  Unless in this situation Nintendo lets someone make something JUST for the console that makes full use of the hardware.

And if they don't then the third party issues where certain games just cannot be done still comes into play.  Maybe the NX console is capable of handling Game X but the NX handheld is not.  If Nintendo insists that the game plays on both models then we just don't get it.
I knew this was going to come up which I touched upon in the thread I started. To elaborate:

1. Scaling has been happening on PC for ages.

2. While Nintendo earned the reputation of being stupidly overbearing in the past, that doesn't seem to be its way anymore. Stories from the development of games like Bayonetta 2 and Devil's Third show a Nintendo that encouraged the developers to make the games their way. Didn't Nintendo suggest Platinum Games' Nintendo themed costumes in Bayonetta 2 better reflect the character? That said, I can't imagine Nintendo demanding a third party developer compromise its vision just so a game works on a handheld. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. That, ultimately, is up to the third party.

3. In this scenario, I think most of Nintendo's first party titles would take advantage of this scalability because the entire point of unifying the console and handheld divisions was to simplify development. It'd be an option available to other companies, not a requirement. They may take it because it reaches a wider audience. We already see something similar happening all the time. PC Master Race should win 100% of the time yet it's the PC version that is compromised to work on consoles.
Why does it have to be both a handheld and a console? Why not just strictly a handheld that you can also happen to play on a TV, it doesn't even have to be HD either so they can keep development costs down, it worked for vita TV atleast on a technical scale. Nintendo's portables have always been more successful than their console counterparts, the market have spoken they do not like traditional Nintendo consoles.
Different devices for different markets. A hybrid compromises both. A handheld can only be so powerful before being priced out of what consumers consider to be acceptable. It happened with 3DS. Not even Nintendo could sell a $250 handheld without people turning their nose up to it. There will be situations where a game is not possible on the hardware in the handheld, and would be exclusive to the console.

I'm decidedly down on Vita TV. I recently found out Uncharted: Golden Abyss is incompatible. That was the only game I was interested in.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 09, 2015, 03:11:24 PM
You can debate whether Nintendo feels it is worth it to bother with HD but it doesn't matter.  The genie is out of the bottle and the market expects it.  Consumers don't give a **** if it's too expensive.  They see all these high budget HD games on the shelf so that's the standard.  Complaining about it is like complaining that games went from one screen to scrolling or 2D to 3D.  Someone raised the bar and set new expectations and you meet them or your product looks out-of-date and doesn't sell.  It may not seem fair and it has put some companies out of business but it's reality.

And this reality continues to destroy much of the industry.  We have less games then ever before, with the remaining third parties focusing most of their efforts on the 2 or 3 yearly mega hit franchises the company has with everything else being cheap mobile games.  The reality that they created is what's going to cause them to eventually crash since the smaller variety of games is going to cause the audience to keep shrinking until you're left with something that can't sustain the high level of cost anymore.

That's the whole point, the rest of the industry is driving a bus with no brakes and when it crashes, it's going to be a disaster.  Nintendo the only one with any common sense to realize this is a dangerous and unsustainable future.

Who dies first?  The rest of the industry or Nintendo for having a product that comes across as outdated and low tech?  I'm not saying the situation is good I'm just saying that it IS the situation.  A game like Grand Theft Auto V comes out and it costs a buttload of money to make but it's a critical and commercial smash.  Okay so that's the competition.  It doesn't matter what your game cost to make, your game is sitting on the shelf for the same price next to a game like that.

The funny thing is that I think Nintendo being a first party dev is what really makes it so they HAVE to meet these standards.  The expectation is that their console has to match up with the competition, not so much their own games.  If they were third party and made games for the PS4 that didn't go tit-for-tat with the big budget stuff would that really matter?  Not everyone is trying to match Call of Duty.  A company like NIS for example doesn't bother.  Would stuff like Mario Kart and SSB come across as low tech on the PS4 or would people care enough if they did to not buy them?  The issue is more that when you buy a Nintendo console you give up all this other stuff to fit into this specific way Nintendo wants to do things.  As a third party they can still do things largely their own way without restricting the experience at a console level.  And I think most people really like Nintendo games, they just don't want to have to buy a second console or give up virtually everything else to access them.

I don't really want Nintendo to go third party but it feels like expecting them to get their console to meet industry standards is futile.  If the option came down to going third party or dying/abandoning videogame entirely then I would rather they go third party.  Unless they somehow survive while everyone dies but is that even a longterm thing?  Are we all suddenly going to forget that these big budget games existed?  It would just be a matter of time before someone with big pockets gives that another go and raises consumer standards again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 09, 2015, 03:22:15 PM
As a third party they can still do things largely their own way without restricting the experience at a console level. 


They would also have way less money and far fewer development studios. Hope you like Mario games.


A company like NIS for example doesn't bother. 

How many games does NIS publish and develop each year? How many games does Nintendo publish and develop each year?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ThePerm on July 09, 2015, 06:27:55 PM
As far as having a multiplatform os....

I woke up and turned on my wii u to watch netflix...
There was an advertisement telling me that I should get Ocarina of Time for Virtual Console, and the first thing I thought was "I wish it was the 3ds version, I'd buy that."

Also, how would sales change for a Nintendo Xbox combined strategy? Wouldn't software sales go way up?(where companies make the real money?) There are people who wouldn't buy a Nintendo, they would buy an Xbox, and if a Nintendo game they liked would happen to be on it than they would buy that. We could go back to the 2 platforms. Which would simplify it for all of us. That third party support..it would come back again. Its a weird position to be in where both Nintendo and Xbox are at. Ps4 is doing the combined sales of both platforms. Nintendo needs to upgrade its hardware already, but what if you could just absorb already released hardware? What if the main concern of Nintendo wasn't what you played it on, but how you played it?

and Why NX, does it just sound cool, or is there meaning behind it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ceric on July 09, 2015, 10:30:32 PM
So there is rumors for the spec of the Lumia 940 XL.  Screen Resolution rumored as 1440x2550, fully DirectX 11 capable, 8 cored, 3GB Ram (Considering everything else that feels low).

The funny part is I don't really doubt those specs.  It doesn't have to have a 4k display on the Nintendo Handheld but being able to reliable drive a 60fps 1080p display would allow to push to 4k if you really wanted to on the screen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Shaymin on July 09, 2015, 11:06:23 PM
I believe the term being thrown around for the handheld screen is "more than we expect, less than what we want".

I'm thinking 960x540 for the handheld screen, which would allow console versions of the software a clean path to 1080p.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Enner on July 16, 2015, 10:42:14 PM
http://venturebeat.com/2015/07/16/more-hints-that-amd-is-building-nintendo-nxs-processor/

The Nintendo NX featuring an x86-based AMD APU makes sense. Nintendo has a good relationship with the company since they have been supplying them with GPUs since the ArtX/ATI days. Also, AMD supplies APUs for the PlayStation 4 and Xbox One. The experience and resources will keep costs down for AMD and Nintendo. Lastly, AMD hasn't been faring well in the market against Intel and other chip manufacturers. While making APUs for video game consoles has low margins, it is a niche that AMD is comfortably in. AMD may feel incentivized to solidify their position.

Of course, Nintendo may hang a wild turn in to nVidia or something ARM-based.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Enner on July 28, 2015, 06:12:56 AM
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/40829/dragon-quest-xi-announced-for-nintendo-3ds-and-nx (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/40829/dragon-quest-xi-announced-for-nintendo-3ds-and-nx)

There are two paths I see in this latest news:

"NX is the hybrid" - The NX version of Dragon Quest XI is an upgraded version of the Nintendo 3DS version. Which means the NX is the low-powered, portable-focused, can-stream-to-a-HDTV hybrid console that some people are guessing.

"NX is a home console or has a home console component" - The NX version of Dragon Quest XI is the PlayStation 4 version of the game. That means the NX has computational power comparable to the PlayStation 4 and supports Unreal Engine 4.

Oh, and the controller will have enough buttons, pads, and sticks to play this Dragon Quest game in either scenario.

While there is a chance of the former being true, all the currently available talk and rumor indicates to me the latter.

Still, taking the announcement in a vacuum or as a whole, the news still leaves NX as a mystery.

EDIT:
http://www.siliconera.com/2015/07/28/dragon-quest-x-and-xi-are-in-development-for-nintendo-nx/ (http://www.siliconera.com/2015/07/28/dragon-quest-x-and-xi-are-in-development-for-nintendo-nx/)

Dragon Quest X (the MMO) will also see an NX version.
This falls in line with Mr. Iwata talking about how the NX will absorb the Wii U architecture in some fashion. That doesn't mean that the NX version of DQX will be some quick and dirty port, though.

Again, there is that 3DS version of DQX that uses cloud streaming to function. But to think that is what the NX version will be based on is absurd given the launch troubles of the 3DS version.

So, I guess that means at the very least the hybrid console will be as powerful as the Wii U? I know we live in a world where the PlayStation Vita and the latest tablets exist, but the thought of a portable Wii U impresses me a bit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Shaymin on July 28, 2015, 07:02:05 AM
Or "NX is an operating system" and DQXI is releasing on two handhelds next year.

Officially, SE is only "considering" the NX: http://www.jp.square-enix.com/company/ja/news/2015/html/8e4134b8203fc226980d056951e0aac0.html
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Enner on July 28, 2015, 07:19:54 AM
Well, the NX has to run on some piece of hardware. If it was only a regular handheld console, that would be underwhelming.

I was just about to write that the NX version is not set in stone. That might indicate that Square Enix doesn't know that much more about the NX than we do.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Soren on July 28, 2015, 11:32:21 AM
Or "NX is an operating system" and DQXI is releasing on two handhelds next year.


My money is on the possible NX version of DQXI being a port of the PS4 version, regardless of whether its a handheld or a console. We'll get to see the "scaleability" of the new OS, and maybe see how much easier it is to port than Wii U/3DS.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 28, 2015, 08:47:27 PM
Anyone else think the NX could be a very slight incremental bump in specs to accommodate the ability to use 2 or more touch screen controllers.  This is what the Wii was compared to the GCN.  Nintendo even stated that they originally tried to get four wiimotes working on the Gamecube and it just wasn't powerful enough. So they created the Wii so it had enough power for that and that's pretty much all they added.

Could the NX just be a Wii U, but with enough power to stream to four touchscreens at once and possibly add multitouch?  I'm hoping it's more and it can have the PS4 version of DQXI ported to it with no problem.  But with the way Iwata mentioned that the NX would somehow absord the Wii U, they may look at what they did from GCN to Wii and think they could replicate that and have success.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on July 28, 2015, 08:53:33 PM
SURPRISE! NX is a Nintendo branded line of shoes & bread.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: lolmonade on July 28, 2015, 09:39:59 PM
Anyone else think the NX could be a very slight incremental bump in specs to accommodate the ability to use 2 or more touch screen controllers.  This is what the Wii was compared to the GCN.  Nintendo even stated that they originally tried to get four wiimotes working on the Gamecube and it just wasn't powerful enough. So they created the Wii so it had enough power for that and that's pretty much all they added.

Could the NX just be a Wii U, but with enough power to stream to four touchscreens at once and possibly add multitouch?  I'm hoping it's more and it can have the PS4 version of DQXI ported to it with no problem.  But with the way Iwata mentioned that the NX would somehow absord the Wii U, they may look at what they did from GCN to Wii and think they could replicate that and have success.


Oh trust me, whatever NX turns out to be, it can't get anywhere close to the wild imaginations of NWR forum goers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: nickmitch on July 28, 2015, 10:56:50 PM
Anyone else think the NX could be a very slight incremental bump in specs to accommodate the ability to use 2 or more touch screen controllers.  This is what the Wii was compared to the GCN.  Nintendo even stated that they originally tried to get four wiimotes working on the Gamecube and it just wasn't powerful enough. So they created the Wii so it had enough power for that and that's pretty much all they added.

Could the NX just be a Wii U, but with enough power to stream to four touchscreens at once and possibly add multitouch?  I'm hoping it's more and it can have the PS4 version of DQXI ported to it with no problem.  But with the way Iwata mentioned that the NX would somehow absord the Wii U, they may look at what they did from GCN to Wii and think they could replicate that and have success.

But would they really make that mistake AGAIN?  I mean, yeah, they would but. . .

Nevermind.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 29, 2015, 12:02:16 PM
Anyone else think the NX could be a very slight incremental bump in specs to accommodate the ability to use 2 or more touch screen controllers.  This is what the Wii was compared to the GCN.  Nintendo even stated that they originally tried to get four wiimotes working on the Gamecube and it just wasn't powerful enough. So they created the Wii so it had enough power for that and that's pretty much all they added.

Could the NX just be a Wii U, but with enough power to stream to four touchscreens at once and possibly add multitouch?  I'm hoping it's more and it can have the PS4 version of DQXI ported to it with no problem.  But with the way Iwata mentioned that the NX would somehow absord the Wii U, they may look at what they did from GCN to Wii and think they could replicate that and have success.

That seems like an idea that is 100% guaranteed to fail.  If the touchscreen was such a great idea I figure the Wii U wouldn't have flopped in the first place.  Plus how expensive would it be for someone to own four touchscreen controllers?

Of course it's Nintendo so while I don't think they'll do this, I wouldn't be shocked if they did.  My expectation of the NX is that it will not be what I think it should be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Adrock on July 29, 2015, 12:54:18 PM
The only way I can see NX being an incremental bump is if its a literal hybrid. That's the sacrifice that has to be made for a product like that to be even remotely viable. Battery life and heat instantly limit handheld electronics. Again, Iwata has already said more than once that Nintendo isn't going the hybrid direction. Unless that's just misdirection, I believe it. Nintendo still wants to sell two pieces of hardware even if they play the same games. Why? Because schmucks like myself would totally still buy both.
Plus how expensive would it be for someone to own four touchscreen controllers?
Not much more expensive than it costs to own four controllers on the other consoles as long as Nintendo doesn't get too greedy. At launch, Nintendo was trying to make like $100 per replacement which can promptly get the **** out of my face. These companies make a killing on controllers because the console is worthless without them. Even with an upgraded GamePad, I still see Nintendo having the Pro Controller around which it will similarly make a killing on.

The Wii U Pro Controller probably costs Nintendo less than $10 in parts and manufacturing. I've always felt Nintendo set the price at $50 for profit margins and for parity. It wants the controller to seem on par with the others even if it's missing key pieces. It also makes the GamePad seem like a luxury item even it isn't. Such is life, I guess.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: lolmonade on July 29, 2015, 02:32:11 PM
So much speculation here.  Ill be honest, the most I expect, and it's evidenced by some things that have already been written, is:
 
The wildest i'd be willing to speculate:
All together, that seems like pretty wild too, huh?  But I'm willing to wager at least one or two of those are accurate as it gets unveiled.
 
 
 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: sudoshuff on July 29, 2015, 11:13:41 PM
One of my guesses (and one for many people) is that they will expand on the idea of using the handheld as a controller for the console.  The 3DS works great as a smash controller.  This would allow them to do backwards compatibility for Wii U games. Instead of of bundling a gamepad with the new NX console, they could just say "if you buy the NX handheld, it will function as a gamepad." 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Evan_B on July 30, 2015, 11:03:15 PM
At first, I laughed at the possibility of the NX being a Wii U able to stream to multiple gamepads- but now that I think about it, it does make sense. They clearly spent a lot of development time on the streaming capabilities of the Wii U and while it didn't take off quite as well, if they dedicated themselves towards pushing that idea further and doing this "NX family" sort of idea, where the handheld streams to the home console, it might just work.

But how do they sell this sort of thing? I think telling people to buy two separate sets of hardware is a risky venture. Two SKUs, one for a handheld NX and one that has the console version isn't viable, especially if the console version is lacking features the handheld version has, or vice versa. Therefore, I believe that the console version will come with a disc drive/tv-connection device but also be a NX handheld as well.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 31, 2015, 05:23:26 PM
I'm hoping they bring the cost down of the gamepads to at max $70 as that would get it closer to the price of other controllers and still be considered a premium due to the screen.  That way it's more likely people would want this style of system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 31, 2015, 07:07:47 PM
Multiple Gamepads is the same concept as games like Crystal Chronicles and Four Swords Adventures and, though I thought Four Swords is one of the best Cube games, the general reaction to those games was "meh".  The whole appeal is that everyone has their own screen... except that's like the norm these days with online multiplayer.  Even back in 2003 the concept seemed like a solution to a problem Nintendo invented, like the whole thing was some workaround for the online play Nintendo for some goofy reason refused to support.  Today when kids probably see local multiplayer as some archaic design from their parents' days it looks even sillier.  Online with voice chat offers essentially the same concept and Nintendo's idiotic anti-voice chat attitude doesn't change that.

So you take a concept that flopped over ten years ago that seems WAY less necessary today, paired up with the trademark concept of a console that was a bomb.  That's such a recipe for failure that it seems on purpose, like it's some weird insurance scam or something.  The Wii U was not some solid concept that was one or two little details away from being a hit.  It was completely the wrong product.

The only way I could MAYBE see such a concept work is if you have multiple Gamepads and all of them can do off-TV play at the same time with completely different games and sessions.  So the idea is that the family buys one system with multiple Gamepads, that are at a much lower price then separate handheld game systems would be, and all of them can use the console at the same time for different things in different parts of the house.  Someone is using Netflix in this room, two other people are playing a multiplayer game together in another, and another is playing a completely different game in another.  Of course that would require some impressive horsepower to pull that off.  That concept could possibly sell.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 31, 2015, 10:17:28 PM
Multiple Gamepads is the same concept as games like Crystal Chronicles and Four Swords Adventures and, though I thought Four Swords is one of the best Cube games, the general reaction to those games was "meh".  The whole appeal is that everyone has their own screen... except that's like the norm these days with online multiplayer.  Even back in 2003 the concept seemed like a solution to a problem Nintendo invented, like the whole thing was some workaround for the online play Nintendo for some goofy reason refused to support.  Today when kids probably see local multiplayer as some archaic design from their parents' days it looks even sillier.  Online with voice chat offers essentially the same concept and Nintendo's idiotic anti-voice chat attitude doesn't change that.

So you take a concept that flopped over ten years ago that seems WAY less necessary today, paired up with the trademark concept of a console that was a bomb.  That's such a recipe for failure that it seems on purpose, like it's some weird insurance scam or something.  The Wii U was not some solid concept that was one or two little details away from being a hit.  It was completely the wrong product.

The only way I could MAYBE see such a concept work is if you have multiple Gamepads and all of them can do off-TV play at the same time with completely different games and sessions.  So the idea is that the family buys one system with multiple Gamepads, that are at a much lower price then separate handheld game systems would be, and all of them can use the console at the same time for different things in different parts of the house.  Someone is using Netflix in this room, two other people are playing a multiplayer game together in another, and another is playing a completely different game in another.  Of course that would require some impressive horsepower to pull that off.  That concept could possibly sell.

I mean, I mostly buy this analysis, but I think they were more so gambling on local multiplayer still being the most enjoyable way to play videogames with other people. That was the Wii's big hook, and a huge awakening while it lasted, though the energy quickly went elsewhere. There's a reotroactively sad logic to them doubling down on unique/convenient local multiplayer experiences while integrating the tools of the previous iteration.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Steven9wii on July 31, 2015, 10:50:29 PM
i think it's too early for another system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 01, 2015, 02:25:41 AM
i think it's too early for another system.

If it comes out holiday 2016 it'll have been 4 years, which seems reasonable considering how much of a flop the Wii U has been.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Shaymin on August 01, 2015, 09:00:00 AM
i think it's too early for another system.

If it comes out holiday 2016 it'll have been nearly 6 years, which seems reasonable considering how much of a flop the 3DS was at launch.

FTFY
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 01, 2015, 12:42:28 PM
Orginal Xbox had four years before the 360. GBA was three years before the DS came out.
Wii ran six years instead of the "typical" five, so a four year life cycle seems okay to me.


I speculate Nintendo could be replacing the typical console life cycle with a more frequent and incremental release schedule for successors, keeping the same basic software base. Something like the iPad has.

For example:
Fall 2016: NX portable
Spring 2017: NX home
Fall 2018: NX Lite
Summer 2019: NX home advanced

This was  hinted at by Iwata before: http://www.digitaltrends.com/gaming/nintendo-president-satoru-iwata-discusses-the-future-of-nintendo-hardware-beyond-wii-u-and-nintendo-3ds/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 02, 2015, 02:45:01 AM
I have a mock up/ prototype of what this system is and I'll post is 2maro.


The NX will play:


Two types of media Both Disc based and 3DS like cartridges on 1 singular system.


Have and advanced AR functionality (think that april fools gag from 2014 with both Google maps and Pokemon, my incredibly unreliable sources say Nintendo was most impressed with the response from consumers and have thought this to be the natural progression of gaming and NOT VR.




And whom ever said that the NX maybe a OS is really close to the mark. Think of the NEW 3DS XL with a docking station the makes it a home console.  Far more powerful than the 3DS but not quite a PS4.. DOCKING STATION is the Cloud, meaning the Home version of the game can be "paired" with the  "Go" version.
 







Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on August 10, 2015, 10:18:43 AM
Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn NX port?

Yoshida says it's possible, depending on the release date and cross-platform gameplay. More importantly though, negotiations have not started yet.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2015/08/nintendo_nx_could_get_a_port_of_mmorpg_final_fantasy_xiv_a_realm_reborn




Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on August 10, 2015, 05:32:07 PM
That Final Fantasy 14 consideration... ah!
Negotiations not being started leaves some room that Square Enix doesn't know what the NX is in terms of technical specifications.

But what if Square Enix knows how much power the NX has? That these considerations of Dragon Quest 10, Dragon Quest 11, and now Final Fantasy 14 are not some carelessly spoken idle chatter but serious business?

This latest rumbling gives a bit of hope to the camps that want the NX or a component of the NX to have technical prowess on par with PlayStation 4 or Xbox One.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 10, 2015, 05:58:56 PM
One good thing to take away from this is that a third party like Square Enix is open to the idea of supporting the NX.  They haven't written it off as something they would never support because they would presume it would fail.  I fully expected somebody like EA or Ubisoft to have that attitude after they so quickly abandoned the Wii U.  Just somebody that actually matters not dismissing Nintendo outright is encouraging.

Though right now it's just talk so we shouldn't get our hopes up too high yet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 10, 2015, 07:34:04 PM
Well it could be some developers dropped support of Wii U because they were already in the loop for NX. Square Enix is kinda a good canary when it comes to support. Generally, they are a well regarded studio that makes (currently mediocre) games, the games won't sell themselves so they rely on user-base and Square name recognition to keep themselves afloat. If they support wii u that usually means others will too.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on August 10, 2015, 07:54:34 PM
I would hope Square Enix knows what the NX is since it was allegedly shown to third parties at E3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 19, 2015, 12:52:24 AM
Give me Final Fantasy XV on NX and I'll reconsider Square's support.

Nintendo has shot themselves in the foot yet again with the announcement of the NX, so much so, that I believe they screwed Wii U sales further by making everyone anticipate a successor- which the NX will be, there's no doubt. I think NX has great potential to be the console that helps Nintendo rise from the ashes as long as they appreciate backwards compatability for the system.

I'm fully convinced at this point that NX will be a hybrid and it will play 3DS and Wii U games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 19, 2015, 06:23:58 AM
Nintendo painted itself into a corner so announcing NX in March was its best move. Given Wii U's performance, Nintendo couldn't reasonably announce its mobile partnership with DeNA without also reassuring everyone that it isn't leaving the hardware business. Sure, Nintendo was forced to throw Wii U under the bus, but that's better than throwing Wii U under the bus AND leaving its future in hardware in question. All things considered, Nintendo (surprisingly) handled that as well as it could.

Anyway, I'm surprised anyone can still be so confidently on the hybrid train despite all evidence to the contrary. On more than one occasion, Nintendo has essentially said, "No, we're not making a hybrid."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Shaymin on August 19, 2015, 07:03:42 AM
Give me Final Fantasy XV on NX and I'll reconsider Square's support.

You're asking for a game that's not launching until Nintendo's next NEXT console at the current pace. I'm sure they'll get around to it, though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 19, 2015, 10:26:10 AM
Anyway, I'm surprised anyone can still be so confidently on the hybrid train despite all evidence to the contrary. On more than one occasion, Nintendo has essentially said, "No, we're not making a hybrid."
Can I have a source for that? Because I follow news pretty religiously and I've heard nothing of the sort.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on August 19, 2015, 12:28:14 PM
March 2014 investor meeting: http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/140130qa/02.html

Quote
In this perspective, while we are only going to be able to start this with the next system, it will become important for us to accurately take advantage of what we have done with the Wii U architecture. It of course does not mean that we are going to use exactly the same architecture as Wii U, but we are going to create a system that can absorb the Wii U architecture adequately. When this happens, home consoles and handheld devices will no longer be completely different, and they will become like brothers in a family of systems.

Miyamoto at E3 2014: http://kotaku.com/miyamoto-can-imagine-nintendo-making-hybrid-console-han-1594989023

Quote
Certainly from a development standpoint there is some challenge to it, because if you have two devices that have different specs and you're being told to design in a way that the game runs on both devices, then that can be challenging for the developer—but if you have a more unified development environment and you're able to make one game that runs on both systems instead of having to make a game for each system, that's an area of opportunity for us.

The Wii U and 3DS will each get a successor. Console and handheld, two different products but united under the same operating system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 19, 2015, 12:39:18 PM
Also
Iwata: Unified Console And Handheld Division Could Lead To More Platforms (http://nintendoeverything.com/iwata-unified-console-and-handheld-division-could-lead-to-more-platforms/)
Quote
In terms of our platform integration, as I explained to you a short while ago, we are not saying that we are planning to integrate our platforms into one. What we are saying is that we would like to integrate software development methods, operating systems, and built-in software and software assets for each platform so that we can use them across different machines.
And from the same investor's meeting Soren linked to:
Iwata on integrating handheld/console teams, next system will “absorb the Wii U architecture adequately” (http://nintendoeverything.com/iwata-on-integrating-handheldconsole-teams-next-system-will-absorb-the-wii-u-architecture-adequately-more/)
Quote
Still, I am not sure if the form factor (the size and configuration of the hardware) will be integrated.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 19, 2015, 12:53:47 PM
Those last two sound less like declarations that they're not doing that and more like them saying that they're not saying they're doing that right now, though, which they've done numerous times shortly before they've then done that thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 19, 2015, 01:34:53 PM
Typically, Nintendo does that when it's trying to shut down a rumor which then ends up being true a couple weeks later. In this instance, Nintendo has been dropping hints that it's planning a handheld and console that play the same games for nearly three years now. And every time the subject comes up again, Nintendo gives a little more. I get what you're saying considering Nintendo's history of denying the existence of handhelds that it ends up releasing (e.g. just about every redesign). It could be misdirection. I doubt it though. I don't remember Nintendo being this forthcoming (albeit still coy) about its future platforms before. It's as if Nintendo wants to talk about them and move on from Wii U but can't justifiably do so this early.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 19, 2015, 01:42:57 PM
Nintendo tried to be secretive the last couple times they had new hardware and both times ended up with huge leaks forcing their hand early. Maybe they're trying something different to avoid that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 19, 2015, 02:51:57 PM
I get the feeling that if Nintendo releases a new handheld and a new console and they both play the same games that the handheld is going to sell really well and the console is going to bomb.  They had the problem this gen that they kept releasing 3DS games that were very similar to Wii U games so that diminished the need for a Wii U.  I prefer consoles so I would buy the console but the general public trusts Nintendo for handhelds but absolutely not for consoles.  So if the console doesn't offer much distinct from the handheld there isn't much of a selling point beyond appealing to people like me that don't like handheld gaming and only buy handhelds for their exclusives.  The hybrid concept works better because it's just one purchase and the customer uses it in the way that suits them.

Sony's handhelds tend to have virtually the same games as their consoles and what happens?  Everyone buys their console and not the handheld.  PlayStation is a strong console brand name but a weak handheld one so with very little to differentiate between the two systems the one with the stronger reputation is the successful one.

I think ultimately people will buy one handheld or one console or one of each.  Nintendo's console needs to come across as an obvious choice OVER the PS4 and XB1.  If it's just a console version of the "4DS" then people will gladly get their preferred combination of a Nintendo handheld and a Sony/MS console.  If the NX console has the same games as the handheld then someone with that combo misses out on virtually nothing.  At least right now if they go 3DS/PS4 they miss out on Wii U exclusives.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on August 19, 2015, 03:22:25 PM

Sony's handhelds tend to have virtually the same games as their consoles and what happens?  Everyone buys their console and not the handheld.  PlayStation is a strong console brand name but a weak handheld one so with very little to differentiate between the two systems the one with the stronger reputation is the successful one.


That's a good point. I also thought the PSP was wrong-headed from the get-go, and didn't know why anyone would want to play complex 3D games (that were also inferior to console counterparts by most metrics) on a small screen  while on the go. And based on the collapse of the Vita, it would seem that most of the market agrees at this point, especially when simple and accessible phone games are universally available. While people do obviously have much more confidence in Nintendo's handhelds, they essentially have the same problem, and the 3DS, while still doing pretty well against the mobile juggernaut, is nowhere near as successful as the DS.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on August 19, 2015, 04:47:19 PM
If what killed the Wii U was 3DS games being too similar overall from content to quality, then that situation will repeat itself regardless as the power and value of handheld hardware improves.

If a repeat of the 3DS and Wii U come to the NX Handheld and NX Home, then at least Nintendo is better off in this situation by more easily being able to produce games for both systems.

While Japan is veering more towards portable means of play, North American, European, Australian, and some other territories show a preference for home consoles. In the hypothetical situation of the NX Handheld and NX Home, Nintendo is in an easier place to provide enough software for both platforms. This also avoids the potential worst-of-both-worlds pitfalls of an NX Hybrid.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 19, 2015, 07:09:33 PM
The hybrid concept works better because it's just one purchase and the customer uses it in the way that suits them.
And a customer would just buy the hardware, handheld or console, that suits them without having to deal with the compromises of a hybrid. You continually bitch about hardware power and you're championing Nintendo going with weaker hardware? And you're not even going to use it as a handheld because you admittedly don't like handheld gaming? What the what?

In a scenario in which Nintendo released a console and handheld that played the same games, I'd imagine Nintendo would adjust manufacturing accordingly, namely that far more handhelds would be made. The console underperforming certainly isn't ideal, but the entire point of this is to consolidate Nintendo's development resources while still giving third parties the most options.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 19, 2015, 09:08:28 PM
Yeah, so none of those quotes proved a thing about a hybrid console. A hybrid console can mean something that plays games from both systems or utilizes the same tech.

And let's be honest, the console in the most people's hands right now is the 3DS. Nintendo should play to their strengths and not do this ridiculous strategy of releasing the same installments on two systems, especially after the a Wii U had three very iterative hallmark titles that looked like their 3DS versions with better graphics. As said before, Nintendo trying to cover their bases in terms of software library on both consoles has been a bad move- I never play Mario Kart 7 because it doesn't do anything different enough from MK8. I didn't even buy MK7 for the same reason. And when your biggest franchise, Mario, has games that look identical on two systems (thankfully the Wii U version isn't utter garbage like the 3DS), that's a big problem, and something that a unification or hybrid style device that unites the libraries of both consoles would be extremely beneficial.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 20, 2015, 12:22:42 AM
The hybrid concept works better because it's just one purchase and the customer uses it in the way that suits them.
And a customer would just buy the hardware, handheld or console, that suits them without having to deal with the compromises of a hybrid. You continually bitch about hardware power and you're championing Nintendo going with weaker hardware? And you're not even going to use it as a handheld because you admittedly don't like handheld gaming? What the what?

In a scenario in which Nintendo released a console and handheld that played the same games, I'd imagine Nintendo would adjust manufacturing accordingly, namely that far more handhelds would be made. The console underperforming certainly isn't ideal, but the entire point of this is to consolidate Nintendo's development resources while still giving third parties the most options.

Except we should not be looking at it from the consumer perspective but from Nintendo's business perspective.

Here is what having a hybrid system or 2 different systems that play the same games would do for Nintendo. 

1) Customers would pick which console they want, but if both are priced at a profit Nintendo doesn't care, because Nintendo gets a big user base for 3rd party and 1st party games.
2) Nintendo gets instant credibility back in the market because 3rd parties and gamers have not abandoned Nintendo's portable market.
3) Nintendo doesn't have to compromise resources on two different consoles...instead one game for two systems, means that Nintendo can release more games a year....since both systems can play both games.
4)Nintendo can be freed up to make more original games and IPs.  Just imagine Nintendo doesn't have to make a Zelda, Mario, Mario Kart, Smash Bros, Animal Crossing for each different system...that Nintendo can make one version to play on all systems...that means Nintendo can release more games like Splatoon.

Yes a hybrid system or even 2 systems that run on the same OS might offer compromises for the player and for Nintendo, but it also gives both huge advantages that shouldn't be ignored.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on August 20, 2015, 01:26:43 AM
Another issue is that if the scalable games between handheld and console thing is true, it places a pretty significant cap on the types of games that will be made. I'm not super up on the specs of stuff, but I'd assume that a new handheld wouldn't be too much stronger than a Vita, which from my understanding is spec-wise a gimped PS3. So we'd be looking at games broadly targeted at WiiU-level specs, with maybe a few exclusives on the console side of the NX equation. Granted, Nintendo doesn't greatly emphasize pushing technical boundaries at this point (and frankly I've yet to see anything "next gen" that really introduces new design concepts based on processing power), but something has to break that ceiling at some point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 20, 2015, 01:40:13 AM
It's also possible that not all games will work across both platforms, with a more poweful console SKU that is required for certain things, like how some iPad games won't work on iPhones.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on August 20, 2015, 05:47:42 AM
I don't think a 3DS successor will be anywhere near Wii U level specs. You want enough contrast between your handheld and your console so it doesn't end up being a Vita situation. I think you can make that distinction in games like insano said but I don't think the 4DS goes over 480p.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 20, 2015, 06:14:25 AM
It's also possible that not all games will work across both platforms, with a more poweful console SKU that is required for certain things, like how some iPad games won't work on iPhones.
That's one of the main reasons why I think the two-platforms-that-play-the-same games concept is a better solution for both Nintendo and consumers. Nintendo's bread and butter is its first party content. Scaling games wouldn't stifle its creativity since it has been known to still make great games on any sort of hardware. It's mainly an option for third parties. Some games can be scaled, but third parties won't get locked out entirely if certain games can't be scaled down enough to work on the handheld. That brings up the question of whether the console would have a large enough user base for third parties to bother. However, consumers having access to all of Nintendo's current software makes it an easier sell to consumers. I don't know if Nintendo will ever completely shake the stigma that people who own its hardware only buy first party games, but if porting is made easy, it might be worth it to test the waters.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Shaymin on August 20, 2015, 07:14:30 AM
I don't think a 3DS successor will be anywhere near Wii U level specs. You want enough contrast between your handheld and your console so it doesn't end up being a Vita situation. I think you can make that distinction in games like insano said but I don't think the 4DS goes over 480p.

The NX-running next handheld actually might have a good reason to go 960x540. That's probably the upper limit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 20, 2015, 10:50:00 AM
Well everyone keeps tell console gamers that PC is the master race...well as PCs have been doing scaling for years now...and it seems to work just fine without truly limiting the scale of the game. 

If the cards or discs or download size allotment isn't a problem then they could just download models and scales that fit the device.  Cross buy could even be a motivating factor for consumers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 20, 2015, 01:33:44 PM
The hybrid concept works better because it's just one purchase and the customer uses it in the way that suits them.
And a customer would just buy the hardware, handheld or console, that suits them without having to deal with the compromises of a hybrid. You continually bitch about hardware power and you're championing Nintendo going with weaker hardware? And you're not even going to use it as a handheld because you admittedly don't like handheld gaming? What the what?

I don't necessarily want the hybrid as much as I just think that's a better strategy than two products that are effectively the same thing.  Now if the console and handheld were clearly different with different games then I think that also would be a good strategy if Nintendo was able to fix their third party support and expanded their resources so that supporting two platforms isn't too difficult for them to do.  But we know they're not interested in that.  They want to bring the two platforms together in some way.  In that scenario I think a hybrid has more sales potential.

Of course I'm also thinking of typical Nintendo goofiness that will muddle up the concept.  Best case scenario you have two platforms with scalable games and cross-buy and the specs on the console are powerful enough that it allows for easy PS4/XB1 third party ports.  Most games are on both platforms but you can have exclusives that take full advantage of the specific hardware.  Nintendo themselves makes some console exclusives where they really push the hardware.  Worst case scenario - no cross-buy and outdated console specs so the NX console is basically nothing more than a console version of the handheld that you have to rebuy the same games for.  Third party support does not improve (aside from up-ports of handheld games) and Nintendo intentionally scales back all of their games to work on the handheld.  Which scenario seems more like what Nintendo would do?  They're greedy so I can see them not offering universal cross-buy and they're cheap so I can see them cheaping out on the specs.

And I'm also just thinking about the damage they've done to their brand name in the console space.  We might sadly be at the point of no return where Nintendo could do everything perfectly but no one will notice because they've already written them off for good.  In that case a hybrid works as a Trojan horse to get a Nintendo "console" in the house of someone who was just intending on buying a Nintendo handheld.  If they're separate then it needs to be such that Nintendo is both the number one choice for handheld and console and it's going to be a lot of work to make it seem like the Nintendo console is worth getting over a PS4 and XB1 (and those consoles now have a several year head start).  Nintendo handheld games with nicer graphics isn't going to cut it.  Nintendo's exclusives have consistently been the best part of their consoles and if the exclusives are all shared with the handheld then they lose the one thing we can probably assume Nintendo will do well.  Nintendo pretty much has to do everything else right and, while I would like that, I don't see that as a realistic scenario.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 20, 2015, 02:37:19 PM
I don't care if Nintendo handhelds share exclusives because I'm sick of the current lazy trend they've made of slight graphical updates for their 'go-to' franchises and one or two added gimmicks that differentiate a handheld version from a console version.

NSMB and NSMBWii felt different enough because of the co-op and larger, more-polished level design (and the sizable difference in graphics), but then NSMB2 and NSMBU were insulting, MK7 and MK8 were insulting, and I suffered through Nintendo getting everything WRONG with the 3D Land formula the first time around before finally being able to enjoy it on Wii U. That's not to mention the blatant similarities of Return to Dreamland and Triple Deluxe, Returns 3D and Tropical Freeze (though I do love the latter)... it doesn't even feel like Nintendo's trying with these franchises anymore and that's frustrating to me because I don't want to have to buy the inferior handheld edition to justify my purchase of the handheld only to be screwed when the updated sequel comes out.

Huh, I guess I just gave the soapbox speech of every gamer that buys a yearly release franchise, or plays video games in general. I just expected more from Nintendo, and for every step in the right direction like XCX or Zelda, where the effort is clear, they make a stupid mistake with a game like Smash Bros.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on August 21, 2015, 03:50:30 PM
Patents!
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=47643.150

A 2015 patent. Patents are very dry, but the interesting takes here are a console that lacks an optical disk drive and another controller with a display screen. It's a Nintendo Go, sans the portability.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on August 21, 2015, 07:19:39 PM



(http://abload.de/img/opnxkm4.png)

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1099932


http://www.ign.com/articles/2015/08/21/nintendo-files-patent-for-console-with-no-optical-drive


http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2015-08-21-nintendo-nx-leak-suggests-it-wont-include-a-disc-drive-report


http://www.forbes.com/sites/davidthier/2015/07/24/nintendo-just-filed-a-patent-for-a-bizzare-new-device/







Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 21, 2015, 08:12:00 PM
well there goes backwards compatability.....

does it rely on the server for processing to some degree?

then again why not release a usb 3.0 external optical drive for classic games? People who want it buy it, people who don't do not. There were only 3 generations of optical drives for Nintendo. There's still time to make Wii U backwards compatible with GameCube too.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on August 21, 2015, 08:40:52 PM
This is a reminder that patents could mean anything or nothing, and that they are terribly vague because patent law is messed up.

So patents are smoke and mirrors... until they aren't!


well there goes backwards compatability.....

does it rely on the server for processing to some degree?

then again why not release a usb 3.0 external optical drive for classic games? People who want it buy it, people who don't do not. There were only 3 generations of optical drives for Nintendo. There's still time to make Wii U backwards compatible with GameCube too.
There's always eShop versions of games.


As for cloud processing, that is definitely a very un-Nintendo thing to guess in a time when eShop gets taken down every Christmas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on August 21, 2015, 09:01:48 PM
One of the external threads I read about this was speculating about references to comparability with optical drives or devices with optical drives, as well as a feature of the processor that would control its speed to sync up properly with (theoretically) an external optical drive or hard drive.

If that's the case, I'm wondering based on Perm's post if they couldn't indeed have a say ~$100 optical add-on that would also have some of its own processing power that could emulate Wii and WiiU games natively. Would keep the cost down on the new console unit, while providing an option to new adopters to take advantage of the WiiU's strong (if small) library. This would be an annoying backwards compatibility option for WiiU owners, but there aren't that many and while the Xbone's upcoming feature is better, this NX option would be preferable to the lousy streaming rental system on PS4.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 21, 2015, 10:46:29 PM
I'm guessing that the memory card comment is for SD cards, and not actual memory cards or game carts.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 22, 2015, 03:20:01 AM
It could be both
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 22, 2015, 08:04:58 AM
I can't see Nintendo dropping physical media before Sony and Microsoft do if only because it has the worst online presence of the three. This would be a ballsy move, but it isn't the kind Nintendo would make.

Nintendo never wanted to adopt optical media in the first place. Even when forced to by an evolving market and consumer expectations, it refused to embrace it entirely with smaller discs on GameCube and a staunch refusal for music and movie playback. The writing was on the wall once cards reached DVD-levels of storage. Capacity and speed continue to rise while cost drops. It still costs more than optical discs, but Nintendo never cared about cost when it came to physical media (maybe Nintendo should). It cared about control. Nintendo likes controlling its media even at the expense of third parties. Digital releases allows Nintendo to have its cake and eat it too though having a physical presence in stores helps tremendously.

If anything, this lends credence to the handheld-and-console-play-the-same-games concept. Optical media doesn't make sense in a handheld.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 22, 2015, 08:52:39 AM
Nintendo's online presence is the worst in terms of multiplayer (and even then, the Wii U got it up to fairly close), but I'd argue navigating the eShop is a significantly more pleasant endeavour than going through Sony or Microsoft's store. If DeNA don't screw up the account system, I'd argue they're probably in the best position to make that move. Also, with the way Nintendo designs hardware, they'd be in the best position to offer retailers better margins to get them to stock the system without physical games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 22, 2015, 11:34:47 AM
This could be 2 things:


"New" Wii U Slim: This would allow Nintendo to continue to support the Wii U brand and offer those few hold outs that are waiting for a price drop to jump in at a discounted price. $199.99 preloaded with "Select Nintendo games" I'd put this at about 35%.




Nintendo ibrydia : (Codename NX)


I 'm in line with the Hybrid console and there are a few bits in that patten that tend to point there for me. The most is the memory card with first and second basic programs(mobile and console code). Server App could mean the docking station, which I am a firm believer is a part of this unit. Also the mass-produced price of new age cartridges and not so out of line with Vita and 3DS that Nintendo could be going back. Plus you can't really max out a cart and they have faster speeds than Blu-ray Disc



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 22, 2015, 01:06:23 PM
Dropping the optical drive means:

- less power needed
- more reliable
- cheaper to build

Nintendo loves all those things
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 22, 2015, 01:15:06 PM
"New" Wii U Slim: This would allow Nintendo to continue to support the Wii U brand and offer those few hold outs that are waiting for a price drop to jump in at a discounted price. $199.99 preloaded with "Select Nintendo games" I'd put this at about 35%.
I'm not sure Nintendo would deem a digital only slim model viable or necessary. That's a lot of time, effort, and money to try to eek out some extra sales of a faltering product.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on August 22, 2015, 01:19:55 PM
Dropping physical media would be a retail suicide, as far as I'm concerned. Something Microsoft and Sony actually do well is dominate shelf space in stores like GameStop while Wii U takes up a sad corner. It would only be another nail in the coffin.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Shaymin on August 22, 2015, 01:34:42 PM
This is a reminder that patents could mean anything or nothing, and that they are terribly vague because patent law is messed up.

So patents are smoke and mirrors... until they aren't!

This.

The next console is going to have some sort of support for physical media, whether it's BluRays, carts or frickin' SD cards.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 22, 2015, 03:13:00 PM
I don't imagine Nintendo is dropping physical media for the NX. I speculate that future support for the Wii U will be significantly scaled down. Also this might be the console they are preparing for the new Chinese market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stratos on August 22, 2015, 03:20:58 PM
"Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix" makes me worry it will be like EA's "unprecedented partnership" this gen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 22, 2015, 05:33:57 PM
"Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix" makes me worry it will be like EA's "unprecedented partnership" this gen.

Well it wouldn't be unprecedented then.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Shaymin on August 22, 2015, 05:57:17 PM
Square supporting a Nintendo console to the point they're dropping numbered Final Fantasies on it as a second choice behind PlayStation? That's the unprecedented part.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on August 22, 2015, 05:59:34 PM
I do not believe in the hybrid theory because it goes against what Iwata had consistently said in 2013 and 2014.

Quote
As you might already know from some newspaper reports, we will reorganize our development divisions next month for the first time in nine years. Two divisions which have independently developed handheld devices and home consoles will be united to form the Integrated Research & Development Division, which will be headed by Genyo Takeda, Senior Managing Director.
Last year we also started a project to integrate the architecture for our future platforms. What we mean by integrating platforms is not integrating handhelds devices and home consoles to make only one machine. What we are aiming at is to integrate the architecture to form a common basis for software development so that we can make software assets more transferrable, and operating systems and their build-in applications more portable, regardless of form factor or performance of each platform. They will also work to avoid software lineup shortages or software development delays which tend to happen just after the launch of new hardware.

http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html (http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 22, 2015, 06:14:54 PM
Beyond that, Nintendo at least tries to make money from hardware sales, which means they'd very much prefer to sell you two pieces of hardware than just the one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on August 22, 2015, 06:51:37 PM
Yep^
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 22, 2015, 07:03:33 PM
Beyond that, Nintendo at least tries to make money from hardware sales, which means they'd very much prefer to sell you two pieces of hardware than just the one.

There is still two hardware pieces in my theory. The NX I and and NX II. The I will be a self-sufficient portable device capable of working independent of the NX II. The II is a docking station that "unlocks" the beta code (second basic program) and creates the scalable assets needed for high resolutions and more complex algorithms. In theory this would be like a built in cross buy system. My theory has huge wrinkles in it but the basic premise is there. There also may be a Server/Set Top Box required for the long anticipated NINTENDO ON DEMAND STREAMING SERVICES.

Believe you me, Nintendo has plenty of hardware to sell us.  Also I predicted Amiibo (not in name but in design and execution over a year before official announcement... there is a natural progression to Nintendo's thinking and I have cracked the code.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on August 23, 2015, 04:18:16 AM
Dropping physical media would be a retail suicide, as far as I'm concerned. Something Microsoft and Sony actually do well is dominate shelf space in stores like GameStop while Wii U takes up a sad corner. It would only be another nail in the coffin.

Think of all that Wii U and 3DS shelf space that could be amiibo and other Nintendo merchandise! Also, new game discs are a low margin anyway, so Wal-Mart and Target probably wouldn't mind carrying less of those. And GameStop sees the writing on the wall for used game discs.

For Nintendo in particular, they have always kept the size of their games very small relative to their peers. Only games like Bayonetta 2, Super Smash Bros. for Wii U, and Xenoblade Chronicles X break the 10/20 GB barrier.

This has me revisiting a daft idea I had that is a compromise between the all-digital future and retail stores. The idea is kiosks in the store that locally stored the data for a lot of video games. You can purchase games from the kiosk, have it loaded on to your special cartridge, USB stick, or (maybe special?) SD card faster than it would take to download it, and then bring that data back home to your system. Of course, there will be redundancies to ensure the purchase is tied to your Nintendo account; the locally stored data is for those with poor (or maybe no) internet connections. These kiosks can have chain-specific sales too.

I say this is daft because there are security issues, you still have a retailer as a middle-man, you will need to train retail staff to operate and maintain the kiosk, and this process is too complex compared to buying a disc or from the eShop.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 23, 2015, 09:28:53 AM
This has me revisiting a daft idea I had that is a compromise between the all-digital future and retail stores. The idea is kiosks in the store that locally stored the data for a lot of video games. You can purchase games from the kiosk, have it loaded on to your special cartridge, USB stick, or (maybe special?) SD card faster than it would take to download it, and then bring that data back home to your system. Of course, there will be redundancies to ensure the purchase is tied to your Nintendo account; the locally stored data is for those with poor (or maybe no) internet connections. These kiosks can have chain-specific sales too.

I say this is daft because there are security issues, you still have a retailer as a middle-man, you will need to train retail staff to operate and maintain the kiosk, and this process is too complex compared to buying a disc or from the eShop.
I don't think that's a daft idea if only because Nintendo already tried a similar service with the iQue Player in China which was meant to curb piracy in that region (as well as circumvent the now lifted console ban). Perhaps security can be handled similarly to how eshop cards have no value until purchased. Say you buy a download card from the store employee then you go to the kiosk and insert the card like you would an ATM, it reads the barcode (so you're not actually typing anything) then a slot opens for an SD card or USB port.

The main issue I see is how long will it take to copy multiple GBs of data from a kiosk. I recently backed up a few GBs of music onto an SD card and it took 20 minutes. Synching pretty much the same data onto an iPod Touch via USB was much faster. My MacBook Pro is roughly five and a half years old. With newer tech, this may not be a problem. I'm hoping Nintendo adopts USB Type-C.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 23, 2015, 10:43:16 AM
No way Nintendo goes all Digital with this console, no way.


We are not (yet) in a world where all info and advertisements come from online.

Posted by: Enner

For Nintendo in particular, they have always kept the size of their games very small relative to their peers. Only games like Bayonetta 2, Super Smash Bros. for Wii U, and Xenoblade Chronicles X break the 10/20 GB barrier.


If Nintendo wants the NX to succeed they must adapt to the wants of the developers that create content. 50GB should be the standard, which poses a real problem from an all digital standpoint. There are legit Millions of DS, Wii and owners who only have DSL or less. Not a really good option for those folks who could just drive to walmart, gamestop and best buy. Hell I get pretty solid speeds in Philly and I hate having to download and wait.


Welcome Back Cartridges! My old friend, you have been missed.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 23, 2015, 10:49:36 AM
Yeah, designing hardware based on how Nintendo makes games and ignoring what everybody else wants is what got them into this mess in the first place. They need to make something so easy for third parties to work with that they see it as worth porting things to even if they don't expect it to sell huge. Assuming it's going to have physical media, it pretty much has to be discs to fit that criteia.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stratos on August 23, 2015, 11:03:51 AM

This has me revisiting a daft idea I had that is a compromise between the all-digital future and retail stores. The idea is kiosks in the store that locally stored the data for a lot of video games. You can purchase games from the kiosk, have it loaded on to your special cartridge, USB stick, or (maybe special?) SD card faster than it would take to download it, and then bring that data back home to your system. Of course, there will be redundancies to ensure the purchase is tied to your Nintendo account; the locally stored data is for those with poor (or maybe no) internet connections. These kiosks can have chain-specific sales too.

I say this is daft because there are security issues, you still have a retailer as a middle-man, you will need to train retail staff to operate and maintain the kiosk, and this process is too complex compared to buying a disc or from the eShop.
I don't think that's a daft idea if only because Nintendo already tried a similar service with the iQue Player in China which was meant to curb piracy in that region (as well as circumvent the now lifted console ban). Perhaps security can be handled similarly to how eshop cards have no value until purchased. Say you buy a download card from the store employee then you go to the kiosk and insert the card like you would an ATM, it reads the barcode (so you're not actually typing anything) then a slot opens for an SD card or USB port.

The main issue I see is how long will it take to copy multiple GBs of data from a kiosk. I recently backed up a few GBs of music onto an SD card and it took 20 minutes. Synching pretty much the same data onto an iPod Touch via USB was much faster. My MacBook Pro is roughly five and a half years old. With newer tech, this may not be a problem. I'm hoping Nintendo adopts USB Type-C.

Nintendo also used the idea of special re-loadable cartridges in Japan as well with the N64DD. I'm not sure how far it was implemented since the system failed, but that was supposed to be a key concept for the system. I don't see it flying because technology is quickly passing any need for that type of system.


If they truly want to go all digital I see them still supporting retail by shipping boxes that have download codes in them, but no actual discs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 23, 2015, 11:59:32 AM
Furthermore, no big retailer is going to sell hardware and accessories for a console that they can't sell games for.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 23, 2015, 12:09:49 PM
Furthermore, no big retailer is going to sell hardware and accessories for a console that they can't sell games for.

People always say this, and I really don't get the logic. New games at retail have the smallest margins of anything in the game business, whereas they could stand to make good money on hardware and especially peripherals. GameStop wouldn't like it because it would cut off the used market, but most of the big retailers either aren't in that business or treat it as a relatively minor thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 23, 2015, 12:23:20 PM
I will make this prediction. If the patent filing is actually telling us something, and the console actually will not use physical games, then it will run some form of Android. An extremely locked down version of Android, but it will be Android.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stratos on August 23, 2015, 12:40:41 PM
If that leads to better support for Android phones by Nintendo (versus only supporting Apple) then I will be all for it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 23, 2015, 12:49:50 PM
That doesn't strike me as something Nintendo would want to do. They'd want something that was completely theirs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Mop it up on August 23, 2015, 01:53:49 PM
Also this might be the console they are preparing for the new Chinese market.
That's what I was thinking. They've made something similar in the iQue Player for China.

This has me revisiting a daft idea I had that is a compromise between the all-digital future and retail stores. The idea is kiosks in the store that locally stored the data for a lot of video games. You can purchase games from the kiosk, have it loaded on to your special cartridge, USB stick, or (maybe special?) SD card faster than it would take to download it, and then bring that data back home to your system.
I don't think that's a daft idea if only because Nintendo already tried a similar service with the iQue Player in China
Nintendo have also done something similar in Japan with the rewritable cartridge called the Nintendo Power for the SNES and Game Boy. Of course, most of its games were only 1 MB or less back then...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on August 23, 2015, 02:04:13 PM
That doesn't strike me as something Nintendo would want to do. They'd want something that was completely theirs.

I'd be inclined to think so too, but the DeNA partnership thingy is a big question mark in my mind. If it's really embedded in the new systems, I thinks it's possible DeNA would have had some stipulations about using an OS platform that would have some continuity with phones.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 23, 2015, 02:15:26 PM
Yeah, I almost added that as a caveat to my post. If they really trust DeNA to do this for them, and DeNA wants to do it that way, they might go along with it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 23, 2015, 05:49:36 PM
Nintendo has an e-shop section at gamestop for classic games. Nintendo doesn't have to get rid of retail sales, they just have to get rid of discs and boxes. They could just sell cards with activation codes at the store and still occupy the same amount of retail space.

Nintendo could also sell preloaded SD cards, or non write non copy sd cards. Doesn't Nintendo already have a system in place so you cant copy your save files over and use them on a different console?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on August 23, 2015, 06:30:08 PM
Hmm, the Wii U basic was practically a disc only system without a hard drive, and then the premium was geared towards digital with it's extra storage but Nintendo being Nintendo messed it up with only 32 gigs, although the intent was there. Not really anything to do with the patent but a possibility for NX is a similar launch with one with a disc drive and then one without. They could even sell the discless system at a massive loss since all software purchases would be at full price through Nintendo rather than some middle man, and also it would cut down on preowned games sales since a lot of the user base is now exclusively digital.
How did retailers react to the PSP Go?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 23, 2015, 06:44:03 PM
the only 32 gigs argument....you can just buy an sd card or usb stick and it takes care of that problem pretty quickly. These things are a very low price now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 23, 2015, 06:49:39 PM
We are the 1% when it comes to Nintendo. Ask yourself  "Do I want a Nintendo system with no physical format?" Neither do I. I don't want any System without a physical format. As I've said before now is not the time for Nintendo to pioneer but reflect and adjust course.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 23, 2015, 06:50:43 PM
if this was the thing Nintendo was pioneering..thats like better than other things it could pioneer

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B011MLR1RA/ref=olp_product_details?ie=UTF8&me=

is this real?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 23, 2015, 07:26:07 PM
No.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on August 23, 2015, 07:42:18 PM
the only 32 gigs argument....you can just buy an sd card or usb stick and it takes care of that problem pretty quickly. These things are a very low price now.
Well you can't store Wii U games on an SD card since it's only for Wii mode and Smash screenshots for whatever reason. And Nintendo strongly recommends against using USB sticks as storage since there are issues with how many times you can rewrite them.
Last year I managed to get a 500gb harddrive with a y power cable and a white Wii U with 4 games for just under the price of a black premium bundle. I see no noticeable difference between games on the HDD or ones on the flash memory in terms of loading, so yeah I think flash memory was a very silly idea on their part.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: nickmitch on August 23, 2015, 07:54:36 PM
I always thought it was inevitable that all video game systems would go back to cartridges.

Clearly Nintendo is with me on that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 24, 2015, 12:25:38 AM
Nintendo also used the idea of special re-loadable cartridges in Japan as well with the N64DD. I'm not sure how far it was implemented since the system failed, but that was supposed to be a key concept for the system. I don't see it flying because technology is quickly passing any need for that type of system.
It isn't so much the technology's existence itself than it is people's access to it. For those that do not have a fast, consistent connection, store kiosks are pretty much the only viable way to buy games on a console without physical media.
I always thought it was inevitable that all video game systems would go back to cartridges.

Clearly Nintendo is with me on that.
Yeah, I've dealt with discs due to the lack of options. My preference is cards/cartridges. A digital only future is inevitable, but I'd holding onto physical media for as long as I can. I'd be elated if Nintendo went with cards for its next home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 24, 2015, 01:13:44 PM
I won't buy an all-digital console and especially not one that uses any cloud based processing.  That goes for any company, not just Nintendo so I'm not holding them to a special standard.  I figure someday the industry will move in that direction but I'll be older and probably have less time for games anyway.  This concept is pretty similar to what MS first presented for the XB1 and it was so poorly received they completely backpedaled on it.  So Nintendo is now going to bust out concepts that were poison only a few years ago?  And again it's NINTENDO.  The guys that think voicechat is bad are going to suddenly be so competent with online gaming that they're going digital-only?  I'm not saying they won't for sure but you know they would completely **** it up.  If Nintendo is ever going to get up to speed on online stuff it will be noticeable over a period of several years.  They won't go from the clueless dipshits they are today to savvy online-only guys tomorrow.  They could try but they would fail for certain.  I don't think they have enough confidence in the online concept to even want to try that.  If anything I would expect them to continue being followers.  Online in general seems like something they never wanted to do and were more or less forced to by the market.

Yeah, designing hardware based on how Nintendo makes games and ignoring what everybody else wants is what got them into this mess in the first place. They need to make something so easy for third parties to work with that they see it as worth porting things to even if they don't expect it to sell huge. Assuming it's going to have physical media, it pretty much has to be discs to fit that criteia.

I think we're well aware of what they NEED to do but that doesn't mean they'll do it.  If anything doing some goofy Nintendo-specific thing that completely screws up third party support is what I expect.  Should they use discs?  Yes.  Will they?  Beats me.  "That's stupid" is never a valid justification for assuming Nintendo is not doing something.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on August 24, 2015, 01:48:34 PM
I suspect the main reason Nintendo would want to go back to cartridges is that it means 3rd parties have to pay them for the only supply of the stuff. Hard to say one way or the other how I would feel about this patent being NX, especially since it's basically a glorified PSP Go. I prefer physical copies of my games where possible, but assuming the HDD size is right I'm not exactly opposed to a digital-only console. I just don't see the likes of Gamestop and Walmart stocking the thing, and bandwidth isn't really where it needs to be right now to support that kind of console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 24, 2015, 02:52:11 PM
I suspect the main reason Nintendo would want to go back to cartridges is that it means 3rd parties have to pay them for the only supply of the stuff.
Nintendo gets so little support on its consoles that third parties probably aren't factoring much into such a decision. I'd say it has more to do with Nintendo not wanting to have to pay Panasonic for the disc drive and discs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on August 24, 2015, 02:53:06 PM
I could see digital only games because Nintendo loves to try and emulate Apple. Provided the interface to download is as "friendly" or at least as familiar as Apple's is for the average consumer, I could see people being OK with it because they are already used to it. And I can see Nintendo emulating Apple on the hardware side with releasing differently positioned devices (home and handheld) with basically the same OS environment. Just like Apple does with the iPad and the iPhone/iPod.
And retailers have no issues stocking Apple devices and also the iTunes cards that folks use to buy the digital games, music and other Apps. And don't forget, retailers are loving stocking Amiibos and will also probably love stocking the Happy Home Designer cards and similar "Amiibo 2.0" products.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on August 24, 2015, 02:59:17 PM
And retailers have no issues stocking Apple devices and also the iTunes cards that folks use to buy the digital games, music and other Apps. And don't forget, retailers are loving stocking Amiibos and will also probably love stocking the Happy Home Designer cards and similar "Amiibo 2.0" products.

Well, don't forget that Apple releases new versions of their devices every year, so retailers see a lot of new & used hardware sales from Apple. But why should Gamestop stock an NX when they can't sell Used games and Nintendo will probably only release a new hardware version every 2-5 years?

Plus, Apple's more perplexingly popular than Nintendo will likely ever be again, if we're being perfectly honest with ourselves.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 24, 2015, 03:51:53 PM
Target wont sell it flat out. Plus Nintendo knows that the bandwidth  infrastructure for all digital platform is not quite there yet. Also you must remember, retail space and physical media is also advertising. And lets not forget, most Apple downloads aren't near the 50GB mark and that's the future if Nintendo wants 3party support. DLC is one thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 24, 2015, 05:36:52 PM
No one ever sold used Mac software, at least not at a level where their business model pretty much revolves around it.  That's a big difference between Apple and Nintendo.  Unsurprisingly I didn't see record stores where their whole business was selling CDs pushing the **** out of the iPod like the general electronics stores were.

Thinking about it, Nintendo games rarely drop in price so I wouldn't be surprised if for GameStop used Nintendo games probably sell pretty well, at least if you take into account the smaller userbase.  I'm not going to bother to buy a game that it's in the Wal-Mart discount bin used but Nintendo games are practically never in there.  You want a cheaper Mario Kart you get it used.  When the Wii was hot GameStop probably made a killing on parents looking for used first party titles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 24, 2015, 05:40:35 PM
Where do you get the idea that Target won't sell it?  Target sells (or at least sold) Kindles and they are digital only.  They also sell iPads.  Those don't have physical media either.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 24, 2015, 05:50:33 PM
Yeah, if anybody's going to refuse to stock it it'd be GameStop, as it'd kill used games. Even then, I doubt they would. No games means it wouldn't take much shelf space to sell it, so as long as the margins on the hardware and accessories are decent I think they'd carry it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 24, 2015, 07:20:39 PM
Target can be quite petty when it comes to these things. While its not the same thing, When Target was left out on the Beyoncé album that iTunes had first, they refused to sell it at all. Walmart stop selling the kindle... because of "reasons". My point (if there is such a thing) Retailers matter in media until the day the don't, and I don't see that day coming before Nintendo releases the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on August 24, 2015, 07:23:58 PM
I presume Walmart stopped selling the Kindle for the same reason Target stopped selling it: Kindle is owned by Amazon, a direct competitor. People treat brick and mortar stores like Amazon showrooms then buy it for cheaper online.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on August 24, 2015, 07:49:09 PM
Target sold Ouyas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on August 24, 2015, 07:55:54 PM
Bear in mind that Walmart sells used games now, as does Best Buy. I can't see either being happy stocking NX like this, though Best Buy might be happy just getting people in the door these days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: nickmitch on August 24, 2015, 08:43:29 PM
Target can be quite petty when it comes to these things. While its not the same thing, When Target was left out on the Beyoncé album that iTunes had first, they refused to sell it at all. Walmart stop selling the kindle... because of "reasons". My point (if there is such a thing) Retailers matter in media until the day the don't, and I don't see that day coming before Nintendo releases the NX.

Target has a policy where they don't sell albums was were initially released digitally.  It wasn't anything personal against Beyonce.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on August 24, 2015, 10:14:58 PM

Target has a policy where they don't sell albums was were initially released digitally.  It wasn't anything personal against Beyonce.


That fine, but the point remains that Target has had anti-digital tendencies and there has been push back from retailers on digitals since the fall of Tower Records. They gain nothing from it, especially when the ps4 is selling like hotcakes. Unless the NX is some amazing new tech, (HD.AR) or the likes, big box stores have virtually nothing to gain.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: nickmitch on August 24, 2015, 10:29:11 PM
That's a good point.  But Target does sell a whole host of Apple products that digital only.

Retailers can still profit on the hardware and accessories sales.  Plus, there's value to having the foot traffic in the stores.

Not everything sold at a store is sold for a profit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 24, 2015, 10:59:10 PM
Target sold Ouyas.

Bingo. Target would sell a digital-only Nintendo console. Nintendo isn't going to make one though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on August 25, 2015, 12:27:32 AM
It's not digital-only. It's not a hybrid. Great last 2 pages.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stogi on August 25, 2015, 11:19:05 AM
Looking at the patent I really think this is just a new system with a 'GBA player' built-in. The new console and the handheld might share the same media, but you won't be able to play a console game on your handheld.It does, however, offer developers the chance to easily port between both.

So when you come home, if you want to the continue the game you were playing on the train, you can plug it in to the console. And if you want to play your eshop game on the go, you could pay a small fee to do so.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on August 25, 2015, 11:34:28 AM
And lets not forget, most Apple downloads aren't near the 50GB mark and that's the future if Nintendo wants 3party support.
This is a very good point. In fact, pretty much all "Nintendo Retail" and third-party "retail" games (as opposed to "smaller" indie or e-shop games) are in the order of GBs now, aren't they? That is the exception for things downloaded to Apple devices, right?

Unless the NX is some amazing new tech, (HD.AR) or the likes ...
Reading that quickly I saw "(HD.AR)" as saying "hardee har har", as in you commenting on the unlikeliness of Nintendo ever having amazing new tech. :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BlkPaladin on August 25, 2015, 12:40:46 PM
Well Nintendo has just got another US patent, this time for a achievement system/game recording. Though it has a slight chance of being retrofitted for the 3DS and Wii U, we will probably see it on the NX.
http://mynintendonews.com/2015/08/24/nintendo-has-registered-achievement-sharing-with-recording-patent/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on August 25, 2015, 12:49:22 PM
Well Nintendo has just got another US patent, this time for a achievement system/game recording. Though it has a slight chance of being retrofitted for the 3DS and Wii U, we will probably see it on the NX.
http://mynintendonews.com/2015/08/24/nintendo-has-registered-achievement-sharing-with-recording-patent/ (http://mynintendonews.com/2015/08/24/nintendo-has-registered-achievement-sharing-with-recording-patent/)
That patent is for NES remix 2, knowing Nintendo I doubt they will ever really use it again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on September 01, 2015, 09:54:57 AM
Just to add a little more fuel to the fire:

http://www.amazon.com/b/ref=vg_homepage_quicklinks_nintendodigital?ie=UTF8&node=12597678011&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=merchandised-search-leftnav&pf_rd_r=0YSMFKQ3P9BDRZEVQHKM&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=2187870802&pf_rd_i=468642

Amazon is now offering direct digital downloads for Wii U and 3DS. You buy it from Amazon, enter your NNID and the code auto populates. You click redeem and it gets sent directly to your device. Who's to say Nintendo isn't working on this kind of service with other retailers?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on September 01, 2015, 11:55:48 AM
Well Nintendo has just got another US patent, this time for a achievement system/game recording. Though it has a slight chance of being retrofitted for the 3DS and Wii U, we will probably see it on the NX.
http://mynintendonews.com/2015/08/24/nintendo-has-registered-achievement-sharing-with-recording-patent/ (http://mynintendonews.com/2015/08/24/nintendo-has-registered-achievement-sharing-with-recording-patent/)

Is that really something they can patent considering Sony already does that with the PS4?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on September 03, 2015, 05:52:50 PM

This doesn't even qualify as rumor, but on NeoGAF a member posted information about NX, originally in Italian, from someone who says he has sources inside NCL. Very easily could've been completely fabricated. That said, an interesting read:


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=177463814&postcount=2847


Quote
- He's under strict NDA with Nintendo Japan


- Informations are from march 2015, with some updates from june-july


- He received a bunch of patents (some of them are publics now), info about what Nintendo is planning and a list of games potentially in development (some of them may or may not have been cancelled), third parties included


- NX is a platform, not tied with a single device


- Wii U is still in the picture thanks to good software results for games like Splatoon, will still be the main home console in 2016


- 3DS is a bit old, they're planning of replacing it. Some games will still come out on it, but big projects are being moved on portable NX


- With NX, Nintendo wants to create a platform where they can develop software for multiple devices with ease, from the home console to the portable to smartphone and tablets. They'll have a big catalogue available for multiple platforms, with cross buy, cross saves and cross play, similar to what Microsoft is doing with Xbox One and PC thanks to Windows 10 (that allows to play many Xbox games on PC, which is also getting a bunch of ports from Xbone). Each platform will still have exclusive games


- NNID is tied to the single device, but it will allow to share details between platforms, like friend list, contents, local coop games, etc. Thanks to the new membership program (the successor of Club Nintendo), we'll benefit from the new Nintendo policies in terms of rewards


- They'll show the portable in spring 2016, will be out for the end of the year or spring 2017 max. Specs will be higher than PS Vita but nothing mindblowing, screen resolution should be 540p, considering 720p if costs go down. BC with 3DS was problematic


- Wii U successor will not have an optical drive, which will be optional. It will sync with the portable (not obligatory). Specs won't be super high, but close to PS4/X1 (doesn't know how much, like with the portable this is still subject to change anyway). Cross games will look better on the home


- Nintendo is focusing a lot on the anti-piracy system


- Big focus on the OS as well. They hired people that worked for Google on Android, the guys who worked on the Gamecube OS and Wii U browser are there too. Optimized versions of the same OS for every NX platform (think, again, W10), each with its set of specific functions. Updates will come out at the same time, they're focusing on making the OS blazing fast on every platform


- The home console can connect with the portable to send to it its own version of the games you buy, will use the same tech as the Wii U-Wii U Gamepad streaming to do that, or the internet connection


- The home will have bc with the Wii U. Gamepad should be compatible as a controller, considering selling it standalone. Can connect with the portable for offtv and bc. WiiMote compatibility is being considered too. As for support, since the new home won't have an optical drive, they're considering an external one. Also being considered NNID/eShop bc for titles bought on the eShop. Seems they're considering digital games sharing too, but this bit is not perfectly clear


- The portable will have its own internal memory, which will be expandable


- There will be a complete overhaul of online infrastructures, but Nintendo is determined to hold successful operations as Miiverse, extending it even further and making it a central hub for communications by developers and a meeting place for players. It will be even more interactive with the ability to upload videos and screenshots in an integrated system and not dependent on the game


- Voice chat and interactions between users will be revisited too, much will depend on the users age though, to protect the minors


- The home will be out 6-12 months after the portable, creating the "NX system" that will allow Nintendo to better use their resources in games development


- They approached third parties during E3. Capcom, Square-Enix, Ubisoft and Electronic Arts already have devkits. Dragon Quest, Final Fantasy, Sonic, F-Zero and Metroid are in development, doesn't know if these are main episodes or spin offs. Zelda is currently a Wii U only title due to high development costs, but they can reconsider to have another big game at NX launch


- Prices will be low, 200-300€ (for the home?), considering a bundle with both for no more than 500€


- Many of these things will be discussed in future Nintendo Directs, which will have a different host in every market if Nintendo can't find a new CEO by october


- A new 3D Mario will be shown, along with a new Zelda trailer. Retro moved their project on NX, will not be unveiled before 10-18 months


- They'll talk about a new "Club Nintendo", which will be in full function with NX


- Considering making agreements with phone carriers in order to better manage applications like Miiverse, Club Nintendo and the ability to purchase software by phone. Some of these will be out by March 2016


- Is everything set yet? Yes, but with Nintendo you'll never know. If he has updates he will share them with us.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 03, 2015, 06:42:11 PM
I'm not really digging that rumoured design.  It's actually the lack of an optical drive that really turns me off.  If I can't do physical media I won't buy it.  The rumour says it optional so can you buy an external drive?  Doesn't matter anyway.  If that's an optional accessory then most games won't support it.  I want it standard so that the big games pretty much HAVE to have a physical release and it will be indie and niche titles that don't, like we have now.

If Nintendo releases the handheld NX first then the console NX is not going to sell worth a ****.  The sheer idiocy of this company to look at an embarrassing disaster like the Wii U and think "we'll replace THAT one second" just drives me up the wall.  So there will be exclusives but that's just going to make the two systems only sort of necessary.  Nintendo typically has enough exclusive to their handhelds and consoles that it is worth it to own both.  But if it's just a little handful of exclusives for each with most of the content being for both then it isn't really going to be worth the cost to own both.  People will pick one and most of them will pick the handheld because they trust Nintendo handhelds and the handheld is coming FIRST so any killer app will sell handhelds but will be old news if it shows up on the console a year later.  The console should come first and should come out next year.  You want your best titles to have a period of console exclusivity to encourage its sales as the handheld will sell itself to the market that likes handheld games.  "Console gaming on the go" is a selling point, "handheld gaming on your TV" is not.

The rumour sounds plausible (usually they throw in ridiculous over-the-top wish fulfilment stuff but this doesn't have that) but then most of it sounds like stuff that's already been rumoured or is a logical conclusion based on the existing rumours.  So it might be someone that isn't a moron creating a credible forgery.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on September 03, 2015, 07:14:13 PM
Console gaming on the go" is a selling point, "handheld gaming on your TV" is not.

Oh really?

*Metaphorically glances at the Super Gameboy, the GBA & DS games on the Wii U VC, and the copy of Danganronpa: Another Episode - Ultra Despair Girls he's currently playing on his Vita TV.*
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on September 03, 2015, 07:22:01 PM
That sounds quite reasonable as far as rumours go. However one thing I just can't get my head around is the lack of an optical disc drive, just why? I really don't understand, are they too expensive for Nintendo now in this authors fantasy land? Games just sell more at retail than they do on the eshop, it's just a fact. I'm sure Nintendo could give consumers the option to go digital only with a cheaper sku, but to force people to get N or get out just seems like suicide and goes against what makes Nintendo Nintendo.

The piece of evidence that damns this for me though is backwards compatibility, I would not be able to accept a reality in which Nintendo goes through the tremondous monolithic amount of effort and money to make the NX backwards compatible with Wii U, but you can only play your physical games through the use of an external optical disc drive. Hahahahahahah no.

On another note I think the hand held being replaced before the console isn't stupid. The 3ds came out basically 2 years before the Wii U came out, plans get set in motion and schedules are planned out years in advance. It's not as simple as "Oh no we need a new console, better stay up and design one up overnight!" Nintendo would have realised that the Wii U was a failure and beyond saving around December 2013, if the theoretical NX console isn't ready before the theoretical NX handheld then there is nothing they can do about that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 03, 2015, 07:54:26 PM
Console gaming on the go" is a selling point, "handheld gaming on your TV" is not.

Oh really?

*Metaphorically glances at the Super Gameboy, the GBA & DS games on the Wii U VC, and the copy of Danganronpa: Another Episode - Ultra Despair Girls he's currently playing on his Vita TV.*

I think the fact my brother just bought a Vita TV in clearance for $50 and it came with a PS3 controller demonstrates my point pretty well. :)

I like playing handhelds on my TV but I don't think it's a big selling point.  Plus there is very much the idea that handheld games are scaled down and "inferior" to console games.  So if Nintendo released some new Mario game on the NX handheld first and then a few months it showed up for the NX console launch I worry it would be seen as a handheld game and thus the NX console (already I'm seeing a major annoyance in this naming convention) is offering "inferior" handheld games while the competition has "real" console games designed specifically for consoles and not compromised in any way to accommodate handheld limitations.

Increased hardware doesn't just make the graphics prettier.  It allows for more items on screen and larger areas and more complicated AI and physics.  Go play some HD remaster of a PS2-era game and while the graphics look nice you'll notice that everything else seems somewhat subdued compared to the large open areas of current console games.  Play a game like MGS: Peace Walker on the PS3 and it is obvious that it was originally designed for the PSP.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 03, 2015, 11:09:14 PM

This doesn't even qualify as rumor,


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=177463814&postcount=2847 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=177463814&postcount=2847)


Quote

LOTS O STUFFS









This is pretty much what I've been saying. I think you can bank 75% of this as rock solid.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: azeke on September 03, 2015, 11:29:56 PM
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=177463814&postcount=2847
According to this rumour NX project is enormous, a Project Manhattan of gaming.

On hardware side Nintendo has to marry directly contradicting demands of handhelds and home console in one standard with possibility to build multiple SKU from it.

OS alone should take them many, many years. Especially if they want to make it fast from the get go.

This all sounds like a lot of wishful thinking.

Reminds me of gif from a few years back, during similar Project Cafe rumour frenzy:
(http://www.twinfinite.net/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/Ruby-Rhod.gif)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on September 03, 2015, 11:36:33 PM
I remember that gif, it was and still is absolutely F'ing hilarious.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on September 03, 2015, 11:44:00 PM
What's funny about that GIF now is that most of those games listed are on PS4 now. :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: azeke on September 03, 2015, 11:53:32 PM
^ also on my years old PC rig ;p

Gotta love x86 architecture.

I think it's crucial NX to be one as well, otherwise at this point you can kiss third parties goodbye.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on September 04, 2015, 03:59:21 AM
That laundry list mostly has things that sound good and what is desired with very few potential **** ups (no disc drive, heavy focus on anti-piracy). Which means I think it is complete horseshit, because we all know there has to be at least one obvious **** up for it to be a Nintendo console.

But it is nice to dream.

The piece of evidence that damns this for me though is backwards compatibility, I would not be able to accept a reality in which Nintendo goes through the tremondous monolithic amount of effort and money to make the NX backwards compatible with Wii U, but you can only play your physical games through the use of an external optical disc drive. Hahahahahahah no.


That to me makes the most sense given Nintendo's goal of having evergreen titles. If they can't sell Wii Us, Nintendo will definitely try to sell Wii U games for backwards compatibility. Obviously, not in a way that makes sense to us, but I will be surprised if Super Mario Maker and Mario Kart 8 are unplayable on the NX Home. As for the external optical drive, Nintendo would love to sell accessories and would bundle a game/amiibo with that thing.

Lastly, the Wii U GamePad would have to be compatible somehow because of amiibo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on September 04, 2015, 08:48:01 AM
The rumor doesn't take any major leaps of faith which makes it sound believable, but I don't know, something feels off. It seems reactionary to recent news perhaps in an attempt to seem more legitimate.
If they can't sell Wii Us, Nintendo will definitely try to sell Wii U games for backwards compatibility. Obviously, not in a way that makes sense to us, but I will be surprised if Super Mario Maker and Mario Kart 8 are unplayable on the NX Home. As for the external optical drive, Nintendo would love to sell accessories and would bundle a game/amiibo with that thing.
Considering how many people haven't played some of Wii U's best titles, I wouldn't be shocked if Nintendo releases NX versions of at least Splatoon, Mario Kart 8, and Super Smash Bros. for Wii U with all DLC included and maybe some extras (like including Ice Climbers in SSB) for $40 or $50 at/around launch. I know I'd say, "Ugh, not you too, Nintendo," then just buy the games anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 04, 2015, 01:28:10 PM
When does Nintendo re-release Mario Kart and SSB games outside of the VC?  They just make a new one.  What the hell does Mario Kart 8 have that is so damn essential that Mario Kart 9 won't have.  When Nintendo did the NPC titles on the Wii they didn't have NPC SSB Melee or NPC Double Dash.

Splatoon I could see a re-release because it was something brand new for only the Wii U.  Super Mario Maker would make sense but doesn't it really need the Gamepad?  I can't see that being standard issue even if they include backwards compatibility.  Any Wii U game that gets a "remaster" would need to be something that works on a normal controller.  If you have to have the optional Gamepad to play it that's niche enough they might as well sell you the Wii U version.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on September 04, 2015, 02:43:43 PM
Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. It isn't unreasonable to think Nintendo would consider leveraging some of Wii U's big titles to give NX more games at or around launch. Mario Kart 9 is the only sequel I could see Nintendo being ready because it released the last round of DLC a while ago, but if not, re-releasing a quality game a lot of people didn't play isn't a bad move. Just making a new Super Smash Bros. like you suggested is much easier said than done. Keep in mind Nintendo admittedly almost re-released Melee on Wii with online support had Sakurai not returned for Brawl so Nintendo at least considered a re-release. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U was in development for over two and a half years, was released incomplete, and the team is still working on content. At this rate, the soonest Nintendo could get a new Super Smash Bros out is 2018 and that's assuming Sakurai finishes DLC for the current Super Smash Bros. and immediately moves on to a sequel. He left HAL Labs because he didn't want to do that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 04, 2015, 04:44:29 PM
Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. It isn't unreasonable to think Nintendo would consider leveraging some of Wii U's big titles to give NX more games at or around launch. Mario Kart 9 is the only sequel I could see Nintendo being ready because it released the last round of DLC a while ago, but if not, re-releasing a quality game a lot of people didn't play isn't a bad move. Just making a new Super Smash Bros. like you suggested is much easier said than done. Keep in mind Nintendo admittedly almost re-released Melee on Wii with online support had Sakurai not returned for Brawl so Nintendo at least considered a re-release. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U was in development for over two and a half years, was released incomplete, and the team is still working on content. At this rate, the soonest Nintendo could get a new Super Smash Bros out is 2018 and that's assuming Sakurai finishes DLC for the current Super Smash Bros. and immediately moves on to a sequel. He left HAL Labs because he didn't want to do that.

Yeah, it still could happen.  Though I suspect Nintendo hasn't done that sort of thing with Mario Kart and SSB because they figure having more than one title in those series on the same platform will dilute the series or hurt sales in some way.  And what could they even call a SSB port?  The game's name is literally Super Smash Bros. for Wii U!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Louieturkey on September 04, 2015, 06:14:44 PM
Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. It isn't unreasonable to think Nintendo would consider leveraging some of Wii U's big titles to give NX more games at or around launch. Mario Kart 9 is the only sequel I could see Nintendo being ready because it released the last round of DLC a while ago, but if not, re-releasing a quality game a lot of people didn't play isn't a bad move. Just making a new Super Smash Bros. like you suggested is much easier said than done. Keep in mind Nintendo admittedly almost re-released Melee on Wii with online support had Sakurai not returned for Brawl so Nintendo at least considered a re-release. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U was in development for over two and a half years, was released incomplete, and the team is still working on content. At this rate, the soonest Nintendo could get a new Super Smash Bros out is 2018 and that's assuming Sakurai finishes DLC for the current Super Smash Bros. and immediately moves on to a sequel. He left HAL Labs because he didn't want to do that.

Yeah, it still could happen.  Though I suspect Nintendo hasn't done that sort of thing with Mario Kart and SSB because they figure having more than one title in those series on the same platform will dilute the series or hurt sales in some way.  And what could they even call a SSB port?  The game's name is literally Super Smash Bros. for Wii U!
They'll call it Super Smash Bros. For NX (or whatever the final name of the system becomes). 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 04, 2015, 07:03:04 PM
They could call it Super Smash Bros. for Wii U for NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 04, 2015, 07:08:14 PM
Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. It isn't unreasonable to think Nintendo would consider leveraging some of Wii U's big titles to give NX more games at or around launch. Mario Kart 9 is the only sequel I could see Nintendo being ready because it released the last round of DLC a while ago, but if not, re-releasing a quality game a lot of people didn't play isn't a bad move. Just making a new Super Smash Bros. like you suggested is much easier said than done. Keep in mind Nintendo admittedly almost re-released Melee on Wii with online support had Sakurai not returned for Brawl so Nintendo at least considered a re-release. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U was in development for over two and a half years, was released incomplete, and the team is still working on content. At this rate, the soonest Nintendo could get a new Super Smash Bros out is 2018 and that's assuming Sakurai finishes DLC for the current Super Smash Bros. and immediately moves on to a sequel. He left HAL Labs because he didn't want to do that.

Yeah, it still could happen.  Though I suspect Nintendo hasn't done that sort of thing with Mario Kart and SSB because they figure having more than one title in those series on the same platform will dilute the series or hurt sales in some way.  And what could they even call a SSB port?  The game's name is literally Super Smash Bros. for Wii U!
They'll call it Super Smash Bros. For NX (or whatever the final name of the system becomes). 

That name is reserved for the SSB designed specifically for the NX.  Oh wait, no, they could just call that one New Super Smash Bros. for NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on September 04, 2015, 07:14:07 PM
Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. It isn't unreasonable to think Nintendo would consider leveraging some of Wii U's big titles to give NX more games at or around launch. Mario Kart 9 is the only sequel I could see Nintendo being ready because it released the last round of DLC a while ago, but if not, re-releasing a quality game a lot of people didn't play isn't a bad move. Just making a new Super Smash Bros. like you suggested is much easier said than done. Keep in mind Nintendo admittedly almost re-released Melee on Wii with online support had Sakurai not returned for Brawl so Nintendo at least considered a re-release. Super Smash Bros. for Wii U was in development for over two and a half years, was released incomplete, and the team is still working on content. At this rate, the soonest Nintendo could get a new Super Smash Bros out is 2018 and that's assuming Sakurai finishes DLC for the current Super Smash Bros. and immediately moves on to a sequel. He left HAL Labs because he didn't want to do that.

Yeah, it still could happen.  Though I suspect Nintendo hasn't done that sort of thing with Mario Kart and SSB because they figure having more than one title in those series on the same platform will dilute the series or hurt sales in some way.  And what could they even call a SSB port?  The game's name is literally Super Smash Bros. for Wii U!
They'll call it Super Smash Bros. For NX (or whatever the final name of the system becomes). 

That name is reserved for the SSB designed specifically for the NX.  Oh wait, no, they could just call that one New Super Smash Bros. for NX.

Following the tradition of stupid Japanese names (seriously, you should see how much of their anime follows this format), "Super Smash Bros.: The NX"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Evan_B on September 04, 2015, 08:50:15 PM
What if Super Smash Bros. For Wii U will be THE last Smash Bros, and they'll just port it to each new system updating modes and DLC characters, renaming it for the next platform?

I'm just screwing around.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 04, 2015, 09:04:46 PM
Stop this madness ....besides we all know that "for Wii U" is just a pun on 4.


Behold SUPER SMASH BROTHERS 4NX!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: broodwars on September 04, 2015, 09:28:48 PM
Stop this madness ....besides we all know that "for Wii U" is just a pun on 4.


Behold SUPER SMASH BROTHERS 4NX!

No, it's SUPER SMASH BROTHER5 :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 04, 2015, 09:44:24 PM
Too Sm5sh Too 4urious
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Caterkiller on September 09, 2015, 12:12:07 PM
Too Sm5sh Too 4urious

Ahahahaha! This guy!

Ever since the ballot was announced I figured we would be getting SUPER Super Smash Bros NX Turbo Alpha & Knuckles. These 2 games started work in March of 2012! 2012! Both games are released and work will not finish until early 2016 at the earliest! If the ballot ends in October and they haven't decided everyone they are choosing yet it will take at least 6 months to finish all that up. (Honestly I'm certain they knew exactly who they would add 2 months after the ballot opened)

Still that is a ton work for the both games but especially the HD version that probably didn't get nearly as much sales as it deserved.

Remember that Smash 6 jobs listing that listed before the games even released? I have a good feeling that was for the DLC right now as well as getting ready for the super short Wii U life cycle. The massive amount of work that went into this game will be ported over to the NX. It will be the deluxe edition. All stages from both versions, a few new stages, Ice Climbers, 5-10 brand new characters, a few new modes, some new music, and all the DLC we have now right out of the box.

I just feel like too much work went into these games(and has yet to finish) to move on to a brand new Smash within the next 2 or 3 years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ymeegod on September 09, 2015, 04:53:42 PM
Still believe the NX is a portable system.  The 3DS lineup (2016) is pretty damn sparse (one paper Mario game, an Zelda port, and the late translation Fire Emblem) which usually means Nintendo's gearing up for a change. 

Specs, I would place an portable system close to the power of the PS3/WIIU and top res to be no more than 720P. What's going be new--GPS, and maybe a phone contract service plan. 

Price point, $250 with one game and 16GB card.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 09, 2015, 10:46:14 PM
Still believe the NX is a portable system.  The 3DS lineup (2016) is pretty damn sparse (one paper Mario game, an Zelda port, and the late translation Fire Emblem) which usually means Nintendo's gearing up for a change. 

Specs, I would place an portable system close to the power of the PS3/WIIU and top res to be no more than 720P. What's going be new--GPS, and maybe a phone contract service plan. 

Price point, $250 with one game and 16GB card.

It most definitely is a handheld and it will be released next year,  however what s becoming increasingly more obvious is NX is more Nintendo's iOS than the name of a console. I'm starting to think that the naming convention of both devices will be the same.  EX. Handheld = DSX,  Console =NEX


Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Shaymin on September 09, 2015, 10:56:40 PM
Don't forget the 2016 Game of the Year (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/game/40470/metroid-prime-federation-force-nintendo-3ds) and the inevitable anniversary Pokemon game, plus there's always a shock localization or two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on September 10, 2015, 09:45:18 AM
Localizing Rhythm Heaven The Best will not be a shock...I hope...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 10, 2015, 01:05:04 PM
Replacing the successful system first while leaving the unsuccessful one to fester for another year is stupid... so I'm starting to become convinced that that IS Nintendo's course of action.  The best way to predict Nintendo is to think of what you would very specifically NOT do if you were calling the shots.

What happens if their next handheld for whatever reason struggles?  Remember how the 3DS initially didn't do to well.  So imagine that occurring while the Wii U struggles for another year.  What kind of profits does Nintendo show for that year?

It seems clear that there is a unified strategy for both platforms this next time around.  If the first one fails they likely will need to rework the other one to avoid the same fate.  What if the NX concept has some key feature that is a complete disaster?  If the handheld introduces the concept first and it bombs then they don't have anything solid to fall back on.  If they did the console first and it bombed they could hang on with the 3DS for a bit while they rethink their strategy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 10, 2015, 08:20:43 PM
The rumor that it is a platform and not a console could mean that they could update firmware to make the Wii U compatible or the 3DS compatible.  Let's say they update the handheld first.  The new handheld is around as powerful as the Wii U, however, the screen is smaller and the OS is crazy efficient, so that the CPU and RAM usage is better.  Now imagine if Nintendo do this and then upgrade the Wii U allowing the new NX platform/OS to be installed on the current Wii U while making memory usage more efficient and adding the immediate benefit of cross platform compatibility using the new handheld has a secondary tablet controller, adding system wide voice chat in the OS so that it is compatible with all games and much more...while still being able to play Wii U games.  I believe all this is possible.  That would give Nintendo a chance to have another year with Wii U on the market with some final games being released on the system.  It gives Nintendo a year for the new handheld to be out, and for Nintendo to update and fix any unforeseen problems with the new OS before the big console release.  Then in 2017, Nintendo can release a new console...it will be affordable but powerful, capable of playing Wii U games, the new portable games, and finally the new console games.     
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 10, 2015, 08:50:20 PM
The rumor that it is a platform and not a console could mean that they could update firmware to make the Wii U compatible or the 3DS compatible.  Let's say they update the handheld first.  The new handheld is around as powerful as the Wii U, however, the screen is smaller and the OS is crazy efficient, so that the CPU and RAM usage is better.  Now imagine if Nintendo do this and then upgrade the Wii U allowing the new NX platform/OS to be installed on the current Wii U while making memory usage more efficient and adding the immediate benefit of cross platform compatibility using the new handheld has a secondary tablet controller, adding system wide voice chat in the OS so that it is compatible with all games and much more...while still being able to play Wii U games.  I believe all this is possible.  That would give Nintendo a chance to have another year with Wii U on the market with some final games being released on the system.  It gives Nintendo a year for the new handheld to be out, and for Nintendo to update and fix any unforeseen problems with the new OS before the big console release.  Then in 2017, Nintendo can release a new console...it will be affordable but powerful, capable of playing Wii U games, the new portable games, and finally the new console games.   




Very solid. Introduce a Brand New OS that can be scaled to current working tech. Seems difficult but very plausible. Nintendo seems to believe in the "tech" of the Wii U (Maybe to a fault) and if this is indeed possible, it would be very "Apple" like. Including old hardware in new tech is a very "blue ocean" type strategy. Building the "NX" brand to include multiple devices is a dangerous but logical step,
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 10, 2015, 08:56:31 PM
Also, if NX has a monthly streaming service that can be a Netflix meets the shop and that service is scalable to all NX devices...well, that will be an interesting day.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 10, 2015, 09:08:15 PM
They have completely different hardware architecture, that would not work unless there was some (seriously performance degrading) CPU emulation going on. The OS doesn't matter. A program that runs on Red Hat on an x86 is not going to run Red Hat on a PS3 unless it's recompiled for the Cell processor. Even if this was possible, then the new OS would still have to be compatible with all preexisting games and apps on both systems (and the old DS). This would also be a terrible idea on its own in general. A new console family with a new OS and similar architecture would be great.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 10, 2015, 10:06:21 PM
They have completely different hardware architecture, that would not work unless there was some (seriously performance degrading) CPU emulation going on.




What has different architecture? Wii U and 3DS, or the 2 NX platforms? I can understand discounting the 3DS in the NX equation, adding BC to the next handheld can be added through a different method. However I firmly believe the Wii U could be added to the  "NX" platform. Most rumors point to the console being a "4k WiiU" (not in terms of output but an extension of existing tech) It could absolutely be done.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 10, 2015, 10:33:28 PM
I guess I misread what Spak-Spang was saying. I read it as a new OS for the 3DS *and* the Wii U as being what NX will be. But to answer the question, Wii U and 3DS have completely different architecture. Sure if they made a new console that had similar architecture as the Wii U, then they could do an OS upgrade on the Wii U (or just do the same OS with a different look on the new console) to make games compatible with both consoles, but that seems extremely unlikely. Sure that would be possible, but the new console would either have to be yet anther extension of the tired GameCube architecture, or again, CPU emulation on the new console. After all, that's basically what they did with the GameCube, Wii, and Wii U, as well as the DS and 3DS (same hardware architecture, not emulation).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 11, 2015, 12:59:07 PM
Well Nintendo can stick with the Cube architecture which benefits literally themselves alone and then the third party support can continue to be virtually non-existent or they can go with x86 architecture and stand a chance of getting including in multiplatform development.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 11, 2015, 01:02:33 PM
That was my point. I imagine AMD is going to cut Nintendo off at this point though, unless they go with x86-64 in their next console. I think Nintendo would be wise to partner with Intel and/or Nvidia on their next console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 11, 2015, 08:43:27 PM
Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the Xbox360 based on the PowerPC and the Xbox One based on x86?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 11, 2015, 10:11:19 PM
Yes, and the original Xbox is x86, which is why there was originally no BC on the XBone, and very limited BC on the 360, and the reason there is no BC on the PS4 (PSX, PS2, PS3 are all PowerPC, PS4 is x86).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 11, 2015, 10:47:57 PM
So if  Microsoft can have BC on 360 to ONE whats to say Nintendo can't have BC on Wii U to NX(HOME) even if they change to an x86 platform...which I agree they should really consider.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 13, 2015, 03:41:37 PM
I didn't say they couldn't have it, it would just be difficult. The NX console would also have to either support the Wii U Gamepad, or have a gamepad nearly identical to it that uses the same protocols. It's probably not a very good idea to build upon the Wii U, after all, the userbase is pretty low, so limiting your system architecture, or spending the resources on allowing BC probably wouldn't be worth the effort. Wii U is a Nintendo-base user console, so they'll mostly be sold on the next console already.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 13, 2015, 04:30:39 PM
I didn't say they couldn't have it, it would just be difficult. The NX console would also have to either support the Wii U Gamepad, or have a gamepad nearly identical to it that uses the same protocols. It's probably not a very good idea to build upon the Wii U, after all, the userbase is pretty low, so limiting your system architecture, or spending the resources on allowing BC probably wouldn't be worth the effort. Wii U is a Nintendo-base user console, so they'll mostly be sold on the next console already.


Gotcha. I do think Nintendo will build on what they have with the Wii U, including the Gamepad. With that being said I think the NX will not require the Gamepad and also provide an improved HD option. The tech used in the GamePad isn't a problem as far as compatibly. I believe (as well as Nintendo) that the Wii U's failure was not due to tech for a either or standpoint (x86, AMD. PowerPc) but from a lack of robustness of that tech (lack of usable ram and OS) and software that shows the point


But for the sake of arguments, lets say Nintendo goes with IBM one more time, the benefits of that decision based merely on a technical standpoint and not looking at what the competition does could be quite nice. Graphically you could achieve similar results to the PS4/XBONE and even mid range alienware alpha with cheaper components and still keep your BC since the that chipset requires less robust RAM. (Still would require 4GB DDR5 dedicated to the CPU/GPU). Not sure about the NX Handheld and that makes me worry about how the 2 will interact





Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 13, 2015, 04:41:20 PM
The new system really needs to be x86 to have any hope of third party support. Whatever benefits there might be to sticking with the same architecture pale in comparison to what they'd stand to lose.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 13, 2015, 04:43:14 PM
x86 is holding technology back as a whole.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 13, 2015, 04:48:27 PM
That's true in some respects, but in terms of gaming that's the standard right now and developers aren't going to go out of their way to support Nintendo consoles given their historically weak third party sales, so they need to accommodate them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on September 13, 2015, 07:44:50 PM
Isn't there some emerging legal issue regarding the patents or somesuch behind x86 that's going to potentially cause a big shift away from it as a PC standard?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on September 14, 2015, 02:52:28 AM
Hey, who knows. Maybe the NX consoles will be powered by ARM architecture.

(DISTANT SCREAMING)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 14, 2015, 03:22:45 AM
Hey, who knows. Maybe the NX consoles will be powered by ARM architecture.

(DISTANT SCREAMING)

If they were going to insist on doing something other than x86 for some insane reason, that'd at least be a better choice than iterating on the GameCube a third time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 14, 2015, 11:01:40 AM

If they were going to insist on doing something other than x86 for some insane reason, that'd at least be a better choice than iterating on the GameCube a third time.






That is crazy  talk my friend. You want 3rd party support form the mobile void? Maybe NX Handheld but no way in hell for the Home Console!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on September 14, 2015, 03:12:30 PM
this is all crazy talk. The cpu type wont matter much in this upcoming generation. If NX can manage to have better graphics than ps3 and xboxone then it will be fine. If not, than no 3rd party support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 14, 2015, 03:42:54 PM
I think the real important thing is that some very specific effort is made to try to win third parties back.  They should be acknowledging that they have completely fucked that up over the last few generations and that it should be the top priority to fix that.  With the Wii U it comes across like they just designed the thing primarily for their own personal needs and if third parties could shoehorn in, great.  They stand a chance to improve it if they actually make some real effort to do so.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 14, 2015, 04:06:50 PM
With the Wii U it comes across like they just designed the thing primarily for their own personal needs and if third parties could shoehorn in, great. 


Yup. They built a "My first HD console." And this is coming from a staunch Wii U supporter. They took such a "good enough" approach that by the time they figured out the tech, It was already 3 years outta date. With that being said, IAN GO BUY A WII U NOW!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stratos on September 14, 2015, 04:42:30 PM
Agreed. There are enough games on the system to justify the purchase. And since it is in a poor sales position a lot of the best games are heavily discounted if you look in the right places.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on September 15, 2015, 04:26:57 AM
Maybe this is what NX is? NX could be basically a ps4 equivalent powered system with a mobile controller. The controller when away from the system can play games. The controller uses SD cards and games can be transferred from console to controller. When playing games on the controller the graphics are downgraded to about Ouya/WiiU quality. Price $500

Basically what would happen if you bought an upgraded DS and Wii U system, but they're just bundled together and the games work on both systems.

Also new advantages would be...multiscreen play, more co-op modes, no worry about reach for netflix. The thing has a wifi connection too.

this works into the nx operating thing because of scalable games.   NX home, NX mobile. They could sale the NX mobile separately to people who don't want the console.

Also gives Nintendo a chance to get into the mobile market(phones not this thing) and not feel guilty for abandoning its cash cow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 15, 2015, 08:55:00 AM
Maybe this is what NX is? NX could be basically a ps4 equivalent powered system with a mobile controller. The controller when away from the system can play games. The controller uses SD cards and games can be transferred from console to controller. When playing games on the controller the graphics are downgraded to about Ouya/WiiU quality. Price $500

Basically what would happen if you bought an upgraded DS and Wii U system, but they're just bundled together and the games work on both systems.

Also new advantages would be...multiscreen play, more co-op modes, no worry about reach for netflix. The thing has a wifi connection too.

this works into the nx operating thing because of scalable games.   NX home, NX mobile. They could sale the NX mobile separately to people who don't want the console.

Also gives Nintendo a chance to get into the mobile market(phones not this thing) and not feel guilty for abandoning its cash cow.




Yup! Just add a switch on The NX II to switch from Handheld mode to controller mode and we're in business. (switch could be virtual)


Also, I am now expecting AR HD/4k from Nintendo.


Having  HD/4K AR is a lot more feasible since what ever device is rendering the frame doesn't have to do an entire 1980 x 1080p screen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 15, 2015, 01:24:22 PM
Perm, that is an awesome idea!  The only problem I see is the price might be too high.  Essentially they're forcing someone to buy both the handheld and console at the same time when they might just want one.  I think some ability to buy just the handheld needs to be available for parents wanting to buy their kids an inexpensive handheld for Pokémon.  The idea needs good marketing too to really make people aware of how the one system serves as a handheld and console.

Of course Nintendo is totally not going to do this.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on September 15, 2015, 04:10:50 PM
but what if they stumbled upon it on accident? I can imagine the R&D people being like just screwing around with the WiiU remote and throwing some power in it and then being like...hey?!!

As far as the price...that's how much Xbox one cost when it came out. I don't like the price, but if I were predicting Nintendo's systems have been continually going up since Wii. They could sell the system separately for $300, but it would only come with a WiiU pro controller.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 17, 2015, 05:25:55 PM
New Rumor:


New Nintendo patent reveals shoulder button that also scroll on GamePad lite type controller.
(http://images.nintendolife.com/news/2015/09/new_nintendo_controller_patent_features_scrollable_and_clickable_shoulder_buttons/attachment/0/630x)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on September 17, 2015, 05:59:47 PM
I don't think that resembles the NX controller, It seems like it 's just a generic controller they slapped together that uses very simple geometry to get the point across. Patent illustrations are never exactly works of art and the Wii U gamepad is just very easy to draw compared to something like a pro controller.

I see this as a cool feature they could easily include in the next device without adding much to the cost, not every game would use it but it's an extra feature you can put on the box. It would integrate well with the next web browser, you could use it to zoom in and out with a camera, switch weapons quickly in a shooter and maybe even use it for Atari 2600 games for the virtual console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 17, 2015, 06:51:34 PM
Nintendo has entered the videogame equivalent of the Tyson Zone (maybe it should be the Mr. Dream Zone).  For those unaware the Tyson Zone is when a celebrity (ie: Mike Tyson) has such a reputation for being wild and crazy and you can make up anything about them and it sounds plausible.  While Nintendo isn't quite at that stage, in regards to general competency within the videogame industry they are at that point where the most ludicrous and idiotic ideas sound plausible.

So the NX being literally just the Wii U with a new hat scrolling L&R buttons would be such an idiotic idea but because Nintendo is in the Mr. Dream Zone it sounds totally like something they would do.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on September 17, 2015, 07:21:16 PM
It seems like the patent is purely for the scrolling L and R buttons (which also include some kind of rotor mechanism for feedback), and would probably be included in both forms of NX if they're as share-y as is speculated. They just used a generic Gamepad/Gameboy type thing for the mock-up, it would be dumb to think they'd relay any more information in a patent application than they had to.

Also, it seems like a cool idea, like a less extreme version of the Steam controller.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Mop it up on September 17, 2015, 07:24:22 PM
What does it mean to "scroll" for a button? Is it like the scroll wheel on a computer mouse?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 17, 2015, 09:39:41 PM
Let's just state for the record: NINTENDO STOLE MY IDEA

You know what I would like added to a controller? A scroll wheel, like off of a mouse. Maybe put it where the Z button is. So instead of having to use the directional pad to go through inventory, you can use the much easier wheel.

And I'm sure Miyamoto would find clever new uses for it as well.
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=9337.75 (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=9337.75)

I knew Nintendo read these forums!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Adrock on September 17, 2015, 09:55:06 PM
What does it mean to "scroll" for a button? Is it like the scroll wheel on a computer mouse?
That's what I was thinking. I'm having a hard time imagining myself using such functionality in a game as I never press down on the scroll wheel on my mouse. The problem may be that I'm comparing it to something that isn't used for gaming purposes. I held a Gamecube controller (since it has the largest L/R buttons of any Nintendo controller), and there's definitely room for additional functionality. And let's not forget that patents regularly go unused.


Companies keep trying new things with controllers, and I appreciate the effort. Sony had pressure sensitive face buttons for two generations before deciding no one actually used them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 17, 2015, 10:41:15 PM
I think a scroll wheel could be a very interesting mechanic for certain games.  Imagine, a realistic shooter where you focus the sniper gun.  Or you could use it to set an exact speed in racing games.   Or you could use it for precision aiming. 

Ok...I can't think of that many ideas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on September 17, 2015, 10:52:43 PM
I can see this happening, but think its a terrible idea.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 18, 2015, 01:14:12 AM
Blue sparks in Mario Kart just got sparkier!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 18, 2015, 01:49:07 PM
If Nintendo is making some game and they're thinking "how do we map this mechanic to the controller" and a scroll wheel seems like the way to do it then I'm all for this.  That's how the N64 analog stick came about.  I don't like this Wii/DS approach where they're thinking "what if we added.... THIS?!" and then they assume that some new controller doodad is going to inspire all sorts of great ideas but it doesn't and we just get it forced into games where it isn't needed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 18, 2015, 03:11:04 PM
If Nintendo is making some game and they're thinking "how do we map this mechanic to the controller" and a scroll wheel seems like the way to do it then I'm all for this.  That's how the N64 analog stick came about.  I don't like this Wii/DS approach where they're thinking "what if we added.... THIS?!" and then they assume that some new controller doodad is going to inspire all sorts of great ideas but it doesn't and we just get it forced into games where it isn't needed.




To be fair, the only time their "innovation" with a controller didn't inspire was the Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 18, 2015, 03:40:16 PM
If Nintendo is making some game and they're thinking "how do we map this mechanic to the controller" and a scroll wheel seems like the way to do it then I'm all for this.  That's how the N64 analog stick came about.  I don't like this Wii/DS approach where they're thinking "what if we added.... THIS?!" and then they assume that some new controller doodad is going to inspire all sorts of great ideas but it doesn't and we just get it forced into games where it isn't needed.




To be fair, the only time their "innovation" with a controller didn't inspire was the Wii U.

And even then, it's had its positives. Super Mario Maker wouldn't work without the GamePad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 18, 2015, 03:43:51 PM
If Nintendo is making some game and they're thinking "how do we map this mechanic to the controller" and a scroll wheel seems like the way to do it then I'm all for this.  That's how the N64 analog stick came about.  I don't like this Wii/DS approach where they're thinking "what if we added.... THIS?!" and then they assume that some new controller doodad is going to inspire all sorts of great ideas but it doesn't and we just get it forced into games where it isn't needed.




To be fair, the only time their "innovation" with a controller didn't inspire was the Wii U.

I personally disagree but no matter what there are always really lame tech demo-ish growing pains which you don't get from a natural controller evolution.  This approach is where dumb **** like blowing into the mic comes from.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: EasyCure on September 18, 2015, 04:14:25 PM
I think a scroll wheel could be a very interesting mechanic for certain games.  Imagine, a realistic shooter where you focus the sniper gun.  Or you could use it to set an exact speed in racing games.   Or you could use it for precision aiming. 

Ok...I can't think of that many ideas.

-Adjusting zoom for a scope / on-screen maps
     -Shooters: Would allow for mobility (left stick) and aiming (right stick) if zoom was controlled by the scroll wheel.
     -Open world games: Assuming there's no Gamepad like device with a screen (and even if there was) you could zoom in/out of a map without interrupting the action



-Inventory scrolling / scrolling through abilities
     -Shooters: Scroll through weapons (assuming you have scroll wheels on each shoulder, left could be for grenade types / right could be for main weapons)
     -Xenoblade: scroll through your skills while still being able to move your character
     -Zelda: do away with the point and click, scroll through your items and click to select

-Misc. Functions / "gimmicks":
     -Racers: change radio station/song, gear shift
     -Shooters: activate weapons secondary function, (very specific Western themed shooter) scroll wheel acts like spinning a revolvers cylinder
     
eh... that's all I got too
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 18, 2015, 04:39:43 PM
So are these scroll wheels replacements for the L&R buttons so that the button is now a clickable scroll wheel?  I can see issues with that if scrolling the wheel and pressing it do different things.  In the middle of intense play it may be difficult to accurately press the scroll wheel without also rotating it.  If both functions are used then you might accidently trigger the scrolling when you just intend to push it.

When people are really into a game they can tend to start waving the controller around and start really jamming on the buttons.  A good controller allows for accurate input within this sort of "stressful" playing.  I can't stand motion control or touchscreens because they're too ambiguous.  Did you swing the controller to do that action or are you just having difficulty keeping the controller still?  And I'll gladly also **** on the PS2 analog face buttons which had this horrible squishy feeling which made it ambiguous if you actually pushed the button or didn't.  You don't want that.  So a scroll wheel removes the "sturdiness" of a button and introduces two ways to push one button.  That suggests input ambiguity.  No good.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 19, 2015, 12:07:44 AM
Even for you this is overly negative. It seems rather simple to make a button that is sturdy enough to not slide by mistake but still easy enough to press like a button.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: MagicCow64 on September 19, 2015, 12:44:52 AM
Also, according to the patent, it will have feedback/locking capability. It would be able to stop at the end of a scroll "list", move by itself as feedback, or even freeze altogether. So long as there are L2/R2 buttons, it seems like it could only add interesting functionality and not remove anything.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: azeke on September 19, 2015, 02:35:35 AM
People use scrollable wheel as a third button in mouse for a decade now.

In gaming included.

It will be totally fine.

Just like touchscreen and motion controls.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Enner on September 19, 2015, 03:44:11 PM
That touchscreen stuff really took off. Motion controls, not much.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 19, 2015, 03:50:25 PM
They just weren't capable enough. If they'd had the Motion+ tech from the beginning I think that might have gone differently.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 19, 2015, 05:05:10 PM
That touchscreen stuff really took off. Motion controls, not much.

Well, the PS3 and 360 had major addons that were inspired by motion controls. Plus motion controls seem to be playing an important part in VR controllers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 19, 2015, 06:00:07 PM
Motion control and touch screen on the Wii/DS changed digital  media not just gaming. "everything starts somewhere"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 19, 2015, 09:09:51 PM
The new console will have a mouse-like scroll wheel so you can fine tune just how quickly Nintendo will go out of business.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 19, 2015, 11:07:54 PM
The new console will have a mouse-like scroll wheel so you can fine tune just how quickly Nintendo will go out of business.

The Force is strong with this one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 22, 2015, 11:24:20 PM
So there are some strong indications that the NX platform will be based on Linux.

Michael Larabel, the man behind the website and graphics testing suite Phoronix, has signed an NDA with Nintendo.
http://www.phoronix.com/forums/forum/linux-graphics-x-org-drivers/opengl-vulkan-mesa-gallium3d/817222-the-platforms-initially-supporting-vulkan

Phoronix is a website devoted to Linux Hardware and you may know it as the site that broke the news that Valve was releasing Steam on Linux. Gabe Newell used Michael as a referral contact for Linux support when they ran into issues out of the gate. http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=MTA3OTY

Phoronix is a very hard core Linux techy website ran by one guy. I'm a regular visitor, and they don't video game or even mainstream electronics coverage. The only reason I can think Nintendo would have him sign an NDA is if they had been talking to him about the development side of things.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: azeke on September 22, 2015, 11:58:05 PM
I wonder how will they will be able to merge Linux's "free software" paradigm and DIY somewhat chaotic open-ness with Nintendo's wish to keep the system as closed as they can.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 23, 2015, 12:04:59 AM
I wonder how will they will be able to merge Linux's "free software" paradigm and DIY somewhat chaotic open-ness with Nintendo's wish to keep the system as closed as they can.

Well Android and ChromeOS are both Linux based and OSX was based on BSD, so I suppose it's possible.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Soren on September 23, 2015, 12:07:51 AM
Tech niche companies stick together!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 23, 2015, 01:17:17 AM
Linux = REDHAT = MARIO




So clear the whole time!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 23, 2015, 08:23:12 PM
Linux has lots of software that is not free.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 24, 2015, 05:46:06 PM
Also, my comment about the scroll wheels is not getting the respect it deserves (thank you, Nile Boogie Returns).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ceric on September 24, 2015, 09:06:33 PM
Free OS is Free OS.  I mean being an ix can get you a lot of Software.  It also makes you more vulnerable because by default there is more information out about how your system works.  *shrug* Its like a phone using Android.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 24, 2015, 09:57:24 PM
It doesn't really make you any more vulnerable, unless you intentionally disable security features like stack randomization. Right now PS4 and Xbone are the only consoles out that haven't fallen to a stack overflow vulnerability at this point (Wii U has been "hacked" recently...but no one seems to really care). Also, this Linux thing is just a rumor for now...but if Nintendo did go with some form of Linux, unless they didn't want any support, it wouldn't be free to them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Ceric on September 24, 2015, 10:10:51 PM
Freer than writing from scratch.  Security through obscurity isn't security but it still some.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 25, 2015, 12:17:27 AM
Also, my comment about the scroll wheels is not getting the respect it deserves (thank you, Nile Boogie Returns).

You're not getting respect about scroll wheels? I posted proof that I invented the things TEN YEARS ago, and nobody has batted an eye!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: OakesJu on September 25, 2015, 12:24:54 AM

First, it shows the Samsung Galaxy s6 cover (http://www.casesam.co.uk/category-galaxy-s6-case-cover-15.html) is simply impossible. WII your game on it? On the console you lost? Not exactly. The Samsung Galaxy s6 edge cover (http://www.casesam.co.uk/category-galaxy-s6-edge-case-cover-10.html) of the screen can not be.
People will buy Nintendo Nintendo really want to buy buy Nintendo reasons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: ThePerm on September 25, 2015, 06:37:13 AM
im confused.....
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 25, 2015, 07:43:36 AM
Makes sense to me - he's clarifying for people who think the function is possible. Of course you can't WII your game on the console you lost, because the rotation of the screen, no matter what you try, can not be - at least not on the consle you lost. I used to also be under the assumption that people will buy Nintendo Nintendo even if they really want to buy buy National Geographic reasons, but in reality it's because they really want to buy buy Nintendo reasons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?)
Post by: Stratos on September 25, 2015, 02:48:57 PM
Of course! I buy Nintendo brand Nintendo amiibo for Nintendo Nintendos.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: ThePerm on September 26, 2015, 04:16:39 PM
http://nerdist.com/somebody-recreated-the-legend-of-zeldas-kakariko-village-in-unreal-engine-4/

again hopefully Nintendo becomes as productive as random internet people.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on September 26, 2015, 05:50:02 PM
Also, my comment about the scroll wheels is not getting the respect it deserves (thank you, Nile Boogie Returns).

You're not getting respect about scroll wheels? I posted proof that I invented the things TEN YEARS ago, and nobody has batted an eye!


Zelda TP having Forward Compatibility, Wii remote being an upside down optical mouse, Shenmue III days before E32015. All the things I predicted on this board. Prophet Confirmed!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 10:21:49 AM

AND SO IT BEGINS...


(WALL STREET JOURNAL)




TOKYO— Nintendo Co. has begun distributing a software development kit for its new NX videogame platform, people familiar with the matter said, suggesting the company is on track to introduce the product as early as next year.The kit is used by third-party software developers to modify existing games for the platform or create new ones. Videogame console makers such as Nintendo like to have popular game titles ready when they start selling new devices.Nintendo’s current flagship products are the Wii U, a console typically used in the living room, and the portable 3DS device. Both have been out for several years, leading analysts to predict that the Kyoto-based entertainment powerhouse will move fairly swiftly to bring out the NX.“We are increasingly of the idea that Nintendo might launch the NX in 2016 because of the softness of 3DS and Wii U,” said David Gibson, an analyst at Macquarie Capital Securities.A Nintendo spokeswoman said the company plans to disclose details of NX next year.Square Enix Co. said in July that it planned to make the latest version of its blockbuster role-playing game Dragon Quest for the NX. That version, called Dragon Quest XI, is also planned for the 3DS and Sony Corp.’s PlayStation 4.The exact shape of the NX hardware isn’t yet clear. People familiar with the development plans said Nintendo would likely include both a console and at least one mobile unit that could either be used in conjunction with the console or taken on the road for separate use. They also said Nintendo would aim to put industry-leading chips in the NX devices, after criticism that the Wii U’s capabilities didn’t match those of competitors.Nintendo’s former president, Satoru Iwata, said in March that NX “is a platform dedicated for videogames.” Mr. Iwata died in July, and his post was assumed in September by Tatsumi Kimishima, a former banker who served as one of Mr. Iwata’s top lieutenants at Nintendo.Mr. Kimishima is expected to carry forward the strategy of Mr. Iwata, a legendary figure for many videogame fans. In the months before his death, Mr. Iwata laid out plans to put Nintendo characters in games for mobile devices under a partnership with DeNA Co. and made a deal with amusement park operator Universal Parks & Resorts, which is part of Comcast Corp.“Nintendo is no longer just a traditional videogame company,” said industry veteran Hirokazu Hamamura, a director at Kadokawa Dwango Corp., which publishes magazines about videogames.






Rejoice!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Evan_B on October 16, 2015, 10:49:58 AM
The end of the Wii U is upon us.

If this article is to be believed, we might see the NX rear it's head in 2016. I won't be buying it- in fact, I find it hard to believe most of this information, as it is very un characteristic of Nintendo. As it is, they have utterly failed with the Wii U and if they even dare to end it's life without a Zelda game of its own I'll be quite annoyed. Anyway, I'm interested by these comments, especially that it's believed the NX will release with some sort of portable element. I hope, for Nintendo's sake, that they can gracefully move away from Wii U and 3DS, which don't seem to be maintaining any sort of substantial presence.

Even so, I'm not going to be an early adopter for NX. Nintendo needs to prove they have a good plan moving forward, not just one that relies on Amiibo, mobile, and rehashed IPs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 16, 2015, 10:53:47 AM
As it is, they have utterly failed with the Wii U
Oh puh-leez with this. You don't wanna buy an NX? Fine. But the rhetoric, ugh.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Soren on October 16, 2015, 11:03:45 AM
If Dev kits are going out today(or close to today) to people, can that really mean the console is launching in 2016? Can you make a game for the NX in a year?

I see headlines calling it a hybrid but to me it looks like what I predicted, a dedicated handheld and a console running on the same OS.

The end of the Wii U is upon us.

...As it is, they have utterly failed with the Wii U...

Blah blah blah. Two things.

1- I'm pretty sure the Wii U's end was somewhere around Jan-Feb 2014, when it was pretty clear sales forecasts were never going to be matched and almost all third parties had abandoned plans for the console.
2- The Wii U was only a failure in a commercial sense. It was a success in terms of games released. Ever single year the Wii U had a competitive GOTY candidate. The top 15 Wii U games match well with the top 15 games released on any other console past or present.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 16, 2015, 11:10:51 AM
Make a new game no...but if it is similar enough to the other consoles or PC gaming perhaps you can modify an existing game, or game in development to play on it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 11:51:04 AM
If Dev kits are going out today(or close to today) to people, can that really mean the console is launching in 2016? Can you make a game for the NX in a year?





I would think that you could if you moved development from Wii U to NX. Don't know why but I don't think Nintendo is moving to X86 chipset and this still a IBM chip. In that, context you could launch in 2016 summer with a decent lineup, no one expects a summer launch but in 2016 you can launch electronics basically at anytime.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Soren on October 16, 2015, 12:59:00 PM
I would think that you could if you moved development from Wii U to NX. Don't know why but I don't think Nintendo is moving to X86 chipset and this still a IBM chip. In that, context you could launch in 2016 summer with a decent lineup, no one expects a summer launch but in 2016 you can launch electronics basically at anytime.

I'm assuming 1st party devs have had kits for a while now. I'm talking more about indie devs and 3rd parties.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 16, 2015, 01:29:43 PM
I find it hard to believe most of this information, as it is very un characteristic of Nintendo.

If the NX is to not share the same fate as the Wii U then it needs to be uncharacteristic of Nintendo.

I like what the article is stating.  It has important stuff like comparable hardware with the competition.  If they failed on that again the NX would be DOA.

While I never had any faith in the Wii U, I felt it was doomed once Sony revealed that they weren't going to be anti-consumer with the PS4 and then MS backpedaled and followed suit with the Xbox One.  There was this hope at the time that Sony and MS were going to have anti-consumer features that would force always-online authentication and lock out used games and stuff like that and that the Wii U would benefit from being consumer-friendly.  Once that was not the case, the Wii U was finished.  All Nintendo had was an outdated console with a weird controller, no third party support, and a price that was not THAT much cheaper than the other guys.  The one hope it had was that the market would reject the new generation Sony and MS were offering and that didn't happen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 16, 2015, 01:50:29 PM
Oh sure, the only comment anyone cares about in my post is how the Wii U is a complete failure- which it is. The "Games of the Year" on other consoles are in genres that the Wii U simply doesn't have. I'd be interested to hear what games you DO think are GOTY quality from the Wii U's lifespan, too- what did Wii U have in 2013? Pikmin 3? The Wonderful 101? 2014, maybe I can give you, with Bayonetta 2.

The Wii U is more than just a commercial failure. Third Party relations are no better, the library is worse (in terms of variety and value, just because you have a bunch of acceptable Nintendo titles doesn't make up for the lack of titles), and the system is overpriced and a misguided attempt to ride on the coattails of its successor without even Nintendo having a decent idea of a killer app. It will hopefully be remembered as a awkward HD growing pain.

Most importantly, it's going to be abandoned. Quickly. Which means Nintendo is screwing over the fanbase they had who actually bought into the whole thing, and would be likely to adopt a new system. What success does the Wii U have? It raised the amount of indie ports while simultaneously allowing the lowest quality games to appear there? The introduction of Amiibo? Is that really a victory? You're right, the end of the Wii U was two years ago, and that's because- not just my opinion- it didn't work. What is my opinion is that it never got a proper chance to get interesting ideas come from the hardware because it never stood one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 01:54:28 PM
I don't get the disbelief at this news. Is it the Nintendo using latest chipset or is it the hybrid console / Handheld  concept? Although not graphics wise but Nintendo has always been at the forefront of game technology.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 02:54:59 PM
Oh sure, the only comment anyone cares about in my post is how the Wii U is a complete failure- which it is. The "Games of the Year" on other consoles are in genres that the Wii U simply doesn't have. I'd be interested to hear what games you DO think are GOTY quality from the Wii U's lifespan, too- what did Wii U have in 2013? Pikmin 3? The Wonderful 101? 2014, maybe I can give you, with Bayonetta 2.





You're right about 2013 (although 3DWorld is solid and Lego City and Wonderful 101 is outstanding). The first year of a console is never the best year. PS4 is just starting to catch Wii U in terms of software and has yet to leave it in the dust .


Star Fox Zero, Zelda U and possibly Retro's game are all Hybrid NX/U games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 16, 2015, 04:57:07 PM
Star Fox and Zelda maybe, but Retro? I doubt it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Enner on October 16, 2015, 05:13:37 PM
Oh sure, the only comment anyone cares about in my post is how the Wii U is a complete failure- which it is. ...

Well, it's what you get when you aren't expressing enough happiness with your consumer purchase among those that do. :p

Anyway, all that Wall Street Journal stuff is soft confirmation on the ideas and hopes of what has been discussed previously in this thread. It sounds good.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 06:53:44 PM
Evan, do you have a Wii U?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 16, 2015, 07:26:02 PM
I do. I own... Hmm. Let's see. 13 full retail games for it, and that doesn't count the 5 I've returned because I found them to be dissatisfying. I also have a number of eShop titles too, and my Wii library is quite large.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 16, 2015, 10:24:44 PM
OK. The reason I ask is that I assume you are more than disappointed with the Wii U (forgive me if I'm mistaken). I've never seen someone who owns a Wii U be very dissatisfied with their purchase. I like it more than most but I take issue with the idea that the system is a failure, but thats an issue for another thread.


BOT:


Nintendo Magic allows them to get "an hour out of 15 minutes" graphically (Mario Kart 8, Kirby Rainbow Curse ) I am excited to see what they can do with top notch (relatively) hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 17, 2015, 12:46:16 AM
In some ways, I am not dissatisfied. I think there's plenty of things to love about the Wii U. But I am dissatisfied with its untapped potential.

I am not sure Nintendo will get much more out of the upgraded hardware- they've just finished their first big leap into HD and it was quite nice, but obviously time consuming. I hope they don't work themselves to death just because there's the potential to do so...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: alegoicoe on October 17, 2015, 02:46:59 AM
I find it hard to believe most of this information, as it is very un characteristic of Nintendo.

If the NX is to not share the same fate as the Wii U then it needs to be uncharacteristic of Nintendo.

I like what the article is stating.  It has important stuff like comparable hardware with the competition.  If they failed on that again the NX would be DOA.

While I never had any faith in the Wii U, I felt it was doomed once Sony revealed that they weren't going to be anti-consumer with the PS4 and then MS backpedaled and followed suit with the Xbox One.  There was this hope at the time that Sony and MS were going to have anti-consumer features that would force always-online authentication and lock out used games and stuff like that and that the Wii U would benefit from being consumer-friendly.  Once that was not the case, the Wii U was finished.  All Nintendo had was an outdated console with a weird controller, no third party support, and a price that was not THAT much cheaper than the other guys.  The one hope it had was that the market would reject the new generation Sony and MS were offering and that didn't happen.


well said
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 17, 2015, 10:00:19 AM
In some ways, I am not dissatisfied. I think there's plenty of things to love about the Wii U. But I am dissatisfied with its untapped potential.
Now this I agree with
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on October 17, 2015, 05:37:18 PM
Speculation: Maybe the NX is an Oculus rift type device. People have been speculating and rumoring all Nintendo consoles to be Virtual reality headsets. Now is actually the time where it would be most likely. Having seen Star Wars Battlefront and Silent Hills the possibility of actual really awesome console virtual reality is possible.

An Oculus rift costs $350. A Wii U controller strapped to your face costs $90. Maybe Nintendo is one of the few companies able to get the price down.

Also note, Nintendo has been experimenting with the Wii U remote in this regard. The 3d videos, Nintendo land in some ways. The wii U already has all the tech to be a VR headset. It just isn't uncomfortably tethered to your face.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 17, 2015, 06:22:40 PM
The words "uncomfortably tethered to your face" don't inspire much confidence.

Virtual reality is just ta TV for your eyes only. It doesn't bring other people into the experience with you and Nintendo is about social gaming. I believe last E3 Reggie commented that it wasn't the sort of experience they thought was necessary.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 17, 2015, 06:36:13 PM
Speculation: Maybe the NX is an Oculus rift type device. People have been speculating and rumoring all Nintendo consoles to be Virtual reality headsets. Now is actually the time where it would be most likely. Having seen Star Wars Battlefront and Silent Hills the possibility of actual really awesome console virtual reality is possible.

An Oculus rift costs $350. A Wii U controller strapped to your face costs $90. Maybe Nintendo is one of the few companies able to get the price down.

Also note, Nintendo has been experimenting with the Wii U remote in this regard. The 3d videos, Nintendo land in some ways. The wii U already has all the tech to be a VR headset. It just isn't uncomfortably tethered to your face.




Nintendo as been anti-VR and pro-AR in the recent years. They tend to feel that AR is more socially and family friendly, while VR promotes isolation. As a father of 5, as shudder at the thought of how expensive that could be.




 4 years ago all I wanted was a Nintendo Console powerful as a PS3 with a Wii Motion plus. I got that in Wii U. But Evan_B  is absolutely right, it never reached its full potential and its a shame it didn't.  Wii U could be in my top 5 consoles all time IF Zelda U and Star Fox actually come out and are solid releases, although I don't expect both games to show up. IF NX is at least as powerful as a PS4 ( and by next year how could it not be?) with a Netflix style game streaming service and the Trojan Horse of the untapped hybrid console market, I'll be cool.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 17, 2015, 06:45:08 PM
The one real ace in the hole that Nintendo has left is that they're still the kings of local multiplayer. Going VR would basically kill that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 17, 2015, 08:52:29 PM
Here's hoping it's Star Fox that skips Wii U and not Zelda!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on October 18, 2015, 10:58:30 PM
you could still do local multiplayer with vr. One player gets the head set, the other gets a tablet controller and a tv. Another type of asymmetric gameplay.

I prefer AR over VR.

why not include the option to buy VR headsets for the console though? The more people have them, the cheaper the price will go down. I imagine a day in the future where these vr headsets cost $60.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2015, 12:33:09 AM
Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes is a great example of local multiplayer with VR.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 19, 2015, 01:54:05 AM
I imagine Nintendo'slast dance with VR didn't sit so well with them. You know, the Virtual Boy.

I think they'll include it when the tech is manageable and enjoyable. Right now, I hear too many whispers of motion sickness, high prices, and little addition to gameplay.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Enner on October 19, 2015, 04:56:43 AM
At the moment, I believe in the enthusiastic impressions of those who have tried and are eagerly anticipating VR to be genuine. Even at the base level of a change in perspective and head tracking, I can imagine the sense of immersion to be revolutionary.

I just wonder if this sense of immersion is something a lot of people will want to do on a regular basis. Or if it as excessive and impractical as a super car or a separate home theater room with a super projector and a mega sound system. That is an unfair comparison given the speculated prices of the upcoming headsets. I can't help but wonder how a VR headset will fit in to any given person's life, if at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: alegoicoe on October 19, 2015, 01:53:50 PM
i read some rumors over at wiiudaily that the NX could be more powerful than PS4 and Xbone, very unlikely giving Nintendo past three consoles but maybe who knows, at least the rumor is not the other way around and it was with the wii and wii u
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 19, 2015, 02:42:12 PM
i read some rumors over at wiiudaily that the NX could be more powerful than PS4 and Xbone, very unlikely giving Nintendo past three consoles but maybe who knows, at least the rumor is not the other way around and it was with the wii and wii u

Any console coming out a few years after the PS4 and XB1 should be more powerful than them.  That's how this stuff has worked for literally every single console ever made except the Wii and Wii U (and I guess the Atari 7800 but it was actually cancelled and resurrected two years after its intended release).  For something like the Gamecube I don't even think there was any intentional effort to be more powerful than the PS2.  It's just simply that it came out a year later and the tech was a little better and a little cheaper so they went with it.

Now I would not expect anything future proof nor do I think Nintendo should do so.  It just needs to be enough to last until the competition goes to their next consoles and last time the generation lasted seven years for Sony and eight for MS.  So release the NX in 2016 and aim to replace it in 2020 (and if the other guys don't upgrade by then, wait longer).  Nintendo ends up splitting the generation between two consoles and then is all caught up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 19, 2015, 03:14:34 PM
The most current scuttlebutt I've seen is tied to the Wall Street Journal article about devkits, which says something along the lines of Nintendo being aware of the power disparity issue and taking care this time to use leading tech. Separately, awhile ago there was some investor call or whathaveyou at AMD that seemed to indicate that they had struck a deal for a large semi-custom chip order to go into production in 2016 with hints that it was videogame related. So now there's speculation that Nintendo has pulled off a deal with the ailing AMD for cutting-edge tech on the cheap, which would allow them to outperform the PS4/XBONE while maintaining a reasonable price point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Mop it up on October 19, 2015, 04:01:37 PM
With the law of diminishing returns, I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 and XBONE are around even longer than the PS360 before getting a successor. Unless they decide to go the phone route instead, making a new one or more every year, though I don't know how well that would work for a game system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on October 19, 2015, 04:31:31 PM
You have to realize that NX is going to be next gen compared to ps4 and xbox one. Wii U is weird in that in most ways it is next gen compared to ps3 and xbox360 except the processor speed. IT has more ram and a superior GPU, which would mean it should be way better than those tow, but according to developers its CPU is weird and not as fast in clockrate. Developers could take advantage of the CPU in different ways, but they would have to reprogram the games.

As a programmer I understand some of this. When I write my code I test it constantly. There are some types of code you could write that's inefficient and may not be noticed on a faster cpu. On a slower CPU you might be like WTF? IT costs too much money to have someone rewrite the code just to get it running on Wii U. There is a lot of slowdown on Watchdogs, this is because what code works on ps3 and xbox 360 does not work on Wii U's cpu. I can imagine that they might have to change some gameplay to get the game running smoothly on wii U, but they didn't.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 19, 2015, 05:16:05 PM
You have to realize that NX is going to be next gen compared to ps4 and xbox one. Wii U is weird in that in most ways it is next gen compared to ps3 and xbox360 except the processor speed. IT has more ram and a superior GPU, which would mean it should be way better than those tow, but according to developers its CPU is weird and not as fast in clockrate. Developers could take advantage of the CPU in different ways, but they would have to reprogram the games.

As a programmer I understand some of this. When I write my code I test it constantly. There are some types of code you could write that's inefficient and may not be noticed on a faster cpu. On a slower CPU you might be like WTF? IT costs too much money to have someone rewrite the code just to get it running on Wii U. There is a lot of slowdown on Watchdogs, this is because what code works on ps3 and xbox 360 does not work on Wii U's cpu. I can imagine that they might have to change some gameplay to get the game running smoothly on wii U, but they didn't.

Gee it's like no one is making games for Nintendo's console because it's an expensive and complicated pain in the ass to do so.  But isn't all just a personal vendetta against Nintendo?  It couldn't be a BUSINESS reason, could it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on October 19, 2015, 08:50:11 PM
I don't think anyone has said they have a personal vendetta against Nintendo. Although there were some nasty comments thrown around by Frostbite engine devs, if I recall?

I believe the age-old adage goes: "Nintendo makes consoles they can program for." But that's pretty much it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on October 19, 2015, 08:50:34 PM
With the law of diminishing returns, I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 and XBONE are around even longer than the PS360 before getting a successor. Unless they decide to go the phone route instead, making a new one or more every year, though I don't know how well that would work for a game system.

Yeah, the PS3 was supposed to last 10 years, right?  I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 didn't last about that long.  There's no way they'd go the phone route.  It'd be too expensive for devs unless the backwards compatibility was a given.  Plus the online system would have to carry over seamlessly, but that may not be a huge issue.  Now, Bi-annual hardware revisions, I could see happening.  Especially if they come with slight spec bumps (bigger HDDs, more RAM for the OS, etc).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 19, 2015, 09:48:32 PM
With the law of diminishing returns, I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 and XBONE are around even longer than the PS360 before getting a successor. Unless they decide to go the phone route instead, making a new one or more every year, though I don't know how well that would work for a game system.

Yeah, the PS3 was supposed to last 10 years, right?  I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 didn't last about that long.  There's no way they'd go the phone route.  It'd be too expensive for devs unless the backwards compatibility was a given.  Plus the online system would have to carry over seamlessly, but that may not be a huge issue.  Now, Bi-annual hardware revisions, I could see happening.  Especially if they come with slight spec bumps (bigger HDDs, more RAM for the OS, etc).

Honestly the PS3 could have lasted 10 years.  The problem is that once companies are making profit on the consoles and games, the buzz is gone and the market starts to dwindle...so you need new hype.  You know that one of the other companies is going to jump first, so you start planning your new system.  But honestly Xbox 1 and PS4 could last 10 years, because graphics and gameplay are already pretty amazing...do we really need more? 

I am really curious what this will do for the industry.  Basically Nintendo could be launching a new system mid-life cycle of the current generation.  This will either be great for Nintendo as Nintendo can start being a mid-generation new system for those that are interested in a slight spec jump...but it is also going to force Sony and Microsoft to end their generation earlier than they probably wanted. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 19, 2015, 11:33:02 PM
The problem with lasting 10 years is some core gamers start moving to the PC for better performance. We saw some of this in 2011 and 2012.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ymeegod on October 20, 2015, 02:48:40 AM
"With the law of diminishing returns"

The thing was you have to recall why Sony and MS needed to extend last generation of consoles.  Both manufactures took heavy loses (Sony with the Cell processor) and MS with the *red" ring of death lawsuit.  So far this generation there hasn't been any "snag" or heavy loss for them so they are already making a profit on their returns. 

I think right now, Sony's unstoppable.  MS needs a  Japanese partner (merger or complete buyout) since it's a totally flop in Japan and has to rethink it's European pricing structure.  Can't win on NA sales alone.

Nintendo has it's own share of problems, namely 3rd parties.  Nintendo needs them to commit and I don't see that happening anytime soon.  Like MS, Nintendo's going have to money hat developers, either buy them outright or buy their support.  Sony's klling it lately, Square's deal the FFVII, Capcom's exclusive SFV, first downloadable content for Activision's BO III.  Sometimes you have to spend money to make money and Nintendo's going have to play that game in order to get back on top.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on October 20, 2015, 08:31:33 AM
We could always bring back that

Nintendo
Xbox

rumor.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on October 20, 2015, 10:37:36 AM
Wii60 Boys.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Mop it up on October 20, 2015, 07:47:17 PM
The problem with lasting 10 years is some core gamers start moving to the PC for better performance. We saw some of this in 2011 and 2012.
Do you have some evidence of this? Those two years had some of the highest sales numbers for both PS3 and 360, so I'm not so sure...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2015, 09:59:59 PM
Given how certain developers treat their PC ports, I don't believe that much either.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 21, 2015, 12:49:11 AM
Just anecdotal evidence. The gaming press started playing a lot of PC version of games over the console counterparts. Far Cry 3 is an example. Skyrim, Dragon Age, etc... It's not everybody, but there are a number of people who have to have 60fps and wait for Steam sales.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on October 21, 2015, 02:28:51 AM
It could be that developers just follow trends, not actual numbers and statistics.

I know how that sounds.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: broodwars on October 21, 2015, 03:19:25 AM
With the law of diminishing returns, I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 and XBONE are around even longer than the PS360 before getting a successor. Unless they decide to go the phone route instead, making a new one or more every year, though I don't know how well that would work for a game system.

Yeah, the PS3 was supposed to last 10 years, right?

*ahem* And it did. It launched in 2006, and it's still getting major software releases in 2016 (Persona 5).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: UncleBob on October 21, 2015, 10:16:43 AM
With the law of diminishing returns, I wouldn't be surprised if the PS4 and XBONE are around even longer than the PS360 before getting a successor. Unless they decide to go the phone route instead, making a new one or more every year, though I don't know how well that would work for a game system.

Yeah, the PS3 was supposed to last 10 years, right?

*ahem* And it did. It launched in 2006, and it's still getting major software releases in 2016 (Persona 5).

Wii launched in 2006 and still got a major release in 2015. :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Louieturkey on October 21, 2015, 08:21:19 PM
I'd like to point out that when Sony says 10 years, that does not preclude them from releasing another system inbetween. They stated 10 years with the PS2 and did continue support through I think 11 years with it.  PS1 lasted with them selling it for 10 years as well.   My guess is the PS3 will be sold through 2018 at this point making it a 12 year console.

I think the PS4/XB1 will last as far as MS decides to keep it on the market.  They are really the ones who have been impatient in the past and I think if they continue to be second place and continue to lose money on the XB1, they will either start the next gen earlier than most hope or sell the Xbox division and get out of the console market.  I think Sony is in the same mindset of Nintendo in that they want to ride the system as long as they can like Nintendo with the original NES.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on October 28, 2015, 04:48:09 PM
I guess with the rumor of this thing being some sort of hybrid similar to Wii U, only more portable, I think that rules out a full blown Tablet at this point?

I am thinking that this could be the system that really makes or breaks it for Nintendo. If they can somehow pull off a major system seller out the gates and pick up, and keep, strong third party support without sacrificing gameplay to some wonky control scheme only the most devoted fans will put up with, this machine could be their true return to glory.

I shouldn't be optimistic because history has taught me to be skeptical of everything Nintendo does, but I don't know with a new President and PS4 proving consoles are not dead, even in Japan, I think that suggests they just might have learned their lesson this time.

I still expect them to be light on the multimedia features as there is just no way they are going to change positions on that now, but at this point I don't think those are a real issue anymore so long as Hulu and Netflix work as expected I think that should be enough for the masses.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 28, 2015, 08:00:39 PM
I agree that this home console system is really going to be the testing point for Nintendo as a hardware console maker. 

The portable gaming market is fluctuating and mobile gaming is changing...even if people think hand phone gaming is worse than portable it is easier to carry one device.  So that is what people will do. 

So now console gaming is more important to Nintendo, but they have been losing popularity in consoles since the Nintendo 64.  The Wii was a fluke, and even then towards the end of the life cycle it wasn't performing as well.

Nintendo needs to get lucky again this next generation...because right now Nintendo looks only successful in handhelds.  A hybrid might help, but honestly, I think Nintendo needs more.  Personally, I think I would double or triple down on the motion controls and get them perfect. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 28, 2015, 08:47:16 PM
I think my idea would be to try to make a motion controller that can do 90% of what a regular controller can do, so that the default controller can be the only controller you need.  That means you need near flawless motion control.

I think combining the Wii motion technology using the infrared lights and camera positioning but using the Wii using the sensor bar and the Wii mote as both camera and infrared projector could give better motion control calculations...you might need a dedicated chip to that but add to that two gyro sensors for best tilt tracking and put all the same technology in the new wireless nunchuk that comes WITH the controller not an add on and you have a good start.

Next move the D-Pad down to where the 1 and 2 buttons are, and put 4 buttons near the top how you hold them and have the A and X button be bean shaped curved towards the Y and B buttons to help feel the buttons is a good start.  Still have the trigger underneath, but add another trigger 2 triggers accessible only when holding the controller in the NES classic Controller setup, and now you have a Wiimote that has motion controls for pointing and mouse controls (the 2nd analog stick) 5 easily accessible buttons for one hand.  An analog nunchuk for movement and 2 more buttons...and a fully operational SNES controller.  The only thing it can't do well is N64 controls. 

This is what the Wii U should have been from the start but with comparable hardware to the Xbox One. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on October 28, 2015, 08:57:26 PM
I agree that this home console system is really going to be the testing point for Nintendo as a hardware console maker. 

The portable gaming market is fluctuating and mobile gaming is changing...even if people think hand phone gaming is worse than portable it is easier to carry one device.  So that is what people will do. 

So now console gaming is more important to Nintendo, but they have been losing popularity in consoles since the Nintendo 64.  The Wii was a fluke, and even then towards the end of the life cycle it wasn't performing as well.

Nintendo needs to get lucky again this next generation...because right now Nintendo looks only successful in handhelds.  A hybrid might help, but honestly, I think Nintendo needs more.  Personally, I think I would double or triple down on the motion controls and get them perfect.

Everything but your last sentence I agree with but I think they need to just ABANDON motion controls altogether unless they are seriously considering entering VR which is not likely.

There was a time when Nintendo was known for working with cutting edge technology firms to bring home the best technology to their products, that time has long gone now is the time to get that reputation back.
Software alone will not save them, they need to get every single partner they can muster on board and they need to prove they are willing to bend over backwards to make everyone happy and take a loss for the first year to get this thing off the ground. With Wii U they stubbornly refused to make any sacrifices to profit for the long term and instead they lost money anyways because sales tanked.

With Steam and Oculus entering the fold hard core gamers are going to be more impressed by technology than ever before, you cut corners in this day and age you might as well throw in the towel and join Sega in nobodygivesashit land.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 28, 2015, 10:06:28 PM
Nintendo has NEVER been about cutting edge technology.  In fact no console maker except maybe Sony and the Cell Processor has been about delivering cutting edge technology. 

My point is, Nintendo can't or isn't willing to risk the costs associated with higher end technology...selling consoles below cost to keep it in a reasonable price range.  Spending budgets the size of mid-range summer blockbuster movies or more is very risky for Nintendo, and Nintendo doesn't have secondary divisions to help balance those types of losses. 

So Nintendo looks for gimmicks to differentiate themselves from the competition.  And the Wii was the ONLY system that had workable motion controls...they were not perfect, but they were workable, and the general public would assume Nintendo was the motion control specialists.  They should have followed up the Wii with the next step of motion control.  Turn the Wii U into the SNES of motion controls.  The SNES was the next evolutionary step in 2D gaming.  We needed that advancement for motion controls, because as Ian Sane would point out, motion controls were not perfectly satisfying yet.  But for many they were incredibly engaging.

Now imagine the money spent on the tablet like controller going into research and development of better motion controls and then launching the Wii U at around the same price, but having better hardware...launching I think you can see how the Wii U could have been something more approachable and even 3rd parties would have already known how to adjust for the difference between Nintendo and other platforms.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 29, 2015, 12:41:47 PM
I think people tend to forget how cutting edge the NES was.  Their goal was to make something that could run Donkey Kong nearly arcade perfect.  The Famicom came out in 1983 and compare that to the Colecovision which came out only a year earlier.  The Famicom also came out the same day as the Sega SG-1000 and ran circles around it.  It was very impressive stuff for the time.

I think motion control is a fool's errand because I think what people want, and Sony appears to have known this more than anyone, is a good flexible videogame system that is actually kind of generic in its features and abilities.  Nintendo offered something like this with the NES and SNES and those are the two consoles where they were the most commercially and culturally relevant videogame company in the world.  Those consoles did what people expected and were broad enough in their functionality that a wide variety of games and genres were present.  Since then Nintendo always has some trade-off.  Some piece of core functionality that the market expects that is cast aside in favour of Nintendo's own weird way of doing things.

N64 - no you don't get FMW or CD quality audio or lower game prices but you do get fast load times
GC - no you don't get online gaming but you do get GBA connectivity
Wii - no you don't get industry standard specifications but you do get motion control
Wii U - no you don't get industry standard specifications again but you do get a tablet controller

It is funny that Nintendo has stuck with this "compromise this to get this" routine for four console generations when it has only worked ONCE while the two consoles they had that didn't do that were hugely successful.  Meanwhile Sony has had four consoles and three of them were the industry leader simply by being incredibly conventional.  The PS3 was their one misstep and that was because they went away from their proven strategy, going with a high end luxury price product instead of something that fit the conventions of the industry.  I don't even know where Nintendo got the idea that being unnecessarily weird was somehow the key to success.  The N64 was largely seen as a misstep and you figure that when it came time to decide if the Cube goes online or doesn't that they would think "failing to follow the conventions of the market really bit us in the ass on the N64 so let's avoid making that mistake again" and instead it was "yeah, being weird for no reason and denying consumers options is the way to go even though the only previous time we did that we surrendered our market share to a non-videogame company that was a newcomer to the market."  A smart company would learn from their mistakes but Nintendo has operated like an insane person since the Virtual Boy.

So focusing on motion controls or other weird gimmicks is going to do jack **** for Nintendo because the only time it ever worked for ANYBODY was the Wii and that appears to be a one time fluke that really only lasted for the first 2/3 of the Wii's life (Wii mania was clearly over the last two years before the Wii U came out).  The market leading console of every other generation has been a very conventional product that has the flexibility to provide lots of games of different styles from different developers.  Because ultimately that's what people want - games.

If Nintendo can include such gimmicks in a console that is also conventional and it somehow doesn't make the price too high then why not do it?  But I don't think that's feasible.  Why doesn't Nintendo just try something conventional?  They haven't put in a real effort to do so in 20 years and yet it makes no sense why when the opposite approach has blown up in their face most of the time.  The only justification I can think of is that their handheld line has been very successful by not being conventional and they've made the mistaken assumption that that same formula applies to consoles, which is still weird because it completely ignores the NES and SNES.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on October 29, 2015, 01:14:50 PM
I have read articles from the time how Nintendo was doing things inside N64 that super computers at the time were not doing. Nintendo partnered with some top technology firms to make sure the N64 was in fact cutting edge, they did the same with SNES in fact they worked with SONY to develop a very high end sound chip for the SNES and compared to Genesis the specs of the SNES were pretty damn good. Nintendo compromised on one issue with SNES and that was censoring games, which bit them in the ass and they shed that, sort of, with N64.

Motion controls were a fluke I don't think perfecting those is going to bring people back, I would rather they pretend Wii never even happened and just moved on. What I can say is people who worship Wii forget that the casual market was into Wii Sports and Wii Fit, they didn't care that waggle worked in Mario because casuals had been playing NES Mario for decades and the casuals flocked to the VC. Nobody outside of grandmas and die hard fans were into motion controls. They worked for a very small handful of niche games and ruined all the traditional games.

The biggest problem with Nintendo is they fix one problem they created only to create new ones each generation. IF Wii had at least been graphically on par with 360 *or* still GC level tech but HD capable, they might have at least been able to get a few more games out of 3rd parties who didn't want to sacrifice quality to port their game down to fit Wii's platform. If you take into account how much it sold despite the 3rd party support and lack of features, imagine how much better it would have been if motion controls really were the selling point and it also had at least comparable specs if not cutting edge.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 29, 2015, 11:28:50 PM
The question is can Nintendo compete in this market.


Before Nintendo was top dog and they were able to manage to make a good system that could still be sold for a profit...now you can't do that.  You are hoping that the profits come from software and that a couple of years losses will benefit the company in the end. 


Well if you look at the Xbox division they have been struggling to make profits and money hatting exclusives has only made it worse.  Nintendo can't bleed money like that...because right now they are pretty much only one division video games.  Sony and Microsoft are much more and they have diversified business models.


Motion Controls were a fluke, but they introduced the world to a new means of playing games...and some games WERE better with motion controls.  Some sports games, many first person shooters, Some great puzzle and adventure games. 


I think in this market of 3 console makers one is always going to be the loser, and Nintendo has been the loser 4 generations in a row.  The Wii sold many units but the long run they were losers...because of software perception and consumers not buying more games. 


However, many of the party games and group games for casuals sold because there was a market for that kind of game...just gamers knew that the better experience for traditional games was on the other system.


What I am suggesting is perfecting the motion controls and differentiating yourself so that you can have great experiences you can't have on another system.  But not compromising on anything else.  Nintendo could have spent R&D not on a tablet but perfecting the online experience and infrastructure.  Nintendo could have saved money and given the user a more powerful console for the price, but didn't. 


Personally, I really liked the motion controls and I know other people did as well...but it could have been implemented better and that is all I wanted to see.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on October 30, 2015, 12:08:22 AM
N64 - no you don't get FMW or CD quality audio or lower game prices but you do get fast load times
It was the exception to the rule, but Resident Evil 2 for N64 had full motion video. So did Jeopardy, Pokemon Puzzle League, Gex 3, Wheel of Fortune, and a few others. Sure, there wasn't a LOT of FMV on any of those games (actually RE2 had a pretty long intro), due to lack of storage space, but it at least was possible. Not worth the investment in larger cartridges though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 30, 2015, 01:17:26 AM
Also, FMV was and is gross. I'm glad it's gone, and that the 64 was not blighted by it for the most part. Also many games, such as Mario 64, would not have been possible due to CD streaming limitations at the time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on October 30, 2015, 10:06:10 AM
Also, FMV was and is gross. I'm glad it's gone, and that the 64 was not blighted by it for the most part. Also many games, such as Mario 64, would not have been possible due to CD streaming limitations at the time.


I am not at all convinced this is true, Mario 64 had TINY levels compared to some games on Playstation, I think it would have been possible look at N64 games that were on Playstation for clues, also the above mentioned Resident Evil, FF7, etc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 30, 2015, 12:31:07 PM
The question is can Nintendo compete in this market.

Before Nintendo was top dog and they were able to manage to make a good system that could still be sold for a profit...now you can't do that.  You are hoping that the profits come from software and that a couple of years losses will benefit the company in the end. 

Well if you look at the Xbox division they have been struggling to make profits and money hatting exclusives has only made it worse.  Nintendo can't bleed money like that...because right now they are pretty much only one division video games.  Sony and Microsoft are much more and they have diversified business models.

Well the Wii U model isn't working out so hot.  If the NX is like the Wii U where it compromises a bunch of stuff to be different then it is going to sell worse.  A console experience like the Wii U where almost every game being made is available for every console except it and the only worthwhile games are made by Nintendo themselves and months go by with nothing being released doesn't increase the customer-base, it shrinks it.  Aside from the spike of the Wii, which only spiked because it found a new audience, each Nintendo console sells less than the one before and that makes sense.  People buy the console, are disappointed by all of it's problems, and lose faith in Nintendo and switch brands.

More than anything else my disappointment with the Wii is the reason I didn't buy a Wii U.  Nintendo needed to show me that things would be different this time and they didn't.  Once I found out the specs were compromised for a weird controller yet again I knew all the third party issues I had with the Wii would continue and I was right, and I was already pretty fed up with that issue on the N64 and Cube.  So if the NX is some another Nintendo weird console then everyone who owns a Wii U and is pissed off that there are so few games for it and that Nintendo has done very little with the Gamepad is going to think "oh that's another Wii U.  I'm not buying that" and the console sells even worse.  And of course all those you wrote off Nintendo in prior generations are going to continue to not buy the console because the Wii U retained the problems of the Wii which retained the problems of the Gamecube which retained the problems of the N64.  Nothing ever is fixed and new problems get introduced and become part of the "formula".

So how long does this approach with the ever shrinking userbase and increased customer dissatisfaction and bad reputation and poor word-of-mouth keep working?  A couple years ago were they not shitting bricks about the poor Wii U sales?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on October 30, 2015, 02:25:41 PM
I think they can compete in the arms race if they focus on what matters. Can they cram in all the 1:1 tech the other two have such as voice commands, robust media options, etc, NO but they don't need to. What they need is to be on equal ground for GAMES and then let their unique set of features balance things out.


With Game Cube they should have gone with normal sized DVD's and either built in online or a better pack in with the adapter to spur sales.

They didn't so they lost 3rd party games the relied on those two features.


The main features they need is a disc drive equal to their competition so features don't get cut, they actually DO have that with Wii U, but they lack the processing power and graphics. So in order to make games look decent on Wii U requires massive programming skills and extra effort than the other two, which costs more money and nobody bothers so they lose money and move on.

IF NX has specs that do not compromise at all, I mean at all the CPU needs to be fast and it needs to be easy to program for or to port from the other two. The graphics set needs to be at least on par with or better than PS4, matching Xbox one won't cut it because they are already low end and Nintendo desperately needs to shed their low end image. They need to implament proper Blu Ray and DVD support, basic media features like Netflix, Hulu, Youtube, and a couple others, and a better online experience and they need to make Mii's optional not forced on you before they have a chance to win back enough people to really matter.


3rd parties won't take the extra time to bother with the weird features if the main game is not comparable. If you have to cut features and account for weird things like Miiverse and funky controls that don't match what the competition has, on top of scaling things down to fit the slower CPU and weaker GPU then why bother when the userbase is too small or too stubborn to matter.

The fact people even say they don't play 3rd party games is also part of the problem the whole elitist culture of Nintendo fans has become part of the problem, its like if a game doesn't play exactly like a Nintendo game or remind them of something from their childhood then forget it it's not worth playing.

A game like Diablo 3 SHOULD have been on Wii U, there desperately needs to be a Mincraft for Wii U and a Sim City or some other mainstream Sims game, but none of those are even going to happen.


Forcing things on users is Nintendo's problem and why people LOVE Playstation, because Sony gives gamers the choice, if you don't like something fine it's optional but if you do they offer the option, they had motion controls optional for those who wanted it, not forced it on those that didn't. Wii would have been just fine if Classic controller was packed in and support mandatory and Wii remote also packed in as a deluxe bundle but optional, like Zapper, for those that didn't want it. Same with the Game Pad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 31, 2015, 03:01:19 PM
Rumor! Tekken 7 is coming to the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 01, 2015, 02:08:14 PM
Also, FMV was and is gross. I'm glad it's gone, and that the 64 was not blighted by it for the most part. Also many games, such as Mario 64, would not have been possible due to CD streaming limitations at the time.


I am not at all convinced this is true, Mario 64 had TINY levels compared to some games on Playstation, I think it would have been possible look at N64 games that were on Playstation for clues, also the above mentioned Resident Evil, FF7, etc.

With the RE games and FF7, the Playstation took advantage of prerendered backgrounds, which was admittedly a strength largely not available to the N64. But that was also a stop-gap in game design that went away. Anyhow, I read a pretty convincing breakdown once on how certain 64 games wouldn't have been doable with the Playstation disc drive, but I can't dig it up at the moment. There was that 64DD version of Mario 64 in the works, but from what I recall the DD wasn't exactly disc based. What PS1 games compare to the scale and complexity of the bigger Mario 64 levels? Or morseo, Banjo Tooie?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 01, 2015, 03:10:14 PM
Mario 64 was also a lunch game, and the levels weren't supposed to be gigantic, otherwise getting stars would take too long.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 01, 2015, 04:49:38 PM
It wasn't that levels couldn't be done, but the experience would suffer.  Mario 64 had so little load time playing it was sheer joy.  You could run from outside the castle and be in a new level in about a minute or two.  And actually the levels are bigger than they feel, it is just moving Mario around the levels is so effortless it makes the worlds more approachable.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 02, 2015, 01:22:00 PM
Super Mario 64 was awesome and so were most of the first party N64 games.  But going with cartridges completely screwed up third party support.  So is each first party N64 game better than 20 good PlayStation games that presumably the N64 would have gotten if Nintendo had gone with CDs?  That's probably about the ratio for each game.  On the Wii U today is each first party game worth that?  It becomes Nintendo's handful of games vs. pretty much every other game being made.  No company can hold up to such a comparison and that's why those that are cool with that are the minority.  Most gamers want access to the broadest selection of games and they don't get that from Nintendo.

So If Nintendo sticks with that formula their consoles are going to continue to underperform sales-wise.  That tradeoff is way too much to ask of most consumers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on November 02, 2015, 03:05:51 PM
Sony does not give players choice.

Most gamers want choice and I agree, Nintendo needs to make a console that allows them that opportunity. But Nintendo needs to be insanely aggressive if they are going to do so since they're competing with two other consoles that are two years deep and now finally have enough third party support to give their systems a decent library. And frankly, I just don't see Nintendo being that aggressive.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 02, 2015, 04:25:30 PM
Super Mario 64 was awesome and so were most of the first party N64 games.  But going with cartridges completely screwed up third party support.  So is each first party N64 game better than 20 good PlayStation games that presumably the N64 would have gotten if Nintendo had gone with CDs?  That's probably about the ratio for each game.  On the Wii U today is each first party game worth that?  It becomes Nintendo's handful of games vs. pretty much every other game being made.  No company can hold up to such a comparison and that's why those that are cool with that are the minority.  Most gamers want access to the broadest selection of games and they don't get that from Nintendo.

So If Nintendo sticks with that formula their consoles are going to continue to underperform sales-wise.  That tradeoff is way too much to ask of most consumers.

Yeah, I mean, I really didn't mind in the moment. I did not think the first-gen CD-based consoles were ready for prime time, and they were lousy at local multiplayer. I was jealous about Resident Evil, but 2 came to the 64. I played through 1/3 of FF7's PC release and did not care for it, and had no interest in the newly cinematic RPG renaissance. By the time the Gamecube rolled around the tech had matured to playable PS2 levels and there's where I would say the lack of software comparably was really a problem, but even then the GC got a healthy amount of ports. Wii obviously went off the rails with that, but had a great catalog in its own right with many interesting experiments. I had a 360 on the early side, but didn't hold onto it for long as the software wasn't there, and I only resorted to getting one again years later after the Wii dried up and there were enough games to go back and play through. Now with WiiU, it's basically only Nintendo, which is certainly pushing viability, but at the same time I'd argue we're in a pretty lousy software environment overall with nothing approaching the volume and diversity of releases available on the PS1 and PS2 (or even PS3), which shows no sign of getting better.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on November 02, 2015, 04:46:50 PM
Sony does not give players choice.

Care to explain? Sony has long been regarded as the default system for console games. The reality is if a game gets announced unless it is exclusive to Nintendo or Xbox then it will be on Playstation. This is mostly true for Xbox but they do lose a few notable Japanese games here and there that Sony always seems to get. With Nintendo its like you don't just have to like Nintendo games, you have to like quirky little indie games that look, play, and sound like Nintendo games or that is it.

I don't know where this whole idea that variety is somehow bad came from, but if Nintendo has embraced it, it's obvious some of their fans have too. I don't see the console war as some arbitrary date set in stone that has to be won or lost by a certain time. Nintendo doesn't have to pay any attention to what Microsoft and Sony are doing as long as they can get enough stuff going in the future. If their console wows gamers and attracts developers it won't matter what the other two are doing. Sony is about to launch a new platform anyways with their VR stuff and Microsoft is going to keep an eye on that if they want to keep up with Sony. Nintendo might be releasing NX two to three years behind the other two but so what? They can get hardware out that is better and does something unique and doesn't cost a fortune to develop for then it could work.

But if they go the second console route again they had better damn well figure out how to price their machine better to be budget friendly. Wii U would be fantastic as a second console, if it was $150 bucks, which is what it should have launched at considering it was LAST FUCKING GEN hardware when it released. There is no sane excuse for Nintendo to release a machine in 2012 that is a weak as a machine released in 2006 but costs as much as one released in 2013. Considering the specs inside Wii U if it does cost them so much to sell it for this high and turn a profit, they got ripped the **** off because MS and Sony should have brought down the cost of that level of chip specs years ago. I call bullshit n Wii U selling for a loss if they sold it for less than $200 there is nothing special about the Wii U that wasn't possible on machines released six or more years prior.

And I doubt there is enough tech in the Gamepad to up the cost as much as fanboys tend to claim either. Nintendo was greedy with Wii U because they were losing money for the first time in years and refused to take chances period, they are cowards it's as simple as that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on November 03, 2015, 12:34:41 PM
Dude, relax. I'm not going to argue with you, in just going to say that the Playstation network has offered me few options in a number of ways, Sony's lineup if games offers little variety, and saying a large library with little actual variety is missing the point of choice.

Not saying Nintendo is any better, though I would argue Microsoft is definitely worse than both other options. But that's just, like, my opinion, man.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: broodwars on November 03, 2015, 01:54:17 PM
Dude, relax. I'm not going to argue with you, in just going to say that the Playstation network has offered me few options in a number of ways, Sony's lineup if games offers little variety, and saying a large library with little actual variety is missing the point of choice.

What?  :Q Here's some major Sony-published titles on PS4 since launch (I cut out the remasters that were on the PS3 as well):

Killzone: Shadow Fall - 1st Person Shooter
Knack - Cartoony character action game
Infamous Second Son - Open World
Driveclub - Driving
LittleBigPlanet 3 - 2D platformer
MLB 14 & 15: The Show - Sports
The Order: 1886 - 3rd Person Shooter
Bloodborne - Character Action Game/Adventure Game
Until Dawn - Telltale-style Adventure Game
Tearaway Unfolded - 3D platformer
Everybody's Gone to the Rapture - Walking Simulator/ "Interactive Narrative"
Helldivers - Co-op Arcade-y shooter
Galak-Z - Rogue-like 2D space shooter

Yeah, there could be some more family-oriented games in there for my liking, but that's a pretty decent variety of genres represented there IMO.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on November 03, 2015, 04:03:11 PM
I would argue that most of those are subpar iterations of games and genres that already have more iconic, better crafted titles available on other systems, but then I'd be summarizing the current era of video games.

So yeah, if by "choice" you mean "the same tired stuff with familiar elements, minor additions, and a slightly better coat of paint" then yeah. I don't exactly trust Nintendo to innovate on any of those genres with how sterile their own efforts have been recently, in addition to them taking forever to do a spin on shooters that's still a gutted beast in regards to online options.

I hate video games, by the way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on November 04, 2015, 04:12:41 PM
I would argue that most of those are subpar iterations of games and genres that already have more iconic, better crafted titles available on other systems, but then I'd be summarizing the current era of video games.

So yeah, if by "choice" you mean "the same tired stuff with familiar elements, minor additions, and a slightly better coat of paint" then yeah. I don't exactly trust Nintendo to innovate on any of those genres with how sterile their own efforts have been recently, in addition to them taking forever to do a spin on shooters that's still a gutted beast in regards to online options.

I hate video games, by the way.


I wasn't trying to start a fight man sorry if it came off that way. I just am in shock someone could claim Playstation has less variety than Nintendo, or that was how I read your post.
I also apologize if my posts are too long sometimes, I am a writer by profession sometimes I get going and I can't stop.

I can sort of see where you are coming from if you prefer say Platformers and quirky games like what Nintendo is known for, except then you get gems like Littlebigplanet, Ratchet and Clank, Minecraft, Plants vs. Zombies, and so many more that more than make up for the lack of Mario and DK games.

I agree there are gaps in Sony's line up too, nobody is perfect, but they have the least gaps of the three.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 04, 2015, 05:14:56 PM
I find the only thing missing on a PlayStation console is Nintendo games.  That's a pretty major gap for someone with tastes like myself but it is miniscule compared to having everything missing except Nintendo games.  For anyone that doesn't care for Nintendo's own games there is no reason to own a Nintendo console, but there is still reason to own a Nintendo handheld and there was for owning the NES and SNES.  And the only person that couldn't find something to play on a PlayStation would be someone that ONLY likes Nintendo games.  Nintendo has created this segregation of the console audience.  They're their own entity with a very devoted group of fans and little customers outside that group.  And that fanbase is so Nintendo-focused that third parties complain that their games don't sell on Nintendo consoles.

Of course I never knew an NES or SNES owner that didn't also like Mega Man or Castlevania or numerous other non-Nintendo games.  In the SNES era it was normal for someone to own one entirely for Street Fighter or Mortal Kombat.  You owned the console because it had the most games and prior to 1996 Nintendo was just one of those many companies whose games were included.  Nintendo-only fans weren't a thing then.  I want both Nintendo games and third party games and I assume I'm not some tiny little minority.  Nintendo's fanbase has become more Nintendo-only simply because those are the only people that would not be disappointed by a console with no third party support.  But is that the true audience or is there a good-sized potential audience of people like me that want a Nintendo console with good third party support and for which something like the PS4 is a compromise - the closer to what they want than what Nintendo is offering but not the modern NES/SNES equivalent that they would really like?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ymeegod on November 05, 2015, 11:13:09 PM
There's been plenty of "knockoffs" during the years though.  So while Sony doesn't have Mario Kart, it does have similar games. 

Also while the WII did bring back platformers, I find myself enjoying "indie" platform games just as much as Nintendo own Mario Games. 

======================================================================
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Shaymin on November 05, 2015, 11:28:48 PM
I'm still waiting for Unkarted from Naughty Dog. Now that they're apparently done with those brotastic action games they can get back to their strength: racing.

And no, this year's E3 demo doesn't count.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on November 06, 2015, 11:45:26 AM
So we are all assuming this is not a full on gaming tablet like an iPad with buttons are a scaled up version of the GamePad but we do assume it will feature a control scheme comparable to 3DS/Wii U correct?

We also are lead to believe it will feature leading edge chips, whatever that means CPU, GPU, some strange VR interface, or some new type of RAM exclusive to Nintendo, we don't know. But we are lead to assume it will be more powerful in someway than PS4, which some had made the ridiculous claims is itself overpowered.

We have also heard rumors that Square is interested in the console to some extent, but we haven't, or at least I haven't followed who all is supposed to be supporting it. Anyways we can assume it will have strong third party support at least  up front, or more so than Wii U if reports are to be believed.

We also know it will feature some sort of shared OS between a handheld unit and a home console unit. This could be a hybrid or it could be a Gamepad on the go situation, or a GBA-GC connectivity situation, we still don't know. Or it could be just PS Vita PS4 cross buy type deal whatever it ends up being is likely to be the central focus of the machine.

Based on what we do know there is not enough reason to be hyped yet, other than the usual hey a new Nintendo console to play more games on. Oh and as far as I can tell there should be some unified account system so we can assume that games currently on eshop and, hopefully, Virtual Console, will be compatible day one with no delays or unnecessary hoops to jump through.

We also know that it should be released sometime next year, either in one phase handheld first console latter, or all at once, we don't know yet but all signs point to something coming next year.

With all that what do we not know about the machine? What type of controls will it use? Are they going to do a more traditional style controller? Stick with the touch and button combo similar to DS and Wii U, or find some new paradigm nobody has though of yet like motion controls?

Speaking of motion controls, how do they play into this new machine? Are they going to keep it backwards compatible with Wii and Wii U software? History suggests one generation back, and Wii U is not well known for its motion controls, will they keep the feature for legacy support of a handful of games? Or will they recognize the market has moved on and finally abandon motion controls entirely?

We DO know they are sticking with Mii's and chances are with the new App coming to smart phones, they are going to really push Mii's hard. Most likely because they somehow think anything carried over from Wii is good since it was so dang popular. How popular? Well I still see commercials on TV for nursing homes that show elderly using Wii Sports so they are likely still trying to target that market, Nintendo's board is aging maybe they are all just struggling with their own age and that is why they are so concerned with reaching the old timer market? Just a thought.

We also know they have not given up their core focus of games first, so they might mis-interpret that, yet again, as a means to deny basic DVD and Blu Ray playback from their customers but they should at least try to get basic media features, not just Netflix, Hulu, and Youtube.

We also have no idea what they are doing about DS/3DS and if the new machine will be compatible with legacy software from those platforms which would be a major selling point if it were.

So all of this leaves us with a lot to speculate. Since Wii U is basically a ghost this Holiday season and 3DS is a sinking ship I think shifting all attention to NX is probably smart. Some might argue its too early to speculate or whatever but if Nintendo does have people reading forums like this one and others then they do need to see their fans discussing their machine in order to get some feedback. Or they could just, continue to ignore the fans and focus yet again on chasing some blue ocean that has been consumed by iOS and Android.

Feel free to summarize, rephrase, or correct any of my findings. Or just generally continue to bring up Dreamcast and Gamecube who are always fun topics to rehash endlessly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on December 13, 2015, 10:18:20 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/9HLMZ7r.jpg)

Kinda like this. IT would make the physical size of the controller smaller, the screen bigger, but you would have effectively the same setup. Its would be the same thing as wii u, but higher resolution, possibly 3d, multi touch.

(http://6.darkroom.shortlist.com/980/4c6d106dc9885b7f0fb53522e477360a:e4f8cc3513bcc1e394156773a1f475f7/nx2.png)

theres this now....

http://www.engadget.com/2015/12/13/nintendo-touchscreen-gamepad-patent/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Soren on December 13, 2015, 11:40:39 PM
I can't wait for people to complain about the price of that thing...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on December 14, 2015, 12:16:52 AM
one of the key differences between the edge-less design I made and this one is, I still had buttons. For a reason. Tactile response.

Everyone is already hating on it.

Personally, I don't mind buttons going away, but not joysticks. Joysticks are important. Unless they got a layer of vibrating touch grid.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 14, 2015, 12:41:24 AM
I think this is more of a "we thought of this, so we might as well patent it" situation than something they actually intend to do in the immediate future. And even if they did use it, I wouldn't read too much into the patent design not showing buttons on it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 14, 2015, 01:05:15 AM
I think this is more of a "we thought of this, so we might as well patent it" situation than something they actually intend to do in the immediate future. And even if they did use it, I wouldn't read too much into the patent design not showing buttons on it.

I am sure Nintendo has build mock ups and if this worked and was affordable then it could be something...but I really don't see this as being the new thing.  It just doesn't pop, and Patient images are never final products it is to get the patient out there with as little evidence as possible to how you would actually use it. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 14, 2015, 03:10:57 AM
Even if it worked great and were affordable, I'm not sure how viable it would be from a marketing standpoint. For Nintendo to get out of the gate strong next time they need to convince people they've learned their lesson and are moving forward, and trying to push something so similar to what they did with the Wii U would dilute that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 15, 2015, 01:23:10 PM
Even if it worked great and were affordable, I'm not sure how viable it would be from a marketing standpoint. For Nintendo to get out of the gate strong next time they need to convince people they've learned their lesson and are moving forward, and trying to push something so similar to what they did with the Wii U would dilute that.

While releasing the Gamepad AGAIN is obviously not a good idea, "that's stupid" is never a valid enough justification to write off Nintendo doing something.  They've been doing obviously stupid things for 20 years.  So I agree that this isn't a viable idea but that doesn't mean Nintendo won't do it.  I'm just hoping this is some patent for a sake of patenting an idea they brainstormed but my fear is that Nintendo, as usual, has learned absolutely nothing from their failures.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on December 15, 2015, 02:56:03 PM
If it's cost effective, I don't see why Nintendo wouldn't do it.  The draw backs on the Wii U game were battery, cost, and lack of meaningful use.  If Nintendo can get the cost down and make a system that supports four of these things, I don't see how that wouldn't work out better.  The asymmetrical gameplay wasn't super interesting, and multiplayer games where everyone has a screen would be awesome.  You could do Mario Kart with both players using off tv play, local multiplayer for Splatoon, I'm out ideas nevermind.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: KeyBilly on December 15, 2015, 03:52:20 PM
It could be that the controller for the NX will have a touchscreen background, but still be more of a traditional controller than a Gamepad.  There could be some ancillary backwards compatibility, but it would be clearly distinct from the Wii U.  With the screen off, it would have the ergonomics and battery life of a standard controller.

When I first heard of a touchscreen controller for the Wii U, it seemed like a logical evolution.  It adds the ability to use custom touch controls and displays, but keeps the benefits of a traditional controller over a phone or tablet.  The Gamepad, though, was a clunky execution of the idea. similar to the strange N64 controller's design based around the analog stick.  The NX might have a more practical and streamlined execution that will set the standard for other companies to follow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 15, 2015, 06:19:17 PM
Nintendo has tried to sell us on this idea that a nifty controller feature will inspire awesome game ideas since the DS and, frankly, they've failed to prove this theory.  90% of the time they either ignore the feature entirely or they shoehorn it in and you're left with some awkward-controlling gimmick game.  Even a big hit like Wii Sports is a pretty much a tech demo.

I think they're full of **** and their true intention is to mask a weak effort by passing off gimmicks as innovation.  But even if they are devoted to this theory - it has failed!  They've been putting screens on controllers since the Gamecube/GBA feature and they still have done little with it.  So what great idea is there that they could have used years ago that requires a separate screen that they for whatever reason just sat on this whole time?  If the concept was truly capable of inspiring all these great ideas we would have seen them already.  The great ideas have been sparse because the concept just isn't all that great.  Same with motion controls.

They should stop with this simply because doing so would indicate a positive change in their approach.  If they're still pushing gimmick controls then they're also going to compromise this and that and hope that the fancy controller will save the day.  And if they do that they're fucked.  No one but the most devoted Nintendo fanatic will put up with the slightest bullshit from Nintendo.  You know that if they put in some neat feature in the controller that they'll skimp on something else that's actually important.  That's the whole damn plan.  If you can fool people with a shiny gimmick you can cut corners!

Nintendo should just make a conventional console and make great games for it.  That's what made them a big deal in the first place.  And when they're not forcing weird controls they still make great games.  They don't NEED to shoehorn in dumb gimmicks to make interesting or enjoyable games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 15, 2015, 06:34:48 PM
Nintendo has tried to sell us on this idea that a nifty controller feature will inspire awesome game ideas since the DS and, frankly, they've failed to prove this theory.  90% of the time they either ignore the feature entirely or they shoehorn it in and you're left with some awkward-controlling gimmick game.  Even a big hit like Wii Sports is a pretty much a tech demo.

I think they're full of **** and their true intention is to mask a weak effort by passing off gimmicks as innovation.  But even if they are devoted to this theory - it has failed!  They've been putting screens on controllers since the Gamecube/GBA feature and they still have done little with it.  So what great idea is there that they could have used years ago that requires a separate screen that they for whatever reason just sat on this whole time?  If the concept was truly capable of inspiring all these great ideas we would have seen them already.  The great ideas have been sparse because the concept just isn't all that great.  Same with motion controls.

They should stop with this simply because doing so would indicate a positive change in their approach.  If they're still pushing gimmick controls then they're also going to compromise this and that and hope that the fancy controller will save the day.  And if they do that they're fucked.  No one but the most devoted Nintendo fanatic will put up with the slightest bullshit from Nintendo.  You know that if they put in some neat feature in the controller that they'll skimp on something else that's actually important.  That's the whole damn plan.  If you can fool people with a shiny gimmick you can cut corners!

Nintendo should just make a conventional console and make great games for it.  That's what made them a big deal in the first place.  And when they're not forcing weird controls they still make great games.  They don't NEED to shoehorn in dumb gimmicks to make interesting or enjoyable games.

And yet when a Game Developer does take the time to include the control as a key mechanic to the game you get an amazing experience...like Zack and Wiki.  I loved that game, and it deserved a sequel.  So much fun.

However, you are right that most developers won't spend that extra time to make it right.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Adrock on December 15, 2015, 08:20:52 PM
Releasing an updated Gamepad absolutely should happen, but it shouldn't be the entire point of NX. It should be "Look, we have this." Not "LOOK! WE HAVE THIS!" Marketing shouldn't focus on it. If a game requires (or is even enhanced significantly) by the GamePad, the game's marketing should advertise it.

The key is to drive the cost down and sell it for a price people don't mind paying (e.g. $50 to $60) which means the Pro Controller would naturally have to be cheaper too (e.g. $30). Rethinking pricing is something Nintendo should be doing anyway because that could give it an advantage.

Still, I don't know if the GamePad is something that should be packed in with consoles. Sure, it would be beneficial to have it in as many people's hands for games like a sequel to Mario Maker. At the same time, Mario Maker is a big enough title that it would sell the controller. And Nintendo could also offer a controller bundle (that would be stupidly difficult to find)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 15, 2015, 08:42:04 PM
If Nintendo or any company would consider lowering the prices on items that are typically being price gouged then I would reconsider getting back into gaming.

I want games to be $40.00.  Drop the CGI movies and voice acting if you need to do...I don't want it anyway.  I just want to play some fun games.  Also Controllers need to be cheaper.  I want to play local games with my friends...it should not cost me over $200.00 to do this.  30 dollars for a full Wii controller should be fair...and 25 to 30 dollars for a Pro Controller should be manageable.  Maybe more if it is wireless or comes with a battery.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 16, 2015, 12:10:00 AM
I'd imagine Nintendo wants to include a touchscreen controller for Wii U backwords compatibly and to continue selling DS and 3DS tiles to future generations on the Virtual Console.  As long as they can keep cost down this time so the controller doesn't **** the NX price for the rest of it's lifespan like the Gamepad did the Wii U, they gain more for being able to keep selling older games to people on the NX then releasing a system with just a basic controller would.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on December 16, 2015, 03:40:20 AM
I would like to mention that Phantom Hourglass, Spirit Tracks, and Skyward Sword are flawed experiences for reasons UNRELATED to their control schemes, which are novel and make them more fun.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 16, 2015, 09:37:29 AM
Honestly I would prefer they make a console that pretends Wii/Wii U never even happened including NOT having backwards compatibility and no more Mii's. But that is not going to happen so they had better make the rest of the experience as worth it and as cost effective as possible because Wii U was such a hard sell.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 16, 2015, 06:37:17 PM
I I disagree about Miis.  I love Miis and when used properly Miis are a fantastic addition to any game.  Sure you can say look at them...they don't scream HD.  But who cares they are cute and a perfect personal Avatar.  If Nintendo could figure out a way to create a Mii game that lets you play in the world of games you already own that could be cool.  Like a Mii Adventure App and when you buy the new Mario game you get 2 Mario themed playground levels for your Mii.  Heck you can even program ALL Amiibos to be able to play in that world with the play mechanics from their games...it could be fun.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Soren on December 16, 2015, 07:54:07 PM
Miis are great.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 16, 2015, 08:01:43 PM
I associate Miis with an era of Nintendo I don't care for so if it was up to me and I was catering things to my own personal preference I would get rid of them and pretend they never existed.  I suppose their could be concern that the Miis are associated with casual gaming and that continuing to have them will turn off hardcore gamers.

But can you think of a more iconic character avatar in videogaming?  I can't.  Considering how important online gaming is today and the need to identify players online I figure you need some sort of avatar system in place so why not use the one you already have?

What Nintendo shouldn't do is give the Miis a prominent place in games where they don't fit.  And they shouldn't make games like Nintendo Land or Wii Party U with the Miis as the main characters and expect them to be system-selling killer apps because the time where they were suitable for that kind of role has passed.  Personally I would use them strictly as avatars for player profiles.  They're only appropriate for casual games and why make casual games when that audience doesn't buy dedicated videogame systems anymore?

And Nintendo should absolutely not reference old Nintendo IP in "Mii form" if there is no legitimate game in that series on the horizon.  Nintendo probably thinks that F-Zero references in Nintendo Land are something that F-Zero fans enjoy.  No.  That's seen as a "**** you, there's no real F-Zero game so eat this **** instead".  Metroid: Federation Force pissed off the fanbase for the same reason.  You either make games in the series or you don't.  No fan wants some spinoff or a themed mini-game in an unrelated title when the series they love is otherwise dormant.  Stuff like that is to compliment new releases, not act as a replacement.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 16, 2015, 09:13:13 PM
I wouldn't mind them if I could use my console without being forced to create a Mii and look at them all the damn time. Nintendo is bad about giving people choices instead it is always their way or nothing. Sony made an effort with Home but realized it wasn't for everybody and didn't make it mandatory like Mii's are. They were a novelty that has worn off.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 16, 2015, 11:55:57 PM
What they need to do is take my Mii and attach him to my new and improved NNID
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 17, 2015, 09:49:32 AM
Quote
And Nintendo should absolutely not reference old Nintendo IP in "Mii form" if there is no legitimate game in that series on the horizon.  Nintendo probably thinks that F-Zero references in Nintendo Land are something that F-Zero fans enjoy.  No.  That's seen as a "**** you, there's no real F-Zero game so eat this **** instead".  Metroid: Federation Force pissed off the fanbase for the same reason.  You either make games in the series or you don't.  No fan wants some spinoff or a themed mini-game in an unrelated title when the series they love is otherwise dormant.  Stuff like that is to compliment new releases, not act as a replacement.

That was how I felt about the Smash Bros. and Mario Party games for the longest time, they new what people wanted out of a Mario game but instead of doing it they kept trying to stick Mario into games where he didn't belong. It was frustrating it took them so long to figure out New Super Mario Bros. and it shouldn't have had to be branded as "new" just to get people's attention.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 17, 2015, 11:36:51 PM
Remove R.O.B. from Smash until we get a new Gyromite!!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Triforce Hermit on December 18, 2015, 08:46:01 AM
I don't like Miis and I hate having to have one. If they want to keep it, fine. Don't force it though. It is a major annoyance for me.



I want games to be $40.00.  Drop the CGI movies and voice acting if you need to do...I don't want it anyway.
But Zelda games still cost $60 without any of those  ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on December 18, 2015, 05:07:01 PM
I like Miis. It makes iconography when saving efficient. My mii looks just like my forum Avatar.

Ideally for me, I would want Nintendo to just keep the same controller as Wii U. Some stability would be nice. What Wii U lacks is power. The new controller should be dual touch though. I want to pinch and zoom when necessary. If you really think about it? Why is Nintendo constantly changing its controllers? That means they never really trusted the last control scheme was really as innovative and revolutionary as they thought. "Try our new controller, it will change everything!" "Were getting rid of that, try this new thing!"

I think both the Wii and Wii U interfaces are good interfaces. I think Nintendo should just make a more powerful wii U with some improvements. They need to call it something totally different though. Wii U was too confusing for consumers. I'm sure 2/3 of people still think its an add on for wii. Hell when they announced it I was confused for a few minutes. Or at least I saw where people could be confused.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 20, 2015, 07:53:55 PM
I like Miis. It makes iconography when saving efficient. My mii looks just like my forum Avatar.

Ideally for me, I would want Nintendo to just keep the same controller as Wii U. Some stability would be nice. What Wii U lacks is power. The new controller should be dual touch though. I want to pinch and zoom when necessary. If you really think about it? Why is Nintendo constantly changing its controllers? That means they never really trusted the last control scheme was really as innovative and revolutionary as they thought. "Try our new controller, it will change everything!" "Were getting rid of that, try this new thing!"

I think both the Wii and Wii U interfaces are good interfaces. I think Nintendo should just make a more powerful wii U with some improvements. They need to call it something totally different though. Wii U was too confusing for consumers. I'm sure 2/3 of people still think its an add on for wii. Hell when they announced it I was confused for a few minutes. Or at least I saw where people could be confused.


I don't think it is so much they have no faith in their controllers I think it is a matter of them truly being totally clueless as to what they are doing wrong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 20, 2015, 10:06:16 PM
I think it is neither.

I think Nintendo believes Graphics are not a selling point to a console.  Hardware power shouldn't be the only addition to a new console.  I personally agree with this philosophy...if there isn't something truly substantial to add then just adding more power to make prettier games isn't enough.  Now, there are times that just the added graphical level adds more than just pretty pictures.  For instance the jump from N64/PS era to PS2 and Gamecube era the graphics had a real impact on not just the visuals but how the player is effected by the game because of the visuals. 

So Nintendo believes that you need more.  Well how you interact with the game is more.  Wii motion controls were flawed, but it did bring a brand new experience to gaming.  The DS and 3DS were flawed, but also brought some new experience to how you played games.  The Wii U, did not bring enough compelling new experiences to sell the audience on the controller...but it could have worked...the market is fickle and it is hard to guess what people you like.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Triforce Hermit on December 20, 2015, 10:23:16 PM
The game(s) should be delivering that experience, not the controller.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Enner on December 20, 2015, 11:06:43 PM
And we all know the difficulty or reluctance of having truly new experiences from games in the console space. Of course, it depends on what you're looking for.

While there's nothing wrong with the sticks, pads, buttons, and triggers of old, new types of control can open avenues previously thought impossible. The Wii Motion+ could have been great as a 3D, six axes manipulator, but it was not meant to be. Maybe Sony's Dreams will take that up.

That said, even I feel pressed to hope for something a bit more conventional when it comes to the controls or controllers for NX. Outside of a handful of games, Nintendo's software have been best suited to the sticks and buttons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 21, 2015, 09:41:52 AM
I think it is neither.

I think Nintendo believes Graphics are not a selling point to a console.  Hardware power shouldn't be the only addition to a new console.  I personally agree with this philosophy...if there isn't something truly substantial to add then just adding more power to make prettier games isn't enough.  Now, there are times that just the added graphical level adds more than just pretty pictures.  For instance the jump from N64/PS era to PS2 and Gamecube era the graphics had a real impact on not just the visuals but how the player is effected by the game because of the visuals. 

So Nintendo believes that you need more.  Well how you interact with the game is more.  Wii motion controls were flawed, but it did bring a brand new experience to gaming.  The DS and 3DS were flawed, but also brought some new experience to how you played games.  The Wii U, did not bring enough compelling new experiences to sell the audience on the controller...but it could have worked...the market is fickle and it is hard to guess what people you like.


But that is YOU, you are the minority, Nintendo has gotten stuck catering too, the vast majority just want their games to be bigger and better, they do want more game play experiences but damn Sony has been innovating in that arena for over two decades and they basically use the same controller NINTENDO invented and just perfected it. Why couldn't Nintendo perfect their own controller instead of letting their competitor who does both innovative new gameplay ideas, and bigger and better graphics while sticking to the truly tested tried and true controller people WANT. Nintendo thinks they have to abandon what worked last gen and start over fresh every time instead of keeping what worked and only adding to it, they are the only company to remove features from their last gen to their next gen all the others have only added never taken away. Unless it was something minor like CD support there are not enough people in the world left who care about.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 21, 2015, 01:43:36 PM
I think Nintendo believes Graphics are not a selling point to a console.  Hardware power shouldn't be the only addition to a new console.  I personally agree with this philosophy...if there isn't something truly substantial to add then just adding more power to make prettier games isn't enough.  Now, there are times that just the added graphical level adds more than just pretty pictures.  For instance the jump from N64/PS era to PS2 and Gamecube era the graphics had a real impact on not just the visuals but how the player is effected by the game because of the visuals. 

So Nintendo believes that you need more.  Well how you interact with the game is more.  Wii motion controls were flawed, but it did bring a brand new experience to gaming.  The DS and 3DS were flawed, but also brought some new experience to how you played games.  The Wii U, did not bring enough compelling new experiences to sell the audience on the controller...but it could have worked...the market is fickle and it is hard to guess what people you like.

It's interesting that you say stuff like "Hardware power shouldn't be the only addition" and "Nintendo believes that you need more".  Nintendo didn't offer "more" with the Wii or Wii U.  They substituted industry standard hardware power for a fancy controller.  The Wii is practically the Gamecube all over again with a different controller.  If Nintendo offered conventional hardware AND a nifty controller I wouldn't give a **** unless it raised the price way above the competition or the controller was so restrictive that it ruined the controls of the games (Wii controller lost functionality but the Wii U merely added to the standard controller design; one of the few things Nintendo did right with it).  What I don't like is the tradeoff because it completely destroys any chance of having half-decent third party support.

The whole concept is like theoretical ideology.  For all of Nintendo's talk about how this is the more innovative way to go the resulting games are pretty cliché stuff with the controller gimmick thrown in.  There is a reason why everyone made fun of the disproportionate amount of 2D platformers on the Wii U because they're talking about innovation and they're giving us stuff that would have been seen as retro on the N64!  The Wii was pretty a generation of Nintendo doing mostly the same stuff they've done for decades but with button presses mapped to controller shakes.  When I play games on the other consoles I'm blown away by how damn OLD Nintendo's new games feel in comparison.  Most of their games feel small and quaint, like the Cube/PS2/Xbox era was the furthest they were comfortable going.  And in the case of Mario it's like Super Mario 64 is too advanced for them and they have to go backwards with these NSMB games.

Nintendo is all talk, no action.  This "controller over graphics" is at best some naïve ideology that doesn't work in practice but I'm pretty cynical so I think it's just an outright con.  They don't WANT to keep with the times so they're hoping to fool everyone with this controller nonsense and it worked on the Wii because they appealed to a non-gaming crowd that isn't familiar enough with standard gaming conventions to notice.  Regardless of what it is, Nintendo can't feed us this crap because everyone knows it is crap.  If you're going to be stale at least be stale like the rest of the industry and follow the conventions.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 21, 2015, 08:42:40 PM
I think you misunderstood.  I was telling my opinion.  I was speaking on behave of Nintendo's ideals.  I was remembering quotes from Nintendo employees and elaborating on them. 

Whether you agree with Nintendo's ideals or not, that is what Nintendo believes.  But I will say you have to have innovation in all 3 areas, games first, hardware second...and hardware innovation is both controller/user interaction with the game and hardware as in graphical and CPU power.  The problem is Nintendo hasn't really given Nintendo users the complete package.  Maybe with the DS and 3DS Nintendo has come close...but the biggest part of the user interaction Nintendo neglects is the online user experience...but this is a pretty big oversight. 

I wonder if the Wii console had a great online experience similar to Xbox live, and graphics and hardware that made porting easier if the Wii would not have done even better.  Nintendo's biggest mistake with the Wii U was the tablet controller.  I keep on wondering if Nintendo didn't sink so much R&D in that and priced the system the same, but include more RAM faster CPU and GPU closer to the eventual PS4 and Xbox One, and pushed for more refined Motion controls what would have happened? 

And Ian for some reason Nintendo decided the easiest way to make money was to play of nostalgia...this is what lead to cheap 2D sequels...and they are good games, but the are more supplemental games and should not have been the main games for release in that year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 22, 2015, 09:27:48 AM
I wholeheartedly disagree with the Nostalgia thing, look at Hollywood, walk down any toy isle in any store, everything that sells right now is based heavily on Nostalgia, the two biggest movies at the box office this year are nothing BUT nostalgia. In fact a lot of what is driving PS4 sales is the nostalgia factor, not just for the games but also the whole system reminds people of a time when Playstation just got it. I went into Wal-Mart disgusted at their selection of over priced card games, not just the prices but the awful design and was sad I wouldn't be buying my family the Uno and Skip-Bo games I wanted, went across the street to Target and they had, what do you know "retro" card decks on a shelf right next to all the "retro" toys I was looking for, including light brite and etch a sketch. retro and nostalgia is what sells right now, that will might wear off but I am not so sure. And for what it is worth the nostalgia factor alone was what got me to get a Wii U, it was NES Remix, Hyrule Warriors, New Super Mario Bros., DKC:TP, and Super Mario World that sold me, not Bayonetta that I played and didn't like on Playstation, or Wonderful 101 that reminds me too much of Disney, or Zombie U that looked like just another soulless zombie game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 22, 2015, 12:11:32 PM
And Ian for some reason Nintendo decided the easiest way to make money was to play of nostalgia...this is what lead to cheap 2D sequels...and they are good games, but the are more supplemental games and should not have been the main games for release in that year.

They're perfectly acceptable games but when you're designing your console in such a way that it effectively jettisons a ridiculous amount of games that appear on every console but your's and you're talking up this controller as your big ace in the hole and the key to all this promised innovation, you can't then pretty much ignore the controller and release retro style games that could have been made 20 years ago.  I don't think it would have even mattered if the third party support was there.  Nintendo could easily get away with making good but not particularly innovative titles if they didn't set things up so that THEY ALONE have to carry the whole system.  They create more pressure on their own games to deliver and then intentionally make unambitious titles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 22, 2015, 01:57:24 PM
Playing to nostalgia is one of Nintendo's strengths. It could be and has been argued that they emphasize that aspect too much. Also, I find it really funny you referred to Zombi U as "soulless" given how much it cribs from the Demon's/Dark Souls games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 22, 2015, 02:05:18 PM
I just don't think Nintendo's style of games lend themselves very well to a big epic blockbuster type that dominates the other two. I think they hit their peek with Game Cube, they know this, and the best they can do now is bring that level into HD and hope for the best.

I honestly don't think anyone can truly predict what Nintendo is going to do because I think even Nintendo themselves are clueless as to why one thing works one time and not the next. But to be completely honest, NX is their last chance to get back into the game proper, if they fail again their brand image will be far to tainted to ever make a real come back, they will have to resort to chasing Wii gamers forever and that business model relies too much on dumb luck.

There are rumors that Sega is about to get back into the hardware game, not on the scale of what the other three are doing but what I read of it sounds more like what Nintendo should be doing, a cheap, retro style console that relies heavily on their own catalog and caters to their core demographic.

If they want to chase the hard core mainstream crowd forget it that is a losing battle, there has always only been room for one dominant console the other two fighting it out for second place, Sony pretty much figured out back in 1995 how to be that dominant console and they made ONE misstep along the way, that that quickly rectified. Nintendo has had ONE hit based entirely on blind luck to get them through and sticking to their guns on the handheld arena.

BUT if they ignore the Call of Duty/Madden/Grand Theft Auto crowd and make a console like Wii, cheap to make and cheap to make games for, with traditional controls, a name that doesn't alienate their audience, and strictly focuses on a balance of retro and modern Nintendo only stuff they will find their audience. To compete they need to be cheap and stick to their guns, this is a strategy that works for them, trying to be on the same level as Sony does not work for them because they cannot go all in. Even with Game Cube they skimped on the hardware, it was mostly on par or better than Ps2 but DVD, no serious online component and the lunch box design all turned gamers and developers away in droves.

If they refuse to go all in, then they HAVE to dig their heels in and stand their ground, and a console that closely unites their handheld division is the best they can do then that is what they will do. What they really need though above ALL is a damn traditional controller and a name that doesn't piss people off.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 22, 2015, 02:06:21 PM
Playing to nostalgia is one of Nintendo's strengths. It could be and has been argued that they emphasize that aspect too much. Also, I find it really funny you referred to Zombi U as "soulless" given how much it cribs from the Demon's/Dark Souls games.

I was agreeing with that aspect, Nostalgia is what they do best, it was Ian who suggested they shouldn't or something like that. As for Soulless, I hate zombie games they are stupid. I hate the whole concept of Zombies honestly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Triforce Hermit on December 22, 2015, 02:29:51 PM
Splatoon didn't cater to nostalgia and yet it is one of the most important games Nintendo has released in years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 22, 2015, 02:51:58 PM
Nintendo nostalgia appeals to the diehards that bought the Wii U at launch.  The general public does not want to spend any serious amount of money on a whole console that plays nostalgic Nintendo titles and nothing else.  I think the nostalgic angle would ironically work best if Nintendo was a third party developer.  On the PS4 a game like NSMB would probably be very popular.  It's a game that a lot of gamers would gladly buy if they had the hardware for it already but would not buy a console for.  If you want to make videogame consoles you need to offer people a real incentive to buy it.  "Hey here is some retro-style game that realistically we could have done on old hardware but we want you to buy a whole new console for" is a **** sales pitch.

Triforce Hermit pointed out that Splatoon was a brand new game and it has been a pretty big hit for a new IP on a console no one owns.  The Wii U is being talked about at my work and it's not NSMB or Mario Kart or anything like that that's created the buzz.  It's Xenoblade because it's big and ambitious.  That's the sort of stuff people buy consoles for, to see where videogames can go.

Nintendo "peaked" at the Cube simply because Iwata led them down that path.  They basically stuck with the same generation for 11 years and have been a generation behind ever since.  It's hard to make cutting edge and innovative games when you're not even caught up with the rest of the industry.  But I think titles like Splatoon show that Nintendo can be more than a nostalgia act if they actually TRY.  Besides they made Super Mario Galaxy last gen.  When they try to do something new and interesting with Mario it results in the cutting edge of platforming.  When they don't we get cliché sidescrollers.  It's their choice to focus on such titles.  There are rumours that open-world Zelda has run into development problems.  Not surprising since Nintendo was making Cube games with waggle while every other developer was branching into the open-world genre.  Nintendo's own decisions left them behind and they now have to learn the ropes and still deliver something that meets present-day expectations.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on December 22, 2015, 03:29:41 PM
Nintendo nostalgia appeals to the diehards that bought the Wii U at launch.  The general public does not want to spend any serious amount of money on a whole console that plays nostalgic Nintendo titles and nothing else.  I think the nostalgic angle would ironically work best if Nintendo was a third party developer.  On the PS4 a game like NSMB would probably be very popular.  It's a game that a lot of gamers would gladly buy if they had the hardware for it already but would not buy a console for.  If you want to make videogame consoles you need to offer people a real incentive to buy it.  "Hey here is some retro-style game that realistically we could have done on old hardware but we want you to buy a whole new console for" is a **** sales pitch.

Triforce Hermit pointed out that Splatoon was a brand new game and it has been a pretty big hit for a new IP on a console no one owns.  The Wii U is being talked about at my work and it's not NSMB or Mario Kart or anything like that that's created the buzz.  It's Xenoblade because it's big and ambitious.  That's the sort of stuff people buy consoles for, to see where videogames can go.

Nintendo "peaked" at the Cube simply because Iwata led them down that path.  They basically stuck with the same generation for 11 years and have been a generation behind ever since.  It's hard to make cutting edge and innovative games when you're not even caught up with the rest of the industry.  But I think titles like Splatoon show that Nintendo can be more than a nostalgia act if they actually TRY.  Besides they made Super Mario Galaxy last gen.  When they try to do something new and interesting with Mario it results in the cutting edge of platforming.  When they don't we get cliché sidescrollers.  It's their choice to focus on such titles.  There are rumours that open-world Zelda has run into development problems.  Not surprising since Nintendo was making Cube games with waggle while every other developer was branching into the open-world genre.  Nintendo's own decisions left them behind and they now have to learn the ropes and still deliver something that meets present-day expectations.


While I agree Splatoon is new and original, it is an idea long time Nintendo fans have been asking for a long time, it's just a unique spin on the Mario Paintball game.

And nobody is saying nostalgia is ALL they do but is sure as hell is what they do best, not just now but GBA name ten titles that weren't ports, remakes, or blatant rip offs of SNES games? It can be done but you will be naming crap nobody bought.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 22, 2015, 05:25:26 PM
Nintendo nostalgia appeals to the diehards that bought the Wii U at launch.  The general public does not want to spend any serious amount of money on a whole console that plays nostalgic Nintendo titles and nothing else.  I think the nostalgic angle would ironically work best if Nintendo was a third party developer.  On the PS4 a game like NSMB would probably be very popular.  It's a game that a lot of gamers would gladly buy if they had the hardware for it already but would not buy a console for.  If you want to make videogame consoles you need to offer people a real incentive to buy it.  "Hey here is some retro-style game that realistically we could have done on old hardware but we want you to buy a whole new console for" is a **** sales pitch.

Triforce Hermit pointed out that Splatoon was a brand new game and it has been a pretty big hit for a new IP on a console no one owns.  The Wii U is being talked about at my work and it's not NSMB or Mario Kart or anything like that that's created the buzz.  It's Xenoblade because it's big and ambitious.  That's the sort of stuff people buy consoles for, to see where videogames can go.

Nintendo "peaked" at the Cube simply because Iwata led them down that path.  They basically stuck with the same generation for 11 years and have been a generation behind ever since.  It's hard to make cutting edge and innovative games when you're not even caught up with the rest of the industry.  But I think titles like Splatoon show that Nintendo can be more than a nostalgia act if they actually TRY.  Besides they made Super Mario Galaxy last gen.  When they try to do something new and interesting with Mario it results in the cutting edge of platforming.  When they don't we get cliché sidescrollers.  It's their choice to focus on such titles.  There are rumours that open-world Zelda has run into development problems.  Not surprising since Nintendo was making Cube games with waggle while every other developer was branching into the open-world genre.  Nintendo's own decisions left them behind and they now have to learn the ropes and still deliver something that meets present-day expectations.


While I agree Splatoon is new and original, it is an idea long time Nintendo fans have been asking for a long time, it's just a unique spin on the Mario Paintball game.

And nobody is saying nostalgia is ALL they do but is sure as hell is what they do best, not just now but GBA name ten titles that weren't ports, remakes, or blatant rip offs of SNES games? It can be done but you will be naming crap nobody bought.

The GBA was notoriously bad for rehashed ports and probably would not have gotten away with that if it had any competition in the handheld market.  I'm pretty sure the N-Gage was the only competing handheld during the GBA's life.

I would say Nintendo does nostalgia best simply because it's what they spend a lot of time and effort doing.  No one just starts off as a nostalgia brand.  Nintendo built a legacy when those brands were all new.  They started getting a little too self-referential around the Cube era, which had disappointing sales.  Then they bounced back with the Wii which sold to a new audience and it's big killer app in Wii Sports was a completely new IP.  Then we have the Wii U which is a notorious flop.

They have this mistaken assumption that the same tired Mario stuff moves units.  Nope.  Didn't on the Gamecube, sold big on the Wii which attracted a large audience with a brand new IP unrelated to Mario, didn't on the Wii U.  Why do they think something like Mario Kart was such a massive hit on the Wii while it failed to move Cubes and now failed to move Wii U's?  It's because the nostalgia doesn't bring people to the console, it's something they get after something else inspires them to get the console.  After Wii Sports sold Wii's and created a large userbase, games like NSMB and Mario Kart Wii sold like gangbusters to that established userbase.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 22, 2015, 06:56:38 PM
Ian Said:  "They're perfectly acceptable games but when you're designing your console in such a way that it effectively jettisons a ridiculous amount of games that appear on every console but your's and you're talking up this controller as your big ace in the hole and the key to all this promised innovation, you can't then pretty much ignore the controller and release retro style games that could have been made 20 years ago.  I don't think it would have even mattered if the third party support was there.  Nintendo could easily get away with making good but not particularly innovative titles if they didn't set things up so that THEY ALONE have to carry the whole system.  They create more pressure on their own games to deliver and then intentionally make unambitious titles."

I completely agree with this.

Triforce Hermit:  Splatoon proves that Nintendo still knows how to make great games.  They had a team explore a concept....found the simple mechanics were fun and different.  Then worked to figure out how to move those concepts into a viable game.  Their effort in development paid off, and the game is a blast.  The sequel will be even better when they add voice chat, 4 team battles and such.  Actually I love the idea of Splatoon with 4 teams battling it out.  talk about strategy and planning needed for those matches. 

At any rate, the truth is Nintendo hasn't peaked...but Nintendo did panic and started trying to just magic money as quickly as possible to prove to their shareholders Nintendo isn't irrelevant and that they management is still capable of making smart decisions for the future of the company.
 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 22, 2015, 09:35:11 PM
The issue always comes back to the fact that Nintendo is generally very conservative in their business practices. On one hand, that's allowed them to survive as a company for over a century, and to survive lean periods like they've faced recently. On the other, they rely too heavily on the things they already know work, and don't try to push the envelope as much as they should. I'm not suggesting they go full-Sony, all out ambition and overextension, but if they're going to get back to being a major player in this business they're going to have to be more willing to take risks.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 23, 2015, 01:00:05 AM
Once again people seem to forget the 3DS even exist.  The 3DS alone shows Nintendo is still one of the biggest and most popular publishers in the industry.  Many of the 3DS top sellers are the newest installments of these franchises that still sell at numbers similar to what they did 20 years ago, and some like Fire Emblem are more popular then ever.  If Nintendo was selling on only nostalgia alone which some say is making them irrelevant, then their 3DS titles should be selling worse then their GBA counterparts since that was the last system before what people like Ian say Nintendo sold out to the casuals.  But the 3DS, despite having the heaviest competition Nintendo has ever had thanks to smartphones, which some people say the casuals that made the DS and Wii popular have moved to, is still selling software at number similar to the GBA and in many cases even higher then it's GBA counterparts.

The Wii U's problem wasn't because of the games they made for it not being popular anymore, it's because they released similar games on the much cheaper 3DS earlier.  Mario 3D Land and NSMB 2 are both 10 million sellers on the 3DS, which is much better then 99% games on the Xbox and Playstation will ever sell.  Except for Minecraft, every other 10 million plus seller on a non-Nintendo consoles pretty much requires a 100 million plus budget which includes development and marketing and being released on Xbox/PS and PC combined to achieve such result.  Nintendo on the other hand can achieve these sales on just one system with less then 5% of the same budget.

Yes making more games like Splatoon is useful especially so the home console has more unique software but this logic that Nintendo is now some niche company that only it's longtime fans still support is rather ridicules.  Unless you're going to argue the current over 54 million 3DS owner are all longtime hardcore Nintendo fans, in which case, over 50 million fans is far from niche.  Either way, Nintendo is still in a pretty healthy position from a software lineup.  They just need to do a better job at giving diversity between the home and handheld again so people have a bigger reason to own the more expensive home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 23, 2015, 01:35:48 AM
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2015-12-21/modernizing-super-mario-how-nintendo-has-reinvented-its-star

Quote
Tezuka declined to comment whether Mario will make an appearance on the smartphone screen. He also wouldn’t talk about the successor to the Wii U console, code-named NX.

“We feel quite strongly about creating things that are in sync with the times,” he said with a smile, a hand on the plush stuffed Mario doll at his side.

What does it mean? What does it mean?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on December 23, 2015, 09:34:30 AM

2003 George Harrison: "And of course Mario will never start shooting hookers"

2015 Takashi Tezuka: "We feel quite strongly about creating things that are in sync with the times, he said with a smile, a hand on the plush stuffed Mario doll at his side."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Triforce Hermit on December 23, 2015, 09:37:31 AM
Nintendo handhelds sell the majority based on Pokemon alone.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 23, 2015, 09:39:48 AM
Nintendo handhelds sell because the overwhelming majority of competitors they've ever seen have been massive flops, and the one that was reasonably successful had the misfortune of going against the best selling game system in the history of the industry.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on December 23, 2015, 01:02:13 PM
This is true, but Nintendo's dominance in that area isn't going to change any time soon. The NX handheld should sell like gangbusters.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 23, 2015, 01:21:41 PM
The issue always comes back to the fact that Nintendo is generally very conservative in their business practices. On one hand, that's allowed them to survive as a company for over a century, and to survive lean periods like they've faced recently. On the other, they rely too heavily on the things they already know work, and don't try to push the envelope as much as they should. I'm not suggesting they go full-Sony, all out ambition and overextension, but if they're going to get back to being a major player in this business they're going to have to be more willing to take risks.

Nintendo is conservative in a really weird way.  Here I am asking them to just make something conventional.  You figure a conservative company would have the problem of being TOO conventional but instead Nintendo is notorious for doing things in a weirdo Nintendo way.  The Wii was actually a HUGE risk.  Forgo a traditional hardware spec upgrade in favour of a non-traditional controller and have the controller be the only unique element of the console that would differentiate it from it's predecessor?  No one ever had done something like that before and if the controller flopped the whole thing was fucked.  But it paid off in spades and then Nintendo started being very safe with their releases.

Sticking with outdated hardware is not really conservative because it's completely different than what everyone else is doing and what everyone else had done before.  But then it really is just Nintendo's refusal to move from cartridges to discs or go online being extended to hardware.  So in that sense it is conservative but it's kind of not because Nintendo themselves always updated their hardware so they weren't going with what they always did.

Nintendo seems to be conservative on stuff where all of their competitors are moving up and they're the only ones staying behind.  And then they're very progressive on routine things where no one wants them to change what isn't broke but they force some wacky Nintendo way that generally flops.  You know what word actually describes them?  CONTRARY.  Nintendo's method is to do things different than everyone else does.  If everyone else changes something, Nintendo stays put.  If everyone else is sticking with something, Nintendo comes up with their own way to do it.  It's the sort of thing that lets them come up with brilliant ideas but 99% of the time just has them going with a stupid idea because the obvious good idea is already being done by everyone else.

What they should aim to be is to be the BETTER company.  Follow conventions when it's routine stuff that customers expect to work a certain way and then compliment that with new approaches when you think of a way to do things better - not arbitrarily different but actually better.  The games is where people want Nintendo to do new creative things, not the controller or the online infrastructure or the hardware or the stuff that's generally functional and doesn't call for creativity.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 23, 2015, 03:04:46 PM
The Wii wasn't really a risk from a business standpoint. Creatively it was a huge risk, but the thing was cheap to build, cheap to develop for, and had a massive profit margin from day one. Worst case scenario it flops and they quickly move on from it to something else. I guarantee you they had a backup plan for that scenario that they just never needed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 23, 2015, 03:51:54 PM
The Wii wasn't really a risk from a business standpoint. Creatively it was a huge risk, but the thing was cheap to build, cheap to develop for, and had a massive profit margin from day one. Worst case scenario it flops and they quickly move on from it to something else. I guarantee you they had a backup plan for that scenario that they just never needed.

Yep it's the same reason the DS was considered a third pillar until its sales exploded at the end of 2005.

That is what's rather funny about this gen.  People complain Nintendo has been too conservative when from a business standpoint, they were more reckless with the 3DS and Wii U then any previous hardware.  They thought after the DS and Wii that both successors would be a sure hit and released for the first time in history two systems that were being sold for a loss at launch.  So when the 3DS sold like **** after launch, they made an emergency price cut that helped save the system, but resulted in them taking their first ever yearly loss as a result.  Because of this they've been unable to drop the Wii U's price more because such a thing would cause an even bigger loss even if hardware sales would have benefited from it.

This is why I imagine the number one goal for NX hardware is to be profitable from day one so if worst comes to worst again, they'll have room to drop the price without breaking the bank and still retain better profits.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 23, 2015, 07:58:21 PM
The Wii wasn't really a risk from a business standpoint. Creatively it was a huge risk, but the thing was cheap to build, cheap to develop for, and had a massive profit margin from day one. Worst case scenario it flops and they quickly move on from it to something else. I guarantee you they had a backup plan for that scenario that they just never needed.

How is having a console flop just something you move on from?  You have to design games for the replacement product for starters.  The replacement product for a Wii flop is an Xbox 360 equivalent and we know from Nintendo's Wii U experience that they can't just casually whip up some HD games at a moment's notice.  If the Wii flopped Nintendo would pretty much have to just go on console hiatus for a bit to get a replacement ready.  And there's also the damage to reputation a weirdo console that flops would have.  If Nintendo had released something conventional it could underperform like the Cube but likely not outright flop.

Nintendo was pretty much risking their whole reputation on a product that was way different than any game system ever made and had it flopped there would be no way for them to finish the generation in anything but last place due to the ground they would give up while they scrambled for a replacement.  It's was either going to take off or Nintendo would lose the generation almost immediately.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on December 24, 2015, 08:33:20 PM
Yeah, a new console is always a business risk.  Even from a manufacturing standpoint, you'd have unsold inventory just lying around your warehouses and factories that have to be reworked for your backup plan.  Then you have angry retailers while unsold inventory either asking that you buy back the inventory or discounting the crap out of it. 

Having a positive contribution margin mitigates risk, sure.  But you still lose money if you don't sell enough units.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 25, 2015, 01:01:02 AM
Yeah, a new console is always a business risk.  Even from a manufacturing standpoint, you'd have unsold inventory just lying around your warehouses and factories that have to be reworked for your backup plan.  Then you have angry retailers while unsold inventory either asking that you buy back the inventory or discounting the crap out of it. 

Having a positive contribution margin mitigates risk, sure.  But you still lose money if you don't sell enough units.

That's why the Wii was so hard to find and constantly sold out the first several months of it's life.  Nintendo played it safe expecting Gamecube level sales at launch so when the system became as popular as it did it took months to ramp higher production.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 31, 2015, 06:26:21 PM
My Current theory for the NX: September '16 release of the hand held with weird screen, scroll wheel buttons, and external sensors for... something. coming in at a mass market $199.  TV/Console add on comes early '17 with added horsepower.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on January 06, 2016, 12:39:44 AM

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1166717


Quote
Nintendo slipped 5% in Tokyo after Nomura Securities said the mysterious new console NX, to be unveiled this June, will cannibalize the existing sales of 3DS and Wii U.


According to analyst Junko Yamamura, Nintendo will make NX available by 2016 year-end’s shopping season. Nomura expects Nintendo to announce the “concept” sometime between March and May, unveil the actual console in June, and launch it between October and November. “We think the NX will start to boost operating profits in 18/3, when it will have been on the market for a full year and will have a line-up of software titles, which carry high operating margins.”


http://blogs.barrons.com/asiastocks/2016/01/05/nintendo-slips-nx-to-eat-into-3ds-wii-u-nomura-cuts-target/?mod=yahoobarrons&ru=yahoo
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Shaymin on January 06, 2016, 07:02:41 AM
...no **** a new system would affect sales of the old one.

Nintendo should go private, honestly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 06, 2016, 09:40:46 AM
Nintendo should go private, honestly.

Pretty much, of course that's one of the reasons why Iwata spent like a billion dollars to buy most of Yamauchi's shares after he died from his family a few years ago.  Nintendo is at least aware how stupid many of their investors are and made the necessary steps to insure these idiots aren't able to gain even more power, because if they did the company would pretty much turn into Konami.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: rlse9 on January 06, 2016, 12:57:47 PM
Wow, that's just ridiculous, does Apple's stock take a hit when rumors of the iPhone 7 mean that the iPhone 6 is going to take a hit in sales?  I wonder what the stock price would have done if they had announced that the NX wouldn't impact 3DS/Wii U sales.  "It's not really of interest to anyone buying the products we currently make, but it's ok because it won't impact their sales at all..."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on January 06, 2016, 01:14:39 PM

This is interesting.


http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=191406998&postcount=614


Quote from: Kiddy Dong;191406998
For those of you hungry for some leaks, there's a guy on reddit who claims he has access to the NX's operating system. He says he's part of a group contracted by Nintendo to find exploits in the OS to run unsigned code (homebrew).


According to him, the OS build for NX compiles for ARM, and there's another build which compiles for PowerPC (likely for a Wii U OS update). There's also drivers for Google Fi, which he says lends credibility for a portable device. It also makes heavy use of Material Design in the OS.


https://np.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/3xuumg/rumor_nintendo_to_unveil_nx_in_january_at_ces/cyasp1u (https://np.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/3xuumg/rumor_nintendo_to_unveil_nx_in_january_at_ces/cyasp1u)


Of course, this is the internet and you'd be a fool to not take this information with a grain of salt. But judging from his post history, he seems like he knows what he's talking about. It's certainly believable enough, and reads like it's relevant developer information as opposed to wild fan speculation. Take it or leave it, I guess.


The guy on reddit seems to have some believable, developer-centered (not fanboy-centered) information.


As always, take with a grain of salt.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on January 07, 2016, 01:40:58 AM
I would just like to comment on a few statements made earlier in this thread, but first I would like to address the Wii U. Has anyone ever considered that it's stupid design and nature was an excuse to easily transition its products into handheld backwards compatibility? I mean, the clamshell design of the DS is comfortable (in my opinion), portable, and makes for great screen economy, so the Wii U being a more direct transition into NX as a handheld would justfiy a lot of its under-usage of gyro, emphasis on DS virtual console, and scaled back tech.

Eh, I'm tired. I'll tackle the other comments tomorrow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 07, 2016, 02:17:39 PM
Splatoon didn't cater to nostalgia and yet it is one of the most important games Nintendo has released in years.

I would say Splatoon is one of the most important games Nintendo has released in years because it didn't cater to nostalgia.

Nintendo should go private, honestly.

Pretty much, of course that's one of the reasons why Iwata spent like a billion dollars to buy most of Yamauchi's shares after he died from his family a few years ago.  Nintendo is at least aware how stupid many of their investors are and made the necessary steps to insure these idiots aren't able to gain even more power, because if they did the company would pretty much turn into Konami.

Meh. Stock price doesn't really impact your financials.  Nintendo needed Yamauchi's shares to prevent them from hiring and firing management all willy-nilly. Market over reactions are always to be expected.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ShyGuy on January 08, 2016, 12:21:46 AM
As a counter argument, Splatoon caters to turn of the century Nickelodeon/Dreamcast Nostalgia.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 08, 2016, 12:22:25 PM
I don't know if you'd call it "nostalgia".  It doesn't invoke that "yearning" for an older time as much as it tries to invoke the same kinds of ideas.  The silly, messy, colorful fun doesn't make me think "Yeah, 90s stuff!" but I'd be lying if I said that bright orange paint doesn't make me think of Nickelodeon.  So, maybe it's the same.  Maybe it's just not invoking nostalgia in a way that isn't exploitative and repetitive though like those buzzfeed articles that are all, "Here's a bunch of .gifs from 90s shows!".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 08, 2016, 04:46:48 PM
At one time all those games that inspire this nostalgia craze actually were cutting edge, original ideas. So what ever happened to the Nintendo that had more than ONE new franchise per generation? Is Splatoon really their only original idea for Wii U? If so then NX might be in trouble. Wii did both nostalgia and original very well, the problem was it did nostalgia too well and original wasn't always good.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 08, 2016, 06:15:12 PM
Well, they bought original ideas from Platinum.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 08, 2016, 06:28:57 PM
Well, they bought original ideas from Platinum.

That's a fair point, Nintendo has a history of commissioning outside companies to produce new ideas for them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 10, 2016, 12:42:33 AM
Yeah, it really speaks to how Nintendo is getting "too small" to maintain two consoles.  They really need to expand either organically (hiring) or inorganically (buying).  Personally, I'd like to see both.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 10, 2016, 12:59:45 AM
That's some of the logic in setting up so that at least some games are playable across both platforms. If one team can support both of them simultaneously that increases their reach without much more in the way of resources.

What I want to see though, is build a new studio from scratch, in the vein of EAD Tokyo, on a more regular basis. Nintendo built that team over a decade ago, and it's gone on to make some of the best games the company's put out in that span, but they haven't tried to do it again. They need to be putting together a team like that every 4 or 5 years, at least.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 10, 2016, 02:45:19 PM
That's some of the logic in setting up so that at least some games are playable across both platforms. If one team can support both of them simultaneously that increases their reach without much more in the way of resources.

See, I think that will only hurt the situation, if you currently own both platforms.  Just for the sake of argument, let's say Nintendo has capacity to make 10 games a year, 5 handheld, 5 console.  A platform that scales up/down still limits you to 10 games.  However, some of those handheld games will scale up, to some degree, meaning they need extra development time (whether that's HD graphics or a splitscreen mode).  That slows down the handheld releases.  So, you kind of end up in a situation where you get more Wii U games at the expense of 3DS games.  Now, if you just had a Wii U, then that's gravy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 10, 2016, 03:36:04 PM
Something like the next New Super Mario Bros. game could be on both without much extra work. You'd need better art assets for the console version, but you could just start with those and scale them back when necessary. I don't think it'd be much of a hindrance.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 10, 2016, 05:16:57 PM
If NX is really just an updated Wii U, and not x86_64-based (or hell, even 64-bit ARM), then they might as well not even waste their time making the system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 10, 2016, 06:26:05 PM
If Nintendo is listening to third parties even a tiny bit there's no way Hollywood and Broadway are staying in there another cycle. ARM makes a lot of sense for Nintendo's MO, with the DS and 3DS bot using it, as well as the mobile phone platforms they're starting to support. I honestly think that's more likely than them going x86 like PS4 and Xbox One.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 10, 2016, 06:34:17 PM
This is interesting.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=191406998&postcount=614 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=191406998&postcount=614)
Quote from: Kiddy Dong;191406998
For those of you hungry for some leaks, there's a guy on reddit who claims he has access to the NX's operating system. He says he's part of a group contracted by Nintendo to find exploits in the OS to run unsigned code (homebrew).

According to him, the OS build for NX compiles for ARM, and there's another build which compiles for PowerPC (likely for a Wii U OS update). There's also drivers for Google Fi, which he says lends credibility for a portable device. It also makes heavy use of Material Design in the OS.

https://np.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/3xuumg/rumor_nintendo_to_unveil_nx_in_january_at_ces/cyasp1u (https://np.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/3xuumg/rumor_nintendo_to_unveil_nx_in_january_at_ces/cyasp1u)

Of course, this is the internet and you'd be a fool to not take this information with a grain of salt. But judging from his post history, he seems like he knows what he's talking about. It's certainly believable enough, and reads like it's relevant developer information as opposed to wild fan speculation. Take it or leave it, I guess.

The guy on reddit seems to have some believable, developer-centered (not fanboy-centered) information.

As always, take with a grain of salt.

So what this "rumor" sounds like to me is that Nintendo is finally working closely with Google to get the base programming right, so they have a solid software foundation to Nintendofy across formats.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on January 11, 2016, 03:39:57 PM
Its not too much to ask for to have their new console be more powerful than xbox one and ps4.

They are already 2+ year old systems. Have at least the same clock speed, have more cores, higher amount of ram. AMD should give Nintendo a discount because they have been doing business with them for a long time, it seems like they had preference over Nintendo, and then suddenly Microsoft got the good ****.

Looking at the comparison between xboxone and ps4, i never knew they were that similar! Both have the same family of APU and GPU processors, the same amount of ram....jeez.

By now using an AMD Jaguar chip in a console must be pretty cheap. With a Radeon GCN.  So millions of these related chips have been selling in 2 consoles. The more of these chips they sell the cheaper they are by economy of trade.

Nintendo could re-use these chips, double the ram, and put in the wii u processors for backwards compatibility.

That would make sense...probably not happening.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 11, 2016, 04:41:25 PM
Its not too much to ask for to have their new console be more powerful than xbox one and ps4.

This is such a frustrating sentence.  11 years ago I would never feel like asking for a console to be more powerful than ones from two years before is something that needs to be worded in a delicate way.  We didn't ask, we assumed, because there was no other way to go about it.  Yet here I find that if Nintendo is even on-par that that would be worth celebrating.  Let's not mince words.  The NX is more powerful than the other consoles or it will flop.  Not a discussion.  That is the bare minimum requirement for a success.

Looking at the comparison between xboxone and ps4, i never knew they were that similar! Both have the same family of APU and GPU processors, the same amount of ram....jeez.

I think that just demonstrates how hard it will be for Nintendo to regain any third party support if they get cute and do too many things in a goofy Nintendo way.  The other consoles get largely the same games because it is so easy to port between the two of them.  The XB1 isn't even doing that well but if it's really easy and cheap to get your game on that platform as well, why not?  If you have to jump through hoops for a console that has a small market share?  That can limit the profit margin quite a lot if you have to put any serious development time into it.  You have your sales potential, which is limited by the userbase size, and you have the development costs.  If the development costs are too high you lose money.  Simple math, simple business logic.  The sales potential is going to be low on the NX for quite a while so the development cost needs to be cheap or no one will support it and it will make perfect business sense for them not to.

Easy ports or no third party support.  No third party support, no sales.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 11, 2016, 04:47:52 PM
I was just going to say something similar to Ian, NX had better be more than just slightly more powerful than the other two. It needs to be DC vs. N64 at bare minimum in terms of step up, probably even higher than that. Right now the longer they wait the more my hype/hope for this machine winds down. I had been very optimistic before on the whole two consoles one OS or one machine that does both home and portable gaming, because it means more games faster. But having strong third party support also means more games faster too.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 11, 2016, 06:54:08 PM
3rd Party ports that the XBone and PS4 are getting won't save the console either.  People who want to play those games probably already have those systems.  Nintendo needs a system devs are willing to make exclusives for; good exclusives, not the crap we got on Wii.  It's gotta have a hook that makes people want to try it and that games can deliver on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 12, 2016, 09:51:16 AM
3rd Party ports that the XBone and PS4 are getting won't save the console either.  People who want to play those games probably already have those systems.  Nintendo needs a system devs are willing to make exclusives for; good exclusives, not the crap we got on Wii.  It's gotta have a hook that makes people want to try it and that games can deliver on.


That is a very narrow minded view, seriously. Nintendo NEEDS those games in addition to any true exclusives they can get or else they are not going to make it. Sure a lot of people already have those machines, but a console generation can last up to ten years, there is nothing that says every single person that is going to buy an Xbox One or a PS4 already has or that every single person planning on it won't change their mind if Nintendo actually offers a true, viable, alternative. Seriously your way of thinking is the utter nonsense that has gotten Nintendo into this mess of trying too hard to be too different.

Nintendo has not made a console truly on even footing with their competition and given it the support it needs since the SNES, there is nothing to say if they did it again they couldn't be that successful especially with a sea of people buying PS4 just because they know Nintendo won't do just that. Also coming a year or two behind won't be the end of the world especially if it is B/C because that gives it a little bit to tide some people over while they make the transition and a HUGE Zelda at launch could be just the game to sway people if the console is actually capable of running the exact same games, with enhancements in some cases hopefully, in addition to exclusives.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on January 12, 2016, 10:46:36 AM
I don't know why we're arguing about power and ports when we all know the NX is a handheld.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 12, 2016, 11:47:21 AM
 :@
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 12, 2016, 11:51:18 AM
3rd Party ports that the XBone and PS4 are getting won't save the console either.  People who want to play those games probably already have those systems.  Nintendo needs a system devs are willing to make exclusives for; good exclusives, not the crap we got on Wii.  It's gotta have a hook that makes people want to try it and that games can deliver on.


That is a very narrow minded view, seriously. Nintendo NEEDS those games in addition to any true exclusives they can get or else they are not going to make it. Sure a lot of people already have those machines, but a console generation can last up to ten years, there is nothing that says every single person that is going to buy an Xbox One or a PS4 already has or that every single person planning on it won't change their mind if Nintendo actually offers a true, viable, alternative. Seriously your way of thinking is the utter nonsense that has gotten Nintendo into this mess of trying too hard to be too different.

Nintendo has not made a console truly on even footing with their competition and given it the support it needs since the SNES, there is nothing to say if they did it again they couldn't be that successful especially with a sea of people buying PS4 just because they know Nintendo won't do just that. Also coming a year or two behind won't be the end of the world especially if it is B/C because that gives it a little bit to tide some people over while they make the transition and a HUGE Zelda at launch could be just the game to sway people if the console is actually capable of running the exact same games, with enhancements in some cases hopefully, in addition to exclusives.

Nintendo doesn't have the mindshare that it used to.  It's past two consoles are looked at as a casual machine and a failure, respectively.  Buying a new Nintendo console is almost a risk to the consumer at this point.  I'm not saying Nintendo shouldn't get those ports, but those games coupled with another New Super Mario Bros, a barely iterative Mario Kart, and the mere promise of a new Zelda isn't going to win people over.  Especially if those games that really make the system (Splatoon, Smash, XCX) are few and far between.  Now, if Nintendo had a system where those ports could play or look better and sit alongside great Nintendo games, then they'd have something.

The console generation has already started and sales are slowing.  If you think tonnes of people will buy a Nintendo system just for the first party exclusives, then you're wrong.  The Wii U shows that.  If you think people who don't own an XBone or PS4 could be easily swayed, you'd also have another thing coming.  Those systems already have install bases, the NX would be starting from scratch.  Those systems will already have the 3rd party games (both released and in development).  Further, those systems are also going to be cheaper than a new-to-the-market console.  It's gotta have something that makes it stand out, whether it's a controller or just software design that addresses the short comings of the other consoles

The 3rd party ports are minimum requirement, sure. But I don't think Nintendo gets away with a by-the-books console on the same level as the PS4.  That console already exists.  It's the PS4. 

I don't know why we're arguing about power and ports when we all know the NX is a handheld.

Good point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on January 12, 2016, 02:05:41 PM
The ports need to come out early and they need to be strong, otherwise there's little use in releasing an "upgraded" version of a game a year after it's original launch- hell, it's risky to do that six months after a game launches, if Watch Dogs has shown us anything.

But again, this is all if the NX is a home console. Which it isn't. I don't care what way you try to spin it, Nintendo is going to double down on its handheld success and either make something that links to a TV, or links to another device that will be released even further down the road. Because it's a stupid idea, and because that's the unconventional thing to do.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 12, 2016, 03:05:40 PM
The ports have to be there.  They won't sell anyone on the console but they have to be there.  Hell, ports isn't even the right term.  We should use "multiplatform releases".  That's what they're called on the other consoles.  It's not like the games are thought of as a PS4 release ported to the XB1 or the other way around.  Usually a developer works on a game for the PS4, XB1 and PC at the same time and releases it at the same time.  This is how the videogame market works these days.  Games are made for all non-handheld platforms at the same time and the first party exclusives are what differentiate the platforms.  Nintendo has been the lone outsider in this and that more than anything is why the Wii U flopped.  Customers expect to buy one console and have 99% of the games made show up on it with only first party releases and a handful of third party exclusives being the exception.  This is why Bayonetta fans were PISSED that the sequel was a Wii U exclusive.  It was bucking the industry convention that the first game had followed.  You're not supposed to miss out on games like that if you buy one of the "normal" consoles.

Of course Nintendo also needs really exceptional first party exclusives to make anyone want to make the switch as the expected third party games won't attract someone that owns one of the other consoles.  They need to be really impressive games, not generic 2D sidescrollers like the Wii U was trying to peddle.  It will still be hard because the time to release something like this was when the other consoles were released but Nintendo fucked that up by releasing the Wii U instead so they have to do what they can with the situation they created for themselves.  The goal of the NX should be simply to make up lost ground so that next gen they launch a console that can truly compete.  The NX's is largely a stop-gap as the Wii U is not fit to survive for a full generation, particularly when the generations are now 7 or 8 years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on January 12, 2016, 03:24:24 PM
If NX is only a handheld... I won't be buying it. I didn't buy 3DS because DS didn't do it for me.

Ideally NX would be a console with a controller that is as powerful as a Playstation Vita(or Wii U) when you take it on the road. When at home it's games scale up to at the bare minimum of ps4 with more ram. That was my idea months ago. The one most people liked.

probably not going to happen. I think Nintendo should for once try to do something practical.  The introductory price for ps4 was $399, the introductory price for xboxOne was $499. At that price I think they have some room to take advantage of economy of trade and Moore's law.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 12, 2016, 05:12:16 PM
Ideally NX would be a console with a controller that is as powerful as a Playstation Vita(or Wii U) when you take it on the road. When at home it's games scale up to at the bare minimum of ps4 with more ram. That was my idea months ago. The one most people liked.

Is there any way Nintendo could do something like this where the controller's specs boost the console's without causing some very weird architecture that third parties wouldn't want to support?  I'm guessing you could split the RAM between the two but not something like a CPU.  I figure this is the sort of thing Nintendo would want to do but I fear it would get into "Sega Saturn has two CPUs and no one but Sega knows what the hell to do with it" territory.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: ThePerm on January 12, 2016, 06:33:33 PM
That sounds grossly inefficient. The console can boost the handhelds specs, but not really the other way around. Like for instance. Say you were playing a game like Minecraft that requires some storage space. The console could act as a server while you are away. You can play in the world and access it via 4g or someone elses wifi. But all the stuff that is changing is happening on the consoles save file, the handheld is only accessing it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Evan_B on January 12, 2016, 07:56:47 PM
...the DS didn't do it for you? It has one of the best software libraries in video game history. What did you need it to do?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 12, 2016, 08:02:52 PM
So the ideal setup is basically a PS4 with the PS Vita as the Gamepad?  Sounds like it would be expensive.  More likely Nintendo would skimp on the specs of both to meet a lower price point (and higher profit margin; let's not BS over the REAL reason Nintendo cheaps out).  Of course if they did a skimpy spec version wouldn't it be essentially a Wii U with a 3DS controller?  Where is the appeal in that?  Doesn't seem different enough than what we currently have.

Whatever they come up with for a handheld has to be a step up from the 3DS to justify its existence and any console can't just be the Wii U again.  Any hybrid idea needs some sort of noticeable hardware boost or it's basically just a 3DS with a TV-out and a portable Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Stratos on January 12, 2016, 09:41:47 PM
NX console is a traditional, top of the line gaming console with a more traditional controller. The NX handheld can act as the gamepad for the new console. The shared framework should allow them to operate together seamlessly, but allow the handheld to operate independently as a portable system.


I would also hope for something similar to Perm's idea where the home system can act as a central hub/server for other games. Allow it to be persistent online for games like Animal Crossing, Minecraft, Tomadotchi Life, and others. Imagine being able to visit your friends AC town while they are away-or better, a shared online village that can be visited by anyone at anytime.

Then there is further encouragement for each portable version to be more about the individual person going out and exploring the world through visiting other locations or playing AR style games like Pokemon GO.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Stogi on January 12, 2016, 11:58:45 PM
I really really think it's a mistake to make the NX a $400 PS4 clone. It's also a mistake to go the gimmick route (and I mean that in the best way) as it's hard to excite a massive audience unless what you offer is truly revolutionary.

I would be conservative and make a console that pairs well with a PS4 or an Xbone. If a PS4 is steak, then NX is scotch. I'd also make it $200 max. Max. Any higher and people will have no choice but to compare it to a PS4 and Xbone, and you don't want that. Any less and people will wonder why a 3DS is so much. $200 is the perfect price point to hit a niche market between heavy hitters and handhelds.

As for features, I'd let it link up with the 3DS or 4DS to come. Better yet, I'd let it link up with phones as well. Need an extra controller in a pinch? Or having people over and want to play music and videos? Make it an AppleTV but with much, much better games. Make the thing damn easy to make games for and port games to. Focus on indie steam games, lightning fast power on - to playing transitions, and multiplayer - particularly same room multiplayer (8 controller connection at least). In terms of power, make it a notch above a WiiU. I've yet to see any reason why all of the latest and greatest games couldn't be toned down in the graphics department and still work. And besides, it's not the job of this console. The only thing that matters is the structure of the computer architecture.


Most importantly, since I'd be putting out a cheap console guaranteed to make money per sale, I'd invest in many more studios working on every type of game, from tiny even texted based games to true masterpieces. I'd aim for a game every month, small or big. I'd also offer the best profit margin to any developer willing to make a bug-free game.


As for media, I'd use the internet of course and SD cards with dual functionality. Meaning, if developers want to make a game for the NX and 4DS, they can put it on one card and the user can play it on either platform. All Nintendo would need to do is encrypt the data so publishers can decide what size the cards need to be.


And I'd make the thing tiny and usb powered. If I could have it be powered by a TV, that'd be even better but at least have it tiny. I'm thinking the size and shape of a CD but an inch thick. If it can't be that small, then make it a block.


And lastly, the controller should as comfortable as gamecube and as functional as a PS3 controller. And then allow everyone to bring their own. Allow Xbone, PS4, PS3, and 360 controllers. Allow Wii, Wii U, and pro controllers. Allow cellphones. Allow options.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Adrock on January 13, 2016, 06:40:34 AM
I don't think Nintendo really has a choice on whether NX is compared to PS4/One, regardless of price. It's going to be. End of story. The only ways Nintendo gets a console down to $200 is if it aims low on hardware or takes a bath on it. For what Nintendo needs the hardware to be capable of as far as third parties are concerned, the latter may be too steep to get the console down to $200.

I'm in the camp that Nintendo should aim high hardware-wise this time if only because it's launching mid-cycle (and that's not even the only reason). Launching higher end hardware is something Nintendo hasn't tried. While it won't magically solve every problem, it's a start and does remove one major hurdle. NX should be more capable than PS4 out of principle. At the same time, launching at $400 against a juggernaut like PS4 is setting NX up to fail. I don't normally advocate selling at a loss, but I feel like Nintendo has to out of the gate. Nintendo has to sell, consumers don't have to buy, and Nintendo is launching from an extremely weak position. Both Sony and Microsoft can drop the price so Nintendo has to anticipate that and plan accordingly. I wonder if Nintendo can take a loss and launch at $300 with better hardware than PS4.

As for the handheld, the XL model (which should be available alongside the regular one at launch) shouldn't exceed $200. No exceptions. Nintendo already played that hand, and it lost. Badly.
NX console is a traditional, top of the line gaming console with a more traditional controller. The NX handheld can act as the gamepad for the new console. The shared framework should allow them to operate together seamlessly, but allow the handheld to operate independently as a portable system.
That's how I see it based on what Nintendo has been saying for the past few years. I'm still of the opinion that console and handheld will share some games, particularly first party.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 13, 2016, 09:31:01 AM
Nickmitch your problem is you just assumse that PS4 console generation is arbirtraily set in stone and once committed to it people won't want to move on. I was never talking about Wii U so why did you even bring it up Wii U was a mess from the start, Nintendo has a chance to fix those mistakes. If it is JUST another Wii U, mid-generation but barely on par then no it will fail it has to be both more powerful, and support B/C with Wii U and Virtual Console, not an easy task. On top of that it needs both Nintendo exclusives, which we all agree on, and third party exclusives, which I said but you ignored somehow. And you are delusional if you think people's minds are set on a five year cycle when history has show that other consoles can launch at any time and throw everything off. N64 was a mid cycle release and it did just fine comparatively.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: nickmitch on January 13, 2016, 01:32:02 PM
Nickmitch your problem is you just assumse that PS4 console generation is arbirtraily set in stone and once committed to it people won't want to move on.

I think your problem is you ignore the current situation and think there's only a minimal impact in launching a new console so late in the generation.  You also ignore what it means for Nintendo to abandon a console mid-generation.


Quote
I was never talking about Wii U so why did you even bring it up Wii U was a mess from the start, Nintendo has a chance to fix those mistakes.

I used it as an example.  You don't have to be talking about something for me to bring it up as an example.  For instance, you bring up the N64 later. Why? No one was talking about it.  But it illustrates your point, so you talk about it.  (Which is ok.)

Quote
If it is JUST another Wii U, mid-generation but barely on par then no it will fail it has to be both more powerful, and support B/C with Wii U and Virtual Console, not an easy task.

Ok, nothing disagreeable here.  But I would like to point out that I never said Nintendo should skimp on the horsepower.  I started with saying they need a hook.

Quote
On top of that it needs both Nintendo exclusives, which we all agree on, and third party exclusives, which I said but you ignored somehow.

So, I wasn't ignoring your point.  I was saying that not enough people bought Wii Us for just the exclusives.  When I said, "Especially if those games that really make the system (Splatoon, Smash, XCX) are few and far between" I was trying to imply that you need something than just exclusives.  Wii U has exclusives, great ones.  Maybe a better way to illustrate my point is that Nintendo needs their big, shiny, sexy games to come out more frequently.  Games like NSMB U (which I intentionally mentioned earlier) and DKC:TF are great games, but nothing to get excited about.  The promise of more of those first party games could make the system.

Quote
And you are delusional if you think people's minds are set on a five year cycle when history has show that other consoles can launch at any time and throw everything off. N64 was a mid cycle release and it did just fine comparatively.

"Delusional" is a bit harsh. I never said anyone's mind was set on a five year cycle.  But the N64 was a 2 year delay.  The NX would be a 3 year delay (at least).  The N64 also paled in sales to the PS1, pretty much only beating out the Saturn, which isn't much to brag about.

Look, my initial point is that the console needs a hook.  If Nintendo put out a machine on par with a PS4, it wouldn't be enough.  The multiplatform releases are needed, sure, but that's not enough.  Normally, I'd say exclusives sell systems.  But they didn't sell the Wii U (again, just using it as an example), so I can't say that's enough either.  It needs something that makes people say, "Hey, I wanna try that" or "Wow, that looks really fun".  Admittedly, it also needs the follow through.  Wii U's hook was half-baked to say the least.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 13, 2016, 02:31:40 PM
I've yet to see any reason why all of the latest and greatest games couldn't be toned down in the graphics department and still work.

Because scaling down a game requires time and money to make an inferior version of the game that no one that owns a console with the better version would EVER bother to buy.  Such titles would only sell with people that ONLY own the NX and if that audience was worth it for third parties to target they would be releasing Wii U games.  And at it's most basic level it's the company with zero leverage demanding that third parties jump through hoops for them which is same bullshit Nintendo has been pulling for 20 YEARS and it has failed miserably all that time and suddenly NOW it's going to work?  Nintendo has no position to ask any third party developer, retailer or CUSTOMER to make any special exceptions for them.  If they require the devs to make scaled down versions they just won't get the games.  If third parties weren't willing to do that for the Wii, which is one of the best selling consoles of all time, why would they do it for the NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!)
Post by: Stogi on January 13, 2016, 11:06:39 PM
I'm talking about game experiences, Ian and not specific games. Name one gaming experience that has to be made on the PS4 or Xbone. You can't. And like I said earlier, the NX should be a complimentary system. And it should allow the 4DS to play it's games remotely with the same gamecard. I don't see those two goals working with a huge system upgrade.

Furthermore, if you make the system architecture closely related to the PS4 and Xbone and PC, then I can see a flood of indie games coming to the NX and a few major titles. As long as it's easy to port and has the best profit margins and allows all sorts of options for control, I don't see third parties passing up an opportunity for more revenue.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 14, 2016, 08:50:39 AM
Scaling won't really be a problem if Nintendo gets on the same architecture as everyone else. It should absolutely go X86-64 on the console side (maybe even the handheld side too) because going with ARM complicates porting to NX. Assuming Nintendo takes the path of least resistance for once (e.g. X86-64), it should be aiming for NX hardware to be powerful enough that the most popular modern and current engines (e.g. Unreal Engine 4, Unity) run well on it.

NX doesn't really need more powerful hardware to run the same games as PS4 (get in the ballpark and scaling will the rest). Doing so just keeps Nintendo in a better position moving forward as a console that is launching mid-cycle. Of course, if Nintendo is planning more frequent hardware updates like some rumors suggest, maybe it doesn't think it needs to directly compete on hardware since it can just keep updating the hardware every other year or so. I don't like that strategy because that's the exact opposite reason I like buying consoles. Also, I think having different configurations is a generally bad idea because it will most likely confuse consumers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 14, 2016, 09:42:42 AM
Glad someone updated the thread title appropriately. 


I don't envy Nintendo's situation.  The path they've paved for themselves ("hybrid' home & mobile console) sounds like it could be as costly as some of the VR solutions that are coming out, but at least for Sony/Microsoft, they can ditch support of those & focus on their core consoles if they fizzle out.  This IS Nintendo's next core business driver.


That said, I'd personally be comfortable predicting the following:


1) The NX will at best get lazy ports of Western 3rd Party developers.  At worst, it'll repeat Wii U with being primarily being the Nintendo machine.  If it's the best case scenario, Nintendo will be the only company to utilize cross functionality between NX home console & handheld in a meaningful way.


2) Nintendo's strategy isn't to be the complementary console to Sony/MSFT.  They want to be the primary machine you play on.  They may get some sales through this market, but their aim is to be the main thing you play on.


3) Lower your expectations on how capable the handheld portion will be.  While patents aren't guarantees of planned functionality (http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/12/nintendo-touchscreen-controller-patent-offers-clues-about-upcoming-nx/), these patents make it look like they'd focus more on flexibility of control options rather than a core experience.  I have no expectations for a handheld portion as capable as a Vita, and moreso expect something akin to a portable accessory you can take on the go and play mobile, RPGs, RTS, & other games that require less tactile input.  I'd also expect the handheld portion to be more it's own separate console & an accessory to the home console, with the NX home portion coming with a controller similar to the Wii U Pro.


4) I expect the NX home console to have hardware comparable with PS4/Xbox One.  The Handheld to have Vita-like physical presence with more an empahsis on the front touchscreen and to not have a back touchscreen.  From a cost point, There's no way Nintendo launches NX home console over $299 - a big draw other than the killer app of motion control was the relatively cheap price point of $250.  If they want people to own both, they better find a way to get the handheld sub - $200, or at least offer a limited time discount to those who purchase the home console.



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 14, 2016, 10:42:59 AM
To those expressing pre-umbrage at Nintendo's bone-headed moves: there is no solid information at all about the NX. The "rumors" are barely even that, with the most recent one haven been taken apart by people in that NeoGaf thread. Actually, the only real new information there is people mentioning that Nintendo has an especially harsh NDA for the new system(s) this time around.

Also, all this talk about porting gives way too much credence to developer complaints about the difficulty. "Oh gosh, it's just so hard! We can't do it, sorry!" I'm sure it's not as easy as porting between PS4 and Xbone, but it wasn't some crazy mountain to climb with WiiU (the guys who ported Darksiders 2 talked about how quickly they got the build running, there were plenty of other ports in the launch window), and it won't be either if the new console is Arm-based.  Third parties just don't want to do it. Removing the supposed hurdle won't start an avalanche of ports, as the publishers will just come up with some other reason or fall back on the old demographic standby. The reality is that the big houses are perfectly happy with three platforms: PS4/Xbone/PC.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 14, 2016, 12:54:47 PM
To those expressing pre-umbrage at Nintendo's bone-headed moves: there is no solid information at all about the NX. The "rumors" are barely even that, with the most recent one haven been taken apart by people in that NeoGaf thread. Actually, the only real new information there is people mentioning that Nintendo has an especially harsh NDA for the new system(s) this time around.

Also, all this talk about porting gives way too much credence to developer complaints about the difficulty. "Oh gosh, it's just so hard! We can't do it, sorry!" I'm sure it's not as easy as porting between PS4 and Xbone, but it wasn't some crazy mountain to climb with WiiU (the guys who ported Darksiders 2 talked about how quickly they got the build running, there were plenty of other ports in the launch window), and it won't be either if the new console is Arm-based.  Third parties just don't want to do it. Removing the supposed hurdle won't start an avalanche of ports, as the publishers will just come up with some other reason or fall back on the old demographic standby. The reality is that the big houses are perfectly happy with three platforms: PS4/Xbone/PC.


Just to speak briefly to the bolded above - 3rd party developers didn't quit porting to Wii U because it was too hard.  They quit porting to the Wii U because the install base is miserable, and the financial incentive isn't there.  Even if the ports of 3rd party companies made money over the cost of porting it, there's a term called opportunity cost, meaning basically "If I Port this game to Wii U, what opportunities are we missing out on by using our limited staff to focus on this instead of maybe working on project A, B, or C?".


The question may be "will this port make us money", but the bigger and right question these publishers ask are "Will this port make us more money than other projects we could have our employees working on right now?".  And the answer to that is a pretty straightforward "no". 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 14, 2016, 02:28:20 PM
Whoa whoa whoa, I'm not so sure that's the correct answer, here. Its a combination of having to make development sacrifices and loopholes for a system structured to do things efficiently in a very different way from more western-oriented philosophies, which eats up dev time and money, in addition to the system being weak, sales-wise. I believe the XBone's install base grew faster than the Wii U but they are not drastically different in terms of overall sales. Am I wrong about this?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 14, 2016, 02:57:03 PM
Nintendo is supposedly notorious for being unfriendly for third parties.  Like they won't document the console worth a **** and if you phone their support they have to contact NCL in Japan and then it takes days to get a simple response because of all the translating and back and forth between countries in different time zones.  Days and weeks of wasted time and thus wasted money go by.

So you have that plus they go with what is essentially non-standard architecture and go weak on power (prioritizing idiotic stuff like power consumption and fan noise instead) and the Wii U product itself was something that everyone but Nintendo knew was doomed to fail.  You think third party devs didn't know that Nintendo was releasing a PS3 equivalent a mere year before the PS4's launch?  They had to know in order to have time to make the PS4 launch so they knew early on that the Wii U was a dumb product and pulled out the second the weak launch sales confirmed their assumption.  The second they found out what the other guys were doing they probably realized the Wii U was screwed so they finished the projects they already started and had no intentions of supporting it further unless the launch sales were really strong.

Weak selling console with a very questionable business strategy behind it that requires MORE work to make games for than the others.  From a strictly business perspective it makes perfect sense to not bother with it.  But if it doesn't require more work and the product actually resembles something that could sell maybe they would.  It isn't like Nintendo set up this perfect product that everyone just ignored.  If Nintendo didn't give a perfectly legitimate reason to not support them would they still not get support?  Kind of hard to determine that since Nintendo never plays ball.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 14, 2016, 04:20:51 PM
Whoa whoa whoa, I'm not so sure that's the correct answer, here. Its a combination of having to make development sacrifices and loopholes for a system structured to do things efficiently in a very different way from more western-oriented philosophies, which eats up dev time and money, in addition to the system being weak, sales-wise. I believe the XBone's install base grew faster than the Wii U but they are not drastically different in terms of overall sales. Am I wrong about this?


To me at least, what you wrote is a longer version of [size=0px] [/size][/size][size=0px]"Will this port make us more money than other projects we could have our employees working on right now?".  That encompasses things like the cost of them working to understand added complexity of the Wii U.[/size]
[/size]
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Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 14, 2016, 05:46:46 PM
There is a reason why Nintendo has to abandon Wii U. Nintendo never really has abandoned a system on this level before. Things aren't working.

Nintendo's best bet is to give gamer's the system they've always wanted. The trick of the matter... What's that?

One would imagine there are five routs for that:
1 Something Weird: This is no longer working.
2 Something Practical: A clone of ps4/xbox one. This is unlikely for Nintendo.
3 High Powered Console, wii U controller that becomes portable (the price tage of which would be $400, $500, but sounds appealing.
4 Going all in on handhelds and dropping consoles.
5. A very high powered handheld, a handheld so powerful that it is more powerful than any console on the market. meaning that it is more powerful than any ipad/cellphone as well. Competing directly with Apple, but also Sony and Microsoft.
6 A powerful tablet that comes with a controller and a dongle.
7 "Bring your own tablet" console. That's one thing Nintendo with Wii u should have done was realized "hey everyone has tablets" and allowed them to hook up their controllers via usb for 2-4 players.  Microsoft has patents on some of this, but not sure what Nintendo can and cannot do.

8 Xbox One- people don't realise this, but Sony is doing way better than Microsoft. Microsoft is rumored to be selling the xbox brand. Xbox one's numbers are actually pretty comparable to Wii U's as far as units sold. Even the president said it might be a good idea publicly. All Nintendo has to do is buy the brand, throw in their new controller for xbox one, create wii u cross compatibility options, port wii u games, and piggyback on xbox's future. This would give both brands a needed push. Reunites Rare with Nintendo. Unifies some market share. If I were to announce I bought the xbox brand, the first game to announce would be a gorgeous James Bond game. This would remind all the console shooter fans where it started.  Question? whats the amount of people who have both a wii u and an xbox one in their home? Sony has 36 million consoles sold and both Microsoft and Nintendo have 10 million each. Also if they brand the xbox one Nintendo NX in Japan..sales will spike in that region.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 14, 2016, 06:01:12 PM
Nintendo's best bet is to give gamer's the system they've always wanted. The trick of the matter... What's that?

The last time they had a console that was what gamers truly wanted was the SNES.  So what's a modern SNES?  If Nintendo never went insane with cartridges on the N64 what would the Wii U have been?  Nintendo took a weird turn in 1996 and they're now miles and miles off course.  So where would they be if they didn't and how do they get there now?

What I personally want is a combination of the third party support of the PlayStation consoles with the quality first party games of Nintendo.  That's what the NES and SNES were!  It's funny that Nintendo insists on being weird all the time whole time but aside from the casual fad of the Wii (which pretty much destroyed their rep with the dedicated gamer market and sowed the seeds for the Wii U's rejection), being weird and contrary has not worked for their consoles!  The NES and SNES were incredibly straightforward.  The weird stuff like sticking with cartridges and not going online are the things that blew up in their faces yet the thought pattern that led to such idiotic ideas is what Nintendo clings to.  It's like everyone working their thinks R.O.B. is the reason the NES was successful.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 14, 2016, 06:14:25 PM
Eh, looking back I think Nintendo made the right choice with cartridges. The games are still better on n64 than on Playstation. All those FMVs look horrible(I never though much of them then anyhow) The fmvs gave allthese people a false opinion Playstation was better. It is still a false opinion. They were the gimmick.

The only thing that changed was the culture of video games. It'd be weird for Nintendo to do anything but carts. Carts work. Carts still work.  Trying to get to the second disc of your ff7? Too bad. Even if you kept your disc immaculate, chances are the drive doesn't work on your psx.

I fucking hated load times. PSX never did it for me.

Gamecube was a pretty straight forward console, but i guess it didn't have online. It didn't have shitty experimental, and slow online with generic shooters.

I think Wii hit it out of the ball park, the only problem was when they stopped making games for it 2 years early.

Wii U also was great, but third parties didn't want to have anything to do with it because it got leapfrogged by a huge margin graphically in its second year. I don't think Wii U was much more than conventional itself. They should have made it more powerful. The controller is nice, but it is expensive. It would be better if they made a straight forward power console initially, and then introduced the controller at this point.  Ideally that is what I would want. I'm still pretty satisfied with the wii u controller, if it had mult touch it would be perfect. I just want my Metroid game to have battlefront graphics.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 14, 2016, 07:02:53 PM
Nintendo is supposedly notorious for being unfriendly for third parties.  Like they won't document the console worth a **** and if you phone their support they have to contact NCL in Japan and then it takes days to get a simple response because of all the translating and back and forth between countries in different time zones.  Days and weeks of wasted time and thus wasted money go by.

Honestly, fixing this will likely solve their 3rd party issue more than anything.  Just having an office (or two) in NA with people trained to help developers would make a difference.  They could go all out and invite devs to workshops or make house calls.  NOA (and NOE) should have this as a core function.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 14, 2016, 07:13:24 PM
Eh, looking back I think Nintendo made the right choice with cartridges. The games are still better on n64 than on Playstation. All those FMVs look horrible(I never though much of them then anyhow) The fmvs gave allthese people a false opinion Playstation was better. It is still a false opinion. They were the gimmick.

The thing is the games left because of the cartridges and gamers followed and really that makes sense.  You just spent the last generation enjoying all these games from companies like Nintendo, Square, Capcom, Konami and then everything splits so that Nintendo is on one side and everyone else is on the other.  Unless you like Nintendo's output more than all of those other companies' combined you were going to go PlayStation.  And the people that stuck with the N64 and have stuck with Nintendo for all these years are the people the value Nintendo's output more than everyone else's put together.  Most people don't have such Nintendo-centric tastes as the Wii U demonstrates.

Really it's about money, isn't it?  Third parties didn't give a **** about load times and durability or even the superior specs of the N64.  At the core of it creating CD games was WAY cheaper so they went in that direction.  Nintendo was insisting on other businesses to spend more money on development and most of them rejected it, just like they do NOW.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 14, 2016, 07:47:11 PM
They didn't care much about making good games. You have a handful of good games on playstation. You have some games that are "good", but were overrated to me. The games that really stick out were Metal Gear,  Resident Evil, Tekken. I think ff7 is a highly flawed game, and never thought it was fun.

You have to think, it wasn't so much that Nintendo went with cartridges, they just stayed with cartridges. They had deals with companies that made cd based tech, but they fell through. You got a decade of **** not working out between Sony and Phillips. If everyone recalls it was Panasonic who finally hooked Nintendo up. CD was never going to work for Nintendo. Things finally came around in the DVD generation. Once they got situated with optical technology they were able to move forward with it.

Speaking of which. Maybe we'll be going back to carts? They're bigger than BLU-Rays now. I imagine the future is mainly digital, but there are some nice advantages to having some sort of physical media.

https://jet.com/product/detail/63f29fda27ac49ae81884a21b7668798?jcmp=pla:ggl:electronics_a2:electronics_accessories_memory_flash_memory_a2_other:na:na:na:na:na:2&code=PLA15&k_clickid=6ccd5110-69f2-4f9b-bd3a-67e75469962c&abkId=403-186666&gclid=Cj0KEQiAq920BRC8-efn57XrotYBEiQAlVlMQ-jwuUzq10vUQ-3Ex6Yv3H-EDnMsgOW8oy-ebhMUc4EaAqog8P8HAQ
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 14, 2016, 09:33:10 PM
I am prepared to give my soul to a glorious, cart-based future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 15, 2016, 01:41:35 AM
Nintendo is supposedly notorious for being unfriendly for third parties.  Like they won't document the console worth a **** and if you phone their support they have to contact NCL in Japan and then it takes days to get a simple response because of all the translating and back and forth between countries in different time zones.  Days and weeks of wasted time and thus wasted money go by.

Honestly, fixing this will likely solve their 3rd party issue more than anything.  Just having an office (or two) in NA with people trained to help developers would make a difference.  They could go all out and invite devs to workshops or make house calls.  NOA (and NOE) should have this as a core function.

Yeah, that would definitely be a good move, but one that would likely end up with Nintendo taking on porting and marketing costs for these games as well, and that's probably not a climate they want to encourage. But still, I'd wager that porting between the 360 and PS3 was probably a bigger pain in the ass than porting between 360 and Wii U then/now, and probably will have been a bigger pain in the ass than porting between a theoretical Arm NX and PS4/Xbone in the future. Nintendo could certainly be a better port midwife, but I still question how many western third-parties would bother short of basically licensing games to Nintendo to port and promote themselves. Which I reiterate they probably should do anyway, but I doubt there's much Nintendo can do to attract these pinatas to the yard aside from distributing moneyhats.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 15, 2016, 07:59:13 AM
Speaking of which. Maybe we'll be going back to carts? They're bigger than BLU-Rays now. I imagine the future is mainly digital, but there are some nice advantages to having some sort of physical media.

https://jet.com/product/detail/63f29fda27ac49ae81884a21b7668798?jcmp=pla:ggl:electronics_a2:electronics_accessories_memory_flash_memory_a2_other:na:na:na:na:na:2&code=PLA15&k_clickid=6ccd5110-69f2-4f9b-bd3a-67e75469962c&abkId=403-186666&gclid=Cj0KEQiAq920BRC8-efn57XrotYBEiQAlVlMQ-jwuUzq10vUQ-3Ex6Yv3H-EDnMsgOW8oy-ebhMUc4EaAqog8P8HAQ

That's still $'s for a blank medium vs ¢'s on a disc.
3rd parties will still rather go multi-disc than single cartridge, just from a cost standpoint alone.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 15, 2016, 08:52:52 AM
Digital games make the cost of media less of an issue though they, admittedly, don't erase the issue. The only way Nintendo can get away with ditching optical discs from its consoles if it the physical media is cross-platform between console and handheld since optical discs just aren't practical on handhelds. Being available to both audiences also helps justify the change.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 15, 2016, 11:13:32 AM
Which is why the NX handheld should be single screen and cart based while the the home console, also cart based, unlocks dual screen capability and DS/3DS backwards compatability.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 15, 2016, 12:57:54 PM
I like carts but if they go with carts then I hope you like how the Wii U gets like six games a year because that's what will continue.  Nintendo has no leg to stand on.  No third party will be willing to pay more for development on a Nintendo console development than they do for the other consoles and cartridges cost more than discs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on January 15, 2016, 03:33:00 PM
Unless Nintendo decides to foot the bill for the extra medium cost, which will never happen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stogi on January 15, 2016, 03:54:39 PM
They would if the carts were ambidextrous. If it worked for the NX and the 4DS, there's a chance they would foot the bill.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 15, 2016, 04:45:48 PM
I like carts but if they go with carts then I hope you like how the Wii U gets like six games a year because that's what will continue.  Nintendo has no leg to stand on.  No third party will be willing to pay more for development on a Nintendo console development than they do for the other consoles and cartridges cost more than discs.

I think we've established that discs are dead though, and carts still have a future/are cheap now/have storage space better than a blu-ray/are more portable/more durable.

Going back to carts only seems logical now. In a year 128GB solid state media will cost $69.99 retail...because they already do.

http://tinyurl.com/jbd2mdl

That's more than enough space to hold 4k video and whatever else you would need.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 15, 2016, 05:24:24 PM
While I strongly favor ditching optical media, I think there's potential for backlash. If third parties are looking for a reason, they'll find one. The cost of media could be one such reason. At the same time, if Nintendo is smart about it, perhaps third parties wouldn't resist such a change.

1. Flash media is pretty cheap these days, and it continues to drop in price. For example, if you're diligent, you can get a 32 GB SDHC Class 10 Card for around $10. Consider that it's still sold at a profit.

2. Nintendo sets the price of its proprietary media. An N64 cart cost third parties $20 each for what, usually like 4 or 8 MB? Most games these days are under 32 GB. Nintendo shouldn't be trying to make money this way. I'd like to see third parties purchase media directly from the company that manufactures it instead of having to go through Nintendo and get charged extra. It's certainly Nintendo's right to do what it pleases as the hardware manufacturer, but it's still a crummy way of doing business. More importantly, Nintendo isn't in the position to get away with it anymore.

3. Cut third parties a deal on licensing if they release a retail version, maybe even add incentives based on a title's sales. For example, for every million physical copies sold, Nintendo foots part of the bill on subsequent runs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 15, 2016, 05:47:47 PM
Nintendo sets the price of its proprietary media. An N64 cart cost third parties $20 each for what, usually like 4 or 8 MB? Most games these days are under 32 GB. Nintendo shouldn't be trying to make money this way. I'd like to see third parties purchase media directly from the company that manufactures it instead of having to go through Nintendo and get charged extra. It's certainly Nintendo's right to do what it pleases as the hardware manufacturer, but it's still a crummy way of doing business. More importantly, Nintendo isn't in the position to get away with it anymore.

This here is why whenever someone defends the N64 with nonsense about Nintendo caring so much about load times compromising their games I roll my eyes.  THIS was the reason they stuck with carts more than anything.  They loved making money off of the media and had the hubris to assume third parties would put up with it despite an alternative being available from a competitor.

Nintendo operates like a penny pinching small businessman who thinks that if he "accidently" gives people the wrong change and buys cheaper toilet paper for the bathroom that that will earn him the big bucks, all while he completely ignores the mass of potential customers he turns off with his bullshit.  You earn money from third parties with license fees.  A console maker gets a cut of every game sold so it's in their best interest to have lots of third parties games that sell lots of copies.  Nintendo doesn't think like that.  They're hung up on exploiting third parties thinking that that is where the moolah will be but it backfires because it costs them support.  If third parties don't support you you make NO MONEY off of them.

Nintendo has the same philosophy with hardware.  "If we cheap out on the hardware we can have a higher profit margin on each console sold."  **** any other excuse, THAT is why the Wii was the way it was.  Of course the flaw in this reasoning is that weaker hardware results in an inferior product which is a harder sell.  A small profit margin on a better product stands to make more money in the long run by creating a larger userbase for which to sell games to.  Oh and if the third party support is healthy then THOSE games sell better too and Nintendo gets a cut of all of that.  And better third party support improves the perceived quality of the console so that increases console sales... which increase the potential sales of every game released all of which Nintendo gets some money from and the whole things perpetuates.  But Nintendo always pisses all of that away because they're hung up on exploiting everyone in the short term.

They're the creep businessman that figures that screwing over a customer once and losing him forever is worth more than years of repeat business at a smaller profit margin per visit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stogi on January 15, 2016, 06:01:53 PM
But my cartridges still work.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 15, 2016, 06:24:15 PM
This here is why whenever someone defends the N64 with nonsense about Nintendo caring so much about load times compromising their games I roll my eyes.  THIS was the reason they stuck with carts more than anything.  They loved making money off of the media and had the hubris to assume third parties would put up with it despite an alternative being available from a competitor.
Why exactly can't both be true? While Nintendo does indeed like having control over its hardware (that is one of the perks of being a hardware manufacturer), it isn't inconcievable that Nintendo cared about load times and such as well. Nintendo has always cared about the game experience to the point where it flat-out cancelled nearly finished games (e.g. Star Fox 2). I don't really see how you can view this as only hubris. There were a variety of reasons for sticking with cartridges. The entire SNES CD-drive saga was a mess, and Sony almost took Nintendo for a ride. Maybe Nintendo overreacted and kept its cards way to close to the chest after that. Going forward with Sony's deal would have been really awful for Nintendo. Sticking with cartridges ultimately cost Nintendo dearly, but too many things happened to blame it all on arrogance.

Personally, I think CDs sucked as a medium for video games. I've never been fond of optical media in general though, admittedly, there have been enough technological advances to make it not absolutely terrible. The original PlayStation was rocking a 2x CD-ROM drive. Ew. Optical media technology in the mid to late 90s just wasn't very good. We all dealt with it obviously. In retrospect, I don't think it was very conducive for the gameplay experiences I wanted. It was a lot of waiting, a lot of bad FMV.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 15, 2016, 11:23:00 PM
You know what was great? Me and my buddy played Mortal Kombat 4 every day. Occasionally we would go to his house. He had a playstation. I had an n64. We got right into the game to play on n64. When we went to his house, we had to wait to play.

Then another time I went over to someones house and he was showing off all the games, like Metal Gear, or Final Fantasy. He had a hard on for FF7, I just didn't see the appeal. What was even weirder was he would walk around the pre-rendered backgrounds which were just jpegs, and then the monster battle would happen and the characters would have a totally different inconsistent design. Its like one of those movies where the movie is bad, but its filled with all the special effect gimmicks.

eventually my brother won a Playstation in a raffle. I had got ff7 and metal gear. ff7 did not grow on me,. Metal Gear was an exciting adventure. Until I got to the second disc. The second disc did not work. I tried renting a game I owned, still did not work. I eventually had to finish the game on gamecube. Playstation did have Resident Evil games. Which although were similar to ff7 in design, were much more exciting. Still kinda bad because they were 3d games not designed for a 3d controller.

on n64 you had all those great n64 games and the only one that had a load time was a not so great Shadowman.

Most psx games sucked except a handful. I don't know how you can reconcile Nintendo's profit motivation with 3rd party profit motivation. It led several game companies to drop quality. The work done by developers on n64 was what I thought of as a higher pursuit. Sure, there are some shitty games on n64. Most games however hold up much better through the lens of time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 15, 2016, 11:29:31 PM
Nintendo stuck with cartridges because could make money off of them, and they didn't want to deal with licensing and using CD-ROMs or DVD-ROMs from other companies. That's it. It had nothing to do with load times. The GameCube had excellent load times.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 15, 2016, 11:39:20 PM
Cartridges being a lot harder to pirate was a big part of it too. And the GameCube didn't have issues with load times because the tech had improved a whole hell of a lot from the 2x CD drives of the mid-'90s.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 16, 2016, 01:12:34 AM
I wonder how hard it will be to sell carts (as the default) to people for the next generation of consoles.  Like, it would be one of those super practical changes, but I feel like regular people would be weirded out for some reason.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 16, 2016, 02:28:00 AM
I wonder how hard it will be to sell carts (as the default) to people for the next generation of consoles.  Like, it would be one of those super practical changes, but I feel like regular people would be weirded out for some reason.

Any carts Nintendo uses would basically be like the DS/3DS ones which are still pretty common to a whole generation of people.  If Nintendo's goal with the NX is to make the handheld and home console closer to each other, sharing carts would make sense and the overwhelming majority of people who still play Nintendo games are used to them as the 3DS shows.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 16, 2016, 02:42:11 AM
Yeah, I had a longer version of the post until I realized Nintendo has been doing it the whole time, especially with increasing capacity of 3DS carts (that's been going up, right?).  But for "the other side" (read: people who don't play Nintendo systems) how do Sony and MS sell people on that idea? How do those people react? I try to picture myself explaining to my friends a disc-free future (which is inevitable) that still needs physical media, and all I can picture is bewilderment.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Triforce Hermit on January 16, 2016, 08:38:22 AM
You know for a fact that if Nintendo went back to cartridges for consoles, the internet would be screaming at the top of their lungs like children.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 16, 2016, 11:03:11 AM
Nintendo stuck with cartridges because could make money off of them, and they didn't want to deal with licensing and using CD-ROMs or DVD-ROMs from other companies. That's it. It had nothing to do with load times.
Well, that isn't true. Nintendo managed to get around licensing fees since transitioning to optical media by disabling movie and music playback. It never believed in optical media until technology advanced enough to allow it to not be awful. And Nintendo still talks about the advantages of ROM cartridges. Nintendo didn't stick with cartridges for any one single reason. The reasons were collectively all the things that have already been discussed.

Nintendo might have gotten away with it if it gave a damn about third parties at all. It never has outside of token attempts there and there, even in the 8-bit and 16-bit days some people look so fondly on. The article isn't available anymore besides snippets here and there, but Emily Roger's "The Sexual History Between Nintendo and Electronic Arts" illustrated this pretty well. It wasn't until Dan Adelman tried to change the culture within Nintendo when it came to indie developers that any headway was made, and he ended up leaving Nintendo about a year and a half ago.

As a company that was homegrown and family owned for decades, it's obvious why Nintendo operates in a bubble. Shigeru Miyamoto created Mario and Donkey Kong because Nintendo couldn't get the rights to Popeye. Then, Universal sued Nintendo for copyright infringement because it cornered the giant gorilla market or something. Next, Sony reached out with a "partnership" that had extremely one-sided terms. Negative dealings with other companies happens enough times and you start getting xenophobic. That doesn't make it right, but it's easy to see where the attitude comes from.

Nintendo seemed to soften its stance on many things once Hiroshi Yamauchi stepped down, but it never lost its desire to remain self-sufficient and independent. That's a different kind of problem though. Sony and Microsoft are overly reliant on third party software. That has gotten so bad that Phil Spencer said in August that Microsoft plans to focus more on first party exclusives. Nintendo's problem seems to be that it thinks it can't do its own thing while also opening the doors and giving back a little.

However, Nintendo has done a better job in recent years, not a good job but a better one. It's licensing out its IPs, making partnerships, and reaching out in unprecedented ways. It's a start, but Nintendo has to get on that. That's my hope for NX. Nintendo doesn't have to stop the good parts of what makes the company what it is to rid itself of the bad parts. Sony is buying exclusives like there's no tomorrow while Nintendo is practically asking not to be bothered. Can it find a middle ground maybe?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 16, 2016, 12:15:55 PM
I'm not just talking about content licensing (DVD movies), I mean actually purchasing DVD-ROM drives from other companies. Also, yes, drives had gotten faster than the PSX days, but load times on the GameCube were significantly faster than load times on the PS2.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 16, 2016, 03:26:19 PM
If Nintendo can do some marketing cornering on Japanese third parties, like what they have already done with Monster Hunter and Yokai Watch, they might be able to prove to western third parties their potential within the boundaries of that handheld.

As it stands, however, I doubt Nintendo will ever really successfully communicate with western third parties outside of indies.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 16, 2016, 03:50:59 PM
Nintendo does indeed operate in a bubble, but doesn't also seem like the other part of the industry operate in a bubble too?

Nintendo's bubble has always been off-putting, but it's also been off-putting that since Xbox came out the industry has always thought of the industry as XBOX vs PLAYSTATION. Even during the years where Wii was dominant in sales, Nintendo would have their section(which was always smaller) tucked in the back of Gamestop, or always eclipsed in Best Buy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on January 16, 2016, 03:56:35 PM
Wasn't that just retailers following the demands of the market? Wiis sold well, along with maybe only a dozen games. Other systems had more games that consistently sold, justifying the extra shelf space.


More importantly, Nintendo was notoriously a jerk to retail partners. While other companies consistently sent reps to stores and helped in numerous ways, Nintendo made unreasonable demands such as dropping the MSRP on merchandise without warning stores. Retailers responded by giving less shelf space to Nintendo products.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 16, 2016, 04:02:33 PM
Nintendo's entire strategy has to change. The Japanese console market is on life support. Nintendo should court Japanese third party support with its 3DS successor. Get the handheld right and Nintendo will keep that support. Western third parties generally don't care about handhelds. They make games for consoles and PC. Get the console right and Nintendo merely gets their attention. Nintendo can get everything right about the hardware and that still isn't enough. Outside of just flat-out putting Steam on NX, Nintendo will have to reach out to each Western third party individually and prove NX is worth supporting. That requires Nintendo to rethink its culture from the ground up. Not everything gets tossed as Nintendo has good ideas. Miiverse, for example, is a really great idea even if it hasn't reached its full potential. However, Nintendo will have to relinquish some control, something it has historically been resistant towards. Can it, for example, deal with the fact that some people are going to be vicious cunts on its servers just to include universal voice chat, Swapnote, and Flipnote? Nintendo can't keep trying to police people's behavior for the supposed greater good if it wants to catch up with the rest of the world.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 18, 2016, 11:24:44 AM
I am a little behind on my responses, been busy at work.

Nickmitch, sorry if I offended you or misrepresented what you were saying, somehow I misread your post.


Personally I think there is literally nothing Nintendo can ever do to get back to the SNES days of control, third party support, and originality. The SNES was probably the last time Nintendo launched as many franchises that have stuck around since the NES.

Launching new franchises means squat when all they do is cater to the same crowd though. As much fun as Spaltoon is, it is probably the most Nintendo like game to come along. On the NES and SNES they were not just known for one type of game like they are now, they had a very broad range.

They occasionally branch out using partners but the reality is they rarely take the chances like they once did. This is the problem they have gotten themselves into. The real issue is they didn't know the NES was going to take off so they did everything they could to make sure it had every type of game that was required to sell the system. When the market accepted them then their partners flocked to release games on the system to cash in.

Nintendo needs to accept they do not NEED third parties, they need games. They need variety and they desperately need more than just a token effort in each franchise. They need to get a proper fighting game franchise on their system that satisfies the fighting game fans that attracts other fighting games to market to to compete. They need a new Killer Instinct to compete with the MK, SF, Tekken, Soul Calibur, etc, games of the world. They have Smash Bros, great I love it, we all do who doesn't? But that is not enough. They can't loan out Link to a 3rd party, stick him in a game that the other guys also have and call it a day, they need their own Eternal Champions, they need their own Virtua Fighter, they need a flagship 1 on 1 marshal arts game that has all the token gameplay and features that fighting game fans expect, set in a very not-Nintendo world that you could pick up and play and not know it wasn't a Playstation game.

Up until GameCube Nintendo also released their own line of sports games, where are those? They don't have 2K or EA so they should step things up and buy a smaller studio that does sports and re-launch some forgotten franchises or start up some new ones. Hell they missed out on this with Wii and Wii Sports was what sold the damn thing. If they had continued to focus on that maybe other companies would have followed suit.

There are just too many to name, Nintendo, when they are at their peak and all their core franchises are getting their fair shake, can carry any console on their own, they have done it before. What they need is to step away from Mario and Zelda and really ramp up 1, all their forgotten franchises, and 2, starting up brand new ones in genres they are lacking. They need their own Castlevania type game, not a clone but some sort of Golden Axe or something like Sega used to do, find a game that was not on their system and make their own.

But they desperately need to expand while they are at it. Merging the two machines into a single platform, however they manage to do that, is a start but still not enough. They don't need to stop making the quirky, fun, exotic stuff that makes them who they are, but they really need to focus on getting some games that their console is missing, and Bayonetta was not the right call that was at best a start but they should have had their own team making their own big scale God of War, Assassin's Creed, Prince of Persia clone. Why is Microsoft so successful because they see what games the market is pining for and if they can't get a 3rd party game in a genre they just make one, where would they be without Halo. Sure Metroid Prime is a MUST, but they also need a real gritty, violent, and epic space shooter FPS that can cater to that crowd.

And as lame as it sounds they need the fan service people keep begging for, Mario Paintball, some sort of World of Nintendo rpg dungeon crawler that makes use of Amiibo, a new F-Zero game, a proper Pokemon console RPG, a Kirby game that plays like Kirby, and the list goes on.

I guess bottom line is there is nothing they can do but what they already do and they know it. They need to expand or get help.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 18, 2016, 01:24:16 PM
Clearly Nintendo needs to change in some way.  I think the one thing more than anything else that they need to change is their bizarre insistence of doing everything a specific Nintendo way.  I want to see creativity like that in the games themselves and they should always be looking at industry conventions and thinking "how can we make this better?"  Those Nintendo qualities are fantastic and are the reason they even have a fanbase in the first place.

But with most things people just want something practical and intuitive and often someone else comes up with those ideas first because they're, frankly, pretty damn obvious.  There is no need to reinvent the wheel in these situations.  Customers typically don't want you to because you're mucking with something that already works great.  A truly great company would recognize when to reinvent the wheel and when to just go with the great idea someone else thought of.

Nintendo also is slow to adapt technology.  Last to use discs, last to go online, last to go HD.  So they're behind and then refuse to use other's ideas but by staying behind that all but ensures that someone else will establish the industry standard.  The two ideologies clash.  Either be the leader and set the standard that everyone else follows or play it conservatively and improve on the ideas of others.  Nintendo's approach is like operating in some alternate universe where everything everyone else did didn't happen.  But customers don't live in the same bubble.  So Nintendo is "discovering" online for example and a way to do it in a world where these discoveries were already made by other companies years before and customer expectations have adapted accordingly.  It is delusional for Nintendo to assume that customers will even tolerate, let alone accept, such an approach.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 18, 2016, 03:40:57 PM
I agree with your general sentiment Ian, that Nintendo is out of touch, but I disagree entirely that they need to be like everyone else to be successful. The evidence suggest they are their most successful when they aren't following what everyone else is doing. Their strength has always been their games, their weakness is primarily not enough games fast enough.

To be FAIR, completely honest and really as objective as possible, nobody expected CD rom to take off when it did, every single machine that relied on CD Rom up to Playstation, including it's direct competitors 3DO and Saturn, were all failures. PSX was a damn fluke it was the Wii of it's time. The problem is Sony saw their success and realized that in order to keep it they just needed to keep doing what they were. Nintendo is doing what they have always done, it's just the consumer have changed, the times have changed, and frankly, nobody knows what will sell anymore anyways.

I think you are also making the same mistake many of us, myself included, often make, and forget to look at Nintendo holistically instead of individual branches. As a company they are successful they are making money giving their customers what they want, they are keeping customers happy. What they are failing to do is bring in new customers to their console division. Their handheld's have always been just fine and in pretty much every way their handhelds have always been behind the times also.

Online was also brand new and Sony was barely online in the PS2 era. Dreamcast was the first to make online a central focus and it was a quick failure too. Nintendo needed to make more of an effort up front but Xbox Live was not something even Sony could match so expecting Nintendo do be able to is insane. Microsoft had the tools to go online, they had the knowledge, the infrastructure, they had the money, experience, the equipment, and they already had online gaming on the PC front. Nintendo barely had network games, in Japan, before Game Cube. Yes they should have tried harder but hell if they had gone all in online on Game Cube they would have gone the way of Sega because there was just no way to get there in 2001 with as little money and experience as they had. Even Sony struggled and it cost them dearly to do so.


Game Cube struggled for the same reason N64 did, lack of quality games. The difference was it also had fierce competition from Xbox which N64 only had Playstation to contend with, Saturn was pretty much out of the picture by the time the 64 hit it's stride. Now Game Cube might have gotten more games if not for the DVD fiasco but that was about the only thing they could have implemented without sinking their profits. Online was not even really a full market thing until Wii. Yes with Wii they should have improved but damn these things take time. It was not Nintendo's fault Microsoft did online better than them, for all intents and purposes Microsoft friggin invented online gaming.

The fact that we all go in circles trying to figure out what is wrong should be telling of how weird things have gotten, it is no wonder the people in charge can't figure it out either because we are probably the most irritatingly irrational fanbase on the planet, and that is including comparing us to the Star Wars fans.


What we can all agree on is Nintendo isn't catering to everyone's needs and we all want them to change to cater to ours. We just disagree on what is broken and thus what needs to be fixed. How they hell can they figure out how to sell to us, they are probably just glad Amiibo worked because with the way this fanbase is Amiibo should have sunk them into the depth of Amiga, Sega, and Atari by now.


I think it is us who are wrong and Nintendo who has it all figured out, We hold onto this myth they are a video game company, like Playstation, but they are not they are a toy company and they work best when they are selling toys, not interactive movies. The gaming culture has changed beyond what Nintendo can reach so they best they can do is keep their costs down so they can get as many of their own, top quality, games as they can.

Wii U was a fantastic machine, for about a year, but it stayed ridiculously over priced far longer than it should have. If it was in line with past generations in pricing it might be inline with past generations sales.

Also SNES gets brought up, but we all tend to forget that they basically had companies tied to SNES under restrictive contracts left over from the NES days when they were literally the only game in town.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 18, 2016, 04:15:20 PM
I think what it is with Nintendo is pride. They tend to play the leader when they are not the leader.  If you look at it from leader follower theory everything makes sense. Nintendo can't be a follower so they do weird **** just to go down their own path. They need to learn how to be contenders. Contender's will push people out of the way to control the path. Sometimes obviously some paths lead to peril. Nintendo is good at seeing those paths generally. Though they have gone down paths filled with thorns. They haven't fallen off a cliff yet though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 18, 2016, 06:14:36 PM
michaelbaysuperfan I read a lot of your response as "please understand".  Lots of excuses for why Nintendo didn't do this and that.  But this is fiercely competitive market.  Excuses don't matter.  The average videogame customer is not going to care why Nintendo didn't do this or that.  They see that brand X has this and brand Y does not so they pick brand X.  And Nintendo has been behind on a LOT of stuff.  It's enough of a trend to say that Nintendo clearly is not on top of adopting industry trends when the rest of the market is.

Who thought CD would catch on?  Sony and Sega!  Every competitor in the market except Nintendo!  Who thought online would catch on?  Sega, Sony and Microsoft!  I understand if Nintendo misses the boat when almost everyone does but they're the only ones that do.  Who thought motion control could be successful?  Just Nintendo.  You can understand how Sony and MS had to play catch up there because there was only one company trying something.  But Nintendo is never behind because one trailblazer left the rest of the industry in the dust.  No, it's always everyone else going in a new direction and Nintendo refusing to go along with them.  That's a company that doesn't keep with the times.

Perm's dead on with the leader stuff.  Hell the Wii felt like a child being upset that they're losing at a sport so they create their own sport that they're the best at because they're the only one playing.  Nintendo always talks about all this "we're not in competition" stuff which is insane.  Of course they're competing with Sony and MS!  They don't even really get to decide that, the market does.  Nintendo needs to face that reality and then make decisions based on that.  If they can admit that they're in competition, whether they like it or not, they can think "how can we compete with these guys" and strategize accordingly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 18, 2016, 06:30:57 PM
As long as Nintendo keeps making video games, I'm okay. So I just want them to do what will enable them to do just that. And I don't really care about how they do it. The Wii was fine, with me. I get that SOME PEOPLE think it was the worst thing to happen in the history of their stint as video game developers but I thought there were tons of great ideas and third party support that did a good job of communicating the use of motion controls. It's still being used, even in subtle ways like Splatoon, that justify its existence.

Anyway, have fun continuing to say the exact same stuff. I'm sure Nintendo is looking at their recent failure and saying they need to do the same thing they've always done in the same way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 19, 2016, 03:22:25 AM
Honestly, I think Nintendo would be better off if they didn't half-ass their own ideas.  With Wii, everyone hoped it would have 1:1 controls, but instead we got waggle.  With Wii U, people immediately asked if there would be support for two gamepads, and that completely caught Nintendo off guard.  Nintendo was able to add M+, but it put devs in a tight spot they couldn't count on everyone having it.  They don't seem like they're doing something similar with Wii U.  In fact, Nintendo has barely been able to execute on the one gamepad.

Nintendo could be the leader, if they showed people ideas that pan out.  Not everything can be joysticks, rumble packs, or the GameBoy Camera, but they need to not be so conservative.  The half-assed risks are costing them as much as a full-assed risk would.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 19, 2016, 03:31:22 AM
As a company they are successful they are making money giving their customers what they want, they are keeping customers happy.

Not to be too contrarian, but from 2012 to 2015, Nintendo had a positive EBITDA (Earnings) once. Same for their Free Cash Flow.  To be fair, 2015 was the positive year, and 2016 may work out positive too, but they're living and dying by amiibo now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 19, 2016, 05:41:39 AM
Honestly, I think Nintendo would be better off if they didn't half-ass their own ideas.  With Wii, everyone hoped it would have 1:1 controls, but instead we got waggle.  With Wii U, people immediately asked if there would be support for two gamepads, and that completely caught Nintendo off guard.  Nintendo was able to add M+, but it put devs in a tight spot they couldn't count on everyone having it.  They don't seem like they're doing something similar with Wii U.  In fact, Nintendo has barely been able to execute on the one gamepad.
There's merit to each of these points which, admittedly, have been brought up before. It's difficult to argue any of them. The GamePad is a great idea (for certain games) executed poorly. I can't play Splatoon's best mode (turf war) locally which is partially why I can't get into it. Launching yourself to your teammates is a big part of that mode and it can only be done with the GamePad. Removing the GamePad requirement would actually change the integrity of the game. This is one of those instances where the hardware severely limited game design. Had Nintendo not half-assed its own idea, it'd have a much better game.

I hope Nintendo truly and completely commits to whatever "new concept" it has planned with NX. Go all in or stay the hell home. Nintendo doesn't have a lot of room for error here. If it's going to tease a new idea for nearly a year, it better deliver. This is likely Nintendo's last chance as a console maker (not hardware in general, however). NX doesn't have to beat PS4, but it has to be compelling enough to keep Nintendo in the conversation which is a tall order in and of itself.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 19, 2016, 09:47:29 AM
Ian, no you misread what I wrote. I am not saying they deserve a pass on those things or that those are not mistakes, but those are things we see in hindsight, I was saying to be fair they couldn't have predicted CD would take off when every CD console that came before, INCLUDING the Saturn, were all failures. Yes they probably had a lot of reasons for not sticking to CD but there were other companies still doing carts too, not successful either but nobody can say that is what mattered. Yes you can point to a dozen reasons why each of those early cd machines failed but when you had, Turbo CD, Sega CD, Neo Geo CD, CD-i (something Nintendo had a small hand in) CDX, CD32, 3DO, Saturn, Jaguar CD, and I am sure one or two more I am forgetting, ALL be complete duds in a three to four year span, you can understand why Nintendo was hesitant. Sega didn't go with CD on Saturn because they saw it as the future, they already did that with Sega CD and took a hit on that, they were already invested in the technology they already had drives, suppliers, etc, things Nintendo didn't have. Sony, give me a break of all the companies that could take a hit on CD it was them, they hold half the patents on the technology so for them it was much cheaper than it would have been for Nintendo.


Dreamcast was the first console to do online out of the box, but Sony and Nintendo had the same strategy at first, wait and see. Sony was better prepared because hey once again they were already invested in it, they had Sony Online before Playstation 2 came along. Sega also had online with Saturn so again they already had investments. Yes it is Nintendo's fault for not investing in those technologies earlier if they wanted to stay relevant but again, Sega died doing those things you praise them for doing, MS almost died, hell Sony ALMOST died doing what they did to topple Nintendo.

These last couple years they were not so profitable, but that was mostly Wii U's fault. I was not apologizing for them just saying that we have hindsight now, they didn't have that then. In the mid 90's everyone, including Nintendo, thought VR was the future and investing in that hurt Atari and Sega and lead Nintendo to their biggest true failure in their video game history.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 19, 2016, 12:54:34 PM
Not to be too contrarian, but from 2012 to 2015, Nintendo had a positive EBITDA (Earnings) once. Same for their Free Cash Flow.  To be fair, 2015 was the positive year, and 2016 may work out positive too, but they're living and dying by amiibo now.

The main reason for their losses for the 2012-2014 fiscal year was because they were spending a shitload of money to do the biggest restructure the company had seen in over 20 years and the 3DS price cut really fucked them up for 2 years since they were selling that thing at a huge loss.  Then of course they spend a lot to buy back Yamauchi's stocks after he died. 

These weren't exactly the typical things that Nintendo usually has to deal with that caused the majority of these losses.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 19, 2016, 12:55:38 PM
Honestly, I think Nintendo would be better off if they didn't half-ass their own ideas.  With Wii, everyone hoped it would have 1:1 controls, but instead we got waggle.  With Wii U, people immediately asked if there would be support for two gamepads, and that completely caught Nintendo off guard.  Nintendo was able to add M+, but it put devs in a tight spot they couldn't count on everyone having it.  They don't seem like they're doing something similar with Wii U.  In fact, Nintendo has barely been able to execute on the one gamepad.

This is a great point.  The whole hook for the Wii U is the damn gamepad.  It has nothing else that consoles from the prior generation weren't already doing years ago.  So the Gamepad better be put to a lot of use or else why didn't we get better specs instead, right?  Now the idea of using the Gamepad extensively in every game freaks me out but that's only because I don't have faith in the concept so I assume that if they used it that much it would be forced and the games would suffer as a result.  I hated when motion control was the only option in a game on the Wii for example but that was because I felt the concept itself SUCKED.  Nintendo didn't half-ass implementing the analog stick on the N64 and it took off and became the industry standard but it was also great idea.

Nintendo's weak Gamepad usage suggests to me two things:
1. They don't have very many ideas for how to use it.
2. They don't have enough confidence in the feature to put it in every game without it ruining otherwise good titles.

But if you have squat for ideas for something and don't feel it is a good enough feature that it can be used all over the place then DON'T base a product around that feature!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 19, 2016, 05:13:57 PM
Nice to see my post promptly ignored. I'm glad people keep trucking with their general disdain.

I wanted to touch on the implementation of the Gamepad and why it SHOULD be less "feared" by those who aren't sold on the concept.

The problem with the Wii U was primarily marketing- Nintendo tried to play the Gamepad as "the next big thing" to justify its lack of power. Now, from a technology standpoint the Wii U is impressive- its streaming capabilities are top-notch and I think we won't see the time and effort Nintendo put into that go to waste. However, the Wii U is a more grounded and controlled look at the Wii's successful aspects- it implements "motion control" better than the previous console and uses it more for practical implementations, as well as adding touchscreen interface and dual display. For example, here are some of the "best" implementations of the Gamepad:
-User Interface Streamlining, Super Mario Maker, Xenoblade Chronicles X, and Zombi U
-Enhanced Map Control and detail, Xenoblade Chronicles X, Splatoon
-Split Screen Co-Op Streamlining, Call of Duty (BlOps 2?), Minecraft, Hyrule Warriors, etc
-Gyro Aiming, Splatoon, Nintendo Land, Zombi U, Fatal Frame, Sonic: Lost World, etc
-RTS Unit and Task management, Pikmin 3
-Spectator enhancements, Kirby and the Rainbow Curse, Scram Kitty and His Buddy on Rails, Nintendo Land, etc
-Touchscreen interfacing (primarily drawing), Art Academy, Super Smash Brothers, Super Mario Maker, various independent titles

Most of these are not "earth-shattering" concepts, but they are generally improvements to a gaming experience. But Nintendo, who situated themselves in a "masters of innovation" position after the success of the DS and Wii, boasted that the Gamepad would have many implementations. While it DOES, it's underused because of the lack of support the system is getting, which in turn causes Nintendo to cut corners on ideas and Gamepad implementation. Could we get a DND-like mapping game on Wii U? Maybe if people thought the market was healthy enough to justify a title like that, or if Nintendo had the time to properly think through a concept like that instead of just trying to put out games in the vacuum that is the Wii U release schedule. The sad thing is, even titles like Hex Heroes, a Kickstarter-cooked Wii U title, had to add PC as one of their platforms despite the game being designed for Wii U because the console was made for ideas like it.

But ultimately, Nintendo has toned down their gimmickry with the 3DS and Wii U, Amiibo non-withstanding. Their pitches with these two consoles have been focused more on presentation and gameplay streamlining, not introducing unnecessary aspects. I don't know why people hate on the Wii U's execution, especially when they buy up Xbone and PS4s which add little to the streamlining of any sort of gameplay. People expect Nintendo to make the next big thing, but are disappointed when they do or when their idea "doesn't live up" to their promise- i.e. being shoehorned into everything. It's awfully contrarian.

Of course, that's not the main issue. Blah blah third party relations, blah blah unconventional design, blah blah Nintendo doesn't make games for me anymore.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 19, 2016, 06:24:36 PM
Evan I feel like you've done a good job of selling the Gamepad features as a good compliment to gaming.  But the problem is that they had to cut corners in other areas to implement it and if they're going to do that then it HAS to be earth-shattering.  No one buys a console for something that is merely complimentary and a nice feature.  The whole design of the Wii and Wii U is that Feature X HAS to go over big because aside from it you're looking at a last gen console and you can buy one of those from one of the other guys at a discounted price.  Nintendo is essentially saying that the Gamepad, not specs, is the TRUE new generation so they have to deliver on that.

And I don't feel I'm being contrarian in feeling they need to use the concept all the time and not wanting it shoehorned in.  A good controller idea begs to be used in almost all games and is such a good concept it doesn't FEEL forced.  If it feels shoehorned in then the concept is too one-dimensional and therefore basing your whole console around it doesn't make sense.  There are two qualifications here.  If you're basing a console around a controller concept then you should be using the feature the vast majority of the time and the concept should be strong enough that doing so does not feel forced.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 19, 2016, 07:05:37 PM
Evan, while you bring up great points, I have a few counterpoints.  For Kirby and the Rainbow Curse, the game is played and controlled on the gamepad, so if I'm playing alone, I can't fully enjoy the visuals.  (Not huge, but it bothers me.)  And the co-op examples would be great(er) if more than one gamepad would be supported.

Not to be too contrarian, but from 2012 to 2015, Nintendo had a positive EBITDA (Earnings) once. Same for their Free Cash Flow.  To be fair, 2015 was the positive year, and 2016 may work out positive too, but they're living and dying by amiibo now.

The main reason for their losses for the 2012-2014 fiscal year was because they were spending a shitload of money to do the biggest restructure the company had seen in over 20 years and the 3DS price cut really fucked them up for 2 years since they were selling that thing at a huge loss.  Then of course they spend a lot to buy back Yamauchi's stocks after he died. 

These weren't exactly the typical things that Nintendo usually has to deal with that caused the majority of these losses.

Stock buyback isn't an income statement transaction, but it does affect your cash flows. The restructuring costs are probably what took them into the red (if that what the non-operating expenses were those years).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 19, 2016, 08:29:32 PM
There is no true new generation. Saying that the PS4 and the Xbone are "next-gen consoles" is not a valid descriptor. "Watered-down PCs" is a better function. Also, when I said "spectator enhancements" I meant: player two or a non-player gets an enhanced look at the game, where player ONE is the person holding the gamepad. Kirby's visuals are sadly sacrificed for the Gamepad player but player two gets a much nicer look at things. The other games I cited were perfect examples.

Now, I'd argue that most of the gamepad implementation is featured in a number of titles and is quite unobtrusive in most of them. I would agree that Nintendo's focus was on the Gamepad and it justified their lack of power in other areas, but I don't think that power matters all that much these days, considering the graphical difference between certain games is not as massive as the SD-HD comparison. We can argue that all we want, but I'll take a step back and call that one "my opinion". As for the Gamepad, I'mm done trying to sell it. But I think, in concept, it is a better controller than its competitors, and has more function and use than they do with its screen alone, but lacks the support.

When you look at a Wii U game, many of them perform better than their competitors and have better art design, too. The main problem with that, of course, is that Nintendo caters to a Japanese audience where those aspects are more important (though game performance should be a standard EVERYWHERE and I find it insulting that people justify low framerates, pop-in, and the like because it "looks better"). If they wanted to appeal to an American audience, their first online shooter would have been militaristic, or perhaps SMTxFE would have been a darker and more graphic RPG. Nintendo is catering to a niche audience- one that buys its games. I find it odd that third party publishers would have trouble selling games since many of them look so drastically different, but again, maybe it comes down to the quality of those titles. Or maybe even the style- I mean, I'd hardly call No More Heroes a polished experience but the art style and gameplay resonated with people and caused them to buy it.

Something relatively disturbing to me is how we've seen several examples of Nintendo diversifying their IP by making it MORE Japanese centric. Triforce Heroes and Federation Force, for example, feature staples of the Monster Hunter genre, and of course we've seen how Miitomo is an ideal product for the Japanese market but makes no sense to the rest of us. Even Splatoon's success is largely because of its function as a Japanese phenomenon. It's clear that we've reached a crossroads where Nintendo can either pinpoint their market or try to broaden it and I worry it's going the other way. Then again, they need to be in touch with Japanese third parties right now, who are begging for a console resurgence, and hopefully use that as a way to connect with Western audiences.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 19, 2016, 11:10:23 PM
I largely agree with Evan here, especially his points about the lackluster exploration of the Gamepad. Nintendo must have known pretty early that the WiiU was tanking. Had it done decently, the multipad support would have come. Had it done a respectable fraction of Wii sales, we'd have seen third party experimentation with the concept, like we saw with the Wii, with plenty of engaging results. But the WiiU was a bomb, and they had to pull back from the concept, and focus on features that are technically extraneous and/or will be replicatable without the pad in the future. This is part and parcel with the death of local multi-player, in my mind, as I had some enchanting play sessions with Nintendoland, and it's not hard to imagine how many of those use cases could've been expanded into full-on games. But the market wasn't there, and I don't think it can be blamed on marketing. The market for hand-drawn 2-D animation is largely gone, too. I've said this before, but markets are shitty mechanisms for determining the value and production of art.

But the conversation is largely eliding how great the pad streaming works, and how great off-screen capabilities are for people sharing a TV. I got a lot of use out of that while I was sharing various living spaces. I had a multi-hour flight delay once and was able to play Toki Tori 2 on the pad out of my luggage, which was fucking boss, no matter how lame I must of looked doing it. Toward the actual dual technology, I find the map implementation in Xenoblade X to be pretty critical given how often it's used; you could easily rework the game to include a map on the main screen, but it would really blow comparatively. I think the same can be said of Splatoon.

Overall, I dunno what to say, other than to repeat the previous barb of wishing everyone joy repeating the same criticisms over and over again. I don't get the impulse. I feel like there are a number of folks who got called babies in middle school for playing Nintendo games and have never been able to get over it, while nonetheless subconsciously understanding that the company is the best in the business in terms of core gameplay. A closet, of sorts!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 20, 2016, 12:58:20 AM
Nintendo wanted to bring people together with the Gamepad, for people to watch the TV and use the screen in the same room, while also create something that would function well for single player experiences. In not having the sales to justify multi-Gamepad implementation (which, at one point they said they were looking into), we can't have nice things like local Splatoon.

And yet, we CAN have nice things like Co-Op that isn't splitscreen, and a competitive fighter which drastically different camera angles that doesn't destroy the TV screen. But Nintendo couldn't please everyone with the way the Gamepad worked, which is unfortunate. We could have had decent local party games and healthy online ones. But the thing didn't sell.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 20, 2016, 12:33:14 PM
To me, there are two BIG distinctions as to why the Wii was a rousing success compared to Wii U flailing despite having some great games (arguably better) comparably.


1) Wii Remote motion control's tapping into a casual market that otherwise wouldn't buy a console.  I've always seen jokes about how the Wii was a console for babies, but honestly, it wasn't, it was a console for your parents and grandparents so they could convince their kids & grandkits to come over & Wii Bowling.


2) Price - It's clear to me that the Wii U would have had a much better chance of success had there been one base model at the $299 price, or more ideally, the $249.99 price.  That casual market has moved on (I assume Nintendo knows this too, given their foray into mobile), they're fine with the Wii, and the dedicated gaming market didn't find the Wii U tablet a compelling enough accessory to justify a price tag so close to the competition that looks better and has distinctive features.  You can either be a premium product or a discount alternative, there isn't room for middle ground in this market, and Wii U tried to have discount graphics at a premium price, using a controller as justification for that premium price that didn't compel customers.




What I worry about is that Nintendo hasn't learned these lessons and they'll make the same error on bullet two.  I expect I'll get hyped about the NX at E3, but I'm going to temper my enthusiasm and wait out the initial sales period, I'm just not excited by the NX like I have been for previous Nintendo consoles.



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 20, 2016, 01:15:18 PM
As much as I hate to admit it, the Wii U name is also a reason casual gamers didn't attach. I have seen the horror of a customer not knowing the difference. It's true, and it's terrible.

I am surprised about the price remarks. I mean, I think it's absurd that the price hasn't been dropped since, but the Wii U is the least expensive console on the market. I hope, after the whole Nintendo Ambassador program thing, that Nintendo will be a little smarter about pricing their handhelds (which is what the NX is, by the way), and I don't really feel that the price was too high for Wii U. Initially. If it had taken off after that initial launch, with third parties flocking to it, it would have been a great price. But since then, we've seen the opposite, and the price isn't justifiable for a console with such a small library.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 20, 2016, 02:08:31 PM
My argument isn't just "price too high", it's price compared to perceived value.  The Wii at $250 seemed like a good deal at the time because it was 1) Scarce, 2) cheap compared to their competitors, and 3) had an accessory that had a perceived value that justified its cost to the consumer despite a discrepancy in graphics and other features.


The Wii U was 1) in good supply, 2) almost same price at competitors, and 3) has an accessory that isn't valued enough to justify graphics & features that don't have parity with their competition.



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 20, 2016, 06:28:31 PM
Right, and I agree with you.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 21, 2016, 01:15:45 AM
Not to go full apologist here, but I think placing the blame of the WiiU's failure on the name/marketing isn't quite fair. Consumers don't seem to have had trouble with the equally silly naming conventions of the Xbox brand. I believe there was casual-level misunderstanding about the WiiU, but I don't really think it would have made a huge difference if it was just called Wii 2. Those consumers who would have been enlightened as to the true nature of the system would still have largely skipped the purchase. I can't imagine there were a ton of people eager to purchase a tablet add-on to the Wii who then balked when they discovered it was a unique console. And I'd wager the majority of the ~50 million people who own Xbones and PS4s know exactly what the WiiU is. A tablet-themed console just wasn't going to cut it no matter what.

Likewise, I don't see how a $400 gimmick-less PS4 equivalent would have done much better, either at the launch of the WiiU or later this year with the launch of the NX. For any number of reasons, Nintendo has been pretty well bounced from the "traditional" console market, and the secular outlook for handhelds is pretty dismal. They've got to go in a significantly different direction to keep rolling, as aping (way too late) the dictates of the increasingly ossified PS4/Xbone market is futile. I'm hoping the NX will be a genuine surprise and outside-the-box success, as there's pretty much no way Nintendo will be able to continue making best-in-class software at the volume they do in a world where they become Sega 2.0 or focus on phone games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 21, 2016, 06:46:52 AM
Likewise, I don't see how a $400 gimmick-less PS4 equivalent would have done much better, either at the launch of the WiiU or later this year with the launch of the NX.
It wouldn't, and it won't because Nintendo's problems as a console manufacturer extend far beyond hardware. If it ever wants be taken seriously in the console space again, it will have to address everything. Honestly, I think it begins with beating Sony and Microsoft at their own game, not by copying (since that won't work) but by changing the rules, namely becoming absurdly third party-centric in a different way.

For example, rather than shelling out for exclusives, cut third parties deals on licensing and offer incentives for meeting sales goals which is advantageous for every game, not just the exclusives. Essentially, it's addition by subtraction. Right now, Nintendo gets minimal support and doesn't make a lot on licensing as a result. Find out what Sony charges then charge less. Once Sony and Microsoft catch wind of this, it's a race to the bottom. The goal is to get to the point where most games are released on all consoles with the added benefit of cutting off a stream of revenue from the competition which may discourage buying exclusives. Nintendo makes most of its profits from software, and it's been without support (and the revenue that comes with it) for so long that it's best bet may be to get the playing field as even as possible and let its first party titles speak for themselves.

Anyway, AMD mentioned supplying an APU to a new console in the second half of 2016 in its Q4 financial results briefing. Very subtle. "I don't want to say it's for NX, but it's not not for NX............... It's for NX. Sorry."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 21, 2016, 10:35:08 AM
Honestly their best bet, and they won't do this, is to just make a proper, Nintendo Tablet a true gaming tablet that runs just the apps a gamer needs, maybe a few media apps, a decent web browser, and something like Game Pad where there are buttons on the side and include HDMI output, then done a merging of the console and handheld division.

That won't happen though so we are right back to where we started, speculating on what is plan, what are we on no E, F, I lost count because they keep changing things.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 21, 2016, 01:35:28 PM
I don't get this idea that Nintendo has to have some different hook or some nonsense to compete with the other guys and that making something conventional won't work.  Nintendo has an advantage in one major area - they're probably the most talented game makers in the world.  If they made something conventional that attracted comparable third party support then the comparison would be the first party games.  That's a comparison that, presuming they doesn't waste time with waggle party nonsense or 2D games that could be done on 20 year old hardware, Nintendo can win.  But instead they make it so that their first party games have to compete against damn near every other game being made and they can't compete with that because of the sheer numbers.

It feels Nintendo is just trying to avoid admitting their mistakes and improving.  "No it can't be that we always **** up simple stuff that any idiot with the slightest familiarity with videogames could get right or that we jerk around our customers and business partners and cut corners and cheap out.  It must be that competing with Sony and MS is completely impossible and hopeless so we need some special gimmick to differentiate ourselves that conveniently allows us to avoid self-improvement, keep up all our bad habits, and never admit we've ever done anything wrong."

When Nintendo puts in an actual effort to release a console that isn't fucked over by some obvious mistake or compromise and it fails THEN you can say it's hopeless and they need to do something different.  But I call bullshit.  They've haven't tried for real in 20 years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 21, 2016, 02:08:44 PM
What's not to get? Nintendo games appeal primarily to Nintendo fans. Releasing essentially identical hardware as Sony and Microsoft is Nintendo asking consumers to abandon PlayStation or Xbox for no good reason. Is Nintendo's software appealing enough to convince people to leave their friends, digital purchases, and familiarity behind? I don't think Nintendo even believes that. It wants to be the "and" company. Nintendo doesn't care if you buy PlayStation or Xbox as long as you buy its hardware too. I'm not saying I agree with that strategy (for the most part, I don't). However, I don't know what you don't get about it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 21, 2016, 02:46:56 PM
What's not to get? Nintendo games appeal primarily to Nintendo fans. Releasing essentially identical hardware as Sony and Microsoft is Nintendo asking consumers to abandon PlayStation or Xbox for no good reason. Is Nintendo's software appealing enough to convince people to leave their friends, digital purchases, and familiarity behind? I don't think Nintendo even believes that. It wants to be the "and" company. Nintendo doesn't care if you buy PlayStation or Xbox as long as you buy its hardware too. I'm not saying I agree with that strategy (for the most part, I don't). However, I don't know what you don't get about it.

Nintendo always groups their games with giving up literally everything else.  Give up industry standard features, give up third party support, give up whole genres - give up all of this for Nintendo games.  That is crazy and, yes, only the most devoted Nintendo nutbar would ever put up with that.  Their games do not get to be compared on even footing, while the decision between MS and Sony comes down largely to first party titles.  Go onto GameRankings and look at the top reviewed games of all time and Nintendo holds the TOP THREE spots!  Their games are very highly regarded and not just from Nintendo geeks.

I understand their strategy but I think it's idiotic (the only time it ever worked was when they targeted a new audience with no familiarity with videogames and thus complete ignorance of Nintendo's shortcomings) and insincere because I think the whole thing is that Nintendo is so far up their own ass they base business decisions on delusional ideas that deflect any responsibility for their own failings.  Coming up with excuses to not actually try and hoping some dumb gimmick catches on is easier than addressing legitimate problems rooted deep in the company culture.

If the idea is that Nintendo is some luxury brand that people should buy a second console for then that just demonstrates the strength and marketability of their first party titles.  Why would anyone buy such a product otherwise?  So why should people buy a PlayStation and a Nintendo console to get both Nintendo games and everything else if they could buy ONE console that had it all?  That's what I would rather buy.  It seems arbitrary that I need to buy two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 21, 2016, 03:08:59 PM
Again, Ian is repeating the same things he's been pissed off about since someone called him a nerd in the 8th grade for reading a Nintendo Power in the cafeteria.

To make it even harder to pretend not to understand:

Ignore all past history, decision making, alternate realities, etc. This year, Nintendo essentially has to launch a new console. They could maybe squeak by into 2017, but at even greater risk of cementing their irrelevancy. Right now, in today's world, with everything having already played out as it has, there are about ~30 million Playstation 4 owners and ~20 million Xbone owners, and who knows how many equivalent level PC owners. These numbers will all be up by the time the NX launches in late 2016. At that time, what compelling reason would anyone have to spend $400 on another bog standard current gen console with (in a best case scenario for this asinine scenario) feature parity and equivalent third party support? There is a small core of super enthusiasts who will buy everything that's out, but those same people bought the WiiU, which will probably finish at around 15 million sales.

As Adrock pointed out, you'd have to really, really want everything a PS4 offers, plus Nintendo games as well to an extent that you would ignore the network effects of the established PS4/Xbone ecosystems, friend preferences, etc. Who is holding out on buying into this current generation until Nintendo puts out an expensive and mostly redundant console? And if the NX was a second console for you, why would you buy third party games on the NX instead of the other systems? Would anyone buy a $400 Nintendo box? Very few are going for the $300 Nintendo box. The $99 Nintendo box (with great first party games and comparatively storng 3rd party support) only moved ~20 million units.

Nintendo can't wait toil 2020 to jump in with the PS5/Xtooth and hope that they'll suddenly become popular again with a demographic and business ecosystem they don't even like. Nor is there any sense in pushing out a me-too attempt halfway through this generation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 21, 2016, 03:37:26 PM
Ignore all past history, decision making, alternate realities, etc. This year, Nintendo essentially has to launch a new console. They could maybe squeak by into 2017, but at even greater risk of cementing their irrelevancy. Right now, in today's world, with everything having already played out as it has, there are about ~30 million Playstation 4 owners and ~20 million Xbone owners, and who knows how many equivalent level PC owners. These numbers will all be up by the time the NX launches in late 2016. At that time, what compelling reason would anyone have to spend $400 on another bog standard current gen console with (in a best case scenario for this asinine scenario) feature parity and equivalent third party support? There is a small core of super enthusiasts who will buy everything that's out, but those same people bought the WiiU, which will probably finish at around 15 million sales.

As Adrock pointed out, you'd have to really, really want everything a PS4 offers, plus Nintendo games as well to an extent that you would ignore the network effects of the established PS4/Xbone ecosystems, friend preferences, etc. Who is holding out on buying into this current generation until Nintendo puts out an expensive and mostly redundant console? And if the NX was a second console for you, why would you buy third party games on the NX instead of the other systems? Would anyone buy a $400 Nintendo box? Very few are going for the $300 Nintendo box. The $99 Nintendo box (with great first party games and comparatively storng 3rd party support) only moved ~20 million units.

I'm the guy who would have replaced the Wii U in 2014 if I could have so I'm the last guy who would suggest that Nintendo doesn't need a new console now.  If anything the fact that the other consoles have grown so much demonstrates the problem in Nintendo waiting as long as they did.

If Nintendo doesn't have something that comes across as a "real" effort then I don't think anyone will take them seriously in the future when the next generation starts and a comparative console is necessary.  Some half-baked cheap pseudoconsole is just going to re-enforce the idea that Nintendo sticks with last gen hardware and dumb gimmicks and is not worth any serious consideration from anyone but the same audience that bought the Wii U.  This is the time for the apology console.  This is the time for them to show everyone they figured their **** out.  Anyone turned off by the Wii U would be equally turned off by another Nintendo console that is essentially following the same design as the Wii and Wii U.

There is to be no more fucking around.  Nintendo plays ball or they're finished as console makers.  To make it with something totally incompatible and different it will have to be really impressive.  I think a better strategy is to win over the Wii U owners (many of which are probably pissed at Nintendo for dropping the ball; each gen Nintendo turns off more of their fanbase with their bullshit) and those who haven't bought a console yet and those that have no beef with owning multiple consoles regardless of price and slowly build things so that next gen they can really attract some attention.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 21, 2016, 05:09:26 PM
The Market is still about 100 million. If there are 30 million ps4 owners, and 20 million xbox one owners then there would still be 50 million people left. Also shiny, new, and if Nintendo is thinking about future glory/past mistakes more powerful then those two. 

Theres talk of a 900p support for the next console, that could be the screen on the controller.  the current one is 854x480

1080p is 1920x1080

Ipads are like 1024x768

900p is probably 1600x900 (based on photoshop's constrain proportion algorithm)

IF I were Nintendo and I wanted to make a beast, but wanted to be lazy about it my specs would be

1.3 ghz amd radeon processor
2 ghz amd 16 core jaguar apu
16gb ram. Divided in some convenient way.
1.24 GHz Tri-Core IBM PowerPC "Espresso" for backwards compatability

so bumping power up about 30% and then doubling the ram. Sony and Microsoft have probably made those family of processors really cheap, and also Nintendo would benefit by getting a newer generation of them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 21, 2016, 11:15:16 PM
The thing is, Nintendo isn't going after Microsoft and Sony's main audience which is 18-34 males.  Nintendo's main audience has always been and will remain kids and families, the ones who bought the majority of their previous systems and currently make up the majority of the over 55 million 3DS that have been sold.  It doesn't matter if some of you like to pretend Nintendo's handhelds don't exist, Nintendo views the home console and handheld audience as the same thing and thanks to handhelds Nintendo is still a major force in the industry.

No surprise that's probably the biggest reason why the NX is shaping to be something where the handheld and home console are more deeply connected even sharing the same OS.  The goal with the NX isn't to take away Microsoft and Sony's audience, it's to make more of Nintendo's own audience buy home consoles again. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 21, 2016, 11:37:16 PM
Okay so now that we've gotten the whole "Nintendo needs to stop fucking around" and "they've alienated their fanbase" thing down, let's move the conversation in another direction (even though I could argue I don't want "everything a PS4 does" because all it does means jack **** to me).

I believe that, if we're talking a handheld screen, those 900p resolution numbers sound pretty good to me. Which is honestly where I'd expect them since no sane person would tout that as a feature of a home console. To me, the idea of interconnected handheld (which is what the NX we'll be seeing this year is, by the way. Don't forget that) makes so much sense with how Nintendo has handled GBA cables, DS/Wii engine sharing and connectivity, and though Wii U hasn't had much of it, the controller itself is a pretty key example, as well as instances like the 3DS Smash Controller (which has deeper implications, especially getting a handheld engine that mimics a console one down so well and then selling that separate).

I know I've said that a billion times before but that seems to be the theme of this thread anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 22, 2016, 10:16:09 AM
I, and I am sure a majority of Nintendo fans, would be more than happy of they exited the home console business entirely and just made a really kick ass handheld that ALSO allowed TV connectivity and that would be all they needed to do. But no they won't see that either. The console business isn't even MS and Sony, it's all Sony has been since 1995. Microsoft is just pretending to matter all they want is to use Xbox to keep their bigger name relevant.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: broodwars on January 22, 2016, 10:35:06 AM
I, and I am sure a majority of Nintendo fans, would be more than happy of they exited the home console business entirely and just made a really kick ass handheld that ALSO allowed TV connectivity and that would be all they needed to do. But no they won't see that either. The console business isn't even MS and Sony, it's all Sony has been since 1995. Microsoft is just pretending to matter all they want is to use Xbox to keep their bigger name relevant.

Thing is, handheld-only simply isn't viable. That market has shrunk tremendously since even the 3DS' launch, to the point where Western dev support has been 0 for quite some time. What little support dedicated handhelds have in Japan is rapidly dwindling due to devs focusing all their resources on mobile. I see no reason to believe that another on-the-cheap Nintendo handheld would change that. Honestly, heresy and unrealistic though it may be, it would actually make much more sense for Nintendo to get out of the handheld market entirely and just have a console that can go mobile. Outside Nintendo, console sales are on the rise and games like Splatoon showed that even Japan could still get drawn into console games if you provide enough doujinshi/hentai material.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 22, 2016, 01:05:39 PM
Nintendo opened Pandora's Box with the Wii and DS, essentially creating the casual market.  But that essentially just opened the door for non-gaming companies to step in and steal their market.  It's pretty obvious from the initial struggles of the 3DS and the weak sales of the Wii U that the casual market isn't interested in a dedicated videogame device now that electronic devices they already own for other purposes can play games.

So consoles and handhelds are for dedicated gamers now.  It's for the person for which videogames are more than a mindless distraction and mobile games are not enough.  That is the market that Sony and, to a lesser extent, MS have.  If Nintendo doesn't target that same audience, who do they truly have left?  Even with kids if parents buy them a phone and they still want a 3DS they're thinking "why am I buying him this when he already has a phone that can play games?"  Dedicated videogame devices are for people that know the difference between a good game and a F2P piece of **** and those people are not impressed with half-assed efforts with flashy gimmicks.

The market is splitting between dedicated videogame enthusiast and indifferent casual user looking to kill time.  Nintendo seems to be hovering in this no one's land between the two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 22, 2016, 02:11:54 PM
Really? A lot of the stuff you just cited as qualities that embody the Sony/MS audience don't really match up with what I see at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: lolmonade on January 22, 2016, 02:37:34 PM
Quote
[size=0px]Nintendo opened Pandora's Box with the Wii and DS, essentially creating the casual market.  But that essentially just opened the door for non-gaming companies to step in and steal their market.  It's pretty obvious from the initial struggles of the 3DS and the weak sales of the Wii U that the casual market isn't interested in a dedicated videogame device now that electronic devices they already own for other purposes can play games.[/size]


Nintendo didn't create the market, those people who gravitated to Wii & DS that aren't dedicated gamers were ones who were the same people who likely didn't play anything other than snake on their phone or solitaire & Snood on their PC. 


Wii to Wii U Sales are also different IMO than when you're talking DS to 3DS.  For the Wii to Wii U, Nintendo had tapped into that market for various reasons with the Wii(scarcity, low price, word of mouth, social aspect & easy introduction into Wii Sports, simplicity in focus of system) that they were afraid to re-tread with their follow-up, or felt like the mass market would adopt the Wii U because of people's familiarity with tablets by then.


For the DS to 3DS, through most of the DS' lifespan, I think most people didn't have a smartphone competing for that space of gaming a LOT of people bought one for (Nintendogs, Brain Age). By the end of DS & start of 3DS, it was almost hard to find a non-smartphone in stores, and all of them have a robust app store that had many games similar to those that were a fraction of the cost or ad supported.  The reality of Mobile gaming is that the actual market left for the kind of games 3DS offers has likely shrunk to the same "core" gamers that mostly go to consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 22, 2016, 03:53:35 PM
I was playing with both an Ipad and a Vita at best buy yesterday. I was thinking their border dimensions were not that different.  I'm ok with smaller joysticks. The smaller buttons were never much of a problem on DS.  If they just take a wii U controller, then enlarge the screen by 20%, change the buttons and just sticks to the smaller ones, then they can keep the controller comfortable and have a bigger/more tablet sized screen.  Or actually they could leave the buttons the same size and shrink the joysticks. I don't know if small joysticks could have click though, you could add a function button next to the joysticks just so games could be ported over.

(http://i.imgur.com/7JAYxBR.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/GlKYuIG.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/A9y3wII.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: rlse9 on January 23, 2016, 01:02:20 AM

Theres talk of a 900p support for the next console, that could be the screen on the controller.  the current one is 854x480

1080p is 1920x1080

Ipads are like 1024x768

900p is probably 1600x900 (based on photoshop's constrain proportion algorithm)

That's accurate for the older generation of iPads but all of the newer models are 2048x1536.


The gamepad could have been good.  Every time I use it I can't help but notice how incredibly low resolution it is and using for off-TV play on anything other than virtual console games feels like a waste because Wii U games look so much better on the TV than on the Gamepad.  And even in a small apartment with the Wii U centrally located, I couldn't use the Gamepad in my bedroom to play games or watch Netflix in the kitchen while making dinner.  If it had decent resolution and range, I would have been much happier with it.  There have definitely been some good uses for the Gamepad but it has never felt revolutionary or game changing.


I've been reading this thread throughout but haven't posted much because I don't have any idea what Nintendo is going to do with the NX and don't have an idea of what they should do but it's been interesting reading everyone's ideas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 23, 2016, 03:30:09 AM
I had meant to put 1st generation up there. But I also thought it was moot. I ran my computer at 1024x768 for years, and its a good resolution. Even for some 13 inch screens. It looks shitty on this monitor, but this one is like a 24 inch one or something like that. On a 9 inch or less screen 900p would actually look pretty good.

They definitely need multi touch. Not being able to pinch and zoom sucks.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 23, 2016, 07:39:59 AM
I thought the 900p "leak" was false. 900p is too high for a handheld Nintendo releases for $200. 540p on a less than five in screen (on both regular and XL models) is more likely with 720p being the absolute highest and that's pushing it. For comparison's sake, Vita has a five inch qHD screen. Assuming Nintendo goes with a similar size screen as DS XL and 3DS XL's 4.88 inch 240p top screen (though I'd expect the aspect ratio to be 16:9 rather than 5:3), 540p is a marked improvement.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: The Lucky Moose on January 23, 2016, 01:20:48 PM
At this point I believe we're either talking a hybrid device that requires only one purchases (imagine you could plug the Vita into a TV and use it as a controller rather than having to buy a PSTV to play Vita games on a TV - that's what I think it would be like) or simply two devices that share only some games (again, much the like the PS4 and Vita). All the more esoteric guesses, especially the ones we have heard the last few days, seem absolutely crazy to me, given actual market realities and Nintendo's corporate culture.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 23, 2016, 06:49:06 PM
Well If Nintendo is planning its handheld with its console. They could just be sold separately. $129 for the handheld.
$300 for the console. They put in a traditional controller + wii mote support.

The traditional controller is a Gamecube controller with joystick clicks and an extra Z button.

The Gameboy as it would be called is a single screen handheld with a fat big screen.

The console is called NES 7 or Gamecube 2 or gamecube 4. Hopefully not 3dwii
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 23, 2016, 07:53:32 PM
Wii U Pro Controller > GameCube Controller

At this point, NX has been known as "NX" for so long Nintendo should just keep the project name. It works and it's easy to pronounce. Since the console and handheld will undoubtedly be connected, maybe NX-Home and NX-Mobile.

Also, I can't imagine Nintendo going back to a single screen handheld. After so many years with a second supplementary screen, it's hard to imagine a Nintendo handheld without it. I'm playing through Majora's Mask 3D and it's just a significant improvement with the second screen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 23, 2016, 09:40:51 PM
I have become quite fond of the Wii U Pro Controller, but the Gamecube Controller has an amazing design that is extremely comfortable despite hindering the utility of certain buttons.

In any case, I could imagine moving away from a dual screened design but only if the handheld was compatible as a controller for the home console, thus allowing backwards compatibility.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 23, 2016, 09:46:25 PM
Nintendo usually has the project names for a long time, and also the project names are usually cooler names for the consoles then the real names

Ultra 64, Dolphin, Revolution, Cafe, NX

It doesn't even feel like that long ago Wii U was Cafe and all the developers were getting on board. Always amazed that they are on board and abandon the console 1 year later.

As far as the second screen goes... Why do you need 2 screens if you have just one big screen?  1 large screen could act as 2 screens if you just split the screen.

What would be kind of interesting is a 2 part handheld. 1 part are the controls and the other part is the screen. Where depending on if the game is letterbox or portrait you can connect the controller part up in different ways.

(http://i.imgur.com/2XgErZ5.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 24, 2016, 08:07:57 AM
In any case, I could imagine moving away from a dual screened design but only if the handheld was compatible as a controller for the home console, thus allowing backwards compatibility.
I can see Nintendo going back to a single screen handheld if it doesn't care about backwards compatibility on the handheld though I get the impression that it does. Since Nintendo is undoubtedly moving away from PowerPC, it probably wants to emulate every previous generation of console and handheld to be playable on both handheld and console. Based on vague comments by Iwata and the fact that Nintendo released a cross-buy game in 2014, cross-buy Virtual Console is the logical next step. Outside of a few more intensive games, I think every first party title will be shared between console and handheld.
Nintendo usually has the project names for a long time, and also the project names are usually cooler names for the consoles then the real names
The project names certainly bucked console naming conventions though I really can't imagine Nintendo getting away with "Dolphin" or "Cafe." I rather liked the names "Nintendo 64" and "Gamecube." "Revolution" was badass, but it wouldn't work in Japan. "NX" is good branding. It doesn't need an abbreviation. It's easy to remember and universally easy to pronounce.
Quote
As far as the second screen goes... Why do you need 2 screens if you have just one big screen? 1 large screen could act as 2 screens if you just split the screen.
Portability.
Quote
What would be kind of interesting is a 2 part handheld. 1 part are the controls and the other part is the screen. Where depending on if the game is letterbox or portrait you can connect the controller part up in different ways.
I think that creates more problems. The best part of a handheld is that it's a self-contained gaming unit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 24, 2016, 01:02:51 PM
Do remember, Nintendo patented a handheld with customizable (i.e. replaceable) button configuration.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 24, 2016, 02:12:55 PM
But Nintendo (and most companies for that matter) patents most ideas just in case. Look back at how many patents it hasn't used over the years.

EDIT: auto-correct
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on January 24, 2016, 02:46:59 PM
This is true.

However, a customizable handheld could overcome developer issues with specific control schemes. I truly think western support was lost without the inclusion of a second stick on the 3DS.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 24, 2016, 03:30:49 PM
Western third parties generally don't care about handhelds. Their bread and butter is on PC and consoles. Even if the right circle pad is really a problem, I expect NX-Mobile to have it for parity with NX-Console. Nintendo just has to figure out how to add the click to the circle pads which shouldn't be too much trouble.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 24, 2016, 05:11:59 PM
Maybe Nintendo still sees 3rd pillar. It continues the DS line, revives the Gameboy line, continues the console line with improved connectivity. Then it binds them all together with unified steam style accounts. Play Mario anywhere.

Or maybe if they just made a phone? Gameboy MP
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 24, 2016, 05:21:02 PM
One of their biggest issues right now is that they don't have the resources to adequately support two separate platforms, so I really don't think adding a third is the way to go.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 24, 2016, 07:33:28 PM
Yeah, they had to pull in people to make mobile games for them, so I don't think a third pillar is the way to go.

I'm thinking the NX portable still has 2 screens, not only for backward compatibility, but also because I think Nintendo will improve on the gamepad concept.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 24, 2016, 08:40:27 PM
Would that be an issue with a unified platform?

What if the platform was being held up by pillars?

Honestly during this portion of development I just speculate wildly.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.0

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.msg667008;topicseen#msg667008

some people got pretty close

(http://i.imgur.com/sqjW5.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 28, 2016, 02:21:58 PM
https://twitter.com/serkantoto/status/692755598497046528

Quote from: @serkantoto on twitter

Bandai Namco is currently developing several NX titles. Smash Bros is planned to be a launch title. I am not sure about the date - yet ;).

People seem to be believing this tweet, so I wanted to drop it here.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 28, 2016, 02:25:33 PM
I still think the NX is a handheld.  Smash 4 can gain a lot more from being on a more powerful handheld than a more powerful console.  I'm also hoping this paves the way for the Ice Climbers to come back.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 28, 2016, 02:51:06 PM
NX collectively is both a handheld and console. It's just a matter of which one Nintendo releases first because there's a case to be made for each. On one hand, Wii U is languishing. Nintendo should try to replace it with a worthy and more importantly finished successor sooner rather than later. On the other hand, Nintendo essentially has the handheld market to itself again with Sony essentially bowing out quietly. Nintendo should be trying to protect that market with a successor as 3DS has been showing its age and New 3DS hardly picking up the slack. Wii U at least has a major holiday release as it continues to tout Zelda as a Wii U game though I think we can expect an NX version. Currently, 3DS has nothing announced for Q4.

Personally, I think NX-Console should launch this year (if not both) since Wii U is in such bad shape, but NX-Handheld is probably more likely. New 3DS, as expected, didn't rejuvenate sales the way Nintendo hoped it would. To date, it has one exclusive. Nintendo knows what its money maker is hardware-wise and will try to capitalize on it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 28, 2016, 03:14:55 PM
I think there's two games playable on nN3DS that aren't on the regular 3DS. I remember someone correcting me when I said there was only one.  Not that it's significantly better.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 28, 2016, 03:48:35 PM
My bet is the handheld SKU launches this holiday, with the console in the first half of 2017.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on January 28, 2016, 04:27:53 PM
As much as we want it, and as much as it would benefit Nintendo, they will not be able to get their console out this year if they want to launch it properly and with good support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 28, 2016, 05:17:42 PM
Console should go first since the 3DS is successful enough to hang on for a bit longer and the Wii U clearly is not but Nintendo are morons so they'll do handheld first.

The Wii U seemed to sell a lot better once games like Mario Kart and SSB showed up for it.  Perhaps Nintendo noticed that and think it would be important to get SSB available on the NX from day one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 28, 2016, 05:48:11 PM
Console should go first since the 3DS is successful enough to hang on for a bit longer and the Wii U clearly is not but Nintendo are morons so they'll do handheld first.

The Wii U seemed to sell a lot better once games like Mario Kart and SSB showed up for it.  Perhaps Nintendo noticed that and think it would be important to get SSB available on the NX from day one.

I think the handheld needs to go out first for reasons you stated in the second paragraph.  Let the console games cook a little longer.  Wii U had to wait for it's bigger, sexier, more notable titles.  Wait until those are absolutely ready before launching.  Wii U can ride out the year (and probably thus its existence) on Star Fox and Zelda.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on January 28, 2016, 06:17:37 PM
Console should go first since the 3DS is successful enough to hang on for a bit longer and the Wii U clearly is not but Nintendo are morons so they'll do handheld first.

The Wii U seemed to sell a lot better once games like Mario Kart and SSB showed up for it.  Perhaps Nintendo noticed that and think it would be important to get SSB available on the NX from day one.

I think the handheld needs to go out first for reasons you stated in the second paragraph.  Let the console games cook a little longer.  Wii U had to wait for it's bigger, sexier, more notable titles.  Wait until those are absolutely ready before launching.  Wii U can ride out the year (and probably thus its existence) on Star Fox and Zelda.

The Wii U doesn't just have to ride out "the year".  When do you think in 2017 it would launch?  Nintendo usually launches consoles around November so it's really riding things out for almost TWO years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on January 28, 2016, 06:32:51 PM
Nintendo has released consoles in the Spring before. I could see them doing it again if they pull it off right.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on January 28, 2016, 06:48:09 PM
Console should go first since the 3DS is successful enough to hang on for a bit longer and the Wii U clearly is not but Nintendo are morons so they'll do handheld first.

The Wii U seemed to sell a lot better once games like Mario Kart and SSB showed up for it.  Perhaps Nintendo noticed that and think it would be important to get SSB available on the NX from day one.

I think the handheld needs to go out first for reasons you stated in the second paragraph.  Let the console games cook a little longer.  Wii U had to wait for it's bigger, sexier, more notable titles.  Wait until those are absolutely ready before launching.  Wii U can ride out the year (and probably thus its existence) on Star Fox and Zelda.

The Wii U doesn't just have to ride out "the year".  When do you think in 2017 it would launch?  Nintendo usually launches consoles around November so it's really riding things out for almost TWO years.

I was thinking closer to the summer.  But you're right.  However, I think Nintendo's got a few more unannounced games to pad it though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 28, 2016, 08:43:33 PM
Nintendo launched 3DS in February in Japan and in March in North America and Europe so it isn't afraid to launch new hardware outside of November.

Targeting different territories with specific hardware is something Nintendo should consider, and it would match up to that rumor that Nintendo is planning to ship 20 million units in 2016. Maybe Nintendo can reach that number with two separate NX products. Handhelds are more popular in Japan so naturally, it'd make sense to get NX-Handheld out there as soon as possible. It would launch with virtually no competition from other dedicated gaming products. Then, Nintendo launches NX-Console in North America and Europe. That's why it'd be really, super helpful if Zelda Wii U became NX exclusive rather than pulling another Twilight Princess and launching on both (with the NX version releasing first). Anyone who would get mad probably already attended the Internet Rage School of Boycotting, where they learned to complain, threaten to boycott then just buy the game and console anyway. Pair Zelda with Metroid and Super Smash Bros. for NX and Nintendo has a really strong first party launch lineup.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 29, 2016, 08:46:44 AM
This generations there should be no excuses for a drought. The games that are supposed to come out on NX should have been in development in early 2014 or late 2013.

That's how I would plan it anyhow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on January 29, 2016, 12:42:03 PM
Nintendo has moved around their handhelds and other devices but have they ever released a home console outside of the holiday or Fall window? Closest I can think of was N64 that came out end of September. I am still not convinced NX has to be two separate machines, but I am convinced something from that initiative is launching this year for sure.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on January 29, 2016, 03:21:06 PM
Nintendo launched 3DS in February in Japan and in March in North America and Europe so it isn't afraid to launch new hardware outside of November.
The 3DS also sold poorly in its first year, so Nintendo might consider this was a factor and not just the price.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 29, 2016, 04:33:39 PM
Nintendo has moved around their handhelds and other devices but have they ever released a home console outside of the holiday or Fall window?
I checked Wikipedia. Nintendo launched NES in Japan in July and SNES in North America in August.
The 3DS also sold poorly in its first year, so Nintendo might consider this was a factor and not just the price.
Nintendo knows it makes most of its money in Q4. With 3DS and Wii U, Nintendo has both met and missed releasing in that quarter. 3DS was delayed to 2011 because it wasn't ready. Wii U was rushed in 2012 despite not being ready. That said, I think Nintendo understands the common thread there. When you launch only matters if people actually want what you're selling. Both launches lacked compelling software and were priced out of what consumers deemed acceptable which is especially troubling for Wii U because at least the Basic Set was sold at a loss.

The $80 price drop helped exponentially though 3DS sales naturally improved once Nintendo actually released some software. Nintendo closed 2011 with Mario Kart 7 and Super Mario 3D Land. Depending on the territory Nintendo's first party launch lineup was Nintendogs + Cats, Steel Diver, and Pilotwings Resort. That won't get it done by any metric. Nintendo had more and better games on 3DS in nine months than Wii U did in double that time.

That why NX is probably getting a shared library for first party games. Portable games these days are similarly as complicated and costly as console games, and Nintendo can't keep up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 29, 2016, 05:02:19 PM
Yeah, I think the 3DS would have sold just fine right out of the game if it had been $200 instead of $250 and the software came quicker. It sold better early in its life than the DS, which had a November release, even as it was.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on January 29, 2016, 05:07:44 PM
I'm just saying, you never know what kind of conclusions Nintendo will come to. Not always the obvious ones. I'm not convinced that they fully understand why the Wii U was not successful, but that's tough to tell until their next system is released.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on January 29, 2016, 08:24:36 PM
This generations there should be no excuses for a drought. The games that are supposed to come out on NX should have been in development in early 2014 or late 2013.

That's how I would plan it anyhow.

I would wager that the big teams would be ready for launch. We know Retro's next game (may it be DKC3 for the gigantic salt mine) is showing up on the "next console", EAD Tokyo has only put out Captain Todd since 3D World... wasn't the reason there were so many spinoffs last year because they're saving as much as possible for the next system?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on January 30, 2016, 03:27:44 PM
Magnetic Resistive DPAD and Buttons

Today is February 1st 2016 (I post from the future) I'm ready to make my NX prediction. The NX Go will have Magnetic Resistive DPAD and Buttons. I'm not even sure what that means.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on January 30, 2016, 07:02:16 PM
That's actually a brilliant idea! Use electromagnetism to create tactile resistance based on what you are doing in the game.


Example: New Donkey Kong Country game has a windy level where the winds push your character back and forth. The greater the wind, the stronger the magnetic resistance in the buttons when you press down the direction you want to go.


Another example: Yet-Another-Mario-Sonic-Olympic-Title has a swimming game where you repeatedly press a button to kick your legs. The lower your stamina gets, the stronger the resistance is against your pressing.


I believe the old Shockwave Force Feedback joysticks did something similar to create resistance in stick controls to better simulate winds in flight games. I think it could even force the stick to move on its own as well.


This could be a great way to return gaming immersion back to its roots. The rumble pack was the last time there was a genuine (and successful) attempt to create immersion in "traditional" style gaming.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on January 30, 2016, 10:38:43 PM
I look forward to resistive force feedback from Sony and Microsoft at E3 2017.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on January 31, 2016, 12:56:03 AM
I look forward to resistive force feedback from Sony and Microsoft at E3 2017.

I mean, it's kind of funny how Microsoft and Sony both responded really droolly to the Wii with the Move and Kinect, and then even after the WiiU flopped there is still quiet acknowledgement about the value of the companion screen with various apps.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 31, 2016, 04:20:13 AM
Sony jumped on that bandwagon well before it flopped.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on January 31, 2016, 04:21:46 PM
Here's a question that popped into my head as I was glancing over my collection, what colour do you think NX games will be if any?

Xbox and PlayStation both have their iconic colours, the closest Nintendo has is white although that went away with Wii U, probably to try to differentiate it from Wii. While 3ds boxes are still white the 3ds has that red motif going on that differentiates it from DS.

I like Xenoblade 3d with it's black box in Europe so personally I'd go with something like that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on January 31, 2016, 04:32:40 PM
Honestly, indigo. Just the game cases, not the actual console (black should be marketed for obvious reasons even if Nintendo released different colors). It's eye catching. The only potential problem is that Kinect cases were purple.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on January 31, 2016, 07:27:20 PM
I think NX should be Light Grey, Dark Gray, and a hint of Red for lettering. There should be like a black stripe somewhere.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on February 01, 2016, 02:12:42 AM
I liked the white clean look for everything on the Wii and Wii U.  However, I can see why Nintendo could want to distance themselves from that.  It really depends on what Nintendo will do with games.  Are they cartridge based, download only?  Disc? 

They should try to make sure the NX section looks distinct and easy to see in a store. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 01, 2016, 05:58:32 AM
Most Wii U game cases are blue. Nintendo made the mistake of not using Blu Ray cases though it generally did a terrible job of differentiating itself from Wii so no surprises there. If Nintendo exclusively uses game cards for NX, it definitely should use smaller game cases in addition to a different color. Not does this help distinguish and distance NX from Wii and Wii U, but it also saves money on packaging and shipping. It doesn't seem like much looking at an individual game, but multiply that a few million times and the savings adds up which also helps drive the cost of Game cards are smaller and inherently more durable than optical discs. They don't need big, hard cases. 3DS game cases are noticably thinner and lighter due to using fewer materials than DS cases, mainly because they don't need to. In fact, 3DS cases are probably too big.

Nintendo shouldn't make the game cases too small because it stands to make NX games look insignificant. Packaging is important in the retail space. When facing forward on shelves, the box art should be large enough to draw attention to itself without consumers having to lean on and squint.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 01, 2016, 09:37:09 AM
Why not go all the way down to CD sized cases? Nobody had a hard time buying CD's when they were new, or cassettes back in the dark days either. Just saying casing isn't that important in today's digital world, it needs to stand out but they can afford to take risks here because they need to look as different from the other guys as possible, if they are going for different, or as similar to the other guys if they are going for just better. They cases should be black Blu Ray sized or CD sized cases if they are discs, or RED, red makes the most sense as Nintendo color, but whatever the packaging is the least important feature to worry about so thanks for putting it out there now Nintendo will fixate on the packing at the expense of everything else.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on February 01, 2016, 03:43:43 PM
I think that red is the most iconic/classic colour that Nintendo have, so that would make for good case design.

To that end, I think it's about time to bring back the "Entertainment System" name. It would actually make even more sense now than it did back then, since game consoles no longer just play games, they also have things like movie and TV services, so they truly are entertainment systems now. I'm not entirely sure what would be good to add to "Nintendo Entertainment System" since they can't use the exact same name again, though. NES 7, maybe?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on February 01, 2016, 04:48:33 PM
Red must be a accent color.  It can never be the dominant color.  I like the idea of making the cases the size of CD cases even if it for a disc game.  It also saves room for the person storing the games. 

White, Grey and Red could be good. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stogi on February 02, 2016, 08:41:36 AM
I still don't think the NX will be all that big, at least not as big as a PS4 or XBONE. So I think an all red console with white and grey highlights would look great. It's distinct, immediately recognizable, and intriguing. If I saw a red box next to my friends TV, I would ask "what the hell is that?" It's color would have done its job.

And they should definitely bring back the NES name. It's nostalgic, easily understandable, and speaks to the features. They could get away with calling it the "NES" if they wanted to, but I do think they should call it the "Next Nintendo Entertainment System" or the NNES. It rolls off the tongue and it doesn't fight the war of numbers like it's rivals. There's probably a better original name out there, but it's hard to argue against using "NES" again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 02, 2016, 08:50:01 AM
They could use Microsoft logic and called it the Nintendo 8, or Nintendo Entertainment System 2 or Nintendo Entertainment System 8 and they beat PS4 and Xbox One in the name by numbers category. They really do need to let people know that they are still making consoles, when I tell people I own a Wii U they ask me what is it, so I stopped explaining it and instead of saying I own a Wii U I just say the new Nintendo system and they say, oh cool I didn't know they had a new one and then I can talk about it.

The fact they are the ONLY gaming company left from the early days still going is something they need to flaunt, they don't just have nostalgia on their side, if they play it right they have longevity on their side and they could use that in their marketing, not some silly "Mario grew up with you too" mushy crap but more like the Play it Loud, Now You Are Playing with Super Power, thing, something like, Hey Remember Atari, Sega, Coleco, Amiga, no well that's because you were too busy playing Nintendo and guess what we are still here, alive and kicking. It doesn't need those words but that message, they survived the the crash, they survived the 90's barrage of endless gaming devices, they survived the ipads and the androids, and they put Microsoft in their place. Nintendo needs to capitalize on that and get their damn balls back. This always apologizing hurts their image, if they really believe in the Wii U fucking have the back bone to show it, if they do NOT believe in the NX to have the balls to come out and say hey don't get a stupid out dated nothing PS4 that only plays the same tired **** your getting bored of by now, but a fucking NX that has all this new exciting plus really cool retro schick stuff you forgot how much you loved, and play off that, whatever the new feature is FUCKING OWN IT. They need their damn balls they need confidence that is all everything they do will be better if they act like they believe in it and stop apologizing for their **** ups.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: alexdickdyke on February 02, 2016, 11:12:04 AM
I think that red is the most iconic/classic colour that Nintendo have, so that would make for good case design.

To that end, I think it's about time to bring back the "Entertainment System" name. It would actually make even more sense now than it did back then, since game consoles no longer just play games, they also have things like movie and TV services, so they truly are entertainment systems now. I'm not entirely sure what would be good to add to "Nintendo Entertainment System" since they can't use the exact same name again, though. NES 7, maybe?




NESX
XNES
NXES


X as in cross.
I really like the Nintendo Cross for some reason. And it would help to explain the dual platforms, if that is in fact what they are doing. 
Nintendo Cross Entertainment System? some form of this seeing as they (japan) like using cross in their game titles lately.
I like the blue colored cases, and purple could be cool too.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 02, 2016, 01:28:42 PM
I find the macho posturing of Sega in it's heyday and Sony in its entirety to be absolutely asinine. While I agree that Nintendo should use their logevity to drive home the pint that they have been consistently profitable and a presence in the medium, they can pull it off with more finesse than "LOOK AT HOW FUCKING GREAT WE ARE". At the same time, they shouldn't rely too heavily on nostalgia as they have with recent 25/30th anniversary promotions.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on February 02, 2016, 05:29:49 PM
Red must be a accent color.  It can never be the dominant color.
Eh, they've made red cases for Mario games and I see no problem with those.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on February 02, 2016, 08:05:37 PM
Grey with red and black accents for the consoles and the cases. And bring back the old racetrack logo to the forefront.


I like the Nintendo Cross Entertainment System (NXES). Or Nintendo's Cross Entertainment System (NCES / Nintendo's CES). Heck, The Nintendo System (TNS) would be a nice, simple name.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on February 02, 2016, 08:55:50 PM
A tidbit from President Kimishima - it seems that NX might interact with Miitomo somehow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on February 02, 2016, 09:20:51 PM
Grey with red and black accents for the consoles and the cases. And bring back the old racetrack logo to the forefront.


I like the Nintendo Cross Entertainment System (NXES). Or Nintendo's Cross Entertainment System (NCES / Nintendo's CES). Heck, The Nintendo System (TNS) would be a nice, simple name.

I think it is wise to give your console a name not totally associated with your corporate brand.  I think this is a lesson Nintendo learned wisely around the Nintendo 64 era, when people complained about game prices.  If Nintendo used The Nintendo System then if that system fails the name Nintendo is also associated with that failure.  However, right now, only Wii U and Wii by name association could be considered a failure.  Even though it is the Nintendo Wii...people just think Wii because of marketing.

So a Name like the Nintendo Cross Entertainment couldn't work because to fully understand what people are talking about you have to say Nintendo Cross.  Otherwise, you could just have a Cross because you are religious. 


Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 03, 2016, 10:26:35 AM
A tidbit from President Kimishima - it seems that NX might interact with Miitomo somehow.

I'm thinking Miitomo will interact directly with Miiverse, so the NX should be able to interact that way.  Let you add people, post, check your 'yeahs', etc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 03, 2016, 07:19:26 PM
They might be able to keep the Cross in the name in Japan but I could see some group claiming it was religious propaganda in the west.

I like the idea of making the game cases red. But I want the console to be slick and black like everything else. The only color I would be okay with other than black is maybe silver or a shiny gray.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on February 03, 2016, 07:47:04 PM
I'm going to guess that if you asked 99% of the population to read the title "Namco × Capcom" out loud they would say "Namco EX Capcom".  X = cross is not even close to a typical English language convention.  So using something like that would actually be worse than confusing names like Wii U and New 3DS because almost everyone would pronounce the name wrong.  Or, even worse, they hear someone saying the name right but then can't correlate it with this X named system they see in the store.  "Hey you have the N-Cross-ES?" you ask the misinformed store clerk and he says "no, I have the NXES?  Is that the same thing?" and confusion ensues.

I would call it Nintendo [Insert distinct name here].  Put Nintendo in the front so everyone knows that Nintendo's making it and then have something distinct that has nothing to do with Wii or DS or could be confused for some competing product (ie: NX would be naturally confused with Xbox) or a prior Nintendo console.  Nothing like Xbox 1 where you make it near impossible for someone to clarify if they mean your current product or the very first one you ever made.  Nothing that resembles potty talk in the English language so no Nintendo Dik or Nintendo Pu.  It's hard to come up with something catchy or cool but it is NOT hard to avoid something idiotic.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on February 03, 2016, 09:44:35 PM
I am one of those people Ian.  EX or just Versus
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 03, 2016, 10:26:46 PM
What about the XES? I like that. Then hipsters can say the Cross Entertainment System and normies can say EX EE ES.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on February 04, 2016, 12:02:00 AM
And the first smartass to flip that acronym around is...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 04, 2016, 01:01:58 AM
X = cross is not even close to a typical English language convention.
Wait, what? There are xing signs all over the United States: school xing, ped xing, deer xing etc.
Quote
Nothing like Xbox 1 where you make it near impossible for someone to clarify if they mean your current product or the very first one you ever made.
Was this ever really a problem? The original Xbox came out in 2002. Was anyone even still talking about it in 2013 let alone now in 2016. The problem with the name "Wii U" is that Nintendo did a terrible job communicating that the console itself was a new and more importantly, separate thing from its predecessor. If it looks like a duck and sounds like a duck...

Anyway, I rather like the name Nintendo NX (as in en-ex, though I don't hate en-cross). It's a good name for a family of systems. Since DS, Nintendo has had some weird philosophy attached to the name of its hardware. It could easily say "The 'X' represents 'cross,'" and then everyone forgets about it except on message boards when it's randomly brought up in discussions of about product names like how "'DS' stands for 'dual screens' or 'developer's system.'"

Speaking of, Nintendo DS was the original codename which was changed to Nitro then changed back to Nintendo DS before becoming the official name. That said, it's entirely possible that Nintendo keeps the name NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on February 04, 2016, 01:55:31 AM
And the first smartass to flip that acronym around is...


Hah! I totally missed that one. I could see them stumbling into a hole in that manner.


Maybe get rid of the S? Nintendo Entertainment Platform? Nintendo Gaming System?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 04, 2016, 02:04:21 AM
Oh! Even better! It promotes the hybrid between the consoles. The SYSTEM ENTERTAINMENT CROSS!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 04, 2016, 09:58:37 AM
"Nintendo Games Machine"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 04, 2016, 11:34:27 AM
With how long the NX name has been out there, I wouldn't be surprised if they kept it, honestly. I know someone expressed a similar thought earlier in the thread, but I don't think Nintendo has every really been this open about the code name of a system prior to this.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 04, 2016, 12:14:48 PM
Has it been a year since they said "NX"?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 04, 2016, 12:18:32 PM
When was the DeNA acquisition? I believe sometime in February or March.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on February 04, 2016, 01:02:38 PM
X = cross is not even close to a typical English language convention.
Wait, what? There are xing signs all over the United States: school xing, ped xing, deer xing etc.

Never for a second thought about those.  Still I think 99% of the population will be read it as the letter X, not as cross.  It's EX-Men, not Cross-Men.  If they made it the Nintendo xing then people might get it but NXED or something like that?  No.  Why even use something that is open to interpretation when it's not necessary?  They can come up with something that has no risk of confusion.  Nintendo's margin of error on the NX is miniscule.  They shouldn't risk anything on something as trivial as a name.  There is no reason to get cute with something so basic.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 04, 2016, 01:26:56 PM
A particular solution to this, which was emphasized with the DS logo design, is showing a literal image of the concept- the two boxes next to the DS in the logo represent the dual screens. If you put an image of one console in the top "arrow" of the X and one in the bottom, you have them being led towards a centerpoint.

Another answer could be the current Monster Hunter logo- emphasize the first two letters of the words, or even insert "Cross" into the X to better communicate it.

I'll definitely be putting together some mockups.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 04, 2016, 05:48:06 PM
Nintendo did such an exceptionally poor job of communicating with consumers that an absurd amount of people didn't even know Wii U was a thing. That's why naming the console "Wii U" was a bad move. The name may have been okay had Nintendo bothered to explain that it was a brand new console. Then, it went to places like Pottery Barn to market Wii U. It was like Nintendo was trying to keep the thing a secret.

It isn't so much about what Nintendo calls the console as it is people knowing it exists. Being part of public consciousness is the important bit. Even if a consumer doesn't walk into a store looking to buy NX; they should at least know what it is.

Nintendo can do a lot worse than NX. I'm not convinced it can do better, just similarly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on February 04, 2016, 06:18:12 PM
I've always felt that "Xbox" was a stupid name, and adding 360 or One doesn't make it any better. But the brand (eventually) did fine despite that.

Now, "PlayStation" I think is an okay name. It's simple and gets the point across. I dunno if it helped the system's success, but it certainly didn't hurt it. Also, I think naming a system with its name and then a number is fine (PS2, PS3, PS4); why do systems need a new name every time? It's never made much sense to me that new systems had new names. This convention is simple and easy to understand that PS4 is the new system to PS3. Why should there even be any need to explain a name or that something is a new system?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 04, 2016, 06:36:14 PM
Are you suggesting the Wii U 2?

Because I like where your head is at.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 04, 2016, 07:05:28 PM
NES8: The Ocho.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 04, 2016, 07:19:52 PM
I've always felt that "Xbox" was a stupid name, and adding 360 or One doesn't make it any better. But the brand (eventually) did fine despite that.
"Xbox" sounds sillier without the history behind it. The console was originally pitched as the "DirectX Box," named after Microsoft's API. Had it stuck, DirectX Box would have been the most utilitarian console name ever. It was named after exactly was it was, more so even than GameCube which wasn't an actual cube.

The meaning behind the original name is practically lost with the truncated "Xbox" label. At the same time, it still works. A product name doesn't have to mean anything so if you aren't going with something literal like "DirectX Box," something simple is a good choice.
Quote
Why should there even be any need to explain a name or that something is a new system?
I think that's why NX works. It doesn't even need to mean anything. Nintendo is weirdly attached to assigning some philosophy to the branding of its products yet the best names are the ones that are practical even without said philosophy. For example, Nintendo DS is good branding because its easy to remember and easy to say in most languages, not because DS means anything. 3DS works because its sequential and utilitarian. It's a DS follow-up with 3D capabilities. That said, NX could mean something, but even if you strip that away, you're left with two letters that are, again, easy to say and easy to remember.

I am a fan of simplicity and sequentiality. I think "Wii 2" would have been a better name for Wii U even if that wouldn't have fixed Nintendo's inability to explain what Wii U was. I was in favor of calling a successor Nintendo 7 just because it's so stupidly simplistic. The main purpose of branding is so people know what to call it then it should get out of the way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on February 04, 2016, 08:54:32 PM
nickmitch wins.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on February 04, 2016, 10:05:04 PM
Are you guys counting right?

1. NES
2 SNES
3 n64
4 GCN
5 wii
6 wii u
7 NX

or do you count ColorTVGame?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on February 04, 2016, 10:41:36 PM
Well, Nintendo does have a precedent for starting to name things by number when they get to 7.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 04, 2016, 11:58:24 PM
NX is a stupid name for a console it is obviously a code name. Nintendo System X would be okay but they need the Nintendo brand in the name, they need to avoid X though it is too similar to Xbox. That got them in trouble with Game CUBE.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on February 05, 2016, 12:01:31 AM
I don't see how NX is any worse of a name than DS, which was also a code name, and they sold like 170 million of those.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 05, 2016, 12:06:02 AM
It wasn't DS, it was Nintendo DS, people knew it was a Nintendo console, NX is too vague. If they called it Nintendo X it could be confused for X box, if they called it Nintendo Cross there are people in the US anyways who might mistake it for a religious thing, see some of the talk back threads. DS stood for Dual Screen, they made that clear when they were talking about it before hand, so far we know literally nothing about "NX" so what does it supposedly stand for? It is terrible in that regards. It sounds cool and people have gotten used to it but Revolution sounded a thousand times infinity better than that idiotic, piece of ****, no good, nothing, stupid ass, lame, crap fest name they went with.

DS didn't sell one console because the name, not calling it Game Boy had no impact either DS was like the Nintendo Piss, it was right place, right time, but the damn was lame.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on February 05, 2016, 12:19:48 AM
I wasn't arguing that it sold based on the name, just that the name clearly didn't have any negative effect on sales. Also they said DS stood for Developer's System as well as Dual Screen, and never referred to it as either in any kind of marketing or really anywhere outside very gamer focused settings like E3 roundtables and such.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 05, 2016, 12:36:25 AM
Well sure, but there was something out there for gamers to reference. All I said was the name is kind of lame, gave my reasons why I felt that way and you replied with DS was a code name, the same old example people point to but DS did have dual meaning, we have nothing official on what the hidden meaning behind NX is, is it NExt Generation, Nintendo Extra, N Cross, it could be anything we don't know. It is really odd they are taking this long to talk about it though, no news at all on this, or any official word on new games. What about QoL are they still working on that if so when do they start talking about it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 05, 2016, 10:39:06 AM
Nintendo: Dual Significance.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on February 05, 2016, 01:36:57 PM
"Xbox" sounds sillier without the history behind it. The console was originally pitched as the "DirectX Box," named after Microsoft's API.
Ah, I'm sure I probably heard about that back in 2001, but wouldn't remember it now. The name makes more sense with that history, but I still think it sounds stupid. But that's my point, it doesn't matter if a name sounds stupid, as long as it isn't confusingly stupid.

Of course, when it comes to sequentiality, they need to come up with a decent enough name in the first place. And if a company has a system that isn't very successful, I could see wanting to move away from that branding and trying something new. Wii U 2 won't work for both those reasons, as well as possibly getting themselves into legal trouble with the band U2. Then again, being associated with U2 may also make the system more popular... But yeah, in the past most systems got new names even when the predecessor was successful; I don't see what would be wrong with NES 2, Genesis 2, etc. Though Super NES wasn't bad.

Also, as dumb as it sounds, I do think they shouldn't use the letter X in the name because of the Xbox. Microsoft sort of "own" the letter as part of a name for a game system, so you never know what kind of perception that would lead to. And why risk it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on February 05, 2016, 02:29:47 PM
Here are some personal anecdotes related to Nintendo names.  My brother didn't know the Wii U even existed until last year when I started expressing interest in trying to find a cheap Wii U for Mario Maker and Xenoblade.  He sure as hell knew about the Wii but had no knowledge of the Wii U and had to clarify with me what the difference between it and the Wii was.

Although the DS was very successful I always have to explain to my parents what the hell it or the 3DS is if I mention it in conversation.  I usually say "eh... Game Boy" and they're like "Oh yeah I know what a Game Boy is".  I think for their age group a short acronym comes across as too technical and thus too complicated.  "Game Boy" consists of clear words that they already know so it's easier to remember and put into context.  Hell my parents just hear "DEE-ESS" and have no idea what weird made-up word I just said.  The DS brand is over ten years old and yet every time my parents see me playing it and ask what it is and I respond "DS" they get this confused stare like they don't understand my answer.  And there is no point explaining the difference between a Wii and Wii U.  One made up word now appended with another one that sounds like the English words "we" and "you" but arranged in a way that makes them gibberish?  The **** they were ever going to understand that.  Names like PlayStation, Xbox and even Gamecube are actually pretty good because they just combine words that everyone of any age knows.  Sony has it best.  PlayStation is an easy word for all ages to grasp, gives an indication that it is at least entertainment based and the whole 1,2,3,4 naming convention is really intuitive.  PlayStation 4?  Hmmmm, must have been released after the PlayStation 3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 05, 2016, 03:19:09 PM
I got tired of explaining to people Wii U was a whole new console so I stopped calling it Wii U and just say the new Nintendo system. My parents had a Wii they loved it, when I got the Wii U they asked me to hook it up to their Wii. I still can't get them to understand it is not a attachment for Wii. Doesn't help that it plays Wii games and I happen to have a few of those too. Mom wanted me to get Mario Maker for her Wii and I had to once again explain how it won't work on hers, and she wanted me to get her a tablet for her Wii.

I know anecdotal but naming wise Wii U was a mistake. Hell I just had the cable guy at my house and was telling him I am a gamer, I have a PS3, a PS4 and a Wii U and he said I have a Wii too, its great and I showed him mine he was confused why mine was bigger than his and I said it was a Wii U not a Wii and he asked whats the difference.


To be fair not everyone is going to get it though, my dad used to tell people I had an Xbox back when I had a Game Cube and I always corrected him and he would invite people over to play games and they would show up expecting Halo and I pulled out a GC, we would play some Smash Bros or some Mario Kart.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 05, 2016, 11:01:25 PM
Honestly, at this point, I wonder how many people would reply, "What's that?" or "Nintendo still makes videogame systems?" if Nintendo didn't reuse the 'Wii' name.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on February 05, 2016, 11:29:48 PM
I don't see why Reggie can't be like "that's a stupid name!" and not get fired.

I'm in favor of naming systems after things that are cool; like animals.

It works with cars

Mustang Jaguar Cobra Sable Viper Beetle Impala Ram Bronco Gremlin Firebird Thunderbird

Nintendo Ninja, Nintendo Neptune, Nintendo Nirvana,

Nintendo NX sounds cool too
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Caterkiller on February 05, 2016, 11:56:49 PM
I was Amiibo shopping around Christmas and over heard a mom confused about Wii and Wii U. I couldn't believe it was still happening.

I like the NX code name but I understand the idea that it could be troublesome with the Xbox brand floating around. I like Nintendo Cross as well but would religious freaks really get up in arms about it and have it result in something meaningful?

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on February 06, 2016, 10:03:37 AM
Nintendo has the awkward situation of inserting the name of the company into their product names, but they don't have to say that the 'N' in NX stands for Nintendo. But anyway, michaelbaysuperfan616, your argument has no merit. They can call it the Nintendo NX, and everyone else will just call it the NX. No one talks about their Microsoft Xbox One, or their SONY PlayStation 4, they call them Xbox One (or just Xbox, or Xbone) and PS4. DS does not officially stand for anyting - some people assume that it means "Dual Screen" but Nintendo used the acronym as shorthand for "Developer's System" - and if it did mean the former, then 3DS means "3 Dual Screen" - which makes no sense. They never said what the 'i' in "DSi" meant either, but one rep said it means "individual."

My point: quit whining. If they call it "Nintendo NX", or just "NX," then that's what they call it. If they call it something else, then that's what they call it. NX is not any worse than DS. No one is going to confuse it with Xbox. Seriously. You see two consoles in the store and think they're the same thing? You don't have internet? Maybe some grandmothers might buy the wrong game for their grandson on his birthday, but the grandson will realize the difference before he opens the game and exchange it at the store, or online, or whatever. Wii U and Wii - those are stupid, and potentially confusing, names - largely due to the "non-gamers" that bought so many Wii consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 06, 2016, 11:56:57 AM
Ah, I'm sure I probably heard about that back in 2001, but wouldn't remember it now. The name makes more sense with that history, but I still think it sounds stupid. But that's my point, it doesn't matter if a name sounds stupid, as long as it isn't confusingly stupid.
Absolutely. When I think about it, "Xbox" is a stupid name, but when I talk about it in regular conversation, I don't think about the name being stupid. It's just "Xbox." Even if DirectX Box stuck, people likely would have just called it "Xbox" anyway because it's easier which was probably the entire reason behind truncating it. The branding isn't as important as the message. Give people something they want, and it doesn't matter what the thing is called. We'll all get used to it.
DS does not officially stand for anyting - some people assume that it means "Dual Screen" but Nintendo used the acronym as shorthand for "Developer's System"
It does on both counts. The explanation is on Nintendo's website: "To our developers, it stands for 'Developers' System,' since we believe it gives game creators brand new tools which will lead to more innovative games for the world's players. It can also stand for 'Dual Screen.'" I'm only bringing this up because:
Quote
Nintendo has the awkward situation of inserting the name of the company into their product names, but they don't have to say that the 'N' in NX stands for Nintendo... They can call it the Nintendo NX, and everyone else will just call it the NX...

If they call it "Nintendo NX", or just "NX," then that's what they call it. If they call it something else, then that's what they call it. NX is not any worse than DS. No one is going to confuse it with Xbox.
Agreed. I would like to add that even if Nintendo insists on an explanation for the name, it stops being a thing because most people won't remember it if they were even privy to that information in the first place. Outside of these meager forum discussions, no one ever talks about why Nintendo called its handheld "Nintendo DS" or its console "Wii." They're just what we call them now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: ThePerm on February 06, 2016, 08:16:21 PM
also, don't forget the x in Xbox also means X as in unknown variable. When people used to discuss consoles made by companies other than Nintendo, Sony, or Sega we would call it an X box. We didn't know who would make the xbox ultimately and we didn't know what they would call it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on February 07, 2016, 09:24:55 AM
It does on both counts. The explanation is on Nintendo's website: "To our developers, it stands for 'Developers' System,' since we believe it gives game creators brand new tools which will lead to more innovative games for the world's players. It can also stand for 'Dual Screen.'" I'm only bringing this up because:
That's kind of my point (and maybe you're agreeing with me?) - yes, to Nintendo, internally, and among developers, it means "Developer's System" but the system itself, its packaging, or its marketing, has never explained what it stands for. It's just "DS" and "3DS" and people buy it because of what it is, without regard to what it's supposed to mean.
Give people something they want, and it doesn't matter what the thing is called. We'll all get used to it.
Exactly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 07, 2016, 09:28:27 PM
Xbox and Playstation don't need the company names in them because they're brands.  I think Nintendo was trying to make "Wii" to a brand (not just a name).

Personally, I think Nintendo is best off throwing their name back into the title of the system, but giving it a strong enough name to carry itself and be iterated upon (if desired).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Dasmos on February 08, 2016, 12:50:02 AM
I don't see why Reggie can't be like "that's a stupid name!" and not get fired.

I'm in favor of naming systems after things that are cool; like animals.

Nintendo Thundercougarfalconbird?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 08, 2016, 10:22:56 AM
They could just call it "The Nintendo" or even "Nintendo X" and it would be OK.
I don't think the name matters at all in terms of sales either, never said it does, but it does matter in consumer confusion and the last thing Nintendo needs is any excuse for customers to not get excited for the machine. Instead of taking the approach of just make a machine that fits Nintendo's definition of a console and throw it out there quirks and all, they desperately need to make something that checks ever box and gets everyone excited without any major hold up that causes them to think twice. The name is trivial but it can affect perception which can be hard to overcome. Say what you will about Wii sales, it DID NOT have good perception it sold well despite that, mostly, no entirely on the strength of Wii Sports. Everything else was the same old Nintendo we have been dealing with 1996. 20 years of crap Nintendo coming off barely 10 years of Great Nintendo, no wonder Nostalgia isn't enough to keep them a strong force anymore, they are running out of good will when it comes to that nostalgia.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 08, 2016, 12:04:11 PM
If you have consumer confusion, you have a sales problem.  One can cause the other.  The name is a factor in that.  Yeah, yeah; marketing, news coverage; blah, blah, blah.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 08, 2016, 03:33:24 PM
It could lead to some loss of sales but not really, it then falls on the sales rep to explain the difference. With Wii and Wii U yes it can be confusing, but with a brand new console, unless they name it the Nintendo Power Station or the Nintendo Box there isn't going to be confusion between their machine and their competitions machine.

Damn you Nintendo gives us SOMETHING so we can stop bickering over what the name is or isn't going to not be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on February 09, 2016, 04:02:32 PM
There will always be at least some confusion over new products, be it from indifference, ignorance, or whatever else. They can still try to choose a name that would result in less of it than some others might, and I personally feel they can do better than NX. Sure, they could also do a lot worse, but still.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: sudoshuff on February 09, 2016, 09:12:06 PM
I would actually be OK "The Nintendo", or some variation of their name, with some really cool Kanji in the logo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 21, 2016, 12:16:12 AM
NintenGen (http://www.nintengen.com/) is run by this dude who posts on neogaf as Trevelyan9999 (he also goes by SuperMetalDave64 on The Youtube). He posted two interesting NX stories recently. The first is a rumor that both Final Fantasy VII Remake and Final Fantasy XV are being ported to NX. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QDWlNBk9eow) He doesn't claim this as anything but a rumor. His source has supposedly been right about things in the past. The second is a bit juicier as he's passing it off as news rather than rumor: NX is definitely launching in 2016 and Zelda Wii U is a launch window game. (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RYJiVUgcSdE) He claims to have received this information from a verified source within Nintendo.

Is there any reason to believe him?

Well, he has something to lose. He runs his own website and a Youtube channel that would immediately lose traffic if he's a fraud. He also faces being perma-banned from neogaf. My understanding of neogaf is that if you claim to have sources or actually be an insider, they make you prove it via private message to the moderators. He sent his proof earlier today and is pending approval. In fact, he's been pretty adamant about wanting to get this done which is the exact opposite behavior of someone dicking around.

I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. He didn't have to start posting on neogaf again where his credibility would immediately be called into question. Sources reaching out to Youtubers isn't a new thing either. Liam Robertson/Tamaki/Unseen64 started by doing his own investigative work on cancelled games and slowely built contacts over the years. Robertson was a guest on a podcast I listened recently, and he detailed how he got started. Sometimes developers reach out to him because they like his channel and his work.

Neither of these NX bits are that surprising. Cloud appearing in Super Smash Bros. made an NX port of the Remake seem like something that could actually happen. If Nintendo drops optical media, it would be so fitting for Nintendo to not only get the game but get it on a cartridge/card. I'm not that excited about the Remake; I just want that to happen. I would definitely buy it if all the episodes were on a single card.

NX launching in 2016 with a port of Zelda Wii U at or around launch isn't particularly sexy news. I figured both would happen once NX was announced last year. I'm not bragging; it just seems like common sense.

Anyway, here's an idea I've been noodling around for a few days: what if NX-Handheld supported Google Chromecast? I feel like that's the closest to a hybrid device that one can hope for. This begs the question: if the console and handheld have a largely shared library, why would anyone bother with the console? Because the handheld is still just the handheld. It'd be stretching the picture, and it's definitely not HD. That will be good enough for some people, not everyone. I think Nintendo knows that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 21, 2016, 12:45:28 AM
I'm only buying Zelda Wii U for one console.

If Final Fantasy XV comes to the system, that would be neat, but not if its a year-and-a-half late bloomer like some Wii U ports were. The Final Fantasy VII remake is going to suck so there's no reason to be excited for that.

It's weird- if the NX ends up being a handheld, I'll be really excited, but honestly, if it's a console, there's no way I'm picking it up close to launch. The Wii U has been such a sore spot and I don't really think I can get myself all excited for a new console just yet. It needs to have a bit of promise.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on February 21, 2016, 09:29:42 AM
Chromecast (at least the first generation) has a little lag if you cast a game to it (though it isn't *horrible* - at least not for games where maybe 50ms lag is acceptible - a 2D Mario game would be unplayable though), at least with my Nvidia Shield Portable. Could be be cause it only supports 2.4Ghz WiFi, the newer model does ac.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on February 21, 2016, 10:13:08 AM
The Final Fantasy VII remake is going to suck so there's no reason to be excited for that.
Why do you think it going to suck? I'm not going to argue; I'm just curious.
Chromecast (at least the first generation) has a little lag if you cast a game to it (though it isn't *horrible* - at least not for games where maybe 50ms lag is acceptible - a 2D Mario game would be unplayable though), at least with my Nvidia Shield Portable. Could be be cause it only supports 2.4Ghz WiFi, the newer model does ac.
I was trying to come up with some "brand-new concept" ideas. With Nintendo embracing mobile, it'd be a good for NX to support different technologies. Nintendo could always make its own streaming dongle, but the point was to keep cost down as in this could be an extra thing the handheld could do if you already had a Chromecast or wanted one. The handheld and streaming dongle would close the price gap with the console. I suppose this wouldn't be a terrible thing since if you want a console, you'd get the console, and the dongle would still be optional.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on February 21, 2016, 12:44:53 PM
Has Nintendo unveiled a console/handheld and then released it in the same calendar year?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on February 21, 2016, 01:38:44 PM
The closest they would have come would have been the GBA/Gamecube, which were both unveiled in the same year (2000) and released the next year. So if two form factors of NX come out this year, it'd be unprecedented.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on February 21, 2016, 02:10:14 PM
As far as I can recall, we didn't know anything at all about the DS until early 2004, and it came out in November of that year. And we didn't really know much of substance about the Wii until 2006, with effectively nothing shown at E3 2005 and the controller at TGS that year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on February 21, 2016, 04:04:32 PM
So if FF7 remake is supposedly coming to the system and so is the next proper full HD console release along side Zelda Wii U, doesn't that pretty much prove NX is going to be a full console? They just released New 3DS last year, there is no reason for them to abandon that so soon. Wii U is the machine that is slipping into a coma.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on February 21, 2016, 11:22:07 PM
I have no where else to put this so here it is. Mistwalker (The Last Story) and Silicon Studio (Bravely Default) have just announced they're working on a new game. Sakaguchi teased some new concept art for a game coming to current gen consoles at a University of Hawaii class earlier this year. Throw NX in the pile somewhere in there and profit.

That is all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Wah on February 21, 2016, 11:35:41 PM
So if FF7 remake is supposedly coming to the system and so is the next proper full HD console release along side Zelda Wii U, doesn't that pretty much prove NX is going to be a full console? They just released New 3DS last year, there is no reason for them to abandon that so soon. Wii U is the machine that is slipping into a coma.
This is how I feel about the NX
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on February 22, 2016, 07:47:11 AM
Quote
My source informed me that it was ok to reveal that they are an Employee that works for Nintendo of America’s Marketing.

Ok, now I know it's BS. You may resume your regular rumor mongering.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on February 28, 2016, 09:11:52 PM
RIDICULOUS Rumors:

http://dualpixels.com/2016/02/27/rumor-new-information-on-next-gen-nintendo-nx-console/

Probably fake, but it all sounds so exciting!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on February 28, 2016, 11:18:57 PM
RIDICULOUS Rumors:

http://dualpixels.com/2016/02/27/rumor-new-information-on-next-gen-nintendo-nx-console/

Probably fake, but it all sounds so exciting!

-Wireless HDMI... play on any screen w/ a HDMI port....
so ultra portable console?

- Full Haptic feedback and motion controls
that sounds good. wireless controllers will no longer last 30hrs on a single charge though.
if the controller is another uPad, then it better come with a MUCH larger battery from the start.

- Bluetooth EVERYTHING
that sounds pretty awesome actually. I like that Nintendo finally decided to take an idea and not halfass it as it was only included for some very specific feature in a flagship game. Do it all out.
that goes for this, the motion controls (now w/ Haptic)

- Powerful enough to handle anything the PS4 & XBone can handle, and extremely easy to code/compile games for.
I guess that's good for 3rd party parity... until PS5/XBtwo comes out. I know we aren't trying to chase power here, and more power cost more money, time & effort, but I don't want 3rd parties to have the same excuses as before for not supporting a major player.

- Increased Social/Multi-player aspects built in, with a very power and user friendly Android-like OS that allows you to use the device to connect to whatever and interact with whatever so that the device is useful for more than just gaming, but becomes a kind of Persona Entertainment/Social HUB  that you can use all the time.
As I said before, assuming this is all true, a large step in the right direction for Nintendo to go all in on an idea and push it to it's potential, instead of marginalizing the idea down to it's usefulness for a very specific function/idea/game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 29, 2016, 12:17:05 AM
Yeah, I'm skeptical. If one of these things turned out to be true I would be happy.

Just one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on February 29, 2016, 12:44:49 AM
There's just no way they could roll out a portable device that could run PS4-level games at anything approaching a viable price point.

I like the streaming dongle idea in theory, and have myself proposed something similar to salvage the proprietary Wii U tech, but if anything that would be a "GBA player" type bonus that would let you play handheld NX games on a TV if you didn't own the console. But even then it's questionable why they would want to discourage adoption of the dedicated home unit out of the gate.

As for the other stuff, I mean, whatever I guess either way. It seems to me that trying to roll every possible app or widget or activity into a video game ecosystem is futile and really only appeals to weirdo video game identity types who want to route everything through their systems just to do it, not because it's actually more convenient than using the phone that they already have on them at all times. I'd wager most people are good with a handful of video streaming services (which they can just run through their TVs at this point anyway).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on February 29, 2016, 01:06:56 AM
If Nintendo is taking the idea of making an everyday use device, or a all-in-one social entertainment system, then they better make sure it operates quickly and smoothly.

I also hope they leave in an expansion slot, as the FCC is trying to push new regulation that will open up the set-top box market to everyone. Which means that Nintendo can have a cable card add on, that will allow your NX to be your new cable box, and then that TVii App Nintendo tried on the Wii U would actually make sense and be useful.

I don't know what NX is supposed to be.... portable console? handheld? hybrid/combo?
but if they are aiming to take the place of a centralized everyday use machine for the house, to replace something like the Roku, while also interacting w/ your cellphone, replacing your remotes, and to be your videogaming device - it has to function quickly, smoothly and intuitively.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on February 29, 2016, 04:05:30 AM
So this time it's 200 GameCubes strapped together, this makes total sense!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 29, 2016, 11:55:04 AM
I like this bluetooth everything idea.  I think an updated Wii Fit that could connect to my FitBit would be pretty sweet.  I like Wii Fit for the interface/weight tracking, but it's easier to wear a FitBit than keep the Wii Fit tracker in my pocket.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on February 29, 2016, 01:01:58 PM
Seems too well executed to be a Nintendo console.  It's a shame that we're at the point where the idea of a Nintendo console that isn't a complete fuckshow is not believable.  I fully expect that NX to be a complete disaster that doubles down on every bad idea Nintendo has had for the last 20 years, while introducing some new bad habits and getting rid of a few good ones.  I don't want to feel this way but I just don't trust this company at all and they have yet to demonstrate any real change that suggests that they're getting their **** together.  Hell, this is supposedly all stuff Iwata put into motion before he died so it isn't even like the new management would abruptly change the company's direction this soon.

This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on February 29, 2016, 04:09:44 PM
Ian has low expectations.

Water is wet.

Mind you, I don't have great confidence in the system either. But if it had full bluetooth integration I'd see that as a smart step forward from Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Louieturkey on February 29, 2016, 07:47:14 PM
I think if it is as powerful as PS4, then it'll compete directly with it through at least 2020.  I think both Sony and Microsoft want at least 7 years out of these consoles and probably would prefer even more.  Nintendo has usually been on a 5 year cycle for their consoles.  The Wii U and the Wii together will be 10 years (if the console version comes out this year). So it'll line up well if their next console comes out in 2021, a year after or right with the PS5/NeXtBox.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on February 29, 2016, 10:41:35 PM
Water is wet.

I've always been bothered by this expression. Can water really be "wet"? Isn't wetness defined by the presence of water in a solid?  I mean, you add water to a towel, you have a wet towel; you add water to water, you just have. . .more water.

This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.

To me, it depends on the cost of the gimmick.  There's the cost to the player in controller costs and battery life.  I certainly wouldn't want to pay materially more for haptic feedback, but it'd be neat to have.  I also don't like losing battery life.  What would get me though, is a feature that Nintendo bets the farm on that falls flat.  I don't think this is it, however.  Not that it wouldn't wow a crowd, but that it would cost Nintendo the metaphorical farm.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on February 29, 2016, 11:48:41 PM
I'm as skeptical as anyone when it comes to Nintendo taking a great idea and making it all it can be, and that's from the last few console cycles of experience of being burned by "innovation" for a very specific use and a singular idea that could have been so much more had they just let it be.
 
Yeah, most times they supposedly held back due to cost, which is a necessity since Nintendo has not been very good at branching out of just videogames to diversify their revenue stream and strengthen the brand.
But sometimes an idea wears thin quickly if you don't see it all the way through. (case in point - the wiimotes w/o motionplus built in from the start - the upgrade 4 years down the road should have been the motion tracking camera system and Nintendo could have completely dominated the motion game and maybe it wouldn't have mostly died out like it did. Had they eaten the cost up front, the success of the Wii would have more than paid off on that gamble, and since they were offered that 3D motion camera that MS bought, before MS bought it, they could have rejuvenated new interest to keep pushing sales over the top, but they didn't want to spend the money or look like they got an idea from somewhere that wasn't in-house developed)

Other times Nintendo just focuses on things that no one really gives a damn about and tries to push it like they are doing everyone else a favor. (like the gamecube's ultra portable smallness with mini dvd's designed for low power consumption.... who gives a ****. We want fun, good looking games. I don't travel w/ my GC, and I don't care that my GC saves me $50 a year in electricity if I gave it equal play to my PS or Xbox... but I do care that the latest game from my favorite 3rd party doesn't come on your system, because it would need 3-5 mini disc to fit. All of that might have been worth it had Nintendo taken the next logical step and released a portable GC, making use of small disc and low power consumption, but nope... never seeing a "good" idea through to it's full potential seems to be one of Nintendo's proudest qualities of recent times.)

So yes, I am very skeptical of any of that rumor, but I'm also an eternal optimist, even amongst all my pessimism. So I want to believe that Nintendo is capable, and I honestly hope they surprise me by following through on those beliefs, but I'm just no longer surprised when it all turns out to be a mere gimmick of an idea than the true revolution they were too short sighted to push for.

So with that being said, here's hoping Nintendo actually comes through on this one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 01, 2016, 08:33:47 AM
The dual pixels rumor was (unsurprisingly) debunked.

Nintendo has managed to keep its cards extremely close to the chest. NX is reportedly under the strictest of NDAs. Most fan discussions are centered around following bread crumbs. It seems like Nintendo is waiting until the new fiscal year to start talking about NX. Unveiling and launching a new platform in an eight month span is a rather tall order.

Who knows what Nintendo's strategy is? If I had to guess (based on these bread crumb discussions), it's going after Japanese third parties hard (and indies to a lesser extent). It makes sense for Nintendo. 3DS got most of its notable third party support from Japanese publishers, and if the partially shared library thing proves true, Nintendo should be doing everything it can to leverage that. It's nice to get the Final Fantasies and Monster Hunters, but I think it's also a good deal to lock up the Bayonettas and other smaller, niche games. That's how Nintendo can lock up exclusives. That way, NX isn't just the Mario machine. It's the place people can get content that may get lost on PS4. Maximizing an obvious advantage on 3DS is a good start. I don't know if that can translate to getting Western third parties to care, but it's leagues better than where Wii U currently stands on third party support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 01, 2016, 09:40:03 AM
Who knows what Nintendo's strategy is? If I had to guess (based on these bread crumb discussions), it's going after Japanese third parties hard (and indies to a lesser extent). It makes sense for Nintendo. 3DS got most of its notable third party support from Japanese publishers, and if the partially shared library thing proves true, Nintendo should be doing everything it can to leverage that. It's nice to get the Final Fantasies and Monster Hunters, but I think it's also a good deal to lock up the Bayonettas and other smaller, niche games. That's how Nintendo can lock up exclusives. That way, NX isn't just the Mario machine. It's the place people can get content that may get lost on PS4. Maximizing an obvious advantage on 3DS is a good start. I don't know if that can translate to getting Western third parties to care, but it's leagues better than where Wii U currently stands on third party support.


How much impact do indies have in Japan? Aside from the ones headed by former big name employees of major companies. I can see the indie push as a big strategy from NoA, but not NCL. To be honest, I still don't know what NoA can do to grab western devs aside from having an impressive spec list and more open lines of communication and support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on March 01, 2016, 09:50:42 AM
The dual pixels rumor was (unsurprisingly) debunked.

Nintendo has managed to keep its cards extremely close to the chest. NX is reportedly under the strictest of NDAs. Most fan discussions are centered around following bread crumbs. It seems like Nintendo is waiting until the new fiscal year to start talking about NX. Unveiling and launching a new platform in an eight month span is a rather tall order.

Who knows what Nintendo's strategy is? If I had to guess (based on these bread crumb discussions), it's going after Japanese third parties hard (and indies to a lesser extent). It makes sense for Nintendo. 3DS got most of its notable third party support from Japanese publishers, and if the partially shared library thing proves true, Nintendo should be doing everything it can to leverage that. It's nice to get the Final Fantasies and Monster Hunters, but I think it's also a good deal to lock up the Bayonettas and other smaller, niche games. That's how Nintendo can lock up exclusives. That way, NX isn't just the Mario machine. It's the place people can get content that may get lost on PS4. Maximizing an obvious advantage on 3DS is a good start. I don't know if that can translate to getting Western third parties to care, but it's leagues better than where Wii U currently stands on third party support.


All you described was their entire strategy with Game Cube, remember they vetted Capcom hard there too, and Sega, and Namco, and it didn't translate that well. Japanese companies are irrelevent in today's market pretty much out side of Final Fantasy, having just that and a few Japanese exclusives is going to win Japan, nothing else, if that is all they want then screw them.

They better get the big three westerns back on board AND vet the ones that used to love them, like Warner/Midway, and whatever is left of T*HQ's properties and Bethesday or even Rock Star, or whoever is making GTA now. No GTA no dice, that has been the big bane since N64. But Nintendo might have to actually beg on hands and knees to get GTA and that is as likely to happen as a Sega console rising from the ashes and taking the industry by storm.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 01, 2016, 10:58:28 AM
How much impact do indies have in Japan? Aside from the ones headed by former big name employees of major companies. I can see the indie push as a big strategy from NoA, but not NCL. To be honest, I still don't know what NoA can do to grab western devs aside from having an impressive spec list and more open lines of communication and support.
I was referring to Nintendo as a whole. Regardless of impact in Japan, Nintendo needs content.

And Nintendo hired Doug Bowser last May from EA. Maybe Nintendo hopes that connection can help rebuild that bridge.
All you described was their entire strategy with Game Cube
Did I? I don't any have fond memories of playing Final Fantasy X and the original Monster Hunter on GameCube. PS2 got the vast majority of Japan's top third party games, usually exclusively, on top of almost all the niche games also usually exclusively. Nintendo already has a foot in the door with Japanese third parties who have enjoyed success on 3DS. Japanese third party support may not be what it once was, but NX needs games. It needs more than Nintendo's first party titles. Getting as many of them on board is a good strategy and good start.
Quote
having just that and a few Japanese exclusives is going to win Japan, nothing else, if that is all they want then screw them.
Did anyone imply otherwise?
Maximizing an obvious advantage on 3DS is a good start. I don't know if that can translate to getting Western third parties to care, but it's leagues better than where Wii U currently stands on third party support.
Nintendo cares about Japan primarily because portable gaming is strongest there. I don't think Nintendo cares about "winning" so much as it cares about profits. You may disagree (even I have some quibbles with it), but that's a separate discussion. Protecting and cornering the Japanese market then using the support gained there to make its platforms more attractive in other markets is a good strategy for what Nintendo wants to do at the basest level. That shouldn't be Nintendo's only strategy, but no one is saying that. It's an upward battle for Nintendo; it should take any victory it can get.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 01, 2016, 11:22:37 AM
If Nintendo is making a home console (which I'm not entirely convinced is the case), they require the support of the ENTIRE Japanese gaming market, period. Console gaming is losing relevance in Japan and Japanese developers know that, which is why a powerhouse system with loads of content would be great for them and for Nintendo.

As for indies, the truth is, unless you adopt early or heavily emphasize exclusivity, your game is at risk on a console. Look at Jools Watsham's Mutant Mudds- it sold obscenely well during the early days of the 3DS and most of Renegade Kid's more recent releases have not shared the same success, simply because the market has become larger and more varied. Despite having a large amount of coverage in the eShop, lots of indies cite struggles to make profits on these systems. This results in products feeling a bit over-inflated in price or timed-exclusivity because they cannot afford to publish on one system. So while NoA has done well enticing a group of indies to their systems, I worry that it's not ultimately a viable option.

Nintendo just needs to make a system that can handle current gen western titles and also sell successfully, which is a tall order. However, it isn't enough to just make something easy to develop considering the poisonous reputation Nintendo has gained for cannibalizing sales. It's their great struggle as a hardware and software developer. Sure, one could argue that Sony and Microsoft also have first party titles, but not in the number or quality of Nintedo titles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 01, 2016, 12:31:04 PM
This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.

To me, it depends on the cost of the gimmick.  There's the cost to the player in controller costs and battery life.  I certainly wouldn't want to pay materially more for haptic feedback, but it'd be neat to have.  I also don't like losing battery life.  What would get me though, is a feature that Nintendo bets the farm on that falls flat.  I don't think this is it, however.  Not that it wouldn't wow a crowd, but that it would cost Nintendo the metaphorical farm.

You figure after the Wii U and 3DS Nintendo would know not to bet the farm on a gimmick that could fall flat.  That bit both systems in the ass.  With the 3DS they at least could offer the 3D-less model in the 2DS but the Wii U was just stuck with this expensive controller no one wanted.  There really wasn't a safety net.  Everything relied on gimmick X taking off and if it didn't Nintendo was fucked.  If I was Nintendo I wouldn't risk something like that happening again but this is Nintendo so they might look at how it worked for the Wii and think that the Wii U was the fluke and that THIS time it will work.  At the very least if they try something like that again they have to look more at the 3DS where they could axe the feature and still have a pretty worthwhile product.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 01, 2016, 01:25:04 PM
This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.

To me, it depends on the cost of the gimmick.  There's the cost to the player in controller costs and battery life.  I certainly wouldn't want to pay materially more for haptic feedback, but it'd be neat to have.  I also don't like losing battery life.  What would get me though, is a feature that Nintendo bets the farm on that falls flat.  I don't think this is it, however.  Not that it wouldn't wow a crowd, but that it would cost Nintendo the metaphorical farm.

You figure after the Wii U and 3DS Nintendo would know not to bet the farm on a gimmick that could fall flat.  That bit both systems in the ass.  With the 3DS they at least could offer the 3D-less model in the 2DS but the Wii U was just stuck with this expensive controller no one wanted.  There really wasn't a safety net.  Everything relied on gimmick X taking off and if it didn't Nintendo was fucked.  If I was Nintendo I wouldn't risk something like that happening again but this is Nintendo so they might look at how it worked for the Wii and think that the Wii U was the fluke and that THIS time it will work.  At the very least if they try something like that again they have to look more at the 3DS where they could axe the feature and still have a pretty worthwhile product.

I don't know if the 3DS really relied on the 3D.  Sure, it was the novelty that set it apart, but the 3DS was also a new and improved NDS.  It had the widescreen up top, a better eShop, the circle pad, and specs.  It could actually house better games than its predecessor. The Wii U kind of needed developers to be inspired by and make really great games surrounding the uPad, but no one really did.  That lack of support contributes to the Wii U's lack of sales, but I don't really see how the 3D cost the 3DS.  It may have driven up the price, but I still contest that the early price drop was caused by a lack of software initially.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on March 01, 2016, 03:57:04 PM
The dual pixels rumor was (unsurprisingly) debunked.


How was it debunked? I thought that the source was already deemed credible? Or was it the site themselves who made the source up?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 01, 2016, 04:24:15 PM
How was it debunked? I thought that the source was already deemed credible? Or was it the site themselves who made the source up?
It was debunked on neogaf. Someone discovered that the Dual Pixels rumor was copied word for word from a 4chan thread from December. Before that, other posters with greater technical knowledge were calling out hardware power part of the rumor (e.g. The closest in terms of “power” it gets to is the Xbox One, but an app idea is Wii U x50 and Playstation Vita x100) as nonsensical.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 01, 2016, 04:28:54 PM
This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.

To me, it depends on the cost of the gimmick.  There's the cost to the player in controller costs and battery life.  I certainly wouldn't want to pay materially more for haptic feedback, but it'd be neat to have.  I also don't like losing battery life.  What would get me though, is a feature that Nintendo bets the farm on that falls flat.  I don't think this is it, however.  Not that it wouldn't wow a crowd, but that it would cost Nintendo the metaphorical farm.

You figure after the Wii U and 3DS Nintendo would know not to bet the farm on a gimmick that could fall flat.  That bit both systems in the ass.  With the 3DS they at least could offer the 3D-less model in the 2DS but the Wii U was just stuck with this expensive controller no one wanted.  There really wasn't a safety net.  Everything relied on gimmick X taking off and if it didn't Nintendo was fucked.  If I was Nintendo I wouldn't risk something like that happening again but this is Nintendo so they might look at how it worked for the Wii and think that the Wii U was the fluke and that THIS time it will work.  At the very least if they try something like that again they have to look more at the 3DS where they could axe the feature and still have a pretty worthwhile product.

I don't know if the 3DS really relied on the 3D.  Sure, it was the novelty that set it apart, but the 3DS was also a new and improved NDS.  It had the widescreen up top, a better eShop, the circle pad, and specs.  It could actually house better games than its predecessor. The Wii U kind of needed developers to be inspired by and make really great games surrounding the uPad, but no one really did.  That lack of support contributes to the Wii U's lack of sales, but I don't really see how the 3D cost the 3DS.  It may have driven up the price, but I still contest that the early price drop was caused by a lack of software initially.

The 3DS was too expensive at first and Nintendo felt the need to give early adopters free games to make up for a quick price cut.  I think they thought that this glasses 3D thing was just so damn cool that everyone would trip over themselves to pay the high price and it didn't happen and they were really caught off guard by it not happening.  And while the 3DS is a new and improved DS isn't the Wii U also a new and improved Wii so it's a similar approach.  I don't know exactly how much the 3D feature cost but the existence of the 2DS suggests that Nintendo thought they had priced the thing out of the "buy it for your kids for Pokémon" price range and getting rid of the feature was necessary to make the cheaper model.

Now the 3DS also had a pretty weak initial lineup and then so did the Wii U.  Gimmicks are usually used to hide deficiencies and I think Nintendo had taken from the Wii/DS years the bad lesson that a cool gimmick will draw attention away from other problems.  Nintendo clearly did not have the resources to properly support both platforms without expanding since they've been alternating between each platform getting stronger support at the expense of the other one.  The idea was probably that 3D and the Gamepad were such cool features that consumers would be so impressed by them that they wouldn't notice other issues like a lack of games or high prices.  When the gimmicks flopped Nintendo had to work hard to make those platforms appear worthwhile to consumers.  You don't have to do that if you have a platform that can attract healthy support and you have the resources to develop games on a frequent schedule.  Something like that doesn't need a gimmick and even you had one, the product wouldn't be in trouble if the gimmick flopped.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 01, 2016, 05:33:55 PM
The Wii U is a drastically different piece of hardware in comparison with the Wii, the two do not go hand-in-hand.

The 3DS is a more powerful DSi. Touchscreen, Wifi, camera, SD card slot. The 3D was a selling point, for sure, but can only enhance the display, not detract from the experience.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 01, 2016, 06:12:58 PM
The Wii U is a drastically different piece of hardware in comparison with the Wii, the two do not go hand-in-hand.

The 3DS is a more powerful DSi. Touchscreen, Wifi, camera, SD card slot. The 3D was a selling point, for sure, but can only enhance the display, not detract from the experience.

What does the Wii do that the Wii U can't?  Seems to have all the same features as the Wii plus better specs and the Gamepad, same as how the 3DS can do everything the DS could and more.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 01, 2016, 07:48:03 PM
The 3DS's improvements are largely iterative. The only exception to that might be gyro, as the DSi had AR gaming.

The Wii U's gamepad is a completely different type of hardware with different utilization than the Wii Remote. Wii remotes working on Wii U =/= Gamepad working on Wii.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on March 01, 2016, 08:17:34 PM
Why would I buy this when I can just buy 100 PS Vitas?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on March 02, 2016, 12:08:57 AM

Why would I buy this when I can just buy 100 PS Vitas?

Do you have that much duct tape lying around? Stuff doesn't grow on trees where I am from, hence why Nintendo has hit a gold mine with this idea. Gen after this they should try taping some Gamecubes... oh wait.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 02, 2016, 03:19:27 PM
This rumoured idea seems like it could work and it seems like a much more legitimate effort to actually compete.  I'm skeptical of the cost and battery life for some of these ideas.  The haptic feedback where the analog stick forces back on you sounds neat but that would cost money and how worthwhile is such an idea?  I imagine we would all be wowed by it for the first few days and then grow sick of it and forget it's even there.  I really don't see the point in investing in minor gimmicks like that that really don't add much value but affect the cost.

To me, it depends on the cost of the gimmick.  There's the cost to the player in controller costs and battery life.  I certainly wouldn't want to pay materially more for haptic feedback, but it'd be neat to have.  I also don't like losing battery life.  What would get me though, is a feature that Nintendo bets the farm on that falls flat.  I don't think this is it, however.  Not that it wouldn't wow a crowd, but that it would cost Nintendo the metaphorical farm.

You figure after the Wii U and 3DS Nintendo would know not to bet the farm on a gimmick that could fall flat.  That bit both systems in the ass.  With the 3DS they at least could offer the 3D-less model in the 2DS but the Wii U was just stuck with this expensive controller no one wanted.  There really wasn't a safety net.  Everything relied on gimmick X taking off and if it didn't Nintendo was fucked.  If I was Nintendo I wouldn't risk something like that happening again but this is Nintendo so they might look at how it worked for the Wii and think that the Wii U was the fluke and that THIS time it will work.  At the very least if they try something like that again they have to look more at the 3DS where they could axe the feature and still have a pretty worthwhile product.

I don't know if the 3DS really relied on the 3D.  Sure, it was the novelty that set it apart, but the 3DS was also a new and improved NDS.  It had the widescreen up top, a better eShop, the circle pad, and specs.  It could actually house better games than its predecessor. The Wii U kind of needed developers to be inspired by and make really great games surrounding the uPad, but no one really did.  That lack of support contributes to the Wii U's lack of sales, but I don't really see how the 3D cost the 3DS.  It may have driven up the price, but I still contest that the early price drop was caused by a lack of software initially.

The 3DS was too expensive at first and Nintendo felt the need to give early adopters free games to make up for a quick price cut.  I think they thought that this glasses 3D thing was just so damn cool that everyone would trip over themselves to pay the high price and it didn't happen and they were really caught off guard by it not happening.  And while the 3DS is a new and improved DS isn't the Wii U also a new and improved Wii so it's a similar approach.  I don't know exactly how much the 3D feature cost but the existence of the 2DS suggests that Nintendo thought they had priced the thing out of the "buy it for your kids for Pokémon" price range and getting rid of the feature was necessary to make the cheaper model.

Now the 3DS also had a pretty weak initial lineup and then so did the Wii U.  Gimmicks are usually used to hide deficiencies and I think Nintendo had taken from the Wii/DS years the bad lesson that a cool gimmick will draw attention away from other problems.  Nintendo clearly did not have the resources to properly support both platforms without expanding since they've been alternating between each platform getting stronger support at the expense of the other one.  The idea was probably that 3D and the Gamepad were such cool features that consumers would be so impressed by them that they wouldn't notice other issues like a lack of games or high prices.  When the gimmicks flopped Nintendo had to work hard to make those platforms appear worthwhile to consumers.  You don't have to do that if you have a platform that can attract healthy support and you have the resources to develop games on a frequent schedule.  Something like that doesn't need a gimmick and even you had one, the product wouldn't be in trouble if the gimmick flopped.

I think the initial software drought hurt the 3DS more than the price did.  Sure, it was a little more expensive than it needed to be, but the lineup of games just made it not worth having with so little to play on it.  I wouldn't say the 3DS gimmick flopped, either.  It didn't take the market by storm, but it was a down market for the industry anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 03, 2016, 10:09:10 AM
Man, I hope this rumor is true:

http://www.destructoid.com/rumor-nintendo-funding-beyond-good-and-evil-sequel-346059.phtml?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Come to where we love you, Michel Ancel!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: michaelbaysuperfan616 on March 03, 2016, 10:27:39 AM
I would be less excited for another failed game from the Cube era making a return than I was with Wind Waker. Nintendo has some strange priorities reviving commercial failures just because some small group of fans can't let go. Nintendo doesn't have a good track record of investing in mature titles they should just stay out of it. They gave up Rare they need to move on. Rare was their best avenue for getting mature titles and they blew that.


BUT I will say this, someone will argue any exclusive is better than nothing but I disagree, the right exclusives matter the wrong exclusives paint a bad picture. Still the first game was good hence why I doubt Nintendo can make a sequel good.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 03, 2016, 02:10:13 PM
I just want a sequel to one of my favorite games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Louieturkey on March 03, 2016, 02:29:59 PM
I just want a sequel to one of my favorite games.
I'm with ShyGuy, BG&E was one of my favorite games.  I've been patiently waiting for a sequel that Ubisoft actually announced like 10 years ago. If Nintendo funding it gets it made faster, I'm all for that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 03, 2016, 02:43:59 PM
Was Bayonetta 2 a bad exclusive?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 03, 2016, 03:23:18 PM
Apparently the Beyond Good and Evil 2 rumor is from the same source as the Dual Pixels rumor so make of this what you will.

I think it would be a good idea for Nintendo to pick up Beyond Good and Evil 2. The point is to rebuild bridges and forge new partnerships. That's what made picking up Bayonetta 2 worthwhile besides getting a really solid game. This is the kind of goodwill that is worth investing in because it targets a passion project. It isn't just a paycheck for the developers; it's something they really believe in. You can't just look at Bayonetta 2's sales for the whole picture. For example, when these creators want to pitch a new project, there's a greater chance of looking Nintendo's way first. Or in Platinum Games' case, Nintendo invited them to revive Star Fox.

Again, Nintendo needs content. And collecting exclusives from proven talent is a good place to get it. Nintendo still needs the multi platform tent pole games like Madden and Call of Duty, but it also needs more than first party exclusives in order to have an attractive and well rounded platform.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 03, 2016, 03:26:12 PM
BG&E2 is a good game to get.  You will sell some systems with it as an exclusive, though not that many.  Getting a good game exclusive to your console is never a bad thing (unless you paid so much money for it that you can't possibly make it back) but I don't want Nintendo to feel that a token effort like that is enough.  Bayo 2 was a great pick up but that's like the whole extent of Nintendo attracting third party support on the Wii U.  They funded this one game and that's better than nothing but it means jack **** in comparison to all the third party games the Wii U didn't get and one game is way too few to have any real effect on sales.  If Nintendo wants to try to secure some exclusives they have to do that a lot and also have a platform that is inviting for third parties and so that Nintendo will just attract some general decent support without having to go specifically set it up.

Bayo 2 just sets a bad precedence of Nintendo getting a cool third party exclusive but doing literally nothing else.  I don't want to see that kind of token effort again so while BG&E 2 would be cool I'll get excited if we see Nintendo funding the development of MANY games like this.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 03, 2016, 03:26:30 PM
Nintendo picking up the tab for cult/niche franchises sounds like a better way to build trust with the likes of Ubisoft/EA/Activision than outright moneyhatting third party ports of multiplatform games.

They funded this one game and that's better than nothing but it means jack **** in comparison to all the third party games the Wii U didn't get and one game is way too few to have any real effect on sales.

They also rescued Devil's Third from oblivion (regardless of whether or not it was worth rescuing) and funded an exclusive Lego game and another exclusive Platinum game with a new IP. They also had an exclusivity agreement with Sega which yielded Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom(again, not talking about quality). It wasn't just one game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 03, 2016, 04:58:02 PM
Nintendo picking up the tab for cult/niche franchises sounds like a better way to build trust with the likes of Ubisoft/EA/Activision than outright moneyhatting third party ports of multiplatform games.

They funded this one game and that's better than nothing but it means jack **** in comparison to all the third party games the Wii U didn't get and one game is way too few to have any real effect on sales.

They also rescued Devil's Third from oblivion (regardless of whether or not it was worth rescuing) and funded an exclusive Lego game and another exclusive Platinum game with a new IP. They also had an exclusivity agreement with Sega which yielded Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom(again, not talking about quality). It wasn't just one game.

I don't really think of Wonderful 101 as a third party game.  Who owns the IP for that, Platinum or Nintendo?  If Nintendo does then it's a first party game.  Okay so let's include it and we get six games and three of them suck.  This is still not a good strategy.  Still seems like the mistaken idea that a few token titles makes up for real support.

Yeah if something like this butters up Ubisoft and ensures Nintendo gets all of Ubisoft's multiplatform games as well that's fantastic but if it's just Nintendo getting this one game then it's borderline useless in the grand scheme of things.  And Nintendo's track record since the Cube with such deals usually has resulted in only getting those token games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on March 03, 2016, 09:41:12 PM
They also rescued Devil's Third from oblivion (regardless of whether or not it was worth rescuing) and funded an exclusive Lego game and another exclusive Platinum game with a new IP. They also had an exclusivity agreement with Sega which yielded Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom(again, not talking about quality). It wasn't just one game.
There was also Fatal Frame V, though it still has the questionable quality...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 03, 2016, 11:09:03 PM
Damn, I still need to get Fatal Frame. I actually liked the demo.

So we're all in agreement, then? Bayonetta 2 was a bad exclusive?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 03, 2016, 11:15:28 PM
The problem is getting exclusive titles that are niche games or unknown titles or even new IPs are not the solution.  If you want to make an impact you need to get the known franchises and desired franchises on your system.  It doesn't even matter if you get timed exclusivity or none...you just need them. 

Bayonetta 2 was a good exclusive that if it came out when the Wii U launched would have helped.  Nintendo actually needs to radically change how they consider doing releases.  They are too slow to release their games and that can be a problem in the market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on March 04, 2016, 12:04:44 AM
Damn, I still need to get Fatal Frame. I actually liked the demo.

So we're all in agreement, then? Bayonetta 2 was a bad exclusive?

Ask your mum.

I don't think BG&E2 would garner the same heat that Bayo got - maybe half as much. Given this game's uh, checkered history I think anyone would be happy to play it. (Basically Nintendo would be pulling a Devil's Third except the game isn't a flaming s**tpile.)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: azeke on March 04, 2016, 12:14:07 AM
So, i've been reading some people who are disappointed about their supposedly favourite series getting sequel on NX.

All the while other long-awaited sequel was announced just last year as exclusive to two platforms that previous games were never on while BG&E actually was on Nintendo).

And the reception was -- thunderous standing ovation.

And their Kickstarter (the gall of these people -- claiming they are reviving the series -- and then immediately take people's own money to do it!) was the most successful kickstarter to date.

(http://awesomegifs.com/wp-content/uploads/i-feel-like-im-taking-crazy-pills.gif)

Do these people have zero self-awareness?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 04, 2016, 12:28:49 AM
What sequel are we talking about here? I gotta keep up with Kickstarter campaigns.

You know, I haven't played Bayonetta 2 (or the first, for that matter) yet, so I can't comment on the game. The 30 dollar pricepoint is really tempting though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 04, 2016, 06:04:02 AM
What sequel are we talking about here? I gotta keep up with Kickstarter campaigns.
I'm thinking Shenmue III.

My understanding of this revival is that Sega freely gave Yu Suzuki the rights to use the IP, but it was on Suzuki and Ys Net to secure funding for the game because Sega had no interest in developing the game itself (clearly, since it has been dormant since 2002). Sony is helping fund marketing while the Kickstarter was for actual development.

I'm not sure azeke's comparison is fair since the same people praising Shenmue III aren't necessarily the same people disappointed in the NX-exclusive Beyond Good and Evil 2 rumor. Additionally, Shenmue III will be released on the most popular console as well as PC, reaching a much larger audience than a yet-to-be-released successor to Nintendo's least popular home console. Admittedly, there is likely some anti-Nintendo bias because people don't want to buy an entire console for one game though that disregards other titles that would be available on it.
Quote
You know, I haven't played Bayonetta 2 (or the first, for that matter) yet, so I can't comment on the game. The 30 dollar pricepoint is really tempting though.
But you won't get the port of the original... Nooooooooooo...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Enner on March 04, 2016, 06:05:19 AM
What sequel are we talking about here? I gotta keep up with Kickstarter campaigns.

Shenmue 3.

Do these people have zero self-awareness?

They do not. Also, they don't have to when Sony is pretty much giving them what they want.
Even less than my expectations for the NX, I don't see Nintendo's PR and marketing getting better in the near future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 04, 2016, 02:12:22 PM
So we're all in agreement, then? Bayonetta 2 was a bad exclusive?

Nah, good exclusive.  :)  But just a drop in the bucket in regards to securing the kind of third party support that's expected of any decent console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Louieturkey on March 04, 2016, 08:02:34 PM
They also rescued Devil's Third from oblivion (regardless of whether or not it was worth rescuing) and funded an exclusive Lego game and another exclusive Platinum game with a new IP. They also had an exclusivity agreement with Sega which yielded Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom(again, not talking about quality). It wasn't just one game.
There was also Fatal Frame V, though it still has the questionable quality...
According to Ian that doesn't count because Nintendo co-owns the IP.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 04, 2016, 08:28:47 PM
I don't really think of Wonderful 101 as a third party game.  Who owns the IP for that, Platinum or Nintendo?  If Nintendo does then it's a first party game. 


Just for clarity: while Nintendo owns the IP, the original idea came from Platinum president Tatsuya Minami and the game was being developed by Platinum for the Wii before the partnership with Nintendo was announced.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on March 06, 2016, 11:16:58 AM
Can someone do me a HUGE favor and catch me up on everything NX up to this point?

A single post that tells and separates the facts of what we "know", from the rumors and speculations that we discuss.

If this is potentially coming out at the end of the year, I'd like to know what it is.

thanks.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 06, 2016, 12:35:04 PM
Here's all we know for sure.

- Iwata described the project, code-named “NX” as “a dedicated game platform with a brand-new concept.” More details were promised for 2016. Then Miyamoto talked about creating games that run on both handhelds and consoles.
- Squeenix is thinking about porting games to it.
- There was a market survey made by British firm GfK.
- Dev kits are out in the wild, but not everyone has one.
- Nintendo has registered patents that may or may not have anything to do with NX.
- There's a chance it will be region-free.
- It's not the next version of Wii or Wii U
- Something about potato chips.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on March 06, 2016, 04:51:37 PM
That's most of the non-speculation info.

The only other bit I can think of:

-Statements from/reporting on a certain chip maker and Foxconn indicate an SKU being released in late 2016.

Oh, and there is apparently a generational-curse level NDA in place that has successfully prevented any substantive leaks from occurring thus far.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on March 06, 2016, 07:57:32 PM
so other than knowing that its coming, some are working on it, and it might appear/launch this year. we don't  know anything about it.

I thought NX itself was the software platform, much Like AndroidOS/iOS that is used to develop cross platform on whatever Nintendo's next hardware formats may be?

is that inaccurate?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 06, 2016, 08:12:59 PM
That's a distinct possibility, heavily rumored, but we don't know enough to have a clear picture as to how accurate it is.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on March 06, 2016, 08:27:17 PM
Man... wish I still had a connect to someone in the industry that knew something. Not that i got anything out of the last person I knew other than a backstage pass to E3 that one time.

So in summary, what are the most credible rumors up to this point?
I honestly have barely read anything videogame related in a very long time, so I have no idea what's going on with the industry right now, other than Nintendo isn't doing too hot and is about to launch something new soon.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 06, 2016, 09:59:00 PM
Don't believe the hype.

Sony is in their last throes, Nintendo decided to double down on Wii U and 3DS.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 06, 2016, 11:18:46 PM
So in summary, what are the most credible rumors up to this point?
1. NX will release this year with a port of Zelda Wii U at or near launch.

2. Square Enix is porting both Final Fantasy VII Remake an Final Fantasy XV.

3. Nintendo is apparently meeting with EA this month regarding support for NX. EA wants some assurance from Nintendo that there's a market for sports title on NX. This includes advertising during sports games, getting apps for the major sports leagues, and hardware bundles including EA titles. That last bit sounds unreasonable except when you consider that Nintendo has packaged third party software in console bundles, and Microsoft and Sony regularly offer EA bundles.

4. Panasonic wasn't on the list of NX suppliers late last year suggesting that NX doesn't have an optical disc drive. I can't remember if this was leaked or rumored. This also doesn't mean there won't be an optical disc drive. The supplier list could be for the handheld only.

Macronix was on the supplier list. The company has provided Nintendo with ROM chips for DS and 3DS (not sure if it had dealings with Nintendo before DS). Macronix confirmed its involvement with NX in late January.

AMD has been hinting involvement with NX as far back as December 2014 though without mentioning Nintendo nor NX by name. It has been dropping vague hints here and there, most recently at an investor call in January. Yeah, this is news, not particularly interesting news considering everyone and their mother expected AMD to be involved again. Nintendo and AMD (or teams/companies absorbed by AMD) have been partners for over 20 years.

Moon Studios (developer of Ori and The Blind Forest) recently expressed frustration with Nintendo's secrecy. The dude was pretty salty. Justified? Maybe. The only thing confirmed there is that Moon Studios does not have development kits though it has talked to Nintendo about NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on March 07, 2016, 02:49:24 AM
 I don't know who Moon Studios is, or the games they made, but they are salty why?

Because they want to know more but aren't in the circle of devs Nintendo deems worthy of early attention? Or because they want to bring a game and can't talk about it? combination of both?

and the FFVII remake rumor for Big N is still alive huh?

also, do we know anything about the new Zelda for Wii U?
I think I remember hearing something about it being open world style play, w/ large areas like Xenoblade/WoW or something.   
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 07, 2016, 06:14:34 AM
Because they want to know more but aren't in the circle of devs Nintendo deems worthy of early attention? Or because they want to bring a game and can't talk about it? combination of both?
Not sure. Maybe closer to the former though. Thomas Mahler addressed frustration with getting development kits from all hardware manufacturers but focused primarily on Nintendo likely because Nintendo is so historically awful at getting development kits out in a timely manner. Based on some rudimentary googling, Moon Studios has one game to its name which was acquired by Microsoft. That said, if the developer wanted to support NX, it'd have to make a brand new game. Moon Studios is an independent studio so I can see why it would want development kits sooner rather than later to get a new game out as soon as possible. It doesn't have the cash reserves to be sitting idly waiting for development kits to be sent out.
Quote
and the FFVII remake rumor for Big N is still alive huh?
For now. The person who leaked this (SuperMetalDave64 on The YouTube, trevelyan9999 on Neogaf) wasn't as sure about the authenticity of this rumor thus flat-out labeled it a rumor, not a leak. He stated the source for this rumor in particular was right about other things without giving specifics. Make of that what you will. For what it's worth, SMD64 had a different source verified by Neogaf mods and his leaks were right on the money regarding the new Pokemon game that was just announced. The Pokemon/Nintendo release schedule source was good though he did an arguably poor job of protecting the source's identity (no name, mentioned the source worked for Nintendo's marketing department).

He also didn't cross verify it without another source. He seems pretty new to this. Everyone has to start somewhere. Emily Rogers admittedly slept with a source to get some info. I'd say SMD64 has a long way to go. Not that he necessarily has to sleep with a dude to score some juicy info. Rather, he has to build up his credibility in order to be taken more seriously. I mean, if he wants to sleep with a dude for leaks, that's on him. Literally.

Ultimately, the verdict is out on Final Fantasy VII Remake/XV, and we probably won't know until E3 at the earliest because Nintendo would undoubtably push these games as part of its presentation. The thing to take away from this is that SuperMetalDave64 already leaked good info and he trusted this other source enough to post the Final Fantasy rumor. I'm not especially excited about either game, but they would be big for Nintendo.
Quote
also, do we know anything about the new Zelda for Wii U?
I think I remember hearing something about it being open world style play, w/ large areas like Xenoblade/WoW or something.
Very little. The horse will automatically avoid obstacles like trees. Link can vault off the horse and enter a bullet-time-esque slow down to shoot arrows. Link can use the sail cloth to glide off high platforms. You can place markers on the map and a light will appear there, making it easier to find. That's about it. There has been talk of providing a female Link option to play as (not Linkle from Hyrule Warriors) though Aonuma may have just been musing about that.

Another rumor: Namco Bandai is porting Super Smash Bros (most likely the Wii U version) to NX. It also has other games in the works. Not surprising considering Nintendo has collaborated with Namco Bandai a lot on Wii U. I'm not entirely sure about the source of this rumor, but I really wouldn't be surprised if this ended up being true. Nintendo wants in on the competitive gaming scene and a new Super Smash Bros. wouldn't be ready for a few years. Porting the game that just had its last set of DLC last month makes a lot of sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 07, 2016, 10:39:52 AM
Dragon Quest X and XI were also pretty much confirmed during a Square Enix event but they had to backpedal and now say that they're thinking about it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 17, 2016, 10:13:09 PM
Magnetic Resistive DPAD and Buttons

Today is February 1st 2016 (I post from the future) I'm ready to make my NX prediction. The NX Go will have Magnetic Resistive DPAD and Buttons. I'm not even sure what that means.


(http://i.imgur.com/pAusBD4.jpg?1)


What say you family, Real or Fake? (From reddit, to Destructoid)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 17, 2016, 10:39:53 PM
Hmmm.

Do not like those touchscreen buttons. Joysticks look really, really weird.

It looks real to me. It also looks like it's a terrible idea that nobody wanted. The joystick appearance makes it seem semi-portable, but that shape... I don't get it. It looks less comfortable to me than the Gamepad, which could be saying something. But WHY touchscreen buttons? And what's the purpose of the weird sized screen? It looks like it will narrow the ability to see things... it looks worse than the gamepad screen.


I just don't get it. But then again, I won't be buying the console, so I guess I'm not their target audience.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Enner on March 17, 2016, 10:57:31 PM
If it's cheap enough to mass produce, I'll be inclined to believe it.

Without that knowledge, this looks too close to that patent filing to be anything but rumor mill baiting.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Dasmos on March 17, 2016, 11:01:05 PM
Wow, that thing looks ridiculous.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Stratos on March 17, 2016, 11:10:41 PM
I call it fake. I don't want touch screen buttons. This could have easily been photoshopped.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on March 17, 2016, 11:22:34 PM
Fake spectrum:

Pro wrestling
Soap operas
Figure skating
Boxing
That thing
2006 NBA Finals
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 17, 2016, 11:45:54 PM
What if it IS real, and the note is a hint?

"The Nintendo WOU"?!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 18, 2016, 12:02:26 AM
This is too much like the other leaked screen that I think was from a patient idea.  One of the things that is important to take from patients is the shape and design is never what they present.  They don't want others stealing their ideas and designs. 

This is super fake.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 18, 2016, 12:05:40 AM
Sorry for the double post.  Looking at the controller again, you can tell it is a fake, because the camera should be on the top of the controller, but look at the buttons.  If that is the case then the button labels are upside down.  Also if that is the case, then their are no buttons on the side of the controller that normally has the action buttons.  This isn't just a fake it is a poor one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 18, 2016, 03:44:33 AM
I can't make heads or tail of what I'm looking at here. Is it covered in tinfoil?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Wah on March 18, 2016, 03:47:04 AM
Looks stupid
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 18, 2016, 08:29:03 AM
According to the original story, the picture was ran through a program that test for inconsistencies often associated with Photoshop and other altering programs and while the lighting is suspect, they claim the photo is legit.




I think its real. I don't think it's the final product but I believe this is a true component of the NX. Plus, when have I ever been wrong about this kinda thing.? (hey, don't answer that. That time doesn't count either it was all Rick Powers fault!)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 18, 2016, 10:01:37 AM
I think the picture is real, but somebody made a fake piece of hardware and took a picture.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 18, 2016, 12:27:55 PM
It also looks like it's a terrible idea that nobody wanted

Unfortunately to me this is the best argument that Nintendo is doing this.  While I hope the NX can be Nintendo's comeback console they have shown pretty much zero sign of learning, well, anything from their mistakes over the last few years so I expect the NX to be even more out-of-touch and insane than the Wii U.  I don't really feel excitement for the NX, it's more cautious "please don't **** this up" hope.

Touchscreen buttons would be borderline useless for any game with any real reflex oriented gameplay as you need tactile feedback to play them.  Think of what sort of games work on touchscreens and which ones don't and the same thing applies for touchscreen buttons on controller.  Turn based games and visual novels and stuff like that will work fine.  Any platformer or FPS or fighting game or shmup will control like complete ****.  The problem is that these days Nintendo designs controllers as a marketing gimmick first, practical tool to control the game second.  I can totally see them completely fucking up the controller in a vain attempt to recapture the Wii audience they lost.

They go with this controller and the NX is finished before it comes out.  The casuals will never return and touchscreen buttons will **** up the controls so bad that dedicated gamers will stay away.  Such a controller would restrict a console to mobile level game quality.  No sane person will ever buy a dedicated videogame system for that sort of ****.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: MagicCow64 on March 18, 2016, 12:45:05 PM
Well, according the the "leaker" the touch screen would also have advanced haptics to help solve the tactile feedback problem.

But after scanning the last few pages of the NeoGaf thread on this leak, they've come up with the exact frame from a UE4 demo that appears to have been cropped for the NX controller image, in a way that wouldn't make sense if it was running live, so looking very likely to be fake.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 18, 2016, 01:37:40 PM
Sony might be getting ready to throw a big curveball soon.

http://kotaku.com/sources-sony-is-working-on-a-ps4-5-1765723053 (http://kotaku.com/sources-sony-is-working-on-a-ps4-5-1765723053)

IB4 NX is already obsolete...


EDIT: Patrick Klepek also just said Microsoft might be working on something similar. Nintendo could very well be swimming against the tide once again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 18, 2016, 02:03:43 PM
PS4.5?  Oh great we're moving into cellphone territory where our consoles get replaced after only a few years with minor updates?  Thanks a lot to every drooling idiot that rushed out and bought a DSi or New 3DS and setting the trend.  Of course we have no idea that this idea will even take off, particularly when consoles cost a lot more than handhelds.

Nintendo is pretty bad at guessing where things are going to go so they actually would benefit a lot from launching last and seeing what everyone else does but with the Wii U being such a poor seller they don't have that flexibility.  Interestingly enough the Wii U is the first time since the NES (which doesn't really count since there essentially was no console market when it launched) that Nintendo wasn't one of the last ones to launch.  The SNES, N64, Gamecube and Wii all came out after a least one major competitor had already released their console so Nintendo knew what they were up against.  The Wii U was really the first time they had to guess... and they really flubbed it bad.

With the PS4 I was thinking more that the VR would be the X factor.  If that takes off what does Nintendo have to combat it?  Have they taken into account the possibility that with all these VR products due to come out soon that that may shift the gaming industry significantly?  Is Nintendo at least factoring in the possibility that it might be something they need to at least have the "hooks" in place to implement on the NX?  The whole thing might bomb but if it doesn't then I'm going to assume VR will be an expected feature, like how Sony and MS felt compelled to have their own motion controls to combat the Wii.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 18, 2016, 03:22:13 PM
God, I hope this isn't the future for consoles. I don't want to have to buy the Wii U 7 for a chance to play the latest games...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Luigi Dude on March 18, 2016, 03:29:32 PM
With the PS4 I was thinking more that the VR would be the X factor.  If that takes off what does Nintendo have to combat it?  Have they taken into account the possibility that with all these VR products due to come out soon that that may shift the gaming industry significantly?  Is Nintendo at least factoring in the possibility that it might be something they need to at least have the "hooks" in place to implement on the NX?  The whole thing might bomb but if it doesn't then I'm going to assume VR will be an expected feature, like how Sony and MS felt compelled to have their own motion controls to combat the Wii.

The price of PSVR has already guaranteed that thing to be DOA.  VR still has a ways to go before it's ready for mass consumption because right now the price is just too damn high for anyone that isn't a hardcore tech head to take seriously.  The motion controls on the Wii took off because it only cost $250 to get a system, that came with said motion controller, and a killer app like Wii Sports all in one.  Right now, VR of any kind has no sort of value with system, controller and a killer app for that kind of mass market price.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 18, 2016, 03:55:50 PM
This PS4.k rumor makes me think that the NX is more of an OS than and actual console. With that "controller " also being the handheld.  Long as that controller is at least 6" wide I'm good!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: alegoicoe on March 18, 2016, 04:58:09 PM
This PS4.k rumor makes me think that the NX is more of an OS than and actual console. With that "controller " also being the handheld.  Long as that controller is at least 6" wide I'm good!


I rather have the NX be a service rather than a console. Consoles are basically becoming PCs anyways, why would i want a console thant i have to upgrade in orde to get the full experience, for that i have my pc with an nvidia 980ti.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 18, 2016, 05:38:30 PM
This PS4.k rumor makes me think that the NX is more of an OS than and actual console. With that "controller " also being the handheld.  Long as that controller is at least 6" wide I'm good!


I rather have the NX be a service rather than a console. Consoles are basically becoming PCs anyways, why would i want a console thant i have to upgrade in orde to get the full experience, for that i have my pc with an nvidia 980ti.

For home use phones and tablets are replacing PCs so the average consumer's not going to have a device to use the service on... unless it also supports tablets and phones but then they have to severely compromise the specs to meet such a lowest common denominator.  A console today is basically a pre-built gaming PC at a mass market price point.  That's what the average consumer is going to be interested in.  If the NX was a service Nintendo would still need some sort of base hardware SKU for those that don't want to figure out the hardware requirement themselves.

For obvious reasons I feel the console industry wants us to buy new consoles with less significant hardware updates more frequently.  I don't like it, I won't support it, but my lone "vote" will mean jack ****.  In a world where F2P scams and microtransactions are a sustainable business model I can see this approach being successful enough to become the new standard.  The industry has clearly shifted over the last ten years to one that seeks to exploit their customers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 18, 2016, 05:45:23 PM
Ehhh, I think the industry will find quite a bit of resistance if they attempt to make us buy 400 consoles every 3 years. Then again, that's what some mad PC users do, sooooo...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 18, 2016, 06:01:55 PM

For home use phones and tablets are replacing PCs so the average consumer's not going to have a device to use the service on... unless it also supports tablets and phones but then they have to severely compromise the specs to meet such a lowest common denominator.  A console today is basically a pre-built gaming PC at a mass market price point.  That's what the average consumer is going to be interested in.  If the NX was a service Nintendo would still need some sort of base hardware SKU for those that don't want to figure out the hardware requirement themselves.

For obvious reasons I feel the console industry wants us to buy new consoles with less significant hardware updates more frequently.  I don't like it, I won't support it, but my lone "vote" will mean jack ****.  In a world where F2P scams and microtransactions are a sustainable business model I can see this approach being successful enough to become the new standard.  The industry has clearly shifted over the last ten years to one that seeks to exploit their customers.




When I say NX is an OS, I'm talking both hardware and software. What I've always said is there will be:


A base handheld (that picture is the prototype)
A base console
A Rebranded Wii U Powered by NX
A Steam-like app that is has  both iOS and Android base standards.




___________________________________________________________




That device, if legit gives the best of both worlds. Physical Buttons, click wheel buttons and force feedback touch. That would allow for scalable cross-development.


edit: example of how it might work from NeoGaf.


(http://i.imgur.com/2AlzoTS.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: alegoicoe on March 18, 2016, 06:28:54 PM
This PS4.k rumor makes me think that the NX is more of an OS than and actual console. With that "controller " also being the handheld.  Long as that controller is at least 6" wide I'm good!


I rather have the NX be a service rather than a console. Consoles are basically becoming PCs anyways, why would i want a console thant i have to upgrade in orde to get the full experience, for that i have my pc with an nvidia 980ti.

For home use phones and tablets are replacing PCs so the average consumer's not going to have a device to use the service on... unless it also supports tablets and phones but then they have to severely compromise the specs to meet such a lowest common denominator.  A console today is basically a pre-built gaming PC at a mass market price point.  That's what the average consumer is going to be interested in.  If the NX was a service Nintendo would still need some sort of base hardware SKU for those that don't want to figure out the hardware requirement themselves.

For obvious reasons I feel the console industry wants us to buy new consoles with less significant hardware updates more frequently.  I don't like it, I won't support it, but my lone "vote" will mean jack ****.  In a world where F2P scams and microtransactions are a sustainable business model I can see this approach being successful enough to become the new standard.  The industry has clearly shifted over the last ten years to one that seeks to exploit their customers.


exaclty my point, consoles are becoming obsolete ot glorified steamboxes
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 18, 2016, 06:29:37 PM
All right, now controller buttons and my damn hands are in the way of the screen!  What I've always wanted!

Seriously in that mock up your missile count is right under where your hand would be.  What is the damn selling point in having the screen in all sorts of nooks and crannies you actually can't see?  How is having joysticks interfering with the display a good thing?  Why would anybody WANT this?  A more logical mockup would be to have the game in the center of the controller and the only screen usage in the sides is for the controls.

Though why are touchscreen buttons an idea that has gained any ground?  Phones have that to make up for inadequate controller options.  Controllers these days have two analog sticks, a d-pad, 4 face buttons, 4 triggers and at least two "admin" buttons.  Do you need more than that?  Because if a game doesn't need more than that then you don't have to have a display that changes the buttons.  I suppose buttons could disappear but are you so inept at games that extra buttons that do nothing confuse you?  Do you need the button to clearly identify what it does like an overlay?  Who needs this other than the most helpless casual gamers?  The whole idea seems like something that sounds cool in theory before you give it five minutes of thought and realize the "need" for it is pretty much non-existent.  In that Metroid mock up the touchscreen buttons literally recreate what every standard controller has so what is the point?!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Caterkiller on March 18, 2016, 07:02:11 PM
The NX platform already sounded like it was going to adopt the way of the upgrades like phones. Nintendo isn't being left behind on that front I'm sure. With all that talk from Iwata about having to always restart from zero and such the message was clear to me. Not really worried and honestly I welcome this future. Give us 10 years of the same device, maybe upgrade it a bit every 3 years like a PC or something, but it still plays all the games only if you've got all the new gadgets the newer games run best.

Anyway about that controller, Rosti on Neogaf has more or less said that thing is legit. Now he doesn't know if it's a final product or just some dev kit prototype. I know people are picking it apart and if we got something like that it would take a lot of convincing for me. Hopefully the final product has handles and physical buttons to go along with all the touch buttons.

I will say that the mock up posted above does look kind of cool and modern. Especially when compared to the U Pad, that really gave off clunky Game Gear vibes. But I just can't imagine getting that oval shape and that be it.

Then when it comes to actually blocking part of the screen I feel like games will be designed with that in mind. You get a lot of extra view around your fingers but it's something that would otherwise never be there without such a screen. I suppose I imagine playing a game any normal old way, be it on the 3DS or Wii U, slap that on the middle of this controller and then expand that same image around your fingers to see what would have originally been unseeable. I guess like when you take an old movie and it's remastered to include Wide Screen?

I'm cautiously optimistic but if this thing releases without physical buttons or an equivalent that feels just as good and is just as responsive, I have a feeling a ton of people will reject the idea more so than the Wii U Gamepad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 18, 2016, 07:28:33 PM
The NX platform already sounded like it was going to adopt the way of the upgrades like phones. Nintendo isn't being left behind on that front I'm sure. With all that talk from Iwata about having to always restart from zero and such the message was clear to me. Not really worried and honestly I welcome this future. Give us 10 years of the same device, maybe upgrade it a bit every 3 years like a PC or something, but it still plays all the games only if you've got all the new gadgets the newer games run best.

To me that's not a 10 year device, it's a 3 year device so we're worse off then we were with 5 year cycles.  To me the whole selling point of a console is you buy it once and everything works the same on it for the entire lifecycle of it.  I've always found little add-ons like the Sega CD or N64 expansion pack annoying since they go against this concept.  Considering how long the PS3 and Xbox 360 lasted before getting replaced I would argue that now is the silliest time in videogame history thus far to adapt such a model.  The obvious benefits from improved hardware is plateauing.  The jump from PS3 to PS4 was way less noticeable than that from PS1 to PS2 or NES to SNES.  The last generation lasted longer because there was less need for new hardware than in prior generations.  So why do we need any sort of upgrade after only three years?  In the 90's if you had a hardware gap of only three years you would notice it.  These days you wouldn't.  We're now at the point where we can stretch a generation longer.  It is some real snake oil nonsense for a console maker to convince you that you need shorter gaps between hardware purchases.

One thing I can see the model working is for handhelds since portable tech is always behind console tech.  If they want to adopt this approach for a handheld model where every so many years it gets a little closer to matching the standard console hardware, I can live with that.  Then one can get the one-time-purchase console like always and let the handheld gamers deal with the ticky tacky updates which they're already willing to deal with with phones and stuff like the DSi and New 3DS.  People are used to buying handheld tech on a regular basis but not so much with consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Caterkiller on March 18, 2016, 09:04:05 PM
I actually think this potential upgrade future will be a little more elegant than what the DSi and n3DS were doing. I know you don't like the add ons like the N64 expansion pack but I am all for it. I would much rather have our base systems longer than replacing them every 5 years or so with little increases in power throughout the years.

I'm one of those who was pushed into a cell phone kicking and screaming and don't get me started on upgrading. Every 2 years to upgrade an entirely new phone really burns me up. I have no idea how or why people do it annually. So I can get where you are coming from but I figure if we aren't completely replacing an entire device like Nintendo's handhelds it's not such a big deal.

I'm talking mostly out of ignorance and to an extreme but isn't this PC gaming life in a nut shell? If my understanding is correct many games still run on older hardware, they just run better on the high end stuff.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: sudoshuff on March 18, 2016, 09:05:27 PM
edit: example of how it might work from NeoGaf.


(http://i.imgur.com/2AlzoTS.jpg)


I quite like the way this looks!  I'm completely on board with the idea if it has physical buttons.  It's basically a gamepad 2.0, expect much more ergonomic and manageable.  Plus, if the persistent rumors are true, I would love to throw that thing in my bag and continue to play NX games on the go with it.


I do seem to be in the minority of optimists on this thread, though...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: sudoshuff on March 18, 2016, 09:14:36 PM
I'm one of those who was pushed into a cell phone kicking and screaming and don't get me started on upgrading. Every 2 years to upgrade an entirely new phone really burns me up. I have no idea how or why people do it annually.


1.They break them.
2. They see their friends with the fancy new version (I mean who wouldn't love it if their photos were actually little videos and were unlocked with a fingerprint scan ;)
3. They get suckered in to it with clever hidden subsidies, monthly payments making the new version "free" (I'm lookin' at you AT&T NEXT plan!).


None of the three reasons above seem like they would apply to the NX for the following reasons: 
1. Nintendo products are designed to be practically unbreakable and handled by small children. 
2. Nintendo has a chance of going viral again with a popular new device, but it won't feel like a fundamental part of your person like a cell phone does.
3. Nintendo would just charge you for the full price of the device up front.


I think NX will be designed to be upgradeable, but I can't see them matching the cell phone makers by coming out with a new version every year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on March 20, 2016, 03:50:26 PM
It looks fake to me, and the only thing which makes it seem plausible is how stupid it is.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 20, 2016, 08:08:19 PM
It looks fake to me, and the only thing which makes it seem plausible is how stupid it is.

Ha.  This is the quote of the day. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: supermario2k on March 21, 2016, 11:45:36 AM
I am not sure Nintendo would be smart to release a controller that would absolutely not work with VR and not be gearing up for VR when that is where the industry appears to be heading. Sure this new round is going to be expensive and appeal mainly to enthusiasts but at least it is affordable this time compared to the 90's. Also it will help launch the next round which will be when it really kicks off. I see parallels to when CD technology was starting. The 90's VR, i.e. Virtual Boy, arcade machines, PC headsets, is similar to the Sega CD and all those other add-ons, the tech was there but not quite ready for market. I see this round as PS1 and Saturn, the tech is there and the industry and market are finally ready.


If Sony dominates with VR and Nintendo sits on the sidelines pushing touch screens then it will be worse than N64 ditching CD's for the C-stick. Ever since playing Super Mario 64 for the first time VR is what I always wanted to come next and with Wii motion controls I thought yes Nintendo is finally pushing for real VR and then they backtracked on motion controls and now think touch is the future I hope they get this figured out soon. That controller would be sweat for a handheld but not a console if there is any hope for it to support VR.

Bring on the NX news already Nintendo what are you all waiting for it's close to the end of March already.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 21, 2016, 12:23:01 PM
Nintendo just needs to make it so that the NX is adaptable enough that if VR catches on they can implement it later on.  There was no SNES CD but they were working on the idea with Sony and later Phillips but didn't do it.  But the SNES itself has a port where some hypothetical CD attachment could have attached.  They didn't design the thing so restrictive that a CD add-on could not have been done without replacing the whole console.  VR is not certainly going to catch on this gen but it is being attempted so Nintendo needs to not handcuff the NX so that it is completely incapable of handling VR.  A good design for a console is to be able to have some adaptability to the market.

One thing about this controller mock up is that it is a very similar idea to the Wii U Gamepad.  That concept flopped.  What sense is there in repeating it?  I figure the best chance the NX has is for it to remind people of the Wii U as little as possible.  Doubling down on the screen controller concept that was soundly rejected and the obvious cost issues that will come with it is pretty damn stupid.  So what trade off on important stuff will the NX have to accommodate the return of the unpopular screen controller idea?  Or will the price just be stupidly high for a console that will have to fight tooth and nail for anyone to even give it the time of day?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 21, 2016, 02:46:47 PM
The console flopped, but the controller idea could still be viable, if the games can be there.  Multiple gamepads would be one of the main ways you get the idea going.  Moving on from Wiimotes is another.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 21, 2016, 04:34:01 PM
The console flopped, but the controller idea could still be viable, if the games can be there.  Multiple gamepads would be one of the main ways you get the idea going.  Moving on from Wiimotes is another.

Multiple Gamepads sounds expensive.  Plus this screen-in-the-controller idea was also promoted as this big ace in the hole for the Gamecube and no fucks were given then either.

I think it is very telling that after a generation of motion controls and guitar controllers, the PS4 won this generation almost instantly by simply being a conventional videogame console.  Sony didn't ask anyone to compromise hardware or pay extra for controller gimmicks, while Nintendo and Microsoft did, and the PS4 cleaned their clocks.  I can't think of a more clear rejection of such concepts as that.

The time for bullshit is over.  No gimmicks, no distractions, no tradeoffs, no "please understand"s.  Nintendo needs to make a great console with great games that meets the expectations of video game customers in 2016 and the years to come.

Plus Nintendo failed to deliver on all their promises of innovation and such for both the Wiimote and Gamepad.  Both ideas end up being pretty half-baked and generally restricted to glorified tech demos, regardless of how many Wii's were sold.  So you don't think that consumers aren't going to remember that?  That after a generation of the Gamepad failing to meet it's potential that they're going to think that THIS time it will be different and the truly brilliant and innovative games are going to come?  No, they're going to quite reasonably assume a repeat of prior generations.  If Nintendo had such awesome ideas for a screen in a controller they would have done them on the Wii U.  Why would they sit on great ideas while the Wii U struggled?  Why would they launch the console with a glorified tech demo and a 2D platformer if they had something better in mind?  And if they just needed time to develop that great idea it would have shown up by now.

Something that was just a great console with no bullshit would be quite out-of-character for Nintendo.  That would suggest Nintendo has changed and that is what will get people interested in them again.  The same old Nintendo is the Wii U and no one bought it.  They're not going to buy anything that suggests a repeat of recent Nintendo generations and doubling down on the screen controller idea would be doing exactly that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 22, 2016, 08:00:25 AM
Multiple Gamepads sounds expensive.  Plus this screen-in-the-controller idea was also promoted as this big ace in the hole for the Gamecube and no fucks were given then either.
A Dual Shock 4 is $59.99 MSRP. Expensive controllers has been the cross gamers bore if they've wanted to play multiplayer.

And GameCube-Gameboy Advance connectivity is not comparable to the GamePad beyond "there's a screen." The latter provides far more freedom from a gameplay and development standpoint. It's really weird that you keep bringing this up. It's especially convenient that you ignore all the reasons why the connectivity didn't catch on because you can't simply reduce it to people giving no fucks about a screen on a controller.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 22, 2016, 08:13:20 AM
Of all the reasons the Wii U failed, I think the use of the GamePad is pretty far down the list. Releasing hardware more in line with the standards of the industry, with better support for developers, that wouldn't be obsolete just a year later would have gone a long way toward success, whereas I doubt dropping the GamePad would have helped much.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 22, 2016, 10:28:41 AM
Sony didn't make the Move a major part of the PS4, but it's part of their VR thing, right?  I'd say Sony is still doing the gimmicks, but they're just doing it halfway, as always.  And that VR is expensive.

I think the GC/GBA thing didn't work because not as many people had GBAs as Nintendo thought, and, IIRC, the cables were kinda hard to find (though you got on free with a game).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: supermario2k on March 22, 2016, 10:39:27 AM
I can't comment on why GBA-GC failed because I ate it up, I loved it I had a GBA and cable and thought it was awesome so what do I know. I also really love the Wii U but I get why someone who keeps bringing up the SNES doesn't.

I guess that probably doesn't make my excitement for VR amount to much either except I do see a lot of hype around it, and it's not looking like just a gimmick this time it looks like the industry has figured out how to do it right and make it affordable, sure $399 is a lot for an add on but it's not like it will be at that price forever. I read an article that Move was created with VR in mind and that Sony has been taking incremental steps for decades to get where they are because that was what the industry needed. Wii was pretty close to VR minus the headset and it sold pretty well.

I would love to play Zelda, Metroid, Mario, Kirby, DK, all in VR and I hope Nintendo prepares for that. This round of VR is like the current round of 3D, everyone was ready for it but just waiting for the technology to catch up and we are finally there. It is going to be pricey at first but not so expensive people won't buy it. This round of VR will set up the next round which will be more affordable with all the bugs worked out. This is PS1 for VR, next gen will be PS2 for VR that is when it will really take off.

I also don't think Sony won this gen just by having a traditional controller their Dual Shock 4 is the most unconventional controller they have ever bundled with a console sure it feels similar enough to traditional but it's done some new things too.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 22, 2016, 12:23:54 PM
Putting a screen in a controller costs money, right?  That money has to come from somewhere.  In the case of the Gamecube the cost was covered by the customer.  You had to own a GBA, which was a fully featured handheld videogame system and therefore was a fair chunk of change, and you had to buy the cable to connect the two.  With the Wii U, Nintendo tried to keep the costs to the customer lower but they had to compromise the hardware to do it.  Why else do you think Sony and MS lapped them in a year?  And why with their clearly inferior hardware that shouldn't cost nearly as much to produce as the XB1 and PS4 do Nintendo never cut the price of the Wii U despite it floundering at the price point it STILL is at with the NX at our door step?  They couldn't because the controller was too expensive.  It's not a matter of getting rid of the controller after the fact.  The problem with the Gamepad is that it shouldn't have been there in the first place and all the compromises that had to be made to adopt it made the overall product undesirable to consumers.

And that's my point about the concept as a whole.  Some sort of compromise has to be made for an idea like this.  Consumers will not pay extra for it and they will not accept expected features being cut or hardware being compromised.  If Nintendo had been able to demonstrate the feature as something truly worthwhile then maybe consumers would be willing to deal with some sort of tradeoff, but they didn't.

So if the NX has this touchscreen controller then either the price is going to be higher or the hardware will be compromised and why would anyone put up with that when history suggests the feature will barely be used?  How is that worth what the consumer has to give up for it?  So unless Nintendo eats the cost of this thing themselves or immediately sells us on this concept they've failed to sell us on after years of opportunities to do so, the concept is poison.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 22, 2016, 12:30:49 PM
You're still leaving out the fact that the system was, and very much still is, hurting for games.  While the Wii U has a number of very solid releases, the schedule very sparse over the past few years.  Most of that was Nintendo's fault for not getting over the HD learning curve because of the Wii, and not the gamepad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 22, 2016, 01:28:46 PM
I don't get the appeal of VR gaming for classic franchises. I don't want to play a third person adventure game on a VR screen, that makes no sense to me.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 22, 2016, 01:37:56 PM
VR seems similar to motion control to me in that for a small subset of games it could be really cool, but in most cases it's either not an improvement at all or is atively worse.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 22, 2016, 02:31:43 PM
You're still leaving out the fact that the system was, and very much still is, hurting for games.  While the Wii U has a number of very solid releases, the schedule very sparse over the past few years.  Most of that was Nintendo's fault for not getting over the HD learning curve because of the Wii, and not the gamepad.

Releasing a last gen console a mere one year before the actual next generation destroyed third party support and that more than anything made the console hurting for games.  If Nintendo's approach is to compromise hardware again for some wacky controller then they're not making a real effort to improve third party support so they're not making a real effort to fix the Wii U's biggest problem.

And Nintendo is facing irrelevance here.  What chances do they have to ever have a viable console again if this one flops as well?  And the handheld market is drying up so they won't have that as safety net anymore.  So this is NOT the time to get cute or push their luck by doubling down on failed ideas or asking consumers to compromise this or that.  This is "put up or shut up" time.  Hell I fear their brand might be so damaged that even a perfect effort might fail.  But to even entertain the idea of going with gimmicky bullshit yet again or anything even resembling the Wii U is nuts.  Nintendo can play ball or they can leave the videogame industry for something else WHEN the NX fails because of their utter refusal to learn any lessons from their past failures.  A failure like the Wii U is a wake up call that you're on the wrong path, not a suggestion that you're just a few tweaks away from the same concept working out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 22, 2016, 02:48:51 PM
I wouldn't say the hardware being underpowered was the number one killer of support.  Nintendo has a reputation of being hard to deal with for 3rd parties.  That's something they need to fix.  They also upset EA at some point, so their ability to build and maintain relationships isn't up to snuff.  When 3rd parties are trying to put games on the system but can't because they have to communicate on a time lag and through a language barrier, then you don't have a hardware issue.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 22, 2016, 03:57:09 PM
The hardware being significantly different from the standard third party developers were used to and Nintendo's less-than-stellar relationships with those developers were much bigger factors than the relative power of the system. If the NX is an x86, basically just standard PC components kind of box like Sony and Microsoft are doing and Nintendo works with publishers more closely and effectively than they have in the past, they'll be fine.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 23, 2016, 01:15:43 PM
I know this sounds like a total overreaction, but I will not buy NX if that ends up being the controller. A life without buttons to press is not worth living.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on March 23, 2016, 01:25:02 PM
New pictures of the NX controller:



(https://i.imgur.com/pkfWmFK.jpg)


(https://i.imgur.com/GB8lTkz.jpg)



Quote
- Only the upper 'nubs' of the sticks move. The bottom part is static (kind of like the circle pad, but it moves along the bottom 'sphere'.
- The rollers on the top feel and look pretty much identical to a mouse scroll-wheel. Though I do don't believe this will be the final design.
- Haptic feedback is feels like Apples 'taptic' engine. Not like regular rumble.
- 3.5mm headphone jack on the bottom


https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/4bn6nm/nx_controller_pictures/













Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 23, 2016, 01:33:19 PM
It's true...all of it!




Magnetic buttons people!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 23, 2016, 01:37:19 PM
What sort of sensation would "magnetic buttons" create? I'm kind of confused by this concept.

The design is kinda attractive without the handles. Is this the "mobile" iteration, with the handles being used for the home console? Or the handles might just be a shell to fit on the thing.

I'm still skeptical about the whole thing though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 23, 2016, 01:38:19 PM
CONFIDENTIAL PROPERTY
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 23, 2016, 01:43:01 PM
Macbook has Sweedish (I think) button layout. Quick, who's a big, European developer? 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 23, 2016, 01:45:10 PM
What sort of sensation would "magnetic buttons" create? I'm kind of confused by this concept.

The design is kinda attractive without the handles. Is this the "mobile" iteration, with the handles being used for the home console? Or the handles might just be a shell to fit on the thing.

I'm still skeptical about the whole thing though.


Magnetic buttons is a term I coined to mean the buttons/dpad are wherever you want them to be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 23, 2016, 01:56:29 PM
On Neogaf a guy called Guevara matched up the tree reflected on the screen in picture 1 with a tree outside Massive Entertainment's headquarters, which is fucking insane, but coupled with the Swedish on the laptop I'm pretty certain it's them. They haven't made any games for Nintendo systems in the past, are owned by Ubisoft and just recently released Tom Clancy's The Division.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 23, 2016, 02:04:24 PM
Oh. That's silly.

I want my buttons to be press-able.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on March 23, 2016, 02:05:58 PM
On Neogaf a guy called Guevara matched up the tree reflected on the screen in picture 1 with a tree outside Massive Entertainment's headquarters, which is fucking insane, but coupled with the Swedish on the laptop I'm pretty certain it's them. They haven't made any games for Nintendo systems in the past, are owned by Ubisoft and just recently released Tom Clancy's The Division.

Look at the photo on Massive's wikipedia page. Major lulz.

I am on Team Buttons. I cannot see myself playing anything with that as the controller. Nintendo's silence has reached the point of harming public opinion on the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 23, 2016, 02:29:08 PM
There are too many pictures of this "thing" now for it not to be something real.  But is if the NX controller or some completely unrelated device being passed off as such?  Or is it even something involved with Nintendo?  Or has someone is just so committed to a hoax that they created a mockup and have taken multiple photos of it instead of going the photoshop route?

I sure hope this isn't it.  I won't buy it.  Games need good controls and I don't for a second believe that this will be anything but a frustrating pain in the ass to use.  I didn't have a lot of hope for the future of the Wii U but at least good games were possible with it.  A bad controller can potentially ruin every game on a system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 23, 2016, 02:42:54 PM
I just want to press buttons, guys.

I get that Nintendo has faith in the touchscreen, especially after DS. But touchscreen + buttons is the best way to play. Wii had motion controls and buttons. Wii U had touchscreen and buttons... why you so dumb, Nintendo?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 23, 2016, 03:32:32 PM
Another flaw with touchscreen buttons is what is the selling point?  Touchscreen buttons are popular with phones and tablets.  Core gamers stick with dedicated videogame systems partially because they feel they need buttons to have decent controls.  If Nintendo takes that away then why would we buy their product?  It is missing one of the key selling points of a dedicated videogame system.  If I'm okay with touchscreen controls my phone is right in my pocket.  What do I need an NX for?  Now a naïve corporate suit would think "Touchscreen buttons are popular!  Let's use them on our videogame system." but making a videogame system more similar to a phone is going to make it less of an essential purchase.  It needs to do the opposite and prove that it has a reason to exist by being different from a phone.

And let's be really optimistic and assume Nintendo somehow revolutionizes how touchscreen buttons work and that videogames can be done right with them.  So why doesn't Apple just copy that for the next iPhone/iPad and put Nintendo out of business?  These are devices people are already going to buy.  If you lower games to their level then people will just stick with phones and tablets.  If you make better gaming possible within the limitations of those platforms then people will just stick to them.  "You need buttons" is an important "fact" for Nintendo to promote because it demonstrates that phones and tablets aren't good enough.  You need to buy a real videogame system, preferably from Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 23, 2016, 03:46:13 PM
Nintendo might be aiming for a sleeker, more portable and savvy look. A screen with no holes in it for buttons to protrude might fit that image. Also, relying less on buttons means that the iphone/ipad target audience might respond a it better to the device, so there's that.

For games, especially action-centric titles like- oh, I don't know, platformers, character action games, and many others- tactile feedback is much more rewarding and responsive. Unless these touch buttons come with some sort of haptic feedback that is centralized around a specific area(since "rumble" on the entire device for one button press would be stupid), it is a clear step back, and not one I'm remotely interested in toying around with.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 23, 2016, 03:50:44 PM
I sure hope this isn't it.  I won't buy it.
Just like you didn't buy Wii U after spending years complaining about it? Understand that no one believes you.

Anyway, I'm holding out hope that thing isn't the controller or at least the only controller. I can't see it being even remotely useable for Super Smash Bros. in particular due to the precision required for fighting games. I guess I wouldn't mind it being an optional accessory for... things. I'm also on #TeamButtons. Without more information, it just seems weirdly shaped for the hell of it while also lacking all the benefits of the GamePad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 23, 2016, 04:14:15 PM
This thing will be awesome. just enough control to standout from the iOS/Android crowd without abandoning the hardcore us. Nintendo hasn't had a single control scheme in over 15 years. They are not about to change that now. I'd wait a few weeks (maybe days) before the next Direct  and make a judgement after a bit more information.


Edit:


Expect this to to connect directly to the TV with via a HDMI dongle (chromcast like)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 23, 2016, 04:37:50 PM
relying less on buttons means that the iphone/ipad target audience might respond a it better to the device, so there's that.

See my point is that that strategy doesn't make sense.  Why would the iPhone/iPad audience give a ****?  "See now we're just like your phone... except without the ability to text and phone and run apps... uh...."  That audience already has a phone.  They will not NOT have a phone unless Nintendo themselves offer one.  So you buy a Nintendo device that plays games with crappy touchscreen controls when you already have a phone and/or tablet that can play games with crappy touchscreen controls?  Why would anyone do that?

If Nintendo still thinks the old Wii/DS blue ocean crowd is just around the corner ready to come back they're fools.  With so many options for casual games in mainstream electronic devices that everyone already owns the only audience that will buy dedicated videogame systems are hardcore gamers, who will soundly reject trading buttons for a touchscreen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 23, 2016, 04:53:25 PM
I am also #TeamButtons. They're what separate true gamers from the filthy mobile casuals.

Also, scroll wheel shoulder buttons? I thought we all realized that the GC had the right idea for shoulder buttons?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on March 23, 2016, 06:51:39 PM
I think it would be funny if Splatoon did a Splatfest, Buttons vs Touchscreen. The former would probably win popularity... or would it?

Anyways yeah, as someone who doesn't like the GamePad, this thing somehow manages to look even worse. Way worse. I'm already super skeptical of Nintendo's next system(s) due to how many disappointing products they've released in the past five years, and so anything that looks like Wii U all over again would mean the first Nintendo system I don't buy (at least not for years, who knows what I'd buy at heavy discounts).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 23, 2016, 07:11:34 PM
See my point is that that strategy doesn't make sense.  Why would the iPhone/iPad audience give a ****?  "See now we're just like your phone... except without the ability to text and phone and run apps... uh...."  That audience already has a phone.  They will not NOT have a phone unless Nintendo themselves offer one.  So you buy a Nintendo device that plays games with crappy touchscreen controls when you already have a phone and/or tablet that can play games with crappy touchscreen controls?  Why would anyone do that?

If Nintendo still thinks the old Wii/DS blue ocean crowd is just around the corner ready to come back they're fools.  With so many options for casual games in mainstream electronic devices that everyone already owns the only audience that will buy dedicated videogame systems are hardcore gamers, who will soundly reject trading buttons for a touchscreen.
Because Nintendo desperately believes that the blue ocean DOES exist. That was the key reason they were successful in the days of the Wii, that's likely the only way they'll gain a new audience, seeing as the older one is shrinking.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Spak-Spang on March 23, 2016, 07:52:36 PM
Magnetic buttons could work, but that is strange...do we have remove and configure the button layout with each new game?  If they were going to do this controller design I wish they would have put the analog sticks like Sony did off to the bottom. 

That could still just be a prototype design and the final controller could have more buttons.  ( I think shoulder buttons and trigger buttons could work.  )

But I am not feeling confident.  Maybe it at a force touch feature like the new Iphones?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 23, 2016, 09:48:47 PM
Is there any proof in these pics that this is a Nintendo device?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Wah on March 23, 2016, 10:09:52 PM
I'm a bit sceptical too, Magnetic buttons that you could move to wherever you want, now THAT would be cool.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 23, 2016, 10:17:45 PM
Is there any proof in these pics that this is a Nintendo device?
No. I suppose they were taken next to a Wii U GamePad to be cheeky. I'm not ready to believe this, and if it's fake, it's better than most due at least partially to not being taken on a flip phone from over 10 years ago. I read claims that this might be 3D printed. That sure would be a lot of trouble to go through.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 23, 2016, 10:32:51 PM
I wonder if this is some weird Chinese electronic device that controls a bluetooth stereo or something. Maybe it is real though, who knows?

Reggie Knows
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: pokepal148 on March 23, 2016, 11:04:20 PM
Anyone wanna guess what that random switch on the front there is supposed to be?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 23, 2016, 11:12:32 PM
I think that's a camera. I wonder what that taped over part is.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 24, 2016, 12:03:27 AM
It's the A button, obviously.

#TeamButtons wins!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 24, 2016, 06:56:16 AM
According to Liam Robertson per a friend at Nintendo of Europe (who is apparently "a public figure"), the controller images are fake. And since so few people actually have access to NX prototype hardware or even know what it is, any leaks should be taken with "a pinch of salt." Make of that what you will. A few things:

1. Robertson is known to have good sources.
2. He has been slipped bad or slightly off info in the past (e.g. Shovel Knight Amiibo was not for Super Smash Bros.)
3. This was not cross-verified, just something he posted on The Twitter.
4. He isn't digging for NX info. Nintendo is so secretive that most people won't even tell him what they think of NX for fear of getting traced back.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on March 24, 2016, 07:16:19 AM
Also, cats. (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/feature/42335/rumor-cats-nx-controller-edition)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on March 24, 2016, 07:49:01 AM
And since so few people actually have access to NX prototype hardware or even know what it is, any leaks should be taken with "a pinch of salt."

If this is true, it makes me a lot more worried than the controller images did. It's way too late in the game for Nintendo to be that secretive with developers. I get wanting to avoid leaks, but unless it's not launching until late 2017 (which would bring its own problems), they need dev kits and detailed info to be in the hands of as many developers as possible.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 24, 2016, 08:53:47 AM
Nintendo absolutely should be more forthcoming with information if it hopes to launch this year. At the same time, that doesn't guarantee support. With Wii U, Nintendo got a bunch of third parties to go on record and talk about how excited they were about the platform. What it got was empty praise and late ports then nothing. This is largely Nintendo's fault for once again sending out development kits late and releasing a half-baked console.

I imagine the people Robertson spoke to are mostly in the West where Nintendo is in a weird position. The vast majority of those big publishers care less about the handheld market where Nintendo is strongest. It's an uphill battle. That doesn't mean Nintendo should do nothing. However, separate reports had Nintendo targeting Japanese publishers. They have apparently had development kits for quite some time now. I think it's conceivable that Nintendo is working closely with them to get content out at or around NX launch. It may end up being a situation in which Nintendo gets less but better support. Ideally, Nintendo could lock down a variety of good third party support, but as we've seen in the last 20 years, it hasn't been able to do that. If those select Japanese third party titles perform well, Nintendo can use that to appeal to Western third parties because right now, it has very little to bring to the table.

Of course, Western publishers could still argue that only Japanese titles sell on Nintendo platforms then the problem is that they just don't want to support Nintendo, and there's really no solution for that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Ian Sane on March 24, 2016, 12:27:22 PM
The only time I ever wanted to arrange the placement of buttons was when Nintendo arranged them in an unconventional way on the Cube.  So solution to a problem Nintendo created themselves?  Actually that's like the easiest way to make a Nintendo rumour believable.

And since so few people actually have access to NX prototype hardware or even know what it is, any leaks should be taken with "a pinch of salt."

If this is true, it makes me a lot more worried than the controller images did. It's way too late in the game for Nintendo to be that secretive with developers. I get wanting to avoid leaks, but unless it's not launching until late 2017 (which would bring its own problems), they need dev kits and detailed info to be in the hands of as many developers as possible.

Skeptic: I'm not buying it because of that controller.
Damage Control: Don't worry it's a fake.  Very few companies have dev kits to leak in the first place.
Skeptic: So I should not buy it because the third party support at launch will be crap and that will result in weak initial sales which will turn off the third parties that are on board and discourage the rest from signing up?
Damage Control: ...

The NX seems to have made a lateral move from "fucked" to "shittered".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 24, 2016, 02:18:00 PM
I'm confused. Who is damage control in that dialog? Liam Robertson doesn't work for Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 24, 2016, 03:02:05 PM
Obviously, he's a corrupt games journalist who's being secretly paid by Nintendo to dispel rumours under the guise of an outside source. D'uh.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 24, 2016, 07:47:52 PM
https://youtu.be/EpkA2MPgmAg

Well there it is, perhaps the greatest fake leak of our time. They even sent Ian into full rampage mode!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 24, 2016, 07:52:32 PM
I was about to post this. I'm glad that's over.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Mop it up on March 24, 2016, 08:20:47 PM
Am I the only one who breathed a sigh of relief?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Adrock on March 24, 2016, 08:28:20 PM
Definitely not. #TeamButtons
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 24, 2016, 09:20:24 PM
I'm calling shenanigans. Not because I liked it or predicted this would be real but that black version is a real, tangible device. Not saying its the controller but its real. So guy 1 makes fake that then guy 2 then makes a real 3d version based on a render posted on the internet? Possible of course but my spider sense is tingling on this.


Either way this has been one hell of a Troller-Coaster.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: pokepal148 on March 24, 2016, 09:34:57 PM
Right, let's just turn up the light, and:

(http://abload.de/img/fake6fuv3.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Enner on March 24, 2016, 10:42:30 PM
So guy 1 makes fake that then guy 2 then makes a real 3d version based on a render posted on the internet? Possible of course but my spider sense is tingling on this.

https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/4avdcg/codename_nx/d1chdzl

Quote
lol sorry ...
no I did not black controller, he resumed my model (Bravú) and made it a better fake ^
With the leaps in computer power and the dedication of a devoted prankster, it is not out of the question that the second set is also a CG fake. If not CG, then some model with 3D-printed assets is thing readily possible today.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 24, 2016, 11:13:44 PM
#TeamButtons stands resolute... for now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 25, 2016, 07:06:33 AM
Here's how it was done.
https://youtu.be/z_B65J86D_8
The first picture was a Photoshop and then a second person came along, perfectly replicated it and made a 3d print of it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 25, 2016, 10:15:44 AM
MAGNIFICENT! Behold, The King of Trolls. His kingdom is everything the net touches. All is his whim.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 25, 2016, 10:31:48 AM
3D printers are going to make me doubt every hardware leak now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: nickmitch on March 25, 2016, 01:20:29 PM
Am I the only one who breathed a sigh of relief?

Definitely not. #TeamButtons

Same. #TeamButtons
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Louieturkey on March 28, 2016, 08:47:59 PM
Will #TeamButtons be on all NWR tweets going forward?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Evan_B on March 29, 2016, 01:24:11 AM
I certainly tried, and failed, to rouse a trend of #TeamButtons in my Twitter circle.

I think it's an important statement in the scope of gaming no matter what.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: Shaymin on March 29, 2016, 07:17:19 AM
Will #TeamButtons be on all NWR tweets going forward?

Although I'm #TeamButtons, we have to remain editorially neutral.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on March 29, 2016, 09:59:19 AM
Will #TeamButtons be on all NWR tweets going forward?

Although I'm #TeamButtons, we have to remain editorially neutral.

This is the fair and balanced cover that I read talkback threads for.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on March 29, 2016, 12:55:18 PM
Well April first is just a few short days away, any chance there will be some real news then? Does Nintendo seriously think they can hold off until E3?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on March 29, 2016, 01:14:54 PM
99% chance of fake news. 0.1% chance of real news.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on March 29, 2016, 01:19:12 PM
Nintendo will outline its performance over the fiscal year during its earnings release on April 27, 2016. I'd expect some information around then (though probably not much during the actual meeting) as announcing a new product will soften the blow of Nintendo's subpar financial performance. A full reveal probably won't happen until E3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION)
Post by: RPGoblin on March 29, 2016, 04:35:16 PM
Am I the only one who breathed a sigh of relief?


Yep, I'm relieved that is was fake for sure. I mean, it didn't look very functional, AND it was hideous IMHO. The new rumors out now about it being a rectangular shape have me interested. I loved the original design of the NES, but if they take that and integrate it with today's technology I'd be moved. Heck, I'd even love the old school gray, black and red to come back.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on March 29, 2016, 07:19:09 PM
While we may have had some legit announcements on April 1st before, Nintendo are definitely smart enough to not announce anything on the 1st.

I think Adrock's got it right, if we hear anything it'll be late April, but probably still only some vague details until E3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on March 29, 2016, 08:17:08 PM
We had a DIRECT on April 1 last year. (April 2 in Japan). Though I don't think Nintendo's up for repeating that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on March 29, 2016, 09:07:02 PM
Unless they end up spilling the beans on something in their earnings call.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on March 30, 2016, 06:21:02 AM
Someone is going to ask during that earnings call, and Nintendo may be more forthcoming due to the new fiscal year, downplaying all non-Amiibo performance and focusing on potentially viable revenue streams. However, I doubt we'll hear anything major regarding NX. Maybe some mildly less cryptic hints. A review of the fiscal year just isn't the forum for these types of bombshell announcements. If anything, the most interesting bits would be regarding theme parks, movies, and even mobile instead of NX.

I think there's a possibility of a pre-E3 Nintendo Direct in May to go over the remaining games on 3DS and Wii U (e.g. Paper Mario: Color Splash), all of which will be at E3 but ultimately overshadowed by NX and Zelda, inevitably also on NX. I doubt we see games until E3. Any NX details between now and E3 will likely be mentioned in interviews, and it'll be things we expect yet will discuss and speculate to death about like partnerships with AMD and Broadcom. Manage your expectations. Outside of leaks, we're not seeing actual hardware and software until E3.

Assuming Nintendo absolutely launches NX this year, it hasn't had this quick of a turnaround between unveiling and launching hardware before. We live in a different time now. The spread of information is a lot easier, and judging by how much attention those fake leaks got, the hype is real. Apple has announced and launched a new product in less time. Granted, Nintendo isn't Apple, but point being, it can be done.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: RPGoblin on March 30, 2016, 11:12:54 AM
Someone is going to ask during that earnings call, and Nintendo may be more forthcoming due to the new fiscal year, downplaying all non-Amiibo performance and focusing on potentially viable revenue streams. However, I doubt we'll hear anything major regarding NX. Maybe some mildly less cryptic hints. A review of the fiscal year just isn't the forum for these types of bombshell announcements. If anything, the most interesting bits would be regarding theme parks, movies, and even mobile instead of NX.

I think there's a possibility of a pre-E3 Nintendo Direct in May to go over the remaining games on 3DS and Wii U (e.g. Paper Mario: Color Splash), all of which will be at E3 but ultimately overshadowed by NX and Zelda, inevitably also on NX. I doubt we see games until E3. Any NX details between now and E3 will likely be mentioned in interviews, and it'll be things we expect yet will discuss and speculate to death about like partnerships with AMD and Broadcom. Manage your expectations. Outside of leaks, we're not seeing actual hardware and software until E3.

Assuming Nintendo absolutely launches NX this year, it hasn't had this quick of a turnaround between unveiling and launching hardware before. We live in a different time now. The spread of information is a lot easier, and judging by how much attention those fake leaks got, the hype is real. Apple has announced and launched a new product in less time. Granted, Nintendo isn't Apple, but point being, it can be done.


I'd have to agree with this, and if I was guessing I would really speculate the first week or two of April to focus on Miitomo, as it comes out tomorrow here in the US. I'm pretty excited for it. Also, we (as Nintendo fans) have a ton of great content to keep us busy until E3. I'm probably most stoked about Miitomo, Bravely Default 2, and of course Star Fox Zero.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on March 30, 2016, 12:29:00 PM
Someone is going to ask during that earnings call, and Nintendo may be more forthcoming due to the new fiscal year, downplaying all non-Amiibo performance and focusing on potentially viable revenue streams. However, I doubt we'll hear anything major regarding NX. Maybe some mildly less cryptic hints. A review of the fiscal year just isn't the forum for these types of bombshell announcements. If anything, the most interesting bits would be regarding theme parks, movies, and even mobile instead of NX.

I think there's a possibility of a pre-E3 Nintendo Direct in May to go over the remaining games on 3DS and Wii U (e.g. Paper Mario: Color Splash), all of which will be at E3 but ultimately overshadowed by NX and Zelda, inevitably also on NX. I doubt we see games until E3. Any NX details between now and E3 will likely be mentioned in interviews, and it'll be things we expect yet will discuss and speculate to death about like partnerships with AMD and Broadcom. Manage your expectations. Outside of leaks, we're not seeing actual hardware and software until E3.

Assuming Nintendo absolutely launches NX this year, it hasn't had this quick of a turnaround between unveiling and launching hardware before. We live in a different time now. The spread of information is a lot easier, and judging by how much attention those fake leaks got, the hype is real. Apple has announced and launched a new product in less time. Granted, Nintendo isn't Apple, but point being, it can be done.


I'd have to agree with this, and if I was guessing I would really speculate the first week or two of April to focus on Miitomo, as it comes out tomorrow here in the US. I'm pretty excited for it. Also, we (as Nintendo fans) have a ton of great content to keep us busy until E3. I'm probably most stoked about Miitomo, Bravely Default 2, and of course Star Fox Zero.


We are not all Nintendo fans, some , or (maybe many?)of us are video game fans, who happen to enjoy Nintendo games. Some of us own a console and not a handheld so I don't think people who are itching to hear about the next console are even slightly interested in what the handheld scene is doing. They are not now, nor have they ever been the same scene, despite some overlap.

I am pretty sure NX won't be fully revealed until E3, nobody should be expecting that, but I don't see why they can't talk about something NX related before then. I think they should mention something, even if it is vague, this week.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 30, 2016, 04:57:05 PM
http://gameranx.com/updates/id/46630/article/rumor-nx-more-powerful-than-ps4xbox-one-easy-to-develop-for/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 30, 2016, 05:43:08 PM
Very generalised wishy washy information, I'm going to say fake.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on March 30, 2016, 09:15:50 PM
Your hat is fake!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on March 30, 2016, 09:52:25 PM
Don't we always hear things like this? I think it's much better to wait and listen to the rumblings of power after the reveal of the hardware instead of before. Then, developers can actually confirm the existence of... you know, something.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on March 31, 2016, 09:20:48 AM
(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/avatar_5630_1457074335_zpsw8ch3cfi.jpg)
Says the toad with the fake moustache, I'm on to you monsieur Shy Guy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on March 31, 2016, 01:28:01 PM
At this point though if it isn't more powerful than PS4 it either has to be a handheld or it is totally going to suck.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on March 31, 2016, 02:55:22 PM
Should Nintendo NX be worried about Playstation4K? I assume the NX has to be more powerful than an 3year old console. What if ps4k is more powerful than NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on March 31, 2016, 05:26:22 PM
Should Nintendo NX be worried about Playstation4K? I assume the NX has to be more powerful than an 3year old console. What if ps4k is more powerful than NX?
No.

First, if NX is a console and handheld with an expected five year or so cycle, the hardware is only going to hurt Nintendo if it aims so low it can't handle modern engines. NX-Console doesn't even need to be more powerful than regular PS4. It should be in the ballpark. Nintendo can aim lower or it can aim higher. Over two years after PS4 launched, it shouldn't be that hard for NX to be more powerful. It depends on what Nintendo values.

The following is my pretty rudimentary understanding of hardware jargon. On x86-64, this isn't difficult. If Nintendo goes with Puma cores, it can match or exceed PS4's CPU with fewer cores and fewer threads per core by just being the successor of the Jaguar cores in PS4 and launching three years later. On ARM, it's apparently possible to outperform PS4's CPU with 64-Bit ARM Cortex-A72 cores, but that's like top of the line stuff. While that lines up with the rumors of Nintendo going with "industry leading chip," I'll believe it when I see it because that doesn't jive with Nintendo's approach with hardware. At the same time, that puts Nintendo in exactly the spot it probably wants to be. The console is comparable to PS4's power while being on the same architecture as the handheld. It won't be considered severely underpowered while benefiting from a shared library without worrying about compiling between different instruction sets and other nonsense I barely understand.

Second, at best, PS4K is Sony's New 3DS. Some games will be enhanced, but most games will be built for and play just fine on the regular PS4. The reactions I've been reading from PS4 owners tend to lean toward "As long I can still play all the games, this is fine." The outliers are people who are ready and willing to upgrade and people vehemently against this. Sony should hope this is the worst of it because the company risks splitting the user base which is exactly the kind of **** up competitors would need to steal back some market share. That's generally how this works. First place has to mess up.

However, Iwata previously hinted at this with his "like brothers in a family of systems" comment from a couple years ago. The difference is that Nintendo seems to have planned upgraded models for years while Sony likely didn't plan iterations. Either way, it's an uphill battle because upgraded hardware models goes against every impulse of purchasing a home console. People buy consoles to not deal with this for several years. DSi and New 3DS are fine, but they didn't light the world on fire. They sold to a very specific subset of consumers because not everyone has money to throw at upgrades. Smartphones are so ingrained in modern culture that a lot of people upgrade those every couple years. That's just not true for an inessential hobby like video games. My hope is that Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo are smart enough to understand this.

Ultimately, I think Nintendo just needs to focus on making the best and most complete hardware it can before worrying about whether PS4K poses a threat. Release a good product, have a solid launch lineup, and market the thing. Get through at least the first year with some semblance that it has been a hardware manufacturer for over 30 years. It doesn't really matter what Sony and Microsoft do if Nintendo can't get the basics right.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on March 31, 2016, 06:59:54 PM
It can't be sub-PS4. Sony is allegedly going to release an upgraded PS4 this year or next year (which is crazy, btw)...Nintendo can't pull another Wii.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on March 31, 2016, 08:39:24 PM
Isn't MS also rumored to be doing an Xbox One and a Half?  Still, I'm assuming the upgraded system(s) would be mostly for the output and making some games slightly faster.

But, I don't think the NX could afford to be sub-PS4.  The Wii U had a bad rep for being too weak, not making it at least "up to par" could be crippling out of the gate. Hell, even "on par" could be considered "too little, too late".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on March 31, 2016, 10:25:41 PM
Sub-PS4 is weirdly non-specific. Are we talking Xbox One or Two Wii U consoles duct taped together? Ideally, the home console would be half a generation ahead of PS4 which is around where PS4K is rumored to be. Can Nintendo reasonably sell that for $300? Doubt it, but that's as high as it can afford to be launching in 2016. Really, it should be powerful enough to receive ports it usually won't get anyway. Xbox One is Nintendo's low bar then. The console with a Pro Controller at $300 is as high as that bar raises. Nintendo can get some decent specs launching at that price in 2016. However, it can't and shouldn't compete with PS4K. That thing is rumored to be $400 to $500. Couple that with PlayStation VR, possibly the main reason PS4K is even apparently a thing. That's an extremely niche audience, one that shouldn't concern Nintendo right now because that audience doesn't officially exist yet and it will always be smaller than the regular PS4 user base anyway.

Nintendo's goal for the first year of NX should rebuilding its brand, and convincing regular PS4 (and regular Xbox One owners) that NX is worth their money too. Figure that out then maybe consider how to take back market share from Sony. And after that, Nintendo can start caring about PS4K. People are getting way too ahead of themselves. Nintendo is no where near where it has to be to worry about Sony and Microsoft launching upgraded iterations of their existing machines.

NX isn't beating PS4, and PS4K is a non-factor in this. Should NX include more advanced hardware, only Nintendo's first party titles and its exclusive reclamation projects from third parties would ever utilize that power. If Nintendo manages to score some ports, they'll look no better than the PS4 version. No company is going the extra mile to make the Nintendo version the best version.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on March 31, 2016, 10:45:21 PM
How many Vitas duct-taped together is the handheld? (At least two, hopefully.)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 01, 2016, 01:02:00 AM
Here's what a console NX should have for power: what would someone who isn't Nintendo go with?  No one but Nintendo would cut corners on the power unless it was like some Hyperscan level junk product.  The Wii and Wii U were weird.  No one in console history has intentionally gone with outdated hardware that was essentially a generation behind the rest of the industry.  It just isn't how things are done.  Even Nintendo's first console was a noticeable step up from the Ataris and Intellivisions it came after.  For example the Gamecube was more powerful than the PS2.  Of course it was.  It came out a year later.  That extra year gave them the ability to make it a little bit better and still sell it around the same price point.

So in a normal world the NX would surely be more powerful than the PS4 because it is coming out a full three years later.  Would it match the PS4K (which is a stupid idea by the way; how is that not the hot topic in the General Gaming section?)  Well if they come out around the same time I wouldn't expect Nintendo to know exactly what they have to match.  Going back with the Cube as an example it was not as powerful as the Xbox but that made sense.  The two came out at the same time and by the time MS revealed their product Nintendo already had committed to their design.  Hell that was out-of-nowhere stuff anyway.  MS was a newcomer to the market and Nintendo could not have assumed they would have to compete with them when they were designing the Cube.  They topped the Dreamcast and PS2 hardware, as expected, and still ended up comparable to the unexpected newcomer.  If they're releasing what should be expected for a PS4 competitor launching three years later it should end up close enough to the PS4K to not matter.

But if the NX is slightly underpowered compared to the PS4?  Bullshit.  What excuse is there when that tech is three years old?  Maybe you can crunch some numbers to show that financially Nintendo has to do that but that isn't what the general public will see.  It will look like Nintendo getting cute and cheaping out again.  Remember that for this to succeed it needs to win over the very people that were NOT interested in the Wii U because that's who buys consoles.

I believe there are a lot of potential gamers that would very much like to play Nintendo's games but don't want to buy some goofy unconventional console with no third party support to do so.  Nintendo games review well with the same sites that are gaga for every cliche Call of Duty sequel so those same people like Nintendo games.  Nintendo makes amazing games, but no games are worth the nonsense they ask their customers to go through with their consoles.  No cut corners, no trade offs - just offer something that follows industry conventions and let the games, which are better than Sony's and Microsoft's first party titles, sell themselves.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 01, 2016, 06:29:17 AM
Here's what a console NX should have for power: what would someone who isn't Nintendo go with?
Nah, that's too vague. Should Nintendo overshoot like Sony and Microsoft did last generation or comparatively undershoot like Sony and Microsoft did this generation? NX is launching mid-generation. That's the biggest clue to where it should be concerning hardware. Xbox One is currently $300, and Microsoft can and probably will drop the price (even temporarily again) by the end of the year. What's the best available hardware Nintendo can release at $300 with a traditional controller and no pack-in game? That doesn't even take into account whether Nintendo goes x86-64 or ARM, whether it takes a loss or makes a profit, how much of either etc.
Quote
But if the NX is slightly underpowered compared to the PS4?  Bullshit.  What excuse is there when that tech is three years old?  Maybe you can crunch some numbers to show that financially Nintendo has to do that but that isn't what the general public will see.  It will look like Nintendo getting cute and cheaping out again.  Remember that for this to succeed it needs to win over the very people that were NOT interested in the Wii U because that's who buys consoles.
First, x86-84 vs. ARM. Second, it depends on what the price is?

You're giving the general public way too much credit. Xbox One is "slightly underpowered compared to PS4," and if the general public was showed the games side by side, I doubt most could tell the difference. PS4 is probably getting held back because third parties still want to release on Xbox One.
Quote
I believe there are a lot of potential gamers that would very much like to play Nintendo's games but don't want to buy some goofy unconventional console with no third party support to do so.
The potential consumers you're referring to don't want to pay a premium for a second console, unconventional or not. And at least in the West, they certainly don't want to buy a handheld too which is another reason why a shared library helps Nintendo. And $300 is even pushing it, and I proposed that largely on the idea that Nintendo also manages to not screw up some basic thing like "make sure to tell people NX is a new console."

Third party support is tricky at this point. People already own a PS4, Xbox One, and/or PC for most third party titles. Getting Call of Duty and Madden is mostly for the Nintendo-only crowd. Nintendo isn't beating Sony and Microsoft at their own game. While it's nice to get those tent-pole games that are on everything else (which Nintendo should still strive for hence ballpark hardware), people aren't going to abandon their friends and an ecosystem they're comfortable with for anything Nintendo offers. Still, that's the reason I also advocate Nintendo picking as many dead projects that passionate groups of fans are clamoring for. One Bayonetta 2 isn't going to do much. However, a Bayonetta 3, a Beyond Good and Evil 2, and a steady stream of smaller exclusives starts getting people's attention and that $300 starts looking like a better investment.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 01, 2016, 09:51:20 AM
PS4 is already 3 years old, by the time NX launches that is more than half way, that is also further along than SNES was compared to Sega Genesis. If NX launches and it is LESS powerful or even JUST AS powerful it will fail period. It needs to shoot for a TRUE next gen benchmark that can do stuff PS4 can't and if that means selling at $350 or even $400 if the hardware and games justify it people will buy, Wii U is 4 years old, there is already a market of 4+ million Wii U owners ready to jump ship, that is enough to get a start and if they bring in some of the outliers on the fence then they will be doing fine. They do not need to beat PS4 they just need to be competitive and make a console people want to buy.


One or two "mature" or "hard core" games isn't going to cut it either, Game Cube had that it didn't work then. NX needs to do everything a PS4 does and play Mario, Zelda, DK, Smash Bros, Metroid, etc, and work without any major hitches. It needs to have the same or better version of the media apps, it needs to have a brand new Splatoon fully online with chat and all, ready to go at launch, not a day after.

They also need to get some partnerships going right now, Sega, Atlus, Capcom, Konami, anyone they can bribe, forget the indies they are not going to be the savior that Nintendo thinks. Being the "best" indie machine didn't mean squat for Wii U, it sure as hell won't matter for NX.


And above all else it needs a traditional controller standard, any add-ons or funky controllers either pack-in but completely optional or just sold separately and completely optional.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 01, 2016, 01:02:02 PM
Quote
I believe there are a lot of potential gamers that would very much like to play Nintendo's games but don't want to buy some goofy unconventional console with no third party support to do so.
The potential consumers you're referring to don't want to pay a premium for a second console, unconventional or not. And at least in the West, they certainly don't want to buy a handheld too which is another reason why a shared library helps Nintendo. And $300 is even pushing it, and I proposed that largely on the idea that Nintendo also manages to not screw up some basic thing like "make sure to tell people NX is a new console."

Nintendo isn't going to win this gen.  Odds are they'll still finish last.  The plan should be to rebuild consumer trust so that they do better next generation.  So the goal should be to sell to those that have no problem buying multiple consoles and those that have not gone up yet and obviously Nintendo fans.  Sony pretty much spent the entire last gen trying to make the PS3 a sellable product.  They had the least sales of the three consoles but in the end had a pretty damn good product and that built up enough trust that the PS4 just ran away with this gen.  Nintendo's goal should be that next time around when everything starts again that they're seen as competent console makers and that buying their product doesn't mean having to put up with this trade-off or missing this feature or missing out on these games everyone else has or paying extra for this novelty feature that barely gets used.  If Nintendo goes weird and gimmicky again then that's their whole image - they're the weird guys that make novelty consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 01, 2016, 07:28:34 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RO4NPspMwLQ

There's a point in the video where the guy says the game will be released on a few platforms that haven't been revealed yet. I wonder how may secretive platforms there are currently.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 01, 2016, 07:38:51 PM
Personally, I'll never understand why anyone would want three same-y consoles on the market that all have essentially the same features and the same / similar games. That's one reason why I liked the Wii, and to a lessor extent the N64; those systems were different than the competition and offered something unique, there was a whole lot more reason to own multiple systems than just a small handful of needlessly exclusive games. Much as I'm disappointed in the Wii U, that's the risk I take asking for something different than the norm, but I'd still prefer Nintendo to create another unique system instead of just copying what Sony and MS are doing. One reason why the PS2/GCN/Xbox generation is my least-fave is because the systems were just so identical to each other, it was boring.

Heck, we kind of still have three same-y systems if you count the PC in with PS4 and XBone, which all have most of the same "AAA" games released across all three. I see no reason to add a fourth to that, and I have no idea why anyone would want to buy 4 different pieces of hardware when they're all essentially the same. Seems like if things are going to be like that, it'd just be better to have one universal system. Yes, I understand the logistical problems with that from the business side, but it's what consumers should want as it would benefit them. I don't want to buy hardware, I want to buy games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 01, 2016, 07:54:08 PM
Personally, I'll never understand why anyone would want three same-y consoles on the market that all have essentially the same features and the same / similar games. That's one reason why I liked the Wii, and to a lessor extent the N64; those systems were different than the competition and offered something unique, there was a whole lot more reason to own multiple systems than just a small handful of needlessly exclusive games. Much as I'm disappointed in the Wii U, that's the risk I take asking for something different than the norm, but I'd still prefer Nintendo to create another unique system instead of just copying what Sony and MS are doing. One reason why the PS2/GCN/Xbox generation is my least-fave is because the systems were just so identical to each other, it was boring.

Heck, we kind of still have three same-y systems if you count the PC in with PS4 and XBone, which all have most of the same "AAA" games released across all three. I see no reason to add a fourth to that, and I have no idea why anyone would want to buy 4 different pieces of hardware when they're all essentially the same. Seems like if things are going to be like that, it'd just be better to have one universal system. Yes, I understand the logistical problems with that from the business side, but it's what consumers should want as it would benefit them. I don't want to buy hardware, I want to buy games.

This is such a great point.  I'd really like Nintendo to either find the next thing (I don't think VR is "it") or double down on the Gamepad idea.  There's reasons that didn't work out (cost, lack of multiplayer, asymmetrical multiplayer being not that interesting) that can be worked out with time and better specs (which can come with time).  The "hybrid console" can probably pull this off.  There aren't enough exclusives to go around in this industry anymore, so unless Nintendo doubles or triples its development capacity, they're gonna have a hard sell on getting new users.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 01, 2016, 07:56:35 PM
Personally, I'll never understand why anyone would want three same-y consoles on the market that all have essentially the same features and the same / similar games. That's one reason why I liked the Wii, and to a lessor extent the N64; those systems were different than the competition and offered something unique, there was a whole lot more reason to own multiple systems than just a small handful of needlessly exclusive games. Much as I'm disappointed in the Wii U, that's the risk I take asking for something different than the norm, but I'd still prefer Nintendo to create another unique system instead of just copying what Sony and MS are doing. One reason why the PS2/GCN/Xbox generation is my least-fave is because the systems were just so identical to each other, it was boring.

I don't want three same-y consoles.  I want one console with Nintendo's games and like 90% of the major third party releases.  To get that however Nintendo either has to smoke the **** out of the other guys or be one of three same-y consoles.  Nintendo's typical model of having a handful of first party releases and **** else is too restrictive to meet my needs as a single console purchase and I don't like the extra costs of owning multiple consoles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 01, 2016, 08:02:11 PM
I think people want Nintendo to make a console like that are those who want to only have to buy one console. They want Nintendo's games as well as everything else, all in one place. Personally, as someone who already has a PS4 and an Xbox One, I'd be more than happy to see Nintendo throw another curveball out there, as long as they fix the real flaws with how they've done things.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 04, 2016, 10:46:05 AM
It wouldn't be 3 of the same console if Nintendo would get their **** together though, it would be Playstation and Nintendo, Xbox would go out of business in a world where Sony and Nintendo were both at their best.

There really isn't room in the console market for three similar consoles, hasn't ever been if you look at history, there is barely room for two similar consoles there has always been enough differences between the major players to tell them apart. Even SNES vs. Genesis are only similar on the surface, once you dig into their libraries and add-ons, marketing, gameplay approaches, they are as different as night and day. Sony and Nintendo are very similar it is Microsoft who is the odd man out, and if you are going to lump PC in with the major consoles well that is a fallacy on it's own as there is little difference between an Xbox console and a Windows PC in the first place. PS and Nintendo you always get true exclusives you won't find on PC but with Xbox chances are outside of a handful of games there is nothing on it that can't be had on a good PC.

Xbox sticks around because of live. This generation Sony has found a way to take that out of the equation so if Nintendo could scoop up the major 3rd party games and have their exclusives, plus get some Nintendo-esque Japanese exclusives they might have a chance taking Microsoft out of the picture entirely. It only takes ONE major mistake in this industry to wipe out all good will and Microsoft doesn't have any good will left to bank on, Nintendo still has their franchises that people can't live without. If they had a product that there was no excuse to not make games for and no excuse not to buy people will flock to it. One reason Playstation has done so well ever is just doing what people expect Nintendo to do.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 04, 2016, 01:38:26 PM
So are today's Reddit rumors the first time X86 has been specifically linked to NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 04, 2016, 02:07:33 PM
I am curious what rumors were like before Wii U was announced. I do remember reading up on Wii before it came out but then I think most of the focus was on speculating what the controller might be like and deciphering the "2-3 times as powerful" comments.

I don't remember what leaks were like and how accurate those predictions turned out being.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 04, 2016, 03:09:27 PM
I am curious what rumors were like before Wii U was announced. I do remember reading up on Wii before it came out but then I think most of the focus was on speculating what the controller might be like and deciphering the "2-3 times as powerful" comments.

I don't remember what leaks were like and how accurate those predictions turned out being.

For the Wii rumors, Matt from IGN back in the day revealed months before E3 that all his sources were telling him the system was basically a slightly more powerful Xbox so we knew what to expect.  Then after that other gaming journalist were saying the same thing from their sources.  So at this point in time back in 2006 we had a pretty good idea how powerful the Wii was going to be, which is why many thought the Wii was destined to fail because after the Gamecube underperforming, some said no one was going to buy a Nintendo system that was so underpowered.  Plus after the PS2s monster success, everyone thought Sony was invincible and there was nothing Nintendo or even Microsoft could do to take people attention away from the PS3.

Of course Nintendo blew the world away at E3 2006 with the Wii's lineup and Sony kind of killed the PS3 for the next several years with their "$599 US Dollars moment" so these people were all proven wrong but yeah, discussions were kind of negative around this time during 2006 for the Wii.  At least NX discussions have been more positive since with the pre-Wii reveal talks, there was a lot more "lol Nintendo going third party" bullshit in every thread.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 04, 2016, 04:00:09 PM
The link to the rumor: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/4dbau3/you_survived_the_af_lockdown_now_claim_your_reward/?sort=old

From a 'verified' Reddit user.

    x86 architecture.

    Backup data to Nintendo server (most likely My Nintendo).

    Support for additional screen.

    Can handle ports of current-gen games.

    Will be able to interact with smartdevice apps.

    Using NX software will unlock My Nintendo reward points.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 04, 2016, 07:12:36 PM
Those rumoured details are so realistic that you don't need a leak.  You can just throw it out there with a good chance of being proven right.  The only way I see that not being the NX is if Nintendo does something really weird that no one could predict.  Of course it's Nintendo so being weird might be the more likely option.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 04, 2016, 08:10:43 PM
-The NX will have a rechargeable battery of some kind.
-It will feature a power button.
-There will be a new eShop for it.
-It will not only play games but also have some sort of video service(s).
-The controller for the NX will be a controller.
-It will be HD and will not work with an RF adapter (this one could be false).
-There will be a power LED indicator light so you'll know when it's on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 04, 2016, 08:31:43 PM
-The NX will have a rechargeable battery of some kind.
-It will feature a power button.
-There will be a new eShop for it.
-It will not only play games but also have some sort of video service(s).
-The controller for the NX will be a controller.
-It will be HD and will not work with an RF adapter (this one could be false).
-There will be a power LED indicator light so you'll know when it's on.

-It will have a completely functional and easy-to-use UI and webstore that will be universally condemned
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 04, 2016, 08:37:19 PM
So are today's Reddit rumors the first time X86 has been specifically linked to NX?
Specifically? I think so. AMD has been seemingly hinting at it as far back as December 2014, never mentioning Nintendo or NX. Devinder Kumar, AMD's Chief Financial Officer, stated AMD scored "design wins" for products to be introduced in 2016, one x86 and the other ARM. Everyone naturally assumed at least one, maybe both was Nintendo. This gets a bit crazier with the all-but-officially-confirmed PS4k. Is one Sony and the other Nintendo? I'm about to throw this speculation cap in a hobo trashcan fire because as much as I like talking about shiny, new hardware, this is getting out of hand. I was starting to lean toward the ARM camp though.

As for the Reddit rumor, the poster has apparently been verified by a moderator, but no one knows how strict Reddit is or what their process for verifying is. It's gotten to the point where the Reddit moderator signed up for NeoGaf (currently awaiting approval because that's a thing you do on NeoGaf to start posting) in an attempt to coordinate with NeoGaf's moderators to re-verify the Reddit poster. What the fuc...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on April 04, 2016, 11:28:27 PM
I am curious what rumors were like before Wii U was announced. I do remember reading up on Wii before it came out but then I think most of the focus was on speculating what the controller might be like and deciphering the "2-3 times as powerful" comments.

I don't remember what leaks were like and how accurate those predictions turned out being.

Well, I've got quite the reading selection for you ;)

The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt* (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.0)

and to bring it all into one indexed thread....

Wii U in Review (News & Rumor Consolidation) (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=37892.0)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 04, 2016, 11:38:10 PM
According NeoGaf user LCGeek (who posted proof that he had info on both Wii and Wii U's CPU, and he hasn't been banned) is claiming info on NX's CPU: NX > Xbox One > PS4.

Note: this is only regarding CPU. He doesn't have info on GPU or RAM.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 05, 2016, 12:31:36 AM
I am curious what rumors were like before Wii U was announced. I do remember reading up on Wii before it came out but then I think most of the focus was on speculating what the controller might be like and deciphering the "2-3 times as powerful" comments.

I don't remember what leaks were like and how accurate those predictions turned out being.

Well, I've got quite the reading selection for you ;)

The OFFICIAL Big N rumor thread *bring your own salt* (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.0)

and to bring it all into one indexed thread....

Wii U in Review (News & Rumor Consolidation) (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=37892.0)
Those were the days. With the onslaught of Directs in recent years, it made sense that the rumor thread ran out of steam, but with the upswing of leaks and such as of late reminded me of those threads.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 05, 2016, 12:39:47 AM
Well that shouldn't be hard, the CPUs in both the PS4 and XB1 are relatively weak 1.6 and 1.75ghz Jaguar CPUs. Especially compared to how beefy the 360's 3.2ghz Triple core Xenon was in 2005.

People complain that the Wii U CPU is underpowered for its time, but MS and Sony's latest entries are underpowered as well. With the X86 architecture, it's even more apparent.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 05, 2016, 02:07:22 AM
Nintendo is re-branding their logo, in a manner of speaking.

http://mynintendonews.com/2016/04/04/nintendo-looks-to-be-going-back-to-red-in-its-marketing-and-logo/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 05, 2016, 06:01:29 AM
Well that shouldn't be hard, the CPUs in both the PS4 and XB1 are relatively weak 1.6 and 1.75ghz Jaguar CPUs. Especially compared to how beefy the 360's 3.2ghz Triple core Xenon was in 2005.
Regardless of difficulty, it's still encouraging that NX (potentially) features a better CPU. That was considered the weak link on both PS4 and One. If Nintendo transitions to x86-64, it would practically have to go out of its way to feature a processor with less computing power. With a new chip design, Nintendo is effectively starting over so it doesn't get the same cost-saving benefit of tweaking one it used for like 10 years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 05, 2016, 04:20:47 PM
I haven't been keeping up with computers much but I thought they stopped getting faster and were focusing more on RAM and stuff like that maybe I am wrong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 05, 2016, 06:31:08 PM
(http://i1030.photobucket.com/albums/y362/tophatant123/New%20IP_zpsg8lxbwo9.png)

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1204802
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on April 05, 2016, 08:26:40 PM
The Jaguar CPUs in the PS4 and Xbone are much more powerful than the CPUs from the Xbox 360 and PS3. Clock speed doesn't mean nearly as much as it used to. For the same processor type, sure, faster is better...but you're basically comparing apples to oranges with these.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 05, 2016, 09:05:21 PM
For the same processor type, sure, faster is better...but you're basically comparing apples to oranges with these.

Apple spent millions on marketing for years and years trying to make people understand that to no avail.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 05, 2016, 09:24:14 PM
The Jaguar CPUs in the PS4 and Xbone are much more powerful than the CPUs from the Xbox 360 and PS3. Clock speed doesn't mean nearly as much as it used to. For the same processor type, sure, faster is better...but you're basically comparing apples to oranges with these.

I know, I'm saying for 2013, they weren't all that and a bag of chips. Where as for 2005, a 3 core Xenon was YUGE.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 06, 2016, 01:14:12 PM
Nintendo is re-branding their logo, in a manner of speaking.

http://mynintendonews.com/2016/04/04/nintendo-looks-to-be-going-back-to-red-in-its-marketing-and-logo/

A minor move but one I like.  The grey logo is associated with Wii/Wii U era Nintendo.  Changing the logo, at least from a branding perspective, suggests that the NX is the start of a new era and that is how they should market it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 07, 2016, 12:26:06 PM
So news has gotten so slow the world of Nintendo has resorted to discussing the logo. I am wondering how much longer people can maintain any sort of anticipation for this thing if they don't give us something to talk about soon.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 07, 2016, 01:18:27 PM
It's Nintendo's fault for announcing the thing 18 months before the E3 they would present it. However, think of it like this- we could either have people railing on the Wii U for being dead in the water, or we can have people cautiously optimistic, yet skeptical of the NX.

That hasn't stopped people from doing both simultaneously, of course, but those people are disappointing in their own right.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 07, 2016, 05:02:02 PM
NX was announced March 17, 2015 so a little less than 15 months. Either way, Nintendo handled that the best way it could. Announcing NX coincided with announcing its partnership with DeNA. Had Nintendo not announced a new platform alongside its mobile push, it would have had to deal with speculation that it was leaving the hardware business considering how poorly Wii U was doing which would have tanked its stock. The timing was all intentional. Nintendo announces its partnership with DeNA right before the end of fiscal year then released its first mobile app, Miitomo, right before the end of the next fiscal year. It got to map out future while downplaying just how poorly Wii U was doing.

And not talking about NX since announcing it was also the best way to handle that situation. Nintendo had to throw Wii U under the bus except it was still stuck with the console for what, another 20 months. Wii U was getting replaced sooner rather than later, but Nintendo really had no other choice other than to continue supporting it. Not an ideal scenario by any metric though Nintendo surprisingly handled it well all things considered.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 07, 2016, 05:04:42 PM
The revised title of this thread, #TeamButtons Wins Again, always makes me think of Red Buttons. But then, he rarely won. He was usually the lovable loser.

That is all. You may now resume your regularly scheduled rampant pointless speculation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 07, 2016, 06:01:27 PM
Adrock makes some good points except they didn't do ALL they could, they could have opened the flood gates on the Virtual Console, they could have made some quick and dirty ports of Game Cube and Wii games, more than they what five that they did? They could have spent less time/money/resources on DLC for the handful of games they do have and threw all of that at even just one more small time franchise to get something else out there. They threw Wii U under the bus because they were side tracked with the money making machine called Amiibo and then forgot that NX was even out there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 08, 2016, 01:25:38 AM
Speculation time!

What if the NX hand held is super cheap at $99us and can be used as controller, and the NX console is heavy duty for $400us with the hand held/controller bundled in? Steamlink/crossplay style support between the two devices. Classic controller NX still available.

Auxillary apps for the console titles are free on the hand held and on mobile. Stuff like SuperMario Maker website and Miitomo apps.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 08, 2016, 08:32:51 AM
Take a crippling loss on the handheld? You must be confusing Nintendo with some other company.


More rumors. Monolith Productions(Shadow of Mordor) wants a new QA manager with experience with Nintendo Lot Check certification. Probably nothing, but it's better than arguing about buttons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 08, 2016, 10:12:15 AM
They have released sub-100 handhelds in the past. With the way tech has been adapting lately there is a real belief they could manage that especially if the two are interconnected someway. Here is an idea, what if NX is just Wii U hardware with PS4-esque chipset but all the extra horespower comes from cloud computing? That might even be what Sony is planning with PS4K.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 08, 2016, 11:11:21 AM
Apparently new Zelda coming to both Wii U and NX, according to Emily Rogers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 08, 2016, 04:19:59 PM
Apparently new Zelda coming to both Wii U and NX, according to Emily Rogers.

It's only rumors, though from people who do good leg work.

I'm a bit bummed that the Wii U won't have a Zelda game to entirely call its own, but this is the better and expected business move.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 09, 2016, 04:02:40 AM
hm,
Maybe VR?
Think about it Nintendo are the Inventors of the Gaming Industry, Motion Controls, 3D in consoles, Touch screens in consoles.
Would it surprise you that the NX might really be a VR system?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 09, 2016, 03:31:39 PM
hm,
Maybe VR?
Think about it Nintendo are the Inventors of the Gaming Industry, Motion Controls, 3D in consoles, Touch screens in consoles.
Would it surprise you that the NX might really be a VR system?

It would because most of the time that Nintendo uses new technology like touch screens or motion control, it's done when the tech is more established and costs for it aren't as high as when they were first created. VR would be against this pattern since it still seems to be an unproven and highly experimental concept, (at least to me) and the costs for the technology are quite high and Nintendo's usually pretty cost conscious on their technology.

As much as the Wii U has gotten slagged over the years and complaints have been made about the Gamepad, I expect Nintendo's next console to be an evolution of the gamepad in some way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 09, 2016, 06:33:04 PM
Every time Nintendo introduces a new thing into controllers, we should expect a version of it on new platforms if only for Virtual Console reasons. There absolutely will be a Gamepad successor. Whether it's included with the console remains to be seen. Personally, I doubt it. I think most first party games will have a GamePad enhanced control option, and games that require it (e.g. Splatoon) will have a version sold with it. Otherwise, it will be sold separately in stores, and there's reason to believe that Nintendo will allow the 3DS successor to function as a GamePad. Nintendo pushed the GamePad as a luxury item when it clearly wasn't. The most expensive component was a six inch 480p screen which was low-end even in 2012.

I think a traditional controller will likely be the pack-in controller if only for simplicity's sake. Most Wii U games had a Pro Controller option while few required the GamePad or Wii Remote even if they were arguably better with the latter options. For those that want to play Wii games on Virtual Console, they'll have to buy a motion control remote separately. I'm curious how Nintendo is going to handle that. I have doubts it will include the port for the sensor bar. Maybe Nintendo releases a USB sensor bar, or just ditches IR-technology altogether because it's awful. If Skyward Sword did anything right, it showed that the gyroscope in MotionPlus did a better job simulating pointer controls than the regular Wii Remote did with actual pointer controls. Nintendo likes 1:1 emulation, but I hope it reconsiders since the gyroscope worked so much better.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 09, 2016, 06:43:39 PM
I doubt the NX will be backward compatible with the Wii U, so they don't necessarily need a 1:1 replacement for the GamePad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 09, 2016, 06:55:47 PM
Yeah, I doubt there will be hardware backward compatibility, but Nintendo will undoubtedly resell those Wii U games one day beyond the enhanced ports of select games it will also undoubtedly release around launch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 09, 2016, 08:50:35 PM
hm,
Maybe VR?
Think about it Nintendo are the Inventors of the Gaming Industry, Motion Controls, 3D in consoles, Touch screens in consoles.
Would it surprise you that the NX might really be a VR system?

It would because most of the time that Nintendo uses new technology like touch screens or motion control, it's done when the tech is more established and costs for it aren't as high as when they were first created. VR would be against this pattern since it still seems to be an unproven and highly experimental concept, (at least to me) and the costs for the technology are quite high and Nintendo's usually pretty cost conscious on their technology.

As much as the Wii U has gotten slagged over the years and complaints have been made about the Gamepad, I expect Nintendo's next console to be an evolution of the gamepad in some way.

There's a VR headset in Miitomo, so I think that pretty much confirms it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 09, 2016, 09:16:37 PM
Nintendo is re-branding their logo, in a manner of speaking.

http://mynintendonews.com/2016/04/04/nintendo-looks-to-be-going-back-to-red-in-its-marketing-and-logo/
The red logo always looked better anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 09, 2016, 10:12:32 PM
There's a VR headset in Miitomo, so I think that pretty much confirms it.
There's also a hotdog costume in Miitomo. Does that confirm a Hotdog Reality™ headset for NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 09, 2016, 10:36:23 PM
No, just more baseball games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 10, 2016, 01:45:34 AM
No, just more baseball games.
ROFL!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 11, 2016, 10:42:28 AM
Collection of Rumors about titles coming to the NX:

http://segmentnext.com/2016/04/11/nintendo-nx-games-include-least-four-wii-u-ports/

New Zelda
Super Mario Maker
Splatoon
Super Smash Bros
Luigi's Mansion 3
Star Wars Battlefront
Battlefield
Beyond Good and Evil 2
Mech Super Extended
Ubisoft Game
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 11, 2016, 10:48:47 AM
Yeah, I doubt there will be hardware backward compatibility, but Nintendo will undoubtedly resell those Wii U games one day beyond the enhanced ports of select games it will also undoubtedly release around launch.


Are you really so sure though? I mean we all love to think the Game Cube had some pretty amazing games but Nintendo has not done a very good job porting those over. GC-Wii, Wii to Wii U is the only time in Nintendo history b/c has even been a thing on the console side of things. If they truly are distancing themselves from Wii U, which they should by all means sweep it under the rug, then we shouldn't expect them to ever port Wii U games to NX. I would expect them to make brand new games for NX and make brand new sequels for games that deserve it. Nintendo wouldn't want you to play Mario Kart 8 Wii U on NX they want you to buy Mario Kart X.

Going from GC-Wii they kind of had to do b/c to sell that Zelda game.

Right now if Zelda U is going to be on NX we can expect it to be like GC to Wii in that the Wii U port will use and rely on the Game Pad but the NX will probably just go with traditional controls, a reversal. Or they will just not bother with releasing it on Wii U at all and just move it to NX. Wii U does not have the install base Game Cube had to worry about "abandoning" they are already abandoning it, they pretty much left it for dead since Splatoon released anyways.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 11, 2016, 11:10:58 AM
Collection of Rumors about titles coming to the NX:

http://segmentnext.com/2016/04/11/nintendo-nx-games-include-least-four-wii-u-ports/

New Zelda
Super Mario Maker
Splatoon
Super Smash Bros
Luigi's Mansion 3
Star Wars Battlefront
Battlefield
Beyond Good and Evil 2
Mech Super Extended
Ubisoft Game
"With Nintendo’s financial situation still dire despite the resounding successes of the new Super Smash Bros. games, Mario Kart 8, and the just-released Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess HD for Wii U, the Nintendo NX may be one of the last gasps of Nintendo’s console market. Its Wii U has only sold around 69 million units in its entire run.
This is in contrast to Nintendo’s original Wii system, which was able to sell over 100 million units and even outsold the Xbox 360 and PS3."

On the Star Wars Battlefront/ Battlefield article it's clear the author has no idea what they're talking about and it's purely speculation mixed in with misinformation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 11, 2016, 11:22:48 AM
You can't even bother to put FIFA/Madden on your fake list of launch games? C'mon man.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 11, 2016, 12:49:58 PM
I think Nintendo might be better off calling the Splatoon port a sequel.  Doing a new single player campaign shouldn't be too hard since the one we got was an afterthought and still came out fantastic.  Plus, adding the Octolings could make it feel fresher.  Zelda has to be a port, but maybe they can also bill Mario Maker as a sequel if they add enough assets.  (Super Mario Maker 2! Now with Slopes!)

I say this because the PS4 is basically a last gen port machine, and this may just be me talking, but that's the number one reason I don't own one.  I was able to get every PS3 game I wanted when they got marked down, so I don't really need "HD" ports of those games.  The NX might still look good with ports, since the Wii U has been such a dud though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 11, 2016, 12:58:03 PM
This is all going to end in an explosion of disappointment like the Wii U/Cafe rumors and speculation, isn't it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 11, 2016, 12:59:47 PM
Ubisoft Game
Don't make Yves Guillemot have to pick only one of his 18 shitty NX Launch titles, they're like his children, he loves each and every one of them equally.

This is all going to end in an explosion of disappointment like the Wii U/Cafe rumors and speculation, isn't it?
Yup.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 11, 2016, 02:42:26 PM
I think Nintendo might be better off calling the Splatoon port a sequel.  Doing a new single player campaign shouldn't be too hard since the one we got was an afterthought and still came out fantastic.  Plus, adding the Octolings could make it feel fresher.  Zelda has to be a port, but maybe they can also bill Mario Maker as a sequel if they add enough assets.  (Super Mario Maker 2! Now with Slopes!)

I say this because the PS4 is basically a last gen port machine, and this may just be me talking, but that's the number one reason I don't own one.  I was able to get every PS3 game I wanted when they got marked down, so I don't really need "HD" ports of those games.  The NX might still look good with ports, since the Wii U has been such a dud though.

In my mind a sequel to those games would attract both newcomers and get Wii U owners that already have the Wii U version to buy the new one because their sequels.  But this assumes a world where people don't rebuy games they already own just because Malibu Stacy has a new hat and that world only exists in my dreams.  Clearly all those ports on the PS4 and XB1 must be selling or every company wouldn't be cranking them out.  So while I would prefer sequels I don't know if Nintendo has to bother.  They could probably do alright with a lot of ports of their Wii U games and due to the obscurity of the Wii U that's probably something the majority would prefer.  "Sweet that one Wii U game I had my eye on in on this Nintendo console I actually bought!"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on April 12, 2016, 11:32:50 AM
Zelda is a no brainer. It's happening for the NX and we knew this the moment we heard about that last delay. Even when we didn't know, we knew.

Mario Maker seems just new enough to get a port and not a sequel just yet.

Smash Bros Wii U, always a hot topic. The game did release at the end of 2014 but the development just kept on until only 2 months ago and that's not including the patch that came after. It's well supported, for the most part universally loved and on a system that tanked hard. Sure the 3DS numbers make up for a lot of it's sales but even then, the assets between both games could be put to further use.

If a Smash Bros 3DU edition comes out for NX it should surprise no one. Leverage all that hard work and effort that went into characters, stages, music and 3rd party deals so they don't have to start all over again. Release right at the start of the generation and then sometime down the line when Sakurai and the gang are ready, add even more new characters and stages to the game to let it just be next gens Smash.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 12, 2016, 12:19:17 PM
I think Nintendo might be better off calling the Splatoon port a sequel.  Doing a new single player campaign shouldn't be too hard since the one we got was an afterthought and still came out fantastic.  Plus, adding the Octolings could make it feel fresher.  Zelda has to be a port, but maybe they can also bill Mario Maker as a sequel if they add enough assets.  (Super Mario Maker 2! Now with Slopes!)

I say this because the PS4 is basically a last gen port machine, and this may just be me talking, but that's the number one reason I don't own one.  I was able to get every PS3 game I wanted when they got marked down, so I don't really need "HD" ports of those games.  The NX might still look good with ports, since the Wii U has been such a dud though.

In my mind a sequel to those games would attract both newcomers and get Wii U owners that already have the Wii U version to buy the new one because their sequels.  But this assumes a world where people don't rebuy games they already own just because Malibu Stacy has a new hat and that world only exists in my dreams.  Clearly all those ports on the PS4 and XB1 must be selling or every company wouldn't be cranking them out.  So while I would prefer sequels I don't know if Nintendo has to bother.  They could probably do alright with a lot of ports of their Wii U games and due to the obscurity of the Wii U that's probably something the majority would prefer.  "Sweet that one Wii U game I had my eye on in on this Nintendo console I actually bought!"

They could always go the Squenix route and make a "1.5 HD ReMiX".  I'm sure I wouldn't be the only one doing a rebuy, if that wasn't the case, but you're right.  The big Wii U titles still probably have considerable cache among people who never bought a Wii U, so there's almost no need.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 12, 2016, 12:43:57 PM
I think a Mario Maker port is as much of a given as Zelda. And Nintendo's flirted with the idea of up-porting a previous gen Smash Bros. in the past, so I wouldn't be surprised there. As for Splatoon, I've been convinced for a while now that Splatoon 2 for NX is going to be Nintendo's big game for Holiday 2017, so I don't think that'll get a port.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 12, 2016, 02:23:04 PM
I think Nintendo would be wise to (and I'd be for) putting enhanced versions of Wii U games on the NX early in its life to pad out the lineup. An updated Smash Wii U, Mario Maker, and something else would do wonders. I'd be a sucker and get them again!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 12, 2016, 02:32:50 PM
Personally, I want new systems to have new games. It's kind of crazy how much that has become radical thinking, as it's something that feels like it should just be a normal want. I guess it just goes to show the problems with game development being so expensive these days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 12, 2016, 02:54:10 PM
It is a normal want, that's why nobody's said it. It's just taken as a given, of course people want new games. These would ideally be in addition to that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 12, 2016, 02:58:27 PM
Super Mario Maker is the sort of game where a sequel would contain all the content from the original game plus more.  What are they going to remove features we can put in our levels?  That just doesn't make sense.  So they could port it with a huge amount of new exclusive content (Charging Chucks, slopes), a game's worth of new exclusive default levels, and backwards compatibility with the existing servers and uploaded stages and that would probably be enough new stuff that it would be a worthwhile upgrade for existing owners.  Because, really, what else would you even expect from a Super Mario Maker sequel?  Just call it Super Mario Maker Ver. 2.0 or something like that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 12, 2016, 02:59:49 PM
It is a normal want, that's why nobody's said it. It's just taken as a given, of course people want new games. These would ideally be in addition to that.
I'm not so sure if that's true. Enhanced ports and re-releases have become extremely popular, and they've even sold the PS4 and XBone at certain points. Plus, I see a lot of people (not just here) requesting a wealth of enhanced ports and re-releases for NX, not just one or two. They seem to be something a lot of people want several of, a mindset I just can't get behind.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 12, 2016, 04:07:11 PM
I also generally find the "remaster" trend to be distasteful and indicative of the poor state of the current gen release schedule. It also speaks to the "whaling" of the industry, as publishers are depending on people double dipping for questionable benefit (this will soon expand to consoles themselves!). Obviously Nintendo is not free of this sin, but as with many other dubious industry practices they've yet to go whole hog.

That said, WiiU re-releases are sort of hard to argue against given how small that audience was and how high-quality many first-party games were. But this would also assume that the NX is going to be dramatically more successful, which I'm skeptical about. Worst case scenario the early slate of the ~15M-lifetime-units NX is larded up with WiiU ports, and later original NX games are in the same position as under-exposed WiiU games were.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 12, 2016, 05:23:16 PM
It is a normal want, that's why nobody's said it. It's just taken as a given, of course people want new games. These would ideally be in addition to that.

I'm not so sure if that's true. Enhanced ports and re-releases have become extremely popular, and they've even sold the PS4 and XBone at certain points. Plus, I see a lot of people (not just here) requesting a wealth of enhanced ports and re-releases for NX, not just one or two. They seem to be something a lot of people want several of, a mindset I just can't get behind.

People buy what you give them.  Nostalgia is in, for sure, but if the high profile games are ports, then that's what people are gonna buy.

For the NX, I think the clamor for Wii U ports mostly relates to games Wii U owners don't want to stop playing and Nintendo's inability to properly support the Wii U.  You don't want to see that happen again, so you expect Nintendo to pad with up ports, but you'd also like them to be good up ports.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 12, 2016, 05:25:21 PM
Super Mario Maker is the sort of game where a sequel would contain all the content from the original game plus more.  What are they going to remove features we can put in our levels?  That just doesn't make sense.  So they could port it with a huge amount of new exclusive content (Charging Chucks, slopes), a game's worth of new exclusive default levels, and backwards compatibility with the existing servers and uploaded stages and that would probably be enough new stuff that it would be a worthwhile upgrade for existing owners.  Because, really, what else would you even expect from a Super Mario Maker sequel?  Just call it Super Mario Maker Ver. 2.0 or something like that.

Or, they could go all out and make Super Mario Maker Maker: a game where you design level editors.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 12, 2016, 05:27:26 PM
The funny thing with a re-release or a remaster is that it does do a service for gamers.  It gives someone the ability to buy a game that is otherwise out of print.  I've bought re-releases before in situations where I didn't own the original version of the game and in some cases didn't even own the original system.  Videogames are specifically tied to hardware.  It's not like music or films where you they can just transition from record to CD and it all just works.  Lots of games don't get re-releases and force people to seek out used copies or resort to piracy to play them.  It can be a big convenience to see an old game get a modern release.

The problem is that the customers for these games aren't just those that missed out the first time.  People double-dip and the publishers know it so they try to exploit that.  Then you get an over-abundance of re-releases, sometimes sharing shelf space with the original versions (if I go to Wal-Mart I can find PS3 and PS4 versions of Last of Us and GTA V effortlessly) and release schedules treating these not as an extra for those that missed out but as a key part of the release schedule.  Nintendo in particular tends to do that.  Re-releases tend to fall into lulls in the schedule which gives the impression like I'm supposed to buy those instead of playing something actually new.  Like those "count" as a proper game and I can't complain about the release gap.  But then I think that aspect is very Nintendo specific as it doesn't appear that way on the other consoles since there is enough third party support that release schedule gaps aren't really a thing.

The PS4 and XB1 tend to have more of a problem of their games also being available on the old hardware making there less of a need to own the new system.  But they also get remasters of games that are like two or three years old which is ridiculous.  What is the remaster for?  Last gen they played it up an HD remaster so that the game looked good on a modern TV.  So why do PS3 games that already look good on an HDTV need a remaster?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 12, 2016, 10:13:53 PM
Get your NX rumors. NeoGaf user, 10k, was passed some info. He was holding onto it for a while, but got the okay not too long ago to post it by the mods there. My understanding is that his sources didn't want the attention, and Nintendo is apparently watching threads like that one. It seems like Nintendo is stupid serious about protecting NX secrets. Why anyone would risk their livelihood to leak sensitive info is beyond me? I'll take it though. Anyway, 10k split the info into tiers based on number of sources backed up the claims (e.g. Tier 1 = one source etc.).

Tier 4
1. NX is more powerful than PS4 "by a noticeable amount" from CPU to GPU to RAM. NX's CPU being more powerful than PS4's was previously mentioned much earlier in that NeoGaf thread by LCGeek.

2. Super Smash Bros. and Zelda Wii U remasters are 100% confirmed. Emily Rogers mentioned there were four ports/remasters. The other two are Super Mario Maker and Splatoon. Nintendo is struggling to transfer player data and doesn't want courses to be lost. It is also struggling to transfer player data for Splatoon, but also wants to make the game cross-compatible with Wii U players. 10k expects a screen in the NX controller though this seemed to be his own musings and not something his sources gave him. Read between the lines and that's the conclusion you should arrive at. If Nintendo wants NX and Wii U players to play Splatoon together, NX is going to need a version of the Gamepad.

Tier 2 (there was no Tier 3)
1. NX Non-Disclosure Agreements are extremely strict. No surprise. However, a source mentioned they know more Nintendo hardware people than software people yet they're being fed info from the software people. The hardware people aren't saying anything.

2. Nintendo is cracking down on leaks.

Tier 1
1. NX software development kits are out and developers have them.

2. NX is easy to port to. Apparently, developers are having no trouble porting current generation games over. It's a quick process and developers seem happy with it.

3. NX architecture is under NDA, but is speculated to be x86. 10k disagreed, but his source said porting from x86 to ARM (handheld to console) and x86 to x86 (PS4/One to NX) is easy while porting from x86 to ARM (console to handheld) is trickier. 10k gets a little technical from here, mentioning compiling and changing integers and recompiling. I'm not going to try to explain that. I just wanted to write out a summary since I have 10k's post on my phone (didn't want to attempt to copy and paste all of that) and I'm typing this out on my laptop.

4. A different source (a coder who works Nintendo) laughed off NeoGaf's focus on x86. 10k speculates that this source is alluding to the console also using ARM.

5. No one knows anything about the handheld. None of his sources or his sources' sources know if "NX"  also refers to the handheld or if it has a different codename. The handheld is speculated to get some exclusive games, but it won't get many downported console games. The console could theoretically play all games. It sounds like a partially shared library. If I had to guess, I'd say Mario Kart is a game that would be a perfect shared title. It's a waste of resources to recreate assets for handheld and console. The Mario Kart team could instead focus on creating DLC packs instead developing Mario Kart 9 then starting over with Mario Kart 10.

---

Anyway, I wouldn't be terribly surprised if NX was more powerful than PS4. It's launching mid-generation. I'm similarly not surprised by the four Wii U ports. Those are the ones I'd pick to start. A Mario Kart sequel could easily be ready in 2017 so no need to port MK8. If true, it's nice to know developers have SDKs and that NX is easy to port to. I still don't expect a ton of ports. Nintendo is going to have to work for third party support. Obviously, start with the big ones (e.g. Madden, Call of Duty) then work its way down.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 12, 2016, 10:18:04 PM
It's very like Nintendo to just go completely nuts with secrecy here in response to how much leaked about the 3DS and Wii U really early. There's a new president, but the spirit of Yamauchi lives on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on April 12, 2016, 10:41:57 PM
The NX app is a solid workaround for Super Mario Maker if the New controller is screenless.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 12, 2016, 11:22:48 PM
That sounds like a lot of "that would make sense".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 13, 2016, 12:15:36 AM
A lot of it is logical. I will say this RE:GamePad. Given the challenges they've faced with implementing meaningful second screen experiences that don't sacrifice performance (see Digital Foundry's Star Fox video) I can see Nintendo supporting the GamePad for a second generation but completely phasing out everything that's not Off-TV play or inventory management. NX will be a resource hog(duh, like any other console) and Nintendo can't afford to have an additional peripheral syphoning off extra processing power where it might be needed most.

Yes, it would mean have to dedicate resources to yet another legacy controller but Nintendo dug themselves into this whole with the Wii. I hope with NX they can finally phase out Wiimotes,Nunchucks, CC,CCP and (sigh) the Wii U Pro Controller and just focus on having a good solid controller that builds off the Pro Controller. And then pair that with the NX handheld and (optional) support for the GamePad.

As for the porting issue, I just want Nintendo to not make the porting process so difficult it prevents devs from even wanting to touch the system. For good or worse, it's a selfish desire on my part.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 13, 2016, 01:25:42 AM
They may have faced some challenges with streaming, but their streaming is very optimized, and I also think they would be hesitant to let that effort go to waste.

Splatoon and Mario Maker confuse me, seeing as both utilize touchscreen heavily. I feel that porting them and removing that functionality (specifically in the case of Mario Maker) would be an awful way to go about things. Honestly, I think that the touchscreen-in-controller is a great mechanic that doesn't need to be a huge focus, but should be present. This is a repeat of what I have stated in the past when considering the NX's controller design, though it makes all the more sense if they'll be porting gamepad-centric titles to the new console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 13, 2016, 08:45:00 AM
I don't think Mario Maker is as resource intensive in its second screen capabilities, so it could work. I'm just saying Nintendo will phase out things like the second screen experiences in Star Fox Zero that are a definite impact on performance.


More importantly, it won't require 3rd parties to support the thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 13, 2016, 12:37:50 PM
A console more powerful than the PS4 with a screen controller sounds like it would be expensive.  Or is the screen controller part optional?  Maybe make the handheld the optional screen controller like with the Cube?  I think the biggest stumbling block with the GC-GBA connectivity was selling the damn cable separately; while I knew lots of GBA owners and very few Cube owners the GBA owners weren't willing to buy a $20 cable for something to use solely at my house and I wasn't going to buy myself four of them.  With today's tech it would all just connect wirelessly.

If the console can theoretically play all the games then I won't bother with the handheld.  I get the concept of one platform but if there are a handful of exclusives on either side it's going to feel like a damn rip-off to buy two systems where 99% of the games are the same, in order to access everything.  One thing that is kind of nice about prior Nintendo handheld/console combos is that they were different enough that it was really worthwhile to own both.  I'm fine with them both being very different or literally exactly the same but not so much where they're only mostly the same.  A side effect of this approach is also that Nintendo will probably not get as many customers buying both so hopefully they're anticipating that.

I don't like the idea of the console using ARM.  Quit bullshitting around, Nintendo.  If you give third parties an excuse to not support you, they won't.  The only valid excuse I could see for not going with x86 is if they really have to have the same type of processor in both the handheld and console for the concept to work.  But I can see Nintendo going with ARM because they're familiar with it.  They're never going to fix the third party support if they design things with too much focus on their own wants.  And if they don't fix the third party support problem their consoles are not going to sell.

The good thing about these rumours is that there isn't something outrageously stupid that looks like it will sink the console before it even launches like Nintendo still going with outdated hardware.  This rumoured design sounds like it could have a chance to succeed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 13, 2016, 12:55:59 PM
Not if you keep talking like that, Ian!

Lighten up! It's going to be hilarious no matter what situation pans out, right???
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 13, 2016, 01:23:22 PM
The funny thing with a re-release or a remaster is that it does do a service for gamers.  It gives someone the ability to buy a game that is otherwise out of print.  I've bought re-releases before in situations where I didn't own the original version of the game and in some cases didn't even own the original system.
Right, I'm fine with straight-up re-releases, especially when they are older games that are long out of print. The Virtual Console is a good example, I have no problem with that because it takes little effort and doesn't feel like it gets in the way of new releases. The stuff you went on to say in your post is what I was referring to as my issue with things.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 13, 2016, 05:05:07 PM
A console more powerful than the PS4 with a screen controller sounds like it would be expensive.
The screen on the controller isn't what would make it expensive which, based on dozens of your previous posts, is your concern despite being corrected on this every time (e.g. what parts/manufacturing costs ≠ what Nintendo charged for replacements). If your issue is that you don't want to pay for something more powerful than PS4, you really need to pick a side. You have spent a literal decade derailing almost every discussion to complain about Nintendo not matching competing consoles' specs, and now Nintendo may finally do the very thing you've been asking for, it's too expensive. You can't have it both ways. If you want powerful hardware, you have to pay a premium.
Quote
I don't like the idea of the console using ARM.  Quit bullshitting around, Nintendo.  If you give third parties an excuse to not support you, they won't.
Third parties don't need an excuse. If they want one, they'll find one. More importantly, I'd recommend reading up on this. ARM is supported by every modern engine, and porting from x86 is apparently easy. Due to the rise of mobile, ARM isn't going anywhere. The most important thing is that Nintendo is moving away from PowerPC.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 13, 2016, 05:52:50 PM
A console more powerful than the PS4 with a screen controller sounds like it would be expensive.
The screen on the controller isn't what would make it expensive which, based on dozens of your previous posts, is your concern despite being corrected on this every time (e.g. what parts/manufacturing costs ≠ what Nintendo charged for replacements). If your issue is that you don't want to pay for something more powerful than PS4, you really need to pick a side. You have spent a literal decade derailing almost every discussion to complain about Nintendo not matching competing consoles' specs, and now Nintendo may finally do the very thing you've been asking for, it's too expensive. You can't have it both ways. If you want powerful hardware, you have to pay a premium.

Yeah, THAT is what to read out of this.  That I don't want up-to-date specs to raise the price.  Not, you know, the fucking screen controller.  If the controller didn't affect the price then why is the Wii U the price it is?  No price cut, not at a price point that works as a secondary console and yet with outdated specs that in theory should make it easier to lower the price.  I can come to two conclusions - either the Gamepad costs a fair chunk and keeps the price of the console high or Nintendo for some idiotic reason has willingly decided to keep the price high on a console that has failed to sell at the current price point but could perhaps sell better at a lower one like its predecessor was able to.  Nintendo is either handcuffed by the Gamepad or fucking stupid.  Nintendo pretty much saved the 3DS by lowering the price so why would they NOT do it for the Wii U if they could?

Considering that the PS4 has no screen controller I'm assuming that a console that exceeds its power and also has a screen controller will cost more than it.  The specs are important, the screen controller is not so it should be optional.  It would not be worth it to inflate the price of the console so Nintendo can port Splatoon and Super Mario Maker.  Also if the price point is higher for essentially a mandatory Gamepad purchase how does Nintendo sell consumers on that when in general the Wii U's use of the Gamepad was underwhelming?  This isn't a new concept where Nintendo can sell it on potential.  We've seen a console with a screen controller and it really isn't that great of a feature.  I'm totally on board with it as an optional feature and I think using the handheld would be the best approach (it would be more adopted than selling a separate Gamepad).  But I think bundling it in is a stupid idea, unless by magic it does not affect the price.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 13, 2016, 05:56:20 PM
I think if the NX console has a touchscreen in its controller, it will be a small one, more like the size of the 3DS top screen (or maybe the XL). If its main use is things like maps or inventory management, and it isn't intended for off-TV play, then it won't need to be very big. Heck, it won't really need to be HD in that case either. Keeping the size down will also allow the controller to be shaped more like a traditional controller (such as Nintendo's own Pro or Classic) instead of the rectangular monstrosity that is the GamePad, which would be a good idea too. I can't imagine a single screen like this costing very much at this point either.

The only Wii U game that I feel might suffer from a smaller controller screen is Super Mario Maker, but I'd have to see it first.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on April 13, 2016, 05:57:17 PM
I wonder if they could get the Wii U gamepad to sync with the NX on its own, allowing for backwards compatibility that way. It would also be an encouragement to Wii U adopters to upgrade because they could continue to get use out of their previous system investment.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 13, 2016, 06:09:22 PM
The controller isn't the reason it won't be backward compatible, that's because of the architecture change. They'd have to either include the Wii U hardware as part of the NX or do a whole lot of work with emulation for limited compatibility like Microsoft is now with Xbox One.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 13, 2016, 08:05:13 PM
Yeah, THAT is what to read out of this.  That I don't want up-to-date specs to raise the price.  Not, you know, the fucking screen controller.  If the controller didn't affect the price then why is the Wii U the price it is?  No price cut, not at a price point that works as a secondary console and yet with outdated specs that in theory should make it easier to lower the price.  I can come to two conclusions - either the Gamepad costs a fair chunk and keeps the price of the console high or Nintendo for some idiotic reason has willingly decided to keep the price high on a console that has failed to sell at the current price point but could perhaps sell better at a lower one like its predecessor was able to.  Nintendo is either handcuffed by the Gamepad or fucking stupid.  Nintendo pretty much saved the 3DS by lowering the price so why would they NOT do it for the Wii U if they could?
Yeah, that is what I'm taking from your post because this has already been addressed many times so spare me your sarcasm. Here's the link to this three year old CNN Money story again. (http://money.cnn.com/video/technology/2013/03/18/t-ts-nintendo-wii-u-teardown.cnnmoney/) The Gamepad components were estimated at $79.25 in 2013, $24.75 of which was the touchscreen. The rest is basically a wash between the GamePad and DualShock 4 (the latter also has all that motion control stuff you hate). You're kicking up a fuss over less than $25 in 2013 so that cost is actually less now because that's what happens when technology matures. A 480p screen was hardly top of the line even when Wii U launched. If a Gamepad successor included a better screen, that screen would probably be around $25 in 2016.

Nintendo didn't drop the price of Wii U because it wouldn't have had nearly the same impact. It has dominated the handheld market since 1989. Crawling on bloody stumps over hot coals to save 3DS during the handheld's first year was the only logical choice. And do you not remember how badly the 3DS price drop fucked up Nintendo's financials? That fiscal year was Nintendo's first ever full-year loss since going public. To further put that in perspective, Nintendo went public in 1962. That collective clusterfuck was so bad Satoru Iwata took a 67% pay cut.
Quote
I'm totally on board with it as an optional feature and I think using the handheld would be the best approach (it would be more adopted than selling a separate Gamepad).  But I think bundling it in is a stupid idea, unless by magic it does not affect the price.
Here's the thing: I actually agree with the first part. I've been saying for quite some time that while there should absolutely be a version of the GamePad on NX, it should be optional. The GamePad can be packaged with games that largely require it like a follow-up to Super Mario Maker with the understanding that both game and controller are also sold separately. There's definitely a place for that controller (namely Virtual Console), but it isn't the point of NX.

Bundling the GamePad with NX wouldn't be a bad move because of the price (as painfully explained to you for the eleventy billionth time). It'd be a bad move because Nintendo should be distancing itself from Wii U (at least until nostalgia kicks in years from now). Nintendo can't do that by launching a similar package. Let NX be NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 14, 2016, 12:43:17 AM
Beyond Adrock's correct point that the screen itself wasn't a huge cost sink in the WiiU, in a GamePad-less scenario it still would have cost $300 bucks. I can't see how a generic 360-level Nintendo console at that point would have fared noticeably better. The screen at least gives the WiiU an identity and provided a solid benefit with off-screen play and second screen management, even if actual showcase uses were rare. There were some cool ones though! There's nothing quite like the Nintendo Land Mario Chase-type games, had great fun the few times it came together to play it with people. It's looking like a failed evolutionary tree, but like the second screen of the 3DS I think having the extra panel is totally worthwhile going forward even if it's just a convenience thing for the most part.

I am also a huge proponent of second screens for general computing, I've been doing it for years in the home office and I feel very claustrophobic when cut back down to one monitor elsewhere.

Edit: Sort of an aside, but I was just trying to think about what game I would be viscerally excited for at this point, and I think it's down to whatever Retro's got cooking. They've lost attention do to the DK games, but between the Prime games and the Returns games, I think they're arguably one of the very best studios working today. I've been going on the assumption that I'll hold off on whatever the NX is, but if there's an awesome Retro roll-out at E3 I could change my tune.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 14, 2016, 02:37:03 AM
I think Retro and EAD Tokyo are arguably the two best development studios in the industry, and both of them are in a position to have something ready at or near the NX launch based on when their last release was. Nintendo wants to hit the ground running, to give people reasons to buy the thing early, and that would be a hell of a one-two punch early on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 14, 2016, 02:56:48 AM
While I think EAD is NOW a great studio (not too fond of their previous efforts), Retro has been consistently good for a while, and that's factoring in some of the people that have come and gone through the company.

I assume that EAD would be doing a Mario title, but I'd honestly like Retro to have the opportunity to do their own thing. A new IP, perhaps. I mean, yes, I DO want a new Metroid, but that could be given to just about anyone.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 14, 2016, 03:43:15 AM
Yes, we've established that you feel that way about EAD Tokyo, but you're in the minority there. And while I'd agree that it'd be neat to see Retro get to do their own thing, I doubt it's going to happen. I think they're making Metroid again, for better or worse.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 14, 2016, 04:01:42 AM
Yeah, I hear you. ESPECIALLY if they're working with Sakamoto. If not, well... they're still probably working on it.

And hey, at least I like EAD now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 14, 2016, 06:59:03 AM
Retro needs to finish the fight that began when they purged all the people who make bad games in '08. So Donkey Kong Country Returns 3 if they're not making something new.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Dasmos on April 14, 2016, 09:28:26 AM
Yeah, I hear you. ESPECIALLY if they're working with Sakamoto. If not, well... they're still probably working on it.

And hey, at least I like EAD now.

What about Jungle Beat? That was their first and, in my opinion, best game.

I'd love a sequel. NX to have a compulsory bongo controller?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: lolmonade on April 14, 2016, 12:36:55 PM
Retro needs to finish the fight that began when they purged all the people who make bad games in '08. So Donkey Kong Country Returns 3 if they're not making something new.


The "Donkey Kong Country Returns" name needs to be old Yeller'd the same way New Super Mario Bros needs to be. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 14, 2016, 12:45:09 PM
The DKCR series, while worthy of it's critical acclaim, is one of Nintendo's least "sexy" franchises.  It's just not a series that invokes excitement.  I just really don't think launching a new home console with a 2D platformer in the year of Arceus 2016 is going to win people over.  I think the 3rd option for Retro would be best.  While I personally would prefer a new Metroid, it's hard to argue it as a system seller.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 14, 2016, 02:45:57 PM
Nintendo should want to avoid being too Wii U-like with the NX.  What was the big joke about the Wii U lineup?  That it was all 2D platformers!  So if EAD busts out a new NSMB and Retro a new DKCR as their first NX titles it's just playing into their detractors' hands.  I don't dislike 2D platformers but you might as well bust out Pac-Man style maze games and text adventures for all the selling power such a genre has in 2016.  Games like that came across as old fashioned on the N64.  A new console needs some pizazz.  Save the retro throwbacks for after the console is established.  They'll sell if there is an established user base as the Wii can attest to but will not move consoles.  The NX needs killer apps and that means games that are grand and ambitious and come across as something that couldn't be done on prior consoles.  DKC was done on the SNES.  The sort of person that would buy a new console for DKC probably did buy a Wii U for Tropical Freeze.  They're too small of a group.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 14, 2016, 04:17:15 PM
Retro needs to finish the fight that began when they purged all the people who make bad games in '08. So Donkey Kong Country Returns 3 if they're not making something new.

The "Donkey Kong Country Returns" name needs to be old Yeller'd the same way New Super Mario Bros needs to be. 


They at least only used it for the first game. They were still calling New Super Mario Bros. new the fourth time they did it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 14, 2016, 04:47:49 PM
I'm currently slogging through a very long thread on NeoGaf for any updates on 10k's info. I'm on page 20 of 72. I wish BlackNMild2k1 would take a break from the Marvel thread and post rumors like he used to so I can go back to being lazy while someone else does all the sleuthing for me.

Until I come across any juicy NX details, I'm honestly just waiting for Ian Sane to say the GamePad is expensive again. I should just bookmark my last post so I can copy and paste it later.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 14, 2016, 09:44:33 PM
The new rumor* on the streets is that the Retro Studios game is actually Donkey Kong 64 Returns.

*that I just made up
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on April 14, 2016, 10:40:18 PM
Donkey Kong Returns Tropical Freeze is one of the finest games of the last 10 years. However I agree that it's not the most "Sexy" of picks to launch a console.


Here's the thing, If Nintendo launches (window) the NX with some of my expected 3rd party titles (I fully expect Final Fantasy XV and Call of Duty: Future Warfare) plus Zelda, Mario Galaxy 3 and whatever Ubisoft( Just Dance, Ea and Skylanders, there might be room for one more DKC game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 14, 2016, 11:30:01 PM
Retro's Donkey Kong Country games are probably my two favorite 2D platformers since Mario 3, but doing another one isn't going to sell anyone an NX. The more I think about it, the likelier it seems that they're doing another Metroid game. It's something they have experience with, and would do more for the sales and street cred of the NX to have that than DKC. I don't think Nintendo trusts them enough to let them do their own IP, partially because of the turnover and partially because I'm not sure they'd trust any western studio to do that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 14, 2016, 11:43:46 PM
The new rumor* on the streets is that the Retro Studios game is actually Donkey Kong 64 Returns.

*that I just made up

I'd buy that at a moderately high price.

Retro's Donkey Kong Country games are probably my two favorite 2D platformers since Mario 3, but doing another one isn't going to sell anyone an NX. The more I think about it, the likelier it seems that they're doing another Metroid game. It's something they have experience with, and would do more for the sales and street cred of the NX to have that than DKC. I don't think Nintendo trusts them enough to let them do their own IP, partially because of the turnover and partially because I'm not sure they'd trust any western studio to do that.

Lord, I hope you're wrong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 15, 2016, 12:00:11 AM
Retro's Donkey Kong Country games are probably my two favorite 2D platformers since Mario 3, but doing another one isn't going to sell anyone an NX. The more I think about it, the likelier it seems that they're doing another Metroid game. It's something they have experience with, and would do more for the sales and street cred of the NX to have that than DKC. I don't think Nintendo trusts them enough to let them do their own IP, partially because of the turnover and partially because I'm not sure they'd trust any western studio to do that.


Street cred? Yes. Sales? No way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 15, 2016, 12:22:45 AM
Just the game would sell worse than DKC, but in terms of selling the system, I think Metroid would help more. The kind of people who'd buy NX for DKC were going to buy the thing anyway. Metroid is a different kind of thing from the rest of what Nintendo does, and would get more people to consider it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 15, 2016, 12:23:26 AM
Yeah, Tropical Freeze is one of my favorite games of all time, in a radically different genre from the Metroid Prime games, which are also some of my all time favorites. Playing through it on hard and watching the top speed runs really pounds in how fucking masterful everything about it is. I would be pumped to play a third game.

But they should do another Metroid next. If they can get even half as ahead of the curve as they were with Prime 1, it'll be worth it as an enthusiast prestige title even if the sales aren't huge. Probably no launch title games will do much over a million outside of a Mario platformer, so I think the timing is right for Retro to shift gears again for a title or two. Tanabe said he has a hook ready to go for Prime 4, so hopefully they've healed their working relationship.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 15, 2016, 12:48:36 AM
I would still bet one billion dollars with anyone here that Retro's next game is going to be a Metroid and I'm 99% sure it'll be Prime 4.  Once again, the whole reason we got Tropical Freeze in the first place is because DKC Returns sold over 6 million copies, which is more then the previous 3 Metroid Prime games sold combined.  Well Tropic Freeze only sold a little over 1 million, which is around what Prime 2 and 3 both sold.

Since the last Donkey Kong sold around what the previous Metroid before Returns sold, it gives Nintendo a reason to make Metroid again since Donkey Kong isn't exactly a bigger prioritize sales wise.  Actually it gives Nintendo a bigger reason to have a Metroid around the launch of the NX, since the sales show something like Donkey Kong thrive later on in the systems life when it has a much larger userbase, while a more hardcore series like Metroid would be better for the early part of it's life when it needs all the hardcore attention it can get to help drive early sales and hype.

And since Metroid Prime 1 is the best selling Metroid of all time, and Prime 3 is the last Metroid that didn't split the fanbase, it makes sense Nintendo would want Prime 4 since not only would that be the best bet to unite the fanbase again after Other M and Federation Force, but it the kind of game that will give a lot more variety to their upcoming lineup as well.  Yeah Tanabe said at last year's E3 they weren't working on it yet but he also said back in 2011 that Retro wasn't working on a sequel to Returns and we all know how that turned out.  Seriously, Nintendo execs have lied about what games are in development before and how far they are before so I wouldn't take his words too seriously.  I wouldn't be surprised if they've been working on Prime 4 since at least 2014, and it's planned on coming out sometime Early 2017, only to get delayed to the later Summer slot like Prime 3 did.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 15, 2016, 03:01:25 AM
I love Donkey Kong (agree that Tropical Freeze is a masterpiece) and I love Metroid Prime (also one of the best games of all time). So I'm conflicted, but I definitely think Metroid is the way to go.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on April 15, 2016, 03:28:34 AM
I'm currently slogging through a very long thread on NeoGaf for any updates on 10k's info. I'm on page 20 of 72. I wish BlackNMild2k1 would take a break from the Marvel thread and post rumors like he used to so I can go back to being lazy while someone else does all the sleuthing for me.

Until I come across any juicy NX details, I'm honestly just waiting for Ian Sane to say the GamePad is expensive again. I should just bookmark my last post so I can copy and paste it later.

LOL. If I had the time before, during and after work that I used to, I would probably be more engaged in the upcoming gen rumors/info.
And if that was the case, this thread probably wouldn't exist, as the Rumor thread would have continued to grow instead.

But I do now like being able to pop in here once every few weeks and see if anything of note has happened. So thanks guys for carrying that torch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 15, 2016, 09:51:21 AM
This whole back and forth about which game to make is the very problem with Nintendo. It shouldn't be do they make a Metroid or do they make a DKC, there needs to be both. They obviously can't have the same studio doing both so they need to divide their resources better. Having just a new Metroid, a new Mario, and the Wii U up-Ports or just having a new DK, a new Mario, and the Wii U up-ports are both going to have the same impact on sales and excitement for NX, in that people will shrug them off as whatever.

They obviously can't have all the big franchises out at once, nobody in their right mind should expect that, but they damn sure need to have everything on NX they can get. This bullshit of juggling the franchises around every generation is what pisses gamers off an alienates them the most. Wii might have been **** as a console in terms of horespower and the waggle hurt it more than helped it, but it had a damn solid line up of games, but only if you like retro gaming. Nintendo can't bank entirely on retro gaming anymore they desperately need to be relevant again.

What they need is to rush, yes rush, the quick and dirty up-ports as fast as they can while giving the major studios a new Mario, a new Metroid, and a new DKC, but then they need to shift to the stuff gamers have baan asking for, a new RPG that isn't paper Mario and then do a Paper Mario latter when the sales are there, a new more ambitous F-Zero that excites that crowd, but let that come after a new Mario Kart which will help bring in the rest of the racing crowd.

There is another problem with NX though, it can have a Game Pad or touch screen no problem but it had better not have motion controls period unless VR is a part of it at some point. If there isn't going to be any VR then move beyond motion controls and get back to the damn basics.

Nintendo also can't bank everything on just a few key titles, the whole point of consolidating is to increase output which means we should be getting as wide a variety as possible each year. If Mario launches with the system Metroid needs to be there save DKC for next year. Work towards a massive dungeon crawler type game in the style of Kingdom Hearts with Nintendo characters that makes good use of the Amiibo craze and get that out within year two. if they can up-port Smash and just focus on DLC characters, make a MAJOR deal out of launching Ice Climbers that will generate some buzz. They also need to set aside a team that does nothing but ports VC games so they can get 10 or more games out a week, preferably more.

The VC team and up-porting teams could work together to get some HD remasters going. If Nintendo could do one major franchise game a quarter like they are know for, but also step up VC and remasters, say do one every three months or so they could really increase interest in the machine. Focus on doing N64 and Game Cube HD-Remasters but don't do them like Wind Waker HD where they bank on it being a major release title, do it as an and one type deal, here is a new Pikmin game and a Super Mario 64 HD remaster 4 player, here is the new NX Mario Party and Star Fox Adventures HD remaster with alternate ending and streamlined game play. Here is the new Animal Crossing and Ocarina of time HD Remaster with whatever new content they can dream up, have a new Hd remaster to coincide with the every major title and ten new VC console games a week the hard core and casual Nintendo gamers come back and that gives 3rd parties incentive to return too.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 15, 2016, 12:09:58 PM
Supermario2K makes me appreciate the brevity and variety of Ian's posts.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 15, 2016, 12:22:22 PM
Depressing how Retro is destined to pump out games with only moderate success. They need to take the pulse of gamers; DK and M are good series but maybe they need to take a nap and look at Splatoon/Sunset Overdrive/90s retro as the next craze. Splatoon First Person Adventure anyone?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 15, 2016, 01:10:56 PM
The two genres that you see the most these days are open world and FPS and Nintendo really hasn't had anything to offer in either genre.  Splatoon is similar to an FPS and they're making an open world Zelda so they're kind of moving in that direction.  But the HD era of consoles started a little over 10 years ago so that's the videogame world a teenager today grew up in.  What does a young person that never experienced Nintendo prior to the Wii think of them and their games?  What does a game like DKC Returns look like from those eyes?  I imagine games like Halo and GTA are as standard of a template of videogames for these people as Super Mario Bros. was for me and a sidescrolling platformer probably looks as ancient as single-screen score based games looked to me.  Metroid Prime will come across as more modern than DK just simply by being first person.

Nintendo plays a lot to nostalgia but that's catering to a pretty old demographic now.  If the NX launches this winter I'll be just shy of 35.  We're talking an age group that's almost certainly at least 30 and into their early 40s.  People that age have careers and families and don't have the time to just slurp up games like kids, teens and young adults do.  For younger people Nintendo are probably that old company that did that Wii Sports thing.  What will Nintendo have for the NX launch that will attract those people's attention?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 15, 2016, 01:28:01 PM
That's a nice, inquisitive, and positive post. Thank you.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on April 15, 2016, 01:43:02 PM
Retro has earned the privilege to make whatever game they want. If that is Donkey Kong, Metroid or whatever. Actually, I wouldn't mind if they mixed the 2 and made Metroid Dread, 2D game using the Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze engine, modified of course.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 15, 2016, 04:59:40 PM
Nintendo has never been good at getting teenagers though. When we were kids, we all played Nintendo, but as teenagers most of us migrated to either Sega or Sony, SNES did alright comparatively but it struggled the first couple of years, and didn't really take off until around the time the entire industry was on the verge of collapse especially Sega, who did collapse just a few years latter.

Nintendo basically starts over every generation with the kids and desperately tries to hold onto, or win back, the gamers that moved on. They will do just fine targeting the 30+ crowd, which is the age group that spends the most money on games, who cares which groups sends the most time on games that's not relevant at all. Teenagers fuel the Xbox and Playstation but even Playstation is beginning to reap the benefits of nostalgia which I think, 20th anniversary of PS1 and all that, probably helped build the hype for PS4 as much as anything else.

Nintendo so Ian says Nintendo needs to make an open world game because that is what Sony and MS has, except Sony doesn't make open world games, Sony makes racing games, fighting games, and a few Nintendo knock offs, with some narrative stuff sprinkled in. They also don't make that many FPS games either, neither does Microsoft for that matter, those are all 3rd party games, presumably if Nintendo can attract the right audience, and a large enough segment of it, they can get those games to come back, Game Cube had open world games, it had FPS games, even Wii had a few, there is no reason NX can't also. Nintendo can't worry about 3rd parties entirely, they need to make the machine accessible, make the best games they can, price it right, target their core audience while making it accessible to as many people as possible and actually market the hell out of it. They do that by having more variety, which I outlined a path to that but someone else mocked me for it because maybe they just want Nintendo to make one game a year forever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 15, 2016, 05:02:47 PM
I'd say the majority of the top posers on this forums were teenagers during the n64 era(in our early 30s now). I'd say Goldeneye, Smash Bros, and Mario Kart have been pretty popular with teenagers.

If Nintendo made 3 years of nothing but M rated titles there would still be a big group that says "Nintendo just makes kiddie games"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 15, 2016, 05:21:10 PM
Also, what the hell were kids playing in their DS systems all last decade? To say newer generations haven't grown up with some sort of Nintendo IP is ridiculous.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 15, 2016, 05:27:06 PM
Okay, let's try this again. Nintendo 64 sold how many? It might have appealed to the loyalists, but what Nintendo console hasn't appealed to them? If you think Playstation wasn't fueled by teenagers then you were living on a deserted island in the 90's. Nintendo has never been strong with teenagers. Just because some people who grew up with DK and Smash appealed to those people who just happened to be teenagers at the time doesn't prove it appealed to the broader category as a whole. And like it or not Nintendo does appeal to kids, just because some grown ups, myself included, also get into their games doesn't mean they don't try to make games that have broader appeal but you gotta admit it's always been a token effort at best.


BTW, Perm you just proved my point, NONE of the games you mentioned were made by Nintendo, bravo buddy thanks for playing. Nintendo has never made games that appeal to teenagers, and as a whole their consoles have never appealed to teenagers. They appeal to kids, and adults that grew up with them, and a few who stick with them even through the awkward teen years. Perm, go back in time and I promise you had more friends that were into Playstation, even people in your HS that weren't your friend, that were into Sega and Playstation, than N64.

Nobody was talking about Handhelds, the rules that apply to them have never applied to consoles it's an entirely different market, no different everything.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 15, 2016, 05:54:02 PM
Nobody was talking about Handhelds, the rules that apply to them have never applied to consoles it's an entirely different market, no different everything.

Only it isn't.  The people playing handhelds are still playing Nintendo games which shows Nintendo's current franchises are still strong with a large percentage of the gaming market.  During the DS/Wii era they got many of these people to buy both the handheld and home consoles.  Once again the Wii U's biggest problem is Nintendo gave little reason for people to own both since the 3DS had many of the same games that literally played the same.  Unlike the Wii era where there was a much bigger difference between their handheld and home console lineup.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 15, 2016, 06:26:23 PM
My point about the open world and FPS games is simply that Nintendo's games don't feel very modern.  They did when a game like Ocarina of Time came across a big ambitious title but not so much these days.  A reason why Zelda is going open world is probably because those types of games have replaced the traditional Zelda format as the ultimate epic videogame adventure.  A big part of Zelda's appeal is how grand it is and it doesn't look so grand anymore in its old format.

"Bigger is better" is an easy sell.  When a new console comes along people want to be blown away by what new possibilities the console provides.  That's why something like NSMB U was a poor choice for a flagship title.  It looks any sort of "oomph".  No one was looking for a console to play a sidescroller in 2012.  Doesn't mean it's a bad game it just doesn't knock anyone's socks off.  No one is going to play it in a demo kiosk with it's well done but unambitious gameplay and think "wow I have to buy this system!" and go tell all their friends unless they're already a big Nintendo fan.  So in Retro's case DKC won't make that kind of an impression.  Metroid could, if it comes across as ambitious like Super Metroid and Metroid Prime did in their time.

I know Nintendo has not been traditionally popular with teens but so what?  Nintendo has to be good at a lot of stuff they suck at for the NX to do well.  I can make the same excuses for third party support and online infrastructure.  Doesn't matter.  They have to improve on this stuff.  If they don't make improvements in their weak areas how are they going to do any better than the Wii U?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 16, 2016, 02:53:16 AM
YOU WANT RUMORS? WE GOT FAT STACKZ OF RUMORS. This from the Mos Eisley Cantina of video games, aka NEOGAF and has been apparently verified. Lots of info in here:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=201100330&postcount=4778

- WAN Remote Play built in
- Luigi's Mansion 3
- Horse power
- Lots of games
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 16, 2016, 03:01:36 AM
A better dumb terminal will be nice to have. The Wii U GamePad is a nice idea, the GamePad we got was just too cheap (and simultaneously too expensive). Adding enough fancy chips for remote play with any suitable internet connection is a neat trick to add.

The AMD-centric one is curious. I'm dubious of the NX adopting the next-generation 14 nm chips from AMD. It's not in contemporary Nintendo's style to use such potentially expensive chips. But after the failure of the Wii U, maybe this is finally the time where Nintendo feels they need to go for it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 16, 2016, 03:59:22 AM
Okay, let's try this again. Nintendo 64 sold how many? It might have appealed to the loyalists, but what Nintendo console hasn't appealed to them? If you think Playstation wasn't fueled by teenagers then you were living on a deserted island in the 90's. Nintendo has never been strong with teenagers. Just because some people who grew up with DK and Smash appealed to those people who just happened to be teenagers at the time doesn't prove it appealed to the broader category as a whole. And like it or not Nintendo does appeal to kids, just because some grown ups, myself included, also get into their games doesn't mean they don't try to make games that have broader appeal but you gotta admit it's always been a token effort at best.


BTW, Perm you just proved my point, NONE of the games you mentioned were made by Nintendo, bravo buddy thanks for playing. Nintendo has never made games that appeal to teenagers, and as a whole their consoles have never appealed to teenagers. They appeal to kids, and adults that grew up with them, and a few who stick with them even through the awkward teen years. Perm, go back in time and I promise you had more friends that were into Playstation, even people in your HS that weren't your friend, that were into Sega and Playstation, than N64.

Nobody was talking about Handhelds, the rules that apply to them have never applied to consoles it's an entirely different market, no different everything.

I don't live in a revisionist history. Goldeneye was published by Nintendo. It was made by Rare, but Nintendo owned just shy of the majority share. When they sold their shares to Microsoft they got $375 million dollars. Smash Bros was made by Hal Labs. If you didn't know Hal Labs offices are located inside the Nintendo Kyoto offices. Miyamoto or Iwata meerly had to take an elevator or staircase to take a look at what was going on during development. Actually, Iwata would just stay put. He was president of Hal. Who else makes Mario Kart? Nintendo makes Mario Kart. Mario Kart 64 was made at EAD. The house of Mario and Zelda. Every game I mentioned was published or made by Nintendo.

lets take a walk through history.

Playstation comes out in 1994. During this time period Nintendo is still releasing SNES games. When it comes out it is met with mild applause. It does well, but not super well. At this time period I never saw any Playstations in stores. I do see Sega NOMAD, 32x, and Virtual Boy.

1995 Nintendo is still making snes games. Games like Donkey Kong Country and Metroid are in stores. If you walked into like a Target you would see an snes hooked up with Donkey Kong Country. Killer Instinct is in full force at arcades and is the big thing. Tekken is around, but not in a big way. You might walk into a k-mart arcade and see Soul Edge. During this time period you start to see some interest in Playstation in some magazines. Sega Saturn comes out in 1995 out of nowhere. At this point you start to see a lot of magazines start to compare Saturn and Playstation a lot. Meanwhile in the rumor section of the magazine there are rumblings about whatever Nintendo is doing. Its a big newspoint that Nintendo is working with the Silicon Graphics company.

1996 two big tings come out Nintendo 64, and Tickle-me-elmo. Initially both products are highly popular and sell out. There is a shortage though. Getting an n64 was big among my friends. Getting an n64 was more like getting a PS3.  You weren't cool if you didn't have one.

At this point if you were to walk into a Toys R Us you would see a trio of systems. Saturn, Playstation, and N64. The first time I played Playstation was in a Toys R Us. They had Mortal Kombat Trilogy on display. But **** that. Mario 64 was on display and the game was something to behold. I've always been a Nintendo/Sega/Pc gamer. We had 3d games on the computer. But they were all 2.5D shooters like Doom and Hexen. Ok maybe there were a few polygonal games like Stunts or Flight simulator. We also have to take into account that the games on Playstation were not using its power. Mario 64 was a revelation of just the amazing synthesis of ideas. It was special. There were lines in the store of people who wanted to play at the kiosk.

Christmas came, Christmas went. I really wanted an n64 that year. For consolation I got Super Mario Bros 2. and an Atari Jaguar with AVP, Cybermorph, Raiden, and NBA Jam. I stared to save some money to buy an n64 myself instead of relying on my parents. Resident Evil came out, but I didn't hear abut it until 1998. It wasn't an exclusive though. It was on Saturn too. D(Dī no Shokutaku) was a scary game too. Also Multiplatform.

The year is 1997. Playstation is this console that did well against snes, but got totally decimated when n64 came out. My brother was a big Sega fan. He collected a lot of magazines. I still possess these, because its a good refresher to read some journalism from the actual time period as opposed to the revised opinion of somebody who wasn't even sperm yet. If you had bought an n64 the previous Christmas you would notice something. There weren't a lot of games coming out for n64 in the future.

A game is coming out that will change everything: Final Fantasy VII. At this point people start to make a bigger deal about how n64 doesn't possess the storage capacity in cartridges.  I have to say though to me. No big deal. Mario 64 would still be a hot product in 1997. I rented an n64 from Blockbuster. I played the **** out of Mario 64. It was a hard game for a 13 year old. I mastered it though. I got an n64 for Christmas with Mario 64 and Diddy Kong Racing.

I went to a friends birthday party in February of 1998. At that house was an amazing game that would sell more than 8 million copies. Goldeneye 007. My birthday was in March. I payed 69.99 for that game, plus tax.
During a free day in 8th grade I got to see some wrestling games like wcw vs nwo world tour and cool boarders. Went to a few other friends houses and saw FFVII and more cool boarders.

I have to say at this point Nintendo captures the majority of the market share (IE more n64s were sold then Playstations had been sold in the last 3 years. But not by much. Sega Saturn wimpers off in the distance as I enter high school after the summer. I see an add in an Electronics Gaming Monthly magazine. Ye Snooze Ye Lose. Get the gold copy of Zelda. It was the thing in  my life I antiscipated the most. When I got it in Novemeber It did not dissapoint. In fact it moved the bar so damn high.

I have to note Starcraft and Half-Life came out on the PC that year. Metal Gear came out on Playstation. I didn't have a psx yet. Pokemon comes out too. It is a gigantic sales champion for Nintendo. Banjo Kazooie also comes out.

Lets skip to 1999-2000. And let me start to cut this short. N64 games dry up, psx games do the opposite. Dreamcast comes out and is a best selling system that breaks initial release sales records. Nobody buys the games though. Everyone pirates them. It was not at all hard to pirate dreamcast games. Sony captures the market share and maintains it. Sega captures 20% of the market share, but doesn't get further. Nintendo 64, which started off strong ultimately doesn't grow much after its initial popularity.

There is a severe drought in games for Nintendo. People have now completely switched from getting their news from magazines to getting their news from online. Oh and Playstation games are now only $9.99 while n64 game are still $60-$70. My brother won a playstation at his HS graduation. He didn't play it much. A friend gave me MGS which was awesome, but the second disc never worked. I tried FFVII again, and still hated it. My brother combined our Birthday money and bought a dreamcast. I had originally bought Aidyn Chronicles, which sucked, I took it back and thats where my money for Dreamcast came. We purchased probably only 3 games for the system. The rest we acquired This satisfied me during the n64 drought. I would have bought psx games if most of them weren't terrible. I did buy resident evil 3.

We hear news of ps2, Microsoft announces Xbox, Sega drops out. Nintendo releases games few and far between at this point. Gamecube gets announced. PS2 comes out, PSone comes out. N64 sales stop.

2 years into ps2 Playstation is still around. Still selling consoles. Nintendo is making gamecube.

What you should learn from this is.

Playstation started 2 years earlier than n64, if it had launched against n64 it wouldn't have gone off the ground. Playstation had continued well after Nintendo had moved on.

I would say the games people did buy for all sold well. Ultimately, the price of the games was a big factor. Getting a game for $9.99 is more appealing than getting multi color consoles and then paying 7 times as much for an n64 game.

Also, the lack of games. So many droughts of games. People would say Nintendo was kiddy. Even while you were beating them at Goldeneye. Console sales were pretty even until game droughts happened in 1999. Nobody wants to buy a system with nothing on the horizon(look at wii u). The n64 ultimately sold 32 million.
If you don't think 32 million people is a lot, consider this, that is almost the entire population of Canada.

But the biggest argument was that there were almost 2000 games for psx and only almost 400 for n64

also Final Fantasy Vii

lets also take into account the combined sales of GBA, GBC, GB, SNES, n64 vs psx and ps2 during that time period of 1994 till 2004. One would find that Nintendo sold more systems and games than Sony. Also, note Sony wouldn't be outputting much themselves besides wipeout and ape escape. Sony relied entirely on 3rd parties during this period. Nintendo had far more on their plate despite the narrative given by revisionist.

also note. In high school I wrote school papers about bias in video game journalism. I remember my interactions with people. I saw the shift, but it seemed to happen to some extant by media manipulation. Also, very shortly after EVERYONE had the internet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 16, 2016, 04:01:38 AM
From the same thread:

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/shyguy70/0AG4tWY_zpsudhmq6et.jpg) (http://s91.photobucket.com/user/shyguy70/media/0AG4tWY_zpsudhmq6et.jpg.html)

Also, there has been rumors/speculation of Call of Duty, Madden, The Division, and WatchDogs 2.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 16, 2016, 05:19:22 AM
I could start a part 2 about how on late n64 through Gamecube Nintendo SPECIFICALLY sought to improve its reputation with teen and mature gamers.

Eternal Darkness(Nintendo contracted Silikon Knights to make a survival horror game), it is an excellent game.
Conkers BFD Nintendo let Rare turn Conker into a violent sexual game
Perfect Dark was actually published by Nintendo.
Sin and Punishment when announced was supposed to be Nintendo and Treasures effort to get Nintendo to make A T rated game. It didn't come out though.
Someone somehow convinced Angel Studios and Capcom to get Resident Evil 2 on n64. It was a 64MB cartridge. INSANITY
The Metroid Prime Series is rated Teen
The Resident Evil Remake, Resident Evil 0, and Resident Evil 4 was initially exclusive to Gamecube, I'm sure a money hat were involved. Resident Evil 2 and 3 were also ported.
Nintendo made a big effort with Konami to get Metal Gear solid on Gamecube
Yamauchi created a weird Q fund to get a Final Fantasy Game(Chrystal Chronicles) on gamecube T rated
Nintendo published Geist (it was mediocre and mostly forgotten)
Star Fox Adventures was rated T
Smash Bros is Rated T

none of these efforts changed the perception of Nintendo. Nintendo then decided "**** it, these rubes are stupid" and released Zelda Wind Waker. I also want to note a lot of people thought PS2 was more powerful than GCN. Nintendo stopped bothering releasing specs. They never mattered. If an opinion never changes despite new information than you are dealing with insanity. The only way to go against that is to go the other way.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 16, 2016, 10:22:23 AM
Big rumor dump from 10k on Gaf. http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=201100330#post201100330

T3
The NX controller will have a screen controller of some kind. Not known if it will be standard or optional. It won't have any processing power, more like a dummy Vita. But then this won't be the NX handheld either. I dunno, this rumor seems like a bunch of bullshit.

T2
Luigi's Mansion 3 in development - Next Level Games is supposedly doing it. Was a Wii U game at one point.

T1
The NX will use a custom Polaris-like GPU - There's a bunch of tech stuff on the post, I'm just going to put his tl;dr here:
Quote
The NX GPU is using features that are debuting on the Polaris chip, and is therefore heavily speculated to be a Polaris chip, as that would work well in a handheld too and help AMD prove they can make low wattage chips with good performance for small devices. (GCN 1.3, Vulkan, Primitive Discard Accelerator, etc)

Nintendo is using Vulkan with NX - Ties in with the Polaris GPU thing. Mentions a dev porting a PS4 game to NX.

Most dev kits won't be given until Nintendo formally reveals the NX - If this is true, don't expect a lot of games at launch, then.

MercurySteam has a dev kit and is making an already announced game for the NX. - Raiders of the Broken Planet maybe?

Final Fantasy XV on NX.

NX will likely launch at different times per region. - Because of the (cutting-edge) chips, there might not be enough ready for a Holiday 2016 launch.

There are lots of NX games in development. - Another quote
Quote
"And you can quote me on this on GAF too: "I think NX software output is going to blow away Wii U. There's a LOT of games in development. I don't know if we'll see all of them at E3, since a lot of Wii U projects weren't announced until January 2013, but I'm very impressed so far with what I'm hearing."

New IP are being developed.

My take? This is a lot of wishful thinking. The "NX will have lots of games" crowd doesn't jive with "most people will only get dev kits after NX is presented" crowd.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 16, 2016, 12:13:01 PM
Ha, I just got to that post after slogging through 96 pages of that NeoGaf thread. I'm glad I don't have to summarize it. Thanks, Soren!

NX Gimmick: I expect a screen controller, but I don't think it should be included in the console. I'm not worried about the cost so much as the stigma of launching a new console with a similar hook as Wii U. I suppose if Nintendo pushes it to the background and let's the games speak for themselves. When Nintendo unveiled the GamePad, the presentation was essentially, "FOR ****'S SAKE, LOOK AT THIS CONTROLLER!" Focus on the games and how they interact with Nintendo Network and My Nintendo, and I think that sends a much better message.

What's described by 10k sounds like one of those things that would only work in a perfect world. What's the point of taking the controller out of your house if it's main selling point requires a personal hotspot or WiFi connection? How often will people find themselves in a scenario where that's viable?

Enhanced GamePad streaming sounds good though. It wasn't great when trying to play from a different room or just to get something from my kitchen. My current apartment isn't that large. My new apartment is actually larger (my kitchen and living room are on opposite ends now). Outside of improved streaming, Nintendo should focus on making it smaller and lighter.

Luigi's Mansion 3: I'm somewhat surprised Next Level Games isn't an official Nintendo second party developer.

Custom Polaris-like GPU: FinFet 14 nm is pretty cool if true. Generally, that means better performance per watt (AMD describes it as a "historic leap" from Radeon to Polaris, you can decide if that's just marketing/PR) which is something Nintendo likes. This would be the most aggressive Nintendo has been in adopting modern tech in... probably ever. AMD is moving to 14 nm this year. For context, Wii U's GPU was on a 40 nm node in 2012 when AMD already had 28 nm GPUs for a year. NX having a 14 nm GPU tends to be hotly debated on tech forums. There's a push in that community that Nintendo should go with 14nm process with skepticism that AMD could have it ready for a Q4 2016 NX launch in the yields that Nintendo wants according to that DigiTimes report, or even what the minimum Nintendo would need available.

The part of the rumor that starts describing power is really weird and practically pointless since it has so little context. NX's GPU is "marginally" better than PS4's GPU, theoretically twice as powerful as PS4's GPU, and theoretically close to PS4K. What? Fine. Ultimately, it's more powerful than PS4. This goes along with leaks we've been hearing from Emily Rogers, IndieGamerChick, etc.

So far, we've heard that both CPU and GPU outperform PS4. That's great and all, but put that into context. PS4's CPU was not good in 2013 and the GPU was mid-tier. Is NX three years ahead of PS4? Does it have to be? Is this impressive, or just impressive "for a Nintendo console?" We should all accept the fact that extra power isn't going to help Nintendo that much. If NX even gets multiplatform games, doesn't expect significantly better performance. Like 10k said, it'd be stuff like steadier frame rate and enhanced effects. To the average consumer, they're probably not going to notice.

The idea that AMD pushed Nintendo to adopt a 14 nm process is both encouraging and exciting. This may actually be the result of the rumor that Nintendo is going with AMD for both console and handheld, in which performance per watt is extremely important in the latter. Early adoption drops the price of 14 nm faster. The more business AMD gets, the better. AMD cutting a deal with Nintendo to supply APUs for both console and handheld is the best case scenario for both companies as well as consumers.

Using Vulkan on NX: Nintendo joining the Kronos Group was one of those announcements that flew under the radar last year. The implications of this are rather encouraging. Nintendo is taking an active role in staying modern. Unity, Epic, Valve, and Dice have all contributed to the creation of Vulkan even if none have games that use it (yet?). Simply put, every major engine maker has supported and been involved with Vulkan so Nintendo being a contributing member of the Kronos group that developed Vulkan is only a good thing.

Most Development Kits Won't be Given Out Until NX is Formally Revealed: If porting is as easy as rumors suggest, this probably sounds worse than it actually is.

---

I don't have much to say about the other stuff. I generally like MercutySteam though Raiders of the Broken Planet isn't particularly my kind of game. Any non-shovelware game Nintendo scores is a good thing. So same goes for Final Fantasy XV. I would personally like remakes of Final Fantasy VI and IX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on April 16, 2016, 02:05:10 PM
I'd be pretty happy with another screen controller but in a way that's done more like the patents. It should be small, sleek and look like something out of the future. The gamepad just looks like an old school clunky Gamegear. With a little screen in the center that's as small and as high quality as your typical smart phone's then it won't appear as intrusive to consumers. With these free form displays keeping the shape of a typical controller instead of forcing to be a rectangle, I think that in it's self would make a screened controller at least visually more appealing.

I love off tv play. It's great when I want to kinda watch tv at the same time or when I need to hide and keep quiet early in the morning while my kids are still sleep.

Just make that controller and the system itself look completely different than the Wii stuff before it. Luckily the new president already expressed his opinion about the Wii U looking far too similar to the Wii so I expect the form factor to be a non-issue.

These rumors are crazy, sort of. Seems almost too good to be true right? I'm optimistic.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 16, 2016, 02:53:22 PM
I just realized I want to play Final Fantasy XV and Dragon Quest XI.

BUT I swore Zelda Wii U would be my last video game. Soooo, maybe at the end of the NX's lifespan. Maybe.

Oh, who am I kidding. Once the next Xeno title comes out I'll probably buy an NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 16, 2016, 03:53:10 PM
Oh, who am I kidding. Once the next Xeno title comes out I'll probably buy an NX.
You will join us, or die.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on April 16, 2016, 06:29:38 PM
That is a rumor that gets me pumped like the good old days. A lot of winning titles if even half of those turn out to be true.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 16, 2016, 08:31:32 PM
If Nintendo is smart they'll have several upgraded wii u/ps4/xboxone titles for NX launch.

I personally would be fine if NX was an improved ps4 with an improved wii u controller at bare minimum.

Marketing will be the most important aspect moving forward with NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 16, 2016, 09:13:33 PM
The Luigi'd Mansion 3 rumor is something I can easily see being true.  Dark Moon, despite being a sequel to a decade old Gamecube launch title that had a lukewarm reception, managed to sell over 4 million copies, which is a million more then the original Gamecube title did.  I can see Nintendo wanting to strike while the iron is still hot, especially since the team that made Dark Moon is still around at Next Level and doesn't have anything more important to make.

Plus there was a rumor several years ago that Nintendo was working on a Wii U port of both Luigi's Mansion: Dark Moon and Kid Icarus: Uprising.  That would easily explain the part about the game originally being a Wii U titles since Nintendo could have decided turning development making it a full fledged sequel was a better option then a port. 


Hey if that is indeed what is happening, maybe the Kid Icarus: Uprising port was turned into a sequel as well and will also hit the NX.  Of course that's harder to do since the original team was basically Sakurai with a bunch of freelance designers Nintendo hired to work with him.  Unless Sakurai is willing to come back to work on a sequel, I don't see who else Nintendo would hire to make a sequel except for maybe Platinum, but after Star Fox maybe they might do just that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 16, 2016, 09:18:37 PM
Marketing will be the most important aspect moving forward with NX.
I'd put price above marketing. Nintendo is going to have a hard time selling NX for anything over $300. If the 14 nm Polaris rumor is true, some people are thinking $400. I could probably convince myself to pay $400 for a Nintendo console, but not the average consumer. I'm part of the dwindling fanbase who buys Nintendo hardware first and asks questions later. I like the first party output, and I don't have time for a lot of games as my backlog illustrates. I've always liked having at least a PlayStation, but I'm finding it harder to justify purchasing more than one console these days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 16, 2016, 10:27:13 PM
Oh, who am I kidding. Once the next Xeno title comes out I'll probably buy an NX.

Here's my pipe dream, it's E3 2017, NX is a console with some handheld component (although I don't see how that works) and has been out for six months.
They've shown some good stuff but this is it the final announcement. President Kimishima addresses the viewers and explains they have one last surprise in store, screen fades to black...

*Beautiful piano music

(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/0ae589acd4c044ed2d555f0150b573_zpsc63jmfdq.png)

The melody kicks in as well as a gameplay montage, it's a fantasy RPG, story driven, linear, 3rd person over the shoulder, HD, new IP set in a tropical land. Vibrant lush green forests and sandy beaches. In comes the battle system it's turn based with elements of time management, with the crux being that there's no mp and instead actions take up different amounts of time to windup, execute and then return to a ready stance.
Quick few shots of the cinematics; it's an age old coming of age tale with drama, romance and a giant tortoise.

(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/2zget8p_zpswutniggv.jpg)

That's right because the end goal of the quest and hence the name of the game (according to a random name generator) is "Tortoise of the North".
Who is this tortoise?
Where is the tortoise?(The north)
Why a tortoise?

The tortoise is shrouded in mystery, but what isn't is the release date as it's this holiday.
*Fade to black.
(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/gfs_29177_2_17_zpsrbukpmiz.jpg)

*Fade back to the Monolith Soft/ Nintendo logo. Music begins to build up.

(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/0ae589acd4c044ed2d555f0150b573_zpsc63jmfdq.png)

What is this? Another one?
And is that Mika Kobiyashi I hear?
"It's something about this planet"
The Sawano drop occurs and a big blue logo splashes onto the screen.

Xenoblade Chronicles 3
     In development
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 17, 2016, 12:18:51 AM
As much as I adore Mika Kobayashi's vocals and Hiroyuki Sawano's style, I would prefer if Tetsuya Takahashi picked a different and new composer or group of composers for his next Xeno game. Sawano's "FULL ANIME" style meshed well with Xenoblade Chronicles X's sci-fi trappings for me, but there were more than a few people that didn't take the "FULL ANIME" music well.

On the NX potentially using AMD's 14 nm chips: This is a path that I don't at all expect Nintendo to take, but truly hope they do. Granted this will make the NX prohibitively expensive for little gain as the current PlayStation 4 secures the place of being the lead development platform for home console games. But I badly want to live in a world where Nintendo arguably has the most powerful home console for a few years, even if it means practically no difference when it comes to most software for the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 17, 2016, 12:21:57 AM
I don't really get the Golden Axe reference, but what you described sounded neat!

However, you clearly want Xenoblade Chronicles X 2, not Xenoblade Chronicles 3. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 hasn't even coe out yet!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 17, 2016, 12:45:28 AM
As much as I adore Mika Kobayashi's vocals and Hiroyuki Sawano's style, I would prefer if Tetsuya Takahashi picked a different and new composer or group of composers for his next Xeno game. Sawano's "FULL ANIME" style meshed well with Xenoblade Chronicles X's sci-fi trappings for me, but there were more than a few people that didn't take the "FULL ANIME" music well.

On the NX potentially using AMD's 14 nm chips: This is a path that I don't at all expect Nintendo to take, but truly hope they do. Granted this will make the NX prohibitively expensive for little gain as the current PlayStation 4 secures the place of being the lead development platform for home console games. But I badly want to live in a world where Nintendo arguably has the most powerful home console for a few years, even if it means practically no difference when it comes to most software for the NX.

I poked around the NeoGAF thread myself, and the most coherent conjecture seems to be: Nintendo was planning on a 20 nm computer brain in 2014 for the NX, when AMD was still actively developing 20 nm stuff. But then AMD decided to drop 20 nm stuff and leap frog down to 14nm, which resulted in Nintendo getting a "free" upgrade. Polaris itself probably won't be ready, but Nintendo could be using a grabbag of Polaris features that are already ready to go, resulting in a sort of hybrid intergenerational chip deal for the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 17, 2016, 07:05:42 AM
My reasoning is that traditionally Monolith Soft can handle more than one game at once, in 2015 we saw the release of Project X Zone 2 and Xenoblade Chronicles X and in the past we have seen titles like Soma Bringer, Disaster Day of Crisis both releasing in 2008, it'd make sense if now that developers are working on a single shared architecture (or it could be streamed but that doesn't seem likely to me) they get games out on that console twice as fast. For example if Mario Kart 9 comes out on both handheld and console NX that frees up the Mario Kart team to make something like F Zero where traditionally they would be trapped devoting most of their resources to Mario Kart, since as soon as they finish one another one is needed for a upcoming system on the horizon.

Takahashi has made comments about his next game not being tied down to a specific genre and story structure closer to a JRPG. From one section of the fans you see a desire for a change of pace with less FULL ANIME bombastics. Another section wants to see a continuation of the open world sci-fi style of X and an evolution of it's story and mechanics.

(http://i738.photobucket.com/albums/xx24/anthonydranfield/Mobile%20Uploads/hqdefault_zpscfgkycgy.jpg)

I don't really get the Golden Axe reference, but what you described sounded neat!

However, you clearly want Xenoblade Chronicles X 2, not Xenoblade Chronicles 3. Xenoblade Chronicles 2 hasn't even coe out yet!
I would like X-2 yes, but I feel that even having it called X-2 makes the game sound like a side step or stopgap for the next game. Psychologically I think it needs to be something like Xenoblade 3 or Xenoblade Z even if it is a continuation story wise from X.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 17, 2016, 12:17:33 PM
Honestly, I'd rather see a continuation of XCX's story with a "remastered version" including several new chapters that extend the ambiguous plotholes. I thought Takahashi stated he wanted to make his next game different from a story and visual standpoint? I think both the original Xenoblade and its sequel have vastly different "moods" so I trust that the result will be something fabulous.

I understand your reasoning in regards to the unification of the platforms, but Project X Zone and XCX are games of completely different scope and likely resource management. Expecting two rather grand RPGs from Monolith in close succession is a risky proposition, as they are great engine builders, whose tech has been utilized by Nintendo in many games. They'll need to help out with creating some of the groundwork for Nintendo's efforts on NX before they can consider tackling even one of those games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 17, 2016, 02:31:04 PM
That's true, especially if NX is as powerful as rumoured. Both the Nintendo support studio and the main Monolith Soft studio have had urgent hirings since October 2015.

Quote
The city part responsible planner
In the console game production experience, who have previously been responsible for the city part of the RPG
Welcome scripting ability, those who are program knowledge
Hot off of google translate this would suggest whatever they're doing next is an RPG with a city, which shouldn't come as too big of a surprise really.

http://www.monolithsoft.co.jp/recruit/recruit_01.html#planner
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 17, 2016, 02:44:55 PM
I know this won't happen but it would be really cool to have a spiritual successor to the Dawn of Discovery Wii game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on April 17, 2016, 05:30:57 PM
That was a fun game. I'd be down for more strategy games like that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 18, 2016, 02:04:46 AM
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=201228478&postcount=6923

From Emily:
Quote
Here is what multiple sources close to Nintendo are telling me about 10k's hardware rumors: The gimmick is made up. GPU is wrong. Power level is wrong." "The specs on NX are good, but a lot of the information being shared in this thread is incorrect.

I was told that NX has good specs, but the info in this thread on the GPU and power level is just not correct. Sorry to burst everyone's hype.

At some point, we had to get back to the ground. It was fun, though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 18, 2016, 08:35:10 AM
I'm braced enough to know that half of what was being said on that thread was bunk anyway. This is purely for entertainment purposes at this point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 18, 2016, 09:50:06 AM
So realistically we should just be expecting Wii U 2.0 but not calling it Wii U. Oh god what if they call it Wii NeXt. I will boycott the thing it if has Wii in the name at all I don't care if it's PS5 level specs and has every damn game I want.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 18, 2016, 11:43:21 AM
So realistically we should just be expecting Wii U 2.0 but not calling it Wii U. Oh god what if they call it Wii NeXt. I will boycott the thing it if has Wii in the name at all I don't care if it's PS5 level specs and has every damn game I want.

Could you do us a favor and start your Nintendo boycott like, now, and forswear any media or forums that have anything to do with Nintendo products?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 18, 2016, 01:06:30 PM
I think I know what I want Nintendo's next console to be called!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 18, 2016, 02:01:44 PM
The Nintendo "A Formal Apology to Ian Sane"?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 18, 2016, 02:03:02 PM
So realistically we should just be expecting Wii U 2.0 but not calling it Wii U. Oh god what if they call it Wii NeXt. I will boycott the thing it if has Wii in the name at all I don't care if it's PS5 level specs and has every damn game I want.

Could you do us a favor and start your Nintendo boycott like, now, and forswear any media or forums that have anything to do with Nintendo products?

That's a little harsh, why so hostile?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 18, 2016, 02:12:19 PM
Because you're playing games for the wrong reasons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on April 18, 2016, 02:34:58 PM
it was a JOKE!

I was making fun of the people who wouldn't buy Wii u because of the name. Lighten up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 18, 2016, 02:42:59 PM
I don't think you understand what the name has to do with people not buying it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 18, 2016, 03:08:24 PM
The Nintendo "A Formal Apology to Ian Sane"?

They can make it sound cooler:
Nintendo Reconciliation
Nintendo Reparation
Nintendo Penance

;)

All I ask is that they don't use Wii again or use some made up word that has us all going "Huh?  The Nintendo what now?"  And don't use "New" in the title.  Just pick a word that sounds like it has something to do with providing an entertaining experience or playing videogames or just sounds cool and could not be confused with something else.  I think it is hard to think of a good name but it's pretty easy to not use a terrible one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 18, 2016, 03:25:59 PM
But I think Wii 3 has a nice ring to it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 18, 2016, 07:01:49 PM
Super Wii U
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 18, 2016, 07:09:48 PM
Wii got Next, Bro
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 18, 2016, 07:16:58 PM
it was a JOKE!

I was making fun of the people who wouldn't buy Wii u because of the name. Lighten up.

That's exactly what the rat would have said.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 18, 2016, 07:18:43 PM
The Nintendo "A Formal Apology to Ian Sane"?

They can make it sound cooler:
Nintendo Reconciliation
Nintendo Reparation
Nintendo Penance

 ;)

All I ask is that they don't use Wii again or use some made up word that has us all going "Huh?  The Nintendo what now?"  And don't use "New" in the title.  Just pick a word that sounds like it has something to do with providing an entertaining experience or playing videogames or just sounds cool and could not be confused with something else.  I think it is hard to think of a good name but it's pretty easy to not use a terrible one.
I hear you. I would be baffled if they chose to use the words "New" or "Wii" in the title, myself. I understand they need to remove themselves from that branding.

Thanks for being a good sport.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 18, 2016, 08:20:32 PM
They can make it sound cooler:
Nintendo Reconciliation

This fall, get ready as Nintendo and Third Parties join together to create some smokin' hot make-up sex all over this current console generation. Making up is so hot to do. The Nintendo Reconciliation. Coming for a conjugal visit to a basement nearest you.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 18, 2016, 08:21:26 PM
The Nintendo "A Formal Apology to Ian Sane"?

They can make it sound cooler:
Nintendo Reconciliation
Nintendo Reparation
Nintendo Penance

;)

All I ask is that they don't use Wii again or use some made up word that has us all going "Huh?  The Nintendo what now?"  And don't use "New" in the title.  Just pick a word that sounds like it has something to do with providing an entertaining experience or playing videogames or just sounds cool and could not be confused with something else.  I think it is hard to think of a good name but it's pretty easy to not use a terrible one.
Wii're Sorry :smug:
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 18, 2016, 08:25:16 PM
The Nintendo "A Formal Apology to Ian Sane"?

They can make it sound cooler:
Nintendo Reconciliation
Nintendo Reparation
Nintendo Penance

;)

All I ask is that they don't use Wii again or use some made up word that has us all going "Huh?  The Nintendo what now?"  And don't use "New" in the title.  Just pick a word that sounds like it has something to do with providing an entertaining experience or playing videogames or just sounds cool and could not be confused with something else.  I think it is hard to think of a good name but it's pretty easy to not use a terrible one.
Wii're Sorry :smug:

Ha ha ha! That gets an up vote from me. Nicely done.

Just to take and ruin that joke a bit, Nintendo can later release an upgrade like PS4K and call it Wii're Even Sorrier.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on April 18, 2016, 09:45:29 PM
Wii Wiilly sorry 4 U.

Shortened WiWiiS4U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 18, 2016, 10:13:26 PM
New Super Nintendo U
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on April 18, 2016, 10:23:23 PM
It will be called:

Nintendo Do U Even Wii, Bro?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 18, 2016, 11:26:43 PM
Wii Wiilly sorry 4 U.

Shortened WiWiiS4U.
That's the name  of the console after the Wii're Sorry.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Manthony Chopkins on April 19, 2016, 10:49:45 AM
 My vote goes to PWiiease Understand.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Disco Stu on April 19, 2016, 01:54:50 PM
I think they should go "full reboot" and just call it


The Nintendo
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 19, 2016, 02:50:21 PM
I think they should go "full reboot" and just call it


The Nintendo

Ah yes, let's introduce the same problem the Xbox 1 did where when talking about consoles in a historical manner you have to be very specific to avoid confusing the latest console in the brand with the first one.

Sony totally got it right when they came up with a pretty decent name for their first console and then just numbered them sequentially after that.  If Nintendo called the Super NES the NES2 and continued from there we wouldn't be having this discussion and I wouldn't at all be worried about what ridiculous name Nintendo is actually going to use.

Something with a noun would be a good idea.  We've already got a "station" and a "box" so that's a convention people are used to.  I really liked the Gamecube name, it's just unfortunate they decided to pair that with a purple lunchbox design.  How about the Nintendo GameConsole? ;)  That's a pretty meta idea and then Nintendo could sue competitors for using "game console" as a generic term.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 20, 2016, 01:00:50 AM
No see they call it the NES in Japan and they call it the Famicom everywhere else.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 20, 2016, 04:46:16 AM
Quote from: https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/04/20/nxs-software-output/
Here is what I’ve been told by my sources close to Nintendo:

1. The big fundamental focal point (and overall goal) behind NX is to vastly increase the software output from Nintendo’s first party teams and studios.
2. To accomplish this, the entire process of how Nintendo develops and produces software has gone through radical changes.
3. There is a new strategy that was put in place to create and release first party software at a faster rate.
4. Multiple unannounced Wii U projects were moved over to NX.
5. The NX could potentially see the highest output of first party software in the company’s history. (I’m talking about the entire lifespan of NX. Not just one or two years.)
...
With that said, the NX definitely won’t be the **** show that we experienced on Wii U with three month droughts on a regular basis. At least not when it comes to first party software.

The hardware guessing game is a distraction to what I think will be the key shift for Nintendo in video games. What Rogers has written is a further evolution of the known integration of home console and portable console hardware teams and the melding of the competing EAD and SPD groups in to the EPD. The split attention on Nintendo caused by the vast hardware and firmware differences of the 3DS and Wii U has hurt Nintendo's software output for those platforms. To hear rumblings that not only will such gulfs be a thing of the past but also have the full talent of Nintendo focused on single platform (or a number of seamlessly similar platforms) is so potentially monumental.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 20, 2016, 07:30:37 AM
Exactly. Nintendo's strength has always been its software from both a creative and financial standpoint. With at least a partial shared library, Nintendo leverages that strength by solidifying its output and creating a scenario in which one piece of hardware (typically console) doesn't have to be marginalized to save another piece of hardware. Ideally, Nintendo can compete in high and low end hardware markets, console being the former, handheld being the latter. It's a great idea that unfortunately took Nintendo well over a decade to figure out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on April 20, 2016, 12:09:01 PM
It's no surprise Iwata started Nintendo's huge restructure around 2011/2012 when the 3DS had a shaky start and they had to start focusing most of their studio's on making 3DS titles and it was also clear internally that Wii U development was going to be much harder then they thought.  They basically had to choose to save the 3DS and doom the Wii U before it even launched at that point, which I imagine was the final straw telling them their old development model wasn't working anymore. 

It's too bad Iwata isn't around to see this since it looks like his final acts of his presidency might have finally solved Nintendo's drought problems their systems have suffered for so long with.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 20, 2016, 01:35:30 PM
Nintendo's drought problems have mostly come from weak third party support.  Nintendo's output on the Wii U was unacceptable but they shouldn't be in a situation in the first place where they alone has to keep the release schedule full.  I like how they felt they needed to address this and it should be a major improvement... but I hope they're not being too internally focused like they often tend to be.  Infrequent releases from Nintendo is not the ACTUAL issue, it's infrequent releases PERIOD.  Increasing first party output is great but they better not have neglected attracting third party support as a result or see increased first party output as a suitable replacement for third party support.  Without good third party support it's really just Nintendo making things less shitty.  The release schedule will still be full of droughts, just not Wii U level droughts.  But Wii U level droughts is pretty much the worst you could get while still considering the platform as being supported so going up from there is not an achievement.  Nintendo is right in knowing that there is a problem but I hope they see the full problem and not just one from their own isolationist perspective.  At the very least it looks like the NX will be an improvement over the Wii U so that's good.  I was afraid of the possibility of them just coming up with excuses (weak yen, "people don't like games anymore", "you're all wrong for not buying our product") and then doubling-down on stupid ideas.  They at least know something is wrong.

Though the vibe I'm getting from all the rumours is that there is little point in owning both the handheld and console.  If the library is virtually identical then you might as well just pick the platform that better suits your lifestyle.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 20, 2016, 02:44:16 PM
Quote
In a single year, the NX will build a larger library of games than Wii U produced in three or four years.

This isn’t some hyperbolic statement. This isn’t speculation nor blind optimism. These aren’t my personal fan wishes either. Furthermore, my negative feelings toward the Wii U have zero influence on any of the information mentioned below.

I dunno sounds like hyperbole to me, I wouldn't be complaining if NX just has tons and tons of games straight out of the gate, but I think by expecting such you just set yourself up for disappointment. I can see them striving for faster output on NX through things like better management and stronger relationships with 3rd parties but a triple or quadruple increase in library size sounds like crazy talk.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 20, 2016, 04:22:49 PM
I don't see it as hyperbole when you consider the maximum possibilities of how the 3DS and Wii U divided Nintendo's resources. Doing some fuzzy guessing in my head, I can see hitting the 2x mark when I think of all the 3DS releases during the times when Wii U releases were slim. The rest can hopefully be covered by changes to how Nintendo develops and produces games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 20, 2016, 10:03:07 PM

Total hyperbole.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_products_published_by_Nintendo#Wii_U


Go to the Wii U section and pick any combination of 3 years you desire. That's what you're going to get in a single year of NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 20, 2016, 10:19:49 PM
Meh, Amiibo prints money so there're fine.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on April 20, 2016, 10:42:19 PM

Though the vibe I'm getting from all the rumours is that there is little point in owning both the handheld and console.  If the library is virtually identical then you might as well just pick the platform that better suits your lifestyle.

This to me is a good thing.  I would rather Nintendo tell gamers look you can play our games the way you want to play the games with a handheld or console.  Sure maybe the console game might look prettier and have local Multiplayer via a TV, but the game is available as a handheld and is perfectly functional.  There will still be Nintendo fans that will want to own both systems and play whenever they want to.

Obviously, I do not think this is what Nintendo is doing, but it should be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 21, 2016, 02:06:58 AM
Total hyperbole.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_products_published_by_Nintendo#Wii_U

Go to the Wii U section and pick any combination of 3 years you desire. That's what you're going to get in a single year of NX?

Now that I look what Nintendo has developed and published, yeah kinda. By themselves, Nintendo has a shot at 2 years worth if the merger of home and portable console software efforts combine in an idea manner. If deals and relationships with second party, close partners, and (some) third party groups pan out in some favorable direction, I could see that third years worth.

The Wii U release calendar has always been slim pickings. Maybe the changes Nintendo is undergoing in its hardware and software divisions will change the pattern significantly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 21, 2016, 01:42:21 PM
How many WiiU and 3DS games combined does Nintendo typically release in a year?  Wouldn't that be the approximate output for an NX year?  It would probably be a little less since the games have to be HD for the console but anything greater than their current output rate over both platforms is a ridiculous guess unless they've expanded their development teams... or plan to make shittier games.

A quick count revealed 17 games last year but that includes remakes like Majora's Mask and some outright trash like Devil's Third (and there is probably eShop stuff I'm forgetting).  Maybe one game a month would be a realistic figure?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: killthenet on April 21, 2016, 04:58:40 PM
One quality Nintendo title a month would be a really good average. I think the number they've developed in house has gone down over the last year due to the restructuring - and they've outsourced a lot of titles to other developers like 'Star Fox' with Platinum and 'Twilight Princess HD' with Tantalus. Hopefully they continue with those sorts of tactics to ensure a more consistent release schedule and form more partnerships with third parties.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 21, 2016, 10:19:21 PM
Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 21, 2016, 10:42:17 PM
Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
You keep telling me that, but they won't lower prices anywhere so I can't disprove it!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 22, 2016, 03:26:36 AM
Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
You keep telling me that, but they won't lower prices anywhere so I can't disprove it!

It's like precious gold, it will only go up in price!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 22, 2016, 08:32:14 PM
Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
It's Ian Sane, any game he doesn't like is deemed as trash, whether or not it is any good is irrelevant.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on April 22, 2016, 09:28:02 PM
You can buy the game for $50 on Amazon with original case, but no manual. Slowly they will drop and we will be able to enjoy our mediocre over-the-top shooty-shooty experience.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 24, 2016, 11:02:52 PM
Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
It's Ian Sane, any game he doesn't like is deemed as trash, whether or not it is any good is irrelevant.
I heardz my name!?
Devil's thrid sucks poopy dick!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 25, 2016, 01:16:56 PM
Oh I'm sorry.  I'm out of line in calling a game that has an average review score of 43.56% trash?  A game that got an almost universal negative reception, that was released so under-the-radar that physical copies are rare because NOA didn't really want you to notice it existed because they knew it was so shitty?  I'm out of line there?  REALLY?  Review scores are typically inflated and practically nothing gets under 50% so for Devil's Third to end up under that mark must mean it REALLY sucks.  But go ahead and stand up for a game that this very site gave a 3.5/10 score on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 25, 2016, 02:15:04 PM
You guys do know there's a perfectly good Devil's Third thread where you can take this argument to, right?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 25, 2016, 05:30:23 PM
You guys do know there's a perfectly good Devil's Third thread where you can take this argument to, right?

No, there isn't. Perfectly good? Don't make me laugh. That thread is outright trash. While this thread may not be that great either, at least it's a step up from a thread this very site gave a rating of 3.5/10.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 25, 2016, 05:59:01 PM
Oh I'm sorry.  I'm out of line in calling a game that has an average review score of 43.56% trash?
ShyGuy has actually played it, and you haven't.

Plus, it's just fun to rib you. :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 25, 2016, 06:06:36 PM
Oh I'm sorry.  I'm out of line in calling a game that has an average review score of 43.56% trash?  A game that got an almost universal negative reception, that was released so under-the-radar that physical copies are rare because NOA didn't really want you to notice it existed because they knew it was so shitty?  I'm out of line there?  REALLY?  Review scores are typically inflated and practically nothing gets under 50% so for Devil's Third to end up under that mark must mean it REALLY sucks.  But go ahead and stand up for a game that this very site gave a 3.5/10 score on.

The critical reception of Devil's Third isn't the issue or what started this recent drive by of your opinions. The statement was:

Devil's Third isn't outright trash.
It's Ian Sane, any game he doesn't like is deemed as trash, whether or not it is any good is irrelevant.

Whether a game is good or not doesn't matter if you don't like it. If you don't like a game, regardless of critical consensus, then you deem the game trash. Do you agree or disagree with that statement because that's what the actual debate is about. Not whether Devil's Third is good. ShyGuy happens to enjoy the game and just made a brief comment disagreeing with your summarization of the game being trash. It's something I think he'd post no matter who made that claim since he's positive about the game and has been posting such thoughts for awhile in an effort to battle the current critical groupthink of the game.

The merciless Mop it up just decided to seize on that moment to cause more forum drama. It's her thing. She's currently trying to encourage various forum members to insult and attack one another in a Funhouse thread as I type this. She loves this stuff as she herself has now admitted.

The problem I see here is one I've called you out on and identified before. You often post your opinions as though they are universal and held by all. I often think that's what gets you in the most trouble because then all the posters who disagree with your view start posting in opposition to you because they feel they have to enlighten you that what you have posted isn't how they feel or that everyone thinks the same as you. Even in cases where the majority of people probably would sum up Devil's Third as trash or easily agree with you, there will always be outliers and people who think differently. That's why I'm always cautious to use any language or make comments that would preclude the idea that others might think differently. I usually make it clear that what I think about something is only how I view it and not give off the idea that my view is the absolute view of everyone else also. If you were more careful about that or kept the thought that most people usually disagree with you in mind, it might help keep you from making these constant post containing so many absolute statements that seem to result in so many forum rebuttals.

Of course, there are other times where disputes come from grossly, over-exaggerated expressions, constantly repetitive complaints, bringing up points or facts that have nothing to do with the subject on hand but you can't leave alone, lack of actual knowledge on a matter or just flat-out wrong statements but let's try to focus on one thing at a time, right? Mop it up is right! It is fun to take you on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 25, 2016, 06:14:07 PM
The merciless Mop it up just decided to seize on that moment to cause more forum drama. It's her thing. She's currently trying to encourage various forum members to insult and attack one another in a Funhouse thread as I type this. She loves this stuff.
This is pretty ironic coming from someone sporting an author icon that spoofs Ian Sane's, and has encouraged a few other users to do the same. :P:
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 25, 2016, 06:38:52 PM
Look at that. Mop it up's trying to subtly direct the conversation to create an attack against me. Help! Help! I'm being oppressed here!

But I see through this clever girl's machinations and I will not fall for them by engaging in some small forum drama. I'm only here to talk about acceptable forum topics like religion, politics and piracy, thank you very much.

On that subject, who here is voting for Jesus our dread pirate lord and who is voting for BlackBeard Moses in the upcoming election?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 25, 2016, 08:00:00 PM
This thread used to be about important things, like buttons, now it's just a bunch of in-fighting. :(
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 25, 2016, 08:25:38 PM
The thirst is real, clearly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 25, 2016, 11:44:40 PM
Mop it up's a girl? :o
but birdo's are male...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 12:45:09 AM
So am I. I just don't go around bragging about it. And Birdo is a well-documented male to female transsexual. The correct term is Birdo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 01:28:15 AM
Going back to an older post in this thread,

From the same thread:

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/shyguy70/0AG4tWY_zpsudhmq6et.jpg) (http://s91.photobucket.com/user/shyguy70/media/0AG4tWY_zpsudhmq6et.jpg.html)

Also, there has been rumors/speculation of Call of Duty, Madden, The Division, and WatchDogs 2.


I always meant to comment that it reminded me of this post I made years ago:

Wii U's secret weapon. Sequels to cult classics.

Pikmin 3
Bayonetta 2
Shenmue 3
Beyond Good and Evil 2
Eternal Darkness 2
Star Tropics 3
Skies of Arcadia 2
Phantasy Star 5
Mother 4
Too Human 2

Wii U is going to be the hardcore of hardcore!

Now, at the time, we knew that Pikmin 3 and Bayonetta 2 were coming and the rest were just jokes. However, I find it interesting that the proposed titles for the NX launch have a Pikmin game (Pikmin 4), Beyond Good and Evil 2 and Final Fantasy 7 (appearing on a Nintendo console almost 20 years later) along with the latest Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest games. To me, the list seems to be fanboyish, to create a word. Oddly enough, Shenmue 3 has since been proposed at last year's E3 so maybe this list will all come true someday (except for Too Human 2). It's just that I think the list is too good to be true and I won't believe until I see it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 26, 2016, 11:12:06 AM
Just a reminder: anyone looking for major NX info in the investors briefing will be in for some disappointment.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg-Mdg_UcAACASB.jpg)
https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2010/100323e.pdf (https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/pdf/2010/100323e.pdf)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 26, 2016, 11:14:56 AM
I think sequels to existing franchises, particularly acclaimed ones, are just a consistent fanboy dream/speculation.  Honestly, it's the only thing you can predict.  You know there will be new IPs, but you have no way of knowing what they are.  The only thing you can guess is a new version of a thing that already exists.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 26, 2016, 12:21:36 PM
On the N64 Nintendo would talk about "quality over quantity".  That was pure PR spin to try to divert attention from the weak third party support but if you already know you're going to be hurting for support at first could you try that as a strategy?  That fanboy list of NX games would attract some customers.  Nintendo isn't going to get all the major games overnight so if the third party releases are going to be uncommon at first it would be best to make them count.  Bayonetta 2 didn't save the Wii U but the idea of landing an exclusive like that wasn't bad in theory, it's just that that one game was all they landed.  But an exclusive sequel to a cult classis is still a better catch than some shovelware based on a kids cartoon or a year old port of a game with missing features.  So can you get a bunch of cult classic exclusives?  If Nintendo could give the NX a rep as being that console with the hardcore fanboy dream games that will sell some consoles.  It's not going to make them a runaway success but it will build some momentum and if they can build enough of that good third party support will follow.

When you're coming from a position of weakness and need to fight for each sale then you want each move to be very calculated.  I feel Sega did that with the Genesis and MS with the Xbox, while Nintendo tends to have a more "eh, they'll buy our console because we're Nintendo" arrogance that is frankly a shitty approach when you're coming from behind.  You have to think about what you're missing and try to address it and think about what the other guys are weak at and take advantage by doing it better or offering something they don't have.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 26, 2016, 12:33:27 PM
I hear Mighty No. 9 might come to the NX.

Maybe.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: pokepal148 on April 26, 2016, 02:45:33 PM
Bayonetta 2 didn't save the Wii U but the idea of landing an exclusive like that wasn't bad in theory, it's just that that one game was all they landed. 
I'll take "What is Lego City Undercover" for 300.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 26, 2016, 04:29:03 PM
Bayonetta 2 didn't save the Wii U but the idea of landing an exclusive like that wasn't bad in theory, it's just that that one game was all they landed. 
I'll take "What is Lego City Undercover" for 300.

It's not that type of hardcore gamer cult classic sequel I'm talking about like Bayo 2 was.  Hell I just assumed it was a port of the million other Lego games that appear on every platform until its fans started praising it and clued me in to it's exclusive status.  It was an odd choice because Lego games are everywhere and they did a poor choice of making it stand out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION)
Post by: Soren on April 26, 2016, 04:51:33 PM
That fanboy list of NX games would attract some customers.  Nintendo isn't going to get all the major games overnight so if the third party releases are going to be uncommon at first it would be best to make them count.  Bayonetta 2 didn't save the Wii U but the idea of landing an exclusive like that wasn't bad in theory, it's just that that one game was all they landed. 

I just had a strange case of deja vu. I could have sworn we had this argument a while back. Oh wait...

Nintendo picking up the tab for cult/niche franchises sounds like a better way to build trust with the likes of Ubisoft/EA/Activision than outright moneyhatting third party ports of multiplatform games.

They funded this one game and that's better than nothing but it means jack **** in comparison to all the third party games the Wii U didn't get and one game is way too few to have any real effect on sales.

They also rescued Devil's Third from oblivion (regardless of whether or not it was worth rescuing) and funded an exclusive Lego game and another exclusive Platinum game with a new IP. They also had an exclusivity agreement with Sega which yielded Sonic Lost World and Sonic Boom(again, not talking about quality). It wasn't just one game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 07:04:11 PM
I just had a strange case of deja vu. I could have sworn I said something about this a while back. Oh wait...

The problem I see here is one I've called you out on and identified before ... there are other times where disputes come from grossly, over-exaggerated expressions, constantly repetitive complaints, bringing up points or facts that have nothing to do with the subject on hand but you can't leave alone, lack of actual knowledge on a matter or just flat-out wrong statements but let's try to focus on one thing at a time, right?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 26, 2016, 07:33:00 PM
I don't get why I get flack for "repetitive complaints".  Nintendo does X.  I don't like X and feel that Nintendo needs to stop doing X if they want to achieve Y.  Nintendo continues to do X for years and years with, predictably, no improvement in achieving Y.  So what am I supposed to do?  The complaint remains because the problem is not addressed.  For example I would stop complaining about the third party problem if Nintendo FIXED IT!!

And sometimes you guys get hung up on semantics.  Well technically Nintendo funded more than one third party exclusive so Ian is wrong!  But what is the POINT I was making?  Nintendo tried some exclusives but too few of them, though the concept may help if done more frequently and in a more calculated way.  So instead of one exclusive Nintendo got two or three.  What the hell difference does that make?  1 or 3 or 5 is all way too little of an amount to be effective.  You're so focused on trying to find some tiny mistake in my statement that you're completely ignoring the actual point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 26, 2016, 07:39:18 PM
Quote
I don't get why I get flack for "repetitive complaints".  Nintendo does X.  I don't like X and feel that Nintendo needs to stop doing X if they want to achieve Y.  Nintendo continues to do X for years and years with, predictably, no improvement in achieving Y.  So what am I supposed to do?

Stop being a baby, leave other people alone, find a new hobby, and move on with your life.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 26, 2016, 07:58:00 PM
That's not very conducive towards healthy discussion, people.

If Ian wants to voice his opinions about things, he can. It's your decision to get involved with addressing those repetitive complaints. Just ignore him!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 26, 2016, 07:59:53 PM
We've heard them long enough. It's time for him to move on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 26, 2016, 08:19:30 PM
I don't get why I get flack for "repetitive complaints".  Nintendo does X.  I don't like X and feel that Nintendo needs to stop doing X if they want to achieve Y.  Nintendo continues to do X for years and years with, predictably, no improvement in achieving Y.  So what am I supposed to do?  The complaint remains because the problem is not addressed.  For example I would stop complaining about the third party problem if Nintendo FIXED IT!
Because we already know your opinion. We've heard it. We know it hasn't been fixed to your liking, so you don't need to point it out again and again. Once is enough. What does stating the same things over and over accomplish, exactly? Nintendo aren't reading your posts.

What do you do? You complain once and move on.

I would call out anyone for being this repetitively negative, but you're the main person who does it.

And sometimes you guys get hung up on semantics.  Well technically Nintendo funded more than one third party exclusive so Ian is wrong!  But what is the POINT I was making?  Nintendo tried some exclusives but too few of them, though the concept may help if done more frequently and in a more calculated way.  So instead of one exclusive Nintendo got two or three.  What the hell difference does that make?  1 or 3 or 5 is all way too little of an amount to be effective.  You're so focused on trying to find some tiny mistake in my statement that you're completely ignoring the actual point.
One reason this happens is because we've already addressed your points and some people don't feel like doing it again when you repeat them. It's also because you have a tendency to exaggerate how bad problems are and tend to idealise the past as being better than it is, sometimes even twisting facts. That's a bigger deal than simple semantics.

Over the years, some people, including myself, have also given you some advice on better ways to state your opinions to receive better responses, but you seem to just ignore them. So, it doesn't feel like you've been listening to things we say, either. Perhaps you should evaluate how you present yourself and question if it's really the best way. After all, you like to recite majority opinions of games to try and prove points, such as Metacritic, so perhaps you should also listen to the majority opinion of yourself as well.

For the record, I don't think you're a bad person, and you have raised some good points from time to time on various subjects. I even agree with some of the things you've said before. But, it appears that you struggle to understand any perspective outside of your own, and you act condescendingly towards any people and things that you don't like. This, along with repetition, is what I take issue with, and other people seem to as well.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 08:20:08 PM
We've heard them long enough. It's time for him to move on.

Zap, I like you. We've been having a lot of fun on these forums the past month and it's great to see you posting more but you got to be careful. The funny thing about blunt, direct posting like this is that it tends to make you look extreme and brings about the opposite result with people usually defending the person on the receiving end. Even I did a double take on this and think you may have gone too far. I get the frustration that can come from Ian's repetition but don't let it take you down.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on April 26, 2016, 08:26:46 PM
There's nothing wrong or extreme with finding new horizons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 26, 2016, 09:09:14 PM
This thread has really gone to ****.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 09:31:07 PM
This is what happens when TeamButtons wins.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 26, 2016, 09:32:28 PM
What does everyone expect for the investor briefing tonight? If the NX is being released this fiscal year, then it will definitely need to be mentioned, sales targets, things of that nature.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 26, 2016, 09:37:42 PM
Soren posted something earlier in this thread about that stating to expect disappointment. He linked a letter to the year the Wii U was to be released that fall and yet nothing about the Wii U was discussed in the investor meeting. It seems highly unlikely that Nintendo will suddenly talk much about its new console, the NX, this time around if they didn't bother last time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 26, 2016, 09:39:37 PM
Not ignoring Soren's post-- I just wanted to get the topic to Pleasantville.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: sudoshuff on April 26, 2016, 09:52:22 PM
I expect something along the lines of..."more info coming at E3".  I would be quite surprised if any useful information comes out at the investor meeting.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 26, 2016, 09:57:26 PM

This is what happens when TeamButtons wins.


#TeamButtons never asked for this. DON'T YOU PIN YOUR CYBERBULLYING ON US!!


What does everyone expect for the investor briefing tonight? If the NX is being released this fiscal year, then it will definitely need to be mentioned, sales targets, things of that nature.


Acknowledging Soren's post, I think we'll get a little more, but not much, than the letter from last year.  Still nothing major, but more pressure is on Nintendo this year to prove something to the investors.  Maybe an unannounced game or two will slip out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 26, 2016, 09:57:38 PM
I'd love there to be a May event from Nintendo. Just so there's no chance at all that Nintendo is somehow overshadowed at E3 for whatever reason, and more selfishly because I want NX info sooner rather than later. :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 26, 2016, 10:00:05 PM
My bad. Ignore this post.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 26, 2016, 10:17:45 PM
I'm sorry to get off track in here, I was just trying to be nice. There hasn't been much to talk about regarding this subject anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on April 26, 2016, 10:28:01 PM
No worries! I understand how broken records can be frustrating, and you came off as nice.


Anyway, I'll probably be up when this is going on because I woke up at noon today. Vacation is a wonderful thing.  :cool;
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 26, 2016, 10:31:32 PM
Dang it Nintendo! Release some new rumors or we are going to get this thread LOCKED AND BANNED

Now in response, to Ian:

British Columbia is trash and they have bad hockey fans. I can say this with authority as I have been there. I can back this up with support by saying the Ian's community of residence has a website dedicated to it called www.langleysucks.com (http://www.langleysucks.com)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 26, 2016, 10:54:37 PM
My point exactly Shyguy, how this thread has gone to ****! ;D
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 27, 2016, 12:51:41 AM
Here you guys go on the NX and other things and without me!!! :P

Things are going to change! lol
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 27, 2016, 01:04:58 AM
I expect some things to be unveiled in the investors meeting, perhaps the Official name of the NX, and maybe a look into the future of the platform and overlaying plans for it, and Nintendo's mobile division and other things.

Also the embargo will be up and devs can announce what games are being in development for the NX and such.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 27, 2016, 03:23:36 AM
Launching March 2017, but not at E3 this year. This is crazy even by Nintendo's standards.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 27, 2016, 03:31:13 AM
This is counter to what we heard last year where the NX was supposed to be unveiled at this years E3. So are they going to show Zelda off for both Systems? or will we have a Direct that'll show off the NX soon? Seeing March will be way before next E3 xD
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 27, 2016, 04:05:32 AM
My #NX2017 is true. It came at the price of Zelda Wii U skipping Christmas.

NX skipping E3 2016 is unfathomably nuts... if this were a world where companies weren't dropping out from E3 left and right. Now, it's just nuts.

But what's still super nuts is that we might not know anything about the nature of the NX until the summer is over.

COULD THIS BE THE TIME OF SPACEWORLD 2016?!

Anyways, Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing mobile games sound interesting. And at least the NX will be able to play Zelda Wii U, so the controller can't be too crazy. Maybe the NX is just a $499 bundle of home and portable console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#TeamButtons Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 27, 2016, 05:45:10 AM
Yikes. I'd rather Nintendo push NX into 2017 than release a consecutive inept mess of a console, but I doubt Wii U can limp through another holiday season. The focus should be on making sure NX is the best platform it can be, and the cost may be that Nintendo has little to nothing for six to eight months. One would hope Nintendo could get its act together and launch a competent console without its current console dragging itself to the finish line, but here we are. I'm on #TeamMakeItRight. Don't rush new hardware because you think you have to. Make it right so it has a chance to be successful. And hey, a 2017 launch increases the chances of Nintendo going with Polaris which might be worth the wait if its more than just AMD PR hype.

NX skipping E3 is disconcerting though Nintendo will have to unveil the thing at some point in 2016 if it's launching in less than a year. I'm not worried about that so much as Wii U's release schedule being a barren wasteland after Paper Mario: **** RPGs LOL. I suppose there will be some unannounced Wii U and 3DS games at E3, but I'm skeptical of any of them being enough to hold people over through a holiday season and a transition to NX.

I wonder if rumblings of Sony's PS4k/Neo forced Nintendo to reevaluate a 2016 launch, not out of fear but as a golden opportunity to strike during a potential moment of weakness. If Nintendo uses those extra months to load up on decent launch window titles and create a stable operating system and online infrastructure, it could be worth it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 27, 2016, 06:39:12 AM
AMD said they had three major contracts for the second half of the year, and I was dead sure the NX console was one. Now? Not so much.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: broodwars on April 27, 2016, 07:13:40 AM
I'm less bothered by NX and Zelda being delayed into 2017 than I am by Nintendo having **** all to release on Wii U this year after Tokyo Mirage Sessions. I don't think we can even count on the latest phoned-in Paper Mario releasing in 2016 if they're not showing it at E3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 27, 2016, 08:26:00 AM
I am a proud member of #Team2017, but I did not change the title. Thank you to the brave mod who did that. I appreciate it.


Anyway, here's my crazy first round of speculation.


- Nintendo is bringing back Space World - I mean, if you're skipping E3 then you have to show the thing at some point. And it can't all just be on the back of special Nintendo Directs. Eventually people have to play the machine in person. This is the perfect opportunity to hold a special event worldwide late summer of early fall to really sell the world on the console. That gives you enough time to then promote it well and get a good launch.


- NX was ready for a Japan 2016 release, but not worldwide - The focus on a worldwide release is good, but I think Nintendo's hand was forced here. Hardware shortages would not have looked good during the holiday period. If we are getting an NX home console then you were looking at a potential weak launch if it's just coming out in Japan. In fact...


- This is definitely the home console version of NX - Nintendo could have justified the 3-4 month wait between regions if we were talking about the handheld version of NX because Japan would have eaten it up no doubt. That and the news of the Zelda NX delay pretty much seals the deal here I think.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: lolmonade on April 27, 2016, 09:45:03 AM
AMD said they had three major contracts for the second half of the year, and I was dead sure the NX console was one. Now? Not so much.


Couldn't it possibly still be so, just in late 2016?  I mean, there's a need to account for lead-times between AMD chip production, final product assembly & packaging, & distribution to retailers.  As someone in SM, 3-4 months from production to on-the-shelf availability doesn't seem unfeasible.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 27, 2016, 09:47:02 AM
My mind boggles... it is probably being delayed for a host of reasons, make sure hardware is finalized, get the OS in shape, make sure there launch lineup is ready this time...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 27, 2016, 09:59:52 AM
Hopefully, Nintendo is working on not having a day 1 software update and having a steady stream of games through the first year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 27, 2016, 10:24:38 AM
Yikes, was not expecting this! I thought it was far more likely they'd announce a pre-E3 event in May to unveil the hardware and gimmick. If they're waiting til 2017 to launch and later this year to unveil, I'm guessing it's because they didn't really have a choice, as missing the holiday for launch has got to sting. Still, it's baffling as to why they couldn't at least do an initial reveal at E3 with a few key titles to boot. Sure, focus on Zelda, but it's not like that game on WiiU is going to do huge numbers with the low install base and historic trajectory of 3D Zelda sales. Curious indeed.

Also, this is going to drive the hardcore enthusiast community apeshit. That's probably not going to redound to Nintendo's benefit.

Edit: Wait, Zelda's delayed to 2017 too?! Holy ****.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 27, 2016, 10:30:10 AM
Another optimist viewpoint: If the system is actually ready to go, waiting until March might mean that Nintendo is stockpiling units to avoid shortages.  I like the thought of this, but I'm worried I'll strain my shoulder reaching this hard.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: alegoicoe on April 27, 2016, 12:01:30 PM
The NX situation is just getting out of hand and its baffling how Nintedo themselves are at fault for a machine that is destined to disappoint people due to the mystification and hopes people have placed on it. Nintendo have been making bad choice after bad choice since they announced the Wii U starting from the name it self, and this trend has continued to the NX which it self is a codename. You wonder why the hell would Nintendo be so secretive about this system, its not like they have a freaking unicorn, its technology and if it is so revolutionary as they claim its going to be copied no matter what. I just think that they are shooting themselves in the foot by not taking advantage of the hype train and pushing the system to early next year, couple with mind blowing decision to punish wii u gamers by pushing zelda once again just to make the launch of the NX and showing a big middle finger to gamers who were told by Nintendo that they were going to be playing the game in 2015, shame on them. I think, and I only speak for my self that i hit rock bottom in terms of disappointment in Nintendo and they awkward and downright stupid decisions that the only purpose it has served is to slowly but surely kill off their already damaged fan base.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 27, 2016, 12:27:59 PM
I think I'm liking this new Kimishima style Nintendo.
Now they're all like "**** it, we will release NX when we're damn good and ready." And they're telling us why, way in advance: "Cuz we want to have games for it, duh!".
Holiday season? "**** it! It'll be ready in March. **** you!"
E3? "**** it! We have Directs for that ****, yo. Also, we're givin you Zelda and it's gonna blow your fucking mind and you're gonna eat that **** up and love it. Shut yo mouth."
Nintendo is doing it's thing and it's making money and it couldn't give two craps whether the "gaming press" or the "hardcore" like it or not.
Respect!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 27, 2016, 01:32:31 PM
Now in response, to Ian:

British Columbia is trash and they have bad hockey fans. I can say this with authority as I have been there. I can back this up with support by saying the Ian's community of residence has a website dedicated to it called www.langleysucks.com (http://www.langleysucks.com)

Langley sucks?!  Ah man, there's where I was born and raised! :(

I really was not expecting anything at all about the NX at the investor's meeting.  Too bad I get to be surprised with a "delay".  I gave my opinion of it in the talkback thread.  I don't think it's going to do the NX any favours to wait until 2017 but Nintendo may be behind enough on game development that this is necessary.  Disappointing news anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 27, 2016, 02:11:15 PM
I just had a fun thought: what if Nintedo is dialing down E3 involvement in favour of another North American genre gathering a little while later: San Diego ComicCon.
Maybe Nintendo is thinking to itself, E3 is too limiting, it's only for gamers, it doesn't get enough mainstream attention. Let's go to ComicCon, which gets way more attention, and do our big NX reveal blowout there and really get the attention of the mainstream media as well as genre enthusiasts. And we will have our mobile offerings there too and Amiibo and the best cosplay and maybe some TV or movie or anime products too. We will be positioning ourselves as just as relevant as the huge entertainment conglomerates that put a lot of effort into ComicCon but not much into E3. We will be showing we are a diversifying (or diversified) entertainment company, not just a dumb vidya game company that peaked in 1985.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 27, 2016, 02:42:18 PM
Wouldn't the competition for attention be greater at ComicCon?  At E3 they only have to compete with competitors in their own industry and not big entertainment companies like Disney and Warner Bros directly.

They've been scaling down E3 in favour of directs for years so this is probably an extension of that mixed with what I think is fair to assume a slim lineup as the Wii U and 3DS finish their lifespans.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 27, 2016, 05:15:26 PM
Well Nintendo could do a Space World event for the NX, or host something like a direct to show it off and give details.

The PS4 was shown off well before E3, so we could see something similar. At least we know we'll have a full blow out at some point on the system. wherever it's before or after E3 is another story.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 27, 2016, 06:29:45 PM
I'm not sure in ComiCon is the place.  And Spaceworld almost seems like too costly an event for Nintendo to throw at this stage.  I'm worried it'll just be at the New York store and that's it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 27, 2016, 06:43:51 PM
Under normal circumstances I would figure you could do a direct and release a demo.  But you can't release demos for games for a brand new console no one owns yet.  So you need some event to get the games into the hands of the media so their previews and impressions will build hype for your product.

Wasn't Spaceworld open to the public?  Probably don't need to go that far.  A smaller press event will suffice.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on April 27, 2016, 07:00:31 PM
Right. They can do Directs for the Wii U's death march lineup, but the press needs to get their hands on the NX.  They'll get TGS, but the West needs something too.  So maybe the press event is something that could work.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on April 27, 2016, 07:01:59 PM
I just checked out the Neogaf thread to see if there were any rumors or rays of hope, and there was this at least:

Quote
  Originally Posted by
FyreWulff
Launching Holiday 2016 just puts them lost in the fray of the VR jerkoff and PS4K.
 
 Holiday 2017 means ports competing with existing console dev time and supply constraints
 
 March 2017 (and Nintendo has launched multiple successful hardware in March) gives them an E3 between launch and holiday, gets them out of the 2016 clusterfuck, lets them account for the 4K if they so desire, developers aren't making the NX version of late 16 / early 17 hardware at the same time as other consoles, they have a GDC, PAX East, E3, PAX Prime that they can openly have hardware and playable demos at.
 
 March 2017 also gets them Destiny 2 in September 2017, instead of Destiny 2 Months After It Already Came Out.
 
 Ubisoft has paused AssCreed for 2016 and won't be releasing one this holiday, so Nintendo isn't missing out on a major Ubi title either for not making this year.
 
 *developer hat on* Strategically, this all makes sense. It makes sense for ports, it makes sense for hardware supply, it makes sense because they can let Sony talk themselves ragged for E3 2016 and then be the main attraction for GDC, PAX East, E3 2017, and PAX Prime going into Holiday 2017.
 
 *developer inside baseball hat on top of developer hat* Also, by releasing at the start of most everyone's fiscal year, they won't suffer from what happened to the Wii U, where a bunch of companies pushed U titles back into fiscal 2013 to make their numbers look better. Developers spin down during December and January, so why put the NX in that position anyway.
 
 Plus they can make retailers happy by exhausting all of their Wii U supply this holiday. Not gonna bet money but wouldn't be surprised to see a farewell Wii U bundle that acts as a soft price cut to empty out the warehouses and retail channel.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 27, 2016, 07:16:35 PM
Hopefully, Nintendo is working on not having a day 1 software update and having a steady stream of games through the first year.
Juuuuuust like the Wii drought before Wii U dropped, right?!

...Right?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: astraith on April 28, 2016, 12:31:57 AM
I think that Nintendo NS is an operating system. It will launch on a handheld first, then be ported to Wii U, and Holiday 2017 we will get a new home console. Think about it. Iwata said a long time ago that they wanted to make a new platform where they make one game for all their platforms, allowing them to make more hardware (tablets, VR/AR units, mobile phones, handhelds, consoles...). This is to address a problem they had this generation: keeping a steady flow of games. The Wii U MIGHT not be included in this, but logically it doesn't make sense not to -- AND doing so will help with making sure we keep our downloaded games on our Wii U's to the NX. Also explains the "Marcvh 2017" release date.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 28, 2016, 03:19:58 AM
Hopefully, Nintendo is working on not having a day 1 software update and having a steady stream of games through the first year.
Juuuuuust like the Wii drought before Wii U dropped, right?!

...Right?
In the face of repeated history, all we have is hope.

It is worth noting that Nintendo has since integrated their hardware and software teams. Might mean more legwork done on one thing rather than two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 28, 2016, 03:41:18 AM
With no handheld forthcoming and Nintendo hinting at something, the hybrid could be true. A console to be stationary and on the go. Like buying a handheld that takes NX games on the go. Or it could be something else, but seeing that there's been no real mention to the 3DS's successor, other than the possibility that NX is the code name for both.

Which would be odd seeing that history has shown two different code names if that was the case.

Still interested, hopefully we'll here more soon. Shouldn't the embargo be up on devs to discuss projects for NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 28, 2016, 06:47:14 AM
The advantage of doing comic con over e3 is it puts the focus on Nintendo, and also filters out biased game journalists and their snarky rich opinions.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 28, 2016, 11:12:50 AM
Another advantage of doing something like Comic Con over resurrecting Spaceworld is that press and regular people are already going to Comic Con. You don't have to get them there by special invite or by possibly paying for their travel and attendance as has sometimes happened with game reveal events in the past (by other companies like Activision; not by Nintendo, I think). Comic Con has a built in, hype-ready audience. Of course GDC would work that way too. But GDC is February 27 - March 3, 2017 which is getting a bit late for a big hardware reveal. Plus, it is not nearly as mainstream as something like Comic Con. But, it doesn't have to be Comic Con. What other gatherings of press and enthusiasts are there between E3 and March 2017?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 28, 2016, 12:44:19 PM
I think that Nintendo NS is an operating system. It will launch on a handheld first, then be ported to Wii U, and Holiday 2017 we will get a new home console.

So the Wii U has to hold on for even longer?  I think asking it to limp along until March 2017 is pushing it.  No may it can last another six or seven months after that.

The advantage of doing comic con over e3 is it puts the focus on Nintendo, and also filters out biased game journalists and their snarky rich opinions.

Wouldn't the gaming journalists know that Nintendo is at comic con and thus go there themselves to see it?  And if they were left out you think they're not going to totally rag on Nintendo for cutting them out?  I don't see the gaming media in general as biased against Nintendo anyway.  The odd site is but I feel most criticism Nintendo receives is earned.  And Nintendo games tend to get really good review scores which doesn't fit the idea of a bias against them anyway.  Everyone that ragged on the Wii also made Super Mario Galaxy the best reviewed game of all time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on April 28, 2016, 01:13:35 PM
I don't think delaying the announcement or the assumed 2016 launch of of the NX is a bad idea. I'm disappointed but I do think its a good idea.

As for keeping their cards super close, I can kind of understand Nintendo not wanting competitors to steal their designs but really, from the Gamecube on the only time anyone seemed to copy anything was well after it was proven to be a sales success.

I remember Miyamoto talking about not wanting to reveal Super Mario 64's successor too early because of them worried about ideas getting stolen. Pretty sure those ideas included Flood. I remember Miyamoto or Iwata talking about how they expected their mini discs and the Gamecube control layout to become the standard. For all their talk of ideas getting stolen or adopted the only things that come to mind is the Wii Remote(long after it was a huge success that no one could completely ignore) and one game using Pikmin's structure as its base for game play.

Yeah Sony put that little screen in their DS4 just in case but the market didn't take to the gamepad at all.

I'm not saying Nintendo is wrong for being secretive but sometimes their ideas are so out there almost seemingly just for the sake of being different half the gaming world don't even take them seriously. I'm also not saying that they should show the NX now and it's new feature, I think they should wait until closer to launch but if they think folks are going to steal this idea I hope it's something really significant where it's potential value can be perceived instantly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 28, 2016, 01:44:44 PM
Would Sony and MS even have time to steal the ideas for the NX in a timeframe that would hurt Nintendo?  If Sony and MS are planning on incremental console updates they don't have time to just throw that all out and copy Nintendo's idea.  Even strictly gameplay ideas are hard to copy these days with the extended development time modern games have.  If Nintendo demos some unique game at E3 a knock off isn't going to be able to be developed in six months to beat it to market.  Not with HD development times.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on April 28, 2016, 03:35:44 PM
Eh. From the rumors and rumblings, most everyone was predicting the NX to probably come out around mid-November like the Wii and Wii U did with Zelda being the major launch game like it was with the Wii. If we go from Star Fox's release date to November 22, that's 7 months. In those 7 months, what are we expecting for releases? There's Mario & Sonic Olympics, Tokyo Mirage, and Paper Mario possibly coming out in this time. Zelda was expected to be the last hurrah in November/December. I know there' some other stuff like e-shop games or Mighty No. 9 or Lost Reavers but as far as major retail releases, is there anything else I'm missing?

The only question was whether Nintendo was going to make a surprise announcement or two about a game that would be released for the Wii U between June and November to help pad the schedule. We already knew it was going to be a slim pickings year like the last year of the GameCube and Wii. The only difference is that there was expected to be a new bounty of games for when the NX launched.

If we go from November 22 - Mar. 17, that's 4 more months. Yeah, the NX getting pushed back sucks when you look at the current schedule leading up to November. Yet, 4 months isn't too long an extra wait time. If there were more Wii U games from Nintendo, like even a total of 8 or so spaced out over that time, it might have made this delay more bearable. As it stands, August 22 will put us back on track from where we before this delay announcement. And if they do announce 2 more Wii U games, we'll be back to where we stated for game releases.

Enjoy 3DS gaming because that's what Nintendo's still supporting.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 28, 2016, 03:44:47 PM
Eh. From the rumors and rumblings, most everyone was predicting the NX to probably come out around mid-November like the Wii and Wii U did with Zelda being the major launch game like it was with the Wii. If we go from Star Fox's release date to November 22, that's 7 months. In those 7 months, what are we expecting for releases? There's Mario & Sonic Olympics, Tokyo Mirage, and Paper Mario possibly coming out in this time. Zelda was expected to be the last hurrah in November/December. I know there' some other stuff like e-shop games or Mighty No. 9 or Lost Reavers but as far as major retail releases, is there anything else I'm missing?


There's the Lego Star Wars Force Awakens game. That's it. You can also expect Nintendo to give Yooka-Laylee a big bump as well.


Don't expect to play much on Wii U anymore.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 28, 2016, 04:30:16 PM
For those interested, @ZhugeEX tweeted from the Koei-Tecmo financials that Koei-Tecmo is developing games for the Nintendo NX. So, rest assured we will be able to play the latest Dynasty Warriors port on Nintendo's next console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 28, 2016, 04:41:15 PM
How many characters do you think the next Hyrule Warriors will have? I'm guessing 40 total.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 28, 2016, 04:42:00 PM
If we go from November 22 - Mar. 17, that's 4 more months. Yeah, the NX getting pushed back sucks when you look at the current schedule leading up to November. Yet, 4 months isn't too long an extra wait time. If there were more Wii U games from Nintendo, like even a total of 8 or so spaced out over that time, it might have made this delay more bearable. As it stands, August 22 will put us back on track from where we before this delay announcement. And if they do announce 2 more Wii U games, we'll be back to where we stated for game releases.

I have enough backlogged stuff that I still have stuff to play and I play less games in the summer months anyway so on a personal level it doesn't really affect me.  Four months in a vacuum doesn't seem like much but in this case it's going through Christmas.  Nintendo is effectively "skipping" a Christmas on the console front which doesn't seem like something I would set out to do unless there was no other option.  I was already concerned about Nintendo's lack of visibility as the Wii U limps to the finish line so the longer the wait the more damage to their brand and thus the deeper pit the NX has to dig itself out of.  It just doesn't look good to have this floundering console in stores with hardly any games coming out.  I don't see people seeing Nintendo's weak Christmas offering this year and then thinking "yeah those Nintendo guys are who I want to support!" in March.  I feel last Christmas was damaging enough and this will be worse.

And with little to offer Wii U owners this Christmas what is to keep them from switching to a competing console?  Nintendo isn't going to sell an NX to someone who bought a PS4 on Black Friday or who got one for Christmas.  They'll have to make a big splash with the NX debut and market it really well to convince people to wait for it.  And if Sony and MS release their iterative console updates this year and those sell well, then those customers are also lost.  The NX could have a bit of a power boost that entices people to upgrade but that doesn't work if Sony and MS beat them to the punch by four months.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 28, 2016, 04:49:34 PM
(http://ebid.s3.amazonaws.com/upload_big/3/7/5/1376241051-8106-768.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 28, 2016, 04:50:02 PM
T
For those interested, @ZhugeEX tweeted from the Koei-Tecmo financials that Koei-Tecmo is developing games for the Nintendo NX. So, rest assured we will be able to play the latest Dynasty Warriors port on Nintendo's next console.

This is my shocked face: -_-
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 28, 2016, 06:52:39 PM
They will also develop the next Fatal Frame game NoA will refuse to bring over.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on April 28, 2016, 07:15:37 PM
Maybe we'll get a sequel to Hyrule Warriors or, even better, we could get Fire Emblem Warriors since FE is now considered a "top tier IP" for Nintendo. They have the case that you wouldn't need a generic army, they could all be named hero units.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 28, 2016, 07:24:53 PM
Fire Emblem Warriors just seems like a no-brainer idea.  Then a few years later they make Hyrule x Fire Emblem Warriors and crossover the two franchises!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on April 28, 2016, 07:30:06 PM
Nintendo won't be skipping Christmas. They've got Pokemon Sun and Moon. They'll just be skipping anything for the Wii U at Christmas.
They'll probably do some bundles or whatnot. Smash all-inclusive version and/or MarioKart. Blah Blah
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on April 28, 2016, 07:55:07 PM
I'm really putting all my money on VR tech know...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 28, 2016, 10:12:44 PM
THE RUMORS, THEY KEEP COMING...


Retro's NX project not Metroid OR Donkey Kong

http://gonintendo.com/stories/256817-rumor-retro-s-nx-project-not-metroid-or-donkey-kong
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 28, 2016, 10:23:47 PM
It's Metroid and Donkey Kong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 28, 2016, 10:31:34 PM
Donkeytroid: Return of Samus Kong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 28, 2016, 10:35:34 PM
So has Sakamoto proven himself competent at all in the past five years? Because I couldn't be less excited about a new IP from him.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 29, 2016, 01:35:49 AM
He's a producer on Tomadochi Life and Miitomo so... ?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on April 29, 2016, 03:11:46 AM
Maybe we'll get Nintendo Warriors for Tecmo-Koei! Wonder when square will reannounce DQXI and FFXV and FFVII for NX? I sure could use a new Chrono Trigger, and Damnit Capcom, get off your asses and make another Breath of Fire game, hell Remake BoF II!!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on April 29, 2016, 03:20:17 AM
Good on Retro getting the opportunity to tackle something new. As much as I enjoyed their Metroid and Donkey Kong games, I'm more keen on them getting a new world and cast to show.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 29, 2016, 04:48:10 AM
So has Sakamoto proven himself competent at all in the past five years? Because I couldn't be less excited about a new IP from him.

Sakamoto's got nothing to do with Retro. Even when they were making Metroid games he basically wasn't involved at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on April 29, 2016, 09:45:25 AM
Would FF XV even come to NX? By March that game will be 5-6 months old.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on April 29, 2016, 10:09:40 AM
So has Sakamoto proven himself competent at all in the past five years? Because I couldn't be less excited about a new IP from him.

Sakamoto's got nothing to do with Retro. Even when they were making Metroid games he basically wasn't involved at all.

The person who confirmed the rumor mentioned him:

https://twitter.com/Doctor_Cupcakes/status/725394073050341377
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 29, 2016, 12:27:52 PM
So has Sakamoto proven himself competent at all in the past five years? Because I couldn't be less excited about a new IP from him.

General Producer on Rhythm Heaven Fever says yes to that question.


The person who confirmed the rumor mentioned him:

https://twitter.com/Doctor_Cupcakes/status/725394073050341377 (https://twitter.com/Doctor_Cupcakes/status/725394073050341377)

How is that confirming a rumor? He's basically say "eh, maybe it's true. Who knows?"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on April 29, 2016, 04:50:57 PM
Retro after like 15 years finally getting a chance to make their own thing would be great!

Though the timing is kind of awkward since there's somewhat of a need for a new Metroid.  So who's working on Metroid if not Retro?  Is anyone working on Metroid besides Federation Force?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 29, 2016, 04:55:29 PM
We would hope so. This would be the system to release a Metroid game on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on April 29, 2016, 05:35:12 PM
I don't care what IP Retro uses, as long as they make a good game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on April 29, 2016, 08:38:55 PM
Retro has been ramping up staff, so the majority can work on the new IP while the stragglers try not to f**k up Metroid after Next Level saves it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 30, 2016, 12:37:39 AM
Is there really a "need" for Metroid? The series doesn't sell. Sure, it's nice for all 37 fans, but I'd hardly call it a need. There are other priorities. Metroid is a game Nintendo should release when it already has a stellar lineup.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on April 30, 2016, 01:40:37 AM
You do need games like Metroid as part of a truly stellar lineup and Nintendo knows this. I seriously doubt they backed something like Bayonetta 2 because they thought it was going to move a ton of units. Nintendo backed it because the Wii U's library needed diversity.

Looking at software sales isn't a good way to evaluate the importance or need for a game in general. Donkey Kong Country outsold Xenoblade Chronicles X, but I'd say the latter is a much more important game for Nintendo when it comes to making their platform appealing. Something like Metroid or Xenoblade Chronicles X might sell to a smaller crowd, but it has a significant impact on their purchasing decision when it comes to actually getting the console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 30, 2016, 02:30:22 AM
There are other priorities. Metroid is a game Nintendo should release when it already has a stellar lineup.
Ehh, that still stands in regards to your response.

Software sales are a good indicator of whether a company should prioritize a specific series or type of game. Metroid is a great supplementary title. However, Nintendo needs something to supplement first. Metroid will always have its dedicated fanbase, but that audience, unfortunately, isn't big enough to be worth catering to first or even second. If Nintendo wants to diversify its lineup, it needs games a broader group of people care about to actually buy its console. Then, it can concern itself with games like Metroid, Bayonetta, Xenoblade etc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on April 30, 2016, 07:25:52 AM
Metroid is going to do differently on different platforms. If NX is as powerful as rumored then I want to see what new Metroid looks like. Obviously, the biggest problem with Nintendo is their level of planning. They plan systems well, they just don't have much of an agenda on what games they want to make. They may not have even started on a Metroid game.

If I were launching NX I'd have started on the F-Zero, and Metroid games two or three years ago.

There is some discussion on whether or not sales are a good indicator of whether or not a company should make a game. They are not. Sometimes the fanbase of a franchise exceeds the sales. I rented a bunch of games I never bought. I borrowed games. I inherited hand-me-downs. I got some games given to me. I know a bunch of people who first played all the snes games on an emulator before turning around and buying it on wii and wii u for laziness convenience. Sometimes the initial sales of a franchise are low and jump up considerably when the technology has matured enough to where they become mega hits. Look at gta or metal gear, both franchises were moderate successes initially, but then became massive hits when they became 3d.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on April 30, 2016, 12:41:43 PM
There is some discussion on whether or not sales are a good indicator of whether or not a company should make a game. They are not. Sometimes the fanbase of a franchise exceeds the sales.
Mmmmmmyeah? No. Sales seem to be the driving philosophy behind everything. Metroid doesn't sell. New Super Mario Bros. and Donkey Kong Country do. Pokemon does.

I remember how Platinum fans raged at the inhumanity of Bayonetta 2 being a Wii U exclusive. I don't think it won over anyone that caused a significant boost in the Wii U's sales. Just because people are loud and obnoxious doesn't mean things will change or improve. Look at me with Paper Mario.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 30, 2016, 02:49:19 PM
There is some discussion on whether or not sales are a good indicator of whether or not a company should make a game.
Ladies and gentleman, here's an example of how to completely misconstrue someone's point.

I'm going to stop you right there, Perm. Let's go back to what I specifically said.
Software sales are a good indicator of whether a company should prioritize a specific series or type of game.
Making something and prioritizing it are entirely different things. The former is about that thing's existence, the latter is about when that thing should exist. A niche game with a small but loud fanbase has no business being a priority, especially for a company like Nintendo that is coming off its weakest home console. Metroid can't carry a holiday season, doesn't sell, and generally doesn't appeal to anyone except its own fanbase. It isn't the kind of series Nintendo should try to sell a console with. Metroid isn't an appetizer; it isn't the first thing people generally eat at a restaurant. And it sure as hell isn't the meal they went out for. If anything, it's the dessert most people can talk themselves into buying after getting their fill. For some, they go out specifically for the dessert, and that's great for them, but they're the outliers.

And again, Metroid is my favorite series. Of course, I'd want a new game. However, what I want and what I think should happen are entirely different things. Metroid isn't going to help Nintendo sell NX in any significant way. I'd rather wait for a new Metroid game if it means Nintendo gets off to a much better start in part because Retro Studios worked on the next Splatoon-esque success instead. Release a new Metroid when NX is rolling. And if it doesn't and Nintendo doubles down on its own fans again, release it then. Launch, near launch, or even the first year is really not the time for it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on April 30, 2016, 03:11:03 PM
There are other priorities. Metroid is a game Nintendo should release when it already has a stellar lineup.
Ehh, that still stands in regards to your response.

Software sales are a good indicator of whether a company should prioritize a specific series or type of game. Metroid is a great supplementary title. However, Nintendo needs something to supplement first. Metroid will always have its dedicated fanbase, but that audience, unfortunately, isn't big enough to be worth catering to first or even second. If Nintendo wants to diversify its lineup, it needs games a broader group of people care about to actually buy its console. Then, it can concern itself with games like Metroid, Bayonetta, Xenoblade etc.

That seems backwards to me. If you want a broader group of people to buy your console, you need a diverse lineup (or at least the promise of one) first. When you devote a lot of internal resources to putting out New Super Mario Bros. U, New Super Luigi U, and Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze within the first 1.5 years of your console's life, you're catering to the same audience over and over again. I'm not trying to say that Metroid should be a priority over New Super Mario Bros. U. It's blatantly clear which one of those should come first. I'm saying Metroid (or something like it) should be a priority over an expansion to NSMBU, or another 2D platformer from one of your best studios, even if these two things outsell Metroid on a software basis.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on April 30, 2016, 03:58:19 PM
Metroid is great, Nintendo needs to make Metroid games. The gamepad really is a gimmick, but it could have been put to good use in a new Metroid Prime game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on April 30, 2016, 07:45:59 PM
That seems backwards to me. If you want a broader group of people to buy your console, you need a diverse lineup (or at least the promise of one) first. When you devote a lot of internal resources to putting out New Super Mario Bros. U, New Super Luigi U, and Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze within the first 1.5 years of your console's life, you're catering to the same audience over and over again. I'm not trying to say that Metroid should be a priority over New Super Mario Bros. U. It's blatantly clear which one of those should come first. I'm saying Metroid (or something like it) should be a priority over an expansion to NSMBU, or another 2D platformer from one of your best studios, even if these two things outsell Metroid on a software basis.
New Super Luigi U isn't a good example considering it was made by a small team in under a year using another game's engine. It wasn't taking up too many resources, and Wii U's big problem at the time was lack of any content. I thought it was pretty obvious why Nintendo fast-tracked that game. It needed something out to release. Had Nintendo forced the game onto Retro Studios or something, I could see where you're coming from.

Additionally, I'm not sure why you're bringing up Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze. This entire arm of the discussion was started from a rumor that Retro Studios isn't working on either Metroid or Donkey Kong. If true, I think that's a great thing as it shouldn't be working on either IP. As a Metroid fan, I'd be excited if Retro Studios was working on Metroid again, but I can, at the same time, state that Metroid is not the kind of game Nintendo needs right now, particularly from one of its best teams. Metroid wouldn't be a waste of Retro Studios' talent. Rather, it could be a potential missed opportunity to strike gold. We all know what to expect from Metroid. Despite Nintendo's best efforts, Metroid isn't a heavy hitter for the company, and it wouldn't bring anyone new to NX which is the opposite of what Nintendo should be prioritizing. Mario, Zelda, and Pokemon would largely take care of the Nintendo crowd at or around launch. Unless Retro Studios is working on one of those three, it should be working on something new to diversify the lineup and hopefully draw people to NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on April 30, 2016, 08:58:40 PM
Agreed. Ultimately I need to see something new coming out of Retro Studios. They perfected the Metroid first person experience and delivered the best platformer on Wii U, bar none. This probably means Nintendo doesn't know what to do with Metroid right now, but I'm ok with that for the reasons Adcock stated above.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on May 01, 2016, 01:04:16 AM
I'm not vehemently arguing for Retro to make Metroid specifically. My point is that saying it doesn't sell a lot (and let's not overstate that either; even if it isn't on par with Nintendo's A-tier releases, implying that the Prime games did not sell at all is unfair) isn't a good reason to say that games like Metroid aren't important or that they shouldn't be a priority over games that sell better. That's why I bring up DKC:TF. I'm sure it would have outsold Metroid on the Wii U, but it was selling to people who already bought the system for NSMBU. If you're trying to prioritize which one comes first, looking at software sales is misleading in that instance.

If Retro is making a new IP which fills a space that Nintendo's first party lineup usually doesn't, that's great. That's exactly what they need to do. But if we go by the logic that software sales should prioritize which kinds of games get made, that new IP should be a 2D platformer or a kart racer, and that's the part I don't agree with. Nintendo is most likely doing a 2D platformer and they're sure as heck doing another Mario Kart. So let Retro do something completely different; software sales potential alone shouldn't dictate the direction they go in.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 01, 2016, 01:34:07 AM
*insert pro-Metroid post*
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 01, 2016, 01:51:34 AM
*Insert aggressively anti-Metroid sentiment*
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on May 01, 2016, 03:42:02 AM
I hope Retro's game is Raven Blade. Meaning, I would love to see an RPG out of them.

Or an American Football game. That would be interesting.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 01, 2016, 12:54:54 PM
With Retro doing a new thing, I guess we can just safely assume one of the EADs is making New Super Metroid.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 01, 2016, 01:39:04 PM
I think it would be best for Nintendo to find Metroid's equivalent to Grezzo. Nintendo trusts Grezzo with Zelda who in turn do an admirable job. For a 2D Metroid, there are any number of companies that would jump at the chance at working on the series. Super Metroid's influence is found in dozens of games over 20 years later. The trick is finding the right team. I think Super Metroid is just about perfect, but in the interest of following Grezzo's path, maybe a remake of Super Metroid would be a good test to see if a team has what it takes to inherit the 2D games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2016, 01:40:55 PM
I hope Retro's game is Raven Blade. Meaning, I would love to see an RPG out of them.

Or an American Football game. That would be interesting.
Get ready for Mario Gridiron Football!

With RPG elements!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2016, 01:42:10 PM
maybe a remake of Super Metroid would be a good test to see if a team has what it takes to inherit the 2D games.
I don't think that game needs to be remade. How about a remake of Metroid II instead? That one desperately needs it.

Whoops, I meant to hit the modify button.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 01, 2016, 03:02:04 PM
I don't think that game needs to be remade. How about a remake of Metroid II instead? That one desperately needs it.
That's exactly why I think it should be Super Metroid. Grezzo got its feet wet with Zelda by mostly redoing textures and the inventory system in Ocarina of Time. Super Metroid's visuals mostly hold up. Like I said, the game is just about perfect. The only thing I'd change is the somewhat clunky item-switching. A graphics update would be expected if Nintendo is going to go back to the game at all.

For a Metroid II: Return of Samus remake, I'd rather see a Metroid: Zero Mission-esque overhaul in which the team just started over. The game hasn't aged well; it's really not that good. Hand the keys over once they handle updating a much better game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2016, 03:43:34 PM
That's exactly why I think it should be Super Metroid. Grezzo got its feet wet with Zelda by mostly redoing textures and the inventory system in Ocarina of Time. Super Metroid's visuals mostly hold up. Like I said, the game is just about perfect. The only thing I'd change is the somewhat clunky item-switching. A graphics update would be expected if Nintendo is going to go back to the game at all.
I don't think someone would need to start that small, but that's just me.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 01, 2016, 03:47:45 PM
I think remaking Super is a dumb idea. What needs updating? Nothing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 01, 2016, 04:59:47 PM
I don't think someone would need to start that small, but that's just me.
Grezzo did.
I think remaking Super is a dumb idea. What needs updating? Nothing.
It was just a suggestion. You can disagree without flat-out calling it dumb, but sure. I'd update the item-switching. To each his own.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2016, 05:27:19 PM
I don't think someone would need to start that small, but that's just me.
Grezzo did.
I'm aware they did, but I don't think a company (or them) needs to. Just my opinion, man.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 01, 2016, 05:31:58 PM
I think remaking Super is a dumb idea. What needs updating? Nothing.

Super Metroid is a great game, but there are definitely things about it that I'd change. As Adrock mentioned, the item switching mechanic is just atrocious. I'd also overhaul the platforming mechanics, in particular the terrible implementation of wall jumping. At the same time, outside of a few aspects of the story, Zero Mission's already effectively a remake of Super Metroid with a lot of these improvements.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 01, 2016, 06:46:33 PM
I'm aware they did, but I don't think a company (or them) needs to. Just my opinion, man.
Understood. I was only pointing out that it worked before. If Nintendo is being cautious (and it usually is), testing a small, third party development team with an arguably easy remake before handing them the keys to the entire IP isn't a bad plan. I'd certainly take a remake that rectifies Super Metroid's weird choices then a remake of Metroid II: Return of Samus that actually makes it a good game. By then, we'd definitely have a developer who "gets it." I mean, if that team can skip those steps, also awesome.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Team. Buttons. For. Life.)
Post by: nickmitch on May 01, 2016, 06:48:14 PM
I'd like a Metroid II remake, but I don't think a Super Metroid remake is a bad idea.  MII needs it A LOT more.  That game was made with the caveat that the sprites wouldn't quite fit right.  There's a great game under there, but it's just buried under the decision to put it on the GB.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2016, 07:05:02 PM
I don't think there's any point in remaking Super Metroid, but it could do with an enhanced port in the vein of Zelda OoT 3D, Wind Waker HD, etc. to iron out some of the quirks with its map system and controls. I don't really see reason to change anything else about the game; even the graphics still look fine, though a little resolution increase may not hurt. That said, this isn't something I would buy as I think the game plays fine as is.

Metroid II is a game that needs a remake, from redoing all its graphics to be more detailed (and in colour of course), to changing up some of the mechanics, and even redesigning some of the areas. Lots of things would need overhauled or changed to bring it up to speed. I'm a little surprised that they didn't do this after Zero Mission.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on May 01, 2016, 08:27:27 PM
Metroid 2 doesn't need that much time.  Use Sprites from the other games except for Boss Metroids.  Redo those.  The map could be redesigned though.  Make something where you really need to focus on the Spiderball. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 01, 2016, 11:14:31 PM
I don't think someone would need to start that small, but that's just me.
Grezzo did.
I think remaking Super is a dumb idea. What needs updating? Nothing.
It was just a suggestion. You can disagree without flat-out calling it dumb, but sure. I'd update the item-switching. To each his own.
Apologies for being blunt. I just think remaking a game just to change item switching and wall-jumping (a precision-based move that demands mastery of the mechanic) is kind of silly. Instead of remaking Super, why not do something akin to A Link Between Worlds? Graphical update and new mechanics, story, controls, and the potential for engine reuse? While some might say ALBW is teetering on remake level, but it clearly is its own thing, and has a number of neat, stand-alone ideas. Plus, it was never a graphically taxing game, and although many associate Metroid with great visuals (Metroid 2 notwithstanding), I'm not sure such a niche title would be worth the graphics investment.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 02, 2016, 12:40:43 PM
When I say there's a need for a new Metroid game I mean it purely from a creative standpoint.  The last entry in the series was a misstep and we haven't had a new game in a while so the series needs a new entry to get it back on track.  I would love to see a Zero Mission style take on Metroid II.  Going back to Super Metroid seems unnecessary.  Zero Mission was practically a new game and Metroid II gives you the flexibility to do the same for it.  Super Metroid is too refined to change much and if you did really re-haul it you would probably make it worse.  Also we've been waiting for years for a new Metroid so a remake is kind of a lame.  Don't we deserve to see something new by now?

In regards to what Nintendo should prioritize I don't think Metroid is going to sell consoles that well but prioritizing the big sellers can lead to a one dimensional lineup.  Nintendo clearly did this with the Wii U.  For the first little while it was like every second game was a party game or a 2D platformer.  In theory this made sense because games like Wii Sports and NSMB were big sellers on the Wii but Nintendo already had a thin lineup and it made no sense to make multiple games in those genres when other genres were completely absent.  DKC Tropical Freeze was a stupid move.  In theory it makes sense because it's predecessor sold well but it was too similar to other Wii U titles.  Plus you would assume that fans of games in one genre would be fans of games in another.  If 2D platformers were your thing I figure NSMB U or Tropical Freeze would be sufficient killer apps for you.  If Tropical Freeze was the sort of game that would sell you on a console you were probably already on board for Mario and if Mario didn't entice you, Donkey Kong wouldn't either.

The NX is not going to have that strong of support at the beginning regardless of what the hardware is like.  After last gen I fully expect third parties to be cautious so Nintendo will have to get the ball rolling themselves.  They should make sure their teams are all working on very different style projects for their first NX releases to provide variety.  No two teams should be working on the same genre, regardless of how popular the genre is.  When those first round of titles are first shown, as many people as possible should feel that there is something in the lineup that appeals to them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 03, 2016, 12:19:47 PM
So I thought of something that is complete speculation and I intend it more as a joke than anything else.

The Wii U is getting a surprisingly large amount of games released in June.  This morning when Terraria was added to that list I thought to myself "what's going on in July that's making everyone try to get their game out in June?"  The whole thing feels like everyone trying to meet a deadline.  Then I thought of something it could be - what if Nintendo's event to debut the NX is in July?  Devs would probably be aware of the timeframe for the reveal so as to get trailers or demos ready for it.  So perhaps the logic is to get your Wii U title out before the NX reveal tanks Wii U sales.

Or it could be something lame like a lot of these companies start their new fiscal year in July and want to get the first round of sales for their game to go towards the old year.

I have no source of on this and it should not be taken seriously.  Just a fun speculative thought that entered my mind.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on May 03, 2016, 04:20:07 PM
So I thought of something that is complete speculation and I intend it more as a joke than anything else.

The Wii U is getting a surprisingly large amount of games released in June.  This morning when Terraria was added to that list I thought to myself "what's going on in July that's making everyone try to get their game out in June?"  The whole thing feels like everyone trying to meet a deadline.  Then I thought of something it could be - what if Nintendo's event to debut the NX is in July?  Devs would probably be aware of the timeframe for the reveal so as to get trailers or demos ready for it.  So perhaps the logic is to get your Wii U title out before the NX reveal tanks Wii U sales.

Or it could be something lame like a lot of these companies start their new fiscal year in July and want to get the first round of sales for their game to go towards the old year.

I have no source of on this and it should not be taken seriously.  Just a fun speculative thought that entered my mind.
San Diego Comic Con NX reveal, confirmed!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 03, 2016, 04:30:42 PM
Nintendo's First Annual Fourth of July Barbecue and NX Reveal Spectacular
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 03, 2016, 04:49:41 PM
Nintendo's First Annual Fourth of July Barbecue and NX Reveal Spectacular

That's what happens when you start letting Americans have input on company policy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 03, 2016, 05:39:42 PM
Nintendo's First Annual Fourth of July Barbecue and NX Reveal Spectacular

That's what happens when you start letting Americans have input on company policy.

Mario Strikers NX: CANCELLED!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on May 03, 2016, 07:03:52 PM
"...before the NX reveal tanks Wii U sales."

I think you confused "NX reveal" with "being the Wii U."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 03, 2016, 07:21:13 PM
Also, that's still too close to E3.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on May 03, 2016, 08:54:25 PM
Most fiscal years go April -> March, btw.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 03, 2016, 11:18:38 PM
There is some discussion on whether or not sales are a good indicator of whether or not a company should make a game.
Ladies and gentleman, here's an example of how to completely misconstrue someone's point.

I'm going to stop you right there, Perm. Let's go back to what I specifically said.
Software sales are a good indicator of whether a company should prioritize a specific series or type of game.
Making something and prioritizing it are entirely different things. The former is about that thing's existence, the latter is about when that thing should exist. A niche game with a small but loud fanbase has no business being a priority, especially for a company like Nintendo that is coming off its weakest home console. Metroid can't carry a holiday season, doesn't sell, and generally doesn't appeal to anyone except its own fanbase. It isn't the kind of series Nintendo should try to sell a console with. Metroid isn't an appetizer; it isn't the first thing people generally eat at a restaurant. And it sure as hell isn't the meal they went out for. If anything, it's the dessert most people can talk themselves into buying after getting their fill. For some, they go out specifically for the dessert, and that's great for them, but they're the outliers.

And again, Metroid is my favorite series. Of course, I'd want a new game. However, what I want and what I think should happen are entirely different things. Metroid isn't going to help Nintendo sell NX in any significant way. I'd rather wait for a new Metroid game if it means Nintendo gets off to a much better start in part because Retro Studios worked on the next Splatoon-esque success instead. Release a new Metroid when NX is rolling. And if it doesn't and Nintendo doubles down on its own fans again, release it then. Launch, near launch, or even the first year is really not the time for it.

I didn't misconstrue anything. We both understand the word indicator. Also, that wasn't entirely aimed at you. That was a generalized statement. It was even worded in a generalized ways. My point wa sometimes sales numbers fail us. How does Halo sell so well? What's the huge difference between Halo and Metroid?  Halo was a system launcher and became popular because it was a decent game when there were few games to buy. Is Red Steel a better game than Metroid Prime? The sales of these games are entirely determined by market perception.

Retro busy? Then get another team to make it. There are plenty of hungry teams that do quality work. People don't buy Nintendo systems because the perceived lack of variety. We are well past the n64 era where only Nintendo and a handful of developers made quality games. We need quality and quanity, and variety. You can combat that by making more games. Ideally first impressions matter. What comes out at launch matters. What would journalists talk about if they were given access to a new incredible Metroid game on NX?

What Nintendo should do is make sure games are coming out. It needs to release old franchises and new. One could compare Nintendo to Disney. We know the next few years of Disney are going to be good. The next few years of Nintendo? A mystery.

Hopefully Nintendo just does the whole unified account system. That solves all sorts of issues.

I'm not opposed to any Metroid game coming out, 2d or 3d. I feel like last year they purposely bated us. They lowered the price of the 2d ones in the Nintendo wii u store and released Metroid Prime trilogy in the eShop. I bought them all, played the **** out of them, and made a Metroid clone in unity.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 04, 2016, 12:52:22 AM
Federation clowns looks promising perm.


I just realised what I said, that's too funny to change! ;D
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 04, 2016, 02:47:33 PM
Well, preferably a western developer or someone like Kojima or Mikami. Federation Clowns is a good name though. Like a Monty Python Space Series.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 04, 2016, 08:30:01 PM
Tis' merely a scratch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 04, 2016, 09:38:20 PM
I'm actually excited about Federation Force- despite its bland graphics, the mission based stuff is exactly what I want to play with my friends.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on May 05, 2016, 04:59:30 AM
Hey Perm, Hopeful that the NX will blow us away!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 05, 2016, 04:15:47 PM
Via NintendoLife: http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/05/rumour_rom_chip_maker_macronix_drops_hint_nintendo_could_be_abandoning_optical_storage_for_nx

Quote
"However, fresh speculation - promoted by comments made by Macronix, the company which traditionally supplies Nintendo with its ROM chips - suggests that the firm could opt to use cartridges or game cards for NX, like it does with the 3DS."

Money-Link (Japanese Financial website)
Quote
Macronix's ROM chips are usually supplied to videogame console maker, Nintendo. Although the sales is in off season during the first quarter, the revenue is similar compared with the same period last year. Wu Miin suggested that as Nintendo had just announced it will release a new generation console in March next year, and the console will be launched at the same time in Japan, America and Europe, so ROM's sales is expected to increase in the latter half of this year, and it will have a large growth potential.

Macronix chairman Wu Miin
Quote
In the past, Macronix sales performance usually peaked at third quarter, while declined at the fourth quarter. However, Wu Miin pointed out that because Nintendo has announced that the new platform will be launched in March next year, orders should be placed in advance. Therefore, the operating revenue of Macronix in the fourth quarter may be as good as the third quarter.

Could be something, or maybe they're speculation as much as ours...still curious.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 05, 2016, 04:18:32 PM
So, this new speculation would also tie in to that patent that didn't have an optical drive, right?  Seems promising.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 05, 2016, 04:47:21 PM
I fear going with carts will cost them third party support.  I figure those cost more than optical discs and if you give third parties an excuse, and a lower profit margin because of a non-standard medium is actually a pretty valid excuse, then they'll take it.  Though with digital distribution there will be an ever increasing chunk of sales with no physical media costs involved at all so this isn't quite like the N64 days.  And if the NX is both a handheld and a console a 3DS style cart makes sense.

Eh... it's still Nintendo going against industry conventions and that has summed up to some **** third party support every single time.  I'm going to have to be sold on this idea.

Though this is a million times better than the "no optical drive" rumour coming to the conclusion of no physical media at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 05, 2016, 04:56:31 PM
If it uses some form of "cartridge" then it will likely be some kind of game card similar to the 3DS. To my knowledge, even the largest sizes on 3DS are still just a few bucks each to manufacture, which is far less than with N64 cartridges which could cost up to $20 for a lot less space than these game cards can provide.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on May 05, 2016, 04:59:51 PM
The NX, it was in front of our eyes this entire time.


Macronix Chairman Wu Miin


Wii U Mini
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 05, 2016, 06:31:59 PM
The NX, it was in front of our eyes this entire time.


Macronix Chairman Wu Miin
I laughed way harder than I should have.


Wii U Mini
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 05, 2016, 06:44:16 PM
Apologies for being blunt. I just think remaking a game just to change item switching and wall-jumping (a precision-based move that demands mastery of the mechanic) is kind of silly.
Perhaps, though saying it's just to change item switching and wall-jumping is reductive. I'd argue that those things would make an already excellent game even better (excellenter?), something Nintendo has done quite successfully in the past such as the aforementioned Ocarina of Time 3D. I mean, Wind Waker HD only changed item switching and sailing (a precision-based move that demands mastery of the wind mechanic). I'm joking, of course. Obviously, there were other changes, point being, you can downplay anything if you try hard enough.

I'm under the impression that Metroid has been dormant for the better part of a decade because Nintendo didn't know what to do with the series though it still cares about how Metroid is handled. If Nintendo is looking for a team to "inherit" Metroid or so to speak, giving that team an intimate look at and the opportunity to rebuild one of the best and most influential games of all time isn't a bad move. I'm sure there's brilliance in Super Metroid that one would only really see and appreciate on the development side. Of course, that isn't the only way. If Nintendo had the utmost confidence in a team to make a new Metroid, **** it, let's see what they can do.
If it uses some form of "cartridge" then it will likely be some kind of game card similar to the 3DS. To my knowledge, even the largest sizes on 3DS are still just a few bucks each to manufacture, which is far less than with N64 cartridges which could cost up to $20 for a lot less space than these game cards can provide.
I'll have to do some digging, but I read a really great post on NeoGaf a while back about how the smaller size of the game cases as well as further trimming the packaging would help offset the higher cost of cartridges.

There are also other ways Nintendo could further bridge the gap between cartridges and optical media such as lowering licensing fees and incentives for meeting sales goals.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 05, 2016, 08:37:49 PM
I'll have to do some digging, but I read a really great post on NeoGaf a while back about how the smaller size of the game cases as well as further trimming the packaging would help offset the higher cost of cartridges.

There are also other ways Nintendo could further bridge the gap between cartridges and optical media such as lowering licensing fees and incentives for meeting sales goals.


I read that same post today. It's not just carts vs discs, or the cost of an optical drive. Smaller cases means you can fit more of them on boxes when you ship. You don't have to order two different kinds of boxes, print two different kinds of paper, etc. The savings would ultimately extend beyond the more cost difference of where you put the game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 05, 2016, 11:06:16 PM
Perhaps, though saying it's just to change item switching and wall-jumping is reductive. I'd argue that those things would make an already excellent game even better (excellenter?), something Nintendo has done quite successfully in the past such as the aforementioned Ocarina of Time 3D. I mean, Wind Waker HD only changed item switching and sailing (a precision-based move that demands mastery of the wind mechanic). I'm joking, of course. Obviously, there were other changes, point being, you can downplay anything if you try hard enough.
I think you're downplaying how great a game Super Metroid is.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 06, 2016, 01:22:16 AM
I think you're downplaying how great a game Super Metroid is.
I have stated on numerous occasions for nearly ten years on this forum that Super Metroid is my absolute favorite game, and it's not even really close. In the paragraph you didn't quote, I even call it "one of the best and most influential games of all time." So no, I don't think I'm downplaying how great a game it is.
I read that same post today. It's not just carts vs discs, or the cost of an optical drive. Smaller cases means you can fit more of them on boxes when you ship. You don't have to order two different kinds of boxes, print two different kinds of paper, etc. The savings would ultimately extend beyond the more cost difference of where you put the game.
(http://i.imgur.com/fyXmsja.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 06, 2016, 01:54:00 AM
Super Metroid's a great game, but even the best games could stand to be improved. Fusion and Zero Mission have a lot of small tweaks that make them better experiences in many ways that I'd be very interested to see applied to Super. What would be really cool is a "Metroid All-Stars" kind of package, that includes Zero Mission, a Zero Mission-style reimagining of Metroid II, the tweaked version of Super Metroid we've talked about here, and Fusion.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 06, 2016, 07:48:36 AM
Super Metroid's a great game, but even the best games could stand to be improved. Fusion and Zero Mission have a lot of small tweaks that make them better experiences in many ways that I'd be very interested to see applied to Super. What would be really cool is a "Metroid All-Stars" kind of package, that includes Zero Mission, a Zero Mission-style reimagining of Metroid II, the tweaked version of Super Metroid we've talked about here, and Fusion.

That would require Nintendo to care about Metroid.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 06, 2016, 08:09:48 AM
I think they care about Metroid, they just don't know where to go with it. It's a similar situation to where Star Fox was at. As we've said here, this kind of thing is something they could outsource, so it'd be a relatively cheap and easy way to show people the franchise isn't dead and give them a bit of time to figure out what they want to do with the next "real" Metroid game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 06, 2016, 11:51:41 AM
I think a new 2D would've been great.  Something to continue the main series.  The industry has been particularly starved for that kind of gameplay.

But I don't really like the excuse of them not having fresh ideas because if you wait long enough, "more of the same" feels fresh.  It's like with F-Zero.  They don't need to do anything "new" with it.  Just make one with shiny graphics.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 06, 2016, 12:43:44 PM
LEAVE METROID ALONE

MAKE A KID ICARIS UPRISING SEQUEL
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 06, 2016, 01:17:59 PM
How about a Kid Icarus game that's more in the style of the original?  What if they made a Kid Icarus on the SNES?  What would that have been like?  That would be cool to see.

Nintendo will say stuff like how they don't know where to go next with F-Zero or Metroid but then they'll gladly crank out another generic NSMB game.  The idea that they don't make sequels unless they have a new idea for it is marketing spin that they'll gladly abandon when they figure they can make an easy buck off of a cookie cutter sequel.  If Nintendo uses that excuse for a franchise it's because it isn't popular in almighty Japan, or just isn't that popular period.  They're not interested in Metroid because it isn't popular in Japan and their attempt to cater to that audience with Other M didn't work.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 06, 2016, 02:58:06 PM
Kid Icarus as a sequel to the original would be great.  I appreciate all the work that went into Uprising, but the original was more of an action-oriented adventure game than a shooter.  A very simplistic one with a lot of flaws, but the style, music, and general ideas were great.  An adventure game in 2D or 3D would make me want to buy whatever system it was on.

As for Super Metroid, it is so close to perfect that any changes would likely make it worse.  The way wall jumping works, for example, is important to the gameplay and flow of the difficulty.  If you change that, you'd need to change other things to rebalance it.  A new 2D Metroid is overdue, though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 06, 2016, 06:49:49 PM
One concern with a Super Metroid remake is that the studio might over do it.  Like a lot of people have said, the game is damn near perfect.  But, if given the chance for a remake, some studios might do more work than is necessary and end up making a far worse product.  I think MII is the safer bet, since there's so much to do, one wouldn't be tempted to overdo it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 06, 2016, 08:02:33 PM
One thing they would probably do with a Super Metroid remake is add cutscenes in the modern style.  Super Metroid has some cutscenes but they're done using the same viewpoint as the game itself which I think is very effective and is a subtle way to do story which was quickly abandoned once we could do gaudy mini-movies with FMV and multiple camera angles.  Like in Zero Mission there is a little cutscene in a comic book style when Kraid shows in his giant form.  In Super Metroid he's just there and shows up.  No little pause where you think "oh here's a cutscene", just this big scary dudes appears in front of you.  Or Crocomire doing that last jumpscare as a skeleton.  That's great stuff and adds to the atmosphere.  A newer game would have this big pause while the cutscene loads up and you would know that some boss is going to make his introduction.  That's a method I thought was very cool when it was new in the N64/PS1 days but has lost most of it's impact today.  The fact that Super Metroid doesn't do that makes it stand out more and I think few devs would pick up on that and keep it as is.  Odds are the whole scene with the Metroid baby (AHHH, I said the forbidden word!!) would be done in a cinematic style under a mistaken belief that because it's more modern and is now technologically feasible that it would be the better way to do it.  Hell Sakamoto himself would probably have tried to play film maker if he could have back then.  We got something special that might have been by accident.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 06, 2016, 09:06:08 PM
If they went the All-Stars route they could just make a couple small tweaks to Super (the map and the item switch) and focus the bulk of their effort on the ground-up remake of Metroid II. If they were only doing Super Metroid they might feel compelled to change more, which I agree would have the potential to go badly.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 06, 2016, 11:50:36 PM
Hell Sakamoto himself would probably have tried to play film maker if he could have back then.  We got something special that might have been by accident.

This has been a bane on all kinds of game development. I hated FMV from the jump. So much of what makes those old SNES games stick with people is that you're playing an abstraction of something that you're building in your head, particularly games like Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy VI. It's a unique triangulation between your imagination and a document that gets lost with 3D representational environments and proportional characters and such.

Speaking of Metroid remakes, I played through Return of Samus on the VC for the first time while traveling a month ago. In many ways it's impressive for a Gameboy game, but man, you'd have to start from a cleaner scratch than even Zero Mission. Like, once you get into it, the game is deliberately a series of self-contained mazes, with each area presenting a more convoluted maze to memorize and navigate, dense with upgrades and expansions (and horrible Metroids!). I kinda don't think you can just straight-up adapt that design structure in today's world unless you did something really weird with it that would essentially be in a different genre. I would fucking hate it, but Metroid II could be a template for a procedurally generated rouge-lite, trying to get deeper with each run while keeping upgrades (some Chozo business could Teleport Samus back to the surface when her health gets critical.) Don't do this, Nintendo!

RE: Cartridges:

I'm all for it if those theoretical cost savings make it viable and there's a way not to piss off third-parties. Discs in every medium seem to be falling out of favor quite quickly, and were always kind of a shitty stop-gap in the first place while the internet built out. Returning to cartridges (make em several times larger than 3DS carts if only for show) could re-invigorate a sense of games as durable physical objects.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on May 07, 2016, 06:19:04 AM
Super Metroid worked because the environment was the story.  The reason why games fail to capture the magic of the Super Metroid formula is because they think it is just about the game play mechanic of backtracking and powering up your character.  But Super Metroid had little moments in the environment that told the story...gave it atmosphere without taking you out of them game.  Sometimes those events only triggered once.  Sometimes the game played off the idea of back tracking and had events happen only after seeing that screen once.  It also never babied the player, you saw clues in the environment that helped tell you what to do.  You know other games even Metroid games didn't do that as well.  But in a way Super Metriod perfected the interactive cut scene.  And you know I never had a problem with Super Metroid's item select.  The wall jump was hard but you only had to do it once...and even then you really didn't have to go down there in the game. 

Actually the only problem I had with Super Metroid was the Power Up to see through walls and such seemed to come too late in the game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 07, 2016, 07:32:42 PM
Spak-Spang is on point with the Super Metroid analysis.


On topic, Gamespot talks about the NX:

Are you seeing excitement through PowerUp Rewards members around the Nintendo NX?
Quote
There is some excitement around NX. Lately here, we’ve been hearing a lot more buzz than we have in the past. Nintendo is interesting in that they really are able to keep things as quiet as they can for a while. And then they just lost their leader, so they’ve gone through a mourning period and so forth. NX sounds exciting. We’re looking forward to it. They’re very innovative in everything that they do. I hope that they come out with something exciting and innovative. I think we’ll be dominant distributor of that platform.
http://www.alistdaily.com/uncategorized/gamestop-ceo-paul-raines-discusses-nintendo-nx-new-consoles-vr/ (http://www.alistdaily.com/uncategorized/gamestop-ceo-paul-raines-discusses-nintendo-nx-new-consoles-vr/)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 07, 2016, 08:00:57 PM
I'm not sure how my suggestion that Nintendo find a small team to develop a near-straight Ocarina of Time 3D-style remake of Super Metroid (graphics update and item switching overhaul being just about it) devolved into a discussion regarding fears that Nintendo would allow another developer to practically change the entire game. Are we talking about the same Nintendo? I don't think it has ever greenlit a complete overhaul of one of its most beloved games so I don't know where this concern is coming from. At that point, the developer would be making an entirely new Metroid game. There is no point of a Super Metroid remake if the team wasn't making Super Metroid anymore. This entire discussion started because I doubted Nintendo trusting just anyone with one of its properties. Any team that gets its hands on a Nintendo IP is under strict supervision. You either make the game Nintendo wants or you don't get to make that game. Any concerns that a team handling a Super Metroid remake overdoing it seem unfounded to me.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 09, 2016, 03:29:08 PM
Gamestop is a retailer, to them another Wii is more exciting than another Game Cube or Wii U. I am not sure if I would get my hopes up too high just yet.

I don't know why people get hung up on what developer is doing what game because they are just names of teams people come and go. t|The "team" that made Metroid Prime might not be the same people working at Retro on the new game, it could be people left over from the team that worked on Wii Music or Nintendoland for all we know. A company like Nintendo surely doesn't force people to stay locked in one department for the duration of their career.

EAD, Rare, Retro, Intelligent Systems, Namco, Bandai, Sega, etc, they are all just names the people come and go.

I want to be hopeful NX will be awesome and so far I am leaning more towards optimistic than I was before. Optimistic can turn south real quick with Nintendo it usually only takes one slip up to throw a monkey wrench into the whole shebang.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 09, 2016, 04:40:43 PM
the guys who worked at retro(that are still alive) mostly work at armature. They are working on this game



...for the competition
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on May 09, 2016, 04:57:40 PM
I'm still curious when the Kickstarter for that is launching, and I think I have it nailed to June 25.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 09, 2016, 08:15:09 PM
Armature's original output has been underwhelming really.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 09, 2016, 10:50:12 PM
I think you're downplaying how great a game Super Metroid is.
I have stated on numerous occasions for nearly ten years on this forum that Super Metroid is my absolute favorite game, and it's not even really close. In the paragraph you didn't quote, I even call it "one of the best and most influential games of all time." So no, I don't think I'm downplaying how great a game it is.
Super Metroid is a great game, and is indeed one of the best games of all time. But influential? Yeah, I guess if you mean on the indie and Castlevania scene, maybe. Outside of that, Super Metroid hasn't done jack for the video gaming industry.

I think you're overstating how great a game Super Metroid is. ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 10, 2016, 02:22:44 PM
I'm sure Super Metroid influenced survival horror games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 11, 2016, 12:06:33 AM
No, Clock tower on the SNES did.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on May 11, 2016, 01:13:08 AM
I think you're downplaying how great a game Super Metroid is.
I have stated on numerous occasions for nearly ten years on this forum that Super Metroid is my absolute favorite game, and it's not even really close. In the paragraph you didn't quote, I even call it "one of the best and most influential games of all time." So no, I don't think I'm downplaying how great a game it is.
Super Metroid is a great game, and is indeed one of the best games of all time. But influential? Yeah, I guess if you mean on the indie and Castlevania scene, maybe. Outside of that, Super Metroid hasn't done jack for the video gaming industry.

I think you're overstating how great a game Super Metroid is. ;)

It is very hard to quantify how influential a game is.  Super Mario 64 influenced many games outside of the 3D platforming genre.  I am sure Super Metroid has influenced several games in ways we may never know.  You don't have a game that is regularly placed in top 10 lists of best games of all time without studying it and being influenced by it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 11, 2016, 06:20:21 PM
Judging by the new animation at the end of the Commercial, can we confirm that the NX controller will at least have the traditional 4 button layout?

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on May 11, 2016, 06:33:13 PM
Sounds like a good assumption, it wouldn't make sense to put effort into a logo that'll be outdated within a few months.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: EasyCure on May 12, 2016, 08:07:23 AM
Just unveiling this and attaching it to the 2DS? Strange, I thought the 2DS model was under performing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on May 13, 2016, 01:19:34 PM
Judging by the new animation at the end of the Commercial, can we confirm that the NX controller will at least have the traditional 4 button layout?


I'd have to assume yes. Would be really weird if the next controller didn't have that and the traditional button layout was left only for the classic controller. We'll get another screened controller with the same layout since the SNES.

So about the NX reveal, if not E3 is anyone else expecting it to be unveiled at the Tokyo Game Show? Wasn't that where the Wii Remote was first seen and we got that crazy trailer that just set everyone's imagination on fire?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 13, 2016, 01:39:08 PM
Yet again, we are presented withe concrete evidence that Nintendo reads our forums.  #TeamButtons now includes Nintendo's upper brass.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 13, 2016, 02:59:30 PM
Glorious Button Master Race!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 13, 2016, 09:25:54 PM
I was just telling my nephe who was playing Sonic on his tablet why buttons are so important. I typed this with buttons.
He couldn't get knuckles to glide....
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 14, 2016, 12:00:34 AM
Forget buttons and touch screen, the next real big innovation is going to be voice controls.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 14, 2016, 12:18:41 AM
I thought that has been pretty under utilized. Nintendo and a few companies have worked on voice controls and listening intelligence ai in the past. Hey You Pikachu, Nintendogs, and Brainage, and Sega's Seaman come to mind. It goes wrong though. I was just annoyed with the xbox one and kinects voice controls. You have to calibrate the Xbox one camera per person. It responded to my roommate most of the time, but not me. With Brainage I would say "Brue" and "Brack" instead of "Blue and Black" because I realized it was made by Japanese speakers. Seaman was an interesting game. It was talking fish with an attitude. Its ai was pretty good for its time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on May 14, 2016, 01:13:27 AM
Considering my google voice dial needs me to add an influx at the end of the name for my wife for it to dial her instead of doing a search on why people call you Mi Amor I don't think voice recognition is ready for game controls.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 14, 2016, 03:27:48 AM
Hot hot hot rumors floating around today...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 14, 2016, 09:46:06 AM
Hot hot hot rumors floating around today...
Recap of Emily Rogers' sources regarding NX:
1. No x86. She didn't say ARM, but that's the only other viable option because Nintendo sure as **** isn't sticking with PowerPC.
2. Polaris rumors are "wacky."
3. Uses "special, custom made chips," hardware design is very modern.
4. Closer to Xbox One than PS4. Cue Ian freaking the **** out.

Recap of Adrock's thoughts:
1. I started leaning toward the ARM camp about a month or two ago once I actually read up on it. ARM makes the most sense for what it seems Nintendo wants to do and where the industry is heading moving forward.
2. Polaris would have been nice, but the timing was off. It seemed more feasible with a March 2017 launch but still iffy.
3. No surprises there. Nintendo always uses custom chips. The modern hardware design is the most important bit. NX needs to be able to run current engines. It's more important to be powerful enough to run these than more powerful than PS4 let alone PS4K/Neo.
4. This is the part I suspect will get the most attention, and it shouldn't. For how Nintendo has to approach NX, its place in the market, and consumers, price is more important than hardware power. Nintendo cannot launch NX for more than $300 and expect anyone besides its own fanbase to give a ****. In fact, $300 might be pushing it since that's around where PS4 and One are now. If NX hardware could outperform PS4 at $300, great, but that gets into economics I'm not privy to. There are ARM chips that outperform PS4's Jaguar-based CPU, but it wouldn't come cheap.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on May 14, 2016, 09:59:40 AM
The main place I'm seeing claim Polaris-based chips (http://www.twitter.com/tenkay23) is also pointing out that three years of efficiency increases could allow a chip with less impressive specs to exceed PS4 (original) output. Provided the developer gives a minute portion of a damn, which... yeah, how'd that do in the PS2 generation with Worst Nintendo System?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 14, 2016, 11:28:37 AM
There is also the other rumor that confirms the Emily one that the NX will use an Nvidia Tegra chip.

http://gonintendo.com/stories/257668-rumor-nx-handheld-to-be-powered-by-nvidia-tegra (http://gonintendo.com/stories/257668-rumor-nx-handheld-to-be-powered-by-nvidia-tegra)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on May 14, 2016, 12:24:08 PM
They should. It would have to be the latest and greatest (post-X1), but Nvidia Tegra would make the most sense, especially if there's a home console and a handheld.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on May 14, 2016, 01:57:46 PM
I learned with the Wii U rumors to not take anything at face value, so anything I hear or read regarding the NX is purely rumor with no likelihood of being true until the system is revealed.


Though it's still fun to read and discuss!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 14, 2016, 04:24:40 PM
Ahhh I've been avoiding NX rumor-mongering for so long but this morning it finally bit me and it bit me HARD!

Generally though, I'm anchoring my expectations to Emily Roger's rumors.

Recap of Emily Rogers' sources regarding NX:
1. No x86. She didn't say ARM, but that's the only other viable option because Nintendo sure as **** isn't sticking with PowerPC.
2. Polaris rumors are "wacky."
3. Uses "special, custom made chips," hardware design is very modern.
4. Closer to Xbox One than PS4. Cue Ian freaking the **** out.

Recap of Adrock's thoughts:
1. I started leaning toward the ARM camp about a month or two ago once I actually read up on it. ARM makes the most sense for what it seems Nintendo wants to do and where the industry is heading moving forward.
2. Polaris would have been nice, but the timing was off. It seemed more feasible with a March 2017 launch but still iffy.
3. No surprises there. Nintendo always uses custom chips. The modern hardware design is the most important bit. NX needs to be able to run current engines. It's more important to be powerful enough to run these than more powerful than PS4 let alone PS4K/Neo.
4. This is the part I suspect will get the most attention, and it shouldn't. For how Nintendo has to approach NX, its place in the market, and consumers, price is more important than hardware power. Nintendo cannot launch NX for more than $300 and expect anyone besides its own fanbase to give a ****. In fact, $300 might be pushing it since that's around where PS4 and One are now. If NX hardware could outperform PS4 at $300, great, but that gets into economics I'm not privy to. There are ARM chips that outperform PS4's Jaguar-based CPU, but it wouldn't come cheap.

I generally accept the first 3 with no argument. I was at some point jazzed to think x86 but I can see an ARM solution as more likely, ESPECIALLY if the handheld version itself is also on ARM.

Number 3 though tells me frankly nothing. "Modern" hardware to me is just marketing talk about how they're not off-the-shelf and they're doing some custom work on it.

As for Number 2/4, this actually make a good bit of sense given Nintendo's home consoles tracking to the last generation (The Wii was 2.5 GameCubes, the Wii U punched above an XBox 360, it would fit for the NX to track towards an XBox One target).

However, I have no reason for thinking that other than it fits a pattern. It still SEEMS to continue to trend, which is why I'll stick with it for now.

The same "track last gen" trend also seems to manifest in Nintendo's handhelds: The GBA got SNES ports, the DS got N64 ports, the New 3DS got a little ambitious with porting Xenoblade from the Wii.

I have no reason to be, but this morning I'm obsessed with the Tegra rumors. The already-released Tegra X1 would make a lot of sense to me as the chipset for the Handheld NX version, especially because it looks like it might have the raw power to be a "Wii U in a handheld" and fit the above trend. It'd also be a chip designed specifically for the limitations of a handheld in terms of heating and power consumption.

Of course, if the Tegra X1 was in the handheld, then there'd have to be a different chipset for the console NX? That console chipset, whatever it is, I'm guessing would be ARM (Number 1 from above), and probably hew closely with other rumors of AMD working on a new ARM APU order.

I've all of a sudden got in my head that, yeah, the NX is a platform, not a single system. Nintendo will position it as a shared ecosystem between both a handheld and a console, and provide development tools where you can build the same game for BOTH easily. There would be obvious differences between performance for the two hardware environments, but most games would be built on technology that accounts for scaling from square one (or just be a rare game that only exists on one and not the other).

That sorta reminds of the PS4K rumors where the new PS4 will have stronger hardware, but would basically run the same PS4 disc just with some graphical improvements if available (ala GBC->GB, or N64ExpansionPak->N64).

In my fever dreams I see them doing something big for cross-purchases too.

And oooh the cartridge rumors! Someone brought that up to me at work a couple weeks ago and I dismissed it out of hand, but then now that I've read back a couple pages about the benefits of removing the optical drive, the already impressive capacity of those existing 3DS carts, and also remembering the falling pricing of memory... They'd still need to be able up the capacity for the cart to at least single-layer Blu Ray amounts if they go this route though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 14, 2016, 08:44:52 PM
I don't think capacity on cartridges would be a problem nowadays. the SDXC format of memory cards can go up to 2tb.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 14, 2016, 08:46:30 PM
Number 3 though tells me frankly nothing. "Modern" hardware to me is just marketing talk about how they're not off-the-shelf and they're doing some custom work on it.
Taken in context, I don't think it's marketing talk. "Modern hardware" refers to more recent feature sets and newer technology. Nintendo joining the Khronos group was an under-the-radar announcement that said a lot about Nintendo's seriousness with keeping up industry standards.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 14, 2016, 09:54:48 PM
Number 3 though tells me frankly nothing. "Modern" hardware to me is just marketing talk about how they're not off-the-shelf and they're doing some custom work on it.
Taken in context, I don't think it's marketing talk. "Modern hardware" refers to more recent feature sets and newer technology. Nintendo joining the Khronos group was an under-the-radar announcement that said a lot about Nintendo's seriousness with keeping up industry standards.

What I mean to say is that just because Nintendo might be saying "modern" doesn't mean I'm ready to speculate that they're picking up some cutting-edge tech... like Polaris for example.

In comparison, the Tegra X1 rumors are interesting because that's a chip that already hit market in a consumer product last year. Perhaps two-year old, non-bleeding edge, but feature-rich tech like the Tegra X1 might fit better with the idea of "modern" in these contexts then?

But maybe even this is too optimistic? Let's not forget that for the 2011 3DS Nintendo chose chips from 2005...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 14, 2016, 10:44:08 PM
What I mean to say is that just because Nintendo might be saying "modern" doesn't mean I'm ready to speculate that they're picking up some cutting-edge tech... like Polaris for example.
Except Nintendo didn't say that, at least not publicly. Emily Rogers said she spoke to seven different people, and all, some, or none may work for Nintendo.

To expand on what I said earlier (not necessarily as a response to you), I believe the biggest clue to what modern means within the context of Rogers' info is Nintendo joining the Khronos group and likely using the Vulkan API. That's as far as I want to speculate without more info on this since Nintendo has never valued raw hardware power. It has, however, made some really smart design choices such as Sony's sound chip in SNES or MoSyS's 1T-SRAM in GameCube.

Speaking of GameCube, this is a console with clear hardware advantages albeit launched a year later yet Nintendo trotted out real-world performance numbers versus Sony boasting theoretical peak performance outside of an actual game environment. That said, when I hear "very modern hardware" or "industry leading chips," I think about ways Nintendo can improve performance through efficiency rather than pushing more powerful hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 15, 2016, 12:22:13 AM
I've read before as well that despite the fact that the WiiU is pretty similar similar to the 360 in raw specs, there's custom voodoo going on that allows Nintendo to deploy impressive lighting and whathaveyou without eating into main computational tasks. This would track with certain WiiU games looking very good despite the last gen baseline (and I assume ZeldaU will be duly impressive, Xenoblade with better art). I'd expect a similar scenario if the NX ends up being close on paper to the Xbone. Nintendo will be able to punch above that weight even if third parties don't bother learning the special sauce recipes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 15, 2016, 02:03:22 AM
To expand on what I said earlier (not necessarily as a response to you), I believe the biggest clue to what modern means within the context of Rogers' info is Nintendo joining the Khronos group and likely using the Vulkan API. That's as far as I want to speculate without more info on this since Nintendo has never valued raw hardware power.

That's why I find the Tegra speculation so tantalizing. That's a pretty full-featured piece of chip! ARGH! Must...tampen...expectations!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on May 16, 2016, 03:28:11 AM
Tweeted from the ArcadeGirl herself:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=203747904&postcount=1780 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=203747904&postcount=1780)

"She did say I could share this small bit with you: 'Nvidia is involved with Nintendo's future hardware.'"

It could be just the Graphics Processing Unit, but it makes more sense to assume that Nintendo is interested in Nvidia's System On a Chip solution, Tegra (http://www.nvidia.com/object/tegra.html). Tegra is basically ARM CPUs paired with Nvidia's GPUs integrated in to a single package. The chips is being used in phones, tablets, laptops, and specialty gaming devices such as Nvidia's SHIELD portable.

This whisper has me excited for what it could mean!


EDIT:
Ah, well, lets recycle the Nvidia stuff for the third-fourth time
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?p=203563215
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 16, 2016, 03:53:48 AM
I don't see them jumping ship due to compatibility issues. I'd imagine it will have a closely related ps4/xbox one cpu and gpu. It might retain a spare IBM espresso for compatibility issues. It'll probably have some whacky awesome unique ram.

On the other hand Nintendo might jump ship because they've been getting the weak **** from amd. With nvidea out of the lucrative console loop they may want to offer their goods for cheap for pokemon money

or even crazier. The nx would have 4 processors. 3 in the box, and then one mobile tegra one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 16, 2016, 12:24:50 PM
My general assumption is that Nintendo will cheap out on the specs because that's what they done for a while now.  And they will prioritize architecture that favours their own development and not put any real effort into addressing what third parties want.  Then they will get dick support and only diehard Nintendo nuts will give a ****.

There is a certain level of effort that is required to compete and Nintendo just doesn't like doing that.  Mix that with their notorious stubbornness and penny-pinching attitude and odds are we'll get the Wii U 2.  We don't know for sure and I'm still very interested in finding out the exact details of the NX but I'm not optimistic because Nintendo has given me no reason to be.  Hell, they seem no different today then they did when the Wii U launched.  If they were getting their act together we would already see the difference.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 16, 2016, 01:26:32 PM
That's like every IanSane post boiled down to its purist essence. Can a mod make a script that just replaces every future post of his with that one?

On topic, there's a dude on the Neogaf thread who seems to be respected as a source, who says that PS4 Xbone ports will be easy and that any barriers will just be business related. Pretty much what was expected.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: EasyCure on May 16, 2016, 01:40:45 PM
There's an interview with Kimishima over on neogaf (which was transcribed on Reddit) where he's quoted as saying the NX is neither the successor of Wii U or 3DS.

Thoughts? I'd this not a successor in the sense that the original DS wasn't a successor to the Gameboy?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 16, 2016, 03:43:04 PM
That's like every IanSane post boiled down to its purist essence. Can a mod make a script that just replaces every future post of his with that one?
It's like he doesn't understand that a company doesn't "cheap out on specs." A custom chipset is still millions of dollars (billions of yen?) in research and development. Nintendo could dump high spec off-the-shelf parts in there and save a ton. Custom hardware is meant to optimize performance so the power it has isn't wasted through inefficiency and/or bottlenecks. Nintendo can't go too high because it still has to sell the thing. I can convince myself to buy a $400 Nintendo console, but I'm an outlier.
Quote
On topic, there's a dude on the Neogaf thread who seems to be respected as a source, who says that PS4 Xbone ports will be easy and that any barriers will just be business related. Pretty much what was expected.
Exactly. NX has to be in the ballpark of PS4 and One. Modern engines are highly scalable. If a game plays like ****, the publisher didn't care what it played like when it released the game.

Ultimately, Nintendo isn't getting Western support until it can prove its platform is worth supporting. Big Western publishers generally don't care about dedicated handheld gaming or, you know, the only thing has consistently done well in the last 25 years. Personally, I'd love to see Nintendo release a higher spec machine, but I know it won't be the difference maker. Nintendo has a long road ahead of it, and regaining support is going to be a process. Rumors point to Nintendo battling software droughts with a shared library and focus on Japanese third parties that still see at least Nintendo's handheld as a viable platform. It's a start. Getting multiplatform Western games like Madden and Call of Duty is also important. If you think higher specs are going to blow the doors wide open, you need to manage your expectations.
Thoughts? I'd this not a successor in the sense that the original DS wasn't a successor to the Gameboy?
I took that to mean that NX is the successor to both Wii U and 3DS due to the shared library rumor. It could also mean a stronger focus on the core audience which is also something Nintendo has talked about in the last year or two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on May 16, 2016, 04:12:11 PM
There's an interview with Kimishima over on neogaf (which was transcribed on Reddit) where he's quoted as saying the NX is neither the successor of Wii U or 3DS.

Thoughts? I'd this not a successor in the sense that the original DS wasn't a successor to the Gameboy?

We've heard him say at least twice now about how the NX will offer a new way to play(what ever that means) but honestly I think it's just a PR way to not cannibalize Wii U and 3DS sales too soon. Because yeah, like the 3rd pillar which was the DS, we all knew it was the successor to the GBA. When it's all said and done though we all know it will just be the next thing to play Nintendo games on.

Maybe this is also a way to distance the new machines from the dying brands and start fresh.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 16, 2016, 04:47:05 PM
That's like every IanSane post boiled down to its purist essence. Can a mod make a script that just replaces every future post of his with that one?
It's like he doesn't understand that a company doesn't "cheap out on specs." A custom chipset is still millions of dollars (billions of yen?) in research and development. Nintendo could dump high spec off-the-shelf parts in there and save a ton. Custom hardware is meant to optimize performance so the power it has isn't wasted through inefficiency and/or bottlenecks. Nintendo can't go too high because it still has to sell the thing. I can convince myself to buy a $400 Nintendo console, but I'm an outlier.

"Cheaping out" means not matching the industry standard expectations of hardware specifications.  It means Nintendo going with something that doesn't match up because it will cost them less money and they're usually hoping they can create a larger profit margin for themselves on the hardware.  Think of it like a sports team which will always have a payroll in the millions.  But some teams will let star players leave in free agency because they, for whatever reason, won't pay them the market value and won't sign pricey free agents to fill holes in their lineup.  So they go out with a hope and a prayer that cheaper journeymen and young players that haven't finished their first contract yet will make them compete with the teams that are willing to pay more.  You can argue the justification but Nintendo is not willing to financially invest in hardware that matches the competition.  You can spend $1000 on something and it's a lot of money... but if you really need to spend $2000 to do it properly then you're cheaping out.  It's not the value of the amount, it's the value relative to what you SHOULD spend.

I feel that there are consumer and developer exceptations for a console released in 2016 and if Nintendo wants to get anywhere they have to meet them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 16, 2016, 05:25:58 PM
Nintendo (Iwata and Kimishima) have said things like that before, but Nintendo has a certain set of things that they generally say regarding product launches.  It seems to represent an internal philosophy that rarely pans out in the actual products.  A more cynical view is that it is just spin.

The rumors, in my thinking, have fallen into two contradictory tracts.  One is that this is a traditional console with an x86 processor, easy current gen ports, and competitive hardware.

The other is that the NX will be a Wii U in reverse... the horsepower in the handheld portion, making it truly portable.  Wireless HDMI streaming, cartridges, and ARM all fit into this concept.  This is the one that seems to be gaining traction, and Nintendo's E3 plans make sense in that respect.  Since it would likely be weaker than current gen consoles, which are themselves old enough to be getting mid-gen upgrades, showing it at E3 could lead to a slaughter in the gaming press.  Also, showing Zelda so extensively for a console that is on the way out would be more logical if it isn't the clearly inferior version after all.

I really hope that isn't true, since I want higher fidelity Nintendo games like Zelda or Metroid more than any games on competing systems, but I am mentally bracing myself for it.  On the bright side, one combined system (which might be marketed as a third pillar just in case it fails) would potentially mean a constant stream of first party games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 16, 2016, 05:27:36 PM
"A dude on NeoGaf" is the new "my uncle who works at Nintendo".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 16, 2016, 06:09:07 PM
"A dude on NeoGaf" is the new "my uncle who works at Nintendo".

Well, there's not a hell of a lot to work with at this point. There was that one Wall Street Journal article that pointed to "industry leading chips". Almost everything else is broad strokes from insiders and second-hand leakers, as folks are too freaked out by NDAs this time around to drop anything specific. This most recent activity is based on a rumor that the NX will be close to the Xbone in power, which caused a wave of panic, but that's as easily countered by the notion that it will be able to run ports of current gen games without a problem, which has been posited with as much credibility.

The average of all of this seems to point to (if anything) that the NX is going to be in the same ballpark as PS4/Xbone, not run on PowerPC, and thus be easy enough to port to that it won't be a feasible excuse not to support the system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on May 16, 2016, 06:29:35 PM
Quote
You can argue the justification but Nintendo is not willing to financially invest in hardware that matches the competition.

And how many years have the competition spent swimming in red ink?


Quote


"That would have been a smart move...two years ago. It's too late now."


Well that's like Nintendo's mission statement.  Hell, Twilight Princess should have been released two years ago instead of Wind Waker.  Release the arty Zelda that the mainstream audience won't like first and the more traditional "cool" Zelda at the very end of the console's life when no one cares anymore?  What sort of backwards logic is that?


Nintendo: two years behind where they should be since 1996. 


Does it ever get tiring whipping a dead horse?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 16, 2016, 06:45:09 PM
I've read before as well that despite the fact that the WiiU is pretty similar similar to the 360 in raw specs, there's custom voodoo going on that allows Nintendo to deploy impressive lighting and whathaveyou without eating into main computational tasks. This would track with certain WiiU games looking very good despite the last gen baseline (and I assume ZeldaU will be duly impressive, Xenoblade with better art). I'd expect a similar scenario if the NX ends up being close on paper to the Xbone. Nintendo will be able to punch above that weight even if third parties don't bother learning the special sauce recipes.


They say this every generation, that Nintendo's hardware "limitations" can be easily overcome by magic that only Nintendo possess. It's a myth perpetuated by fanboys that don't accept reality. I remember endless discussions on how The Conduit supposedly looked better than Halo 3 and Gears of War. Sega fanboys said the same thing about the ill-fated Saturn, that nobody could program the thing properly. 30 years latter and we know this was false. The machine was hard to program for but it was also VERY WEAK hardware to begin with.

Quote
And how many years have the competition spent swimming in red ink?

Well let's see, you are comparing Sony, a company that invested billions into cell phones, computers, televisions, car audio, tech gadgets, smart tv apps, motion controls, VR, Spider-Man 3, and a whole bunch of other ****, to a company that ONLY invests as much money as they have to stay afloat?


Yeah okay Sony was in dire financial trouble but it was NEVER because of the Playstation brand. You do realize that the PS3 was only unprofitable for a couple of years, and most of that was marketing and focusing all the attention on using Blu Ray to kill off HD-DVD, or did you forget that Sony and friends had to spend 18 months throwing millions of dollars at Blu Ray to get it to the place it is?

Nintendo hasn't always cheaped out on specs, but they have always cut something gamers and developers considered essential to cut costs. Even with NES and SNES they did this but they were able to MASK that by using chips in the cartridges. Something they can't exactly do anymore can they? Maybe that is why they want to bring the carts back to bring back the FX chips to give them an edge?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 16, 2016, 06:49:18 PM
Quote
You can argue the justification but Nintendo is not willing to financially invest in hardware that matches the competition.

And how many years have the competition spent swimming in red ink?

There's a cost of doing business in the console industry and Nintendo won't play ball.  I'm not saying that avoiding red ink isn't a good reason... but if the hardware isn't up to snuff and is in some architecture that turns off third parties the console won't sell.  The average consumer doesn't give a **** what Nintendo's excuse is.  It doesn't match the competition, so they don't want it.  If Nintendo can't or won't meet the expectations set by the competition then there is no point in releasing a console.  Either play ball or go third party.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 16, 2016, 06:55:41 PM
"Cheaping out" means not matching the industry standard expectations of hardware specifications.  It means Nintendo going with something that doesn't match up because it will cost them less money and they're usually hoping they can create a larger profit margin for themselves on the hardware.
1. Selling hardware at a small profit was the norm until Sony stupidly started selling at a significant loss (fun fact: even GameCube was sold at a loss at launch). The razor and blade business model is a bad idea for hardware because hardware costs hundreds of dollars. It easy to talk yourself into a razor especially since you probably need one. This worked out so poorly for Sony that it minimized losses with PS4 but ended up with a comparatively sub-par CPU. You can't have it all. Your consumer-focused mentality is understandable, just obscenely unreasonable. Someone has to pay for it yet you don't want that responsibility. In two generations, Sony went so high end that it barely sustained itself then it went middle-of-the-pack yet still sold at $400. I don't see either scenario as ideal, particularly for Nintendo.

2. PS4 was like a mid-tier PC at launch which is where Nintendo would have to be to meet your lofty expectations of what kind of specs NX should have in 2017. I'm still waiting for you to explain how you expect Nintendo to sell a $400 console. Kimishima has already stated NX won't be sold at a loss which is smart (even Sony didn't really want to **** with that anymore), and Nintendo really isn't in a position to retail NX at $100 or more than PS4 and One.

If Nintendo goes with ARM like the most recent run of rumors suggest, it'll be the most forward thinking Nintendo has been in a while. It may cost Nintendo some power now, but it's a better long term move.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 16, 2016, 07:34:03 PM
Your consumer-focused mentality is understandable, just obscenely unreasonable.

Why is it unreasonable to expect that if company B wants to compete with company A they have to at the very least match company A's product?  Nintendo should at the very least offer a PS4 comparable product at the same price point.  And with these half-step upgrades to the PS4 and XB1 then potentially a higher price point is going to introduced.

An underpowered console with no third party support will sell no better than the Wii U unless it is ridiculously cheap and Nintendo has some killer apps that encourage people to buy it as a second purchase.  Nintendo might just be fucked.  They might be the small business owner priced out of the market by the big chain store.  Consumers don't give a **** what reasons Nintendo may have.  If they notice that all these games come out for every console but Nintendo's then they're not going to buy Nintendo's console and if the hardware is too weak or too different those games aren't coming.  You might not think it is fair or that Nintendo has no other option but that's just how it is.  If Sony was selling supercomputers for 10 cents then that becomes the consumer expectation: 1 supercomputer for 10 cents and anyone that can't compete with that is left out in the cold.

I'm just saying that this is what the NX needs to be and maybe that isn't feasible for Nintendo but this is still what the NX has to be.  It's not my decision, it's just the expectation the competition has set.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 16, 2016, 07:48:55 PM

They say this every generation, that Nintendo's hardware "limitations" can be easily overcome by magic that only Nintendo possess. It's a myth perpetuated by fanboys that don't accept reality. I remember endless discussions on how The Conduit supposedly looked better than Halo 3 and Gears of War. Sega fanboys said the same thing about the ill-fated Saturn, that nobody could program the thing properly. 30 years latter and we know this was false. The machine was hard to program for but it was also VERY WEAK hardware to begin with.



First and second, _fuck_ yourself.

Third, I didn't say any nonsense about Wii games looking like Gears of War. I said that despite having specs in some ways worse than the 360 on paper, the WiiU can in some aspects output better visuals than PS360 because of the system's bespoke architecture that obviously Nintendo knows inside and out. I'd expect them to build in a similar, if not as pronounced given a likely move toward the PC-in-a-box design of the current generation, set of goodies for the NX that would give them some extra juice beyond a raw output similar to an Xbone.

If you want an actually cogent comparison instead of the asinine strawmen you brought up, look into the development of Rogue Squadron on Gamecube.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 16, 2016, 08:05:43 PM
My general assumption is that Nintendo will cheap out on the specs because that's what they done for a while now.  And they will prioritize architecture that favours their own development and not put any real effort into addressing what third parties want.  Then they will get dick support and only diehard Nintendo nuts will give a ****.

There is a certain level of effort that is required to compete and Nintendo just doesn't like doing that.  Mix that with their notorious stubbornness and penny-pinching attitude and odds are we'll get the Wii U 2.  We don't know for sure and I'm still very interested in finding out the exact details of the NX but I'm not optimistic because Nintendo has given me no reason to be.  Hell, they seem no different today then they did when the Wii U launched.  If they were getting their act together we would already see the difference.
I'm saving this for future reference.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on May 16, 2016, 09:27:07 PM
Ya'll can't forget that Nintendo is competing with evil multinational monopolies who are BUYING (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Microsoft) their way into your living room. Remember how brazenly they lied about Xbox/PS2's specs? The rootkits and RRODs? The $600 console thing really happened. I didn't dream it. They really did think with the Gamecube dead, that they could charge whatever they wanted and screw the customers up the warp pipe.


You think they really care about making the greatest looking games or whether they're art? They are playing nice now, but only because Nintendo is still sucking up 10s of millions of customers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on May 16, 2016, 09:57:23 PM
Quote
Nintendo has again stressed that the NX is not to be thought of as a system that will simply replace the Wii U, even if its release will negatively impact sales of that system. Nintendo CEO Tatsumi Kimishima said in a new interview with Asahi Shimbun that the NX is "neither a successor to the Wii U nor to the 3DS."

Instead, "It's a new way of playing games, which I think will have a larger impact than the Wii U," he added, according to a translation by NeoGAF's GSR. "But I don't feel it's a pure replacement for the Wii U."


http://www.gamespot.com/articles/nx-will-have-larger-impact-than-wii-u-and-represen/1100-6439849/

Sorry to drag neogas back into the discussion, but it's an interesting development.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 16, 2016, 11:37:43 PM

They say this every generation, that Nintendo's hardware "limitations" can be easily overcome by magic that only Nintendo possess. It's a myth perpetuated by fanboys that don't accept reality. I remember endless discussions on how The Conduit supposedly looked better than Halo 3 and Gears of War. Sega fanboys said the same thing about the ill-fated Saturn, that nobody could program the thing properly. 30 years latter and we know this was false. The machine was hard to program for but it was also VERY WEAK hardware to begin with.





First and second, _fuck_ yourself.

Third, I didn't say any nonsense about Wii games looking like Gears of War. I said that despite having specs in some ways worse than the 360 on paper, the WiiU can in some aspects output better visuals than PS360 because of the system's bespoke architecture that obviously Nintendo knows inside and out. I'd expect them to build in a similar, if not as pronounced given a likely move toward the PC-in-a-box design of the current generation, set of goodies for the NX that would give them some extra juice beyond a raw output similar to an Xbone.

If you want an actually cogent comparison instead of the asinine strawmen you brought up, look into the development of Rogue Squadron on Gamecube.


Well funny how you brought up Game Cube, I wasn't talking about it I specifically mentioned Wii. But okay. Game Cube was NOT as powerful as the Xbox. The Xbox came out the same time as the Game Cube, was on sale for one year LESS than the Game Cube, was priced $150 higher than the Game Cube more than half of it's life and still ended up selling over two million units more than the Game Cube and had over 150 more games released for it than the Game Cube. It was capable of doing things the Game Cube couldn't do and the market responded by buying it. The machine was more powerful than the Game Cube in almost every way yet fanboys continue to bring up how powerful the Game Cube was like it had some magic untapped potential only Nintendo could figure out how to program for.

Except you can compare dozens of games that were on ALL THREE consoles and because the Game Cube had a smaller disc drive that limited the amount of content and the lack of online features meant it had to lose game modes that the other two had. Oh but I guess having some shaders that ONLY Nintendo knew how to make use of suddenly wipes out all of it's flaws. Ok buddy live in your delusion. I live in the REAL WORLD where Sony and Microsoft have kicked the **** out of Nintendo for twenty fucking years and Nintendo limps along by being cheap. Not saying anything about the quality of the games because okay sure Zelda TP was a masterpiece, I guess, but seriously dude compare it to the first God of War and tell me the fucking Game Cube was some magical box that could do things the PS2 couldn't do, it might have had some shaders or some other technical term only nerds even care about but real world performance proved that despite the slower CPU and supposedly weaker GPU the PS2 was easily capable of doing things without trying that developers had to struggle to do on Game Cube because they were too busy deciding what features to cut and they had to get all the shading and lighting and wharever other fuzzy feel good buzzword you need to convince yourself it didn't have flaws.


I won't even talk about the god damn Wii because in terms of power and graphics it was horse **** from day one. It was horse **** the day it died. Wii U was horseshit in HD. Oh so I guess some gibberish about how this game has some imaginary nerd quality that nobody can point to but are told to accept some how proves it is better. I own a fucking Wii u dude, I have played every god damn game I can, I have not played ONE game that was possible on it that could not have been done BETTER on the PS3 considering how many games WERE BETTER on the PS3. Oh except Bayonetta which is the one everyone points to, well that game, while maybe fantastic on Wii U because there is nothing like it, is third tier so-so mediocrity compared to the dozens of vastly superior games in the genre on PS3.

But I guess PS3 sucks because Sony lost money on it or whatever your argument was. But I guess your argument is more sound than mine because whatever.

Post needs two more paragraphs to ensure nobody takes it seriously. Right, will get on that asap.
Something about Motion controls and the Blue Ocean proves Nintendo was right.
Something about how the euphoria of playing Chibi Robo cancels all human thought.
Something about how Super Smash Bros. Melee is the greatest video game of all time.
Something about how Galaxies is super fantastic despite it being 80% empty screen space
something about Sony sucks because Blu Ray should die
something about how Resident Evil 4
something about Resident Evil REmake
something about Pokemon something or other
Something about Nintendo makes more than 4 games a year, if you spend the extra $150+ bucks to get their second machine
something about PSP was a dud or something
something about how Xbots are a plague against humanity (this one I almost believe)
something about how that ONE amazing Star Wars game on GC trumps all the other amazing Star Wars games NOT on Game Cube somehow invalidating their existence
something about Wii Sports and grandmas or something
something about Game Play vs. Graphics = bad graphics automatically means good game play
something about good graphics automatically means bad game play
something about the art of storytelling being lost in the art of something or other
blah blah blah incoherent ramblings on both sides
Oh **** it's time for bed gotta work in the morning to pay taxes so you can sit at home and play video games with your welfare money or something offensive like that
something about how I MUST be a complete idiot because my OPINIONS are not valid because a GOD DAMN DECADE AGO I was a dumb kid.
something about you can call me an idiot, tell me to **** myself, call me a troll and nobody bats a god dman eye but the first time I show a hint of anger, frustration, or some other human emotion I am told to go to fucking hell instead of asked to chill and whatever. Oh it's easier to say **** off we hate you than it is to hit the EDIT key and say, that was not nice dude.
Something about I should kill myself because you all thought it, said it, or wished it at one time.
something about how I try to not care and I don't care and I just want to have fun but mean people are assholes.
something about how I was an asshole first, fair enough I never said I wasn't.
Something about Sega being cool because they just are.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 16, 2016, 11:56:17 PM
Honestly I do think you have matured, just not a lot ;)


But going back and looking at past posts... Jesus you were an idiot weren't you?, nothing like you really are now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 17, 2016, 12:14:45 AM
If you like PS3 games more than Nintendo games, you should probably stop buying Nintendo consoles.

See, with how bad the Wii U sold, I now see this is the breaking point- this is going to be where Nintendo either proves that they can continue to be relevant for all those people that have grown tired with their practices. I mean, with how the Wii U performed, they could have bowed out and ceased making consoles- but they are still trying, and I thin this one has to be THE ONE. I can see the NX, ideally, reaching PS4 level sales, maybe... but I can't see it doing any better. Of course, this is assuming it is simply a home console. If it is a hybrid, like it should be, it might reach a middle ground between 3DS and PS4, but that's really stretching it.

Oh, and this "power" argument is bullshit considering consoles become obsolete within like, a year of their release. Not being HD was the Wii's fatal flaw, it was still able to run good games that were fun and pushed the limits of game design. All you can ask for in the hardware of a console is to perform well and do what it needs to do. Name calling and ****-flinging about the limitations of a console is fruitless and petty.


Relax. These are video games we're talking about, and while we all have our moments of entitlement and heated emotions, there's no use talking about how disappointed we were in the past- I'm including myself in this group. The past ain't changing, and the more you argue about it, the more you sound like Ian Sane.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 17, 2016, 12:19:34 AM
I don't think it'd be wise for Nintendo to release one system that does it all; one platform for sure, but not one system. And I'll explain while later.  But let me tell you what I'm concerned about

What I'm most concerned about is the controller. I still think the Wiimote is the future of controllers, it just needs more accurate technology and the ability to play console games now (ie two analog sticks, normal button arrangement etc). But if Nintendo wants parity with both their handheld and their console, then motion controls other than basic gyroscopic motion is all we can hope for. Or is it?

Next I'm worried about battery life. Remember people complaining about the 3DS battery life? It'll only get worse with more powerful hardware. There's no way you can run a PS3-like game on a handheld for more than a couple hours. And if that's the case, it's not really portable. It'll be the GG all over again.

And lastly, I'm worried about the market. The PS4 is the system you want for updated last-gen games and a few novel games. Sounds like Nintendo for the past few generations right? So Nintendo can either compete with the PS4 and convince third parties to support their platform or go a different route. If they follow the former, it'll be a system that costs 300-400 dollars, will likely have severe droughts until sales go up, and then maybe third parties would support the system. Meanwhile, customers (and parents) will most likely go with Sony. If Nintendo doesn't follow that path, and go with something more meager, they're now competing with the App store, Google Play, and Steam. They would have much more freedom to explore the landscape of gaming though. And that's a huge plus. And I've mentioned this several times, but Nintendo is at the point where they can pretty much put out any product. Nothing is off the table. And I think it is time to be ambitious so I would go with the latter path.

What is my suggestion? I want a Wii 2 and a Wii U 2. I'll explain. I want motion controls at home. I want the controller to have all the necessary features as  the ones on other consoles while still in two parts and much more accurate. I want game developers to take another whack at ideas that didn't work due to limited technology. Meanwhile, I want a handheld that doesn't push the boundaries but instead solidifies what has worked, while also extending the battery life far past what we have now. Let me play VC games on my handheld for days before my next recharge. And most importantly, I want the two to talk to each other. And this is what I mean by Wii U 2. I want the handhelds to act as separate screens as I play multiplayer. I want the promise of multiple monitors to come to fruition. There were so many good ideas that were never made due to limitations. Take another shot at it! And lastly, I want games from the new handheld to be ported easily to Wii 2 and vice versa (motion controls willing), and a VC that is account locked rather than system locked. Put it all under a name that is completely different from the DS and Wii (ie start over), and sell it as the future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 17, 2016, 12:23:12 AM
I love it how me and the PC gamers are just sitting back and laughing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 17, 2016, 12:44:41 AM
My general assumption is that Nintendo will cheap out on the specs because that's what they done for a while now.  And they will prioritize architecture that favours their own development and not put any real effort into addressing what third parties want.

Let it be known that I generally agree with IanSane here! I just see the glass as half-full instead of half-empty ^_^

Nintendo will be Nintendo, and I not only accept that, I'm excited by it. They take different risks, make different choices, and dream up different games and experiences. The videogame medium benefits by them being in it on BOTH the software and hardware sides. And my experience as a player is all the richer too.

Money, profitability, and sustainability are all necessary. So too is creating an environment where other game makers are interested, willing, and excited to make games alongside you. But these are only means to an end. And that end is creating great games that expand our concepts of fun, challenge our understanding of possibility, and deepen our experience of the world we live in.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 17, 2016, 12:49:18 AM
I've read before as well that despite the fact that the WiiU is pretty similar similar to the 360 in raw specs, there's custom voodoo going on that allows Nintendo to deploy impressive lighting and whathaveyou without eating into main computational tasks. This would track with certain WiiU games looking very good despite the last gen baseline (and I assume ZeldaU will be duly impressive, Xenoblade with better art). I'd expect a similar scenario if the NX ends up being close on paper to the Xbone. Nintendo will be able to punch above that weight even if third parties don't bother learning the special sauce recipes.


They say this every generation, that Nintendo's hardware "limitations" can be easily overcome by magic that only Nintendo possess. It's a myth perpetuated by fanboys that don't accept reality. I remember endless discussions on how The Conduit supposedly looked better than Halo 3 and Gears of War. Sega fanboys said the same thing about the ill-fated Saturn, that nobody could program the thing properly. 30 years latter and we know this was false. The machine was hard to program for but it was also VERY WEAK hardware to begin with.

Quote
And how many years have the competition spent swimming in red ink?

Well let's see, you are comparing Sony, a company that invested billions into cell phones, computers, televisions, car audio, tech gadgets, smart tv apps, motion controls, VR, Spider-Man 3, and a whole bunch of other ****, to a company that ONLY invests as much money as they have to stay afloat?


Yeah okay Sony was in dire financial trouble but it was NEVER because of the Playstation brand. You do realize that the PS3 was only unprofitable for a couple of years, and most of that was marketing and focusing all the attention on using Blu Ray to kill off HD-DVD, or did you forget that Sony and friends had to spend 18 months throwing millions of dollars at Blu Ray to get it to the place it is?

Nintendo hasn't always cheaped out on specs, but they have always cut something gamers and developers considered essential to cut costs. Even with NES and SNES they did this but they were able to MASK that by using chips in the cartridges. Something they can't exactly do anymore can they? Maybe that is why they want to bring the carts back to bring back the FX chips to give them an edge?


This is one of the worst revisionist Sony fanboy in Mario clothing post I've ever read. Its filled with so many levels of misinformation. I think you need to read the video game industry death thread to even get a picture of how badly Sony was doing during the ps2 and ps3 years. Sure Sony sold a lot of ps2s, and right before ps4 launched finally picked up its ps3 sales, but they were making consoles and selling them at a loss for almost a decade and it was putting a big hole in their pocket so they could propogate the new video format. That being said... I'm glad they got over that hump and are doing well again.

To say Nintendo is living check to check to stay afloat is ridiculous. The company has existed since the 1800s. They save their money and don't spend it. Nintendo could survive several failed consoles.

read this article
http://www.dailytech.com/Report+Nintendo+is+Second+Most+Valuable+Company+in+Japan/article9040.htm

Nintendo did extremely well during the last generation. They sold millions and millions and millions of consoles with a high profit margin which set them up for the next few decades. As soon as Wii got in last years drought mode it was back to negative nancy Nintendo hate.

Fact is despite with Wii U apparently dead I would still rate it better than Wii. I got really well made games from Nintendo and a bunch of good 3rd party games. It's done pretty well to get me to keep playing.

and Saturn wasn't 30 years ago. I was 11 not 2. I can also tell you it was developers talking about that **** and not fanboys. Fanboys who had internet were rare. We all read magazines. Playstation was a piece of **** and so was Saturn. The idea of a video accelerator was new and was barely developed. The previous generation of hardware's focus was how many colors you could put on the screen, and how many sprites and layers could be handled.
Early Saturn games look better than early Playstation games. If they had released Shenmue on Saturn it would have surpassed  many n64 games

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foZUcPQAMvg

but Saturn's sold like **** because the Sonic game never came out. I remember looking at Toy's R Us ads and seeing thing the Sonic Xtreme adds only to have the date pushed back until it got cancelled.

also watch this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_OchOV_WDg
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 17, 2016, 01:09:30 AM
I honestly wouldn't have a problem with Nintendo cheaping out if it meant an inexpensive console. $199 NX console with controller, no game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 17, 2016, 01:26:37 AM
I still feel like I only got a Wii U recently. I didn't get it at launch, I got it the following March. I say the biggest problem with Wii U was it was called Wii U. I don't know how many people I ran into that thought it was just an extra controller for Wii.  If it releases in 2017 I actually would prefer if they didn't rush it to market. I would rather it have games ready.

Hopefully, there will be a lot of games ready because there wasn't much for Wii U last year and there isn't much known this year. Nintendo has had plenty of time to make NX games. On the other hand I've become a slow burner of games. I have a huge back catalog of games to play. I have gamecube and wii games to play even. Although, I really don't think I'll get anywhere with Killer 7.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 17, 2016, 01:39:46 AM
I'm not going to read the awful-looking wallpost from that fellow, but I was mainly objecting to the Gamefaq-level "fanboy" talk. Christ, out of good faith I would like to think that anyone posting here is not doing so on that level. Dragging up nonsense Sega era stuff really has no bearing on this conversation.

I am once again chagrined at the level of pessimism on this Nintendo-focused site. I am not sanguine at all about the general state of the hobby (must be nice to give a **** about VR), but I'd like to think that Nintendo has another season in them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 17, 2016, 01:46:03 AM
I'm not going to read the awful-looking wallpost from that fellow, but I was mainly objecting to the Gamefaq-level "fanboy" talk. Christ, out of good faith I would like to think that anyone posting here is not doing so on that level. Dragging up nonsense Sega era stuff really has no bearing on this conversation.

I am once again chagrined at the level of pessimism on this Nintendo-focused site. I am not sanguine at all about the general state of the hobby (must be nice to give a **** about VR), but I'd like to think that Nintendo has another season in them.

I'd say more skepticism than pessimism. I just hope they don't do something incredibly whacky this next generation. I thought Wii U was good, but technologically it waas eclipsed by the competition in the realm of graphics. Ideally, I just want  improved Wii U. I still think the Wii U is blue ocean. I don't want Nintendo to swim in the same red ocean as the competition, but I certainly don't want them to swim in the brown or yellow ocean, I'm not sure what green ocean would imply.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 17, 2016, 01:49:24 AM
I've read before as well that despite the fact that the WiiU is pretty similar similar to the 360 in raw specs, there's custom voodoo going on that allows Nintendo to deploy impressive lighting and whathaveyou without eating into main computational tasks. This would track with certain WiiU games looking very good despite the last gen baseline (and I assume ZeldaU will be duly impressive, Xenoblade with better art). I'd expect a similar scenario if the NX ends up being close on paper to the Xbone. Nintendo will be able to punch above that weight even if third parties don't bother learning the special sauce recipes.


They say this every generation, that Nintendo's hardware "limitations" can be easily overcome by magic that only Nintendo possess. It's a myth perpetuated by fanboys that don't accept reality. I remember endless discussions on how The Conduit supposedly looked better than Halo 3 and Gears of War. Sega fanboys said the same thing about the ill-fated Saturn, that nobody could program the thing properly. 30 years latter and we know this was false. The machine was hard to program for but it was also VERY WEAK hardware to begin with.

Quote
And how many years have the competition spent swimming in red ink?

Well let's see, you are comparing Sony, a company that invested billions into cell phones, computers, televisions, car audio, tech gadgets, smart tv apps, motion controls, VR, Spider-Man 3, and a whole bunch of other ****, to a company that ONLY invests as much money as they have to stay afloat?


Yeah okay Sony was in dire financial trouble but it was NEVER because of the Playstation brand. You do realize that the PS3 was only unprofitable for a couple of years, and most of that was marketing and focusing all the attention on using Blu Ray to kill off HD-DVD, or did you forget that Sony and friends had to spend 18 months throwing millions of dollars at Blu Ray to get it to the place it is?

Nintendo hasn't always cheaped out on specs, but they have always cut something gamers and developers considered essential to cut costs. Even with NES and SNES they did this but they were able to MASK that by using chips in the cartridges. Something they can't exactly do anymore can they? Maybe that is why they want to bring the carts back to bring back the FX chips to give them an edge?


This is one of the worst revisionist Sony fanboy in Mario clothing post I've ever read. Its filled with so many levels of misinformation. I think you need to read the video game industry death thread to even get a picture of how badly Sony was doing during the ps2 and ps3 years. Sure Sony sold a lot of ps2s, and right before ps4 launched finally picked up its ps3 sales, but they were making consoles and selling them at a loss for almost a decade and it was putting a big hole in their pocket so they could propogate the new video format. That being said... I'm glad they got over that hump and are doing well again.

To say Nintendo is living check to check to stay afloat is ridiculous. The company has existed since the 1800s. They save their money and don't spend it. Nintendo could survive several failed consoles.

read this article
http://www.dailytech.com/Report+Nintendo+is+Second+Most+Valuable+Company+in+Japan/article9040.htm (http://www.dailytech.com/Report+Nintendo+is+Second+Most+Valuable+Company+in+Japan/article9040.htm)

Nintendo did extremely well during the last generation. They sold millions and millions and millions of consoles with a high profit margin which set them up for the next few decades. As soon as Wii got in last years drought mode it was back to negative nancy Nintendo hate.

Fact is despite with Wii U apparently dead I would still rate it better than Wii. I got really well made games from Nintendo and a bunch of good 3rd party games. It's done pretty well to get me to keep playing.

and Saturn wasn't 30 years ago. I was 11 not 2. I can also tell you it was developers talking about that **** and not fanboys. Fanboys who had internet were rare. We all read magazines. Playstation was a piece of **** and so was Saturn. The idea of a video accelerator was new and was barely developed. The previous generation of hardware's focus was how many colors you could put on the screen, and how many sprites and layers could be handled.
Early Saturn games look better than early Playstation games. If they had released Shenmue on Saturn it would have surpassed  many n64 games

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foZUcPQAMvg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foZUcPQAMvg)

but Saturn's sold like **** because the Sonic game never came out. I remember looking at Toy's R Us ads and seeing thing the Sonic Xtreme adds only to have the date pushed back until it got cancelled.

also watch this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_OchOV_WDg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_OchOV_WDg)


Well I didn't say Nintendo wasn't doing well financially. I was kind of saying it doesn't matter how much money Sony LOSt they still sold the most consoles and had the most games made.

Funny you call me a Sony fanboy, when I used to HATE playstation. Wanna know when I changed my mind, when I saw the damn Wii for what it was.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 17, 2016, 02:23:29 AM
As far as being a Sony fanboy it's how you worded your compare/contrast paragraph. You imply financially Nintendo can't keep afloat, and then you say Sony was never having problem with the ps3 brand and then in the next sentence you say "ps3 was only unprofitable for a couple of years"

Even if you weren't a Sony fanboy, you seem like some sort of anti-nintendo troll or plant. I used to have a friend whose whole job was to troll games forums. So, its not out of the realm of possibility. Your name and avatar are so counter your stance on games that it seems to be sheep's clothing. You just seem to be the biggest downer on these forums with the most skewed/misinformed perspective.

We have Iansane who is really negative, but brings up good points based on sound logic. He has the information clear, he sometimes differs in opinion. Actually, I'm probably closer to an Ian than a Bill Aurion.
with Ian, over the years he has had a reputation for being really negative. He makes excellent posts however. Really thought out. He gets criticism for his negativity, but at least he has his **** together. His biggest problem this generation was he didn't have a Wii U and he would talk **** about it, and its hilarious how now that he has one, he is really warming up to it.

Then we have you whose information is all screwed up. At least with Iansane he's been around here for the last 10-15 or so years. He's been responding to the same articles and topics as I have.

This whole talk has made me want to make a documentary about n64 - early ps3 era. Ian would be a good pundit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 17, 2016, 01:44:03 PM
I'm trying to think what sort of lower price Nintendo console I would personally be okay with.  I suppose if I could get a PS4 and NX for the price of a launch price PS4 that would be okay.  For the most part I would get both the third and first party titles I want.  Though I don't really know how different such a console would be from the Wii U.

And I actually want Nintendo to use the better hardware.  One thing that is really exciting about the new Zelda for example is we get to see what Nintendo will do with the series with HD level hardware.  We stuck around the same level for over ten years.  Skyward Sword doesn't really feel any "bigger" than Wind Waker for example.  Zelda stuck with this Gamecube level scale while the rest of the industry was expanding the scope of how just plain huge a videogame adventure could be.  Nintendo is very talented so why wouldn't I want to see what they could do with the improved hardware?  You can complain that modern AAA games are all generic but that's the whole point!  A truly talented and creative developer like Nintendo was not participating!

A negative aspect of Nintendo being more niche and less culturally relevant is that they have less of a positive influence on videogames as a whole.  A console like the Wii U that is off most people's radar is another generation of tomorrow's game developers with little to no Nintendo influence.  Pick whatever popular PS4 game you don't care for and THAT is the influence of tomorrow's devs.  If few buy Nintendo consoles then few are being influenced by Splatoon or Captain Toad or Pikmin 3 or whatever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 17, 2016, 03:05:11 PM
I think Nintendo tried to make SS feel "bigger" in the opposite way they made WW feel "bigger".  They made SS small but dense, and WW big but spaced out.  Neither technique was perfect, but I think they can find the middle ground with better hardware.

Ian makes a great point about the importance of Nintendo's influence.  Splatoon won the Game Award for best shooter (over COD and Halo, IIRC), but you're not really seeing that many new shooters trying to be different.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 17, 2016, 05:11:13 PM
Your consumer-focused mentality is understandable, just obscenely unreasonable.
Why is it unreasonable to expect that if company B wants to compete with company A they have to at the very least match company A's product?
You know goddamn well that isn't what I meant. You quoted one line in that entire post, cutting out the surrounding content that put it into context. Get the **** out of here with your straw man bullshit.

It is unreasonable to expect and demand powerful hardware without accepting the responsibility of having to pay a premium for said hardware.
Quote
Nintendo should at the very least offer a PS4 comparable product at the same price point.
Jebus, man... Emily Rogers' sources put NX right between PS4 and Xbox One which is exactly what you're stating here. I merely added that Nintendo really should not try to market a $400 console. $300 is the bar (if Rogers' sources are correct, $300 is probably NX's MSRP), and that's pushing it because PS4 will likely be $300 or less by the time NX launches. Do you really want to see how ugly it will get if Nintendo launches $100 or more above the competition mid-generation?
Quote
You might not think it is fair or that Nintendo has no other option but that's just how it is.  If Sony was selling supercomputers for 10 cents then that becomes the consumer expectation: 1 supercomputer for 10 cents and anyone that can't compete with that is left out in the cold.
That's a terrible analogy. That isn't a sustainable business model which was my first point. Had Sony continued on the path PS3 was originally on, Nintendo could have just waited until Sony put itself out of business. And NX at $400 like PS4 was at launch isn't going to work either because no one is going to buy it at that price for reasons that have been stated so many times before.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 17, 2016, 06:37:34 PM
Your consumer-focused mentality is understandable, just obscenely unreasonable.
Why is it unreasonable to expect that if company B wants to compete with company A they have to at the very least match company A's product?
You know goddamn well that isn't what I meant. You quoted one line in that entire post, cutting out the surrounding content that put it into context. Get the **** out of here with your straw man bullshit.

It is unreasonable to expect and demand powerful hardware without accepting the responsibility of having to pay a premium for said hardware.
Quote
Nintendo should at the very least offer a PS4 comparable product at the same price point.
Jebus, man... Emily Rogers' sources put NX right between PS4 and Xbox One which is exactly what you're stating here. I merely added that Nintendo really should not try to market a $400 console. $300 is the bar (if Rogers' sources are correct, $300 is probably NX's MSRP), and that's pushing it because PS4 will likely be $300 or less by the time NX launches. Do you really want to see how ugly it will get if Nintendo launches $100 or more above the competition mid-generation?

You're the one making these assumptions about Nintendo charging $100 more.  If the PS4 if $300 by the time the NX launches then why can't Nintendo make something on par with that and charge the same price?  And if the NX is $300 and so is the PS4 and the NX is LESS powerful despite costing the exact same price how is that going to go over?  The console comes out years later and sells for the same price point but can't match up?  Why would you assume that consumers would give Nintendo slack if on DAY ONE they're already busting out excuses and compromises like they've been doing for the last 20 years?

Assume no one gives a **** about Nintendo at best and are openly hostile towards them at worst because that's not far off.  How does Nintendo win these people over with an okayish effort with lots of "please understand"s?  They have to make a strong first impression so there can be no intentional compromises or "eh, that's good enough" attitude.  Nintendo never goes all in, always has some little compromises and cut corners, and seems to expect that people will cut them slack.  You need leverage to get people to cut you slack and Nintendo coming off a dud console has none.  We got all the same little excuses and compromises on the Cube as well and the N64 was a much more successful console than the Wii U and no one cut them slack or put up with their nonsense then.  A big chunk of the userbase had written them off and Nintendo made no real effort to try to win them back.  They wheeled out a new console that was pretty good but not great and it didn't catch on.

So if you don't care about Nintendo, or maybe outright dislike them, is a new console that is not quite able to match the competing consoles that came out years before going to win you over?  Are you going to feel that Nintendo has changed and is not going to continue to do all the annoying things that probably turned you off of them in the first place or are you going to think "they're slacking on the hardware again" and ignore them?  When Nintendo is criticized for going with underpowered hardware how they go out and do exactly that again and expect that to go over well?  If it's XB1 level then at least it isn't a gen behind but it's still playing into the hands of their critics.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 17, 2016, 07:00:01 PM
I imagine the price of the console will be based on a pretty simple equation. Every system Nintendo has released has cost whatever $200 dollars was worth in 1998 increased by inflation..
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 17, 2016, 07:35:54 PM
According to the CPI Inflation calculator, 200 in 1998 is now the same as $293.57, so $299.

Off topic, but jeeze, a near 50% inflation rise in 18 years? No wonder my consumer buying power is less...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 17, 2016, 07:39:21 PM
We have our launch price!

Actually, I was wondering about if there were separate console and handheld units at launch, if there could be some retailer bundles where you get both at once and pay like $500.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 17, 2016, 07:59:42 PM
We have our launch price!

Actually, I was wondering about if there were separate console and handheld units at launch, if there could be some retailer bundles where you get both at once and pay like $500.

That's what I was thinking. So essentially you'd get two controllers, a console and a handheld.

And I'd brand it all the same. I can't overstate how important that is. People need to know from the get-go that these two systems mesh with each other. No more DS and no more Wii. It needs to be _____ home system and _______ portable system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 17, 2016, 08:31:29 PM
Your consumer-focused mentality is understandable, just obscenely unreasonable.
Why is it unreasonable to expect that if company B wants to compete with company A they have to at the very least match company A's product?
You know goddamn well that isn't what I meant. You quoted one line in that entire post, cutting out the surrounding content that put it into context. Get the **** out of here with your straw man bullshit.

It is unreasonable to expect and demand powerful hardware without accepting the responsibility of having to pay a premium for said hardware.
Quote
Nintendo should at the very least offer a PS4 comparable product at the same price point.
Jebus, man... Emily Rogers' sources put NX right between PS4 and Xbox One which is exactly what you're stating here. I merely added that Nintendo really should not try to market a $400 console. $300 is the bar (if Rogers' sources are correct, $300 is probably NX's MSRP), and that's pushing it because PS4 will likely be $300 or less by the time NX launches. Do you really want to see how ugly it will get if Nintendo launches $100 or more above the competition mid-generation?

You're the one making these assumptions about Nintendo charging $100 more.  If the PS4 if $300 by the time the NX launches then why can't Nintendo make something on par with that and charge the same price?  And if the NX is $300 and so is the PS4 and the NX is LESS powerful despite costing the exact same price how is that going to go over?  The console comes out years later and sells for the same price point but can't match up?  Why would you assume that consumers would give Nintendo slack if on DAY ONE they're already busting out excuses and compromises like they've been doing for the last 20 years?

Assume no one gives a **** about Nintendo at best and are openly hostile towards them at worst because that's not far off.  How does Nintendo win these people over with an okayish effort with lots of "please understand"s?  They have to make a strong first impression so there can be no intentional compromises or "eh, that's good enough" attitude.  Nintendo never goes all in, always has some little compromises and cut corners, and seems to expect that people will cut them slack.  You need leverage to get people to cut you slack and Nintendo coming off a dud console has none.  We got all the same little excuses and compromises on the Cube as well and the N64 was a much more successful console than the Wii U and no one cut them slack or put up with their nonsense then.  A big chunk of the userbase had written them off and Nintendo made no real effort to try to win them back.  They wheeled out a new console that was pretty good but not great and it didn't catch on.

So if you don't care about Nintendo, or maybe outright dislike them, is a new console that is not quite able to match the competing consoles that came out years before going to win you over?  Are you going to feel that Nintendo has changed and is not going to continue to do all the annoying things that probably turned you off of them in the first place or are you going to think "they're slacking on the hardware again" and ignore them?  When Nintendo is criticized for going with underpowered hardware how they go out and do exactly that again and expect that to go over well?  If it's XB1 level then at least it isn't a gen behind but it's still playing into the hands of their critics.
Girls, Girls you're both fabulous,
not as much as me though! ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 17, 2016, 09:47:02 PM
There are obviously people who do give a **** about Nintendo, Ian. That includes yourself, despite your hate-hate relationship persona.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 17, 2016, 09:57:02 PM
You're the one making these assumptions about Nintendo charging $100 more.
The only assumption I've made about Nintendo charging more is that it'd be a bad idea. Nintendo isn't in a good enough market position to do so.
Quote
If the PS4 if $300 by the time the NX launches then why can't Nintendo make something on par with that and charge the same price?
Come on, man. That's what I've been saying. Again, Kimishima has already stated that NX will not sell at a loss so no razor and blade business mode. And again, Emily Rogers' sources put NX between Xbox One and PS4 which are generally on par with each other. PS4 is a little more powerful and the games have slightly better frame rates and textures, but the differences are negligible for most games unless you're looking at a Digital Foundry comparison. That said, I expect a NX to be priced similarly to PS4 and Xbox One when it launches unless Sony and Microsoft decide to undercut Nintendo at the last minute. They can slash the price, and Nintendo really can't.
Quote
And if the NX is $300 and so is the PS4 and the NX is LESS powerful despite costing the exact same price how is that going to go over?
Depends on how much less powerful. Better than Xbox One but worse than PS4? I don't think it'd matter. Obviously, NX would be able to handle multiplatform games then the question is a matter of whether Nintendo can convince publishers to support NX which is the same exact problem as if NX was more powerful than PS4.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on May 17, 2016, 11:24:26 PM
I didn't read most of what's being said in here, and I'm not apologizing for that, but I just wanted to chime in on this.

Quote
If the PS4 if $300 by the time the NX launches then why can't Nintendo make something on par with that and charge the same price?

Yields. (1 of likely several reasons)
PS4 has had years to push yields and get price points down. Nintendo would be on a new chip, and even though they may have decent yields... it's still a new chip at new chip pricing.

.........I will now lurk back into the shadows.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 18, 2016, 01:11:20 AM
For a new chip it would still could be more powerful that ps4.  We have to take into account profit margin from the supplier, and also a few other things making parts cheaper for the board. Board and price optimization is an art.

My assessment is NX will be to PS4/XBOXONE what Wii was to Gamecube. Better, but not super better.

Does anybody find it unusual the ps4 and xbone use a graphics processor labeled GCN? If anyone remembers ATI designed the Gamecube chips and that was their big project. When AMD took over ATI the ATI people became the upper management. Nintendo may have put Wii U out and planned to suspend it to take advantage of a future ATI processor upgrade cycle.

Maybe what will separate nx from the ps4 and xboxone will be its cpu, which could be a radically different design. They might stick with IBM for their processor. IBM has been making all sorts of new processors and memory upgrades
lately.

its all speculation though, we won't know until later, and it will likely still be secret when the console is released.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 18, 2016, 10:45:47 AM
As far as being a Sony fanboy it's how you worded your compare/contrast paragraph. You imply financially Nintendo can't keep afloat, and then you say Sony was never having problem with the ps3 brand and then in the next sentence you say "ps3 was only unprofitable for a couple of years"

Even if you weren't a Sony fanboy, you seem like some sort of anti-nintendo troll or plant. I used to have a friend whose whole job was to troll games forums. So, its not out of the realm of possibility. Your name and avatar are so counter your stance on games that it seems to be sheep's clothing. You just seem to be the biggest downer on these forums with the most skewed/misinformed perspective.

We have Iansane who is really negative, but brings up good points based on sound logic. He has the information clear, he sometimes differs in opinion. Actually, I'm probably closer to an Ian than a Bill Aurion.
with Ian, over the years he has had a reputation for being really negative. He makes excellent posts however. Really thought out. He gets criticism for his negativity, but at least he has his **** together. His biggest problem this generation was he didn't have a Wii U and he would talk **** about it, and its hilarious how now that he has one, he is really warming up to it.

Then we have you whose information is all screwed up. At least with Iansane he's been around here for the last 10-15 or so years. He's been responding to the same articles and topics as I have.

This whole talk has made me want to make a documentary about n64 - early ps3 era. Ian would be a good pundit.


Well I am sorry you feel that way but screw you. First of all I usually post in gest you should fucking know that by now dude I been posting the same way for over a god damn decade. Second of all, I love Nintendo, I just don't give them a free pass and I hate how you have to include their handheld in the discussion. We are not talking about the success of the COMPANY we are talking about the success of the MACHINE.
SONY might have been unprofitable as a company but all of their Playstation consoles sell to the market's expectations, Nintendo does not, how is that not sound logic it's a god damn fact!

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 18, 2016, 12:12:13 PM
If market expectations result in unprofitable business practices, the. I'm not sure I want to live on this planet anymore.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 18, 2016, 12:14:00 PM
There are obviously people who do give a **** about Nintendo, Ian. That includes yourself, despite your hate-hate relationship persona.

Of course there are but that's probably around the size of the Wii U userbase and if Nintendo can't attract beyond that existing userbase why even replace the Wii U?  For the last 20 years the view of Nintendo consoles from the perspective of those outside the Nintendo fanbase is that they're for kids and Nintendo fans (and casuals during the Wii years) and if you're not in those groups there is no point in owning one.  Nintendo needs to break beyond that.  The other guys just make videogames consoles for people that want to play videogames.  That's what Nintendo needs their consoles to be... unless they truly feel that kids and Nintendo fans can support them by themselves but I think the Wii U shows that isn't the case.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 18, 2016, 09:41:14 PM
part of the branch autonomy thread highlights something that needs to be addressed. Nintendo wants to make its consoles in ways that would revitalize the Japanese game market. This does not work world wide, and in fact the sales were also mostly foreign. Hopefully NX is branded well in North America, and NOA gets a stronger ability to broker deals to get games made.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 18, 2016, 09:44:11 PM
A closer link between the handheld and console versions would help them both in Japan and in the west. It consolidates software support, strengthening the library of each model.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 18, 2016, 09:55:21 PM
It goes without saying that Nintendo needs to sell more hardware than the Wii U, but the deeper question is to what end?

If Nintendo was like any other company, then it'd simply be to make more money. Not that Nintendo will say "no" to more money, finances are a HUGE driving force behind their thinking.

Instead, I propose that if Nintendo wants to succeed in the role that some proscribe to them, that of a game maker who is influential through innovation, uniqueness, and high quality, then a larger market presence is naturally required so that they can create conditions for that innovation not just for themselves, but for other game makers, and so that they can reach an audience who will be inspired and carry on those values in their own work elsewhere.

Now the problem would be defining at what level they might achieve that. "Somewhere between the bottom console and total world domination" is simply too broad a range to be useful. The Wii U was obviously too small relative to its market and environment, Nintendo's ability to exercise its values are constrained under those numbers. Likely the GameCube's userbase and demographic reach is likely too small as well.

What about the N64, and it's 33 million units shipped versus the PlayStation's 120 million units shipped? If the Wii U enjoyed a similar marketshare in this generation it would have sold.... about 14 million units... so maybe not? Yet the N64 and its software library was highly influential in so many ways despite the userbase ratio it experienced.

Perhaps there's a magic number at some point, like 35 million consoles, at which the user base is large enough in gross terms that marketshare might be irrelevant. That's a low mark to hit fiscally, obviously Nintendo's money counters want to sell more than that and return to Wii-like levels of profitability.

But for the sake of argument, IF Nintendo could make oodles of money at 35 million hardware units sold, AND garnered visible-if-not-complete third-party support, would 35 million hardware units sold give it enough of a platform to freely exercise their ambitions, make the games they want, and inspire a whole new generation of players?

To be clear, its likely that anyone at Nintendo who proposed a plan to sell only 35 million hardware units over the life of the NX would be fired on the spot. But aside from the strictures of ambition, would that number be enough to achieve the specific goals we proscribe to them, and if not, what? Keep in mind that the current gen of home consoles (Wii U, PS4, XBox One) have only sold around 72 million hardware units cumulatively up to this point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 19, 2016, 05:08:14 AM
That will be a big factor. All signs point to the NX as a handheld/console combo, which if the case could not be considered the successor(although that would make it the successor to both). Resources put to full dedication will end all software droughts. Also, improved hardware is going to be a big blessing as well. Ps4 and xbox one leapfrogged Wii U when most of us expected people to not know the difference. A new system means they can manage ports a little better and this will make third parties happy. With any luck NX will get some easy ports of oher console hardware.

Transferring the content of Wii to Wii U worked pretty well. I wonder how they'll do it with Wii U and NX. I have most my stuff on flash drives. I hope I can for the most part just transfer it over by linking accounts.

what would also be nice is if it had access to other stores outside the eShop.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on May 19, 2016, 09:10:27 AM
what would also be nice is if it had access to other stores outside the eShop.


Nintendo already has a digital storefront on Amazon.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 19, 2016, 01:05:16 PM
What about the N64, and it's 33 million units shipped versus the PlayStation's 120 million units shipped? If the Wii U enjoyed a similar marketshare in this generation it would have sold.... about 14 million units... so maybe not? Yet the N64 and its software library was highly influential in so many ways despite the userbase ratio it experienced.

Perhaps there's a magic number at some point, like 35 million consoles, at which the user base is large enough in gross terms that marketshare might be irrelevant. That's a low mark to hit fiscally, obviously Nintendo's money counters want to sell more than that and return to Wii-like levels of profitability.

But for the sake of argument, IF Nintendo could make oodles of money at 35 million hardware units sold, AND garnered visible-if-not-complete third-party support, would 35 million hardware units sold give it enough of a platform to freely exercise their ambitions, make the games they want, and inspire a whole new generation of players?

Deep down I feel Nintendo's only true goal is to make money.  They're better than like EA for example but they'll still release the odd half-baked title to make a quick buck.

I think the N64 was in a specific position that other Nintendo consoles since then haven't been in - it was following up the most popular and best selling console of the prior generation (I suppose the Wii U could say the same thing but the Wii was not popular with the traditional gaming audience).  It wasn't like the PlayStation kicked it's ass right away.  It took a bit of time and games like Final Fantasy VII to do it.  At the time there was a pretty logical assumption that the N64 would keep the Nintendo train rolling.  At least on a personal level I remember that most SNES owners I knew bought the N64 because the Nintendo brand had served them well up until then so why not keep with it?  They transitioned to the PlayStation as it became obvious that the N64 was starving for games and most of their favourite devs from the SNES had moved to the PSX.  So the N64 was in an odd position where it probably had a fair sized chunk of owners who were not pleased with the machine itself and those N64 owners then did NOT buy a Gamecube after becoming disillusioned with Nintendo.  I find that the more well known N64 games among non-Nintendo fans are titles released earlier in the console's life - in other words the games everyone played before they switched to a PlayStation.  Later titles like Majora's Mask, Perfect Dark, Paper Mario or Conker are much less known then Mario 64, OoT or Goldeneye.  You could say the N64 had a period of time where it was the main focus of gamers but the Cube and Wii U pretty much never did and thus have virtually no influence.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on May 19, 2016, 01:38:18 PM
I don't believe Emily Rogers on anything, besides that she slept with aguy to get a scoop... yeah, integrity she is not.

For everything she made been right, there's 100x she's been dead wrong on her predictions.

I believe she's wrong on the nvidia integra chip, and I think she's wrong on the arm deal.

I believe the NX will be x86 architecture, would make sense if ports were to be an easy endeavor.

It's possible the handheld would have the arm, assuming if it's not a hybrid. Guess we'll find out at some point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on May 19, 2016, 02:21:49 PM
Oh, Mystic. You've been away too long that you've missed the Emily Rogers Rule on this forum. No mentioning the sex.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 19, 2016, 02:37:13 PM
The question of influence (jumping right over the other drama in this thread) seems linked to perception as much as sales.  The Wii U was seen as a failure, despite many people owning it, so the games tend to be ignored in the bigger picture.  Despite Nintendo saying that they aren't competing with Microsoft and Sony, they release consoles that are essentially the same, so they are measured by the same standards.  In that respect, the Wii U was hardly worth considering.

If the NX is a portable that can stream video and accept wireless controller input, that would put it in the same class as any modern phone or tablet.  The only difference is that Miracast has more lag than Nintendo would presumably accept.  Still, having this sort of setup would necessarily mean compromising on hardware power.  Nintendo could play games with the numbers, since it would be comparing very different architectures, but the downgraded ports (or lack thereof) would make the reality clear.  The reason I bring this up is that many would not consider it a "real" console, and that might help Nintendo.  Without the expectation of direct competition with the other consoles, the measure of success would be different.  It might be for the best, assuming Nintendo can pull off the marketing of this new thing.

The other aspect is scope.  Nintendo tends to churn out their franchise games with polish, but not much innovation.  They used to push the industry forward because they were passionate about their field and the company structure supported that.  Mario Galaxy and Splatoon are modern examples of that, and I hope more room is made for those games.  Having only one platform to develop for, or two if you consider phones, might allow teams to take more time and chances.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on May 19, 2016, 08:40:01 PM
what would also be nice is if it had access to other stores outside the eShop.


Nintendo already has a digital storefront on Amazon.

And their own webstore, complete with automatic sale adjustments.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 20, 2016, 01:25:22 AM
The question of influence (jumping right over the other drama in this thread) seems linked to perception as much as sales.  The Wii U was seen as a failure, despite many people owning it, so the games tend to be ignored in the bigger picture.  Despite Nintendo saying that they aren't competing with Microsoft and Sony, they release consoles that are essentially the same, so they are measured by the same standards.  In that respect, the Wii U was hardly worth considering.

If the NX is a portable that can stream video and accept wireless controller input, that would put it in the same class as any modern phone or tablet.  The only difference is that Miracast has more lag than Nintendo would presumably accept.  Still, having this sort of setup would necessarily mean compromising on hardware power.  Nintendo could play games with the numbers, since it would be comparing very different architectures, but the downgraded ports (or lack thereof) would make the reality clear.  The reason I bring this up is that many would not consider it a "real" console, and that might help Nintendo.  Without the expectation of direct competition with the other consoles, the measure of success would be different.  It might be for the best, assuming Nintendo can pull off the marketing of this new thing.

The other aspect is scope.  Nintendo tends to churn out their franchise games with polish, but not much innovation.  They used to push the industry forward because they were passionate about their field and the company structure supported that.  Mario Galaxy and Splatoon are modern examples of that, and I hope more room is made for those games.  Having only one platform to develop for, or two if you consider phones, might allow teams to take more time and chances.

As far as sales->influence goes, it's a pleasant bit of arm chair theorycraft, so I doubt my musings have much value. That said, I'd peg 35 million hardware units as the minimum number GROSS to consider for a Nintendo console exercising influence on the market. But in addition to that, I'd expect that number to also represent a third of the market. In today's generation, a third of hardware sales would pace to 24 million sold at this point in time, which I don't think the XBox One has hit either.

It's interesting what you say about perception KeyBilly. I've been talking about influence share in terms of console hardware sales numbers, but if we look at the bigger picture then we have to accept that influence across the population should also take into account handheld and mobile. The rise of the smartphone and what it means for handheld gaming cannot be ignored.

My above musings may be even more non-sensical taking that into ccount, and then even MORE so if NX will eventually have a separate handheld unit as part of the platform that will eventually replace the 3DS in the ecosystem.

In that sense maybe Nintendo has an even steeper hill to climb to wield influence AND demonstrate a viable market for both game makers and game players.

Nintendo seems to be tacking into Mobile as an important partner experience (not replacement) for their core gaming experiences. I'm not quite sure right now how I'd measure how Nintendo affects videogames as a whole when mobile is added to the equation. After all, the smartphone market uses vastly different metrics to describe itself and its player base.

Taking this expanded field in accout, Nintendo is definitely not the sole torchbearer for gaming, not that they ever were. But they're probably just one player among many adding to the diverse sphere of gaming. In order to be a large champion for their values though, I definitely feel like 35 million NX Home Console units sold wouldn't be enough to push that forward.

I guess the elephant in the room is wondering what the size of the future for console and handheld dedicated gaming hardware is next (half?) generation. Is the challenge to reverse a shrinking of that market, or is the challenge to seek out a different way of evaluating, coalescing, and accessing a player base?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on May 20, 2016, 03:13:47 AM
Oh, Mystic. You've been away too long that you've missed the Emily Rogers Rule on this forum. No mentioning the sex.

Hey, I've slept with women for a lot less than an insider scoop. No judgements needed to be passed.
I'm sure those that were judging her have done more to (still not) get laid than she gave up to get a scoop. so #fuckthehaters
but I still don't put no stock in any rumors I've heard so far. But it would be nice to if someone consolidated them down so we know what they all are. It seems quite a few contradict each other, but I haven't really been paying much attention, so I could be way off.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on May 20, 2016, 03:27:25 AM
I never liked Emily Rogers, and I even called her out on IGN back in the day when she was totally off rails :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: trevasweet22 on May 20, 2016, 04:15:18 AM
Whatever NX turns out to be, I hope it lives longer than the Wii U.


Why can't Nintendo release that Zelda Wii U game that's been delayed for how many times already...:(


I'm pretty worried about their announcement regarding Animal Crossing and Fire Emblem going mobile...considering Japan is very much thriving on mobile games nowadays, and we are just starting to catch up, and still have some kind of disgust towards it. Maybe cause we're still solid console/handheld/PC fanatics as of the moment and anything mobile = gross.



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 20, 2016, 01:33:01 PM
The question of influence (jumping right over the other drama in this thread) seems linked to perception as much as sales.  The Wii U was seen as a failure, despite many people owning it, so the games tend to be ignored in the bigger picture.  Despite Nintendo saying that they aren't competing with Microsoft and Sony, they release consoles that are essentially the same, so they are measured by the same standards.  In that respect, the Wii U was hardly worth considering.

If the NX is a portable that can stream video and accept wireless controller input, that would put it in the same class as any modern phone or tablet.  The only difference is that Miracast has more lag than Nintendo would presumably accept.  Still, having this sort of setup would necessarily mean compromising on hardware power.  Nintendo could play games with the numbers, since it would be comparing very different architectures, but the downgraded ports (or lack thereof) would make the reality clear.  The reason I bring this up is that many would not consider it a "real" console, and that might help Nintendo.  Without the expectation of direct competition with the other consoles, the measure of success would be different.  It might be for the best, assuming Nintendo can pull off the marketing of this new thing.

The other aspect is scope.  Nintendo tends to churn out their franchise games with polish, but not much innovation.  They used to push the industry forward because they were passionate about their field and the company structure supported that.  Mario Galaxy and Splatoon are modern examples of that, and I hope more room is made for those games.  Having only one platform to develop for, or two if you consider phones, might allow teams to take more time and chances.

As far as sales->influence goes, it's a pleasant bit of arm chair theorycraft, so I doubt my musings have much value. That said, I'd peg 35 million hardware units as the minimum number GROSS to consider for a Nintendo console exercising influence on the market. But in addition to that, I'd expect that number to also represent a third of the market. In today's generation, a third of hardware sales would pace to 24 million sold at this point in time, which I don't think the XBox One has hit either.

It's interesting what you say about perception KeyBilly. I've been talking about influence share in terms of console hardware sales numbers, but if we look at the bigger picture then we have to accept that influence across the population should also take into account handheld and mobile. The rise of the smartphone and what it means for handheld gaming cannot be ignored.

My above musings may be even more non-sensical taking that into ccount, and then even MORE so if NX will eventually have a separate handheld unit as part of the platform that will eventually replace the 3DS in the ecosystem.

In that sense maybe Nintendo has an even steeper hill to climb to wield influence AND demonstrate a viable market for both game makers and game players.

Nintendo seems to be tacking into Mobile as an important partner experience (not replacement) for their core gaming experiences. I'm not quite sure right now how I'd measure how Nintendo affects videogames as a whole when mobile is added to the equation. After all, the smartphone market uses vastly different metrics to describe itself and its player base.

Taking this expanded field in accout, Nintendo is definitely not the sole torchbearer for gaming, not that they ever were. But they're probably just one player among many adding to the diverse sphere of gaming. In order to be a large champion for their values though, I definitely feel like 35 million NX Home Console units sold wouldn't be enough to push that forward.

I guess the elephant in the room is wondering what the size of the future for console and handheld dedicated gaming hardware is next (half?) generation. Is the challenge to reverse a shrinking of that market, or is the challenge to seek out a different way of evaluating, coalescing, and accessing a player base?


I think history will show us that the magic number is closer to 40 million. Sega Genesis sold just shy of that and it remains a staple in the gaming industry. The Sega brand has been tarnished beyond all hope for repair but for the better part of the 90's they were unstoppable in terms of influence and mindshare. They didn't achieve the same sales numbers as Nintendo whose 90's consoles combined did a total of what 90 million for the decade? But they did have mindshare, they did influence the market even if it cost them every damn penny they had to do so.

SNES was pretty strong in the market but people forget that it struggled at first too. Many people, gamers, gaming press, developers, flocked to Sega due to the Anti-consumer practices of the NES ere. Nintendo fought to win people back with the SNES, only AFTER Sonic came along and kicked Mario in the groin. Arguable this proved very strong motivating factor for them because that was around the time they started hyping All-Stars and gearing up for the influx of Rare stuff. For a while Sega and Nintendo were going back and forth for marketshare but Sega had the mindshare locked down. They blew it beginning with 32X and never recovered.

In order for Nintendo do make that big of an impression they could do it with closer to 25 million if they had to, that is just north of what Xbox did and they seem to have made a lasting impression with their original console. So the numbers are arbitrary anyways it's more about mindshare and presence and Nintendo has a LOT of work to mend their mindshare problems. Even people like me, Ian, etc, who DO love Nintendo are finding it increasingly difficult to say good things about them. There was a time not six years ago where I would have defended Nintendo to death and wished Playstation would go away. I changed my mind, I don't want to root for Nintendo for the sake of it I want them to succeed and have the  games I want but if they can't do it and Sony can then fine I will support Sony. I personally don't mind owning two consoles, been doing it since SNES-Genesis anyways.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 20, 2016, 01:50:04 PM
I think one thing for mind share that really helps is that you come across as going upward.  The original Xbox didn't sell nearly as well as the PS2 and not that much better than the Gamecube but it had good mindshare and the Xbox brand was strong going in to the next gen where the Xbox 360 ended up being the console of choice for core gamers.  That's because it was a brand on the rise.  It was a brand new competitor that managed to not finish last and carved some space in the market for itself.  I think Xbox owners were generally pleased with their purchase as it was a great first effort.  Meanwhile the Cube was less successful than the N64.  Nintendo ended that gen going downward.  They lost marketshare and ended in a worst position than they started.  People are going to be more likely to back your brand if it's growing.

Last gen the Wii outsold the PS3 except the Wii's last few years were a barren wasteland while the PS3 ended on a high note having done a great job of climbing back into relevance after a horrible start.  You can see that momentum or lack thereof having a direct effect in the initial sales of the Wii U and PS4.  Despite the raw sales figures being in Nintendo's favour the Wii brand name meant little and the PlayStation brand name meant a lot.  I would see the NX as a success if the feeling going in to the next generation will be that Nintendo is on the upswing and things will only get better.  They could have the lowest sales and still be in a decent spot if there is confidence in the brand and confidence in their future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 20, 2016, 02:06:34 PM
I have a good feeling about NX just like I did Wii. What makes me optimistic it will sell well to the audience is if this two machines in one approach pans out. The lack of games, or rather the need to buy two  machines to get all the games, is what hurts Nintendo the most. They have mindshare in the market with DS and Youtubers, they just are a laughing stock in the console business. But many gamers, myself included, grew tired of the need to buy two machines to get all the games. I haven't bought a handheld since the DS Lite launched.

With a unified machine where I can get ALL the games Nintendo makes there is a much stronger chance the machine will sell to the larger fanbase. Unlike, pay attention Perm, people like me who WILL buy it anyways because I am a Nintendo nut and can't live without my Mario games.


Case in point and where Ian seems to be mostly half right.
Take going from SNES to N64. For the most part the games left Nintendo and went to Sony. Half true. Except they didn't LEAVE Nintendo they migrated to the handheld. Okay so I could still get a very good Mega Man, Castlevania, Mortal Kombat, Street Fighter, TMNT, Metroid, Zelda, etc, on the handheld plus gems like Pokemon and those amazing DBZ games. Well yeah if you bought BOTH machines you could get a decent library. Well with SNES you could get a really great library on the console and if you wanted more pick up a Super Game Boy.

Game Cube sorta had this with Game Boy Player but GBA wasn't quite there yet. I see the same parallels with a lot of the e-Shop stuff, games designed to play like retro handheld games or retro SNES/NES games. The problem is we don't get the exact same games but a lot of them DO make it to the DS brand. Well with DS finally catching up to where the handheld games are good enough then if there was a shared library, or even a way to play 3DS/DS games on the Wii U, it would have sold better. How much more I am not sure but so many of the games that used to grace the console that have migrated to Sony, not just literally but also the spiritual successors or modern takes on the concepts, well that makes it harder to justify the console. But when every game that gets made is on one machine people are more likely to buy that one machine. If you sell a machine that is a home console at home but the controller can detach and become a handheld on the go and you get all the same games, the Pokemon, and the Monster Rancher, etc, then you have an ace people will buy.

The reason people went to Playstation was the games went to Playstation but they never left Nintendo they just left Nintendo's consoles. This won't exactly ensure they make it to the new "platform" as it means starting over and many western devs have left the portable machine behind as well. but there is hope that the machine could sell better especially if they could sell the handheld separate for those that just want it and ensure more games get made but mandate those games scale up to or are playable on the console, most problems are solved.


The other issue is not giving consumers an excuse to not buy your machine, in other words don't give them fodder for jokes that will turn into bad press and lower mindshare. Wii sold well but not to gamers, it sold well as a second console to gamers sure but most dismissed it. Game Cube sold terrible to gamers, it only appealed to die hards and a few stragglers who got it cheap because it was inexpensive and had most of the major games.

But honestly I think the world really isn't big enough for three and in order for Nintendo to truly succeed Microsoft has to exit the space and give them room to breathe, because Sony depends on Playstation they are sticking around MS leaving is Nintendo's *best*, but not only, chance.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on May 20, 2016, 08:37:23 PM
For now, I do not believe Nvidia will be providing a Tegra SoC for Nintendo NX.

I still think it'll be from:

(http://i.imgur.com/INyRSsx.png)

I'll let you guys figure out what some of the smaller logos on the bottom are, and why they're there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 20, 2016, 09:49:24 PM
whos from 3d realms? the art x people were from SGI
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on May 20, 2016, 09:59:56 PM
not 3d realms,  Real3D. 

another verion of their logo:

(http://i.imgur.com/yPVtUBO.png?1)


You are correct about artx and SGI.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on May 20, 2016, 10:15:21 PM
not 3d realms,  Real3D. 

another verion of their logo:

(http://i.imgur.com/yPVtUBO.png?1)

Hint: They used to be the graphics company owned by an absolutely massive U.S. defense corporation. Real3D designed the graphics tech for arcade hardware, for Nintendo's major *rival* in the early-mid 1990s.  When Real3D shut down, ATI got most of their graphics engineers & patents.   Of course, ATI eventually merged with AMD, where many of these people from those older graphics companies still work.


You are correct about artx and SGI.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on May 20, 2016, 10:21:28 PM
not 3d realms,  Real3D. 

another verion of their logo:

(http://i.imgur.com/yPVtUBO.png?1)

Hint: They used to be the graphics company owned by an absolutely massive U.S. defense corporation. Real3D designed the graphics tech for arcade hardware, for Nintendo's major rival in the early-mid 1990s.  When Real3D shut down, ATI got most of their graphics engineers & patents.   


Of course, ATI eventually merged with AMD, where many of these people from those older graphics companies still work. No doubt, they've all contributed, more or less, to the last ~14 years of Radeon graphics cards (everything from 2002's Radeon 9700 Pro, forward) home consoles with ATi/AMD GPUs, etc.


You are correct about artx and SGI.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 22, 2016, 02:02:17 PM
Frothing fanboy speculation incoming:

Hey guys, what's everyone's feel for what NX might be DESPITE the fact that we know nothing yet and no one agrees on which rumors are trustworthy?

I've seen some crazy speculation out there, but I actually think the NX will be much less bleeding-edge except for it being a shared architecture/platform at the development level for both the handheld and the console that will be Nintendo's way to leverage developers for one platform to develop for the other, try to present things as a two-for-one deal.

That is to say, the NX is a "platform" where Nintendo will release a Handheld version of it, and a home console version of it. They will technically have different game libraries, but Nintendo's tools and development environment behind the scenes will allow for developers to output builds for either platform at the flip of a switch. In this way developers, both Nintendo and Third Parties, practically just scale a game up or down if they want to support BOTH hardware units.

The software libraries WILL be different (it sounds too complicated to truly and completely share them what with the need for up-down scaling, and if you imagine that both would have to run off the same physical game cart/disc), and the hardware may even use different media (one carts, the other discs). However, there will be some nifty cross-buy stuff that Nintendo makes available to encourage people to own both consoles and use both. Additionally, the home console version would come with the ability to stream the handheld version to the screen (Built-in Super GameBoy basically), OR use the handheld hardware as a de Facto Wii U-esque GamePad for two-screen play. This is also how we'd finally get multiple Wii U GamePad type play locally. This would mean the home console would launch with a traditional controller since all the two-screen Wii U stuff would be activated by buying a handheld unit.

I'm NOT sure that backwards compatibility fits into this picture for the Wii U's physical library though... which would be a change-up for Nintendo.

Basically, the idea behind this is that if you want the home console for stronger performance and some console-only offerings, you can get it. And if you want the handheld unit, you can get that. They both are so similar in development that Nintendo will be encouraging devs to release the same games on both. The handheld unit will be the more appealing in the market (as 3DS is more appealing), but by virtue of the handheld's development being a switch and a scaling away from console, the home console would have its software library increased via that trojan horse method.

And if you want both, you could enjoy some neat two-screen experiences, multi-screen experiences, or just the whole Super GameBoy aspect of it which is awesome enough.

As for power, the two would have to have similar architectures (ARM?) ... I have no reason to believe Emily Rogers, and no reason to disbelieve her, but her stuff inspires the least internet conspiracy in me, so it's what I take to more realistic than my wild imaginings. I'm expecting the Handheld unit to be at or above a Wii U's raw power (Tegra X1 maybe?), and the home console unit to be around an XBox One's level, whatever that means.

Under this idea I'm not sure if both would launch at the same time... it's possible that Nintendo staggers the launches... but it'd honestly be more fun for me as a consumer if they both launched at once and retailers could sell them separately or they could justify an all-in bundle of console+traditionalController+handheld for around $500.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 22, 2016, 05:00:15 PM
Maybe the standard controller is just a slightly improved wii u controller. Maybe there is a secondary controller that is its own system which you buy that connects to the home system that can act independently.  They however connect to the same library, and you can play the games anywhere.

I see them doing this to keep cost down. When Wii U came out the controller was something like $80 eating into the price of the whole system?  They could make it so the controller connects to your system at home. That sounds like it would run like garbage though. You could have both. You could have a secondary controller that acts independently and a primary controller that needs the system.

There was rumors that the NX could bluetooth anything. Maye it connects to cell phones too. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 22, 2016, 05:35:59 PM
(This ended up being longer than I expected so I went back and bolded the key points for skimming purposes.)

If you read around the internet (and not just Neogaf though forum members there have been good about culling rumors and quotes from Nintendo, and putting the tech stuff in context), I think there's enough to formulate a reasonable conclusion. There will be a console and a handheld. Reading over Iwata's interviews over the past few years, a shared library seemed like an obvious verdict. Once I started lurking Neogaf more frequently, I noticed the idea was gaining traction. I doubt I'm the first one to think of it, but I felt a little vindicated that others were arriving at the same conclusion.

The library will NOT be 100% shared because third parties will decide which of their games will and will not play on both though Japanese third parties that released successful 3DS software will likely have their games shared if only because it makes more sense to do so. It allows them to sell to a wider audience. Very rarely will we see PC/console games scaled down since that may affect the integrity of the product.

More often than not, first party games will be shared. If a game is too intensive for a handheld (probably anything Monolith Soft pitches), Nintendo will likely greenlight a console exclusive because it's been very good lately about not compromising a creator's vision (e.g. Bayonetta 2). I'm sure some are going to complain about Nintendo holding its first party output back by making games compatible on weaker handheld hardware, but those people are silly and they don't know what they're talking about. Nintendo has been making console-level games on handhelds for at least a generation. It has always valued gameplay over graphics. More to the point, it has always valued art direction and design over graphics. As Nintendo transitions to more powerful handheld hardware, the only difference in terms of its handheld and console output will be resolution. A shared library makes more sense now than ever.

Nintendo is abandoning optical media as it's no longer a viable storage solution for video games. The sheer amount of data of most modern games cannot be read fast enough from an optical disc to display on a screen. This solves a couple of issues. No disc drive cuts cost and no discs mean no installations. Shared library games can be scaled up, but a better solution would be to have the higher resolution textures on the game card and the hardware detects which to display. 540p scales to 1080p easier so expect the handheld screen(s) to be 540p. I suspect digital versions will simply include the texture pack you need depending on the hardware you're playing on. No need to have the larger, higher resolution textures on the handheld.

Nintendo would prefer people buy both console and handheld, but it's a software company first. The point of a shared library is to alleviate droughts and to ultimately release a greater volume of software. Nintendo's thinking is possibly that console owners will have access to all games, but handheld owners will have access to more games than they have before. If a console exclusive game is so desired that a handheld owner buys the console, that's just a win for Nintendo.

Since Nintendo is moving to game cards across the board, physical backwards compatibility is out of the questions, and I doubt Nintendo will bother with an external disc drive. People can still keep their Wii U and Wii, and they'll get over it in time anyway. Still, I expect Nintendo to strive for Virtual Console to include every past generation including Wii U, and be playable on the handheld. Speaking of, for Virtual Console purposes, I fully expect a rebranded Remote/Nunchuk. For simplicity's sake, I think NX's have the standard two sticks, four face buttons, four shoulder buttons, D-Pad, and start/select/home. I'm undecided if the console's main controller includes a screen, but a screen controller is definitely returning.

As far as hardware, specs are not the same as performance, and without proper context, it's hard to tell what Emily Rogers' source means. Still, I expect the console to be in the ballpark of Xbox One and PS4. Unless there's a noticeable jump in performance (which there likely will not be consider NX will not be sold at a launch and releasing over $300 is practically marching it out to die), it doesn't matter if NX is more powerful than PS4. As long as games can be ported, it's ultimately just a business decision whether NX gets support. I expect the handheld to have better performance than Wii U which won't be very difficult in 2017, and only displaying in native 540p would allow the hardware to allocate its power to other things.

I think it's in Nintendo's best interest in the long-run to transition to ARM on the console now, but x86-64 is still a very reasonable expectation. Most modern engines support ARM. The proprietary engines of a few major third party games currently do not. Compiling code for those engines probably isn't especially difficult though it is an extra step. However, the chances of Nintendo getting those games at/around launch or even ever were not very high to begin with. Since regaining support is going to be a long process, this isn't something Nintendo needs to concern itself with right now. And with ARM gaining more and more traction, those proprietary engines or their successors may eventually support ARM. Right now, Nintendo seems to be making all the right moves to create the anti-Wii U. If it has learned anything, I hope it learned that there are no quick fixes, no shortcuts. To improve its market position, Nintendo has to work with what it already has (excellent first party output and key third party output on its handheld) and build from there.

One bit I'm really looking forward to is where My Nintendo fits into puzzle. Right now, it's only compatible with Miitomo (which is weirdly addicting). Players are given "Missions" and completing them Platinum Coins which can be exchanged for discounts or even games. I doubt Nintendo opens up "Missions" to non-mobile games until NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 22, 2016, 08:01:59 PM
When I was making Unity games for Ouya they would look pretty good on my old computer. When I ported them to Ouya the real time lighting went off in a really ugly way, but they were still playable. That was ARM based. I've played some really good looking games on Ouya. The Ouya also used a Tegra 3. I can imagine the NX controller might be basically an Ouya with a screen. That would work out physically too, since the system was so tiny(the size of an actual apple). And also, 3ds and Ouya were not that different in chips. Ouya is a quadcore ARM9 and 3ds is a dual core ARM11 with an ARM9 processor.

Apparently the Tegra k1 outperforms both ps3 and xbox360 while running low power. This could be the guts of the new controller/console.

The Tegra X1 is probably too new and expensive for a handheld. I don't know how these things price. Ouya was $99 and sold at a profit in 2012 with a Tegra 3. Dead trigger kinda looked better than ZombiU.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 22, 2016, 08:46:35 PM
So am I alone in hoping that motion controls return?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 22, 2016, 08:50:23 PM
So am I alone in hoping that motion controls return?

Probably.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 22, 2016, 09:00:17 PM
Even if it's motion plus version 2 on both the right and left halves of the controller?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on May 22, 2016, 09:09:00 PM
Tegra X1 is pretty strong, but over a year old now and can't compete with Xbone or PS4. I have a Shield Android TV with the X1.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 22, 2016, 09:13:53 PM
Even if it's motion plus version 2 on both the right and left halves of the controller?

Honestly, I'd rather have the screen make a return than a controller that splits in half for motion controls. Even if we get an improved WM+ in both halves.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on May 22, 2016, 09:46:27 PM
No reason why we can't have both. The components for Motion Plus are super cheap now that it can be sold on the side with little to no fanfare just for Virtual Console support. If it's appropriate for a game, I'd rather it be there than not. Motion controls have played such a big part in Nintendo's history that they'll always be a thing though I wouldn't shocked if certain games were retro-fitted with a traditional controls option just so Nintendo can sell more Virtual Console games. Super Mario Galaxy comes to mind.

I'd probably buy an NX Remote/Nunchuk just to have it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 22, 2016, 09:46:53 PM
Nintendo is abandoning optical media as it's no longer a viable storage solution for video games. The sheer amount of data of most modern games cannot be read fast enough from an optical disc to display on a screen. This solves a couple of issues. No disc drive cuts cost and no discs mean no installations. Shared library games can be scaled up, but a better solution would be to have the higher resolution textures on the game card and the hardware detects which to display. 540p scales to 1080p easier so expect the handheld screen(s) to be 540p. I suspect digital versions will simply include the texture pack you need depending on the hardware you're playing on. No need to have the larger, higher resolution textures on the handheld.

I can see the sense in this. I'm just still coming to terms with the idea. Not because I'm opposed to it, but because it just never entered my mind as a possibility before.

Tegra X1 is pretty strong, but over a year old now and can't compete with Xbone or PS4. I have a Shield Android TV with the X1.

I thought the idea was that the Tegra X1 would go in the handheld, and a more powerful chipset of similar architecture would make it into the home console itself?

So am I alone in hoping that motion controls return?

I'm in for continued support of Wii Remotes for motion controls. Was playing Just Dance 2016 only a couple hours ago!

And my speculation has the Handheld becoming a "screened" controller such that there is no longer a dedicated GamePad unit, but a Handheld that switches function to act like a Wii U GamePad.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on May 22, 2016, 09:49:22 PM
I would rather double down in motion controls and forget the double screen strategy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 22, 2016, 09:54:25 PM
I would rather double down in motion controls and forget the double screen strategy.

That's why I like the idea of putting the Handheld console in "slave" mode to imitate a GamePad. It means you can still support Dual-screen gameplay but without blocking any other avenues of support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 22, 2016, 10:43:52 PM
Right. And in that way, you could explore both avenues of gameplay. There are still so many good ideas for games that could use a handheld screen or motion controls or both. I'd still like to play madden against my friend where I can draw up plays on the fly or a card game where my hand is hidden. I'd also like to explore ambidextrous motion controlled gameplay, where one hand needs to move in a different way than the other, ie patting your head and rubbing your stomach. There is potential for some really innovated games. And if both halves of the controller also have IR sensors, eg. dual reticules in FPS's, that would be interesting as well.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 22, 2016, 11:10:07 PM
I'd also like to explore ambidextrous motion controlled gameplay, where one hand needs to move in a different way than the other, ie patting your head and rubbing your stomach. There is potential for some really innovated games. And if both halves of the controller also have IR sensors, eg. dual reticules in FPS's, that would be interesting as well.

I wouldn't think this would require two halves of a controller... just two Wii Remotes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 22, 2016, 11:16:48 PM
No reason why we can't have both.

I think there is.  Having both raises the question of whether you make a game for one input, the other, or both simultaneously.  It also means packaging both, unless you can make one controller that envelopes both concepts.  But if you're going with the former, you enter a situation where you could have 5+ input methods for a console, like the Wii U.  I don't think that's an ideal situation.

I would rather double down in motion controls and forget the double screen strategy.

That's why I like the idea of putting the Handheld console in "slave" mode to imitate a GamePad. It means you can still support Dual-screen gameplay but without blocking any other avenues of support.

I disagree.  I think this puts you in a GBA/GC situation where the console supports this functionality, but the asking price is far too high (need both systems, multiple handhelds for multiplayer) to be practical for the consumer, and too niche for a developer to make games for.  I don't think it's viable for Nintendo to half-ass any feature.  They have to double down on one or the other.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 22, 2016, 11:23:48 PM

I'd also like to explore ambidextrous motion controlled gameplay, where one hand needs to move in a different way than the other, ie patting your head and rubbing your stomach. There is potential for some really innovated games. And if both halves of the controller also have IR sensors, eg. dual reticules in FPS's, that would be interesting as well.

I wouldn't think this would require two halves of a controller... just two Wii Remotes.



If you bring back Wiimotes or even an advanced new version, you'd run into the same problem as the Wii where you had several accessories. It's a clumsy solution.

But if you were to make a controller that looks like a broken PS4 controller, then you'd be able to play every game (more comfortably I might add) without the need for extra hardware. Plus, maybe the game doesn't call for motion controls often, but when it does, it's with both hands. You wouldn't swap controllers then and so you've essentially told developers to never do that.


No reason why we can't have both.

I think there is.  Having both raises the question of whether you make a game for one input, the other, or both simultaneously.  It also means packaging both, unless you can make one controller that envelopes both concepts.  But if you're going with the former, you enter a situation where you could have 5+ input methods for a console, like the Wii U.  I don't think that's an ideal situation.

I would rather double down in motion controls and forget the double screen strategy.

That's why I like the idea of putting the Handheld console in "slave" mode to imitate a GamePad. It means you can still support Dual-screen gameplay but without blocking any other avenues of support.

I disagree.  I think this puts you in a GBA/GC situation where the console supports this functionality, but the asking price is far too high (need both systems, multiple handhelds for multiplayer) to be practical for the consumer, and too niche for a developer to make games for.  I don't think it's viable for Nintendo to half-ass any feature.  They have to double down on one or the other.


Point taken. But wasn't you that mentioned the VC? You would need that type of support regardless of if a developer would take advantage of it.


More importantly, if NX is a platform, than it would be very strange for the hardware it resides on to not communicate with one another.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 22, 2016, 11:46:19 PM
Point taken. But wasn't you that mentioned the VC? You would need that type of support regardless of if a developer would take advantage of it.


More importantly, if NX is a platform, than it would be very strange for the hardware it resides on to not communicate with one another.


You don't need motion controls for a VC that goes from the NES through the GC/DS.  You do, however, forfeit Wii backwards compatibility, but that may be worth losing in order to reduce the controller options to a practical number.


Plus, if the NX has a handheld and a console aspect, and the two talk to eachother; that plays 100% into the gamepad concept and 0% into dual motion controls.  No handheld will be two pieces, so the only way to have games work on both is to double down on the gamepad.  Plus, a handheld with a touch screen more easily acts as a controller for a console that has a controller with a touch screen than a console with a two piece controller with motion controls.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 12:13:09 AM
You think the main console controller is going to have a touchscreen? I was betting it wouldn't. And if it doesn't, then the only reason not to have motion controls would be for parity with the handheld games, which is likely the focus of NX as a whole.

But this is a situation where you can have your cake and eat it too. Remember it is the console that has the severe droughts and lack of support, not the handheld. So games are more likely to be ported from the handheld to the console and not the other way around. This is assuming, of course, that game versions are sold separately. And if that's the case and depending on how much motion controls cost, it might be worth it to include with the console.

You'd be able to give developers who want to focus on the console the ability to make something unique, something different from the handheld/console game hybrids. You'd get to add many more games to the VC. You'd have much more experience with motion controls. And it would still be used to play all the handheld ports as it can be used as a regular controller.

So TLDR if the main controller for the console doesn't have a screen and if game versions are sold separately, then there is no downside to providing motion controls other than the cost to implement them into the controller. The upsides are three-fold. 1, you make the console unique, ie handheld has portability, the console has motion controls. 2, you could add Wii games to the VC. 3, Nintendo can use the already learned experience to make better motion control games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on May 23, 2016, 02:14:57 AM
Here is what I think.  I have said this repeatedly but I will say it again.

Nintendo hit on something special with the Wii...and instead of following up with the next innovative step truly fulfilling the motion control vision, they tried to hit another homerun with a new interface.  That new interface failed for SO many reasons.

1) It was expensive
2) It couldn't be used as multiple controllers
3) It sent a mix message with too many accessories (Wii motes, Classic Controller Pro, Wii U Game Pad)  It was just confusing.

I want to simplify it again and diversify.  Double down on being different, but perfect your difference.  IF you can get motion control without need for calibration and perfect it's movement recognition and response times and be able to add a few more buttons to make the Remote part function as comfortable and competent SNES controller then you would be set.
  I could see something like the Microsoft Pro Controller where you could change and have a second analog stick attacked.  Then that could be interesting. 

I believe Nintendo had a good thing going when it was the go to secondary console to own because it offered a quality unique experience you couldn't get on other consoles.  I think they lost that some with the Wii U.   
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 23, 2016, 06:00:22 AM
When I bought the Wii I got the original one. I bought an extra controller, and then a bunch of classic controllers. Eventually I had to buy a wii motion plus adapter. I play my wii u games all the time. Any wii game takes additional setup and is annoying. Starfox Zero is kinda annoying. I don't have a special seat at my current place to sit directly in front of the tv. I'm not standing up like I would for wii sports. Bleh. Around mid-wii generation I stopped playing because I was annoyed with the whole setup. I was just uncomfortable playing games. The games I ended up liking the most didn't even use precision motion controls, it was more waggle. When WiiU came out it brought me more traditional games and I could sit and play comfortably. Nintendo's implementation of the wii menu sucks too. I want to access it without having to use a wii remote. My solution, I just repurchased most of the games on wii u(luckily there was a discount for doing so) Even better I share a living room with someone who watches fucking real housewives all the time and I can play Mario Maker at the same time. Going back to motion controls seems a step backwards. I still think you should be able to play with wii controllers, after all this is all bluetooth. If I can connect my wii controller to my ouya then I should be able to connect it to my nx. Certain games may benefit from the wii controller, but that is a different direction.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 06:55:01 AM
Nintendo is a position to double down on both ideas. It really comes down to cost.

If Nintendo can sell both the handheld and console for $400, I can see them pushing themselves to make interesting console/handheld games that require both. If, however, the bundle is $500, then it would be wise to wait and see how it sells before making unique games.

Now if Nintendo could make the console and handheld cost $400 without providing motion controls and $500 if they did, I would go with the cheaper cost for now. Later in the NX's cycle, however, I would roll out a motion control game/controller bundle (Metroid? Wii Circus? New IP?) and eventually a console/handheld/controller/game bundle. This would allow me to double down on both ideas, provide yet another reason to purchase an NX if you already haven't, and gain exposure.


Pre-EDIT: Perm, what mid-wii generation games did you find uncomfortable? And did you like how Skyward Sword controlled/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 23, 2016, 09:52:26 AM
I don't think Nintendo will improve if they go back to being too different like Wii. They need to get all the third party support back they can and motion controls limits the games your system can have. I think it would be in their best interest to wipe Wii from their memories. I understand the fans of Wii-Games like Wii Sports and the like won't like that but I think the Wii brand image is to tarnished for Nintendo to embrace it. At least with Game Cube there was a cool factor and now there is the retro factor. Wii will have a retro factor for some but I liken it to the split between Car Robots and Beast Wars in the Transformers universe. The number of people who responded to Beast Wars was large, at first, but dwindled over time. Same with Motion controls the people who responded favorable were large numbers at first because it hit a fad everyone was into. Once the fad wore off they showed their true colors and all but the really devoted remained interested.

I never liked them at all. I was sold on the concept before hand but in practice they don't add anything useful they distract you. The ONLY way motion controls fit in now, B/C be damned I say, the only way they fit in now is if NX implements VR. And then it needs to be something akind to an actual glove where you can still have our fingers pressing imaginary buttons if that is what makes you comfortable.

Either way no matter what they do it needs a traditional controller as the pack in option not as some expensive accessory on top of the fad controller. But my dislike of Motion controls is my own problem I am not sure how the market as a whole feels outside the constant trash talking people do of the Wii these days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 11:34:59 AM
I don't think you understood. The controller would be exactly like a traditional controller, just split into halves. One-half would have a joystick, d-pad, and two triggers. The other half would have another joystick, four buttons, and two triggers. That way it can play any port from the handheld as well as the PS4 and XBone, and it can also play motion games. It's a best of both worlds scenario.

Furthermore, as I said above, if the bundle for both console and handheld is affordable, they can play around with the second screen idea as well.

It really comes down to what graphic output they are willing to be okay with. If it's PS4 level for the console and X1 for the handheld, this will get expensive fast. But if it's a more-capable Wii U console and a Wii level handheld, then costs could be mass market friendly, allowing for there to be a focus on interaction and controls.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 23, 2016, 02:40:41 PM
I don't think Nintendo could make a stand-alone handheld and console bundle affordable.  That's just too much tech/effort.  Plus, what would you do for extra controllers for people who want to use the extra screen?  Is that now the cost of a new Handheld?  How much is it for people who just want one or the other?  If the second system/screen controller is $200+, then you're back in the GBA/GC situation where devs assume no one has it, so it goes unsupported.  Doing both ideas means either half-assing one or adding yet another accessory/controller option.

You can double down on motion controls, but that means no Wii U BC.  Or you can double down on the gamepad and forfeit Wii VC.  Both have downsides, but c'est la vie.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 04:44:13 PM
You're working off the assumption that the console controller will have a screen. I don't think that will be the case.

Also, I'm working off the assumption that Nintendo's handheld won't exceed $200 and their console won't exceed $300, and I base that number on their history, hence why I said the bundle could cost a maximum of $500. I actually think the maximum will be cheaper due to the nature of bundles, but it's a good maximum regardless.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 23, 2016, 05:26:33 PM
I am conflicted on the question of motion control and screens.  In some ways, these feel like failed experiments that never caught on with developers, similar to Kinect.  But, they are also ideas that could evolve well and it would be a shame to lose either of them, unless there is a new technology to replace them.  That is the big question... does Nintendo have a great new innovation, or is the hybrid idea that they've been hinting at for years "it?"

The breakapart controller is a good idea.  Also, remember that whole perspective shifting with head position patent, to make it seem as if we are looking through a window.  That would be an answer to VR that doesn't require extra processing power or much expense.

I agree with the thinking that a hybrid will fail to work if it is just a console and portable that work together.  We've had that before in a couple forms and, while interesting, it is just too much to ask from the users and the fragmented user base makes it unattractive for developers.  If anything, Nintendo needs to be unifying their platforms.

That could work in a few ways, with the most obvious being a system that is essentially a portable console, apart from being able to stream video to a TV and accept Bluetooth controllers.  Even most cheap cell phones can do this, and Nintendo has the proprietary lag-free streaming tech.  Sitting in a cradle might add some hardware muscle, similar to the Surface Book Pro having a discrete GPU in the base.  Still, I don't know if that is really worth the engineering effort if a mobile GPU is good enough for decent 1080p graphics.  Developing for just one configuration would be simpler, too.  Scaling down textures and turning off effects could be a quick fix, but the entire game would need to be tested in both configurations.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 23, 2016, 05:31:28 PM
The easiest and simplest solution is do away with the console entirely and stick to their guns with a handheld. BUT to satisfy the console crowd, give it HDMI output and allow it to connect additional controllers for the end user to use it as a true hybrid. Then they can throw all their support at one machine. Or a dedicated gaming tablet that has buttons with HDMI out and support for additional controllers but that is too far-fetched to work.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 07:18:45 PM
You guys are forgetting who actually buys Nintendo handhelds in droves; parents for their children. It needs to be durable and not that expensive. And one simple way to raise the price is to make it graphically advanced, and one simple way to raise the anxiety of it breaking is by raising the price. Neither is a good idea.

I've been calling for cheap systems with a unified platform from the beginning. It makes the most sense given the climate of the industry today. But that's neither here nor there. Still...Do I have to search for the Wall of Shame?

With cheap hardware, you need a hook. And that hook is a unified gaming platform. Nintendo could put out a perfect third-party console and it still wouldn't receive any major support. So in the short term, they need to support themselves. This is their solution.

My main concern is why would anyone buy the console? No, think about it. If the entire point is to unify the development platform, then why would anyone choose the console when you'd most likely be able to play the same games, for cheaper, anywhere. For better graphics? Is that why some people proposed a base that acts like a console? It could work, allowing you to use your TV and possibly get a graphics boost, but that solution hardly seems worth it for Nintendo. They'd be axing one revenue stream, and even though the Wii U was a failure, forfeiting their (albeit small) territory isn't a smart business strategy.

And it's for that reason that I proposed motion controllers. It gives the console a reason to exist. It draws in a unique game library separate from the handheld and it gives developers the best compromise...use it but only if you'd like to.

PS:
I understand the hesitation regarding the high cost of hardware and the ill-fated GBA/GC experience when considering to do it all over again with the NX, but what is so wrong with that, other than developers not supporting it? The main draw is porting from handheld to console. The main draw is solving third party support. But the option still exists if anyone would like to pursue it (and some might after learning about the handheld/console attachment rate or if bundles are for sale out of the gate).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 23, 2016, 07:31:31 PM
You're working off the assumption that the console controller will have a screen. I don't think that will be the case.

Also, I'm working off the assumption that Nintendo's handheld won't exceed $200 and their console won't exceed $300, and I base that number on their history, hence why I said the bundle could cost a maximum of $500. I actually think the maximum will be cheaper due to the nature of bundles, but it's a good maximum regardless.

My argument is that if you have a handheld that acts as a controller, you're still only playing around with the GBA/GC concept.  ~$200 systems aren't going to make for good second (,or 3rd, or 4th,. . .) controllers. Which is not doubling down on the Wii U concept.  That is taking a step back.  You can have one or the other, but not both.

To summarize, if Nintendo doubles down on motion controls, they have to drop the gamepad concept and vice versa.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 23, 2016, 07:39:38 PM
Another problem
Guys my age see Nintendo as the derpy #nomlgpro console.
I don't but many do, I don't know how but Nintendo needs to change this "pro's" ideas so they will buy their product. (and go away from shitty games like CoD)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 23, 2016, 07:40:18 PM

I understand the hesitation regarding the high cost of hardware and the ill-fated GBA/GC experience when considering to do it all over again with the NX, but what is so wrong with that, other than developers not supporting it?

Developers not supporting something is an insurmountable reason not to do it. No dev support means another Wii U situation or a feature that might as well not be there.  This is a games machine we're talking about.  If there's a feature people aren't going to use to make games, it probably doesn't need to exist.

Also, people not willing to pay for a 4-player experience.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on May 23, 2016, 08:04:11 PM
I now understand what you're saying. If the NX console has controllers with screens, then using an NX handheld in a pinch is much more flexible. And that's not a bad idea. Still, I'd prefer motion controls as the possibility of getting multiple NX handhelds with a console isn't outlandish. You just need friends. So even if separate screen gameplay isn't fully supported, it's still possible as a feature that could be included into games. Madden may not expect players to have the necessary hardware, but they can still provide the experience in case players do.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 23, 2016, 09:23:00 PM
Why was the Wii U a failure? Was it the controller, was it that it supported 5+ controllers? Was it that it had no support after the first year? Bingo. It had no support after the first year because developers didn't want to waste time to downgrade their games for Wii U. It is harder to downgrade games then to upgrade games because taking a 20,000 polygon object and turning it into a couple thousand polygon object is hard. Taking a game a pre-rendering the lighting as opposed to just using a ton of shaders is difficult. To say they are actually difficult is more or less to say they are time consuming. Development time costs money.

If the wii U had a cpu with a slightly faster clock speed we probably wouldn't be having this conversation. I remember reading developer interviews where they were like we could have ported the game fine, but we had to make so many changes to the programming of the game it wouldn't really be the same game. In programming having to figure out a totally different way to do something that was done automatically may take several days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 23, 2016, 10:36:19 PM
Very true, Perm. Well said.  But is being on par with the competition enough to sell the NX?  If devs can make a system powerful enough to port to without degradation, would they?  Are Nintendo games still enough to sell systems?  Does the Nintendo brand still have enough cache to sell on the promise of first party titles?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 23, 2016, 11:15:58 PM
I don't think initially. I think If they can pull off the power and wow gamers again I think gamers will come back.  Will the nx be able to handle the game engines? Will it be easy to port. Will it take time to port? I don't care if you play a game and it has a black screen on the controller, but is otherwise the same game as the competitors system version of the game. A nice feature to the digital future is if you're using the same game engine and that game engine works on all systems sometimes its as simple as a drop down menu to port the game. If you can throw that game on an app store and it runs pretty bug free and it sells well then you've made money. The future of Nintendo is less barriers. Indy developers re going to have a bigger and bigger role as well. I'm going to continue to buy Nintendo titles because of my love for them. Third parties are always up in the air. If the game is good and its available on my platform than I can buy them. What makes Xbox one any different then ps4? The only thing nowadays is pretty much the first party titles.

There is still a possibility Nintendo will buy the Microsoft games division so Microsoft can go back to focus on OS and server world. That rumors been floating around for a while since the president of the company was tossing around the idea publicly. I kinda like the idea, because I'm using Windows 8 right now and its garbage(windows 10 does seem better though) and that's a round about way to get Rare back. Nintendo has the money and its sort of a juggernaut move. The move would be beneficial to both companies as it would get the assets over to Nintendo, some of the infrastructure of the xbox live, and then give Microsoft a bunch of cash to by cloud servers. The only issue is it would be counted as a huge cash loss for Nintendo. I think the benefits might outweigh the downsides though. Will it happen? Long shot. Yamauchi might have done it(as a sort of dick move), Iwata was warming up to acquisitions, Kimishima? Well he was a bank guy before hand.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 24, 2016, 10:41:06 AM
I think it will do fine if it has the major third party games and the major Nintendo stuff. The biggest complaint I keep hearing is the current gen is all ports and remasters. The timing of NX is perfect to get into the real console exclusives for this gen and if Nintendo can get their good games out next to the 3rd party games their exclusives alone sell systems, their exclusives + 3rd party games that aren't gimped = SNES sales easily. Don't underestimate the Playstation gamers who were once die hard SNES fanboys making a return if the right games come along.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on May 24, 2016, 10:46:52 AM
What does Nintendo need to do to cure the developer support issue? They need to first recognize it. As someone who has been a fan of Nintendo since the 80's, it pains me to accept that they don't appear to see this as much of an issue. If they did, they would show more interest in matching their competitors. About their competitors, though, I'm not sure they recognize who their competitors actually are. I bet if we asked them, they would name Apple, Google, and perhaps Sony. After all, they show a ton more concern over the mobile market than they do the games one.


I'm slowly losing interest in the NX. Even though all we have are rumors to work off of, the more I hear about it the more I'm convinced they are bound to make the same mistakes as before. Nintendo seems destined to match whatever is currently on the market, go with custom hardware to do it, and have some showcase feature that is the centerpiece to the experience. I love the Wii U, but it is far from a success mostly for the reasons I've listed. Developers may not mind the challenges of working with a unique platform, but businesses hate spending additional resources on a gamble.


I would love for Nintendo to go the extra mile with their home console product. I want to see them embrace some industry standards such as the X86 architecture. Nintendo needs to be a little bold this time like opting to cram some additional hardware power into this box and sell at a small loss. As the consumer, I don't feel good about hearing Nintendo turning a profit from day 1. I need to feel their is a little something special in that box. More to the point, I want to feel that Nintendo has gone the distance in producing a gamer's machine with slick UI, smooth OS, and lots of interesting features.


If Nintendo wants to wow, they can. If they did, I believe they'd go with mainstream hardware and a "modern" online community that demonstrates they understand the competitive gamer's wants and needs. Plus, I'd like to see them do something like strike a deal with Valve and and make the NX into a fully compatible Steambox. If you can't get publishers on board from day 1, then bring them on through someone else's platform from day 1.

But nah, that would require robust hardware and forward thinking that goes beyond your own nose.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 24, 2016, 12:29:19 PM
To say that they must go with x86 hardware is kinda missing something. x86 hardware is kinda garbage. The entire computer industry wanted to move away from it in the mid 90s. My own first personal computer was a 286. I has 386's and 486. The first Pentiums were like 586 processors. Nintendo has been using RISC architecture which runs more efficiently. Now there are things Intel and AMD have done over the years that have made x86 remain more popular, but that does not make them better. Its been a while since anyone has seen a truly remarkable power pc pc processor. ARM processors are also RISC based and they have been the way Nintendo has been going with their handhelds. Looking at the teardowns vs the specs of the wiiu espresso vs the ps4 jaguar there are some ways wiiU's processor is actually better.  5 more cores and a boost in clockspeed and it definitely would be comparing apples to oranges.

If I were to guess. There was some deal with IBM and ARM in 2011 to develop 14nm processors. What Nintendo might get is the fruit of this deal. They work with both companies for processors. NX might have a 8-16 core ARM based processor.

Thinking about these things...NX might not be a regular tv console. If they miniaturize enough then most of the guts might be in the controller. On the xbox one and ps4 that are huge i don't know if most of that is because they are using big ass computer architecture. Nintendo knows miniaturization. If they drop discs....

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on May 24, 2016, 05:16:01 PM
Thinking about these things...NX might not be a regular tv console. If they miniaturize enough then most of the guts might be in the controller. On the xbox one and ps4 that are huge i don't know if most of that is because they are using big ass computer architecture. Nintendo knows miniaturization. If they drop discs....


I think that Nintendo's focus is leaving fans like myself behind. While I have owned a DS and a 3DS, I think that the worst aspects of Nintendo have emerged as a result of their battle against the mobile devices. They can stick the entire console into a controller, but it is not the thing I want. I'm not impressed by that, and I really don't care that I can still play on the TV. TV play is the main mode of play for most people. I'd be a lot more impressed if the mobile stuff ran in the cloud and could leverage your existing mobile phone as a terminal to access it.


That's beside the point though. I truly feel that Nintendo's priorities don't align with my own. I have hope that Kimishima will right this ship and demonstrate that he better understands North America than Iwata ever did.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 24, 2016, 05:45:14 PM
#TeamButtons does not favor streaming games to existing mobile phones.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 24, 2016, 05:54:34 PM
After the Cube it feels like Iwata's idea for Nintendo's direction was that they should offer something really different than everyone else.  Like he felt the Cube was too similar to the competition and thus didn't stand out and didn't sell.  But I don't want Nintendo to offer something different in terms of consoles and controllers.  I want that stuff to be very conventional and the creativity to be used entirely in game design.

I also think that the Gamecube's problem was in how it was different - too many easily avoidable screw-ups were made.  It was the only console that didn't have DVD playback and the only one that was essentially offline.  It used different media than the others with a smaller capacity.  There were even little tiny things like Nintendo's idiotic policies regarding demo discs and how their memory card was 1/8 the size of the PS2 initially but cost the same amount or their Player's Choice games were $30 when everyone else had $20.  If you did a checklist comparison of features between the three consoles the Cube was often last and almost never first in anything.

So what I really want is for Nintendo to just stop fucking up the easy stuff.  They just routinely make mistakes that no one with the slightest familiarity with videogames should make.  They do things weird and different for no reason to the point where I wonder if it is policy that Nintendo always do things their own way.  Come up with a new gameplay idea for a game?  Great!  That's the area where people want creativity.  But stuff like friend codes and tying online purchases with the hardware instead of an account?  Fucking ridiculous.  The competition did it the right way years before and no one wants a special Nintendo way because it's just basic functionality and all that's needed is that it just works well.

I feel Iwata's approach has just encouraged Nintendo to make mistakes because when you're being all different you can conveniently avoid meeting industry standards.  You can also never admit to any mistakes because you can chalk that up as just being different and thus never learn or have to fix anything.  What I wanted from the Cube follow up was just a conventional console with the expected hardware upgrade and without all the stupid little easily avoidable mistakes and with Nintendo's amazing first party lineup.  And I really just want the 2017 equivalent of that from the NX.

Nintendo has never TRIED that.  They avoided correcting the mistakes of the Cube by being different and grabbing a new audience.  And had the Wii not caught on with that audience it probably would have had the same fate as the Wii U.  Their bad habits have just been reinforced with each generation.  So how about they actually get their **** together for a change instead of trying to disguise things with gimmicks and weirdness and if THAT fails then they can declare it hopeless and go back to being weird for no reason?  And if they "try it" and there's a Gamecube-esque list of easily avoidable mistakes to go with it then that doesn't count as a real effort.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 24, 2016, 07:21:21 PM
No offence Ian Sane, but I'm getting real sick of your Nintendo-rambling-hating ****.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 24, 2016, 11:42:21 PM
We've talked about the bubble before. It is just odd that they live in a bubble and they don't pay much attention to what the other companies are doing. In some ways it makes them unique in other ways it makes them jut plain weird. Would anyone of us make the same decisions Nintendo has over the years? No. I don't even think what Nintendo did with the Gamecube were grave sins. Microsoft did things different because they wanted to improve things in the console world. Noble, but you have to take into account when Nintendo started planning Gamecube they were competing against Sony and Sega. If you took Microsoft out of the equation then the design of the Gamecube makes a lot of sense. Form factor and control and design were made to compete against Dreamcast. They even made the name a weird nonsensicle compound word. Yamauchi had wanted to call it StarCube, DreamStar GameCast. Nintendo made a more powerful system than the ps2, but really they were aiming to compete with Dreamcast. I understand why they didn't do much with online games on Gamecube...they were inexperienced with it and the games were in its infancy.

online games are still in their infancy in types if you think about it. You have mostly shooters, and mmo. Minecraft came into existance in the last few years. Fighting games aren't even popular for online because you need super fast broadband for that to be good. Nintendo does have an amazing online racing game though.

With the "failure" of the Gamecube, I think Nintendo wanted to do something to remain in the mindshare. That's what came with the Wii. Nintendo did things mostly right with Wii U. I don't think they expected to get leapfrogged in tech so much. I really didn't either. I figured ps4 and xboxone would come out and there wouldn't be a huge clear noticeable difference. I think I was a generation off though. To a large extant they really don't look that different. My biggest comparison would be the difference between Blackflag on Wii U, and on Xbox One. You can see the difference but it isn't huge. Watchdogs looks shitty on Wii U though. They spent the extra time, but they really didn't optimize it enough to where I could continue to play it. I look to what was achieved by Konami in the cancelled ps4 game demo for Silent Hills PT. They jumped up from 60% realistic to 97% realistic.

If Nintendo's system can achieve the same level of realism than the key is going to be their output of games. Pikmin 4 could look fantastic. A Metroid Game could be fantastic. That Mario Galaxy 3 game could be great. The new Zelda game should launch with NX just as TP launched with Wii. The key is Nintendo getting these game out. Getting them out on a regular basis. And maintaining a steady schedule. A new Xeno game is probably coming out because that team seems to run well. There can't be gaps. Nintendo has to remember they are a games software company first.

The next step is getting exclusives. Making sure that the games people want to buy only come out on NX. We know an FF7 remake is coming out, what if that was only on NX?

So what I should say is they should run the company how they ran it in the SNES days.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 24, 2016, 11:46:50 PM
*shrug* Everyone has different tastes and opinions. I used to be a Blizzard fanboy and I really have not touched much they've made recently, nor have any interest in re-entering that universe, despite being utterly in love with their work with WC1-3, SC, and WoW.

As for Nintendo though, I like them taking risks, I like them making different choices, and I like the diversity in thought they encourage in the game industry. They're not the only perspective out there, maybe they're not even the best, but they're a perspective and viewpoint and value-set that I value as part of this medium.

As for x86 though, I don't see what people would have against ARM. I feel like a broken record, but the Tegra X1 (which uses ARM CPUs) can run Unreal Engine 4, display 4K, and run the upcoming Vulkan low-level API. x86 isn't much of a player in mobile because it hasn't been paying as much attention to the needs of that space as ARM has (Battery life is VERY important I say!). So ARM is definitely getting a lot of attention and use and support in the real world (which I imagine would be the same argument for x86: adopting widely supported non-custom tech to ease development), and isn't at all the odd-duck that the PowerPC tech was for Nintendo's last three console generations.

Actually, is there any reason why a Tegra X1 chip and ARM in a supposed "handheld" version of NX would be a bad thing? I'm curious what people's objections to that possibility are.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 25, 2016, 12:25:07 AM
There's no way FFVII Remake is ONLY coming out on NX. That is a bad business choice for Square Enix in every regard.

Also, don't you guys get tired of doing this...? I honestly can't go into this thread without feeling exhausted. I know that specs are "important", but I'm sure Nintendo had much of this discussion long before you guys did. Or maybe they avoided it. Either way, arguing about what NX "should be" is a bit fruitless at this point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 25, 2016, 12:50:08 AM
I'm on the same boat as Evan here I couldn't be f*cked to read all this/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on May 25, 2016, 01:44:39 AM
There's no way FFVII Remake is ONLY coming out on NX. That is a bad business choice for Square Enix in every regard.

Square Enix wouldn't make it an exclusive just because; Nintendo would obviously have to throw a lot of money their way for that to happen. That might be a bad business move for Nintendo (without knowing anything about the NX or how aggressive they're going to be in getting other exclusives), but if Square Enix would get so much money up front that they could be reasonably assured they'd reach an acceptable level of profit on the game (short of something disastrous taking place), it could make plenty of sense for them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Evan_B on May 25, 2016, 01:58:48 AM
No offence Ian Sane, but I'm getting real sick of your Nintendo-rambling-hating ****.
Honestly, if he cared about other people's opinions, he would have laid off on it a long time ago.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 25, 2016, 02:30:23 AM
We wants another rumor Nintendo, we NEEDS it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 25, 2016, 03:16:40 AM
I like endlessly throwing spaghetti at the wall. Then when we find out I can see how wrong/right we were.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on May 25, 2016, 06:30:09 AM
SquareEnix said last year during Sony's dog and pony show that FFVII-R was "first on PS4". It's more likely to be "NX doesn't get it period" and it goes PS4/PC like Street Fighter V did.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 25, 2016, 09:28:44 AM
I would think a Super Mario RPG partnership exclusive would be better than FF7 remake because that sort of has Sony's hands all over it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on May 25, 2016, 11:55:10 AM
Also, don't you guys get tired of doing this...? I honestly can't go into this thread without feeling exhausted. I know that specs are "important", but I'm sure Nintendo had much of this discussion long before you guys did. Or maybe they avoided it. Either way, arguing about what NX "should be" is a bit fruitless at this point.

Haha, I've stayed clear of NX rumors until only a couple weeks ago and then I didn't drink the rumor koolaid, I drowned myself in it.

But yeah, I don't see much sense in talking about what it "should" be, that's sterile conjecture. What's more engaging is trying to tease out what it will be, trying to temper back any conspiracy tendencies and guess at Nintendo's internal trajectory and then how that will manifest.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 25, 2016, 12:43:56 PM
Cut and dry, all I want is a PS4 that plays Nintendo games. Give me that I will be happy. I already have a PS4 so personally the only way I'd buy 3rd party games is if they are exclusive to it, or are the definitive version in some way. Price is a factor and so is timing. I was planning on waiting to see what NX was then comparing it to Playstation VR. I am already sold on Playstation VR and with NX being delayed, from what I was expecting, that means it had to be something really special to sway me from spending that $500 that is earmarked for Sony VR and give it to Nintendo instead.

IF however the NX is a VR and it does it in a way that suits me better than what Sony is doing then I might consider changing directions. But if it isn't going to have the 3rd party games, I mean exclusives be it true exclusives or really good exclusive features, then it had better be a bargain machine if it only plays Nintendo games and a handful of games I can get better versions of elsewhere.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on May 25, 2016, 05:26:46 PM
Cut and dry, all I want is a PS4 that plays Nintendo games. Give me that I will be happy. I already have a PS4 so personally the only way I'd buy 3rd party games is if they are exclusive to it, or are the definitive version in some way. Price is a factor and so is timing. I was planning on waiting to see what NX was then comparing it to Playstation VR. I am already sold on Playstation VR and with NX being delayed, from what I was expecting, that means it had to be something really special to sway me from spending that $500 that is earmarked for Sony VR and give it to Nintendo instead.

IF however the NX is a VR and it does it in a way that suits me better than what Sony is doing then I might consider changing directions. But if it isn't going to have the 3rd party games, I mean exclusives be it true exclusives or really good exclusive features, then it had better be a bargain machine if it only plays Nintendo games and a handful of games I can get better versions of elsewhere.

Okay, great, just go chill over at Push Square or whatever, and come back here and chime in if you decide to buy the PS4-identical Nintendo VR box that is never going to happen. Can't wait to hear from you again.

Apropos of which, bubbling up into "real news" are leaks about the XTwone, which is supposedly going to release in late 2017 and be 4x as strong as the XBone, and also significantly stronger than the PS4K, which is rumored to be releasing by the end of this year.

The tide seems to quickly be shifting toward this tacky arms race of iterative consoles, likely designed to milk as much money out of the ossifying core gamer base as possible. Any thoughts on how this affects NX plans? If anything I thought MS was going to fade off into branded PC boxes as they edged out of the dedicated console space, but instead they are supposedly doubling down with this new "Scorpio" device, along with a slim Xbone, and various Roku and Fire stick type things. It all frankly seems kind of senseless to me, outside of VR applications, which I don't care about and can't see taking off in a serious way anytime soon. I feel like whatever Nintendo's go up their sleeves, they're going to be portrayed as having been caught with their dingus out next to this new circus.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 25, 2016, 06:17:47 PM
Nintendo releasing a box just like the PS4 would likely still get few and poorly optimized ports, and sell poorly.  Gamers are already invested in those online communities, and Nintendo is not likely to know how to win them over at this point with brute force.  On a personal note, I think it would also be boring.  If they want to get mainstream attention, they need some hook.

As for ARM vs. x86, I think the idea that the latter is terribly inefficient is outdated.  ARM was traditionally for cheap and small devices that didn't need much CPU power, including things like microwaves.  x86 was instead for heavy duty computing, and used an increasing amount of electricity to keep up with Moore's Law.  But, this is historical, and they've both largely converged as it is relevant to this topic.  There is nothing inherently high or low power about either.  They are just based on different instruction sets.  Intel has a good line of mobile chips that are powerful and don't kill batteries any more than ARM.  They are used in Windows tablets and ultrabooks rather than phones.  There are much higher end options with x86 than ARM, but that is not relevant for a console at a reasonable price.  ARM or x86 would work fine.  The only thing people dislike about ARM is that it makes ports from other consoles and PCs less direct, plus some (perhaps invalid) implication that Nintendo is not attempting to keep up with the competition.

If this is a hybrid device, might as well stick with ARM.  The third party support might follow more from the developers that supported the 3DS than the PS4, which could be a good thing.  We don't want another Wii U situation, with ports of games that have been out for months or longer on other systems and little reason to buy them.  Although, portable versions of popular games might sell if they are the types of games that people want to take everywhere (trendy shooters, etc.).  In other words, games that people would love to play on the go, but would not make sense for phones.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 25, 2016, 06:36:59 PM
I'd like to think these blatantly anti-consumer double-dip iterative consoles will be soundly rejected by the buying public... but too often I've underestimated just how many idiots with disposable income there are.  Hell Nintendo themselves have managed to make this concept reasonably successful with their handhelds.

Nintendo releasing a PS3/XB1 equivalent just as those consoles get replaced by a slightly updated model would be such a Nintendo thing to do that it sounds almost like satire.  Ironically Nintendo may have kickstarted this whole thing.  Unlike the other guys, they put themselves in a situation where they absolutely couldn't go with another long generation and would have to replace their console ASAP.  Sony and MS may have looked at Nintendo's need to release a new console and figured it would give them the ability to try out new hardware as well with Nintendo giving the appearance of a need for a new generation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 25, 2016, 07:21:16 PM
I should clarify I don't mean specs, I mean features. I want a Nintendo console that does what a PS4 does but a Nintendo console that does some weird thing and leaves out the BASIC functionality the other consoles have.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 25, 2016, 08:28:31 PM
Like what exactly? Is it the friends system? The video recording? game trophies? an ethernet jack? I haven't spent enough time with a PS4 to see all that it offers
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 25, 2016, 08:45:27 PM
A user friendly interface. Blu Ray play back, maybe even more media options. A traditional controller. Good 3rd party exclusives, to name a few, plus yeah the things you said and I don't know maybe a better eco system, more video and web services than just the bare minimum.

Let me rephrase it. In order for me, personally, to buy an NX I either want it to be something that gives me an experience I can't already find else where. I won't be buying another Wii, or a Wii U. If they can't prove up front that it will have games I want and features I want then I won't be buying. Not unless it's real cheap like $200 at launch which isn't going to happen. Honestly what does anyone want from a Nintendo console? I want it to be able to get 3rd party exclusives and the same types of games I can get on the PS4 in addition to the Nintendo games. I don't mean the CoD games I mean the Street Fighter games, stuff that you know used to be and should be on a Nintendo console.

If all you want is for it to play Nintendo games and nothing else then that is why Nintendo is in the position they are, they shoot for the bare minimum and don't even try to reach for anything better anymore.

I mean damn the Wii U couldn't even run a comparable Netflix app for over half of the systems life. If the machine can't convince me that it belongs in my living room sitting besides my PS4 then it has to be second console status and for that it needs to be dirt cheap.

I am hoping it will blow me away. It will have great specs, it will have great games. Look the only reason people care about specs is because developers care, if Ubisoft says the machine is underpowered and would require too much effort on their part to make games for it then they won't.

In order for it to have great exclusive games it needs to be better than PS4 to some degree. Now granted to be fair the bar is lower than Wii already because it WILL be HD so it's not like choosing between an HD system and a not HD system so as far as specs go it will already be on a more level footing anyways. Gamers won't notice if a game isn't sporting all the latest little features whatever they are, as long as it isn't obviously gimped from the start. Genesis was lacking in a few colors compared to SNES but for the most part it had comparable graphics. It sold just fine and had plenty of multiplatform games. That is what Nintendo needs, they can be weak in one area as long as it's not so obvious it hampers development. With Wii even if they had a fast enough CPU and a strong enough GPU to render Halo 3 quality graphics, not being HD was more than obvious for most people.

For Wii U, I don't think most games look all that bad, even compared to my PS4. Now if NX comes out and has a super fast CPU, plenty of RAM, a very powerful GPU but it runs say a slow system Bus or whatever to save heat or whatever and that throws a wrench in the whole damn thing. Bottom line it needs to have the same features as the competition going in and then something the competition doesn't have.

The choice between PS4 and Xbox One comes down to minor things and the games. If the choice is something like games vs. no games, HD vs. SD, or 4K vs. 2k, then most people will go with the better of the choice. Wii sold pretty damn good all on it's own but the HD consoles sold right behind it, and they combined sold twice what it sold in the end.

I guess I just don't want a system that is going to be a lame duck out of the water. You can interpret that however you want. If it doesn't sell me up front then, maybe like Wii U it might in a few years but there are probably more people like me than who will buy it just because and I am still fairly open to Nintendo games anyways.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on May 25, 2016, 08:49:11 PM
See this is what I mean abut Ian Sane's posts, he points out all the bad in a VERY negative way and shows none of the good things his posts should be like yours 2k.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on May 25, 2016, 08:55:13 PM
Those seem like fair things to expect and I hope for them too.  I agree that it would need to be more powerful than the PS4 by at least a bit to make ports easy, since third parties won't likely want to spend time optimizing for an unproven system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 26, 2016, 10:22:44 AM
actually I think I liked the earlier builds of netflix more than the current build. The current build is pretty identical to other versions and I was pretty miffed when I had to update. The old version had a data file problem like Windows where it would slow down over time unless you re-installed it or deleted a data file. Otherwise it was cool and easier to swipe around, plus you could use the built in wii u touch keyboard code. In some ways it got better, in other ways it got less better. There was a time when it was the best version of netflix.

What's really going to matter is if it runs the latest version of unreal when it comes out. If it runs the game engines developers want to use it is going to be pretty transparent and easy to get titles to be on the system.
What's amazing is Ouya got unreal 4 and not wii u. I'm pretty sure WiiU is more powerful than Ouya and Epic just hates Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 26, 2016, 11:17:59 AM
They definitely hate Nintendo.  I recall them saying it'd be impossible to port one of the Unreal Engines to Wii and then a short while later gloat about how they got it running on iOS.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: supermario2k on May 26, 2016, 11:43:18 AM
I kind of get the impression some days all developers hate Nintendo.

To Perm: I liked the old Netflix interface also, but I have multiple profiles and for me not being able to access the different profiles was worse than putting up with the terrible new interface.

But to be fair, I have been using Netflix less and less each month as they keep going downhill. I mostly stick to a few shows on Amazon or Hulu these days.

Like always, I will get NX for the Mario game so I am sold before hand, Nintendo knows this. But when I buy is up to what the machine can offer me that I can't get elsewhere. If it does something truly amazing I can't get anywhere else and doesn't cost a fortune I might get early. If it is like Wii, Game Cube, Wii U, where I have to really weight the pros and cons heavily then I will wait for a price point that is easier to jump in at or more than just a Mario game.

That is the problem Nintendo needs to fix. They never get early adopters because people take one look at the machine and all hype fizzles when they realize the weird funky thing it does different they have to put up with. If it would just be a standard machine that does what people expect, or if it has to be different not worse than the competition. Different can be better. For a while Wii was better than 360 and for a LONG time it was better than PS3. But you knew that with PS3 it would improve in time and with Wii it's major flaws would only get worse in time. That is not how you sell a system.

Lucario, I am not being negative at all, I am critical there is a difference. I would love for NX to be great and not do anything weird, trust me I am rooting for it and Nintendo to succeed. I just am much older than you so I been through this enough times to know every generation is different. The machine is the gateway to the games but if the machine makes the games less fun than they should be for any reason it can be a problem. The games are always great, that is kind of why there is a push out there by some people for them to just go 3rd party. It won't  happen ever but there are those who do just want the games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on May 26, 2016, 12:43:33 PM
In terms of features I actually don't really care about non-gaming stuff.  Stuff like the online store matters to me because it ties in directly with the games but stuff like Netflix just isn't on my radar.  I would say Nintendo should match PS4 features that are popular and widely used.  Anything that is well known enough that someone may ask a store clerk about it while shopping for a console.  Like back with the Cube and DVD playback.  The DVD feature was such a well known and popular feature that you know people asked about it and were discouraged by finding out the Cube didn't offer it.  Nintendo shouldn't want someone to ask "how about this?" and get an answer that Sony and MS have it but Nintendo does not.  But there are probably some features that hardly anyone uses and Nintendo could save some money by not offering them and it will have no negative impact at all.

The NX is going to get great exclusives because Nintendo's own games are usually great.  It's funny that they're all hung up on being different when if the third party support was identical between all three platforms it would be a battle of first party releases and that would play to Nintendo's strengths.  If they don't get the third party support then all those non-exclusives on the PS4 and XB1 are like anti-exclusives from a Nintendo perspective.  They won't steer people specifically to Sony or MS but they will steer them AWAY from Nintendo.  If someone likes Game X if Nintendo has it then their console is involved in that person's console-buying decision.  The Wii U was only ever in consideration if Nintendo's own games are your top priority.  With good third party support they can be a lower priority but end up being the deciding factor.  "Well they've all got mostly the same stuff... oooo but I also get Mario and Zelda with this one!"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on May 26, 2016, 03:18:13 PM
For me, it would be great if Nintendo's next system offered online features on par (or close to) the other systems, but without the subscription fee. If they could win back some of the third-party support, it may even be a selling point for Nintendo as people could play games like Call of Duty without paying extra for a sub fee.

In any case, I just hope it still offers free online play.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 26, 2016, 04:05:50 PM
The no-DVD on Gamecube was an easy answer. First Nintendo was not in the DVD business. Second actually they had that covered. There was a version of the Gamecube that had DVD: The Panasonic Q. Adding DVD added a licensing fee. Which would propel Gamecube off of the at the time mass market price of $199. The Panasonic Q was expensive and now is an insane collectors item. Even a broken one costs $300 on ebay. Third again Nintendo did not plan for Xbox. To Nintendo's eyes  Nintendo was competing against Sega, and then secondly Sony who was an electronics conglomerate outsider. If Microsoft hadn't shown up to support the direction of Sony we'd probably still have a different playing field. I think Nintendo was under the impression they would just end up being a 3do or phillips. You have to keep in mind this is under Yamauchi who didn't play games, was kinda an old guy from the old school of business.

That it doesn't have blueray/dvd now infuriates me. If I could just download a legal $20 license program to make it happen. Yesterday I was having troubles with my DVD player(my mom lost the remote), If my Wi U could play DVDs that would solve that damn problem.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: sudoshuff on May 26, 2016, 06:01:27 PM
You have to keep in mind this is under Yamauchi who didn't play games, was kinda an old guy from the old school of business.


Isn't this kind of the same situation with Kimishima? And...how will that bode for the NX?  I mean, unless you think that all the details of the NX were conceived of under Iwata and Nintendo plans to execute that vision (which I believe has been alluded to).  This is actually my biggest concern with the NX (and I'm an NX optimist)--that Kimishima seems a little too out of touch to guide the company in the creative direction it needs to go.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on May 26, 2016, 06:19:18 PM
The no-DVD on Gamecube was an easy answer. First Nintendo was not in the DVD business. Second actually they had that covered. There was a version of the Gamecube that had DVD: The Panasonic Q. Adding DVD added a licensing fee. Which would propel Gamecube off of the at the time mass market price of $199. The Panasonic Q was expensive and now is an insane collectors item. Even a broken one costs $300 on ebay. Third again Nintendo did not plan for Xbox. To Nintendo's eyes  Nintendo was competing against Sega, and then secondly Sony who was an electronics conglomerate outsider. If Microsoft hadn't shown up to support the direction of Sony we'd probably still have a different playing field. I think Nintendo was under the impression they would just end up being a 3do or phillips. You have to keep in mind this is under Yamauchi who didn't play games, was kinda an old guy from the old school of business.

That it doesn't have blueray/dvd now infuriates me. If I could just download a legal $20 license program to make it happen. Yesterday I was having troubles with my DVD player(my mom lost the remote), If my Wi U could play DVDs that would solve that damn problem.

I wouldn't call a modestly distributed product "covering the base".  And part of that premium was the fact that the system was being made by someone else, who also had to wet their beak on top of the licensing. Nintendo could have designed and distributed something similar for a reasonable price.

Plus, I think Nintendo was moreso learning from than competing against the Dreamcast.  The piracy issue probably contributed to Nintendo wanted to go with the smaller sized, and less commercially available, disks.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on May 26, 2016, 10:22:40 PM
I sincerely hope that Nintendo is holding the NX back from the public as a means to allow themselves the freedom to gauge what the competition has planned in terms of hardware power and then actually match or top it.


I know that's just daydreaming, but I would like to see a Nintendo console that has more than ample CPU and GPU power and actually do some cool stuff with it. What would that be? I don't know. Wow us, Nintendo. Create a holodeck or something.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on May 27, 2016, 01:36:42 AM
Dreamcast was a case study of a great few years of hardware sales and poor software sales because of piracy.

Also, when talking about what Xbox and Gamecube one has to really keep in mind that Nintendo had already designed and made deals to have gamecube to be made before microsoft announced and released xbox. No matter what Nintendo did Microsoft was going to one-up Nintendo's specs. The original xbox was a huge mess of a box that was more of a stripped down computer than a console. It was sold at a loss and was pretty much taking advantage of Microsofts tech monopoly power to strongarm themselves into the industry.

Also, lets keep in mind something. How big are some games today? I see a lot of Nintendo titles that are still 1-2 gb. 1.5 gb was a perfectly logical size for that generation. Anybody making 2 disc dvd games were making games inefficiently. I never liked the trend of FMV heavy games. The only games in this case that worked out for me was Resident Evil which made it onto the cube on 2 discs. Most games in this time would not go over 1.5 gb. Shenmue worked out in this era too. It was a 4 1gb disc game. Of course it was also a totally pirated game as well.

also keep in mind Xbox also had poor sales compared to ps2, and was discontinued earlier than Gamecube.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on May 27, 2016, 09:14:24 PM
Gamestop speculates on NX revenue:

http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/05/26/gamestop-compares-potential-nintendo-nx-sales-to-wii-u-and-wii-excited-about-it/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 02, 2016, 09:43:51 PM
Hawt NX VR Rumors from China!

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 02, 2016, 11:09:41 PM
Nintendo already has some level of vr on wii u. If I taped my wii U controe to a pair of goggles and did the 3d video you'd have really silly vr.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on June 02, 2016, 11:12:18 PM
I'm skeptical of Nintendo rumours in general, but this seems even more questionable than most.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 03, 2016, 01:33:11 AM
I read the source earlier and I was like I have never heard of this news outlet before, and I wish I owned the domain.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shorty McNostril on June 06, 2016, 03:13:52 PM
Mr Bikkies talks about it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7M8K70OxRU
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on June 06, 2016, 03:54:25 PM
Digitimes, in my experience, is like Michael Pachter after getting hit by Sand Attack 3 or 4 times.

Let that sink in.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 13, 2016, 12:46:56 PM
4K Xbone S is real, if NX doesn't support 4K *at least for video services* then it's doomed from the beginning, again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ejamer on June 13, 2016, 01:15:28 PM
4K Xbone S is real, if NX doesn't support 4K *at least for video services* then it's doomed from the beginning, again.


Is there actual demand for this?


My internet (download caps and speed) won't support 4k video content, and even if it would I'm not buying a new TV.


I'm not against seeing 4k support, but I am pretty solidly against paying extra for it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on June 13, 2016, 05:02:15 PM
Well, every time Nintendo didn't have the new hot tech, it resulted in declining sales (aside from the Wii).  Judging from history, it could be a mistake not to.  Plus, 4K screens will only become more ubiquitous during the NX's life cycle.  Nintendo may not want to be last on this train. . .again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on June 13, 2016, 05:10:56 PM
What do the third parties want?  If they feel this 4K stuff is important than the NX needs it.  If they don't then it probably will be fine without it.  Do what it is needed to stop the trend of games showing up on every platform but Nintendo's and the sales will improve.  Continue to almost intentionally maintain that status quo and the sales will just get worse with each gen.

Though I'm not particularly confident in Nintendo making the right call in what tech they don't need to support.  Just matching the competition on this stuff is probably the safest move.  My assumption is that they WON'T match it and that gives me another reason to hope and pray this iterative console stuff flops.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: rlse9 on June 13, 2016, 05:28:08 PM
What do the third parties want?  If they feel this 4K stuff is important than the NX needs it.  If they don't then it probably will be fine without it.  Do what it is needed to stop the trend of games showing up on every platform but Nintendo's and the sales will improve.  Continue to almost intentionally maintain that status quo and the sales will just get worse with each gen.

Though I'm not particularly confident in Nintendo making the right call in what tech they don't need to support.  Just matching the competition on this stuff is probably the safest move.  My assumption is that they WON'T match it and that gives me another reason to hope and pray this iterative console stuff flops.
Everything I've heard/read is that there's no way the updated PS4/Xbone would be capable of running games, outside of very basic 2D games, in 4k.  It takes way too much processing power to do 4k.  So, I doubt third parties really care, none of the AAA third party games are going to be coming out in 4k anytime soon.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 13, 2016, 05:46:40 PM
I don't think anyone knows exactly what the specs are for the updated consoles, but they could be sold at a loss, or very low profit margin for a while - but they will definitely be playing "real" games at 4K. The GTX 1070 can do it on the cheap, and the AMD 480 will probably be able to as well. Hell, the Nvidia Shield Android TV can play games at 4K.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on June 13, 2016, 07:08:04 PM
You call it on the cheap, yet the 1070 by itself is more expensive than the Xbox 1 S.  You'd still need the CPU, MB, RAM, HDD or SSD, case and operating system on top of the 1070 to be able to do anything at all.

I'm pretty sure the Nvidia Shield will not natively play games in 4k.

However, it would be good for Nintendo do at least think about being able to display games in 4k, even if they have the tech level of the One S in the system.  Being left behind even that is not a good idea at this point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 13, 2016, 08:29:31 PM
Yes, the retail price for the 1070 is more than the Xbone S. The new AMD card is $199 though (retail), and Xbone S/PS4 will be using AMD still. However, Nvidia has already demoed a 1070 built-in to a motherboard (small, too).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 13, 2016, 08:37:33 PM
So the Xbone S won't play games at 4K apparently, that will happen with next year's Project Scorpio. So, there's no reason to upgrade to the Xbone S unless you have a 4K TV that is not a smart TV, I guess.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on June 13, 2016, 08:45:58 PM
I don't think it's intended as an upgrade as much as an alternative for people who don't currently own one and would prefer one that's not the size of a boxcar.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 13, 2016, 09:59:39 PM
so project scorpio is what the Microsoft people call NX? :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 14, 2016, 07:35:47 PM
Wait a minute, if Breath of the Wild is a launch game on NX, then NX is most likely PowerPC again, unless a new architecture (x86 or ARM) is why the port is taking a long time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on June 14, 2016, 09:51:23 PM
It's not like it's impossible to port something from one architecture to another. It happens all the time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 14, 2016, 09:55:08 PM
If they ever happen to officially reveal what the NX is, looks like, and/or does, can someone do me the favor of sending me a PM.

thanks,
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: EasyCure on June 14, 2016, 10:59:17 PM
If they ever happen to officially reveal what the NX is, looks like, and/or does, can someone do me the favor of sending me a PM.

thanks,

Gotchu, fam
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 15, 2016, 01:10:47 AM
Wait a minute, if Breath of the Wild is a launch game on NX, then NX is most likely PowerPC again, unless a new architecture (x86 or ARM) is why the port is taking a long time.

If you work for Nintendo and your job is coding Zelda then you're going to be a competent coder. The type of complexity  means you could pull it off on whatever cpu you work with. Iwata was a programmer, he most likely hired all the best programmers he could
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ceric on June 15, 2016, 07:29:24 AM
The other alternative is you don't do any CPU specific coding.  Let the compilers and API handle that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 15, 2016, 06:39:04 PM
Exactly. When I use unity most all my code goes to collision detection and physics. In one of the things I was programming I found a sure way to make the cpu slow the hell down. I'll make sure not to do that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on June 15, 2016, 09:49:55 PM
Not a rumor or speculation but Nintendo of Canada says they'll talk about NX in the fall. So sometime From September to December.

I think we all expected as much.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on June 16, 2016, 04:17:45 PM
Fall is a little later than I was hoping for.  I was hoping for August, September isn't too bad, but anything after that is going to feel like it takes forever to come.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on June 16, 2016, 04:53:18 PM
Nintendo has to be cognizant of the fact they can't lose hype between the console reveal and the console launch after the Wii U. I was listening to an old episode of RFN a little while ago and Dr. Metts brought up how there was a lot of hype around the Wii U at its first E3 (even from people who ran multi-platform or Playstation sites), but by the time the next E3 rolled around, a lot of the excitement was gone because it felt like the reveal and the initial excitement was such a long time ago. This episode was a couple months prior to the Wii U launching, so it's not as if he said this with the benefit of hindsight either.

If revealing the console this late allows them to keep a constant stream of headline-grabbing information flowing up to the console launching, it could end up working really well for them.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on June 16, 2016, 05:16:40 PM
I'm slightly optimistic and slightly pessimistic regarding how Nintendo will handle the NX. It'll be an interesting year, for sure!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on June 16, 2016, 05:23:57 PM
No one is reporting on the latest news: Nintendo is not interested in terraflops but content! You heard it hear first. Nintendo is once again stating they are concerned about matching technical specs of the competitors. Cue the rage!

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on June 16, 2016, 05:56:55 PM
The language is very generic Nintendo PR speak, but disheartening anyway.  The first time I cared about hardware power was with Metroid Prime 3.  I saw how much work they had put into the worlds and all the talent and passion felt wasted compared to the contemporary systems.  Knowing what it could have been made me realize how nonsensical the nearly identical PR message behind the Wii that I had been defending was.  I may have that feeling when playing the new Zelda at some points too.

Not that I'm complaining.  If they need to do a relatively low power hybrid system to get back into profitability, then I'm glad they have the foresight to do it.  They need to stay in business to keep making great games, after all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 16, 2016, 06:20:49 PM
Nintendo of Canada eh?

I've been watching videos from this youtube channel all day.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZpmbKeSnKreOTk_5IwKsQQ
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on June 17, 2016, 02:24:43 AM
Nintendo has to be cognizant of the fact they can't lose hype between the console reveal and the console launch after the Wii U. I was listening to an old episode of RFN a little while ago and Dr. Metts brought up how there was a lot of hype around the Wii U at its first E3 (even from people who ran multi-platform or Playstation sites), but by the time the next E3 rolled around, a lot of the excitement was gone because it felt like the reveal and the initial excitement was such a long time ago. This episode was a couple months prior to the Wii U launching, so it's not as if he said this with the benefit of hindsight either.

If revealing the console this late allows them to keep a constant stream of headline-grabbing information flowing up to the console launching, it could end up working really well for them.

Yeah the Wii U was revealed waaaaaaaay too soon. Two E3's and then all that time until the following November did not do it any favors. I'd say give us a 6 to 4 month heads up before releasing it to keep the hype fires burning.

Reggie saying that same old PR from a gajillion years ago for the most part is just talk but it's not something anyone wants to hear. That kind of PR is supposed to control the message and keep fans happy but in fact it will only just do the opposite because now even guys like me who loved the Wii and Wii U don't want to hear any excuses for weaker hardware again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on June 17, 2016, 03:17:38 AM
Part of unveiling the Wii U when they did was how many details had already leaked out about it. They were left with the unpleasant choice of letting all that sit out there or announcing it too early. With NX they've done a much better job of keeping everything under wraps.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: lolmonade on June 17, 2016, 09:59:32 AM
No one is reporting on the latest news: Nintendo is not interested in terraflops but content! You heard it hear first. Nintendo is once again stating they are concerned about matching technical specs of the competitors. Cue the rage!


I'm not a graphics/specs whore, but you would at least hope their specifications would be comparable enough for ports from 3rd parties to be a low barrier of entry.  Even then, I expect to be disappointed by the 3rd party offerings, either due to them being not equivalent in quality or by not existing at all.


And I think this is at the crux of Nintendo's problem with 3rd parties.  People who buy Nintendo consoles only buy nintendo games, or at least that's the perception. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on June 17, 2016, 10:03:28 AM
Watching the Microsoft conference you realize how stupid you sound when you say the word teraflops with a straight face.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 17, 2016, 12:06:55 PM
People buy Nintendo games for Nintendo consoles because 3rd parties don't make good games for them. Perception = reality.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on June 17, 2016, 04:17:16 PM
And I think this is at the crux of Nintendo's problem with 3rd parties.  People who buy Nintendo consoles only buy nintendo games, or at least that's the perception. 

The thing is Nintendo's third party support has been such **** for 20 years now that the Nintendo console audience is naturally going to be skewered towards gamers that are only interested in Nintendo games.  Aside from some stubborn fools like myself, it really hasn't made sense to buy a Nintendo console if third party support is important to you.  Or those for which it is important buy a Nintendo console as a second console specifically to get the first party stuff they're missing.  I noticed during the Wii gen that once I got fed up and bought a PS3 that suddenly I paid a whole lot less attention to the Wii's third party output because I didn't need to.  The PS3 was filling all the holes in my library except the Nintendo stuff.  But if the third party support was better at the start maybe the trend wouldn't be there.  How well did multiplatform releases on the Gamecube sell, because that's the closest since the N64 that Nintendo has had to the proper support they should have?  I think it was pretty good until the other consoles went online and the Cube always had the de facto worst version for missing online content.

Regarding specs (and gimmick controls while we're at it), Reggie can spin this or that but I KNOW what weak specs means: Wii and Wii U.  I know what we'll get and it will be pretty lousy and it would be pretty asinine after the Wii U's obvious failings to push essentially the Wii U AGAIN and expect any one to fall for it.  How about NO SPIN because there is no spin NEEDED?  What a concept!  Just make something that's awesome and brag about it openly with no PR speak.  Does Reggie have to use spin to explain why the new Zelda will be awesome?  Nope, he can just be open and honest about it and we'll eat it up.  If you need to train up your PR people to put the right spin of something then you have screwed up.  If you need spin for the NX then you need to rethink the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on June 19, 2016, 04:47:25 AM
Kinda make me wonder why not just say, "No comment," or, "We'll have more to say about the NX and Nintendo's future at a later date," to every NX question since that is the truth of Nintendo's PR plan with the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 19, 2016, 07:38:58 PM
Since nothing has been officially announced yet, and Nintendo waited to reveal the NX...Nintendo COULD, do a last minute upgrade.  I don't expect them too, but they could.  Even if it is just upping the RAM but I hope it is more than that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on June 19, 2016, 09:21:32 PM
No one is reporting on the latest news: Nintendo is not interested in terraflops but content! You heard it hear first. Nintendo is once again stating they are concerned about matching technical specs of the competitors. Cue the rage!

Watching the Microsoft conference you realize how stupid you sound when you say the word teraflops with a straight face.

Quote 2 explains why Nintendo wouldn't care about teraflops.  However, devs have been shown to care about that sort of thing, and devs drive content.  So, if Nintendo wants to care about content, then. . .ya know.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Spak-Spang on June 19, 2016, 10:35:42 PM
Talking about the power of your console is not what you do at an expo.  That is a fact sheet you give to potential developers and then you let your games speak for the power of the console.  Plain and simple.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on June 19, 2016, 11:10:17 PM
The NX "will be fantastic" according to CD Projekt Red (The Witcher series):


http://www.nintengen.com/2016/06/cd-projekt-red-nx-will-be-fantastic.html?m=1
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 19, 2016, 11:21:53 PM
Hmm, sounds like the power is not as strong as the new Xbox, but Nintendo has a spectacular trick up its sleeve.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 19, 2016, 11:48:47 PM
The NX "will be fantastic" according to CD Projekt Red (The Witcher series):


http://www.nintengen.com/2016/06/cd-projekt-red-nx-will-be-fantastic.html?m=1

He did mention that it is a console....
that's something I guess.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 20, 2016, 12:38:21 AM
Take Two is also watching what Nintendo does:

https://www.thestreet.com/story/13611582/1/take-two-interactive-ceo-strauss-zelnick-we-re-here-to-delight-customers.html
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Caterkiller on June 20, 2016, 02:40:18 AM
Yeah first Take Two and CD Projekt Red I'm not sure what to make of it. When someone like the usuals(EA or Ubisoft) have good things to say about a console you kinda know a bit of it is BS because they likely already have a hand in it somewhere and want their own stuff to be successful with he platform. But these two are different all together when you consider their history with Nintendo which is a whole lot of nothing. Well that Bully game is one thing but it certainly ain't no GTA.

So hopefully there is something significant behind these comments. Instead of saying it's fantastic you'd think CD would say something a little safer. I guess it gives me a little more hope.

About that Scorpio though, 5 teraflops? Isn't that like a full generation ahead?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 20, 2016, 03:15:04 AM
Cater, you should know better by now than to get any sort of hopes up regarding vague comments developers about anything Nintendo.

And they made it sound like they aren't actually working on anything, as they may not really even have everything there is to know about what Nintendo is up to.

Quote
Nintendo (NTDOY) has already announced Nintendo NX will be coming out in spring 2017. What impact will new consoles from the major players have on the gaming industry over the next couple of years?

It could be very exciting. You never want to count Nintendo out. They go quiet for a while and then they come to market and do something really exciting. We are very interested and watching closely the development of what Nintendo plans to do next.

Sounds like they are sidelining it for now. Or just keeping expectations at Zero.
depends on how you want to look at it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Phil on June 20, 2016, 10:12:00 AM
The NX "will be fantastic" according to CD Projekt Red (The Witcher series):


http://www.nintengen.com/2016/06/cd-projekt-red-nx-will-be-fantastic.html?m=1 (http://www.nintengen.com/2016/06/cd-projekt-red-nx-will-be-fantastic.html?m=1)


Apparently he was joking, and I, along with others, bought it hook, line, and sinker. Still, there seems to be plenty interested in the NX, developer-wise. Though that might not translate to support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on June 20, 2016, 01:42:43 PM
Developers are always interested in new systems, especially ones from veteran manufacturers. But just like we were interested in films like Batman Vs Superman before they released, the final product may not be worth following through on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 21, 2016, 01:32:39 AM
Developers are always interested in new systems, especially ones from veteran manufacturers. But just like we were interested in films like Batman Vs Superman before they released, the final product may not be worth following through on.

The unfortunate glass half is empty reality that is Nintendo and their 3rd party support.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 21, 2016, 01:40:37 AM
It's kind of like how a video game thread gets way more posts before the game releases than after it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 21, 2016, 11:53:52 PM
That's super true.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: sudoshuff on June 22, 2016, 02:43:56 PM
It's kind of like how a video game thread gets way more posts before the game releases than after it.


The Letter may be one exception to that rule.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 22, 2016, 04:15:38 PM
It's kind of like how a video game thread gets way more posts before the game releases than after it.


The Letter may be one exception to that rule.

Well, the Letter is the game of the generation, so it just makes sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on June 22, 2016, 06:28:29 PM
It's kind of like how a video game thread gets way more posts before the game releases than after it.

By then, everyone knows if it will suck or not based on the breakdown analysis of all the partial information given before the games release meaning no one has to actually buy or play the game and it experience it for themselves to see if that initial impression is right or not. After all, first impressions are always correct.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on June 22, 2016, 06:37:21 PM
However, in all honesty, because of the backlog of games I have, I rarely play games when they are released. In addition, because I then don't want the game spoiled, I'll often avoid the game thread after, and sometimes a bit before, the game's release. I don't know how many other users may have the same mindset as me but that may be part of why discussion trails off at the time of a game's release.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on June 22, 2016, 08:55:01 PM
The Letter is hilarious. I wouldn't let my nephew play Fatal Frame, but he did enjoy the **** out of The Letter. After he beat the game he was like "thats it?" I was like "yeah". After we were done playing The Letter we played fatal frame for 10 minutes. He started asking too many questions and I turned it off.

I still give the creator of the game accolades for being able to get the game on the eShop and making a buck. I still need to get my Nintendo developers license.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 22, 2016, 09:14:49 PM
Warner Bros sounds like it will support the NX.

Quote
GamesBeat: How do you start making decisions now about which of the new consoles to support? Microsoft’s already announced theirs. Nintendo is coming.

Haddad: We have great relationships with all the console platforms. We believe we play a role in each of them. What I saw with the announcements that were made at the show — I’m fairly bullish about he console cycle, about gamers spending time on them and finding great content, about publishers being able to find returns on increasing investments in that space. We’re constantly deciding how to navigate that, but supporting them is not a question for us.

http://venturebeat.com/2016/06/22/warner-bros-is-still-racing-ahead-on-internally-produced-console-and-pc-games/ (http://venturebeat.com/2016/06/22/warner-bros-is-still-racing-ahead-on-internally-produced-console-and-pc-games/)

More Lego for all!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on June 22, 2016, 09:59:39 PM
Lego is a given. What I want to know is where's, I dunno, the next Shadows of Mordor/Injustice 2/Mortal Kombat Next.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 23, 2016, 12:14:14 AM
Lego is a given. What I want to know is where's, I dunno, the next Shadows of Mordor/Injustice 2/Mortal Kombat Next.

Would you settle for a Shadows of Mordor with an unoptimized frame rate, an Injustice 2 with no DLC, and a Mortal Kombat Next with with sweat instead of blood?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on June 23, 2016, 01:00:09 AM
Lego is a given. What I want to know is where's, I dunno, the next Shadows of Mordor/Injustice 2/Mortal Kombat Next.

Would you settle for a Shadows of Mordor with an unoptimized frame rate, an Injustice 2 with no DLC, and a Mortal Kombat Next with with sweat instead of blood?

I'd take it.

I still think it's a shame that FarCry for the Wii got overlooked for it's horrible screen tearing issues, because it was hands-down the BEST launch FPS on the Wii.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 23, 2016, 01:30:09 AM
As a long time Red Steel fan, I have to buy Far Cry Wii now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on June 23, 2016, 01:38:43 AM
As a long time Red Steel fan, I have to buy Far Cry Wii now.

IT'S ABOUT TIME!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on June 23, 2016, 02:58:49 AM
Screen tearing? Is that a graphics issue?


How did it control? I might go check it out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 28, 2016, 12:12:55 AM
NX has a Lemon Lime Twist

http://gonintendo.com/stories/260297-miyamoto-teases-a-special-element-to-nx

Quote
"In terms of NX, there's an idea that we're working on. That's why we can't share anything at this point, and I don't want to comment on the other companies. If it was just a matter of following advancements in technology, things would be coming out a lot quicker."

In before Motion Controls with 3D and built-in double touch screens on the Wiimote.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on June 28, 2016, 10:46:24 AM
C'mon, people actually thought there wasn't going to be a gimmick controller...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 28, 2016, 11:03:23 AM
C'mon, people actually thought there wasn't going to be a gimmick controller...

Maybe the gimmick isn't in the controller. Maybe it's a hologram projector.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on June 28, 2016, 11:04:30 AM
Also, why doesn't the PS4 get flack for it's controller? It has a big fat gimmick touch pad right in the middle with a glowing light in the front. Is it because it's roughly the same size and shape as previous controllers?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on June 28, 2016, 11:14:19 AM
More or less. Most of the space it occupies was previously empty space on the previous Dual Shocks. I only notice it because of the terrible placement of the "options" button. Never really used the track pad thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on June 28, 2016, 09:47:49 PM
Track pad is more or less just the select button now, and options is start.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on June 28, 2016, 10:13:45 PM
Sounds like NX is definitely not VR?

Kimishima, in response to a question, said that Nintendo was researching VR and preparing the NX.  It was a response to a compound question, and the statements weren't that close, and I'm looking at a translation, and (insert RFN siren). . . But it sounded like separate statements.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on June 28, 2016, 11:13:01 PM
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on June 30, 2016, 06:09:10 PM
Also, why doesn't the PS4 get flack for it's controller? It has a big fat gimmick touch pad right in the middle with a glowing light in the front. Is it because it's roughly the same size and shape as previous controllers?

It's how it's marketed.  Nintendo's approach with the Wii and Wii U promotes the philosophy that the new videogame experiences that the new generation is going to provide you with are going to come from the features of the controller, instead of specs which are a generation behind the other consoles.  So the controller comes under much harsher scrutiny because it carries on these expectations and it's the tradeoff for better specs.  The PS4 controller is just a controller, expected to do the things controllers do and nothing more.  Maybe new experiences will be provided by controller features or improved specs or both.  Nintendo puts themselves in a situation where if the controller doesn't deliver, the whole console comes across as completely unnecessary and out-of-date.

I have no beef with the Wii U controller itself.  Unlike the Wii controller it has all the expected features plus some unique concepts.  It's the fact that the controller is the sole thing that makes it a "current" console that I find ridiculous.  If the Wii U had up-to-date specs and the Gamepad (and somehow didn't cost more than the PS4) then I would have no problem with its design.

Will the NX have a gimmick controller?  It's Nintendo so I would assume "yes".  If they had changed their tune then a game like Star Fox Zero wouldn't get made this close to the NX's release.  Unless that was Miyamoto getting his gimmick controls out of his system in one last hurrah before he can't do it anymore.  Nintendo seems to feel that they need something unique to make their product stand out (which actually shows a really lack of confidence in their own games.  Mario and Zelda need gimmicks?  They don't stand out by just being really good?).  I just hope it's more of the DS/3DS complimentary approach and not the Wii/Wii U tradeoff approach.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: sudoshuff on June 30, 2016, 11:50:41 PM
I just hope it's more of the DS/3DS complimentary approach and not the Wii/Wii U tradeoff approach.


This is why I took so well to the 3DS.  It was more powerful and the additional gimmick was totally optional, but also pretty cool when implemented well.  As it matured, developers (even Nintendo) got even better at designing for a 3D effect (Kirby Triple Deluxe, SM3DLand) and the handheld itself implemented it better with "super stable 3D".


Not sure how NX could mimic this.  Maybe a pretty standard controller with one little twist--like the analogue stick on N64 or the C-stick on Gamecube?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 19, 2016, 03:37:25 PM
Have you guys heard about these heart-rate monitor and/or VR rumors?

http://www.designntrend.com/articles/81022/20160719/nintendo-nx-spec-rumors-console-games-open-source-virtual-reality.htm

http://www.enstarz.com/articles/167397/20160719/nintendo-nx-news-updates-recent-leak-suggest-upcoming-console-focus.htm

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 19, 2016, 03:39:33 PM
Heart rate monitor? They're bringing back the Vitality Sensor?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 19, 2016, 03:44:54 PM
That all sounds very legit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 19, 2016, 04:24:46 PM
The thinking behind ideas like a heart rate monitor is just so damn crazy.  How many people in the world are going to be swayed into buying a console for something like that?  Is it even 10?  It's just such a minor feature.

But if Nintendo puts it in what are they taking out to accommodate it?  That's been their MO for over ten years now.  Neato gimmicks don't go in unless something else is sacrificed to accommodate it in order for the maintain an acceptable price point.  And there's the classic Wii and Wii U problem where important stuff gets compromised and cut in favour of novelties.  If you can put in heart rate nonsense essentially for free without impacting anything else, go for it.  They'll be like two games that use it and the novelty will have worn off by year two but there's no harm.  But that's not been the trend with Nintendo.  And how much does an idea like this improve games?  Is it going to improve games more than better specs would?  Is the experience of owning the console going to be better if Nintendo neglects on important stuff like storage or online support to focus on gimmicks?  How would potentially poor third party support affect the experience?

That's what I feel Nintendo failed to realize with the Wii U and I fear that they will do again with the NX.  They get this tunnel vision on some novelty and don't take into account the overall impact of the tradeoffs needed to accommodate it and then they scratch their heads when their very flawed product fails to sell.  It's because it turns into tradeoffs vs. gimmick.  The Gamepad vs. weaker specs and all the flaws that come with it.  And I don't want to become heart rate monitor vs. a bunch of compromises and tradeoffs.  Maybe this rumour is all nonsense but the approach for designing a console should take into account the whole package.  Cool little novelty features aren't worth anything if important stuff has to be compromised.  It's focusing on the garnish at the side of the plate over the main course.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on July 19, 2016, 07:32:13 PM
Just taking the temperature of the room here... neither Sony or Microsoft is trotting out the dogs and ponies at Gamescom this year. They have booths, but no live conferences.

There's no way Nintendo would debut a new system in their weakest market, is there?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 19, 2016, 07:59:35 PM
I don't really expect Nintendo to debut the NX at a public event.  I figure they'll have something like a direct.  It's more their style as of late.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 19, 2016, 08:15:46 PM
The besieged king of Ubisoft, Yves Guillemot, has mentioned the NX. Growing the market, bringing back casuals? Sounds like Wii 2017, or Pokemon Go in hardware form?

Quote
“On the NX, what we have seen is really great, so we think having a new machine coming is going to help the industry to continue to grow and to take lots more casual players back in the industry.”

http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/07/19/ubisoft-ceo-talks-nintendo-nx-what-we-have-seen-is-really-great-really-excited-about-new-xbox/ (http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/07/19/ubisoft-ceo-talks-nintendo-nx-what-we-have-seen-is-really-great-really-excited-about-new-xbox/)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 19, 2016, 09:13:46 PM
The thinking behind ideas like a heart rate monitor is just so damn crazy.  How many people in the world are going to be swayed into buying a console for something like that?  Is it even 10?  It's just such a minor feature.
Is there any reason to believe that would be the major selling point of NX and not, you know, just an extra thing it has?
Quote
If you can put in heart rate nonsense essentially for free without impacting anything else, go for it.
I like how we don't even know what it is, if it's even implemented into the hardware, or how it relates to games and you're already calling it nonsense. Fine.
Quote
The Gamepad vs. weaker specs and all the flaws that come with it.
This literally did not happen. It was Gamepad vs. nothing. Nintendo raised the price to accommodate the Gamepad. We wouldn't have gotten $80 worth of better hardware. Nintendo would have sold a $250 box which may or may not have helped it sell better. Considering Wii U's greatest sin was its lack of software, a lower price tag would have helped it sell better but still not well.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on July 19, 2016, 11:18:51 PM
Just taking the temperature of the room here... neither Sony or Microsoft is trotting out the dogs and ponies at Gamescom this year. They have booths, but no live conferences.

There's no way Nintendo would debut a new system in their weakest market, is there?

On the one hand, Nintendo is riding on a lot of momentum right now.  Pokemon Go is a powerhouse, and the NES Mini is getting people's attention.  A lot of eyes are on them right now.

On the other hand, how long can Nintendo ride this momentum?  The system is due in March, Gamescon is in August.  That's 7 months.  In the meantime, the NES mini will launch, Johto Pokemon for Go (probably?), and Pokemon (bd)SM.

But then, what else would they show?  More details on the mini? amiibo that are long overdue? those two Wii U games they have left? the vitality sensor?  Maybe a tease and a showing at TGS? That's what I'm thinking.

Edit: sentence fragments
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 20, 2016, 12:17:01 AM
Everything is so quiet at this point that I think there's going to be a major "tea table flip" when the NX is finally revealed, possibly on the level of the Gamecube--->Wii shakeup. It's maybe the most interesting (potential) thing in the industry right now!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 20, 2016, 04:39:39 PM
Any talk about casual gamers in relation to the NX is an obvious turn-off for me.  Somehow I can see Nintendo thinking they were targeting the hardcore gamers with the Wii U and it didn't work so they should double-down on the casuals with the NX.  I really am not interested in the NX growing the industry or attracting casual players - I just want a competent console with both Nintendo games and strong third party support.

As for Pokémon Go and the NES Mini helping build momentum for the NX, I don't know if they will.  Ideally Nintendo would love it if people being introduced to or re-acquainted with Pokémon by Go will end up transitioning to the "real" Pokémon games on the 3DS and its successor (which might be the NX depending on what it is).  But that was the dream with the Wii.  All those new customers that were on board for Wii Sports and Wii Fit were supposed to "graduate" to the other deeper Nintendo games.  Wii Sports fan today - Zelda fan tomorrow.  But that didn't happen.  They played their handful of Wii Series casual titles and then never bought anything else or transitioned to the Wii U.

The theory is that these people are merely intimidated by the appearance of how complex videogames appear and would like videogames in general if they had the right title to introduce them to gaming.  That's not how it actually works.  It turns out the simple design of the "beginner" game is all they really need to be content until they get bored and find something else to do.  There is no interest in going from something one-dimensional like Wii Sports to something more complicated and deep like Zelda.  They're all fine with sticking with the simple design and will move from one simple game to another but not "up" to anything more.  So odds are a lot of the Pokémon Go players are content with Pokémon Go and they don't have any desire to move to the complexity of the proper Pokémon games.  The rest of the Go players would be Pokémon fans that already own the proper games and will continue to do so.

And it makes sense that this doesn't happen because it doesn't happen with anything else.  Do you know that many people that listen to pop music that "graduate" to more challenging stuff or do they just like pop and stick with it?  Or how about people that go see dumbed down blockbusters and then move on to arty dramas?  Is McDonald's the gateway to fine dining?  No.  There are lowest-common denominators that people embrace and stick with.  The thing is the sort of person that wants to play a more complicated and deep videogame didn't need some casual game to hook them in.  The very concept of videogames intrigued them from the start.  So Pokémon Go is not going to result in a bunch of new Nintendo customers.  But if it creates good buzz for Nintendo then maybe they can use that to create hype with gamers or convince third parties that the NX will be a success and they should make games for it.  I don't think the Go success will transition to console success but that doesn't mean Nintendo can't convince third parties that it will.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 20, 2016, 05:51:30 PM
It's possible to both appeal to casual players and have a console that ticks off all the boxes for people like us at the same time. Look at the DS, or the PS2.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 20, 2016, 07:02:51 PM
I wonder if we will see a difference in what casual means to Nintendo. Casuals play Pokemon Go, casuals are the target market for the NES box this Christmas. Those seem to be a different flavor than Wii Sports or Wii Fit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 20, 2016, 07:37:36 PM
NX will be an Xbox One S with an NES Classic plugged into the HDMI Input on it. Confirmed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on July 20, 2016, 09:28:26 PM
It's possible to both appeal to casual players and have a console that ticks off all the boxes for people like us at the same time. Look at the DS, or the PS2.

Both ancient, pre-iPhone machines.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on July 20, 2016, 09:32:49 PM
It's possible to both appeal to casual players and have a console that ticks off all the boxes for people like us at the same time. Look at the DS, or the PS2.

Both ancient, pre-iPhone machines.

The market isn't as broad as it was before smartphones, but I think there's still a significant audience of casual players who are open to buying dedicated gaming hardware. If anything, the iPhone cutting off a chunk of that market actually makes it easier to design something that appeals to both casuals and more dedicated players.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 20, 2016, 11:55:25 PM
Quality of Life tidbit, does this go under NX? Who knows!

Quote
...improve their QOL in a fun manner by making sleep and fatigue status visible and offering various services based on this information.
What does this even mean? 'You look tired, there is a day spa five miles from your house' ?

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/07/nintendo_reconfirms_march_2017_nx_launch_and_quality_of_life_concept_development
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 21, 2016, 11:14:43 AM
As for Pokémon Go and the NES Mini helping build momentum for the NX, I don't know if they will.  Ideally Nintendo would love it if people being introduced to or re-acquainted with Pokémon by Go will end up transitioning to the "real" Pokémon games on the 3DS and its successor (which might be the NX depending on what it is).  But that was the dream with the Wii.  All those new customers that were on board for Wii Sports and Wii Fit were supposed to "graduate" to the other deeper Nintendo games.  Wii Sports fan today - Zelda fan tomorrow.  But that didn't happen.  They played their handful of Wii Series casual titles and then never bought anything else or transitioned to the Wii U.

The theory is that these people are merely intimidated by the appearance of how complex videogames appear and would like videogames in general if they had the right title to introduce them to gaming.  That's not how it actually works.  It turns out the simple design of the "beginner" game is all they really need to be content until they get bored and find something else to do.  There is no interest in going from something one-dimensional like Wii Sports to something more complicated and deep like Zelda.  They're all fine with sticking with the simple design and will move from one simple game to another but not "up" to anything more.  So odds are a lot of the Pokémon Go players are content with Pokémon Go and they don't have any desire to move to the complexity of the proper Pokémon games.  The rest of the Go players would be Pokémon fans that already own the proper games and will continue to do so.


That's an oversimplification, though, because I do know a lot of people who got into PC gaming by being exposed to WoW, The Sims, or similar. While these same people didn't necessarily "graduate" to high fidelity games (ie. graphically intense FPS games that require cutting edge hardware), they most certainly bought every expansion pack and invested gobs of time into their games. I've already been thinking about how Nintendo could possibly want to build a bridge from Pokemon Go to NX, but I maybe giving them too much credit. I think it can be done in a very popular way that gives incentive to own an NX without hurting the mobile experience. They will not get every GO player, but I'm seeing a lot of addicted players right now who don't fit the Nintendo playing stereotype, and those are the gamers Nintendo ought to go after. Nintendo has hopefully been working with Niantic regarding an NX app (something that is an expansion and not the exact same mobile app, etc). I would hope to see it day-1, free to play, etc.


Beyond that, one shouldn't expect to see an influx of millions of people buying up NX solely because of Pokemon GO. There just are a lot of people who are playing GO because someone else is playing it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on July 21, 2016, 01:12:51 PM
If people who get into the Sims and WoW are only buying expansions, then that speaks more to Ian's point than yours.  Nintendo could expand Pokemon Go and cash in some more, but that still doesn't necessarily translate to hardware sales.

Still, I think Nintendo should be able to parlay the good press into something.  They've got everyone's attention again, they just gotta wow people.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on July 21, 2016, 02:35:30 PM
It is simply not true that the folks that bought a Wii for WiiSports didn't "graduate" to more traditional or more complicated games. They absolutely did. They all bought NSMBWii for a start. And Guitar Hero was best selling on Wii over other consoles and that is one complicated-ass game. The attach rate for Wii was quite good as I recall.
But, yeah, smartphones.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 21, 2016, 04:07:27 PM
If people who get into the Sims and WoW are only buying expansions, then that speaks more to Ian's point than yours.  Nintendo could expand Pokemon Go and cash in some more, but that still doesn't necessarily translate to hardware sales.

Still, I think Nintendo should be able to parlay the good press into something.  They've got everyone's attention again, they just gotta wow people.

I think it could translate to hardware sales. Over the lifespan of those games, the expansions eventually required hardware upgrades (although modest ones) to continue. I think my point still stands that people who are not traditional PC gamers buy the hardware to play those games. Some people keep a decent laptop just for the purpose of playing one game.


Ian's point was that people who are only intersted in playing Pokemon Go wouldn't buy an NX because they won't graduate to more complicated games. They don't need to graduate to more complicated games to buy more hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 21, 2016, 04:14:31 PM
It is simply not true that the folks that bought a Wii for WiiSports didn't "graduate" to more traditional or more complicated games. They absolutely did. They all bought NSMBWii for a start. And Guitar Hero was best selling on Wii over other consoles and that is one complicated-ass game. The attach rate for Wii was quite good as I recall.
But, yeah, smartphones.
Yep, most of Nintendo's known franchises had their best selling games on the Wii, including Mario Kart, 2D Mario, Smash Bros, etc.  There was a good attach rate for the Wii.  Maybe not at first, but once people started seeing other things they could do, they started buying other games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on July 21, 2016, 04:50:36 PM
Hasn't Nintendo stated that Pokemon Go will work with Sun/Moon? This could lay the groundwork for some more advanced connections with NX titles. Imagine a game like the Wiiware Pokemon Farm game where you could store pokemon there, or the online Box subscription services.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on July 21, 2016, 05:03:11 PM
Average Number of Games Sold Per Console
https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/sales/hard_soft/index.html


NES = 8.08 Games
Game Boy = 4.22 Games
SNES = 7.72 Games
Nintendo 64 = 6.83 Games
Game Boy Advance = 4.63 Games
Game Cube = 9.59 Games
DS = 6.16 Games
Wii = 9 Games
3DS = 4.66 Games
Wii U = 6.57 Games

Low attach rate for handhelds can be attributed to the fact that handhelds are usually upgraded or can be lost or damaged.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 21, 2016, 06:18:33 PM
I am mostly shocked that the Wii had such a high attach rate. In looking at the SNES, I would think that its higher install base at least factored into the lower attach rate, but then I also know that the price of games was absolutely absurd and game renting/sharing was huge. By comparison, the Wii had a bigger install base and a higher attach rate, which is just mind boggling.

The thing I find fascinating about the Wii is that while I own a lot of games for it, I hate the system. I won't even play Wii games on my Wii U. The games mostly hurt my eyes with jaggies and then there's the Wiimote. Blah. /rant
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 21, 2016, 09:42:00 PM
I am mostly shocked that the Wii had such a high attach rate. In looking at the SNES, I would think that its higher install base at least factored into the lower attach rate, but then I also know that the price of games was absolutely absurd and game renting/sharing was huge. By comparison, the Wii had a bigger install base and a higher attach rate, which is just mind boggling.

The Wii was a cultural phenomenon with an insane amount of must own titles for kids and families during most of that time.  Between 2006 to 2010, the Wii had a complete monopoly over the family market since Microsoft and Sony were busy burning all their money on the 18-32 male dudebro crowd during this time.  Not hard to imagine the average Wii household having 9 games since it had a wide variety of games that appealed to not only the kids but also their parents as well.

That's why the Wii despite having a larger install base also has a higher attachment rate then the SNES because it was a system that successfully appeal to the parents as well as the kids.  Yes there were parents that played older Nintendo systems as well but no where close to the mass appeal the Wii was offering.  It also helps that a lot of parents who bought Wii's for their kids were probably kids during the NES/SNES era as well so that's where Nintendo's nostalgia is pretty handy.  Hell, that was one of the big selling point for NSMB Wii showing how parents who grew up playing 2D Mario can now play with their kids at the same time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on July 21, 2016, 10:49:14 PM
I would also attribute the low attach rate for handhelds to all of the little tykes whom were bought one system with one game as more of a toy than an actual console intended to have a collection of games.


I am still surprised how many toddlers (1-4 year olds) I have seen with a DSi, DSiXL, 3DS, or New 3DS and it seems a lot of them have one game, like a Mario or Lego title.


I'd never buy a kid that young their own $100+ device like that because they tend to lose or break them much more easily.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 22, 2016, 11:50:44 AM
I'm going to assume that attach rate would take into consideration all games including VC titles.  Old consoles like the SNES didn't have any cheap games.  A modern gaming system can have cheap digital titles that only cost a few bucks so that would contribute to a higher attach rate.  During the cartridge years there weren't even "greatest hits" discount lines and no cheap bin at Wal-Mart.  When every game costs a fair amount you're going to buy less.

And of course last gen lasted longer than other gens before it.  The PS3 and X360 probably have really skewered attach rates due to how long they were on the market.  If you're buying games over seven or eight years versus five then, yeah, you're going to end up owning more games for that system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: rlse9 on July 22, 2016, 02:07:49 PM
I'm curious how much of the 9 game attach rate is first party games?  And it's a good question how virtual console/WiiWare/eShop figure into to these numbers.  And do they include pack in games in their software sales or not?  That would skew the numbers between consoles.  I also wonder how the attach rates of PS3/XB360 compare.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 22, 2016, 02:26:35 PM
I'm pretty sure it includes pack in numbers.  I highly doubt it includes digital games, or at least ones that weren't announced directly by the makers of the games.  Nintendo rarely let anyone know how many VC games were being sold.  Maybe Wiiware is included but I also highly doubt that.  Only this month did US game tracking data start including digital sales on PSN & XBL.  They weren't tracking those numbers during the Wii/PS3/X360 years.


Actually, I take some of this back.  Since it's Nintendo putting this number out there, it could very well include digital sales.  I wonder what NPD would put as the attach rates on each system.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 22, 2016, 02:53:31 PM
I looked closer and based on the area breakdown, they only include digital downloads of disc based software on the Wii U and card based softward on the 3DS.  So I don't think they include digital sales on any of those other numbers.  Wii software is discs sold at retail and so on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on July 22, 2016, 08:16:04 PM
3rd Party Published Games Compared to 1st Party (Excludes Download Games like Virtual Console or Wiiware)
https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/library/historical_data/pdf/number_of_titles_e1603.pdf (https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/library/historical_data/pdf/number_of_titles_e1603.pdf)

Famicom JP 1st Party 49, 3rd Party 998
Famicom Disk System JP 1st Party 42, 3rd Party 187
NES US 1st Party 72, 3rd Party 607

Game Boy JP 1st Party 63, 3rd Party 1182
Game Boy US 1st Party 106, 3rd Party 859

Super Famicom JP 1st Party 30, 3rd Party 1369
SNES US 1st Party 52, 3rd Party 667

N64 JP 1st Party 43, 3rd Party 153
N64 US 1st Party 53, 3rd Party 244

GBA JP 1st Party 107, 3rd Party 679
GBA US 1st Party 71, 3rd Party 950

Game Cube JP 1st Party 55, 3rd Party 220
Game Cube US 1st Party 48, 3rd Party 504

DS JP 1st Party 132, 3rd Party 1713
DS US 1st Party 98, 3rd Party 1639

Wii JP 1st Party 76, 3rd Party 387
Wii US 1st Party 55, 3rd Party 1206

3DS JP 1st Party 62, 3rd Party 472
3DS US 1st Party 66, 3rd Party 344

Wii U JP
1st Party 35, 3rd Party 67
Wii U US
1st Party 36, 3rd Party 114
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on July 22, 2016, 08:38:26 PM
Also, the first system to get a Player's Choice line was the Super Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on July 23, 2016, 03:07:59 PM
Also, the first system to get a Player's Choice line was the Super Nintendo.
What was the price of those titles? I remember them still being $40, though I'm not certain. I'm pretty sure they were still more than the $20 or less titles of today, and there is also inflation to consider.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stratos on July 23, 2016, 04:17:50 PM
$35 is stuck in my mind, though the price may have varied depending on the game since game prices hadn't quite standardized by that point. Star Fox w/ Super FX Chip may have cost more than other games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 23, 2016, 05:18:23 PM
I recall $30. I bought Sim City when it went player's choice. I also recall feeling like that was such a steep price for a game that had been out for years. Sim City 2000 was already out for PC, etc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on July 24, 2016, 10:57:36 AM
The oldest players choice price I remember is the N64 players choice games which started at $39.99.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Luigi Dude on July 26, 2016, 09:51:20 AM
So according to Eurogamers sources the NX is basically the hybrid console people have talked about for years.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-26-nx-is-a-portable-console-with-detachable-controllers (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-26-nx-is-a-portable-console-with-detachable-controllers)


It's a handheld that can be docked to the TV.  If true that would certainly be a ballsy move on Nintendo's part.  I guess they feel that having only one system to develop for will outdo the risk of losing 2 different forms of revenue from handheld and home console.

Of course on the other hand if true this would make Breath of the Wild even bigger then ever.  Being able to play something like that on your TV and then taking it to work or wherever else can be a huge selling point.  Basically a way more successful version of what Sony tried with the PSP/Vita since the NX is just one system so it's easier to advertise.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on July 26, 2016, 10:08:13 AM
So according to Eurogamers sources the NX is basically the hybrid console people have talked about for years.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-26-nx-is-a-portable-console-with-detachable-controllers (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-26-nx-is-a-portable-console-with-detachable-controllers)


It's a handheld that can be docked to the TV.  If true that would certainly be a ballsy move on Nintendo's part.  I guess they feel that having only one system to develop for will outdo the risk of losing 2 different forms of revenue from handheld and home console.

Of course on the other hand if true this would make Breath of the Wild even bigger then ever.  Being able to play something like that on your TV and then taking it to work or wherever else can be a huge selling point.  Basically a way more successful version of what Sony tried with the PSP/Vita since the NX is just one system so it's easier to advertise.




Even down to the docking station I called this! I'm not sure I like the X1 chip as it's vastly underpowered compared to XB1/PS4. Maybe Nintendo can work it's magic and get it to almost XB1 levels but even then...well let's see what its got in terms of games.




OH **** WHAT IF IT HAS GPS BUILT IN?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 26, 2016, 10:25:38 AM
Welp, zero 3rd party support confirmed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 26, 2016, 10:48:39 AM
Welp, zero 3rd party support confirmed.

Silver lining: maybe NX can get Vita ports of Japanese games such as Gal*Gun 2!

Kidding aside, yeah, I'm okay with this. I mean, a Reverse-Wii-U is basically a Nvidia Shield, right? Or almost. It is a huge bummer for those that really wanted another home console and backwards compatibility. (Assuming this latest rumor will all be true.)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 26, 2016, 11:08:57 AM
Also, can someone explain where the console part of this hybrid is? All this rumor seems to be pointing at is a handheld that can display your games on TV. If this is the NX handheld then yeah, no big deal. But if this is also the home console then I have some serious reservations about this piece of hardware.

Nvidia Tegra deep-dive.
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-nintendo-nx-mobile-games-machine-powered-by-nvidia-tegra

Quote
Right now, [Nintendo] is simply not interested in providing hardware that directly competes with PlayStation 4 and Xbox One. It has its own ideas on where to take next-gen gaming.

Quote
And the compromise there is clear - a relatively lower level of performance compared to the existing current-gen machines. Nvidia's Tegra technology is built with a specific profile in mind: a delicate balance between performance and power efficiency in order to maintain battery life, the life force of mobile gaming.

Quote
But just how powerful is the NX relatively? In terms of the capabilities of Tegra X1, consider this: Doom BFG Edition on Xbox 360 and PS3 runs at 720p60 with frame-rate drops. The same game running on the Shield Android TV micro-console, based on X1, hands in a near-flawless 1080p60 presentation. Trine 2 - another 720p30 game on Sony and Microsoft's last-gen consoles - operates at 1080p30 on Tegra X1. Typically speaking, OpenGL games port really well to Tegra X1, while DirectX ports, like Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance and the recently released Resident Evil 5, aren't so impressive.

There's direct comparisons with Vita and PS360 games. That's not what I want from my home console experience. Not when I may or may not be having to also upgrade my PS4 at the same time. I hope this rumor is crap.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 26, 2016, 02:59:45 PM
Fascinating and juicy rumors!

Keep in mind, nintendo trademarked a supplemental computing device http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/04/nintendos_supplemental_computing_device_patent_is_cleared_for_completion (http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/04/nintendos_supplemental_computing_device_patent_is_cleared_for_completion)

I could see a deluxe bundle that comes with a 'horsepower' base that will give more juice to the system.


Also, the Tegra isn't a wimpy chimp. Remember it is designed to output to 4k and can run UE4.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 26, 2016, 04:15:16 PM
When I think the hybrid concept I feel the selling point is "it's a console that's also a handheld!"  This rumour sounds more like "it's a handheld that's also a console" and there is a subtle but very crucial difference in that.  No one would think of the Gameboy Player or the PS TV as a "console" and this sounds more like that or how certain models of the PSP had a TV out.

What games is this going to get?  If it's getting PS4/XB1 ports that are indistinguishable from those versions then this is a console.  If it's getting the sort of games the 3DS or Vita get but blown up on a TV screen then it's a handheld.  The marketing and the types of games Nintendo brings early on will have a major impact on how this is seen.  A handheld that connects to a TV is a convenience, not a suitable replacement for a console.  And if it's seen as a handheld then it will probably not sell as well in the West as a well-designed console would since handhelds are losing ground to phones.

The hybrid concept is a console that's also portable or has some way to make at least part of that experience portable, like with scaled down visuals or something like that.  It is not a handheld with a TV out.  One concept sounds like a license to print money and the other sounds like Nintendo quitting the console market.

I think Sony and MS going with these half-step improved consoles really has derailed Nintendo's plan.  If this was XB1 sort of hardware and there was still years to go before the current consoles get replaced this would be a pretty good idea but now it seems a lot like the Wii U where Nintendo catches up to everyone else right before they go to the next step.  XB1 specs NOW is embarrassingly out-of-date.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on July 26, 2016, 04:18:42 PM
YAY I LIKE RUMOURS!
But I'll believe it when I see it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 26, 2016, 04:54:15 PM
Not ready to believe this as is. I'm still of the belief that NX isn't a simple hybrid, and that there's a console component to it that isn't the docking station. On at least two occasions, AMD practically outed Nintendo as a partner on one of three semi-conductor wins (Project Scorpio was recently revealed as one).

I think there's a place for a handheld that connects to a TV even alongside a full-blown console particularly if they play the same games. I'm skeptical of the detachable controller though. It sounds great on paper, but the reality of it is that the pieces can be left behind, lost, or more easily broken. Detachable controllers complicate the least complicated gaming hardware by adding parts to a self-contained unit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 26, 2016, 05:50:40 PM
Dang. Like I said a bit ago, I figured they'd blow something up with the NX, and that people were delusional if they thought Nintendo was pumping out a heavy specced PS4 clone. But I really believed the hybrid theory was bunk, given the direct denials. I'm with Adrock, though, in that I suspect there's more to the story here, and that detachable controller pieces on a portable device is probably too awful an idea to be the case.

There is a rumor percolating on Twitter that there's a separate console-only SKU that would more closely match some of the rumors about computing power from earlier in the year, but there's not a whiff of that in the Eurogamer report.

But as for Iansane's point about it being a handheld with a TV out, the unit is supposed to be several times stronger than the WiiU, so it would be capable of running good-looking full 3D games, making this more of a semantics issue than anything. Though I am still of the camp who doesn't see the appeal in playing full 3D console games on the go. But hey, I guess you could never take it out of the house and it would functionally just be off-TV play over again (provided the screen is big enough).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on July 26, 2016, 06:48:20 PM
I'm highly skeptical about this hybrid concept being true. I recognize there are signs that definitely point to this possibility but I just think the components and tech to make a handheld even a bit more powerful than Wii U would be too pricy for Nintendo to consider not to mention I see it going against their handheld philosophy of long lasting battery power. (Although the 3DS was already a sign of this with a much shorter battery life than the DS and GB line.)

I don't see them programming games to run in HD when you've plugged it into the home docking port and it becomes a console and then running at a lower definition if playing on the go. Since we know there are a couple of HD games coming to the NX like Zelda and Project Sonic 2017, it's got to have better graphic capabilities than the Wii U not less. So, to have an HD console you can play on the go as a handheld feels pricy to me when considering Nintendo's history.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 26, 2016, 06:51:50 PM
Devkits allegedly have X1 chips, if this is true, then it's completely possible that the actual system could have an X2 instead. Having said that, at least the X1 is more powerful than the Wii U, but it doesn't compare to the Xbone or PS4 - other than native 4K resolution. It would need a big boost in VRAM to output games at 4K though...which is also completely within the realm of possibility.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 26, 2016, 08:47:50 PM
Remember the little screen you could buy and attach to the ps one? Maybe it's a portable in that sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 26, 2016, 10:33:55 PM
Digital Foundry's deep dive on the NX rumors.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 27, 2016, 01:37:03 AM
The question of whether it's a portable that can go home console, or a home console that can go portable, does sound like a weird semantic toss-up to me. I assume the real concern behind the thinking is whether we'll get significant console-style ports from other platforms beyond what Nintendo's gotten in the past. That's got to do more with the controller inputs and porting difficulty, I think.

(As an aside, would we assume that the NX would inherit all the third-party support that the 3DS has received? Because that'd be pretty awesome in my book and at least a START on rehabilitating third-party presence on Nintendo "consoles"!)

One exciting thing is that Nintendo's finally getting off the PowerPC architecture that they've been on since the GC. If true that they're getting on Nvidia's Tegra line, then it's sounding like they're really finally on something designed for modern graphics tech. The Tegra X1 is 4K capable, runs UE4, and is even ostensibly future-proofed enough for Vulkan. Sure the typical thinking for how to get to modern hardware would be to jump to an x86 AMD chipset, but ARM chips are all over the place too, especially in the mobile space that's seeing plenty of activity and competition to drive up performance and adoption and simultaneously drive down price.

One worry that I've been wrestling with in regards to the Tegra X1 talk though is that great as the Tegra chip sounds, it doesn't seem to make it to XBox One power. It's definitely above 360, and above Wii U, and that DOES put it in Nintendo's traditional target power target (Take last gen and multiply by anywhere from 1.2 to 2). However, if the great power console hope of 2+ Tera Flops is to be realized, then what we're talking about here with the eurogamer stuff has got to either be:

1. only the Mobile form of NX, with a Beefier Console NX still hidden from sight, or
2. just the initial dev hardware, with a Beefier Tegra X2 chip to be used in the real thing, or
3. that supplemental computing device talk is true and the dock for this will magically make it beefier, so players who want that experience can pay extra above the base mobile unit to get it

Possibilities 1 or 3 sound more fruitful to me.

Option 4 would be Nintendo's path of least resistance though: The Tegra X1 gets the GC->Wii treatment and is tweaked and overclocked and improved, but not at the same scale that other companies leap up. Taken on its own merits, it will be the most powerful Nintendo hardware created, be capable of amazing visuals, and have modern features, but it would definitely not be your 4K TV showstopper demonstration piece.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 27, 2016, 01:42:10 AM
Couple more random musings:

I'm definitely gonna have to budget for accessories at launch time for this. An NX sleeve, yes, but also a portable battery pack to ensure this thing has life on the go!

Being random here, but would totally love for Nintendo to do something with cellular networks. 2G is pretty withered tech, and since withered tech is Nintendo's modus operandi, maybe they find a way to use dirt-cheap 2G connectivity to drive asynchronous networked gaming...

...same goes for GPS now that the entire world has been awakened to the power of Pokemon Go.

I saw a mockup someone did of holding what this might look like in Portrait orientation. Is it the return of my beloved DS "Book" mode? AHHH! One of my pet dreams is Nintendo teaming up with Kobo and throwing an E-Reader App on this thing!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 27, 2016, 03:27:24 AM
Mad thought:
Hey, maybe both rumor trains are true.
There is a NX Portable that is a Nvidia Tegra machine and a NX Home that is an AMD SoC console. The rumors have been a double blind all along!

And whatever the NX OS and API is, it's some Open GL thing that makes Team Green and Team Red play nice with each other. Ah, that would be such a crazy thing that only Nintendo can make happen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 27, 2016, 04:08:29 AM
The rumors have been a double blind all along!

That would be mind blowing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on July 27, 2016, 06:27:05 AM
I imagine the NX will be more like a platform/library/store.

There will be an NX console, and an NX handheld. The handheld is nvidea tegra, the console is essentially a ps4 in Nintendo's clothing. You buy them separately, but the games are compatable with both. The system mainly relies on cartridges, but the home console has a disc slot. The console home console comes in 2 forms backwards compatible and not. The backwards compatible one can play everything from wii u to gamecube. It's $100 more expensive.
The regular console doesn't have a disc slot. Just a small cart slot. It comes with a regular controller, the controller is kinda like the wii u pro controller, but there is something special/new about the shoulder buttons.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 27, 2016, 10:30:54 AM
No way Nintendo has deals with both Nvidia and AMD.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 27, 2016, 11:26:50 AM
And that would makeno sense. Completely different CPU architecture.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on July 27, 2016, 12:10:03 PM
Another dream deferred.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 27, 2016, 03:38:02 PM
The part I'm skeptical of most is Nvidia's involvement. The first time Nvidia was even rumored was a couple months ago while AMD has been heavily linked to NX since late 2014. That doesn't mean I'm dismissing Nvidia outright. However, I remain skeptical. I'm siding with AMD until given more than just Eurogamer to base this on. I generally trust Eurogamer; it's just that every outlet seems to be using Eurogamer as the source for this.

I still expect a full-blown dedicated console even if the handheld launches first and is Nintendo's main focus. One may ask why even bother releasing the dedicated console if the handheld can connect to a TV, and the answer is simple: native 1080p. There's a market for that. This strategy allows Nintendo to pitch products to high and low end users.

And sure, the handheld can be ARM while the console can be x86, but not if they're meant to play the same games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on July 27, 2016, 04:58:09 PM
This think-piece at NintendoLife (http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/07/talking_point_nintendo_nx_deal_is_a_vindication_of_nvidias_shield_program) states it too have separately confirmed the Nvidia rumor.
Quote
Many assumed that the NX would follow suit and harness AMD silicon, but yesterday's reports (http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/07/video_digital_foundry_breaks_down_details_on_nintendo_nx_and_nvidias_tegra_technology) - which through our own snooping we've since discovered to be pretty watertight - now point to an Nvidia Tegra chipset being at the heart of Nintendo's new hardware
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on July 27, 2016, 06:18:39 PM
I like the idea tossed around that the handheld can plug into a "console dock" to play on a TV with added power. I think I could get on board with that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 27, 2016, 06:50:06 PM
I don't get why everyone is treating this like it's only coming from Emily Rogers. A lot of sites are corraborating this with what they claim as multiple of their own sources, which they SHOULD be doing (multiple sources). There's the possibility someones playing an elaborate shell game and making one source look like many independent ones, but if so that'd reflect poorly on all these larger sites jumping into the fray.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on July 27, 2016, 07:48:14 PM
Do they deserve that trust? I've walked a lonely road down a Boulevard of Broken Megaton Dreams long enough to be skeptical. 32gb cartridges do sound delicious, however.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 27, 2016, 10:47:32 PM
I'm trying to be skeptical. I refuse to believe Nintendo looked at the Vita and was like "yeah, let's do that."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on July 27, 2016, 11:41:30 PM
I want stacks and stacks of gray rectangular cassettes on my coffee table again! I want to pull one out of my jacket, slap it down, and say are you ready to play instead of fumbling around with a dumb cd.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 27, 2016, 11:43:38 PM
Well, if you distrust videogame outlets (reasonably), The Wall Street Journal chimed in and basically backed everything up. So I think we're pretty much looking at the first flush of the NX, with the exact power level TBD as well as the possibility of a non-portable unit (that wouldn't play different software and thus would be in the same ballpark).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 28, 2016, 12:16:31 AM
At this point, I'm generally not willing to trust any outlet until Nintendo officially announces something, not even merely comments. Even then, that gets hazy (e.g. Zelda Wii U in 2015). I'm too lazy to dig up old posts, but there was tons of evidence to support Nintendo not going this route (which still may come to pass). Iwata said NX wasn't a hybrid, but Nintendo as a whole is notorious for playing with semantics to just not understanding it at all. For example, Yoshio Sakamoto once said Metroid: Other M is "more than just a collaborative effort — it's one group working toward a common goal." So, you know, a collaborative effort..............
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 28, 2016, 01:57:08 AM
Lol
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 28, 2016, 02:16:48 AM
AMD doesn't have a good portable chip in their line up (as far as I know). Nintendo still needs a portable console, if only to stubbornly think that Japan hasn't been completely taken over by mobage.

If you want the best portable chip, it has to be ARM. And who would you go to for a deal on an ARM chip? Samsung has its hands full. Qualcomm has their Snapdragon in a bunch of things. And then you have Nvidia with their Tegra line in the back of the ARM pack, hungry to make a big move and a big chip buy.

In my head of mad thoughts:
AMD is desperate to make long-lasting deals to stay afloat. Nvdia is hungry to be a bigger beast in the ARM race. It is not so far-fetched that Nintendo can hash out a deal with both of these companies at once.

My response to the difficulty of the different chip architectures is an impulsive thought that even I think is a bit too stupid crazy:
Maybe Nintendo is getting AMD to do an ARM-derivative of the AMD SoC? Now I can get a dozen computer engineers to say that's the most improbable thing to think of. Of how you can't lop off a x86 CPU core with an ARM one willy nilly.

This spitball has shot past the moon and in to the sun!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 28, 2016, 08:45:55 AM
There's simply no way that's happening. NX has been outed, it's a handheld with a dock for TV play. It will be Tegra-only, supporting two different CPU architectures means making games twice means two different systems means it's not the NX. AMD has Microsoft and Sony, they'll be fine.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 28, 2016, 08:54:56 AM
AMD has been working on ARM to enter that race, but it's no where near where Nvidia is currently. This current rumor lines up with the SemiAccurate rumor in May. The important bits were:

1. Nvidia downplayed profit margins from consoles, but it was butthurt by losing console contracts from Sony and Microsoft to AMD.
2. Considering Nvidia was looking to sell rather than Nintendo looking to buy, it's believed Nintendo made off very well in that deal. SemiAccurate was told that Nvidia promised software, support, and the kitchen sink at a very low cost just to get Nintendo's business.
3. Neither generation nor process node were discussed.
4. Home console was not discussed.

That looks like a great deal for Nintendo because that's exactly what Nintendo goes for. Was this rumor tailored to fit Nintendo? Is the current rumor parroting parts of the SeniAcurrate rumor in an attempt to seem more legitimate?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 28, 2016, 10:12:32 AM
I think the strength of these rumors means we're looking at an Nvidia only machine. No way AMD is involved anymore. At this point you're basically hoping Nintendo chooses a different chip, but then that's still total speculation like how Digital Foundry talked about the X2.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 28, 2016, 11:18:15 AM
Here's the thing, AMD has SoC's, Nvidia has none when it comes to consoles, otherwise they'd have SoCs.

It's likely that it could be a handheld, but not the home console, also Nintendo has stated that the NX is multiple devices, not singular. So this could be taken as a Home Console and a Handheld.

I doubt Nintendo would do what razor did several years back, and it failed as was made by Nvidia.
https://www.youtube.com/embed/YZ4AlnlYenc (https://www.youtube.com/embed/YZ4AlnlYenc)
Don't believe anything until an official statement from Nintendo is released. EG has been wrong before, their record isn't spotless. Right now all of this are rumors.

We should hear something by September if not sooner.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 28, 2016, 11:28:56 AM
I think the strength of these rumors means we're looking at an Nvidia only machine. No way AMD is involved anymore. At this point you're basically hoping Nintendo chooses a different chip, but then that's still total speculation like how Digital Foundry talked about the X2.

I think AMD is very involved with the Home console as they have SOC wins that haven't been announced yet, now why wouldn't they? Probably likely waiting on Nintendo for approval. Also it's unlikely that the console would be running on anything from Nvidia, as nvidia has no semiconductor contracts.

Maybe the handheld, but I doubt it'll be with nvidia as I've stated before. I believe it was the President of NCL that stated last year that the NX will not be some hybrid console/handheld.

We know there will be a handheld and a home console.




Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on July 28, 2016, 12:22:50 PM
This all sounds like my (our) speculated hybrid from last year or the year before... I can't remember.

Even the screen with detachable wiimotes idea was floated around. I believe we even had mock ups.

Maybe I should dig that old thread up and see what we were taking about and who was saying what.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on July 28, 2016, 01:24:13 PM
I'm warming up to the idea of having a handheld that docks and boosts its overall power. I like the idea of having one system that does both things. It'd be especially interesting if the dock streamed its signal wirelessly. There's a lot of potential there.

But the more I like the idea, the more I think it's fake. If it is going to match the current generation, it sounds too difficult to pull off. They're too many problems from a hardware point of view, not to mention what developers would have to do to make essentially two versions of the same game for one system. It sounds completely cumbersome.

Two systems that can swap games sounds more doable, more cost effective, and solves more problems. It'll still be a pain in the ass for developers, having to develop a game that works on both hardware systems. Still, this allows Nintendo to widen its support for both systems at once, and keep costs down while matching the market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 28, 2016, 03:44:19 PM
At this point I'm thinking beefy Nvidia GPU in the home console dock that utilizes the Tegra chip for PhysX and additional GPU operations for enhanced visuals or perhaps... 4k output.


If I'm gonna dream, I'm gonna dream BIG. And Nvidia ownz the GPU market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 28, 2016, 04:27:40 PM
Two systems that can swap games sounds more doable, more cost effective, and solves more problems. It'll still be a pain in the ass for developers, having to develop a game that works on both hardware systems. Still, this allows Nintendo to widen its support for both systems at once, and keep costs down while matching the market.

Isn't this pretty much the same routine that the PS4 and Vita have?  The Vita gets a lot of PS4 ports and that probably played a part in it's weak sales in the West since it doesn't seem like that essential of a purchase.  The 3DS is worth owning even if you don't care at all about portability because it has great games you can't get anywhere else.  If Nintendo makes the lineup of their two systems identical then their handheld loses all appeal aside from portability so the sales will be worse than the 3DS since it will lose those that just bought it for the games.  It goes from an essential videogame system to just a way to play games on the go and that's a big reason why non-Nintendo handhelds have struggled.  To focus development on one lineup of games, some sort of hybrid makes more sense.

What I find rather disappointing about these rumours is that nothing is really all that creative or interesting.  Nintendo is making out like this is a super top secret stuff that will change everything.  Yet a handheld that also plugs into your TV is nothing new.  There are models of the PSP that already did that.  Sharing a lineup between a separate handheld and console is a little more new but it's very similar to the Vita/PS4 setup.  These ideas are basically Nintendo doing what Sony did years ago, except they're not stealing the successful ideas.

Ideas about a handheld that plugs into a console dock and gets a power boost from it is at least a new and different concept.  It makes sense for Nintendo to be hush hush about that and not let competitors steal it and for them to be excited about the NX's future because they're trying something the industry has not seen before.

The big rumour about the handheld you plug into the TV is so subdued that if Nintendo revealed that as the real deal and we had not been tipped off beforehand I think the reaction would be "that's it?"  Even now there are assumptions that that must just be a handheld NX and there's also a console NX.  Like the idea of passing this concept off as a CONSOLE is so ridiculous that we must assume that we're not seeing the full picture.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on July 28, 2016, 04:47:42 PM
Since many of us came to this prediction a couple years ago, my reaction to this is completely different than if it had come out of nowhere.  Even in this thread, I've gone through denial (they wouldn't do that!), sadness (no Mario or Metroid with PS4 graphics and physics...), and finally acceptance.  I still doubt it, only because my predictions on Nintendo are always wrong.  I also think that the head tracking to give the illusion of depth, shifting perspective with the viewer, may be included as a gimmick that could actually be more pleasant than the early VR hardware and very cheap to implement.  Wireless video streaming could also be a thing, since Nintendo already has the technology with the Wii U for minimal latency.

No matter what Nintendo does, console third party support may be a hurdle they just can't overcome at this point.  Most gamers look to other consoles or their PCs for that.  If the NX gets the portable developers instead, that is pretty exciting.  Also, the Tegra chip is good for 1080p 60 fps gaming even on the Android OS, and can also stream 4K video.  With a dedicated gaming OS, it will be a nice bump from the Wii U.

As for how they introduce it, they can always refresh the "third pillar" approach.  Basically, pretend this is a new thing rather than a replacement to either the Wii U or 3DS.  If the system sells well, pretend you never said that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on July 28, 2016, 05:11:01 PM
Two systems that can swap games sounds more doable, more cost effective, and solves more problems. It'll still be a pain in the ass for developers, having to develop a game that works on both hardware systems. Still, this allows Nintendo to widen its support for both systems at once, and keep costs down while matching the market.

Isn't this pretty much the same routine that the PS4 and Vita have?  The Vita gets a lot of PS4 ports and that probably played a part in it's weak sales in the West since it doesn't seem like that essential of a purchase.  The 3DS is worth owning even if you don't care at all about portability because it has great games you can't get anywhere else.  If Nintendo makes the lineup of their two systems identical then their handheld loses all appeal aside from portability so the sales will be worse than the 3DS since it will lose those that just bought it for the games.  It goes from an essential videogame system to just a way to play games on the go and that's a big reason why non-Nintendo handhelds have struggled.  To focus development on one lineup of games, some sort of hybrid makes more sense.

Wait...what? Do you know how the Vita/PS4 Link works? You have to be within an internet/router connection for it to work. It is connecting to your PS4 and sending the game via an IP to your Vita. Having two systems swap games, like I propose, is a completely different method (and a much better one).

Furthermore, having one game you swap and having two games, one of which is a port, is also completely different than what I'm talking about.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 28, 2016, 07:05:22 PM
I was never opposed to the idea of a hybrid. I thought that was where Nintendo was headed eventually, just not for another generation or two. I remained skeptical because I didn't think the technology was where it needed to be to do so correctly, and the verdict is out of that one. What do you sacrifice in order to launch this in the near future? The expectation is a single device acting as the best of both worlds; the reality is a single device that's mediocre at two things.

As someone who merely tolerates handheld gaming just to play those games, a hybrids more or less works for my habits. I get to play all those games on a TV. At the same time, a shared library did the same thing. If NX ultimately ends up being only a portable that can plug into a dock with no dedicated console, I don't see that as "a brand new concept." The Razer Edge Pro was basically that. It's easy to point out that the Razer Edge Pro failed, but that's not the mark against it. I believe Nintendo could take that concept much further. However, I don't believe the concept is different enough.

I'm in the camp that thinks Nintendo has to offer something different, and if it ever hopes of taking back significant market share it eventually has to knock out either Sony or Microsoft (probably Microsoft). Nintendo can't do that by offering the same thing because there's no real reason why anyone would just drop an entire ecosystem all their friends are part of. Being the platform that ends up in more homes by virtue of second-console status is the path of least resistance. Nintendo takes back market share without taking on Sony and Microsoft. I think that was always the plan, but Nintendo just couldn't figure out how to crack it in a sustainable manner (Wii was lightning in a bottle). Nintendo doesn't care about being first. I mean, it'll take being first, but it mainly cares about profits.

What's that have to do with this latest NX rumor? Well, if the SemiAccurate rumor from May also proves true, Nvidia gave up the farm to get Nintendo's business. That means Nintendo gets better performance for a lower price which could mean higher profit margins... just not on hardware. If Nintendo is smart, it will pass those savings onto consumers in order put NX in homes with the intent to sell more software with a larger install base.

The problem is that the best portable hardware is still low-end hardware which ultimately means alienating an entire segment of the market as well as most Western third parties. This is where I think a shared library would benefit Nintendo. It wouldn't launch high-end hardware because that would price the console out of its primary audience. However, if Nintendo has a product for that audience (e.g. an NX portable-hybrid), it can finally launch an enthusiast console without fear that the software won't also sell. Yeah, the dedicated console would undoubtedly sell worse than the portable-hybrid, but that's not the point of launching it.

One or the other is not different enough. Together, Nintendo might have something.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 28, 2016, 08:54:25 PM
I was never opposed to the idea of a hybrid. I thought that was where Nintendo was headed eventually, just not for another generation or two. I remained skeptical because I didn't think the technology was where it needed to be to do so correctly, and the verdict is out of that one. What do you sacrifice in order to launch this in the near future? The expectation is a single device acting as the best of both worlds; the reality is a single device that's mediocre at two things.

As someone who merely tolerates handheld gaming just to play those games, a hybrids more or less works for my habits. I get to play all those games on a TV. At the same time, a shared library did the same thing. If NX ultimately ends up being only a portable that can plug into a dock with no dedicated console, I don't see that as "a brand new concept." The Razer Edge Pro was basically that. It's easy to point out that the Razer Edge Pro failed, but that's not the mark against it. I believe Nintendo could take that concept much further. However, I don't believe the concept is different enough.

I'm in the camp that thinks Nintendo has to offer something different, and if it ever hopes of taking back significant market share it eventually has to knock out either Sony or Microsoft (probably Microsoft). Nintendo can't do that by offering the same thing because there's no real reason why anyone would just drop an entire ecosystem all their friends are part of. Being the platform that ends up in more homes by virtue of second-console status is the path of least resistance. Nintendo takes back market share without taking on Sony and Microsoft. I think that was always the plan, but Nintendo just couldn't figure out how to crack it in a sustainable manner (Wii was lightning in a bottle). Nintendo doesn't care about being first. I mean, it'll take being first, but it mainly cares about profits.

What's that have to do with this latest NX rumor? Well, if the SemiAccurate rumor from May also proves true, Nvidia gave up the farm to get Nintendo's business. That means Nintendo gets better performance for a lower price which could mean higher profit margins... just not on hardware. If Nintendo is smart, it will pass those savings onto consumers in order put NX in homes with the intent to sell more software with a larger install base.

The problem is that the best portable hardware is still low-end hardware which ultimately means alienating an entire segment of the market as well as most Western third parties. This is where I think a shared library would benefit Nintendo. It wouldn't launch high-end hardware because that would price the console out of its primary audience. However, if Nintendo has a product for that audience (e.g. an NX portable-hybrid), it can finally launch an enthusiast console without fear that the software won't also sell. Yeah, the dedicated console would undoubtedly sell worse than the portable-hybrid, but that's not the point of launching it.

One or the other is not different enough. Together, Nintendo might have something.


What if the portable GPU was used as a secondary GPU when docked? It could do PhysX. I currently use my Intel integrated GPU for additional support to my primary GPU in games like GTA5 and Skyrim. I wonder if Nintendo's solution could be similar?

As it stands, there's actually really no way of getting around this. The portable GPU will be used in conjunction with the dock GPU whether it's a full SLI configuration OR it's like what I described above.


For what it's worth, the NX may officially be a dual GPU gaming system! That will certainly boast a smooth 1080p framerate!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on July 28, 2016, 11:11:30 PM
Two systems that can swap games sounds more doable, more cost effective, and solves more problems. It'll still be a pain in the ass for developers, having to develop a game that works on both hardware systems. Still, this allows Nintendo to widen its support for both systems at once, and keep costs down while matching the market.

Isn't this pretty much the same routine that the PS4 and Vita have?  The Vita gets a lot of PS4 ports and that probably played a part in it's weak sales in the West since it doesn't seem like that essential of a purchase.  The 3DS is worth owning even if you don't care at all about portability because it has great games you can't get anywhere else.  If Nintendo makes the lineup of their two systems identical then their handheld loses all appeal aside from portability so the sales will be worse than the 3DS since it will lose those that just bought it for the games.  It goes from an essential videogame system to just a way to play games on the go and that's a big reason why non-Nintendo handhelds have struggled.  To focus development on one lineup of games, some sort of hybrid makes more sense.

Wait...what? Do you know how the Vita/PS4 Link works? You have to be within an internet/router connection for it to work. It is connecting to your PS4 and sending the game via an IP to your Vita. Having two systems swap games, like I propose, is a completely different method (and a much better one).

Furthermore, having one game you swap and having two games, one of which is a port, is also completely different than what I'm talking about.

No, it's not exactly the same as the PS4/Vita.  It's a better idea for sure.  But my point is that today the 3DS isn't just a portable way to play Wii U games while the PSP and PS Vita have struggled because they come across as that for the PS3 and PS4.  In that case it involves having two different versions of the game which isn't really what people want.

But there are 3DS owners who don't give a damn about portability and basically play it exclusively at home.  They bought it for its exclusives.  Most of those people also own at least one console since they prefer the home experience.  If they could JUST buy a console and get all those games to play at home they would never bother with a handheld.  The Vita has been hurt by that since so many of it's games are multiplatform with the PS4.  The appeal is more to get the handheld experience as opposed to buying the system simply for it's library whether you care about portability or not.

If Nintendo has two systems with the same games for both with crossplay, that is a better option than the PS4/Vita combo, but it also makes the handheld an unnecessary purchase for those that bought Nintendo handhelds solely to access its library.  The handheld will almost certainly sell less than the 3DS for this reason.  Instead of being strong videogame systems in their own right, Nintendo handhelds will become a compromised console experience solely for those that feel the need to play games on the go.  And if you're down with compromised games on the go, hey, you've got a phone in your pocket already that can do that.  So it ends up being for those that want to play games on the go but want something with more meat than a mobile game.  Hardcore gaming enthusiasts will stick with the console since it will have the superior experience and casual players that just want a distraction on the bus will stick with their phones.  This group of customers that want something in-between is probably not that big.

I think a successful handheld these days has to either be very distinct from the consoles or part of some greater whole like these docking station ideas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 29, 2016, 01:32:01 AM
@IanSane

Like I said, I'm with you on the general lack of appeal of playing 3D console games on the go. But at this point, what's a mobile console going to do? You can't put the processing genie back in the bottle. You could put out a super-cheap touch dealie that's meant to play 2D games/Fruit Ninja type junk, but what would be the point? Like you said, phones already do that. I'd say that Nintendo is probably pessimistic enough about the general dedicated device market that they're willing to forgo revenue streams from selling two different devices with mostly discreet game libraries (and double dipping), and thus the single device has to do both home and console duty.

Buuut, there's a new rumor percolating that some dude on a Brazilian forum leaked the NX concept a while ago, and that it's radically modular. Screens, controller parts, additional processing units, whathaveyou, allowing you to build from a basic touch unit up to a current gen console depending on your proclivities and budget. Extreme skepticism is warranted, but going whole hog in this direction would be quite a curveball, and would fill in some of the missing pieces we all seem to be detecting about the Eurogamer leak.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on July 29, 2016, 12:33:59 PM
Two systems that can swap games sounds more doable, more cost effective, and solves more problems. It'll still be a pain in the ass for developers, having to develop a game that works on both hardware systems. Still, this allows Nintendo to widen its support for both systems at once, and keep costs down while matching the market.

Isn't this pretty much the same routine that the PS4 and Vita have?  The Vita gets a lot of PS4 ports and that probably played a part in it's weak sales in the West since it doesn't seem like that essential of a purchase.  The 3DS is worth owning even if you don't care at all about portability because it has great games you can't get anywhere else.  If Nintendo makes the lineup of their two systems identical then their handheld loses all appeal aside from portability so the sales will be worse than the 3DS since it will lose those that just bought it for the games.  It goes from an essential videogame system to just a way to play games on the go and that's a big reason why non-Nintendo handhelds have struggled.  To focus development on one lineup of games, some sort of hybrid makes more sense.

Wait...what? Do you know how the Vita/PS4 Link works? You have to be within an internet/router connection for it to work. It is connecting to your PS4 and sending the game via an IP to your Vita. Having two systems swap games, like I propose, is a completely different method (and a much better one).

Furthermore, having one game you swap and having two games, one of which is a port, is also completely different than what I'm talking about.

No, it's not exactly the same as the PS4/Vita.  It's a better idea for sure.  But my point is that today the 3DS isn't just a portable way to play Wii U games while the PSP and PS Vita have struggled because they come across as that for the PS3 and PS4.  In that case it involves having two different versions of the game which isn't really what people want.

But there are 3DS owners who don't give a damn about portability and basically play it exclusively at home.  They bought it for its exclusives.  Most of those people also own at least one console since they prefer the home experience.  If they could JUST buy a console and get all those games to play at home they would never bother with a handheld.  The Vita has been hurt by that since so many of it's games are multiplatform with the PS4.  The appeal is more to get the handheld experience as opposed to buying the system simply for it's library whether you care about portability or not.

If Nintendo has two systems with the same games for both with crossplay, that is a better option than the PS4/Vita combo, but it also makes the handheld an unnecessary purchase for those that bought Nintendo handhelds solely to access its library.  The handheld will almost certainly sell less than the 3DS for this reason.  Instead of being strong videogame systems in their own right, Nintendo handhelds will become a compromised console experience solely for those that feel the need to play games on the go.  And if you're down with compromised games on the go, hey, you've got a phone in your pocket already that can do that.  So it ends up being for those that want to play games on the go but want something with more meat than a mobile game.  Hardcore gaming enthusiasts will stick with the console since it will have the superior experience and casual players that just want a distraction on the bus will stick with their phones.  This group of customers that want something in-between is probably not that big.

I think a successful handheld these days has to either be very distinct from the consoles or part of some greater whole like these docking station ideas.

but aren't you the one that complains of software droughts and a lack of third-party software? Who cares about hardware sales, software sales will more than cover the loss.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 29, 2016, 01:36:31 PM
NX is going to be surprisingly cheap

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/nintendo-nx-the-pros-and-cons-of-a-transforming-portable/0170297 (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/nintendo-nx-the-pros-and-cons-of-a-transforming-portable/0170297)

Quote
Early online speculation about pricing for the NX expects it to be cheaper than current consoles, but from what we’ve heard it’s going to be cheaper than even the vast majority expect. This is a machine that is targeting the mass market, and Nintendo certainly plans for it to have a mass market price.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on July 29, 2016, 01:45:20 PM
Buuut, there's a new rumor percolating that some dude on a Brazilian forum leaked the NX concept a while ago, and that it's radically modular. Screens, controller parts, additional processing units, whathaveyou, allowing you to build from a basic touch unit up to a current gen console depending on your proclivities and budget. Extreme skepticism is warranted, but going whole hog in this direction would be quite a curveball, and would fill in some of the missing pieces we all seem to be detecting about the Eurogamer leak.

That Brazilian leak is totally fake.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1254576
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 29, 2016, 02:12:26 PM
NX is going to be surprisingly cheap

http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/nintendo-nx-the-pros-and-cons-of-a-transforming-portable/0170297 (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/nintendo-nx-the-pros-and-cons-of-a-transforming-portable/0170297)

Quote
Early online speculation about pricing for the NX expects it to be cheaper than current consoles, but from what we’ve heard it’s going to be cheaper than even the vast majority expect. This is a machine that is targeting the mass market, and Nintendo certainly plans for it to have a mass market price.

If it launches at $199 I will flip.

That Brazilian leak is totally fake.

Common sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 29, 2016, 03:51:28 PM
Latest: Direct Feed Gaming says that NX will use the new Tegra chip

https://twitter.com/DirectFeedGames/status/759072574777196544 (https://twitter.com/DirectFeedGames/status/759072574777196544)

Details about the chip: http://www.fool.com/investing/2016/07/29/why-the-nintendo-nx-wont-use-the-nvidia-corporatio.aspx

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on July 29, 2016, 04:02:43 PM
Sounds more likely NX is going to have the next Tegra chip (X2 aka 'Parker)' which is based on Pascal architecture and is on 16nm.  The current NX dev-kits have Tegra X1, based on Maxwell architecture, and need active cooling. Developers can at least get used to working on Tegra hardware until the final NX hardware is ready with Pascal-based Tegra X2.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1254960 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1254960)

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=211844472&postcount=9636 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=211844472&postcount=9636)

(http://i.imgur.com/oVH2mwV.jpg)

https://twitter.com/directfeedgames/status/759072574777196544 (https://twitter.com/directfeedgames/status/759072574777196544)



Edit: beaten by ShyGuy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 29, 2016, 04:16:34 PM
If it is X2 then it's better, but now we really need a Tegra X2 siren to go along with the NX siren.

The rumor mill is starting to line up in a way. The idea that Nvidia promised the moon for a contract with Nintendo after losing out on the other consoles, and then Nintendo in a way passing the savings on to consumers, hence the "substantially cheaper" rumors seems to be gaining strength.

EDIT: This latest batch of rumors somehow also feels like it's addressing a certain portion of internet forum dwellers, so it deserves a big grain of salt as well.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 29, 2016, 04:24:55 PM
Chips! A Tegra X2 would be an industry leading chip if the NX were to use it.

Hey, maybe the NX-AMD camp will get some rumors later on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on July 29, 2016, 05:12:51 PM
Chips! A Tegra X2 would be an industry leading chip if the NX were to use it.

Yep.

Industry leading in terms of architecture (Pascal), industry leading in terms of manufacturing process (16nm FinFET). Obviously that never meant industry leading in terms of raw performance in a home console, but definitely in the handheld / mobile space.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on July 29, 2016, 05:37:51 PM
These rumours are almost lining up too nicely. Maybe the leak from a few days ago indeed had some truth to it (it makes sense in theory, but I'm still kinda having a hard time totally buying into it for some reason) so people are more willing to talk now as a result, but it feels more like all of these people coming out of the woodwork are just hitching their wagon to Eurogamer's information from a few days ago and the conjecture that followed it. Regardless, it would obviously be neat if the NX used a new, possibly more powerful chip than the one that's supposedly in dev kits right now and I do believe that launching at least one NX form factor below the price point of current gen consoles will be a priority for Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on July 29, 2016, 06:46:11 PM
If things go as they usually do, the NX won't use a stock chip.  So, regardless of the architecture, we won't really know the general range of how many flops it can flop until people like the Digital Foundry do a deep dive on it.  Pascal should be better for power consumption and cooling regardless, so hopefully that rumor is true.  For a console of any sort to have an architecture so new would be very unusual.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 29, 2016, 07:21:47 PM
Buuut, there's a new rumor percolating that some dude on a Brazilian forum leaked the NX concept a while ago, and that it's radically modular. Screens, controller parts, additional processing units, whathaveyou, allowing you to build from a basic touch unit up to a current gen console depending on your proclivities and budget. Extreme skepticism is warranted, but going whole hog in this direction would be quite a curveball, and would fill in some of the missing pieces we all seem to be detecting about the Eurogamer leak.

That Brazilian leak is totally fake.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1254576 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1254576)

Looks like that thread is locked, but it wasn't proven fake. There's just nothing else to do with it for now and people are rightfully very skeptical. It's definitely a long-shot, but interesting to keep in mind heading toward the reveal. As I recall somebody posted assets from Breath of the Wild on Gamefaqs awhile ahead of E3 and was laughed off.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 29, 2016, 10:41:33 PM
There's no need to prove that thing fake, it's a Raspberry Pi with a touch screen and an LCD. The Tegra X1 would die in a matter of seconds if you ran it without a heat sink. Here's a link to the device in the screenshot - http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/7-7-Inch-TFT-Touch-Screen-LCD-Display-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-or-B-HDMI/1491443_32217991621.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/7-7-Inch-TFT-Touch-Screen-LCD-Display-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-or-B-HDMI/1491443_32217991621.html)


Digital Foundry has completley confirmed that the NX has a Tegra X1 in the dev kits, but leave open the possibility of moving up to the X2. Sounds to me like it's the X2 in the final system. Sure it's not going to be as powerful as the PS4 or Xbone - but it will be a pretty damn impressive handheld console, and it will be much more powerful than the Wii U (the X1 already is).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on July 29, 2016, 11:51:08 PM
Can someone explain this like I'm five?
http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 29, 2016, 11:58:15 PM
Sure, that guy is just pulling stuff out of his ass.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on July 30, 2016, 12:03:48 AM
Can someone explain this like I'm five?
http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR (http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR)

I'll take a shot at that....

"Tegra uses too much much power to be used as a portable machine with the max specs everyone is speculating. Trying to pack the power of Xb1 into a portable would wield the results of a Sega Nomad/GameGear in todays gaming space. To even entertain the idea would be like bumping the X1 -> to X2, like the GC -> to Wii, performance gains at a huge compromise."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 30, 2016, 12:11:22 AM
Can someone explain this like I'm five?
http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR (http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR)

The Tegra, as this anonymous engineer knows it and Nvidia, is a battery eater and will always be so.

These rumours are almost lining up too nicely. Maybe the leak from a few days ago indeed had some truth to it (it makes sense in theory, but I'm still kinda having a hard time totally buying into it for some reason) so people are more willing to talk now as a result, but it feels more like all of these people coming out of the woodwork are just hitching their wagon to Eurogamer's information from a few days ago and the conjecture that followed it.

Well, this is what corroboration is, isn't? Everyone who has kept their eyes and ears on the rumor watch has heard snippets throughout the year. Most of them just never had enough they thought to go to press with. Now that Eurogamer has stepped first, this helps others more confidently share what they have heard.

Of course, this will invite bad actors as well, but that's part of what is supposed to make this all fun!
(Never burn your source.)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 30, 2016, 01:31:47 AM
Nintendo releasing a handheld that's potentially two to three times more powerful than its current console with decent battery life and no heat sink (the entire point of going with Pascal) is pretty neat-o stuff. Should these rumors prove true and Nintendo/Nvidia actually pull this off, color me impressed.

I'm still trying to reconcile how Iwata could say "we are not saying that we are planning to integrate our platforms into one. What we are saying is that we would like to integrate software development methods, operating systems, and built-in software and software assets for each platform so that we can use them across different machines" then launch the exact opposite of that four years later. The best I could come up with was: a lot can change in a few years. Nvidia reportedly offered Nintendo an extremely lucrative deal (to the point where Nvidia only really gets to use NX to pitch its technology to other companies which may have been enough for the company). Maybe Nintendo management and internal hardware research and development teams saw Nvidia's offer and collectively decided, "Well, **** AMD. Let's do this instead."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 30, 2016, 02:57:16 AM
Agreed. To a point I'm still not buying the idea of a hybrid, but I imagine Nvidia had to come with a pretty sweet offer.  Nintendo of course being a company used to turning down deals for "unprecedented partnerships".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on July 30, 2016, 03:18:23 AM
Can someone explain this like I'm five?
http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR (http://pastebin.com/0hpCSbsR)

The Tegra, as this anonymous engineer knows it and Nvidia, is a battery eater and will always be so.

These rumours are almost lining up too nicely. Maybe the leak from a few days ago indeed had some truth to it (it makes sense in theory, but I'm still kinda having a hard time totally buying into it for some reason) so people are more willing to talk now as a result, but it feels more like all of these people coming out of the woodwork are just hitching their wagon to Eurogamer's information from a few days ago and the conjecture that followed it.

Well, this is what corroboration is, isn't? Everyone who has kept their eyes and ears on the rumor watch has heard snippets throughout the year. Most of them just never had enough they thought to go to press with. Now that Eurogamer has stepped first, this helps others more confidently share what they have heard.

Of course, this will invite bad actors as well, but that's part of what is supposed to make this all fun!
(Never burn your source.)

The speculation, rumours, and theories leading up to a console reveal are fun, for sure (if I didn't think so I wouldn't browse this thread as much as I do). The idea of someone riding the coattails of a person who appears to have done real, honest work does not feel very fun though. In the case of this Direct-Feed Gaming person, I'm not sure how Eurogamer's information changed anything for them. If it was about protecting their source, which would be understandable, they're in the same position they were in a week ago. Eurogamer didn't confirm anything when it came to a chip from Nvidia using this Pascal architecture: Eurogamer/Digital Foundry very clearly stated that part of their information was speculation. If this person is really confident that this chip will in the NX, it wouldn't make sense for this to be a case of Eurogamer filling in some blanks for them either. So what exactly changed? The rumoured information itself seems like a possibility given Eurogamer and Digital Foundry's reasoning from a few days ago, but the circumstances surrounding some of these corroborations seems questionable.

I should add that if we're talking about corroboration in the sense that people have come out and said that they're hearing the same things Eurogamer did, I'm more inclined to believe that. Regardless of how accurate or inaccurate Eurogamer's information is in the end, I do believe that they got it from sources they deemed trustworthy, so I can see how others would hear similar things from their sources. The stuff I'm skeptical about is some of this new information.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on July 30, 2016, 03:51:18 AM
I can't wait until rumorville is over.

The Tegra rumors sounds like a bad idea. So they're probably true(half sarcastic). There was absolutely nothing wrong with the Wii U except that it was under powered.  If they had powered it a little higher they could have had a 7 year console instead of a 4 year console.

Instead of doing something new and wacky, I'd rather they just improve the Wii U. That being said a Hybrid console is in line of an improvement of the Wii U console. It's not a huge improvement, and I doubt it's future proof. I just hate the idea that again the technology and marketing driven companies will pass over Nintendo again. I was really annoyed by EA programmers publicly ranting about how they hate to program for WiiU. Oh you hate challenges? Then shut the **** up and stop being a programmer.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on July 30, 2016, 03:57:49 AM
This is another article talking about Tegra battery life:

http://www.pcworld.com/article/3097641/hardware/nvidias-next-generation-tegra-mobile-chip-is-on-its-way.html (http://www.pcworld.com/article/3097641/hardware/nvidias-next-generation-tegra-mobile-chip-is-on-its-way.html)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 30, 2016, 05:48:27 AM
I still believe it'll be amd based. Eurogamer thought the 3DS would have Nvidia inside.

They have been wrong, could just be a place holder.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 30, 2016, 08:50:06 AM
It will be an Nvidia Tegra chip. You can believe it will be AMD if you want to, but it won't. AMD has essentially no mobile presence, Nvidia makes the most powerful mobile chip you can buy. Nintendo is not going to pay for AMD to do R&D on a new technology, they're going to go with the company that's already making it happen - and this could be perfect for both companies because Nvidia has recently dropped out of the cell phone market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Shaymin on July 30, 2016, 09:43:07 AM
I'm still trying to reconcile how Iwata could say "we are not saying that we are planning to integrate our platforms into one. What we are saying is that we would like to integrate software development methods, operating systems, and built-in software and software assets for each platform so that we can use them across different machines" then launch the exact opposite of that four years later. The best I could come up with was: a lot can change in a few years. Nvidia reportedly offered Nintendo an extremely lucrative deal (to the point where Nvidia only really gets to use NX to pitch its technology to other companies which may have been enough for the company). Maybe Nintendo management and internal hardware research and development teams saw Nvidia's offer and collectively decided, "Well, **** AMD. Let's do this instead."

Given what happened about a year ago, I suspect the philosophy has changed at Nintendo. If you want to make it so they're not Steve Jobs-ing or Walt-ing the company, doing a 180 on the "No hybrid" idea would make sense.

I really hope we can talk to some people at the company someday who can confirm (or deny, idk) that the NX probably got rebooted somewhere along the line, and that's why it's launching by the end of March instead of, I dunno, November.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 30, 2016, 11:19:42 AM
I'm still trying to reconcile how Iwata could say "we are not saying that we are planning to integrate our platforms into one. What we are saying is that we would like to integrate software development methods, operating systems, and built-in software and software assets for each platform so that we can use them across different machines" then launch the exact opposite of that four years later. The best I could come up with was: a lot can change in a few years. Nvidia reportedly offered Nintendo an extremely lucrative deal (to the point where Nvidia only really gets to use NX to pitch its technology to other companies which may have been enough for the company). Maybe Nintendo management and internal hardware research and development teams saw Nvidia's offer and collectively decided, "Well, **** AMD. Let's do this instead."

Given what happened about a year ago, I suspect the philosophy has changed at Nintendo. If you want to make it so they're not Steve Jobs-ing or Walt-ing the company, doing a 180 on the "No hybrid" idea would make sense.

I really hope we can talk to some people at the company someday who can confirm (or deny, idk) that the NX probably got rebooted somewhere along the line, and that's why it's launching by the end of March instead of, I dunno, November.


What happened a year ago is also a pretty good reason to suspect that Nintendo's grand scheme is not a home gaming solution throttled by mobile graphics technology. Nintendo's president should understand western gamers a lot better than Iwata did.


I'm still clinging to the hope that this Nvidia partnership is going to yield something technologically robust. Because the handheld portion of this deal is likely to require some power limitations for extended battery life, I'm thinking that the docked solution will boost performance (naturally). I'd like to see something like dual Tegra (handheld GPU + dock GPU) in SLI. Let's not be a tick below current generation consoles. Let's see something new.


So far, I'm not buying NX based on current information. A super handheld that outputs to the TV is okay. It needs to do something fresh and new though. I just don't care that much about taking my games on the go.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 30, 2016, 12:27:25 PM
That would require the developer to implement SLI support too though, which is already pretty rare on the PC these days, and the costs outweigh the benefits (for example, if you get 30 FPS in a game with a single GTX 1080, you're not going to get 60 FPS when you have two running in SLI). Battery life should not be that big of a concern. Having a single screen (so the device does not need to fold) means you can have a much larger battery.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 30, 2016, 12:36:48 PM
I doubt Satoru Iwata's death was the impetus for a potential reboot. The turnaround for that would be way too short. Iwata was saying the same things up until May 2015, right before he got really, really sick. Then, everything Nintendo and Tatsumi Kimishima have said and done since Kimishima was appointed president pointed toward the company continuing the course set by Iwata.

If anything, Kimishima may have chosen to cut back on or reorganize what Iwata was planning. Looking back at things Iwata was saying, it really sounded like Nintendo was planning an ecosystem featuring a shared OS, architecture, and library to be available in multiple form factors. That may not have changed. However, I could see Kimishima looking over the what the hardware team was working on and decided, "That's the one we're moving forward with for launch."

The most current crop of NX rumors doesn't sound like a straight-up hybrid. As it stands, NX sounds like a handheld that just so happens to optionally plug into a dock that connects to a television which isn't that crazy of an idea. The only part of it I'm having trouble imagining are the detachable controllers. That's a clusterfuck waiting to happen.

New 3DS was Nintendo experimenting (on a very small scale) with a form factor that actually used the spec bump to improve performance in games. A non-portable NX form factor that included better specs since it doesn't have to worry about heat or battery life could be in the pipeline though you really have to ask whether that's even something Nintendo should pursue. A72 ARM cores can match or exceed PS4's CPU performance and a Pascal GPU unhindered by heat and battery life may get in the ballpark of PS4's GPU performance. Sounds great on paper, but if Nintendo can't round up third party support, that performance is largely wasted. Nintendo would be better off focusing on a cheaper, portable focused form factor. If that's where Nintendo is now, I can't really disagree with direction.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on July 30, 2016, 02:02:17 PM
That would require the developer to implement SLI support too though, which is already pretty rare on the PC these days, and the costs outweigh the benefits (for example, if you get 30 FPS in a game with a single GTX 1080, you're not going to get 60 FPS when you have two running in SLI). Battery life should not be that big of a concern. Having a single screen (so the device does not need to fold) means you can have a much larger battery.


I don't really understand where that idea is coming from though. To date, I can count more than 360 mainstream games that support SLI. It looks to me like an overwhelming majority of major western games (COD, Assasin's Creed, Fallout, Skyrim, Sim City, etc) support SLI on PC. Why wouldn't this have appeal in a home console?
Frankly, I'm not seeing the benefits of a home docking station if I'm going to basically get the same gaming experience on the big screen that I do on the handheld.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on July 30, 2016, 07:48:42 PM
The home docking station doesn't necessarily mean that you get more CPU/GPU power, it could just mean that more actual electric power to charge the system and play at the same time, and to attach to your TV. Or it could end up being something along the lines of SLI, or it could be something entirely different that no one's thought of yet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 30, 2016, 08:13:36 PM
The power-up Dock thing IS interesting, but I still have more belief in a second non-portable SKU (home console) that'll be bumped up in spec but otherwise play the exact same stuff, possibly even use the same media. You'd get a cheap portable console, and an expensive powerful home console, but they'd have a combined library of games that scaled up or down, and gamers could choose which price point and experience they want!

Whether the second SKU would launch at the same time would be a good question though...

As for the resurgence of X2 / Pascal rumors, that's about the upper limit of what I could ask for from a portable system, which makes me suspicious since Tegra X1 sounds much more Nintendo's style of tempered expectations. A newer chip would make more sense though from a power efficiency standpoint, but then wouldn't that increase price? Maybe a Tegra X1.5 is more likely than a full X2.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on July 30, 2016, 08:36:34 PM
Maybe tegra x1 in the handheld, tegra x2 in the console?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 30, 2016, 11:23:31 PM
Maybe tegra x1 in the handheld, tegra x2 in the console?

Could be, it'd make for a cheaper underpowered handheld that you could super gameboy to a TV, plus a pricey competent console to play all the exact same games but at more impressive visuals. You could choose the pricepoint/form factor to jump into, or you could buy BOTH for the best of both worlds! And it'd be a true shared library if they all used the same cartridges, so no matter which you chose you'd get the full game library (or almost so) and be able to play with anyone else no matter their handheld/console choice!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 31, 2016, 04:43:58 AM
I'm doubting it's tegra anything, no developers or Nintendo have responded to these leaks.

Quotes from SMD64: No Tegra could run ports that easy from PS4,nope. OsirisBlack also leaked PS4 Neo correctly: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1202462&highlight= (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1202462&highlight=) …

It should also be noted that OsirisBlack has been slient concerning this NX Nvidia Tegra report from Eurogamer.

Just being honest here guys, Tegra X1 and X2 would need to be extremely downgraded to have any good battery life. Wii U portable? Meh

About bringing Third Party games to NX: "one that's easy to program and work on" no Third Party would port to Tegra

What's funny is that here are tons of options, here are few: http://wccftech.com/amd-raven-ridge-apu-14nm-glofo-amkor/ (http://wccftech.com/amd-raven-ridge-apu-14nm-glofo-amkor/) …
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Enner on July 31, 2016, 04:54:09 AM
You don't comment on rumors or speculation when you have a long PR/marketing plan to follow or a Non-Disclosure Agreement to honor.

As for where these sources might be coming from, people under third-parties tend to have looser lips or have someone overhear something they shouldn't have. I've often gotten that the impression that Europe is a leaky place with Japan being the least.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 31, 2016, 05:07:02 AM
You don't comment on rumors or speculation when you have a long PR/marketing plan to follow or a Non-Disclosure Agreement to honor.

As for where these sources might be coming from, people under third-parties tend to have looser lips or have someone overhear something they shouldn't have. I've often gotten that the impression that Europe is a leaky place with Japan being the least.

That may be but amd had socs  Nvidia does not, this is reason to believe it'll be  amd for the home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on July 31, 2016, 06:03:33 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/3lcLdfo.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 31, 2016, 07:49:35 AM
As for the resurgence of X2 / Pascal rumors, that's about the upper limit of what I could ask for from a portable system, which makes me suspicious since Tegra X1 sounds much more Nintendo's style of tempered expectations. A newer chip would make more sense though from a power efficiency standpoint, but then wouldn't that increase price? Maybe a Tegra X1.5 is more likely than a full X2.
Going back to the SemiAccurate rumor from May and how it relates to these new rumors, the entire reason Nintendo chose Tegra is because Nvidia's offer to Nintendo was a steal. Margins on gaming platforms apparently aren't great, but that isn't the value of it which Nvidia learned the hard way after getting ditched by Sony and Microsoft. First, it makes the company look worse than AMD if it loses contracts to the competition. Second, Nvidia presumably wanted a product that it can regularly showcase to other companies what its technology can do. That's what its own Shield product was supposed to do except nobody cared/bought it.

The thinking behind the original SemiAccurate rumor is the Tegra division was basically told, "Figure it out or go home," so Nvidia's plan was to sell Nintendo on Tegra. Nintendo isn't the end goal here though I wouldn't be surprised if part of this rumored deal is Nvidia insisted on a "Powered by Nvidia's Tegra" or something of the sort on packaging and actual unit. If margins on gaming devices are minimal, why bother? You do it for brand visibility, to increase the value of the product, and ultimately to reach out to other companies with products that will have greater margins.

What this means for Nintendo is it'd get a great deal on a pretty advanced technology which is just about the only way Nintendo would do such a thing.
Just being honest here guys, Tegra X1 and X2 would need to be extremely downgraded to have any good battery life. Wii U portable? Meh
X1, yes. X2, no. The entire point of going with X2 is Nintendo would get better performance than the best X1 with greater efficiency. X1 is about twice as powerful as Wii U. X2 with decent battery life is expected to be in that range.
Quote
About bringing Third Party games to NX: "one that's easy to program and work on" no Third Party would port to Tegra
Porting to Tegra isn't that difficult. Just about all middleware supports ARM.
That may be but amd had socs  Nvidia does not, this is reason to believe it'll be  amd for the home console.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but Tegra is a system on a chip. If you're talking about contracts again, it's conceivable that Nintendo asked Nvidia not to announce anything as it would out NX immediately. If Nvidia were to announce a semi-custom design wins as AMD had, everyone would know it was Nintendo as both Sony and Microsoft very publicly jilted Nvidia.

I'm not really sure why you're so vehemently against Nintendo going with Nvidia's Tegra. I've been #TeamAMD for years now, but in light of everything above, it makes sense. If Nvidia offered Nintendo a deal that AMD couldn't match financially and/or technologically, I don't see why Nintendo would ever not take that deal.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on July 31, 2016, 10:07:50 AM
Another new Nintendo patent ?


(http://i.imgur.com/2NTfWaW.jpg)


https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20151016&DB=&locale=en_EP&CC=HK&NR=1171403A1&KC=A1&ND=4 (https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20151016&DB=&locale=en_EP&CC=HK&NR=1171403A1&KC=A1&ND=4)


http://translationportal.epo.org/emtp/translate/?ACTION=description-retrieval&COUNTRY=KR&ENGINE=google&FORMAT=docdb&KIND=A&LOCALE=en_EP&NUMBER=20130020715&OPS=ops.epo.org/3.1&SRCLANG=ko&TRGLANG=en

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: RABicle on July 31, 2016, 10:53:50 AM
I can't say I understand why some of you are resistant to the idea that NX is a high powered handheld that streams to the TV. This is what I wanted NX to be and I think a single machine that does two roles is a simpler concept to market to normies too. There isn't two versions of games like Smash Bros, there's just one and you can have a multiplayer match with a friend at university or enjoy it by yourself at home.

Furthermore, I expect NX to be an iterative game platform, with hardware updates pushed out every 2 years or even quicker, just like we can expect to see with the PS4 and Xbox from now on. The success of the iPhone/iPad removes any doubts that consumers are resistant to this. Ditching backwards compatibility to switch to ARM represents a clean break from the past and repositions the NX not as a underpowered competitor to the PS4/Xbone but rather the high powered gaming tablet. There are a lot of developers out there that make great games for iOS/Android that feel hamstrung by lack of buttons and the flood of freemiun **** on the market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on July 31, 2016, 12:07:25 PM
Another new Nintendo patent ?


(http://i.imgur.com/2NTfWaW.jpg)


https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20151016&DB=&locale=en_EP&CC=HK&NR=1171403A1&KC=A1&ND=4 (https://worldwide.espacenet.com/publicationDetails/biblio?FT=D&date=20151016&DB=&locale=en_EP&CC=HK&NR=1171403A1&KC=A1&ND=4)


http://translationportal.epo.org/emtp/translate/?ACTION=description-retrieval&COUNTRY=KR&ENGINE=google&FORMAT=docdb&KIND=A&LOCALE=en_EP&NUMBER=20130020715&OPS=ops.epo.org/3.1&SRCLANG=ko&TRGLANG=en



I didn't find that pic, but there was one that was just like that one, only the 2 halves where connected and the screen slotted in and out.

there was also a Game Pad pic and the previous "rumored" controller that had that fake mock-up made.

I haven't been following any of this for years, so this is all very interesting.

My question right now is: What is fact, and what is rumor?
or considering this is Nintendo and they haven't announced anything yet....
What is considered most likely fact, and what is pure rumor/speculation?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 31, 2016, 12:23:26 PM
About bringing Third Party games to NX: "one that's easy to program and work on" no Third Party would port to Tegra

From the Digital Foundry article:
Quote
Typically speaking, OpenGL games port really well to Tegra X1, while DirectX ports, like Metal Gear Rising: Revengeance and the recently released Resident Evil 5, aren't so impressive.

But let's be honest. Ease of portability isn't the reason most western third parties won't be supporting NX, regardless of the chip inside the hardware. Also, I don't understand the criticism of Eurogamer for hitching their wagon with one source, while people do the same thing with SMD64 and other Gaf "insiders".

Furthermore, I expect NX to be an iterative game platform, with hardware updates pushed out every 2 years or even quicker, just like we can expect to see with the PS4 and Xbox from now on.

Please god, no.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: RABicle on July 31, 2016, 01:28:43 PM
Furthermore, I expect NX to be an iterative game platform, with hardware updates pushed out every 2 years or even quicker, just like we can expect to see with the PS4 and Xbox from now on.

Please god, no.
It's the future Soren! We all manage it with our phones and PCs and they are more expensive devices. You won't be forced to upgrade, it'll be up to devs to decide to support older models and they will often strive to do so. But there will be a gradual march forward in processing power and us gamers will migrate forward at our own pace.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on July 31, 2016, 01:43:27 PM
Furthermore, I expect NX to be an iterative game platform, with hardware updates pushed out every 2 years or even quicker, just like we can expect to see with the PS4 and Xbox from now on.

Please god, no.
It's the future Soren! We all manage it with our phones and PCs and they are more expensive devices. You won't be forced to upgrade, it'll be up to devs to decide to support older models and they will often strive to do so. But there will be a gradual march forward in processing power and us gamers will migrate forward at our own pace.

The only reason I upgrade my phone is because I get it for free when i renew my contract. All my laptops and PCs have lasted me 4-6 years and my current Mac Mini/Mac Book Pro combo are on age 3 and 2 respectively, with no plans to replace them soon. I'm not going to buy a Scorpio, Neo or any future NX upgrade because that **** is too much. I don't have the income to upgrade all my machines every 2 years nor do I trust developers to support legacy versions far along anyway.

It's the same as companies trying to capitalize off cord cutters. A while back we only had to worry about Netflix and Hulu. Now there are far more people in the game and eventually, some just don't get supported.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 31, 2016, 02:05:20 PM
As for the resurgence of X2 / Pascal rumors, that's about the upper limit of what I could ask for from a portable system, which makes me suspicious since Tegra X1 sounds much more Nintendo's style of tempered expectations. A newer chip would make more sense though from a power efficiency standpoint, but then wouldn't that increase price? Maybe a Tegra X1.5 is more likely than a full X2.
Going back to the SemiAccurate rumor from May and how it relates to these new rumors, the entire reason Nintendo chose Tegra is because Nvidia's offer to Nintendo was a steal. Margins on gaming platforms apparently aren't great, but that isn't the value of it which Nvidia learned the hard way after getting ditched by Sony and Microsoft. First, it makes the company look worse than AMD if it loses contracts to the competition. Second, Nvidia presumably wanted a product that it can regularly showcase to other companies what its technology can do. That's what its own Shield product was supposed to do except nobody cared/bought it.

The thinking behind the original SemiAccurate rumor is the Tegra division was basically told, "Figure it out or go home," so Nvidia's plan was to sell Nintendo on Tegra. Nintendo isn't the end goal here though I wouldn't be surprised if part of this rumored deal is Nvidia insisted on a "Powered by Nvidia's Tegra" or something of the sort on packaging and actual unit. If margins on gaming devices are minimal, why bother? You do it for brand visibility, to increase the value of the product, and ultimately to reach out to other companies with products that will have greater margins.

What this means for Nintendo is it'd get a great deal on a pretty advanced technology which is just about the only way Nintendo would do such a thing.
Just being honest here guys, Tegra X1 and X2 would need to be extremely downgraded to have any good battery life. Wii U portable? Meh
X1, yes. X2, no. The entire point of going with X2 is Nintendo would get better performance than the best X1 with greater efficiency. X1 is about twice as powerful as Wii U. X2 with decent battery life is expected to be in that range.
Quote
About bringing Third Party games to NX: "one that's easy to program and work on" no Third Party would port to Tegra
Porting to Tegra isn't that difficult. Just about all middleware supports ARM.
That may be but amd had socs  Nvidia does not, this is reason to believe it'll be  amd for the home console.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but Tegra is a system on a chip. If you're talking about contracts again, it's conceivable that Nintendo asked Nvidia not to announce anything as it would out NX immediately. If Nvidia were to announce a semi-custom design wins as AMD had, everyone would know it was Nintendo as both Sony and Microsoft very publicly jilted Nvidia.

I'm not really sure why you're so vehemently against Nintendo going with Nvidia's Tegra. I've been #TeamAMD for years now, but in light of everything above, it makes sense. If Nvidia offered Nintendo a deal that AMD couldn't match financially and/or technologically, I don't see why Nintendo would ever not take that deal.

Because amd has socs and a few they can't talk about yet.NX fits in that camp.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on July 31, 2016, 04:20:38 PM
Furthermore, I expect NX to be an iterative game platform, with hardware updates pushed out every 2 years or even quicker, just like we can expect to see with the PS4 and Xbox from now on.

Please god, no.
It's the future Soren! We all manage it with our phones and PCs and they are more expensive devices. You won't be forced to upgrade, it'll be up to devs to decide to support older models and they will often strive to do so. But there will be a gradual march forward in processing power and us gamers will migrate forward at our own pace.

My computer is from before half life 2, and my phone is a no frills flip phone. I can buy a console every 4-5 years. I can't keep up with you upper middle class types. Believe me I tried.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MagicCow64 on July 31, 2016, 04:49:50 PM
There's no need to prove that thing fake, it's a Raspberry Pi with a touch screen and an LCD. The Tegra X1 would die in a matter of seconds if you ran it without a heat sink. Here's a link to the device in the screenshot - http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/7-7-Inch-TFT-Touch-Screen-LCD-Display-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-or-B-HDMI/1491443_32217991621.html (http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/7-7-Inch-TFT-Touch-Screen-LCD-Display-for-Raspberry-Pi-Model-B-or-B-HDMI/1491443_32217991621.html)



I feel silly trying to give more credence to this "leak", but it never claimed that picture was the NX, just that it was a facsimile of what the dev kit looked like. So, again, not proven fake yet. Keep it on the rumor bingo board.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on July 31, 2016, 06:29:18 PM
Because amd has socs and a few they can't talk about yet.NX fits in that camp.
You flat-out said Nvidia does not have SOCs which is entirely false.
That may be but amd had socs  Nvidia does not, this is reason to believe it'll be  amd for the home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on July 31, 2016, 07:00:04 PM
Because amd has socs and a few they can't talk about yet.NX fits in that camp.
You flat-out said Nvidia does not have SOCs which is entirely false.
That may be but amd had socs  Nvidia does not, this is reason to believe it'll be  amd for the home console.

We'll see ;) But don't be surprise if it's AMD, keep in mind I've been talking of the Home Console and not the handheld, and yes they are two different devices.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on July 31, 2016, 10:40:21 PM
I wouldn't mind at all if AMD is doing the chips for it, honestly. I prefer them for PCs for family members too because I'm so price conscious plus I love me an underdog.

It's just that if I had to choose between the two rumors, I just feel like there's more "truthiness" on the Nvidia side of things... based on absolutely nothing objective, lol.

But as for Nintendo using them BOTH? (NVidia for Handheld AMD for Console) My mind can't wrap itself around that idea! @_@  I thought a major point of the NX would be to make it EASIER for Nintendo/devs to develop a game ONCE and then release it across more than a single piece of hardware!

Also I'm starting to dislike the "Hybrid" moniker for a lot of these ideas because I feel it might be misleading. If there's a handheld AND a console unit and they both play the same games more or less, that's not a hybrid, that's a single ecosystem which gives consumers their choice of form factor/power.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 01, 2016, 02:04:54 AM
We'll see, but everyone's just piggy backing on this rumor. EG was wrong on the successor to the DS, I believe it's the same scenario. Evidence contradicts everything we've heard in the last year. Just have to wait for Nintendo to announce the unveiling.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 01, 2016, 04:03:29 AM
I just did some digging back into the Hybrid speculation (mostly just what I was saying... because it was easier to search for myself) and damn, was I putting up the argument for the for that powerful Handheld w/ a "tvbox" attached to the TV for home play... all the way back in October 2013.

I will be juiced if this Hybrid idea is what ends up happening.
I'm all for a "customized" Tegra X2 based system, and a Roku-like docking system.
especially if this dock allowed for massive local storage for game/app/data management and allowed hot-swapping of content on and off of your portable device

I think removable controllers (that function like wiimote+'s?) sounds pretty awesome

I also think it would be dope AF if Nintendo eventually released a full fledged home console that worked hand-in-hand w/ this hybrid portable. But it would be even more awesome if it wasn't even needed because they just handled the Hybrid right from the start and it was adopted across the industry.

and for something that is supposedly launching in March of next year, they really don't have a lot of time left to announce the thing properly. It was speculated that since Nvidia is revealing the X2 sometime in August, that is when the NX has it's coming out party.

I guess the waiting game continues.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 01, 2016, 04:13:17 PM
For Honor will not run on Tegra, just a thought.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on August 01, 2016, 06:38:54 PM
We're really thinking of this in terms of tegra only. If there is a dock console it could very well have some sort of other nvidia chip.

https://youtu.be/Xn1EsFe7snQ?t=1196

watching this video Nintendo and Nvidia might have some synergy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Agent-X- on August 01, 2016, 06:40:26 PM
We're really thinking of this in terms of tegra only. If there is a dock console it could very well have some sort of other nvidia chip.


That is my hope and is something I suggested earlier in this thread. The Tegra chip doesn't have to be the primary GPU in the home console...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 01, 2016, 07:03:49 PM
Nvidia has had SoCs for years. X1 is their 6th generation Tegra SoC.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 01, 2016, 07:44:13 PM
Not in the console sector, and not since the original Xbox.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 01, 2016, 08:13:47 PM
Not in the console sector, and not since the original Xbox.
So we're moving the goal posts now?  I have a feeling the NX will be revealed this month and we'll all find out what's up at that point hopefully.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 01, 2016, 08:34:42 PM
Not in the console sector, and not since the original Xbox.
So we're moving the goal posts now?  I have a feeling the NX will be revealed this month and we'll all find out what's up at that point hopefully.

Indeed, but it won't be what EG is leading it to be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 01, 2016, 09:23:25 PM
So that Brazilian forum rumor talked about how the NX was very modular, with interchangeable CPU, GPU, and LCD screen.

I think ideally, Nintendo doesn't not want to again marry itself to a specific chip, like it did with the PowerPC. A software platform that can move, using technology like GLES and Vulkan, to x86 or ARM, Nvidia or AMD. That's easier said than done.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 01, 2016, 09:32:51 PM
hmmm....
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 01, 2016, 10:56:39 PM
The original Xbox did not use an SoC. It was basically a custom micro ATX motherboard with a custom 733 MHz Intel Pentium 3, custom Nvidia GeForce 3 GPU, standard IDE HDD, standard IDE DVD-ROM and custom USB controllers.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on August 01, 2016, 11:56:55 PM
Not in the console sector, and not since the original Xbox.
So we're moving the goal posts now?  I have a feeling the NX will be revealed this month and we'll all find out what's up at that point hopefully.

Indeed, but it won't be what EG is leading it to be.

If I was pressed to make a choice I wouldn't bet on Eurogamer's information being completely on the mark, but I don't see how you can categorically declare that they're wrong given the general lack of concrete information out there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on August 02, 2016, 12:12:51 AM
Take anything the media tells you with a grain of salt.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on August 02, 2016, 12:20:19 AM
Take anything the media tells you with a grain of salt.

Do trust Gaf posters who have been "vetted" by mods.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on August 02, 2016, 12:29:27 AM
Take anything the media tells you with a grain of salt.

Do trust Gaf posters who have been "vetted" by mods.
Maybe, I'm just sceptical of a lot of the stuff on this thread.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on August 02, 2016, 12:35:07 AM
If you look at it, what were some things that worked with Wii U?

The controller was great, but it needed improvement...it would be nice if you could take it more than a few feet away from the console. It needed dual touch.

The system had augmented reality, but it was rarely used. I have an augmented reality game idea, but i have no idea how I would program it.

Nintendo actually released 2 version of wii u. A deluxe version and a cheaper shittier version. The only difference was storage space, but Nintendo could theoretically decide to have a few models of NX each with different levels. Nintendo could release systems that have different levels of power. They would scale down depending on how much you want to pay. Nintendo wouldn't usually do this, they would rather have a mass market version and push that. However, Nintendo does kinda do this with the DS line. Having a few models does two things. It give 3rd parties no excuse, and it allows some flexibility.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on August 02, 2016, 01:00:43 AM
Reading through the thread, I still see no compelling reason to have one hybrid console rather than a handheld and console that share the same game format.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 02, 2016, 01:32:25 AM
Reading through the thread, I still see no compelling reason to have one hybrid console rather than a handheld and console that share the same game format.

I didn't read through this thread, but maybe you could revisit an old thread for a more compelling reason?
http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=43282.msg819203#msg819203

I think it's just as valid now, even though it was made almost 3 years ago.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on August 02, 2016, 02:12:16 AM
I think in the Hybrid versus two-form factor discussion, Nintendo might be able to have their cake and eat it too.

What if the NX Handheld was close to what Eurogamer described, and could dock to a TV if so desired at little to minor graphical bump? Then the NX Console was a beefier version of the exact same, but could play the exact same game media at higher resolutions?

You don't need to force a handheld-console hybrid to do two different things well, it might end up doing neither (power for a console experience being a counter-force to longer battery life). It's one of the reasons the rumors about an actively-cooled Devkit sounds so crazy, why are you overclocking a Tegra X1? You can't stick fans in a portable handheld! And if you go with a Tegra X2, aren't you increasing the price above mass market? And can you get enough power from the Tegra X2 to make a powerful experience when the hybrid is in console mode while making sure it can still down-power for handheld mode?

Instead, have two distinct products, different form factors that play the exact same game so you get the expanded unified library, but with a really great handheld that downscales visuals with a cheaper processor (Maybe a die-shrunk Tegra X1?) and a beefy console that upscales visuals (with a Tegra X1.5 or Tegra 2?). That would explain the overclocked Tegra X1 dev kit rumors, the dev kit would HAVE to be able to do console level development, and then just downscale to Handheld for the "handheld" mode of the game. Nintendo would even double dip with consumers like me who would want both even though I wouldn't actually need both.

Now, maybe the "NX Console" takes a slightly different form, like a "Super Dock" as opposed to the simple no-improvement dock that comes with the handheld. Or maybe the Handheld launches first, and the Console/SuperDock comes to market 6 months later?

Still, the advantage of committing to two distinct form factors is that each can do its natural purpose better, but if they play the same media and share the exact same game carts, then they continue to reap all the benefits of a single "Hybrid" (focused development, combined library).

I personally find a single Monolithic Hybrid less interesting than games that I can take from my Handheld, plug into my Console, keep gaming on TV, and plug back into my Handheld to continue gaming on the Go. It even makes sense because the saved games will be on the Game Cartridge itself!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on August 02, 2016, 02:52:41 AM
Kairon's officially on the hype train

(https://az616578.vo.msecnd.net/files/responsive/embedded/any/tablet/2015/09/25/635787550977653630273730233_1d3.png)

Also Kairon, since the handheld can actually process gameplay, it could stream it to the dock ala the Wii U in reverse, allowing for apps and games to be thrown on the TV. And it's not farfetched to think they could be used as controllers for the console, allowing for the evolution of the Wii U idea, ie multiple tablet ideas.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on August 02, 2016, 03:20:57 AM
Hey, I dig the "Buy lots of portables then use them as controllers" idea. That's money in Nintendo's pocket, supports two-screen gaming, and is just too synergistically sweet!

And I forgot about the streaming to TV tech. Hmm... though I don't see the point honestly. Why not just plug it in, detach the controllers, and sit back on the couch?

The thing I'm having trouble wrapping my head around is how Nintendo can get cost savings on the handheld if they use a die-shrunk Tegra chip, even if it was just based off of the X1. I had assumed that all the savings Nintendo has is because NVidia was stuck with extra 20nm inventory, but if they go to newer 16nm chips for the extra power efficiency, then where are the savings coming from? Would Nvidia have been that hungry for a place at the console table?

This is bouncing around in my head because my hype-train dreams are that the portable is cheap right at launch. $249 is the highest I can imagine the NX Handheld being, and that's at the very very high end. Can you imagine launching a $199 piece of tech that plays the newest Zelda both on the go and plugged into the TV? WOW!

Then also let everyone know they can play the same game (even same game cartridge) in more beauty on an optional $$350-400 home console/super dock. The Console would be the fancy schmancy power unit that's targeted at the enthusiast market, less popular but there to assuage power-hungry spec shoppers. Those sorts of consumers wouldn't normally buy a super-pricey Nintendo console, but this one would ride the software library coat-tails of its mass-market priced little brother and... AHHH HYPE TRAIN!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 02, 2016, 09:24:50 AM
Handheld first.  Nintendo NX>go
Hybrid portable with TV dock

Then Xmas of the following year. Nintendo NX>home
Home console that doubles as super dock for popular NX>go portable.

I could see it happening.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 02, 2016, 10:17:49 AM
AMD said Scorpio was one design win, Xbox One S is considered "new SOC business" not a new design win :) https://t.co/zwYK0l2ahW
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on August 02, 2016, 10:35:20 AM
And I forgot about the streaming to TV tech. Hmm... though I don't see the point honestly. Why not just plug it in, detach the controllers, and sit back on the couch?

I was thinking for games like mmorpgs or apps like Netflix, you'd want a touchscreen in front of you rather than a controller.

Then also let everyone know they can play the same game (even same game cartridge) in more beauty on an optional $$350-400 home console/super dock. The Console would be the fancy schmancy power unit that's targeted at the enthusiast market, less popular but there to assuage power-hungry spec shoppers. Those sorts of consumers wouldn't normally buy a super-pricey Nintendo console, but this one would ride the software library coat-tails of its mass-market priced little brother and... AHHH HYPE TRAIN!

This. So much this.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: King of Twitch on August 02, 2016, 01:18:06 PM
What if the NX is a tv hybrid so you don't have to buy a tv and you can watch your tv on the bus-- awwugh shoot that's a stupid idea forget I said it
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 02, 2016, 03:29:33 PM
Lisa Su from AMD. She talked about both XB1S and Scorpio, clearly saying Scorpio was 1 design win. 2 more later. https://t.co/CwN8EU7Lpv
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 02, 2016, 06:53:08 PM
PS4 Neo and whatever comes after the Scorpio.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 02, 2016, 08:41:11 PM
PS4 Neo and whatever comes after the Scorpio.

NX my dear Watson ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 02, 2016, 08:58:15 PM
Lisa Su from AMD also said they more SOC design wins besides just the 3, so we'll see, in due time https://t.co/2GISoz9jTC
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on August 02, 2016, 09:14:04 PM
Not a huge surprise, but it sounds like Ubisoft has more in the works for the NX beyond Just Dance 2017:

Quote
Another new technology that Ubisoft is excited to support is the Nintendo NX. Of course, Nintendo has yet to say anything at all about its new hardware while the rumor mill continues to present plenty of plausible possibilities, but Corre assures me that Ubisoft is gearing up for a slate of titles beyond Just Dance.

"We announced that we're developing Just Dance for NX and we have other surprises that we will announce later, but we also believe Nintendo has the power to reinvent the way families are playing," Corre tells me. "Nintendo is a fantastic powerhouse of brands that are really cherished by a lot of fans and families... I am still impressed by the reoccurrence of success and appetite even today for the Nintendo franchises on the current system."

Ubisoft's games don't typically appeal to me, but these comments are certainly a good sign for early third party support.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-08-01-ubisoft-our-vr-games-will-be-profitable
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Dasmos on August 02, 2016, 09:20:12 PM
What this means is Beyond Good and Evil 2 is a NX exclusive, right? Right?!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 02, 2016, 11:13:44 PM
Umm, Nvidia does make CPUs (licensed technology from ARM) so that Twitter post has no merit. Tegra = CPU, GPU, RAM, etc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Kairon on August 02, 2016, 11:14:12 PM
Isn't Ubisoft ALWAYS game for first mover status? They get in to a new platform before others, benefit due to being among the fewer early choices, but whether they stick around is another story.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 02, 2016, 11:16:18 PM
Also, we are at the point where Nvidia would have denied any involvement with the NX by now, and Nintendo would have released a statement about speculation to the press.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 02, 2016, 11:25:22 PM
But nothing makes it certain that it's nvidia especially for the home console besides the rumor, which for all intent could be false leaks. We'll see though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on August 02, 2016, 11:32:28 PM
Umm
Stop it, TJ.
Also, we are at the point where Nvidia would have denied any involvement with the NX by now, and Nintendo would have released a statement about speculation to the press.
NVidia, probably. Nintendo, who knows? Sometimes, it doesn't comment. Sometimes, it does, but when it does, it may or may not flat-out lie to everyone. Silence makes Nintendo look less terrible. I mean, no comment is a comment in itself, but it's better than actual dishonesty. No need to deny if it's just going to make a formal announcement in a few weeks. I wonder if Nintendo has figured out that its public relations department sucks balls. Scott Moffitt left which may not have been entirely voluntary so maybe Nintendo realized its marketing department sucked balls and finally did something about it. Hopefully, PR is next. Baby steps.

Nvidia will be at the Hot Chips conference on August 22 which is where it's expected the company formally reveals the X2. Slim chance Nintendo gets mentioned, but it would lead the way for Nintendo announce an Nvidia partnership shortly after. My bet is on September to boost the quarter because Nintendo had ****-all during this period.
But nothing makes it certain that it's nvidia especially for the home console besides the rumor, which for all intent could be false leaks. We'll see though.
But nothing makes it certain that it's AMD especially for the home console besides the rumor, which for all intent could be false leaks. We'll see though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 01:42:32 AM
I'll rebuke you with a only thing for sure is nothings for sure.

And if Nvidia announces nothing with the x2 then what's the conensus?

Amd has more to announce, but time will tell.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on August 03, 2016, 05:17:36 AM
We're discussing rumors. Of course, nothing is for sure. It's just weird that you keep bringing up AMD despite recent reports all pointing to Nvidia powering NX. Eurogamer may be wrong and no one has a perfect track record, but by the same token, no one is refuting either. It's been about a week and there haven't been any denials by Nintendo, Nvidia, nor another insider. While we can't say anything is certain until given official word from Nintendo and its partners, all signs are pointing to:

1. NX using an Nvidia semi-custom SOC.
2. There is no separate console.

I mean, I'd prefer a dedicated console, but looking at this objectively, nothing is supporting that right now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on August 03, 2016, 10:38:53 AM
This discussion has pretty much peaked for now. In the interest of talking about something else here's Digital Foundry taking a theoretical look at a possible Gamecube/Wii Virtual Console.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 03, 2016, 12:21:13 PM
Not a huge surprise, but it sounds like Ubisoft has more in the works for the NX beyond Just Dance 2017:

Quote
Another new technology that Ubisoft is excited to support is the Nintendo NX. Of course, Nintendo has yet to say anything at all about its new hardware while the rumor mill continues to present plenty of plausible possibilities, but Corre assures me that Ubisoft is gearing up for a slate of titles beyond Just Dance.

"We announced that we're developing Just Dance for NX and we have other surprises that we will announce later, but we also believe Nintendo has the power to reinvent the way families are playing," Corre tells me. "Nintendo is a fantastic powerhouse of brands that are really cherished by a lot of fans and families... I am still impressed by the reoccurrence of success and appetite even today for the Nintendo franchises on the current system."

Ubisoft's games don't typically appeal to me, but these comments are certainly a good sign for early third party support.

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-08-01-ubisoft-our-vr-games-will-be-profitable

Ubisoft gushed about the Wii U as well.  I guess this is better than if things were so dire that even Ubisoft wouldn't give the NX a shot but it's more a sign of things being "not terrible" instead of specifically good.  The constant mention of families suggests lots of Just Dance and Petz.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 04:41:47 PM
Here's something I found interesting from Iwata a year ago:

IWATA: "What we mean by integrating platforms is NOT INTEGRATING HANDHELDS DEVICES AND HOME CONSOLES TO MAKE ONLY ONE MACHINE. What we are aiming at is to integrate the architecture to form a common basis for software development so that we can make software assets more transferable and operating systems and their build-in applications more portable regardless of form factor or performance of each platform".

So if this still carries weight, then it still suggests that the handheld and home console are separate.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 04:51:22 PM
Eurogamer debunked? https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on August 03, 2016, 05:07:09 PM
I just hope some games are revealed soon...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on August 03, 2016, 05:17:30 PM
I would be ecstatic if Nintendo did GameCube Virtual Console. There are a lot of games I missed out on during the GameCube years that I really wanna play, but trying to get a copy of games like Skies of Arcadia and Fire Emblem: Path of Radiance is prohibitively expensive now (though I guess getting games like that isn't a guarantee even if they do ahead with the service). While it's not going to push consoles on its own, GameCube Virtual Console would be a good complement to Nintendo's launch lineup if they could have it ready in time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 05:20:38 PM
We're discussing rumors. Of course, nothing is for sure. It's just weird that you keep bringing up AMD despite recent reports all pointing to Nvidia powering NX. Eurogamer may be wrong and no one has a perfect track record, but by the same token, no one is refuting either. It's been about a week and there haven't been any denials by Nintendo, Nvidia, nor another insider. While we can't say anything is certain until given official word from Nintendo and its partners, all signs are pointing to:

1. NX using an Nvidia semi-custom SOC.
2. There is no separate console.

I mean, I'd prefer a dedicated console, but looking at this objectively, nothing is supporting that right now.

There's quite abit that supports amd over nvidia, unless the 22nd reveals something, but it's off that Nvidia hasn't revealed anything of such to share holders as that would be important and would raise stock prices.

Just because EG and others are going by rumors doesn't mean that will be the end product, all these sources have been wrong before at one point or another. Also IGN once stated that the Wii U would be as powerful as the X1, but we knew how that turned out.

But we'll find out between now and September.

Right now we know It's possible that it'll be AMD or Nvidia, or it could even be both. One for Console AMD and the Handheld Nvidia... although not sure how software would work with Nintendo wanting unify things via software with very different GPU's.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Mop it up on August 03, 2016, 05:22:06 PM
Yeah, a GCN VC is something I was hoping for out of the Wii U, especially once I saw the GCN controller adapter. The Wii U is already capable of handling GCN emulation so I see no reason why the NX couldn't. I missed out on a fair number of GCN games, most of which have gone up in price more than I'm willing to pay, so I'd probably buy quite a few on VC. In addition to the two Oedo mentioned, I'd also hope for more obscure stuff like Chibi-Robo and Cubivore.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 05:24:25 PM
Yeah, a GCN VC is something I was hoping for out of the Wii U, especially once I saw the GCN controller adapter. The Wii U is already capable of handling GCN emulation so I see no reason why the NX couldn't. I missed out on a fair number of GCN games, most of which have gone in price more than I'm willing to pay, so I'd probably buy quite a few on VC. In addition to the two Oedo mentioned, I'd also hope for more obscure stuff like Chibi-Robo and Cubivore.

I would love for that, I always wanted to get MGS: TTS  and a few others.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 05:25:54 PM
Also be cool if the NX could upscale and bump the textures and stuff to those old games, maybe even improve the frame rate and lighting.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on August 03, 2016, 05:27:40 PM
Here's something I found interesting from Iwata a year ago:

IWATA: "What we mean by integrating platforms is NOT INTEGRATING HANDHELDS DEVICES AND HOME CONSOLES TO MAKE ONLY ONE MACHINE. What we are aiming at is to integrate the architecture to form a common basis for software development so that we can make software assets more transferable and operating systems and their build-in applications more portable regardless of form factor or performance of each platform".

So if this still carries weight, then it still suggests that the handheld and home console are separate.

That quote is from January, 2013. https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html (https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html)

Eurogamer debunked? https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI (https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI)


My rumor is bigger than your rumor. Nah uh, not so! My rumor is the biggest one of all!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 05:42:05 PM
Here's something I found interesting from Iwata a year ago:

IWATA: "What we mean by integrating platforms is NOT INTEGRATING HANDHELDS DEVICES AND HOME CONSOLES TO MAKE ONLY ONE MACHINE. What we are aiming at is to integrate the architecture to form a common basis for software development so that we can make software assets more transferable and operating systems and their build-in applications more portable regardless of form factor or performance of each platform".

So if this still carries weight, then it still suggests that the handheld and home console are separate.

That quote is from January, 2013. https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html (https://www.nintendo.co.jp/ir/en/library/events/130131/05.html)

Eurogamer debunked? https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI (https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI)


My rumor is bigger than your rumor. Nah uh, not so! My rumor is the biggest one of all!

But my Le pepe is huge! It's Hydrolic!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Stogi on August 03, 2016, 06:26:27 PM
Handheld first.  Nintendo NX>go
Hybrid portable with TV dock

Then Xmas of the following year. Nintendo NX>home
Home console that doubles as super dock for popular NX>go portable.

I could see it happening.

I can see a stagger release but not as far as you're suggesting. NXGO in March 17 NXGOHOME November 24.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: KeyBilly on August 03, 2016, 06:29:58 PM
Eurogamer debunked? https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI (https://youtu.be/ljBwUlaG8cI)

While we may still get the traditional console with an AMD processor, the debunking here seems to be based on overly literal interpretations of Nintendo's and AMD's PR.  If it is a hybrid as the rumor suggests, Nintendo still may sell it as a new thing rather than a replacement to their console and mobile platforms.  That leaves them room to make the traditional console and portable if the NX fails.  The rumors seem to be based on development units using Tegra X1 chips, which only gives us a clue to the general architecture.  The final design, if mobile, will likely be a custom chip made to work in that form factor.  It might be both Pascal and weaker than we would expect.  With that said, the 3DS has poor battery life, so they may not have that as a priority anymore.

Digital Foundry has been a great resource lately.  For virtual console, it would be nice if they do render some games to 1080p at 60 fps.  It wouldn't work for everything and would require a lot more testing than just straight emulation.  You can emulate GCN/Wii games with nice filtering at 4K on a PC, but they are buggy and require tinkering to actually play.  Good HD emulations would be worth paying a decent premium for.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 03, 2016, 06:36:34 PM
I just hope some games are revealed soon...

This. While I'm definitely interested to see what new concept Nintendo may be cooking up for their hardware, it'd be really nice to see some big name games announced and see what kind of software projects they are currently developing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 06:38:18 PM
It would seem and even heard the NX that we know of would be a Home console, as right now that's where Nintendo is hurting the most, the 3DS is pretty fine and has plenty of software coming, the Wii U has nothing other than Paper Mario color splash, and Darksiders warmastered edition.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ThePerm on August 03, 2016, 07:14:37 PM
Alright so based on your linked info it would seem they are developing a console and a new handheld. We may not know about the handheld immediately, but they may be announced at the same time because 3ds has been out long enough as well. Plus they upgrade handhelds all the time and there is little risk in showing off a newer handheld.

I think they are going the tegra route. I'm not sure, but how related are the gpu's for Geforce and Tegra(Maxwell /Pascal? OR how flexible is the Tegra line? Maybe Nvidia is designing a custom superpowered home console Tegra chip for the NX. I have an ouya, that was tegra, but that was like 3 generations of Tegra ago, and not custom. Nintendo chips generally are always special custom versions. I would imagine Nintendo might still pair it with an extra cpu even if it does have an SOC tegra. Maybe still another IBM PPC or an extra ARM.

Also, note Nintendo buys in bulk, is a new customer, and has excellent credit. This might give Nintendo some low prices on Nvidia's best tech.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 07:41:19 PM
http://www.forbes.com/sites/moorinsights/2016/05/23/a-cache-coherent-interconnect-for-accelerators-ccix-fantasy-or-nirvana/#1333bdf86afa

Apparenty Xilinx is part of AMD partnership, Nvidia is not. Nintendo software engineers are using xilinx in current dev kits.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on August 03, 2016, 07:45:29 PM
egh!
This website says this.
That website says that.

See the pattern guys?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 03, 2016, 07:47:44 PM
egh!
This website says this.
That website says that.

See the pattern guys?

Websites can't be trusted?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on August 03, 2016, 07:53:07 PM
egh!
This website says this.
That website says that.

See the pattern guys?

Websites can't be trusted?
DING DING DING!
50 points for SHYGUY!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 03, 2016, 08:03:32 PM
The evidence in piling up for Team#AMD lol
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on August 03, 2016, 08:37:55 PM
It would seem and even heard the NX that we know of would be a Home console, as right now that's where Nintendo is hurting the most, the 3DS is pretty fine and has plenty of software coming, the Wii U has nothing other than Paper Mario color splash, and Darksiders warmastered edition.


The 3DS is having a great 2016 in terms of software releases and sales are probably going to be better than people expected coming into the year, but Nintendo literally has one 3DS game announced for 2017 right now (Ever Oasis) and it's probably not a coincidence that they aren't even the ones developing it. Nintendo will likely release more than just that and there are a few major titles announced from third parties like Dragon Quest XI and Lady Layton, but taken as a whole the 3DS does not have a whole lot announced for 2017. Yeah, it's much better off than the Wii U in a general sense, but if you're looking at software lineups it still appears that the 3DS is getting replaced very soon.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Wah on August 03, 2016, 08:39:22 PM
...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 03, 2016, 09:26:05 PM
It would seem and even heard the NX that we know of would be a Home console, as right now that's where Nintendo is hurting the most, the 3DS is pretty fine and has plenty of software coming, the Wii U has nothing other than Paper Mario color splash, and Darksiders warmastered edition.


Type upcoming Nintendo games in Google and be amazed at all that is coming out for both the Wii U and 3DS. 3DS just looks good right now because of all the 3rd party RPG releases. If you want to believe Nintendo is going the handheld/console hybrid, then you can use the lack of announced software for both systems as you evidence that Nintendo is preparing to shut down game production on both systems in order to put all its games in the NX hybrid.

The 3DS is having a great 2016 in terms of software releases and sales are probably going to be better than people expected coming into the year, but Nintendo literally has one 3DS game announced for 2017 right now (Ever Oasis) and it's probably not a coincidence that they aren't even the ones developing it. Nintendo will likely release more than just that and there are a few major titles announced from third parties like Dragon Quest XI and Lady Layton, but taken as a whole the 3DS does not have a whole lot announced for 2017. Yeah, it's much better off than the Wii U in a general sense, but if you're looking at software lineups it still appears that the 3DS is getting replaced very soon.

Oedo is making the same point. It's possible Nintendo still might release a few more 3DS games if the Hybrid is real and launches in March. They still released some big DS games just before and after the 3DS came out. Most notably Pokémon Black and White as well as Pokémon Black 2 and White 2. So, something like Lady Layton might still be released on 3DS next year if the Hybrid is true but I wouldn't expect to see much more.

Has there ever been a point in Nintendo's history and release schedule where there are almost no game titles announced as being in development or upcoming beyond the next 4 months for both its console and handheld? Usually there's a few titles that will have been announced for the late winter, spring and early summer timeframe. But, for once, there isn't. The absence of software is very strange.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 03, 2016, 11:19:59 PM
The Wii U does not do GameCube emulation, in can play GameCube games natively, it just doesn't - unless you have Nintendont installed on your Wii U. The Wii U chip family is the Wii family is the GameCube family. Same processors, different clockspeeds (and core counts).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 12:56:30 AM
More info on NX https://youtu.be/eCO8e8dDGYk

SMD64 gives a shout out to NWR for their radio broadcast  doubting EG's rumor.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 04, 2016, 01:08:40 AM
More info on NX https://youtu.be/eCO8e8dDGYk

Uh-oh, SuperMetalDave64 references NWR's Radio Free Nintendo as a source of excellent analysis. I can't believe him now. :(
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 01:22:53 AM
Well his information has credit with what took place earlier on youtube.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 04, 2016, 01:34:42 AM
Hmm well, SMD64 did argue with Shaymin about leaks, so that puts him back in my good graces. ;)

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/editorial/41982/leak-debunker-february-2016-edition
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 08:02:18 AM
lol shyguy
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 02:02:59 PM
More info from SMD64 via french developer contact: Translated:NX runs ports easily from PS4, UE4 & Unity run perfectly. NX has VR/AR chips.Final Architecture is secret https://t.co/tOtNQ2cFp8
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 04, 2016, 04:19:55 PM
Rumour that Nintendo is aiming to get a Zelda, Pokémon and Mario game out for the NX within the first six months of its life:  http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678 (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678)

Sounds great in theory but I know that not all Mario and Pokémon games carry the same weight.  We know that Zelda will be Breath of the Wild but Nintendo could fairly easily crank out another NSMB and a Pokémon Stadium game to pad out the lineup (or maybe a Pokken "sequel" in the typical incremental fighting game style).  Better than nothing obviously but not the amazing thrill that a Mario/Zelda/Pokémon sounds like at first.  Both Mario and Pokémon have lots of spinoffs.  It would be very easy for Nintendo to technically check those boxes.

The article also says "It won’t appeal to PS4 fans. Nintendo seems set on trying to upgrade smartphone gamers.” which is not really up my alley at all but certainly SEEMS like the approach Nintendo would take.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Soren on August 04, 2016, 04:22:42 PM
More info from SMD64 via french developer contact: Translated:NX runs ports easily from PS4, UE4 & Unity run perfectly. NX has VR/AR chips.Final Architecture is secret https://t.co/tOtNQ2cFp8 (https://t.co/tOtNQ2cFp8)

NX runs ports from PS4 easily? The same report (translated from Gaf) goes on to say:

Quote
"On the other hand,the ports demand special optimisation due to the different architecture from the XB0 and PS4. Once again, the talent and methods used by des will make the difference."

That sounds like porting to Nintendo consoles 101 for sure. Expect the same results if true. Also (bolded for emphasis by me)

Quote
"The feedback from people in contact with the first dev kits is unanimous, the feeling is especially positive. Nx will be different from the other machines and interesting"

Tegra confirmed alongside Half Life 3 NX handheld exclusive.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Adrock on August 04, 2016, 04:37:48 PM
I'd be shocked if Nintendo went back to the New Super Mario Bros. well. My guess is a Mario Maker port or a full 3D Mario but not Galaxy 3.

Trying to get smartphone gamers to upgrade is an interesting play, one we've all discussed here. We know Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing are coming to iOS/Android. Like Wii, Nintendo wants people to eventually move up to Mario and Zelda. That said, I don't think it's going to work on a scale that matters. If the rumors are true, Nintendo's mobile games will be playable on NX so fans can get them with or without a smart device. Fans of those series are likely where most of the revenue will come from. Still, the extra revenue from these titles is good for the company.

If NX is a portable that can dock to a TV, that isn't a bad move. Nintendo is betting on what has historically worked in the past. The dock is just a bonus for people like me who don't really like handheld gaming.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: nickmitch on August 04, 2016, 04:40:50 PM
Rumour that Nintendo is aiming to get a Zelda, Pokémon and Mario game out for the NX within the first six months of its life:  http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678 (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678)

Sounds great in theory but I know that not all Mario and Pokémon games carry the same weight.  We know that Zelda will be Breath of the Wild but Nintendo could fairly easily crank out another NSMB and a Pokémon Stadium game to pad out the lineup (or maybe a Pokken "sequel" in the typical incremental fighting game style).  Better than nothing obviously but not the amazing thrill that a Mario/Zelda/Pokémon sounds like at first.  Both Mario and Pokémon have lots of spinoffs.  It would be very easy for Nintendo to technically check those boxes.

The article also says "It won’t appeal to PS4 fans. Nintendo seems set on trying to upgrade smartphone gamers.” which is not really up my alley at all but certainly SEEMS like the approach Nintendo would take.

Upgrading smartphone gamers doesn't sound like the next, great 3D Mario adventure.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 04:53:41 PM
Rumour that Nintendo is aiming to get a Zelda, Pokémon and Mario game out for the NX within the first six months of its life:  http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678 (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678)

Sounds great in theory but I know that not all Mario and Pokémon games carry the same weight.  We know that Zelda will be Breath of the Wild but Nintendo could fairly easily crank out another NSMB and a Pokémon Stadium game to pad out the lineup (or maybe a Pokken "sequel" in the typical incremental fighting game style).  Better than nothing obviously but not the amazing thrill that a Mario/Zelda/Pokémon sounds like at first.  Both Mario and Pokémon have lots of spinoffs.  It would be very easy for Nintendo to technically check those boxes.

The article also says "It won’t appeal to PS4 fans. Nintendo seems set on trying to upgrade smartphone gamers.” which is not really up my alley at all but certainly SEEMS like the approach Nintendo would take.

The story smells fishy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 04, 2016, 04:56:52 PM
We know Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing are coming to iOS/Android. Like Wii, Nintendo wants people to eventually move up to Mario and Zelda. That said, I don't think it's going to work on a scale that matters. If the rumors are true, Nintendo's mobile games will be playable on NX so fans can get them with or without a smart device.

This sounds really horrible actually.  If the NX can play the mobile games then Nintendo might feel that the mobile games "count" as a proper entry in a series and they don't have to make something a little more legitimate.  It would be better if the platform was separate from mobile so that Nintendo would feel the need to create a Fire Emblem or Animal Crossing game designed specifically for the NX, which would presumably be a much better experience than a phone game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 04, 2016, 05:46:10 PM
We know Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing are coming to iOS/Android. Like Wii, Nintendo wants people to eventually move up to Mario and Zelda. That said, I don't think it's going to work on a scale that matters. If the rumors are true, Nintendo's mobile games will be playable on NX so fans can get them with or without a smart device.

This sounds really horrible actually.  If the NX can play the mobile games then Nintendo might feel that the mobile games "count" as a proper entry in a series and they don't have to make something a little more legitimate.  It would be better if the platform was separate from mobile so that Nintendo would feel the need to create a Fire Emblem or Animal Crossing game designed specifically for the NX, which would presumably be a much better experience than a phone game.

Yeah I call bs on that story, makes no logical sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Oedo on August 04, 2016, 05:51:03 PM
Miyamoto made some comments around E3 this year that made it sound like there was little chance we'd see a new Mario game within six months of the NX launch. In fact, he wouldn't even commit to it showing up at E3 next year:

Quote
"We're always challenging ourselves to create something new, so hopefully you'll see a new kind of Mario in about a year or two," Shigeru Miyamoto said in an interview with IGN.

"Maybe next E3 we'll be able to share something."

So yeah, if there is any truth to this rumour (as always, a big "if), it seems like it would have to be a port or an HD remake.

http://ca.ign.com/articles/2016/06/16/e3-2016-nintendo-a-new-kind-of-mario-is-coming

We know Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing are coming to iOS/Android. Like Wii, Nintendo wants people to eventually move up to Mario and Zelda. That said, I don't think it's going to work on a scale that matters. If the rumors are true, Nintendo's mobile games will be playable on NX so fans can get them with or without a smart device.

This sounds really horrible actually.  If the NX can play the mobile games then Nintendo might feel that the mobile games "count" as a proper entry in a series and they don't have to make something a little more legitimate.  It would be better if the platform was separate from mobile so that Nintendo would feel the need to create a Fire Emblem or Animal Crossing game designed specifically for the NX, which would presumably be a much better experience than a phone game.

Nintendo has said from the very beginning that they don't see mobile games as a substitute for the experiences they offer on dedicated gaming platforms. One of their major stated goals for this whole mobile initiative was to bring people who engage with their mobile titles over to their full-fledged console games, which runs counter to the idea that they wouldn't be working on a Fire Emblem game for consoles because they might also release their mobile Fire Emblem game on NX. We also know that Nintendo was looking to hire developers to work exclusively on mobile games, which suggests that they're not just shuffling around internal resources who would normally be working on console games to make their mobile games instead.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (#Team2017 Wins Again!)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 04, 2016, 06:35:35 PM
Based on those comments, they could also be making a Mario Galaxy 3 or another NSMB game since those would not be anything new, just direct sequels.  Sounds like he wants a new gimmick for a new Mario like the water backback on Sunshine or crazy gravity in Galaxy. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 01:11:44 AM
SMD64 Strikes again! https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 05, 2016, 01:55:42 AM
Like Wii, Nintendo wants people to eventually move up to Mario and Zelda. That said, I don't think it's going to work on a scale that matters.

Perhaps. Or maybe Nintendo has had time to look back on the Wii to better figure out how to do that. The Wii's success and sales for it's first 3 years was totally unexpected no matter how much us Nintendo fans were hoping that Nintendo could take back the market. Even though Nintendo did tap into a new market, they never seemed to have a clear strategy of how to crossover Wii Sport or Wii Fit users into traditional time gaming. Maybe they've figured something out with tapping into the mobile market where people are already playing games instead of creating new consumers that have to be sold on the concept of gaming.

Interestingly, from the same site Ian Sane linked to about Mario, Pokémon and Zelda being around at NX's launch, the site had this article talking about the sudden surge of 3DS sales and older Pokémon 3DS games (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/3ds-sales-up-over-200-per-cent-as-pok-mon-go-phenomenon-continues/0170682) along with the fact that Pokémon Sun and Moon presales have also risen significantly since the release of Pokémon Go. Now, it might just be some antidotal evidence and there's not a lot of data as to how much that translates into sales but I think it shows potential. People have not been talking about Nintendo in the news this much since the first few Wii years 8 - 10 years ago. It's gotten Nintendo's brand back into people's minds again. I don't think Pokémon has had this much exposure since the late 1990's. The result suggests to me that a lot of people are playing Pokémon Go and liking the experience so much that they want more and are now turning to the non-mobile fun market to play the current Pokémon games since that's the only other source for them.

It's like how Wii Sports was so big that people would try it and then go a buy a Wii so that they could also play Wii Sports. The difference is that Wii Sports was too simple and so a lot of these first time gamers or "casual" gamers were still intimidated from playing harder, more traditional games involving more button pressing and skill. You can't just swing a remote only in Mario Bros. or Metroid Prime or Kirby. You had to start learning normal control schemes. The challenge is how do you appeal to people to play those traditional games when they are only playing a video game for the first time because they don't really have to input anything except swinging the remote? If pressing buttons on a controller to play through a game didn't appeal to them for some 30 or so years, why would it now because they played a game where they didn't have to press a lot of buttons but just physically moved a controller? Phones appealed to that market because most games just required tapping on a screen. They're already used to tapping the phone to do other things so there's less intimidation to play a game when it just requires more tapping of the screen.

Now, with Pokémon Go, they're reaching out to people that are a bit more game savvy. Even if they're just used to playing mobile games, such people may be more open to playing a game on a handheld or console because they've learned some fundamentals of gaming. These are people who want to play games and they don't have to simplify your brand to appeal to them. They don't have to make the control method / scheme very basic. It's an easier consumer to win over because electronic gaming isn't a daunting prospect for them compared to a first-time or casual type video game player.

I felt like I had a clear vision of what I wanted to say and where I was going with this but it's getting late and I suddenly feel very tired and that this has all started to become murky and I'm losing my train of thought. But I've written this much so I'm posting and maybe someone else can take what I've started and run with it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 05, 2016, 01:59:17 AM

SMD64 Strikes again! https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4 (https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4)

For all we know these PS4 ports people keep talking about could be the usual suspects. Just Dance. Lego Dimensions. Skylanders. Stuff that won't break a console regardless of what's under the hood. Hell, the Wii U is getting a PS4 port pretty soon, and I'm betting that will run flawlessly on Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 03:15:21 AM
Sound's more plausible than EG's rumors.

SuperMetaldave64:

One big thing I forgot to mention in this rumor from Gameblog is that they also stated that the NX has VR/AR Compatible chips, so that also lends to the NX being more powerful as well. This entire rumor from Gameblog and the previous has 2 other rumors from them are very consistent in that it implies that the Nintendo NX is more powerful than PS4. It appears from these very opposite rumors for the mobile console that Eurogamer reported to these more powerful console rumors from Gameblog that we likely have at least 2 different dedicated devices for the Nintendo NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: ThePerm on August 05, 2016, 04:51:14 AM
I'm hoping for a 3d mario game without a gimmick. Or maybe Super Mario Sunshine 2. I was playing Mario Galaxy recently, and its lost some charm, I was getting motion sick. I can get right into Mario 64. I can get right into Mario Sunshine.

It would be kinda awesome if they Did "Super Mario Dream World". Basically the idea of Super Mario 2 in 3d. You can do a lot with the idea of dream reality.

Would a new traditional 3d mario game be in cycle? This could be one of the few times when Nintendo's teams are all ready at once. I usually say Nintendo doesn't plan ahead well enough to release a ton of good games at launch. However, they could accidentally have a bunch of good games at launch.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Adrock on August 05, 2016, 07:39:35 AM
Perhaps. Or maybe Nintendo has had time to look back on the Wii to better figure out how to do that.
I suppose that's where I disagree. I don't believe there is a way to do that. The audience for these mobile versions will largely be the people who already play the main games. The rest will mostly be content with just the mobile versions. Sure, there may be some people who move up to the main games. However, as previously stated, I doubt it will be on a scale that matters.

Nintendo's best bet with NX is keep it affordable, different, and focused on core gamers. Outside of Nintendo's own fanbase, people will be more open to an alternative product if it doesn't cost them too much to enter the ecosystem. People don't need or want another PS4 or One; they may be convinced to try something different and new as long as it isn't at a premium.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Ian Sane on August 05, 2016, 12:22:42 PM
I think the biggest challenge in regards to trying to get a casual gamer to "graduate" to deeper games is that videogames aren't passive entertainment like watching a video or listening to music.  The activity requires active participation from the user so you have to learn how to play and you might need some practice to become good at it and you can fail.  That limits the appeal because not everyone is going to get the hang of it or be interested enough to have the patience to develop skills in it.  It's the same reason why playing a sport or an instrument or something like that can be very popular but never to the point of something like watching a movie which requires virtually no effort from the user.

Everyone I know absolutely sucked at videogames the first time they played them, like mistiming your jump and getting killed by the first Goomba in Super Mario Bros.  But the concept interested us enough to put in the time and effort to learn the ropes and get to an acceptable skill level where it become fun.  I look at someone like my Dad who just immediately dismisses a videogame the second he struggles with it and it doesn't surprise me that he never got beyond bowling in Wii Sports and Solitaire on the computer.  He doesn't really have the interest and thus doesn't have the patience to become good enough at games to find them fun.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 05, 2016, 01:00:39 PM
Take-Two has confirmed they will not have any games at launch for NX, or for the fiscal year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 05, 2016, 01:46:35 PM
Take-Two has confirmed they will not have any games at launch for NX, or for the fiscal year.
Obviously because they don't want to port them to the Tegra chip.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 03:39:05 PM
Take-Two has confirmed they will not have any games at launch for NX, or for the fiscal year.
Obviously because they don't want to port them to the Tegra chip.

Unlikely that it's Integra, and more likely they have nothing to say yet, and who knows when their fiscal ends, could be March 2017. Either way I would wait, it's just take two. I'm sure we'll hear more in the coming months.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 08:02:03 PM
More info from Dave: Multiple sources and at least one from a major AAA Publisher (i know the location, can't say yet..) said: Games run better on NX vs PS4
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 05, 2016, 08:19:21 PM
More info from Dave: Multiple sources and at least one from a major AAA Publisher (i know the location, can't say yet..) said: Games run better on NX vs PS4

So is this supposed to be a "confirmation" that the NX is actually more powerful or more efficient that PS4? Cause I guess that would mean Nintendo is finally ready to Play with Power again. and edging out a system that's been out for almost 3.5yrs by the time you release is a start...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 05, 2016, 08:45:54 PM
Take-Two has confirmed they will not have any games at launch for NX, or for the fiscal year.
Obviously because they don't want to port them to the Tegra chip.

Unlikely that it's Integra, and more likely they have nothing to say yet, and who knows when their fiscal ends, could be March 2017. Either way I would wait, it's just take two. I'm sure we'll hear more in the coming months.
Didn't get the sarcasm I see.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 09:06:52 PM
Here's another for those still thinking it's nvidia: Happynintendofan: One developer told me, the Hyrbid rumor/report is 100% false. There 2 consoles, handheld and Home Console.

To Clearify, i wanted 2 get #TeamTegra 's attention: There's a lot more proof, lot of details, info, sources that back up a Home console.

 The Development kit has features (Gbit Ethernet, 4 USB, GPU/CPU Xilinx Tech) that don't fit a Hanheld/Mobile Form-Facor.

 I know of at least 3 Ex-Nvidia Enginers, that worked on heating problems back in Jan 2016 for a console, also from another company.

Dev kit has slots for multiple GPUs (PCIE/SLI), 8 Core CPU, Xilinx tech in the dev kit can boost CPU/GPU with 1GHZ/1GB RAM,Ethernet port

Xilinx involved in NX dev kit = DMP is involved too in #NX handheld & Console

And 4 the record: I'm 100% Sure about AMD, Still #TeamAMD there will be a Home Console
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 09:17:53 PM
Sounds very interesting and it's what I hoped with Nintendo, the unveiling can't come soon enough, soon we'l find out just what it truly is! "rubs hands menacingly"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 05, 2016, 09:22:13 PM
Also Dave mentions Digitimes saying Q416 for mass production of the NX, where is Nvidia reporting revenue to investors if they are involved with the chips?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 05, 2016, 10:07:21 PM
More info from Dave: Multiple sources and at least one from a major AAA Publisher (i know the location, can't say yet..) said: Games run better on NX vs PS4

Of course the Just Dance NX version is going to run better than the PS4 one...

Unlikely that it's Integra, and more likely they have nothing to say yet, and who knows when their fiscal ends, could be March 2017. Either way I would wait, it's just take two. I'm sure we'll hear more in the coming months.

Their fiscal year ends March 31. Still it's worrying to see they're not even bothering with a token NBA or WWE game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Shaymin on August 05, 2016, 10:55:04 PM
Might as well give it an extra few months and go with next year's games at that point. Warriors 2k17 and WWE launch within like, two weeks of each other around the first part of October.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 05, 2016, 11:12:02 PM
Was that an NBA dig. LOL.

Is it that bad online? I heard a few stories, but Warriors 2k17!?  LOL
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: nickmitch on August 05, 2016, 11:23:10 PM
I have friends who play NBA 2K, and they say the Warriors are incredibly OP.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Adrock on August 06, 2016, 12:07:08 AM
The NBA really should just cancel next season and just give Golden State the title. The best team in the league managed to sign a top three player. Yes, the Warriors were the best team last year (that Draymond Green suspension was bullshit and ruined the Finals). No, I'm not even a Warriors fan. My two favorite teams were the two worst teams last year. I should stop being a fan of things.

On topic, is there any reason to believe "happynintendofan" on Twitter has more credibility than a major publication like Eurogamer? I kind of want to dismiss what he/she says for misspelling "clarify" and using the number four instead of the word "for." Get your **** together.

At this point, I'm not on either #TeamAMD or #TeamNvidia. I was on the former; now I don't care. I'm on #TeamJustUnveilNXAlready.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 06, 2016, 12:29:30 AM
I have friends who play NBA 2K, and they say the Warriors are incredibly OP.

Was that an NBA dig. LOL.

Is it that bad online? I heard a few stories, but Warriors 2k17!?  LOL

Might as well give it an extra few months and go with next year's games at that point. Warriors 2k17 and WWE launch within like, two weeks of each other around the first part of October.

Stephen Curry (the human) is often described as a human cheat code. So yes. The Warriors in a video game are extremely OP.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 06, 2016, 01:08:28 AM
The NBA really should just cancel next season and just give Golden State the title. The best team in the league managed to sign a top three player. Yes, the Warriors were the best team last year (that Draymond Green suspension was bullshit and ruined the Finals). No, I'm not even a Warriors fan. My two favorite teams were the two worst teams last year. I should stop being a fan of things.


At this point, I'm not on either #TeamAMD or #TeamNvidia. I was on the former; now I don't care. I'm on #TeamJustUnveilNXAlready.


I 100% agree, but that is a topic for a different discussion in an NBA thread that apparently doesn't exist, because I looked for it during this past season... but I also didn't want to start it just to boast about Curry and the boys. Especially when they ultimately lost gm7 after being cheated in several different ways after gm4 and during gm6.


and I'm on #TeamWakeMeWhenTheShowStarts
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 06, 2016, 01:41:52 AM
Stephen Curry (the human) is often described as a human cheat code. So yes. The Warriors in a video game are extremely OP.

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/shyguy70/QcGPQM_zpsuvdkz0ko.gif) (http://s91.photobucket.com/user/shyguy70/media/QcGPQM_zpsuvdkz0ko.gif.html)

On Topic, #TeamPowerPC forever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 06, 2016, 01:54:59 AM
I don't care about basketball at all, I find it incredibly boring to watch, but as a general Cleveland sports fan everybody in this thread can suck it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 04:12:12 AM
The NBA really should just cancel next season and just give Golden State the title. The best team in the league managed to sign a top three player. Yes, the Warriors were the best team last year (that Draymond Green suspension was bullshit and ruined the Finals). No, I'm not even a Warriors fan. My two favorite teams were the two worst teams last year. I should stop being a fan of things.

On topic, is there any reason to believe "happynintendofan" on Twitter has more credibility than a major publication like Eurogamer? I kind of want to dismiss what he/she says for misspelling "clarify" and using the number four instead of the word "for." Get your **** together.

At this point, I'm not on either #TeamAMD or #TeamNvidia. I was on the former; now I don't care. I'm on #TeamJustUnveilNXAlready.

guy has access to stuff that an everyday fan doesn't have access to, he appears legit.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Adrock on August 06, 2016, 04:26:08 AM
guy has access to stuff that an everyday fan doesn't have access to, he appears legit.
So does Eurogamer, Emily Rogers etc. and you've pretty much dismissed them outright because what they said didn't line up with what you want. It's weird. What does it matter which company partners with Nintendo?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 04:34:35 AM
http://www.nintengen.com/2016/08/the-facts-nintendo-nx-using-nvidia-or.html (http://www.nintengen.com/2016/08/the-facts-nintendo-nx-using-nvidia-or.html)

 There was a report recently by Eurogamer indicating that Nvidia is working with Nintendo for the chipset of the Nintendo NX Portable Console device. However, there is no evidence for even an Nvidia “Theory” but actually many reasons against any Nvidia chips being used for a Nintendo NX Handheld or Home Console, see below for my comparison of the facts vs facts for both Nvidia and AMD possibilities:


Nvidia has never provided a Semi-Custom design win for a major game console

Nvidia Publicly stated in 2016 that they are moving away from mobile

Nvidia Publicly stated in 2016 they are designing the 25 watt Tegra X2 specifically for their Driverless Car Technology

Nvidia has not reported any Semi-Custom Design wins during 2016

Nvidia has not forecasted to their investors any new revenue (money to be made) for any volume orders of chips for the fiscal year.

Nvidia Tegra X1 or X2 would not be the actual chip Nintendo would use, it would need to be custom build, hence a Semi-Custom design. There is none like this for Nvidia anywhere to be found and no evidence to support that anything is even being made.


Source for Mobile Departure & Tegra X2 focus

Many are believing Nvidia based solely on “sources” that are unsubstantiated despite actual evidence to the contrary. However, there is evidence to believe AMD is providing the Semi-Custom Designed APU for the Nintendo NX:


Nintendo has been a Partner with ATi (now AMD) for developing their console GPU’s since 1999 when designing the Nintendo GameCube first started

AMD Publicly stated multiple times since October 2014 to July 2016 that they are focusing on the Semi-Custom design business with multiple design wins already successfully under their belt with the Wii U, Xbox One and PlayStation 4 SOC designs.

AMD Announced in April 2016 they expect over 1.5 billion dollars in revenue of Three Semi Custom design wins over the next 3-4 years.

AMD Announced the RX480, RX470 and RX460 at 14nm size, which is smaller than Nvidia’s 16nm upcoming Tegra X2 – which is not designed or targeted for gaming - and far more powerful for the cost (RX470 is 5 Teraflops starting at $179).

AMD Announced in July 2016 that Xbox Scorpio was one of the Semi-Custom Design wins to be released in Fall 2017, with two more coming, one expected by Fall 2016 (This is highly likely to be Neo) and the Third Semi-Custom Design when they have quote: “More Visibility” to do so – Biggest Hint at Nintendo NX that there is. 

AMD Announced in July 2016 that they have more Semi-Custom Design wins beyond just the Three and are trying to get away from numbering them at this point.


AMD Q1 2016 Report  AMD Computex 2016 Presentation  AMD Q2 2016 Report


Based on the actual evidence shown above, the chances of Nintendo using Nvidia for any of its upcoming products seems extremely unlikely at this time. A logical theory that makes more sense from these reports of Nintendo using a Tegra X1 in the NX Portable Console device is that they may have used a Tegra X1 as a placeholder chip until the final product was/is ready, this would explain a great deal because Nvidia would not be counting projected financial revenue with the limited number of Tegra X1 chips for Nintendo to purchase for the dev kits limited supply of test units and it would not need to be custom because as most people know pre-release Dev Kits are very non-form fitting devices that simply function for testing a product that is not completed. It should be noted that the Nintendo 3DS was reported using a Tegra chip before the final model ended up using the Pica200 GPU instead.

The report by Eurogamer may very well have been given old information on the Nintendo NX Portable Console based on all the real evidence we have reviewed since there is no evidence, especially financial projected data to support Nvidia working with Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 06, 2016, 11:30:28 AM
Clarification on Take Two's NX efforts at launch

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-08-04-take-two-financials-endure-battleborn-miss (http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-08-04-take-two-financials-endure-battleborn-miss)

Quote
Zelnick said he doesn't think the guidance for the current fiscal year includes any contribution from the Nintendo NX platform, which Nintendo has said would launch right at the end of Take-Two's fiscal year in March 2017.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Adrock on August 06, 2016, 12:09:26 PM
Makes sense. Take Two doesn't have anything that it could release for a March 2017. I wonder if Nintendo and third parties discussed skipping late ports. Nintendo delayed NX so software would be ready (ultimately, its best move). If first party content can carry NX for the first several months, getting some solid third party offerings at the same time as PS4 and One would be much better for the platform. The NX versions likely sell the worst (barring any Link in Soul Calibur II situations) though hopefully they'll be good enough to justify continued support. If Nintendo ever gets consistent support again, it'll be a slow burn to get there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 06, 2016, 01:29:33 PM
Mr Happy Nintendo: (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpL1f6dWIAEpc4n.jpg:large)

https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642 (https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Kairon on August 06, 2016, 01:37:33 PM
I'm #TeamTegra also #TeamHandHeldWithTVOut also #TeamBothHandHeldAndAConsole

*phew* That's a lot of teams!

But yeah, this is fun and all but it'll be really neat when it's eventually officially revealed and all these many different possibilities disappear because we'll know what it really is! (For the most part unless Nintendo doesn't announce certain things like a later Home Console version?)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 06, 2016, 01:43:48 PM
Mr Happy Nintendo: (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpL1f6dWIAEpc4n.jpg:large)

https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642 (https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642)

How many spelling errors can you find!? 4?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 01:43:58 PM
I'm #TeamTegra also #TeamHandHeldWithTVOut also #TeamBothHandHeldAndAConsole

*phew* That's a lot of teams!

But yeah, this is fun and all but it'll be really neat when it's eventually officially revealed and all these many different possibilities disappear because we'll know what it really is! (For the most part unless Nintendo doesn't announce certain things like a later Home Console version?)

Prepare to be disappointed :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 01:46:20 PM
Mr Happy Nintendo: (https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpL1f6dWIAEpc4n.jpg:large)

https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642 (https://twitter.com/happy_nintendo/status/761941748612464642)

How many spelling errors can you find!? 4?

Any hints? ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 01:48:32 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Soren on August 06, 2016, 02:05:36 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.


That doesn't mean as much as you think it does.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 06, 2016, 02:08:57 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.

He should be verified by MS spellcheck first. :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: Adrock on August 06, 2016, 02:17:02 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.

He should be verified by MS spellcheck first. :P
Ah, we missed you on this side of the forum BlackNMarvel2k1.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 02:25:03 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.

He should be verified by MS spellcheck first. :P

Well he is french :P
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 06, 2016, 03:17:55 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.

He should be verified by MS spellcheck first. :P:
Ah, we missed you on this side of the forum BlackNMarvel2k1.

a new unofficial name is found. I like it.

and you guys could use some organization to all these rumors...
that would make it easy to go back and see where the bullshit was coming from, and how the rumors progressed over time. But who's got time for all that nowadays.


and Mystic seems to be making a decent argument for #TeamNovidia, but I have barely paid any attention to any of this NX business, so I hardly know whats going on or where the info is coming from.


I'm #TeamHybridhandheld/consoledock
but mostly just #teamwakemewhenweactuallyknowsomething


I pop in here from time to time mostly because this seems to be the only constantly active thread on these forums.

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 03:40:59 PM
Apparently Happynintendofan is willing to be verified by Neogaf, so that's in the works.

He should be verified by MS spellcheck first. :P:
Ah, we missed you on this side of the forum BlackNMarvel2k1.

a new unofficial name is found. I like it.

and you guys could use some organization to all these rumors...
that would make it easy to go back and see where the bullshit was coming from, and how the rumors progressed over time. But who's got time for all that nowadays.


and Mystic seems to be making a decent argument for #TeamNovidia, but I have barely paid any attention to any of this NX business, so I hardly know whats going on or where the info is coming from.


I'm #TeamHybridhandheld/consoledock
but mostly just #teamwakemewhenweactuallyknowsomething


I pop in here from time to time mostly because this seems to be the only constantly active thread on these forums.



Woot Mystic/BnM Back together again! lol
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 06, 2016, 04:50:45 PM
MysticGohan is the only person who doesn't believe that NX will be powered by Nvidia. Nothing in that picture makes any sense.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 05:14:23 PM
MysticGohan is the only person who doesn't believe that NX will be powered by Nvidia. Nothing in that picture makes any sense.

I'm not the only person, there's thousands who believe, and there's no concrete proof that nvidia has anything to do with Nintendo. And all evidence posted support everything AMD and nothing Nvidia.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Adrock on August 06, 2016, 06:23:11 PM
There's no concrete info to support either AMD or Nvidia. All we have are info from unnamed sources. And everything you have posted supports AMD which doesn't mean there's nothing supporting Nvidia. Something like ten major publications have claimed Nvidia including The Wall Street Journal which generally does not **** around. So there's plenty that supports Nvidia and at this point, more than AMD. This is coming from someone who was firmly in the AMD camp for nearly two years now. Granted, I want to hear more and I'm so exhausted by rumors at this point that I won't even pick a side anymore. It doesn't matter. I feel like there are large swaths of information we don't know about NX, most of which is more important than who is supplying the chipset. At the very top of that is what the hell is Nintendo going to do set this thing apart and get anyone beyond its fanbase to give a ****. What makes NX so special? Otherwise, nearly a dozen major publications have thrown their weight behind Nvidia while random Twitter person and SuperMetalDave64 (whose channel I've subscribed to for nearly a year) are still waving the AMD flag. That isn't proof, but it still isn't looking good for AMD.

This is ultimately pointless. The number of logical fallacies you've posited here is astounding so trying to appeal to reason is a waste of my time. This thread can't go anywhere without you popping in and saying, "No, it's AMD."
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 06:31:47 PM
There's no concrete info to support either AMD or Nvidia. All we have are info from unnamed sources. And everything you have posted supports AMD which doesn't mean there's nothing supporting Nvidia. Something like ten major publications have claimed Nvidia including The Wall Street Journal which generally does not **** around. So there's plenty that supports Nvidia and at this point, more than AMD. This is coming from someone who was firmly in the AMD camp for nearly two years now. Granted, I want to hear more and I'm so exhausted by rumors at this point that I won't even pick a side anymore. It doesn't matter. I feel like there are large swaths of information we don't know about NX, most of which is more important than who is supplying the chipset. At the very top of that is what the hell is Nintendo going to do set this thing apart and get anyone beyond its fanbase to give a ****. What makes NX so special? Otherwise, nearly a dozen major publications have thrown their weight behind Nvidia while random Twitter person and SuperMetalDave64 (whose channel I've subscribed to for nearly a year) are still waving the AMD flag. That isn't proof, but it still isn't looking good for AMD.

This is ultimately pointless. The number of logical fallacies you've posited here is astounding so trying to appeal to reason is a waste of my time. This thread can't go anywhere without you popping in and saying, "No, it's AMD."

Still can't convince me even it's Nvidia, so until Nvidia revels anything that shows in the slightest they are working something concrete, there are comments from Reggie and other devs in the recent past that contradicts these stories of nvidia.

Looking forward to an announcement, we'll find out.

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 06, 2016, 07:22:32 PM
Hey! I post most of my rumors from GoNintendo!
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 07:48:17 PM
Hey! I post most of my rumors from GoNintendo!

Yeah, the guy there seems to have a thing for emily, which discredits that site when reporting things as if it's fact or authentic source.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Soren on August 06, 2016, 10:47:31 PM
Yeah, the guy there seems to have a thing for emily, which discredits that site when reporting things as if it's fact or authentic source.

SMD64 Strikes again! https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4 (https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4)


Hmmm...
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 06, 2016, 11:34:25 PM
Yeah, the guy there seems to have a thing for emily, which discredits that site when reporting things as if it's fact or authentic source.

SMD64 Strikes again! https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4 (https://youtu.be/-t9Z34UCTt4)


Hmmm...

Logic backs me up :p
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Adrock on August 07, 2016, 09:22:26 AM
Claiming the musings of random Twitter accounts and Youtubers are valid while at the same time claiming the reports of nearly a dozen well-known publications, including The Wall Street Journal, are not is the opposite of logical. You're presenting them as true rather than speculation. Ringing the bell of shame on you.
(http://i.imgur.com/raIhowN.jpg)

And to elaborate on Soren's post, discrediting GoNintendo for believing Emily Rogers, who has proven to have good sources in the past, then posting the grammatically impaired ramblings from a three week old Twitter account as anything worthwhile is contradictory at best and a waste of everyone's time at worst. There are any number of reasons to discredit GoNintendo (it's just not a very good site); just not the hill you seem willing to die on.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Agent-X- on August 07, 2016, 01:36:53 PM
MysticGohan is the only person who doesn't believe that NX will be powered by Nvidia. Nothing in that picture makes any sense.


I wouldn't go that far. Nintendo has a history with AMD, and there's more reason to believe that partnership runs deep enough for them to continue the partnership.


I'm still waiting for that compelling piece of evidence that lends support to the Nvidia rumor. Give us a picture or a screenshot. We need something a little more than "My source who is a Ninetndo developer says..." For all we know, at least at this point, Nintendo is about to release an Android phone that is gonna trump all smart phones. For all we know, right? For all we know...


Unlikely.


I will come closer to believing Nintendo has it sights set on taking the Console Power crown once again because that is slightly more believable now with Kimishima as president. I'm still clinging to that hope. :)
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 07, 2016, 02:10:07 PM
Claiming the musings of random Twitter accounts and Youtubers are valid while at the same time claiming the reports of nearly a dozen well-known publications, including The Wall Street Journal, are not is the opposite of logical. You're presenting them as true rather than speculation. Ringing the bell of shame on you.
(http://i.imgur.com/raIhowN.jpg)

And to elaborate on Soren's post, discrediting GoNintendo for believing Emily Rogers, who has proven to have good sources in the past, then posting the grammatically impaired ramblings from a three week old Twitter account as anything worthwhile is contradictory at best and a waste of everyone's time at worst. There are any number of reasons to discredit GoNintendo (it's just not a very good site); just not the hill you seem willing to die on.

To say none of those publications can't be wrong is a bold statement.

Yet we've had nothing solid yet from nvidia. Shouldn't Nvidia reported to their shareholders that they've had a major order of chips? Surely such a thing wouldn't go unnoticed.

But I'm not going to believe these publications until nintendo unveils the truth.

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Agent-X- on August 07, 2016, 02:23:43 PM
Honestly, every month that goes by I get a little bit more concerned about Nintendo's supposed plan for a March release. Summer will be over soon, and Christmas may as well be right around the corner.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Enner on August 07, 2016, 04:56:06 PM
But I'm not going to believe these publications until nintendo unveils the truth.

Pretty much defeating the purpose of participating in a discussion thread about rumors and speculation.
Especially if the majority of the comments are either arguing over validity (over rumors, something that is based in murkiness) in zeal, or waiting for an official announcement.


EDIT:


Arguing from the #TeamAMD, the few ways I can make sense of the nVidia stuff from multiple publications is that the sources are misinformed or running a misinformation operation. The former is a possibility, even at this late stage of development and proper vetting on the publications part. The latter is incredibly wild, even for a company as oddball as Nintendo.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: pokepal148 on August 07, 2016, 04:59:41 PM
Your source is so wrong that if they were any more wrong they'd circle back and be right but I'm not going to believe these publications until nintendo unveils the truth.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Luigi Dude on August 07, 2016, 05:26:18 PM
I will come closer to believing Nintendo has it sights set on taking the Console Power crown once again because that is slightly more believable now with Kimishima as president. I'm still clinging to that hope. :)

Kimishima hasn't even been president for a year yet.  Any deals that went down with AMD or Nvidia would have all been taken care of before Iwata died.  If Iwata decided that Nintendo was going with Nvidia, then that's what's powering the NX.  Even if Kimishima wanted to release a more powerful system, it was already too late to change said course by the time he was president without breaking multi-million dollar contracts and delaying the systems launch by at least another year, something Nintendo can't afford to do.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 07, 2016, 06:21:53 PM
Your source is so wrong that if they were any more wrong they'd circle back and be right but I'm not going to believe these publications until nintendo unveils the truth.

I believe it'll be amd over nvidia, you have any better sources than eg?
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Adrock on August 07, 2016, 08:14:50 PM
To say none of those publications can't be wrong is a bold statement.
That's one hell of a strawman. No one even implied that. It's one thing to say you don't believe their sources. No one is forcing you to. I can appreciate a healthy dose of skepticism. However, to disbelieve their sources while repeatedly ramming HappyNintendoGamer and SuperMetalDave, both of whom have not shown no evidence of having insider information ever (lurking LinkedIn hardly counts), down everyone's throats is the part I find illogical.
Quote
Shouldn't Nvidia reported to their shareholders that they've had a major order of chips?
First, I don't believe Nvidia fabricates its own chips. It designs them then another company (e.g. Samsung, GlobalFoundries, TSMC etc.) actually manufactures them. Second, no, Nvidia can but doesn't have to announce anything (and if the rumors are true, Nintendo could have asked them not to say anything yet). Are shareholders worried about Nvidia? It's dominating the graphics card market. Nvidia apparently didn't make much money from consoles. It's business that is nice to have but not integral to its bottomline.

AMD didn't even need to announce those design wins either. It did most likely because it's something positive to tell its shareholders when it's repeatedly getting stomped by Nvidia.
I believe it'll be amd over nvidia, you have any better sources than eg?
Duly noted, but do you have any better sources than a random Twitter account and a random Youtube account?
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 07, 2016, 10:16:51 PM
To say none of those publications can't be wrong is a bold statement.
That's one hell of a strawman. No one even implied that. It's one thing to say you don't believe their sources. No one is forcing you to. I can appreciate a healthy dose of skepticism. However, to disbelieve their sources while repeatedly ramming HappyNintendoGamer and SuperMetalDave, both of whom have not shown no evidence of having insider information ever (lurking LinkedIn hardly counts), down everyone's throats is the part I find illogical.
Quote
Shouldn't Nvidia reported to their shareholders that they've had a major order of chips?
First, I don't believe Nvidia fabricates its own chips. It designs them then another company (e.g. Samsung, GlobalFoundries, TSMC etc.) actually manufactures them. Second, no, Nvidia can but doesn't have to announce anything (and if the rumors are true, Nintendo could have asked them not to say anything yet). Are shareholders worried about Nvidia? It's dominating the graphics card market. Nvidia apparently didn't make much money from consoles. It's business that is nice to have but not integral to its bottomline.

AMD didn't even need to announce those design wins either. It did most likely because it's something positive to tell its shareholders when it's repeatedly getting stomped by Nvidia.
I believe it'll be amd over nvidia, you have any better sources than eg?
Duly noted, but do you have any better sources than a random Twitter account and a random Youtube account?

Touche... all I've seen is WSJ backing EG's rumors and people acting that WSJ has never been wrong and they have.

If you want to believe it's nvidia that's your prerogative, but mines elsewhere.

Lets agree to disagree :p
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Enner on August 07, 2016, 11:30:17 PM
I'm pretty sure no on in this forum is taking the latest nVidia rumor as the one and only truth of what's happening behind the scenes. 'cause, ya know, it's a rumor and/or information from undisclosed sources about an absurdly secretive company in a very secretive industry.

Instead, I believe most of us are using it as a bounce pad for our own thoughts and feelings.

Well, actually, I think most people just want the gosh darn reveal to happen already.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 08, 2016, 12:27:02 AM
I'm pretty sure no on in this forum is taking the latest nVidia rumor as the one and only truth of what's happening behind the scenes. 'cause, ya know, it's a rumor and/or information from undisclosed sources about an absurdly secretive company in a very secretive industry.

Instead, I believe most of us are using it as a bounce pad for our own thoughts and feelings.

Well, actually, I think most people just want the gosh darn reveal to happen already.

Indeed! Hopefully it'll be soon, it's been such a long drought of authentic news.

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Wah on August 08, 2016, 12:30:02 AM
and so, we keep spreading rumours, great job guys! 10/10 job.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 08, 2016, 12:56:53 AM
Some have more evidence than others ;)
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ThePerm on August 08, 2016, 04:15:09 AM
And it might not have even been Kimishima that wanted the hardware power crown either. Iwata could have been like "**** these clowns, lets get the best, so they can die like the rest" and then called their supplier and been like "dude we gotta be max get me that ****" and then pimp slapped whatever company is supplying the goods.

To put it in another way: Nintendo has avoided the most powerful hardware contest for 2 generations, they may have decided that now was the time to get some powerful hardware for the sake of public perception. I have said it for years, there is a peak, a valley, a wall, or whatever where we aren't going to be able to differentiate the consoles in terms of power for several years. The type of stuff I've seen with the fox engine, the luminous engine, or unreal4 are very photo-realistic.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 08, 2016, 05:39:07 PM
And it might not have even been Kimishima that wanted the hardware power crown either. Iwata could have been like "**** these clowns, lets get the best, so they can die like the rest" and then called their supplier and been like "dude we gotta be max get me that ****" and then pimp slapped whatever company is supplying the goods.

To put it in another way: Nintendo has avoided the most powerful hardware contest for 2 generations, they may have decided that now was the time to get some powerful hardware for the sake of public perception. I have said it for years, there is a peak, a valley, a wall, or whatever where we aren't going to be able to differentiate the consoles in terms of power for several years. The type of stuff I've seen with the fox engine, the luminous engine, or unreal4 are very photo-realistic.

I love how you put that Perm lol. Though may not be far from the truth.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 08, 2016, 07:05:05 PM
Well we knew it, but DQX has been confirmed for NX.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 08, 2016, 08:12:31 PM
Bethesda is non-committal.

VIA GONINTENDO NOT NEOGAF  https://www.finder.com.au/bethesda-nintendo-nx (https://www.finder.com.au/bethesda-nintendo-nx)

Quote
Pete Hines: We talk to Nintendo all the time – we’re pretty well briefed in on what they are doing. It’s definitely something we will look at; and our philosophy is that we will put our games out on any format that supports the games as we envisage and make them. If the NX fits that from a technical standpoint, and fits the game that a developer in our stable is making, I don’t see why we would not put it out on NX. But it’s too early to say, ‘we’ll definitely be putting games out or not.’ Like with mobile, we want to have the right fit for the right formats.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Shaymin on August 08, 2016, 09:02:04 PM
It’s definitely something we will look at; and our philosophy is that we will put our games out on any format that supports the games as we envisage and make them.

Given that they make their games with more bugs at launch than the body count of the National Brotherhood of Exterminators...
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 09, 2016, 02:24:04 PM
AMD didn't even need to announce those design wins either. It did most likely because it's something positive to tell its shareholders when it's repeatedly getting stomped by Nvidia.
And Intel.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 09, 2016, 09:22:00 PM
AMD didn't even need to announce those design wins either. It did most likely because it's something positive to tell its shareholders when it's repeatedly getting stomped by Nvidia.
And Intel.

Maybe Intel is doing the CPU and GPU for the NX...
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 09, 2016, 10:28:21 PM
Apparently HappyNintendoFan has tweeted: Sources Close 2 Retro Studios; "2 Consoles will be revealed at Nintendo Event, 1 Handheld based on ARM, 1 Home Console, x86 AMD Polaris" #NX

Apparently Retro has been working on an original game due to release for NX in 2017.

Then he shows an image https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpdjLNJW8AAe-K5.jpg

Also claims to have proof four verification via neogaf and reddit.

Hope this event is true, seeing Sony has announced Sept. 7th for Neo's announcement, I wonder will we see space world? Though seems unlikely as it typically takes place in late august, or used to. But who knows how nintendo will show this off.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 10, 2016, 12:25:23 AM
Interesting. Emily Rogers also had a rumor that Retro Studios had a new game that wasn't Donkey Kong or Metroid...
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 10, 2016, 01:00:11 AM
Interesting. Emily Rogers also had a rumor that Retro Studios had a new game that wasn't Donkey Kong or Metroid...

We knew Retro was working on something, but what? Who knows. Though I heard it's an original IP, maybe Raven Blade lives? Or could it be Metroid? Retro is big enough to handle two projects. Hopefully we'll hear something during the NX unveiling.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 10, 2016, 03:54:31 AM
Apparently HappyNintendoFan has tweeted: Sources Close 2 Retro Studios; "2 Consoles will be revealed at Nintendo Event, 1 Handheld based on ARM, 1 Home Console, x86 AMD Polaris" #NX


You know, back when I posting about the very low number of upcoming games from Nintendo for both the handheld and console front and mentioned that it could be seen as proof that the NX is a hybrid, I was trying to deduce in my mind what other possibilities this could point to. The only other explanation I could come up with is that maybe Nintendo is launching a new handheld and console at the same time. With two separate consoles, it could explain why there seems to be conflicting rumours as to what the NX is. People are getting different information about either the handheld or the console.

However, I then dismissed the possibility because it just didn't seem feasible. Would Nintendo bundle both things together? What would be the cost of that unit then? On the other hand, would they launch two pieces of hardware close to each other and basically have them compete with each other for sales and users? I don't see Nintendo viewing that as a business strategy they'd employ. Then there is the recent claim of Nintendo expecting to beef up game production and keep the NX from experiencing draughts. Not that us jaded long time fans put much faith in that and just see it as expected promotional speak. If Nintendo did launch two pieces of hardware close to each other, do they really expect to keep both from experiencing draughts when they have to launch and create a game library for two units?

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 10, 2016, 03:55:04 AM
Time to put the thinking cap on. The SNES had the GameBoy Player allowing handheld games to be played on consoles. With GameCube, Nintendo did its biggest experimentation with console/handheld connectivity. Not only was there the GBA player to play Advance games on the console, there were link cables to use the GBA as a controller for some games notable Pac-Man VS, 4 Swords Adventures and Final Fantasy Chronicles. There were other minor uses of it. One could look at Pac-Man Vs and draw a sort of parallel to the Wii U with its controller screen giving a different perspective or giving that player a different ability /role compared to the other Wiimote players in a room like in some NintendoLand games. With the Wii, Nintendo backed away from connectivity and the DS hardly had much interaction with the Wii console for anything. With the 3DS and Wii U, that non-connectivity approach has continued for the most part aside from a rare exception. The biggest thing would be using it as a controller in Smash Wii U. However, the Wii U Gamepad sort of acts like a handheld device connected to your console.

Iwata put the handheld and console hardware teams together to get them to work together better no doubt in part because of the software / menu architecture needed these days to allow for sending out patches, emulating games through the VC, and accounts like the e-Shop or Miiverse. I think we've started seeing the effects of some of this through Miiverse being incorporated on both systems, Amiibo and NFC and a couple cross-buy game attempts. However, it's not nearly at the integration fans would like with GBA games non-existent on the 3DS e-Shop or the length it took SNES games to be released not to mention better cross-buy support of being able to buy an SNES game on 3DS but also download it to your Wii U account if you want or vice-verse instead of paying twice for the same game. That problem, however, may come from the fact that handheld and console development teams were separate before and didn't confer with the other team about how they could or should approach development to make that programming worth with both systems. We are still waiting to see the first console and or handheld be released under this new directive. Was this combining part of a plan and idea already in place and beginning for what the Wii U successor would be? Or has it created a new plan and bold new direction to attempt? (Yes, the NEW 3DS has come out and is technically the first handheld released under this combined development team but it clearly is still tied to the original 3DS design and architecture to be truly new or be considered a successor.)

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 10, 2016, 03:55:55 AM
Going back to the Wii U, a lot of people expressed positivity to the off-screen play ability provided by the GamePad although there was a limit to how far away you could take the Gamepad from the console. It was like a handheld plugged into a wall. Is the NX the next step in Gamepad design? The Wii U never came up with or had a game that would use two Gamepads at once. That never happened despite the bone thrown to complainers that Gamepads would be sold separately and multiple pads could be used for future games. Would the NX allow for more connectivity with Gamepads? Would it allow you to talk the Gamepads further away effectively turning them into a type of handheld? Considering handheld dual screen gaming has now by Nintendo's handheld model for a decade, would the new gamepad controller also have two screens? Plus, some Wii U games did use the Gamepad for other things besides offscreen TV. Would having a second screen allow those Wii U games to function on offscreen gameplay?

This whole idea creates many interesting and crazy questions but I also can't see what they might be leading to or what kind of interesting console idea Nintendo could have from following in this direction.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: MysticGohan on August 10, 2016, 09:31:56 AM
Khusrenada, what if you can play both portable and console games on the console?

Seeing that it's likely that both the handheld and console will be cartridge based, only thing is the handheld games can play on the console but not the other way around.

We know Iwata has expressed in the past that the NX will not be a hybrid, I would think that logic would continue today.

It just makes sense that all these rumors are off and are really two systems under the NX name.

Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Khushrenada on August 10, 2016, 12:50:36 PM
Khusrenada, what if you can play both portable and console games on the console?

Seeing that it's likely that both the handheld and console will be cartridge based, only thing is the handheld games can play on the console but not the other way around.

Well, considering that the SNES and GameCube had adapters to play handheld games, having the NX be able to play handheld games isn't exactly revolutionary. But with the DS system's method of inputs and controls, it has only been recently with the Gamepad that Nintendo has been able to port DS games to play on a console. Unless the next handheld is going to be a different kind of design or the NX continues the gamepad style, then the console being able to play handheld games might not happen.

In any case, it's hardly a revolutionary idea or one that would require so much secrecy since that's been done before.

Quote
We know Iwata has expressed in the past that the NX will not be a hybrid, I would think that logic would continue today.

It just makes sense that all these rumors are off and are really two systems under the NX name.

It makes sense in some ways but, like some of those questions I wondered about, it doesn't make sense in other ways.
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Louieturkey on August 10, 2016, 02:20:07 PM
I'd like to point out that the PC Engine/Turbo Graphix 16 had a handheld counterpart that used the same game cards and played the same games, but on a handheld.  And near the end of the Genesis' life, Sega released the Nomad which was a portable Genesis.

Would Nintendo release two systems that play the exact same games?  I don't know.  I do like the idea of them being lower res on the handheld and scaling to look better on the console version if one bought both.  You could also play the same game together, one on the handheld and one on the console at the same time.  It would bring the Wii U's gamepad to the level. But with the Wii U being a failure, would they double down on that and risk destroying their handheld market?
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 11, 2016, 03:38:33 PM
Hot Patent reveals from Polygon! Gestures! Attachable controllers! I got this from http://News.Google.com (http://News.Google.com) so CHANGE THE TITLE OF THE THREAD!

http://www.polygon.com/2016/8/11/12441972/nintendo-nx-detachable-controller-gesture-based (http://www.polygon.com/2016/8/11/12441972/nintendo-nx-detachable-controller-gesture-based)

EDIT: Hot Pix for the skimmers

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/shyguy70/Screen_Shot_2016-08-11_at_2.07.07_PM.0_zpsewodsrl1.png) (http://s91.photobucket.com/user/shyguy70/media/Screen_Shot_2016-08-11_at_2.07.07_PM.0_zpsewodsrl1.png.html)

(http://i91.photobucket.com/albums/k302/shyguy70/Screen_Shot_2016-08-11_at_2.08.09_PM.0_zpsiaqqevaw.png) (http://s91.photobucket.com/user/shyguy70/media/Screen_Shot_2016-08-11_at_2.08.09_PM.0_zpsiaqqevaw.png.html)
Title: Re: NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors)
Post by: Agent-X- on August 11, 2016, 05:30:51 PM
As long as gesture-based controls do not impedge or are not expected to replace traditional control, I'm cool with it.


I'd love to be able to do hand-based gesture type controls for things like menu navigation and control of apps like Netflix.

Will this be Nintendo's thinking? I'd almost bet money not since they almost never give more than two seconds thought to what I mostly use my Wii U for (watching Netflix!!!).


"Hmm. What can we do to make our console truly cool and differentiate it from our competitors? I know, let's make it so all the games have to be different in order to work on our platform! This will ensure that our libraries almost never actually overlap, which should make our customers happy, right?"
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 11, 2016, 05:44:10 PM
Reminder that Sony has a patent for "blocking used games" that came out with the PS4, and Nintendo owns a patent for a horse bag.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 11, 2016, 06:39:42 PM
People keep mocking the horse bag patent. Laugh it up. It's coming, and it will be excellent.

Nintendo Horse Bag. Coming 2017. Powered by AMD.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Kairon on August 11, 2016, 06:44:20 PM
The attachable controllers that aren't electronic and just reflect back IR BLOWS MY MIND. That's a ridiculously innovative use of astoundingly ancient tech, and both reduces electrical use while making controls almost completely configurable/versatile with new "dumb" plastic shells.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Khushrenada on August 11, 2016, 07:10:14 PM
People keep mocking the horse bag patent. Laugh it up. It's coming, and it will be excellent.

Nintendo Horse Bag. Coming 2017. Powered by AMD.

Pocket Card Jockey 2! You ARE the horse!

Eat it up, Nintendo fans! Eat it from the bag.

You will say neigh!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 11, 2016, 07:24:21 PM
Nvidia has announced nothing, other than X2 being used in cars. If they were doing chips for Nintendo, they would've told investors today.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 11, 2016, 08:03:46 PM
Gesture stuff is Kinect, right?  So Kinect's fad appeal dies so hard that Microsoft strips it out of their console and Nintendo then thinks "yeah, let's do that"?  The key thing that was missing from the Wii U was the Xbox One's failed feature?

I don't have much (or really any) confidence in Nintendo on this stuff anymore but ripping of Kinect would honestly shock me.  Like it's TOO stupid to be believable.  If that's the NX, it is going to make the Wii U's sales look like the PS2 in comparison.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 11, 2016, 08:34:43 PM
Nvidia has announced nothing, other than X2 being used in cars. If they were doing chips for Nintendo, they would've told investors today.
Here's 13 straight years of Steve Jobs not telling investors what Apple was planning until it was announced to the public:
In 2000, Jobs told Macworld attendees that he was no longer "Interim CEO." Investors didn't officially know who the CEO of the company was until pretty much the rest of the world did.

Apple didn't announce everything to investors when it was on the verge of bankruptcy, and it still doesn't do so today as one of most valuable companies in the world. Nvidia isn't Apple; different companies do different things. That's the point. Just because AMD announced design wins to investors doesn't mean Nvidia will or has to.

Investor calls are mostly fluff anyway. A couple years ago, a Nintendo investor said, "I do not understand video games," then went on to say he was angry that Nintendo, a company that has made video games for over three decades, keeps talking about "such childish topics as 'what the future of video games should be'" during its shareholders' meetings.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 11, 2016, 09:09:31 PM
Nvidia has announced nothing, other than X2 being used in cars. If they were doing chips for Nintendo, they would've told investors today.


Nintendo's shareholders know as much about the NX as we do.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 11, 2016, 09:36:41 PM
Nvidia has announced nothing, other than X2 being used in cars. If they were doing chips for Nintendo, they would've told investors today.


Nintendo's shareholders know as much about the NX as we do.

I'd go as far as to say the majority of them actually know less about it than we do.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 11, 2016, 11:29:07 PM
I'd go as far as to say the majority of them actually know less about it than we do.


Plot twist, Nintendo is not doing the NX. The Playstation NEO is actually Sony buying out Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 03:16:42 AM
Nvidia has announced nothing, other than X2 being used in cars. If they were doing chips for Nintendo, they would've told investors today.
Here's 13 straight years of Steve Jobs not telling investors what Apple was planning until it was announced to the public:
In 2000, Jobs told Macworld attendees that he was no longer "Interim CEO." Investors didn't officially know who the CEO of the company was until pretty much the rest of the world did.

Apple didn't announce everything to investors when it was on the verge of bankruptcy, and it still doesn't do so today as one of most valuable companies in the world. Nvidia isn't Apple; different companies do different things. That's the point. Just because AMD announced design wins to investors doesn't mean Nvidia will or has to.

Investor calls are mostly fluff anyway. A couple years ago, a Nintendo investor said, "I do not understand video games," then went on to say he was angry that Nintendo, a company that has made video games for over three decades, keeps talking about "such childish topics as 'what the future of video games should be'" during its shareholders' meetings.

Here's more fuel to the fire http://finance.yahoo.com/news/amd-revenues-hit-weakness-semi-130735686.html

Semi-custom business

AMD, which competes with Intel (INTC) and NVIDIA (NVDA) in the CPU (central processing unit) and GPU (graphics processing unit) market, dominates the gaming console market. It’s the sole supplier of semi-custom processors for Japan-based (EWJ) Sony’s (SNE) PlayStation 4 and Microsoft’s (MSFT) Xbox. It has also won an order for Nintendo’s upcoming console, codenamed “NX.”
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 03:35:28 AM
Also more current is this http://knowtechie.com/amd-polaris-rising-star-flop/



"An exciting summer it was. Fans of both camps had something to rejoice about. Although some were happier than the others, it is evident that the story doesn’t end here. AMD is yet to unveil its high-end chips, labeled as Vega. Nvidia is rumored to release Volta architecture for the next year. Sony is launching its new Polaris based Playstation 4 Neo next month, and Microsoft and Nintendo are also revising their hardware with AMD’s latest chips (a great win for AMD). So, more exciting months are ahead of us, regarding the new gaming hardware."
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 12, 2016, 03:57:17 AM
I'd go as far as to say the majority of them actually know less about it than we do.


Plot twist, Nintendo is not doing the NX. The Playstation NEO is actually Sony buying out Nintendo.

:P

That reminds me of a lovely thread from General Gaming Discussion.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 12, 2016, 05:14:35 AM
Here's more fuel to the fire http://finance.yahoo.com/news/amd-revenues-hit-weakness-semi-130735686.html

Semi-custom business

AMD, which competes with Intel (INTC) and NVIDIA (NVDA) in the CPU (central processing unit) and GPU (graphics processing unit) market, dominates the gaming console market. It’s the sole supplier of semi-custom processors for Japan-based (EWJ) Sony’s (SNE) PlayStation 4 and Microsoft’s (MSFT) Xbox. It has also won an order for Nintendo’s upcoming console, codenamed “NX.”
I don't get it. How was any of this a response to my post? Companies routinely do not tell investors things. The link you posted doesn't refute that at all.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 12, 2016, 10:26:46 AM
But the link he provided does specifically mention that AMD is doing chips for the NX. So that would back his claim that Nvidia has nothing to do with the NX, and that AMD is still working directly with Nintendo.

But yes, it does not refute your claim that some companies will not share everything with investors.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 12, 2016, 12:47:17 PM
There is no source for that (which would be huge news) though, it's just placed there with no explanation. The three new console chips that are not the current consoles (at the time) are Xbox One S, Project Scorpio, and PS4 Neo.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 12:59:31 PM
There is no source for that (which would be huge news) though, it's just placed there with no explanation. The three new console chips that are not the current consoles (at the time) are Xbox One S, Project Scorpio, and PS4 Neo.

XBOX One S does not count as its not a new semi conductor, it's just a slightly ramped up xbone.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 01:42:41 PM
There is no source for that (which would be huge news) though, it's just placed there with no explanation. The three new console chips that are not the current consoles (at the time) are Xbox One S, Project Scorpio, and PS4 Neo.

Well, there was that article from yahoo news, but that was in may and the following was just 48 hrs ago, so it's something.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Oedo on August 12, 2016, 02:40:18 PM
It seems pretty clear that whoever wrote that Yahoo piece saw a rumour while they were doing their research and mistakenly took it as fact. If they actually had real knowledge on what chip the NX would be using, it would be its own story instead of a throwaway line in an analysis of AMD's Q1 earnings for the fiscal year and what those results might mean for its future. The same goes for the other link. I don't think there's anything of value to glean from either one of those.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 12, 2016, 03:20:16 PM
I don't know what semiconductors have to do with anything...but according to Microsoft, it's a new console. The APU is not the same as the one in the original Xbox One, otherwise the difference between the two would just be a software upgrade (apart from the UHD Blu-ray drive) - so it does count as a difference chip, because it is different.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 12, 2016, 04:10:06 PM
I love how those two articles didn't even bother to put a token "sources say" to their bogus claims. MarketRealist and KnowTechie out there breaking news, son!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 12, 2016, 05:10:00 PM
But the link he provided does specifically mention that AMD is doing chips for the NX. So that would back his claim that Nvidia has nothing to do with the NX, and that AMD is still working directly with Nintendo.

But yes, it does not refute your claim that some companies will not share everything with investors.
Not really getting the point of this either. MysticGohan can sing about AMD all day long if he so chooses. My confusion is rooted in him quoting me as if what he said was some kind of counterpoint. Sure, the link backs his AMD stroking, but it still has nothing to do with my specific post. At this point, I think MysticGohan is just trolling. That article is from May. If there was any truth to it, we wouldn't still be talking about this.

And what I said about companies not sharing everything with investors isn't a "claim." It's fact. They don't. This has been proven publicly countless times. If it wasn't, there would be no secrets. There would be no need for leaks. If you owned even one share, you'd be privy to tons of information. Media outlets everywhere would do just that. If Nvidia scored a contract with Nintendo, there's no hard and fast rule that it has to announce the partnership as soon as the ink dries. It's weird that such a thing is still even being entertained by anyone.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 06:54:16 PM
But the link he provided does specifically mention that AMD is doing chips for the NX. So that would back his claim that Nvidia has nothing to do with the NX, and that AMD is still working directly with Nintendo.

But yes, it does not refute your claim that some companies will not share everything with investors.
Not really getting the point of this either. MysticGohan can sing about AMD all day long if he so chooses. My confusion is rooted in him quoting me as if what he said was some kind of counterpoint. Sure, the link backs his AMD stroking, but it still has nothing to do with my specific post. At this point, I think MysticGohan is just trolling. That article is from May. If there was any truth to it, we wouldn't still be talking about this.

And what I said about companies not sharing everything with investors isn't a "claim." It's fact. They don't. This has been proven publicly countless times. If it wasn't, there would be no secrets. There would be no need for leaks. If you owned even one share, you'd be privy to tons of information. Media outlets everywhere would do just that. If Nvidia scored a contract with Nintendo, there's no hard and fast rule that it has to announce the partnership as soon as the ink dries. It's weird that such a thing is still even being entertained by anyone.

My point I'd simply it's likely amd is powering the nx, Nvidia already dismissed the Tegra SOC for a future gaming focus, no matter the platform. J. Wong was very clear. https://t.co/kYgFXv51By
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 12, 2016, 07:25:19 PM
Can we please not use random Twitter accounts for "facts?" And the only thing CEO Jen-Hsun Huang said, which you have to find through the link on the page that's linked in the twitter feed (http://wccftech.com/nvidia-longer-interested-making-mobile-socs/) is this - “We are no longer interested in that market. Anybody can build smartphones, and we’re happy to enjoy these devices, but we’ll let someone else build them.” Nvidia is not dropping out of the mobile market (ever heard of a laptop?), they are still pushing the Nvidia Shield Android TV (which I own two of) and plan on expanding GeForce Now on that platform.

Also, the guy who you just quoted from Twitter thinks that the article linked makes it *more likely* that Nvidia is working on the NX.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 12, 2016, 07:53:45 PM
Can we please not use random Twitter accounts for "facts?" And the only thing CEO Jen-Hsun Huang said, which you have to find through the link on the page that's linked in the twitter feed (http://wccftech.com/nvidia-longer-interested-making-mobile-socs/) is this - “We are no longer interested in that market. Anybody can build smartphones, and we’re happy to enjoy these devices, but we’ll let someone else build them.” Nvidia is not dropping out of the mobile market (ever heard of a laptop?), they are still pushing the Nvidia Shield Android TV (which I own two of) and plan on expanding GeForce Now on that platform.

Also, the guy who you just quoted from Twitter thinks that the article linked makes it *more likely* that Nvidia is working on the NX.
 

They've canceled their shield projects.

http://www.technobuffalo.com/2016/08/11/nvidia-shield-2-tablet-cancelled/
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ceric on August 12, 2016, 08:29:04 PM
Cancelling of the Shield line would be, for me, a better indication of Nintendo being powered by NVidia.  It lets them do what their going to do regardless, make chips, instead of having to have to worry about all the extra things you need to do when you have a platform.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 12, 2016, 08:36:03 PM
They aren't cancelling the Shield line, just the Shield K1 and not making a new model. Shield Android TV is still going...wish I would have gotten a tablet before though. I also have the portable. Nice little system.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 13, 2016, 07:47:33 PM
They aren't cancelling the Shield line, just the Shield K1 and not making a new model. Shield Android TV is still going...wish I would have gotten a tablet before though. I also have the portable. Nice little system.

They're canceling Shield 2.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 13, 2016, 08:35:51 PM
That's exactly what I just said, though they aren't cancelling it, just not introducing a new model...and it would be the Shield Tablet 2, not the Shield 2 (which they also never made).
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 17, 2016, 08:40:29 PM
In other news, EA gonna EA!

http://gonintendo.com/stories/263436-ea-still-won-t-talk-about-supporting-the-nx
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 17, 2016, 10:10:47 PM
Do you really want EA on the NX though?
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 17, 2016, 10:23:56 PM
Do you really want EA on the NX though?

Hmm looking at their releases this gen... Maybe I would buy Plants vs Zombies Garden Warfare NX? That's probably about it, unless Unravel was cheap.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 17, 2016, 10:27:50 PM
EA, the only thing I really liked of theirs was Mass Effect (one of my fav games especially 2) but I hate the company and every unfinished piece of **** they come out with.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stogi on August 17, 2016, 10:35:07 PM
I always loved Burnout aka Need for Speed. Aren't those published by EA?

Oh and the holiest of holies....FIFA.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 17, 2016, 10:38:56 PM
FIFA? fifa....
You like FIFA? The Game EA vomits out each year?
You my friend is what's wrong with the gaming industry.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 17, 2016, 11:23:14 PM
FIFA is a pretty renown series. Saying EA "vomits" them out is a disservice.  They've even taken the time to start including women's teams recently.

But I think the overall question is pretty valid.  Does Nintendo need EA anymore?  What else of notable quality are they making outside their sport sims? 
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 17, 2016, 11:26:28 PM
"EA respects non-disclosure agreement" doesn't bring in TEH CLICKZ.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 18, 2016, 12:21:41 AM
But I think the overall question is pretty valid.  Does Nintendo need EA anymore?  What else of notable quality are they making outside their sport sims? 


I know EA gets a bad wrap from just about anyone that isn't a sports gaming enthusiast... (and even then they still get a hard time), but Support from a BIG producer like EA is just as important to Nintendo as hopefully the install base supporting games from big producers like EA, as it only draws in more install base and more support from other BIG fish.

so while I'm sure Nintendo can afford to survive w/o large 3rd party support, and therefore don't "need" EA, they sure could use the boost large support and success from EA would give to all the rest of the big players looking to drop major IP on yet another platform.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stogi on August 18, 2016, 01:04:54 AM
FIFA? fifa....
You like FIFA? The Game EA vomits out each year?
You my friend is what's wrong with the gaming industry.

Yeah...probably. I also don't buy games unless they're about two years old; my only caveat are major Nintendo and Sony releases like Zelda or Uncharted. And I never buy a system day one. Case in point, I just picked up a 3DS.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 18, 2016, 01:45:19 AM
FIFA is a pretty renown series. Saying EA "vomits" them out is a disservice.  They've even taken the time to start including women's teams recently.

But I think the overall question is pretty valid.  Does Nintendo need EA anymore?  What else of notable quality are they making outside their sport sims? 

EA makes Mass Effect so that's enough of a justification for me to want them on a Nintendo console.  I'm going to likely buy some videogame system for the new Mass Effect so does Nintendo want it to be Sony's or Microsoft's?

Does Nintendo need EA anymore?  Nintendo needs EVERYONE.  We saw what Nintendo on their own results in - a commercial disaster.  No third party publisher of any note should be considered expendable to Nintendo.  I don't care for EA and Mass Effect is literally all I care about from them but EA matters.  Their sports games alone can make their absence a dealbreaker.  Nintendo pretty much has no sports presence at all aside from Mario sports games.  There are people where their annual Madden is a key videogame purchase and there is only one NFL game in town these days.  This comes from a more Canadian perspective but I know people that buy the annual NHL game and a console without it is of no use to them.

You have to not think in terms of Nintendo games and the people that are primarily interested in them.  Those people are a niche group, you're probably part of them, and their numbers are as small as the Wii U userbase.  For most people Nintendo games matter no more than any other publisher's games.  One console has effectively just Nintendo and the other ones have everything else.  Everything else wins by a landslide if Nintendo is just some random dev to you.  So Nintendo absolutely needs EA and Ubisoft and Take Two and Activision and everyone else you've ever heard of.  It's strictly a numbers game.  The Wii is literally the only console in videogame history to sell the best for its generation while not winning the numbers game.  The less devs supporting the NX, the worse it will sell.  EA support is mandatory.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Dasmos on August 18, 2016, 02:25:14 AM
Anyone who doesn't think the NX would benefit from having games like Battlefield, Titanfall and Battlefront on the system is kidding themselves.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 18, 2016, 05:52:32 AM
In other news I bought Mass Effect 3 for 8 dollars and want my money back. I didn't like the gameplay. EA have done things I like in the past though.

I'm more concerned about Ubisoft. There are Ubisoft game series that I like. Prince of Persia, Assassin's Creed, I enjoyed BG&E and never beat it. I'm kinda disappointed  Killer Freaks from Outer Space turned into ZombiU.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 18, 2016, 06:21:25 AM
3 sucks.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: lolmonade on August 18, 2016, 09:29:04 AM
FIFA is a pretty renown series. Saying EA "vomits" them out is a disservice.  They've even taken the time to start including women's teams recently.

But I think the overall question is pretty valid.  Does Nintendo need EA anymore?  What else of notable quality are they making outside their sport sims?


I have several acquaintances that wouldn't buy a console if you couldn't get NFL, MLB, or FIFA sports games.  Is that Nintendo's core fanbase?  No, but I think this console generation has shown that Nintendo can't support its video game business with just its core fanbase.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 18, 2016, 03:41:17 PM
I have several acquaintances that wouldn't buy a console if you couldn't get NFL, MLB, or FIFA sports games.  Is that Nintendo's core fanbase?  No, but I think this console generation has shown that Nintendo can't support its video game business with just its core fanbase.

Do these people already own consoles to play these games?  Would they buy other games for the NX?  Do they need/want multiple systems with these games?

EA makes Mass Effect so that's enough of a justification for me to want them on a Nintendo console.  I'm going to likely buy some videogame system for the new Mass Effect so does Nintendo want it to be Sony's or Microsoft's?

I mean, they made Mass Effect.  Is that series still going?  Honestly, haven't been following it.

To everyone's point that the NX benefits from EA support: I mean yeah, duh.  Is there any 3rd party support that would be detrimental?  Or even neutral?
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 18, 2016, 03:50:25 PM
EA makes Mass Effect so that's enough of a justification for me to want them on a Nintendo console.  I'm going to likely buy some videogame system for the new Mass Effect so does Nintendo want it to be Sony's or Microsoft's?

I mean, they made Mass Effect.  Is that series still going?  Honestly, haven't been following it.

A new game in the series, Mass Effect: Andromeda, is coming out in March of next year, just like a certain piece of hardware.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 18, 2016, 04:14:43 PM
Oh, snap!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: lolmonade on August 18, 2016, 04:22:06 PM
I have several acquaintances that wouldn't buy a console if you couldn't get NFL, MLB, or FIFA sports games.  Is that Nintendo's core fanbase?  No, but I think this console generation has shown that Nintendo can't support its video game business with just its core fanbase.

Do these people already own consoles to play these games?  Would they buy other games for the NX?  Do they need/want multiple systems with these games?


What I'm getting at is these people only bother to own one console, and if Nintendo wants to be something other than the niche console, they need people to decide their console is compelling enough to be THE console. 


Perhaps some of them already have PS4/Xbone, but I had more than a few friends that were intrigued at the idea of Wii U's off-TV play for sports games, then suddenly saw EA backpedaling away from Wii U as quickly as possible turn them off.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Mop it up on August 18, 2016, 04:39:33 PM
Bummer. A dumbed-down port of Madden was my most-anticipated NX game.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: rygar on August 18, 2016, 05:33:03 PM
I have several acquaintances that wouldn't buy a console if you couldn't get NFL, MLB, or FIFA sports games.  Is that Nintendo's core fanbase?  No, but I think this console generation has shown that Nintendo can't support its video game business with just its core fanbase.

Do these people already own consoles to play these games?  Would they buy other games for the NX?  Do they need/want multiple systems with these games?



 My favorite game genres are WRPGs and FPSs. I also like sports games, but not as much as those. I only own a 3DS because it is portable and on-tv play isn't viable for me anymore. I bought it on a whim, but I would have gotten one sooner if it meant being able to play Bethesda or Bioware games. I love it, so I don’t regret the purchase, but I probably won’t be in a rush to upgrade to the NX if it doesn’t expand Nintendo’s catalog of franchises. I’d probably be content playing out my 3DS backlog for at least another year. However, if the NX is going to have games like Mass Effect: Andromeda (and it’s portable), I’d probably purchase it close to launch. I know you were responding to a post specifically about sports and not western genres in general, and I don't know if sports games alone would justify the upgrade, but I'd at least be more likely to consider it.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 18, 2016, 07:21:54 PM
What I'm getting at is these people only bother to own one console, and if Nintendo wants to be something other than the niche console, they need people to decide their console is compelling enough to be THE console. 


Perhaps some of them already have PS4/Xbone, but I had more than a few friends that were intrigued at the idea of Wii U's off-TV play for sports games, then suddenly saw EA backpedaling away from Wii U as quickly as possible turn them off.

Seems like the gimmick has to hook them in and then make them choose the NX as their dedicated Madden machine.

My favorite game genres are WRPGs and FPSs. I also like sports games, but not as much as those. I only own a 3DS because it is portable and on-tv play isn't viable for me anymore. I bought it on a whim, but I would have gotten one sooner if it meant being able to play Bethesda or Bioware games. I love it, so I don’t regret the purchase, but I probably won’t be in a rush to upgrade to the NX if it doesn’t expand Nintendo’s catalog of franchises. I’d probably be content playing out my 3DS backlog for at least another year. However, if the NX is going to have games like Mass Effect: Andromeda (and it’s portable), I’d probably purchase it close to launch. I know you were responding to a post specifically about sports and not western genres in general, and I don't know if sports games alone would justify the upgrade, but I'd at least be more likely to consider it.


If those genres are your faves, then Nintendo has been under-serving you for years.  But you're right, Nintendo's console needs to serve a wider market with the software lineup.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 18, 2016, 08:03:41 PM
Dragon Quest Builders may be coming to the NX

http://www.dualshockers.com/2016/08/18/square-enix-looking-at-the-possibility-of-nintendo-nx-port-of-dragon-quest-builders/
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 18, 2016, 08:13:41 PM
Hrm. On the one hand, I would love it (and Nintendo would probably help with marketing it). On the other hand, we're lucky to be getting that game in the West at all (digital only on its lead platform).

Still, if that's true, I hope it's announced soon so I can use the PSN credit I'm saving on something else.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: rygar on August 18, 2016, 09:01:42 PM


If those genres are your faves, then Nintendo has been under-serving you for years.  But you're right, Nintendo's console needs to serve a wider market with the software lineup.

In retrospect, it was partly a matter of perception. Everybody I knew in elementary school (whose parents could afford them) had a NES. Only a small percentage bought new systems, and those that did, got Sega specifically for Madden. I needed a PC for school, so I just played games on that until my roommate bought an xbox. My wife and a friend briefly owned Wii, but they only had games like Wii sport. I literally thought/assumed Nintendo was for children.

Now that I own a 3DS and have been exposed to Nintendo's post-NES work, I definitely enjoy it. I imagine I will eventually get a NX even if they don't expand their software catalog. But, I've already bought enough games to last me through 2017, so I could just clean out whats left of what I want on the 3DS estore, and put the NX money towards a gaming computer. I would much rather go low cost on a computer, and buy a NX that has WRPGs and the latest Zelda, Pokemon, et al.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 18, 2016, 09:52:28 PM
Oh, wow.  That's an interesting background!  What made you get the 3DS?

And Nintendo's family friendly image does hurt them sometimes.  It's easy to see them as being "for kids", but I like to think of them as having broad appeal.  Like, there's nothing offensive about Splatoon, but that doesn't make it for kids.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: rygar on August 18, 2016, 11:15:53 PM
Thanks! I had stopped gaming around 2007. TV play stopped being feasible and I had a laptop priced for word processing/internet browsing. I think I got a smart phone around 2009 or 2010 and started playing games on it. I liked it well enough, but I hated both tying up my phone and interrupting my games.

I was going on a long road trip two years ago and found the Retronauts podcast. That reminded me of how much I liked gaming when I was younger, and I started craving a more substantial experience. I tried downloading higher quality games on mobile, but I hated the controls. I was going on a different vacation the following summer, and decided to grab a handheld for the flight. I had a vague sense that the vita had a bad reputation, so I went with the 3DS.

I'm glad I did and I'm also really happy I found RFN soon after. Listening to it has increased my enjoyment of Nintendo, and the more I play Nintendo, the more I enjoy the podcast and the rest of NWR.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 19, 2016, 11:40:58 AM
Wow, you are literally the market Nintendo is after for the NX.  And from the recent sales news, they seem to be pulling you guys in!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: sudoshuff on August 20, 2016, 08:47:15 AM
I tried downloading higher quality games on mobile, but I hated the controls.


For me it was the controls and the lack of depth.  Strangely, as graphics got prettier and the swiping got fancier, it just made want a game I could really sink my teeth into.  It was playing the Secret of Mana port on iOS that convinced me I just needed to go out and buy a 3DS.  I think the market of lapsed gamers or gamers who want something a little more than mobile can offer shouldn't be underestimated.  The NX has a real opportunity there.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: rygar on August 20, 2016, 02:57:14 PM
Good call on the depth too and I think that tracks quality. I probably regret 75% of my mobile spending, lol. But I don't regret any of my Nintendo purchases even though I'm unlikely to play a significant number of them. The games are of sufficient intrinsic quality to make just having access to them worth it.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stratos on August 20, 2016, 04:46:37 PM
It is those complaints that have always kept me away from a lot of the mobile gaming market. I finally warmed up to playing certain specific games as a form of time killing when out and about, especially since it was more convenient to just carry a phone instead of a phone and a 3DS.


I have spent a few Google Play free credits on mobile games, and the Amazon free app of the day program introduced me to a few I would have been willing to buy because I liked them so much.


But I don't regret any of my Nintendo purchases even though I'm unlikely to play a significant number of them. The games are of sufficient intrinsic quality to make just having access to them worth it.


The nice thing about those games is that you know for the most part you can still dive into it years later and get near full enjoyment out of them. Its how I justify growing my backlog: having the promise of one day sitting down and enjoying a random gem I never cracked open. With phone games so much is tied to servers and IAPs that there is little promise of the game even running properly a year or two later.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Mop it up on August 21, 2016, 12:45:52 PM
Yeah, that's why I prioritise the games on my backlogue which have online features, since who knows how long those will last. I still ended up missing out on a few goodies on Wii and DS when the NWFC was shut down. :(
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stratos on August 21, 2016, 02:09:46 PM
Some guys figured out a workaround to create an ad hoc NWFC network, so it is doable if you really wanted to try.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 22, 2016, 07:54:13 PM
Hey, here info on the new Nvidia Chip from Hot Chips. Nothing was said about the NX today.


http://wccftech.com/nvidia-tegra-parker-soc-hot-chips/
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Phil on August 22, 2016, 09:11:21 PM
Don't care for the hot scoops. More interested in the hot takes.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 22, 2016, 10:25:39 PM
hottake
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 22, 2016, 11:46:46 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla. Half tempted to move this to the Funhouse.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Phil on August 23, 2016, 02:15:39 AM
"Nintendo is not half the competitor that Lebron James is." Stephen A. Smith's hot take.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 23, 2016, 09:30:51 AM
Should be hearing something soon, but don't be surprised if it's not Tegra based :p
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Louieturkey on August 23, 2016, 03:15:44 PM
Should be hearing something soon, but don't be surprised if it's not Tegra based :p
Been wondering why you've been so quiet.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 23, 2016, 03:38:13 PM
Should be hearing something soon, but don't be surprised if it's not Tegra based :p
Been wondering why you've been so quiet.

Birthdays/Life, but TEAM #AMD #NX Rolls on!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Mop it up on August 23, 2016, 09:09:53 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla.
Too soon. :(
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 23, 2016, 09:25:13 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla.
Too soon. :(
?
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 23, 2016, 09:58:13 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla.
Too soon. :(
?

Visit the Support Donkey Kong section of the the Miiverse. You will understand and wish you hadn't. NSFL

https://miiverse.nintendo.net/titles/14866558073037299863/14866558073691937172

In other news from GoNintendo, No Deus Ex for NX   ...or is there?

https://www.finder.com.au/eidos-slams-deus-ex-mankind-divided-for-nintendo-nx-rumours
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 23, 2016, 10:43:49 PM
who the f*ck is harembe?
it's all over that miiverse!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 23, 2016, 11:35:31 PM
https://www.finder.com.au/eidos-slams-deus-ex-mankind-divided-for-nintendo-nx-rumours

Yes, tell us about porting your game to a console that doesn't technically exists yet and you're still not allowed to talk about anyway.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: lolmonade on August 24, 2016, 08:21:17 AM
who the f*ck is harembe?
it's all over that miiverse!


Dicks out for Harambe.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Dasmos on August 24, 2016, 09:26:06 AM
(https://assets.change.org/photos/6/bv/zr/PtbVzRjyxVbdejN-800x450-noPad.jpg?1470838544)
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: rygar on August 24, 2016, 11:23:30 AM
Lol at the type and ability.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 24, 2016, 07:16:27 PM
Did some research why is this such a big thing? It's just a gorilla. In Australia we eat our national icon sooooo....

Also lol that pic almost had me convinced.

also lol
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Khushrenada on August 24, 2016, 07:16:44 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla.
Too soon. :(
?


who the f*ck is harembe?
it's all over that miiverse!


A few months ago, a kid fell into a gorilla enclosure at the Cincinnati Zoo. The gorilla in the enclosure named Harambe grabbed the kid and dragged him around the enclosure for awhile until the zoo officials shot and killed the gorilla in order to free the child. It's been a big debate point for awhile with people upset at the killing of the gorilla.

I didn't know about the DK miiverse going on and on about it though or the fake Pokémon Sun and Moon version of Harambe which is pretty hilarious.

EDIT: Sure, figure out the answer just before I post it. First he votes me out of mafia and now this. Last time I help Lucario out.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 24, 2016, 07:23:19 PM
I'msorrySENPAI!
PlZ DON'T SHOOT ME!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Khushrenada on August 24, 2016, 07:27:12 PM
IT'S NO USE!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 25, 2016, 10:44:05 PM
While the rumor starved zombies mill around outside, Nintendo quietly prepares its counter assault.

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/279939/Nintendo_bolsters_supply_chain_with_NX_on_the_horizon.php

Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 25, 2016, 10:45:14 PM
More Nvidia rumors, with the added spice of a Rumor about Metroid Prime 4.

http://www.ibtimes.com/nintendo-nx-rumors-tip-tegra-x2-specs-metroid-prime-4-launch-game-2407282
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 25, 2016, 10:55:41 PM
wtf, that video at the top of their page is old.

edit watched the other video interesting. I didn't mind the spoilers mainly because I don't have a 3ds.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Oedo on August 25, 2016, 11:47:42 PM
An E3 interview with Reggie went up today where he talked about the NX. A lot of it is reiterating many of the things that we've already heard from Nintendo about the NX; they believe they have a strong concept with the NX, they have to do a better job of explaining why the NX is a worthwhile gaming experience to a broad range of consumers and communicating its value to them, and they need be more on point with software planning to produce a constant stream of compelling software for the platform. We'll see what their execution is like, but they're certainly saying a lot of the right things.

The most interesting thing in the interview is that Reggie talks about learning lessons from the Wii U launch and saying that he still believes the second screen was a worthwhile concept. I'm more inclined to think that's just him doing his job and defending the Wii U, but it could also be read as "we looked at what worked with the Wii U and what didn't, and we still think there's merit to the concept of a second screen." That would lend credence to the idea of the NX being a hybrid (or at least there being a high level of integration between their next handheld and console).

The relevant parts from the interview:

Quote
How are you seeing things evolving in the console space with Sony and Microsoft launching new consoles this year and Nintendo NX coming out in 2017?

Nintendo has a quite appropriate reputation of doing its own thing, so whatever Microsoft and Sony decide to do, that’s for them to manage. From a Nintendo perspective, we are focused first on making sure that the consumer understands [The Legend of Zelda] Breath of the Wild and some of the other games that we’ve highlight here at the show, Pokémon Sun and Moon, Pokémon GO, Ever Oasis and Mario Party Star Rush. There was a lot of content that we wanted to showcase at E3. We’ve done that. Now, we’re going to start moving forward communicating more and more about NX as appropriate. For us, it’s all about the right communication at the right time. We believe we’ve got some games that are going to continue to drive our momentum this holiday, and we believe we’ve got a strong concept for NX that we’ll unveil in the future.

Quote
Many thought Nintendo was in dire straits after GameCube failed to find an audience, and then Wii exploded. Are there lessons learned from Wii U that are being applied to NX?

Every time we launch a new platform, every time we launch a critical new game, we always learn. We always do our breakdown of what worked, what didn’t, and certainly we’ve done that with Wii U, and we continue to believe that the innovation of the second screen was a worthwhile concept. The games that we’ve launched on the Wii U are hugely compelling: Splatoon, Super Mario Maker, Smash Bros., Bayonetta 2, the Super Mario game, The Legend of Zelda. Arguably, if you line up all of the single platform games for Wii U and the other two platforms, we have by far the most unique games that are highly rated by consumers and highly rated by the media. So those things worked.

One of the things that we have to do better when we launch the NX—we have to do a better job communicating the positioning for the product. We have to do a better job helping people to understand its uniqueness and what that means for the game playing experience. And we have to do a better job from a software planning standpoint to have that continuous beat of great new games that are motivating more and more people to pick up the hardware and more and more people to pick up the software. Those are the critical lessons. And as I verbalize them, they’re really traditional lessons within the industry. You have to make sure people understand the concept, you have to make sure you’ve got a great library of games, and when you do that, you tend to do well.

http://www.alistdaily.com/strategy/nintendo-president-reggie-fils-aime-discusses-nintendo-nx/
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 26, 2016, 12:43:40 AM
Reggie is a politician. He says a lot of words and says nothing at the same time.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 26, 2016, 01:35:24 AM
"We believe we’ve got a strong concept for NX" - this sort of line just cracks me up.  What, did Nintendo not think the Wii U had a strong concept?  It would seem pretty stupid for them to regard it as a weak concept and release it anyway.  I don't think Nintendo would release a product they didn't have confidence in.  Nintendo thought a tablet controller would sell the Wii U and it didn't so just because THEY believe they have a strong concept doesn't mean it is.

I personally don't care about a game system "concept" anyway.  The best consoles just have a great lineup of games and are sold at a price point the buying public is willing to pay.  There's a "strong concept".  Build a console that allows for that and you've got a chance.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 26, 2016, 07:48:17 AM
I wanna see the receipts.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 26, 2016, 10:13:22 AM
'reposted from gaf' New rumble rumors, reinforces detachable controllers.

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-detatchable-nx-controllers-support-motion-control-and-force-feedback/

Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 26, 2016, 11:44:31 AM
One problem I see with the detachable controllers is that Nintendo handhelds have traditionally been sturdy.  Aside from the stylus my 3DS doesn't really have removable parts.  I fear that if your handheld has this big section that routinely disconnects from it that over time whatever holds them together will wear out and the thing will separate in your pocket.  We've never had any issues like that or have had essential parts of a handheld that can get separated or lost from the rest of it.  The worst was losing the easily replaceable stylus or the battery "door" on the old Gameboys.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Kairon on August 26, 2016, 11:48:14 AM
One problem I see with the detachable controllers is that Nintendo handhelds have traditionally been sturdy.  Aside from the stylus my 3DS doesn't really have removable parts.  I fear that if your handheld has this big section that routinely disconnects from it that over time whatever holds them together will wear out and the thing will separate in your pocket.  We've never had any issues like that or have had essential parts of a handheld that can get separated or lost from the rest of it.  The worst was losing the easily replaceable stylus or the battery "door" on the old Gameboys.

That's why the latest patent about detachable controller's that don't use electronics, but only an IR camera into the controller itself is interesting.

The best consoles just have a great lineup of games and are sold at a price point the buying public is willing to pay.  There's a "strong concept".  Build a console that allows for that and you've got a chance.

I agree. I'm not too hung up on how you get there, just find a way!
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 26, 2016, 12:40:43 PM
Polaris reference in the DMP/Khrornos/Samsung/Xenco presentation might be a coincidence...but very interesting ;) https://t.co/sC5kuRXwu7

Seems interesting and more inline of what Nintendo will use.

I think he's on to something.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 26, 2016, 04:08:12 PM
Rumors from Emily Rogers. Not facts. Just rumors. Secondhand reports. Rumors. Things she heard. Not facts. The opposite of facts. Rumours. Fleetwood Mac.

- This article about NX's detachable controllers supporting force feedback and motion controls has truth. http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-detatchable-nx-controllers-support-motion-control-and-force-feedback/
- NX prototype had a 6.2 inch 720p multi-touch touchscreen. Unknown if final product's screen size will be larger/smaller than prototype.
- Prototype for dock station has USB ports. I heard 2 usb ports, but I don't know if this number will change in the final product.
- MCV's report about GameFreak being involved with NX has some truth to it.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 26, 2016, 04:26:50 PM
Tiers for potential GF involvement:
C: Tembo the Badass Elephant port
B: Giga Wrecker (currently in Steam Early Access) is PC/NX
A: Upgraded Solatiba
Jesus F**k: Pokemon game
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Khushrenada on August 26, 2016, 04:38:33 PM
Not facts. The opposite of facts. Rumours. Fleetwood Mac.

So, Dreams then.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 26, 2016, 05:01:28 PM
My issue with the detachable controllers is that it seems like the wrong thing to detach. If you take the controllers off to plug the main unit into the dock, you can't use the touchscreen anymore. By far the best use of the touchscreen on Wii U was Super Mario Maker. Would you only be able to create stages in portable mode? That would be weird.

What if the SOC and cartridge slot were in a cartridge of sorts itself that you placed in the dock at home or controller when mobile? That way, you could still use the touchscreen if needed when docked. The shell without the main processors would essentially be a Wii U GamePad. Just an idea. That would add some extra weight to the thing though. If this thing is rocking a 6.2 inch screen, it's already going to be pretty unweildy for longer play sessions.

Anyway, I don't think 720p is something Nintendo would have considered if its console and handheld were separate. It's more of a battery drain. It'd be cool if that "brothers in a family of systems" led to a pro/elite version with a 1080p display. Let's go nuts. Throw a glass OLED screen in there and it can retail for 599 US dollars.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Oedo on August 26, 2016, 05:05:07 PM
I wouldn't be too bothered by this detachable controllers and force feedback stuff if games on the NX were still largely designed to be played using traditional controls. They'd have their work cut out for themselves marketing it though. It's definitely going to be a concern for a lot of parents.

Everything about that screen sounds too good to be true. I would be elated if that ends up being true. I know some will question the size given that it's meant to be a portable, but I don't think it's that out there. Nintendo would have to give people a compelling reason to take it with them when they leave the house, but the same is true of handhelds in general. The 3DS XL isn't exactly something you can comfortably stick in your pocket, so they've already crossed this bridge to a certain extent. I'd still take the under on the Nintendo's next handheld having a screen that big though.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Mop it up on August 26, 2016, 05:35:56 PM
I think the DS and 3DS already show that two screens can be a good, viable concept if applied in the right ways. One of the main reasons why I think it works on the 3/DS and doesn't work on Wii U is that the screens are separate on Wii U, which makes it a lot more difficult to switch looking at them or to see both at the same time.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 26, 2016, 06:14:31 PM
Investors in Japan speculating NX handheld DMP chip based on yesterday's presentation. Interesting. https://t.co/RuMsWDYra9

Dave has come up with something interesting via happynintendofan.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 27, 2016, 02:26:24 AM
https://youtu.be/We7VpbAkDBc

This sums up how I feel about emily's rumors.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 27, 2016, 11:50:34 PM
I think the DS and 3DS already show that two screens can be a good, viable concept if applied in the right ways. One of the main reasons why I think it works on the 3/DS and doesn't work on Wii U is that the screens are separate on Wii U, which makes it a lot more difficult to switch looking at them or to see both at the same time.

Yeah the DS and 3DS are more like one big tall screen that you can sort of take in all at once and switch between the screens with eye movement instead of cranking your head like the Wii U.  It's also a clever way to work around the limited screen real estate that a small portable device is going to have.  How do you make a bigger screen without making the device itself huge?  Split the screen in two and use a hinge to "unfold" it.  Screen real estate is not really an issue on a console when you've got a whole TV to work with, particularly now that we're in the HD era.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on August 29, 2016, 03:26:04 AM
Did you guys see this mock-up?

I think it looks pretty good. cool concept. could be very interesting.

(http://i.imgur.com/crehHLA.jpg)

(http://i.imgur.com/VluAvxJ.jpg)
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 29, 2016, 11:56:00 AM
I'm hoping with that mock up that the controller parts can attach to the tablet in a horizontal orientation as well.  It would be way too restrictive otherwise and too different from everything else, which is a classic formula for weak third party support.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Khushrenada on August 29, 2016, 12:59:54 PM
*swipes left*
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 29, 2016, 06:52:07 PM
So, assuming that the NX uses an Nvidia Tegra chip (X1/X2), here's, at the very least, what you can expect visually. This is Shadowgun Legends running on the Nvidia Shield Android TV (Tegra X1, 3GB RAM).

Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Wah on August 29, 2016, 06:53:44 PM
So what these theory's come down to is, that the NX is going to be a glorified Tablet.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stogi on August 29, 2016, 07:03:11 PM
So what these theory's come down to is, that the NX is going to be a glorified Tablet.

Pretty much. And it wouldn't surprise me.

I really hope the hybrid idea is a environment to share the same games and not actually a handheld/console system.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 29, 2016, 07:38:18 PM
If that Controller Mock Up is real.  I agree with Ian Sane that it needs to be in the Landscape position as default.  Or at least be able to do Landscape connectability.

I understand Horizontal allows for easy porting of DS and Perhaps 3DS games to the system which would be a huge plus.  But that isn't enough.  Landscape is just more functional for gaming in general. 

If this is the direction they take I can see Nintendo doubling or quadrupling down on the Wii U idea actually.  The limitation of the Wii U was that you only had one tablet.  Personally I hope that with built in processors in the controller to allow it to be a mobile system as well...that means all controllers can have the WiiU tablet functionality.  If you could get fit a slightly upgraded 3DS into the controller that could be amazing...Sure the controllers might need to be expensive for an additional controller but they could break the price into 2 purchases to make it appear less.  $70.00 for the tablet that can play Nintendo's Cell Phone App games and connect to the internet then $30.00 for the controller shells?  It could be possible.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 29, 2016, 07:51:21 PM
Doubling down on the failed Wii U concept as if it was a great concept that just didn't work because of marketing or timing or a weak yen or whatever excuse Nintendo would come up would be such a Nintendo thing to do that it comes across as a satirical joke strategy someone would make up to mock them.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 29, 2016, 09:50:34 PM
Doubling down on the failed Wii U concept as if it was a great concept that just didn't work because of marketing or timing or a weak yen or whatever excuse Nintendo would come up would be such a Nintendo thing to do that it comes across as a satirical joke strategy someone would make up to mock them.

Perhaps...but honestly Nintendo always does this.  They have a great idea and try to implement it before the technology is fully ready or can be done affordably.  The Wii was a great example, but the controller tech should have been developed more and fully ready at the Wii Motion + level control or higher.  If Nintendo had waited and moved the motion control movement to this generation and Nintendo pushed hard into the HD generation last generation Nintendo would look much better with this movement into Virtual Reality coming into play.

Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 29, 2016, 10:07:28 PM
If the NX is Parker based than it's going to future proof itself, if not then it's going to be in the same position Wii U was.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Stogi on August 29, 2016, 10:16:22 PM
And it's gonna be 300-400 dollars for a handheld by a company who makes most of its profit from the parents of children and from a fanbase that generally prefers style over raw graphical power.

This is a really dumb idea.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 29, 2016, 10:35:44 PM
I think the Wii U is basically the same.  It was a good idea, but the technology was not affordably achievable.  However, if it could be affordable and truly support 4 player local play then it would be a pretty good system.  They just need to focus...no more Wii if this is the controller concept drop all other concepts...period. 
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MagicCow64 on August 30, 2016, 01:50:08 AM
I was holding out hope that there was something else going on with the NX besides being a tablet with a TV dock, but at this point I think that's what we're getting. Sounds like you can remove the controller parts for local multiplayer, or to use the touch screen only, neither of which use case sounds like something I'll do. Nor am I into portable gaming outside of longer flights. So, realistically, the NX hardware is not going to light my world on fire, and rumors about a home console version seem to have evaporated for the near-term.


But the scuttlebutt is that it's coming in cheaper than you might expect. I will probably be down with dropping $250 at launch to play Zelda and leave the thing docked to the TV. Graphically it should be a noticeable jump from the WiiU, and it'll have dozens of Nintendo games. All in all it should be fine. Although I have never quite understood the mindset that gets so hungup on the particulars of the hardware. I had basically no issues with the WiiU as such.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 30, 2016, 02:08:58 AM
I find that Tokyo Mirage Sessions uses the Gamepad very well.  You get text messages on them from the other characters in the game and it's immersive to bring your head down and check as if you yourself actually got a message on your phone.  It's a very clever and fun idea.  Plus the game does what a lot of 3DS RPGs do where at lot of the stats and such are on the second screen.  But would I pay extra for these ideas?  No.  Would the game suffer greatly if it couldn't do them like this?  Not really.

Some people swear by the off-TV feature of the Wii U.  I never use it but I can get why some people with families and limited TV availability would like it.  But how much of a killer app is it?  How important is it that it would sway your console purchase towards a product that supported it?

That's the big risk of basing a console around a feature.  Even if it has some cool uses and even if it proves to be a very useful feature for some people it has to be REALLY impressive to be a major selling factor.  I think both 3D and the Gamepad suffered from the fact that they're neat features but not that amazing.  They weren't like motion control where it was fulfilling some game design fantasy that people had had since Pong.  No one ever thought "boy I wish my console had a tablet for a controller" so the reaction was mostly going to be "oh, that's neat I guess".

I don't think the tech isn't ready, I just don't think it's such an amazing feature that it matters.  In some alternate fantasy land where Nintendo could release something like the Wii U at the same price point as the competition that matches everything and also has the Gamepad, I don't think the Gamepad would make the slightest difference in attracting customers towards Nintendo.  Truly amazing, system-selling features are incredibly rare so basing your business strategy around coming up with such concepts makes no sense.  You'll have way more weak or just unexceptional features than you'll have brilliant ones and you can't live through multiple failed generations while waiting for the truly exciting feature to come along.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Spak-Spang on August 30, 2016, 02:35:07 AM
I will only have 1 TV in my house and right now, I can tell you that an off-TV mode would be a blessing.  If Nintendo could figure out multiple streaming...even if it needs to put two separate CPUs to do the streaming that could be huge.  Possibilities could include allowing 2 different kids to watch different TV shows/movies.  (Imagine this plugged into a smart car partnership.)  Multi-user Multitasking could be a big thing.

The detachable controllers could basically make a platform that would be compatible with almost anything Nintendo has done.  Virtual Console, DS, 3DS, Wii U, NX games...only Wii games won't be natively supported...but WHAT IF those controllers on the side WERE upgraded Wii Controllers!!!!  Then you would have 100% full Nintendo game support in one package.  That would be a selling point.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Adrock on August 30, 2016, 05:33:04 AM
One of the worst things about Wii U was that it was compatible with 37 different controllers. Unlike Wii U, no one already has these swappable parts. The more things you have, the more likely you are to lose something. What if you only misplace the left side? Can you buy that individually?

Playing Virtual Console games in a platform's original layout targets a very specific audience, one I'm not sure is worth basing a major component of NX on. I like options, but simplicity is the key here. Nintendo must have a clear message with NX. Despite being known for over-explaining things, Nintendo never had a clear answer of what it wanted Wii U to be. I don't like the idea of detachable controllers because it complicates what should be a straight forward device.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 30, 2016, 06:26:49 AM
As far as the price goes, if they were to go Parker I can imagine them lowering the price a couple years down the line, as opposed to what happened with Wii U.  Plus 3ds+ wii U would still be more expensive.

Maybe if they have some solid titles at launch the higher price might be worth it. They can dwindle into casual fair as the price goes down, and then ramp back up in a long generation.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 30, 2016, 09:54:30 PM
Hot rumor swirling around today is NX has a 'split' dpad and a share button

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-nx-to-feature-ps4-style-split-d-pad-and-share-button/


Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: nickmitch on August 30, 2016, 10:41:25 PM
How do we know they're not just looking at the new Play Station mobile gaming unit?
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on August 30, 2016, 11:23:45 PM
>implying Sony will ever develop another standalone gaming handheld
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 30, 2016, 11:47:04 PM
CONFIRMED: The new gimmick is flipping the screen upside down....

NOBODY CARES...
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: MysticGohan on August 31, 2016, 12:49:15 AM
http://www.idigitaltimes.com/nintendo-nx-update-handheld-rumors-debunked-after-koei-tecmo-president-calls-nx-home-500211#.V8ZAXr0KWBI.twitter

Nintendo NX Update: Handheld Rumors Debunked After Koei Tecmo President Calls NX A ‘Home’ Console

Thought it was interesting. Never believed the NX was or would be a handheld/hybrid nonsense
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on August 31, 2016, 01:00:42 AM
how are they debunked? Like that didn't reveal anything about NX at all. Even more interesting it was in the context of VR.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 31, 2016, 08:53:04 AM
Quote
Koei Tecmo President and CEO Yoichi Erikawa seems certain the NX will indeed be a traditional home console.

Yup, that certainly seems like a rumor debunked. My eyes rolled so far back they fell off the edge of the level Donkey Kong Country style...
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on August 31, 2016, 12:40:02 PM
Split d-pad?  Oh come on, Nintendo is going to rip off Sony's BAD ideas?  Hope that isn't true.  Nintendo's d-pads are the best.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on August 31, 2016, 01:58:54 PM
What's wrong with split d-pads? I honestly can't tell the difference.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Soren on August 31, 2016, 02:07:09 PM
D-Pads, ranked.


Nintendo>>>>Microsoft>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sony.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Louieturkey on August 31, 2016, 02:17:24 PM
I've never had a problem with Sony's d pad.  I've never had a problem with most any d pads.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on August 31, 2016, 02:34:01 PM
D-Pads, ranked.


Nintendo>>>>Microsoft>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Sony.

I'm not a huge fan of Sony's d-pads (except the one on the Vita, which is great), but they're definitely better than Microsoft's.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: KeyBilly on August 31, 2016, 03:58:42 PM
The rumors are falling into place so quickly now that there seems to be almost no reason for an unveiling.  Just tell us how much it costs and show us the games.  Although, the more specific rumors about dimensions and processors seem to be based on dev kits, which might be misleading in some ways.

The Sony D-pads are terrible, in my opinion.  A detached pad's main benefit is that it can also serve as buttons, similar to the C buttons on the N64.  Perhaps the purpose would be to make the layout more flexible in some cases, with a traditional Nintendo pad also being an option.  The controller rumors are just strange.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on August 31, 2016, 05:46:32 PM
Sony D-Pads are the best. You guys are crazy.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 31, 2016, 07:17:02 PM
Via GoNintendo, More details from Letsplayvideogames

- detachable controllers
- split D-Pad, A, B, X, Y
- camera / share button
- size of dev kit is slightly thicker than the Nintendo 3DS XL when folded
- 25 mm, with a width of around 281 mm and a height of 92 mm with the controllers attached
- separated, the controllers have the same depth and height, and they both have a width of 38 mm
- console itself has a width of 205 mm
- TV port, headphone port, SD Card port, power button and cartridge port
- controllers connect to console via a hole in each side of the system ??
- button on the back of each controller that lowers the center spike that keeps it in place, making it eject from the system
- current NX development kits are region free
- those developing software for it have not heard anything about region locking being added before launch

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-nx-handheld-dimensions-layout-info-lack-of-region-lock/
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on August 31, 2016, 07:19:06 PM
I wish we could get some more 'official' sources on this thing. Everything since Eurogamer seems to build off their rumor. I want to hear a slip from a developer or someone else respected.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Louieturkey on August 31, 2016, 08:34:41 PM
I wish we could get some more 'official' sources on this thing. Everything since Eurogamer seems to build off their rumor. I want to hear a slip from a developer or someone else respected.
Official sources likely won't happen until the big reveal.  I'm guessing most companies that really know what's going on have kept their mouths shut.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Ian Sane on September 01, 2016, 12:05:34 PM
So the big amount of 3DS stuff revealed today is making me think that the NX is not going to be a replacement for the 3DS and will solely be a Wii U successor.  Today's direct suggests that Nintendo plans for the 3DS to last a bit longer.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Louieturkey on September 01, 2016, 12:49:56 PM
Well, there is a chance they support both.  The original plan with the DS was it was going to be sold alongside the GBA in case the DS flopped.  Since it didn't, the GBA eventually stopped being made but there were new games for it at least a year after the DS came out.

Sony is still having new content for the PS3 even though the PS4 has been out for 3 years now.  It's not unprecedented for a company to continue to support the old system as the new one is in its infant stages.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ShyGuy on September 01, 2016, 04:30:18 PM
So the big amount of 3DS stuff revealed today is making me think that the NX is not going to be a replacement for the 3DS and will solely be a Wii U successor.  Today's direct suggests that Nintendo plans for the 3DS to last a bit longer.

I thought the same thing.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 01, 2016, 07:06:06 PM
I could see the NX being compatible with 3DS. It reportedly takes cartridges, so who knows. You'd probably be giving up 3D though which I would be sad about. I like the 3D.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Mop it up on September 01, 2016, 08:17:32 PM
Well, there is a chance they support both.  The original plan with the DS was it was going to be sold alongside the GBA in case the DS flopped.  Since it didn't, the GBA eventually stopped being made but there were new games for it at least a year after the DS came out.

Sony is still having new content for the PS3 even though the PS4 has been out for 3 years now.  It's not unprecedented for a company to continue to support the old system as the new one is in its infant stages.
Exactly, it's happened a number of times before, especially when Nintendo had more popular systems like the NES and SNES which continued a few years after their successors released. Heck, the DS still saw Pokemon Black and White 2 a while after the 3DS came out, and those were pretty major games. Some of the 3DS stuff we're getting also came out in Japan a while ago.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Kairon on September 02, 2016, 12:04:47 AM
I'm still holding out hope for NX backwards compatibility with 3DS. How I don't know, but it'd be a really neat feature.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Luigi Dude on September 02, 2016, 12:19:30 AM
Yeah it's not a surprise Nintendo is keeping the 3DS around longer.  The system still has an active userbase of around 60 million, something the NX even if successful will takes years to reach.  Plus Nintendo isn't stupid, they know not to put all your eggs in one basket.  If the NX is a failure by the end of 2017, I can guarantee they probably have some kind of backup plan to release a traditional successor to the 3DS in 2018, just like they had a backup traditional successor planned for the GBA if the DS failed.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: ThePerm on September 02, 2016, 01:44:52 AM
Theory: NX will play 3ds games and 4ds will play nx games.

Wii U games will be available on NX, but downloadable only. Also, most likely Nintendo titles only. If you have the wii u disc, you an download a patch to bridge compatibility.
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 02, 2016, 09:50:49 AM
Theory: NX will play 3ds games and 4ds will play nx games.

Wii U games will be available on NX, but downloadable only. Also, most likely Nintendo titles only. If you have the wii u disc, you an download a patch to bridge compatibility.
I like this idea
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Louieturkey on September 02, 2016, 05:14:20 PM
Theory: NX will play 3ds games and 4ds will play nx games.

Wii U games will be available on NX, but downloadable only. Also, most likely Nintendo titles only. If you have the wii u disc, you an download a patch to bridge compatibility.
I like this idea
I like it too.  Too bad Nintendo always wants you to buy the game again. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 04, 2016, 11:12:26 PM
I was hoping someone else would post this because I was too lazy to format, but fine, I lost this game of chicken.

Not Really New Rumors From Emily Rogers (https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/09/02/rumor-what-should-we-expect-from-the-final-nx-product/)

For those too lazy:
Quote
Disclaimer: Everything in this blog post is rumor until proven otherwise. Please take everything with a grain of salt.

Here is what you can expect from the final retail product:

-Custom Nvidia GPU chip
-Region Free (No region lock)
-Six inch (6.2 inch?) multi-touch screen (Heard nothing about a stylus)
-The touchscreen has 720p resolution.
-32GB of built-in internal storage
-SD card support
-Supports USB 2.0 and 3.0
-The dock has two 2.0 usb ports and one 3.0 usb port.
-The device is around 14 – 15 mm in thickness.
-The right analogue stick (or circle pad?) will be below the face buttons.
-Camera and microphone are not built into/inside the NX portable device.
-Cooling is still a little noisy
-Detachable controllers (motion controls and next-gen vibration technology) <– Everything Laura Kate Dale said in her article was correct.
-Share / Social button that Laura Kate Dale posted is true.
-There are *at least* two shoulder buttons.
-Battery Life — Ehhh not great. I haven’t heard an exact number of hours, but it doesn’t sound great.
-Below PS4 and XB1 in raw power.
-Supports Unreal Engine 4 and Unity Engine.
My Thoughts (this section became longer than intended so I don't expect everyone to read it):

1. Cooling is noisy because development kits are using X1. Final hardware will be based on nvidia's recently announced Parker SOC while also based on already available Pascal GPU architecture (16nm FinFET process) with all the automobile stuff stripped out for obvious reasons. There will be no heat sink on the retail unit because one makes no sense on a handheld. Nintendo is going with something based on Parker for energy efficiency rather the performance boost.

2. Region free is pretty nice. It's something Iwata mentioned Nintendo was thinking about. I think this is a smart move. Region locking is not worth the trouble to implement since few people will take advantage of it anyway.

3. A 6.2 inch screen is surprising as it's portable yet not pocketable. This decision is oddly encouraging. Pockets are for phones these days, but that doesn't mean people won't still carry NX in a bag. This could be a preliminary hint that Nintendo is starting to understand its place.

4. Nintendo had no choice but to go at least 720p with a screen that large in 2017. If Iwata's "brothers in a family of systems" ever comes to pass, I'd expect a 1080p screen at some point.

5. Not really understanding why Nintendo would still be fucking with USB 2.0. I hope this is a development kit thing. There to show it will be there but not representative of the final product. Anything less than USB 3.0 is unacceptable though I'd push for USB 3.1. It's backward compatible and standard now. No excuse for this if true.

6. Depth of 14mm to 15mm is encouraging as it's much thinner (and likely lighter) than the GamePad. With Parker, Nintendo can fit a larger battery in there.

7. I expect a camera and microphone if only for backward compatibility and augmented reality.

8. Everyone keeps speculating that the detachable controllers are so you can play two player games with them. One thing I haven't heard anyone mention is that each part would then require a battery. That adds weight and cost. My thinking is that the physical buttons detach to make the touchscreen easier to hold for games that heavily use the touch screen. Doubtful Nintendo ever pushes dual screens at home. When demoing Breath of the Wild, Nintendo admitted that forcing players to look away from the TV disrupted gameplay. I would not be surprised DS/3DS backward compatibility on the go was achieved by viewing the screen vertically.

This also has the added benefit of allowing people to really punish the controller parts with impunity without having to worry about replacing the whole unit. I can personally attest to this. I prefer not using the GamePad for fear of wearing it out. I don't doubt that there will be niche peripherals in lieu of the standard layout.

9. Social/share button is likely the Miiverse button. I'd be downright shocked if it was for something like Twitch or YouTube. I'd never use it, but I'd welcome it. I could see maybe a menu popping up. Then again, couldn't that just be implemented by pressing the home button. Who knows?

10. I'll judge battery life once we know what the SOC is in this thing. I'm hoping for 10 hours. Anything less than 5 hours is garbage-tier. Either way, I will almost always have this thing docked. I'd prefer if there was a straight-up home version of this and consumers can buy a touchscreen separately though that confuses the messaging here. A powerful handheld with HDMI-out is the right call. Once the platform is established with Nintendo (hopefully) nailing the marketing, it can start releasing other models.

11. I'm okay with NX being below Xbox One in power considering NX is, by all respected accounts, a portable that trounces Wii U. Being on a modern API (Vulkan) and natively supporting most modern engines will help tremendously. EA's Frostbite engine may be the only holdout and even that can probably be ported. Additionally, Neo and Scorpio probably won't change anything either.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 04, 2016, 11:26:35 PM
Why mess with USB 2.0? Maybe they got a whole bunch of hardware $$$CHEAP$$$ when the Wii U came out and they want to burn through it. That's about the only thing I can think of.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 04, 2016, 11:36:56 PM
32gb of internal storage sounds low
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 04, 2016, 11:50:41 PM
Why mess with USB 2.0? Maybe they got a whole bunch of hardware $$$CHEAP$$$ when the Wii U came out and they want to burn through it. That's about the only thing I can think of.
Perhaps though this isn't the time to be going cheap. Nintendo is presumably transitioning back to one platform. Go big or go home.
32gb of internal storage sounds low
It is low though it may even be too high. I suspect the internal storage is primarily reserved for the operating system similar to 3DS. Nintendo expects people to buy an SD Card. You can get a 128 GB micro SDXC card for $40. Even so, there is bound to be a lot of "cleaning out the fridge" for anyone digital only. This makes USB 3.1 even more necessary.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 05, 2016, 12:21:42 AM
With how bloated games and patches are getting, I don't think a 256gb would be enough.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 05, 2016, 01:05:57 AM
Low amount of internal storage is pretty stupid.  This is the age where people will buy all digital.  I guess if this is portable that a hard drive isn't going to work too well but I figure you either put enough storage in as a default or you have essentially none and offer a lower priced system with the understanding that people supply their own hard drive separately.  Don't sort of have some storage and let people buy it thinking everything is fine only to be tearing their hair out once a couple system patches eat up all their space.  If they have to buy a separate hard drive make it obvious up front (and maybe offer two SKUs).  And USB 2.0 is fucking ridiculous.  Only with Nintendo would I assume such a rumour is true.  Might as well use Firewire or Zip drives.

If they can't match even the XB1 and PS4, which are about to have incremental upgrades that will presumably make the base units outdated, then all those PS4 and XB1 third party games aren't coming to the NX.  Take that and combine it with seemingly doubling-down on the screen concept and it's the Wii U 2 and I would expect it to sell about as well as the Wii U.  It might sell worse since I figure some amount of the existing Wii U userbase has been turned off.  You don't release consoles with the problems the Wii U has and expect to retain 100% of your customers.

The best case scenario I can see with an NX that resembles these rumours is that it replaces the 3DS as Nintendo's handheld and for all intents and purposes Nintendo is seen as having left the console market.  The whole thing sounds like taking the Wii U and making it portable.  But then it won't be as small as a proper handheld and it won't have that level of pricing or battery life.  Nintendo is smart to have 3DS releases continuing into 2017 in case this thing flops.

The whole thing sounds like trying to make the Wii U more like an actual tablet instead of a console that has a tablet-esque controller.  I think this makes a rather dumb assumption that the Wii U concept was a great concept that just wasn't done quite right.  If this is the NX, the NX is probably going to be a bigger bomb than the Wii U was.  This is basically an oversized handheld that plugs into a TV and I question what the market is for that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 05, 2016, 03:39:46 AM
Also something to note. Ouya, which is a ancestor of this line was able to get better performance because it was plugged into the wall and didn't have to be as energy efficient. Also, the thing got really damn hot.

another nice thing, because it was android based(an old rumor for nx), you could download any cell phone game you could make work.

I got the android Grand Theft Auto Vice City on ouya because it was in the Amazon store. I got Dead Trigger too.

I also, have running APK files from old versions of my game. I stopped making games for it though when I realized they didn't have self shadowing in unity yet on android.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 05, 2016, 06:50:45 AM
With how bloated games and patches are getting, I don't think a 256gb would be enough.
Absolutely. I don't think there's a really good solution to this currently. NX shouldn't have a regular hard disk drive because the moving parts make unit less durable and energy efficient. While physical size isn't really an issue because there are HDDs the size of postage stamps, anything that small and proprietary is going to drive up cost. It doesn't make sense for Nintendo to push for something Parker-based then waste the benefits it provides. If somehow NX isn't Parker-based, Nintendo would be releasing a product that is really unacceptable as a handheld.

500 GB would be the best start though even that will get eaten up really quickly.
Also something to note. Ouya, which is a ancestor of this line was able to get better performance because it was plugged into the wall and didn't have to be as energy efficient. Also, the thing got really damn hot.
A common thought is that, unconstrained by battery requirements, NX's SOC will reach greater performance in docked mode as in more cores will be available. I'm not sure I buy that nor do I think the dock serves as a supplemental computing device as recent patents suggest. I think it's more likely that most games will be developed with 720p in mind while others (e.g. Super Smash Bros.) will have 1080p assets and will naturally look better when connected to a 1080p television.
Quote
I got the android Grand Theft Auto Vice City on ouya because it was in the Amazon store. I got Dead Trigger too.
Did they run well?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 05, 2016, 06:56:52 AM
It doesn't get mentioned very much, but the storage issue does seem to be one of the biggest hurdles in implementing the hybrid concept. Having 25 GB game cards is all well and good until you want to sell those games digitally in that format.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 05, 2016, 07:37:17 AM
Sadly, it's even worse than that. Wii U discs top out at 25 GB. Rumors state NX will have 32 GB cards available at launch which doesn't even take into account space needed for DLC. 64 GB cards may even pop up in the future. A lot of the games on PS4 greater than 32 GB probably aren't coming to NX anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on September 05, 2016, 08:05:26 AM
It'll be the GameCube all over again, losing games because of low capacity media.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 05, 2016, 10:08:37 AM
Hopefully whatever SDK the system would have in this scenario would have good compression (in addition to the need to only have 720p assets) to keep the file size down.

And I can see a scenario where USB 3(.1) is advertised strictly as a storage port, with the 2.0 ports used for backwards compatible accessories. I've got a Skylanders portal and the Pokken pad, which doesn't need to transmit data that quickly. Some of you bought a thing to use the worst controllers ever on the Wii U and that ran off USB, which would work with the rumored Smash ultimate edition. And so on.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: sudoshuff on September 05, 2016, 10:46:59 AM
And I can see a scenario where USB 3(.1) is advertised strictly as a storage port, with the 2.0 ports used for backwards compatible accessories.


I sincerely hope that the USB ports can draw enough power individually for an external hard drive without the need for an external power supply.  Tracking down one of those split USB cables was a pain in the butt for the Wii U. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 05, 2016, 10:59:23 AM
There's no reason Nintendo needs to mess with USB 2.0 on a console releasing in 2017.

I wonder if Nintendo will go the route of mandatory game installs. It doesn't seem likely with these rumors. It's funny, I've never had to fridge clean my Wii U Basic with my 250GB external hard drive in the nearly 4 years I've owned it but I've had to go and clear up space on my 500GB PS4 several times in less than a year of ownership. My copies of Little Inferno and Mighty Switch Force HD still live on my console ready to play at any time.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 05, 2016, 01:39:35 PM
isn't there a new USB out that obsoletes all previous USB?

was it a different form factor or something?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 05, 2016, 01:39:39 PM
and I thought I would drop this in here for easy reference to all the NX rumors so far w/ links


Quote from: NeoGAF
source: Dystify@NeoGAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=215758899)

Everything we know about Nintendo NX (with sources)

Everything here is a rumor, unless stated otherwise.

If you think I missed anything or made a mistake let me know here or on Twitter (https://twitter.com/Dystify). I will keep updating this list until NX is officially announced.
Source links can be found below. New information will be [highlight]highlighted[/highlight].

Hardware


  • Nintendo NX will be a portable, handheld console (Eurogamer article #1, backed by Kotaku and WSJ article #1 among others)
  • A base unit, or dock station, is used to connect NX with your TV (Eurogamer article #1)
  • Six inch (6.2 inch?) multi-touch screen (Emily Rogers article #2)
  • The touchscreen has 720p resolution (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • The device is around 14 – 15 mm in thickness (Emily Rogers article #2)
Controls
  • NX has detachable controllers (Eurogamer article #1, among others)
  • Features motion controls and next-gen vibration technology (LPVG article #1)
  • The d-pad is split (LPVG article #2, Emily Rogers article #2)
  • It has a Share / Social button (LPVG article #2, Emily Rogers article #2)
  • There are at least two shoulder buttons. No info about Triggers yet. (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • The right analogue stick will be below the face buttons. (Emily Rogers article #2)
Features
  • Custom Nvidia GPU chip based on Tegra (Semiaccurate article #1, Eurogamer article #2)
  • Nintendo NX to use Nvidia's Pascal GPU architecture (@DirectFeedGames on Twitter aka. NateDrake on NeoGAF. Tweet Link (https://twitter.com/directfeedgames/status/759072574777196544))
  • NX CPU is more powerful than the CPUs of PS4/XBO. (LCgeek on NeoGAF. Comment Link (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=200144552&postcount=786))
  • Nintendo NX will use cartridges (Eurogamer article #1, WSJ article #2)
  • 32GB of built-in internal storage (Emily Rogers article #2)
  • SD card support (Emily Rogers article #2)
  • Supports USB 2.0 and 3.0 (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • The dock has two 2.0 USB ports and one 3.0 USB port (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • Below PS4 and XB1 in raw power (Emily Rogers article #2)
  • Camera and microphone are not built into the NX portable device. Note: This does not mean there isn't a camera/mic somewhere. We don't know yet. (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • Cooling is still a little noisy (Emily Rogers article #3)
  • Battery Life doesn’t sound to be great (Emily Rogers article #3)
Other features
  • Nintendo NX is Region Free (No region lock) (LPVG article #3, Emily Rogers article #3)
  • Supports Unreal Engine 4 and Unity Engine (Emily Rogers article #2)


Software


  • NX is compatible with Nintendo's smartphone games (WSJ article #1)
  • Any game that runs on PS4/XBO should run on NX with little to no issue. (Osirisblack on NeoGAF. Comment Link (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=203631027&postcount=1390))

    Confirmed Games
  • The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild - Nintendo (Source (https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/725224978984083456))
  • Just Dance 2017 - Ubisoft (Source (http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/06/13/e3-2016-just-dance-2017-announced))
  • Holiday 2017 Sonic Game - Sega (Source trailer (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCh9--2xcKk))
  • Dragon Quest X - Square Enix (Source (http://www.siliconera.com/2016/08/08/square-enix-confirms-dragon-quest-xs-development-nintendo-nx-alongside-ps4-version/))
  • Dragon Quest XI - Square Enix (Source (http://gematsu.com/2016/08/dragon-quest-xi-confirmed-nx-simultaneous-launch-ps4-3ds-versions-suggested))
  • (Pikmin 4 - Nintendo (Source 1 (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-07-20-pikmin-4-in-development-and-very-close-to-completion) | Source 2 (http://gamerant.com/pikmin-4-update-miyamoto/)) Note: While the game is officially confirmed it is currently unclear if it will launch on NX, but we can safely assume it will be on NX.)

    Indie Games
  • Tank it! - Bplus (Source (http://gonintendo.com/stories/264393-bplus-announces-anti-war-game-tank-it-for-steam-and-nintendo-nx))

    Rumored Games

  • A Mario game within 6 months of launch (Source (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678))
  • A Pokémon game by Gamefreak within 6 months of launch (Source (http://www.mcvuk.com/news/read/pok-mon-mario-and-zelda-headline-nx-dream-line-up/0170678))
  • A Super Smash Bros. game for NX launch (Source (https://twitter.com/serkantoto/status/692755598497046528))
  • Splatoon (Source (http://i.imgur.com/E3Vh027.png)) Note: This game is in development but may not release. See source.
  • Super Mario Maker (Source (http://i.imgur.com/E3Vh027.png)) Note: This game is in development but may not release. See source.
  • Beyond Good and Evil 2 - Ubisoft (Source (https://www.destructoid.com/rumor-nintendo-funding-beyond-good-and-evil-sequel-346059.phtml))
  • [highlight]A Mario Sports Superstars port[/highlight] (Source (https://twitter.com/NicoWav/status/772800080780881920) | Reference on the leaker (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=215948073&postcount=4630))


  • Bandai Namco is working on several NX titles. (Source (https://twitter.com/serkantoto/status/692755598497046528))
  • Retro Studios is not working on Metroid, DKC or Diddy Kong Racing, sounds like a new IP (Source (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1212933))
Source Links


  • Eurogamer article #1: Nintendo NX is a portable console with detachable controllers (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-26-nx-is-a-portable-console-with-detachable-controllers)
  • Eurogamer article #2: Nintendo NX is powered by Nvidia Tegra technology (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-nintendo-nx-mobile-games-machine-powered-by-nvidia-tegra)
  • Kotaku: Report: Nintendo NX Is A Portable Console With Detachable Controllers] (http://kotaku.com/report-nintendo-nx-is-a-portable-console-1784314749)
  • WSJ article #1: Lacking ‘Pokémon Go’ Effect, Nintendo Swings to a Loss (https://t.co/c6s9XKeuBd) (NX related part starts a bit further below the graph.)
  • WSJ article #2: Nintendo’s New NX Console to Go Retro With Videogame Cartridges (https://t.co/dm5SAm8eaB)
  • Semiaccurate article #1: Nintendo NX handheld to use Nvidia Tegra-based SoC (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1218933)
  • Emily Rogers article #1: Email 8.27.2016: The big question about resolution. (https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/08/27/email-8-27-2016-the-big-question-about-resolution/#more-9466)
  • Emily Rogers article #2: Here’s a recap of NX Hardware details (https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/08/31/recap-of-nx-hardware-details/)
  • Emily Rogers article #3: Rumor: What should we expect from the final NX product? (https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/09/02/rumor-what-should-we-expect-from-the-final-nx-product/)
  • LPVG article #1: Report: Detatchable NX Controllers Support Motion Control and Force Feedback (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-detatchable-nx-controllers-support-motion-control-and-force-feedback/)
  • LPVG article #2: Report: NX to Feature PS4 -style Split D-Pad and Share Button (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-nx-to-feature-ps4-style-split-d-pad-and-share-button/)
  • LPVG article #3: Report: NX Handheld Dimensions, Layout Info, Lack of Region Lock (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/08/report-nx-handheld-dimensions-layout-info-lack-of-region-lock/)

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stogi on September 05, 2016, 04:43:10 PM
What about the most obvious solution to store DLC? On the game cards themselves.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 05, 2016, 05:01:52 PM
What about the most obvious solution to store DLC? On the game cards themselves.

Unless you are doing everything though Digital Download.

Otherwise wouldn't that be the whole purpose/advantage of using cartridges again? or any solid-state media? Speed of Access and Writable Storage Space.
A fast 32GB card probably cost a large manufacturer like $1-$2, the game itself is probably only 10-20GB's considering you don't need to replicate data to make it easier to find, like you would on a disc.
that leaves you with potentially plenty of writable storage space on the game itself, for DLC, save games, and whatever other ideas Miyamoto had left over from the 64DD experimentation phase.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 05, 2016, 05:38:55 PM
Storing stuff on carts is a pretty archaic because, frankly, physical media is dying out.  Old geezers like me want it but young people that stream all their movies and music are fine with digital only.  The concern about true ownership isn't a priority to them.  These days I figure a game system should be designed with the intention of people going all digital and physical media just being a grandfathered feature for older customers that aren't comfortable going all digital yet.  Ten years from now we probably will see consoles with no physical media at all, so for Nintendo to emphasize it, and going back to cartridges as well, looks backwards.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stogi on September 05, 2016, 05:43:02 PM
But both the PS4 and XB1 accept discs, so who's really archaic?

And then you mentioned streaming movies and music but still thought having the information on your HDD is a non-archaic solution.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 05, 2016, 06:33:24 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CrkZRuRUMAABNdL.jpg:large)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 05, 2016, 07:38:32 PM
Pulling up a quote from an old interview does very little.  All we know is Nintendo is looking at building an OS that can be shared across both platforms and create assets.  Game Engines, Character Models, Physics Engines, Logic Engines, and other programing/gaming tools that can be used in all future Nintendo products.

This could mean 2 systems a portable and console...or it could just mean a new philosophy that no matter the system Nintendo is moving to unify and simplify development.  Personally, this quote could even be used to support a hybrid/docking system if they wanted too. 

I am curious what Nintendo decides to do next.  What is interesting about Nintendo is everyone keeps saying their next console is their last chance to prove themselves in the market...but since Nintendo continues to do things differently than Microsoft and Sony, even when they bomb...they are valuable to the market place because nobody is doing what Nintendo is doing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 05, 2016, 09:05:14 PM
But both the PS4 and XB1 accept discs, so who's really archaic?

And then you mentioned streaming movies and music but still thought having the information on your HDD is a non-archaic solution.

Well I'm not saying the NX shouldn't support physical media.  But in the era of downloads if your solution to concern about storage space is "don't worry you can save onto the cartridges" you might as well have just walked out of a time portal from 20 years ago.  It sounds like something a confused old man would say.  Maybe this thing should run on AA batteries and connect to the internet by dial-up while we're at it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 05, 2016, 09:21:07 PM
What ever happened to C and D batteries? I got a flashlight the other day it held four AAA batteries in a circle! You could fit a C in there and save on parts!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 05, 2016, 09:28:18 PM
But both the PS4 and XB1 accept discs, so who's really archaic?

And then you mentioned streaming movies and music but still thought having the information on your HDD is a non-archaic solution.

Well I'm not saying the NX shouldn't support physical media.  But in the era of downloads if your solution to concern about storage space is "don't worry you can save onto the cartridges" you might as well have just walked out of a time portal from 20 years ago.  It sounds like something a confused old man would say.  Maybe this thing should run on AA batteries and connect to the internet by dial-up while we're at it.

Well, the rumors suggest onboard storage and expandable storage through SD cards and probably USB HDD's. That would be your DIY unlimited solution to your storage space, assuming it's true.
So yes saving game related data directly to the game cartridge it pertains too is also a part of that solution, since the solid state media they would be using is fairly cheap and easily expandable upon demand in size.
And even though Nintendo is traditionally behind the times when it comes to technology, I wouldn't be surprised to see them adopt cloud storage solutions as part of the Nintendo Network. As it's a very good way to keep people logging in, and staying invested in the Nintendo Software/Hardware Platform.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 05, 2016, 09:37:29 PM
What ever happened to C and D batteries? I got a flashlight the other day it held four AAA batteries in a circle! You could fit a C in there and save on parts!

Companies realized that the most common batteries in peoples houses are AA and AAA batteries.  So for convince they started making most battery powered things use those types.  As well I think battery technology has gotten better so you can produce more power in those smaller batteries indicating you don't need to have the larger batteries. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 05, 2016, 09:39:55 PM
But both the PS4 and XB1 accept discs, so who's really archaic?

And then you mentioned streaming movies and music but still thought having the information on your HDD is a non-archaic solution.

Well I'm not saying the NX shouldn't support physical media.  But in the era of downloads if your solution to concern about storage space is "don't worry you can save onto the cartridges" you might as well have just walked out of a time portal from 20 years ago.  It sounds like something a confused old man would say.  Maybe this thing should run on AA batteries and connect to the internet by dial-up while we're at it.

Except that cartridges are much cheaper these days, and actually it is always simpler and easier to have the save data on the cartridge that the game is on when possible...it is something that was severally lacking in the DVD/CD era of games...that is less of a problem with hard drives and cloud storage, but still...I like the idea, I have my game cartridge I have my save game file.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Wah on September 05, 2016, 10:14:41 PM
So no final Fantasy 7 remake anymore?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 06, 2016, 03:11:37 AM
On wii U i've been using two 32 gb USB sticks to store my excess data. Considering they were only $12 it works pretty well. Could I see games returning to cartridges?

Well, sort of I'm like already kinda doing it. If I do it right I can store all my metroid games on one stick, zelda on another, and mario on the other.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 06, 2016, 09:12:26 AM
I don't know where you all reside, but in Western Illinois, we have data caps on our internet, and you have to pay a pretty penny to get to an internet tier where you have more than 15 mbps and a 250 GB cap before having additional charges.  That cap isn't much when factoring in video streaming and digital game libraries, because when I lived in NC, Time Warner didn't have a data cap but let you view your usage, and in colder months we easily hit 500+.


I don't think most users are at the "all digital future" until at least the above issue is solved.


Another question - Regarding kids' expectations to have everything installed on the device - I think kids can and still do differentiate well enough on expectations between something like a phone and video game system.  Also, when Christmas comes up, what's going to be exciting about giving your child a box and having it opened to show a download code, or just a note saying that "Mario NX" is already installed for them!".  Kids are enamored with the physical, tangible in equal, but different ways.



I'm not excited about the lackluster internal memory size based on the Rumors, but if my Wii U is any indication, I wouldn't want to purchase full retail games digitally on my Nintendo console, anyway.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on September 06, 2016, 12:05:20 PM
So no final Fantasy 7 remake anymore?

Nope. Nintendo stuck with a cartridge format for the NX while PlayStation 4 went with a CD format so now the Final Fantasy 7 remake is going to be on PlayStation instead.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on September 06, 2016, 05:20:24 PM
I'm sure all-digital is in the cards eventually, but beyond the aforementioned lackluster internet in much of the states still (and as fiber remains elusive, games are pushing 50 gigs), it will require people getting fully on-board with not owning resalable media.

I got the digital versions of Smash, Mario Kart, and 3D World on the WiiU because I was fairly confident those would have an evergreen rotation due to the multiplayer. Everything else I bought physical and everything else I resold. A big part of the industry in the states still revolves around the used game ecosystem. Gamestop is trying furiously to differentiate in to a video game Hot Topic, but at the same time Walmart and Best Buy have gotten into the used games game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 06, 2016, 06:07:13 PM
I like physical media too, but Nintendo's "NX is a platform" talk may mean that they are going to make digital more attractive.  With Android, Steam, etc., I purchase once and can play on all sorts of platforms for an indeterminate amount of time.  If Nintendo can design a system like that, I would make more digital purchases.  Even with the improvements they have made, I still feel like my content is locked to a system that will one day die and take all the content with it.  Cloud backups for saves is also an important element, although also possible with physical media.

A nice way to introduce this feature would be to have all 3DS games purchased digitally available on the NX for no extra cost when logged in to the same account.

The true answer to this issue is the same it always has been: no DRM.  I can still play PC games that were sold in the 70s because of that.  The Steam approach is the closest thing that major publishers will actually work with.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 06, 2016, 06:17:47 PM
A nice way to introduce this feature would be to have all 3DS games purchased digitally available on the NX for no extra cost when logged in to the same account.

3DS games are tied to the system though.

I get where you're going but this is Nintendo we're talking about. Start smaller and hope this is the case at least for Virtual Console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 06, 2016, 08:40:38 PM
I'm sure all-digital is in the cards eventually, but beyond the aforementioned lackluster internet in much of the states still (and as fiber remains elusive, games are pushing 50 gigs), it will require people getting fully on-board with not owning resalable media.

I got the digital versions of Smash, Mario Kart, and 3D World on the WiiU because I was fairly confident those would have an evergreen rotation due to the multiplayer. Everything else I bought physical and everything else I resold. A big part of the industry in the states still revolves around the used game ecosystem. Gamestop is trying furiously to differentiate in to a video game Hot Topic, but at the same time Walmart and Best Buy have gotten into the used games game.

you know, I didn't even pick up on that, but now that you mention it, the only way for GameStop to really move forward is to switch to a game swag store. As time goes by the games subculture will be such that it could support a store on swag alone.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 06, 2016, 09:47:50 PM
Digital is an interesting beast.  Where buying used games used to be the only way to buy games at a discount, unless you waited for store sells or half a year for discounts.  Digital stores allow for more frequent and more common sales.  Since there is no overhead for packaging/shipping, and no markup for the stores to make a small profit, the publishers can make more money on each digital purchase...allowing for more frequent digital only sales. 

So, for the consumer, Digital is actually a really good deal.  Specially once Digital matures and games are updated for newer systems and you don't have to worry about repurchases (like the App Store for ipad.)  This is where Microsoft correctly sees the future as not having to be generation based.  Once a strong platform for programming games is created, hardware just needs smaller jumps to remain relevant.  As long as a policy of supporting the legacy console for up to 5-6 years + exist. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 06, 2016, 11:50:50 PM
Nintendo NX - Specs Upgraded & Two Ubisoft Exclusives?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ScwIn2mi1pg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Apparently, there's more to the NX :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 06, 2016, 11:56:05 PM
NX wasn't really delayed because of games, it was delayed because of specs were upgraded according to SMD64 and his sources. So there's that, and it fits in  line with what I've been hearing prior to EG's "sources"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 07, 2016, 12:17:27 AM
C'mon man, even SMD64 isn't totally dismissing Eurogamer's reporting anymore like you are.

Also, Ubisoft isn't giving Nintendo an exclusive BG&E2 out of the kindness of their heart. Nintendo is paying for that if true.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 07, 2016, 12:32:48 AM
C'mon man, even SMD64 isn't totally dismissing Eurogamer's reporting anymore like you are.

Also, Ubisoft isn't giving Nintendo an exclusive BG&E2 out of the kindness of their heart. Nintendo is paying for that if true.

He also doesn't agree with them either, they are off about the system. But we'll see :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 07, 2016, 02:47:26 AM
Could Nintendo throw caution to the wind and just kinda throw a Hail Mary pass with specs on this console? 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on September 07, 2016, 09:12:18 AM
Could Nintendo throw caution to the wind and just kinda throw a Hail Mary pass with specs on this console? 

No.  After the Wii U, they want a system that if it bombs again they can minimize the losses.  This is once again why the Wii's specs were what they were since after the Gamecube Nintendo wanted something that wouldn't kill them if it sold similar numbers or even worse.

The NX will be as powerful as Nintendo can afford it to be while still selling at a profit, with the ability to drop the price in case the worst happens, something they were unable to do with the Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 07, 2016, 09:46:23 AM
via the evil NeoGaf: Nintendo Europe giving away an NX for a Splatoon Tournament.

https://twitter.com/NintendoEurope/status/773436875864440832

It looks like that tournament runs six months, so I don't think Nintendo is planning on delaying the NX past March!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 07, 2016, 10:23:45 AM
So no final Fantasy 7 remake anymore?

Nope. Nintendo stuck with a cartridge format for the NX while PlayStation 4 went with a CD format so now the Final Fantasy 7 remake is going to be on PlayStation instead.
It's history repeating itself all over again!
I replied just to let you know that at least someone got your joke. Well played.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on September 07, 2016, 11:52:12 AM
Could Nintendo throw caution to the wind and just kinda throw a Hail Mary pass with specs on this console? 

No.  After the Wii U, they want a system that if it bombs again they can minimize the losses.  This is once again why the Wii's specs were what they were since after the Gamecube Nintendo wanted something that wouldn't kill them if it sold similar numbers or even worse.

The NX will be as powerful as Nintendo can afford it to be while still selling at a profit, with the ability to drop the price in case the worst happens, something they were unable to do with the Wii U.


But isn't it this kind of mindset that has placed Nintendo in this situation? The mistake made with the Wii U isn't that the hardware was too costly, and it also isn't the gamepad. We could spend a hundred pages talking about what the real mistake with the Wii U was (as there were many mistakes), but I assert that hardware cost and unique controller were not the mistakes made.


I would even argue that not investing more in hardware is a contributing factor to their current position. Better hardware won't remedy the WIi U's problems, but the hardware is definitely one of the reasons why Nintendo is out.


Having to place cushions on the ground in case your next stunt fails is reason alone for most of us to remain skeptical of Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on September 07, 2016, 12:02:31 PM
So no final Fantasy 7 remake anymore?

Nope. Nintendo stuck with a cartridge format for the NX while PlayStation 4 went with a CD format so now the Final Fantasy 7 remake is going to be on PlayStation instead.
It's history repeating itself all over again!
I replied just to let you know that at least someone got your joke. Well played.

Thanks! I appreciate it. I thought that post was brilliant but it seemed to have gone totally ignored as people kept posting about make believe specs. Here. Have a bag of money.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 07, 2016, 02:03:55 PM
So no final Fantasy 7 remake anymore?

Nope. Nintendo stuck with a cartridge format for the NX while PlayStation 4 went with a CD format so now the Final Fantasy 7 remake is going to be on PlayStation instead.
It's history repeating itself all over again!
I replied just to let you know that at least someone got your joke. Well played.

Thanks! I appreciate it. I thought that post was brilliant but it seemed to have gone totally ignored as people kept posting about make believe specs.

The make believe specs is anything from Nvidia on the home console ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 07, 2016, 02:29:57 PM
I noticed and thought it was clever.  I give you a heart+.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 07, 2016, 03:42:31 PM
Could Nintendo throw caution to the wind and just kinda throw a Hail Mary pass with specs on this console? 

No.  After the Wii U, they want a system that if it bombs again they can minimize the losses.  This is once again why the Wii's specs were what they were since after the Gamecube Nintendo wanted something that wouldn't kill them if it sold similar numbers or even worse.

The NX will be as powerful as Nintendo can afford it to be while still selling at a profit, with the ability to drop the price in case the worst happens, something they were unable to do with the Wii U.

Sounds like Nintendo doing the very things that will ensure a flop to minimize the impact of a flop.  If they cheap out on specs the console will flop because the support will be non-existent and consoles with no games don't sell.  The Wii was a lucky fad and I fear the Nintendo-as-a-console-maker story will end on a string of failed attempts to recapture that lightning in the bottle.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 07, 2016, 09:11:47 PM
via GoNintendo: Bethesda seems to know what the NX is, acts kinda douchey.

http://gonintendo.com/stories/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q%5Btitle_cont%5D=nx&q%5Bcategory_ids_in%5D=&button=
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 07, 2016, 09:40:22 PM
I didn't think Pete Hines was being douchey. That was definitely a non-interview though. The gist of it for anyone too lazy to click the link:

Metro: So Nintendo is a thing, right?
Hines: Nintendo sure is a thing. We're always in contact with Nintendo. We say words at each other sometimes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on September 07, 2016, 11:21:10 PM
I noticed and thought it was clever.  I give you a heart+.

Ok, Sport! Here's a fat-free Yogurt.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 08, 2016, 02:46:00 PM
Thanks for thinking of my health.  I would just blow a bag of money on regular fat yogurt.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 10, 2016, 06:59:03 PM
based on the current speculation of the controller config, what do you guys think of this mock up?

(while replacing controller mode with the missing 3DS mode, which would be both controller halves attached to either side of the screen in vertical mode.)

(http://fs5.directupload.net/images/160901/8h89yujx.jpg)

Personally I like the concept, but sometimes, too many options is too many options, and some people get confused too easily. On the other hand, there isn't a game type that this can't do.

What also isn't shown would be the optional head gear to attach the screen to for VR mode, and you already have your motion controls in hand.

There really wouldn't be a game type this couldn't play with that many possible configurations out of the box. Only needed additional equipment would be the headgear for optional VR mode.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 10, 2016, 09:07:25 PM
I still don't like the detachable controllers thing unless it's just for replacement parts. When it comes to controllers, there should be fewer options, not more. Traditional, touch screen, motion; that's it. None of the options have start and select.

Cocktail Arcade Mode doesn't look like it can be a realistic option in practice. People move when playing games, and there's bound to be some cunts who yank the controller away.

NES mode and Pointer Mode would require a battery for each part. First, who wants to pay for that? Second, who wants to potentially charge three separate things? It's messy, and just doesn't seem necessary or worth it.

I doubt there's a single Smash Bros. elitist who would bother with an add-on. It's GameCube controllers or bust.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 10, 2016, 09:38:54 PM
I'm sure it would require a battery in all parts regardless if the controllers detached for independent use. And you could easily charge all 3 at once just by reattaching them to the screen, and plugging the unit in as a whole.

So while I'm sure there are little things to nitpick, and everyone probably has one or two about the design, I think it practically covers everything in 3 pieces that all come in the box (4 if you include a base station/tv dock).

It would definitely be something quite different from PSXboxOne4, while also allowing it to play the exact same games as them, but games that they cannot without some sort of major design change or additional hardware too.

So I'm fully onboard with style of design.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 11, 2016, 09:58:20 AM
Reattaching the parts to charge the controllers still means you can't use them in NES Mode or Pointer Mode. That isn't a nitpick; that's fundamentally problematic design. That means there are situations when you just can't play certain games unless everything is tethered to an outlet. What the **** kind of games machine is that?

Simplicity is key. If I can detach the controller so the touchscreen is easier to hold when creating levels in Super Mario Maker or to replace them because controllers wear down over time which we just accepted with every other handheld ever, that makes sense to me. Adding a myriad of options overly complicates the whole thing. Sure, other companies will likely create peripherals if the included controllers detach, but let them worry about that mess. Nintendo should focus on ergonomic yet elegant design and ease of use.

Despite all the leaks, I doubt we've heard everything. Detachable controllers have pros and cons just like everything else. Once you entertain the idea that they operate independently, you start running into the major flaws. NX is rumored to have a 6.2 inch 720p screen, and the thinking is to add more weight and cost to that? No, sir, I don't like it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 11, 2016, 12:43:24 PM
The sticks are too far away from the face buttons/D-pad. Given that most developers may default to a twin-stick setup you're either going to be very uncomfortable playing them or (surprise surprise) you're going to have to default to a second controller.


This looks like it's trying to appease way to many options and it does none of them right. None of the modes feel like they're comfortable to hold.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 11, 2016, 01:10:20 PM
Reattaching the parts to charge the controllers still means you can't use them in NES Mode or Pointer Mode. That isn't a nitpick; that's fundamentally problematic design. That means there are situations when you just can't play certain games unless everything is tethered to an outlet. What the **** kind of games machine is that?

...but if the controller is dead, then you weren't going to be using them to play anything anyway.
and it's not like it still couldn't charge independently if needed. The solution to that problem would be to include inductive charging for ease of use and less wires and ports to connect them to.

If Nintendo wants to be up on Tech, offer more Bang for the Buck, and look like a Pioneer in the industry, wireless controllers that recharge wirelessly would be a good move and make perfect sense.

Quote
Simplicity is key. If I can detach the controller so the touchscreen is easier to hold when creating levels in Super Mario Maker or to replace them because controllers wear down over time which we just accepted with every other handheld ever, that makes sense to me. Adding a myriad of options overly complicates the whole thing. Sure, other companies will likely create peripherals if the included controllers detach, but let them worry about that mess. Nintendo should focus on ergonomic yet elegant design and ease of use.

But I think that's the beauty of that design. It is simple. A screen with controllers that detach.
You can do so much with so little. It's simple, yet it's also sophisticated by giving you options to play many types of games in many types of ways with nothing more than what came in the box. A screen with controllers that detach.

Where I see things getting complicated would be the additional attachments, like the "gamecube controller add-on" and other such additional and unnecessary stuff that clutter the space beneath your TV.

Quote
Despite all the leaks, I doubt we've heard everything. Detachable controllers have pros and cons just like everything else. Once you entertain the idea that they operate independently, you start running into the major flaws. NX is rumored to have a 6.2 inch 720p screen, and the thinking is to add more weight and cost to that? No, sir, I don't like it.

Cost is always a concern, but Nintendo underdelivering on a good idea is also an issue with their past 2 home consoles. They need to see an idea all the way through instead of gimping it due to cost concerns.

They crippled the Wiimote by removing the motion+ aspect of it due to saving something like $2 per controller. Had they just ate the cost or passed it on (Oh No Wii cost $201.99 instead of $199.99), they could have avoided the whole "waggle" fiasco once the Wii Sports novelty passed.
The Wii U was almost still-born since the controller had no processing of it's own, which means you were still kinda stuck to 20ft from the console unless you had thick walls. Cost was a major concern in that case, but it was still an idea that was half executed, and therefore ultimately failed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 11, 2016, 02:59:47 PM
"Controller mode" looks terribly uncomfortable.  The controller needs to be wider or my fingers are going to be bumping into eachother.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 11, 2016, 03:40:21 PM
"Controller mode" looks terribly uncomfortable.  The controller needs to be wider or my fingers are going to be bumping into eachother.

Yeah, that's why I suggested replacing that with the 3DS mode.

controller move can be the same a pointer mode. the halves working independently.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stogi on September 11, 2016, 05:09:59 PM
That mockup is insane. I wonder how long that took?

Let's start with what I like. I like that it can play anything, which means it can play every VC game. I also like that I can change its orientation. Some games play better vertically. They used tetris, but I would have used a space shooter.

It's interesting for sure, but I'm still on the "NX is a platform, not one system" boat. I just don't see Nintendo messing with the DS formula that drastically, with both the DS and 3DS selling well.

I think Nintendo's main motivations this round are: How can we provide more software in a timely matter for both handheld and console? How can we entice people to buy both?

The only conclusion I can come to is to make both markedly different from one another but still play the same games. I suggested Nintendo offer one game that plays on both, but in reality, they could go the SSB approach and offer a bundle for a discount and still achieve the same effect as long as the development process on the game itself is cut in half. This would ensure a reliable stream of games on both systems from Nintendo and allow third parties to sell their wares on both handheld and console with little effort.

If the two system idea is what is actually being planned, then the next question is how closely do you relate the specs? A better question is how close do they have to be? We could assume they at least have to run the same version of engine in order to be compatible. And that's probably why we keep hearing rumors about Nvidia. They have the SoC that can run today's latest engines on a handheld. I don't think they'll go with Parker though. Nintendo made a mistake pricing the 3DS at $250 and now knows it'll be hard to get away with anything over $200. I particularly like $189.

Our biggest clue to how powerful it has to be is can it run BotW? The Wii U can. Does anyone know if the X1 is comparable to the Wii U or at least make an educated guess? Another clue we have is Xenoblade Chronicles on 3DS. This type of conversion might be what we're likely to be looking at.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 11, 2016, 05:30:31 PM
...but if the controller is dead, then you weren't going to be using them to play anything anyway.
and it's not like it still couldn't charge independently if needed. The solution to that problem would be to include inductive charging for ease of use and less wires and ports to connect them to.
A dead battery is universal. That's not really the problem. The messaging is confusing. And there's no way Nintendo includes three separate AC adapters for independent charging. Sure, it's convenient sometimes. However, as previously stated, Nintendo would be added weight and cost for the option to use shittier controls.
Quote
But I think that's the beauty of that design. It is simple. A screen with controllers that detach.
You can do so much with so little. It's simple, yet it's also sophisticated by giving you options to play many types of games in many types of ways with nothing more than what came in the box. A screen with controllers that detach.
I don't think that's simple at all. Nintendo would be adding different parts that detach and need to be charged and can get lost. Some games use them, some don't. That's a marketing nightmare, and I don't know if I trust Nintendo enough to pull that off.

I've never been sold on the hybrid concept, but if Nintendo is going to make it work, NX has to be one better than the other. Being a mobile device first is the better move. A handheld device can scale up better than a console can scale down (mainly due to physics and thermodynamics). That said, it's in Nintendo's best interest to make the best portable it can without compromising the benefits of a portable. If that means a standard portable with an HDMI-port, so be it. Handhelds are personal devices. Let it stay that way on-the-go. Docked at home, have a separate Pro Controller. That is the simplest messaging Nintendo can have if it insists on going this direction. Adding weight and cost just to have detachable controllers that will inevitably confuse most of the people Nintendo is targeting is asinine.
Quote
Cost is always a concern, but Nintendo underdelivering on a good idea is also an issue with their past 2 home consoles. They need to see an idea all the way through instead of gimping it due to cost concerns.
Extra controllers are hidden costs on consoles. Besides being overpriced to all hell, they aren't included on consoles MSRP. On a machine with detachable controllers, that cost is now included.
I think Nintendo's main motivations this round are: How can we provide more software in a timely matter for both handheld and console? How can we entice people to buy both?
If Nintendo were to release a console and a handheld (which is currently looking slim), I don't think Nintendo can entice people to buy both. However, Nintendo combined its console and handheld hardware devisions for a reason, presumably since it couldn't handle supporting both. My thinking is the console would play all the handheld games like a Gameboy Player out of the box. It'll be like the New 3DS or PS4 Pro in that games played on the more powerful console will benefit from improved performance. Nintendo would likely develop games primarily with the handheld in mind. Considering how powerful NX is, I don't think it'd be an issue.
Quote
Our biggest clue to how powerful it has to be is can it run BotW? The Wii U can. Does anyone know if the X1 is comparable to the Wii U or at least make an educated guess? Another clue we have is Xenoblade Chronicles on 3DS. This type of conversion might be what we're likely to be looking at.
At best, Tegra X1 is two to three times as powerful as Wii U. That isn't a bad goal for a portable. Unfortunately, you aren't getting that performance without a heatsink. That said, Nintendo would have to go with Parker. Being on a smaller node and utilizing more modern technology would solve the heat problem.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stogi on September 11, 2016, 06:03:20 PM
Hmmm... So you're proposing that Nintendo may focus their efforts on hand-held development with upscaling coming automatically on the console? I can see that.

I was thinking the opposite. Nintendo would focus on developing for their home console and downgrading their graphics for the hand-held. But if hand-held development includes making games like BotW, then I see no problem with your idea.

It still gives people the option to buy either and enjoy the entirety of Nintendo's catalog.

EDIT:

So the x1 gets incredibly hot? Hmmm....that's going to make the hand-held quite expensive. I was thinking for both the console and hand-held it'd cost $500.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 11, 2016, 08:39:25 PM
The mockup is interesting.  However, some of those modes would be extremely uncomfortable.

The Gameboy Mode just won't work.  The system is going to be too heavy to be comfortable like that...and the connector might snap or be very fragile in that orientation.  This is probably true with the Cocktail mode even though it is cool it is also kinda pointless and could cause problems. 

2) Controller Mode just won't work with that shape.  For a photoshop edit it works fine, but that right analog stick is going to be uncomfortable while playing with buttons, plus you can't even use it like a fully compatible traditional controller.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 11, 2016, 09:13:17 PM
I would drop "controller mode" and just use it in free standing "pointer mode" instead.
and I would also skip "GB Mode", and just use it in "3DS Mode" w/ both handles on either side of the vertical orientation of the screen.


If I had the motivation to install an editing app, and then edit the pic myself, I would, but I don't, so I haven't.
I just assume my description is adequate. really wish the original creator didn't forget the 3DS Mode though. pretty large oversight.


and I think cocktail mode is interesting. I'd be interested in seeing the kinds small arcade like games they come up with to play in that mode.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 11, 2016, 09:46:45 PM
Cocktail mode looks like something from Wii Party U.  Not sure how much that'll get used.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 11, 2016, 09:57:44 PM
I know they had a few things like that in Wii Party U, but assuming this device is actually popular, and someone other than Nintendo makes games for it, i figure there will be all sorts of table-top games released and mini-2 player things. The mock up looks like a perfect middle ground for Hard-core and casual gamers of the home and portable types

I'm sure the novelty of it would wear off quickly though.

so is there any speculation as to when this supposed to be revealed?
I think last official mention was before end of the year... but was that fiscal or calendar?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 11, 2016, 10:05:35 PM
so is there any speculation as to when this supposed to be revealed?

Tonnes. (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=50346.0)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 11, 2016, 10:22:25 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1kahYiMaXFc two of the three SoC's have been revealed, one of course being Scorpio, the other being PS4 Pro, the third has yet to be announce until more clarity. Which is likely the NX.

And No the X-box slim or whatever it's name is, is not a new SoC, it's still based on the Bones architecture and is slightly beefed up. So it doesn't count, plus AMD has more SoC's.

But I'm expecting to hear something very soon this month.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 12, 2016, 05:50:29 AM
Hmmm... So you're proposing that Nintendo may focus their efforts on hand-held development with upscaling coming automatically on the console? I can see that.

I was thinking the opposite. Nintendo would focus on developing for their home console and downgrading their graphics for the hand-held. But if hand-held development includes making games like BotW, then I see no problem with your idea.
If NX is two to three times more powerful than Wii U, handheld and console development for the company is indistinguishable. Very few of its first party output is natively 1080p anyway such as a Super Smash Bros. Nintendo can still develop games with 1080p assets and they'll naturally look better on a larger display. If NX has a 720p display, that likely remains the target resolution for most of its games. Nintendo will likely use the extra processing power on things like better frame rates and reducing pop in.
Quote
So the x1 gets incredibly hot? Hmmm....that's going to make the hand-held quite expensive. I was thinking for both the console and hand-held it'd cost $500.
Heat isn't what makes a system on a chip expensive. Maxwell/X1 isn't a great mobile chip when pushed for performance. That's why it would benefit Nintendo the go with Parker. It can the get same or slightly better performance with much greater power efficiency.

As for cost, the first Tegra-NX rumor stated that Nvidia gave up the farm to get Nintendo's business. The thinking was Nvidia wanted Tegra in a product that could show what its SOC can do. The loss it would take to get Nintendo's business (e.g. a semi-custom design, all the support, the kitchen sink etc) paled in comparison to what it stood to gain by selling its designs to other, much larger companies (e.g. car manufacturers). Apparently, Nvidia's margins from consoles were never great. It had burned bridges with both Microsoft and Sony so Nintendo was the only one left to pitch to (and really, it made the most sense as Nintendo is the only company in need of a mobile SOC). There was another rumor years back that Nvidia almost had a deal to get Tegra in 3DS, but it couldn't provide the yields Nintendo wanted so Nintendo went with DMP. This time, Nvidia has more to gain with Nintendo being more a means to an end.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 12, 2016, 04:31:25 PM
NWPlayer123 on Twitter. https://twitter.com/NWPlayer123/status/775412480956784640 (https://twitter.com/NWPlayer123/status/775412480956784640)

Quote
Breath of the Wild's ™ mentions both cartridges and discs and is confirmed for a dual release so yeah NX uses carts
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 12, 2016, 04:35:48 PM
Great work on that mockup.  Almost looks like something you would see in official press materials.  Like others have said though that controller mode just isn't going to work from an ergonomics perspective.  I really don't like the NES mode though that's a knock on the rumour, not the mock up.  There is a reason modern games use these dual analog controllers because that level of complexity is required to control a fully 3D game.  I hated when Wii games would shoe-horn in this stupid NES style design and force a button map to a shake because the controller has less buttons than a damn Genesis controller from 25 years ago.  And we had all this constant usage of d-pads in 3D games when NINTENDO is the company that determined that analog sticks were the best way to control a game in 3D space.  We were going BACKWARDS from a standard that THEY SET!

This all just looks like doubling down on the Wii U's core concepts.  The Wii was a fad, the Wii U was a failure - any NX resembling these rumours will be a failure as well.  And it will have **** specs and that means it will have **** support and that right there will sink the console instantly.  Nintendo is all concerned about spreading themselves too thin and their solution is to have one platform to support.  That still will not be enough games.  Doubling the Wii U's output would not have made a difference.  20 games a year instead of 10 is still peanuts compared to what a product with proper third party support gets.  Nintendo seems to recognize the issue of not having enough games but for whatever reason refuses to even consider the very typical way of solving this by encouraging other companies to make games for your system.  This concept that solved the problem for the NES and SNES and Nintendo's handhelds and for any of their competitors that had any level of success is for some reason not something to even try for.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 12, 2016, 08:36:03 PM
Team#AMD ftw! Just getting ready for the party :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 13, 2016, 12:38:50 AM
But Ian, the single platform Nintendo wants to develop for is a software platform that works across any Nintendo hardware.
If 3rd parties want to support the Nintendo handled, well guess what... They are just supporting ALL of Nintendo's hardware, as the game supports the software platform, which works on all their hardware.

At least if my understanding of what NX really is supposed to be is correct.
Whether we get a handheld and/or console, it's all the same software.

And personally I think the Wii U at its core was a great idea. They just scaled it back into a half assed concept that was reversed on itself due to cost restrictions, or that famous Nintendo frugality, and the need to not step on the 3DS business.
What's been rumored is more the realization of what the Wii U could have and probably should have been.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 13, 2016, 02:12:47 AM
I dont like the non traditional + control pad. I really hope they dont change it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 13, 2016, 02:22:34 AM
If Nintendo could develop 2 hardware devices that use the same programming engines and OS.  However one is scaled for Handheld because it only needs 720P and the other is scaled for silky smooth 1080 60 FPS with the ability to software upscale to 4K in the future then you have a capable handheld/ Home Console system. 

The key is to get that perfect balance and demand 100% cross buy options for either system...and then a retail manufacturing price of 49.99 for games.  (Nintendo will generously cut of the sell to 10-15%) for all games, and Developers can also make some profit on DLC content of course.  Personally, if I was to do this, I would start with the Handheld version because that is the system that is doing the best...however I can understand trying to salvage the train wreck that is the Wii U.  So If Nintendo releases this system with new games, and just happens to also release all the games for the Wii U on the new system, or make the new system compatible it would go along way to building support for the new system as there are MANY great games players may have missed on the Wii U that they can play.

I still say whatever they do, they need to have a single controller system. None of this bring whatever controller you want to the system.  The only exception might be the Wii U Pro Controller....I think that controller could still be used throughout the Nintendo line. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on September 13, 2016, 01:30:11 PM
For those that just want the gist,

price, games, controller that works.



Ian, what you want will never happen. Nintendo is never going to be the SNES again. The Wii's biggest problems were lack of options, like you addressed with the controls; online features, i.e. friend codes, being SD only, and the stigma of the name, I would add Mii's but that is a personal preference the masses seemed to dig them so whatever.

Wii U's biggest strength was it fixed most of the Wii's problems its weakness was always price, marketing, lack of games, and over confidence. Nintendo needed to realize early one for Wii U to succeed they needed to get more games out quicker and they needed to bring the cost down quicker. The stupid thing hasn't dropped in price since the PS4 launched, that is terrible.

I see bigger things for NX but I do think the issue of 3rd parties needs to be put to rest. Nintendo has existed to some degree without major 3rd party support for 20 YEARS, they had major 3rd party support for TEN YEARS. At this point it is blatantly obvious we all, ALL buy the Nintendo console for the 1st party games. Now I agree that Nintendo forgets that not every gamer likes every game so they need more diversity but 3rd parties are never coming back. Nintendo could literally do everything right and 3rd parties will still shrug them off, the market has changed since the SNES, the 3rd party games that you clamor for, the Mega Man's the Castlevanias, etc, they don't even truly exist anymore.

I think Ian, it isn't the 3rd party games you are missing, you already can get those on your PC, if you don't have a PC what are you doing on a discussion board posting from your phone, play the 3rd party games on your phone, on a tablet play them there. A consumer doesn't have a right to demand anything from a company you buy what they make or you don't end of story. You like Mario, Zelda, Donkey Kong, Metroid, if I remember correctly F-Zero and RPG's, and a few fighting games. Are you getting THOSE games on PS4? I didn't.

I am happy with my PS4 because it had the few games I wanted it to have that Wii U didn't but I still use my PS3 more than either. Why? Because it had the games.

That asside, I think we all have to face the reality the world has changed, Nintendo did change with it but not in the way we wanted. Some people wanted Nintendo to keep doing what worked 25 years ago, others want them to just follow Sony and make a Playstation that runs Mario games, that won't happen.  What I am saying is it doesn't do anyone any good to get their expectations in the wrong place.

Nintendo doesn't need Call of Duty, the gamer who BUYS and PLAYS that game isn't into Mario, they are into Doom, Assassin's Creed, Resident Evil, and Halo plus any game that looks or plays like those games. The GTA gamer is not interested in Mario, they play GTA and games that resemble it.

Yes Nintendo should strive for reaching the widest audience, but they need to be realistic, there are different types of games, those that really want the visual experience, the cinematic experience, they HAVE to get a Sony or an Xbox or play them on the PC, because those games require a level of commitment that you need a large hard drive and online infrastructure and internet community to support, Mario, Zelda, Kirby, DK, etc, you just need the characters to look good, Wii U looked good, do you really need Mario to look like Tomb Raider or Zelda to look like Skyrim? Who would buy that?

We go in circles every generation, all of us do this, and it is because our tastes differ. Nintendo is not going to get the RPG games back, those gamers have settled on Sony, Nintendo can at best hope for GC level of RPG output which was pathetic or at worst N64 and Wii U level which is damn near zero.

What does that leave? More than you give them credit for! Nintendo lives and dies on retro, not just true retro but the retro image. The memory of things like Mega Man. Do they need a true proper Mega Man game? No they do not, they have those they are on Virtual Console, I would wager money that ANYONE who  plays Mega Man games will tell you those first 6 and Mega Man X are about the only ones really worth getting anyways so why bother porting a new one. If you want a new Mega Man game might I suggest you try AVGN Adventures, there are a pair of them.

What about platformers, Nintendo does those better than anyone. Hell if you look at their best consoles, NES and Wii, they were sold on gimmick sports games and weird controllers, when Nintendo does the "traditional" console that gamers and 3rd parties "want" them to do, they fail. Sure in the end raw numbers show SNES beat Genesis. But that is only if you look at it in the end at raw numbers. Sega kicked Nintendo's ass for three years, then it was a virtual tie before SEGA threw in the towel and conceded the market to Nintendo only to half-ass their way back in once they recognized it was a mistake. I am not saying Sega was better than Nintendo but 3rd party companies did, they wanted out from under Nintendo so they flocked to them first chance they got. Sega did things Nintendo was afraid to do, they took risks. When Nintendo takes risk, they roll the dice, it is rare they take risks anymore more often than not they play it safe, why because that works.

We can go back and forth all day long does their next console need Street fighter games or doesn't it, well if you like them or you don't it doesn't matter reality is they are not coming to the system so if you like fighting games and you like Mario games you have to face reality and buy both consoles. My question is who cares about support any more anyways? One think that being an aging gamer has taught me is that I do not need to own all three consoles TODAY in order to enjoy them in a few years from now. For me, You, Adrock, all of us here, if we really want to go back and play those fighting games, those RPG games, those Minecraft and GTA games, wait five years and pick up the Sony console cheap and load up on cheap games. Pick your current gen console, stick with it and then go back to the **** you missed, it's pretty much the way we have been doing business for THREE DECADES now. Face it, accept it, get over it.

No, Nintendo does not NEED all the third party games in the world, YOU want that so you can buy one machine, save money and not have to give money to Sony. Here is a solution, buy the games you want on Steam and play them on your PC, then in three years get a used or bargain bin PS4 when they are on clearance and then load up at the used game store.


NX needs two things, it needs to be priced right, and it needs to have games (Nintendo games) at a regular pace. I would argue it also needs traditional controls but it doesn't it needs controls that work, as long as they work for the games it gets. Do I want a PS4 that plays Nintendo games, sure but I don't want to pay for that, I chose PS4 for current gen and Wii U for Nintendo games, I as a consume realize that was necessary. I then picked up a cheap PS3 and never looked back. I also got a pair of Wii consoles, a pair complete working, for $5 bucks, WE are not the market Nintendo is chasing, they are going after kids and the rest of us will buy it anyways we always do. The kids that grew up on Playstation are not going to convert to Nintendo fans, the kids that grew up on Xbox need mental health evaluations when they should have just stuck to their real PC's and not put MS on the damn map, everyone else that games does it as a hobby occasionally.


Price, games, controls that work. When they do that they sell good when they don't they sell bad. Nintendo needs NX to sell well and if walking away from the dedicated console space, something MS and Sony are doing anyways, then that is what it takes that is what they need to do. Then the games that WILL sell to the Nintendo crowd will make their way on the console and the games that won' never were going to anyways. Remember outside NES when Nintendo FORCED developers to be exclusive, Nintendo never got all the games anyways even your beloved SNES, Genesis had DOZENS, literally dozens of superior games than SNES that SNES either didn't get or their only claim to fame was more colors.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 13, 2016, 04:28:12 PM
While Nintendo hasn't really had good third party support for 20 years, keep in mind that in that time three of the four consoles they released underperformed sales wise.  They got a good boost from the Wii and they've had their handhelds bail their asses out.  What if the Wii didn't catch on and Nintendo had had four consoles in a row sell worse than their predecessor where would they be?  If they didn't have their handhelds where would they be?  This isn't just a personal preference, it affects Nintendo's financial stability as a videogame company.  The Wii U isn't really that bad of a system in that the games it does have are generally quite good but its small userbase is pretty much the size of the userbase that will buy a Nintendo console for just Nintendo games.  The best bet is that a low price will expand that userbase.  That's the big gamble.

Now Nintendo still has the handhelds but how long does that last?  I see a brighter future for consoles than handhelds.  Handheld gaming has always had a fair bit of casual appeal where one is willing to put up with a scaled back experience to play on the go.  But playing on the go has switched to phones.  That leaves the handheld market to gaming enthusiasts for which a phone game is not good enough.  But a console is more up the alley for a dedicated gamer than a handheld because it's a less compromised experience.  I feel that gaming has become more segregated where hardcore gamers use dedicated videogame systems (or PCs) and casuals do not bother with gaming machines at all because their phone or tablet is good enough.  Handhelds will be more hurt by that than consoles and Nintendo sucks at consoles and seems indifferent towards addressing that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 13, 2016, 09:14:43 PM
Certainty AMD will be powering the NX https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gkpaz4HL83Y this was dicussed today via amd. We know there are 3 console SoC's, one being Scorpio, the other PS4Pro, so this clearly leaves Nintendo as the third.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on September 14, 2016, 01:18:31 AM
NX needs two things, it needs to be priced right, and it needs to have games (Nintendo games) at a regular pace. I would argue it also needs traditional controls but it doesn't it needs controls that work, as long as they work for the games it gets. Do I want a PS4 that plays Nintendo games, sure but I don't want to pay for that, I chose PS4 for current gen and Wii U for Nintendo games, I as a consume realize that was necessary. I then picked up a cheap PS3 and never looked back. I also got a pair of Wii consoles, a pair complete working, for $5 bucks, WE are not the market Nintendo is chasing, they are going after kids and the rest of us will buy it anyways we always do. The kids that grew up on Playstation are not going to convert to Nintendo fans, the kids that grew up on Xbox need mental health evaluations when they should have just stuck to their real PC's and not put MS on the damn map, everyone else that games does it as a hobby occasionally.


Price, games, controls that work. When they do that they sell good when they don't they sell bad. Nintendo needs NX to sell well and if walking away from the dedicated console space, something MS and Sony are doing anyways, then that is what it takes that is what they need to do. Then the games that WILL sell to the Nintendo crowd will make their way on the console and the games that won' never were going to anyways. Remember outside NES when Nintendo FORCED developers to be exclusive, Nintendo never got all the games anyways even your beloved SNES, Genesis had DOZENS, literally dozens of superior games than SNES that SNES either didn't get or their only claim to fame was more colors.


Don't kid yourself. If you weren't a Nintendo gamer during the SNES, then I think you just excluded yourself from the "know." What I mean by that is that you talk as if SNES is some 'outlier' and that we should all just expect that the formula for Nintendo success looks like the N64, GameCube, and even more so the Wii--the basic idea being that Nintendo first party games will drive the sales and third party support is just a bonus. This is the problem IanSane has already pointed out with this line of thinking. Producing a $200 box with a simple control scheme and some sort of gimmick is just as likely to result in a firestorm of success as it is total consumer abandonment. The fact is that even someone such as myself, once a Nintendo fanboy who used to write for sites like this one, is all but nearly a Steam gamer now because there are a lot more interesting games on Valve's platform while Nintendo land looks a lot like a derelict amusement park these days.


If Nintendo follows your line of thinking, I may just not buy in on this round of Nintendo--it will be a first time ever for me.


The thing about the SNES that I think you fail to acknowledge is that it was not lacking in any genre. I did not hold animosity towards the Genesis like my Genesis brethren held towards the SNES. Both had Madden football, several varieties of baseball, basketball, and hockey. Both consoles had nearly everything going for them, except Genesis didn't have Mario, Zelda, and Donkey Kong (among many other legendary games). But it was a truly great time to be a gamer, as both consoles offered enough unique qualities to be loved. By comparison, I feel that today's gaming market is on the verge of becoming a disgrace because game publishers are really pushing to homogenize the gaming hardware market. The emphasis is more on portability and putting a single effort onto as many platforms as possible.

Now this all sounds good in practice and also offers the ease of market entry that has renewed the "indie" game development scene (basically, what we sort of already had once when smaller publishers such as Westwood and Maxis were legendary), BUT I would also like to point out that the unique hardware qualities (now seen strictly as challenges) of yesteryear also drove creativity to some degree. Developers saw these limitations as merely a puzzle to solve, and it's truly amazing some of the games that were produced for the SNES.


The point is basically that even though some other consoles had exclusives, the SNES had something really good for everyone. It was a powerhouse game console that not only drove 16-bit gaming but by the end of its life was pushing 3-dimensional polygonal graphics. It wasn't just some affordable gaming box with traditional controllers. This was when Nintendo was truly pioneering video games.


That beloved SNES succeeded on a formula that includes offering new and truly innovative blockbuster games. The Wii was an innovation, but the bulk of the games for it were not blockbusters. We want hardware that inspires truly exceptional titles rather than shovelware aimed at taking advantage of a flash market.


So while affordability and good traditional controls are certainly qualities that are needed to truly be successful, the game machine needs to have the potential to handle the games. Merely matching yesterday's potential seems weak by comparison. The leading edge of development yearns for something much more powerful than what we have today. We want to see Nintendo pushing the technological envelope because that's what they used to do really well.


As an aside, wouldn't we all rather see Nintendo take a big risk with some hardware even if it means said hardware is somewhat controversial in a positive way and for whatever reason comes up short? Early on the SNES was aid to be lacking in CPU, and Sega was quick to highlight this difference in their Sonic games. Now we all know the SNES totally got the last laugh in terms of GPU superiority. I'd rather see Nintendo attempt a power grab than continually settle with good enough graphics. I want potential. Even the Gamecube had unrealized potential.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 14, 2016, 07:39:47 AM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 14, 2016, 08:34:31 AM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.


Probably all the more reason to believe the NX will only be one platform that'll be your home and mobile console.  Consolidates Nintendo's developer efforts into one platform so that worst case scenario, if NX is Wii U-2, Nintendo can at least keep a steady stream of gaming in absence of 3rd parties.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: daifuco on September 14, 2016, 09:10:59 AM
So while affordability and good traditional controls are certainly qualities that are needed to truly be successful, the game machine needs to have the potential to handle the games. Merely matching yesterday's potential seems weak by comparison. The leading edge of development yearns for something much more powerful than what we have today. We want to see Nintendo pushing the technological envelope because that's what they used to do really well.

What do you mean with potential? rawpower?


I think the important thing is to make a hardware balanced enough so development teams dont feel constrained by it.
But sometimes constrains are not that bad at all, you need creativity to overcome problems.
The gamecube had little memory compared to the Xbox. Which probable led to a cell shaded Zelda... of course back then internet kids were not happy with a "childish" zelda but now the Wind Walker is considered an outstanding work of art.
The Wii had Mario Galaxy one of the greatest looking game of its generation.

And... We are still in a Minecraft generation!!!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 14, 2016, 09:42:14 AM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.


Probably all the more reason to believe the NX will only be one platform that'll be your home and mobile console.  Consolidates Nintendo's developer efforts into one platform so that worst case scenario, if NX is Wii U-2, Nintendo can at least keep a steady stream of gaming in absence of 3rd parties.

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely devices with compatible os's.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on September 14, 2016, 11:11:12 AM
I am not going to turn this into a stupid Sega vs. SNES Debate,  I DID OWN A FUCKING SNES I WAS ALIVE THROUGH IT SO DON'T ACT LIKE YOU KNOW MORE THAN ME ALRIGHT!



I am not saying it is better for Nintendo to shrug of 3rd party support, ALSO I have been a LONG advocate for them doing more than just what they do, BUt fucking crhist they aren't getting it, 20 years is not a fluke it is a pattern its a damn way of life it is NOT GOING TO CHANGE>


SO we say what would they be like if they didn't have their hand helds, how is that any different than pretending to predict where they would be if they did a or b with their consoles? It's not productive because there are too many variables.


YES Wii was a fluke but it hit the sweet spot, and Hey all of us, even me, who bitch about complain about it, even YOU Ian, who talk trash about it, we bought the fucking thing so then we forget we DID like it at one time, we try to pretend like we always hated it and then we talk **** about Wii U when we realize it didn't fail because of the reasons the Wii succeeded the truth is, we don't know why it failed, neither does Nintendo nobody does, we can guess we can make educated guesses and assumptions and we can talk factors, we know Price was a factor, we know games library was a factor.



Also sales do not matter, not as much as Ian tries to make them out, to YOU to 3rd parties they matter but we have to accept that unless Nintendo does something truly amazing they won't have Wii sales ever again but NEWS FLASH, they never had Wii sales before in the console market EVER. the best they did was NES when they literally had no real competition. When faced with competition they struggled, they BEAT Sega, they competed with Sega, but then they threw in the towel when Sony entered the arena and have been coasting every since. That is a hard damn fact.

I want them to have all the games sure, we all SHOULD but reality is what it is, that is all there is to it.


Adrock is right, I think it was easier for them to get that level of support when they FORCED companies to make games for them they were the only game in town. The last 20 years Nintendo should have been going all out to mend those relationships they didn't they are reaping what they sowed in those days.
Then they insult the very userbase that WANTS them to make more powerful consoles by making off handed comments about how power isn't important, so we already know that Nintendo is NOT going to chase that crowd again.


BUT where I think Ian is wrong, where I think NX is brilliant and will succeed is it will marry the handheld and console into one affordable device that will give it near SNES sales and NEAR SNES library of support, it will have that because indies who grew up on SNES are trying their hardest to recreate that right now and Nintendo is relying on that they are counting on that. DS systems sell because they are cheap and have the games, hey gues what the 3DS has already outpaced the SNES and it also has a larger and more varied library, so if ALL the NX did was just play the 3DS library on a TV NINTENDO already is back to SNES levels.


That is where I think delusional people forget, SNES was NOT the massive hit they keep trying to remember it as, it was a hit but it sold less than 60 million, every single console "winner" since then has sold over 60 million so chew on that. Whatever, if NX sells 45 million it still won't have the 3rd party support SNES had, probably 75 percent or MORE of the companies that made games then are DEAD, gone end of story. The only companies that were around then still making games that haven't into the modern era are Nintendo, Sega, and Capcom. Capcom is struggling, Nintendo is not, Sega might as well just sell Sonic to Nintendo and be done.

Every franchise from the SNES is either Sony exclusive or done, some evolved into handheld games or continued on the handheld market, but the console versions died out, so asking for Nintendo to make a console that also plays CoD and Madden is stupid. asking Nintendo to make a handheld that plays all the original and retro games the handheld gets PLUS Nintendo stuff and can connect to your TV is smart.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 14, 2016, 11:50:28 AM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.


Probably all the more reason to believe the NX will only be one platform that'll be your home and mobile console.  Consolidates Nintendo's developer efforts into one platform so that worst case scenario, if NX is Wii U-2, Nintendo can at least keep a steady stream of gaming in absence of 3rd parties.

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely devices with compatible os's.




If so, I will likely sit NX out until end of life cycle.  I don't have confidence Nintendo has the developer bandwidth to maintain two separate devices anymore, and my appetite for Japanese-centric gameplay has waned over the last console generation.


That said, enough of the walls of text, people.  I look here to see if anyone has scooped up any hot NX news, not to see the same stupid arguments rehashed over and over.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 14, 2016, 12:17:19 PM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.


Probably all the more reason to believe the NX will only be one platform that'll be your home and mobile console.  Consolidates Nintendo's developer efforts into one platform so that worst case scenario, if NX is Wii U-2, Nintendo can at least keep a steady stream of gaming in absence of 3rd parties.

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely devices with compatible os's.




If so, I will likely sit NX out until end of life cycle.  I don't have confidence Nintendo has the developer bandwidth to maintain two separate devices anymore, and my appetite for Japanese-centric gameplay has waned over the last console generation.


That said, enough of the walls of text, people.  I look here to see if anyone has scooped up any hot NX news, not to see the same stupid arguments rehashed over and over.

Well, I've posted tidbits and news. Where AMD talks about their SoC's just the other day, and that there was 3 console SoC's.

Now the important thing here is that they said three, two of course as I've mentioned previously were the Pro and scorpio... now who could the third be? I'm banking the NX, it lines up with previous statements from AMD on when it'll be announced when there's more clarity. That sounds like Nintendo.

Also what lends credence to this is that Nvidia already had their conference and talked about what they're doing going forward, they did not mentioned anything game related, and they have canned projects with the Tegra chips and are working with smart cars and the like.

No matter how much people want to insist that Nvidia Tegra is powering the NX or it's a hybrid, it's just not going with what Nintendo has stated in the last two years. Also EG was wrong on the 3DS, so it feels history repeating itself.

Also the so called "Concepts" for the NX seems to look exactly like the Razor tablet that came out awhile back that was using the tegra. I think they are desperate for clicks or were trolled.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 14, 2016, 12:19:17 PM
This thread has stopped being relevant about 10 pages ago. At this point I don't know why people would still care about NX if Nintendo still can't figure out a way to properly reveal the thing less than 6 months from release. They apparently were going for a September reveal but even that is getting pushed to October.  Meanwhile rumors keep festering and people keep bickering and if everything about these rumors pan out we're basically looking at another Wii U. I've personally checked out and that says a lot. Nintendo's silence is now teetering on the brink of irrelevance.


Well, I've posted tidbits and news. Where AMD talks about their SoC's just the other day, and that there was 3 console SoC's.
That's literally the same news story from weeks ago of the 3 design wins by AMD. Nothing new has been added.


Also EG was wrong on the 3DS, so it feels history repeating itself.


Eurogamer was indeed wrong but they published a retraction of that story before the 3DS was revealed. That hasn't happened yet in this case.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 14, 2016, 12:32:37 PM
This thread has stopped being relevant about 10 pages ago. At this point I don't know why people would still care about NX if Nintendo still can't figure out a way to properly reveal the thing less than 6 months from release. They apparently were going for a September reveal but even that is getting pushed to October.  Meanwhile rumors keep festering and people keep bickering and if everything about these rumors pan out we're basically looking at another Wii U. I've personally checked out and that says a lot. Nintendo's silence is now teetering on the brink of irrelevance.


Well, I've posted tidbits and news. Where AMD talks about their SoC's just the other day, and that there was 3 console SoC's.
That's literally the same news story from weeks ago of the 3 design wins by AMD. Nothing new has been added.


Also EG was wrong on the 3DS, so it feels history repeating itself.


Eurogamer was indeed wrong but they published a retraction of that story before the 3DS was revealed. That hasn't happened yet in this case.

It doesn't mean they're right either, sources from actual devs have gone to say the NX is more powerful than the PS4, the tegra wouldn't be capable of doing that.

Also it seems the NX has gotten it's specs upgraded to do AR/VR. The Tegra could in no conceivable way be able to do such a thing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 14, 2016, 01:00:38 PM
It was easy to get SNES-level of support when a company had a near monopoly on an entire industry for the better part of 10 years. Anyone longing for a return to those glory days is out of touch with reality. While there are plenty things Nintendo can do better to improve third party support today, the kind of support people think Nintendo can just pull out of a hat is unrealistic. Sony and Microsoft do things Nintendo is unwilling or unable to do. It isn't wise for Nintendo to launch a $400 to $500 console. While Nintendo will pick up a dead or struggling project, it won't get into a bidding war. Nintendo would like 10 of those to potentially make a difference on its platform. I wouldn't blame any company for not wanting to take those odds. Sony and Microsoft regularly do; Nintendo won't. For better or worse, it lives (and dies) by its own output.


Probably all the more reason to believe the NX will only be one platform that'll be your home and mobile console.  Consolidates Nintendo's developer efforts into one platform so that worst case scenario, if NX is Wii U-2, Nintendo can at least keep a steady stream of gaming in absence of 3rd parties.

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely devices with compatible os's.




If so, I will likely sit NX out until end of life cycle.  I don't have confidence Nintendo has the developer bandwidth to maintain two separate devices anymore, and my appetite for Japanese-centric gameplay has waned over the last console generation.


That said, enough of the walls of text, people.  I look here to see if anyone has scooped up any hot NX news, not to see the same stupid arguments rehashed over and over.

Well, I've posted tidbits and news.


I was more talking about SuperMario2K and IanSane, sweet jesus, what a wall of text.


I understand the well is a bit dry on the NX news/rumors at the moment, but at least contain that crap to a separate thread.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 14, 2016, 01:17:41 PM
This thread has stopped being relevant about 10 pages ago. At this point I don't know why people would still care about NX if Nintendo still can't figure out a way to properly reveal the thing less than 6 months from release. They apparently were going for a September reveal but even that is getting pushed to October.  Meanwhile rumors keep festering and people keep bickering and if everything about these rumors pan out we're basically looking at another Wii U. I've personally checked out and that says a lot. Nintendo's silence is now teetering on the brink of irrelevance.



I think you've hit where I'm almost at, Soren.  And I don't even care about the "well, they're hurting themselves by not giving all gamers time to get excited about a new system to buy.  I'm personally just exhausted by the lack of announcement from Nintendo themselves to the point where my enthusiasm for a new console has deflated like a balloon, and I 1) scoured stores for a Wii during the peak scarcity of the Wii to find one, including scanning bar codes at target every Saturday until they showed a backroom stock that would be laid out the next day, 2) Bought a Wii U at launch, and 3) have bought a good 4 different 3DS systems, including incremental upgrades to the New 3DS.


I fall in the Nintendo enthusiast bucket, and we are getting all the colors of a painting without Nintendo showing us what it means for the entire picture of their gaming future.  Maybe they think they have to withhold their info to prevent competitors stealing ideas, maybe they're planning for the "perfect" announcement, or maybe they're making last ditch updates to the specs.


In the words of our friend Squall.


(http://i.imgur.com/2EAAg.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 14, 2016, 01:27:05 PM
Any chance Nintendo is keeping quiet so as not to spoil holiday sales?

I could see them announcing in January, hyping and media blitzing for 2+ months and releasing in March. Why not keep the advertising window nice and short? Why play your hand too early?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 14, 2016, 01:48:52 PM
Any chance Nintendo is keeping quiet so as not to spoil holiday sales?

I could see them announcing in January, hyping and media blitzing for 2+ months and releasing in March. Why not keep the advertising window nice and short? Why play your hand too early?


I don't mean this with any Snark, but is there any reason for Nintendo to think they'll have any real sales of the Wii U?  They've more or less left it to die on the vine this year.  I expect there to be possibly a few good bundles during Black Friday, possibly discounts from retailers to rid them of whatever Wii U stock left in inventory prior to NX release. 


Logistics for products can be a nightmare, I can't imagine them waiting to early next year in order to announce the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 14, 2016, 01:59:56 PM
Nintendo's silence is now teetering on the brink of irrelevance.

So true.  Nintendo's only been able to maintain media attention with Pokemon Go, Super Mario Run, and the NES thingy.  None of which say, "Guys, we're still in the business of making new and exciting systems!" to me.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 14, 2016, 02:12:00 PM
Any chance Nintendo is keeping quiet so as not to spoil holiday sales?

I could see them announcing in January, hyping and media blitzing for 2+ months and releasing in March. Why not keep the advertising window nice and short? Why play your hand too early?


The only thing Nintendo is really selling this holiday is Pokemon and an NES. Those two things will sell themselves and will not be derailed by any new console announcement.


Two months might be plenty of time to sell a console to a group of die-hard Nintendo fans. But that group is growing smaller and smaller by the month. You need way more time if you expect this thing to be a success. That's why I'm getting nervous about this reveal delay.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 14, 2016, 02:53:14 PM
Fatty might be referring more to 3DS sales.  If the NX is what it is rumored to be, it might destroy 3DS sales when it is properly revealed.  They have a new Pokemon edition and the galaxy style that they want to push for a bit.  It might even play 3DS games, although that is very optimistic.  Regardless, it should introduce us to the new Nintendo ecosystem.  Similar to Android or what MS has been trying to do, games will be playable across platforms that support this OS.  So, any system before that will be obsolete in a sense.

As for the "wall of text" complaints, I actually appreciate those posts sometimes.  It is fun to think through Nintendo's plans for the future, particularly with people that have different viewpoints.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 14, 2016, 03:58:43 PM
This thread has stopped being relevant about 10 pages ago.
Welcome to NWR. Thread derailment is just another Wednesday.

harleyquinnitswhatwedo.gif
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 14, 2016, 04:39:53 PM
Fatty might be referring more to 3DS sales.  If the NX is what it is rumored to be, it might destroy 3DS sales when it is properly revealed.  They have a new Pokemon edition and the galaxy style that they want to push for a bit.  It might even play 3DS games, although that is very optimistic.
That's sort of what I meant but didn't think about it that specifically.
I just meant in general, Nintendo has stuff to push this Holiday season, a time of year which is typically a big sales focus. If they announce New Shiny NX but it isn't available for Christmas sales, they might be concerned with confusing and driving away consumers generally. Just a theory. Unsupported by anything really. So, not really a theory so much as an opinion. Talking out of my ass, if you will.

At leat I'm in good company here.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 14, 2016, 06:43:19 PM
If they're announcing in October and it's a console, it makes sense that they're waiting until the second to last Wii U retail product (2016 Game of the Year silver medalist Paper Mario Color Splash) launches.

Just sayin'.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on September 14, 2016, 06:52:39 PM
It's also telethon month, that can hardly be a coincidence, I bet Ronaghan knows more than he's letting on.  ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 14, 2016, 07:05:15 PM
Tegra X2 would be more capable than the PS4. Also, you have to realize that "capable" does not mean "has better graphic horsepower."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 14, 2016, 07:10:58 PM
 I can only imagine what happened before I heard the crash. How Bill Trinen’s powdered-sugar coated hands slipped from the steering wheel on my back road, beginning the greatest adventure of my life, will always be a mystery. I can only thank those sweet hands of fate and remember.

The sound of a car meeting a tree found me while my parents were at work. As usual, I was toiling at home, guarding it from intruders. They never thanked me for this, but only because they didn’t understand how dangerous it was. My imagination was often filled with terrorists and thieves, which I would cleverly dispatch. When they returned from their safe jobs, rolling their haughty eyes at my greasy appearance, I would smile knowing that I had saved them again. Of course, I wouldn’t tell them and give them the satisfaction.

From such a daydream I was broken, but it still seemed real enough to make me think I was being shot at. So, I rolled to the floor with the tight reflexes of a gamer. I stayed still, listening to the footsteps of two men approaching. I could determine from the right-leaning gait that one of them was carrying something, but I had no idea how special it was.

“Herro.”

My head slowly moved up to avoid giving away my position on the floor. There, looking at me like a Piñata too cute to bat, was Shigeru Miyamoto. My heart stopped colder than it already had been to conceal my chi.

“Huh… hi!”

I kipped up and moved from the middle of the room to the door, which I opened with disbelief. Seeing that Shigeru was in good hands, Bill made a sticky retreat back to the smoking vehicle. As I escorted the master in, I heard, “Reggie will be here to pick us up after his meeting with EA and other major third parties!”

The words seemed to hit Shigeru like a brick, as he collapsed in my arms. No longer lost in awe, I laid his limp frame gently on the couch and executed emergency resuscitation.  It was only then that I noticed the blood dripping from his head, ejecting in spurts as I beat his genius chest.
After what seemed like an eternity, but must have been only an hour of beating, he awoke with a jolt and shielded his face from my hovering sweaty fist.

“You shaved my rife,” he murmured tenderly, still dizzy and afraid. “What can I do for you?”

“Miyamoto-san,” I said in perfect Japanese, “I owe you more than you could ever owe me. The couch you’re lying on, now soaked in your blood, has seen countless hours of joy because of the gifts you’ve given me.”

“Call me Mia. Even Bill doesn’t know that I like to be called that. It’s a name reserved for family.”

No words could find my throat, as if they were born so deep in my soul that they couldn’t leap high enough to escape. He understood and shook his head with a smile I’d never seen at an E3 presentation. It went directly to my heart, like a Nintendo Direct presentation.

“I want to show you something.”

He motioned to his bag, which remained where he fell. With a smile that I feel I’d never had before, I retrieved it and sat back by him as by a friend. As by family.
He took my hand, curling his fingers into mine, and we moved like Ouija brothers into the bag and onto something sleek and substantial. Was it possible?

I’ve never felt the touch of a woman, but the electricity that vibrated through my middle-aged flesh couldn’t have been entirely different.

AMD. Traditional console. 4K. Dedicated RAM.

NX.

Mia touched my chin, gently directing my watery gaze to his own.

“You were right about everything in the forums. You’ll be a god to them.”

My head drifted aimlessly, like a balloon filled with Mexican jumping beans. I knew that I had a high IQ, because I had taken a free test and purchased the additional analysis. The company was so impressed that they still send me emails to this day. Still, I never imagined that it would be him telling me.

A dart of light danced across the ceiling. Reggie was here, and the dream would soon be over. I lightly marched my fingers like Pikmin across Mia’s leg, up his arm, and finally up to wipe away his tear.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 14, 2016, 10:50:51 PM
Tegra X2 would be more capable than the PS4. Also, you have to realize that "capable" does not mean "has better graphic horsepower."
Unlikely with Nvidia canceling those projects, and I'll have a hard time believing that's powering the home console.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on September 14, 2016, 11:03:29 PM
So while affordability and good traditional controls are certainly qualities that are needed to truly be successful, the game machine needs to have the potential to handle the games. Merely matching yesterday's potential seems weak by comparison. The leading edge of development yearns for something much more powerful than what we have today. We want to see Nintendo pushing the technological envelope because that's what they used to do really well.

What do you mean with potential? rawpower?


I think the important thing is to make a hardware balanced enough so development teams dont feel constrained by it.
But sometimes constrains are not that bad at all, you need creativity to overcome problems.
The gamecube had little memory compared to the Xbox. Which probable led to a cell shaded Zelda... of course back then internet kids were not happy with a "childish" zelda but now the Wind Walker is considered an outstanding work of art.
The Wii had Mario Galaxy one of the greatest looking game of its generation.

And... We are still in a Minecraft generation!!!


Potential can be raw power, but it can also be unrealized possibilities (ie. add-ons, upgrades). There is the traditional console design (fixed hardware) and there is now an emerging console concept that includes multiple hardware configurations and the possibility of upgrades. Potential can be Nintendo looking to some technology not yet seen in a console.


Be innovative and not so selfish as to only consider their own development needs.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 15, 2016, 01:06:45 AM

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely different devices that support the same SOFTWARE PLATFORM (aka the NX).

I fixed that for you. ;)


I haven't been stuck int eh hyperbolic sound chamber that is the rumor mill like you guys, but last I remember, NX was a software platform that would be shared through all the hardware iteration that Nintendo will have going forward. Much like iOS and Android, to use Iwata's example (RIP).


So IF Nintendo reveals a handheld, or IF Nintendo reveals a home console, or IF they reveal BOTH, they will most likely run the SAME OS, and the SAME GAMES that happen to scale to the hardware they are on, like a PC will change resolution/detail of a game depending on system specs.
Not to say that all games will always be compatible w/ all hardware, as there are plenty of games that depend on a certain version of the OS to be compatible, but you would essentially be developing for the same platform for the foreseeable future, assuming Nintendo got it right.
....this is all assuming of course that NX really is a software platform (and not just the next Nintendo hardware)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 15, 2016, 03:50:31 AM

Unlikely, as nintendo wouldn't put all their eggs in one basket.

There will be a home console and a handheld,  mark my word.

They will be two completely different devices that support the same SOFTWARE PLATFORM (aka the NX).

I fixed that for you. ;)


I haven't been stuck int eh hyperbolic sound chamber that is the rumor mill like you guys, but last I remember, NX was a software platform that would be shared through all the hardware iteration that Nintendo will have going forward. Much like iOS and Android, to use Iwata's example (RIP).


So IF Nintendo reveals a handheld, or IF Nintendo reveals a home console, or IF they reveal BOTH, they will most likely run the SAME OS, and the SAME GAMES that happen to scale to the hardware they are on, like a PC will change resolution/detail of a game depending on system specs.
Not to say that all games will always be compatible w/ all hardware, as there are plenty of games that depend on a certain version of the OS to be compatible, but you would essentially be developing for the same platform for the foreseeable future, assuming Nintendo got it right.
....this is all assuming of course that NX really is a software platform (and not just the next Nintendo hardware)

I see what you did there :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 15, 2016, 07:31:59 AM
It's also telethon month, that can hardly be a coincidence, I bet Ronaghan knows more than he's letting on.  ;)

I would kill for a NX reveal on the telethon, yes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 15, 2016, 07:59:23 AM
I've gotten to the point where I actually want NX to be Tegra-based only because of how smug and condescending SuperMetalDave64 has become in his videos. I've unsubscribed to his channel because he turned into such an intolerable **** when discussing NX. Otherwise, I don't care what SOC is powering NX. I just want to witness the shitstorm descendeth upon SMD64 and his channel for lulz purposes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on September 15, 2016, 10:31:58 AM
I want the deal to be with Nvidia because I think that one has the most potential to give Nintendo a more expensive box for a lot less cost.


Otherwise, I don't care. I just don't want Nintendo offering me a $250 game machine with budget GPU because of the cost of controls and screen.......
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 15, 2016, 01:08:44 PM
I want the deal to be with Nvidia because I think that one has the most potential to give Nintendo a more expensive box for a lot less cost.


Otherwise, I don't care. I just don't want Nintendo offering me a $250 game machine with budget GPU because of the cost of controls and screen.......

If it's tegra based then it's unlikely to really be close to pro or scorpio, and it still wouldn't be the performance nintendo is looking for.

After the X-Box left a bad taste in Nvidia's mouth, I doubt they'd be willing to lose money again.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 15, 2016, 01:35:22 PM
Shout out to KeyBilly and his story. I lol'd many a time reading that, sir.

Fav line:
Quote from: KeyBilly
It went directly to my heart, like a Nintendo Direct presentation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 15, 2016, 04:21:33 PM
Thank you for the kindness!  It was strangely therapeutic for me.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 15, 2016, 06:54:05 PM
Looks like Nintendo is gearing up for something! #NX baby!

https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica (https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 15, 2016, 09:05:36 PM
What? I dont see anything NX related on their twitter page.

Did I miss something?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 15, 2016, 09:12:52 PM
They announced the Next gen is coming NX March 2017

https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/725221813081522176

Meh, didn't realised it was from april, funny it just showed up in my feed xD (https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/725221813081522176)

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 15, 2016, 10:41:59 PM
Bet that's when they reveal the Damn thing ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 15, 2016, 11:05:23 PM
Bet that's when they reveal the Damn thing ;)

Think it'll be the 20th or 22nd of this month BnK
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 16, 2016, 12:31:59 PM
Yeah because Nintendo hasn't delayed anything recently.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stratos on September 16, 2016, 03:55:59 PM
Yeah because Nintendo hasn't delayed anything recently ever.


Fixed that for you.


If a Nintendo fan at this point is not used to their rampant delays they have short term memory loss or were too young to remember the rampant "delays for quality control" that used to happen for almost every major holiday title.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stogi on September 16, 2016, 04:11:55 PM
You'd think at some point they'd know how long it'd take to make a game.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 16, 2016, 04:23:06 PM
So Nintendo of Europe may have spilled the beans on the release date of the Breath of the Wild amiibo.

March 4, 2017. That's a Saturday.

Of course that could also be the day Breath of the Wild releases. As well as the NX. For reference the Wii U released on a Sunday in NA and a Friday in Europe.


EDIT: The Wolf Amiibo released on March 4, 2016 so this could all very well be placeholder dates. YMMV.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 16, 2016, 04:45:44 PM
You'd think at some point they'd know how long it'd take to make a game.
It's more that Nintendo doesn't anticipate tossing out large portions of its games (particularly Zelda) and starting over. There's no way to anticipate that, and no way of telling how long that sets development back. That said, I suppose one has to wonder why Nintendo doesn't work a potential delay into production and stop announcing big titles until a game is in the home stretch of development.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 16, 2016, 05:21:02 PM


You'd think at some point they'd know how long it'd take to make a game.
... why Nintendo doesn't work a potential delay into production and stop announcing big titles until a game is in the home stretch of development.

Isn't that exactly what they did, until everyone started complaining, because Nintendo had "no games"?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 16, 2016, 07:19:07 PM
via GoNintendo: Resident Evil 7 to the NX?

http://gonintendo.com/stories/265229-resident-evil-7-trademark-mentions-cartridges-adds-fuel-to-nx-ru
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 18, 2016, 02:43:25 AM
IGN NVC Podcast talks NX Rumors:

http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers

Quote
Peer has heard these detachable controllers communicate via IR

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 18, 2016, 03:55:48 PM
IGN NVC Podcast talks NX Rumors:

http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers

Quote
Peer has heard these detachable controllers communicate via IR
Quote

The following info comes from IGN's Peer Schneider...
- detachable controllers are low budget...cheap like the Wii Nunchuk
- Peer has heard these detachable controllers communicate via IR
- these detachable controllers are for travel play and aren't your main method of gameplay input
- Just Dance 2017 on NX means there's a way to measure what you're doing while dancing

what i don't like and what seems like another half-measure is that the controllers will communicate with IR when connected. I think they they should connect through RF, so that they can be detached and used in many different ways, even ways that they didn't intend in their currently being developed games.

They should be able to be detached and used as motion controllers for JD 2017, or attached to the screen in at least 2 different configurations (gamepad and 3DS modes)

It would be nice if both halves functioned like a wiimote, so that we can rid ourselves of all the old wiimotes and all the hardware from previous systems.
But my thinking is very attached to the idea of the mock-up posted previously. That could all change based on what Nintendo actually has cooked up (or I could just be disappointed because the mock-up seemed better in theory)

I like the idea of this new system being a "reboot". Hopefully that means more than just starting back at cartridges, and more meaning starting everything from scratch, disconnected from the Wii & Wii U hardware all together (chip family upgrades, etc etc), and beginning anew on this unified software approach.

I'mnot a big fan of "cheapness" when it comes to the controllers, especially if it means they are all basically shells w/ minor motion like the nunchuck. They atleast need full gyro capabilities for that full independent motion control, which can still work as an accurate pointer with no expensive cameras needed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on September 18, 2016, 06:46:17 PM
IGN NVC Podcast talks NX Rumors:

http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers (http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers)

Quote
Peer has heard these detachable controllers communicate via IR


Best news I've heard all day. Make the detachable controllers very, very inexpensive and very traditional. Get them out of the way when playing at home. No more forking out hundreds of dollars on gimmicky controls, please.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 06:54:51 PM
I like the idea of single tablet screen with IR sensors on two sides in which a controller could Slide into place and lock together.  Then Nintendo could literally design the controller for perfect control for whatever game they wanted to make.  Smash Bros can play like Smash Brothers Proper, but Street Fighter could play like Street Fighter. 

Design the controllers so they can also be connected together for traditional controllers and you got a pretty nifty system.  If they could sell full featured controllers for the traditional $49.99 for a new controllers, but allow developers or Nintendo to release "cheap attachments" for $19.99 or even bundle them with special games.  Street Fighter gets perfect arcade controller with a nice D-Pad and six button layout could be very nice. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 18, 2016, 06:59:57 PM
IGN NVC Podcast talks NX Rumors:

http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers (http://gonintendo.com/stories/265262-ign-discusses-nx-rumors-things-they-ve-heard-from-developers)

Quote
Peer has heard these detachable controllers communicate via IR


Best news I've heard all day. Make the detachable controllers very, very inexpensive and very traditional. Get them out of the way when playing at home. No more forking out hundreds of dollars on gimmicky controls, please.

I think this:
Quote
- these detachable controllers are for travel play and aren't your main method of gameplay input

kinda suggest that you will be using another controller(s) for home play. which may leave room for tons of gimmicky controls that may cost hundreds.

I think if the controls attached to NX was more capable, then we wouldn't need a separate controller for home play. Not that you couldn't use one... but you wouldn't need one.


I like the idea of single tablet screen with IR sensors on two sides in which a controller could Slide into place and lock together.  Then Nintendo could literally design the controller for perfect control for whatever game they wanted to make.  Smash Bros can play like Smash Brothers Proper, but Street Fighter could play like Street Fighter. 

Design the controllers so they can also be connected together for traditional controllers and you got a pretty nifty system.  If they could sell full featured controllers for the traditional $49.99 for a new controllers, but allow developers or Nintendo to release "cheap attachments" for $19.99 or even bundle them with special games.  Street Fighter gets perfect arcade controller with a nice D-Pad and six button layout could be very nice. 


although that doesn't sound like a terrible idea either.
...until someone finds a way to abuse it.


should still use redio frequency (RF) over infra red (IR), since the former doesn't require line of sight.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 18, 2016, 07:06:34 PM
A perfect arcade controller would have a stick, not a D-Pad. Not even Super Smash Bros. tournament players would really benefit from a GameCube layout because they're not playing the game on a handheld let alone without a GameCube controller so long as Nintendo keeps making that an option, and there's no reason to believe it won't.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 08:02:18 PM
Adrock I thought of that...but a perfect Stick controller would also need enough space and weight to rest on your table or lap.

But a good sized D-pad with proper slide for fireballs and special moves would work well in a home console controller. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 08:04:52 PM
Since IR requires line of sight it may be beneficial for not adding more wireless interference.  It also means that signals won't get mixed....which could possibly mean more controllers playing together.  8 person Bomber Man for instance.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 18, 2016, 08:17:44 PM
The point I was trying to make is that it wouldn't make sense for Nintendo to make a perfect arcade controller for what is intended to be a handheld device. Players would have to "settle" for a D-pad which is contradictory to having exchangable controllers built for a specific game. Same goes with Super Smash Bros. Ultimately, a GameCube layout still isn't a GameCube controller. Therefore, what is the point of all these attachments if they don't serve the purpose they're intended to serve.

I've yet to hear a compelling argument in favor different attachments. They all sound great on paper until you really start thinking about why it wouldn't work in practice. Would they really, really be better than a basic traditional layout?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 08:38:10 PM
error
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 18, 2016, 08:59:40 PM
If the theoretical NX package came with a WiiU Pro controller, I think it would be a game changer for it being accepted as a home console in NA.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 18, 2016, 09:03:07 PM
Maybe if it was rebranded. Outside of Virtual Console, get the Wii name as far away from NX as possible.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 18, 2016, 09:27:12 PM
If the theoretical NX package came with a WiiU Pro controller, I think it would be a game changer for it being accepted as a home console in NA.

A Game changer? by including a regular controller, like the other 2 consoles? Or do you just mean because this "portable hybrid" would be accepted as not just a portable that's played at home, since it has a standard controller in the box as well?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 09:43:46 PM
Well if you want people to seriously view it as a PORTABLE and Console.  Having it dock and charge on the base/ Console Component would mean needing some traditional controls for it to play.  Providing at least one full controller in the box would mean gamers could see the device quickly and easily as both a console and portable.  But this is where the breakable controller is genius.  You only have to include one controller...IF you connect it to the portable device to be portable, and then connect it to then detach it from the portable when it is docked and reconnect it to itself for console play. 

You lose touch screen support at home with this set up, but the Wii U already showed that gimmick isn't very useful.  But you could still reverse stream the portable to the base (think Wii U technology in reverse if you needed too...however you would lose some graphical power to those games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 18, 2016, 10:19:42 PM
If the theoretical NX package came with a WiiU Pro controller, I think it would be a game changer for it being accepted as a home console in NA.

A Game changer? by including a regular controller, like the other 2 consoles? Or do you just mean because this "portable hybrid" would be accepted as not just a portable that's played at home, since it has a standard controller in the box as well?

Yes, that is what I mean. Better said than I did.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 18, 2016, 10:31:50 PM
Just for conversational purposes, here is another mock-up

(http://i.imgur.com/kaZldH5r.jpg)


I like the amount of detail in this one, and the fact this it includes the Dock, but I don't like that you need a separate middle piece to use the detachable controllers, and I also don't like that there doesn't appear to be a 3DS mode (I really like the idea of being able to change the orientation of the screen and the controllers if the game needs to use that perspective - 3DS mode, Top Down Shooters/dungeon crawlers/pinball, etc etc).
But just for getting a basic look at what this thing might look like, I generally like the designs I've seen so far.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 18, 2016, 10:40:31 PM
BlackandMild, that is almost perfect, but I would expect Nintendo to make a design that does not require the Third Component to make the controller.  It is a additional component that means something could get lost, or Broken. 

However, the 3rd Component could be the Brains of the controller and also a potential pointer for Wii Games.  And I suppose the Docking bay could have slots on the side to lock 2 separate middle pieces together for storage and charging.

Personally, I think it is more elegant to have the two controllers slide into each other and lock into place...and eliminate the need for the middle piece. 

Other than that, that Mock Up is perfect.  Now think about how the right side could be replaced with a Gamecube controller, or Nintendo 64 button layout, or Street Fighter Layout fairly cheaply.  Now also imagine that the left part could be replaced with a bigger D-Pad or Control Stick or even Extra buttons or Rhythm games....or piano keys for a music game. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 18, 2016, 10:56:13 PM
I really like that mock up. I would be very happy if the actual product if similar to that
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 18, 2016, 11:14:12 PM
I think a square would be uncomfortable to hold, but I guess it depends on the contours on the backside.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 19, 2016, 12:02:21 AM
The question is can the above design capable of sharing assets, like the base console using the handheld's processor for additional power, or access the RAM on the portable device?  If that is impossible then this design really isn't improving anything. 

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 19, 2016, 12:12:14 AM
not sure if this was mentioned, and I'm sure it's of no surprise to anyone if true, but it looks like Nintendo might have a New Metroid in the works
https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/53as8q/metroidnintendocom_seems_to_be_a_webpage_that/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/53as8q/metroidnintendocom_seems_to_be_a_webpage_that/)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 19, 2016, 12:35:35 AM
All this controller talk just does not appeal to me at all. I was able to deal with the Wiimote and Nunchuk combo well but after the honeymoon period with the GamePad wore off I basically refused to use it unless the game required it like Splatoon or Mario Maker. And even with Mario Maker once I stopped making stages I switched to the Pro Controller and only used the GamePad to input stage codes. I feel like Nintendo managed to make the GamePad as ergonomic as possible and even then it's still uncomfortable for long periods of play.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on September 19, 2016, 04:45:07 PM
I would be okay with getting detachable-type controllers if it meant getting something similar to the Wiimote and Nunchuk again. That's still my fave controller for a variety of reasons, including that it comes in "two parts."
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stratos on September 19, 2016, 06:18:36 PM
If it means the return of the pointer driven FPS mechanic in future COD and Splatoon titles than I am all in for the detachable controller feature. Hopefully this turns out more like what happened when Nintendo went to optical media (super fast load times) versus what happened with some of their other experimental features.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 19, 2016, 09:05:13 PM
These mock-ups are getting really good.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 19, 2016, 09:52:10 PM
I would like Nintendo to just go back to the Wiimote and perfect its design.

Get Wiimotion Plus working perfectly in Nunchuk You can keep it wired, I think it is better that way.

Then The Wiimote would be better if you put the pointer on the side of the buttons and not the D Pad.  Then give the Button layout like the Gamecube Controller.  Big A Button, Left and Right Bean shaped Buttons and then a Small B Button either in a circle shape or Bean shape above the Big A Button.  This would give you a pointer with 4 easy and comfortable face buttons.  Then the bottom Trigger give it resistance for use as a gas pedal and the click feature from the gamecube.  Finall do the same with one of the Nunchuk triggers and provide Resistance with a click feature.  Make the Nunchuk bigger and give it the ergonomics to comfortably rest two fingers on the triggers. 

Done Nintendo you have just designed the perfect controller for most 3D action games and FPSers and you didn't even need to invest in new technology.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 20, 2016, 09:28:54 AM
San Disk has just unveiled a 1TB SD Card.

http://gizmodo.com/sandisk-just-revealed-a-monstrous-1-terabyte-sd-memory-1786722284
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 20, 2016, 10:33:24 AM
Hopefully Nintendo also puts dual SDXC card slots for hot data swaps and mass storage expansion.

But that would be future proofing... So I'm not holding my breath on that one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Adrock on September 20, 2016, 11:10:35 AM
The Pokemon Company Will Make Games for NX, Confirms Water is Wet (http://www.polygon.com/2016/9/20/12986612/pokemon-nintendo-nx)

Also, Tsunekazu Ishihara basically just confirmed a hybrid of sorts:
Quote
The NX is trying to change the concept of what it means to be a home console device or a hand-held device. We will make games for the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 20, 2016, 11:31:33 AM
The Pokemon Company Will Make Games for NX, Confirms Water is Wet (http://www.polygon.com/2016/9/20/12986612/pokemon-nintendo-nx)

Also, Tsunekazu Ishihara basically just confirmed a hybrid of sorts:
Quote
The NX is trying to change the concept of what it means to be a home console device or a hand-held device. We will make games for the NX.


You have to wonder if developers are tired of having to withhold information on the games they're making for the console.  Probably part of why Ishihara stated that, or maybe it's part of what Nintendo felt ok with him saying about the console to this point.


This "confirmation" is kind of a moot point at this point, given the leaks that have more or less confirmed it anyway.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 20, 2016, 12:15:17 PM
We're way past due for something. Any dev with an opportunity to release a game at launch for this system has got to be just as or even more annoyed as the general public is with Nintendo right now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Louieturkey on September 20, 2016, 01:38:15 PM
We're way past due for something. Any dev with an opportunity to release a game at launch for this system has got to be just as or even more annoyed as the general public is with Nintendo right now.
Or they know when Nintendo is actually revealing the NX and are not annoyed at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 20, 2016, 01:49:46 PM
We're way past due for something. Any dev with an opportunity to release a game at launch for this system has got to be just as or even more annoyed as the general public is with Nintendo right now.
Or they know when Nintendo is actually revealing the NX and are not annoyed at all.


I would be inclined to believe that but I don't think even Nintendo knows when Nintendo is revealing the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 20, 2016, 07:20:12 PM
Maybe sooner than later on the announcement? (https://mynintendonews.com/2016/09/20/retailers-are-heading-to-nintendo-europe-in-germany-for-an-announcement/)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 20, 2016, 07:36:49 PM
I hope sooner. An announcement within days would be very nice.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 20, 2016, 08:41:16 PM
Maybe sooner than later on the announcement? (https://mynintendonews.com/2016/09/20/retailers-are-heading-to-nintendo-europe-in-germany-for-an-announcement/)

All Zelda related, apparently. So technically NX-relevant, but only inasmuch as Zelda's supposed to be a launch title.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 21, 2016, 12:09:14 PM
Maybe sooner than later on the announcement? (https://mynintendonews.com/2016/09/20/retailers-are-heading-to-nintendo-europe-in-germany-for-an-announcement/)

All Zelda related, apparently. So technically NX-relevant, but only inasmuch as Zelda's supposed to be a launch title.

Damn. :(
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Oedo on September 22, 2016, 05:05:40 PM
Ubisoft continues to make vague, positive comments about the NX and Nintendo:

Quote
Speaking to IGN at an Ubisoft event yesterday, Guillemot - who has previously expressed his admiration for the upcoming console - explained specifically why he was excited for NX:

"I think, once again, the interface is very attractive," he said. "It's a machine that will be easy to use for all gamers. They have built in something that will give us chance to really have a different experience from what exists today. That's what I like - that they come with something new that is adapted to what we actually want now."

During a separate presentation, he called it "a fantastic machine", going to on to explain that "I think it's a really new approach, it's really Nintendo, coming with something new again. We love it."

Quote
Nintendo's last home console, Wii U, has been a sales failure. When we asked if Guillemot saw the NX as a step back towards the Wii's more inclusive (and financially successful) approach, he said:

"It's difficult to answer that [before NX is revealed]. What we see is that Nintendo has learned from the Wii U. All publishers learn from what they do, and then come with something new and more attractive, which I think is the case here."

http://ign.com/articles/2016/09/22/nintendo-nx-fantastic-will-offer-different-experience-to-other-consoles-ubisoft-ceo
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 22, 2016, 05:38:16 PM
I hope it's all legit praise and not just towing the supportive line.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 22, 2016, 06:49:02 PM
Rayman 2 port confirmed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on September 22, 2016, 07:07:34 PM
Rayman 2 port confirmed.

I think that has been on nine systems. Has any game topped that yet? Resident Evil 4 maybe?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 22, 2016, 08:57:33 PM
maybe it's like a gigantic AR Tablet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 22, 2016, 09:17:32 PM
I cant take anything Ubisoft say very seriously. They always jump on new hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 22, 2016, 09:30:53 PM
I cant take anything Ubisoft say very seriously. They always jump on new hardware.


Nintendo should be happy Ubisoft is saying anything at all about them after what happened when they went all in on Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 22, 2016, 09:41:05 PM
Ubisoft took a gamble and made a lot of money all in on them with the Wii.  Ubisoft is willing to take gambles because they know early system launch that you can usually make your investment back.

I am curious about Ubisoft's numbers for the Wii U if they did make money or not.  Overall, betting on Nintendo early in the life cycle is probably still a safe bet. 
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 22, 2016, 10:11:21 PM
Ubisoft took a gamble and made a lot of money all in on them with the Wii.  Ubisoft is willing to take gambles because they know early system launch that you can usually make your investment back.

I am curious about Ubisoft's numbers for the Wii U if they did make money or not.  Overall, betting on Nintendo early in the life cycle is probably still a safe bet.


Ubisoft's Wii U lineup is bigger than it should have been. Even after it was clear the system was a dud they picked up the tab for Cloudberry Kingdom, released Splinter Cell Blacklist, finally gave us Rayman Legends and released an Assassin's Creed game that they knew was probably going to tank hard (it did). Then they threw us another bone with Child of Light. Then almost a full year later gave us WatchUnderscoreDogs.


You could say any money they made from the Wii U's launch was lessened by what they put out the rest of that first year.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 23, 2016, 03:03:02 AM
pretty sure this is nothing NX related, but interesting none-the less
Nintendo patents projecting flat images on uneven surfaces

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/WO2016147731A1.html (http://www.freepatentsonline.com/WO2016147731A1.html)
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/WO2016147731A1.pdf (http://www.freepatentsonline.com/WO2016147731A1.pdf)

(https://shigerunews.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/ibfmmgx.jpg?w=1352)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CtAIsdTWgAAvlnL.jpg)
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CtAIvdfW8AA1vm7.jpg)
(https://shigerunews.files.wordpress.com/2016/09/ulhpkg6.jpg?w=1352)
source (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=217809452&postcount=1)


and here is discussion on the patent from back in August that first mentioned some sort of projector on what is believed to be an NX related patent
http://www.n-sider.com/blog/2016/08/nintendos-nx-could-be-a-super-game-watch (http://www.n-sider.com/blog/2016/08/nintendos-nx-could-be-a-super-game-watch)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 23, 2016, 11:29:07 AM
According to Digitimes, Foxconn has started a trial production build of the NX. (http://www.digitimes.com/news/a20160922PD207.html) 


For anyone not in the know about supply management/logistics.  There's usually something called a PPAP (Production Part Approval Process) prior to giving a supplier full approval to produce your product in full production quantities.  Essentially, it's a verification check to ensure the supplier can consistently and reliably produce your product per the specification outlined in the product, that their production processes are consistent and repeatable, and also acts as a last check to identify any potential issues that could cause production issues. 


This also usually includes what's referred to as an ISIR (Initial Sample Inspection Report), which necessitates a trial production run of a certain quantity as a verification that what the supplier submits in their PPAP is accurate.  My guess would be that the "trial production" is Foxconn's ISIR required in order to submit their PPAP for approval from Nintendo prior to starting their full production build.  Also makes sense if they expect a certain lead time for component parts on production quantities, as well as time for logistics from foxconn to their distribution partners, and eventually retail.

tl;dr - if at all true, a positive sign we're not far from a reveal (whether through Nintendo or Foxconn employee leaks), and also a positive sign we're not going to see a launch delay, barring any catastrophic findings from the PPAP submission/approval process.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on September 23, 2016, 04:22:01 PM
Thanks for the breakdown.  It reminds me of the Iwata Asks discussing manufacturing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Stratos on September 23, 2016, 04:50:07 PM
Ubisoft took a gamble and made a lot of money all in on them with the Wii.  Ubisoft is willing to take gambles because they know early system launch that you can usually make your investment back.

I am curious about Ubisoft's numbers for the Wii U if they did make money or not.  Overall, betting on Nintendo early in the life cycle is probably still a safe bet.


Ubisoft's Wii U lineup is bigger than it should have been. Even after it was clear the system was a dud they picked up the tab for Cloudberry Kingdom, released Splinter Cell Blacklist, finally gave us Rayman Legends and released an Assassin's Creed game that they knew was probably going to tank hard (it did). Then they threw us another bone with Child of Light. Then almost a full year later gave us WatchUnderscoreDogs.


You could say any money they made from the Wii U's launch was lessened by what they put out the rest of that first year.


For what it is worth, I bought most of those Ubi titles to support them in that investment. Granted, there was not a lot else going on the system, but I appreciated having the titles available.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 23, 2016, 06:40:02 PM

EDIT: NEVERMIND. It was all fake.


JUST ANNOUNCE THE FUCKING CONSOLE ALREADY NINTENDO FFS!!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on September 23, 2016, 07:14:42 PM
Ahh, I looked before you edited! That Neogaf thread has been closed, but it's not 100% debunked. It seems like it originated on a Chinese forum on a newly created account. Some claim it's the same person who apparently leaked sketches of the PS4 pro. I wanna hear more from Neal!

Anyway, it wasn't too crazy, aside from the addition of an additional computational unit that was claimed to also be portable. Otherwise the same Gamepad with detachable controllers and a TV dock that has been widely rumored/mocked up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 23, 2016, 07:32:52 PM
What was it? I missed it.

Found it on GameFAQs
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/189706-nintendo-nx/74331238
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Sarail on September 24, 2016, 05:07:24 PM
NX?

What's that? A new console? I'm betting Nintendo are gonna jump into the candy making industry. Sign me up.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 26, 2016, 08:20:36 AM
Thanks for the breakdown.  It reminds me of the Iwata Asks discussing manufacturing.


No problem!  I have experience and interest in manufacturing/supply management, so I always find it fun to inject my knowledge of the subject, but not sure how much interest there is here from others when I do post a wall of information on occasion  :-\ .
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 26, 2016, 01:42:02 PM
Thanks for the breakdown.  It reminds me of the Iwata Asks discussing manufacturing.


No problem!  I have experience and interest in manufacturing/supply management, so I always find it fun to inject my knowledge of the subject, but not sure how much interest there is here from others when I do post a wall of information on occasion  :-\ .


I enjoy those posts! I usually don't have much to add on the topic so I don't reply.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 26, 2016, 05:37:34 PM
This seems way, way too specific:
http://docs.pawbyte.com/platform-specifics/#nintendo-nx
Quote
At this time we are unable to disclose development in regards to support for the Nintendo platform codenamed “NX”.
 
Please check back at our estimated date of October 4, 2016 6PM CST.
This is a game development engine that works for PC (all three OSes + HTML5) and it added Wii U support a few months back. I don't think anything commercial has released on Wii U using it. Yet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 26, 2016, 06:20:01 PM
This seems way, way too specific:
http://docs.pawbyte.com/platform-specifics/#nintendo-nx
Quote
At this time we are unable to disclose development in regards to support for the Nintendo platform codenamed “NX”.
 
Please check back at our estimated date of October 4, 2016 6PM CST.
This is a game development engine that works for PC (all three OSes + HTML5) and it added Wii U support a few months back. I don't think anything commercial has released on Wii U using it. Yet.


I guess what I'd like to know next is when was that page updated....
Does Nintendo usually do announcements on Tuesdays?

I'm not expecting anything on that date, but it would be funny because no one in the "guess the date" thread picked Tuesday Oct 4th. Although EVERYONE would be happy since it was announced, and much sooner than nearly half of us guessed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 26, 2016, 06:38:59 PM
The last couple of Directs were announced on Tuesday for Thursday airing, among other things.

October 4 is already reserved for a Google event in the larger media's mind, though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 27, 2016, 01:53:45 AM
The last couple of Directs were announced on Tuesday for Thursday airing, among other things.

October 4 is already reserved for a Google event in the larger media's mind, though.

Well... there was that joint Nintendo Google operating system was never released publicly, right?
what if the NX is the fruit of that labor.


did we even find out what happened with that joint project BTW? it was so long ago I really don't remember.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on September 27, 2016, 04:29:04 AM
How strangely specific. It would be pretty interesting if Nintendo and Google have teamed up to make something.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on September 27, 2016, 10:27:00 AM
It's good thing I used to keep my rumor threads all neat and organized with those indexed post, because I knew there was a time when you'd want to reference back to something, but it would be too hard to find.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.msg731247#msg731247 (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=16688.msg731247#msg731247)

I don't think anything ever came of it, not that we saw in an actual product, but I could be wrong as all that was quite some time ago. It's been in development forever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 27, 2016, 06:27:56 PM
Hey BnM apparently Nintendo NYC is hosting a private event on the 1st according to twitter. So there's a chance we could be seeing the NX there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 27, 2016, 06:32:20 PM
If by the NX you mean the stars of your favorite random Disney Channel shows promoting Disney Magical World 2, yes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 27, 2016, 06:34:22 PM
If by the NX you mean the stars of your favorite random Disney Channel shows promoting Disney Magical World 2, yes.

You know something's going on, and it's damn near time to unveil this thing! And prove what I've been going with since day 1 :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on September 27, 2016, 06:44:25 PM
Shaymin just keeps shooting down all potential rumors with a sawed off shotgun of facts.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 27, 2016, 07:19:29 PM
Shaymin just keeps shooting down all potential rumors with a sawed off shotgun of facts.

But my info is more sound and logical then those of EG and Nvidia tegra or x2 oh wait.... X2 doesn't exist, it's called pascal... but wait.. it's being used in smart cars.

I know it sounds like I'm being cocky, but for the love of Shiggy-san it just makes sense. I mean if you look at history, Nintendo helped build atx from the 64 days and went on being ATI and then was bought by AMD. long long history there between the two.

Nvidia wouldn't make sense, sure they could customized the chips, however Tegra or Pascal, is something that would need to be able to shrink to handheld size, and the battery life is under 2 hours.

And the performance would not me up there for a home console, and would be roughly xbone level kind of power.

Plus it would still be expensive to get a tegra or pascal to fit in a handheld. it just wouldn't work, Nvidia doesn't like to lose money and I don't see them making a deal with nintendo and lose money just to get a foot back into the console market.

Add in the fact Nintendo would see better gains with polaris and much more affordable than Nvidia's tegra/pascal chips.

You could argue that nvidia doesn't have to announce any SoC's as a reason why their behind the NX, but........ They do have to report to shareholders of sales, especially one of interests like Nintendo.

In either case, Nvidia has no SoC's todate regarding to consoles, While AMD has three, with the 3rd to be announced at a later date. I believe that date is nearing.

I don't believe in a hybrid and I think words and comments from Nintendo and the pokemon company are taken way out of context.

Nintendo has stated that they would not be using anything related to the Wii/ Wii U. as they want to distanced themselves from the disastrous sales of the Wii U.

Iwata even shot the hybrid theory down, even if he's no longer with us, I'm sure Nintendo would carry his wishes.

Plus all the mock ups and descriptions of detachable controllers and a tabled look awfully like the razor table which used the Tegra.

I can't help that alot of these so called sources from EG are click bait or and seriously mislead. The EG article was written by the same guy who claimed the 3DS was going to use Tegra. Which we know never happened.

So history repeats itself, you can tell me that other sources are claiming the same including WSJ, however all of them just seem to be piggybacking off EG, but none ever list a legitimate source.

And yes, both WSJ and EG have a history of being wrong, on numerous occasions.

I'd be happy to admit i'm wrong if that's the case, however I believe it will be AMD polaris that's powering the NX home console.

Also, as I stated before, Nintendo would never put all their eggs into one basket. It's just possible that the two systems will share a unified operating system, maybe even using the supposed SCD slot on the NX.

Again, time will tell what this mystery machine truly will be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on September 27, 2016, 07:33:40 PM
I was talking more about the Store event being for Disney Magic World 2 and not the NX and Oct. 4 being more for Google news than NX but I guess when you're a supporter of AMD you have to use every post you see as a way to swing the conversation back to the NX maybe using that brand of chip. I agree with you. That horse might not actually be dead yet. God speed, AMD soldier.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Louieturkey on September 27, 2016, 07:50:36 PM
MG really is passionate.  Gotta give credit where it is due.  I've heard rumors that both Polaris and Pascal are being used.  That one seems weird but it's out there.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 28, 2016, 02:14:48 AM
Well a man's gotta have hobbies :p

Just makes more sense to go with Polaris architecture than pascal.

I just feel it's the most likely outcome of the two.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on September 28, 2016, 02:17:56 AM
I was talking more about the Store event being for Disney Magic World 2 and not the NX and Oct. 4 being more for Google news than NX but I guess when you're a supporter of AMD you have to use every post you see as a way to swing the conversation back to the NX maybe using that brand of chip. I agree with you. That horse might not actually be dead yet. God speed, AMD soldier.

As long as their are wars, there will always be gundams! And AMD not too far behind.

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 28, 2016, 08:18:20 AM
Hey BnM apparently Nintendo NYC is hosting a private event on the 1st according to twitter. So there's a chance we could be seeing the NX there.


Jokes on you, they're just reserving a space for their fall chili contest.




In all seriousness, has Nintendo ever announced anything on a Saturday?



Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on September 28, 2016, 08:21:07 AM
Thanks for the breakdown.  It reminds me of the Iwata Asks discussing manufacturing.


No problem!  I have experience and interest in manufacturing/supply management, so I always find it fun to inject my knowledge of the subject, but not sure how much interest there is here from others when I do post a wall of information on occasion  :-\ .


I enjoy those posts! I usually don't have much to add on the topic so I don't reply.


Good!  It's just hard to tell if in my old man status whether people here have interest in traditionally boring non-gaming knowledge that I've obtained in my career.  I've found it interesting, but tough to tell anymore whether i'm out of touch...


(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cg4GQk3WkAEIfh0.jpg:large)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on September 28, 2016, 08:49:57 AM
Who knows. I'm also in my thirties. But yes, the kids are totally out of touch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 28, 2016, 06:52:11 PM
Children, while debatably adorable, are almost consistently wrong.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on September 28, 2016, 07:16:46 PM
Hey BnM apparently Nintendo NYC is hosting a private event on the 1st according to twitter. So there's a chance we could be seeing the NX there.


Jokes on you, they're just reserving a space for their fall chili contest.




In all seriousness, has Nintendo ever announced anything on a Saturday?

Another point in favor of itsf**kingnothing.gif

Edit: Just realized another point against something coming Tuesday: that's the next Sun/Moon trailer day.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 29, 2016, 12:06:18 AM
I can imagine a large AR Screen on some sort of wheeling system.

(http://i.imgur.com/GucI3m4.png)
probably not what Nintendo would do, but a kinda futuristic invention.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Louieturkey on September 29, 2016, 03:01:01 PM
I can imagine a large AR Screen on some sort of wheeling system.

(http://i.imgur.com/GucI3m4.png)
probably not what Nintendo would do, but a kinda futuristic invention.
Don't those exist already?  Well, not for AR but like a Facetime screen on wheels.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 29, 2016, 05:50:54 PM
Doesn't Edward Snowden live inside one of those? I think I saw that on 60 minutes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Louieturkey on September 29, 2016, 08:25:07 PM
The CEO of Ubisoft is super hyped on the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on September 30, 2016, 12:33:32 AM
The CEO of Ubisoft is super hyped on the NX.

Cool, hopefully that mean BG&E
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on September 30, 2016, 12:00:49 PM
Ubisoft enthusiasm is borderline meaningless.  They're on board for everything at first.  The only positive thing to take from it is that the NX is not so obviously terrible that even Ubisoft is turned off.

Okay so Nintendo just announced the Famicom Mini.  I figure there is nothing else that they need to reveal this year so time to reveal the NX, right?  Nintendo, you guys were just waiting to get the Famicom Mini announcement out of the way first, correct?  Please?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on September 30, 2016, 07:25:40 PM
I'm almost willing to be that the next hardware announcement will be a 3DS revision.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: alegoicoe on October 01, 2016, 03:39:18 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE),


I was kinda impressed when i saw this, if this is even close to what Nintendo is planning then i think it might just work for Nintendo.


fast forward to around the 2 minute mark
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 01, 2016, 11:05:44 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE),

I was kinda impressed when i saw this, if this is even close to what Nintendo is planning then i think it might just work for Nintendo.

fast forward to around the 2 minute mark

Well.... if that isn't a proof of concept, then I don't know what is.
some ideas i've seen improve on that proof of concept, but I'm liking what I see.

Nintendo, ball's in your court.


edit
Now SMD64 seems to think this is a bad idea, but when you Nintendoize this product.... (Which they were planning on selling for $299, and since it's a small company, you know that's at a mark-up, and that's with small scale production.) it suddenly has software behind it. The glassesless 3D screen becomes useful. The removeable controllers become Wiimotes. maybe even they attach to to the tablet in a vertical orientation. all of a sudden w/ said software, it becomes a viable and supported product w/ mass manufacturing and deals on parts.


So if they were planning on doing this at $299.99, Nintendo should be able to make a better product for cheaper. and certainly the product described at $349.00ish.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 01, 2016, 12:11:44 PM
SMD64 chastising Eurogamer for not having updates on their initial reporting is hilarious considering he's been flogging the same rumor for months now. He's not said anything new in these months, he's just regurgitated the same spiel in every new video. Eurogamer's reporting is still valid because nothing new has been brought to the table to refute them. It's all been speculation. It's all gone back to the same "AMD 3 design wins" which oh by the way, Eurogamer also reported on earlier this year.  (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-amd-design-wins-suggest-three-upcoming-console-reveals)


Also, he took Ubisoft's comments of "NX being back in the race" at face value.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 01, 2016, 01:16:15 PM
SMD64 chastising Eurogamer for not having updates on their initial reporting is hilarious considering he's been flogging the same rumor for months now. He's not said anything new in these months, he's just regurgitated the same spiel in every new video. Eurogamer's reporting is still valid because nothing new has been brought to the table to refute them. It's all been speculation. It's all gone back to the same "AMD 3 design wins" which oh by the way, Eurogamer also reported on earlier this year.  (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-amd-design-wins-suggest-three-upcoming-console-reveals)


Also, he took Ubisoft's comments of "NX being back in the race" at face value.

No EG's reports are not valid in any sense of the word until nintendo unveils it and it's near what EG "Claims" it to be!

The 3DS never panned into what EG claimed it was, and it's the same guy who's stating once again with the tegra.

Speaking of which, EG has had nothing new to report since, feels like they are back pedaling on something.

Plus we've heard that Nintendo has upped the specs on the NX to include AR/VR support, should they decide to go that route.

Just be thankful that Nintendo isn't Sega, for those who remember the Sega Saturn and when it was announce and when it was released, a cookie to those who knows how far apart from the announcement and release of said system :p

So far we only have two competitors in the Videogame industry..... What... am I missing someone you say? Oh that's right.. Microsoft. From what I hear they may not be staying in the console race for much longer, as shareholder aren't happy and there's talks of pulling from the gaming division.. but we'll see.

I'm hoping for an announcement from Nintendo soon, I just hope it's not much longer. It's time to put an end to these rumors and see who's right about the NX.

I know where I stand and it will come to fruition!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 01, 2016, 02:19:22 PM
I don't understand why the lack of reporting by EG means that they're back-pedalling. How are you guys able to leap into these conclusions.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 01, 2016, 02:53:03 PM
I would be surprised if Nintendo's NX was basically an already existing game machine. It's far from revolutionary or a completely new way to play when the device is already for sale.  ::)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 01, 2016, 02:54:22 PM
I don't understand why the lack of reporting by EG means that they're back-pedalling. How are you guys able to leap into these conclusions.

It's not hard to :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on October 01, 2016, 07:24:29 PM
So far we only have two competitors in the Videogame industry..... What... am I missing someone you say? Oh that's right.. Microsoft. From what I hear they may not be staying in the console race for much longer, as shareholder aren't happy and there's talks of pulling from the gaming division.. but we'll see.

We've been hearing those rumors for years. I'll believe it when we see it.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 12:30:18 AM
So far we only have two competitors in the Videogame industry..... What... am I missing someone you say? Oh that's right.. Microsoft. From what I hear they may not be staying in the console race for much longer, as shareholder aren't happy and there's talks of pulling from the gaming division.. but we'll see.

We've been hearing those rumors for years. I'll believe it when we see it.

And each year we get closer and closer.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 02:54:50 AM
Looks like what EG was on about http://youtu.be/y-8dXWgrWRc lmao
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 02, 2016, 10:06:29 AM
in case any one wants to have a clue as to what MG might be talking about, and I'm only guessing because he didn't specify, skip to 6:21 in the video.

and if that's the case, that's exactly why Nintendo tries to keep it's cards so close to it's chest, so that competitors can't come to market with something similar before they can launch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 11:57:05 AM
in case any one wants to have a clue as to what MG might be talking about, and I'm only guessing because he didn't specify, skip to 6:21 in the video.

and if that's the case, that's exactly why Nintendo tries to keep it's cards so close to it's chest, so that competitors can't come to market with something similar before they can launch.

It's the tablet with wii remote like detachable controllers, I just don't believe the NX is a hybrid handheld at all.
Just like the mock ups and patents they had showed. I believe this is what they were confusing the NX for lol.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 02, 2016, 12:55:56 PM
I believe this is what they were confusing the NX for lol.


I don't know. That sounds more like the behavior of guys who make YouTube videos with "inside" information.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 02, 2016, 02:00:17 PM
So far we only have two competitors in the Videogame industry..... What... am I missing someone you say? Oh that's right.. Microsoft. From what I hear they may not be staying in the console race for much longer, as shareholder aren't happy and there's talks of pulling from the gaming division.. but we'll see.

We've been hearing those rumors for years. I'll believe it when we see it.

And each year we get closer and closer.

I dunno.  MS just put out new hardware, with plans to release more in the future, I think this year put us further away if anything.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 03:16:34 PM
I believe this is what they were confusing the NX for lol.


I don't know. That sounds more like the behavior of guys who make YouTube videos with "inside" information.

and EG has a perfect record.. right? :P
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 02, 2016, 04:33:16 PM
and EG has a perfect record.. right? :P:


No one has a perfect record. But between EG and some guy on YouTube I'll go with EG more times than not.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 05:05:25 PM
and EG has a perfect record.. right? :P:


No one has a perfect record. But between EG and some guy on YouTube I'll go with EG more times than not.

I'd go with a better source than EG lol
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 02, 2016, 07:33:47 PM
in case any one wants to have a clue as to what MG might be talking about, and I'm only guessing because he didn't specify, skip to 6:21 in the video.

and if that's the case, that's exactly why Nintendo tries to keep it's cards so close to it's chest, so that competitors can't come to market with something similar before they can launch.


Something like a unique controller shouldn't be what defines your latest game console, though. They got away with that with the Wii, sort of. There was a lesson to be learned from the Wii and now the Wii U, and if something like these detachable controllers is something that needed to stay close to the chest then produce a box that is so impressive that people don't really fixate on the controllers.


Imagine with me for a moment if the N64 controller was Nintendo's big idea to revolutionize 3D gaming. What if the N64 was just an minor improvement over the Super Nintendo like just enough to make Mario 64 possible. Imagine that the controller was the thing Nintendo was busy highlighting.


That's how Wii and Wii U have felt for me. I'm sure a lot of us are feeling that way. Brand new way to play games with 6 year old technology right out of the gate. Wow. Exciting. Limitless potential.


Tired of the emphasis being on controllers. Let us play with power!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 02, 2016, 09:16:03 PM
in case any one wants to have a clue as to what MG might be talking about, and I'm only guessing because he didn't specify, skip to 6:21 in the video.

and if that's the case, that's exactly why Nintendo tries to keep it's cards so close to it's chest, so that competitors can't come to market with something similar before they can launch.


Something like a unique controller shouldn't be what defines your latest game console, though. They got away with that with the Wii, sort of. There was a lesson to be learned from the Wii and now the Wii U, and if something like these detachable controllers is something that needed to stay close to the chest then produce a box that is so impressive that people don't really fixate on the controllers.


Imagine with me for a moment if the N64 controller was Nintendo's big idea to revolutionize 3D gaming. What if the N64 was just an minor improvement over the Super Nintendo like just enough to make Mario 64 possible. Imagine that the controller was the thing Nintendo was busy highlighting.


That's how Wii and Wii U have felt for me. I'm sure a lot of us are feeling that way. Brand new way to play games with 6 year old technology right out of the gate. Wow. Exciting. Limitless potential.


Tired of the emphasis being on controllers. Let us play with power!

That was Nintendo's.slogan "now you're playing with power"
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 02, 2016, 09:53:23 PM
in case any one wants to have a clue as to what MG might be talking about, and I'm only guessing because he didn't specify, skip to 6:21 in the video.

and if that's the case, that's exactly why Nintendo tries to keep it's cards so close to it's chest, so that competitors can't come to market with something similar before they can launch.


Something like a unique controller shouldn't be what defines your latest game console, though.

Tired of the emphasis being on controllers. Let us play with power!

The idea could have been much more than "the controllers detach" that needs to be protected. The very idea of it though is what produces cheaper knock-offs of the idea that make it to market, or at least public presentation, first.
Nintendo's idea could be more along the lines that the controllers detach so that the handheld can just be a tablet, or re-oriented into vertical view, or attach to a dock and/or become secondary screen to the TV while the controllers now act as independent wiimotes/wireless controllers used on the TV. Which would be quite unique for a home console/portable handheld hybrid.
But then we see something come to market where it's just detachable controllers to an existing phone or tablet, it kinda of cheapens the idea.

Much like when the Wii was released and then there waggle stick tv game knock-offs for a fraction of the prcice that hardly did even part of what the Wiimotes could do.

Seeing that vid of the tablet with the detachable controllers is only part of what was rumored/speculated for the NX, and for $299, I liked where it was going. Assuming N is going that route, I would expect much more towards what was speculated, which would pretty much make the device in that video look like an inferior product (outside of probably screen size).
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 03, 2016, 12:45:41 AM
As much as I hate to say it BlackNMild makes some very salient points. As someone who wants a PS4 level machines with a more conventional control design even I have to look at some rumors pointing to powerful hardware and more streamlined design with a huge grain of salt. There has been nothing in Nintendo's history to suggest what some people here might desperately want. "Now you're playing with Power" was a slogan from the early 90s. It's 2016 yo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 03, 2016, 01:02:34 AM
why would you hate to say it?

anyway, to add to my early point, how the system plays, and the features it provides is exactly what should define their latest game console. It's about what sets it apart from the rest, not what makes it the same.
As you can see between XBO and PS4 the graphics are nearly identical, so they must do something that makes you want one over the other besides exclusive game content. Graphics are good enough to the point where pushing a few more pixels isn't gonna be the difference between whether this game is doable on this platform vs no doable on that platform when they all use the same display and button layout.

If Nintendo is attempting to pull off the rumored/speculated designs, especially based on the mock-ups seen, then Nintendo would technically be able to have everything the other current consoles have w/o any major compromise with the added addition of games and abilities of a handheld, all packaged neatly in to one simple device.

Depending on it's execution, it could change the game if it catches on. and it still doesn't prevent them from putting out a more powerful at home only console to compliment the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 03, 2016, 01:38:37 AM
As much as I hate to say it BlackNMild makes some very salient points. As someone who wants a PS4 level machines with a more conventional control design even I have to look at some rumors pointing to powerful hardware and more streamlined design with a huge grain of salt. There has been nothing in Nintendo's history to suggest what some people here might desperately want. "Now you're playing with Power" was a slogan from the early 90s. It's 2016 yo.

Nope, Now you're playing for player was first used in 1986 for the nes :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on October 03, 2016, 02:03:59 AM
I believe they had a modified version of that slogan for the snes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 03, 2016, 02:08:35 AM
I believe they had a modified version of that slogan for the snes.
Indeed they did, Super Power!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 03, 2016, 03:01:43 AM
New info from HappyNintendofan:

Here's the new info: - Reveal date is set, soon & known by devs - Expect some more "leaks"/ leaks before the reveal - No Launch delay #NX

So we should hopefully be hearing something this month!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 03, 2016, 03:10:31 AM
New info from HappyNintendofan:

Here's the new info: - Reveal date is set, soon & known by devs - Expect some more "leaks"/ leaks before the reveal - No Launch delay #NX

So we should hopefully be hearing something this month!


Suits me. Here's hoping it is revealed 17 days from now like I've been telling people for months. (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=50346.msg900350#msg900350) Here's hoping that Adrock and Louie Turkey don't beat me out of my rightful prize of Official NWR NX Expert before then.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 03, 2016, 03:14:52 AM
New info from HappyNintendofan:

Here's the new info: - Reveal date is set, soon & known by devs - Expect some more "leaks"/ leaks before the reveal - No Launch delay #NX

So we should hopefully be hearing something this month!


Suits me. Here's hoping it is revealed 17 days from now like I've been telling people for months. (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=50346.msg900350#msg900350) Here's hoping that Adrock and Louie Turkey don't beat me out of my rightful prize of Official NWR NX Expert before then.

And I'm banking on being right about what's powering the NX, and hint: it's not Nvidia :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 03, 2016, 04:12:27 AM
Love him or hate him, Dave has a valid point https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 03, 2016, 05:11:13 AM
No, he doesn't. SuperMetalDave64 is an attention-seeking hack who has posted nothing but confirmation bias for the past several months. Fine if he wanted to post one video explaining why he doesn't believe the Eurogamer rumor, but he keeps going back to that well for views which is just pathetic at this point. He has no credible sources, and no one will touch him or his channel now because he outed (and probably got the guy fired and blacklisted) the one source at Nintendo who slipped him info one time. I get that people are thirsty for NX info, but my goodness, we can all do better than SuperMetalDave64 and his condescending, poorly supported nonsense. This thread has been a waste of everyone's goddamn time for weeks now.

I don't even have an opinion on AMD vs. Nvidia anymore. It doesn't matter. And either way, I have no reason to believe Nintendo will ever launch a powerful box. What is NX? Occam's Razor points to it being largely handheld-focused because that's pretty much the only thing that has been working for Nintendo lately. That market has been Nintendo's darling for nearly 30 years.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 03, 2016, 10:41:26 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE),

I was kinda impressed when i saw this, if this is even close to what Nintendo is planning then i think it might just work for Nintendo.

fast forward to around the 2 minute mark

(http://images6.fanpop.com/image/photos/39500000/48-hours-later-memebase-com-39505238-325-240.jpg)

Love him or hate him, Dave has a valid point https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ynqq3wetjQE)

We've reached peak NX rumor shitposting. I'm done here.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 03, 2016, 07:15:48 PM
I hear many people looking back at the Wii and are saying the controller was the problem.

The Wii was a HUGE revolution in gaming controllers.  Should the box have been more powerful, with HD and a robust online infrastructure yeah...it should have.  And THAT was the problem, not the controller.

Nintendo should be looking to advance game controllers even more.  Yes, Waggle controls were not always great or fun, but that is partially because they didn't work perfectly.  However, the answer is not to throw out the baby with the bath water, but instead to figure out how to make a better motion controller. 

The fact that Nintendo abandoned the single most significant aspect of the Wii for the Wii Tablet and didn't figure a way to advance motion control gaming was shortsighted.  They should looking forward and perfecting motion control gaming because it really is the future and more enjoyable than holding a button traditional controller.

So in short, a console CAN be designed around a controller, but you better also have the other elements properly there to SUPPORT the backbone on the concept. 
Title: Re: NX hot scoops straight from Google!
Post by: Shaymin on October 03, 2016, 11:18:03 PM
The rumor mill is deader than a Cincinnati gorilla. Half tempted to move this to the Funhouse.

Still true, btw.

At this point, the only things I'm concerned about are what non-Zelda games are launching with it and when they're revealing. Anything else is fluff.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 04, 2016, 01:41:12 PM
I heard a guy talking about NX at a used video game store and they suggested that it was actually just the NES Mini all along and Nintendo is officially exciting the hardware business and going full on Playstation 3rd party.

At this point, I am starting to think Nintendo is waiting to make sure the other guys are locked into VR before they reveal whatever it actually is.

The only thing I want, if I am to consider buying one at all, is to guarantee all the games I have on virtual console transfer over. Being able to migrate all my Wii virtual console purchases was one thing that took the sting of buying a Wii U down a little. If they only let you migrate Wii U and 3DS purchases but throw out all the Wii stuff I might be tempted to skip this machine entirely. Especially if it's just a handheld that plugs into your TV.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 04, 2016, 05:52:26 PM
It would be pretty great if I could transfer all Wii and Wii U games over.  I have more of these than physical games right now.I have acouple of games that are both in the Wii VC and on the Wii U vc.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 04, 2016, 06:13:49 PM
I just hope it makes waffles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 04, 2016, 07:19:30 PM
is to guarantee all the games I have on virtual console transfer over. Being able to migrate all my Wii virtual console purchases was one thing that took the sting of buying a Wii U down a little.

I think it is very unlikely that will happen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 04, 2016, 10:31:25 PM
I dunno I feel Nintendo is realizing that the market wants to carry their game purchases over to each new system.  I can see Nintendo charging a small conversion charge like they did with the Wii U.  Hopefully it will not be per game, but a single one time charge...at least for Digital Virtual Console Games
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 04, 2016, 10:34:54 PM
Part of why that worked, though, is that the Wii U was a continuation of the same hardware architecture as the Wii and could run everything natively in Wii mode. There's no guarantee it'll be anywhere near that easy this time around.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 04, 2016, 11:04:49 PM
Most of the digital games we buy are just old roms with attached emulators and unity games. It could be one of the reasons why NX is in the dark so long is because they are spending a lot of time doing conversions/ports. Very few games use proprietary or inflexible engines.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 05, 2016, 12:00:50 AM
I'm almost willing to be that the next hardware announcement will be a 3DS revision.

(http://i.imgur.com/YrKaGIw.png)

Close enough.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 05, 2016, 12:21:08 AM
Yeah, you're not going to be able to straight transfer your WiiU VC games over, but if the My Nintendo account is good for anything it should know what games you purchased and allow you to re-download or convert them as they're released for NX. Although there's nothing on My Nintendo that shows a game list as far as I can tell, so I'm leery. I sold my WiiU, but not before I synced it with MyNin. I'm really hoping there won't be some kind of hardware dickery involved between the WiiU and NX to get it to recognize games on my account.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 05, 2016, 12:51:20 AM
is to guarantee all the games I have on virtual console transfer over. Being able to migrate all my Wii virtual console purchases was one thing that took the sting of buying a Wii U down a little.

I think it is very unlikely that will happen.

There's no rational reason (in 2016) for that to be anything but an easy yes.

Fact is, charging us for the Wii U version of an emulated game that we already purchased on the Wii was a pretty harsh dick move. Nintendo better recognize.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 05, 2016, 02:18:50 AM
This is Nintendo we are talking about here. They will happily charge us again for the same VC games, Im sure of it.
But I will be very happy to be proven wrong when the NX launches.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 05, 2016, 11:41:17 AM
No they will happily charge most of you to rebuy  games you already have, not me not this time. If there is one thing I learned buying Nintendo this gen it's KEEP EVERYTHING, the number 1 reason I bought a Wii U was I know it will be damn collectible in 15 years and if its the only way to hold onto my very large Wii Virtual Console library without having to re-buy the same games again I will do it just to spite Nintendo. I would happily pay a small conversion fee or transfer fee, small as in a 1 time $10 fee or less. I will NOT be paying more than that. Or I would consider a $1 fee per game but not what they did with Wii U I want everything I bought on Wii, I have 60+ Wii VC titles, I barely have 20 Wii U VC titles, mostly just DS and Wii stuff with the main SNES stuff just for easier access.

Actually I am not sold on NX yet, but I doubt it will be Wii U fail I am predicting closer to N64 levels of successful but GC levels of support. Maybe slightly higher. Depends on what great new gimmick they come up with and price.


I know they won't or there is a good chance they won't but it's the number 1 deal breaker for me. There might not be a way to do a "Wii Mode" but I am sure they can figure out a way to access the Wii store.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 05, 2016, 10:59:36 PM
Boogie2988 aka Francis of all people has some juicy tidbits

http://gonintendo.com/stories/266258-rumor-boogie2988-gets-insider-info-on-nx-expands-upon-console

Interesting he talks about playing regular Assasins Creed in console mode, then picking it up and playing the Assasin's Creed mobile game on the go.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 06, 2016, 12:56:08 AM
Boy we hard up for info if we're listening to that noise.

But, uh, that concept of playing the real game on the screen and the mobile version on the go, that, uh, sounds a little too Nintendo-like for comfort and isn't something I'd seen floated before.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 06, 2016, 02:07:52 AM
Much like my assessment when the Famicom-mini was announced, Nintendo got their minor 2DS colour revision news out so... now time for the real stuff, right?

I can't tell if the NX is falling behind schedule and they're stalling for time or Nintendo is just being their weird selves and are sitting on the announcement for reasons that only make sense to them.  For any other company if they had said a March launch and still had not revealed things by October I would assume the product is delayed but with Nintendo I don't feel confident making that assumption.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 06, 2016, 05:02:33 AM
I was expecting a September announcement and that didnt happen. Now Im thinking it will happen after the NES mini is released.
That way all the focus is on the NES instead of the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 06, 2016, 12:18:18 PM
Isn't the NES Mini not coming out until November?

How late is too late?  (All announcement related bets aside.)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 06, 2016, 02:50:24 PM
I'm not expecting any kind of backwards compatibility since it seems Nintendo is moving away from the Wii / U hardware and name, which would be a good idea. Besides, the PS4 and XBONE didn't have backwards compatibility (though they may have had some added in, I forget), and nobody seemed to care. Then again, I'm probably forgetting the double standards people tend to hold to Nintendo...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Oedo on October 06, 2016, 03:39:46 PM
We might not know what the NX is, but one thing that we can safely assume is that Nintendo will be counting on it to be a medium-long term source of revenue for them. They're counting on the NES Classic Edition being a source of revenue over a couple of months and that's about it. I don't think Nintendo is really letting the NES Classic Edition factor into their timing of the NX announcement in many material way (and if they are, someone needs to have a long chat with the people behind that decision).

How late is too late?  (All announcement related bets aside.)

If Nintendo still intends to launch the NX in March, I think it has to be this month. If they wait much longer and still release it in March, they'll be sabotaging another hardware launch.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on October 06, 2016, 08:54:20 PM
The system will more then likely be shown by October 27.  Like I already said in the NX predict thread several times, Nintendo more then likely wanted to get Paper Mario out of the way before announcing the system.  The NX is the future while the Wii U is the past, why would they announce the NX anytime in September when they have only one last Wii U game left to sell?  Yeah they've announced new hardware along with new games for older hardware in the past but none of those systems were as big a failure hardware wise as the Wii U.  All reports point to the NX being a major reboot for Nintendo so it's not hard to see why they want to get rid of the old before moving on since they don't want to remind people of the old anymore.

Basically after Paper Mario's release tomorrow Nintendo will officially bury the Wii U.  When they start talking about the NX they want to show everyone how awesome it's going to be and not want people to even think about the previous system called the Wii U since then people could think the NX will suffer the Wii U's same problems.  Yeah there will still be a Wii U version of Zelda but that's meant for the hardcore necrophiliac fanboys like myself who Nintendo has no problem with them still getting enjoyment from a dead system, but won't be officially condoning said behavior.  In terms of branding, marketing and coverage, Breath of the Wild will basically be a NX exclusive to the rest of the world.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 06, 2016, 09:49:57 PM
I can see Nintendo waiting until Nov. 18th because that is the date Nintendo uses to release the LAST holiday game or new system in the US.  I am sure Nintendo wants to sell as much hardware as possible before announcing the new system.  This may upset many consumers, but businesses almost never care about consumers and really want to get old stock out of the way to prevent too much loss.  Any console sold before the announcement is better.  After the announcement especially if the system will launch in March, there will be few new Wii U systems sold.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 07, 2016, 09:30:46 AM
I'm not expecting any kind of backwards compatibility since it seems Nintendo is moving away from the Wii / U hardware and name, which would be a good idea. Besides, the PS4 and XBONE didn't have backwards compatibility (though they may have had some added in, I forget), and nobody seemed to care. Then again, I'm probably forgetting the double standards people tend to hold to Nintendo...

I am personally was never asking for backwards compatability of anything Wii or Wii U related, nobody in their right mind should expect that. I want Virtual Console b/c or at least to keep the games I already purchased, some twice. I was okay with it on Wii U because the logistics and the way things worked out but damn it I have $600 invested in Wii virtual Console that of those games are lost, as in they aren't even the ones ported to Wii U yet, I will be pissed. Not to the point I won't get an NX, I am not sold on it yet anyways, but I might out of spite because **** it, I don't know I just feel like at the very least they need to find a way to include Wii and Wii U virtual console games no matter how they do it. Even if it means launching a Wii app just for virtual console and everything else is not useful fine I would settle for that and Nintendo could pull that off. If its rights issues they need to get that sorted out five years ago.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 07, 2016, 01:12:06 PM
[ur]http://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2016/10/06/a-nintendo-nx-delay-would-help-it-dominate-in-2017/#482dbb6c496d[/url]

Here's an article saying Nintendo should (not will) delay the NX launch to the summer.

I think the author makes one good point, but I don't think Nintendo can maintain their relevance that long.  They'll have bee more or less out of the console business for months by the time they announce.  And then, people will question why Nintendo just doesn't put w/e games they show for the system on mobile or on other consoles.

Wanted to see what everyone else thinks.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 07, 2016, 01:45:25 PM
One thing I noticed in that article was that it argued that if they waited until early January to unveil the system that would necessitate a delay. It treated that as a given, as completely obvious and in no need of justification. My question is why couldn't they do the big reveal the first week of January and then release it at the end of March? In basically every other sector of the tech industry they can announce a product and have it in people's hands within a week. Even if you grant that a console launch is a bigger deal and requires more preparation, why couldn't you do it in two and a half months?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 07, 2016, 04:19:30 PM
Yeah, with how quickly information can travel these days with the Internet and all, I don't think game systems need a lot of pre-release hype to succeed. If the NX is a good product, it will sell regardless of when it is revealed or released. Therefore, I think the only reason to delay it would be if it still isn't fully ready.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 07, 2016, 04:50:26 PM
I think they could announce it as late as November and still release in March but any later than that and it has to be delayed. The problem with announcing too early can also back fire so six months is really the sweet spot and we're there now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 07, 2016, 05:10:51 PM
Why, though? What about a console launch requires that much of a lead up? Unless there's a ridiculous amount of misinformation out there, developers are already familiar with the system, so this reveal is just for the general public, and I don't see why they couldn't be successful with a 2-2.5 month window of hype as long as they really hit the marketing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 07, 2016, 05:58:17 PM
I can see Nintendo thinking that revealing the NX too soon could hurt Wii U sales at Christmas.  But if Nintendo can get real hype going before Christmas they could also discourage PS4 and XB1 sales.  Someone who was thinking about buying one of those might save their money for the NX instead if it sounds up their alley.  Meanwhile someone who buys a PS4 in December is not necessarily going to want to buy another console in March.  Nintendo should want the NX to factor into console purchase decisions and that won't happen if we know nothing about the NX when those decisions are being made.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 07, 2016, 06:02:07 PM
Why, though? What about a console launch requires that much of a lead up? Unless there's a ridiculous amount of misinformation out there, developers are already familiar with the system, so this reveal is just for the general public, and I don't see why they couldn't be successful with a 2-2.5 month window of hype as long as they really hit the marketing.

Oh sure, NOW everyone is seeing the wisdom of this. Like I was saying simply AGES ago...
like, almost a month ago. that's a LONG TIME if you're a dog. Or a budgie.
Any chance Nintendo is keeping quiet so as not to spoil holiday sales?

I could see them announcing in January, hyping and media blitzing for 2+ months and releasing in March. Why not keep the advertising window nice and short? Why play your hand too early?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 07, 2016, 06:10:27 PM
Sorry, this thread got kind of annoying for a while and I wasn't reading it all that closely so I must have missed that. But I don't think it'd be about not spoiling holiday sales as much as so they could get the media to focus completely on them instead of having to compete with big holiday releases on other platforms.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on October 07, 2016, 10:16:49 PM
I think whatever 3rd parties they can get on the system at launch would want a short-but-traditional marketing cycle for their launch titles, and even a short marketing cycle (as seen with Fallout 4 or most Atlus localizations) is 5-6 months.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 07, 2016, 10:21:36 PM
That only makes sense if we're talking about exclusive titles from third parties, and I don't expect much in the way of those at launch. If it's ports they don't need as long to specifically market them for NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 07, 2016, 11:24:06 PM
That only makes sense if we're talking about exclusive titles from third parties, and I don't expect much in the way of those at launch. If it's ports they don't need as long to specifically market them for NX.

PS VR is about to be all the gaming rage, if Nintendo doesn't want to end up in the situation where people forget they even have something in the works because of the media blitz the PS VR is sure to receive, which is already starting, then they do too need to get something out sooner rather than later. The benefit is people are anxious now, they are talking about it now, they are hyped or trying to get hyped now, if Nintendo waits too long these people might just spend their money on other stuff now and put off NX or lose interest in it. Surely they do not think the Wii U will magically sell gangbusters this Christmas they are probably hoping to wipe out existing inventory and quietly move on.

The only thing that really makes sense pushing the reveal closer to launch is if the idea is something that could be stolen and is so great everyone might rush out to steal it right away. They learned that lesson with Wii but if they are hoping for or expecting Wii success they had better have something truly amazing. I think the hybrid console is going to get them back to SNES levels of support and sales consistently but they need to get games out and they need to start the hype train before people move on and lose interest. That just makes it that much harder to regain trust and rebuild hype going forward. Once a console loses steam its really hard to get it back. They are already fighting an uphill battle, with boulders chained to their ankles, so they need to be smart about it. Hopefully they reveal something before everyone commits their console money this holiday season.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 08, 2016, 02:17:44 AM
SM2k You're forgetting something: VR is lame.


Nintendo could just do something it hasn't done in a while. A console with a lot of launch titles. And good launch titles.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 08, 2016, 03:13:52 AM
The only thing that really makes sense pushing the reveal closer to launch is if the idea is something that could be stolen and is so great everyone might rush out to steal it right away.

If the March date is real then there is only like six months for a competitor to steal the idea.  How could anyone steal it in that short time frame unless the idea is REALLY minor and easy to copy?  But if that's the case the idea ain't going to be worth a damn anyway.  If the idea is going to be stolen then the copycats are going to start the day it's revealed so Nintendo buys another couple months, maybe?  If they revealed it a year before or something like that then I can see it but it's far too late for someone to beat Nintendo to the market.  The Wii came out in 2006 and Move and Kinect didn't follow until 2010.  That was plenty of time for Nintendo to reap the benefits of the idea.  25 years ago you could crank out a game in months so a copycat product was really feasible.  These days games take YEARS to make.  A couple extra months between the reveal and launch is nothing.  No serious competitor should be able to beat Nintendo to the market or realistically even get a copycat product out before the end of 2017.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 08, 2016, 07:31:59 AM
Sure, companies like Apple have successfully announced a product and launched it within a couple weeks. There's no reason Nintendo can't either. However, it is so goddamn terrible at marketing, it probably shouldn't.

At the same time, maybe using the budget Nintendo would have spent on six months of marketing into three months or less would help it reach more people, more commercials, online ads etc. within a smaller time frame. That is, of course, assuming Nintendo wouldn't just half the budget because it feels it only has to market for half the amount of time it usually would.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 08, 2016, 11:33:39 AM
Another conclusion could be made.

Maybe Nintendo doesn't want to announce the NX because it's delayed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 08, 2016, 11:43:10 AM
Sure, companies like Apple have successfully announced a product and launched it within a couple weeks. There's no reason Nintendo can't either. However, it is so goddamn terrible at marketing, it probably shouldn't.

At the same time, maybe using the budget Nintendo would have spent on six months of marketing into three months or less would help it reach more people, more commercials, online ads etc. within a smaller time frame. That is, of course, assuming Nintendo wouldn't just half the budget because it feels it only has to market for half the amount of time it usually would.

Nintendo is actually marketing the NX right now but they're just so inept at it that we're not aware of it! ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 08, 2016, 01:18:25 PM
Sure, companies like Apple have successfully announced a product and launched it within a couple weeks. There's no reason Nintendo can't either. However, it is so goddamn terrible at marketing, it probably shouldn't.

At the same time, maybe using the budget Nintendo would have spent on six months of marketing into three months or less would help it reach more people, more commercials, online ads etc. within a smaller time frame. That is, of course, assuming Nintendo wouldn't just half the budget because it feels it only has to market for half the amount of time it usually would.

Nintendo is actually marketing the NX right now but they're just so inept at it that we're not aware of it! ;)

or Nintendo is actually marketing the NX right now, and their doing it by small controlled "leaks" that has the internet doing all the work for them... for free.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 08, 2016, 02:31:12 PM
Oh sure, NOW everyone is seeing the wisdom of this. Like I was saying simply AGES ago...
Meh, I don't think it's a wise idea, they should reveal it this month. What I'm saying is that I don't think having a January reveal and a March release would have much of a negative impact if that's what happened.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 08, 2016, 08:40:49 PM
IMHO Nintendo already botched the launch by missing the holiday window. A March release is not a very good start but it does give them time to get several games released for next year's holiday season. I just hope they're able to handle any negative perception that will result from a potential slow start.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 08, 2016, 08:58:28 PM
Nintendo's official stance on the March 2017 launch is that the games aren't ready. That doesn't even sound like PR spin. If anything, Nintendo is avoiding a botched launch. The last time Nintendo forced a holiday season launch, we got Wii U. It had no business being shipped in the shape it was in. No thanks. I don't believe when hardware launches (even the holiday season) is more important than launching competent hardware with captivating software.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 08, 2016, 09:16:52 PM
From the squalor of Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/56jomc/leak_goodies_from_a_large_retail_partner/

Info about the supposed packaging.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 08, 2016, 09:21:38 PM
Nintendo's official stance on the March 2017 launch is that the games aren't ready. That doesn't even sound like PR spin. If anything, Nintendo is avoiding a botched launch. The last time Nintendo forced a holiday season launch, we got Wii U. It had no business being shipped in the shape it was in. No thanks. I don't believe when hardware launches (even the holiday season) is more important than launching competent hardware with captivating software.

Don't forget the 3DS, which was forced out before the end of the fiscal year, really hurting it (though it ultimately overcame that). That's two systems in a row Nintendo made the mistake of releasing when they weren't ready yet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 08, 2016, 10:58:15 PM
From the squalor of Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/56jomc/leak_goodies_from_a_large_retail_partner/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/56jomc/leak_goodies_from_a_large_retail_partner/)

Info about the supposed packaging.

Quote
"Interact with your game on the go." phrase seen on a poster.

That's a clumsy tagline...

Quote
Strong co-branding effort with a Mario launch title on many posters.

Smells bull crappy

Quote
The color scheme for the packaging is white and blue (compared to the Wii U's blue and black).

The Wii U Basic model was also white and blue.

Quote
1080p and 60fps are being used by the marketing teams...

This is such a massive red flag I can't take this leak seriously.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 08, 2016, 11:30:38 PM
The wording of the more recent "leaks" implies that Nintendo hasn't yet been able to make a complete hybrid, with the portable aspect being a more limited experience.  Still, most of it lines up with the bulk of the rumors, so it could just be more echoes in our chamber of desperation.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 09, 2016, 10:40:32 AM
The only thing that really makes sense pushing the reveal closer to launch is if the idea is something that could be stolen and is so great everyone might rush out to steal it right away.

If the March date is real then there is only like six months for a competitor to steal the idea.  How could anyone steal it in that short time frame unless the idea is REALLY minor and easy to copy?  But if that's the case the idea ain't going to be worth a damn anyway.  If the idea is going to be stolen then the copycats are going to start the day it's revealed so Nintendo buys another couple months, maybe?  If they revealed it a year before or something like that then I can see it but it's far too late for someone to beat Nintendo to the market.  The Wii came out in 2006 and Move and Kinect didn't follow until 2010.  That was plenty of time for Nintendo to reap the benefits of the idea.  25 years ago you could crank out a game in months so a copycat product was really feasible.  These days games take YEARS to make.  A couple extra months between the reveal and launch is nothing.  No serious competitor should be able to beat Nintendo to the market or realistically even get a copycat product out before the end of 2017.


Sure they could, suppose the idea is something that relies on existing tech that the other two have access to through their technology divisions. I am not saying they could do a complete copy cat product, but it didn't take them long to implement motion controls despite all sucking at it. What I mean is what if they have something that say Apple could steal? Apple might not like Nintendo making a play to dethrown them from the mobile scene knowing that Nintendo used to be kings of that market. We still don't know what it is but I am willing to bet you that Apple more than has the funds and resources to get a new iPhone or something else that does the same thing by the end of the year. They don't even need to have a full product ready by Christmas, they just need enough cobbled together by E3 to show they are working on it to start building hype and deflating the NX hype.

And if its really a hybrid Sony and Apple are both in a position to modify existing products very easily to get something of that effect out, hell Apple already is doing that now with their unified OS anyways. If they decided that say the breakway controller works and is a good idea they could work that into the next iPhone and Nintendo is a dead goose having to exit the console business for good if they quitely concede the living room console space which sounds like they are doing, and lose the mobile space, their finished as a game tech company.

I am not saying this is what will happen but yeah it could, your just too down on Nintendo its like nothing they do impresses you anyways.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 09, 2016, 12:30:54 PM
I'm sure no matter what Nintendo comes up with, Sony and MS have something they are messing with that they can shove out their to say "Me too!" That's how it works. You create the illusion that you have feature parity if the competition comes out with something new. The competition has done it with: D-pads, shoulder buttons, light guns, portable systems, analog sticks, trigger buttons, wireless controls, rumble,  motion controls, avatars, second screen game play, and that's not even getting into the games!

The R&D teams at Sony and Mircosoft surely have prototypes or are associated with companies that have technology like:
- Portable console gaming
- Holograms
- Mini Projectors
- Haptic feedback
- Augmented Reality
- Lightguns
Or whatever else Nintendo comes up with.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 09, 2016, 01:48:15 PM
But there's still the question whether or not they have anything they could show off that would be market-ready.  Sony and MS wouldn't show some clumsy prototype that looks like a Frankenstein next to their own finalized hardware.  Nintendo knows they'll be emulated, but it's about timing.


The comparisons to Apple, while valid, are missing one point.  Apple is huge.  A lot of people stream their announcements and wait outside in lines to buy their products.  It's an annual tradition.  One that comes with free marketing.  Nintendo just doesn't have that level of social cache any more.  Delaying into the next year could really hurt them, IMO.  Regaining the relevance via the mobile space might end up hurting their credibility as a console maker.  So, for that reason, and Ian's point, I think they need an unveiling this month.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 09, 2016, 06:13:20 PM
It doesn't really matter when they unveil it if they don't know how to market it. In response to Adrock, that too is another way they are botching the launch -- they didn't have the software ready in time for the holiday window. This really speaks to what used to drive Nintendo's sales. At this point, I am salivating for a technical masterpiece that just blows the top off of gaming as I know it, because that's what Nintendo used to do. They need that killer piece of software that is going to hook people who aren't even considering Nintendo.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 09, 2016, 06:25:56 PM
...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on October 09, 2016, 06:29:06 PM
At this point, I am salivating for a technical masterpiece that just blows the top off of gaming as I know it, because that's what Nintendo used to do. They need that killer piece of software that is going to hook people who aren't even considering Nintendo.

They actually have that, it's called Breath of the Wild.  The reaction to that game at E3 is the biggest Nintendo has had since the Wii, and that's from a demo representing less then 2% of the game.

The actual launch of the NX will be fine because of Zelda but the post launch is what will be most important.  Nintendo could have had an amazing launch this holiday with the NX and Zelda if they wanted to.  The problem is if they have another huge drought, which they probably would have that would have killed the systems momentum in early 2017.

The most important thing for the NX isn't the actual launch but the post launch.  They can't have periods of over 3 months with nothing again or else all hype will be fucked no matter how amazing Zelda is.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 09, 2016, 07:18:21 PM
This is kind of off topic, but I dont think they have said Zelda will be a launch title. They just keep saying it will be next year.
I think it would be crazy of them not to have it as a launch title.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 09, 2016, 10:31:16 PM
This is kind of off topic, but I dont think they have said Zelda will be a launch title. They just keep saying it will be next year.
I think it would be crazy of them not to have it as a launch title.

Don't do this to me...
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 09, 2016, 11:17:38 PM
I'm sure no matter what Nintendo comes up with, Sony and MS have something they are messing with that they can shove out their to say "Me too!" That's how it works. You create the illusion that you have feature parity if the competition comes out with something new. The competition has done it with: D-pads, shoulder buttons, light guns, portable systems, analog sticks, trigger buttons, wireless controls, rumble,  motion controls, avatars, second screen game play, and that's not even getting into the games!

The R&D teams at Sony and Mircosoft surely have prototypes or are associated with companies that have technology like:
- Portable console gaming
- Holograms
- Mini Projectors
- Haptic feedback
- Augmented Reality
- Lightguns
Or whatever else Nintendo comes up with.

It begins!

http://nseavoice.com/games/sony-wanted-hybrid-ps4-not-nintendo-920017064.html
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 10, 2016, 12:15:18 PM
Since the point I was making got lost in the bickering I will say it again. I do not think they should wait longer to announce it, I think it needs to be this month, but knowing them if they hold off on the announcement it is because they are paranoid someone will steal their idea, I was not saying I agree with that.

But I concede to Insanolord that hey is right in todays day and age they could reveal things closer to launch and still build hype, I just think they would be smarter to say something sooner than later or else they might need to delay it to summer or later and launching in summer is a gamble.

Another thing everyone keeps forgetting is they are also supposed to be launching QoL at that same time frame and have yet to mention anything about it, so before we get our hopes too high the NX isn't some lame attempt at trying to get gamers to exercise like Wii was lets keep in mind they haven't announced squat on that stuff either. Unless they changed directions entirely I am willing to bet its going to tie into NX somehow.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on October 10, 2016, 12:29:39 PM
I'll go ahead and make the argument against them announcing as close to release as Apple would for their newest product.  Apple can get away with this because they are so pervasive in our culture and their products have such a wide market that they know they will sell through their stock of whatever it is they're releasing at or near launch.


Nintendo has worldwide name brand cache, but their rabid fanbase is much smaller than Apples, and their products aren't tied to something that's seen as an almost necessity like cellphones are quickly becoming, if not considered already by most.


Hopefully Nintendo has that much self awareness, but I wouldn't be surprised if they thought they were video games' "Apple".
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 10, 2016, 04:35:00 PM
Sure they are, if you are just talking about Mac then yes Nintendo and Apple are on the same level, at least in terms of to the gaming community as a whole. Also one thing Apple has going for it Nintendo does not, phone companies lock people into those forever plans that promise you a new phone when they get released or offer you new phones at certain intervals, Nintendo has no equivalent of that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 10, 2016, 06:14:58 PM
I'm not suggesting they wait as close to release as Apple, they still probably need a couple months of buildup for something like this, I just think waiting until early January, after the holiday craziness has died down, is a viable strategy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 10, 2016, 06:57:44 PM
But so much of the market will have just bought a new console in January. Would they really consider buying another one so quickly?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 10, 2016, 07:22:17 PM
That's why waiting until after the holidays to have a reveal makes no sense. If you're not giving the market a chance to consider your console they'll just spend their money on the PS4 or Xbox bundles during the holidays and won't even bother buying something new 3 months later. Awareness needs to be there much earlier.


Also, announcing the NX will in no way cannibalize the sales of the NES Mini.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 10, 2016, 10:19:14 PM
I'm wondering what the stocks for Wii U look like.  No way Nintendo is still sitting on piles of them, right?  They haven't exactly priced them to move, so I'm thinking they stopped making them long enough ago.  If they're waiting in order to finish out the supply, that's probably a bad move since slashing the price to invoke a sales blitz would only put a bad taste in people's mouths.  Nintendo should probably have negotiated inventory buybacks from retailers by now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 11, 2016, 01:46:51 AM
At this point, I am salivating for a technical masterpiece that just blows the top off of gaming as I know it, because that's what Nintendo used to do. They need that killer piece of software that is going to hook people who aren't even considering Nintendo.

They actually have that, it's called Breath of the Wild.  The reaction to that game at E3 is the biggest Nintendo has had since the Wii, and that's from a demo representing less then 2% of the game.

The actual launch of the NX will be fine because of Zelda but the post launch is what will be most important.  Nintendo could have had an amazing launch this holiday with the NX and Zelda if they wanted to.  The problem is if they have another huge drought, which they probably would have that would have killed the systems momentum in early 2017.

The most important thing for the NX isn't the actual launch but the post launch.  They can't have periods of over 3 months with nothing again or else all hype will be fucked no matter how amazing Zelda is.


I just don't see it that way, and I don't think non-Nintendo gamers really see it that way either. On its own, Breath of the Wild looks like a fantastic game that looks to offer a little something different from other Zeldas and from Skyrim. The thing is that the game isn't much of a technical showcase since the Wii U can handle the game. This new Zelda is running on 10 year old hardware, right? I bet my LG G5 can run it! Seriously.


I want something that can only be experienced with the NX. Even the GameCube had graphics that were pretty much only found on GameCube. Super Mario Sunshine had that water! Loved that water! Wind Waker was cel shaded and had that vast ocean. That ocean was vast. Too much water! Metroid Prime boasted amazing graphics. F-Zero too. As well as Resident Evil. GameCube really was an unparalleled experience. It wasn't cheap hardware. It had potential waiting to be realized. And it was the system with faster load times.


Let's see NX offer a level of quality that the other consoles must strive to match.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 11, 2016, 11:07:16 AM
At this point, I am salivating for a technical masterpiece that just blows the top off of gaming as I know it, because that's what Nintendo used to do. They need that killer piece of software that is going to hook people who aren't even considering Nintendo.

They actually have that, it's called Breath of the Wild.  The reaction to that game at E3 is the biggest Nintendo has had since the Wii, and that's from a demo representing less then 2% of the game.

The actual launch of the NX will be fine because of Zelda but the post launch is what will be most important.  Nintendo could have had an amazing launch this holiday with the NX and Zelda if they wanted to.  The problem is if they have another huge drought, which they probably would have that would have killed the systems momentum in early 2017.

The most important thing for the NX isn't the actual launch but the post launch.  They can't have periods of over 3 months with nothing again or else all hype will be fucked no matter how amazing Zelda is.


I just don't see it that way, and I don't think non-Nintendo gamers really see it that way either. On its own, Breath of the Wild looks like a fantastic game that looks to offer a little something different from other Zeldas and from Skyrim. The thing is that the game isn't much of a technical showcase since the Wii U can handle the game. This new Zelda is running on 10 year old hardware, right? I bet my LG G5 can run it! Seriously.


I want something that can only be experienced with the NX. Even the GameCube had graphics that were pretty much only found on GameCube. Super Mario Sunshine had that water! Loved that water! Wind Waker was cel shaded and had that vast ocean. That ocean was vast. Too much water! Metroid Prime boasted amazing graphics. F-Zero too. As well as Resident Evil. GameCube really was an unparalleled experience. It wasn't cheap hardware. It had potential waiting to be realized. And it was the system with faster load times.


Let's see NX offer a level of quality that the other consoles must strive to match.

I disagree with your assessement of Non-Nintendo gamers. believe it or not their are way more Nintendo gamers out there than not, if you remember to keep in mind the console does not represent the entire fanbase. That is why NX, if it truly is what we are all now expecting it to be, will be a massive hit if done right. Sony couldn't do it right because Sony didn't understand the purpose of the handheld. Nintendo does. Nintendo also knows how to scale their games better than Sony did.

The core Nintendo userbase is still roughly 60-90 million, if you combine the handheld sales with the console sales, that has been consistent every generation. double that for the DS and Wii because their blue ocean strategy worked.

Really NX is just Nintendo getting back to what worked in the past, from the sounds of it at least on the surface. Who knows it could very well end up being the end of them for all we know.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on October 11, 2016, 11:35:36 AM
I want something that can only be experienced with the NX. Even the GameCube had graphics that were pretty much only found on GameCube. Super Mario Sunshine had that water! Loved that water! Wind Waker was cel shaded and had that vast ocean. That ocean was vast. Too much water! Metroid Prime boasted amazing graphics. F-Zero too. As well as Resident Evil. GameCube really was an unparalleled experience. It wasn't cheap hardware. It had potential waiting to be realized. And it was the system with faster load times.


Come on, that's pure nostalgia BS.  There were Xbox games that graphically matched and surpassed all the games you mentioned here.  Seriously, the Gamecube was a powerful machine for the price it was but it was by no means this beast the other consoles of that gen were striving to match.

And yes Breath of the Wild is a technically masterpiece no matter what you try to spin.  Find me an open world game on any system right now that's the sizes of this game with the kind of engaging fast gameplay that Zelda provides with the kind of physics engine this game has and isn't a complete buggy mess.  If you're going to consider games like Mario Sunshine (which outside of the water was terrible graphically) as a technical masterpiece just because it did something the other systems at the time weren't doing, (even though the original Xbox easily could have), Breath of the Wild fits the exact definition of what your saying Nintendo should make since it's doing something technically that no other system or dev has done so far, even on more powerful hardware.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on October 11, 2016, 11:47:21 AM
The GameCube is a really weird example to use there, because to me, of all Nintendo's systems, it's probably the one that stands out the least from its competitors.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 11, 2016, 11:56:10 AM
From the squalor of Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/56jomc/leak_goodies_from_a_large_retail_partner/ (https://www.reddit.com/r/NintendoNX/comments/56jomc/leak_goodies_from_a_large_retail_partner/)

Info about the supposed packaging.

Quote
"Interact with your game on the go." phrase seen on a poster.

That's a clumsy tagline...
Indeed it is. It also uses the alarming phrase "interact with your game" on the go instead of "play your game" on the go. This seems to line up with some recent rumours that the part of the NX you can take with you will play a "mobile version" of the full game you play on the "home console" part, and that when you return, the two game versions will synch or something. (here is one news article that succinctly sums up the rumours and concept (http://www.express.co.uk/entertainment/gaming/718558/Nintendo-NX-news-Ubisoft-Assassin-s-Creed-NX-reveal))
This is a tricky point. If the on-the-go game is basically the same game as on the home console but just graphically inferior or something, I think most folks would think that was a good feature and embrace it. If the mobile version is just an app-store tie-in version of a console game, I think folks would find that very disappointing or worse.
*edit* I get that all this is highly speculative and makes a number of assumptions based on rumours, upon rumours.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Oedo on October 11, 2016, 02:35:28 PM
I'm wondering what the stocks for Wii U look like.  No way Nintendo is still sitting on piles of them, right?  They haven't exactly priced them to move, so I'm thinking they stopped making them long enough ago.  If they're waiting in order to finish out the supply, that's probably a bad move since slashing the price to invoke a sales blitz would only put a bad taste in people's mouths.  Nintendo should probably have negotiated inventory buybacks from retailers by now.

Given that they only projected to sell a meager 800,000 units coming into this fiscal year and we were already hearing about shortages in Japan last winter, I think it's a safe bet that Nintendo has been very careful about how many Wii U units they produce for a while now. This is why I don't think any potential lost Wii U sales will factor into their timing of an NX announcement in the slightest. They accepted the fact that the Wii U is going to sell very, very poorly from here on out a while ago.

That's why waiting until after the holidays to have a reveal makes no sense. If you're not giving the market a chance to consider your console they'll just spend their money on the PS4 or Xbox bundles during the holidays and won't even bother buying something new 3 months later. Awareness needs to be there much earlier.


Also, announcing the NX will in no way cannibalize the sales of the NES Mini.

Yeah, a two month turnaround from reveal to launch might be considered a bold but possibly worthwhile strategy if they were planning to release the console in October or November (although it still seems dubious to me considering Nintendo's current position in the market). If they plan to release the console in March, this sort of strategy seems untenable.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 11, 2016, 04:00:45 PM
The most important thing for the NX isn't the actual launch but the post launch. They can't have periods of over 3 months with nothing again or else all hype will be fucked no matter how amazing Zelda is.
Yeah, that's definitely true. I think due to its generally low sales, people tend to forget that the Wii U actually did perform well at launch, putting up good numbers for sales and pre-orders. It was everything after that where it fell off a cliff.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 11, 2016, 05:56:33 PM
So, I only recently got and started playing Super Mario 3d World.

The game is fun.

If I were thinking of a mobile and console way to play the game. What if the  console version of the game was the regular levels and the mobile version of the game was the Captain Toad levels?

Smash bros is another example. You play the single player at home, or you could play multiplayer on the handheld or at home.

Maybe the handheld system is basically another system, but your games library is combined, and depending if your out and about you get a different experience.

In game development this really only works for Nintendo who already does this, but it has the added benefit of gamers who have a more focused Nintendo and a more flexible library.

My biggest question though is "How much is this thing going to cost?", and "even if its the best thing since sliced bread, will the public perceive it that way?"

The Wii U has some convenience advantages over PS4 and Xbox One, but nobody seems to care.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 12, 2016, 10:31:02 AM
I want something that can only be experienced with the NX. Even the GameCube had graphics that were pretty much only found on GameCube. Super Mario Sunshine had that water! Loved that water! Wind Waker was cel shaded and had that vast ocean. That ocean was vast. Too much water! Metroid Prime boasted amazing graphics. F-Zero too. As well as Resident Evil. GameCube really was an unparalleled experience. It wasn't cheap hardware. It had potential waiting to be realized. And it was the system with faster load times.


Come on, that's pure nostalgia BS.  There were Xbox games that graphically matched and surpassed all the games you mentioned here.  Seriously, the Gamecube was a powerful machine for the price it was but it was by no means this beast the other consoles of that gen were striving to match.

And yes Breath of the Wild is a technically masterpiece no matter what you try to spin.  Find me an open world game on any system right now that's the sizes of this game with the kind of engaging fast gameplay that Zelda provides with the kind of physics engine this game has and isn't a complete buggy mess.  If you're going to consider games like Mario Sunshine (which outside of the water was terrible graphically) as a technical masterpiece just because it did something the other systems at the time weren't doing, (even though the original Xbox easily could have), Breath of the Wild fits the exact definition of what your saying Nintendo should make since it's doing something technically that no other system or dev has done so far, even on more powerful hardware.


I consider it an "unparalleled experience" because of the quality of the software, but the hardware had its advantages over its competitors (which led to the really good software). The competition was definitely striving to match the GameCube (for reference, see Okami), and Nintendo was also striving to match the others (see remakes: Metal Gear Solid, Resident Evil). I think you guys maybe took my statement to mean GameCube was leading in graphics when all I'm saying is that Nintendo offered a very comparable box that had advantages and some major quirks (24 MB of RAM vs 32 MB of RAM, limited game save storage).


The reason I chose the GameCube as a reference is because that's the last time Nintendo offered the same quality as its competitors. This NX might be the berth of a brand new gaming platform, but for the price tag I sincerely hope they find a way to offer the same potential that their competitors offer for home gaming.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 12, 2016, 12:28:58 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on October 12, 2016, 12:44:48 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",


Legend of NX: Breath of a Console
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 13, 2016, 10:55:47 AM
Someone at Wikileaks needs to hack Nintendo asap.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 13, 2016, 04:23:14 PM
Someone at Wikileaks the Kremlin needs to hack Nintendo asap.
FTFY
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 13, 2016, 04:53:28 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

EDIT: Here's a brief history of this thread's title changes:
- NX and third parties - June 2015
- NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (July 2016 Release? $150? Third Parties?) - July 2015
- (Unprecedented partnership with Square Enix?) - August - September 2015
- (CONFIRMED:You can't WII your game on it.) - September - October 2015
- (Only the best industry-leading [potato] chips!) - October 2015 - January 2016
- (Your guess is as good as mine EDITION) - January 2016
- (The rumor well is drying up! EDITION) - February - March 2016
- (CSI:Sweden Zoom and Enhance! EDITION) - March 2016
- (#TeamButtons Wins Again!) - April 2016
- (#Team2017 Wins Again!) - April - August 2016
- (Team. Buttons. For. Life.) - only NickMitch used this one, BOOOOOOO
- (New Splatfest! AMD vs NVDIA) - August 2016
- NeoGaf Repost Thread (May also contain NX rumors) - August 2016
- NX hot scoops straight from Google! - August 2016
- Back to NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Calm before the storm? Edition) - September 2016
- (Foxconn "Leaks" Edition) - September - October 2016
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 13, 2016, 06:18:46 PM
https://www.google.com/amp/seekingalpha.com/amp/news/3213925-expecting-nx-console-disappointment-macquarie-cuts-nintendo-neutral

Next week?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 13, 2016, 07:09:07 PM
(The rumor well is drying up! EDITION) - February - March 2016

As true today as when it was first created.

https://www.google.com/amp/seekingalpha.com/amp/news/3213925-expecting-nx-console-disappointment-macquarie-cuts-nintendo-neutral

Next week?

I've been saving the date of Oct. 20 for just this occasion.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Lemonade on October 13, 2016, 07:28:26 PM
Next week would be just before the investor meeting, so, it does make sense.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 17, 2016, 10:42:14 AM
Let's ditch all the stupid hardware talk and get to the really good stuff: exclusive games that will make other gamers very salty.

http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/10/rumour_new_beyond_good_and_evil_title_set_to_be_a_semi-reboot_and_nx_exclusive (http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/10/rumour_new_beyond_good_and_evil_title_set_to_be_a_semi-reboot_and_nx_exclusive)

Quote
Dale also states that she's been informed by another source that [BG&E2] is indeed an NX exclusive, and will have a CG trailer to be shown as part of the system's reveal (whenever that will be). The target release window is apparently Summer 2018.

I want this to happen because I love chaos. I want incessant port begging that will make Bayonetta 2 port-begging look tame by comparison.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 17, 2016, 11:29:04 AM
Do we have a thread of rumored or confirmed games, exclusive or otherwise for the NX yet?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: nickmitch on October 17, 2016, 12:51:24 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.


Quote
- (Team. Buttons. For. Life.) - only NickMitch used this one, BOOOOOOO

Boo yourself. #TeamButtons
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: lolmonade on October 17, 2016, 01:43:49 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.



Boo to you, too.  And it's Kudos.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: ThePerm on October 17, 2016, 01:55:53 PM
I speculate NX will have full Unreal 4 and unity support.
This is similar to what it could look like






I always liked these fan demos.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 17, 2016, 02:41:02 PM
There are sources multiple saying there's going to be a digital event on the 21st for the NX, Also people are speculating on a tweet from AMD about consoles using AMD the usual line of suspects and a tag line MARCHing into battle.

People are speculating that this ties into the NX unveiling this week.

Time will tell :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Minsc on October 17, 2016, 08:12:30 PM
I find living my life and not checking much anything video gaming is working wonders.  Being glued to the internet and a Nintendo fan must be painful.

Don't see myself buying the NX (or any console) but I am curious as to what the Big N will ship out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 17, 2016, 09:21:01 PM
I find living my life and not checking much anything video gaming is working wonders.  Being glued to the internet and a Nintendo fan must be painful.

Don't see myself buying the NX (or any console) but I am curious as to what the Big N will ship out.

Get "N" or get "Out" :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Enner on October 17, 2016, 10:01:29 PM
During last week (10/10 - 10/16), Jeff Gerstmann from Giant Bomb was away from that week's Bombcast on assignment. Peter Brown from Gamespot appeared on the 8-4 Play podcast, which is based in Japan. It seemed very odd for Jeff to be on assignment given this time of the year is review season rather than preview season. Giant Bomb doesn't regularly attend non-major publisher events. The possibility of Jeff going to a Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare review event is moderate, but I believe he would rather wait to have the full game in the comfort of his home or work. Then we have Peter Brown being in Japan when nothing is really happening in the Japanese video game industry on the surface. Peter Brown is the head reviews editor of Gamespot, so taking a (short) vacation during review season seems ill-advised.

That was a long paragraph explaining how I jokingly thought to myself, "Is it the NX? Are they there for the NX? Are they getting videos and photos and interview time and hands-on time and...."

And now we're here on 10/17/2016 when there are strong rumors that the NX reveal is nigh.

Ahhh... now I'm finally in the crazy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: nickmitch on October 17, 2016, 10:02:26 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.



Boo to you, too.  And it's Kudos.

Damn.  You're right. :(

It looks like everyone on Twitter thinks this is the week. I really just need to know now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 17, 2016, 10:40:00 PM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.



Boo to you, too.  And it's Kudos.

Damn.  You're right. :(

It looks like everyone on Twitter thinks this is the week. I really just need to know now.

All sources indicate this Thursday or Friday being the day of reckoning!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 17, 2016, 11:38:17 PM
During last week (10/10 - 10/16), Jeff Gerstmann from Giant Bomb was away from that week's Bombcast on assignment. Peter Brown from Gamespot appeared on the 8-4 Play podcast, which is based in Japan. It seemed very odd for Jeff to be on assignment given this time of the year is review season rather than preview season. Giant Bomb doesn't regularly attend non-major publisher events. The possibility of Jeff going to a Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare review event is moderate, but I believe he would rather wait to have the full game in the comfort of his home or work. Then we have Peter Brown being in Japan when nothing is really happening in the Japanese video game industry on the surface. Peter Brown is the head reviews editor of Gamespot, so taking a (short) vacation during review season seems ill-advised.

That was a long paragraph explaining how I jokingly thought to myself, "Is it the NX? Are they there for the NX? Are they getting videos and photos and interview time and hands-on time and...."

And now we're here on 10/17/2016 when there are strong rumors that the NX reveal is nigh.

Ahhh... now I'm finally in the crazy.

Hmmm... Somebody check the whereabouts of IGN Nintendo team. probably Peer Schneider or Brian Altano?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 17, 2016, 11:45:34 PM
During last week (10/10 - 10/16), Jeff Gerstmann from Giant Bomb was away from that week's Bombcast on assignment. Peter Brown from Gamespot appeared on the 8-4 Play podcast, which is based in Japan. It seemed very odd for Jeff to be on assignment given this time of the year is review season rather than preview season. Giant Bomb doesn't regularly attend non-major publisher events. The possibility of Jeff going to a Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare review event is moderate, but I believe he would rather wait to have the full game in the comfort of his home or work. Then we have Peter Brown being in Japan when nothing is really happening in the Japanese video game industry on the surface. Peter Brown is the head reviews editor of Gamespot, so taking a (short) vacation during review season seems ill-advised.

That was a long paragraph explaining how I jokingly thought to myself, "Is it the NX? Are they there for the NX? Are they getting videos and photos and interview time and hands-on time and...."

And now we're here on 10/17/2016 when there are strong rumors that the NX reveal is nigh.

Ahhh... now I'm finally in the crazy.

Hmmm... Somebody check the whereabouts of IGN Nintendo team. probably Peer Schneider or Brian Altano?


I mean, this all makes infinitely more sense than a random word in a trailer.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 17, 2016, 11:58:05 PM
During last week (10/10 - 10/16), Jeff Gerstmann from Giant Bomb was away from that week's Bombcast on assignment. Peter Brown from Gamespot appeared on the 8-4 Play podcast, which is based in Japan. It seemed very odd for Jeff to be on assignment given this time of the year is review season rather than preview season. Giant Bomb doesn't regularly attend non-major publisher events. The possibility of Jeff going to a Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare review event is moderate, but I believe he would rather wait to have the full game in the comfort of his home or work. Then we have Peter Brown being in Japan when nothing is really happening in the Japanese video game industry on the surface. Peter Brown is the head reviews editor of Gamespot, so taking a (short) vacation during review season seems ill-advised.

That was a long paragraph explaining how I jokingly thought to myself, "Is it the NX? Are they there for the NX? Are they getting videos and photos and interview time and hands-on time and...."

And now we're here on 10/17/2016 when there are strong rumors that the NX reveal is nigh.

Ahhh... now I'm finally in the crazy.

Hmmm... Somebody check the whereabouts of IGN Nintendo team. probably Peer Schneider or Brian Altano?


I mean, this all "almost" makes infinitely more sense than a random word in a trailer.
"fixed" :p
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 18, 2016, 01:25:46 AM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.



Boo to you, too.  And it's Kudos.

Damn.  You're right. :(

It looks like everyone on Twitter thinks this is the week. I really just need to know now.

All sources indicate this Thursday or Friday being the day of reckoning!

This week I'm out of town on business and will have no time to surf the net for Nintendo news.  So this is totally going to be when they finally reveal this thing.  Nothing would fit the typical pattern of my life then for me to go through months of nothing only to miss when something real is actually  revealed.  This might as well be a lock.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 18, 2016, 07:45:46 AM
This thread needs a new title.  I'd like to suggest either "Baseless Speculation Edition" or "Legend of NX: Lack of Information",

Legend of NX: Breath of a Console

We can always do better.

And better we did.  Cudos.



Boo to you, too.  And it's Kudos.

Damn.  You're right. :(

It looks like everyone on Twitter thinks this is the week. I really just need to know now.

All sources indicate this Thursday or Friday being the day of reckoning!

This week I'm out of town on business and will have no time to surf the net for Nintendo news.  So this is totally going to be when they finally reveal this thing.  Nothing would fit the typical pattern of my life then for me to go through months of nothing only to miss when something real is actually  revealed.  This might as well be a lock.

We'll keep you briefed :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Minsc on October 18, 2016, 08:03:25 AM
Get "N" or get "Out" :p


Oh when the time comes I'll Get N (to the hype).

Your username takes me back to simpler times.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 18, 2016, 08:17:40 AM
Get "N" or get "Out" :p


Oh when the time comes I'll Get N (to the hype).

Your username takes me back to simpler times.

Wasn't THAT long ago lol :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 18, 2016, 08:19:11 AM
Happy has Posted this imaged on his Twitter
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 18, 2016, 08:20:28 AM
Evidence is showing I was right, AMD is the manufacturer powering the NX home console :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: lolmonade on October 18, 2016, 10:29:13 AM
Happy has Posted this imaged on his Twitter


This is evidence of Hitman possibly being ported to NX?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 18, 2016, 11:04:53 AM
I guess that would be a good game to get.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 18, 2016, 11:28:32 AM
Or you know, they're referencing the Wii U. Which is Nintendo's latest console.

EDIT: Hell, they're referencing both the Wii and Wii U with those numbers.


EDIT 2: Sorry, my post makes no sense in part because MG keeps posting stuff without any proper context. In the AMD video people keep talking about you see the following text:


"AMD powers the world's leading game consoles (...) in more than 227 million homes around the world (1).


That (1) refers to the (1) from the image MG posted earlier which means "Based on publicly available data from Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo as of 9/15/2015" which means AMD is referencing sales numbers from this generation and the previous one (sans PS3 I assume).


The whole "marching into battle" thing just makes reference to the images of Hitman we see over the rest of the trailer. It's rather curious for AMD to release a trailer at this moment. If it's true that NX is being unveiled this week why do you release a trailer without it just a few days before? That is, if AMD is even powering the NX at all.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 18, 2016, 02:29:01 PM
Or you know, they're referencing the Wii U. Which is Nintendo's latest console.

EDIT: Hell, they're referencing both the Wii and Wii U with those numbers.


EDIT 2: Sorry, my post makes no sense in part because MG keeps posting stuff without any proper context. In the AMD video people keep talking about you see the following text:


"AMD powers the world's leading game consoles (...) in more than 227 million homes around the world (1).


That (1) refers to the (1) from the image MG posted earlier which means "Based on publicly available data from Microsoft, Sony and Nintendo as of 9/15/2015" which means AMD is referencing sales numbers from this generation and the previous one (sans PS3 I assume).


The whole "marching into battle" thing just makes reference to the images of Hitman we see over the rest of the trailer. It's rather curious for AMD to release a trailer at this moment. If it's true that NX is being unveiled this week why do you release a trailer without it just a few days before? That is, if AMD is even powering the NX at all.

We will see my young grasshopper :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 18, 2016, 03:55:36 PM
Latest rumors I read suggest a price as low as $249 and as high as $349, if it's over 300 count me out this time. I will wait on a price drop I got burned on Wii U and I really wish I hadn't gotten in so early. Both times I came into a Nintendo console this early I felt cheated. I mean unless it is something really amazing and has plenty of games at a steady stream then maybe.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Adrock on October 18, 2016, 05:12:14 PM
Latest rumors I read suggest a price as low as $249 and as high as $349, if it's over 300 count me out this time. I will wait on a price drop I got burned on Wii U and I really wish I hadn't gotten in so early. Both times I came into a Nintendo console this early I felt cheated. I mean unless it is something really amazing and has plenty of games at a steady stream then maybe.
I want to say I'd do that, but I'm going to buckle like a belt. There was no real reason for me to buy a Wii U at launch. One happy accident happened though. I probably would not have played Zombi U had I not been there so early.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 18, 2016, 05:35:07 PM
Since I can get Breath of the Wild on the Wii U, I will almost certainly wait and see on an NX purchase, particularly since the rumours don't suggest that the NX version will have a significant advantage, if any at all.  Nintendo will need an additional killer app to attract me.  $350 is pretty high.  $250 is quite reasonable.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 18, 2016, 06:12:09 PM
No regrets here about a day 1 Wii U purchase. I have loved progressing through all of the iterations etc. as they happened and, I dunno, just being part of it. The pros of early adoption outweigh the cons for me when it comes to Nintendo. I'm along for the ride.
In contrast I have yet to upgrade from PS3 to PS4. I haven't felt compelled yet for various reasons. But the recent announcement of Red Dead Redemption 2 will push me to upgrade for sure.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on October 18, 2016, 10:08:14 PM
I honestly don't understand why anyone is seeminlgy rooting for AMD to be powering the NX when Nvidia makes far superior products.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: nickmitch on October 18, 2016, 10:46:39 PM
I honestly don't understand why anyone is seeminlgy rooting for AMD to be powering the NX when Nvidia makes far superior products.

You've obviously never felt the thrill of being right on the internet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 18, 2016, 10:48:47 PM
I honestly don't understand why anyone gives a **** about the chips inside these things in the first place. It'll have a target spec and the games will look how they look, the guts don't really matter. It's not like Nintendo flipped a coin at some point over which chip to go with and that drastically affected the graphical fidelity of the system. Especially given the portability focus that is all but confirmed.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Adrock on October 18, 2016, 11:02:43 PM
As far as this thread, I'm fairly certain only one person gives a **** about which company is providing Nintendo chips. For everyone else, it's more an occasional conversation piece while we're hella thirsty for any kind of NX news. Otherwise:
(http://i.imgur.com/ezjqf1u.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 18, 2016, 11:18:50 PM
https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/788561182432956416
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 19, 2016, 12:11:54 AM
Huh, Emily Rogers opened up her twitter for the public.

Speaking of Twitter, Some guy named Neal Ronaghan says he heard NX news is this week. He's probably just another troll.
https://twitter.com/nron10/status/78819381243904409
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 12:12:35 AM
Personally I have never cared much for specs, I want games if specs are so low or so different it keeps games off the system then that is a bad thing, if the specs are comparable r adequate and developers can make good use of it and want to make games for it that sell good enough to keep making games, then good.

I have no regrets owning a Wii U. I regret buying a Wii U. The damn thing was over priced then, it is criminally price gauging now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 19, 2016, 01:38:00 AM
As far as this thread, I'm fairly certain only one person gives a **** about which company is providing Nintendo chips.

(http://i.imgur.com/VS1zPpl.jpg)

HAHAHA FIGHT!!!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 19, 2016, 02:48:38 AM
Go banana!

(http://images.memes.com/meme/310937)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: ThePerm on October 19, 2016, 04:32:27 AM
https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/smachteam/smach-z-the-handheld-gaming-pc

This got announced today. It's funny. I'm pretty sure all the people fawning over this probably pissed all over the Wii U on a message board at some point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 10:51:13 AM
Go banana!

(http://images.memes.com/meme/310937)

The banana represents Nintendo. :)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 11:43:46 AM
Forget who makes the CPU, I want to know how many colors does it display compared to it's competition and does it have Blast Processing or not.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 11:58:35 AM
I was willing to play along with this and have it be fun and games, but it stopped the moment people started holding every reporter to this unrealistic expectation of accuracy. That their entire reputation and career hinged on whether or not they got this right and how dare you report this version of a console I don't like. That an entire YouTube and Twitter subculture sprang up and it got to the point they were trolling Zelda Williams. I didn't hate Nintendo for taking their time to announce NX but I now resent them for allowing this cesspool to keep growing to the point where no person reporting on Nintendo news is safe from an unwarranted attack. **** that.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 12:13:45 PM
I was willing to play along with this and have it be fun and games, but it stopped the moment people started holding every reporter to this unrealistic expectation of accuracy. That their entire reputation and career hinged on whether or not they got this right and how dare you report this version of a console I don't like. That an entire YouTube and Twitter subculture sprang up and it got to the point they were trolling Zelda Williams. I didn't hate Nintendo for taking their time to announce NX but I now resent them for allowing this cesspool to keep growing to the point where no person reporting on Nintendo news is safe from an unwarranted attack. **** that.


Those reporters deserve every ounce of scrutiny, though. Believe that. Don't report rumors as facts, plain and simple. He should not represent his rumors as invalidating her rumors, and her rumors shouldn't be her justification for invalidating his rumors. So on and so forth. These people are total amateurs.


When I did work as a journalist covering Nintendo, we were careful never to present anything as news if it didn't come from the lips of someone willing to print their name as the source.


It's a cesspool, but they created it for themselves. It's about getting the early scoop. It's about being the source for everyone else's news. It's about printing stories to attract a lot of attention in a time with very sparse details. Worst of all, it's very little to do with actually reporting news.


On the topic of the NX, if it's the way Emily Rogers describes it (ie. "good for Nintendo games", "Japanese 3rd party support", "Not much Western support") then my interest is nil. They will have to work extra hard to sell me another Wii U.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 12:17:04 PM
I was willing to play along with this and have it be fun and games, but it stopped the moment people started holding every reporter to this unrealistic expectation of accuracy. That their entire reputation and career hinged on whether or not they got this right and how dare you report this version of a console I don't like. That an entire YouTube and Twitter subculture sprang up and it got to the point they were trolling Zelda Williams. I didn't hate Nintendo for taking their time to announce NX but I now resent them for allowing this cesspool to keep growing to the point where no person reporting on Nintendo news is safe from an unwarranted attack. **** that.

Soren, I work in the real news media, have worked in television, radio, print, web, it's not exclusive to Nintendo, the entire country has this perception that people in the media are either supposed to be flawless and get it right every time or they are incredibly biased and can't be trusted. It's best to just roll your eyes at the nuts and move on. Trust me I get enough of that myself nobody takes anyone seriously if they don't fit some imaginary mold that nobody can ever fit into.

I feel your pain and it sucks but take a deep breath and look the other way, this entire election has turned the entire country into a screaming gob of nuts who all think everyone on the other side is a monster. Especially those of us in the media.And to prove my point see above comment posted while I was typing this. Bravo.

Um Agent X everyone has been careful up to now to say RUMOR in every story I have read. Is anyone really going on record as their source is LEGIT and all others are fake? Not the readers mind you I mean the journalists. Also not everyone with a Twitter is a journalist.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 12:21:42 PM
I was willing to play along with this and have it be fun and games, but it stopped the moment people started holding every reporter to this unrealistic expectation of accuracy. That their entire reputation and career hinged on whether or not they got this right and how dare you report this version of a console I don't like. That an entire YouTube and Twitter subculture sprang up and it got to the point they were trolling Zelda Williams. I didn't hate Nintendo for taking their time to announce NX but I now resent them for allowing this cesspool to keep growing to the point where no person reporting on Nintendo news is safe from an unwarranted attack. **** that.

Soren, I work in the real news media, have worked in television, radio, print, web, it's not exclusive to Nintendo, the entire country has this perception that people in the media are either supposed to be flawless and get it right every time or they are incredibly biased and can't be trusted. It's best to just roll your eyes at the nuts and move on. Trust me I get enough of that myself nobody takes anyone seriously if they don't fit some imaginary mold that nobody can ever fit into.

I feel your pain and it sucks but take a deep breath and look the other way, this entire election has turned the entire country into a screaming gob of nuts who all think everyone on the other side is a monster. Especially those of us in the media.And to prove my point see above comment posted while I was typing this. Bravo.


Dude, you work in the media. Journalists are incredibly biased. Employers do force their reporters to only report what they want. I have every reason to approach every piece of news with high skepticism. Your source is very important to me, and those who have the best sources have the highest credibility. Report to me something that is false and your reputation ought to take a big hit. Getting it wrong is as good as spreading a lie. Why do those in the media not comprehend this anymore?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 12:28:33 PM
I was willing to play along with this and have it be fun and games, but it stopped the moment people started holding every reporter to this unrealistic expectation of accuracy. That their entire reputation and career hinged on whether or not they got this right and how dare you report this version of a console I don't like. That an entire YouTube and Twitter subculture sprang up and it got to the point they were trolling Zelda Williams. I didn't hate Nintendo for taking their time to announce NX but I now resent them for allowing this cesspool to keep growing to the point where no person reporting on Nintendo news is safe from an unwarranted attack. **** that.

Soren, I work in the real news media, have worked in television, radio, print, web, it's not exclusive to Nintendo, the entire country has this perception that people in the media are either supposed to be flawless and get it right every time or they are incredibly biased and can't be trusted. It's best to just roll your eyes at the nuts and move on. Trust me I get enough of that myself nobody takes anyone seriously if they don't fit some imaginary mold that nobody can ever fit into.

I feel your pain and it sucks but take a deep breath and look the other way, this entire election has turned the entire country into a screaming gob of nuts who all think everyone on the other side is a monster. Especially those of us in the media.And to prove my point see above comment posted while I was typing this. Bravo.

Um Agent X everyone has been careful up to now to say RUMOR in every story I have read. Is anyone really going on record as their source is LEGIT and all others are fake? Not the readers mind you I mean the journalists. Also not everyone with a Twitter is a journalist.


I'm working off the assumption that Soren is referring to Emily Rogers, Super Metal Dave 64, EGM, etc., because these are the main outlets everyone is generally talking about. In reference to those supposed journalists (and I do count anyone in the business of sharing information with a following of readers as a reporter or member of the media) I would say that they stake their reputation on what they publish. Even EGM is somewhat culpable for the way in which they have presented Emily Rogers' rumors. They did not, however, give equal coverage to competing leads.


If I totally misunderstood Soren, my apologies. This thread went quiet for a few days and then all of a sudden sprang to life. I thought I read all the new posts.


Still, I think the measure by which I grade journalists is fair. I'm not saying a reporter cannot redeem their credibility, but trust should be hard to come by.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: nickmitch on October 19, 2016, 12:36:37 PM
So, is it this week or not? Because we're running out of week here.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 12:43:12 PM
Your source is very important to me, and those who have the best sources have the highest credibility. Report to me something that is false and your reputation ought to take a big hit. Getting it wrong is as good as spreading a lie. Why do those in the media not comprehend this anymore?

Have fun not reading any news media because everyone has gotten something wrong at some point.

On the topic of the NX, if it's the way Emily Rogers describes it (ie. "good for Nintendo games", "Japanese 3rd party support", "Not much Western support") then my interest is nil. They will have to work extra hard to sell me another Wii U.

You just made my point for me. People are so scared of the idea of another Wii U that they were willing to trash and dismiss anyone who has the temerity to report on a hybrid console powered by NVIDIA, which they have unilaterally decided will be worse than a mythical AMD-powered console which may or may not reach PS4 levels of power.


So, is it this week or not? Because we're running out of week here.


Everyone thought it would be before the investor's meeting. Everyone knows nothing.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Adrock on October 19, 2016, 01:12:16 PM
Everyone knows nothing.
(http://i.imgur.com/Qjlezqi.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 01:18:10 PM
Quote
Employers do force their reporters to only report what they want.


This is false. In fact this is so far from false I don't know where you got it form. In my experience whenever we have something that is legit news to report we check our facts as best we can in the time we have, IF we make a mistake we correct it. I have not seen any journalist that doesn't admit they made a mistake.

But we are talking rumors. When someone is reporting RUMORS you can't with any sense of authority debunk them or dismiss them. All you can do is take them as rumors. If someone is reporting a rumor as fact, they are not being a good journalist. Vague comments about Japan will be on board, this thing is exciting, it's a game change, how is any of that hard facts that can be commented on as legit or not?

I might not be following this very closely and maybe video game journalist have a different standard or a different methodology I don't know I am not a gaming journalist just a news reporter. But I do know that every story I write has skeptics weather it came directly from the source or not. There was a drug bust recently, man was convicted we ran his mugshot and ONLY reported just the facts from the police reports, verified them with the chief and the judge. The persons mother and girl friend still called us and left comments on facebook that we reported it wrong and dragged a good mans name through the mud. Whatever people are always going to be skeptical there is nothing I can do about that. But I can safely say 100 percent that there is no media conspiracy there is no agenda and most media outlets, contrary to popular belief, are not in cohoots, they see each other as competition. But as our motto is in our news room, it is what it is, people will believe what they want regardless of facts.

But I assure you nobody has ever told me you have to cover that up or not report it, our discussion have never gone to that extreme. We ask ourselves is it local for our market, if it isn't we ask how we can localize it, if we can't do that we let the daily have it. They do the same thing when it comes to the metro and they do the same thing when it comes to the NYT, we all do that. There are stories that make my front page the TV station doesn't even pick up on. There are stories that make the top of the news that we have no interest in.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 19, 2016, 01:50:31 PM
I don't want to wade into the mess of media bias or corrupting forces, but I think there are certain things that give information tacit credibility.  In the case of "leaks," as we have seen in large amounts lately, there may be either identifying information (potentially withheld) or the inability of the company or people who have been exposed to directly deny it.  They can reimagine how we should interpret it, complain that the real problem is the people who revealed their documents, or simply say that the matter is still confidential.  What they can't do is deny it outright if there is information that will inevitably be confirmed as true, because they would add a lie to whatever other complaints people might have.  In the case of Nintendo, a leak of some aspect of their console wouldn't be directly denied.  The only reason they would comment at all is if it was giving them bad press over something that isn't true.  For example, a false leak of a nasty DRM policy.

The other sort of confirmation comes when we get information that all the big outlets know, but have been holding back to protect their relationship with Nintendo.  As soon as one person publishes it, the others nod quietly that this rumor is legitimate.  These are the rumors that tend to be true, and almost every major hardware reveal from any company is leaked in this way.  The hybrid theory falls into this category, which is why most people believe it.

What we've learned from leakers like Emily Rogers is that a single source without either of the above is nearly meaningless.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: lolmonade on October 19, 2016, 02:05:50 PM
Haven't been privy to any of the trolling from angry Nintendo fans, but that said, regardless of how you feel about the "mainstream media",  I'd suggest people to take anyone reporting on video games, especially unreleased product, with a HUGE grain of salt. 




It should be assumed that anything that's being reported about the NX is either 1) An approximation of what the final product will actually be from a legit source, 2) from a source that isn't reputable, or 3) clickbait that the scum websites post with just a conglomeration of all the things already individually reported on in order to get extra clicks.


Even this Friday's speculated announcement date is based simply on a financial trade source stating they'd EXPECT Nintendo to announce it before the investor call.  They also cited concern over the price being between $350-$400, yet there's more recently rumors the price will actually be $299.  All the more reason to stop getting wound up about it until news from the Horses' mouth (Nintendo) comes.  It's all just a giant tease until that point.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 02:28:56 PM
All valid points. What I was trying to say is there is separation from the person and the journalist, or there should be.

Let me phrase it this way. I work for a newspaper, I have an official Twitter where I post news as a representative of that newspaper. Anything I post or share on that Twitter is editorial, it belongs to the newspaper.

I have a personal Twitter that is me being a regular citizen, a human being with thoughts, opinions, and views that may or may not line up with my employer. When I am posting as me I stop being a journalist and become a regular nobody.

That is all I am saying. If a person is writing articles for a news site and on that site they say state a RUMOR as a fact that is bad journalism. If a journalist by day posts something rumor, true, false or otherwise, on their PERSONAL Twitter, they stopped being a journalist and that is in NO WAY grounds to judge their professional integrity.

I don't know who Emily Rogers even is, or what she has said. But I am saying that if she said it on her PERSONAL Twitter it was Emily Rogers the citizen not the journalist. If she posted it on a company owned Twitter as a representative of the company she said it as a journalist. Same goes for whomever else is being trashed here, I didn't keep up.

AS far as click bait articles on less than trust worthy news sites, not all media outlets are legit news. There is such a thing as sensational journalism, have you ever heard of The National Enquirer? I am sure there are websites that are the same as that, if the site is not trust worthy or is not legit news don't read that site.

I do think more people than should accept this fallacy there is such a thing as the "mainstream media" and that they are all conspiring together one way or another. Like all gaming journalists and outlets are out to get Nintendo or whatever.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: lolmonade on October 19, 2016, 02:45:14 PM

Nintendo skipping corporate strategy meeting for Q2 earnings (https://twitter.com/NinEverything/status/788741867282235392?lang=fr)


Just in case any of you were holding out hope for a reveal this week because of the investor meetings next week.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 02:46:37 PM
Quote
Employers do force their reporters to only report what they want.


This is false. In fact this is so far from false I don't know where you got it form. In my experience whenever we have something that is legit news to report we check our facts as best we can in the time we have, IF we make a mistake we correct it. I have not seen any journalist that doesn't admit they made a mistake.

But we are talking rumors. When someone is reporting RUMORS you can't with any sense of authority debunk them or dismiss them. All you can do is take them as rumors. If someone is reporting a rumor as fact, they are not being a good journalist. Vague comments about Japan will be on board, this thing is exciting, it's a game change, how is any of that hard facts that can be commented on as legit or not?

I might not be following this very closely and maybe video game journalist have a different standard or a different methodology I don't know I am not a gaming journalist just a news reporter. But I do know that every story I write has skeptics weather it came directly from the source or not. There was a drug bust recently, man was convicted we ran his mugshot and ONLY reported just the facts from the police reports, verified them with the chief and the judge. The persons mother and girl friend still called us and left comments on facebook that we reported it wrong and dragged a good mans name through the mud. Whatever people are always going to be skeptical there is nothing I can do about that. But I can safely say 100 percent that there is no media conspiracy there is no agenda and most media outlets, contrary to popular belief, are not in cohoots, they see each other as competition. But as our motto is in our news room, it is what it is, people will believe what they want regardless of facts.

But I assure you nobody has ever told me you have to cover that up or not report it, our discussion have never gone to that extreme. We ask ourselves is it local for our market, if it isn't we ask how we can localize it, if we can't do that we let the daily have it. They do the same thing when it comes to the metro and they do the same thing when it comes to the NYT, we all do that. There are stories that make my front page the TV station doesn't even pick up on. There are stories that make the top of the news that we have no interest in.


Okay, that statement made by me was a bit of a reach. The company I am thinking of is the NY Times, who you may recall was in a very messy situation for stealth editing their Bernie Sanders articles (search results (https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=New+York+Times+stealth+edits+Bernie+articles&pws=0)). They also landed in hot water over leaked emails that suggest the Hillary Clinton campaign has veto power over Hillary quotes they choose to publish (search results (https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#pws=0&q=New+York+Times+gave+Hillary+veto)).


That statement was a reach though. I won't drag further politics into the discussion.


Anyway, having read some of the tweets, Emily Rogers can preface the blog with "Rumor" but the person certainly comes across as "I've provided facts. My facts are right. Dave's are wrong." so it's a little hard for me to accept "take it with a grain of salt" on the blog post with all the specific details.


If this Emily Rogers is wrong, it certainly will damage trust.

BTW, just read your last post up above, and I can agree with that. Regarding Emily, I don't see it as being a personal twitter account, but that's me making an assumption. I figure it's an alias.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 19, 2016, 03:24:04 PM
I won't drag further politics into the discussion.

Please don't. This discussion has gotten borderline at points. And Nintendo. Please release the NX details and end the madness we are seeing begin to see develop.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 19, 2016, 03:59:31 PM
I won't drag further politics into the discussion.

Please don't. This discussion has gotten borderline at points. And Nintendo. Please release the NX details and end the madness we are seeing begin to see develop.


I second the motion. Give us the goods already!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 04:23:45 PM

Nintendo skipping corporate strategy meeting for Q2 earnings (https://twitter.com/NinEverything/status/788741867282235392?lang=fr)

Just in case any of you were holding out hope for a reveal this week because of the investor meetings next week.

Just to be clear the investor meeting will still happen, they just wont brief media/analysts afterwards. Which in a way makes sense if you're going to use the investor meeting to announce a later date when they'll reveal the NX.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 19, 2016, 04:45:56 PM
Kimishima is still apparently meeting with the press next week, so it may not be much different than the standard meeting from our perspective.  After such a long silence, any news will be nice.

Even if people are going into strange territory with all the NX speculation and the surrounding community of meta jokes, I am happy to see so many people excited about it.  With the Wii U, there was a general lack of interest.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Evan_B on October 19, 2016, 04:55:16 PM
I think you are all taking the release of the Nintendo Entertainment System Mini way too seriously. It's already been revealed, it's Nintendo's only new console.

If anything, you're all overly optimistic, thinking Nintendo would try to pick themselves up after THE WORST CONSOLE OF ALL TIME, AKA YOUR LORD AND SAVIOR THE NINTENDO WII U AKA HOW U WILL PLAY NEXT.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: supermario2k on October 19, 2016, 06:32:04 PM
If the NES Mini classic or whatever they call it is the last thing they make before they implode it's still better than how Sega, Atari, and Coleco all went out.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: King of Twitch on October 19, 2016, 08:32:50 PM
Quote
Nintendo of America ‏@NintendoAmerica  3 minutes ago
Be among the first to discover #NX. Watch the Preview Trailer at 7am PT/10am ET!

IT'S HAPPENING
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 08:38:27 PM
Oh my lord....


EDIT: The trailer will be 3 minutes long. So expect a bigger event in the future.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 19, 2016, 08:41:07 PM
I told you it would be this week! Don't be shock when I'm right :p But you can still be my friend!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Zelda Williams Twitter Watch 2016)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on October 19, 2016, 08:46:57 PM
SOUND THE ALARMS
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 08:57:17 PM
LOL, since I was beaten, here be more rumors. The floodgates are about to open.

EDIT: More stuff
Laura Kate Dale ‏@LaurakBuzz  1m1 minute ago
A big indie team who brought their game to New 3DS but not original 3DS (sorry on vague wording, not hard to work out) have an NX dev kit.

Laura Kate Dale @LaurakBuzz2 minutes ago
At least three devs are waiting for tomorrow's NX name reveal to announce NX software.

(http://i.imgur.com/UMxnvcV.png)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 19, 2016, 09:05:36 PM
lol Emily being right is the work of fiction, she has been more wrong than right in the past... This will be no different. Her Tegra dreams are about to bust in flames.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: King of Twitch on October 19, 2016, 09:10:05 PM
I wish I could be at the investor meeting. Businessmen bowing to me while I'm hitting everyone up for high-fives and asking if their body is ready. I'd be kicked out of the country in about 10 minutes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Oedo on October 19, 2016, 09:14:53 PM
I'm trying to form coherent thoughts, but it mostly just keeps going back to near uninhibited excitement right now. Thanks Soren, and to anyone else that tracks down the information that's going to spring up over the rest of the night.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 09:16:16 PM
Going scorched earth right now.

Laura Kate Dale ‏@LaurakBuzz  1m1 minute ago
Tomorrows 3 min trailer will confirm the NX use of cartridges.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Adrock on October 19, 2016, 09:21:18 PM
LOL, since I was beaten, here be more rumors. The floodgates are about to open.

EDIT: More stuff
Laura Kate Dale ‏@LaurakBuzz  1m1 minute ago
A big indie team who brought their game to New 3DS but not original 3DS (sorry on vague wording, not hard to work out) have an NX dev kit.

Laura Kate Dale @LaurakBuzz2 minutes ago
At least three devs are waiting for tomorrow's NX name reveal to announce NX software.

(http://i.imgur.com/UMxnvcV.png)
SuperMetalDave64 is going to **** himself.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 09:24:55 PM
www.nintendo.com (http://www.nintendo.com)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvLH-fdWIAAkcZI.jpg)

EDIT: Guys I'm sorry this hype train has taken off and there's no way to stop it!!!!

(http://i.imgur.com/Ws38Hyj.png)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: Dasmos on October 19, 2016, 09:38:09 PM
LOL, since I was beaten, here be more rumors. The floodgates are about to open.

EDIT: More stuff
Laura Kate Dale ‏@LaurakBuzz  1m1 minute ago
A big indie team who brought their game to New 3DS but not original 3DS (sorry on vague wording, not hard to work out) have an NX dev kit.

Laura Kate Dale @LaurakBuzz2 minutes ago
At least three devs are waiting for tomorrow's NX name reveal to announce NX software.

(http://i.imgur.com/UMxnvcV.png)
SuperMetalDave64 is going to **** himself.
What about MysticGohan? How will he recover?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 09:44:55 PM
EDIT: This is most likely fake, but who cares the hype train is not stopping!!
 
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvJ259cXYAEMjCw.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: nickmitch on October 19, 2016, 09:54:51 PM
Those specs look close to what Emily Rodgers posted.

Also, "Promotional Unit"?! o_0
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 09:56:21 PM
It was a 10k NeoGaf leak and Emily has already suggested those specs are false.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ThePerm on October 19, 2016, 09:58:00 PM
If these are true then we're in good hands. Its Parker with 6GB. I'd have expected 8GB, but hey we aren't thinking in that Nintendo box to keep the price down. 6 GB seems like the price/power compromise that sounds realistic. That's less RAM then ps4, but if it's a cartridge based system it could dip in RAM a bit.  Also, the type of RAM is a faster RAM.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 19, 2016, 10:01:25 PM

I came home for this. Breaks over I'm back

Never heard of that ram before. Where are the leaked Emily's specs?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ThePerm on October 19, 2016, 10:07:26 PM
http://www.androidauthority.com/lpddr4-everything-need-know-599759/

I also wonder if there will be a Android Channel. If third parties don't want to be on NX, then they will be forced to be on NX via proxy.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 19, 2016, 10:13:51 PM
NX everybody! NX!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Adrock on October 19, 2016, 10:18:45 PM
What about MysticGohan? How will he recover?
(http://i.imgur.com/TToWPqJ.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 19, 2016, 10:32:05 PM
What about MysticGohan? How will he recover?
(http://i.imgur.com/TToWPqJ.jpg)

It isn't over yet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 19, 2016, 10:33:47 PM
http://www.androidauthority.com/lpddr4-everything-need-know-599759/ (http://www.androidauthority.com/lpddr4-everything-need-know-599759/)

I also wonder if there will be a Android Channel. If third parties don't want to be on NX, then they will be forced to be on NX via proxy.


I've been gone long enough for Perm to change his avatar? It has truly been a long road.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 19, 2016, 10:38:30 PM
Fucking finally.

Checked NeoGaf, it's predictably a mess, but this has bubbled up from 4Chan:

(https://i.4cdn.org/v/1476927537715.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Minsc on October 19, 2016, 10:43:38 PM
The **** is about to hit the fan.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 10:45:11 PM
Thanks to our own James Jones: what can Nintendo show in 3 minutes?

Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Adrock on October 19, 2016, 10:50:12 PM
It isn't over yet.
(https://media.giphy.com/media/3o7TKL8WTane97Sy7C/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (reveal trailer @10amET, All hail Emily Rogers)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 19, 2016, 10:53:53 PM
Didn't wanna say... pffft.. sure I do... Somebody better pickup that phone, because I fuking called it!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 19, 2016, 10:55:26 PM
THIS IS HOW MYSTICGOHAN ROLLS MWHAHAHAHAHA
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ThePerm on October 19, 2016, 10:59:42 PM
Quote from: Satoru Iwata
should make us all feel young again....at least for a while
:'(
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Minsc on October 19, 2016, 11:05:29 PM
Quote from: Satoru Iwata
should make us all feel young again....at least for a while
:'(
I am feeling young right now.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Soren on October 19, 2016, 11:15:18 PM
THIS IS HOW MYSTICGOHAN ROLLS MWHAHAHAHAHA


(http://i2.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/010/506/figure1.jpg)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 19, 2016, 11:26:30 PM
LOL, since I was beaten, here be more rumors. The floodgates are about to open.

EDIT: More stuff
Laura Kate Dale ‏@LaurakBuzz  1m1 minute ago
A big indie team who brought their game to New 3DS but not original 3DS (sorry on vague wording, not hard to work out) have an NX dev kit.

Laura Kate Dale @LaurakBuzz2 minutes ago
At least three devs are waiting for tomorrow's NX name reveal to announce NX software.

(http://i.imgur.com/UMxnvcV.png)
SuperMetalDave64 is going to **** himself.

Or emily will have a stroke ;)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: ThePerm on October 20, 2016, 12:28:19 AM
That action figure hasn't shown up in a game yet has it?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: MysticGohan on October 20, 2016, 04:48:57 AM
That action figure hasn't shown up in a game yet has it?
It had not, also AMD has a press conference  today coincidence?  I think not
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Adrock on October 20, 2016, 10:04:45 AM
Nintendo Switch

Should we start a new thread?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 20, 2016, 10:10:55 AM
Haha, the rumors were one million percent correct. Pretty terrible name, but whatever.

So what all games were glimpsed?

Zelda, something that looked like an Elder Scrolls games, a new 3D Mario that looked a tad Sunshine-esque, a basketball game, Splatoon, Mario Kart
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 20, 2016, 10:15:14 AM
Wow.  BlackNMild's models were almost perfect. 

I think Nintendo might actually have a winner with this product.  Yes it will not be PS4 or Xbox1 powered...however it might not have to be.  What they showed was pretty cool.  It took the best elements of the Wii U and the best elements of the Wii.  And figured out a way to combine them and eliminate the gimmick when need be. 

The overall design seems fresh, and I will definitely look into this product.  I don't need or want another console but a console home system yes.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: lolmonade on October 20, 2016, 10:16:19 AM
They did a good job highlighting their intent with the console, and your ability to SWITCH between home and on the go, as well as SWITCH between different control options for games. 


While I didn't like it at first glance, I don't think the SWITCH is a bad console name, considering 1) What their recent naming decisions have been, and 2) how well it makes sense with the way they're apparently going to market the console.


Won't lie...the marketing approach and how easy it is to visualize how you can use the SWITCH?  Very reminiscent of how clear they made the Wii with the motion control seem.  Don't think it'll hit that level of mass Market, but DO think this has potential for Nintendo to get some real interest from more than just core Nintendo fans.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Lemonade on October 20, 2016, 10:17:07 AM
It  looks a lot like that mockup that was posted a while ago.

I cant say I like the switch name, but its better than Wii U.
The whole thing is basically Wii U attempt number 2.

Im slightly disappointed that the leaks were accurate, but I will buy one on day 1
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on October 20, 2016, 10:24:31 AM
So do I enforce the ban bet? (https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/)
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 10:26:50 AM
lol
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 20, 2016, 10:29:49 AM
Sorry AMD guy

https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 20, 2016, 10:29:53 AM
So do I enforce the ban bet? (https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/)
Nintendo has not announced its new home console powered by AMD.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 20, 2016, 10:32:34 AM
Glad everything got settled and once again, Nintendo is on top of the market.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Luigi Dude on October 20, 2016, 10:36:23 AM
So yep, it's a hybrid.  From a marketing standpoint, it's already off to a much better start then the Wii U which first reveal in 2011 made it look like just a new Wii controller.  Plus the actual hybrid nature of the system will make it much easier for Nintendo to advertise this time as well.  Plus if the games they showed in that little preview are just part of what we can expect in 2017, then the first year lineup is already looking lightyears better then the Wii U's.

As long as the price isn't too absurd, Nintendo looks to have a real winner here.  Iwata made sure his final gift to us would deliver. :'(
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 20, 2016, 10:39:30 AM
So it is a gaming tablet that has detachable controllers and hooks into your TV, um exactly what I was calling for. Thanks Nintendo. I think it's very close to the design Blacknmild also suggested so I am happy its what I wanted and it looks amazing.

Now can't wait to hear more about games.



Okay to be fair because Khush will surely dig up what I actually said, I didn't predict detachable controllers I suggested a gaming tablet with controls built in with TV out, so close enough but this is better than what I was hoping for so it's going to be great.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on October 20, 2016, 10:53:00 AM
Remember months ago when I said it would be an Nvidia Tegra chip? I now know the satisfaction of being right on the internet.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 10:56:12 AM
NVIDIA handling the API themselves is very reassuring.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 20, 2016, 11:01:52 AM
This will OWN Japan. Although it looks much weaker than an xbox one, it should still be fine for what Nintendo wants to do.


So it was a Sheikah Slate the whole time. I knew it!
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 20, 2016, 11:04:48 AM
NVIDIA handling the API themselves is very reassuring.
Hmm, I was under the impressed that Nintendo was going with Vulkan though I suppose it still can. Nvidia's handling this does go back to the Semi Accurate rumor from May which posited that Nvidia was giving Nintendo a ton of support just to get its business.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 11:06:45 AM
NVIDIA handling the API themselves is very reassuring.
Hmm, I was under the impressed that Nintendo was going with Vulkan though I suppose it still can. Nvidia's handling this does go back to the Semi Accurate rumor from May which posited that Nvidia was giving Nintendo a ton of support just to get its business.

Quote
NVIDIA additionally created new gaming APIs to fully harness this performance. The newest API, NVN, was built specifically to bring lightweight, fast gaming to the masses.
https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 20, 2016, 11:08:00 AM
Remember months ago when I said it would be an Nvidia Tegra chip? I now know the satisfaction of being right on the internet.

Drink it in, man. Drink. It. In.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 20, 2016, 11:10:37 AM
Quote
NVIDIA additionally created new gaming APIs to fully harness this performance. The newest API, NVN, was built specifically to bring lightweight, fast gaming to the masses.
https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/
I didn't need clarification. I already read Nvidia news thing. I was merely commenting on how Nintendo is a contributor of the Khronos Group that created Vulkan so I expected Nintendo to use that API.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 11:11:28 AM
I know, I was just trying to remember where I read it. No big deal

Two things we still don't know.

- Touch screen? (probably not, would have been shown)
- Region-free?
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on October 20, 2016, 11:14:03 AM
Leaning toward no touch screen and yes on region free, but trying to corroborate.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 20, 2016, 11:15:01 AM
Surely it has to be a touch screen. It would be crazy for it not to be.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 20, 2016, 11:15:13 AM
All good News!! :)

It would be awesome if the orientation could change on the screen, but certainly not a deal breaker, and I'm sure they haven't revealed everything yet (not that I think they are worried about the few occasions when vertical orientation would be useful), but I'm sure they have more pleasant surprises in the works.

I'm not blown away, but that's only because all the most reasonable rumors were actually mostly true/accurate.

And MG needs a new damning tag for his ATi bandwagon in the face of an Nvidia victory. Khush, make it a good one.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 20, 2016, 11:20:01 AM
Surely it has to be a touch screen. It would be crazy for it not to be.

Like I said, I'm sure Nintendo has more to reveal on this thing. This 3 minute video was a proof of design. The hybrid home and portable nature of the hardware, and how it's also not a solo experience.

Touch screen is a GIVEN, but I'm sure they'll get more into that when they reveal the OS, UI and accompanying software.

This is Nintendo guys, I'm sure they didn't blow their whole load in that quick proof of concept video.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 11:26:07 AM
I just think Nintendo was very careful to show everything that was possible with the Switch. I can't believe they couldn't sneak in a quick shot of someone using a stylus. Then again I'm not sure any of the games shown would have any meaningful touchscreen use.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 20, 2016, 11:30:07 AM
Now that it has been announced, I think they will go quiet again until late January. Then they will show all the features and slowly show the launch games.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 20, 2016, 11:31:55 AM
I'm thinking that this supports both touch screen and glasses free 3D. I'm anticipating a lot of 3DS/DS ports to help beef up the library, though.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 20, 2016, 11:32:44 AM
Oh snap! You can attach only one side and play Gameboy style and Arcade Shumps!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 20, 2016, 11:34:20 AM
Did the removable controllers have "shoulder" buttons?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 20, 2016, 11:36:48 AM
Did the removable controllers have "shoulder" buttons?


Looks like the standard bumpers and triggers.
(http://i.imgur.com/C8sYzF2.png)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 20, 2016, 11:39:12 AM
Did the removable controllers have "shoulder" buttons?


Yes!


I have a very HUGE problem with this.  If it is a home console that I can take with me. I am going to have to buy no less than 3 Switches.  What the heck are the kids going to play while I have the Switch with me during my commute to work? Like really. Unless this cost $199 out the box I'm screwed.


Maybe the Switch Dock has some functionality that supports different tablets un the same house. Not a deal breaker but I have a house full of gamer kids.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 20, 2016, 11:41:33 AM
BnM, I asked the samething.

If it doesn't have a touchscreen for at least IU navigation, that might be a problem. With Nintendo going into the mobile space, it seems obvious that this will have a touchscreen though. It's the only thing stopping them from porting over their own games.

Is anyone else as excited as I am for the return of cartridges?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 20, 2016, 11:43:06 AM
Are we ready to open betting on whether Nintendo will let this (http://www.aikun.co/index.php?ac=article&at=list&tid=114) be superior to the NS? It supports glasses free 3D, has an IPS display, and is a touch screen.
Title: Re: NX Rumors and Speculation Thread (Reveal Trailer 10/20/2016 10am ET)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 20, 2016, 11:48:24 AM
Fucking finally.

Checked NeoGaf, it's predictably a mess, but this has bubbled up from 4Chan:

(https://i.4cdn.org/v/1476927537715.jpg)




This is 100% real by the way
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 20, 2016, 11:49:45 AM
Did the removable controllers have "shoulder" buttons?


Looks like the standard bumpers and triggers.
(http://i.imgur.com/C8sYzF2.png)

I meant in sideways mode. Like multiplayer mode.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Nile Boogie Returns on October 20, 2016, 12:02:23 PM
I also wonder does this mean a patch for single player pro controller Wii U support  for Spaltoon? Looks like Splatoon Seitch as pro controller support.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 20, 2016, 12:14:32 PM
And MG needs a new damning tag for his ATi bandwagon in the face of an Nvidia victory. Khush, make it a good one.

Someone already changed his title last night. (But maybe I'll change that in a week.)

However, since I'm in a generous mood due to nailing the NX reveal date, I'd be willing to change your title. Anything you want or do you want to be surprised?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on October 20, 2016, 12:21:00 PM
Is anyone else as excited as I am for the return of cartridges?
Probably more so. I've been thumping the cartridge card for over a decade. It's so nice to see them return.

I'd be shocked if Switch didn't have a touchscreen. My guess is Nintendo wanted to focus on core games and the unit itself, and any touchscreen use in the trailer would immediately remind people of Wii U. Smart.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on October 20, 2016, 12:38:52 PM
Is anyone else as excited as I am for the return of cartridges?

I've loved that rumor and am glad to see it also came true. Maybe that's another part of why I've liked the DS and 3DS more than consoles of late. Being able to click in those little cartridges into their slot. Plus, cartridges are just more durable than CD / DVD's. I'm happy with the choice.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on October 20, 2016, 12:46:50 PM
edit: moved comment to new (hotness) Switch thread
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 20, 2016, 12:59:13 PM
It was an odd feeling to see nearly the exact thing that we've had in our heads for a couple years show up in the reveal... both exciting and underwhelming.  It is as sleek as I hoped it would be, if a bit bland looking.  Something we haven't yet seen are the goofy accessory controllers for different games.  The biggest surprise was Skyrim.

One disappointment is that the dock mostly hides the screen.  That implies that dual screen functionality like the Wii U won't be possible, unless they have some other way to do it.


Nile Boogie Returns, I don't understand the complaint.  If you want to have multiple people playing simultaneously, that has always meant buying multiple devices.  I guess you are concerned that the cost will be higher than current handhelds?  The 3DS started at $250.  If they go too much higher than that, they will likely kill the system before it launches anyway.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 20, 2016, 01:26:10 PM
Nile does bring up a good point, though. What will happen to Nintendo's handheld lines?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on October 20, 2016, 01:48:05 PM
Probably more so. I've been thumping the cartridge card for over a decade. It's so nice to see them return.
Yeah, I've always hated discs ever since the PS1 days, and was always glad the N64 stuck with cartridges despite the limitations at the time. I'm also glad to confirm the NX isn't going digital-only which I know was another small rumour, it was only a tiny concern of mine but still, nice to know it isn't happening.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 20, 2016, 02:16:26 PM
Nile does bring up a good point, though. What will happen to Nintendo's handheld lines?

Probably the same thing that happened to the Game Boy line when the DS arrived, unless the NS sells poorly.  In that case, there will likely be a 3DS successor in typical fashion.  Beginning next year, we are transitioning from the console+portable model to the hybrid+mobile model.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Minsc on October 20, 2016, 06:39:44 PM
Is anyone else as excited as I am for the return of cartridges?
Probably more so. I've been thumping the cartridge card for over a decade. It's so nice to see them return.

I'd be shocked if Switch didn't have a touchscreen. My guess is Nintendo wanted to focus on core games and the unit itself, and any touchscreen use in the trailer would immediately remind people of Wii U. Smart.

I don't see there having been any need to show off functionality.  It is not like touchscreens are anything new in this modern age of tablets. 

Nile does bring up a good point, though. What will happen to Nintendo's handheld lines?

Probably the same thing that happened to the Game Boy line when the DS arrived, unless the NS sells poorly.  In that case, there will likely be a 3DS successor in typical fashion.  Beginning next year, we are transitioning from the console+portable model to the hybrid+mobile model.
  The DS always was the third pillar. :)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 20, 2016, 11:18:02 PM
And MG needs a new damning tag for his ATi bandwagon in the face of an Nvidia victory. Khush, make it a good one.

Someone already changed his title last night. (But maybe I'll change that in a week.)

However, since I'm in a generous mood due to nailing the NX reveal date, I'd be willing to change your title. Anything you want or do you want to be surprised?

Give me something I'll love and I won't ask to Switch it ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on October 21, 2016, 03:46:14 PM
They never mentioned a touch screen, but the flushness of the display against the front strongly implies that it will have one, at least in my thinking.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 21, 2016, 03:55:22 PM
No touchscreen = no mario maker 2.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on October 21, 2016, 05:29:52 PM
Hmm, could they do a smartphone app that connects to the Switch via bluetooth for a 2nd touchable screen?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TOPHATANT123 on October 21, 2016, 07:10:10 PM
I don't think it needs a touch screen, you would only be able to use it when it was disconnected from the dock.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 21, 2016, 07:34:53 PM
It absolutely needs a touch screen.
One thing I liked about the Wii U was how good the web browser was and the ease of text input with the on screen keyboard.

How could they continue Miiverse without the drawing?

Nintendo would be insane to not make it a touch screen. Im sure they just want to focus on the new control style for now.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 22, 2016, 11:02:37 AM
According to Laura Kate Dale the Joy-Con triggers may be analog. Rejoice people.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Caterkiller on October 22, 2016, 08:35:13 PM
According to Laura Kate Dale the Joy-Con triggers may be analog. Rejoice people.

I remember watching BlackNMild tell Reggie to his face that the Wii U needs analog triggers. It may have been too late then but now maybe his efforts were not in vain...

I feel like this thing will without a doubt have a touch screen, it just has to happen. Though it's crazy to think that they didn't show anything of the sort during the trailer! Then you have Nintendo saying that there will be no Gamepad/Tv Wii U style play and wowzers my mind is blown. They really wanted to distance themselves from all that was the Wii brand. Well in this initial reveal anyway.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 22, 2016, 09:26:28 PM
According to Laura Kate Dale the Joy-Con triggers may be analog. Rejoice people.

I remember watching BlackNMild tell Reggie to his face that the Wii U needs analog triggers. It may have been too late then but now maybe his efforts were not in vain...

I was thinking about that too when I saw this news. The thought that my voice was ringing in Reggie's ears all these years... "Analog Triggers!!!". feelsgoodman.jpg

Quote
I feel like this thing will without a doubt have a touch screen, it just has to happen. Though it's crazy to think that they didn't show anything of the sort during the trailer! Then you have Nintendo saying that there will be no Gamepad/Tv Wii U style play and wowzers my mind is blown. They really wanted to distance themselves from all that was the Wii brand. Well in this initial reveal anyway.

There is absolutely NO WAY this doesn't have a touch screen. and where did you hear the bolded?
I don't exactly keep up with all the news nowadays. I'm hoping you can still swtich on the TV while holding the tablet portion. I can see why that might not happen, but if they did the Wii U wifi tech in reverse to the dock, it shouldn't be an issue.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 22, 2016, 10:32:39 PM
There is absolutely NO WAY this doesn't have a touch screen. and where did you hear the bolded?
I don't exactly keep up with all the news nowadays. I'm hoping you can still swtich on the TV while holding the tablet portion. I can see why that might not happen, but if they did the Wii U wifi tech in reverse to the dock, it shouldn't be an issue.

Nintendo has been touting the "Switch is a "single-screen experience" line since the reveal.

http://www.polygon.com/2016/10/21/13362890/nintendo-switch-not-dualscreen
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Caterkiller on October 23, 2016, 01:53:51 PM
Yeah apparently you can still do Off TV Play obviously but the dual set up with Star Fox, Nintendo Land and everything else that has gameplay on the tv and the 2nd screen at the same time is no more.

I liked those mini games like Nintendo Land's Lugii's Mansion, I liked Star Fox and I love item management and maps on the 2nd screen but most people could not give two shakes of a rat's apples.

Nintendo's games are going back to how things were pre double screened with far less touch involved. Well no touch while you are playing at home with the dock. I'm sure folks like Ian and Broodwars will welcome this with open arms. I'll be little upset if gyro isn't included in the pro controller for the Splatoons and Star Fox's of the future. The 2nd screen I could live without.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 23, 2016, 03:25:22 PM
is everyone ready for this? was this posted yet?

(https://cdn0.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/fTGmwTkN6_Z0TQ4wEgx11vSG3pY=/800x0/filters:no_upscale()/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_asset/file/7316369/nxmodconcept.jpg)

it was rumored that this is happening... and it could be really fun if they are cheap enough.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 23, 2016, 04:22:23 PM
That is actually a really great way to incorporate some of those more unique control setups of past consoles or Wii add-on dongles.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 23, 2016, 06:38:21 PM
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CvPCBHOVYAApVqv.png)

and immediately, it went from cool and sleek, to childrens toy again.
BUT, the base marketing will still be the New Cool and Sleek Nintendo, so I am ok with that.

the possibilities for controller add ons is crazy though, especially if it's not that expensive to make a single joy-con that can be bundled with certain games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 23, 2016, 06:47:08 PM
For those add-ons that are game specific, Nintendo would need better retail space to sell to people who prefer digital games.  This would also assume the add-ons are purely optional because traveling with all that plastic crap would be cumbersome.

That said, I would own way too many of these.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 23, 2016, 07:31:30 PM
Nintendo could offer them only on the Nintendo Webstore.  That way they don't dilute the message and image of the system.  Unless a game specially needs it.  Then Nintendo just partners with retail stores and make it exclusive to those retail stores, or
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 23, 2016, 07:40:15 PM
or maybe the games that are dependent on the use of a special joycon just won't be sold digitally?

or maybe the digital price includes the cost of the device and Nintendo automatically ships out to you in a deal with Amazon or something.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Wah on October 23, 2016, 08:18:07 PM
So with the ports, will they be free if you brought the wii u versions? Like you hook up your Nintendo account  and bam games? or are they going to be scummy and make you buy them again?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 23, 2016, 08:29:42 PM
But none of those controller mock-ups do anything that a normal controller can't do. They only exist to siphon more money from your wallet which, really? That's what we're going for here? Custom button-mapping makes way better sense that most of those add-ons.

The modular nature of the Joy-Con has me dreading this. I sincerely hope Nintendo is not designing games with unique controller add-ons in mind. The new Smash Bros does not need Gamecube style Joy-Con add-ons. It's bad enough I have to once again budget for another Pro-Controller. I am no longer the target demographic for stupid gimmick controllers.

Now if you'll excuse me, today was a cloudy day so I have to go outside and do some yelling.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 23, 2016, 09:14:09 PM
They can always be optional unless they truly bring something significantly different to the table.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: alegoicoe on October 23, 2016, 09:46:29 PM
Gamexplain just posted over at youtube a nice interview with one of the guys involved in the splatoon section of the reveal trailer, not much was said but it was cool hearing from someone who actually held the switch
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 24, 2016, 01:38:13 PM
More rumors from Laura Kate Dale

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/10/report-nintendo-switchs-right-joy-con-offers-ir-pointer-functionality/ (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/10/report-nintendo-switchs-right-joy-con-offers-ir-pointer-functionality/)

Quote
we believe the solution is that touch screen games will be playable on your TV by use of an IR pointer located in the bottom of the right Joy-Con.

Quote
Having spoken to sources within Ubisoft, we believe that games which support touch functionality on the handheld will use IR functionality to replicate that ability on the TV.
We believe the handheld, when docked, will switch on two small IR lights similar to the Wii Sensor Bar at the top of the handheld screen, peeking out above the top of the dock. The IR sensor in the right Joy-Con can then be used in much the same way as a Wii Remote pointer. This is designed to be used for touch screen replication, rather than the camera turning and aiming functions Wii Remotes were often used for.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on October 24, 2016, 01:42:33 PM
or maybe the games that are dependent on the use of a special joycon just won't be sold digitally?

or maybe the digital price includes the cost of the device and Nintendo automatically ships out to you in a deal with Amazon or something.

Nintendo is already committed to selling games both digitally and retail, so I don't think that would be the case.  An amazon deal would be amazing because you could have your game immediately and your fancy dongle within 2 days (2 days!), but doesn't Amazon hate Nintendo?  I mean, this kind of deal could repair that relationship, but both parties would have to want to come to the table.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Woadstool on October 24, 2016, 01:55:44 PM
Trying to get caught up on this growing hurricane of cool Switch news. I for one really dig those controller add-ons as we all know certain Nintendo games work better with certain controllers. I hope we'll see NES & SNES add-ons for us classic gamers.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 24, 2016, 02:50:35 PM
Soren, while some sort of pointer functionality is a given (?), placing IR lights in the screen would mean that the dock would need to sit under or over the TV for decent aiming.  That would be even worse than the sensor bar, although current wireless sensor bars might be compatible.  If they can implement a more modern system of motion and position detection with minimal drift, they wouldn't need IR at all for basic pointer control.  I can see them updating a lot of things like this in the NSi, with some "good enough" solutions for the first generation that are inexpensive.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on October 24, 2016, 03:32:27 PM
So with the ports, will they be free if you brought the wii u versions? Like you hook up your Nintendo account  and bam games? or are they going to be scummy and make you buy them again?
Oh Lucario, you sad, hopeful Khush dupe...
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 24, 2016, 05:15:04 PM
New Monster Hunter announcement coming (http://gematsu.com/2016/10/monster-hunter-nintendo-direct-set-october-27) 10/27!


I know they say no Switch info will be given, but this is also for sure not one of the already released games in Japan as this is a Japanese announcement.


People are suspecting it will be either a Generations G/U release or Monster Hunter 5. And the game will be releasing in March 2017 so I can't help but wonder if they will release for both 3DS and Switch with cross system play like they did with 3U on the U/3DS.


They also confirmed that it will not be a cell phone announcement.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 24, 2016, 07:17:53 PM
I think it would make more sense to have motion plus style pointing, which doesnt use the sensor bar.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Wah on October 24, 2016, 07:20:16 PM
So with the ports, will they be free if you brought the wii u versions? Like you hook up your Nintendo account  and bam games? or are they going to be scummy and make you buy them again?
Oh Lucario, you sad, hopeful Khush dupe...
yep def a Khush dupe! XD man, who wouldn't want to be!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on October 24, 2016, 07:33:49 PM
So with the ports, will they be free if you brought the wii u versions? Like you hook up your Nintendo account  and bam games? or are they going to be scummy and make you buy them again?
Oh Lucario, you sad, hopeful Khush dupe...
yep def a Khush dupe! XD man, who wouldn't want to be!
Well, me, for starters.

But I definitely get your concern. My hope is that they do allow digital transfers, at least. For those that are getting enhanced ports, I could certainly see them asking for a double dip (although that's a nice way to screw over the few people that bought a Wii U), or at best, a Wii to Wii U-like virtual console charge, albeit more sizable, like 10-15 bucks.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on October 24, 2016, 08:43:01 PM
Just going to go on record here and say that I'm expecting MHXG coming out of Japan soon. (If Capcom wanted to do the west a solid they'd make that content DLC for the West, but I'm not exactly confident in that. Also, I am not working off any inside information.)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 24, 2016, 11:45:34 PM
So that is your bet for the MonHun announcement? I could see it being that or MH5U, with either one also getting a Switch version. I would totally double dip if it came to switch, but I think I'll pass if it is just the G/U version of Generations on 3DS. That or I'll get it and give my regular version to my sister or someone else since I have not gotten very far in it.


But previous comments from the devs have strongly implied that Gen/X was a one-off "celebration" of Monster Hunter. Granted, they could have changed their minds (or had their minds forced by executive interference).


Also, it feels too soon for a genuine Monster Hunter 5 unless they got early dev kits from Nintendo. And it has been two years since the last mainline Monster Hunter title released.


Flip a coin, it could be either. So long as it finally brings by my beloved Wroggi cowboy armor I'll be happy.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on October 24, 2016, 11:57:14 PM
Reagardless of what MonHun game gets announced, any hypothetical Switch version will not get revealed on a Nintendo-sanctioned Direct barely a week after saying no further Switch info would be revealed this calendar year.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 25, 2016, 12:11:08 AM
Yes, which is why the idea of dual releases are so appealing here. Announce game and show 3DS version. Then his us with the Switch version in the first 2017 direct.


Though I'll take the hint and move my MonHun rumors to the general rumor threads now ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on October 25, 2016, 05:12:27 PM
For some reason I look at that JoyCon Grip and my conspiracy-addled brain keeps whispering to me "Is that a Touchpad? Is that a Touchpad?"
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 25, 2016, 05:55:39 PM
For some reason I look at that JoyCon Grip and my conspiracy-addled brain keeps whispering to me "Is that a Touchpad? Is that a Touchpad?"


Nintendo stealing ideas from Sony, you heretic.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 25, 2016, 06:05:26 PM
For some reason I look at that JoyCon Grip and my conspiracy-addled brain keeps whispering to me "Is that a Touchpad? Is that a Touchpad?"

I thought the same but I don't see why it would be necessary.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 25, 2016, 06:12:55 PM
A touchpad might be nice, since you lose access to the touchscreen when using the grip.  Otherwise, the grip seems like a huge chunk of plastic to store or carry with little value.  It takes up as much room as a standalone controller, so we might as well just use a controller.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: sudoshuff on October 25, 2016, 06:58:32 PM
For some reason I look at that JoyCon Grip and my conspiracy-addled brain keeps whispering to me "Is that a Touchpad? Is that a Touchpad?"

I thought the same but I don't see why it would be necessary.


Ewww....and it would probably feel like those Synaptics touchpads on old Windows laptops. 


Am I the only one hoping the Switch releases with a bunch of color options? I'm kind of tired of the whole black/white/grey console thing.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 25, 2016, 07:09:57 PM
There might be no touchscreen stuff here so that Nintendo can cut the screen in an SKU if they feel they need a major price drop.  If it's just a screen for portability it can be removed.  A touchscreen won't work that way since devs will have made games that assume you have one.  One big problem with the Wii U was that when it was clearly a bomb Nintendo couldn't cut the price because the most expensive component was a mandatory part of the controller.  If the screen is just a screen then they can make a home-only version of the Switch that costs less.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on October 25, 2016, 07:25:24 PM
Am I the only one hoping the Switch releases with a bunch of color options? I'm kind of tired of the whole black/white/grey console thing.

I really like the black and grey theme of the switch. But I wouldn't complain if other colours were available.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on October 25, 2016, 08:13:26 PM
Am I the only one hoping the Switch releases with a bunch of color options? I'm kind of tired of the whole black/white/grey console thing.

Faceplates please, ala New 3DS!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 25, 2016, 08:25:02 PM
There might be no touchscreen stuff here so that Nintendo can cut the screen in an SKU if they feel they need a major price drop.  If it's just a screen for portability it can be removed.  A touchscreen won't work that way since devs will have made games that assume you have one.  One big problem with the Wii U was that when it was clearly a bomb Nintendo couldn't cut the price because the most expensive component was a mandatory part of the controller.  If the screen is just a screen then they can make a home-only version of the Switch that costs less.

idk, i think we might be past the point where the screen cost is a problem. Screens are everywhere now. It may be that it was a specific sized FWVGA touch screen. Nintendo might want to use a more generic screen to keep cost down.  In fact they probably should have updated the wii u mid generation to keep costs down. They could have started making the wii u controllers have a 720p screen because they would be more generic/cheaper.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Wah on October 25, 2016, 08:37:40 PM
Autodesk is a partner? What, is 3DS max animation tools and such going to be on the switch? XD
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on October 26, 2016, 02:09:18 AM
There might be no touchscreen stuff here so that Nintendo can cut the screen in an SKU if they feel they need a major price drop.  If it's just a screen for portability it can be removed.  A touchscreen won't work that way since devs will have made games that assume you have one.  One big problem with the Wii U was that when it was clearly a bomb Nintendo couldn't cut the price because the most expensive component was a mandatory part of the controller.  If the screen is just a screen then they can make a home-only version of the Switch that costs less.

idk, i think we might be past the point where the screen cost is a problem. Screens are everywhere now. It may be that it was a specific sized FWVGA touch screen. Nintendo might want to use a more generic screen to keep cost down.  In fact they probably should have updated the wii u mid generation to keep costs down. They could have started making the wii u controllers have a 720p screen because they would be more generic/cheaper.

What about battery costs?  If they had a cheap home-only version where the Switch and dock are one in the same they can strip out both the screen and the battery in the Switch (and speakers too I guess).  Would that be able to knock down costs?  I really am not familiar enough with hardware to know.  I do know though that "the screen is too expensive" was the common reason given when I would ask why Nintendo wouldn't do a Wii U price cut so I figured it was some big expense.  Still a touchscreen means that it HAS to be there so even if they offered a home-only variation it would still need something resembling the Wii U Gamepad in order to work.

The 3DS and Wii U both come with styluses and I don't see any slot on the Switch for one.  Now the iPad doesn't have a stylus either so it's not mandatory but not having a stylus for the touchscreen would be a different approach for Nintendo.  Plus I figure if they did have a touchscreen surely someone in that video would be using it at some point.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 26, 2016, 03:05:54 AM
The stylus could become an optional accessory like the charger on a New 3DS.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 26, 2016, 07:37:34 AM
Maybe this is what NX is? NX could be basically a ps4 equivalent powered system with a mobile controller. The controller when away from the system can play games. The controller uses SD cards and games can be transferred from console to controller. When playing games on the controller the graphics are downgraded to about Ouya/WiiU quality. Price $500

Basically what would happen if you bought an upgraded DS and Wii U system, but they're just bundled together and the games work on both systems.

Also new advantages would be...multiscreen play, more co-op modes, no worry about reach for netflix. The thing has a wifi connection too.

this works into the nx operating thing because of scalable games.   NX home, NX mobile. They could sale the NX mobile separately to people who don't want the console.

Also gives Nintendo a chance to get into the mobile market(phones not this thing) and not feel guilty for abandoning its cash cow.




Yup! Just add a switch on The NX II to switch from Handheld mode to controller mode and we're in business. (switch could be virtual)


Also, I am now expecting AR HD/4k from Nintendo.


Having  HD/4K AR is a lot more feasible since what ever device is rendering the frame doesn't have to do an entire 1980 x 1080p screen.

I look through my ideas..... Nile Boogie named the system!

The way Nintendo has it now though, i can't imagine it being more than $350. Unless they plan to start releasing multiple SKUs Apple/Samsung style.

The general zeitgeist believes like Wii U the Switch will be underpowered. However, if we remember some old news and rumors.

"They also said Nintendo would aim to put industry-leading chips in the NX devices, after criticism that the Wii U’s capabilities didn’t match those of competitors."

http://www.wsj.com/articles/nintendo-begins-distributing-software-kit-for-new-nx-platform-1444996588

and this is interesting

https://mynintendonews.com/2016/10/21/wall-street-journal-has-heard-one-developer-is-moving-ps4-titles-to-nintendo-switch/
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 26, 2016, 01:12:15 PM
$299 is the top price for me. Anything above that and I will wait for a price drop. But I am willing to pay that much. I would be more happy with $249 or even better Game Cube's magic $199 but that might be a pipe dream.

If Nintendo is not marketing kids instead going after the gamer culture, which they should be doing, then there is a chance they will price it higher to avoid image issues. But if it's $349 at launch I will wait.

Mass market for a high end electronic device can be $350, but at that price this thing better have some really good media capabilities and support Apps that are more than just gaming.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on October 26, 2016, 04:32:32 PM
I think that people are so negative against Nintendo that if there isn'ts some power behind it, it's going to be as dead as Wii U when it comes out. This thing is competing against not only Xbox One, ps4, ps4 pro, Xbox one Scorpio, Ipad, Samsung Galaxy Tablet, Old xbox360s and ps3s, PCs, Wii u, 3ds, Android TV, Cell phones, Razer Forge TV, etc...

I think the smartest thing to do for Nintendo is have scalability. Nintendo needs Switch to be a unified operating system platform, but it could have different levels of power. I think the best way for Nintendo to skip the power arms race, is to disrupt it.

Also, I would imagine Sony and Microsoft have paid corporate spies. They probably knew about Switch, and that's why PS4 PRO and Scorpio had to come out.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on October 26, 2016, 05:58:09 PM
I think that people are so negative against Nintendo that if there isn'ts some power behind it, it's going to be as dead as Wii U when it comes out. This thing is competing against not only Xbox One, ps4, ps4 pro, Xbox one Scorpio, Ipad, Samsung Galaxy Tablet, Old xbox360s and ps3s, PCs, Wii u, 3ds, Android TV, Cell phones, Razer Forge TV, etc...

I think the smartest thing to do for Nintendo is have scalability. Nintendo needs Switch to be a unified operating system platform, but it could have different levels of power. I think the best way for Nintendo to skip the power arms race, is to disrupt it.

Also, I would imagine Sony and Microsoft have paid corporate spies. They probably knew about Switch, and that's why PS4 PRO and Scorpio had to come out.


I would buy that. My source within Microsoft suggested they are really scrambling to figure out how to make sure this thing doesn't become a threat to Surface. Their not at all concerned for Xbox, but that is a different division he sort of acts like its the redheaded stepchild and since he works on Windows they all scoff at Xbox anyways. But Sony doesn't have a tablet on the market and this is not going to sway anyone looking at PS4 Pro.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on October 27, 2016, 07:48:18 AM
Good news and bad news from the rumor mill:
The Switch will use standard microSD cards (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/10/report-nintendo-switch-to-support-micro-sd-up-to-128gb/) (with the 128GB limit being Nintendo's usual conservatism, the format goes up to 2TB)...

...but there won't be hard drive support (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/10/report-nintendo-switch-dock-doesnt-support-external-usb-drives/).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on October 27, 2016, 07:51:39 AM
Gambling on dual SDcard slots!!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: azeke on October 27, 2016, 08:10:24 AM
I love how these no-name sites split rumours into separate links for more clicks.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 27, 2016, 01:29:20 PM
The lack of hard drive support seems like a terrible idea.  It would be relatively easy to have the OS automatically manage keeping the newest and most used games on the main system, while the hard drive holds the eventual TBs of digital content.  I expect a smaller NS in the future more oriented towards pure mobile use, but the current system could take advantage of its home base.  It has to spend a lot of its life there anyway to charge.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on October 27, 2016, 01:41:44 PM
Yeah. I'm wondering, what are the rumored USB ports on he dock for if not an external HDD? And while an external HDD obviously wouldn't work magically with the Switch's portable nature, if the Switch OS and Dock provided some sort of straightforward loading/unloading functionality that'd make things smoother.

The lack of a Fridge, even one at home on the dock, would have an immensely jarring effect on my rat-pack must-buy-all-eShop mentality.

Of course, that wouldn't solve the problem of ickiness if the player undocks the Switch in the middle of a 32GB transfer. But I feel like that ickiness is less than the ickiness of no HDD at all.

ALSO Nintendo is losing out on MAJOR profits from having a branded external HDD they can sell at a branded-markup.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on October 27, 2016, 01:55:35 PM
You guys are so silly. Can't you see, this is just Nintendo's way of stopping us from spending too much money.

They don't want us cluttering our hard drives, or draining our wallets, on stupid, pointless eShop games. They're so thoughtful.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on October 27, 2016, 02:23:02 PM

Of course, that wouldn't solve the problem of ickiness if the player undocks the Switch in the middle of a 32GB transfer. But I feel like that ickiness is less than the ickiness of no HDD at all.


I dismissed this rumor on first read because it just sounds too counter-intuitive, but the above quoted, hrm, that does indeed seem like something Nintendo would be inordinately concerned about.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on October 27, 2016, 03:33:07 PM
So I know multi-touch capacitive touchscreen hasn't been confirmed yet, but if it's indeed there do we expect Nintendo to try to do a "Mobile Framework" initiative (akin to the Wii U Web Framework) to try to make porting from Smartphone platforms easier? Well, maybe with Unity and Unreal Engine 4 supported front and center a dedicated Mobile Framework porting technology isn't as necessary, but I wonder if they're going to make any concerted outreach to those devs directly, or reach out to them with the tact of "your Unity/Unreal game engine already supports Switch, so...".
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on October 27, 2016, 03:44:16 PM
There have been rumors of Android being there in some sense for a long time.  Not the Play Store, of course, but something more like the Amazon Fire app store.  It seems like a stretch, but Nintendo has been getting out of their comfort zone since Iwata changed gears a few years ago.  It would make ports very simple -- even better if GPS is included.  With that said, I don't think there are any cameras (?), so the obvious Pokemon Go wouldn't be as interesting.

Support for mobile games within the Nintendo ecosystem could be huge, as long as they don't make the hurdles too high for publishers.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 27, 2016, 10:03:24 PM
Eurogamer: Switch Has A Multitouch Display; Right Joycon Has IR Sensor.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-10-27-nintendo-switch-has-a-6-2-multi-touch-screen

Quote
A number of sources, including those who informed me of the Switch's design and detachable controllers back in July, have all confirmed other capabilities which Nintendo is currently keeping quiet.

Let's start with the Nintendo Switch's screen. It is 6.2" in size, 720p and - for the first time in any Nintendo device - boasts a capacitive multi-touch screen.
....
So, how will the touchscreen work when the Switch is docked? While connected to your TV the Switch itself is out of reach - you play either with both JoyCon controllers attached to the system's grip or with a Pro Controller. The Switch's touchscreen is almost entirely obscured within the console's dock.

The answer may lie hidden in the right-hand JoyCon, which houses a short-range IR sensor in its base. This could be used to point at the TV to replicate basic touchscreen functionality, picked up by a corresponding IR sensor in the docked Switch.

Given that these sources include the one that was spot on, I think these rumors are all but confirmed. And if they're true, then it's possible to have 3DS backwards compatibility. The only thing needed to allow Wii/U compatibility is a gyroscope or accelerometer.

If Nintendo wants to start a subscription service that allows you to play their entire backlog, like people have speculated, it makes sense to support the control style for all their games, whether within the system already or with the actual old controllers.

Others have speculated that the system may run a similar OS to android, and thus might allow Andriod games to be played. Having a 10-point multitouch screen certainly allows it, but unless Nintendo receives some money per download, I don't think Nintendo would allow it. If it runs Andriod OS, though, it'll be an interesting piece of hardware to jailbreak.

Finally, I loved House of the Dead on the Wii. It's hilarious to play with a friend. The action, the dialogue, the bosses; it's a solid game. It's unfortunate, due to the left Joycon apparently not having an IR sensor, that if a game came out similar to HOTD I can't play it on the system out of the box. I'd have loved to talk my neighbor on a flight to join me in killing some zombies.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on October 27, 2016, 11:13:49 PM
Even if they can replicate touch controls through pointer functionality, it would still be difficult to do 3DS backwards compatibility without a true second screen wouldn't it? I think they'd wait until they come out with a revision and push it as a reason for people to double dip, but that seems kinda un-Nintendo. I do hope they eventually find some way to use the 3DS/Wii U library though.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on October 27, 2016, 11:35:21 PM
(https://i.reddituploads.com/6d4333c1416142298537d7f86725cf75?fit=max&h=1536&w=1536&s=6789492de8bc7d7bfadb17452f512c4d)

I was using the assumption that you wouldn't play it on the TV. With a bracket like this mock-up, you could be able to dock the system vertically. This would allow you to play 3/DS games or have a better portrait for games like space shooters, pinball, etc.

The only problem is you couldn't access the headphone jack.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on October 28, 2016, 12:09:33 AM
The AR sensor in one controller is a great idea, but they need/should put it in both.  With full Wii mote Motion + support. 

I guess it is possible that if Nintendo puts the Gyros in the controllers and not the system then it could save motion controls and save money.  Sure it means you can't play with tilt controls without the joypads being connected, but do you really need to?

I just hope the device has a camera on the back and front.  Also it would be interesting to have a game where one person is holding the switch and other people are trying to shoot the screen.  Yeah it would end up in the switch breaking, but it could be fun.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on October 28, 2016, 12:10:47 AM
Even if they can replicate touch controls through pointer functionality, it would still be difficult to do 3DS backwards compatibility without a true second screen wouldn't it? I think they'd wait until they come out with a revision and push it as a reason for people to double dip, but that seems kinda un-Nintendo. I do hope they eventually find some way to use the 3DS/Wii U library though.


They would have to offer a few different options for 3DS mode. Fact is, most DS and 3DS games do not make extensive use of both screens. One screen is almost always a map or an inventory while the other is the main screen. The solution in the case of these games is to let the user alternate between which screen is visible. If the user wants both screens visible, then show both with one as primary and the other as a smaller secondary (screen in screen style). Point is, the DS/3DS two screens is not impossible to handle on one single high resolution screen. Totally doable!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: azeke on October 28, 2016, 12:13:20 AM
Man, all those crazy configurations...

Switch looks is gonna be LEGO/Transformer style console where you're constantly take it apart and put it together in every which way.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 28, 2016, 12:17:23 AM
Reminds me of the dead Google Project Ara phone, where you could swap out parts to upgrade your phone. Going on a hike? Plug in the advanced camera! Too bad it got killed.

https://atap.google.com/ara/ (https://atap.google.com/ara/)


(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/7/7d/Project_Ara_scattered_parts.png)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Parallax Scroll on October 28, 2016, 02:07:23 AM
Interesting conversation, rumor / speculation over on NeoGAF about the Tegra SoC for Switch.
Some of that posted below.

Before I post it though, keep the following in mind regarding Nvidia's names for different generations of Tegra processors, to help avoid confusion!

"Kal-El" - Tegra 3
"Wayne" - Tegra 4
"Logan" - Tegra K1 (Nvidia Kepler architecture)
"Erista" - Tegra X1 (Nvidia Maxwell architecture)
"Parker" - Tegra ?? (Nvidia Pascal architecture) Not officially Tegra X2 but everyone calls it X2.
"Xavier" - next gen Tegra SoC. (will use Nvidia's Volta architecture). Nvidia won't even start sampling this chip until late 2017, therefore Xavier obviously won't show up in products until sometime in 2018, most likely.

With that out of the way, here's that NeoGAF conversation:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=221751839&postcount=1792 (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=221751839&postcount=1792)
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1297136&page=36

Quote
http://www.gamespodcast.de/2016/10/23/runde-81-ft-teut-weidemann-nintendo-switch/

The following information comes from Teut Weidemann, one of the first German professional game developers. He worked at Rainbow Arts, Microsoft USA, cdv Software Entertainment, Ubisoft and more. It does not seem that Mr. Weidemann is working on the Switch himself, but he is in contact with devs that have dev kits.

* Switch screen is a touchscreen that supports up to 10 points of interaction
* current dev kits are running on older hardware specs
* Switch may be based on the new Tegra X2, which is quite a jump from the X1


Quote
[strong]Cool, another source suggesting Pascal. And I'm gonna assume when he says Tegra X2 he means Parker.[/strong] Going from a base Parker chip, what are the likeliest modifications we're going to see? I've read before that Denver cores have no business being on a console, so I imagine they'd go.

Quote
Another source calling it X2, however, I can understand why they would. The Tegra Parker was made for auto-driving cars, ergo it's name (IT'S A CAR PUN!). So calling it X2 makes more sense, but it's probably the exact same thing as the Parker, albeit with custom assets for the Switch (more focus on GPU than CPU functions maybe?).

Quote
[strong]It's actually named Parker after Peter Parker. The X1 was Erista (Wolverine) and the next one will be called Xavier.[/strong]

Nvidia have been using superhero codenames since Tegra 3/Kal-El.

Quote
"Worst" case scenario is it X1 as base with heavy customization, maybe that's why some devs are saying it's probably closer to X2, which wouldn't be a surprise since Nintendo went all out including active cooling, something I never thought they'd include.

Quote
he main issue with X1 is that it uses the 20nm fab process which is pretty much obsolete with everybody skipping it and go for 16nm.

Quote
Parker itself (the current official name for X2) gets 750GFlops in FP32, 1.5TFlops in FP16. It's unknown exactly how much game code can be FP16 (and it would vary wildly game to game), but speculation puts us at somewhere between 20%-50% being possible in FP16. I don't think that translates exactly to up to 1.12TFlops, but it should perform a decent amount better than the 750 number indicates.

Quote
Nice so we could be looking at something quite close to XB1 which is 1.3TF right?

Quote
In pure flops? No, that would be unlikely. It's possible in this type of form factor but it's likely too expensive for what Nintendo wants to charge.

But Nvidia typically has better tools and software that end up getting better performance out of their hardware, at least on PC (which is apparently where we get the whole "Nvidia flops are better than AMD flops). We don't know if that will be the case on a console though.

So we really don't know what the real world performance will be, but it's likely much closer to XB1 than Wii U.

Quote
I think it will be fully custom and probably better than parker to be honest. With some of the things they learned building Xavier.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on October 29, 2016, 02:28:25 AM
Thanks for the breakdown Parallax, really helped when reading the quoted convos. Has be very excited for how it will turn out graphically.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 03, 2016, 09:13:16 AM
Laura Kate Dale is reporting March 17 could be the Switch launch day in PAL regions. She says Switch won't be a same-day worldwide release, but will be in stores during that same week.


If it's true I'm guessing either March 12 or 19 would be the NA release date.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on November 03, 2016, 03:51:12 PM
It looks like we could be getting to breathe some wild soon.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 03, 2016, 03:54:00 PM
The 17th would be nice, but Im still guessing the 31st for Australia
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on November 03, 2016, 06:08:08 PM
Laura Kate Dale is reporting March 17 could be the Switch launch day in PAL regions. She says Switch won't be a same-day worldwide release, but will be in stores during that same week.


If it's true I'm guessing either March 12 or 19 would be the NA release date.

More likely:
NA / Europe March 17
Japan / Australia March 18
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: rygar on November 03, 2016, 07:43:56 PM
Given its proximity to St. Pats/5th Ave, that would make for an interesting scene at the Nintendo Store.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 03, 2016, 09:37:08 PM
Dress as Luigi for St. Patty's day. Get drunk on Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 04, 2016, 07:45:40 PM
Yeah. I'm wondering, what are the rumored USB ports on he dock for if not an external HDD? And while an external HDD obviously wouldn't work magically with the Switch's portable nature, if the Switch OS and Dock provided some sort of straightforward loading/unloading functionality that'd make things smoother.

The lack of a Fridge, even one at home on the dock, would have an immensely jarring effect on my rat-pack must-buy-all-eShop mentality.

Of course, that wouldn't solve the problem of ickiness if the player undocks the Switch in the middle of a 32GB transfer. But I feel like that ickiness is less than the ickiness of no HDD at all.

ALSO Nintendo is losing out on MAJOR profits from having a branded external HDD they can sell at a branded-markup.

I just checked and there ARE 512 GB SD Cards, and 256 GB Micro SD Cards. I'm no longer concerned about a hard drive, just whether the switch and its OS are built to take advantage of the latest in SD card tech.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 04, 2016, 10:02:12 PM
Yeah. I'm wondering, what are the rumored USB ports on he dock for if not an external HDD? And while an external HDD obviously wouldn't work magically with the Switch's portable nature, if the Switch OS and Dock provided some sort of straightforward loading/unloading functionality that'd make things smoother.

The lack of a Fridge, even one at home on the dock, would have an immensely jarring effect on my rat-pack must-buy-all-eShop mentality.

Of course, that wouldn't solve the problem of ickiness if the player undocks the Switch in the middle of a 32GB transfer. But I feel like that ickiness is less than the ickiness of no HDD at all.

ALSO Nintendo is losing out on MAJOR profits from having a branded external HDD they can sell at a branded-markup.

I just checked and there ARE 512 GB SD Cards, and 256 GB Micro SD Cards. I'm no longer concerned about a hard drive, just whether the switch and its OS are built to take advantage of the latest in SD card tech.

where have you been when I was linking to them... they are relatively cheap too....
[well... this is about 128GB mSD - Re: Nintendo Switch Pre-Release Discussion (March 2017) (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=50737.msg906587#msg906587)but I was also chanting for dual SD card slots so we could double up.
prices on 256 mSD's will be down in about a years time, then we can double up on those as well ;)]
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 04, 2016, 11:40:20 PM
I wonder how big of a hand nvidia has put into this? 500 man years and an OS sounds like this thing will be more than nifty.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 06, 2016, 04:57:03 AM
That new post on the nvidia website makes it sound like they have done a lot of work on it
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 06, 2016, 10:03:47 AM
There aren't any "rumored" USB ports on the dock, there are USB ports. Clearly shown in the video with "USB" etched into the dock. Wii U supports external HDDs, Switch will support external HDDs.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 06, 2016, 10:32:56 AM
That new post on the nvidia website makes it sound like they have done a lot of work on it

link?
does no one source their comments anymore? :P:


is there a newer one than this?
https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 06, 2016, 10:49:34 AM
That new post on the nvidia website makes it sound like they have done a lot of work on it

link?
does no one source their comments anymore? :P: :


is there a newer one than this?
https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/ (https://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2016/10/20/nintendo-switch/)


That's the only one.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 06, 2016, 12:53:59 PM
After looking up a 512 GB Micro SD, I no longer have concerns about storage space.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 06, 2016, 01:55:32 PM
After looking up a 512 GB Micro SD, I no longer have concerns about storage space.

Just price...
but that will come down over time. 512 on a micro is quite expensive right now.
even a 256GB is quite expensive right now.

But, if Nintendo gives us the dual Micros SD card slots, 2x128GB MicroSD's cost about the price of a game or 2.

a good brand name 128GB card cost between $30-$50
a good brand name 200GB-256GB card cost between $85-$150
a good brand name 512GB card cost around $200-$330

I rather buy 2x 128GB cards as needed, than spring for a single 200+GB card for now.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 06, 2016, 03:21:26 PM
After looking up a 512 GB Micro SD, I no longer have concerns about storage space.

Just price...
but that will come down over time. 512 on a micro is quite expensive right now.
even a 256GB is quite expensive right now.

But, if Nintendo gives us the dual Micros SD card slots, 2x128GB MicroSD's cost about the price of a game or 2.

a good brand name 128GB card cost between $30-$50
a good brand name 200GB-256GB card cost between $85-$150
a good brand name 512GB card cost around $200-$330

I rather buy 2x 128GB cards as needed, than spring for a single 200+GB card for now.
60 dollars is not expensive. Think of it this way- instead of Nintendo offering a system lacking in 60 dollar games, they are lacking in 60 dollar memory options.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 06, 2016, 04:07:12 PM
I didn't say $60 is expensive.
I said a 512GB micro SD card for $200+ is expensive
and so is a 200GB + card for about $100 or so.

on the other hand, two 128GB micro SD cards for the price of a $60-$70 game isn't that expensive.
So I hope Nintendo gives us the dual SD card slot option for memory expansion purposes.

... unless I'm misunderstanding what your lack of concern over storage space was after seeing a 512GB micro SD card.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 06, 2016, 06:03:23 PM
I didn't say $60 is expensive.
I said a 512GB micro SD card for $200+ is expensive
and so is a 200GB + card for about $100 or so.

on the other hand, two 128GB micro SD cards for the price of a $60-$70 game isn't that expensive.
So I hope Nintendo gives us the dual SD card slot option for memory expansion purposes.

... unless I'm misunderstanding what your lack of concern over storage space was after seeing a 512GB micro SD card.
I mean, 512 gb is a ridiculous amount of space, unless you're considering buying completely digital, so I don't really see the issue. Sure, memory is going to drop in price over time, but considering the sparse library of Nintendo consoles in general, their compact filesize on their digital releases, and the high likelihood that the Switch won't get third parties, I don't really see the issue.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on November 09, 2016, 02:08:05 PM
Not something we haven't heard before, but Laura Kate Dale is throwing some more weight behind the rumour of a Smash 4 port for Switch:

Quote
According to a pair of sources who we have used in the past when reporting on Switch news, we have learned that the Bayonetta and Cloud Amiibo, both previously slated for 2016 release, are now being held back to launch alongside an upcoming Switch port of Smash Bros.

According to our information, the port will not be a launch day release for the Switch, but is targetting a release in the first six months after the Switch hits shelves. We have not heard any confirmation that the port will contain any new content, but we have been told it will contain all DLC from the Wii U version of the game.

We have not heard anything regarding Gamecube Controller support for the port.

While we are aware multiple sites and outlets have claimed a slew of enhanced ports are coming to the Switch on launch day, including some sites falsely attributing us as their source, we would like to make it clear that this report is the sum total of what we are currently announcing. Our reporting on a Smash port should not be taken as confirmation of any other recent reports with our name incorrectly attached being accurate.

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/11/report-remaining-smash-amiibo-delayed-until-2017-smash-bros-switch-port-arrives/
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 09, 2016, 06:41:29 PM
Pete Hines of Bethesda: Supporting Nintendo Consoles A "Hardware Issue"


http://metro.co.uk/2016/09/07/pete-hines-bethesda-interview-were-only-going-to-make-games-that-we-think-raise-to-a-certain-level-of-quality-6113553/

Quote
GC: Third party support is a constant problem for them, but I think it’s questionable whether people would even buy things like Battlefield or GTA if they were on a Nintendo console. Is the reason you haven’t supported them much in the past partly because you don’t think your games would sell to that audience?

PH: No, no. it’s usually been one of a technical… hardware issue. It’s just, what it is that the devs are making and what are the hardware requirements that they’re looking at, to support what they’re making? And what fits? And anything that is below the line is, ‘Well, we can make it work, but we’d have to cut this or that or do it like…’ But no, that’s not the point. The point is to take the game, as you designed it, and to get it working on those platforms. Not make a bunch of cuts and a bunch of changes and bring out some other version of it.

GC: So if NX is announced in the next few weeks and is as powerful as an Xbox One or higher, then…

PH: Then it will absolutely be something that we consider. Okay… let’s say they come out and say tomorrow it does X, Y, and Z. Well, Dishonored 2 is way down the road, it’s not in the conversation. But anything that is in development, I think we’d take a look at and see if technically does it line up with what they’re doing?

And then to your point, of course we always want to look at what we’re doing from an audience standpoint. But I think that we have any number of things that might appeal to the Nintendo audience. Maybe it’s not as appealing as Super Smash Bros., or it doesn’t appeal to that exact same audience, but that doesn’t mean that there’s not still an audience there.


Considering that Bethesda is one of the companies supporting the Switch out of the gate and was even featured during the announcement trailer, we can assume it meets their graphical threshold.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 09, 2016, 06:59:44 PM
Kind of nice to see a dev confirming the rather logical point that third parties won't support them because of inadequate hardware and not some ridiculous conspiracy theory that third parties just don't like Nintendo or feel threatened by their first party games or whatever.  Basically Bethseda would have supported the Wii and Wii U if they didn't have outdated hardware that could support Bethseda's games without major compromises.

And at the same time the fact that they ARE supporting the Switch is very encouraging as Stogi pointed out.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 09, 2016, 08:50:39 PM
Pete Hines of Bethesda pretty much confirms Switch is at least as powerful as XB1

I mean. No. That's not at all what he said. There's a lot of connecting of dots but Bethesda is still being as non-committal as ever.

EDIT: Also, I'd hold off on making graphical comparisons with current gen consoles. 1) Bethesda chose to highlight a remaster of a PS360 game for the Switch video and 2) that footage is more than likely not from any Nintendo hardware build.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 09, 2016, 09:58:57 PM
The only dots I'm connecting is whether Bethesda would support a system if it didn't meet their technical standards and their support for the Switch.

But you're right. The best we can take from this is that they are supporting the Switch and thus are at the very least "okay" with the technology.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 11, 2016, 02:28:31 AM
rumor has it Switch has a USB-C port, making it charge fast, and very future proof.

Also, as I have said before. I think it will be powerful enough. nVidia uses the words scaleable in its press release if that is any indicator. When we look at the Gamecube vs the Xbox, Nintendo did some things that made the system run really efficiently even with less ram and a slower processor.

On the question of RAM. Emily Rogers had the rumors that it would only have 4GB of ram. There were however rumors that Nintendo delayed the console to have a more powerful console. It also could be that certain developers were given dev kits on weaker hardware, which is a common practice. Switch is mostly a successor to Shield so, it wouldn't be surprising if they used Shields to test software in the meantime.

I really think there is going to be different versions of the tablet. Each with different levels of Tegra Processors and different amounts of ram. Nintendo is in the console/tablet/and handheld sector. Nintendo may have plans to future proof itself. Tablet tech is going to keep shrinking and getting more powerful. Nintendo is likely putting themselves right in the middle of this. I imagine Nintendo could release 3 models at different price points and as years pass people buy upgrades. Buying upgrades is great because that means you can pass them around the family or just have a spare to let your friend play on when they visit.

It is conceivable that Skyrim is a special case. There is an xbox360 version and this new hd version. It could be that docked it's the full hd version and on the go its a slightly different version. A big reasony why you would have to download a huge download for the xbox360 version was because the game is on a DVD which is only 8.5GB. Early versions of the game needed updates and had scaling slowdown because of the hardrive. Cartridges do not have this problem. Wii U would never get this game because of storage and power limitations, but NS could easily get some version of the game. The Switch has more power and ram than wii u.

As a Nintendo fan and a Zelda fan. Skyrim is actually really appealing.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 11, 2016, 10:33:43 AM
I think Emily's rumors about RAM were about the fear that the retail unit might only have 2GB of ram, and she confirmed that she could claim that the retail units themselves had 4GB ram. For the RAM to jump above that would be far exceeding the initial low expectation fears.

I too think we could start seeing "revisions" of the Switch on a more frequent, 1/2 year basis, both up and down market. I imagine. Switch Slim that'll be the same thing but Portable only in a year or two, potentially both more portable and smaller. At the same time, a Switch Pro could come out with beefier specs but maintaining the same idea and form factor. If you had a launch switch you could give Nintendo more money, or hold on to the Launch Switch until it became no longer supported maybe in 6 years because the lure of the Switch ProPro's tech would be too powerful for devs to resist, forcing you to incrementally upgrade.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 11, 2016, 06:03:57 PM
I think consoles for the most part are extinct.

I welcome the new evolutions. The directions we may go.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on November 11, 2016, 06:20:48 PM
I can buy their plan to incrementally upgrade. They have already been doing that with the 3/DS line.


DS Phat, DS Lite, DS XL, DSi + DSi XL, -> 3DS, NEW 3DS
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 11, 2016, 09:07:39 PM
this fits in with the current discussion, so I'll just drop this in here as well

Looks like Nvidia plans for a long healthy relationship with Nintendo
http://seekingalpha.com/article/4022322-nvidia-nvda-q3-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single

Quote
I guess you could also say that Nintendo contributed a fair amount to that growth. And over the next – as you know, the Nintendo architecture and the company tends to stick with an architecture for a very long time. And so we've worked with them now for almost two years. Several hundred engineering years have gone into the development of this incredible game console. I really believe when everybody sees it and enjoy it, they're going be amazed by it. It's really like nothing they've ever played with before. And of course, the brand, their franchise and their game content is incredible. And so I think this is a relationship that will likely last two decades and I'm super excited about it.

2 decades... that's 3-4 gens of Nvidia<3Nintendo, or Eninen, (aka N&N)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 11, 2016, 10:06:51 PM
I've listened to speeches from Jen-Hsun Huang and he's all about disruptive technology, and so is Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 13, 2016, 11:01:17 AM
Best Buy is advertising a 256 GB USB 2.0 Flash Drive at $37.99 for Black Friday (https://www.bfads.net/Item/Best-Buy-SanDisk-Cruzer-256GB-USB-20-Flash-Drive-BlackRed/370366). If non-HDD memory continues to fall in price and rise in capacity, I don't know whether HDD storage will be a first-choice solution for expanded game console memory for much longer.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 13, 2016, 03:14:52 PM
Cartridges FTW!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on November 13, 2016, 03:56:34 PM
this fits in with the current discussion, so I'll just drop this in here as well

Looks like Nvidia plans for a long healthy relationship with Nintendo
http://seekingalpha.com/article/4022322-nvidia-nvda-q3-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single

Quote
I guess you could also say that Nintendo contributed a fair amount to that growth. And over the next – as you know, the Nintendo architecture and the company tends to stick with an architecture for a very long time. And so we've worked with them now for almost two years. Several hundred engineering years have gone into the development of this incredible game console. I really believe when everybody sees it and enjoy it, they're going be amazed by it. It's really like nothing they've ever played with before. And of course, the brand, their franchise and their game content is incredible. And so I think this is a relationship that will likely last two decades and I'm super excited about it.

2 decades... that's 3-4 gens of Nvidia<3Nintendo, or Eninen, (aka N&N)
You're making Mystic Gohan cry.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on November 13, 2016, 06:35:10 PM
Toys 'R Us Canada lists Switch for Canadian Wii U MSRP of $329.99 (http://www.toysrus.ca/product/index.jsp?productId=115713676&prodFindSrc=search&fv=2510384&f=Taxonomy&fd=&fg=&keywords=Nintendo+Switch&x=0&y=0&foreSeeBrowseSampling=15&foreSeeBrowseLoyalty=1&foreSeeEnabled=true).

Given the weakness of the Canadian dollar (#ThanksHarper) that works out to roughly $245 US.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 13, 2016, 07:18:55 PM
That's a good find, but might be a provisional estimate.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 13, 2016, 08:19:25 PM
I'm mentally and financially planning on $300. I think $250 is the magic number though. Switch will sell competitively at that price, but I'd be surprised to see Nintendo get it that low.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 13, 2016, 09:02:01 PM
I know I'm in the minority, but I'd rather it be $100 better, for $100 more.

I'm prepared for $349.99
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 13, 2016, 09:39:26 PM
Since we are talking portable console...I agree getting something more expensive but better technology is better. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 13, 2016, 09:54:46 PM
Wouldn't most retailers shoot to over estimate on the price? So, could this actually be accurate?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 13, 2016, 10:17:16 PM
$250 is probably the price. Nvidia Shield K1 tablet is $199, Shield Android TV is $199. This has the display that the Shield Android TV lacks, and the controller that the Shield K1 lacks...so $250 makes sense.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on November 14, 2016, 03:08:48 AM
this fits in with the current discussion, so I'll just drop this in here as well

Looks like Nvidia plans for a long healthy relationship with Nintendo
http://seekingalpha.com/article/4022322-nvidia-nvda-q3-2017-results-earnings-call-transcript?part=single

Quote
I guess you could also say that Nintendo contributed a fair amount to that growth. And over the next – as you know, the Nintendo architecture and the company tends to stick with an architecture for a very long time. And so we've worked with them now for almost two years. Several hundred engineering years have gone into the development of this incredible game console. I really believe when everybody sees it and enjoy it, they're going be amazed by it. It's really like nothing they've ever played with before. And of course, the brand, their franchise and their game content is incredible. And so I think this is a relationship that will likely last two decades and I'm super excited about it.

2 decades... that's 3-4 gens of Nvidia<3Nintendo, or Eninen, (aka N&N)
You're making Mystic Gohan cry.

(applauds)

However, pretty sure Mystic Gohan committed Harakiri or Seppuku after the Switch reveal listing Nvidia as the chipmaker. He hasn't logged back on here since that date. Poor guy. I don't think anyone cares that much so if he is wondering if the coast is clear to return and is reading this in secret, it is ok to come back. Although maybe we should be alerting SuperMetalDave to hire some protection. Maybe MysticGohan is going to go after SMD for making him look bad on these forums by believing in SMD's rumours.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 14, 2016, 06:03:30 AM
In a few months, we'll see a new poster going by the username "TheGreatSaiyaman." He'll sound remarkably like MysticGohan, but he's a completely different person.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 14, 2016, 10:23:51 AM
So $250 for the Switch and $300 for Switch/pack-in game sounds like the best possible scenario.

EDIT:
http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/11/report-uk-retailer-game-to-price-nintendo-switch-from-199-99/

LKD pointing to two different SKUs for Switch, on priced at £199.99 and another at £249.99 which has more storage and a pack-in game. GAME then responded with a threatening email, which was then immediately followed by an apology from GAME for sending the threatening email.

Which kind of makes me think the price point might be true.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 14, 2016, 01:55:44 PM
Man, $250 for a Basic SKU would be neat, and $300 for an enhanced SKU with Pack-in I would TOTALLY jump at! I'm pretty happy about those price points of true. I wonder though if they'd even need a pack-in game at the higher price point because higher built-in memory is enough temptation for me in all honesty.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on November 14, 2016, 02:48:17 PM
I've got an article in the editing room about the price, but I'll say this:
- TRU has pulled the listing
- Someone at GAME jumped down Laura's throat over the reporting (then someone else apologized)

I'm not saying it's aliens, but it's aliens.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 14, 2016, 03:01:43 PM
$250 seems like it could be the "No Dock" set. It's still better to get to that price. I'll get whatever has a better value. I'm single and have two cats. I have nothing better to do with my life than buy the more expensive set.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 14, 2016, 04:25:53 PM
If there is two versions, I will buy the premium one no matter the cost.
Im just going to wait until January for official prices. I dont see much point speculating on the price
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: alegoicoe on November 14, 2016, 05:14:00 PM
I think 250 is right on the money especially since it lends it self as a complementary system to those who own ps4 and xbones as the wii was to the previous generation, that way nintendo can tap into that audience without directly competing with them
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on November 14, 2016, 07:26:44 PM
$250 seems like it could be the "No Dock" set. It's still better to get to that price. I'll get whatever has a better value. I'm single and have two cats. I have nothing better to do with my life than buy the more expensive set.

How are you so cavalier with your money when you'll have to pay for cat college and cat weddings?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on November 14, 2016, 08:32:03 PM
Breath of the Wild might not be ready for March according to Emily Rogers:

Quote
Disclaimer: Everything in this blog post is rumor until proven otherwise.  Please take everything with a grain of salt.

Breath of the Wild is one of the largest games — if not the largest game — that Nintendo has ever developed. It’s probably larger than Twilight Princess, Skyward Sword, and Wind Waker combined.

In early September, I heard rumblings that the localization for the game was becoming more work than anyone had anticipated. They have to localize all of the game’s text, NPCs, quests, etc. Then, around October, I received another update that Zelda’s localization was still not going as smoothly as planned. “A very ambitious game, maybe even too much” claimed one particular source.

That brings us to the month of November. More sources have now come forward and corroborated my information. They’ve told me that localization for Breath of the Wild might not be finished until the end of December. After localization is completed, this game will require between (at least) four-to-six months of testing. As I mentioned earlier, this is one of Nintendo’s largest and most ambitious games ever. The amount of testing required for a huge open-world game like this is enormous. Nintendo’s intention is to have the game as bug free as possible.

Based on what I’ve heard, I have no reason to believe that Breath of the Wild will be a March title. There’s a much higher chance of Breath of the Wild being a summer 2017 game.

On an unrelated note, I’ve also heard whispers of the Switch version of BoTW running more smoothly than the Wii U version. Furthermore, I hear the final version of the game is a bit harder than what the press and media played at E3. Actually, I hear they toned down the E3 demo’s difficulty a tiny bit because they wanted journalists and press members at E3 to have fun exploring.

That’s all for now, but keep your eyes peeled for my next blog post. I’ll be discussing other Switch games later this week.

https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/11/14/rumor-breath-of-the-wild-will-not-be-released-in-march/
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 14, 2016, 08:51:37 PM
This is the same person with the rumor that Mario Switch WILL be ready for launch.  So to me it sounds like Nintendo moved several Wii U projects to Switch and started upgrading them.  Probably Switch has many games near completion because they were going to be Wii U games for 2016 holiday season and into 2017. 

So Nintendo could really switch their launch lineup around if localization isn't finished.  Personally, I think this is a good thing, because it hints that the first year of Nintendo Switch can be very strong.  Switch launch with Mario and a Spring/Summer launch of Zelda would be very strong (Unless it is released for Wii U first.)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 14, 2016, 09:13:18 PM
Two thoughts that are a cause for speculation/skepticism:

- No way Zelda gets released during the summer. If it gets delayed it's going straight for Holiday 2017.
- Nintendo would then be releasing a Wii U game during Holiday 2017. And that sounds insane.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 14, 2016, 09:19:56 PM
Two thoughts that are a cause for speculation/skepticism:

- No way Zelda gets released during the summer. If it gets delayed it's going straight for Holiday 2017.
- Nintendo would then be releasing a Wii U game during Holiday 2017. And that sounds insane.

Why would Nintendo wait if the game is ready? And Nintendo has ANOTHER game that could be released in 2017.  If Breath of Fire is not Ready, Nintendo knows it needs to release it as soon as possible.  If it is delayed they will not wait for holiday 2017.  For a couple reasons.

1)  It is also releasing for the Wii U, and they don't want the Wii U game out for a several months before the Switch game.  Also, they want to close the chapter on the Wii U gracefully, and a final game in the Spring or Summer could do that.

2) Breath of the Wild is the only really publicized and played Switch game.  When people think about the game to play on the Switch right now it is Breath of the Wild.  Yes, that excitement could change, but a big Nintendo delay to 2017 on a game so far in development could signal weakness to costumers that saw Nintendo very weak during the Wii U. 

IF Breath of Wild is delayed it is delayed until Spring and Summer...then Nintendo uses Mario Kart Switch as their big holiday game.   
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 14, 2016, 09:28:43 PM
Breath of the Wild is a sexier pick for the big Holiday release than Mario Kart.  Mario Kart may be the more reliable, higher sales over the long term pick, but it's not exactly sexy.

But it also being a Wii U game makes it a Catch 22.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 14, 2016, 09:44:34 PM
Nickmitch I agree:  However Nintendo wanted Breath of Wild out for 2016 holiday season Wii U.  It didn't make it...partially because of the change to make it a Switch game...and Nintendo REALLY wants it for Switch launch.  I think Nintendo wants to holiday Mario Switch for holiday season, but if Zelda isn't ready Nintendo knows they need a home run system selling launch title.  To me that is either Mario or Zelda.  So if Mario is ready and Zelda isn't, Mario is the launch game.

But, then what do you do?  Hold a completed game for an entire year...which is possibly the last game for Wii U?  Nope.  You also don't launch it for Wii U, and then make Switch owners wait 6 months to play it.  You trust your IPs and you release Zelda in Spring or Summer then push one of your other games to holiday.  Mario Kart is a good holiday game.  So is Splatoon. 

Personally.... IF this delay is true (which I think it isn't.)  Then I see the lineup falling like this:

Mario Launch
Zelda Spring
Splatoon Summer
Mario Kart Holiday game

That gives Zelda Wii U and Switch a proper release early 2017.  It gives Nintendo a solid Single Player and Multiplayer gaming.  I could see Splatoon and Zelda switching release spots to have Single Player/ Multiplayer/ Single Player/ Multiplayer games...and that could be very cool.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 14, 2016, 09:56:19 PM
The last mainline Zelda game to release during the summer was Phantom Hourglass. Of the 17 mainline Zelda games, 10 have a had a release date of either late fall(October) or holidays (November-December). 3 other games were released during the February-April window. The odds are clearly in favor of a Holiday or late Winter release date. Given that (and my total lack of knowledge in game development/localization/testing) I think two things can happen:

(TOTAL FANTASY SPECULATION ZONE)
- Nintendo lets the release date slip to as far back as May. Monolith Soft (the only Ninty developer I know with experience in open world games of BoTW's scale) is told to drop everything they're doing and put all hands on deck to help test and get the game ready. It launches but includes a massive Day 1 patch.

- Nintendo realizes testing will take too much time, but they still want Zelda to release in a favorable window. Nintendo doesn't believe that window is Summer (plenty of evidence on that). So they spend the rest of the year thoroughly testing the game, then release it at the best window possible, sacrificing Wii U sales but maximizing Switch sales potential.
(END TOTAL FANTASY SPECULATION ZONE)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 14, 2016, 10:08:59 PM
This news further enrages this Wii U owner, seeing as my Wii U will likely be sitting and collecting dust until then. While I certainly want the product to run as smoothly and have as few glitches as possible, if Nintendo waits until holiday next year to release this game I will lose my fucking mind.

...I will not be buying a Switch in the meantime.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 14, 2016, 10:10:40 PM
Breath of the Wild was supposed to come out last year. They should just stop delaying it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 14, 2016, 10:11:38 PM
Oooooooooooh What if they cancelled the Wii U version?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 14, 2016, 10:26:16 PM
That would kill a lot of good will for the Switch, which will 100% have shortages in to the holiday.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 14, 2016, 10:36:02 PM
Oooooooooooh What if they cancelled the Wii U version?


I think it's too late in the game to do that.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 14, 2016, 10:53:40 PM
If it's delayed out of March, I can't seem them wanting to maintain a retail presence for WiiU stuff at all, especially not with enhanced ports rumored to be larding up the Switch slate.

So if there is a delay, I'd expect BotW WiiU to be digital only, or one of those Gamestop-preorder only jobs.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 14, 2016, 11:16:28 PM
At my Wal-mart there is a single wii u third party game in the cabinet.

NES classic has better third party support than Wii U
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on November 15, 2016, 12:15:54 AM
I think if Zelda is as polished as Nintendo wants it to be by summer 2017, it's coming out in summer 2017. Mario Kart 8 and Splatoon have proven that a release during that time of the year doesn't necessarily preclude a game from selling well or moving hardware units (relatively speaking), and Zelda had a lot of hype surrounding it during E3 2016 from a lot of the people that Nintendo is trying to win back with Switch. If all goes well and Nintendo has a strong first six months with the console, it shouldn't matter which big series they slot into the Holiday 2017 spot; ideally, they'll already have a lot of momentum going into that part of the year.

Mario Kart and Splatoon being ready by summer isn't a given either. We're all assuming that they're enhanced ports or heavily leveraging their Wii U counterparts so they should be ready for release by then, but that might not end up being the case (even if it does seem like the likely scenario). On the flip side, I guess there is that rumour from Laura Kate Dale that the Smash 4 port is planned to be ready within the first six months, so that might be an alternative.

All of this is, of course, assuming Zelda doesn't come out in March 2017 (which this rumour doesn't totally rule out).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 15, 2016, 01:07:20 AM
Question: do you guys consider May a part of Summer? Because you guys keep saying Summer and all I think about is June/July/August and those are mostly barren months for Nintendo. Maybe it's just a difference in location.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 15, 2016, 01:23:51 AM
I consider March April May to be Spring and June July August to be Summer.

And we have no idea what games are coming out launch year or how far along the games are, and Nintendo is infamous for showing games early to hype a system then the games get delayed. 

I am just assuming that because Nintendo highlighted 4 Nintendo properties that those games could all be ready for year one.

You know what if the Nintendo Franchise Retro Studios got next is Mario Kart, and they are the ones making Mario Kart Switch?  That would get me VERY excited for a new Mario Kart, and it could explain why it would be close to finished...and we know Retro Studios has already contributed to a Mario Kart game.  Hmmm....

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 15, 2016, 12:04:11 PM
Add Eurogamer to the chorus of voices saying Mario Switch will be ready at launch.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-11-15-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-will-miss-nintendo-switch-launch

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on November 15, 2016, 12:11:54 PM
You know what if the Nintendo Franchise Retro Studios got next is Mario Kart, and they are the ones making Mario Kart Switch?  That would get me VERY excited for a new Mario Kart, and it could explain why it would be close to finished...and we know Retro Studios has already contributed to a Mario Kart game.  Hmmm....

Nintendo already has a dedicated Mario Kart team at EAD that has development of Mario Kart's down to a science to them.  Retro just worked on the assests for the Retro stages in Mario Kart 7 but the main development was still EAD.  If Nintendo wanted Retro to work on a racing game their skills would be better used working on something like F-Zero or a new IP then giving them something one of Nintendo's main EAD studio's already excels at doing.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 15, 2016, 12:48:07 PM
Oooooooooooh What if they cancelled the Wii U version?
So if there is a delay, I'd expect BotW WiiU to be digital only, or one of those Gamestop-preorder only jobs.
You guys are merciless in your attempts to grind my gears.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on November 15, 2016, 03:09:19 PM
Question: do you guys consider May a part of Summer? Because you guys keep saying Summer and all I think about is June/July/August and those are mostly barren months for Nintendo. Maybe it's just a difference in location.

Nintendo is already moving away from its typical release pattern by launching a home console in March. Whether it's Zelda or something else, they can't let months three, four, and five after their new home console's launch go by without a big first party release. There's going to have to be something big in those typically sparse months.

Add Eurogamer to the chorus of voices saying Mario Switch will be ready at launch.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-11-15-zelda-breath-of-the-wild-will-miss-nintendo-switch-launch

Well that's three voices with a pretty good track record on Switch rumours saying Zelda will likely miss March now. Personally, I'd be fine with 3D Mario at launch and Zelda getting pushed as far back as the holidays if that's how much time it needs to be as amazing as we think it's going to be. I'd obviously like to play it sooner rather than later, but if Nintendo can bridge the gap from Mario to Zelda with other good games, I can wait.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 15, 2016, 04:16:54 PM
Moving Zelda would probably kibosh the Wii U version.  If it still gets released then I figure that would end up being quite a collectable.

I'm not planning on buying a Switch any time soon and I really want Zelda on the Wii U so I would be pretty mad if it got cancelled.  But what would I be able to do to express my anger?  I still want the game so if I refused to buy a Switch in protest then I deny myself the very thing I want.  Nintendo probably knows that.  We'll grumble but any Wii U owner that is really wanting to play BotW is going to get the game no matter what, even if they have to buy a new system to get it.

But if Zelda isn't available at launch then they better have that Mario game or something big.  The Switch isn't going to do well with a limp launch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 15, 2016, 06:26:26 PM
If Zelda isn't coming out at launch then it needs to perpetuate the strength of the launch cycle. What is really important is what Nintendo has planned for the rest of the launch period, which will likely "stress" the importance of localizing Zelda. For example, Nintendo has shown us that we can expect games like the fabled 3D Mario, Mario Kart, and Splat2n close to the Switch launch, and that's not even taking in the third party titles that could potentially be coming afterwards. However, I will agree that Zelda feels like a holiday title, and that both Mario Kart 8 and the original Splatoon launched prior to Summer. If Nintendo has the Switch versions of these games targeted around these same time periods, then that leaves a big Holiday spot open, unless they haven't revealed something they are planning to drop. However, Mario Kart 7 was released in December, so Mario Kart Switch could definitely fill that spot.

With many developers seemingly lacking access to Switch kits, I imagine a select few games will be targeted for the release window, among them being some poor-performance version of Skyrim, EA's "big title", a Dragon Quest or maybe even the first episode of Final Fantasy VII, and whatever Image and Form has cooked up- or maybe not, seeing as their development cycles are pretty long. With Nintendo's own releases being impressive powerhouses in their own right, I wonder where Zelda necessarily has to fit in the Switch's first year. Who knows, maybe it will slip into 2018.

As a burned Wii U owner and Switch skeptic, Zelda's slipping date is obviously aggravating, but it does pose an interesting question, one that I don't believe we have never faced- what happens to a "dual release" title if it's not being released close to the second console's launch? Does the previous version get screwed over? If the Switch fails miserably after its initial launch, does a dual release make sense in order to optimize sales? While these questions exist, the truth is, we have seen Breath of the Wild running on Wii U only, and so, I don't think they'll shelf its release. The more I think about it, it definitely makes sense to go digital, so that they can encourage a digital transfer to Switch when the sales begin to disappoint and the Wii U is dropped completely.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 15, 2016, 07:42:28 PM
Nintendo has probably spent way too much money on the development of the Wii U version to cancel it so late in the game. I imagine the pre-order numbers will be enough to keep Nintendo from cancelling it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 16, 2016, 05:56:25 AM
Given the number of times Miyamoto has upended the tea table, I'm not convinced Nintendo is overly concerned with sunk cost, and in this case, particularly considering it's still releasing another version that's a lot more important to the company moving forward. Nintendo wouldn't be losing that much. Even though the Switch version will inevitably sell better, I think it's better for Nintendo to cancel the Wii U version anyway. Any Wii U owners upset by Nintendo cancelling that version will ultimately buy it on Switch regardless of all of their online vitriol and posturing of boycotts.

Still, Nintendo wants to honor the promise of releasing Breath of the Wild on Wii U which is admirable if misguided. Reassign anyone working on the Wii U version to the Switch version (or a different project) and get the game out. The damage has been done. The problem wouldn't be that the Wii U version got cancelled but that Wii U bombed and forced Nintendo to regroup with a new platform. Nintendo's goal should be focusing on releasing the best new console it can, not keeping an old platform riddled with issues on life support for a subset of fans who would forgive the company so long as it proved that it learned from past mistakes. Getting a big title like Breath of the Wild out sooner rather than later is a good start.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 16, 2016, 10:11:30 AM
Something that I didn't take into account in my earlier fantasizing is that if bug testing is what's left to get the game out, then it might not be something that gets fixed by just throwing more people into the project. With every day that passes I do think Zelda will be delayed. I also think the Wii U version is more a good-will gesture to the people who stuck by the system and will not immediately gravitate to the Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on November 16, 2016, 01:56:50 PM
More rumours on the launch lineup of games from Emily Rogers and Laura Kate Dale. To summarize:

Mario Switch (launch title):

- Open 3D hub world from which different worlds can be selected; multiple objectives in each world.
- More like Super Mario Galaxy and 64 than 3D World (less linearity in the level design).
- Multiplayer will be a co-op version of the main game with a "tether" to keep players from going too far apart (in game).

Splatoon Switch (launch title):

- Nintendo is currently planning to bundle it with the more expensive Switch SKU.
- New 1 vs. 1 mode between two people on different Switch units where weapons can be changed anytime during the match.
- More single player content.
- Will receive regular updates like Wii U version.

The Elders Scroll V: Skyrim (launch title):

- Will mirror the remastered version of the game.
- Will allow mods at some point post-launch (limited to mods using existing in-game assets, however).

Mario Kart Switch (within first three months):

- Development is complete.
- All previous Wii U content included (including DLC).
- Switch version will get new tracks, playable characters, and a new and improved battle mode.

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/11/report-mario-skyrim-switch-at-launch-splatoon-pack-in-no-march-wii-u-zelda/ (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/11/report-mario-skyrim-switch-at-launch-splatoon-pack-in-no-march-wii-u-zelda/)

https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/11/16/rumor-mario-kart-for-switch-brings-a-mix-of-old-and-new/ (https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/11/16/rumor-mario-kart-for-switch-brings-a-mix-of-old-and-new/)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 16, 2016, 02:24:00 PM
The Elders Scroll V: Skyrim (launch title):
- Will allow mods at some point post-launch (limited to mods using existing in-game assets, however).


I will believe it when I see it.


Also, I think Splatoon would benefit from an Overwatch-style playlist, where the game will randomly shuffle between different maps and game modes.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 16, 2016, 02:34:09 PM
The Elders Scroll V: Skyrim (launch title):
- Will allow mods at some point post-launch (limited to mods using existing in-game assets, however).


I will believe it when I see it.


Also, I think Splatoon would benefit from an Overwatch-style playlist, where the game will randomly shuffle between different maps and game modes.


It's sounding a lot more plausible, though. I was having serious doubts about Skyrim even being released for the Switch after Bethesda became non-committal, but considering how much Nintendo highlighted the game in the reveal trailer and now what Laura Dale is reporting I am more inclined to believe it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 16, 2016, 03:30:05 PM
I would be very happy if Splatoon was the pack in game.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 16, 2016, 04:02:54 PM
I would be too, especially as it would mean that Nintendo is highlighting the online community aspect that the game brings. I would also like to think that this would maybe open the doors to perhaps EA testing the platform with the latest Battlefield game (the big game they might be bringing to Switch).


UPDATE: Not that I'm getting excited for the Switch... the potential could be there though...
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 16, 2016, 05:13:30 PM
A Mario+Splatoon launch doesn't seem bad at all to me. Mario would deliver the big name, mass market appeal while Splatoon would provide a fresher, multiplayer-focused, newer IP alternative. Both are great franchises.

Meanwhile, Zelda being delayed would leave room for Skyrim or other third-party games (hopefully new ones, not just remakes of years-old franchises) to grab some attention in the hardcore mindspace. I don't think Nintendo can rely on third-parties to carry a launch, but if Mario is the launch flagship that assuages my concerns.

Meanwhile, Mario Kart can release just about anytime and do well, plus sell continuously over the entire system's life. They can afford to make that game wait its turn and plug maybe a summer or holiday hole in their lineup.

With those four tentpole 1st party questions answered, one wonders though about the Switch efforts for Smash and Super Mario Maker. Of course, maybe the Super Mario Maker effort got canned or transformed into something else. There has been speculation that Smash might also show up in year one though...
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 16, 2016, 06:27:25 PM
What the hell? Super Mario Galaxy has a ridiculous amount of linearity.

Anyway, I see Mario Kart Switch being released as soon as possible- get those evergreen sales started as soon as possible. Surprised by Skyrim, but honestly, who cares? Even with mods, that game will have existed for... 7 years now? Even with improvements, its no bombshell. It speaks more towards the processing power of the Switch, but still.

Splat2n is the only thing about this list that excites me, because it's the most fun thing on this list. Otherwise, a return to the Galaxy formula is the last thing I want from 3D Mario after 3D World was finally a good show.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on November 16, 2016, 07:23:32 PM
Anything more than $300 would be a bad idea, at least for NA. I know we don't know the specs yet, but it seems very unlikely the Switch will even match the power of the XBONE, let alone PS4, never mind the beefed-up versions releasing soon. Therefore, I think the system will be a hard sell as is, so it certainly can't cost more than the more powerful ones. And Switch will be compared to these two due to being part home console.

It's funny to see people hoping that third-parties don't release ports of old games, because that's exactly what I'm hoping Nintendo aren't planning. Please, no ports! (aside from Zelda)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 16, 2016, 07:36:20 PM
What the hell? Super Mario Galaxy has a ridiculous amount of linearity.

Splat2n is the only thing about this list that excites me, because it's the most fun thing on this list. Otherwise, a return to the Galaxy formula is the last thing I want from 3D Mario after 3D World was finally a good show.

Well, we do have that micro-clip from the reveal trailer, which looks to me like a blend of 3D World obstacle course gameplay with a bit of the older style framing it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 16, 2016, 07:57:25 PM
Man, That launch lineup sounds good.

I just hope the Mario game is more Super Mario 64 and less Galaxy.  I really want a game where you run around freely in the levels and can find Stars out of order by exploring.  I LOVED, LOVED that about Mario 64.  Sure it wasn't every Star, because sometimes the game needed to set the world for special situations to earn Stars, but if you could figure out how to find stars you could get them early. 

Super Mario 64 is still the BEST designed 3D platformer of the Gamecube/Nintendo 64 era games. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 17, 2016, 12:23:57 AM
It's funny to see people hoping that third-parties don't release ports of old games, because that's exactly what I'm hoping Nintendo aren't planning. Please, no ports! (aside from Zelda)


Yeah, it's funny... for a platform that just straight up needs quality games. I think remasters of older games are a great start. Now you can play it away from home! Isn't that what we wanted?? Basically XB1 on the go??


Personally, I'm hoping for Mario Sunshine HD. I'll take it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on November 17, 2016, 12:40:29 AM
Man, That launch lineup sounds good.

I just hope the Mario game is more Super Mario 64 and less Galaxy.  I really want a game where you run around freely in the levels and can find Stars out of order by exploring.  I LOVED, LOVED that about Mario 64.  Sure it wasn't every Star, because sometimes the game needed to set the world for special situations to earn Stars, but if you could figure out how to find stars you could get them early. 

Super Mario 64 is still the BEST designed 3D platformer of the Gamecube/Nintendo 64 era games. 

Well the few second of footage we saw is channeling Mario 64 pretty heavily and I'm sure that was intentional on Nintendo's part.  The first thing we see is some kind of Mexican village with NPC, which as the first thing Nintendo showed point to me they've trying to tell people this Mario will be more exploration based.  We also see a spinning heart in the next section of the trailer, which is pretty telling since the spinning heart was only used in Mario 64 as well.

I mean they could have easily just shown Mario jumping on goomba's or running around any generic Mario environment but the fact they choose to show a village that screams exploration and a callback to Mario 64 with the spinning heart to me says that's the kind of Mario game this will be closest to.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 17, 2016, 12:48:07 AM
I think there's an added emphasis on Wii U ports because that's the only thing we know right now. Come January, we'll start to know what new games Nintendo has in store for the system.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 17, 2016, 01:27:50 AM
http://venturebeat.com/2016/11/16/nvidia-porting-ps4-xbox-one-and-pc-games-to-nintendo-switch-is-simple/

Nvidia is definitely enthusiastic.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: sudoshuff on November 17, 2016, 07:34:41 AM
...but the fact they choose to show a village that screams exploration and a callback to Mario 64 with the spinning heart to me says that's the kind of Mario game this will be closest to.


Boy, I hope that's true.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 17, 2016, 04:30:58 PM
I want a 3D Mario with stages based on the Mario Kart tracks that aren't based on Mario stages (e.g. Music Park, Dragon Driftway)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 17, 2016, 06:43:49 PM
I want a 3D Mario with stages based on the Mario Kart tracks that aren't based on Mario stages (e.g. Music Park, Dragon Driftway)

I like this idea.  I really liked how Mario 64 the levels were like mini 3D playgrounds to explore and just have fun in.  If Nintendo took your idea and the Mario 64 formula you could have a lot of fun abstract levels.  Heck, I would keep with the painting theme from Mario 64, and just have players jump into paintings, and the painting might change the texture work.  Really have fun with level design.  They don't even have to be HUGE levels, just something. 

Then Nintendo could do the whole 120 Star thing again, and if you get them...they unlock HD versions of Super Mario 64 same levels but new Stars.  Maybe not all the stars either...maybe 3 per level.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 17, 2016, 06:50:06 PM
I want a 3D Mario with stages based on the Mario Kart tracks that aren't based on Mario stages (e.g. Music Park, Dragon Driftway)

I like this idea.  I really liked how Mario 64 the levels were like mini 3D playgrounds to explore and just have fun in.  If Nintendo took your idea and the Mario 64 formula you could have a lot of fun abstract levels.  Heck, I would keep with the painting theme from Mario 64, and just have players jump into paintings, and the painting might change the texture work.  Really have fun with level design.  They don't even have to be HUGE levels, just something. 

Then Nintendo could do the whole 120 Star thing again, and if you get them...they unlock HD versions of Super Mario 64 same levels but new Stars.  Maybe not all the stars either...maybe 3 per level.

Ooh, I like this thinking.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 17, 2016, 07:33:06 PM
I want a 3D Mario with stages based on the Mario Kart tracks that aren't based on Mario stages (e.g. Music Park, Dragon Driftway)

I think we're getting something like this. The Latin-themed village in the trailer is a good indication. If the NSMB games taught Nintendo anything by the end, I hope it's that Mario needs to push out the aesthetic range of expression after basically stalling post Sunshine tropical theme. Different world world cultures is a good potential hook. Tropical Freeze also deployed this well in a few worlds.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 17, 2016, 07:34:20 PM
Emily Rogers teased more Eurogamer rumors coming tomorrow.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on November 18, 2016, 07:07:35 AM
Yep. Pokémon Sun and Moon's 3rd version to be Switch exclusive? (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-11-18-nintendo-switch-will-get-pokemon-sun-and-moon-version)

Nintendo, you shouldn't have hired additional ninjas this year.

Companion LPVG rumor: Mario / Rabbids crossover RPG on Switch launch day. (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/11/report-ubisoft-developing-rabbids-mario-crossover-rpg-for-switch-launch-day/)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 18, 2016, 11:10:05 AM
Why are Rabbids still even a thing?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on November 18, 2016, 12:10:06 PM
Why are Rabbids still even a thing?


Probably for the same reason Minions are a thing.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 18, 2016, 12:45:22 PM
Isn't there a fairly well-regarded Rabbids cartoon show on the air? I think I saw Brad Neely say that it was one of the better all ages animated series around.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 18, 2016, 01:38:11 PM
I have never played a Rabbids games in my life.  With any Mario crossover the references would go right over my head.

Here's a hint Nintendo: The Nintendo/Square team-up in Super Mario RPG was a dream crossover.  The only people who care about any Ubisoft/Nintendo crossovers work for those companies.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on November 18, 2016, 01:53:21 PM
I have never played a Rabbids games in my life.  With any Mario crossover the references would go right over my head.

Here's a hint Nintendo: The Nintendo/Square team-up in Super Mario RPG was a dream crossover.  The only people who care about any Ubisoft/Nintendo crossovers work for those companies.


I mean, in an ideal world, if Nintendo/Ubisoft HAD to do a mario crossover, it would at least be Rayman.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Phil on November 18, 2016, 02:48:35 PM
I have never played a Rabbids games in my life.  With any Mario crossover the references would go right over my head.

Here's a hint Nintendo: The Nintendo/Square team-up in Super Mario RPG was a dream crossover.  The only people who care about any Ubisoft/Nintendo crossovers work for those companies.

I highly recommend Rabbids Go Home for the Wii, if you're open to a Rabbids game, Ian. It's a 3D action-platformer where you're Rabbids in a shopping cart.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on November 18, 2016, 03:01:28 PM
I have never played a Rabbids games in my life.  With any Mario crossover the references would go right over my head.

Here's a hint Nintendo: The Nintendo/Square team-up in Super Mario RPG was a dream crossover.  The only people who care about any Ubisoft/Nintendo crossovers work for those companies.

Most of these crossovers are the result of the third party approaching Nintendo.  Right now Nintendo needs all the games they can get for the Switch especially after how barren the Wii U's retail lineup was.  If Ubisoft is willing to make an RPG crossover with Mario, then why should Nintendo have a problem since it's a free game for them?  Hell, maybe someone at Ubisoft saw the negative reaction from Paper Mario fans for what Nintendo has done with that series and got the idea to pitch a turn-based RPG Mario to Nintendo to try and appeal to the bitter Paper Mario fans and they made such a good case Nintendo agreed.

Plus it could also be part of a deal for other games.  Maybe the Beyond Good and Evil 2 rumors about the game being exclusive to the Switch are true and Ubisoft getting to make some kind of Mario crossover was part of the deal in order for Nintendo to have the game as an exclusive.  Sega got to make the Mario/Sonic at the Olympics games because Nintendo wanted Sonic for Smash Bros Brawl.  Sega demanded they get to make a Mario and Sonic crossover in return but Nintendo wasn't going to let Sega mess with any of the main Mario series, so they settled on some Olympic sports game.  Could very well be a similar situation.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 18, 2016, 09:18:28 PM
I have ZERO problems with this new rumor of a Rabbids Mario crossover, especially since it's an RPG. Much better than a Rabbids Mario crossover party game!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 18, 2016, 10:17:02 PM
I have never played a Rabbids games in my life.  With any Mario crossover the references would go right over my head.

Here's a hint Nintendo: The Nintendo/Square team-up in Super Mario RPG was a dream crossover.  The only people who care about any Ubisoft/Nintendo crossovers work for those companies.


The way I choose to look at it, Nintendo is giving Ubisoft a reason to develop and release a game during the NS launch window. Whereas Ubisoft might be more tentative about dedicating its resources to the Switch, this deal should guarantee them some profit, and I'm sure the handling of this license comes with an agreement that certain other titles be released in a timely manner. I just can't imagine Nintendo freely giving something like this without expecting something else in return, right?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 18, 2016, 10:43:40 PM
Plus it could also be part of a deal for other games.  Maybe the Beyond Good and Evil 2 rumors about the game being exclusive to the Switch are true and Ubisoft getting to make some kind of Mario crossover was part of the deal in order for Nintendo to have the game as an exclusive. 


I can totally see this being the case. Ubisoft knows having Mario will help sell Rabbids, which have really declined as a IP for them.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 19, 2016, 01:48:16 AM
Mario is always chasing after rabbits. The rabbids appeal to me because they are essentially the same as Gremlins. I never played a Rabbids game, but they looked like fun.

I was disappointed when Killer Freaks from outer space became Zombi U.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 19, 2016, 01:36:15 PM
I'm all for this crossover if it somehow involves Nintendo helping Ubisoft stave off a Vivendi takeover.

Also, Rayman as a secret optional party member.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 19, 2016, 05:10:44 PM
I mean, in an ideal world, if Nintendo/Ubisoft HAD to do a mario crossover, it would at least be Rayman.

well, Rabbids is a Rayman spin-off.
And since Ubisoft it supposedly making it, there always a chance Rayman is in it somewhere.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 20, 2016, 06:39:02 PM
another Laura Dale rumor

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cxs0XohXcAQypsX.jpg:large)

**not the complete line-up
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 20, 2016, 07:11:34 PM
I'd probably buy enhanced Switch ports of all first party and exclusive titles. It's probably a waste of money even if I get the ports on sale. I'll always remember Wii U fondly, but I have limited TV stand space. Wii U will be a fun collector's item.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 20, 2016, 08:33:57 PM
I know there's no way that's the complete lineup but 5 ports of Wii U games in the first 6 months is overkill and makes me want to buy the console at launch less than before. I need to see new games and those new games need to be sprinkled in with ports of old stuff.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 20, 2016, 08:37:02 PM
Ports are not good, though I understand Nintendo wants to get more money for the investment on some great games that might not have been bought because the Wii U did so poorly. 

However, enhanced ports with 2 more cups in Mario Kart...or 2 new characters in Smash Bros.  Or Splatoon with new weapons, levels, modes of play, that would be fine.  The important thing is to make it valuable for the loyal customer. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 20, 2016, 10:19:06 PM
Mario, Smash, MarioKart, a giant RPG, and Zelda in one year? Hell yeah.

Pokemon and Pikmin next year? Hell yeah.

All I need now is Metroid.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 20, 2016, 10:42:23 PM
Ports aren't necessarily good for people who already own those games, but they're good for the vast majority of gamers who do not own a Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 20, 2016, 10:43:40 PM
Ports are the reality of every system's early life. There are still some decent exclusives and original titles. It's good for Nintendo to get the ports out sooner rather than later. Consumers get some of the best of Wii U's lineup on a more promising platform. Nintendo is essentially telling people not to even bother trying to find Wii U on the cheap. Skip it and get the better versions on Switch. That's a really smart move even if a fraction of Wii U owners will refuse to buy the ports outright.

The key is to not treat them as brand new games. They should be $50 or less and feature some marketing label that admits they're ports without drawing attention to the fact that they were Wii U games. "Remastered" isn't bad per se, just a little cliche. Maybe something like "Switch Essentials," "Enhanced for Nintendo Switch," or "Better on Switch."

Nintendo's entire back catalog up to Wii should be on Virtual Console within a year, if not sooner. It's entire Wii U output should be ported within two years between new titles. Splatoon, Mario Kart 8, Super Smash Bros. for Wii U Switch, and Super Mario Maker should be the priority as launch or launch window ports. The rest should pad the release schedule for those first two years.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 20, 2016, 10:50:24 PM
How about Switch'd Up.

Mario Kart 8 Switch'd Up
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 20, 2016, 11:07:07 PM
The port strategy is a bit of a gamble. Theoretically it's good to give the games some extra polish/content while putting them in front of a new audience. But during the launch window how many Switches are going to sell to people fresh or returned to a Nintendo platform? You have to assume that the ~13 million WiiU owners are the hardest of Nintendo's core, and the most likely early adopters, and to them (I would include myself here), even souped-up ports of the likes of Mario Kart and Smash Bros. might not do much for them given how much time was likely put into the alpha forms.

If the Switch takes off like a rocket then this is basically moot, but if it tracks between WiiU and Gamecube, it'll be something of an oatmeal first few years for the Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 20, 2016, 11:15:46 PM
If Nintendo has proven anything, it's that Nintendo fans will rebuy games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on November 20, 2016, 11:19:17 PM
Re-releases  seem to be pretty popular with this gen. I think the key will be if re-releases are the majority of the big games, or if there is a healthy sprinkling of new games and third party games high profile games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 21, 2016, 12:26:09 AM
There may be a significant representation of ports on that list, but they're mostly ports of franchises that can have a real strong evergreen effect across a system's entire lifespan: Mario Kart, Smash, Pokemon, Splatoon.

I've always like the idea of getting these types of games out early in a system's lifespan because they're just the sorts of titles that are instantly essential, so every new Switch owner ever will probably give these titles serious consideration as to whether to buy or rebuy them.

Additionally, I'm hoping that not having to worry so hard about delivering a "Mario Kart" franchise on the system means that Nintendo's dev teams can move onto new and different and compelling things sooner rather than later.

Plus these are simply just strong names to have at the ready when going out to market the switch.

Now while I'd be less than enthused seeing a lineup of ports on a new console, that list also shows a new Mario, a new Zelda, and a new Pikmin. That's exciting to me no matter which way I slice it. Plus I'm hoping that the third party offerings, slim though they are guaranteed to be on a Nintendo system, are compelling. I've never played Skyrim, I'm definitely game for a Mario Rabbids RPG, I'm decided on Just Dance 2017, sounds like I'm going to get a Basketball game... and is that a Telltale game I see?

I'm starting to worry that if Year one is this awesome, year two can't be anything but disappointment. Maybe Switch year 2 will actually get some original IP from Nintendo First Party?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 21, 2016, 12:54:11 AM
Everyone is saying the same thing, but basically...if the port is good and adds some value to the product then it will be good for both new players and Nintendo fans.  I also agree if you are going to do the port thing do it the first year, only where it will be hard to have enough games for your system out the first year anyway.  Price them at around $40.00 and include all DLC content if available, and if possible add one or two new features.  So for starters.

Super Mario Kart 8:  I thought adding a new cup would be good...but perhaps that is too much work.  Then how about adding a new racer, and perhaps tweaking the battle mode to make it better...or include a new battle mode the rips off Rocket League.  Sweet bonus that could re-sell the game easy. 

Smash Bros:  Add a few more Redone Retro levels could be easily done.  Add all the exclusive content from the 3DS version and Wii U version into one package, then add Ice Climbers.  That is easily a package worth paying for. 

Splatoon:  More weapons, more customization.  New play modes like 4 team battle royals or 1 on 1 battles and add new single player content...and of course a year of free new content like levels and such. 

Super Mario Maker Port:  Add Slopes, and perhaps Character exclusive power ups like Fire Flower allowing Link to Shoot his arrows.  (Think Super Mario Bros Crossover...but official)  Also add more enemies, and add a new feature of boss rooms. 

I think Nintendo could really have something special with the Switch and the Wii U ports if they are careful.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 21, 2016, 01:04:13 AM
Well that's the thing, yes, evergreen titles are good off the bat, but this presumes a fresh audience for these titles plus enough credulous WiiU owners to double dip. That's where I'm a little skeptical. Personally, I'm not going to spend even $40 on Mario Kart 8.5. I'd probably spend another $15 on four more cups, a la the DLC, but I don't think there's going to be any upgrade option or discount or whatever. Same for Smash Bros. and XBX (though that one's a little different). I can wait for full sequels.

The cumulative effect here is making me question whether I need the console in the first year, especially if Animal Crossing and Pokemon Eclipse are the big holiday games. New Zelda, Mario, and Pikmin will stay good. I'm an early WiiU adopter, so I worry about feedback cycles here.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 21, 2016, 01:09:16 AM
I have no problem with the ports of
Smash and Mario Kart. They are our madden. They really are. All I want is an updated roster every couple of years, and some neat new levels/tracks. Splatoon could easily be one of those games in the future.

However, Switch could benefit from ports of Wii U games. People didn't buy the Wii U , but could easily buy the Switch instead. They can collect a whole library of games they missed. I never got Xenoblade, and would not mind getting an upgraded version.

It would be really nice if you had the wii u version if you could register it and download it for switch though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 21, 2016, 05:55:11 AM
5 ports of Wii U games in the first 6 months is overkill and makes me want to buy the console at launch less than before. I need to see new games and those new games need to be sprinkled in with ports of old stuff.
The cumulative effect here is making me question whether I need the console in the first year
Nintendo is probably okay with this if it means convincing everyone else that Switch is a fresh start for the company and the new platform is viable. Neither of you are saying you don't want Switch. Rather, you may not want it right away which is a completely reasonable and justifiable position. That's an important distinction because the other side decided Wii U was not worth their time or money. And it doesn't mean Nintendo is turning its backs on Wii U owners, particularly early adopters. It means Nintendo understands that a platform can't succeed with 13 million units sold.

Lack of content was one of the main reason Wii U faltered its two years. If Nintendo can use what probably comes out to three actual years of Wii U content to prop up Switch and make it appealing to people who dismissed the platform those games originally released on, it will already do better on Switch than it did on Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 21, 2016, 09:59:19 AM
My line of thinking is mostly predicated on the fact that we won't know anything new until January 12, and that the current rumor trend of ports was in part pushed by the games we saw in the Switch trailer. Part of the reason I was ok with the Wii U's extreme software drought this year was because I assumed (and still do) that Nintendo is bringing new experiences and new games to Switch, not also devoting time and resources to games I have already played and moved on from.

Because who am I kidding? I'll buy a Switch at launch, and I'll probably buy a lot of these "remastered ports". But I'm not going to play 150 hours of a "remastered" Splatoon like I did with the original on Wii U. Ditto with Mario Maker and Smash Bros. If these games don't bring any new, substantial elements that switch up(sorry) the gameplay a bit then it just isn't worth a lot of my time. I get the "it's new to me" element it will bring to people who weren't Wii U owners. That's just not the case for me.

The only port on the list that interested me was the Xenoblade port, in part because I know the game will get a noticeable bump in graphics and performance on the new hardware.. But I probably won't be able to carry over my save file so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 21, 2016, 01:10:09 PM
Nintendo is probably okay with this if it means convincing everyone else that Switch is a fresh start for the company and the new platform is viable. Neither of you are saying you don't want Switch. Rather, you may not want it right away which is a completely reasonable and justifiable position. That's an important distinction because the other side decided Wii U was not worth their time or money. And it doesn't mean Nintendo is turning its backs on Wii U owners, particularly early adopters. It means Nintendo understands that a platform can't succeed with 13 million units sold.

Lack of content was one of the main reason Wii U faltered its two years. If Nintendo can use what probably comes out to three actual years of Wii U content to prop up Switch and make it appealing to people who dismissed the platform those games originally released on, it will already do better on Switch than it did on Wii U.
Ah, yes. I completely understand this train of thought, and I support it fully.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 21, 2016, 01:48:19 PM
Nice straw man, Evan.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 21, 2016, 02:21:25 PM
I think Splatoon will be billed as a sequel.  All they have to do is add a few more online stages, remix some older ones, add a few new weapons, throw in the Octolings that were already planned (and workable based on that hacker?), and do another single player mode (which was a last-minute add in the first game, right?) and that would be good enough for a "2".  They were adding stuff to that game for a while after release, so I wouldn't be surprised if the team just kept working  and could everything they didn't add to the first enough for a sequel.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 21, 2016, 02:43:59 PM
Nice straw man, Evan.
Thanks! I finally figured out how to do it just right.

However, none of those points address the people that have wasted(?) the Wii U's life waiting for games and now want something new. And while not all 13 million Wii U owners feel that way, there's likely a sizable portion that does, but will begrudgingly buy these Switch ports because of the lack of backwards compatibility, or those that also feel that way, but will buy the ports willingly because of the "newness" of commercialism. I'm just seeing the Wii U and Switch situation much more transparently. Why buy one at launch when the system will arguably sell for the exact same price down the line with a much better and likely "Select-ified" library two or three years down the line? Why buy it at launch when I already own the games they're releasing for it (the answer is, they'll shut down the online services for the Wii U versions as further incentive to make you "Switch")? That's the situation I wasn't smart enough to see with Wii U and now I'm an embittered skeptic that hates video games. ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 21, 2016, 03:16:42 PM
Personally, I'm not enthused for ports, but that rumored year 1 with Mario, Zelda, and Pikmin from 1st Party is pretty solid to me as a Nintendo fan. And hope springs eternal for 3rd party gems.

I WILL say though, that I consider Mario Kart as not really changing much over the last series of games. And HECK, half of the stages in Mario Kart 8 were OLD stages. I'm not sure that Mario Kart 8 really delivered that much in mindblowingly new content anyways.

Also, I've been eagerly waiting for more Single Player content before jumping into Splatoon (My brother is the squidkid in the house). A robust single player mode, to me personally, is more than enough justification to buy a Splatoon Sequel/Port/Portquel/Sequort.

That said I'd probably sit out a Xenoblade port entirely, and put off buying a Mario Maker port for a lengthy amount of time. (Gotta find time to play NEW games you know!)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 21, 2016, 03:53:18 PM
So just to throw some more speculation into the air:

http://kotaku.com/two-nintendo-fan-games-removed-from-game-awards-nominee-1789223036

So why would Dorito Pope and the Game Awards bend over backwards to appease Nintendo (one of the sponsors this year) and damage their credibility as an awards show??

Call me crazy but maybe something Switch related gets teased at the Game Awards.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 21, 2016, 04:11:54 PM
I think if the Switch has too many ports it may create the narrative that the Switch is just a repackaged Wii U.  I get the desire to fill up the launch lineup and how most people didn't play these games but the systems needs enough unique content to provide value for Wii U owners and newcomers alike.  Ports of titles like Mario Kart and SSB would be really odd as the expectation is for a new entry of those series per generation.  So if the Switch gets a port does it get a new Mario Kart and SSB as well at some point or do the ports "count" as that generation's entry?

And of course if the Wii U library was such a system seller then the Switch wouldn't exist and we would be talking about upcoming Wii U releases.  So we get a 3D Mario and a bunch of Wii U ports?  Those games didn't sell Wii U's when they were new.  The Gamecube suggests that 3D Mario in a vacuum doesn't move systems.  Nintendo's familiar franchises tend to sell huge on a system like the Wii where a large userbase is sold on the console by something else but don't tend to move systems on their own.  If Mario was a killer app these days then the Gamecube and the Wii U would have sold gangbusters.  The general public is perfectly content to get their gaming on without Mario.

Zelda sounds like a potential system seller (even though it isn't exclusive... maybe) because it's changing up the formula and comes across as ambitious.  Nothing else seems like it would attract much attention beyond the Nintendo fanbase that were a certain sale anyway.  Based on the rumours the Switch's concept seems like it's best selling point.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 21, 2016, 06:13:47 PM
I take your point, Adrock, and I hope that's how it shakes out.

But I also have the Iansane fear tendrils about how a port-laden Switch launch period could encourage a certain narrative among the gaming press/commentariat that could smother the system in the crib. But I suppose those folks were hard sells anyway, and they're hoping for a fresh blue ocean infusion. Bless their hearts, I hope it works!

But to follow up to an above point, it sounds like they should really try to rebrand the hell out of the WiiU games and not emphasize at all that they're not "fresh". As was mentioned, they could slap the word Switch on everything, but it might be worth it to go so far as to just flat out call things Splatoon 2, MarioKart 9, and so forth, where possible. Might piss a few people off, but most Nintendo hands will know the score.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on November 21, 2016, 07:29:38 PM
Ports are what sold the PS4 and XBONE for a while, so I don't see why it can't work for Switch, as long as nothing else is screwed up.

Of course, that means I, myself, won't be interested in the Switch for a long time, but as an owner of both Wii U and 3DS, I'm used to disappointments and screwovers.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 21, 2016, 07:36:42 PM
Ports are what sold the PS4 and XBONE for a while, so I don't see why it can't work for Switch, as long as nothing else is screwed up.

Yeah, updates of older games is what helped my buy a PS3, let alone a PS4.  This wouldn't be a new trend, just new for Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 21, 2016, 08:27:06 PM
I'll play the hell out of a Ubisoft strategy RPG though. I loved the last one I played.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 21, 2016, 08:53:19 PM
I still hope that the ports rumor is just a bad rumor because of speculation.

We already know the Mario Kart footage was new.  It could be similar tracks, but some of the core gameplay could be different.  I would love for a more modern take on the Mario Kart 64 design...instead of the direction the series has been going. 

Also there has to be some "B-Sides tracks" for Mario Kart 8 and "B-sides" Stages not used in Smash Bros they can add.  As well as adding back in Ice Climbers...and perhaps Pokemon Trainer. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on November 21, 2016, 11:26:39 PM
I really doubt Mario Kart and Smash Bros are going to be ports or even just slightly enhanced.  These are evergreen titles that sell throughout the systems lifespans and both also sold pretty well on the Wii U already.  Both games are more then likely going to be labeled as new installments in their series with a shitload of new content over their Wii U counterparts.

Like I've said before, by the time the Switch is released it'll have been 3 years since the base game for Mario Kart 8 was released and 2 years since the last DLC.  If Smash Bros doesn't come out until closer to fall then it'll have been almost 3 years since it's base game was also released and over 1.5 years since it's last DLC.  This is plenty of time for the main teams add enough content to each to make what could be considered a full blown sequel.

The port rumors probably come from the fact both games are running off the exact engine as their predecessors and reusing a shitload of assets instead of being build from the ground up like Nintendo sequels usually are.  People have to remember someone like Emily Rogers said before E3, Breath of the Wild would contain the option to play as a female Link, something Aonuma joked about they thought at the very beginning of development but then decided "But what would Zelda do then?"  A lot of the time these rumors get based off of old information from sources who are no longer apart of the development team.  Mario Kart and Smash Bros could have easily start development as basic expansion packs, similar to how games like Ocarina of Time and Mario Galaxy 2 originally started as expansion packs from their predecessors as well before being turned into full blown sequels, build heavily off the assest of the previous to save development time, which is more then likely what Nintendo wants to do with both installments for the Switch so they can get them out as quickly as possible.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 22, 2016, 12:24:31 AM
Based off modified versions of the same engines? Is this a Majora's Mask situation then?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 22, 2016, 12:35:38 AM
If the original Engine is good and the models are already in HD, then perhaps modified texture work would be fine.

You know I always wanted Smash Bros to add one more attack button.  Kick, Punch, Special.  I know it kinda defeats the purpose of not being like normal fighting games, but I think it would make for more variety of attacks, and combos, and could be a really nice enhancement to the game...to make the sequel different.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 22, 2016, 01:46:24 AM
Hey, looky there, it only took me 10+ years, but I finally got a non-title!

Anyway, again, color me skeptical that the Switch Kart, Splatoon, and Smash entries are going to pass as full-fledged sequels. If anything I expect that they've spent their energy re-coding the engines/games to work with the new hardware architecture, and to set up a games-as-service platform for these franchises with the first new content packs included.

Which I'm not exactly wild about as an idea. Part of the fun of these franchises is seeing how they reconstitute between entries. Given that we've never seen more than one Smash or Kart per console (and that we're now merging the platforms), I'm nonplussed about potentially locking in point-five versions as the baseline from the get-go.

But we'll see! And alternatively, if my Nintendo account is worth anything and I can buy in to these franchises for a discount and continue accumulating content, I will probably be happy with the situation. Not holding my breath though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 22, 2016, 02:06:08 AM
Bethesda's Todd Howard on Switch: "One of the best demos I've ever seen", promises support.

http://www.glixel.com/interviews/skyrim-creator-todd-howard-talks-switch-vr-and-elder-scrolls-wait-w451761 (http://www.glixel.com/interviews/skyrim-creator-todd-howard-talks-switch-vr-and-elder-scrolls-wait-w451761)

Quote
What do you think of the Switch, Nintendo's newly announced console that is portable but also hooks up to your TV?

I love it. I got to play it. I will tell you – well, maybe that's an N.D.A. thing. One of the best demos I've ever seen. Probably the best demo I've ever seen. At E3.

Was it a Nintendo game?

I mean the device itself. I think it's really smart what they're doing. We're definitely going to be supporting it. It's the first time we've done something on Nintendo. If you don't count the old NES stuff. Home Alone. Or Where's Waldo?


Can you really bring Skyrim with you on the go?

It’s the same game on the TV and on the other screen.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 22, 2016, 02:16:38 AM
I don't understand where all this doubt on sequel from Mario Kart is coming from.  If we assume the actual game shown in the switch reveal is real then we already know that

1) No Mario Kart game has shown 2 items being held in the same manner as it was in the switch reveal, so that is a new mechanic.  In fact only Double Dash if I remember has allowed 2 items being held like that.

2)The Splatoon video showed new squid "hair styles" and gear so we know that game has added stuff as well. 

Nintendo learned one thing from Smash Brothers and Super Mario Kart, that is that people will pay for DLC if it is good DLC.  So I can see Nintendo wanting to get these games out early enough that it can offer DLC over the life of the product, since both Smash Bros and Mario Kart and even Splatoon has shown a strong evergreen status.  Basically, anything with strong Multiplayer focus can sell for longer periods of time and be popular.  Nintendo needs that Multiplayer edge and hook early on in the Switch life cycle.  So I can see Nintendo using current assets to make sequels...but they will be sequels, and there will be new content out of the box. 

Will it be a full priced sequel?  Perhaps, but then again perhaps not.  Nintendo could try to do the Microsoft Killer Instinct model.  And honestly, that could be a way to keep the game fresh.  Introduce a new level pack and new multiplayer mode every 6 months. 

There are so many different types of good ideas for racing game multiplayer games, that I am sure Nintendo could support something like this for 2 years.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on November 22, 2016, 02:44:30 AM
Hey, looky there, it only took me 10+ years, but I finally got a non-title!

Your profile says you registered in 2010. That's about 6 years. I'm tempted to change that title to Liar! You're welcome.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 22, 2016, 03:25:18 AM
Hey, looky there, it only took me 10+ years, but I finally got a non-title!

Your profile says you registered in 2010. That's about 6 years. I'm tempted to change that title to Liar! You're welcome.

Well, I've been around since the PlanetN2000 days, but had some off time between platform changes (and also got yelled off by Rick Powers at one point), but who's counting. Cheers!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 22, 2016, 06:14:11 AM
However, none of those points address the people that have wasted(?) the Wii U's life waiting for games and now want something new.
None of my points were supposed to. They were meant to explain how important it is for Nintendo to have enough content to attract people who dismissed Wii U and would be inclined to dismiss Switch if it's life starts similarly the way its predecessor did (e.g. immediate software drought).

Nintendo hasn't stopped making new games. You may be underestimating three things:

1. Ports don't require nearly the same development resources as a new games therefore those teams are either split or the port was handed off to a different team (e.g. Tantalus)
2. 3DS develop is also winding down. Despite what Nintendo keeps telling people, 3DS is likely getting phased out within a year.
3. Once that happens, Nintendo will be developing primarily for one platform with mobile taking up far fewer resources.

That said, if you want new games, you'll get plenty of them eventually. In the first year or so, you're just going to get a lot of last generation ports, but when was the last time that hasn't been true?
Quote
Why buy one at launch when the system will arguably sell for the exact same price down the line with a much better and likely "Select-ified" library two or three years down the line? Why buy it at launch when I already own the games they're releasing for it...
Exactly. You don't have to buy one at launch, and no one is making you. You don't have to begrudgingly do anything. Just don't buy one right away. If you do buy one at launch, that's on you which isn't an indictment. For the betterment of its new platform, Nintendo needs more than the people who are already planning on buying it.
And of course if the Wii U library was such a system seller then the Switch wouldn't exist and we would be talking about upcoming Wii U releases.
You'd have to change a lot of things about Wii U to reasonably make that point.
But I also have the Iansane fear tendrils about how a port-laden Switch launch period could encourage a certain narrative among the gaming press/commentariat that could smother the system in the crib.
Releasing a bunch of ports and padding the lineup is exactly what Sony and Microsoft did so if people give Nintendo **** over that, Nintendo is damned no matter what it does.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 22, 2016, 09:40:29 AM
Nintendo learned one thing from Smash Brothers and Super Mario Kart, that is that people will pay for DLC if it is good DLC.  So I can see Nintendo wanting to get these games out early enough that it can offer DLC over the life of the product, since both Smash Bros and Mario Kart and even Splatoon has shown a strong evergreen status.  Basically, anything with strong Multiplayer focus can sell for longer periods of time and be popular.  Nintendo needs that Multiplayer edge and hook early on in the Switch life cycle.  So I can see Nintendo using current assets to make sequels...but they will be sequels, and there will be new content out of the box. 


I don't like this particular line of thinking because it means none of those games get significant gameplay changes. And none of these games are perfect enough where a straight port with some added content will actually make a new entry in each series.


I'm totally fine with a Game of the Year edition of Smash Bros. Wii U with all the DLC, ditto Mario Kart 8 (new characters and an extra item box do not make for significant upgrades) but I can't honestly get behind drip feeding content for those games. I think Nintendo has squeezed as much as they can from those specific games and any new content added would benefit a new entry in the series more than an upgraded port.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on November 22, 2016, 12:33:11 PM
Wouldn't the ports be more for the people who passed up on the WiiU and are now returning to, or picking up their first Nintendo system?

If current WiiU owners also pick up the ports, great, but there's a vast audience of people (myself included) who skipped the WiiU and are excited to pick up the Switch and get back to Nintendo gaming after a hiatus.

From a business standpoint, the ports are great to make more money without spending a ton of resources, draw in new or returning Nintendo players by offering AAA titles close to launch, and possibly encouraging the WiiU carryover buyers to purchase third party titles since they've already played the ports.

Just my two cents, and hello everyone! I'm new here, though I've been lurking for quite a while now.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 22, 2016, 01:00:23 PM
Welcome! Great to see you looking into jumping baxk into the fray for the Switch! Haha!

And yeah, the Ports and remasters simply make way too much sense from so many levels. Other companies do it too, so it's not unprecedented. But I think the danger is if there are no new experiences to prove on a higher level that this is a must-have system beyond great games people missed out on last gen. However, I really do think this is an overblown concern with a new Mario, a new Zelda, and a rumored new Pikmin in year 1, plus surprises and other new exclusives.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ejamer on November 22, 2016, 01:17:25 PM
Ports aren't a problem unless that's all that gets offered.  It's not that different from offering backwards compatibility... just a more limited (and more expensive) form.


The key for me is what else gets offered.  At this point there hasn't been many compelling reasons for Wii U owners to rush out and buy.  Maybe next year we'll learn more.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on November 22, 2016, 01:22:03 PM
I tossed this question to the NWR Chat podcast as well, but figured I'd throw it out here, too.


Anyone here think there is potential for cross play between the Wii U and Rumored versions of Switch Ports?  I figured it would 1) assuage grumps like me who won't buy Wii U ports I already own, and 2) would ensure that there's already a good install base of players to the Switch version for their online functions.


Maybe that makes too much sense, or maybe I'm underestimating the heavy lifting that'd go into marrying those two systems' online together.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on November 22, 2016, 02:17:05 PM
It depends on how "enhanced" these ports are. If they add new stages or things like that it wouldn't be as feasible, unless they went back and added that stuff to the Wii U versions.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on November 22, 2016, 03:07:25 PM
Could work for Super Mario Maker, but not sure about Splatoon/Mario Kart.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on November 22, 2016, 06:59:12 PM

The key for me is what else gets offered.  At this point there hasn't been many compelling reasons for Wii U owners to rush out and buy.


However, I really do think this is an overblown concern with a new Mario, a new Zelda, and a rumored new Pikmin in year 1, plus surprises and other new exclusives.

I'm with Kairon on this. Zelda and Mario are locks to be released in the launch window. That's two AAA Nintendo titles, on top of third party games, on top of ports. Seems like a win-win-win strategy.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on November 22, 2016, 07:23:51 PM
Anyone here think there is potential for cross play between the Wii U and Rumored versions of Switch Ports?  I figured it would 1) assuage grumps like me who won't buy Wii U ports I already own, and 2) would ensure that there's already a good install base of players to the Switch version for their online functions.
I'm guessing "no" because Nintendo will want people to buy the Switch versions, not keep playing the Wii U ones, nor will they still be selling the Wii U versions.

I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo shut down the online for Wii U next year, for a variety of reasnos.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 22, 2016, 09:35:08 PM
Personally, ports are my least favorite form of buffing a library, period. I don't condone it no matter the platform, and I hope that Nintendo doesn't become to reliant on it. I say this while also having bought the Wind Waker and Twilight Princess HD, but those are really the only exceptions. It warms my heart to see people positive about the Switch, but I still feel like there are way too many variables at stake with the system for me to consider buying one.

I hope that Mario isn't like Galaxy. I'll be playing Zelda on Wii U.

So the only thing I'm really looking forward to on Switch is Pikmin 4, with the hope that it is as good as Pikmin 3. That would be the only reason I'd buy a Switch before the end of the year.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Louieturkey on November 23, 2016, 12:06:33 PM
What if they added the Ice Climbers back into Smash along with making Zelda and Sheik one character again? Since they don't have to worry about the limitations of the 3DS now that should be feasible. I think I'd rebuy Smash for that and all the DLC (barring issues with 3rd party characters not being allowed).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 23, 2016, 01:00:03 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.

A Switch with enhanced ports favors me, someone who didn't jump on the Wii U train. And there's a lot of us. From my point of view, I get a year one only a fanboy can dream of. If the line-up is true, I'm buying a Switch day one. The last time I bought a console on day one was the gamecube, so you see why this strategy might work.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 23, 2016, 03:51:46 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.

I've been burned so many times in the past I have trouble taking a third-party at their word when they claim to be blown away by Nintendo's new console. Haha, blame EA and Ubisoft ^_^

A Switch with enhanced ports favors me, someone who didn't jump on the Wii U train. And there's a lot of us. From my point of view, I get a year one only a fanboy can dream of. If the line-up is true, I'm buying a Switch day one. The last time I bought a console on day one was the gamecube, so you see why this strategy might work.

Heck, I jumped on the Wii U train and I'm not deterred. I'd personally like to see some new IP but when is that NOT the case? I love the idea a ton of the evergreens are showing up early. I basically consider all Mario kart games remakes now anyways... and buy them anyways!

Maybe the reason we're so obsessed with ports is that these have been the most rumored games in the lineup, and such we have a fair amount of confidence they're coming out whereas other games might be cursed as too "unprecedented" to let into our hearts just yet.

Also, these ports hit a bunch of Nintendo franchises dead on, so of course if there's a Mario Kart or Splatoon game, we'll be talking about it! &P
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: rygar on November 23, 2016, 04:41:07 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.

A Switch with enhanced ports favors me, someone who didn't jump on the Wii U train. And there's a lot of us. From my point of view, I get a year one only a fanboy can dream of. If the line-up is true, I'm buying a Switch day one. The last time I bought a console on day one was the gamecube, so you see why this strategy might work.

I'm also very excited. Putting aside unresolved battery and storage questions, the hardware already appears perfectly tailored to my needs, and the software rumors have me completely bought in. Skyrim and BotW alone would justify the purchase personally, especially at the $250 price. Adding ports only makes it more attractive for me.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on November 23, 2016, 07:16:17 PM
I would probably buy a Switch version of Smash 4 if it had all the content from both versions.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 23, 2016, 07:52:55 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.


Bethesda is going to release a game on Switch that will be almost 5 months old on other consoles. I say the level of excitement here seems appropriate.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on November 23, 2016, 10:15:22 PM
If the only game Bethesda brings to the Switch is Skyrim, what Todd Howard said is true and nothing changes from what we already knew from the trailer.

I'd be excited if he had said they would be bringing more than one game to the system. That he's impressed with the hardware is cool, but not too impactful without games to back it up.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on November 24, 2016, 12:22:20 AM
It's interesting how times changes.  How many ports from the previous gen did the SNES, N64 or Gamecube have?  If they had launched the N64 with a bunch of SNES ports they would have been laughed at.  Of course back then the jump to a new generation was so drastic that last gen games would have looked really out of a place.  These days the differences are subtle.  Though everyone does it so I wouldn't single out Nintendo for criticism and new games back then weren't so expensive to make.

There is going to be a dynamic of what ports will appeal to certain kinds of customers that I hope publishers will realize that.  Something like Skyrim is only going to sell to Nintendo-only gamers.  If you wanted that game and had access to any recent non-Nintendo console or a capable gaming PC you would have bought it already.  At the same time Wii U owners will be less interested in Wii U ports.  Those games are for those that skipped the Wii U and want to experience some of its notable games.  And if you're someone who owned a Wii U and another console then NONE of those ports are of interest to you and you're only going to be interested in new titles.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 24, 2016, 12:30:12 AM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.


Bethesda is going to release a game on Switch that will be almost 5 months old on other consoles. I say the level of excitement here seems appropriate.


In the case of Skryim, that point is exceedingly irrelevant. Skyrim has been around on other consoles for years, and if you're talking about the Enhanced Edition [they gave it away for free] to those of us who bought all the DLC on PC.


The draw of Skyrim on Switch is the ability to play it anywhere and everywhere. It's a fantastic pick-up-and-play game. The moment I saw it on the Switch, I realized my adventures across Skyrim need no longer wait for me to get home!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 24, 2016, 12:45:20 AM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.

A Switch with enhanced ports favors me, someone who didn't jump on the Wii U train. And there's a lot of us. From my point of view, I get a year one only a fanboy can dream of. If the line-up is true, I'm buying a Switch day one. The last time I bought a console on day one was the gamecube, so you see why this strategy might work.


I think the others are missing the point of Todd's comments. There's obviously a bigger hardware detail than what we've been shown, and it seems to have him excited. It is obviously something more than just the portable function of the console (so it can output to different HD screens, big whoop).

And then just today, the CEO of Gamestop really had a mouthful to say regarding the Switch during their investor call.

Quote
"The Nintendo Switch, which I played at Nintendo a few weeks ago--we believe could be another game-changer that will expand the audience for gaming."


"The Switch is a very interesting device.... A movement-related game is more fun for kids, you know, taking those [Joy-con controllers off] and then the master controller, you can really do a lot of interesting things with that in gameplay."


"I think it has tremendous potential as a game-changer. We'll have to wait and see. Like everything else in this industry, the consumers will vote with their dollars."


WHAT??


Up till now, no one had confirmed anything about motion controls! It seems he may have just confirmed something that Nintendo wasn't even letting slip through their "unofficial" rumor sources (aka Rogers, Dale, etc). That would seem a pretty significant detail to not leak out, no?


Personally, I don't care much for motion controls. However... if you're gonna do VR you sort of need them.  ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 24, 2016, 08:42:15 PM
I don't doubt that there is some sort of motion control with the Switch.  Nintendo has been leading the way for motion gaming for years now. 

However, I do not think you can take the above quotes to mean that motion control is confirmed.  I read his statements as just talking about the break away controllers.  That the regular controller or main controller is a full fledged controller either in the controller dock, or connected to the Switch for portable play. 

However, the motion comments sound like the ability to just break away the controller for instance multiplayer games on the go.  For simple games this is a pretty amazing feature that will allow for playing simple multiplayer games on the go easily. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on November 24, 2016, 08:54:34 PM
I wonder if the Switch screen itself has motion controls or if it will just mooch off of the joycons.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 24, 2016, 09:35:46 PM
I wonder if the Switch screen itself has motion controls or if it will just mooch off of the joycons.

Interesting question.  I would assume that if anything the joycons would mooch off the screen, not the other way around. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on November 24, 2016, 11:28:22 PM
The joycons supposedly have some basic pointer functionality though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 25, 2016, 02:06:13 AM
I wonder if the Switch screen itself has motion controls or if it will just mooch off of the joycons.

Interesting question.  I would assume that if anything the joycons would mooch off the screen, not the other way around. 

it would make more sense for the joycons to have the motion controls inside, rather than the screen, IF only 1 were to have it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 25, 2016, 03:53:02 AM
Black and Mild:  I dunno.  If you want to possibly play games on the screen that are just touch screen and motion without the Joycons it would make since to have it in the screen.  Also you could have motion controls in the Joycon main controller.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on November 25, 2016, 09:35:08 AM
Black and Mild:  I dunno.  If you want to possibly play games on the screen that are just touch screen and motion without the Joycons it would make since to have it in the screen.  Also you could have motion controls in the Joycon main controller.

How do you propose to hold the screen without the JoyCons in that scenario?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on November 25, 2016, 11:19:05 AM
Black and Mild:  I dunno.  If you want to possibly play games on the screen that are just touch screen and motion without the Joycons it would make since to have it in the screen.  Also you could have motion controls in the Joycon main controller.

The joycons being motion controllers when attached and especially when unattached makes a lot more sense than just having motion in just the tablet. being able to use the joycons as 2 separate motion controls, like 2 wiimotes, is infinitely more valuable in play-options than only having motion in just the tablet.

You can always attach the controllers to the tablet do do some tabletop motion marble puzzle maze game, but you would make games like Just Dance, Wii Motion Sports, Zelda Archery, drum master, two handed sword combat, etc etc etc an imposibility, as the controllers would need to be attached to the screen.


Not to mention of when you were trying to play these exact same games on the TV.... how would that work? hint: it wouldn't. You need the motion controls in the joycons, as that is the only way to use motion when playing on the tablet and/or the TV.

So if you only had to choose 1 part to put motion controls in, it wouldn't make sense to put it in just the tablet instead both of the joycons.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on November 25, 2016, 01:40:27 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.


Bethesda is going to release a game on Switch that will be almost 5 months old on other consoles. I say the level of excitement here seems appropriate.


In the case of Skryim, that point is exceedingly irrelevant. Skyrim has been around on other consoles for years, and if you're talking about the Enhanced Edition [they gave it away for free] to those of us who bought all the DLC on PC.


The draw of Skyrim on Switch is the ability to play it anywhere and everywhere. It's a fantastic pick-up-and-play game. The moment I saw it on the Switch, I realized my adventures across Skyrim need no longer wait for me to get home!

One thing I'm concerned about if Skyrim does make it to the Switch is that its sales will be the judge for all future Bethesda titles; for instance, if it only sells moderately well then a port of Fallout 4 is more likely than their next output in the series.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 25, 2016, 08:34:23 PM
BlackNMild:  Yes I see your points, and agree.  Hopefully Nintendo will implement it's 3rd iteration of motions controls and pointer controls, and it will be even better then the Wii motion Plus.

So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.


Bethesda is going to release a game on Switch that will be almost 5 months old on other consoles. I say the level of excitement here seems appropriate.


In the case of Skryim, that point is exceedingly irrelevant. Skyrim has been around on other consoles for years, and if you're talking about the Enhanced Edition [they gave it away for free] to those of us who bought all the DLC on PC.


The draw of Skyrim on Switch is the ability to play it anywhere and everywhere. It's a fantastic pick-up-and-play game. The moment I saw it on the Switch, I realized my adventures across Skyrim need no longer wait for me to get home!

One thing I'm concerned about if Skyrim does make it to the Switch is that its sales will be the judge for all future Bethesda titles; for instance, if it only sells moderately well then a port of Fallout 4 is more likely than their next output in the series.

I have a big fear of this as well.  1st party ports are not a problem for me, because Nintendo understands they will sell less, and it is not like Nintendo will stop making games for the Switch if ports don't sell.  However, 3rd parties sometimes want the same high return on their investment for ports as the original release and use poor port sales as an indicator of lower reception to their software on the platform.  This just isn't fair.  You can't expect that, because people have several other places to play the game and perhaps cheaper. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 27, 2016, 12:45:40 PM
BlackNMild:  Yes I see your points, and agree.  Hopefully Nintendo will implement it's 3rd iteration of motions controls and pointer controls, and it will be even better then the Wii motion Plus.
In the case of Skryim, that point is exceedingly irrelevant. Skyrim has been around on other consoles for years, and if you're talking about the Enhanced Edition [they gave it away for free] to those of us who bought all the DLC on PC.


The draw of Skyrim on Switch is the ability to play it anywhere and everywhere. It's a fantastic pick-up-and-play game. The moment I saw it on the Switch, I realized my adventures across Skyrim need no longer wait for me to get home!

One thing I'm concerned about if Skyrim does make it to the Switch is that its sales will be the judge for all future Bethesda titles; for instance, if it only sells moderately well then a port of Fallout 4 is more likely than their next output in the series.

I have a big fear of this as well.  1st party ports are not a problem for me, because Nintendo understands they will sell less, and it is not like Nintendo will stop making games for the Switch if ports don't sell.  However, 3rd parties sometimes want the same high return on their investment for ports as the original release and use poor port sales as an indicator of lower reception to their software on the platform.  This just isn't fair.  You can't expect that, because people have several other places to play the game and perhaps cheaper.


There has to be some amount of tempered expectations with this Special Edition release. I doubt it's a million seller on Xb1 or PS4 considering most who will buy this likely already own a copy of it for console. Frankly, I'm even shocked a little that they're selling it for more than $30 and the best price I could find for it on Black Friday was $25. It's going to sell to hardcore fans of the game and anyone who has been waiting for the right time to try the game.


I think this game, with ample promotion, will sell reasonably well on Switch -- I'm thinking 400,000 copies. I think people who've already played Skyrim could be interested in playing it on a portable/console. What I think could also really help this game is if Bethesda (or Nintendo) added some additional content in the form of custom items, maybe a few new side quests, and just really added some Nintendo polish.


I'm not saying put Zelda in Skyrim, but put Zelda in Skyrim.


UPDATED to respond to Ian Sane, Soren, etc:
BUT you guys are all absolutely right that if this fails to sell more than 200,000 copies we will likely never see another Bethesda game for Switch. I think the general lukewarm response from a few of you is the bigger cause for concern. As though the anticipated sales of the game tempers your own anticipation for one of the best games of all time? GMAFB. If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response.


This is the perfect game to test the Nintendo waters. If it flounders, I'd be scared.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on November 27, 2016, 01:24:44 PM
UPDATED to respond to Ian Sane, Soren, etc: ... If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response.

You must be new here.

The wasting resources is less of concern to me (though it really does bugs me when someone like Retro is being wasted on it) than how Nintendo will typically use re-releases as a replacement for a new game.  It isn't usually like they just release it willy nilly in the release schedule as a compliment to the new titles.  They slot these things quite clearly in the gaps like it's supposed to "count" as a new release.  Like if I complain that they released nothing in the last three months they can point at some re-release "Yeah we did! See?!"

The best example is the GBA back in 2002.  Metroid Fusion was literally the only new first party release in the ENTIRE YEAR.  The rest of the year they shoved SNES ports in my face.  It isn't like Nintendo has some new 3DS Zelda coming out shortly after this port.  No.  They will likely re-release Majora's Mask first and OoT 3D will plop down right in the middle of a big gap in the release schedule as if this is a big new title instead of a re-release of a game that every Nintendo fan probably owns two copies of.

We never got a new Mario on the GBA and that's because suckers were content to buy the same old Mario games they already played a million times.  When Nintendo was going hog wild with NPC games on the Wii it was during a time where NOTHING ELSE was being released.  Nintendo uses these as a cheap easy way to avoid giving us new content.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 27, 2016, 04:59:35 PM
Quote
"UPDATED to respond to Ian Sane, Soren, etc:
BUT you guys are all absolutely right that if this fails to sell more than 200,000 copies we will likely never see another Bethesda game for Switch. I think the general lukewarm response from a few of you is the bigger cause for concern. As though the anticipated sales of the game tempers your own anticipation for one of the best games of all time? GMAFB. If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response."

This isn't the same comparison.  Ocarina of Time is a game that is several years old and only had one portable upgrade, that didn't add much to the game for the 3DS.  You basically only had 2 systems to play the game on, and it was still exclusive to Nintendo systems.

When Skyrim for the Nintendo Switch comes out, players will have 3 current generation consoles to play the game on, and 2 of those current generation consoles will have the game for cheaper, because it is an older game.  Yes it is a great game, but you just said the new version is only selling to fans, so the question is...will there be 400,000 fans of the game, that will buy a Switch and Skyrim?  Probably gamers that don't have another console?  Probably not.  Unless there is new content...even then the content has to be compelling adding Link to Skyrim as a skin is not compelling. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 27, 2016, 08:52:43 PM
The biggest problem with Skyrim is it is basically the same issue as Mass Effect. It's a game that's been out for a while that Nintendo fans are not familiar with, that might be seeing diminishing returns from people who already own it on other consoles. If it doesn't sell well, then that actually doesn't mean ****, but Bathesda like EA may not realize this. Sales on Nintendo systems are often misread.

Nintendo's audience is a fluctuating group like any console owner. If this was Skyrim than who is going to buy it. If this was a new Elder Scrolls game and it doesn't sell than that's Nintendo's audience fault.

With Mass Effect 3. I bought it from Target for $8 after the game flopped on Wii U. Ultimately, I didn't even like the game. Perhaps if I had played Mass Effect 1 and 2 it would make sense to me?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on November 27, 2016, 11:22:39 PM
I think the general lukewarm response from a few of you is the bigger cause for concern. As though the anticipated sales of the game tempers your own anticipation for one of the best games of all time? GMAFB.


I really don't care for Elder Scrolls games so that might be the reason for my particular tepid response. I like more games for the Switch though, so it's a positive.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 28, 2016, 03:16:32 PM
Who said Skyrim was one of the greatest games of all time? WHO SAID IT?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on November 28, 2016, 05:40:13 PM
Who said Skyrim was one of the greatest games of all time? WHO SAID IT?

IGN?  ??? Bethseda?  :-\  You?  ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: azeke on November 28, 2016, 08:10:56 PM
http://bindingofisaac.com/post/153791362179/tyrone-not-again :

Quote
Expect Afterbirth+ on PlayStation 4, Xbox One and one more console. Sorry no PS Vita or Wii U versions. Date? Spring 2017–we’re already working on the console versions.

Afterbirth+ is second content update over Binding of Isaac: Rebirth.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: rygar on November 29, 2016, 12:36:26 PM
I think the general lukewarm response from a few of you is the bigger cause for concern. As though the anticipated sales of the game tempers your own anticipation for one of the best games of all time? GMAFB.


I really don't care for Elder Scrolls games so that might be the reason for my particular tepid response. I like more games for the Switch though, so it's a positive.

I'm sorry to read that. Morrowind is my favorite video game and one of my favorite pieces of media overall. For me it provided the best single player table-top role playing experience I've found (I haven't played any WRPGs since Oblivion). There was so much flexibility in character creation, and the four regions and expansion areas so aesthetically distinct and well developed, that it gave you the narrative tools to create your own tabletop like stories.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on November 29, 2016, 02:41:00 PM
If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response.

Also, just to add my 2 cents that this is not a good argument, in a way Nintendo has done this with Wind Waker and Twilight Princess by upscaling them for the Wii U with maybe a few tweaks but no major overhaul or redesign of the game. I was not chomping at the bit for them. Despite Wind Waker being an all-time favorite game of mine, I only just picked up the Wii U version this past weekend because it was free. And even then, I'd have taken a different game I'd never played before over it if that possibility had existed. I have no desire to play the game anytime soon because I've played it so much already.

As for Ocarina of Time, I remember when Twilight Princess was finally released, the common criticism levied at the game as people beat it was its similarity to Ocarina of Time in many ways. Twilight Princess is almost a remake/remastering of Ocarina of Time and now that game has been put into HD. I played Ocarina of Time on the GameCube with the special Ocarina of Time/Master Quest disc that Nintendo released. I've got a second GameCube copy on the Zelda Collectors Disc. I've never bought the game on the Wii or Wii U Virtual Console but I did pick up the 3DS version since I got a good bargain on it and playing it in 3D was appealing enough to purchase it again. However, I have yet to still open its packaging and play it. If Nintendo were to announce an upscaled $60.00 version for Switch, I would positively not buy it. It's a fine game but it's been around so long and available on many consoles for people to play that I don't see it being a major draw for the vast majority of gamers. Heck, I can't think of anyone here ever posting that they wished Nintendo would re-release of OoT in HD at any time. It's like Rayman 2. Who here want's an upscaled version of the game? It's been around so long and available on many consoles that a $60 upscaled version isn't suddenly going to revitalize sales and demand for more copies of that game.

So, yes, I think the tepid response by users is the feeling of the majority of gamers by the announcement of Skyrim on Switch. It's great to see a major 3rd Party game like that on a Nintendo system. No one is against that. But I think the time where releasing Skyrim on a Nintendo console could have an impact has come and gone. At this point, a new Elder Scrolls game releasing on a Nintendo system alongside the competition would be a far bigger cause for excitement and positivity and be a true test of whether a 3rd Party game like that could sell on Nintendo hardware. Unfortunately, right now, releasing Skyrim just feels like it is going to be the same failed pattern of 3rd parties to release an old game that has already tapped into the majority of its market sales and will thus sell a small modest amount because of that on the new Nintendo hardware leading to the claim of 3rd party games being unable to sell on Nintendo hardware.

Has this tactic of selling 3 - 5 year old games on a new Nintendo system at full price while the competition has them available at 50% or less ever been successful for any 3rd Party? And yet, they keep doing it. The only one that may have been successful was Batman: Arkham City and I only say that because Batman: Arkham Origins was later released on the Wii U so I'm guessing sales were enough that they considered it was worth it to release that game also. Compare that to Rayman Legends. It was held back so that it could be released on the Wii U, PS3, and Xbox 360 at the same time and yet, from what I recall hearing, it sold the best on Wii U showing that when a 3rd Party does release a brand new game on a Nintendo console alongside the competition, it can still sell unlike releasing the third game of a trilogy in which the first two games are available only on other systems and you release a package with all 3 games on it at the same time on those other systems while trying to sell the 3rd game only to the market that hasn't had any of them before. Why not sell the complete trilogy also on the system/market that has never had any of the games on it before?  The Mass Effect 3 release was one of the all-time boneheaded release choices by a 3rd Party absolutely designed to fail like it did.

Anyways, I've gone on about this long enough. It wasn't my intention to turn this into a long rant as to why Billy and the Clonosaurus is such a bad idea but once one gets started on this subject, it is hard to stop. Thank you! Come again.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on November 29, 2016, 04:15:39 PM
I plan on buying almost all first party Wii U ports but definitely not for $60. That can get right the **** out of my face.

Bethesda hasn't had a strong (any?) presence on Nintendo platforms. It should use Skyrim as its Trojan Horse into Nintendo fans' homes. I think the magic number is $30. The price of entry should be lower to encourage people to bite. I would even try Skyrim at $30. Selling lower at launch (window), giving people a taste of Bethesda content makes it easier to justify a brand new $60 game in the future. We already know how the alternative will shake out. The goodwill of selling a six year old game at fair perceived value should go a long way. If it doesn't, well, that supports if not at least partially validates the notion that third party games, particularly Western third party games, generally do not sell well on Nintendo platforms.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 29, 2016, 04:52:49 PM
I think I want to buy SKyrim:it must have been a big deal for a reason, I enjoyed what little I played of fallout 4, I never played the original, action rpg fantasy appeals to me(if i like zelda then I might like this).

Honestly, I'm probably the perfect audience for this.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on November 29, 2016, 05:06:26 PM
I didn't care for Morrowind on Xbox, so I'm not so sure Skyrim would appeal to me either. But I might give it a try on Switch if it's cheap enough. I also don't have a very high tolerance for glitchy games, so if it runs like I hear the PS3 version does (did?), no thanks.

If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response.
I dunno mate, I remember a lot of complaints about the 3DS having a "weak first year" in part due to the N64 ports it had, which includes OoT. And we've also seen people here complaining about the potential of Wii U ports on the system. I'm not seeing anyone here like the type of person you're suggesting.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 29, 2016, 05:35:00 PM
Ports are never the optimal solution for library support on any console. My GCN and Wii are showing age, and I've heard plenty of people mention Wii disk drives failing. That's why I own Wind Waker and Twilight Princess on Wii U. However, I would not be excited for Ocarina of Time on Switch for the same reason I think a lot of people wouldn't be excited: Virtual Console exists, and whether we like it's current implementation or not, Nintendo is sure as hell going to put that game on VC eventually.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 29, 2016, 09:32:51 PM
If they do it right: Nintendo has the chance to have an enormous library.

Nintendo slowly released games on Wii and Wii U for virtual consoles, but what they need is a gigantic store with everything you could possibly want on it. I'm still a proponent that there should be an android store as well. Maybe ran by nvidia, but if Switch is so similar to shield, it's going to make getting those games on there nothing but a corporate decision.

Read this article
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22

and visit this site
https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/

Think about if there is some sort of Day one store filled with android games. From the sounds of it nvidia really wanted to have something like that with shield, but people don't go for these microconsoles like they do for the big three. Teaming up with Nintendo could be just as beneficial for nvidia as it is for Nintendo. Ouya was a system I bought for the hell of it. It wasn't to expensive. We knew it wouldn't last long. However, there were some innovations. I had access to an Ouya store, and access to Amazon underground, and Google Play. The system had a huge amount of games. Some of it good, some of it shovel ware. I think the biggest change for Nintendo is if they have a platform with 1000s of games on it. Imagine if Ouya if on top of all the innovative new things they were doing had Nintendo's brand and software support. Technically, switch is already in that territory.  Its related by hardware and even has the same color scheme.

Nintendo and nvidia are both companies that seek to create disruptive technologies. An  8th/9th generation handheld/console/tablet with 1000s of games. That could be about the most disruptive thing in games ever.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 29, 2016, 10:10:55 PM
If they do it right: Nintendo has the chance to have an enormous library.

Nintendo slowly released games on Wii and Wii U for virtual consoles, but what they need is a gigantic store with everything you could possibly want on it. I'm still a proponent that there should be an android store as well. Maybe ran by nvidia, but if Switch is so similar to shield, it's going to make getting those games on there nothing but a corporate decision.

Read this article
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22)

and visit this site
https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/ (https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/)

Think about if there is some sort of Day one store filled with android games. From the sounds of it nvidia really wanted to have something like that with shield, but people don't go for these microconsoles like they do for the big three. Teaming up with Nintendo could be just as beneficial for nvidia as it is for Nintendo. Ouya was a system I bought for the hell of it. It wasn't to expensive. We knew it wouldn't last long. However, there were some innovations. I had access to an Ouya store, and access to Amazon underground, and Google Play. The system had a huge amount of games. Some of it good, some of it shovel ware. I think the biggest change for Nintendo is if they have a platform with 1000s of games on it. Imagine if Ouya if on top of all the innovative new things they were doing had Nintendo's brand and software support. Technically, switch is already in that territory.  Its related by hardware and even has the same color scheme.

Nintendo and nvidia are both companies that seek to create disruptive technologies. An  8th/9th generation handheld/console/tablet with 1000s of games. That could be about the most disruptive thing in games ever.


I was saying this months ago regarding the Nvidia partnership. I was imagining a Nintendo platform featuring both Google Play AND Steam. THEN they wouldn't need to bargain for third party ports since a lot of those games are already on Steam.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 29, 2016, 10:24:48 PM
If Nintendo simply upscaled Ocarina of Time and sold it for $60, why do I suspect you'd be chomping at the bit, yet this other all-time great game gets a "Eh. It's been out for 5 years everywhere else." response.

Also, just to add my 2 cents that this is not a good argument, in a way Nintendo has done this with Wind Waker and Twilight Princess by upscaling them for the Wii U with maybe a few tweaks but no major overhaul or redesign of the game. I was not chomping at the bit for them. Despite Wind Waker being an all-time favorite game of mine, I only just picked up the Wii U version this past weekend because it was free. And even then, I'd have taken a different game I'd never played before over it if that possibility had existed. I have no desire to play the game anytime soon because I've played it so much already.

As for Ocarina of Time, I remember when Twilight Princess was finally released, the common criticism levied at the game as people beat it was its similarity to Ocarina of Time in many ways. Twilight Princess is almost a remake/remastering of Ocarina of Time and now that game has been put into HD. I played Ocarina of Time on the GameCube with the special Ocarina of Time/Master Quest disc that Nintendo released. I've got a second GameCube copy on the Zelda Collectors Disc. I've never bought the game on the Wii or Wii U Virtual Console but I did pick up the 3DS version since I got a good bargain on it and playing it in 3D was appealing enough to purchase it again. However, I have yet to still open its packaging and play it. If Nintendo were to announce an upscaled $60.00 version for Switch, I would positively not buy it. It's a fine game but it's been around so long and available on many consoles for people to play that I don't see it being a major draw for the vast majority of gamers. Heck, I can't think of anyone here ever posting that they wished Nintendo would re-release of OoT in HD at any time. It's like Rayman 2. Who here want's an upscaled version of the game? It's been around so long and available on many consoles that a $60 upscaled version isn't suddenly going to revitalize sales and demand for more copies of that game.

So, yes, I think the tepid response by users is the feeling of the majority of gamers by the announcement of Skyrim on Switch. It's great to see a major 3rd Party game like that on a Nintendo system. No one is against that. But I think the time where releasing Skyrim on a Nintendo console could have an impact has come and gone. At this point, a new Elder Scrolls game releasing on a Nintendo system alongside the competition would be a far bigger cause for excitement and positivity and be a true test of whether a 3rd Party game like that could sell on Nintendo hardware. Unfortunately, right now, releasing Skyrim just feels like it is going to be the same failed pattern of 3rd parties to release an old game that has already tapped into the majority of its market sales and will thus sell a small modest amount because of that on the new Nintendo hardware leading to the claim of 3rd party games being unable to sell on Nintendo hardware.

Has this tactic of selling 3 - 5 year old games on a new Nintendo system at full price while the competition has them available at 50% or less ever been successful for any 3rd Party? And yet, they keep doing it. The only one that may have been successful was Batman: Arkham City and I only say that because Batman: Arkham Origins was later released on the Wii U so I'm guessing sales were enough that they considered it was worth it to release that game also. Compare that to Rayman Legends. It was held back so that it could be released on the Wii U, PS3, and Xbox 360 at the same time and yet, from what I recall hearing, it sold the best on Wii U showing that when a 3rd Party does release a brand new game on a Nintendo console alongside the competition, it can still sell unlike releasing the third game of a trilogy in which the first two games are available only on other systems and you release a package with all 3 games on it at the same time on those other systems while trying to sell the 3rd game only to the market that hasn't had any of them before. Why not sell the complete trilogy also on the system/market that has never had any of the games on it before?  The Mass Effect 3 release was one of the all-time boneheaded release choices by a 3rd Party absolutely designed to fail like it did.

Anyways, I've gone on about this long enough. It wasn't my intention to turn this into a long rant as to why Billy and the Clonosaurus is such a bad idea but once one gets started on this subject, it is hard to stop. Thank you! Come again.


Alright, it was a flimsy argument. Still I think that you guys show a lot more interest and grace towards Nintendo "retreads" than you do towards third party offerings. Still, I think you are all making strong points and I share your same concerns.


Frankly, what I see happening is that currently the Special Edition has an MSRP of $60, which I find astounding since they dropped it into my Steam library at no charge. If anything, I feel that's a big middle finger to console gamers, but I would even put money down that by March the Special Edition will be down to $40 on PS4 and XB1, while the Switch version debuts for... you guessed it, $60!


We all know that is a terrible proposition to anyone in possession of other platforms to play it on. Frankly I don't understand how they could sell it for $60.


Bethesda Explains $60 Price For The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Remastered On PS4 And Xbox One (http://attackofthefanboy.com/news/bethesda-explains-60-price-elder-scrolls-v-skyrim-remastered-ps4-xbox-one/)


Maybe we just wait and see how poorly this sells on PS4/XB1 before guessing at the price for Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 29, 2016, 11:06:03 PM
I think you are missing the point Agent X.

I don't think anyone really cares one way or another if Skyrim is on Switch...in fact if anything people would be happy for a game.  The problem has always been, 3rd party developers giving Nintendo late ports to games and then blaming Nintendo for there failure, and stops supporting Nintendo platforms.

This is not the same as Nintendo launching a release game/port because Nintendo usually has tempered expectations for those re-releases...and won't stop supporting a system if that game doesn't succeed.  That is why we are worried. 

However, your point just isn't supported by the evidence of this thread.  Many people were complaining about the HD remasters.  Many people have complained about the repurchasing of Virtual Console games.  Many people have been upset about the "Nintendo tax" for re-releases.  However there is one difference between Nintendo and 3rd parties.  When Nintendo does it, you still only have the options of Nintendo hardware to play the game, and so therefore if you are interested in that game you only have one choice...support Nintendo.  But when 3rd parties do it, you have several choices and some of them may be at deep discounts by the time it is released on Nintendo. 

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 29, 2016, 11:17:23 PM
Just to sprinkle a dash of hope...


Take-Two Is Very Optimistic on Nintendo Switch, Says Nintendo Is Making a Great Effort for Third Party (http://wccftech.com/take-two-optimistic-switch/)


Two things... yes, we all know third parties sang praises from the hill tops about Wii U. Hopefully this is different.


Two.... the emphasis here is that Nintendo is making an effort for third party support. I don't want to jump to too many conclusions, but some of the evidence of this is in the Switch trailer. I can only see this in a positive light. If they went after that NBA game then probably they have much more up their sleeve.


Something that resonated positively with me when Kimishima became President is his time as an executive in North America. I get an impression that he has a better understanding of the western gaming audience. It would make a huge difference to offer a platform capable of handling third party support for the next 5 years.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 29, 2016, 11:20:15 PM
If they do it right: Nintendo has the chance to have an enormous library.

Nintendo slowly released games on Wii and Wii U for virtual consoles, but what they need is a gigantic store with everything you could possibly want on it. I'm still a proponent that there should be an android store as well. Maybe ran by nvidia, but if Switch is so similar to shield, it's going to make getting those games on there nothing but a corporate decision.

Read this article
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22)

and visit this site
https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/ (https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/)

Think about if there is some sort of Day one store filled with android games. From the sounds of it nvidia really wanted to have something like that with shield, but people don't go for these microconsoles like they do for the big three. Teaming up with Nintendo could be just as beneficial for nvidia as it is for Nintendo. Ouya was a system I bought for the hell of it. It wasn't to expensive. We knew it wouldn't last long. However, there were some innovations. I had access to an Ouya store, and access to Amazon underground, and Google Play. The system had a huge amount of games. Some of it good, some of it shovel ware. I think the biggest change for Nintendo is if they have a platform with 1000s of games on it. Imagine if Ouya if on top of all the innovative new things they were doing had Nintendo's brand and software support. Technically, switch is already in that territory.  Its related by hardware and even has the same color scheme.

Nintendo and nvidia are both companies that seek to create disruptive technologies. An  8th/9th generation handheld/console/tablet with 1000s of games. That could be about the most disruptive thing in games ever.


I was saying this months ago regarding the Nvidia partnership. I was imagining a Nintendo platform featuring both Google Play AND Steam. THEN they wouldn't need to bargain for third party ports since a lot of those games are already on Steam.

Egads. I absolutely cannot imagine what Nintendo would get out of giving up royalties by letting Steam and Googple Play stores on their console. Hardware margins are paper thin, the whole reason for controlling a platform like a console is to make money selling licensed software and pocketing royalties. Why would you give that up?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 29, 2016, 11:22:01 PM
I think you are missing the point Agent X.

I don't think anyone really cares one way or another if Skyrim is on Switch...in fact if anything people would be happy for a game.  The problem has always been, 3rd party developers giving Nintendo late ports to games and then blaming Nintendo for there failure, and stops supporting Nintendo platforms.

This is not the same as Nintendo launching a release game/port because Nintendo usually has tempered expectations for those re-releases...and won't stop supporting a system if that game doesn't succeed.  That is why we are worried. 

However, your point just isn't supported by the evidence of this thread.  Many people were complaining about the HD remasters.  Many people have complained about the repurchasing of Virtual Console games.  Many people have been upset about the "Nintendo tax" for re-releases.  However there is one difference between Nintendo and 3rd parties.  When Nintendo does it, you still only have the options of Nintendo hardware to play the game, and so therefore if you are interested in that game you only have one choice...support Nintendo.  But when 3rd parties do it, you have several choices and some of them may be at deep discounts by the time it is released on Nintendo.


Yeah, no, I get it. The point was not lost on me.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 29, 2016, 11:31:45 PM
Im sure there were rumours of steam and other stores on Wii U too, before that was out. Im glad that never happened.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 29, 2016, 11:56:37 PM
Honestly, my problem with VC (and I'm sorry to make this about VC and not about how Skyrim isn't going to sell) is that it should be a catalog of games that is available on the console at launch, and then continue to receive NEW releases as the console's life progresses. Hell, I don't even care about the purchases being cross-platform- even though that would be preferable, it's not profitable, and I don't see Nintendo being that generous.

But if VC had the current Wii/Wii U/3DS(?) VC available on it from day ONE, you would have a crazy amount of classic games to purchase and enjoy on the system, even on the go. If I could take Paper Mario or its sequel on the go with me or throw it up on my TV screen from day one, you bet your sweet ass I'd be slapping down money for a Switch right away. I understand that creating an emulator for these games is tough and time-consuming work, but this is why Nintendo needs to have the architecture that will enable them to make VC games forward compatible as soon as possible. The idea of Virtual Console is amazing and continues to be underutilized, and I could see having not just the exclusivity of new Nintendo releases on Switch, but the exclusivity of all Nintendo's classics on there as a huge benefit.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on November 30, 2016, 12:03:39 AM
Honestly, my problem with VC (and I'm sorry to make this about VC and not about how Skyrim isn't going to sell) is that it should be a catalog of games that is available on the console at launch, and then continue to receive NEW releases as the console's life progresses. Hell, I don't even care about the purchases being cross-platform- even though that would be preferable, it's not profitable, and I don't see Nintendo being that generous.

But if VC had the current Wii/Wii U/3DS(?) VC available on it from day ONE, you would have a crazy amount of classic games to purchase and enjoy on the system, even on the go. If I could take Paper Mario or its sequel on the go with me or throw it up on my TV screen from day one, you bet your sweet ass I'd be slapping down money for a Switch right away. I understand that creating an emulator for these games is tough and time-consuming work, but this is why Nintendo needs to have the architecture that will enable them to make VC games forward compatible as soon as possible. The idea of Virtual Console is amazing and continues to be underutilized, and I could see having not just the exclusivity of new Nintendo releases on Switch, but the exclusivity of all Nintendo's classics on there as a huge benefit.

Don't worry about it.  This thread is not about a single game.  Also I 100% agree with you.  Trickling the releases is annoying, and there isn't a real excuse for not having games because of the emulator.  You should be able to have an emulator for the system already perfected and then just drop ROMs into the emulator and go.  Personally, I hope all the classic system emulators about build into the OS so Nintendo can easily do this from day one. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on November 30, 2016, 12:06:10 AM
Nintendo certainly dropped the ball on the WiiU and 3DS virtual consoles, and they can certainly bounce back by having robust libraries off the bat (or at least rapidly filled out in the first few months).

But I fear we'll never see the golden age of the Wii VC again. That was incumbent on many third party rights holders accommodating the platform, and we seem to be entering a new age of platform balkanization. While there isn't really anything like the fracturing Amazon/Hulu/Netflix/Etc. bases yet, I have to imagine a lot of folks are holding out to squeeze those old roms for as much as they can. Like, will Sega want to dump their library on a Nintendo system again when they can roll out those souped up "classics" as with the 3DS?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on November 30, 2016, 12:42:40 AM
Its a nice feature to have, but I dont see myself buying any VC games on Switch. I only ever bought two of the 30c games on Wii U. Not counting the ambassador games, only have two or three VC games on 3DS.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 30, 2016, 01:27:41 AM
If they do it right: Nintendo has the chance to have an enormous library.

Nintendo slowly released games on Wii and Wii U for virtual consoles, but what they need is a gigantic store with everything you could possibly want on it. I'm still a proponent that there should be an android store as well. Maybe ran by nvidia, but if Switch is so similar to shield, it's going to make getting those games on there nothing but a corporate decision.

Read this article
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22 (http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasonevangelho/2013/07/30/skyrim-in-bed-the-nvidia-shield-review/#c1249e575a22)

and visit this site
https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/ (https://www2.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/games/)

Think about if there is some sort of Day one store filled with android games. From the sounds of it nvidia really wanted to have something like that with shield, but people don't go for these microconsoles like they do for the big three. Teaming up with Nintendo could be just as beneficial for nvidia as it is for Nintendo. Ouya was a system I bought for the hell of it. It wasn't to expensive. We knew it wouldn't last long. However, there were some innovations. I had access to an Ouya store, and access to Amazon underground, and Google Play. The system had a huge amount of games. Some of it good, some of it shovel ware. I think the biggest change for Nintendo is if they have a platform with 1000s of games on it. Imagine if Ouya if on top of all the innovative new things they were doing had Nintendo's brand and software support. Technically, switch is already in that territory.  Its related by hardware and even has the same color scheme.

Nintendo and nvidia are both companies that seek to create disruptive technologies. An  8th/9th generation handheld/console/tablet with 1000s of games. That could be about the most disruptive thing in games ever.


I was saying this months ago regarding the Nvidia partnership. I was imagining a Nintendo platform featuring both Google Play AND Steam. THEN they wouldn't need to bargain for third party ports since a lot of those games are already on Steam.

Egads. I absolutely cannot imagine what Nintendo would get out of giving up royalties by letting Steam and Googple Play stores on their console. Hardware margins are paper thin, the whole reason for controlling a platform like a console is to make money selling licensed software and pocketing royalties. Why would you give that up?

I can't imagine that either. What I can imagine is a store that is ran by Nintendo and nVidia. Different from the regular Nintendo Shop. Certain games are already on android. I imagine N&N's new operating system is going to be related to android in some way. It may not be a regular android operating system, but that doesn't mean it won't have compatibility.

Here is the most Nintendo way to do it. Regular android stores carry APK files which you download. All they are is a distribution and profit system. Only Nintendo approved Android Apps would end up on the store. This prevents emulators and other problematic apps ending up on the system. Certain android games, especially those with basic controller support would end up on the store. Nintendo's operating system is most likely different than Android being that it will most likely be closed. You might play android games on a separate channel much like the Wii channel. I doubt they would allow something like google play or amazon underground on the system, but they might have an nvidia ran hybrid where they still make money and they get all the ports they need.

The android ecosystem is a big ecosystem. It would not hurt to effortlessly get some of that, especially since the hardware is related. Developers have shied away from Nintendo platforms, but if they don't have to do anything to get it on the system then that works out well for all parties involved. Developers already put games on android, and android is going nowhere. The easier the process it is to get those games over, than the more games we'll get.

Nintendo is already pretty good with indie developers. Even big developers make games for android. If you could create a bridge between the two communities that would be epic.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on November 30, 2016, 09:42:38 AM
I appreciate the thought you put into your post, Kairon, but how would Nintendo's android store be any different or better than Amazon's, which is run basically the way you described? I find the Kindle store to be very disappointing compared to Google Play, and I see Nintendo's version of the store being the same way.


To your other point regarding Steam on a Nintendo console, I'm not sure Nintendo's profit margin is all that thin on their hardware. I recall seeing some very detailed arguments as to why Nintendo will never abandon hardware, and as I recall a healthy chunk of their profit actually stems from actual hardware sales and not from software sales or software royalties (via 3rd party software).


From my vantage point, having next to zero third party support and allowing someone like Valve to cash in a little on what third party royalties you receive is kinda like the exact same thing. In other words, unless Nintendo intends to have a ton of third party support via their hard earned efforts to repair relationships, it'd be better to invite these other stores onto their platforms just for the point of offering all that content as I'm sure it would help move some more consoles.


On that last point, I maybe wrong, but having access to the Steam library seems attractive to me, and Nvidia's Shield already had that baked in, so having it on the Switch would seem to be a simple achievable concept. Why would anyone not want that?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 30, 2016, 01:23:02 PM
To me it boils down to two things: if someone else is earning royalties over software on your console, you're doing it wrong. The entire point of a closed console is so that you make the money on every piece of aoftware sold on it. With hardware you make money once, with software you make money multiple times from the same consumer.

Also, to have even an path for Android to be on your console opens it up to piracy and hacking. Android is very open. That sounds very un-Nintendo.

There shouldn't be a need for a Steam Store to be on Switch if Switch has good mainstream engine support, which one hopes it has given the announced Unity and UE4 support. And as for Android, a MUCH safer avenue for Nintendo to take would be providing a porting path for Android games to be repackaged for Switch natively and sold through Nintendo's own eShop like normal, not expose yourself to a whole other ecosystem.

Besides, as exciting as these instant libraries sound, the best path forward is not to give up control of your platform, or open yourself up to completely different OS', but to support the game engines and development tools that already specialize in creating multiplatform porting solutions going forward, pursuing the exciting games of the future instead of chasing after the been-there-done-that games of the past.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on November 30, 2016, 06:32:35 PM
Either way. I would hope either Nintendo steps up, or nVidia helps them out to make sure the games end up on the platform. It is possible to make a closed android system. My prediction is Nintendo will be competing with android far longer than they competed with ps4 and xbox. These platforms can either be competitive or cooperative. Nintendo is itself are already an android developer.

Apple and Samsung already compete in the portable space, but never discount Nintendo. If you think about it in terms of the console war you're going to limit your scope, but if you think about it in terms of how the future is going to be then it might be best to be going after Apple and Samsung.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on November 30, 2016, 07:18:28 PM
That said, what sort of Android/Mobile games would you actually be excited to see come to the Switch?

Obviously the Mobile market is ginormous and the richest gaming companies are, I believe, actually mobile centric.

Beyond the fact that I'd love to see all of Nintendo's Mobile games on the Switch (Miitomo, Super Mario Run, then Fire Emblem and Animal Crossing when they come out), mobile seems to have a bottomless supply of games in some genres, like Tower Defenses which I am a COMPLETE sucker for and can't imagine why there weren't more for the Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on November 30, 2016, 08:05:31 PM
I have little to say on this subject, except that I tend to find that usually, developers who want to put out quality content at the potential sacrifice of profit attempt to develop on consoles, and mobile markets are centralized more on low-risk, low-quality sorts of experiences.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 30, 2016, 08:53:12 PM
There will be no Steam on the Switch. Steam runs on x86 processors, and namely Windows or Linux, and the games have to be compiled likewise. Tegra chips are ARM-based. It is entirely possible that Nvidia's GeForce NOW service could come to the Switch, however. Not saying it's probable, but it's definitely possible. Obviously would not work when you aren't docked or at least on WiFi (5 Ghz recommended for GeForce NOW - it does work excellently though).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 01, 2016, 12:08:01 AM
It would be kinda great if games like the Dead Trigger series and the Shadowgun games showed up. I actually enjoy room puzzle games despite their small scale. On Ouya there was a pretty good FFIII demo that I downloaded. I think the world needs to play the console version of Organ Trail(a parody of Oregon trail)

I look at the Shield Store and that newer version of Tomb Raider is on it, Ultra Steet Fighter IV, Shadow Warrior 2, Thief, Saints Row IV.  Games that have shown up on xbox and playstation and microconsoles, but have been absent on Nintendo Platforms.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 01, 2016, 10:01:53 AM
I'm feeling my enthusiasm for Nintendo Switch decline again...


The Nintendo Switch could unite the gaming audience, Ubisoft exec says (http://www.polygon.com/2016/11/30/13794304/ubisoft-nintendo-switch-nintendo-casual-hardcore-evolution)


Quote
“We are thinking that if Nintendo’s philosophy is really to gather those two worlds,” Poix said, “if adult players and console players could be the same community, then what's the best user journey of one player that would own the Switch? Not necessarily only with the Switch mind you, but we tried to consider this in the way our upcoming games are being designed. We thought about the time needed for a play session in this game to fit the experience of a handheld.


“When you are playing a game, an adult console game or mobile game for instance, you are spending less time than you then when you are at home in front of your TV for hours. So that's something that we have in mind for the games that we are producing right now.”


So that's what they have in mind for the games they're producing right now.


I guess I hope other publishers aren't thinking this way. It's not hard for me to imagine why publishers would be salivating over the prospects, though, if they think this thing could bring mom and grandma back within full game price reach for their cheap gimmicky games. I suppose some good stuff can come from that pile, too. Count me as one who was scarred by the Wii.


Also, I think this pretty much sums up everything about the Switch. I think the joycon motion controllers maybe were the last detail that insiders were sitting on. So this is maybe it, and in every way imaginable Nintendo is returning to its past endeavors. We have the Wii U Gamepad as the console now. We have the joycons as the motion controllers. This thing is Wii-port and Wii U-port ready in all ways. And it's a portable. I'm still expecting to find out that this thing is possibly Android OS at its core and they plan to support some Android-based mobile games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 01, 2016, 12:04:42 PM
But it's not Wii U Port-ready, because it doesn't have a second screen.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 01, 2016, 03:37:35 PM
I was thinking about the Skyrim port on Wii, along with possible Zelda ports, and wondered what could make them worth it. And the first thing that came to mind was perfect 1-1 motion controls.

I loved Skyrim and despite how many hours I put into it before putting it down, I'd definitely play it again, but with motion controls, it'd be even better. Motion controls would also allow for faster menu navigation for weapon selection, etc.

I've also never played Skyward Sword (though I want to but don't have a Wii or WiiU) but one of the main gripes I hear about it, is the motion controls. A port of SS with 1-1 motion controls and the other issues fixed would be great for returning Nintendo players like me. OooT, and every other Zelda would also benefit from 1-1 motion controls (maybe not Wind Waker as much because of the combo battle system) and could be good for the system. I know "gimmick" will be the first thing to come from some people, but let's also remember that Todd Howard was really impressed with the demo. What if the motion controls are what impressed him?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 01, 2016, 07:50:28 PM
Zelda 1:1 motion controls

I think there's about zero chance of that happening. If you'd played Skyward Sword, you'd know that the 1:1 motion controls of that game were not cosmetic. The entire game is essentially based around controlling Link like an action figure. There'd be no way to port it to traditional controls without neutering the experience. BotW meanwhile is clearly fully playable with the standard gamepad setup. The most you'd see is something like the Twilight Princess Wii port, with waggle sword and pointer aiming.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 01, 2016, 09:44:42 PM
But it's not Wii U Port-ready, because it doesn't have a second screen.


Let's not overthink it.


The Switch has millions of second screens (tablets and phones) if it really [has] to have it for any of the Wii U's best titles. All it would take is an app from Nintendo. Besides, there are really only a few great titles that fully realized the potential of the second screen, so I hardly think of this as a barrier.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 03, 2016, 02:02:50 AM
Amazon leaked Yooka Laylee's release date as March 17th.

What are the chances that will be Switch's release date as well.

Also,  St. Patty's day.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 03, 2016, 06:12:25 AM
I was thinking about the Skyrim port on Wii, along with possible Zelda ports, and wondered what could make them worth it. And the first thing that came to mind was perfect 1-1 motion controls.

I loved Skyrim and despite how many hours I put into it before putting it down, I'd definitely play it again, but with motion controls, it'd be even better. Motion controls would also allow for faster menu navigation for weapon selection, etc.

I've also never played Skyward Sword (though I want to but don't have a Wii or WiiU) but one of the main gripes I hear about it, is the motion controls. A port of SS with 1-1 motion controls and the other issues fixed would be great for returning Nintendo players like me. OooT, and every other Zelda would also benefit from 1-1 motion controls (maybe not Wind Waker as much because of the combo battle system) and could be good for the system. I know "gimmick" will be the first thing to come from some people, but let's also remember that Todd Howard was really impressed with the demo. What if the motion controls are what impressed him?

Nice handle. That'll never get old hahaha ha haaaa........RIP PlanetGamecube
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 03, 2016, 03:46:01 PM
Let's not overthink it.

The Switch has millions of second screens (tablets and phones) if it really [has] to have it for any of the Wii U's best titles. All it would take is an app from Nintendo. Besides, there are really only a few great titles that fully realized the potential of the second screen, so I hardly think of this as a barrier.
I'm not saying that there are a number of games that utilized the second screen well, but I am saying that a "quick fix" like a mobile app is not going to do the job. The gamepad was a device with tech that synced directly to the console. Some of its uses were minute, but integral.

This kind of brings me to another gripe I have about a Switch title, which is the inevitable Spla2n. One of the most beneficial aspects of the game, and something that I think will be damaged in getting rid of the second screen, is the way it functioned as a progress tracker. Without that information being easily available, I can't see myself enjoying the game as much.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 03, 2016, 07:42:14 PM
I was thinking about the Skyrim port on Wii, along with possible Zelda ports, and wondered what could make them worth it. And the first thing that came to mind was perfect 1-1 motion controls.

I loved Skyrim and despite how many hours I put into it before putting it down, I'd definitely play it again, but with motion controls, it'd be even better. Motion controls would also allow for faster menu navigation for weapon selection, etc.

I've also never played Skyward Sword (though I want to but don't have a Wii or WiiU) but one of the main gripes I hear about it, is the motion controls. A port of SS with 1-1 motion controls and the other issues fixed would be great for returning Nintendo players like me. OooT, and every other Zelda would also benefit from 1-1 motion controls (maybe not Wind Waker as much because of the combo battle system) and could be good for the system. I know "gimmick" will be the first thing to come from some people, but let's also remember that Todd Howard was really impressed with the demo. What if the motion controls are what impressed him?

Nice handle. That'll never get old hahaha ha haaaa........RIP PlanetGamecube

Lol thanks. I only expect to last seven years at the most... I've been around since PlanetGamecube and had an old account when the switch was made to NWR but I've long since changed computers and have forgotten the name and which email account is was registered to (I have too many email accounts, and why I don't know, but I like it).

Six more weeks and we'll know everything there is to know about the Switch. Hopefully the rumored price point is true.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 03, 2016, 10:33:20 PM
The rumor is $249 base model, $299 upgraded model with possible pack-in right?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 04, 2016, 12:04:47 PM
Let's not overthink it.

The Switch has millions of second screens (tablets and phones) if it really [has] to have it for any of the Wii U's best titles. All it would take is an app from Nintendo. Besides, there are really only a few great titles that fully realized the potential of the second screen, so I hardly think of this as a barrier.
I'm not saying that there are a number of games that utilized the second screen well, but I am saying that a "quick fix" like a mobile app is not going to do the job. The gamepad was a device with tech that synced directly to the console. Some of its uses were minute, but integral.

This kind of brings me to another gripe I have about a Switch title, which is the inevitable Spla2n. One of the most beneficial aspects of the game, and something that I think will be damaged in getting rid of the second screen, is the way it functioned as a progress tracker. Without that information being easily available, I can't see myself enjoying the game as much.


So will your phone or tablet via bluetooth. All the gamepad does (beyond being a controller) is stream video from the console.


When I make this sort of offhand claim about Wii U ports it's with an expectation that we understand there is some feasible intelligent solution available. I only said the NS is Wii U port ready because it is literally already getting Wii U ports. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 04, 2016, 01:12:40 PM
I understand that some intelligent, feasible solution is available. But I don't think it involves mobile devices, because I don't think that's an intelligent solution.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 04, 2016, 09:32:13 PM
I understand that some intelligent, feasible solution is available. But I don't think it involves mobile devices, because I don't think that's an intelligent solution.


Ok, so now we've gone full circle. Originally you said the Switch isn't Wii U port-ready even though it's already getting ports from Wii U.  :confused;
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 04, 2016, 09:51:39 PM
Most game engines handle porting pretty easily. In unity, it's as simple as a box in the publishing window.

(https://docs.unity3d.com/uploads/Main/BuildSettings.png)

i've never used unreal 4(my computer is really old) but apparently, this is what it looks like on it.

(https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Wjzjnv9E5SU/maxresdefault.jpg)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 04, 2016, 10:09:34 PM
Ok, so now we've gone full circle. Originally you said the Wii U isn't port-ready even though it's already getting ports from Wii U.  :confused;
No, I never said the Wii U isn't port-ready. The Switch is not Wii U port ready. There is certainly some way to make Wii U games work on the Switch, but I don't think it will be the method you described, and I don't think it will be simple. It will require reworking of the games in order to either remove or integrate the dual-screen mechanics so that it functions for a single screen.

The Switch is MORE Wii port ready because it has the remote and nunchuk hardware available in the system, and the games will likely not differ in performance from translating motion controls to those devices. Does that mean a port will be easy? Not necessarily. However, important Wii U ports will differ in performance from their originals, no matter how much you say "the second screen stuff was minimal at best". Xenoblade Chronicles X had an off-TV play mode, fair enough. Mario Maker was primarily played on the Gamepad because of touch controls. Splatoon had a map on the second screen that was constantly updating while you were in-match and allowed interaction. You selected and painted cards on the second screen, not the first, in Color Splash. Those elements will be removed in their Switch iterations, and while that might be "easy" to get rid of, it will still need to be gotten rid of.

I understand your definition of "port-ready"- the game will make its way to Switch because it's finished, the architecture will likely support it, and it will take fewer resources to do so than actually developing a new game. Yes. This makes sense. Just as you don't understand what I meant when I disagreed. I hope we have both clarified our points of view, and although our definitions are different, I don't think that either of them are particularly valid, because you think a port would be easy if Nintendo used a mobile app to circumvent the issues of taking away the Gamepad's second screen interaction and functionality, while I think of a port as "a 1-1 transfer of mechanics and controls to a new system."
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 05, 2016, 02:30:45 AM
So, when writing code, making the second screen is similar to writing 4 player splitscreen code. Dropping all second screen code and reworking it to be more traditional is not too hard. Its not like writing ai code. It'd be like cutting features with an axe. Many games have off screen play mode, which uses one screen.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 05, 2016, 12:15:55 PM
Many do, and that's why they'll likely be easy ports to Switch. Some don't, and they'll require rethinking or redesign in order to work on the system. Those aren't port ready, and they likely won't get on Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on December 05, 2016, 12:34:15 PM
A side not on Wii U ports, since that appears to be where the discussion is heading atm.

First there is already precedent, at least 2 Wii U exclusives have already been ported to PS4 that relied on Wii U features on Wii U but had those features removed, Rayman and ZomieU. It is not beyond the realm of possibilities that the games on Wii U that would benefit from being ported could go through a similar process. Everything else just needs a brand new game in the series.

So something like Nintendo Land could be ported where they either remove any of the functionality that is dependent on Wii U tech missing from the Switch, or they could just make a brand new Nintendo Land Switch that creates the same experience but uses all of the features of the Switch.

Everything else will get a sequel and so that reduces the need to cater to the niche market of Wii U owners that might re-buy Super Mario 3D World, which I imagine would be easy to port minus Wii U specific features anyways. So I am really not seeing an issue with porting games from Wii U to the switch. Also as stated, EVERYONE has a cell phone and most people have a tablet, there is a method of providing a second screen right there.

They could go a step further and let you sync the Switch with your existing DS/3DS but I imagine that is something they won't do.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 05, 2016, 03:24:30 PM
What is this "everyone has phones" mentality you guys keep pushing? For the oddly specific reveal trailer demographic, AKA millennials with apartments they can't afford, this might be the case.

I'll stop arguing, though, because I am in the wrong. As usual.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 05, 2016, 04:28:43 PM
I mean, I'm sure there are more people who own phones but don't own video game consoles than the opposite.

EDIT: At least some concrete numbers
http://www.pcworld.com/article/2999631/phones/pew-survey-shows-68-percent-of-americans-now-own-a-smartphone.html

Quote
According to the survey, 68 percent of adults in the United States currently own a smartphone, up from 35 percent four years ago. Meanwhile, 45 percent own some form of tablet, up from three percent in 2010.

Quote
Additionally, the survey shows the game console ownership rate remained around 40 percent since 2009, while the percentage of those who own a dedicated portable gaming device (like the Nintendo 3DS) dropped from 18 percent in 2009 to 14 percent today.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on December 05, 2016, 04:58:02 PM
What is this "everyone has phones" mentality you guys keep pushing? For the oddly specific reveal trailer demographic, AKA millennials with apartments they can't afford, this might be the case.

I'll stop arguing, though, because I am in the wrong. As usual.

I was trying to be optimistic but I basically argued what you said, but made the opposite point. Ha, words are funny.

As far as Wii U games are concerned, Nintendo could very well take the aptly appropriate view of why bother they only sold 13 million of them and even fewer games, I mean based on sales numbers alone Nintendo could just decide porting Wii U games to Switch is a waste of their resources and not chase after that small sub-set of the userbase that cares.


I loved the Game Cube, we all loved the Game Cube and yet it's sales figures surely are the primary justification for why Game Cube games do not get ported to Virtual Console when Wii games do, because more people owned a Wii than a Game Cube. I am nearly 90 percent certain that at this point Nintendo would rather pretend Wii U never existed and I am 75 percent certain they will actually make a strong effort to make it go away once Switch is out, but they will love to remind people they had fun playing Wii you can bet your ass of that.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 05, 2016, 07:01:19 PM
I think its more likely that the controller is more why there is no Gamecube VC. Unusual button placement and analogue triggers, it just wouldnt work very well on the Gamepad.
Im sure Nintendo would love to sell us Luigi's Mansion, Mario Sunshine and Mario Kart DD again.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 05, 2016, 09:13:10 PM
I hope Nintendo sells a Gamecube Classics collection for Switch with a Gamecube style joycons. 

I don't see why they couldn't.  If you just released the games that really NEEDED the analog Triggers to play correctly, or really needed the correct button placement. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 05, 2016, 09:20:28 PM
I think Nintendo might be shying away from putting out so many accessories.  I also think the reason there was no GC on the VC was either due to the file sizes not being manageable or Nintendo wanting to save the library for HD ports.  They did Zelda twice out of desperation, but that isn't to say other titles weren't on the table.  With how much of the PS4 library is HD Remakes and Remasters, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo was eyeing the GC library for potential ports.  Especially for games that maybe never made it out west like Doshin the Giant.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 05, 2016, 09:29:39 PM
Yeah, I think additional joycons are the best bet for GC re-releases, and would also conveniently cater to Smash Bros. Cube controller die-hards (myself among them) without needing the somewhat clunky adapter.

And I do think the Gamecube controllers are a legitimate emulation problem. I might be stepping out of bounds here, but last year a friend was moving and gave me a box of his old GC stuff and a bunch of games. I was excited to play melee again as well as stuff I'd never tried, like Star Fox Assault, F-Zero GX, and Wave Race: Blue Storm. It turns out the lag was so bad I couldn't play them on my modern TV. But I really wanted to give Star Fox a shot and owned a disc, so I downloaded Dolphin and the rom. It turns out the game is functionally unplayable with a standard 360 pad due to those triggers. I'd imagine Mario Sunshine would be similarly problematic, as would other games. To release the games via VC they'd have to screw with the innards in a way they clearly don't want to.

Note how there was no problem with Wii games on the WiiU VC with bigger file sizes. They hacked the DS together for it, but they had the advantage of a large single-touch resistive screen on the Gamepad.

As for WiiU ports, it's again perhaps not as easy as you might think for games that use the second screen heavily. That Gamepad streaming is proprietary low-latency tech, and I doubt Nintendo could get a second-screen experience going with tablets or smart phones that they would deem satisfactory.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 05, 2016, 10:21:15 PM
I think its more likely that the controller is more why there is no Gamecube VC. Unusual button placement and analogue triggers, it just wouldnt work very well on the Gamepad.
Im sure Nintendo would love to sell us Luigi's Mansion, Mario Sunshine and Mario Kart DD again.


So you don't think the N64 button layout is more exotic than the GCN?


I get that the button placement on the right side was a little offset, but it doesn't strike me as being something that would prevent me from playing a game. Look at Wind Waker: that plays just fine.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on December 05, 2016, 11:00:28 PM
I think Nintendo might be shying away from putting out so many accessories.  I also think the reason there was no GC on the VC was either due to the file sizes not being manageable or Nintendo wanting to save the library for HD ports.  They did Zelda twice out of desperation, but that isn't to say other titles weren't on the table.  With how much of the PS4 library is HD Remakes and Remasters, I wouldn't be surprised if Nintendo was eyeing the GC library for potential ports.  Especially for games that maybe never made it out west like Doshin the Giant.


But the Wii U had the Pro Controller so that debunks the person who said the Game Pad was the cause, and Wii games are larger than Game Cube games and there are dozens of those so that debunks the large file sizes.

As for HD Remasters, they did 2, they didn't exactly light sales charts on fire.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 06, 2016, 02:21:27 AM
Look at Wind Waker: that plays just fine.

Thats a remake with new controls, so yes it does. But I think VC games with gamecube button icons might get slightly confusing and awkward. Definitely not unplayable though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on December 06, 2016, 02:27:11 AM
Nintendo's numbers put The Wind Waker HD at two million units sold. Putting aside the fact that it came out on a console that only sold 13 million units, Miyamoto said Breath of the Wild would supposedly recoup its costs if it surpassed the two million units sold mark. Considering all the time and the resources that have gone into Breath of the Wild over the past five years, I'd say two million units sold for a game that was mostly just an HD remaster is pretty darn good if that's truly their benchmark.

Twilight Princess HD seems to have fallen well short of The Wind Waker HD, but I think that has a lot to do with the fact that there are close to six million Wii discs of that game out in the wild. It probably would have done a lot better if Twilight Princess was a GameCube game only.

Among the other candidates, Super Smash Bros. Melee HD would easily be a hit if they left the game intact. The competitive Melee scene is only continuing to grow, even fifteen years later, and I think it's safe to say that Melee is considered the best game in the series by most casual fans as well. Super Mario Sunshine HD is another obvious one. Given how big Fire Emblem has gotten in the West, Path of Radiance seems like a good candidate (though adding the additional modes many new fans have come to expect would probably be a non-insignificant amount of work). I think there are a fair number of GameCube games that could do well as HD remasters or remakes and Nintendo probably has considered them.

Personally, I'd much rather have a GameCube Virtual Console though. I don't think the odds are "good" given how the Wii Virtual Console has gone, but it would at least give us a non-zero chance of games like Skies of Arcadia, Super Monkey Ball 2, and the Baten Kaitos games showing up on the service.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on December 06, 2016, 09:52:39 AM
Looks like a Switch Accessory Pack got listed w/ a USB-C cable as part of the combo
http://nintendoeverything.com/first-switch-accessories-appear-at-eb-games-australia-system-may-use-usb-c-charging/

I like that Nintendo is being very progressive here. Possibly utilizing new technologies in a beneficial forward thinking way
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 06, 2016, 11:43:05 AM
Among the other candidates, Super Smash Bros. Melee HD would easily be a hit if they left the game intact. The competitive Melee scene is only continuing to grow, even fifteen years later, and I think it's safe to say that Melee is considered the best game in the series by most casual fans as well.

Only it's not at all.  Most casual fans play Smash Bros for the characters in which is why the most recent Smash Bros is always their most favorite.  The competitive fighting community makes up a very small percent of Smash Bros audience which is why even when the competitive part of the fanbase was crying over Brawl, everyone else was eating the game up.  Of course since the most recent Smash Bros isn't anti-tournament like Brawl even the competitive part of the Smash Bros fanbase is pretty split about Smash Bros For Wii U and Melee this time around which gives Nintendo even less incentive to appeal to the Melee fans when many of them even prefer the newest game this time.

This is why outside of an eventual Gamecube Virtual Console release at some point, a Melee HD will never happen since each new Smash Bros makes the previous obsolete to the majority of the gaming community.  This is why Nintendo never releases Mario Kart remasters since it's the same situation where the newest installment keeps surpassing what most people love about the franchise.

Given how big Fire Emblem has gotten in the West, Path of Radiance seems like a good candidate (though adding the additional modes many new fans have come to expect would probably be a non-insignificant amount of work).

Now this I can see happening.  Path and Dawn of Radiance are both very popular among traditional fanbase who would be very likely to buy a remaster, especially since the Switch will be a handheld as well so both games can do much better in Japan this time unlike their original release where the home console release hurt them over there.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on December 06, 2016, 03:49:02 PM
Of course since the most recent Smash Bros isn't anti-tournament like Brawl even the competitive part of the Smash Bros fanbase is pretty split about Smash Bros For Wii U and Melee this time around which gives Nintendo even less incentive to appeal to the Melee fans when many of them even prefer the newest game this time.

It's more accurate to say that Smash 4 inherited the competitive Brawl fanbase (which, small as it is, did exist) and gained an impressive amount of new fans in a hurry than it is to say that many competitive Melee fans even prefer the newest game this time. Even though Smash 4 is much more tournament-friendly than Brawl, there's still very little crossover appeal between Melee and Smash 4 at that level (which is why there was less than a 16% overlap between entrants at EVO this year and most fans of one game don't even bother watching the other most of the time). Melee has also continued on an upward trend in entrants and viewership even after Smash 4 was released. I don't think there's much evidence to suggest that a lot of Melee fans switched preferences.

Point taken on casual fans though (which I do count myself as). Most of my gaming friends and acquaintances would still say Melee is their favorite, but that's anecdotal. Maybe you're right and most other casual fans who have been with the series from the beginning just consider each new entry their favorite.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 06, 2016, 04:55:28 PM
Looks like a Switch Accessory Pack got listed w/ a USB-C cable as part of the combo
http://nintendoeverything.com/first-switch-accessories-appear-at-eb-games-australia-system-may-use-usb-c-charging/ (http://nintendoeverything.com/first-switch-accessories-appear-at-eb-games-australia-system-may-use-usb-c-charging/)

I like that Nintendo is being very progressive here. Possibly utilizing new technologies in a beneficial forward thinking way

I hope this means fast-charging.  But I do get nervous since the cheaper cables have been known to make things more. . .explode-y.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 06, 2016, 05:22:38 PM
So From Software is considering porting Dark Souls to Switch.

I wonder what ridiculous exclusive title Nintendo is funding them to put on the console.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 06, 2016, 05:26:53 PM
So From Software is considering porting Dark Souls to Switch.

I wonder what ridiculous exclusive title Nintendo is funding them to put on the console.
Metroid Prime: Federation Party featuring Chibi Samus.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Order.RSS on December 06, 2016, 05:57:42 PM
So From Software is considering porting Dark Souls to Switch.

I wonder what ridiculous exclusive title Nintendo is funding them to put on the console.

Darkey Kong: Droppical Bleed.

(Or maybe Lost Kingdoms 3?)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Khushrenada on December 06, 2016, 05:59:55 PM
So From Software is considering porting Dark Souls to Switch.

I wonder what ridiculous exclusive title Nintendo is funding them to put on the console.
Metroid Prime: Federation Party featuring Chibi Samus.

Buying slightly different colored Federation Trooper Amiibo allows you to play on different gameboards / maps as you collect Chozo artifacts to win the game and be declared the Bounty Hunter Superstar!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 06, 2016, 06:29:35 PM
Seriously though, the Wonderful 101/Bayonetta 2/Star Fox Zero relationship with Platinum seemed to work out for them, I'd expect them to want to take it one step further with other Japanese devs. The downside of Platinum is that their games are relatively niche. From Software has a broader audience.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: alegoicoe on December 06, 2016, 06:30:22 PM
A dark souls trilogy would be very sweet, i wouldn't mind double dipping souls 3 if i have the ability to play the other 2 which i haven't played.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on December 06, 2016, 06:54:57 PM
LPVG put out some other interesting rumors about Switch today as well:

Quote
Hey all, it has been a while.

We have recently learned through a source at Nintendo connected to the organisation of an upcoming hands on press event that the Nintendo Switch Dock does increase the performance of the handheld, but not due to any additional processing in the dock.

When the system is connected to the dock by USB-C, the system’s components will run at a higher clock speed to facilitate 1080p resolutions on the TV. Both video and power will be transfered over USB-C when docked. Plugging the system into the dock will also activate a small additional fan to help with cooling when run at that higher clock speed. This fan is in the rear of the dock, and there is a gap in the back of the dock to allow the system’s inbuilt fans to vent when docked.

The dock is incredibly light weight and, while it does play a part in increasing system performance on the TV, it is designed to be cheap to produce. The intention is that some time after launch additional docks will be sold to place in differing rooms if you have multiple TVs.

Nintendo’s January 13th 2017 reveal events will feature near retail level hardware. Each title will be locked to playing one game demo, but press will be free to take the systems to a separate area of the event to play on sofas rather than the TV. When returning to TVs, they will not be required to return the system to the same dock it started at.

The event will be held in a large number of small sessions, each with a minimal number of press in attendance to ensure hardware is kept track of. UK Press are required to RSVP for the event by 11:59PM December 8th 2016. The location of the reveal event has not been made known to press. Let’s Play Video Games were not amongst the outlets invited to this event. They did not respond to our request for an invite to the event when we learned invites had been sent out.

http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/12/report-nintendo-switch-dock-increases-performance-not-via-extra-hardware/ (http://letsplayvideogames.com/2016/12/report-nintendo-switch-dock-increases-performance-not-via-extra-hardware/)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on December 06, 2016, 07:25:27 PM
A dark souls trilogy would be very sweet, i wouldn't mind double dipping souls 3 if i have the ability to play the other 2 which i haven't played.


I only just bought the complete DS2 and have yet to start it so I'll be more than happy if a full trilogy gets announced for Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: alegoicoe on December 06, 2016, 08:16:44 PM
A dark souls trilogy would be very sweet, i wouldn't mind double dipping souls 3 if i have the ability to play the other 2 which i haven't played.


I only just bought the complete DS2 and have yet to start it so I'll be more than happy if a full trilogy gets announced for Switch.


I really enjoyed 3 specially the dungeons and artstyle
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 06, 2016, 08:58:45 PM
Once again, a third party game will feature a Samus costume because Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 06, 2016, 10:32:38 PM
According to Liam Robertson (Unseen64 contributor, broke the Devil's Third stuff, etc) the Switch will have GameCube VC despite its entire purpose being completed with re-releases of Skies of Arcadia Legends and Baten Kaitos Origins.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 06, 2016, 10:47:25 PM
As long as we get F-Zero GX.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 06, 2016, 11:01:27 PM
The Metroid, Pikmin, and Zelda games on the platform all got superior versions to the original GameCube ones, but there's still some good stuff to be had there. Though honestly, one big one in Super Mario Sunshine could really use a remaster instead of a VC release to smooth over some of the more egregious flaws.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 06, 2016, 11:09:44 PM
THQ Nordic is working on two games for the Switch. Me thinks it's a port of the first Darksiders and a remaster of some obscure Gamecube/PS2 era game.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 06, 2016, 11:15:27 PM
I think if they added an radar or something to help find the Blue Coins that would be nice. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 06, 2016, 11:18:08 PM
I think if they added an radar or something to help find the Blue Coins that would be nice. 

Or better yet, got rid of the blue coins and made actual levels for those shines. Super Mario 64 DS added 30 stars to the game, so just do something like that, but instead of inflating the number replace those. Do that and improve the camera and I'd absolutely buy that package.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 06, 2016, 11:35:23 PM
I think if they added an radar or something to help find the Blue Coins that would be nice. 

Or better yet, got rid of the blue coins and made actual levels for those shines. Super Mario 64 DS added 30 stars to the game, so just do something like that, but instead of inflating the number replace those. Do that and improve the camera and I'd absolutely buy that package.

I would agree to that.  I never found all the blue coins.  They were so frustrating it was impossible to map out.  There are some aspects of Super Mario Sunshine, that make it one of the better Mario games, but other aspects that make it awfully frustrating.  I don't think I want a remake...I would rather have a new game that keeps the mechanics that work and gets rid of the mechanics that don't.  Here are the things I would like kept:

1) Hover Mechanic for pinpoint accuracy with jumps
2) Mini challenge stages to get stars pushing the limit of your platforming skills
3) The Tight Rope walking and jumping...and basically open world with focus on vertical exploration
4) Sliding down walls and wall jumping

The things that didn't work:
1) The water gun mechanic mixed with limited water...was not enjoyable
2) The Race the clock to complete a task...with no idea where to go or where to look.  Worse when you also have to use the water gun...and run out of water.
3) The story.
4) Finally the limited environments. 
5) The Over World Hub to the other actual levels was clunky and not very enjoyable or easy to maneuver to the next level.

All in all, Super Mario Sunshine took everything that was in Super Mario 64 that was fun and made it better and perfect...but then they added features that actually hurt the design and made it worse.  Super Mario Sunshine always excelled when the game felt more like a souped up Mario 64, and failed when it started moving away and doing its own thing. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 06, 2016, 11:41:33 PM
So what's the Rumored/Official games list?

Zelda BOTW
Mario Switch
Pikmin 4
Splatoon
Smash Bros.
Dark Souls Trilogy
Pokemon Stars
Skyrim Remastered
Mario Kart
NBA 2k
Mario/Rabbids RPG

Am I missing any?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on December 07, 2016, 01:28:17 AM
Or better yet, got rid of the blue coins and made actual levels for those shines. Super Mario 64 DS added 30 stars to the game, so just do something like that, but instead of inflating the number replace those. Do that and improve the camera and I'd absolutely buy that package.

The problem with that is Nintendo would rather use any new level idea's for a new 3D Mario then put into an HD remaster.  Mario 64 DS was kind of an unique situation where the game had to be a standout title for launch of the DS since the system was rushed out and had nothing else for months and the visuals/controls were a blatant downgrade over the N64 original so Nintendo needed something to make up for it and get people's attention.

The only way I see Nintendo putting that much work into a Sunshine remaster is if they were in a really desperate situation and needed that game to be a big hit because it was released during the middle of a huge drought.  Of course if the Switch is having huge droughts and need filler like that Nintendo would probably be more likely to just remaster Galaxy 1+2 instead since both games were more popular, and could easily be remastered without any major changes unlike Sunshine which needs a lot more work.


I would agree to that.  I never found all the blue coins.  They were so frustrating it was impossible to map out.  There are some aspects of Super Mario Sunshine, that make it one of the better Mario games, but other aspects that make it awfully frustrating.  I don't think I want a remake...I would rather have a new game that keeps the mechanics that work and gets rid of the mechanics that don't.  Here are the things I would like kept:

1) Hover Mechanic for pinpoint accuracy with jumps
2) Mini challenge stages to get stars pushing the limit of your platforming skills
3) The Tight Rope walking and jumping...and basically open world with focus on vertical exploration
4) Sliding down walls and wall jumping

The things that didn't work:
1) The water gun mechanic mixed with limited water...was not enjoyable
2) The Race the clock to complete a task...with no idea where to go or where to look.  Worse when you also have to use the water gun...and run out of water.
3) The story.
4) Finally the limited environments. 
5) The Over World Hub to the other actual levels was clunky and not very enjoyable or easy to maneuver to the next level.

All in all, Super Mario Sunshine took everything that was in Super Mario 64 that was fun and made it better and perfect...but then they added features that actually hurt the design and made it worse.  Super Mario Sunshine always excelled when the game felt more like a souped up Mario 64, and failed when it started moving away and doing its own thing. 

Yeah this is why I just don't see Nintendo being willing to do a full HD remaster for Sunshine since the game has too many problems with some of them requiring a complete overall to fix.  They would basically have to remake the game from the ground up to make it even come close to the quality of the other 3D Mario games and I imagine Nintendo would rather spend that money on actual new Mario games instead since these remasters are usually limited to the original fans that bought them, while a new game brings in a much wider audience.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 07, 2016, 08:54:55 AM
THQ Nordic is working on two games for the Switch. Me thinks it's a port of the first Darksiders and a remaster of some obscure Gamecube/PS2 era game.

Sphinx the Cursed Mummy obscure enough?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 07, 2016, 09:14:23 AM
Oh hey, it's the "Sunshine is low quality" argument again.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 07, 2016, 12:23:37 PM
It's the game that most perfectly represents the Gamecube, honestly.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 07, 2016, 05:18:09 PM
I'm all for a GameCube Virtual Console though I'd still like to see most of those games remastered if only to put them in widescreen without stretching the picture. I had my doubts that Nintendo would ever release Super Smash Bros. Melee HD, but I'm holding out hope (in vain) the Switch port of Super Smash Bros. For Wii U/3DS has a Melee Mode that emulates Melee's speed, physics, and gameplay but tries to fix its balancing issues so more than four characters are viable.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on December 07, 2016, 05:29:20 PM
I had my doubts that Nintendo would ever release Super Smash Bros. Melee HD, but I'm holding out hope (in vain) the Switch port of Super Smash Bros. For Wii U/3DS has a Melee Mode that emulates Melee's speed, physics, and gameplay but tries to fix its balancing issues so more than four characters are viable.
Myself, I'd love to see a Smash 64 mode. I always liked the gameplay best there, but it sorely lacks content.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 07, 2016, 06:50:46 PM
I had my doubts that Nintendo would ever release Super Smash Bros. Melee HD, but I'm holding out hope (in vain) the Switch port of Super Smash Bros. For Wii U/3DS has a Melee Mode that emulates Melee's speed, physics, and gameplay but tries to fix its balancing issues so more than four characters are viable.
Myself, I'd love to see a Smash 64 mode. I always liked the gameplay best there, but it sorely lacks content.

This I loved Smash Bros 64 more than any other.  Melee's single player content was much better...but I found the speed to be too fast.  Also, I found the overly advanced technical hits of Melee and others to be annoying.  Seriously, I have to time my attack to hit the tip of a sword or show to get the strongest attack...who would have even thought to be that specific without reading about it? 

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 07, 2016, 06:55:36 PM
Oh hey, it's the "Sunshine is low quality" argument again.

If that is directed towards me.  I hope you know I had positives to say as well.  Sunshine while I was playing it the first time was very engaging and many aspects were much better than Super Mario 64.  That said, there are some games I love and are great games, but I will probably never play through again.  Sunshine is one of those games...then there are games I can play through, over and over again.  Super Mario 64 is one of those games.  I think it comes to accessibility.  And I think SM64 is more accessible than Sunshine.  Also I will play Link to the Past over and over again...but the other 2D Zeldas and OoT I can't play through again...there are just bottleneck areas that I don't want to trudge through to get to the better parts of the game again.  That is why story is never important to me in playing games...I know it is just my opinion though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on December 07, 2016, 07:32:55 PM
THQ Nordic is working on two games for the Switch. Me thinks it's a port of the first Darksiders and a remaster of some obscure Gamecube/PS2 era game.


This tells me enough to decide to not buy the Wii U edition until Switch launch just to be sure. I have DS2 digital on my Wii U, but I'd love to get a physical combo pack of 1 & 2 on Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 07, 2016, 08:49:41 PM
Oh look, it's the "Melee needs to come back" argument.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 07, 2016, 11:16:48 PM
Evans_B:  I agree Melee doesn't need to come back.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 07, 2016, 11:22:53 PM
Melee will 100% be the best selling game on the GameCube Virtual Console.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on December 07, 2016, 11:39:49 PM
It won't, because Nintendo will follow their MO of announcing this "great new system with VC support" and then only release 3-4 titles we slightly care about and "surprise us" with Double Dash a two and a half years later, giving us hope for a revival, only for us to be disappointed for another 3-4 years... ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 08, 2016, 12:21:52 AM
Melee will 100% be the best selling game on the GameCube Virtual Console.


That's an odd way of spelling Double Dash.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 08, 2016, 12:25:35 AM
Super Mario Kart Double Dash would definitely beat Melee.  I think that is one of the better Mario Kart games.  Though, I really want a Mario kart with the controls of Double Dash but the Weapons of Super Mario Kart 64, which had the best Blue Turtle Shell, and also I loved being able to break and prevent banana peel spin outs. 

If a Double Dash sequel was made I would love to seem them add an item combination feature that allows for a special powered up attack combining the two drivers items.  Like Mushroom and Red Turtle shell is a faster shot.  Lightning and Banana Peel shrinks players.  Ghosts and and a special item steals that specific item and gives you two of them. 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 08, 2016, 01:38:09 AM
Meant to post this here versus the official game announcement thread.

Rumor has it from a pretty solid source that From Software has Dark Souls 3 running on the Switchand are happy with the performance.

Quote
According to one of our sources, From Software has Dark Souls 3 running on the Nintendo Switch with a level of performance they are happy with. They have not committed to releasing it yet, but discussions internally at the company have discussed the financial viability of re releasing the main three Dark Souls titles on the Switch with their DLC bundled in.
Development on a Switch port has been underway for several months via a small team, with From Software waiting to see initial sales data before committing to producing ports. The plan would be for a Switch rerelease of Dark Souls 3 if greenlit to release the same day as PS4, Xbox One and PC receive versions with all DLC included.


Hopefully, provided the sales data looks favorable, that last sentence implies they would release Dark Souls 3 with all DLC for Switch the same day as PS4, Xbox One, etc.


This is sounding positive. I would have to give strong consideration to picking up one or all three of these games. If this is a sign of the kind of games we can expect on Switch, then this is going to be a successful platform for Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on December 08, 2016, 03:33:22 AM
wasn't sure where I should post this, but I guess in here is as good as anywhere....




Jimmy Fallon really is the biggest geek isn't he? LOL


edit: I guess it was already posted in the BotW thread.
but this wasn't


Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 08, 2016, 05:51:09 AM
Evans_B:  I agree Melee doesn't need to come back.
Personally, I think Super Smash Bros. For Wii U/3DS mops the floor with Melee. It's hard for me to go back to any other previous Smash game. However, I don't understand your position. Why shouldn't Nintendo bring Melee back? What harm would that be? We still get the Switch port and probably a sequel down the line. Why shouldn't Melee be revisited in some way? The game has a really passionate following. Why try to take that away from them? Why not introduce it to a newer generation? By the same token, I didn't really like Mario Kart: Double Dash, but **** it, bring it back. Let's get a Double Dash mode in Mario Kart Switch (granted, alongside fixing Battle Mode).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 08, 2016, 06:38:33 AM
It was good to get a closer look at the switch. Its surprisingly thin, I cant wait to get one.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 08, 2016, 10:34:53 PM
Switch analysis by someone I know
http://imgur.com/a/2Zeia
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: supermario2k on December 09, 2016, 10:49:47 AM
I wish Amazon would already allow pre-orders I want to get mine locked in before I spend all the money reserved for it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 09, 2016, 12:49:00 PM
Amazon wouldn't charge until it ships, though. And GS won't open preorders until the 13th of January.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 09, 2016, 08:43:42 PM
Rumor: FF VII Remake will be on Switch, and will be the first or one if the first things shown in the January 12th announcements. That was part of the reason why it hasn't shown much since its announcement in 2014. Is also why Cloud is in Smash Bros despite having never appeared on a Nintendo console.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 09, 2016, 09:10:25 PM
That would be a huge get for Nintendo. I've never played it, and have no real interest in changing that, but that'll draw a lot of attention to the system.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stratos on December 09, 2016, 09:43:00 PM
Would also be a great pairing for a Smash for Switch up-port w/ Cloud amiibo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 09, 2016, 10:59:42 PM
As previously stated, I just want the delicious irony of seeing Final Fantasy VII Remake on a cartridge-based Nintendo console
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 09, 2016, 11:07:08 PM
Is this posted somewhere? Not that I don't love an irony overdose, but I'd like to have something to point to, y'know?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 10, 2016, 04:01:48 AM
And GS won't open preorders until the 13th of January.

Im surprised to hear that. EB Games in Australia has lets you preorder just about anything. They have all the games in the reveal trailer up to preorder.
I preordered the Switch the day after the reveal video. I wanted to get in nice and early and not miss out, like I did with the NES mini.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 10, 2016, 06:11:54 AM
Is this posted somewhere? Not that I don't love an irony overdose, but I'd like to have something to point to, y'know?

More word of mouth speculation with friends type thing. When Cloud was put in smash bros it was just very odd. At least when Snake showed up he had been on a Nintendo system. These rumors come from speculation, not a leak.

We do know Square-Enix is going to be supporting Switch, Cloud was in Smash Bros last year near the time when ff7 remake news went dark,  "Some 3rd told me they are moving PS4 titles to Switch. So that may suggest NVIDIA-powered Switch's spec." — Takashi Mochizuki

Although SuperMetalDave64 was spreading the rumor according to this article in February
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2016/02/rumour_final_fantasy_vii_remake_and_xv_headed_to_nx_could_be_definitive_versions

I would enjoy some irony pie. I didn't actually like the original FFVII on PSX. The games style changes got on my nerves really quick, and I could never enjoy it. A lot of that could just be the Playstation's limitations. I was never a fan of the presentation on that platform. I don't think they got it right until Final Fantasy IX. The new trailers look quite good though. I have also enjoyed other Final Fantasy games like the remake of Final Fantasy III.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 11, 2016, 09:44:42 AM
As previously stated, I just want the delicious irony of seeing Final Fantasy VII Remake on a cartridge-based Nintendo console


On 3 cartridges no less!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 14, 2016, 10:12:11 PM
http://gonintendo.com/stories/270367-rumor-switch-specs-detailed-less-powerful-than-ps4-may-be-on (http://gonintendo.com/stories/270367-rumor-switch-specs-detailed-less-powerful-than-ps4-may-be-on)

Selected quotes:
Quote
- Switch uses Nvidia’s older Maxwell architecture, not the new Pascal graphics technology
- Nintendo was in such a rush to replace Wii U that it couldn’t wait for the updated Pascal version of the graphics technology
- may not be able to handle 4K graphics
- does not run the full Android operating system
- Nintendo made sure devs who use Unity and Unreal will be able to easily port those releases on the Switch
- USB Type-C connectivity for faster data transfer as well as fast charging for the battery


A lot of qualified statements in this rumour.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 14, 2016, 10:38:17 PM
http://gonintendo.com/stories/270367-rumor-switch-specs-detailed-less-powerful-than-ps4-may-be-on (http://gonintendo.com/stories/270367-rumor-switch-specs-detailed-less-powerful-than-ps4-may-be-on)

Selected quotes:
Quote
- Switch uses Nvidia’s older Maxwell architecture, not the new Pascal graphics technology
- Nintendo was in such a rush to replace Wii U that it couldn’t wait for the updated Pascal version of the graphics technology
- may not be able to handle 4K graphics
- does not run the full Android operating system
- Nintendo made sure devs who use Unity and Unreal will be able to easily port those releases on the Switch
- USB Type-C connectivity for faster data transfer as well as fast charging for the battery


A lot of qualified statements in this rumour.


It's possible this is true, but what is in these details that we're supposed to believe? Is it the Maxwell architecture? What does that even mean with regards to graphics performance? (hint: it means nothing) Is it the Android OS part? Or is it the USB Type-C that has already been confirmed? These supposed leakers have provided absolutely no new information other than what many of us have already been speculating. How about some actual clock rates or battery details? No? Then this looks like it was just lifted directly out of the Switch hardware speculation thread over at Neogaf.

The bit about Maxwell is so meaningless. It will only matter as far as power consumption is concerned. If it is true, that's sad. Look for a future iteration of Switch about a year or two after launch that will feature Pascal with much better power efficiency and maybe a modest performance bump.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 14, 2016, 11:45:35 PM
Then this looks like it was just lifted directly out of the Switch hardware speculation thread over at Neogaf.

I generally buy the line of thinking this new report supports, but you're right. This is sort of a really long article that ultimately adds little more than the "VentureBeat" name to the whole rumor mill.

Look for a future iteration of Switch about a year or two after launch that will feature Pascal with much better power efficiency and maybe a modest performance bump.

Yup, that's what I anticipate. A sort of Switch "Pro" (ala Sony) but on the sort of timeframe that Nintendo had with the DSLite.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 14, 2016, 11:59:38 PM
It figures the day I'm late making the rounds is the day Neogaf also has Emily Rogers quoted as supporting the "Maxwell" rumor.


https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/809210867288014848 (https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/809210867288014848)


Quote
At least 90% of the info in that GAF thread's OP is correct. Including the "Maxwell" part.


It is believed to be a semi-custom design and a second generation Maxwell chip. FWIW, the Maxwell chip can do it all. It will just take more power to do it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 15, 2016, 01:54:53 AM
It figures the day I'm late making the rounds is the day Neogaf also has Emily Rogers quoted as supporting the "Maxwell" rumor.

https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/809210867288014848 (https://twitter.com/ArcadeGirl64/status/809210867288014848)

Quote
At least 90% of the info in that GAF thread's OP is correct. Including the "Maxwell" part.

It is believed to be a semi-custom design and a second generation Maxwell chip. FWIW, the Maxwell chip can do it all. It will just take more power to do it.

Yeah, I was hoping for Pascal for purposes of battery life, but I wasn't very optimistic. Like I said in my other thread, I'm girding myself for having to buy accessories for a better battery life.

Also, I feel like the specs she's commenting on could just be someone's guesstimate designed to jive with current rumors. I could see it being true, but more because it's a good guess that's devoid of flights of fancy than because it must have some secret leaker who's shared the info.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 15, 2016, 03:01:04 PM
Nintendo Patents for Switch released

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1325344

What has been found:

> The Joycons both have accelerometers, gyroscopes, and rumble.
> The right Joycon also has an "infrared image-capturing section", or IR sensor, and NFC.
> The Switch LCD is a touchscreen.
> It has USB-C
> It has one SD card slot
> The Joycon dock is essentially a battery pack
> 4 Joycons can be used at once for 4-player gaming
> There is an image of a VR setup using the Switch, similar to phones and Google's VR
> The Joycons also have shoulder buttons within the attachable side.
> The Switch itself has an accelerometer and gyroscope.
> The Switch has a "Sound input/output terminal" meaning there isn't a dedicated microphone
> The gamecards are read/writeable.
> The Switch uses bluetooth to communicate with controllers, but no evidence for wireless headphones.
> There are several variations of the Joycon dock, one looking very similar to GC controller.
> Finally the Switch will have two modes of function, portable and console. While portable, the output of the Switch will be tapered.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on December 15, 2016, 03:30:05 PM
While everything seems consistent with the previous rumors, it is nice to see something more concrete.  The IR sensor having some vitality sensor functionality is floating around, with recognition of different people to auto-login and health functions.  The two gyro controllers and portable screen does seem practical for fitness games.

In terms of the X1 style architecture as originally rumored, I don't mind too much.  It is still a huge step forward for a Nintendo handheld, and I don't expect a lot of PS4 and XBOX ONE/PC ports anyway.  If they can get some of the main console games that would benefit from portability, plus all the handheld developers, it would be great.  This isn't a system to replace other systems, in my opinion.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 15, 2016, 03:51:12 PM

> There is an image of a VR setup using the Switch, similar to phones and Google's VR


My first thought on this is that it seems cumbersome to use the whole Switch as the VR platform, but it undoubtedly saves money, and from seeing it on Jimmy Fallon, it looks light enough for it to not be too bad.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 15, 2016, 04:01:31 PM
I'm pretty sure this is to cover their bases as they'll release a lighter, more powerful, and most importantly, higher-res version of the Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 15, 2016, 06:53:25 PM
That could be achieved with just a dedicated VR headset like PS4 has, which is how I thought Nintendo would do their VR as well. Having the whole Switch on your head has to be heavier than just a headset I would think, but is less expensive for both user (hopefully) and Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 15, 2016, 08:27:38 PM
The bit about Maxwell is so meaningless.
Yeah, basically. We've known since Switch was officially announced that Nintendo was going with a semi-custom design. We all just assumed it would be before Nvidia was even rumored because Nintendo doesn't use stock chips. The semi-custom part is the important bit in all this. Pascal was introduced April 2016 so hoping Switch would be Pascal-based wasn't especially realistic (though not entirely impossible). Pascal is based on Maxwell. It's possible Switch's semi-custom GPU shares some of Pascal's improvements over Maxwell, the most important of which would be a die shrink to 16 nm if only for energy efficiency purposes. Depending on how customized Switch's GPU is, one could, in a way, consider it a different successor to Maxwell or a stop gap between the two which wouldn't be bad. I suppose when people were hoping for Pascal on NX, they were really hoping for Pascal-like improvements over Maxwell, and that's still a very real possibility.

Ultimately, I'm not worried about Switch's GPU being Maxwell-based. Peak Maxwell is a beast. Its problem at that performance was power consumption. Pascal resolves that. If Nvidia's Switch GPU similarly solves that issue, being Maxwell-based is not really a problem. We already know Switch can run Unreal Engine 4, Unity etc. Performance isn't what anyone should be concerned with. Battery life, however, is since we're talking about a handheld here, and so much of it depends on what fabrication process Nvidia has the chip on.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 16, 2016, 01:10:57 PM
Here's an easy to digest video of the recent patent dump. Lot's of good info!

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 16, 2016, 06:42:25 PM
That video was very interesting. One thing I noticed was the lack of any cameras. Its probably a good thing they gave up that feature.

Also nice to see touch and motion controls confirmed.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 16, 2016, 07:06:36 PM
And rumble. Have we ever had a handheld that rumbles?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: rlse9 on December 16, 2016, 10:40:12 PM
And rumble. Have we ever had a handheld that rumbles?
Nintendo released a rumble pack accessory for the DS that plugged into the GBA slot, though I remember hearing that it did more noise making than it did rumbling.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 17, 2016, 11:08:11 AM
Here's a (decent) rundown of everything we know thus far: (HYPE!)

http://www.knowyourmobile.com/devices/nintendo-nx/23158/nintendo-switch-release-date-specs-features-price-launch-games
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on December 17, 2016, 01:38:57 PM
And rumble. Have we ever had a handheld that rumbles?
Nintendo released a rumble pack accessory for the DS that plugged into the GBA slot, though I remember hearing that it did more noise making than it did rumbling.
I think he meant as a built-in feature. The Game Boy line also had some cartridges with a rumble motor in it, it's been done that way before. But I don't know of one which had rumble built into it, I don't think Sony's systems did though I can't say for certain.

Does anyone actually care about rumble these days? I don't, and never have.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 17, 2016, 02:38:55 PM
And rumble. Have we ever had a handheld that rumbles?
Nintendo released a rumble pack accessory for the DS that plugged into the GBA slot, though I remember hearing that it did more noise making than it did rumbling.
I think he meant as a built-in feature. The Game Boy line also had some cartridges with a rumble motor in it, it's been done that way before. But I don't know of one which had rumble built into it, I don't think Sony's systems did though I can't say for certain.

Does anyone actually care about rumble these days? I don't, and never have.


The most immersive experiences I've had while gaming have been on PC without rumble. I can only think of it positively enhancing American football games and extreme sports/racing games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 17, 2016, 02:53:29 PM
So I'm confused. I post news that the creator of Skyrim thinks the Switch was "one of the best demos", if not "the best demo" he's ever seen and confirms support for the system, but no one seems to care.

A Switch with enhanced ports favors me, someone who didn't jump on the Wii U train. And there's a lot of us. From my point of view, I get a year one only a fanboy can dream of. If the line-up is true, I'm buying a Switch day one. The last time I bought a console on day one was the gamecube, so you see why this strategy might work.


I think the others are missing the point of Todd's comments. There's obviously a bigger hardware detail than what we've been shown, and it seems to have him excited. It is obviously something more than just the portable function of the console (so it can output to different HD screens, big whoop).

And then just today, the CEO of Gamestop really had a mouthful to say regarding the Switch during their investor call.

Quote
"The Nintendo Switch, which I played at Nintendo a few weeks ago--we believe could be another game-changer that will expand the audience for gaming."


"The Switch is a very interesting device.... A movement-related game is more fun for kids, you know, taking those [Joy-con controllers off] and then the master controller, you can really do a lot of interesting things with that in gameplay."


"I think it has tremendous potential as a game-changer. We'll have to wait and see. Like everything else in this industry, the consumers will vote with their dollars."


WHAT??


Up till now, no one had confirmed anything about motion controls! It seems he may have just confirmed something that Nintendo wasn't even letting slip through their "unofficial" rumor sources (aka Rogers, Dale, etc). That would seem a pretty significant detail to not leak out, no?


Personally, I don't care much for motion controls. However... if you're gonna do VR you sort of need them.  ;)


I'm quoting myself obviously because I was teasing this weeks ago. Now allow me to go one step further: Nintendo is a lot more serious about VR than they let on. Whatever their demo has been to game developers, it has gotten a ton of attention. Does anyone think the best demo ever was a game device that can switch from home TV play to portable seamlessly? Anyone think there were other features of this device that blew people away? And what exactly is Emily Rogers not revealing? She said she wouldn't drop any more details this year.


What would I do with a Switch VR headset and motion controls? ...I'd Wave Race. I'd do some 1080's on a snowboard. I'd explore ancient ruins to unlock secrets and save the galaxy from metroids. I'd do it with the Switch at full power and games that run at a smooth 60 fps and at 720p.


Who here would be on board for that?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 17, 2016, 04:00:09 PM
Who here would be on board for that?

I certainly would be. To your other point, Nintendo would be foolish (ala GC having no real online gaming kind of foolish) to not include VR. For me, it was always the how and when. Would it be a launch feature, would it use a current device, etc. That Nintendo's VR will use the entire Switch, like Google VR uses the entire phone, is still slightly worrisome to me, but your point about it running at 60fps in 720p is well taken.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 17, 2016, 04:31:49 PM
You do not need motion controls for VR. See: PlayStation VR.

I'd rather Nintendo not tack VR on to the Switch's functionality. That would be akin to PlayStation Move or Amiibo- a quick cash grab that is poorly thought out. VR is currently passable, but it's not good.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 17, 2016, 05:05:17 PM
You do not need motion controls for VR. See: PlayStation VR.

I'd rather Nintendo not tack VR on to the Switch's functionality. That would be akin to PlayStation Move or Amiibo- a quick cash grab that is poorly thought out. VR is currently passable, but it's not good.


It wouldn't be tacked on, nor would it be a quick cash grab. I'm suggesting it's a core part of why the Switch is designed as a very powerful portable.


I imagine they will only do VR if the quality is there. The way that I am seeing it, Nintendo can deliver 60 fps VR that looks really good. You don't have to push 1080p Skyrim into a VR experience to produce the best VR experience ever.


Then again, maybe this doesn't happen until the second iteration of Switch arrives featuring a Tegra chip based on Pascal. Clearly Nintendo is forward-thinking here because if they didn't patent this use of their Switch, someone else would have.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 17, 2016, 06:27:07 PM
Given how hard-line the VR enthusiasts seem to be about tech thresholds, I sincerely, sincerely doubt Nintendo will try to turn the Switch tablet into a half-assed VR device, patent doodle be damned. The screen is 720p and thus would be half that for each eye. It would be absurdly unwieldy in a head mount.

As for what demo is getting developers excited, probably just some regular old software being fed through an "off-the-record" PR sieve.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 17, 2016, 06:42:25 PM
Yes you do. Anything less than 1080p is basically a no-go for VR. 720p would be unwatchable.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 17, 2016, 06:43:24 PM
Given how hard-line the VR enthusiasts seem to be about tech thresholds, I sincerely, sincerely doubt Nintendo will try to turn the Switch tablet into a half-assed VR device, patent doodle be damned. The screen is 720p and thus would be half that for each eye. It would be absurdly unwieldy in a head mount.

As for what demo is getting developers excited, probably just some regular old software being fed through an "off-the-record" PR sieve.


You're probably right... It maybe something along the lines of a very simplified porting process thanks to Nvidia.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 17, 2016, 09:04:03 PM
Since you clearly know more about forward thinking business practices than I do, we can just leave it at "Nintendo patented this for an eventual hardware upgrade" because I don't see the basic 250-300 dollar Switch affordably executing on the premise. Just my opinion though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 18, 2016, 12:36:43 AM
I didn't think about it before, but if the VR dock is like the TV dock, then the Switch would broadcast in 1080p. The question then is the screen capable of 1080p and only does 720p in portable mode to save on battery life?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 18, 2016, 01:23:41 AM
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 18, 2016, 12:30:50 PM
Since you clearly know more about forward thinking business practices than I do, we can just leave it at "Nintendo patented this for an eventual hardware upgrade" because I don't see the basic 250-300 dollar Switch affordably executing on the premise. Just my opinion though.


Nah, you're probably right. The experience wouldn't be very good without some additional hardware. I was simply getting my hopes up, but after reading through the patent and looking at some of the lower end VR on the market I realized it's either a) not up to Nintendo's standards or, b) like you said, tacked on. No thank you.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 18, 2016, 03:00:59 PM
No no, I think we both have valid points. I'm just a pessimist. ;)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on December 19, 2016, 01:57:21 PM
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 19, 2016, 03:33:26 PM
Uh oh, two numbers are low. Time for the people who were never going to buy the Switch anyway to complain about Nintendo. LETS BURN THIS MOTHER DOWN.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Ian Sane on December 19, 2016, 05:18:03 PM
Ultimately when it comes to specs the opinions that matter to me are those of the developers.  If they don't feel they can port their games or not do so without major compromises then low specs are a problem.  With the Wii and Wii U I never found the games ugly, it just sucked that damn near any decent game not made by Nintendo was not on those platforms.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 19, 2016, 07:01:22 PM
I agree with Ian to a point and it gives me a certain level of calm that both Bethesda and From Software are in line to support system.

Where I disagree is how popular the Switch is with consumers as no one will support it even superficially without raw sale data. And in that way, it's a catch 22.

If these specs are true, launch and launch window just became incredibly important.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 19, 2016, 07:46:59 PM

NVIDIA "Nintendo Switch is powered by the performance of the custom Tegra processor. The high-efficiency scalable processor includes an NVIDIA GPU based on the same architecture as the world’s top-performing GeForce gaming graphics cards.


We know it's a custom chip. For all we know nVidia calls it internally Paxwell. I would imagine early dev kits would just have maxwell processors.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 19, 2016, 08:06:10 PM
While you may be right, I think it's in our best interests to think the worst and hope for the best.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on December 19, 2016, 08:46:43 PM
Yes, I imagine that this chip is somewhere in-between Maxwell and Pascal.  And I am sure that the original development kits had Maxwell Chips.  The question is what advancements did they make with the custom chip?  Did Nintendo decide to focus on energy saving or power...or both?  Personally, I don't care...last generation's graphics were good enough for me.  The PS4, Xbox 1 generation is more graphical power than I personally need for games...and honestly it is getting to the level that any better will be cost prohibiting to developers. 

So if the Switch can do similar graphics to PS4 and Xbox 1 and developers say it is easy enough to port games over to then I am happy.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 19, 2016, 08:57:16 PM
If it has an X1 chip, simply put, it cannot match the PS4 or Xbox One, or even come close. X1 is a very powerful mobile chip, more powerful than the Wii U, no doubt, but it is nowhere near the level of the current generation. However, the hope to still grasp on to, is where Nvidia said, "Nintendo Switch is powered by the performance of the custom Tegra processor. The high-efficiency scalable processor includes an NVIDIA GPU based on the same architecture as the world’s top-performing GeForce gaming graphics cards." The world's top performing GeForce gaming graphics cards, at the time of that press release (blog post), were the GTX 1070, etc. which are Pascal cards. So here's for holding out hope that the X1 was simply in development kits, and something newer than the X1 is what's in the actual hardware. It seems extremely unlikely though, at this point. But 1 GHz CPU, 4 GB RAM, 750 MHz GPU (300 MHz for "undocked" mode) is not sounding too promising. Sure, if we can get some games that are on par with beautiful Wii U games like Mario Kart 8 (which only runs at 720p, mind you), then that's great. And also, there is no excuse for the Switch to not support 4K video streaming services (right out of the box), because the Nvidia Shield Android TV does this already (and 4K gaming, but lets not even think about that now). Pretty disappointing that the CPU is clocked so low though. The Tegra X1 in the Shield (and Pixel C) runs at 1.9 GHz.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 19, 2016, 09:41:15 PM
I've got news. Eurogamer believes they've nailed down the exact clock speeds of the Switch CPU and GPU. It sounds like a stock X1 with halved CPU and much-downclocked GPU. Anomalies appears to be the only way to describe Nintendo's preferred specifications.

Eurogamer article (http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-nintendo-switch-spec-analysis)

Quote
Regardless, behind the scenes, sources inform us that Nintendo continued to brief developers with a spec that is uncannily similar to this Twitter leak that actually surfaced before the official reveal - and in crucial areas, it's a match for a stock Tegra X1.

There are some anomalies and inconsistencies there that raise alarm bells though. Tegra X1 is a fully-featured HDMI 2.0 capable processor, so why is video output hobbled to HDMI 1.4 specs? What's the point of a 4K, 30Hz output? The X1 also has 16 ROPs, so why is pixel fill-rate mysteriously running at only 90 per cent capacity - the 14.4 pixels/cycle should be 16 were this a standard Tegra X1. Nvidia's chip also has four ARM Cortex A53s in combination with the more powerful A57s - so why aren't they on the spec too? (In fairness, the A53s didn't actually see much utilisation based on Tegra X1 benchmarks).

...

Where Switch remains consistent is in CPU power - the cores run at 1020MHz regardless of whether the machine is docked or undocked. This ensures that running game logic won't be compromised while gaming on the go: the game simulation itself will remain entirely consistent. The machine's embedded memory controller runs at 1600MHz while docked (on par with a standard Tegra X1), but the default power mode undocked sees this drop to 1331MHz. However, developers can opt to retain full memory bandwidth in their titles should they choose to do so.

As things stand, CPU clocks are halved compared to the standard Tegra X1, but it's the GPU aspect of the equation that will prove more controversial. Even while docked, Switch doesn't run at Tegra X1's full potential. Clock-speeds are locked here at 768MHz, considerably lower than the 1GHz found in Shield Android TV, but the big surprise from our perspective was the extent to which Nintendo has down-clocked the GPU to hit its thermal and battery life targets. That's not a typo: it really is 307.2MHz - meaning that in portable mode, Switch runs at exactly40 per cent of the clock-speed of the fully docked device. And yes, the table below does indeed confirm that developers can choose to hobble Switch performance when plugged into match the handheld profile should they so choose.

There it is. It is what it is. I think we all know this is the Nintendo way.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 19, 2016, 09:56:35 PM
I find it very hard to care about hardware specifications like this.
All that matters is that devs can easily port their games over.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 19, 2016, 10:01:27 PM
I find it very hard to care about hardware specifications like this.
All that matters is that devs can easily port their games over.


Sure. Devs can easily port their games over. Bubble pop. Fappy bird. Casino Slots. Mad Rabbids Endless Mad Dash Lite Mobile. Some games from a few years ago. I don't see why modern Madden games and other sports games wouldn't get ported. Pretty much everything getting ported to PS3/X360 should appear on the Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 19, 2016, 10:05:27 PM
I'm a pessimistic guy, but until devs choose not to support the device because of these specs, I don't give two shits about the storm that is about to be unleashed by gamers thinking they know something about specs, clock speeds, and processors.

In fact, I continue to refuse to care about the Switch until I see a launch lineup.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 19, 2016, 10:20:49 PM
Wait...This is based off of Venturebeats article? Isn't one of the sources debunked by Perm's video, where the "devkit" the guy had was a toaster?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Enner on December 19, 2016, 10:38:57 PM
With Eurogamer, I assume that they have sources separate from Venturebeat's. Maybe. Can't be 100% sure since this is all hush-hush.

The Nintendo Switch is taking the expected route of being a super handheld that you can dock to display on a TV. I'm okay with that. I don't think many big western devs will be okay with that in the long run. I hope that Japanese devs will be okay with it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 19, 2016, 11:04:45 PM
I'm with you, Enner. It's looking like a super handheld. My inner fanboy wants to throw a tantrum and rage quit Nintendo, but then I realize I'm totally getting that Pokemon Stars game for Switch, and I'm all in on this for jRPGs and Nintendo's traditional offerings. The ability to play handheld games on a TV is appealing.


I want... so badly... to rage quit. I'm tempted to buy a PS4 Pro just to make a point.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 19, 2016, 11:23:21 PM
Nintendo custom chips tend to have larger caches, greater bandwidth size, some efficiency modifications, and higher clock speeds than the chips they are based off of. Sometimes, like with Wii U they multiply the cores. Ouya, was actually more powerful than portable Tegra 3 chips because once plugged into a wall the need for energy efficiency was lower, and it could draw more power for performance gains.

Also, that Eurogamer article is based off of Nothing. Unless I see a spec sheet on either Nintendo or NVidia's website, or I see a breakdown of the console after the release than no specs are confirmed. Also, it makes the claim that it might be weaker than the Shield? Why would Nintendo go for that? Unless the go for a $150 price. The Shield currently costs $200, if Nintendo wanted they could just put their logo on a shield and that would be that.

Nintendo set up the Switch so it would have wild rampant speculation, and in this click bait world that means money. I talked to one of the Venturebeat/Gamerbeat guys. They have no idea what they are doing. We have a cottage industry of Switch speculation. These are not real journalists.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 19, 2016, 11:47:40 PM
The fact that Bethesda is onboard with Switch, despite doing little to nothing on Nintendo platforms in the past, is enough to make me not worry about exact specs. Nintendo's clearly doing something right with the system if they've got all the developers listed signed on and saying positive things about it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 20, 2016, 12:01:22 AM
Digital Foundry confirmed the specs too, claiming to have "Nintendo sources." There is still always the chance of Nintendo including GeForce NOW with the Switch (which would work docked or undocked), but I doubt it would happen.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Adrock on December 20, 2016, 12:07:20 AM
Also, that Eurogamer article is based off of Nothing.
Dude, Eurogamer, Emily Rogers, and Laura Kate Dale have gotten just about everything right about Switch so far (semi-related: Let's Play Videogames has a pretty good podcast).

There's an obscenely large Neogaf thread about Digital Foundry's leak that I have neither the time nor the patience to go through. I did manage to come across Thraktor's post which puts the technical stuff in context (http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=226861686). It's quite lengthy so I don't want to post the whole thing here.

Anyway, as far as specs go, I've been operating on a few guiding principles in order to manage my expectations:
1. Nintendo and Nvidia can't break the laws of thermodynamics. Even in the best case scenario, Switch wasn't going to top PS4 like some had hoped if only by virtue of the heat it would need to generate which wasn't practical by any metric due to its size.
2. Switch was always going to be a better handheld or console, not excel at both. In this case, it's a better handheld. Undocked on The Tonight Show, it was running Breath of the Wild smoothly. That said, Switch as a handheld seems like pretty impressive tech if it's outperforming Nintendo's current home console. Switch gets a GPU boost when docked due to active cooling which is nice but it won't impress the pants off anyone. It always made more sense for Nintendo to push Switch's mobility. It's the one thing PS4 and Xbox One can't do.
3. Running modern engines that are highly scalable is something I keep bringing up and for good reason. Nintendo got that wrong two generations in a row so it's nice the company finally got its **** together there. As far as third party support goes, that is the very least Nintendo could do.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on December 20, 2016, 12:18:10 AM
The fact that Bethesda is onboard with Switch, despite doing little to nothing on Nintendo platforms in the past, is enough to make me not worry about exact specs. Nintendo's clearly doing something right with the system if they've got all the developers listed signed on and saying positive things about it.

While spec talk is nice and Dev praise is great and all, none of it means **** if the games never show up. So Nintendo, just please make sure all the talk isn't just talk. deliver the games. 1st, 2nd and 3rd party.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 20, 2016, 12:30:47 AM
Also, that Eurogamer article is based off of Nothing.
Dude, Eurogamer, Emily Rogers, and Laura Kate Dale have gotten just about everything right about Switch so far (semi-related: Let's Play Videogames has a pretty good podcast).

There's an obscenely large Neogaf thread about Digital Foundry's leak that I have neither the time nor the patience to go through. I did manage to come across Thraktor's post which puts the technical stuff in context (http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=226861686). It's quite lengthy so I don't want to post the whole thing here.

Anyway, as far as specs go, I've been operating on a few guiding principles in order to manage my expectations:
1. Nintendo and Nvidia can't break the laws of thermodynamics. Even in the best case scenario, Switch wasn't going to top PS4 like some had hoped if only by virtue of the heat it would need to generate which wasn't practical by any metric due to its size.
2. Switch was always going to be a better handheld or console, not excel at both. In this case, it's a better handheld. Undocked on The Tonight Show, it was running Breath of the Wild smoothly. That said, Switch as a handheld seems like pretty impressive tech if it's outperforming Nintendo's current home console. Switch gets a GPU boost when docked due to active cooling which is nice but it won't impress the pants off anyone. It always made more sense for Nintendo to push Switch's mobility. It's the one thing PS4 and Xbox One can't do.
3. Running modern engines that are highly scalable is something I keep bringing up and for good reason. Nintendo got that wrong two generations in a row so it's nice the company finally got its **** together there. As far as third party support goes, that is the very least Nintendo could do.


This has been a central concern. The Switch is meant to be a handheld and a home console. Will it manage to do both well? Will it manage to do either well? Is it going to fail to make either audience happy?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 20, 2016, 12:54:11 AM
Wii U had a big list of developers early on as well. That didn't amount to much.

But really. Lets get a few things straight. Obviously, given Nintendo history we should all manage our expectations.
That doesn't mean we shouldn't discredit bad sources. I have about 5 sources for Switch's specs. They're all leaks, and none have been confirmed by an official source. Some conflict.

Source 1: Emily Rogers - initially made the claim that Nintendo was Switching to nvidia. Something anyone could guess. Although, so far has been the most reliable source. Predictions were accurate.

https://arcadegirl64.wordpress.com/2016/08/31/recap-of-nx-hardware-details/

Source 2: Laura Kate Dale - said switch would have 4mb of ram. When you go to her twitter page right now, the first thing you see is a link to donate to her pay pal.

Source 3: A Chinese Worker
http://www.gamespot.com/forums/system-wars-314159282/rumor-chinese-factory-worker-leaks-nintendo-switch-33369556/

Source 4: Unnamed sources connected to Venture Beat

Source 5: Venture beat apparently reconfirming an article in july
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/digitalfoundry-2016-nintendo-switch-spec-analysis

Source 6: Nvidia says directly that it is a custom chip. Nintendo doesn't do regular chips. Remember Big Blue and Watson? Their chips were based off of those, but they weren't those.
https://www.engadget.com/2011/06/07/ibm-puts-watsons-brains-in-nintendo-wii-u/

There is a lot of circle jerking going on with people who have apparently broken a scary Nintendo NDA. Also, does anyone think that is most suspicious that more leaks and rumors have come out since the general public became interested. I hear a lot of people taking Tertiary sources as facts.

None of us are talking directly with God(Nintendo). There is no Holy Book(Nintendo or nvidia's website) We're getting information from Apostles(reporters or worse youtubers and tweeters), who are getting their information from Prophets(leaks from developers). I got too much conflicting dogma going around to know what is what. We can't use science(detailed chip hacking) to find out what is true yet. The only thing we can wait for is the next Revelation(January 12)

I also talked to Jeffry Grubb who is somehow connected to Dean Takahashi of Venture Beat. In my chats with him he was trying to manipulate the conversation to cover his ass. He doesn't understand the wall of skepticism. The motive to create fake news to get internet hits is just too high right now. At least with Emily Rogers and Laura Kate Dale, they have a track record of being right. Dean Takahashi and Jeffrey Grubbs are coming from nowhere. Not every source is a trusted sources, they have to earn it. I have access to a developer myself. However, they're tight lipped as ****(They work at Ubisoft). They never tell me ****. I've known them for like 13 years.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on December 20, 2016, 01:10:10 AM
While you may be right, I think it's in our best interests to think the worst and hope for the best.

always the best approach when it comes to Nintendo. constantly giving everyone around here something to bitch about.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 20, 2016, 01:45:16 AM
In fact, I continue to refuse to care about the Switch until I see a launch lineup.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 20, 2016, 02:05:50 AM
I've got no reason to doubt the latest Eurogamer reports, and honestly I'm playing the "keep expectations low" game. Emily Rogers, Laura Kate Dale, and Eurogamer appear to be the trio of really solid leak/speculation sources right now, and that's built on their track records over the past several months, not wishful thinking.

Ultimately when it comes to specs the opinions that matter to me are those of the developers.  If they don't feel they can port their games or not do so without major compromises then low specs are a problem.  With the Wii and Wii U I never found the games ugly, it just sucked that damn near any decent game not made by Nintendo was not on those platforms.

I think Ian's got it right. We can have a spec sheet war and all, but what matters is any material increase in actual developer support.

What I'm REALLY jazzed about right now is a couple of things:

1. If true, I think this thing is going to be CHEAP! The Shield Android TV launched in 2015 with a straight-up Tegra X1 at $199 and I really don't think that product could afford to be a loss leader. We could be looking at a $249 Switch with a goodly amount of room to maneuver on price!

2. These are still modern chips, even if it's looking almost certain they'll be a far cry from PS4 levels even when docked. The Switch has been rated to conform to the latest in OpenGL and OpenGL ES, AND the cutting edge Vulkan API as well. Power is all well and good, but a greater effect on dev support may be engine support, and hardware that can support these modern features means that the Switch already had avowed Unreal Engine 4 support right from the announcement.

3. I do still think this gives Nintendo room to go the incremental improvement route, with both a Switch Micro in the future, as well as a Switch Pro that probably jumps to Pascal and uses the newer manufacturing processes to squeeze more power while staying in the same range of heat and battery life.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 20, 2016, 03:09:46 AM
Source 1: Emily Rogers - initially made the claim that Nintendo was Switching to nvidia. Something anyone could guess.

LOL!

On a different note, ports are important, but the Wii managed to sell without them, and to a (much) lesser extent, so did the GC. The Switch is what the WiiU should have been but was unable to be. If the WiiU made it easy to port games to it, the second screen aspect would have been even more useless because those ports would hardly make use of it, if at all. What the Switch really needs to do is give developers a reason to make good exclusives for it, and the only way to do that is sales.

I, like most of you, was pretty upset with Nintendo holding out for so long on what the Switch actually is, but the hype they've generated is far beyond anything expected. People are actually excitedly talking about a Nintendo console, rather than mocking it. The ability to take your game from TV to car/bus/walk/park/etc. is what will generate sales, which will in turn generate developer support. That the console supports Unreal and other popular engines will mean that it can potentially get even more support than did the Wii, and ton more shovelware as well.

It hasn't been much discussed, but let's not forget that the Switch is bringing back the simplistic motion controls that drove Wii sales. If they can market that aspect to the casual gamers who now only play games on their phones, while marketing the graphic capabilities and "mature games" to the hardcore gamers, and keeping everyone happy (but especially loyalists) with their AAA titles, they've got a winning formula on their hands.



In fact, I continue to refuse to care about the Switch until I see a launch lineup.

And yet you're here... In the context of the discussion, I get your point but to say you refuse to care, is kind of silly. There's nothing wrong with saying you're excited for the console, despite how cool it is to be apathetic on the internet.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: lolmonade on December 20, 2016, 08:52:54 AM
3. I do still think this gives Nintendo room to go the incremental improvement route, with both a Switch Micro in the future, as well as a Switch Pro that probably jumps to Pascal and uses the newer manufacturing processes to squeeze more power while staying in the same range of heat and battery life.


This more than anything gives me pause.  I'm inclined to wait the switch out until mid-life-cycle to see if a New Switch Pro+ Tournament Edition comes out, because I'd rather start the system with the best hardware possible.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 20, 2016, 12:51:48 PM
3. I do still think this gives Nintendo room to go the incremental improvement route, with both a Switch Micro in the future, as well as a Switch Pro that probably jumps to Pascal and uses the newer manufacturing processes to squeeze more power while staying in the same range of heat and battery life.


This more than anything gives me pause.  I'm inclined to wait the switch out until mid-life-cycle to see if a New Switch Pro+ Tournament Edition comes out, because I'd rather start the system with the best hardware possible.

Yeah, this is starting to concern me as well. I don't want to early adopt if there's going to be a significantly (i.e 3DS to New 3DS) upgraded unit 18 months down the line or some such.

I don't think Nintendo would do this, but now would be the time to lay all the cards on the table if they are actually going to use the supplemental computing patents. I would be fine getting a Switch on the earlier side if I knew I could upgrade it later without buying a whole new device.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 20, 2016, 09:35:25 PM
3. I do still think this gives Nintendo room to go the incremental improvement route, with both a Switch Micro in the future, as well as a Switch Pro that probably jumps to Pascal and uses the newer manufacturing processes to squeeze more power while staying in the same range of heat and battery life.


This more than anything gives me pause.  I'm inclined to wait the switch out until mid-life-cycle to see if a New Switch Pro+ Tournament Edition comes out, because I'd rather start the system with the best hardware possible.

Yeah, this is starting to concern me as well. I don't want to early adopt if there's going to be a significantly (i.e 3DS to New 3DS) upgraded unit 18 months down the line or some such.

I don't think Nintendo would do this, but now would be the time to lay all the cards on the table if they are actually going to use the supplemental computing patents. I would be fine getting a Switch on the earlier side if I knew I could upgrade it later without buying a whole new device.


This is the sort of thing we would really hope Nintendo doesn't have to learn a hard lesson on. I feel like they've taken their home console experience and are totally gambling with it. The smell of vodka is heavy on their breath. I've never seen so many options packed into a game device. At the end of the day, I'm left to wonder: is this the new console, is it the new handheld, or is it something else entirely? Will there be something else to replace it within 2-years?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 20, 2016, 09:57:27 PM
Ok. Nintendo has one chance.


$199.99

Nintendo Switch base unit.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 20, 2016, 10:47:12 PM
Im pretty sure the Switch will be $400-450 here in Australia.

The Wii U has been $430 since launch, they have just bundled more with it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 20, 2016, 10:53:57 PM
I'm not excited for the console?

There's one game on it that I want, the other one is going to be on Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 20, 2016, 11:00:43 PM
Im pretty sure the Switch will be $400-450 here in Australia.

The Wii U has been $430 since launch, they have just bundled more with it.

Is that in AUD or USD? if its AUD that means its worth $311.98 US Dollars.

Or is it priced at 592.69 Australian Dollars and you did the math for us?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 20, 2016, 11:26:45 PM
Sorry, I meant $430 AUD
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 20, 2016, 11:27:40 PM
This is the sort of thing we would really hope Nintendo doesn't have to learn a hard lesson on. I feel like they've taken their home console experience and are totally gambling with it. The smell of vodka is heavy on their breath. I've never seen so many options packed into a game device. At the end of the day, I'm left to wonder: is this the new console, is it the new handheld, or is it something else entirely? Will there be something else to replace it within 2-years?

This is a Handheld with a Super Gameboy Accessory packed in. I now am imagining it launching at $249, but Nintendo totally capable of dropping that to $199 whenever they need to, even if that might be it's first Holiday season.

Also, if we think of its a Nintendo Handheld, then it's almost assuredly getting a hardware refresh at some point. Just look at the long history of Gameboy Pocket, GameBoy Color, GBA SP, DS Lite, DSi, 3DS XL and New 3DS. It's strange for me to see people worried about this since it's been Nintendo handheld reality for FOREVER. Personally, I LOVED both my Launch DS Phat AND my Launch 3DS, so anticipate that if Nintendo goes Switch Pro and Switch Micro within two years I'll be tickled, but won't be letting go of my Launch Switch launch either.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 20, 2016, 11:39:11 PM
This is the sort of thing we would really hope Nintendo doesn't have to learn a hard lesson on. I feel like they've taken their home console experience and are totally gambling with it. The smell of vodka is heavy on their breath. I've never seen so many options packed into a game device. At the end of the day, I'm left to wonder: is this the new console, is it the new handheld, or is it something else entirely? Will there be something else to replace it within 2-years?

This is a Handheld with a Super Gameboy Accessory packed in. I now am imagining it launching at $249, but Nintendo totally capable of dropping that to $199 whenever they need to, even if that might be it's first Holiday season.

Also, if we think of its a Nintendo Handheld, then it's almost assuredly getting a hardware refresh at some point. Just look at the long history of Gameboy Pocket, GameBoy Color, GBA SP, DS Lite, DSi, 3DS XL and New 3DS. It's strange for me to see people worried about this since it's been Nintendo handheld reality for FOREVER. Personally, I LOVED both my Launch DS Phat AND my Launch 3DS, so anticipate that if Nintendo goes Switch Pro and Switch Micro within two years I'll be tickled, but won't be letting go of my Launch Switch launch either.


Has any Nintendo handheld ever launched >$200? $249.99 is definitely a home console price. At $199.99 I could conceive of buying 2 of them for the new Pokemon game, but that is not the case at $249.99.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 20, 2016, 11:46:47 PM
The 3DS, which due to a lack of compelling software got shotgunned down to $170 after its first full financial quarter.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 21, 2016, 12:19:20 AM
This is the sort of thing we would really hope Nintendo doesn't have to learn a hard lesson on. I feel like they've taken their home console experience and are totally gambling with it. The smell of vodka is heavy on their breath. I've never seen so many options packed into a game device. At the end of the day, I'm left to wonder: is this the new console, is it the new handheld, or is it something else entirely? Will there be something else to replace it within 2-years?

This is a Handheld with a Super Gameboy Accessory packed in. I now am imagining it launching at $249, but Nintendo totally capable of dropping that to $199 whenever they need to, even if that might be it's first Holiday season.

Also, if we think of its a Nintendo Handheld, then it's almost assuredly getting a hardware refresh at some point. Just look at the long history of Gameboy Pocket, GameBoy Color, GBA SP, DS Lite, DSi, 3DS XL and New 3DS. It's strange for me to see people worried about this since it's been Nintendo handheld reality for FOREVER. Personally, I LOVED both my Launch DS Phat AND my Launch 3DS, so anticipate that if Nintendo goes Switch Pro and Switch Micro within two years I'll be tickled, but won't be letting go of my Launch Switch launch either.

Right, I'm sure there will be a hardware refresh, but I'm coming in to this with a heavy console preference. I guess we're living in the world of mid-generation console upgrades now, but I'm not wild about the idea. I picked up the DS and 3DS later in their lives after the hardware "settled", because I was expecting that and am not much of a handheld enthusiast in the first place, and had no intention of dinking around with multiple units.

I'm going to treat the Switch as a console and I'd like to feel relatively secure in the knowledge that it won't end up like the OG GBA, technically functional but kind of a piece of **** compared to the refresh.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 21, 2016, 01:15:33 AM
I'm going to treat the Switch as a console and I'd like to feel relatively secure in the knowledge that it won't end up like the OG GBA, technically functional but kind of a piece of **** compared to the refresh.

Yeah, I'm hoping that's the way it plays out too. Maybe the first test we'll see of this is how the PS4 Pro plays out? Definitely a different situation, but I haven't heard anything about it leaving regular PS4 owners out in the cold.

Frankly, I don't think it'd make much sense to start splitting the userbase 2 years in, that would really undermine the ability to treat the Switch products as a "family" in my opinion. Instead, they should have at least a couple of generations on the market existing concurrently before they start introducing software that explicitly cuts older gens out, sort of like how iPhone 5s and iPhone 7s co-exist today. Maybe that would be a four-year life-span for any single generation? The difference would be it's ability to co-exist with other "generations" of Switch and provide a gradual smooth upgrade opportunity at a wide variety of price points.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 21, 2016, 01:27:52 AM
BOLD PREDICTION: $229.95
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on December 21, 2016, 10:05:37 AM
I'm not excited for the console?

There's one game on it that I want, the other one is going to be on Wii U.

I'll concede that excited was too strong a word, I just mean that you care to some degree at least. You haven't just vanished from the boards since the reveal.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 21, 2016, 04:13:55 PM
"Different settings for docked / portable Switch modes spotted in Unreal Engine 4"

http://nintendoeverything.com/different-settings-for-docked-portable-switch-modes-spotted-in-unreal-engine-4/

Quote
A file in Unreal Engine 4’s master branch shows names for Switch, SwitchConsole and SwitchHandheld. As the developer points out, “the SwitchConsole settings are a notch lower than the UE4 defaults used on PC, PS4 and XB1.” It’s thought that the settings “serve as a good starting point to get a PS4/XB1 UE4 game to run acceptably on the Switch.”

Coming from the developer, this should mean it's quite possible to run ports just fine. Hype train back on course?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on December 21, 2016, 08:04:43 PM
That sounds pretty good to me. I will be using it mostly while docked
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 21, 2016, 10:56:03 PM
I guess Michael Pachter has it on good authority (read: developer sources) that the Switch is by far the easiest platform of the three (referring to PS4, XB1) to develop for.


Honestly, I won't be shocked if the Switch sees a ton of ports. If the thing will just sell, we could even see games developed for Switch and ported to the others with improved textures, etc.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 21, 2016, 11:47:20 PM
I know that March is a REALLY odd time to launch, but I really like it for a couple of reasons:

1. The hardcore early adopters can buy it without competing with holiday crowds
2. It gives Nintendo a couple months before the Holidays to work out kinks and fix things that pop up as glaring errors
3. If demand is huge, then Nintendo has a couple months to try and up production for the Holidays
4. By the time Holidays role around, there might be sales for those sitting on the fences, PLUS there's a bit more of a software library to entice the next couple waves of slightly-less-educated/convinced consumers
5. If necessary, Nintendo can use sales/price drop during the Holidays to really try to whip up demand
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 21, 2016, 11:50:46 PM
I guess Michael Pachter has it on good authority (read: developer sources) that the Switch is by far the easiest platform of the three (referring to PS4, XB1) to develop for.

That makes me hopeful. I mean, in my other thread you can see I'm reticient to be gung-ho about this, but I really do think that the adoption of NVidia and their modern CPU and Graphics tech will be the main driver of the biggest increase in third-party support for Nintendo in a long while.

I mean, Indie Support for the Wii U has been great, but even there we're no getting parity with MS and Sony. I think it's not too outlandish that we could start seeing parity support in at the very least that specific developer segment.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 22, 2016, 12:36:53 AM
I guess Michael Pachter has it on good authority (read: developer sources) that the Switch is by far the easiest platform of the three (referring to PS4, XB1) to develop for.


Great, now Switch will be the hardest console to develop for.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 22, 2016, 11:47:43 AM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on December 22, 2016, 02:55:08 PM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?

If it truly is that easy, all they'll need to make them willing is a strong install base. It all comes down to whether they think the Switch version will sell well enough to justify the work it takes to make it, and if the amount of work is relatively minor, the less it will take to convince them of that.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: MagicCow64 on December 22, 2016, 03:27:19 PM
I've pitched this idea before, but I think it would be a smart move at this point for Nintendo to set up a big port shop for western third parties. Offer to do the work themselves (or at a subsidized rate) in exchange for a percentage of money from the sales. Even if it would be profitable to port stuff to the Switch for any given 3rd party, it still might be less profitable to use those resources on that versus something else. A Nintendo-run midwife outfit could remove this calculus, and also develop American talent they could feed into bigger projects, their own ports or remasters, or an expanded Retro/new 2nd party (or functionally equivalent) studios.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 22, 2016, 04:14:49 PM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?

If it truly is that easy, all they'll need to make them willing is a strong install base. It all comes down to whether they think the Switch version will sell well enough to justify the work it takes to make it, and if the amount of work is relatively minor, the less it will take to convince them of that.

But will the install base be there without the support?  Sort of a chicken-and-egg scenario.

I've pitched this idea before, but I think it would be a smart move at this point for Nintendo to set up a big port shop for western third parties. Offer to do the work themselves (or at a subsidized rate) in exchange for a percentage of money from the sales. Even if it would be profitable to port stuff to the Switch for any given 3rd party, it still might be less profitable to use those resources on that versus something else. A Nintendo-run midwife outfit could remove this calculus, and also develop American talent they could feed into bigger projects, their own ports or remasters, or an expanded Retro/new 2nd party (or functionally equivalent) studios.

I've seen things about Devs complaining about how hard it is to work with Nintendo.  They might not even have to subsidize ports to this extent, if they can work on that, but something of this sort would be helpful.  I worry how costly this would be on Nintendo's part.  Sort of a risky investment.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 22, 2016, 04:39:24 PM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?

If it truly is that easy, all they'll need to make them willing is a strong install base. It all comes down to whether they think the Switch version will sell well enough to justify the work it takes to make it, and if the amount of work is relatively minor, the less it will take to convince them of that.

But will the install base be there without the support?  Sort of a chicken-and-egg scenario.

It'll be there. With Mario Kart, Mario, Zelda, and a rumored Pokemon game in the same year, I don't see many Nintendo fans skipping the Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 22, 2016, 05:19:43 PM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?

If it truly is that easy, all they'll need to make them willing is a strong install base. It all comes down to whether they think the Switch version will sell well enough to justify the work it takes to make it, and if the amount of work is relatively minor, the less it will take to convince them of that.

But will the install base be there without the support?  Sort of a chicken-and-egg scenario.

It'll be there. With Mario Kart, Mario, Zelda, and a rumored Pokemon game in the same year, I don't see many Nintendo fans skipping the Switch.


That's not a big group, though.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on December 22, 2016, 05:36:31 PM
So, if Nintendo has fixed the ease of porting games over, what do they do about willingness?

If it truly is that easy, all they'll need to make them willing is a strong install base. It all comes down to whether they think the Switch version will sell well enough to justify the work it takes to make it, and if the amount of work is relatively minor, the less it will take to convince them of that.

But will the install base be there without the support?  Sort of a chicken-and-egg scenario.

It'll be there. With Mario Kart, Mario, Zelda, and a rumored Pokemon game in the same year, I don't see many Nintendo fans skipping the Switch.


That's not a big group, though.

So, what does Nintendo do to reach people outside that group? Other than make sure they have the inventory.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 22, 2016, 07:51:25 PM
From Takashi Mochizuki's Twitter (WSJ tech reporter in Tokyo) - https://twitter.com/mochi_wsj (https://twitter.com/mochi_wsj)

Ace Research Institute analyst Yasuda:
- Switch uses DisplayPort over USB-C; internal bus speed at 5GBps, faster than 3DS' 128MBps.
- Switch's resolution not likely 1080 to 720 but WQHD(1440p) to 1080.
- VR just for patent purpose. Not likely to be used.
- Patent filings show Switch's architecture good for open-world games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 22, 2016, 09:39:22 PM
Bus speeds seem awfully low, like first gen USB 3. I guess that means no "upgraded dock" as the connection speed can't handle both the display and running an extra gpu/cpu.

1440p. That seems ambitious. I honestly don't know what Nintendo is thinking. It doesn't fit what we have heard from other sources at all. There's no need to have the definition that high if all your gonna pair it with is an X1. All the games are gonna be 720p regardless. This is raising the cost of the device for no reason. It's extremely unlike Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 22, 2016, 10:03:44 PM
I've pitched this idea before, but I think it would be a smart move at this point for Nintendo to set up a big port shop for western third parties. Offer to do the work themselves (or at a subsidized rate) in exchange for a percentage of money from the sales. Even if it would be profitable to port stuff to the Switch for any given 3rd party, it still might be less profitable to use those resources on that versus something else. A Nintendo-run midwife outfit could remove this calculus, and also develop American talent they could feed into bigger projects, their own ports or remasters, or an expanded Retro/new 2nd party (or functionally equivalent) studios.

I've seen things about Devs complaining about how hard it is to work with Nintendo.  They might not even have to subsidize ports to this extent, if they can work on that, but something of this sort would be helpful.  I worry how costly this would be on Nintendo's part.  Sort of a risky investment.


Possible understatement. If I've heard correctly, Wii U dev kits may not have even come translated. Everything was supposedly in Japanese. All the documentation was Japanese-only. This is all message board rumor, but it's what I've seen suggested.


Now compare this with Switch, whose dev kits I'm going to assume have had a large amount of help from Nvidia. I'll just assume that this thing is fully documented in at least 5 different languages, including English. That's bound to help get developers started with it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 22, 2016, 11:10:46 PM
5GB per second? Talk about future proofing.

With something like that Nintendo could release a cheap memory expansion at stores.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on December 23, 2016, 01:24:27 AM
Bus speeds seem awfully low, like first gen USB 3. I guess that means no "upgraded dock" as the connection speed can't handle both the display and running an extra gpu/cpu.

1440p. That seems ambitious. I honestly don't know what Nintendo is thinking. It doesn't fit what we have heard from other sources at all. There's no need to have the definition that high if all your gonna pair it with is an X1. All the games are gonna be 720p regardless. This is raising the cost of the device for no reason. It's extremely unlike Nintendo.

5GB (GigaByte? or Gigabit?) per second seems slow? (edit: it was Gb, and in comparison to other stuff 5Gb is slow)

and if Nintendo is building the Switch to natively handle 1440p, then that is nothing but good news, because since it will normally be rending at 1080p or even 720p, then it should have plenty of horsepower left over for other stuff.

but personally I think this sounds wrong. It sounds great, but I don't think it sounds right.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Stogi on December 23, 2016, 02:55:35 AM
5Gbs is too slow to run a separate CPU/GPU or dual monitors or etc. I have a USB-C Thunderbolt 3 connection on my laptop and its bus speed is 40 Gbs. It can do all those things I mentioned at once.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 23, 2016, 03:58:49 AM
if it's Gb then it's slow. If it was GB then 5GB is all you would need.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 23, 2016, 03:15:14 PM
Mochi clarifies some stuff RE: WQHD to 1080.

Quote
Sorry for confusion. this means internal chips can ha[n]dle WQHD and downgrades to 1080 when docked & undocked. why? https://twitter.com/mochi_wsj/status/811851139553456128 …

Quote
he says that way can produce better 1080 pics and leaves future possibility for better docked or undocked display quality when things ready.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 23, 2016, 09:28:43 PM
If Nintendo chose some hirez screen its because it was the cheaper screen.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 24, 2016, 09:16:56 PM
In regards to the "Gigi bits v Giga bytes: dawn of seconds" discussion, was there a specific reference to the speed being greater than the 3DS? Fact checking the 128MBps statistic would affirm whether or not it was bits v bytes, correct?

Also, can I get a clarification in regards to this resolution talk? You're saying docked Switch outputs in WQHD on the TV bit 1080 when undocked? I'm a bit confused by this.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on December 25, 2016, 03:15:48 PM
I think the chips can go up to WQHD, but the output is limited to 1080p. I am guessing the Switch Pro of 2020 will do the WQHD
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 25, 2016, 03:39:55 PM
Not sure what you guys are talking about, but the X1 in the Shield can do 4K @ 60FPS (and does in the Nvidia Shield Android TV).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 25, 2016, 10:40:35 PM
I think the claim, as I understand it, is that the video source from the GPU is at the higher resolution but is then "right-scaled" by the GPU to the display "native resolution." This is actually a nice way of leveraging the muscle of a GPU to create a nicer, sharper image onto the screen. I've known gamers to bump their GPU resolution to 4K and "right-scale" it to their native resolution to get better visuals.


Of course, this is something you would do if you have GPU to spare, heh. In other words, wouldn't you rather process visuals at a lower resolution and use the GPU memory to handle more details on screen? Or, this may be Nvidia's finest API package EVER. I do trust them above anyone else to squeeze more out of their hardware than anyone else ever could.


Can't wait to find out the facts.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on December 26, 2016, 12:29:03 PM
Not sure what you guys are talking about, but the X1 in the Shield can do 4K @ 60FPS (and does in the Nvidia Shield Android TV).

I remember this, but I thought this was only for media playback (Netflix, playing video files, etc.) and not on any actual interactive/game content?

I think the claim, as I understand it, is that the video source from the GPU is at the higher resolution but is then "right-scaled" by the GPU to the display "native resolution." This is actually a nice way of leveraging the muscle of a GPU to create a nicer, sharper image onto the screen. I've known gamers to bump their GPU resolution to 4K and "right-scale" it to their native resolution to get better visuals.

Ooh, that sounds like what he's referring to. I believe this is called supersampling, a way of doing full-screen antialiasing? Anyways, it still sounds pie-in-the-sky for me because it implies that the system is more powerful than I've been led to believe.

In regards to the "Gigi bits v Giga bytes: dawn of seconds" discussion, was there a specific reference to the speed being greater than the 3DS? Fact checking the 128MBps statistic would affirm whether or not it was bits v bytes, correct?

I remember reading some speculation on Neogaf that where this numbers comparison seems to make sense is comparison of the game cartridge connections between the 3DS and the alleged Switch game cart. But if so, this would put the game cartridge read connection vastly faster than the fastest SD card connections right now. I still don't know what to make of that rumor, it doesn't seem to easily slot into any clearly-arranged context.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 26, 2016, 07:08:14 PM
There are a handful of games that support 4K native resolution on the SATV. I mean technically if you can output 4K for video services, you can output it for anything.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on December 26, 2016, 10:53:35 PM
I think the claim, as I understand it, is that the video source from the GPU is at the higher resolution but is then "right-scaled" by the GPU to the display "native resolution." This is actually a nice way of leveraging the muscle of a GPU to create a nicer, sharper image onto the screen. I've known gamers to bump their GPU resolution to 4K and "right-scale" it to their native resolution to get better visuals.

Ooh, that sounds like what he's referring to. I believe this is called supersampling, a way of doing full-screen antialiasing? Anyways, it still sounds pie-in-the-sky for me because it implies that the system is more powerful than I've been led to believe.


Yes. It's a form of supersampling.


Run PC Games at a higher resolution than your monitor supports (http://lifehacker.com/run-pc-games-at-a-higher-resolution-than-your-monitor-s-1577524203)


It's very inefficient. I would hope this is not the case, because I'd rather have more rendered in each frame and have fewer pixels than the opposite.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 27, 2016, 02:34:38 PM
That would essentially be pointless. Super sampling is used to run games at a higher resolution than your monitor supports, essentially it's a form of anti-aliasing. The limitation is your monitor though, in this situation - not the hardware of the console. PS4 Pro can do this with some games (for instance if you only have a 1080p monitor). Sure it would be a nice option to have, but it would be a *stupid* standard to have. If you have the horsepower to output at 4K, then output at 4K - don't render a 4K image and then output it at 1080p.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on December 27, 2016, 02:54:19 PM
OR a simpler explanation is that the handheld screen just supports multiple screen modes. I bet the games will likely still be 720p......or 900p as the OLD rumor suggests.

Brandogg, in another thread you were saying the Shield does 4k rendering(or not)? Or is it just video. They should change your title to resident ShiledTV expert. I think your the only one with a Shield. I could be the Ouya expert. I've made working Ouya software.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: oohhboy on December 27, 2016, 09:38:47 PM
I guess Michael Pachter has it on good authority (read: developer sources) that the Switch is by far the easiest platform of the three (referring to PS4, XB1) to develop for.

Holy **** dude, never ever quote or cite Michael Pachter. He has never been right about anything. I actually expect it to be harder to develop because he said it is going to be easy.

Full Pascal would have been quite nice as it is very, very good performance per watt for full fat chips. The cards consume half the power of an equivalent Maxwell card. It is so good enough in fact that there is no laptop version of the 10xx series aside from form factor. It is the same chip whether it is a desktop or not.

Being hybrid Pascal or having Pascal elements would be good news as a lot of Pascal's technologies are applicable to mobile when it comes to power consumption.

I think the claim, as I understand it, is that the video source from the GPU is at the higher resolution but is then "right-scaled" by the GPU to the display "native resolution." This is actually a nice way of leveraging the muscle of a GPU to create a nicer, sharper image onto the screen. I've known gamers to bump their GPU resolution to 4K and "right-scale" it to their native resolution to get better visuals.

Ooh, that sounds like what he's referring to. I believe this is called supersampling, a way of doing full-screen antialiasing? Anyways, it still sounds pie-in-the-sky for me because it implies that the system is more powerful than I've been led to believe.
Yes. It's a form of supersampling.

Run PC Games at a higher resolution than your monitor supports (http://lifehacker.com/run-pc-games-at-a-higher-resolution-than-your-monitor-s-1577524203)

It's very inefficient. I would hope this is not the case, because I'd rather have more rendered in each frame and have fewer pixels than the opposite.

*cough*Nvidia Maxwell DSR Tech (http://'http://www.geforce.com/whats-new/articles/dynamic-super-resolution-instantly-improves-your-games-with-4k-quality-graphics")*cough* A much better solution more efficient than doing something dumb like brute forcing a higher draw resolution.

Depending on the game it has almost not performance impact like Mad Max where it will maintain the same frame rate whether you run it at 1080p or 1440 DSR. The opposite of that is PayDay 2 where rendering in DSR would bring my system to it's knees pretty quickly and feels sluggish right out of the gate. DSR can be a nice way to do anti-aliasing however from experience it varies a lot between games while other methods are more consistent.

The drop clock rates are worrying news if true. However clock rate these days have *somewhat* less importance than it use to have. Some applications though will demand a high clock rate like emulation.

However this news doesn't seem to pass the sniff test as the drops are absurdly high and would require a massive **** up or near ground breaking custom tech to make sense. So I am definitely wait and see on this.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on December 28, 2016, 12:24:22 AM
I wouldn't say I'm a Shield expert, but I probably am the only person on these forums that has one (and I remember your Unity demo on the OUYA - sold mine when I got the Google ADT-1). If the tablet has a 720p display, there is no reason to run anything at higher than 720p when it's undocked - you'd only be killing battery life.

720p on a 6.2" will probably look "fine" - especially when it's still a relatively powerful system. The display on the Shield (original, portable version) is 5" and 720p and it looks pretty amazing, and to be honest the display on the Wii U Gamepad isn't *horrible* even at 480p. But like I mentioned before, it's a no-go for VR. Any rumors on if it will support 3D though? I think it's weird enough that it supports touch, because obviously that's not going to work when it's docked - unless the base for the Joycons they've been showing is a touchpad like the PS4.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on December 30, 2016, 12:06:47 PM
Here's some pretty ridiculous speculation. Hell, I don't even think it's speculation, it's just throwing **** on the wall and seeing if it sticks.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1MOlzz3s4jnik8lKLjNa8vLPyEFv35jNqqdJghIEk4mg/edit (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1MOlzz3s4jnik8lKLjNa8vLPyEFv35jNqqdJghIEk4mg/edit)

I mean, look at some of the ridiculous fanboy nuggets being thrown out:
- Nintendo creating their own eSports league.
- Super Mario Switcharoo
- A Pikmin game having online multiplayer.
- No mention whatsoever of Retro Studios.
- Overwatch on Switch with a special Nintendo character (lol)
- Somehow thinking EA is going to bring 8 games to the Switch (including the bonus delusion that Nintendo has any say in the Rogue Squadron series)
- There will be approximately 405934069 different Switch bundles, with most 3rd party publishers getting in on the action.
- Red Dead 2 on Switch!
- Final Fantasy XIV is a "nindie".
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: pokepal148 on December 30, 2016, 12:36:41 PM
I can't wait for the "NEW Super Mario Super Show".
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on December 30, 2016, 02:14:49 PM
There's no way any of that is based on facts.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on December 30, 2016, 03:27:20 PM
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on December 30, 2016, 03:38:45 PM
 ::)
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on January 01, 2017, 02:55:21 PM
More rumors from Laura Kate Dale found here http://www.vgnmagazine.com/2016/12/31/nintendo-switch-wont-have-lte-more-features-released/

There’s a record button on the left Joy-Con.

There will be no friend codes, DeNA is helping Nintendo with the networking.

The leak from Reddit user ‘Genos’ is fake.

Laura was asked if there was the possibility of Red Dead Redemption 2 or Overwatch coming to the Switch. Regarding Red Dead, she stated that there’s almost no way it’s going to happen due to Rockstar’s relationship with Nintendo. She assures that Overwatch wouldn’t be there at launch, and the two stated that it would require a massively overhauled port due to the ‘always-online’ nature of the title.

Don’t expect a delay for the Nintendo Switch.

Laura was asked about voice-chat, before she was going to answer she asked if she could say anything due to OBE1 releasing a video detailing it out soon. This basically confirmed the fact that it’s going to be included, smooth move guys.

The system will have Bluetooth, not sure to what extent.

The Joy-Cons will be available to be purchased separately at launch date. Docks will be purchasable after 6 months and will be ‘cheap’.

There won’t be a bundle that includes the Pro Controller, they will be purchasable separately.

The battery will last around 3 hours with everything at maximum.

The charging port is USB and will easily and quickly charge the system.

Only expect three virtual console GameCube games at launch, they will be optimized for their original resolutions.

At launch there will only be one color of the Switch, and it will be the default grey. However, there’s a slight chance that there will be multiple colors after launch.

The right Joy-Con has an IR pointer akin to the Wii mote, this will allow touch-screen functionalities while docked.

The entry bundle for the switch will have 32GB of onboard storage, Micro SD card support will extend to 128 GB.

When asked about Mass Effect Andromeda, she brought up the point that Mass Effect 3 sold horrendously on Wii U and that there are no plans to release the title.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 01, 2017, 04:36:53 PM
Still gotta love the "sequel to franchise never released on this underselling platform releases much later than other platforms with a built-up franchise fanbase, and then sells like ****, so the next sequel that could've release same time as other consoles, on this new console, will not release at all"
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 01, 2017, 05:07:38 PM

The entry bundle for the switch will have 32GB of onboard storage, Micro SD card support will extend to 128 GB.


Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on January 01, 2017, 05:09:48 PM
More rumors from Laura Kate Dale found here http://www.vgnmagazine.com/2016/12/31/nintendo-switch-wont-have-lte-more-features-released/ (http://www.vgnmagazine.com/2016/12/31/nintendo-switch-wont-have-lte-more-features-released/)

The leak from Reddit user ‘Genos’ is fake.

No ****.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 01, 2017, 07:08:05 PM
Still gotta love the "sequel to franchise never released on this underselling platform releases much later than other platforms with a built-up franchise fanbase, and then sells like ****, so the next sequel that could've release same time as other consoles, on this new console, will not release at all"


I know. Don't you just want to club someone over the head (in this case, LKD and obviously whomever actually makes this decision) when they state this reason and logic behind the new game getting little/no consideration on the new console?


But you know, I really blame Nintendo. It's Nintendo's fault. If they wanted a certain game, they'd get it. It's really only their fault when these games skip their console just like it's their fault when their console gets late ports.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 01, 2017, 07:47:59 PM
But you know, I really blame Nintendo. It's Nintendo's fault. If they wanted a certain game, they'd get it. It's really only their fault when these games skip their console just like it's their fault when their console gets late ports.

The reason EA gave the Wii U Mass Effect 3 instead of Trilogy and inteniontally sabotaged all their Wii U games is because they wanted Nintendo to use EA's shitty Origin for the Wii U's online and Nintendo rightfully told them to **** off. 

Seriously, what exactly was Nintendo suppose to do in that situation, just allow EA to have full control over Nintendo's entire online infrastructure?  Yeah Nintendo has done a lot of stupid things with third parties but these third parties are far from innocent in the **** they pull as well.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 01, 2017, 09:35:06 PM
But you know, I really blame Nintendo. It's Nintendo's fault. If they wanted a certain game, they'd get it. It's really only their fault when these games skip their console just like it's their fault when their console gets late ports.

The reason EA gave the Wii U Mass Effect 3 instead of Trilogy and inteniontally sabotaged all their Wii U games is because they wanted Nintendo to use EA's shitty Origin for the Wii U's online and Nintendo rightfully told them to **** off. 

Seriously, what exactly was Nintendo suppose to do in that situation, just allow EA to have full control over Nintendo's entire online infrastructure?  Yeah Nintendo has done a lot of stupid things with third parties but these third parties are far from innocent in the **** they pull as well.


In comparison with that mess of an online gaming service the Wii U ended up with? I honestly don't know. At least if it was Origin, the Wii U probably gets a crap load more games.


That situation only comes about because Nintendo obviously had poor/no plans for their online gaming infrastructure. It had to look like a great deal in EA's eyes. Furthermore, Nintendo has dug this hole that they are in, so naturally they are last on the priority list and don't even seem to care.


Would you agree that Nintendo appeared to not care? I think they do care a little with regard to the Switch, but it was all lip service with the Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 02, 2017, 12:33:00 AM
I wouldn't say I'm a Shield expert, but I probably am the only person on these forums that has one (and I remember your Unity demo on the OUYA - sold mine when I got the Google ADT-1). If the tablet has a 720p display, there is no reason to run anything at higher than 720p when it's undocked - you'd only be killing battery life.

720p on a 6.2" will probably look "fine" - especially when it's still a relatively powerful system. The display on the Shield (original, portable version) is 5" and 720p and it looks pretty amazing, and to be honest the display on the Wii U Gamepad isn't *horrible* even at 480p. But like I mentioned before, it's a no-go for VR. Any rumors on if it will support 3D though? I think it's weird enough that it supports touch, because obviously that's not going to work when it's docked - unless the base for the Joycons they've been showing is a touchpad like the PS4.

So, does someone have a copy of Dark Infinity floating around?  Because that would be hilarious.  Also, funny to know  someone played "Rival". Which version did i send you? The field with the giant fish you could move and the camel? Some poor new Ouya owner loads it up and is like "ooh dark infinity sounds cool" loads it up and is like WTF is this?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 02, 2017, 12:37:25 AM
Would you agree that Nintendo appeared to not care? I think they do care a little with regard to the Switch, but it was all lip service with the Wii U.

Well Nintendo kind of had a good reason not to care back then since many of these same third parties literally killed themselves last gen or came pretty close to bankrupting themselves.  We even have a nice little thread in the OT section that hasn't been the most active of late but gives a pretty good idea what the videogame landscape was like back when Nintendo would have been designing the Wii U in the first place.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=30285.0 (http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=30285.0)


Yes, I do agree Nintendo has done a poor job in dealing with third parties overall, but at the same time, it's not hard to see why Nintendo doesn't exactly trust them.  Look at how recklessly many were gambling their entire companies last gen, especially EA who was taking some pretty big losses for much of last gen and you can't exactly blame Nintendo for not given a **** about them for making the Wii U.  These same companies were the ones who demanded Microsoft and Sony make the 360/PS3 as powerful as they were and both companies lost billions as a result of trying to please them.


Of course the industry is in a different place now then it was back in 2011.  For one third parties have started to care more about containing cost, especially the Japanese ones, then they were and Nintendo themselves have gone through their own HD growing pains on the Wii U so they at least have a better understanding on how development on this kind of hardware works.  So at least with the Switch, both sides are somewhat closer on understanding the other which should help Nintendo at least get better support early on then they did with the Wii U.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 02, 2017, 02:10:37 AM
But you know, I really blame Nintendo. It's Nintendo's fault. If they wanted a certain game, they'd get it. It's really only their fault when these games skip their console just like it's their fault when their console gets late ports.

The reason EA gave the Wii U Mass Effect 3 instead of Trilogy and inteniontally sabotaged all their Wii U games is because they wanted Nintendo to use EA's shitty Origin for the Wii U's online and Nintendo rightfully told them to **** off. 

Seriously, what exactly was Nintendo suppose to do in that situation, just allow EA to have full control over Nintendo's entire online infrastructure?  Yeah Nintendo has done a lot of stupid things with third parties but these third parties are far from innocent in the **** they pull as well.


In comparison with that mess of an online gaming service the Wii U ended up with? I honestly don't know. At least if it was Origin, the Wii U probably gets a crap load more games.


That situation only comes about because Nintendo obviously had poor/no plans for their online gaming infrastructure. It had to look like a great deal in EA's eyes. Furthermore, Nintendo has dug this hole that they are in, so naturally they are last on the priority list and don't even seem to care.


Would you agree that Nintendo appeared to not care? I think they do care a little with regard to the Switch, but it was all lip service with the Wii U.

How exactly was the Wii U's online service a mess? It's not really missing much from its competitors. The games weren't there to take advantage of it, but I really can't find a ton of fault with the service itself.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 02, 2017, 02:17:24 AM
The only thing Nintendo's online service needs is voice chat.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 02, 2017, 03:25:50 AM
Yeah, the lack of a systemwide party voice chat system is really the only big thing it's missing that I can see.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on January 02, 2017, 04:41:18 AM
As long as it stays free, I dont mind what happens. Im happy enough with online games on the Wii U.

Another accidental leak from EB Australia
(http://gearnuke.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/mario-kart-switch.jpg)
(http://images.nintendolife.com/news/2017/01/eb_games_listing_confirms_mario_kart_8_and_skyrim_for_switch/attachment/1/original.jpg)

Looks too good to be a quick mock up, I would say its real.
New content for Mario Kart 8 sounds great
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 02, 2017, 05:55:42 AM
I think Nintendo has 2 issues.

1) Repeatedly trying to re-invent the wheel just so that they can call it their own.

2) Designing their hardware w/ a specific gaming target in mind. and then adding features afterwards, that only take away from performance and pre-set resources.

they can fix (1) by teaming up w/ or buying out other companies that specialize in the things they are trying to accomplish, instead of trying to recreate it from the ground up and going through the trial and error that these other companies have already gone through many years prior, and now being a generation+ behind in features because they wanted to do it their way.

and they address (2) in a very similar fashion to (1), and teaming up w/ Nvidia for a fresh version of a modern chip is a good start. And i have no idea what the final specs will be, but I'm hoping they aren't just set to optimize whatever flagship game they have in mind, and then struggle to add competent background features, or more complex games w/ in-game and those same background features (i.e. 8 player online/voicechat/videochat/streaming/etc etc) - in other words, leave some room to grow.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Spak-Spang on January 02, 2017, 06:11:51 AM
So if that EB leak is true...my question on Mario Kart 8 Switch is are those 24 additional tracks not the DLC tracks and characters?  Or does it include the DLC? 

My guess is that it includes the DLC content which is 16 tracks meaning that Mario Kart Switch could only have 8 new tracks, which seems fair.  Then the characters with the DLC means it might be only 4 new characters...which would also be fair.  Perhaps one of the characters would be a new outsider?  Perhaps Sonic? 
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 02, 2017, 06:30:51 AM
It would be awesome if they had a bunch of diddy kong racing maps remastered.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 02, 2017, 09:18:11 AM
Well, it's clear that Nintendo has shot themselves in the foot with that pricing. One thousand dollars per system? Do they think I'm MADE of money?!
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on January 02, 2017, 10:02:36 AM
That EB stuff is mockups made by the webmaster at Vooks (Aussie site) so it's not confirming anything.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 02, 2017, 11:39:08 AM
Laura Kate Dale backtracks on her reports of Breathless in the Wild not being a launch title. Apparently it will now come out at launch and I have to assume it will get a massive Day 1 patch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 02, 2017, 12:25:32 PM
Should have included an emoticon, because I was joking.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 02, 2017, 01:06:28 PM
Should have included an emoticon, because I was joking.


I caught it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 02, 2017, 01:21:10 PM
But you know, I really blame Nintendo. It's Nintendo's fault. If they wanted a certain game, they'd get it. It's really only their fault when these games skip their console just like it's their fault when their console gets late ports.

The reason EA gave the Wii U Mass Effect 3 instead of Trilogy and inteniontally sabotaged all their Wii U games is because they wanted Nintendo to use EA's shitty Origin for the Wii U's online and Nintendo rightfully told them to **** off. 

Seriously, what exactly was Nintendo suppose to do in that situation, just allow EA to have full control over Nintendo's entire online infrastructure?  Yeah Nintendo has done a lot of stupid things with third parties but these third parties are far from innocent in the **** they pull as well.


In comparison with that mess of an online gaming service the Wii U ended up with? I honestly don't know. At least if it was Origin, the Wii U probably gets a crap load more games.


That situation only comes about because Nintendo obviously had poor/no plans for their online gaming infrastructure. It had to look like a great deal in EA's eyes. Furthermore, Nintendo has dug this hole that they are in, so naturally they are last on the priority list and don't even seem to care.


Would you agree that Nintendo appeared to not care? I think they do care a little with regard to the Switch, but it was all lip service with the Wii U.

How exactly was the Wii U's online service a mess? It's not really missing much from its competitors. The games weren't there to take advantage of it, but I really can't find a ton of fault with the service itself.


There are a few thing that are just really lacking. Others have mentioned Party chat and the need to make their own wheel rather than going and buying a finely made one. Another consideration: All their work on the Wii store, virtual console, etc. got reset on the Wii U. Not only that, but they evidently couldn't be bothered to work out all the licenses for the Wii U virtual console or something because that feature went by the wayside.


I also think the UI is just really inefficient. I never really feel "connected" even with Nintendo pumping tons of weird "community" content to it. I'd rather just see what my friends are up to, see what they're saying, etc., and have voice chat. Instead, every time I turn on the Wii U it feels like I'm looking at the exact same thing even if the artworks are different. Their idea of a community maybe just doesn't feel very fresh or lively?


I kinda feel like I'm just saying what others already said, and my gripes are more with the UI and overall technical flow of the OS and then some major glaring shortcomings of their online service.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on January 02, 2017, 09:54:25 PM
That EB stuff is mockups made by the webmaster at Vooks (Aussie site) so it's not confirming anything.

Ah, yes Im familiar with Vooks. I think is pretty bad of him to spread misinformation like that. He was claiming "social experiment" on twitter, which is just BS in my opinion.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 02, 2017, 11:34:02 PM
In news that should surprise no one (once again) Mass Effect Andromeda is not coming to Switch.


http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/01/mass_effect_producer_says_theres_no_plan_to_bring_mass_effect_andromeda_to_switch
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 02, 2017, 11:39:51 PM
Laura Kate Dale backtracks on her reports of Breathless in the Wild not being a launch title. Apparently it will now come out at launch and I have to assume it will get a massive Day 1 patch.

Either that or I assume the debug teams haven't gotten a lot of sleep lately.  I imagine Nintendo has always wanted Zelda as their flagship launch title and the game was being harder to debug because of it's massive size but would only delay it if absolutely necessary.  It was probably in danger a few months ago but the developers have done a massive crunch and managed to get it up to a quality Nintendo is happy with.  Yeah they'll still be patches but even day one unpatched will probably still run a lot better then the usual open world experiences.

I suspect 3D Mario was a backup plan in case Zelda had to be delayed but if Zelda will indeed make the launch then 3D Mario will probably be their summer game now.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 03, 2017, 02:10:49 AM
In news that should surprise no one (once again) Mass Effect Andromeda is not coming to Switch.


http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/01/mass_effect_producer_says_theres_no_plan_to_bring_mass_effect_andromeda_to_switch

It's not new information, but that really isn't a great sign for Switch's third party support when a big, premier title from a company that's supposed to be onboard with Switch that's launching on the other consoles at essentially the same time as the Switch launch isn't coming to it.



Laura Kate Dale backtracks on her reports of Breathless in the Wild not being a launch title. Apparently it will now come out at launch and I have to assume it will get a massive Day 1 patch.

Either that or I assume the debug teams haven't gotten a lot of sleep lately.  I imagine Nintendo has always wanted Zelda as their flagship launch title and the game was being harder to debug because of it's massive size but would only delay it if absolutely necessary.  It was probably in danger a few months ago but the developers have done a massive crunch and managed to get it up to a quality Nintendo is happy with.  Yeah they'll still be patches but even day one unpatched will probably still run a lot better then the usual open world experiences.

I suspect 3D Mario was a backup plan in case Zelda had to be delayed but if Zelda will indeed make the launch then 3D Mario will probably be their summer game now.

The people in the know seem to think that Mario is basically done, so sitting on it until the summer while rushing Zelda doesn't make much sense. I'm taking this to mean they intend to have both Mario and Zelda at launch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 03, 2017, 10:23:54 AM
I mean, Andromeda might be a premier title, but it's one that has to fight an uphill battle after Mass Effect 3 really screwed the series, both on Wii U and in general.

In other news, apparently Switch might be getting a port of Rayman Legends, and Beyond Good and Evil 2 will have year-long exclusivity? Those are good signs. But if 3DS developers are going to get on board with Switch, I'm hoping we see some localized Japanese titles before the end of the year.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on January 03, 2017, 12:19:05 PM
That EB stuff is mockups made by the webmaster at Vooks (Aussie site) so it's not confirming anything.

Ah, yes Im familiar with Vooks. I think is pretty bad of him to spread misinformation like that. He was claiming "social experiment" on twitter, which is just BS in my opinion.

That's a classic comment for regretful trolling.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 03, 2017, 12:33:50 PM
...Switch might be getting a port of...

Every time a port of a Wii U game is rumored I die a little bit more inside. I might not make it to January 12.


EDIT: No Persona or Yakuza for Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 03, 2017, 01:02:19 PM
As long as Switch gets the superior Atlus RPG, SMTV, I don't give two shits about Persona. Anyway, the Wii U ports are unsurprising, but Rayman Legends is a bit baffling. Didn't that game underperform?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on January 03, 2017, 02:05:42 PM
I think Nintendo has 2 issues.

1) Repeatedly trying to re-invent the wheel just so that they can call it their own.

I think the Wii was the first time they tried this, and it was so successful, that it only made sense to try and upend the table again with the WiiU. It probably would have been better (imo) to make a Wii2 instead, with better or the same motion controls (the same only so the controllers would be compatible), but with better graphics. Instead, they tried something new, which failed, and now the Switch is what the WiiU should have been. Instead of having a screen on the controller, the system has a screen for when you want to take it outside. This makes it more of a traditional machine which is good for gamers and designers.

Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 03, 2017, 02:39:11 PM
The people in the know seem to think that Mario is basically done, so sitting on it until the summer while rushing Zelda doesn't make much sense. I'm taking this to mean they intend to have both Mario and Zelda at launch.

Mario Galaxy 2 was basically done by the end of 2009 and Nintendo even admitted they didn't release it because they didn't want it taking attention away from NSMB Wii.  Donkey Kong Tropical Freeze was basically done by the end of 2013 but Nintendo intentionally held it a few months because the Wii U had nothing in early 2014 until Mario Kart.

Realistically Zelda is the game Nintendo would want as the flagship title for the Switch.  This is their first major open world title that's being aimed at the mass gaming audience.  This is the kind of game that will have a lot more impact on todays gaming market since the open world genre has exploded in popularity during the last decade.  Yes they could release both games at the same time but I imagine Nintendo wants to spend most of their Switch advertising for launch on Zelda alone since it has way more crossover appeal to the modern gaming audience and doesn't want to run the risk of Mario taking away any hype.

Even if 3D Mario is done now, Zelda is the series they want selling better and getting all the attention at launch because it's way more important for Nintendo's future for it to happen.  The platformer genre outside of Nintendo's own games are pretty much dead outside of indies which Nintendo already gets.  Mario selling over 10 million copies won't do anything since the platformer audience already lives off Nintendo, while Zelda selling over 10 million would bring in a whole new crowd for Nintendo which is one of the things they hope the Switch does.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on January 03, 2017, 03:14:58 PM
In news that should surprise no one (once again) Mass Effect Andromeda is not coming to Switch.


http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/01/mass_effect_producer_says_theres_no_plan_to_bring_mass_effect_andromeda_to_switch (http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2017/01/mass_effect_producer_says_theres_no_plan_to_bring_mass_effect_andromeda_to_switch)

It's not new information, but that really isn't a great sign for Switch's third party support when a big, premier title from a company that's supposed to be onboard with Switch that's launching on the other consoles at essentially the same time as the Switch launch isn't coming to it.

Either Switch or Andromeda is getting kicked to November, and it's not the hardware.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Oedo on January 03, 2017, 08:10:12 PM
I can't see Nintendo releasing both Zelda and Mario at launch, but who knows. I'm excited to play both so I'm happy either way, but I do agree that Breath of the Wild seems like it has more broad appeal (especially after the coverage it got at E3 2016).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 03, 2017, 09:46:28 PM
I think Nintendo has 2 issues.

1) Repeatedly trying to re-invent the wheel just so that they can call it their own.

I think the Wii was the first time they tried this, and it was so successful, that it only made sense to try and upend the table again with the WiiU. It probably would have been better (imo) to make a Wii2 instead, with better or the same motion controls (the same only so the controllers would be compatible), but with better graphics. Instead, they tried something new, which failed, and now the Switch is what the WiiU should have been. Instead of having a screen on the controller, the system has a screen for when you want to take it outside. This makes it more of a traditional machine which is good for gamers and designers.


That's not re-inventing that we're complaining about, though. The Wii motion controls were major selling point for all of us. [That] was exciting. Let's talk about what's not exciting:


1. Gamecube: Opting for proprietary mini-discs while the rest of the market uses standard DVDs. Consequently, Gamecube discs have far less storage and are more expensive for third parties. Why not just go with the standard everyone else is happy with?


2. Gamecube: Going with 59 Mb memory cards as the standard (and ONLY available Nintendo branded) memory card while [everyone else] has game save storage space into the megabytes. Why not just go with what has been proven to work with that generation for the past year?


3. Wii: Going with "friend codes" that are unique to each and every game that supports online play. Want to play with your friends? Prepare to enter a GUID using a pointer for every friend code EVERY TIME you get a new game. This is majorly off-putting to everyone who has played online on PC, Xbox, or Playstation. NO ONE has EVER chosen to do online play like this before. NO ONE. Nintendo came up with this all on their own. Why not just go with the standard that has already been in place for more than a decade???


4. Wii: Games are FINALLY on DVDs. No DVD movie playback. Why not include a hugely popular feature all other competitors offer??? I mean, F--K, I know people who don't even f--king game who bought 3 or more Wii's just to hook them to TVs and run Netflix. Seriously. Japan of all nations dictates you to make a smaller console, AND YOU GO OUT OF YOUR WAY TO DENY US DVD PLAYBACK!!!!11!1


5. Wii: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 8 GB is enough. Doh.


6. Wii U: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 32 GB is enough. Doh.


7. Switch: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 32 GB is enough. Doh.


8. Wii U: Code friends. No friend list. No party chat. No subscription service. No monthly free games for subscribers. Why not go with the hugely popular standard demonstrated by their competition a generation ago? Oh, that's right. There's only 32 GB to work with. Doh.


When Nintendo does something, they make sure and do it themselves and make sure to only do what their narrow vision requires. One the minimum is satisfied, they trim anything that might be of use to anyone outside Nintendo and make sure they aren't paying an extra penny anywhere along the way while still asking a premium price for the damn thing. I give you: Nintendo re-inventing the wheel.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on January 03, 2017, 11:00:36 PM
Uh, the Wii U used network IDs and had a friends list.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 03, 2017, 11:25:34 PM
Uh, the Wii U used network IDs and had a friends list.


How am I supposed to know that when I am the only person I know (in person) who plays Wii U?


Kidding aside, I was in a hurry to end my post, but seriously: the rest of #8 is still perfectly valid. Wii U literally offers nothing to make the online service exciting. I'd never know there was a friends list because there is nothing on the landing screen to tell me I should make some friends. Where would one even see this?


Moot point, though. What little I did with Mario Kart 8 online was enough for me.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 03, 2017, 11:35:27 PM
I refuse to believe all Nintendo needs is to add voice/party chat to fix its online. At the very least it needs wired connection options that don't involve wasting a USB slot on a shitty adaptor.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 03, 2017, 11:41:36 PM
Wii U video chat would have worked better if there was a third party multi platform chat program like skype. too bad.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 03, 2017, 11:54:27 PM
And just so I don't come across as a Nintendo-hater, I'd like to take a moment to state that I bought the Wii U because I love Nintendo games. I own a Wii, which I still play even though I kinda hate the Wii. I own a bunch of games for Wii. I own quite a few for Wii U: MK8, Super Mario 3D World, NSMB Wii U, DKC Tropical Freeze, Pikmin 3, Super Smash Bros Wii U, Twilight Princess, Wind Waker HD, and a few others.


I think quite a few of you relate with where I'm coming from. I want Nintendo to be cool, but it's just not who they are. They make the games I really want to play, but they do not make the console I want to own. Here's to hoping the Switch will be a good enough platform to attract a lot of quality third party support.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 04, 2017, 12:30:29 AM
I think Nintendo has 2 issues.

1) Repeatedly trying to re-invent the wheel just so that they can call it their own.

I think the Wii was the first time they tried this, and it was so successful, that it only made sense to try and upend the table again with the WiiU. It probably would have been better (imo) to make a Wii2 instead, with better or the same motion controls (the same only so the controllers would be compatible), but with better graphics. Instead, they tried something new, which failed, and now the Switch is what the WiiU should have been. Instead of having a screen on the controller, the system has a screen for when you want to take it outside. This makes it more of a traditional machine which is good for gamers and designers.


That's not re-inventing that we're complaining about, though. The Wii motion controls were major selling point for all of us. [That] was exciting. Let's talk about what's not exciting:

When Nintendo does something, they make sure and do it themselves and make sure to only do what their narrow vision requires. One the minimum is satisfied, they trim anything that might be of use to anyone outside Nintendo and make sure they aren't paying an extra penny anywhere along the way while still asking a premium price for the damn thing. I give you: Nintendo re-inventing the wheel.

Yes. you understand what I was talking about.

trying so hard not to be a "copy-cat" that you end up with a vastly inferior product to the industry set standard in place for YEARS already. Welcome to the Party Nintendo, but the flyer invite for that party was back in 2014.... it's 2017 now. maybe next time.

and penny pinching so hard, that you build the perfect machine for YOUR launch game. Now you challenge everyone else to fit in Mario's overalls better than Mario... who the overalls were tailor made for. Guess what.... it's a little tight in the crotch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on January 04, 2017, 12:58:14 AM
I get the sense that while a dedicated data port would be a big deal to me, it probably is FAR from top-of-the-mind for the average mass market consuner out there.

However, I understand that the 5ghz wifi support revealed from the recent fcc flings is actually a pretty good thing?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 04, 2017, 05:22:04 AM
That's not the online service, that's a hardware thing. And with the way they approached the design of the Switch, it doesn't seem likely.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 04, 2017, 09:09:18 AM
Stylistically, the Switch is something I very much want to own. It's a lot more sleek and appealing than the Wii U and I get the premise immediately. I like that there will be games that I can share with others, although to what extent and what amount of the library that will be, I am unsure. I like that I will be able to play current-gen console games on it, although again, the overlap between systems is questionable. Hell, I REALLY like that I'll be able to play GCN games on it since I can think of a few that I'd love to have playable portably.

I suppose this is the point where I awkwardly admit that I've come into a sad, strange situation lately that has given me the ability to buy a Switch at launch, and while that has definitely perked up my ears regarding news and rumors related to the console, there are still fundamental issues I have with the device. All of the things I mentioned prior as exciting are all circumstantial and unlikely to pay off until late in the console's life. If all goes well, it will be a bit more manageable than the Wii U- that is all the leeway I will give the Switch at this point.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on January 04, 2017, 02:08:16 PM


That's not re-inventing that we're complaining about, though. The Wii motion controls were major selling point for all of us. [That] was exciting. Let's talk about what's not exciting:


1. Gamecube: Opting for proprietary mini-discs while the rest of the market uses standard DVDs. Consequently, Gamecube discs have far less storage and are more expensive for third parties. Why not just go with the standard everyone else is happy with?

To protect their intellectual property. The mini discs were harder to pirate and Nintendo thought that third party developers would be on board with making their games harder to copy too. Love it or hate it, Nintendo is obsessed with protecting their property and with the preponderance of piracy in this day and age, I can't blame them for it.




2. Gamecube: Going with 59 Mb memory cards as the standard (and ONLY available Nintendo branded) memory card while [everyone else] has game save storage space into the megabytes. Why not just go with what has been proven to work with that generation for the past year?

I may be recalling incorrectly, but I'm pretty sure Nintendo had bigger memory cards for the GC than 59 Mb, and I'm also pretty sure there were third party memory cards. I don't recall which game it was, but I know there was a game that required the larger card and that annoyed me to have to buy a new one. It worked for them, and for the most part, two memory cards were sufficient to hold all the games I played, except when the larger card came out and I bought two of those. I just looked it up: https://www.amazon.com/Gamecube-Memory-Card-251/dp/B00012D0SG


3. Wii: Going with "friend codes" that are unique to each and every game that supports online play. Want to play with your friends? Prepare to enter a GUID using a pointer for every friend code EVERY TIME you get a new game. This is majorly off-putting to everyone who has played online on PC, Xbox, or Playstation. NO ONE has EVER chosen to do online play like this before. NO ONE. Nintendo came up with this all on their own. Why not just go with the standard that has already been in place for more than a decade???

While I can't really defend Nintendo's overall online strategy, the reason for this is pretty solid: to protect the younger audience they knew they had. We, as adult gamers who love Nintendo, may hate the "kiddie" tag associated with them, and they probably don't like it either, but that doesn't change the fact that they do cater to not only a younger audience, but also an older audience of casual gamers who don't want to be dragged into the cesspool that is online gaming. Their attempt ultimately failed, but I give them credit for at least trying to do something about it.

4. Wii: Games are FINALLY on DVDs. No DVD movie playback. Why not include a hugely popular feature all other competitors offer??? I mean, F--K, I know people who don't even f--king game who bought 3 or more Wii's just to hook them to TVs and run Netflix. Seriously. Japan of all nations dictates you to make a smaller console, AND YOU GO OUT OF YOUR WAY TO DENY US DVD PLAYBACK!!!!11!1

Honestly, if you still needed a DVD player in 2006, I don't know what to tell you.

5. Wii: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 8 GB is enough. Doh.


6. Wii U: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 32 GB is enough. Doh.


7. Switch: Everyone else is offering 100+ GB storage solutions. Nintendo believes 32 GB is enough. Doh.


I'm pretty sure all of that is related to saving costs and not trying to reinvent the wheel. Also, we don't know how much storage the Switch will have yet, just rumors. With a GC VC, 32GB seems a bit ridiculous. But that doesn't really go with what we're talking about.


8. Wii U: Code friends. No friend list. No party chat. No subscription service. No monthly free games for subscribers. Why not go with the hugely popular standard demonstrated by their competition a generation ago? Oh, that's right. There's only 32 GB to work with. Doh.


When Nintendo does something, they make sure and do it themselves and make sure to only do what their narrow vision requires. One the minimum is satisfied, they trim anything that might be of use to anyone outside Nintendo and make sure they aren't paying an extra penny anywhere along the way while still asking a premium price for the damn thing. I give you: Nintendo re-inventing the wheel.

The first part of this statement was already shown to be mistaken, so let's go the second part that's also a mistake. "While still asking a premium price for the damn thing". The Wii and WiiU were both underpriced compared to the competition. I wouldn't exactly call that a "premium price" in fact, it's the exact opposite in the context of the console market.

Yes. you understand what I was talking about.

trying so hard not to be a "copy-cat" that you end up with a vastly inferior product to the industry set standard in place for YEARS already. Welcome to the Party Nintendo, but the flyer invite for that party was back in 2014.... it's 2017 now. maybe next time.

and penny pinching so hard, that you build the perfect machine for YOUR launch game. Now you challenge everyone else to fit in Mario's overalls better than Mario... who the overalls were tailor made for. Guess what.... it's a little tight in the crotch.

I guess we're differing on their motivation. As I see it, they aren't trying to not be a "copy-cat", but rather doing things they feel fall within what they're trying to do, regardless of what everyone else is doing. Before the WiiU, that strategy served them very well. Now with the Switch they are conforming a little, while still pursuing their vision for what the WiiU should have been from the start. They are definitely penny pinchers, there's no denying that, but Sony and Microsoft have other streams of revenue to rely while Nintendo is only a game maker.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 04, 2017, 03:27:52 PM
8. Wii U: Code friends. No friend list. No party chat. No subscription service. No monthly free games for subscribers. Why not go with the hugely popular standard demonstrated by their competition a generation ago? Oh, that's right. There's only 32 GB to work with. Doh.

How much of an axe do you have to grind when you're trying to spin Nintendo not charging for online play as a bad thing? Free games or not, Xbox Live is a ripoff, and PSN+ is a way bigger ripoff. And it's not only 32 GB as it supports USB hard drives, which Sony still doesn't do.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Phil on January 04, 2017, 04:11:58 PM
%$^ Microsoft for introducing paid online to gaming (among putting a ticking time bomb that was the original 360). And ^^#% the people who so happily bent over to make it so acceptable that Sony then did it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Kairon on January 04, 2017, 04:16:55 PM
I really don't want to pay for online multiplayer.

Putting my business hat on, I look across at Sony and MS and see the money they're raking in for paid online services and I'm jealous on that count because money is resources and the more resources Nintendo has the better positioned they'll be to make big outside the box bets on gaming that could stretch the medium, advance the artform, and possibly create more of the games that I'm a big Nintendo fan because of.

Then I take that hat off and I really, REALLY, don't want to pay just to race Mario Kart online.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on January 04, 2017, 04:29:15 PM
Nintendo's current issue is that they don't have an online system that's actually worth paying for right now.  So, charging might be a no-go unless they can roll out some great features.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 04, 2017, 04:33:18 PM
Sony doesn't have an online system worth paying for right now either, but they didn't let that stop them.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on January 04, 2017, 04:56:59 PM
Touche
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 04, 2017, 10:30:49 PM
Dude who uses wired internet anymore? Any halfway decent wireless router can provide more bandwidth than just about any ISP (in the US, with our shitty internet, at least). It just needs at least AC support, like every other console does (now).

Edit - meh, the "unread" thing made me think I was replying to an older post. Oh well.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on January 04, 2017, 10:33:58 PM
I read somewhere that the Switch uses 802.11AC WiFi. Maybe it was on the FCC page?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 04, 2017, 10:35:22 PM
Well then that's great. There's no need to support wired internet anymore. It's 2017 bruh. Get a router from the last few years and you're good.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 05, 2017, 03:49:15 PM
That all sounds cool but I live in the Caribbean and while services have improved in the last decade I still have better performance using wired connections on my consoles. I'm not disputing the effectiveness of wireless, I just want more options.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: KeyBilly on January 05, 2017, 04:43:06 PM
The desire for wired internet is not about speed.  It is the shorter latency and better reliability.  I don't personally use it, but I can understand why it is a must for some people when playing certain games.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: King of Twitch on January 05, 2017, 06:00:08 PM
The last time  :reggie: reapplied for the Eternal Darkness trademark was in 2013, the same year that Retro released their last game. Coincidence?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on January 05, 2017, 07:18:04 PM
Yeah, Nintendo's online being free is something I feel is often overlooked. Personally, I'd rather have mediocre online than pay for anything better, and Nintendo's online is usually good enough to suit my needs. It's just too bad other people don't feel the same way. In this day and age, it's pretty easy to arrange other forms of communication in games that don't have any.

I'm worried that Nintendo will start to charge an online fee for Switch, and even worse, it won't be much better than now. And the Nintendo nuts will still pay it, but it won't go over well with anyone else.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on January 05, 2017, 08:02:24 PM
Wii U video chat would have worked better if there was a third party multi platform chat program like skype. too bad.

And a decent camera.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Switch Force Edition)
Post by: Agent-X- on January 07, 2017, 12:56:05 AM
The desire for wired internet is not about speed.  It is the shorter latency and better reliability.  I don't personally use it, but I can understand why it is a must for some people when playing certain games.


This. /argument


Bandwidth equals throughput. How many bits per second. We may call it "speed" but it is in fact not how fast a bit travels. Latency describes how long it takes for a packet of data to travel from source to destination, but for whatever reason we don't actually refer to this as speed.

Serious online gamers require a wired network connection.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: crashnnburn on January 07, 2017, 02:16:38 AM
Not sure if anyone has mentioned this. Being that the Switch is based off the Nvidia Shield concept and technology. What would the chances be that while you have your Switch at home, you can stream games to it from your computer using GameStream. This way all your PC library can be playable on your Switch.

This is a win win for both devs and Nintendo. Once the Switch sells like hotcakes then devs can start porting or making new games from the ground up for Switch. Nintendo wins cause all PC gamers will most likely buy the Switch too.

I don't know, I think it's a good opportunity if implemented well. The tech already works with the Shield.

And what if, since I remember correctly there was an old rumor Switch would run on Android or something like this. What if, it does have Android... And you can run anything from the google play store. Any mobile game... They can tap into ALL the market with one device. Console, handheld and mobile all in one system. I mean they are getting into the phone app game market with Dena.

Both of these would surely move Nintendo to the top in a matter of months and I think they would dominate for years to come.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on January 07, 2017, 03:06:07 AM
The problem Nintendo woudl have with that strategy is that even though those features moved X amount of systems, it is now likely that the extra X system, plus lots of the rest of them won' t be buying Nintendo Switch Licensed games, and that is where the money in this 1st party industry is at.

The console may not be sold at a loss, but it's barely making a profit. All the money is in the license to sell the games. So if you are buying games made for the Switch, Nintendo isn't getting paid. If you are instead streaming all your PC games and playing all your free mobile games, Nintendo isn't getting paid.


Imagine how disastrous it would be for Nintendo if the only dollar they made off the majority of the Switch owners was the initial hardware purchase, and this is because everyone decided that it was better and smarter to just purchase every 3rd party game through Steam (on sale) and just stream it to the Switch.
Nintendo might get the occasional 1st party game purchase, but why bother with a 3rd party (non-exclusive) title on Switch, if I can probably get it for cheaper on Steam and play it from whatever computer I happen to own for the rest of the existence of Steam.


This causes more problems in the long term, than it solves in the short.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: crashnnburn on January 07, 2017, 03:23:32 AM
Well that would be true for most PC gamers. Personal opinion but I think most PC gamers are console owners, but most console gamers don't do PC games so it won't really affect Nintendo negatively. And if you buy Switch is so you can take it on the go and your steam library would be worthless when you go out. The point of this is for the most amount of people to own the Nintendo Switch, you're just a tap away from purchasing their first party or third party games (if downloadable).


Not to mention the whole play together with friends on the Switch with local connected multiplayer using four Switches connected. You wouldn't be able to use that on steam games. It's just an added plus to be able to play your pc games on switch is all i'm saying.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 07, 2017, 03:46:33 AM
the idea seems doable, but very non Nintendo.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 07, 2017, 09:36:43 AM
It does seem very non-Nintendo, but so does Mario on an iPhone. I don't think they would ever add GameStream (which is being replaced by Steam I believe), but possibly GeForce Now. It could even be part of the online service it they make you pay for it.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: TheSevenYearSwitch on January 07, 2017, 05:19:54 PM
Yeah, it would be very impractical to offer it free. The other limitations of not every console gamer being a PC gamer also make it more feasible as would the portability aspect of needing the game to be on the Switch to work outside the home.

As for putting the Android app store on it, that to me gives people the option to pay Google for games instead of Nintendo, which doesn't seem smart, unless Nintendo and Google work out a deal where Nintendo gets some of that money.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 07, 2017, 05:29:51 PM
There's no way they're putting the Android app store on there, and having it run Android would be a terrible decision anyway, with this gimped X1 especially.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 07, 2017, 05:46:22 PM
Steam streaming would be great. I'd never buy a device just for that, but it'd be an amazing bonus for Switch.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 08, 2017, 11:33:55 AM
Nikkei is reporting that Switch may be 25k Yen. $250 could be a reality.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on January 08, 2017, 12:53:43 PM
$250 is good. Include a demo cart or a game bundle.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 08, 2017, 01:05:33 PM
25,000 yen is about $215, so not only is $250 a possibility, $200 might even be one.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Luigi Dude on January 08, 2017, 01:57:00 PM
Nikkei is reporting that Switch may be 25k Yen. $250 could be a reality.

Assuming Nintendo doesn't do anything stupid like releasing a $300 bundle then this is a great price.  Yeah the Wii U had a $250 SKU as well but nobody cared when the $300 SKU had a pack in game and more memory making it the clear superior deal.  Hopefully the Switch will only be a single $250 SKU just for marketing reasons alone which will give it much better word of mouth, especially with Breath of the Wild being a much better killer app then NSMB U which was great, but the cheaper NSMB 2 on the 3DS killed any momentum and hype that game could have hoped to get.

Of course considering the exchange rate, they could do a $200 and $250 SKU tag as well.  $200 SKU for the system by itself while $250 will be bundled with Splatoon like some rumors have mentioned.  That would be a nice way to get the multiplayer audience going especially if Mario Kart also comes out around launch or shortly after.  Yeah the $200 SKU would still sell a lot less but at least the main $250 SKU which everyone will talk about will still be cheaper then the Wii U's main SKU and if Splatoon is the pack-in, will be much stronger then Nintendo Land which while fun, had pretty limited appeal since it tried to appeal to both Wii Sports casuals and traditional Nintendo fans and ended up being too hard for the Wii Sports crowd while not offering a deep enough experience for the traditional audience.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Shaymin on January 08, 2017, 03:13:10 PM
Just a note: That Nikkei report was actually an editorial, but we've had multiple other things pointing to $250 US.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 08, 2017, 03:16:54 PM
I find it hard to believe.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Mop it up on January 08, 2017, 03:37:15 PM
As I've been saying all along, if they're smart then it'll be $250 or less.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: BranDonk Kong on January 08, 2017, 03:46:28 PM
$200 or GTFO. They'd still be making money off of the hardware at $200.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 08, 2017, 03:51:52 PM
There's no way it's going to be 200. It's a level of aggressiveness I don't Nintendo is ready to go to just yet. Specially for early adopters.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 08, 2017, 03:55:27 PM
I think it's going to be $250 with a game, and then depending on how things go they may drop it to $200 for the holidays.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Kairon on January 08, 2017, 04:23:31 PM
I can see $250 with a game, or $200 for a basic unit. I believe they actually have the space to manuever on the price. Bbut I'm keeping my expectations low. I'm basically expecting a redux of a two SKU setup (ala Wii U) with a $250 base unit and a bundle/more-storage unit at $300.

I definitely agree that $200 would be all-guns blazing for Nintendo, and it would be really exciting to see, but I think it might be a better strategy for them to hold that in reserve for the future:

1. This is launch, and there's a group of people (like myself) who are more or less locked in to buy it unless it requires us to get two jobs to pay for it. Nintendo knows they can wrest a ton of money from my wallet already and probably won't leave that on the table.
2. This is launch, and if they get more people wanting to buy the Switch than they have supply they simply won't have enough consoles to sell to all those people ready to jump in at $200, no matter how much they want it.
3. They can always drop it to $200 later, like Holiday 2017, as a way of doing a big second wave of marketing push.
4. Nintendo has had lots of consoles launch at $250, both successes and failures. What will have a bigger effect on selling the console won't be a cheap price, but it's ability to sell a unique experience (hybrid) as well as a tempting software library (software sells games, not hardware).

I just don't think Nintendo needs to fire the $200 arrow just yet. If there are people willing to jump in only at $200 but not at $250, I don't see the big risk in Nintendo putting off those $200 consumers until Holiday 2017 while pocketing an extra $50 from each of those consumers who are just fine at $250.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 08, 2017, 05:07:11 PM
If they bundled the Switch with a pre-existing port of Wii U game, I can see them getting away with 250.

Otherwise, it's too competitive a price point for Nintendo, in my opinion. At least, for a home console. I wish they'd get over themselves and stop with this "third pillar" or "not a 3DS replacement" mentality.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on January 08, 2017, 06:45:36 PM
Im kind of hoping for a Nintendo Land style pack in game, rather than a Wii U port.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on January 08, 2017, 07:23:30 PM
What if Pokemon Go or Miitomo is the pack in?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 08, 2017, 07:24:52 PM
Unless it has a cellular data connection we haven't heard about Pokémon Go doesn't make any sense.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: ThePerm on January 08, 2017, 07:34:51 PM
Quick math.We've worked it out before. What does $199 in 1998 equal in terms of inflation now?

according to the inflation calculator

http://www.westegg.com/inflation/infl.cgi

What cost $199 in 1998 would cost $299.59 in 2016.

Keep in mind n64 and gcn were top of the line consoles. Wii and Wii U were priced according to inflation, but had outdated hardware.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 09, 2017, 02:56:03 PM
If I were Nintendo I'd get on the phone with Kamiya and Platinum and talk about reviving Scalebound for Switch...
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Kairon on January 09, 2017, 04:15:00 PM
If I were Nintendo I'd get on the phone with Kamiya and Platinum and talk about reviving Scalebound for Switch...

I read somewhere that MS owns the Scalebound IP though? And also that Kamiya was taking time off for mental health.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 09, 2017, 04:54:50 PM
I'm just throwing crap at the wall. I doubt Kamiya wants to return to this game at all even if they did get IP back. But I think Nintendo is more willing to let Kamiya do his thing at his pace and be more supportive.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: ShyGuy on January 09, 2017, 05:06:46 PM
The industry platform holder's history of copying Nintendo's outside party collaborations and failing continues. The curse is real!

Somebody get Platinum working on Switch game.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Adrock on January 09, 2017, 05:44:23 PM
Every time a talented game creator leaves or gets totally disrespected, Nintendo fans say Nintendo should pick up the phone. For once, that's actually a realistic expectation. Nintendo might actually do that this time. It has history with Platinum Games of literally doing exactly this. At the same time, Nintendo gauging interest in Scalebound automatically drives up the price of even a cancelled IP. Microsoft may not be so willing to give up the rights. I suppose it depends on if Nintendo wants to buy more than Microsoft wants to sell and vice versa. Nintendo could always pick up the game in spirit by having Platinum Games develop a similar game using the core concepts without calling it Scalebound.

I'm curious where this leaves Platinum Games. It likes having creative control but would greatly benefit from organization and consistent financial backing. It got both from The Wonderful 101 and Bayonetta 2. Platinum Games and Nintendo have had a good working relationship. Nintendo could use all the help it can get plugging genre holes in Switch's lineup while Platinum Games needs stability. Given how volatile Hideki Kamiya can be, would a partnership eventually implode? Maybe his public persona is nothing like his professional persona. I wonder if Nintendo could ultimately live with Platinum Games releasing higher budget, critical darlings that never become more than niche, particularly with Monolithsoft already as a first party developer.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 09, 2017, 05:54:43 PM
Platinum fans are an interesting lot, seeing as they pride themselves with understanding the machinations of the studio's work and are vocal about its technical elements and the challenge they provide, but the flip side is that Platinum games almost never sell well unless backed by a recognizable brand, which means their fanbase is a vocal minority. This is potentially advantageous, seeing as Nintendo has become more open to sharing their IPs, but with how Car Fax Zero turned out, I am wary of future partnerships with Platinum, and I think many of the creative forces at Platinum would agree. Kamiya seems like someone who likes making his own, original IP, and while I respect the thought and experience the guy has, he's yet to make a game that has truly won me over.

I just wanted to add a disclaimer: I think Platinum games are marvelous when in the hands of someone who has learned their intricacies and I get a huge kick out of watching high level play in the same way that I enjoy fighting games, but they aren't for me.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: oohhboy on January 09, 2017, 06:02:19 PM
I find Platinum games good in small doses, but yet it is a poor way to play them as you really need to build up the skill to play them to satisfaction. They are amazing then you crush the game but the amount of effort to do it is extreme.

The problem becomes that when you pass a stage and get Bronze or Sliver or even Gold is that you want to go back to get a higher rank even though you are not equipped to do so which means you grind away at the game burning yourself out. That is definitely what happened to me playing Bayoneta.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Adrock on January 09, 2017, 06:12:41 PM
but with how Car Fax Zero turned out...
I'm trying to figure out if this was intentional or just a shining example of auto-correct.

I'm not a huge Platinum Games fan. I'm not good enough at videogames to ever make the company's games look as cool as they're supposed to be. I've liked and bought a few of Platinum Games' titles (e.g. Madworld, The Wonderful 101, Bayonetta 1 and 2). It does a good job of world building, and I rather like the character of Bayonetta even if (and maybe because) she's so ridiculous.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 09, 2017, 06:15:36 PM
Nier Automata looks really good and the demo played well.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 09, 2017, 08:22:03 PM
It was intentional.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: nickmitch on January 09, 2017, 10:45:15 PM
Nintendo should have enough bread-and-butter type IPs that could finance the higher budget critical darlings.  That should push hardware sales, and if Nintendo can keep turning profits on hardware sales (as they strive to do, despite sensibilities) the net impact can be neutral.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 10, 2017, 05:22:26 PM
https://twitter.com/Wario64/status/818945492407025664 (https://twitter.com/Wario64/status/818945492407025664)

A LAN adapter. A LAN ADAPTER. aDZDJNRTRSTY5YJDFYGCHJDM,XDCGY KMOYU;T.IUYFKDTRSXYKLFYUIP©¥•ʼÖ

EDIT: https://twitter.com/Wario64/status/818950683902636032

A possible share button? Twitch/YouTube integration maybe? I hope so.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: NWR_insanolord on January 10, 2017, 05:55:12 PM
The thing's part handheld and Nintendo has never included a wired connection built-in, it was crazy to expect anything other than an adaptor for that.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Lemonade on January 10, 2017, 06:27:21 PM
It would have been nice for the dock to have LAN, but it would probably make problems un docking the switch while the lan is active.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Soren on January 10, 2017, 06:34:02 PM
The LAN adapter was always going to be on the dock, I just hope the thing has enough USB ports. I know it's a silly thing to nitpick (and I already have a Wii LAN adapter) but I'm just frustrated by this leak confirming what I already suspected.
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Evan_B on January 10, 2017, 07:07:11 PM
What, that the Switch's online matchmaking is going to suck?
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Oedo on January 10, 2017, 08:55:53 PM
Atlus has launched the website for the 25th anniversary of Shin Megami Tensei. (http://shin-megamitensei.jp/) It could easily be a coincidence and it makes sense to launch this kind of website very early in the year, of course, but the timing is still kinda interesting. Whether or not anything related to the series gets announced this week for Switch, the 25th anniversary logo seems to be hinting pretty strongly at Shin Megami Tensei V coming up in some capacity this year (which has me really excited).
Title: Re: Switch Rumors and Speculation Thread (Mighty Wii U to Switch Port Edition)
Post by: Oedo on January 11, 2017, 04:23:14 PM
Missed the Hori post earlier in the thread. If that leak is accurate, I hope the accessories are there for launch. I've been very pleased with the Hori screen protectors for 3DS and would like to put one on the Switch screen right out of the box. The arcade stick is interesting because it doesn't really make sense for Hori to release their $150 Real Arcade Pro model on Switch unless there's at least a couple of big fighting game coming out on the console this year. The possible candidates for launch are:

- Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3 (which is coming out on XB1 and PC in March... go figure)
- Guilty Gear Xrd -Revelator- (Arc System Works appears on the Switch partners list)
- BlazBlue: Chrono Phantasma Extend or Central Fiction (not sure if the latter is exclusive to PlayStation consoles but, again, Arc System Works)
- Tekken 7: Fated Retribution (I remember Harada made some comments a while ago that made it sound like he hadn't even gotten his hands on the console yet, but Bandai Namco is on the Switch partners list, so who knows)

And then there's Marvel vs. Capcom: Infinite coming later in the year. I would not buy that arcade stick if it's only compatible with Switch, and, unfortunately, that is likely the case given that there are separate models for PS4/PS3 and XB1/XB360. It's cool that these games might be coming to the console though.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Soren on January 12, 2017, 10:55:11 AM
Guys...we're almost there.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Soren on January 12, 2017, 11:21:20 AM
Switch Presentation Leaked...  ;)

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/C17eLTFWgAEm6PO.jpg)
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Khushrenada on January 12, 2017, 11:40:00 AM
Star Fox 64 Remastered, Super Smash Bros. Disagreement.  A couple funny titles on there. I like it.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: rlse9 on January 12, 2017, 11:47:43 AM
My prediction is that they announce NintenDogsCats Switch in which your pet is a dog when you're taking the game on the go but magically switches into a cat when the Switch is docked.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Shaymin on January 12, 2017, 02:35:52 PM
Getting a little ahead of ourselves for Ape Rule Fools, I think.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Evan_B on January 12, 2017, 02:52:38 PM
What a great thread title! It's so original!
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Khushrenada on January 12, 2017, 03:15:45 PM
Which reminds me, I'm going to lock this thread after tonight. I was going to do it after the first Switch reveal when the official Switch topic was created and I stickied that. This thread seemed to be dying out for a week back then but, before I locked it, people suddenly started posting in here again and discussing different rumors so I figured that since the Switch still wasn't fully revealed, I'd leave the topic alone for the time being. But a bunch of times people would post something in the Official Switch topic and then someone would post the same thing here and the conversation would split or mainly carry on in here. It's time to move on to the Official Switch thread. This one had a good run but all remaining rumors and news can start going there.

Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: KeyBilly on January 12, 2017, 04:02:06 PM
My prediction is that they announce NintenDogsCats Switch in which your pet is a dog when you're taking the game on the go but magically switches into a cat when the Switch is docked.

I actually really like the idea of a game changing up like this in the docked vs. undocked mode.  It seems likely that Nintendo will have some lighthearted games that use that concept.  Rotom is basically a Switch, so that would be a good place to do it.  It reminds me of Another Story for DS, which cleverly used a lot of the DS features for puzzle solving, including one that required closing the DS hinge.  That one stumped me for a while.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Soren on January 12, 2017, 07:21:48 PM
Walmart Canada listing the Switch at 399. So 299 USA? Uhhhhhhhh
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Evan_B on January 12, 2017, 07:30:10 PM
Oh hey, Nintendo being stupid about pricing their console? Surprise, surprise.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Agent-X- on January 12, 2017, 10:09:00 PM
Less than an hour to go.
Title: Re: Switchmas Eve Rumors and Speculations Thread
Post by: Khushrenada on January 13, 2017, 12:09:59 AM
This thread is over. Take your Switch complaints to the Official Thread here:

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/forums/index.php?topic=50737.0