Gaming Forums => Nintendo Gaming => Topic started by: UncleBob on September 19, 2012, 11:28:40 PM
Title: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 19, 2012, 11:28:40 PM
So, while we all hold our breath waiting for TJ to come forth with his reliable source for his statements regarding the relationship between Amazon and Nintendo, Kotaku posted a little article today worth reading.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: MrPhishfood on September 19, 2012, 11:40:06 PM
I posted this in another thread:
Nintendo has to deal with a lot of stuff being both a publisher and a console manufacturer. If you live in the UK and went inside a GAME (http://www.game.co.uk/) store did you ever notice how Nintendo products are always near the back of the store or some hidden away corner?
This is because Nintendo refuses to pay GAME for "premium" space, they have a weird antagonistic business relationship with each other. When GAME were starting to go bankrupt Nintendo were the first to refuse them stock of new games because they knew GAME wouldn't be able to pay for them at a later date, then Capcom did the same.
Here's how I imagine it
Nintendo: We're launching a new console and I was thinking if we could make a deal, I'll pay you x amount of money and for x amount of time you give preferential treatment by helping advertise the Wii U on your website. Amazon: Everyones products get equal treatment, I'm sorry we can't cut a deal Nintendo: So we can't work anything out? At all? Amazon: Nope Nintendo: Well if you're not going to help me sell the Wii U then you're not going to sell any of my stuff. NEVER EVER EVER!! and your website sucks because its trying to recommend me anger management books when I obviously don't need them
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 19, 2012, 11:43:11 PM
I seriously doubt that's the case - Historically, Nintendo isn't the type of company to give moneyhats for special treatment.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: TJ Spyke on September 19, 2012, 11:53:48 PM
When I have time to find the links, I will post them. But apparently it is Amazon who is refusing to buy hardware from Nintendo (not Nintendo refusing to let them) because Amazon wanted the same treatment that Walmart gets (but no other retailer does).
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: rlse9 on September 19, 2012, 11:59:54 PM
There was an article on another site about this a couple days ago. Basically it said that Amazon was frustrated by the high number of returns that they were getting with the 3DS and how Nintendo was handling it, the fact that Amazon wanted to lower the price when the 3DS wasn't selling and Nintendo wouldn't let them, then let Wal-Mart reduce the price before anywhere else could, and finally because Amazon wanted the same deal Wal-Mart gets, as was mentioned by TJ.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Mop it up on September 20, 2012, 12:00:38 AM
The blue 3DS XL was up for sale by Amazon the other day, so the feud may be ending soon. I hope it's over by the holidays, Amazon usually has good deals and I want to get a 3DS XL this holiday.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Ceric on September 20, 2012, 09:45:53 AM
I know how popular Amazon is but, I seriously doubt they buy as much Product from Nintendo as Walmart. We're talking the good and the bad.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Do_What on September 20, 2012, 10:29:09 AM
Amazon only sells Nintendo stuff through third party retailers and even then it's always above MSRP. It's really frustrating.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Chozo Ghost on September 20, 2012, 10:30:43 AM
Is there any other online retailer besides amazon that will offer Wii U systems? The advantage of buying online is you don't have to pay sales tax, which is a considerable amount on something that costs $350.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 20, 2012, 10:34:42 AM
No product seller is gouing to give anyone the deals they are basically forced to give Wal Mart. Wal Mart is tolerated because sellers have to do business with them. Those deals are not going to be repeated. Amazon is dreaming.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 20, 2012, 10:46:55 AM
Is there any other online retailer besides amazon that will offer Wii U systems? The advantage of buying online is you don't have to pay sales tax, which is a considerable amount on something that costs $350.
"Don't have to pay sales tax" is generally relative to how much you care about following the law. Most states that charge a sales tax require you to pay sales tax on internet purchases if the retailer doesn't collect them at POS.
I know how popular Amazon is but, I seriously doubt they buy as much Product from Nintendo as Walmart. We're talking the good and the bad.
Beyond that, I have serious doubts that if Nintendo even cuts Walmart some super-special deal that Amazon would even remotely know the details. You can be sure that if any such deal is in place, Nintendo isn't giving out that information (to prevent others from trying to get the same deal) and Walmart isn't giving out that information (because Walmart would never give up such information regarding their business advantages).*
*Disclaimer: Spoken as a member of the general public with some common sense, not as an employee of any business with super-top-secret information.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: leahsdad on September 20, 2012, 12:36:38 PM
Is there any other online retailer besides amazon that will offer Wii U systems? The advantage of buying online is you don't have to pay sales tax, which is a considerable amount on something that costs $350.
"Don't have to pay sales tax" is generally relative to how much you care about following the law. Most states that charge a sales tax require you to pay sales tax on internet purchases if the retailer doesn't collect them at POS.
Especially in California, where Amazon had never directly charged sale tax for years, meaning that I saved about $25 when I bought my ambassador 3DS from amazon at launch.
Unfortunately, this past Saturday Amazon started to charge sales tax to California customers as a part of a deal they negotiated with the state of California a year ago. This was apparently such a big deal that it was on all the local news, including NPR.
If you live in a state that Amazon doesn't charge sales tax in yet, I wouldn't bank on that continuing ad infinitum. Amazon is an awfully big target, and state governments are gunning for that revenue.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Ian Sane on September 20, 2012, 01:04:25 PM
Amazon is a big enough fish in online retail that I don't think it's worth Nintendo's while to feud with them. It would look really bad if MS and Sony products were on Amazon but not Nintendo. I think giving Amazon the "Walmart deal" is not really feasible but they should play nice to the best they can.
I think it's sad that Nintendo's reputation for dealing with any outside company is so poor that I immediately assume this is their fault.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Ceric on September 20, 2012, 02:06:29 PM
At this point Nintendo doesn't need to play nice with Wii U. Unlike more Niche products Nintendo Systems and Games are widely available. You be hard press to find someone in the United States that couldn't find someone who had the ability to sell them a Nintendo System or game in 100 miles. I think it more of a Blemish on Amazon not to have Nintendo Products then Nintendo to not be on Amazon.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Chozo Ghost on September 20, 2012, 02:07:53 PM
I think every state is going to make online sales tax mandatory at some point in the near future. But until then those of us who can take advantage of it might as well do so while we can. 7% sales tax on a $350 is a considerable amount. Not quite enough for a new game, but over half way there. If you can save that why wouldn't you?
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 20, 2012, 03:36:22 PM
I think every state is going to make online sales tax mandatory at some point in the near future. But until then those of us who can take advantage of it might as well do so while we can. 7% sales tax on a $350 is a considerable amount. Not quite enough for a new game, but over half way there. If you can save that why wouldn't you?
Can you give me an example of a state that has a retail sales tax and doesn't require residents to pay in on their online retail purchases?
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Stoeff.at on September 20, 2012, 05:28:09 PM
Nintendo has to deal with a lot of stuff being both a publisher and a console manufacturer. If you live in the UK and went inside a GAME (http://www.game.co.uk/) store did you ever notice how Nintendo products are always near the back of the store or some hidden away corner?
This is because Nintendo refuses to pay GAME for "premium" space, they have a weird antagonistic business relationship with each other. When GAME were starting to go bankrupt Nintendo were the first to refuse them stock of new games because they knew GAME wouldn't be able to pay for them at a later date, then Capcom did the same.
Here's how I imagine it
Nintendo: We're launching a new console and I was thinking if we could make a deal, I'll pay you x amount of money and for x amount of time you give preferential treatment by helping advertise the Wii U on your website. Amazon: Everyones products get equal treatment, I'm sorry we can't cut a deal Nintendo: So we can't work anything out? At all? Amazon: Nope Nintendo: Well if you're not going to help me sell the Wii U then you're not going to sell any of my stuff. NEVER EVER EVER!! and your website sucks because its trying to recommend me anger management books when I obviously don't need them
quality
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: TJ Spyke on September 20, 2012, 05:53:15 PM
Kind of off topic but related to Amazon and Walmart, Walmart announced today that they will stop selling the Kindle: http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-09-20/amazon-falls-after-wal-mart-plans-to-stop-sellling-kindle
Target announced the same thing back in May. Amazon does make more money when selling the Kindle online, but this will still hurt sales.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: MrPhishfood on September 20, 2012, 05:55:34 PM
You think the problem may actually be between Walmart and Amazon with Nintendo being caught in the crossfire?
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: ThePerm on September 20, 2012, 06:27:24 PM
Fun quazi-fact, the word Amazon means "no breasts", A = not having, Mazos = boobs, or at least thats the folk etymology
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Shaymin on September 20, 2012, 06:27:43 PM
There's no relation to the two situations. Walmart doesn't want to sell something that's basically an extension of Amazon.com.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: TJ Spyke on September 20, 2012, 06:33:38 PM
They did for a long time. And it makes me think that it's a matter of time before they stop selling stuff like iTunes gift cards.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: ShyGuy on September 20, 2012, 10:09:32 PM
I remember reading somewhere that the Amazon women warriors would chop off one of their breasts because it got in the way when they drew a bow. Crazy!
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Adrock on September 20, 2012, 10:44:06 PM
I heard that too. That's like slapping God across the face for giving you a beautiful gift.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: alegoicoe on September 21, 2012, 12:06:58 AM
F*UCK AMAZON!!!
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Chozo Ghost on September 21, 2012, 02:58:44 AM
Fun quazi-fact, the word Amazon means "no breasts", A = not having, Mazos = boobs, or at least thats the folk etymology
That makes sense because I have read that the Amazons would cut off one or both of their breasts so that it wouldn't get in the way when they used bows and arrows.
I looked it up. The Greek word for breasts is Mastos. So I can see how the word Amastos could have evolved into Amazon over the centuries.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/masto-
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Plugabugz on September 21, 2012, 03:34:58 AM
I'm going to look at it from a consumer's perspective.
Amazon USA simply does not want your money. The contracted relationship for supply of goods rests with Amazon and not Nintendo. If they do not want to supply it then, they lose out. I go elsewhere. Plenty other places on the internets.
The point for me is moot as Amazon UK is selling it, however. Premium is £300.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 21, 2012, 07:27:59 AM
I think every state is going to make online sales tax mandatory at some point in the near future. But until then those of us who can take advantage of it might as well do so while we can. 7% sales tax on a $350 is a considerable amount. Not quite enough for a new game, but over half way there. If you can save that why wouldn't you?
You know, I thought we had this entire conversation before - but I was on my cell and couldn't look it up at the time...
I think every state is going to make online sales tax mandatory at some point in the near future. But until then those of us who can take advantage of it might as well do so while we can. 7% sales tax on a $350 is a considerable amount. Not quite enough for a new game, but over half way there. If you can save that why wouldn't you?
You know, I thought we had this entire conversation before - but I was on my cell and couldn't look it up at the time...
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 21, 2012, 08:22:42 AM
A.) Ignorance of the law is no excuse. B.) I gave you the web link directly to the Michigan state government's website where they discuss it nearly a year ago, so you have no excuse not to know.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Adrock on September 21, 2012, 08:42:34 AM
I read Chozo's post as a joke response like the way little kids act when being scolded by their mom. Even if that wasn't his intent, it still gave me a slight chuckle.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Kairon on September 21, 2012, 11:57:18 AM
I'm going to look at it from a consumer's perspective.
Amazon USA simply does not want your money. The contracted relationship for supply of goods rests with Amazon and not Nintendo. If they do not want to supply it then, they lose out. I go elsewhere. Plenty other places on the internets.
I think this is how I feel about it. Amazon, you taught me that I have options as to where I can buy things that I want/need. I am going to exercise those options this fall.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Chozo Ghost on September 21, 2012, 01:57:50 PM
A.) Ignorance of the law is no excuse. B.) I gave you the web link directly to the Michigan state government's website where they discuss it nearly a year ago, so you have no excuse not to know.
If it really is the law you need to blame Amazon for not enforcing it. As a consumer its not my responsibility to figure that out. If the vender isn't charging it, then I'm not paying it. Simple as that.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 21, 2012, 02:16:15 PM
A.) Ignorance of the law is no excuse. B.) I gave you the web link directly to the Michigan state government's website where they discuss it nearly a year ago, so you have no excuse not to know.
If it really is the law you need to blame Amazon for not enforcing it. As a consumer its not my responsibility to figure that out. If the vender isn't charging it, then I'm not paying it. Simple as that.
It's not Amazon's place to do it. It's your place to remit your taxes for purchases made out of state. You have the option to not make purchases out of state *or* move to a state that doesn't have this law.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Ian Sane on September 21, 2012, 03:06:35 PM
I'm sure there is absolutely no person in the entire United States, bureaucrats and politicians included, who makes a specific effort to pay taxes for out of state purchases or any personal transaction like buying something on Craig's list or eBay. Does anyone here calling Chozo out actually do that themselves?
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Chozo Ghost on September 21, 2012, 03:54:34 PM
So if I buy something at a garage sale or flea market I got to pay taxes on that?
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: UncleBob on September 21, 2012, 04:10:11 PM
I'm sure there is absolutely no person in the entire United States, bureaucrats and politicians included, who makes a specific effort to pay taxes for out of state purchases or any personal transaction like buying something on Craig's list or eBay. Does anyone here calling Chozo out actually do that themselves?
Two years ago, the state of Illinois introduced a line on the income tax form and and a handy chart for estimating your tax liability for internet purchases. I've taken the standard cut each year which is probably more than I actually owe.
tl;dr: Yes.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 21, 2012, 04:13:47 PM
So if I buy something at a garage sale or flea market I got to pay taxes on that?
Don't think so. Tax on first sale only. Used stuff is exempted
in Canada, anyway
Yup. I'm no tax advisor and your laws my vary, but typically, sales tax is collected on new goods and services.
Think of it this way - if I buy a game at Walmart - I've paid tax on it. If I sell the game to you and you had to pay tax on it too, it'd get double taxed. That's why you can get a special tax exempt status - for example, if my wife comes in to Walmart to buy pickles for their restaruant, they get them tax free, then collect the tax when they resell to the customers. But if she comes in for a bottle of bleach for cleaning (and not for resale), she has to pay tax on it.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: ejamer on September 21, 2012, 04:46:33 PM
So if I buy something at a garage sale or flea market I got to pay taxes on that?
Before, I thought you were trolling Uncle Bob. This question is dumb enough that now I'm no longer sure... ;)
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: TJ Spyke on September 21, 2012, 04:55:27 PM
Retailers still charge sales tax on used games. For example, you buy a used game from GameStop and they charge sales tax just like they would if you bought a new game.
Ian, I don't have a choice. New York started charging sales tax for online purchases a few years ago.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Ian Sane on September 21, 2012, 05:04:06 PM
So if I buy something at a garage sale or flea market I got to pay taxes on that?
Don't think so. Tax on first sale only. Used stuff is exempted
in Canada, anyway
In Canada I pay tax on used videogames all the time. Unless every store I buy from is ripping me off. I buy used records on a regular basis as well and my brother buys used old action figures and, again, we're charged sales tax.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: Fatty The Hutt on September 21, 2012, 05:44:02 PM
So if I buy something at a garage sale or flea market I got to pay taxes on that?
Don't think so. Tax on first sale only. Used stuff is exempted
in Canada, anyway
In Canada I pay tax on used videogames all the time. Unless every store I buy from is ripping me off. I buy used records on a regular basis as well and my brother buys used old action figures and, again, we're charged sales tax.
Hmm, I think you're right, Ian. I'll have to check my receipts. Unless its just PST you're being charged and not GST (which is what I was thinking about)? Or th Harmonized Sales tax? Maybe if your retail business is selling used products, you are caught by the tax laws? I am still pretty sure that for a private used sale, there is not GST (like if you sell your car). Maybe there's a monetary threshold of sales that if you exceed it, you're caught by the tax laws? Needless to say, I do not fully understand it.
Title: Re: Nintendo & Amazon
Post by: TJ Spyke on September 21, 2012, 05:49:17 PM
I found this on the website of the Pennsylvania Department of Revenue: I am having a yard sale. Should I apply for a Sales Tax license? If your yard sale qualifies as an isolated sale, you do not need a license and do not need to collect sales tax. An isolated sale is an infrequent sale of tangible property by someone who is not in the business of selling that property and the sale does not reoccur.
However, if you take taxable items to a flea market or someplace where you are competing with other vendors, then you will need to collect Sales Tax and you therefore need to apply for a Sales Tax license.
