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NWR Interactive => TalkBack => Topic started by: Traveller on June 05, 2012, 02:49:14 PM

Title: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Traveller on June 05, 2012, 02:49:14 PM

Two player support comes at a cost.

http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/news/30489

Nintendo posted a Twitter update about playing with multiple Wii U GamePads, stating that for games that utilize two controllers will experience a drop in framerate. The Wii U will lower the framerate to at least 30fps. Apparently switching one off will smoothly transition the framerate back to normal.

Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: NeoThunder on June 05, 2012, 03:20:06 PM
I would have thought the support for multiple gamepads was a communication limitation instead of a hardware processing power limitation.  I would think it would have been better to have the gamepads have chips and processors to process some of that data so it wasn't so much work for the console.
Have they stated how the Gamepad connects to the WiiU, is it blutooth like wii remotes?
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Mop it up on June 05, 2012, 03:45:29 PM
I think they said something a while back about how allowing two Game Pads would require dropping the framerate, so this isn't surprising to me.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Adrock on June 05, 2012, 03:52:16 PM
As long as the games are still playable, this shouldn't be a problem. It's important that it's there. As developers become more comfortable with the hardware, they'll be able to push this functionality.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: nhaines on June 05, 2012, 04:32:16 PM
Wireless bandwidth is *extremely* limited.  You couldn't get enough raw data to the controllers (textures, geometry, shader information) fast enough for the controllers to process it, and then of course the controllers couldn't even begin to process it until all information had been transmitted.  Plus, then you spend $100 in CPU and GPU technology in the controllers.

You can still have the same bandwidth to two controllers as you do with one controller.  It's like a three-way phone call: you have an extra person on the line but since only one person can talk at once you can't send twice as much information just because there's an extra person.  (You can multicast identical video to both controllers at once, but if each controller needs different viewpoints then you have to send each stream separately and can only send half as much data to each controller.)

Let's not forget that Wii-U gamepads are controllers first and foremost and will also be optimized to send controller input as efficiently as possible, which means you can't push the wireless communication to the limits like you could if they were display-only devices.  Remember, one of the best things about the Nintendo Wavebird controllers was that they were pretty much the first RF wireless console controllers that didn't have any lag to speak of, which made them so great.  ;D And the Wii will still have Wii-U controllers to communicate with at the same time.

This doesn't mean there's not still a hardware processing power limitation--it's probably still a tricky job.  But it just means that there's both that plus the wireless communication limitation.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Ceric on June 05, 2012, 04:35:09 PM
I have to agree with Nhaines.  With it dropping a clean 30fps means to mean that half the bandwidth is going to the other Gamepad.  Not a horsepower thing at all.  Just not enough lanes on the highway and the FCC wouldn't give them more.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Shorty McNostril on June 05, 2012, 07:55:05 PM
As long as its a solid 30fps then this is a more than acceptable trade off.  There is nothing wrong with a solid 30fps.  If it jumps around, then it will be a bit ordinary. Lock it at a reduced frame rate and all will be well.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: ThePerm on June 05, 2012, 08:30:41 PM
i dont really want to use the pads so much to display 3d content, i just want them used to serve gameplay. The usual cited use for them is in sports games, but i can imagine 2 players where they both display spells and stuff as a menu.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: BlackNMild2k1 on June 06, 2012, 02:54:05 AM
Quote from: NeoThunder on June 05, 2012, 03:20:06 PM
Have they stated how the Gamepad connects to the WiiU, is it blutooth like wii remotes?

I believe the video is through a wireless N channel, and the button information is through bluetooth like before.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Adrock on June 06, 2012, 07:24:29 AM
Will that affect online performance? I wish Nintendo included an Ethernet port (unless they did already and I didn't get the memo). I wonder why they're so against it.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Chozo Ghost on June 06, 2012, 07:58:10 AM
Quote from: Adrock on June 06, 2012, 07:24:29 AM
Will that affect online performance? I wish Nintendo included an Ethernet port (unless they did already and I didn't get the memo). I wonder why they're so against it.

My guess is they just figured WiFi was "good enough", and that they could shave off the 2 bucks or whatever it would have cost them to slap an ethernet port on.
Title: Re: Wii U Frame Rate Drops When Using Multiple GamePads
Post by: Adrock on June 06, 2012, 08:32:26 AM
At the same time, wasn't Nintendo selling a 1st party USB enabled LAN adapter? That would cost them more and it's infinitely less convenient for everyone. The "good enough" explanation falls apart because it's actually bad for everyone, even and especially Nintendo. I don't get it.