NWR Interactive => Podcast Discussion => Topic started by: Jonnyboy117 on April 29, 2011, 07:58:10 PM
Title: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on April 29, 2011, 07:58:10 PM
*Perfect Dark has now appeared in three polls, so this is its final chance for RetroActive selection.
**Beyond Good & Evil HD will be available on PSN sometime in May. We will schedule RetroActive around its release, if necessary.
***Sands of Time HD is available as part of a disc trilogy collection in North America, while the game is an individual PSN download in Europe.
All of these games are available in two distinct versions: an original release (which included a Nintendo platform) and a recent remake on a different platform. Either version is completely valid for the RetroActive discussion -- we're hoping for some interesting comparisons! And the wide variety of platforms should hopefully allow more people to participate.
Note that there are only four games in this poll. We considered some options for the fifth slot, but none seemed to fit. Clash of Heroes is too recent; Conker is too difficult to acquire on N64, and the Xbox version is no longer functional online. I almost included Animal Crossing as a franchise, but that seemed too cynical.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: TalesOfFan on April 29, 2011, 08:20:54 PM
I was kind of hoping for Blaster Master and Blaster Master Overdrive, but the choices are still pretty interesting. Especially Perfect Dark, since I have been wanting to try that for awhile now.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jet Pilot on April 29, 2011, 08:47:12 PM
I went for Beyond Good & Evil for several reasons.
First, it just sounds like an interesting game.
Second, it's available for the most amount of platforms and therefore the most accessible. Being available on the download services and the GameCube as well, it is affordable and playable on all 3 current generation consoles. The more people that have access to the game the bigger the discussion and the better the RetoActive episode.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 29, 2011, 08:55:15 PM
Beyond Good and Evil and Prince of Persia are two games that people rave about that I've never played, so they'd be good choices. On the other hand, Perfect Dark is Perfect Dark, so that's what I voted for.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: broodwars on April 29, 2011, 08:59:57 PM
You really don't want to play the PSN/PS3 disc version of Sands of Time. It's a bit of a buggy mess, and the game has aged very poorly in that version (which I think is based on the PS2 version, the worst version of that game). So for me that just leaves Beyond Good & Evil and Perfect Dark, games I thought were enjoyable in their own rights but still overrated (for different reasons). Well, I really don't want to listen to yet another podcast gushing about Beyond Good & Evil, so I guess I'll go with Perfect Dark (it's its last chance, anyway).
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Ceric on April 29, 2011, 11:06:56 PM
I never played Perfect Dark but, I don't know where my N64 is and it need to be upgraded and get the cart. Never played through Banjo-Tooie because I didn't like the store Demo. Prince of Persia was good, I forget how far I got in it. I think I beat it but it was a Gamefly rental. Beyond Good and Evil Vudu let me borrow and I got mostly through it and then returned it. I'm curious about the HD version and I do have a PS3. If I had a 360 or my N64 and the xpac I go with Perfect Dark but, thats not the case.
You know what forget it. I'll still vote Perfect Dark so, I can hear more about it.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: gojira on April 29, 2011, 11:13:35 PM
I went with Banjo Tooie mostly because it's the only game on the list I haven't played. I also purchased the Beyond Good and Evil & Perfect Dark HD remakes or whatever you want to call them. And I don't think either game is all that good anymore.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: lolmonade on April 30, 2011, 01:32:43 AM
Have to go with Perfect Dark, if just to see if my nostalgia goggles have lied to me again.
I remember actually playing this game a lot more than Goldeneye. Split screen with bots and making a makeshift divide for the TV made out of cardboard to prevent screen-watchers! Look forward to the discussion either way.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Killer_Man_Jaro on April 30, 2011, 03:03:20 AM
I suppose I'll vote for Perfect Dark. Honestly, I found this line-up to be pretty underwhelming, and am kind of surprised that you couldn't fill that 5th spot on the poll. I'm not saying you couldn't have a good discussion about whatever wins, but... I dunno, it feels like there was more potential with this 'originals & remakes' idea. For the record, some of my suggestions might have been:
* Mega Man (NES/Wii) and Mega Man: Powered Up (PSP) -- this would be the most ripe for conversation, in my view * Final Fantasy II (SNES) and Final Fantasy IV (DS) * Dragon Warrior IV (NES) and Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen (DS) * Pikmin (GCN) and New Play Control! Pikmin (Wii)
But anyway, beggars can't be choosers, so I'll shut up now.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: KeyBilly on April 30, 2011, 11:20:32 AM
Banjo-Tooie for me. I was considering buying that after playing the demo a long time ago, but never did. Maybe this will motivate me to go for it. I had the other games originally and didn't like them a lot, though Perfect Dark was good as a tech demo.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Shaymin on April 30, 2011, 11:38:46 AM
The only two of these I have reasonable access to are Prince of Persia and BG&E, which would be interesting but I'd probably tune out because another podcast I listen to recently just did it.
So I went with Sands of Time. Need an excuse to play it again.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on April 30, 2011, 03:52:37 PM
KMJ, we may revisit this theme sometime. Two of your suggestions are RPGs, which we specifically avoided because they tend to dominate voting and are hard to play through in a reasonable amount of time for the show schedule. Mega Man is a good idea, although that is by far my least favorite game in the whole series. I love Pikmin, but does the "remake" really add much? The controls were fine in the first place, and I don't think there are any other differences.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Killer_Man_Jaro on April 30, 2011, 04:59:47 PM
KMJ, we may revisit this theme sometime. Two of your suggestions are RPGs, which we specifically avoided because they tend to dominate voting and are hard to play through in a reasonable amount of time for the show schedule. Mega Man is a good idea, although that is by far my least favorite game in the whole series. I love Pikmin, but does the "remake" really add much? The controls were fine in the first place, and I don't think there are any other differences.
True, very true. I just had it in my mind that all of the nominations had already been discussed a fair bit, and at least two of them got substantial time in the Game of the Decade feature, as I recall. But you've made good reasoning and I can't really argue against it.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Halbred on April 30, 2011, 05:55:06 PM
KMJ, we may revisit this theme sometime. Two of your suggestions are RPGs, which we specifically avoided because they tend to dominate voting and are hard to play through in a reasonable amount of time for the show schedule. Mega Man is a good idea, although that is by far my least favorite game in the whole series. I love Pikmin, but does the "remake" really add much? The controls were fine in the first place, and I don't think there are any other differences.
*gawks* How do you not like Powered Up? It's so...it's so good! In some ways, I like it more than Maverick Hunter X! Certainly has more replay value. And the level editor!!!
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Mop it up on April 30, 2011, 06:18:21 PM
Two of these I own and the other two I wouldn't mind getting because I've heard mostly positive things about them and have wanted to try them. So I don't mind much what gets picked, but I voted for Perfect Dark since I still think it's the most well-crafted shooter to date even with its technical limitations.
* Dragon Warrior IV (NES) and Dragon Quest IV: Chapters of the Chosen (DS)
The NES game is kind of rare, isn't on the Wii VC, and was never released in PAL territories. Selecting it for RetroActive would encourage the use of an emulator, which I don't think is a good idea. Not bad choices though, I'd add this one too: Metroid (NES, GCN, GBA, VC) vs Metroid Zero Mission (GBA)
I love Pikmin, but does the "remake" really add much? The controls were fine in the first place, and I don't think there are any other differences.
The Wii version also has the ability to travel back to any previous day and redo things from there, although I don't think that's a significant enough change to call it a remake.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Traveller on April 30, 2011, 07:15:02 PM
Perfect Dark was my vote. Its a great game. Yes shooters have evolved a bit since then, but what it loses in cinematic set-pieces, I think it gains much more in freedom to explore levels and is far less of a linear experience.
Anyone want to play some PD multi later on live?
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Halbred on April 30, 2011, 07:44:04 PM
If Perfect Dark wins--and it looks like it's going to--I'll have to get in on XBLA. I've been looking for an excuse to get it.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: gojira on April 30, 2011, 08:52:31 PM
I love Pikmin, but does the "remake" really add much? The controls were fine in the first place, and I don't think there are any other differences.
I think the pointer controls vastly improve the game. But then again I generally dislike controlling an onscreen cursor with an analog stick.
Also it's not like Beyond Good and Evil HD added anything other than achievements. The same goes for the campaign in the Perfect Dark remake. So I would say Pikmin on Wii has a much more fundamental change over the original version than the games chosen.
I'm not one for online multiplayer (with the exception of last year's Transformers game). But if Perfect Dark did win, it would be interesting playing some games with everyone here.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on May 01, 2011, 12:39:27 AM
Zach, I would definitely try Powered Up if I ever get a PSP. Everyone says good things about it. The original Mega Man, however, is really not much fun. It was innovative and provided a baseline for improvement later in the series, and that's about it.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Killer_Man_Jaro on May 01, 2011, 02:23:59 AM
The original Mega Man, however, is really not much fun. It was innovative and provided a baseline for improvement later in the series, and that's about it.
Crazy talk, crazy talk!
Although I might just be saying this because the 1st Mega Man is the only game in the series i've been able to make substantial progress on. Anyone have a noob friendly megaman that I could cut my teeth with and then upgrade from? I have the mega man collection for gamecube.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on May 01, 2011, 12:34:22 PM
Mega Man 2 is the easiest overall. Find an E-tank (Flash Man's stage is good for that), then use it to beat Metal Man. You'll get the Metal Blade, which wrecks everything in the game, fires in eight directions, and uses almost no weapon energy.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Mop it up on May 01, 2011, 03:16:01 PM
The original Mega Man may be a little rough around the edges, but it still contains the coolest weapon of the series with Guts Man's weapon. The Magnet Beam is also a neat item that's a little more clever than every other tool the series has introduced.
As for which Mega Man game is good to start with, probably not the original game. Personally I find it to be the most difficult of the series, and it's the only one of the ten which I never did beat. Mega Man 2 is fairly easy on the "Normal" setting, which is actually an easier version of the game created for its North American release. However, I believe the Mega Man Anniversary Collection has an "Easy" setting that can apply to all the games, and it kind of screws with Mega Man 2 in such a way that it isn't faithful to the original and still slightly tougher than the NES version.
For me, I'd go with Mega Man 5 or 6 as I find them a little more forgiving than the previous games. The charge shot helps a lot in reducing the difficulty, as does the slide move that the first two games lack. The robot master patterns are also more simplistic, so you don't have to deal with things like the impossible-to-dodge tornadoes that Air Man fires in Mega Man 2. Furthermore, the Wily stages in Mega Man 2 can be rather tricky if you don't know what to do, and I can see people giving up in frustration on the third stage's boss encounter after running out of the required weapon's energy.
Find an E-tank (Flash Man's stage is good for that), then use it to beat Metal Man. You'll get the Metal Blade, which wrecks everything in the game, fires in eight directions, and uses almost no weapon energy.
Metal Man's stage has two E-tanks, so there is no reason to visit another stage first.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: happyastoria on May 01, 2011, 09:23:05 PM
I vote for Perfect Dark just so you guys can have a conversation about how some games don't age well.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Traveller on May 01, 2011, 10:21:19 PM
I don't think that's true, the game design is different, but is definitely still playable.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: gojira on May 02, 2011, 12:31:33 AM
Mega Man 2 is the easiest overall. Find an E-tank (Flash Man's stage is good for that), then use it to beat Metal Man. You'll get the Metal Blade, which wrecks everything in the game, fires in eight directions, and uses almost no weapon energy.
Wow, an original Mega Man I might actually be able to beat.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: NWR_insanolord on May 02, 2011, 11:04:34 AM
I vote for Perfect Dark just so you guys can have a conversation about how some games don't age well.
I think Perfect Dark has aged remarkably well for a first-person shooter.
EDIT: And by that I mean the Xbox Live Arcade version. The N64 version is probably unplayable today. Still, it's amazing that fixing the framerate and adding online play turns it into something, in my opinion, on the same level as shooters a decade newer.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Mop it up on May 02, 2011, 06:14:52 PM
Perfect Dark has a few issues that have become more pronounced from age, but I'd have to protest the argument that it's unplayable. I'll save that for if the game gets picked, which is looking likely.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: viciouskillersquirrel on May 02, 2011, 11:44:15 PM
I voted for BG&E. I keep hearing about how it's a great Zelda-like. Also I think it's easily the most available to people as it's on the most platforms.
By the way, it's available for download on Steam, so there's really no excuse to not play it if it gets chosen.
EDIT: Also, I have zero interest in shooters.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: SEAL PUP85 on May 03, 2011, 12:50:51 AM
PERFECT DARK!!!! I remember reading about this in Game Informer, and it was the best looking game I had ever seen at the time. I am playing through it now on XBox and although it doesn't do much good to compare it to recent shooters, I must say it brings back good memories. I suspect it is one of those games you appreciate if you were around to play it when it came out. Anyway, just my two cents.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Traveller on May 03, 2011, 06:12:43 AM
I voted for BG&E. I keep hearing about how it's a great Zelda-like. Also I think it's easily the most available to people as it's on the most platforms.
By the way, it's available for download on Steam, so there's really no excuse to not play it if it gets chosen.
EDIT: Also, I have zero interest in shooters.
I think BG&E is pretty over-rated by the internet. I played it when it released, and while I enjoyed it, thought it was merely an average game.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: TheYoungerPlumber on May 03, 2011, 10:38:44 PM
Hmmm, I've played all of these except BG&E, but the recent discussions of BG&E and its stealthy aspects lead me to think I wouldn't like it.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Ceric on May 04, 2011, 09:45:47 AM
Hmmm, I've played all of these except BG&E, but the recent discussions of BG&E and its stealthy aspects lead me to think I wouldn't like it.
But in most cases, TYP, you can kill the guards even after they've seen you. Things do get tougher later in the game, though, what with the insta-kill lasers.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: TheYoungerPlumber on May 05, 2011, 02:09:40 AM
Hmmm, I've played all of these except BG&E, but the recent discussions of BG&E and its stealthy aspects lead me to think I wouldn't like it.
The Stealth is like the Stealth in the Zelda Series and not say MGS which is the kind of stealth I hate.
I hate the stealth in Zelda games, too. In fact, I kind of hate them more than what I sampled in MGS: The Twin Snakes.
Yeah, then you'll hate this game. The photo aspect is cool so if you reallly loved Pokemon Snap you might get over the stealth, maybe.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Da Jarvis on May 05, 2011, 09:08:27 PM
Beyond Good and Evil HD... how perfect xD. My Xbox DVD Drive had just broke a week ago, and this gives me a great excuss to finally pick up the HD Remake and test it out :)
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: LittleIrves on May 06, 2011, 07:16:13 PM
I voted BG & E, just to see what the fuss was about. Quick Question: I generally like playing the original versions of games over"upgraded" remakes, especially if I haven't played it before. But is there a good reason to download the XBLA version over finding a copy for Gamecube? And the increased graphical fidelity won't play into it too much, since I'm still using my Standard Def TV set. (Which, text aside, still allows those 360 games to look pretty good.)
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on May 07, 2011, 01:14:13 AM
This varies for each of the nominated games, but BG&E HD is a very straight remake other than the graphical upgrade. There are some very minor control tweaks to account for the modern controllers.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: adadad on May 07, 2011, 07:56:34 AM
I have to agree that Beyond Good and Evil is overrated. It's still a very good game, and I'd recommend it to most people (stealth haters aside), but for me it's not in the same league as Zelda or Okami. The hoverboat/craft thing you fly around the overworld is good fun though. The story is well told too, I just don't think the core gameplay is particularly great. Plus I found the length of the game and size of the world to be slightly underwhelming. I wish Michel Ancel would make a new Rayman platformer, BG&E has a few parts that are reminiscent (mostly in the environments) of Rayman 2.
Anyway, my vote goes to Perfect Dark. I got stuck on a mission several months ago and I need an excuse to get back to it, because up until that point I'd found the missions pretty decent. And considering I've unlocked the 007 difficulty mode on Goldeneye it's frankly pitiful that I haven't even finished Perfect Dark on the easiest difficulty.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on May 07, 2011, 01:17:00 PM
Ancel is working on a new 2D platformer called Rayman Origins. It was shown at Ubisoft's E3 press conference last week, so it should be out soon. I think it is planned for XBLA, PSN, Steam, and maaaaaaaaybe WiiWare (probably not).
EDIT: Sorry, I just saw info from Game Informer saying that it has been changed to a retail release on PS3 and 360.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: adadad on May 07, 2011, 09:16:50 PM
Ancel is working on a new 2D platformer called Rayman Origins. It was shown at Ubisoft's E3 press conference last week, so it should be out soon. I think it is planned for XBLA, PSN, Steam, and maaaaaaaaybe WiiWare (probably not).
EDIT: Sorry, I just saw info from Game Informer saying that it has been changed to a retail release on PS3 and 360.
Damn, that's too bad, as I only have access to a PS1, N64 and PC...occasionally see a Wii. Never heard of the PS3 or 360. It's just a random jumble of letters and numbers to me. I'll sit tight - I expect they'll announce a PS1 port soon. Some things are inevitable.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Stardust on May 08, 2011, 06:51:05 PM
i saw perfect dark across my xbla screen and went "hmm, looks cool. I'm too lazy to buy it though." then the last retro active came up and I saw it as a candidate and was like, "HEY! I CAN ACTUALLY JOIN THEIR CONVERSATION!" Sadly no. lol, but hopefully Perfect Dark wins this round, cuz it seems kinda fun!
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Dropkik on May 13, 2011, 03:19:37 AM
Who do I need to beg to get a retroactive on Wind Waker, Majora, or Links Awakening?
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: lolmonade on May 13, 2011, 08:48:20 AM
Yes! Perfect Dark!
I was excited to get this game. Just recently bought a N64 and have been amassing a collection for it. This gives me a chance to pick up a copy of this game and see if it's as fun as I remember it being. I've had a lot of fun replaying Goldeneye after I adjusted from HD gaming to 64-bit, now I'll have to see if the framerate issues are as bad as people here claim. I remember there being occasional slowdown, but nothing that dramatic.
Also helps that the game is only 5-10 bucks online.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: broodwars on May 13, 2011, 11:29:36 AM
Who do I need to beg to get a retroactive on Wind Waker, Majora, or Links Awakening?
Those games have gotten a lot of play and discussion already on RFN, though. I could see RFN maybe doing Link's Awakening when it comes out on the 3DS Virtual Console just because not as many people played it on the GameBoy, but even that's a stretch. I'd love a Retroactive on Majora's Mask, but I think everything there is to say about that game has already been said on RFN and other podcasts. The same goes for Wind Waker.
Title: Re: RetroActive #18 Poll - Originals & Remakes Edition
Post by: Jonnyboy117 on May 13, 2011, 12:59:25 PM
Once 3DS Virtual Console is up and running with a decent selection of games, we'll definitely have at least one RetroActive associated with it.
