Gaming Forums => Nintendo Gaming => Topic started by: AV on March 28, 2009, 03:55:01 PM
Title: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: AV on March 28, 2009, 03:55:01 PM
I've been playing lots of of New Play Control pikmin and I loved 2, so I am excited for 3 eventually on Wii.
Here are a few things I want to see:
1) Ability to enhance your life. Think Heart Pieces for Zelda but pikmin instead. Every once in a while animal drops some metal. Collect 3 and your life grows.
2) Give Olimar more offensive abilities like melee weapons like a baseball bat or something. I know the Pikmin are supposed to do the work but having this would help in defeating the monsters faster. Maybe some animals need to be stunned first by the club than the pikmin can attack.
3) Mating habitats. This will give you the ability to mate two colors of pikmin and the offspring will have attributes of both. However these habitats will be random occurrence and one day only thing in far corners of the level.
4) Advanced Multiplayer features: 2-player co-op online with voice chat. And 2 player 'mario galaxy' style co-op, and many more online and offline multiplayer modes
5) Full Stat tracking and online leader boards.
What do you want to see ?
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: King of Twitch on March 28, 2009, 04:42:39 PM
I think these are fine ideas. Cause all I want to see is livelier and smarter pikmin, brand new enemies and environments, and co-op. No overhauls or experimenting.
A different story wouldn't hurt (bounty hunting for rogue pikmin terrorists, or scavenging for exotic plants or valuable minerals, or clearing out an area for a future pikmin jungle cruise for example).
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: NWR_pap64 on March 28, 2009, 04:57:43 PM
I am definitely curious as to what may happen next in the Pikmin world.
While the second one had a decent story you can tell that they had to create a new conflict for Olimar, especially since he survived his greatest threat.
What are they going to do for the third one? Hocotate can't go under a SECOND time, and neither Olimar or Louie can get lost for a second time in space.
I am also curious as to how they will enhance the gameplay. The NPC versions already enhanced what was a great engine and system, how can they go further? We already tried survival with a time limit and treasure hunting, what more could there be?
I am very intrigued as to what they might do next.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: KnowsNothing on March 28, 2009, 05:09:17 PM
You know what might be interesting? One giant, seamless environment instead of individual levels. You could set up the game sort of more like a standard adventure game where you gain access to new areas when you collect enough ****. Doing this would make the game feel very fresh and open up tons of new gameplay and story options while still maintaining the RTS element (for enemy encounters and collecting items).
I just think the Pikmin universe is very versatile and could make for a very cool Zelda-esque adventure game while still mainting its RTS roots. Instead of having those shitty cave levels in Pikmin 2, you would have well thought out, individual dungeons like in a zelda game. Bring back Louie and you could have some seriously awesome puzzle and strategy based dungeons and ****.
Just a thought.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: DAaaMan64 on March 28, 2009, 05:22:55 PM
Open universe sounds excellent KnowsNothing.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: TJ Spyke on March 28, 2009, 05:58:56 PM
I am definitely curious as to what may happen next in the Pikmin world.
While the second one had a decent story you can tell that they had to create a new conflict for Olimar, especially since he survived his greatest threat.
What are they going to do for the third one? Hocotate can't go under a SECOND time, and neither Olimar or Louie can get lost for a second time in space.
Maybe they could have Hocotate's president decide that they can make more money by scavenging for items than they can shipping stuff, so the president makes that part of Olimar's job.
I don't really like the idea of making Olimar able to do more in combat. I do like the idea of breeding Pikmin (not sure how they would do this though). I think it's also best if they make sure that any multiplayer is online this time. I liked the stat tracking in Pikmin 2 (I forgot that the first Pikmin didn't have as many stats) and agree that online leaderboards would be nice.
Maybe they could make it so you can have your Pikmin sorta combine together (by climbing on top of each other, similar to what Joe and his other crippled friends did in that episode of Family Guy where they formed this giant robot man) if you have an equal amount of each color.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: nickmitch on March 29, 2009, 04:29:12 AM
Maybe, they could discover a new planet and Olimar and Louie could be trying to bring the Pikmin there. This way, the new planet could have odd effects on the Pikmin creating new types.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: KDR_11k on March 29, 2009, 06:56:43 AM
There's always the option of an ecologic catastrophy threatening the Pikmin population... Or they could go the Metroid route and drop Phazon on the planet.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on March 29, 2009, 02:41:29 PM
No Olimar. I think it should star his two kids and they each could have different affects on the Pikmin. The son could get the Pikmin to climb or jump on ledges to get to higher areas and he could have a booster/jet pack. The daughter could cause the Pikmin to work faster at digging, building and carrying.
There could also be some new types of Pikmin. I think a type of flying Pikmin could have potential.
Maybe there could be a Swiss Family Robinson plot where all of Olimar's family is stuck on the planet or maybe staying there for a family vacation. Each family member could have a different strength. Instead of leaving every night they could have a central 'safe nest' where they go for the night. This nest could be transformed over time with modifications made by the Pikmin combined with parts found in the wild.
I love the unified world idea. You could have mini safe nests scattered around the world where you can hide away for the night.
I don't think Pikmin breeding would work with the game's mythos because Pikmin are seeds that grow from the ground. Though maybe you could have it where pellets are not stored in Onions and instantly converted into basic Pikmin but placed in a dry storage place. Then you could mix the different colors to create new colored or hybrid Pikmin.
2-Player Co-op campaign is a must in my book. More multiplayer battle modes would be interesting as well. I'd like to see the marble capture mode except with a larger 4-player scale.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Spinnzilla on March 29, 2009, 04:19:34 PM
I want an online vs. mode. Not fighitng, but racing to get the pieces to your ship the fastest.
Also level leaderboards!
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Armak88 on March 29, 2009, 05:56:14 PM
The vs. multiplayer in pikmin 2 was pretty good, so if that came back with online I think that would be good. Co-op campaign seems so obvious after Pikmin 2, but I'm not getting my hopes up.
I hope that they keep the day time limit. It's a pretty integral part of the game so I hope it comes back. ALso, I liked the challenge mode in the first Pikmin. landing on the planet with 3 of each pikmin type then seeing how many you could grow in one day was really fun. Online leader boards for that kind of thing would be addicting for me.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: blackfootsteps on March 29, 2009, 07:44:29 PM
Perhaps some other company is also utiliising Pikmin, but in a vicious and cruel way. As Olimar/Louie you have to have Pikmin vs Pikmin battles and free the brainwashed Pikmin from tyranny.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Khushrenada on March 30, 2009, 12:20:01 AM
Pikmin colonization. Like KN's idea of a seamless envioronment. Olimar sets up his base camp and then slowly goes about terraforming the landscape and shaping it into something acceptable for expansion and colonization. You'd have to beware of wildlife that go down hunting trails at certain times of the day or days of the week. Slowly, you make a safe haven against the rest of the world. However, an enemy has appeared who is seeking to colonize the world to his own benefit and is able to lead the beasts of pikmin in a unified manner like Olimar has done with the pikmin. A clash of pkimin versus an army of Bulborbs.
I'm just talking crazy. But reading the idea of an open envioronment just planted this idea in my head of plopping down in the middle of this giant untamed wilderness and then slowly going and conquering it all into a little empire.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on March 30, 2009, 12:31:08 AM
I love the open world idea. The idea of constant adventuring sounds fantastic.
I also like the idea of spreading out your colony. Maybe there could be other beings other than Pikmin that you have help you bet only by helping them first? (sort of like a Black & White thing)
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on March 30, 2009, 03:17:32 AM
I'd like to see the strange bulborb-pikmin hybrids explored a bit more. They appeared in a few levels of Pikmin 2 and always seemed to be a curious matter.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: decoyman on March 30, 2009, 12:06:34 PM
Online (w/ WiiSpeak support) AND offline multiplayer – competitive AND co-op please. That is by far my most desired addition.
Also, some of the ideas of different family members with different strengths sounded interesting, and upgrading your house, too. Not sure I want a spin-off Pikmin tactical strategy game where you develop bases in new areas and such... at least not yet. I still hunger for a meaty, traditional action/strategy Pikmin adventure. And I don't think EVEN MORE pikmin types is a good idea. Five pikmin types is already pushing it, if you ask me. I find myself thinking fondly back to the simplicity that was the 3-pikmin-type system of the original.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on March 30, 2009, 01:06:41 PM
KnowsNothing's idea is awesome! The second I read it I was just like "that's it! That's what I want to see!"
Exploration is my favourite thing to do in videogames. That's why I love Zelda and Metroid. That's why I really don't connect with the Wii ____ series: no world to discover. Give me a world to explore and I'm easily amused. Hell I would probably have a blast with a game that played like Metroid Prime but had no actual conflict and just involved exploring an alien world.
I love the Pikmin games but both of them had a game design mechanic that hurt exploration. Pikmin 1 had the time limit. It's hard to explore when you're under the gun. Pikmin 2 had the caves. I think Pikmin 2 is an absolute must-play classic but since the caves are randomly generated they were not nearly as interesting as the overworld levels.
Before Pikmin 2 was revealed I was trying to think of some logical storyline to continue the series. I thought of the idea of the Pikmin having gained independence in their time with Olimar and you play a "Pikmin General" that orders the other Pikmin around. The game is more about survival in nature instead of specfic conflict involving a human-like character. So the game becomes about capturing prey to breed Pikmin and finding new areas to set up Onions and maybe you get new abilities based on items you find. In an open-ended world like KnowsNothing suggested that would be really cool.
In Pikmin 2 they got rid of the challenge mode and that really irked me because I felt it added tons of replay value to the game. That's sort of more what I imagine Pikmin 3 could be like. Build your Pikmin colony and expand across the world.
Though I imagine Nintendo will use Olimar again. They put him in SSB Brawl and with the extra attention the franchise is getting from the New Play Control versions he's now a marketable character and they probably don't want to get rid of him. As with most Nintendo series the storyline will probably become more contrived and will introduce all sorts of obvious plotholes that any fan of the game would notice immediately. But thankfully the game will likely still play like a dream.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: vudu on March 30, 2009, 05:00:04 PM
I don't think one giant open world will really add much to Pikmin unless they change the rules quite a bit. Assuming you must return to your ship every night you're not going to be able to wander off too far. It'll require you to move your ship every few days, which at that point you're not too far off from having individual levels.
If they did want to move to this design, you could have your Pikmin gather parts to build little fortresses that you could stay in at night.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on March 30, 2009, 05:08:28 PM
I don't think one giant open world will really add much to Pikmin unless they change the rules quite a bit. Assuming you must return to your ship every night you're not going to be able to wander off too far. It'll require you to move your ship every few days, which at that point you're not too far off from having individual levels.
If they did want to move to this design, you could have your Pikmin gather parts to build little fortresses that you could stay in at night.
That's what I meant by secret safe nests earlier. They are places you can stay the night, that is all. You home base would more be the one you can modify.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: KnowsNothing on March 30, 2009, 06:10:36 PM
Quote
I don't think one giant open world will really add much to Pikmin unless they change the rules quite a bit.
...exactly. I see nothing wrong with changing the rules quite a bit. Perhaps early on you would have to return to your ship at night because extremely powerful enemies come out, then a bit later you would have the ability to build (or discover) these "safe-houses," and then eventually you would discover luminescent pikmin that would grant you the ability to explore at night (by, for example, dealing extra damage to nocturnal creatures). Sort of like...uhh...Dark Aether, I suppose. At first it's dangerous to stay there for a long time but later on when you upgrade your suit it's not really a problem anymore.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on March 30, 2009, 06:39:10 PM
For sure. That's exactly how I envisioned it.
But like I said before not all animals have to be dangerous. In fact, enlisting them could be the way you travel across the world quickly or defend yourself from a bulborb stampede!
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: decoyman on March 30, 2009, 06:46:30 PM
I like the Nighttime exploration idea, KN... if they do it right, it could transform a known environment into almost a whole new place.
Awesome, the more I think about it, the more I like it. :D
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on March 30, 2009, 07:13:53 PM
Quote
But like I said before not all animals have to be dangerous. In fact, enlisting them could be the way you travel across the world quickly or defend yourself from a bulborb stampede!
I figure that Pikmin themselves are the most dangerious creatures of their world. Their only weakness is they need leadership and organization. Even the Bulbmin in Pikmin 2 are parasitic Pikmin. Unless other animals are enlisted against their will I don't think it would seem very Pikmin like. You're really kind of playing the bad guy in the Pikmin games, killing all the creatures around you to harvest more Pikmin. It's like a cute version of the Borg or the Alien Xenomorphs.
I like the idea of nocturnal Pikmin though. Realistically it's pretty hard to think of other logical Pikmin types. I was really surprised with what they came up with for Pikmin 2 and nocturnal Pikmin would be a very useful and logical idea to introduce. Have that and parasite Pikmin to possess other creatures to expand on the Bulbmin concept.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on March 30, 2009, 07:21:35 PM
I was thinking giant animals like a snake or fish that you could ride on top of along with all your pikmin.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: King of Twitch on March 30, 2009, 08:46:57 PM
Player two (or three) could navigate the ship/onions with the DS if there's going to be one giant level or (like in Metroid Prime 3) blast through walls. It'd involve some kind of flight mode mini game with Olimar's ship inbetween landing sites. Of course that'd be too complicated for nongamers.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on March 30, 2009, 08:51:11 PM
Or make it onrails ship flying levels like StarFox Adventures.
thread destroyed
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: MoronSonOfBoron on March 31, 2009, 12:13:32 AM
For the past two Pikmin games, the Pikmin have unquestioningly served Olimar and other captains, never flinching in the face of danger and often flinging themselves towards certain doom. There is a simple devotion and dependency here that was eventually translated into famous Pikmin "Ai no Uta", or Love Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esYm9q-bi4w). Indeed, who here can forget the subtle emotional bond observable when Olimar first escaped the Pikmin Planet?
I've played both Pikmin games extensively, but losing Pikmin has never been easy, even when you could freely replenish your Pikmin numbers by revisiting the onions. For me, the feeling of loss when a single Pikmin died was a strong emotional discouragement against feckless tactics and bad decisions.
Looking at the ideas in this thread has raised in me the notion that a lot of what other people see in the Pikmin games are the themes of conquest, expansion, and exploitation.
Do you remember how in Pikmin 2, Olimar's company sent him back to the Pikmin Planet to essentially exploit and harvest its resources? Imagine that this becomes the norm: Pikmin are being domesticated and used as slave labor, paving the way for large companies to plunder the Pikmin Planet for treasure, leading to unchecked prospecting and the eventual establishment of colonies. Pikmin themselves are being altered for use by the companies: genetically modified Onions produce purple and white Pikmin, for example.
Olimar is recruited into one of these colonization efforts, and the first part of the game deals with him using Pikmin as part of the mining efforts: gathering treasure, clearing out wildlife, and such. Some of the puzzles here would involve using Pikmin to gather parts and assemble machines, and learning to use the new features and gadgets employed by companies to "farm" and organize Pikmin.
Eventually, the Pikmin are recruited to help assemble what amounts to the atomic bomb: a terraforming device. To further the expansion taking place on the Pikmin Planet, it is essential that its environment be made non-toxic to Olimar's people, even if doing so would wipe out life on the planet. Faced with the unblinking beady little eyes of Pikmin he has raised from pellet to full bloom, Olimar turns against the companies, swearing to undo the damage they are causing before it goes too far.
In this frantic second half of the game, the puzzles and exploration from the first game are now joined with the combat and tactics of the second as the player works to reverse-engineer and disable the colonies and their machines. Olimar will still have the new tools to control the Pikmin; they will simply be more difficult to use or replace. Pikmin armies controlled by the colony would also reintroduce the PvP aspects that were touched upon in Pikmin 2; this could help players prime themselves for online combat, as well. Olimar will have the opportunity to liberate enslaved Pikmin Onions, bolstering his own army or adding special varieties that were bred or genetically altered by the companies (some of which he had worked with while employed).
So the Pikmin story comes full circle: Olimar ultimately owes his life to the Pikmin, and they in turn need his guidance to escape certain doom.
But that's just an idea I had.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: AV on March 31, 2009, 12:59:28 AM
For the past two Pikmin games, the Pikmin have unquestioningly served Olimar and other captains, never flinching in the face of danger and often flinging themselves towards certain doom. There is a simple devotion and dependency here that was eventually translated into famous Pikmin "Ai no Uta", or Love Song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esYm9q-bi4w). Indeed, who here can forget the subtle emotional bond observable when Olimar first escaped the Pikmin Planet?
I've played both Pikmin games extensively, but losing Pikmin has never been easy, even when you could freely replenish your Pikmin numbers by revisiting the onions. For me, the feeling of loss when a single Pikmin died was a strong emotional discouragement against feckless tactics and bad decisions.
Looking at the ideas in this thread has raised in me the notion that a lot of what other people see in the Pikmin games are the themes of conquest, expansion, and exploitation.
Do you remember how in Pikmin 2, Olimar's company sent him back to the Pikmin Planet to essentially exploit and harvest its resources? Imagine that this becomes the norm: Pikmin are being domesticated and used as slave labor, paving the way for large companies to plunder the Pikmin Planet for treasure, leading to unchecked prospecting and the eventual establishment of colonies. Pikmin themselves are being altered for use by the companies: genetically modified Onions produce purple and white Pikmin, for example.
Olimar is recruited into one of these colonization efforts, and the first part of the game deals with him using Pikmin as part of the mining efforts: gathering treasure, clearing out wildlife, and such. Some of the puzzles here would involve using Pikmin to gather parts and assemble machines, and learning to use the new features and gadgets employed by companies to "farm" and organize Pikmin.
Eventually, the Pikmin are recruited to help assemble what amounts to the atomic bomb: a terraforming device. To further the expansion taking place on the Pikmin Planet, it is essential that its environment be made non-toxic to Olimar's people, even if doing so would wipe out life on the planet. Faced with the unblinking beady little eyes of Pikmin he has raised from pellet to full bloom, Olimar turns against the companies, swearing to undo the damage they are causing before it goes too far.
In this frantic second half of the game, the puzzles and exploration from the first game are now joined with the combat and tactics of the second as the player works to reverse-engineer and disable the colonies and their machines. Olimar will still have the new tools to control the Pikmin; they will simply be more difficult to use or replace. Pikmin armies controlled by the colony would also reintroduce the PvP aspects that were touched upon in Pikmin 2; this could help players prime themselves for online combat, as well. Olimar will have the opportunity to liberate enslaved Pikmin Onions, bolstering his own army or adding special varieties that were bred or genetically altered by the companies (some of which he had worked with while employed).
So the Pikmin story comes full circle: Olimar ultimately owes his life to the Pikmin, and they in turn need his guidance to escape certain doom.
But that's just an idea I had.
Pikmin + World of Goo ??? FTW.
I also love " Cute borg" that ian said.
I think RFN should take this topic and discuss it on the podcast. We are getting some fantastic ideas from everyone.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on March 31, 2009, 01:56:09 PM
Quote
Of course that'd be too complicated for nongamers.
SO?!
I like MoronSonOfBoron's idea. In fact it sounds more like a storyline Nintendo would do over any of the other story ideas that have been thrown around. And it keeps Olimar in the series in a non-contrived way.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on March 31, 2009, 05:08:17 PM
The only problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it might be too serious a story for a Pikmin game, but I like it a lot. I can picture battles for control of enemy onions, leaving a squad of Pikmin at your own onions to protect them from Olimar's co-workers trying to do the same, and maybe even being able to construct base defenses that your Pikmin could operate.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: vudu on March 31, 2009, 05:17:16 PM
PIKMIN MASS GENOCIDE
EXTERMINATE (WITH EXTREME PREJUDICE) THE BLUE PIKMIN
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on March 31, 2009, 05:43:46 PM
Quote
The only problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it might be too serious a story for a Pikmin game
Well Pikmin is kind of a dark game anyway. When you get killed in Mario do you really feel it? Nah. But you lose any Pikmin due to carelessness and you feel like crap. There's also the fact that none of the enemies are actually evil, but are just predators trying to survive as much as you are. The first game also has the real possibility of Olimar not succeeding and dying, leaving behind his family. There's no continue screen. You screw up and not get all the parts in time Olimar is dead. It looks cute in screenshots but Pikmin is one of Nintendo's most serious and mature franchises.
If anything my problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it introduces actual evil into the story, instead of just being about survival in nature. It also lacks subtlety as I think it's kind of funny to imagine kids innocently playing Pikmin, completely oblivious to what a morally ambiguous game it is. But it is a really good storyline idea that makes sense.
Though I wonder exactly how Miyamoto sees Pikmin. I wonder if we see more in it than he intended.
I have thought of another storyline idea that could involve Olimar. Perhaps some ecosystem has had Bulborbs introduced to it and they're overrunning the place without natural predators. So Olimar rounds up some Pikmin to solve the problem. It introduces a new environment and a whole list of new creatures (minus the Bulborbs of course) and is a story that involves Olimar but not in a contrived way.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on March 31, 2009, 06:17:47 PM
If anything my problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it introduces actual evil into the story, instead of just being about survival in nature. It also lacks subtlety as I think it's kind of funny to imagine kids innocently playing Pikmin, completely oblivious to what a morally ambiguous game it is. But it is a really good storyline idea that makes sense.
Pikmin 2 introduced good old corporate greed already, didn't it? I guess that was still about survival in a sense, but corporate exploitation of the Pikmin follows very smoothly from there. If you want moral ambiguity, just consider the implications of Olimar turning on his own people and starting a Pikmin civil war.
Quote
Though I wonder exactly how Miyamoto sees Pikmin. I wonder if we see more in it than he intended.
Pikmin is a lot like an episode of Muppet Babies about gardening, i.e. turning growing flowers into an adventure. Gonzo would take the side of the bugs and keeping the others from using pesticide, leading up to a lesson from Nanny about how every living thing has the right to live. (I don't know where that came from.) Anyway, Miyamoto's take on it would be like the blurb in the TV listings that reads, "The kids have an adventure in a flower bed," and our take on it would be a doctoral thesis entitled "Environmental Activism in Children's Television Programming." It's what fans do.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Kairon on April 02, 2009, 02:27:34 AM
GOD my brother's awesome.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: AV on April 02, 2009, 05:51:47 PM
The only problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it might be too serious a story for a Pikmin game
Well Pikmin is kind of a dark game anyway. When you get killed in Mario do you really feel it? Nah. But you lose any Pikmin due to carelessness and you feel like crap. There's also the fact that none of the enemies are actually evil, but are just predators trying to survive as much as you are. The first game also has the real possibility of Olimar not succeeding and dying, leaving behind his family. There's no continue screen. You screw up and not get all the parts in time Olimar is dead. It looks cute in screenshots but Pikmin is one of Nintendo's most serious and mature franchises.
If anything my problem with MoronSonOfBoron's idea is that it introduces actual evil into the story, instead of just being about survival in nature. It also lacks subtlety as I think it's kind of funny to imagine kids innocently playing Pikmin, completely oblivious to what a morally ambiguous game it is. But it is a really good storyline idea that makes sense.
Though I wonder exactly how Miyamoto sees Pikmin. I wonder if we see more in it than he intended.
I have thought of another storyline idea that could involve Olimar. Perhaps some ecosystem has had Bulborbs introduced to it and they're overrunning the place without natural predators. So Olimar rounds up some Pikmin to solve the problem. It introduces a new environment and a whole list of new creatures (minus the Bulborbs of course) and is a story that involves Olimar but not in a contrived way.
The fact Nintendo decided to add souls to ALL THE CREATURES AND SCREAMS OF DEATH are subtle things that are really dark. It's a little odd you kill babies of a bulborbs that sleep near the mother.
I really think this is a much darker game than people realize. Just actually read some of the journals.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on April 02, 2009, 05:53:28 PM
Its dark in the way the Lion King is dark.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on April 02, 2009, 05:54:57 PM
I thought the little Bulborbs were actually just different species instead of babies. But you still feel a but sad when you pick off one of the little ones and carry it's body off while the rest sleep blissfully unawares. ...I'm a baby killer...BWAHAHAHA!
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on April 02, 2009, 06:03:16 PM
"LOOK INSIDE YOURSELF, OLIMAR! YOU ARE MY SON, AND THE ONE TRUE KING!"
Is it wrong that I always laughed when I faced the "baby kiliing" situation. I always tried to be as stealthy as possible; making sure to take them out quick lest alert the mother. I like to talk in a "gringo" accent aswell, like "Crikey! Look over there, a mother crocodile and her young. Good Lord! Look at that huge mouth! I better be careful."
*The noise of pikmin flying through the air*
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on April 02, 2009, 06:10:00 PM
I've never heard the term 'gringo' used to refer to Steve Irwin type Australian accents. Then again, I've never been to Australia so maybe it's a regional thing based on where you live.
Back to topic, I asked my little sis what she wanted to see in a Wii Pikmin game and she said whe wanted to be able to fling the Pikmin with the remote like you throw stuff in Boom Blox. It would be tedious when you are throwing a lot of them, but for precision throwing it could work. Maybe to dictate where bombs are thrown to avoid those clumsy bomb mistakes that kill all your pikmin.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stogi on April 02, 2009, 06:15:29 PM
Ya i guess gringo just means "white."
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: TJ Spyke on April 02, 2009, 06:31:38 PM
I've never heard the term 'gringo' used to refer to Steve Irwin type Australian accents. Then again, I've never been to Australia so maybe it's a regional thing based on where you live. ombs are thrown to avoid those clumsy bomb mistakes that kill all your pikmin.
"Gringo" is a term that is sometimes used to describe any non-native speakers of Spanish. It's usually only used for North Americans and Europeans though.
Also, Dwarf Bulborbs are not baby Bulborbs. They are a subspecies of the Breadbug family.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on April 02, 2009, 06:34:59 PM
Reading about the creatures in Pikmin is extremely fascinating. There is a good deal of time and effort that went into the creature design.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: MoronSonOfBoron on April 02, 2009, 07:42:10 PM
Reading about the creatures in Pikmin is extremely fascinating. There is a good deal of time and effort that went into the creature design.
I spent quite a lot of time poring through the Piklopedia, myself! I imagine that studying the behaviors of the native wildlife, and subsequently subverting them, would make for an interesting gameplay mechanic if taken a step further.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on April 02, 2009, 07:51:29 PM
I think with the Bulborbs the red ones are a mimic species that look like baby Bulborbs but the black ones actually are babies. Or something like that.
All that detail just made the game that much better. After completing a day in Pikmin 2 I would just pour over all the new information I had obtained. That was a big part of the hook of the game for me. Kinda like the scans in Metroid Prime. I figure some people would call that an OCD way of playing a game but to me it's just part of the exploration.
I think an exploration game with no real conflict that plays almost like edutainment but with a completely fictional world would be a blast. Probably way too uncommercial but I would get a real kick out of it. Nintendo did something like that with Endless Ocean but that was the real world. That's just not as interesting.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on April 02, 2009, 09:28:00 PM
Good thoughts Ian and MSB (I'd call you Moron for short but that feels wrong, guess I could be unlazy and type out your full name but..)
I liked reading the Scans in Prime, the side stories in Mario Galaxy, the logs and piklopedia in Pikmin and anything like that in other games. I just love getting sucked into the nuances of a story's universe.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Mop it up on April 02, 2009, 11:09:25 PM
Good thoughts Ian and MSB (I'd call you Moron for short but that feels wrong, guess I could be unlazy and type out your full name but..)
In the time it took you to write all of that you could have written out his name several times.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: tombo125 on April 03, 2009, 12:10:44 AM
The return of the time (day) limit would be amazing to me. In pikmin 2 I would try not to have less than like 1000 of each pikmin and it became no fun cuz I was not trying to kill any pikmin and just get more. I played the first Pikmin like 3 times all the way through and I only got three areas in Pikmin 2 to explore before I got bored. I am sure I am in the minority tho so I just hope that there is maybe 2 modes like that. You could choose between Pikmin 1 style and Pikmin 2 style and use the same levels and just change the story a little bit to make it seem reasonable,
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Stratos on April 03, 2009, 12:32:42 AM
The return of the time (day) limit would be amazing to me. In pikmin 2 I would try not to have less than like 1000 of each pikmin and it became no fun cuz I was not trying to kill any pikmin and just get more. I played the first Pikmin like 3 times all the way through and I only got three areas in Pikmin 2 to explore before I got bored. I am sure I am in the minority tho so I just hope that there is maybe 2 modes like that. You could choose between Pikmin 1 style and Pikmin 2 style and use the same levels and just change the story a little bit to make it seem reasonable,
You are not alone in that thought Tombo. There have been a number of other members who preferred the first from the second. I like your idea of having both available. Maybe the first part is timed and then once you accomplish that you get the opportunity to carry on in the world for the after game. Maybe there could be timed missions you can take where there is a limited number of days to complete them.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on April 03, 2009, 01:10:27 PM
Maybe there could be timed missions you can take where there is a limited number of days to complete them.
Ingenious. I can see that working with the constructing safe havens idea from before. You enter a new area, and you have a limited number of days to gather parts for a safe haven or else you'll be forced to abandon the area and try again.
Of course, the whole safe haven idea is threatened by the onions' ability to fly. Maybe they can evolve an upgraded, permanently rooted form that generates more and/or better Pikmin, e.g. they bloom faster in the ground or have higher base stats. Maybe not completing the timed mission to build a safe spot for a rooted onion simply forces you to go without the upgrade in that area. Maybe choosing to stick with mobile onions has its own advantages, like being able to call them to you or choosing new landing spots.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: NWR_insanolord on April 03, 2009, 01:17:39 PM
Also, Dwarf Bulborbs are not baby Bulborbs. They are a subspecies of the Breadbug family.
I know the game says that, but I have to wonder if that was just Olimar's alien perspective leading him to false conclusions.
It's funny that you pointed out how the fans probably see a lot more depth in the game than is actually intended and then you post that.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Ian Sane on April 03, 2009, 01:25:41 PM
Quote
Ingenious. I can see that working with the constructing safe havens idea from before. You enter a new area, and you have a limited number of days to gather parts for a safe haven or else you'll be forced to abandon the area and try again.
That's a great idea!
There could also just be parts of the game that once you enter you have to do it in one try within the days allotted. If you decide to quit or don't accomplish your goal in the time frame it sends you back in time to before you entered that part of the game. So it's just really a "Game Over" screen but you don't have to reset the whole game, just that part. And these can be optional sidequests so that those that don't want to deal with the stress of the time limit can still beat the game but not get 100%. Lots of Nintendo games are like that.
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: AV on April 04, 2009, 09:28:14 PM
i sort of want a lock on system . maybe you can upgrade some abilities
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: Dasmos on May 04, 2009, 12:00:23 PM
I can't be bothered finding the official Pikmin 3 thread. (FIX YOUR FUCKING SEARCH NWR!!!)
Suppodely in this month's Edge's coming soon page hints at Pikmin 3 being revealed.
Issue 202 of Edge magazine arrived in subscribers’ hands this morning, and there seems to be a Pikmin-shaped surprise waiting at the end of it.
As spotted by WiiWii.TV, Issue 202’s Next Month page seems to suggest that a new Pikmin title will be revealed in the next issue. Can’t quite see it? Look a little closer. Hidden amongst the grass on the top right-hand side of the page is a small purple blob that looks remarkably like a Pikmin.
Shigeru Miyamoto quietly revealed that a new Pikmin title was in production during a Q&A session at last year’s E3, but nothing has been seen of the game so far.
Could all be revealed in next month’s Edge, or are we getting excited over a small splash of colour for nothing?
Title: Re: Pikmin 3: What advancements in gameplay do you want to see ??
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on May 04, 2009, 12:36:46 PM
One of the new advancements is the Normal mode will be a piss-easy Casual Mode. There is no Hard Mode, or any legitimate challenge, for that matter.
