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NWR Interactive => TalkBack => Topic started by: Nick DiMola on July 23, 2008, 08:52:54 AM

Title: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Nick DiMola on July 23, 2008, 08:52:54 AM

In a lost lawsuit with Anascape Ltd., Judge Ron Clark rejected Nintendo's appeal for a new trial and ordered a ban on various Nintendo controllers.
 http://www.nintendoworldreport.com/newsArt.cfm?artid=16449

 Recently Nintendo has faced some legal trouble, the most recent of which involves a controller suit with Anascape Ltd.. The suit brought upon Nintendo involved Anascape defending their patent in which they claim infringements by Nintendo with the Gamecube Controller, Wavebird Wireless Controller, and the Wii's Classic Controller. According to Anascape, Nintendo has "clogged the channel" preventing Anascape from entering the market with their own controller designs.    

The suit was settled in Anascape's favor, forcing Nintendo to pay the company $21 million. Clearly unhappy with the settlement, Nintendo had requested a new trial from the presiding Judge Ron Clark. As of yesterday, Nintendo's request was denied and Judge Clark has requested Nintendo post a bond or put royalties in escrow or else face a ban on the controllers found to infringe on the patent.    

According to Nintendo spokesperson, Charlie Scibetta, Nintendo plans to "immediately appeal" the ruling and post a bond in order to continue selling their Wii Classic Controller. With Nintendo's upcoming appeal, the court battles will continue.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Nick DiMola on July 23, 2008, 04:17:32 PM

Stupid patent trolls, I hope this gets overturned in the appeal. Our patent system is a disaster.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Enner on July 23, 2008, 05:22:48 PM

6 types of motion at once, eh...
Anyway, shame that this happened. Reminds me to grab an extra GCN controller since some of mine are getting faulty.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on July 23, 2008, 06:07:56 PM

I haven't been able to figure out what the patent troll in this case is actually claiming to have invented.  I thought when this thing started that I heard it was about having a controller with an analog stick and rumble, but the classic controller doesn't have rumble.  The slashdolts seem to think it's about the clicking shoulder buttons, but Microsoft was a part of this case, too, until they paid the troll off.  Microsoft hasn't ever used that kind of shoulder button, right?

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: ThePerm on July 23, 2008, 08:05:29 PM

i bet the judge doesnt even know whats going on. WTF this **** is stupid...what fucking good is the patent office if they can award patents and you can still get sued for them, reeks of broken system to me.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Ceric on July 23, 2008, 08:33:17 PM

Are patent system is loopy.  They shouldn't be able to patent things like putting analog sticks with rumble because it is obvious.  Plus how could Nintendo loose a patent war when they had a patent already for rumble... This makes no sense and proves how are patent system is abused and stifle innovation.  I believe people should paid for others inventions but I do not agree when people just have patents and sue people but they don't actually create anything.

I don't know about this case in particular but I really doubt that they actually make what the patent describes.  I believe that if you can't offer then you shouldn't be able to reap the benefits of the patent.  I also believe that you shouldn't be able to buy raw commodities without the ability to store said commodities.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: RABicle on July 23, 2008, 08:58:22 PM

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/gaming/2008-05-15-nintendo-patent_N.htm

Good to see that everyday USAToday readers dont know what's going on either.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: brian577 on July 23, 2008, 09:15:56 PM

Here's a complete list of the patents nintendo is accused of violating

Patent #    Title
6,222,525    "Image controllers with sheet connected sensors"
6,344,791    "Variable sensor with tactile feedback"
6,351,205    "Variable-conductance sensor"
6,563,415    "Analog sensor(s) with snap-through tactile feedback"
6,906,700    "3D controller with vibration"

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Ceric on July 23, 2008, 09:35:23 PM

Quote from: brian577 on July 23, 2008, 09:15:56 PM

Here's a complete list of the patents nintendo is accused of violating

Patent #    Title
6,222,525    "Image controllers with sheet connected sensors" ????
6,344,791    "Variable sensor with tactile feedback" I can think of a lot people who could be sued for this overly broad patent
6,351,205    "Variable-conductance sensor" ???
6,563,415    "Analog sensor(s) with snap-through tactile feedback"I can't seem them violating this because of the snap-through portion
6,906,700    "3D controller with vibration" Lets assume they mean the analog stick, Nintendo would have needed to sued for the N64 controller.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: MegaByte on July 23, 2008, 09:37:49 PM

Quote from: Ceric on July 23, 2008, 09:35:23 PM

I can't seem them violating this because of the snap-through portion

I think this is the analog + digital shoulder buttons.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Djunknown on July 23, 2008, 10:10:37 PM

Quote

Nintendo plans to "immediately appeal" the ruling and post a bond in order to continue selling their Wii Classic Controller

So does this mean they have to pay X amount a dollars per day to keep classic controllers on the shelves? Or is it one lump sum?

Comment from the USA today article:

Quote

The fact is both Microsoft and Nintendo have large legal teams whose only job is to research registered trademarks and patents and make sure their products dont violate those patents.

Its obvious that in this case, they decided to take the risk and move forward with their design anyways. Thus, they gambled and lost.

Any merit to this?

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Crimm on July 23, 2008, 10:15:42 PM

No, there's no merit to that.  Anascape's patent is so disgustingly broad that this wasn't a "risk."  A broad patent is doubly good, because not only does it encompass a lot of other things but it's very hard to catch in research.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: RABicle on July 24, 2008, 01:12:48 AM

Not to mention Nintendo's large legal teams who's only job is to research patents would have had to reserch intot eh future and see what future patents by Brian Armstong they would have to break. I bet Brian is claiming to have invented friend codes tomorrow.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: TheYoungerPlumber on July 24, 2008, 01:23:26 AM

Perhaps I don't understand patent law, but Patent #6,563,415 "Analog sensor(s) with snap-through tactile feedback" was filed in 9/18/2001 and issued in 2003. Nintendo GameCube was released on September 14, 2001 in Japan, FOUR DAYS BEFORE THIS WAS FILED. If a patent is to retain the rights to a new, novel idea, then the marketplace demonstrates why this patent is invalid and should not have been issued, as the idea was already out there.

Also, what the heck does "clogging the channel" mean. Does this company really suggest that Nintendo prevented them from releasing their own controller? If Nintendo hadn't "infringed" on this patent, Anascape would not have released a controller for the GmaeCube with this function because no games would support it. Would Anascape have released its own gaming system? And did it REALLY take you four+ years to realize that this controller infringed on your rights...or did you just wait until it looked like a profitable lawsuit venture, what with Wii's success? *sigh*

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Ian Sane on July 24, 2008, 11:58:39 AM

The entire legal system suffers from not having a "this is stupid" filter.  You look at this and a zillion other stupid lawsuits where the second they are even mentioned a judge should just say "this is stupid" and the whole thing is thrown out.

You file for a patent on something that has already been released on the market at the time of inventing?  "This is stupid."  Done.  Someone complains about seizures when there is already a clear warning on the box?  "This is stupid."  Done.

It is always very obvious when a lawsuit is frivolous and yet they're allowed to go on.  Can't we just make "intentionally abusing the legal system for personal gain" a crime?  I guess the concern is some legitimate cases will get ignored but then innocent people go to jail sometimes too.  It will never be perfect but it sure as hell is broken now and worth investigating.

I do support the concept of patents but they need to be pretty damn careful about what is granted a patent.  It should reward TRUE innovation, not lumping pre-existing concepts together.  Is there a patent for a cellphone that is also a toothbrush?  I better get the f*ck to the patent office even though I didn't invent the cellphone or the toothbrush and accomplish nothing by glueing them together.

The annoying thing is any time I've met someone who has tried to patent something it's this huge annoying process that just ends up in rejection anyway and yet somehow scammers like Anascape manage to do it.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: Flames_of_chaos on July 24, 2008, 07:07:32 PM

 Ladies and gentlemen anascape.net (http://www.anascape.net/)

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on July 24, 2008, 07:26:21 PM

laffo

analscrape

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: KDR_11k on July 29, 2008, 04:36:09 PM

It's a troll. The only way to kill a troll is to use fire or acid. Yes, I support setting their execs on fire or dropping them into a vat of acid.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: ThePerm on August 01, 2008, 12:01:30 AM

doesnt anascapes patent infringe on nintendo's patent? To be able to patent a controller with analog rumble then you would have to have the patent on the controller first.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: ThePerm on August 01, 2008, 12:06:06 AM

Quote from: KDR_11k on July 29, 2008, 04:36:09 PM

It's a troll. The only way to kill a troll is to use fire or acid. Yes, I support setting their execs on fire or dropping them into a vat of acid.

QFT, i had a similar thought...i didnt even read your post till after i posted

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: MegaByte on August 01, 2008, 12:41:10 AM

Quote from: ThePerm on August 01, 2008, 12:01:30 AM

doesnt anascapes patent infringe on nintendo's patent? To be able to patent a controller with analog rumble then you would have to have the patent on the controller first.

Problem is, Anascape doesn't have any actual products that Nintendo could sue over.  Part of their case was that Nintendo prevented them from being able to get into the market.  You are allowed to patent inventions that require previous patents to realize as well as patenting new uses for old inventions.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: KDR_11k on August 01, 2008, 02:47:01 AM

Apparently the court this lawsuit was filed in is notorious for rubberstamp judgements in favour of the plaintiff and you don't even need a von Karma or anything. Alledgedly the gimmick the area uses to attract business.

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: TJ Spyke on April 13, 2010, 08:09:03 PM

Sorry to bump this, but Nintendo won their appeal today with the judge saying that none of Nintendo's accessories violate Anascape's patents.
http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2010/04/nintendo_wins_appeal_in_controller_patents_case

Title: Re: Nintendo Faces Controller Ban Due to Patent Infringement
Post by: BeautifulShy on April 13, 2010, 08:43:41 PM

You know I was going to comment that this was resolved until I noticed the date this story was posted.
Thank you TJ Spike for bumping this.:)