Post by: Chozo Ghost on November 25, 2007, 10:03:21 AM
Is this the view of everyone on the Wii Zapper? Has anyone who bought it actually like it? How does it play with the other games besides the Crossbow one it comes with?
Post by: Arbok on November 25, 2007, 10:28:59 AM
Post by: wulffman04 on November 25, 2007, 10:33:39 AM
Post by: NeoThunder on November 25, 2007, 10:41:16 AM
the only advantage is you can hold the wii remote like an actual gun, instead of holding it like normal which is like holding a phasor from star trek the next generation.
other than that it doesn't really give a great advantage
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 25, 2007, 10:58:49 AM
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 25, 2007, 11:25:13 AM
QuoteOh come on. All of the recent the mainstream mainline Zelda games have a shooting gallery style mini-game, in them. Tell me how many have not had some kind of archery or hookshot aiming skill game to earn rupees or heart containers or other helpful items.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
I haven't played Crossbow traning yet, but so far I don't see how you can lose if you can stomach the molesting of the Zelda franchise to create a shooting gallery style game. I'm interested in trying out the zapper, and will hopefully get that chance later tonight
So why is pulling out the archery skill test mini-game contained with in mainline Zelda games "molesting" the Zelda franchise?
Post by: NWR_pap64 on November 25, 2007, 11:40:54 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: 31 FlavasQuoteOh come on. All of the recent the mainstream mainline Zelda games have a shooting gallery style mini-game, in them. Tell me how many have not had some kind of archery or hookshot aiming skill game to earn rupees or heart containers or other helpful items.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
I haven't played Crossbow traning yet, but so far I don't see how you can lose if you can stomach the molesting of the Zelda franchise to create a shooting gallery style game. I'm interested in trying out the zapper, and will hopefully get that chance later tonight
So why is pulling out the archery skill test mini-game contained with in mainline Zelda games "molesting" the Zelda franchise?
I think what she means is that this is the first time Nintendo has used the Zelda series to sell a peripheral and created a spin off like mini game disc to do so.
In short, "the first time Nintendo has whored Zelda outside the main games".
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 25, 2007, 12:10:33 PM
QuotePerhaps this is just nitpicking, but didn't Nintendo "whore" out Zelda with the 4 swords adventure game to sell GBAs and link cables? Or use the mainline GBC Zelda's to pimp the GameBoy Camera? What about the Tingle Tuner in Windwaker?
Originally posted by: pap64
I think what she means is that this is the first time Nintendo has used the Zelda series to sell a peripheral and created a spin off like mini game disc to do so.
In short, "the first time Nintendo has whored Zelda outside the main games".
It just seems rather arbitrary to now call "molestation" on something that has been standard issue, and well recieved, in nearly all Zelda games. Why can't that, like 4-swords was, be fleshed out into a game that will give value to the Wii Zapper? Link's crossbow training is quite short, maybe an hour or two to get all platinum medals, but it is by no means a crappy game.
Post by: Luigi Dude on November 25, 2007, 12:19:14 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: pap64
In short, "the first time Nintendo has whored Zelda outside the main games".
Well when the game only cost $20 and comes with a giant piece of plastic, I wouldn't consider that whoring. Now if they release a Zelda Party or a Zelda Golf and charge $50 for it, then I'd say they're whoring the series out.
Post by: NWR_pap64 on November 25, 2007, 12:36:58 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: 31 FlavasQuotePerhaps this is just nitpicking, but didn't Nintendo "whore" out Zelda with the 4 swords adventure game to sell GBAs and link cables? Or use the mainline GBC Zelda's to pimp the GameBoy Camera? What about the Tingle Tuner in Windwaker?
Originally posted by: pap64
I think what she means is that this is the first time Nintendo has used the Zelda series to sell a peripheral and created a spin off like mini game disc to do so.
In short, "the first time Nintendo has whored Zelda outside the main games".
It just seems rather arbitrary to now call "molestation" on something that has been standard issue, and well recieved, in nearly all Zelda games. Why can't that, like 4-swords was, be fleshed out into a game that will give value to the Wii Zapper? Link's crossbow training is quite short, maybe an hour or two to get all platinum medals, but it is by no means a crappy game.
Just in case, I don't mind Link's crossbow training. I am trying to guess why some people are annoyed by it.
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 25, 2007, 12:54:18 PM
QuoteYea, for the record, I wasn't slighting you.
Originally posted by: pap64
Just in case, I don't mind Link's crossbow training. I am trying to guess why some people are annoyed by it.
Getting back on topic.... (I'll try, at least)
Whether or not Wii Zapper is "worth it", I'd hazard a guess, is going to be subjective. Find a friend, maybe ask at an EB/GS if you can demo one. Regardless, I think you'll get $10 of enjoyment out of the game. If the Zapper does nothing for you, you can sell it for $10 to a friend that wants an extra, or on Craig's list, or eBay. Hell, i'll buy it from you for $10.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 25, 2007, 01:52:32 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: 31 FlavasQuotePerhaps this is just nitpicking, but didn't Nintendo "whore" out Zelda with the 4 swords adventure game to sell GBAs and link cables? Or use the mainline GBC Zelda's to pimp the GameBoy Camera? What about the Tingle Tuner in Windwaker?
Originally posted by: pap64
I think what she means is that this is the first time Nintendo has used the Zelda series to sell a peripheral and created a spin off like mini game disc to do so.
In short, "the first time Nintendo has whored Zelda outside the main games".
It just seems rather arbitrary to now call "molestation" on something that has been standard issue, and well recieved, in nearly all Zelda games. Why can't that, like 4-swords was, be fleshed out into a game that will give value to the Wii Zapper? Link's crossbow training is quite short, maybe an hour or two to get all platinum medals, but it is by no means a crappy game.
The key points being that all those mentioned games were full fledged Zelda games, even Four Swords even if it was streamlined a bit. Link's Crossbow training is a shooting gallery game that has Link use something he hasn't ever SEEN in previous games. Next I suppose Nintendo will bring out Zelda the Light Gun game. Zelda never was meant to be a mini game collection, which is basically what Link's Crossbow training is. It is almost as bad as Metroid Pinball was even though I liked that game, though I cannot deny it whored out the franchise to something it was never intended to be. Also I do not believe I called it a bad game, but it doesn't change the fact that Nintendo is sucking off the Zelda franchise to make mini-game shooting gallery for a series that has been about adventuring and puzzle solving.
Post by: Mario on November 25, 2007, 02:26:23 PM
TP didn't even have a shooting gallery did it?
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on November 25, 2007, 02:32:57 PM
Post by: IceCold on November 25, 2007, 02:59:56 PM
Post by: MilkManX on November 25, 2007, 03:38:38 PM
1.) It takes time to adjust to it especially if you are use to just holding the Wii Mote
2.) Once you adjust(I am a righty and I found it better when I have my right hand on the trigger area and my left on the chuck...which is totally backwards from the Sub Machine Gun shape of the unit) it becomes alot better.
3.) I dont know about anyone else but I am having alot of fun with it and thats what I like about it!
Post by: BranDonk Kong on November 25, 2007, 03:53:28 PM
Post by: Nick DiMola on November 25, 2007, 04:17:12 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Brandogg
I played Link's Crossbow Training and MOH Heroes 2 with the Wii Zapper - and I think it totally kicks ass. Sure it doesn't actually change how you play the game, but it definitely gives you a more authentic "light gun feel" when you play the games. If you're not going to get games like MOH Heroes 2, Link's Crossbow Training (which is packed in obviously), Resident Evil: the Umbrella Chronicles, Ghost Squad, and the upcoming House of the Dead games, then you have no reason to get one, but if you are into those games, then you owe it to yourself to buy a Wii Zapper. It's awesome. On a side note, if you have the Nyko Charge Station, which includes replacement battery covers/grips, then you need to remove the grips when you use the Wii Zapper, or it doesn't completely "lock" into place, which is only an issue when reloading in arcade mode in MOH.
QFT. The Zapper is awesome and feels great, plus LCT is a great pack-in game and happens to be a ton of fun. After using the Zapper to play Ghost Squad, I couldn't imagine playing it without it.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 25, 2007, 04:59:58 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mario
Zelda was never meant to be 3D either. Things change.
TP didn't even have a shooting gallery did it?
Except that Zelda has always been about adventuring and puzzle solving from day 1, not some stand alone light gun shooter. While the graphical presentation has changed, the core basics of the series has stayed in tact with mini-games as more a fun diversion. Even Four Swords had those elements. I'm just worried that Nintendo is going to go down the Mario route with Zelda now that its popularity is waining and I see Link's Crossbow as a potential first step to whoring out the license like they attempted to do with Metroid Pinball, arguably even Hunters, genres that the series was never meant to be turned into.
Post by: ShyGuy on November 25, 2007, 05:23:40 PM
Post by: LuigiHann on November 25, 2007, 05:48:54 PM
I haven't played Link's Crossbow Training, but the impression I get is: it seems less like "whoring out the Zelda name" and more like "reusing the resources from Twilight Princess" because it's a low-budget game and reusing resources is cheap. I don't see this as a turning point or a worrying trend for the Zelda series... it could just as easily have looked like Wii Play or Wii Sports, but the Zelda world is a better fit for this sort of 3D game.
I also can't fathom why people keep complaining about Link using a crossbow. The world of Twilight Princess does seem like its technology is at the level where crossbows would exist.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 25, 2007, 05:55:05 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: LuigiHann
I quite enjoyed Metroid Prime Pinball, and would probably have no problem with Metroid Prime Pinball 2, if they made it... in my mind, it could become its own little sub-franchise with its fantastic graphics and clever implementation of Metroid regulars into well-designed pinball tables.
I haven't played Link's Crossbow Training, but the impression I get is: it seems less like "whoring out the Zelda name" and more like "reusing the resources from Twilight Princess" because it's a low-budget game and reusing resources is cheap. I don't see this as a turning point or a worrying trend for the Zelda series... it could just as easily have looked like Wii Play or Wii Sports, but the Zelda world is a better fit for this sort of 3D game.
I also can't fathom why people keep complaining about Link using a crossbow. The world of Twilight Princess does seem like its technology is at the level where crossbows would exist.
Whoring is pretty much stamping a respected franchise onto an unrelated genre (with a low budget usually) or takes one element not related to the overall genre of the game(Some of Ratchet and Clank games come to mind) and putting it on the market to make a cheap buck. They've been doing it with the Mario series ever since its inception. BTW like I said I liked Metroid Pinball but I cannot deny it was a low budget knockoff to suck off the Metroid name!
Post by: NWR_insanolord on November 25, 2007, 09:11:42 PM
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 25, 2007, 09:24:43 PM
Link's crossbow training is no different.
GP is made of fail and lose.
Post by: Chozo Ghost on November 25, 2007, 11:56:53 PM
Post by: Mario on November 26, 2007, 12:32:30 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 26, 2007, 07:16:34 AM
Post by: UncleBob on November 26, 2007, 07:27:07 AM
http://www.dmgice.com/news/goldcam/
Perhaps people should do research before making statements that aren't true.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 26, 2007, 07:39:04 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBob
First time Nintendo has "whored" out the Legend of Zelda franchise to pimp some accessory without using a "full fledged" Zelda game? Not so.
http://www.dmgice.com/news/goldcam/
Perhaps people should do research before making statements that aren't true.
Yeah because that was a widely distributed, not to mention it is basically a Zelda themed Game Boy Camera with some Zelda stamps, it may be whoring but it isn't what I'm talking about, it is more in line with the (awesome) Zelda themed NDS!. ::rolls eyes:: Maybe someone else should learn to read.
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 26, 2007, 10:22:07 AM
QuoteI don't think anyone is dismissing that LCT is short or could/should have this or that. But what do you expect for $10? It's just supposed to be a pack-in that is fun and gives some value to the initial Wii Zapper purchase.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Well i played and beat Zelda Crossbow Training. While it isn't terrible by any means, I'm not even sure it is worth $20 considering I beat it in 40 minutes or so. For a game that ripped everything from TP I would have thought they could have used more of the boss battles which were the highlight of the games SHORT lifespan.
What I do think most people are dismissing here is that LCT is "molestation" of the Zelda franchise. Hey, it's your opinion, you don't have to agree with us. Perhaps we need to just agree to disagree. But, LCT is really no more of a molestation then Mario Kart. Link is not suddely firing a Star Trek phazer gun or the Half-Life gauss gun. A crossbow is not out of place in the medieval-esqe Zelda universe nor is target shooting, even the bomb arrows come direct from Zelda.
Just as Mario Kart has made the Mario franchise IP better over all, Four-Swords Zelda has made the Zelda-franchise better over all. Since, now you can play a Zelda with a friend or three, just like with Mario Kart. Neither Four-Swords nor LCT should be a *replacement* for a traditional Zelda, but I think they do make great in-between games. Just like Mario Kart or Super Smash Bros are great in-between games.
Hence why I do not, at all, view LCT as any abomination, molestation, or whoring of the Zelda IP.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 26, 2007, 11:14:47 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: 31 FlavasQuoteI don't think anyone is dismissing that LCT is short or could/should have this or that. But what do you expect for $10? It's just supposed to be a pack-in that is fun and gives some value to the initial Wii Zapper purchase.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Well i played and beat Zelda Crossbow Training. While it isn't terrible by any means, I'm not even sure it is worth $20 considering I beat it in 40 minutes or so. For a game that ripped everything from TP I would have thought they could have used more of the boss battles which were the highlight of the games SHORT lifespan.
What I do think most people are dismissing here is that LCT is "molestation" of the Zelda franchise. Hey, it's your opinion, you don't have to agree with us. Perhaps we need to just agree to disagree. But, LCT is really no more of a molestation then Mario Kart. Link is not suddely firing a Star Trek phazer gun or the Half-Life gauss gun. A crossbow is not out of place in the medieval-esqe Zelda universe nor is target shooting, even the bomb arrows come direct from Zelda.
Just as Mario Kart has made the Mario franchise IP better over all, Four-Swords Zelda has made the Zelda-franchise better over all. Since, now you can play a Zelda with a friend or three, just like with Mario Kart. Neither Four-Swords nor LCT should be a *replacement* for a traditional Zelda, but I think they do make great in-between games. Just like Mario Kart or Super Smash Bros are great in-between games.
Hence why I do not, at all, view LCT as any abomination, molestation, or whoring of the Zelda IP.
Like I said Nintendo has been molesting and selling out the Mario franchise since almost day one, and yes I consider the Mario Kart games and any other "spin off' not related to the genre of that particular game to be whoring out the franchise to sell games. Four-Swords is 50xs the game then Crossbow Training is, and it retains many of Zelda's key components, puzzle solving and great boss battles. Crossbow Training is what? Zelda Wii Play that lasts 40 minutes. Also I'm not too sure we won't see the continuing decline in Zelda as a traditional game considering its popularity is waning but we'll just have to see about that. Crossbow Training at best shouldn't even be considered a in-between game considering the extremely short gameplay and lack of ANYTHING that has to do with the main components that make a Zelda game.
Zelda has been about these things:
Exploration
Puzzle Solving
It has NOT been about target practice besides a few mini-games, and even those were limited to shooting targets, not HotD lite. Heck it is pretty sad when the CDI games have more to do with what Zelda is then ZCT
Post by: 31 Flavas on November 26, 2007, 12:49:02 PM
QuoteHm... So if LCT was fleshed out more to a $40 or $50 game, perhaps sold independently, you'd stop your shenanigans? I mean, these ridiculous claims that LCT is on level or worse then the CDi games. You want to talk molestations? CDi Zelda is molestation of the franchise. Hotel Mario is molestation of the franchise. Mario Kart, Smash Brothers, Four-Swords these are the opposite of molestation. These are tender, loving, awesome extensions of the franchise. LCT is short, but I can't believe you're calling it CDi level molestation.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Like I said Nintendo has been molesting and selling out the Mario franchise since almost day one, and yes I consider the Mario Kart games and any other "spin off' not related to the genre of that particular game to be whoring out the franchise to sell games. Four-Swords is 50xs the game then Crossbow Training is, and it retains many of Zelda's key components, puzzle solving and great boss battles.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on November 26, 2007, 01:02:26 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: 31 FlavasQuoteHm... So if LCT was fleshed out more to a $40 or $50 game, perhaps sold independently, you'd stop your shenanigans? I mean, these ridiculous claims that LCT is on level or worse then the CDi games. You want to talk molestations? CDi Zelda is molestation of the franchise. Hotel Mario is molestation of the franchise. Mario Kart, Smash Brothers, Four-Swords these are the opposite of molestation. These are tender, loving, awesome extensions of the franchise. LCT is short, but I can't believe you're calling it CDi level molestation.
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Like I said Nintendo has been molesting and selling out the Mario franchise since almost day one, and yes I consider the Mario Kart games and any other "spin off' not related to the genre of that particular game to be whoring out the franchise to sell games. Four-Swords is 50xs the game then Crossbow Training is, and it retains many of Zelda's key components, puzzle solving and great boss battles.
I don't recall saying LCT is a bad game, I'm just saying the CDI games have more Zelda, how to put this, gameplay mechanics which defined the series then LCT. Like I said about Mario Nintendo has been whoring out the franchise for years! Does that make the games bad? Heck no, in fact I love some of the whored out Mario games, though I do NOT want to see Zelda go that route. Maybe it is just me, but I see Zelda, along with Metroid as franchises that should stick to their particular genre as close as possible, to remain true to their genre. Neither should be dumbed down to casual experiences or spin-off genres.
Post by: UncleBob on November 26, 2007, 03:48:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: UncleBob
First time Nintendo has "whored" out the Legend of Zelda franchise to pimp some accessory without using a "full fledged" Zelda game? Not so.
http://www.dmgice.com/news/goldcam/
Perhaps people should do research before making statements that aren't true.
Yeah because that was a widely distributed, not to mention it is basically a Zelda themed Game Boy Camera with some Zelda stamps, it may be whoring but it isn't what I'm talking about, it is more in line with the (awesome) Zelda themed NDS!. ::rolls eyes:: Maybe someone else should learn to read.
I'd have to say - I'd rather Nintendo make mildly amusing games with the Zelda brand than just throw the Triforce logo on something and try to sell it because it's Zelda...
Post by: ShyGuy on November 26, 2007, 05:26:26 PM
Post by: Infernal Monkey on December 05, 2007, 06:52:05 PM
Case.
Post by: Ghisy on December 05, 2007, 10:39:04 PM
I just need to find an empty white dvd case and print a custom cover art. Does anyone have a US custom cover art btw?
Post by: IceCold on December 06, 2007, 01:10:50 PM
QuoteWell if you bought the Euro version it wouldn't work in your system anyway, eh? So you'd have to buy both versions, one for the game and one for the case..
Originally posted by: Ghisy
Too bad 15 euros is too much for a case... (Euro retail price [30 euros] - US retail price [$20.00 which is 15 euros] = 15 euros)
I just need to find an empty white dvd case and print a custom cover art. Does anyone have a US custom cover art btw?
Post by: UncleBob on December 06, 2007, 01:16:40 PM
Official-like covers can be printed from thecoverproject.net. Be sure to stop by the forums and thank those who do such a great job.
Post by: Fred333 on December 07, 2007, 09:04:09 AM
Post by: ShyGuy on December 25, 2007, 04:41:21 PM
Post by: NWR_pap64 on December 25, 2007, 05:15:13 PM
I LOVE Crossbow training. The reason I love it so much is because it reminds me of classic zapper games of a bygone era, like "Duck hunt", "Hogan's alley" and "Gumshoe" on the NES and "Safari Hunt" and "Gangster Town" on the Master System. I got addicted to it the first time I played it. I wouldn't stop playing the same three levels till I got a high score.
Frankly, I don't understand why people say it cheapens the Zelda franchise. In fact, I think it makes it stronger thanks to all the nostalgia. Even if they recycled everything from graphics to sound effects I started to remember great Twilight Princess moments at the sight of them.
The zapper feels good, too. I think it adds to the experience if you play with it. Controls are tricky in some of the levels but once you get the hang of them you can move around with ease.
Overall, the game's awesome. I don't care what everyone else thinks, I really enjoyed it.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on December 25, 2007, 06:37:11 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: pap64
My nephew got the Zapper and Link's Crossbow Training for Christmas so I was able to try it out.
I LOVE Crossbow training. The reason I love it so much is because it reminds me of classic zapper games of a bygone era, like "Duck hunt", "Hogan's alley" and "Gumshoe" on the NES and "Safari Hunt" and "Gangster Town" on the Master System. I got addicted to it the first time I played it. I wouldn't stop playing the same three levels till I got a high score.
Frankly, I don't understand why people say it cheapens the Zelda franchise. In fact, I think it makes it stronger thanks to all the nostalgia. Even if they recycled everything from graphics to sound effects I started to remember great Twilight Princess moments at the sight of them.
The zapper feels good, too. I think it adds to the experience if you play with it. Controls are tricky in some of the levels but once you get the hang of them you can move around with ease.
Overall, the game's awesome. I don't care what everyone else thinks, I really enjoyed it.
Pap supports Zelda Pinball and Zelda Hang gliding next!
Post by: UncleBob on December 26, 2007, 12:18:54 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
So I got the game for Christmas. It's fun. my sister really likes it, but I still think it cheapens the Zelda franchise. Even a small story/cutscene explaining how some benefactor has given link a magic Crossbow with unlimited arrows would have helped.
People are concerned about the crossbow with unlimited arrows, but no one is concerned with the regular bow from Zelda 1 that magically deducts a rupee from your pocket every time you fire an arrow.
Post by: Ceric on December 26, 2007, 01:16:26 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBobQuote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
So I got the game for Christmas. It's fun. my sister really likes it, but I still think it cheapens the Zelda franchise. Even a small story/cutscene explaining how some benefactor has given link a magic Crossbow with unlimited arrows would have helped.
People are concerned about the crossbow with unlimited arrows, but no one is concerned with the regular bow from Zelda 1 that magically deducts a rupee from your pocket every time you fire an arrow.
For the record I wish they go back to that. I mean I know it doesn't make much sense but I hate collecting arrows and bombs and what have you while I'm sitting on a variable fortune of useless Rupees.
Post by: UncleBob on December 26, 2007, 11:23:28 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on December 26, 2007, 11:25:28 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: UncleBob
I actually think that's part of the problem with the Zelda series and rupees. They need to stop putting such items around fields and such and actually make you buy them. That's one way they could up the difficulty level a bit, perhaps "Easy" has items in grass and "Hard" doesn't....
Because making things more tedious means difficult.
Post by: UncleBob on December 26, 2007, 11:40:35 AM
Post by: Kairon on December 26, 2007, 11:46:34 AM
It's official people. The warm and happy feelings from Christmas have now worn off.
Post by: NWR_pap64 on December 26, 2007, 12:11:13 PM
Post by: Uncle Bob on December 26, 2007, 12:14:37 PM
Post by: Infernal Monkey on December 26, 2007, 01:36:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Pap supports Zelda Pinball and Zelda Hang gliding next!
Anything's better than another Twilight Princess garbage dump game!
_
Post by: Chozo Ghost on December 26, 2007, 02:59:31 PM
Post by: UncleBob on December 26, 2007, 03:35:59 PM
Oh, and there must be Monster Hunting from FSA. That rocked.
Post by: Kairon on December 26, 2007, 03:41:53 PM
Post by: UncleBob on December 26, 2007, 03:49:16 PM
