Post by: wandering on September 20, 2006, 08:30:27 PM
A:
Quote
Originally posted by: Sir_Stabbalot
Your character survives a crash landing in the middle of the Atlantic ocean and manages to swim to a lighthouse that is oddly sticking out in the middle of the sea. Inside is a small one-man bathysphere that takes you to Rapture. Rapture is a city made by an ex-Soviet citizen who created a super-capitolist city on the ocean flor encased in a huge glass dome. The city is spawling and filled with 50s-era sttyled buildings, but when you arrive it's in ruins. One of the focal points of the game is a substance called "Adam". It's a mutagen made from a sea slug that secretes pure stem cells. The question is this: How much of your humanity will you give up for power?
Gameplay terms, it's a sci-fi horror FPS with many ways to achieve an objective.
Q: Sounds great! When can I get a copy?
A: In North America, it's coming out for both the Xbox 360 and PC on August 21.
Q: Will I be able to play it on the crappy PC I bought five years ago?
Probably not! Here are the system requirements:
Minimum:
Operating System: Windows XP with Service Pack 2 or Windows Vista
CPU: Pentium 4 2.4 GHz (single core)
System RAM: 1 GB
Video card: DirectX 9.0c compliant card with 128MB RAM (NVIDIA 6600/ATI X1300 or better, excluding ATI X1550)
Sound card: 100% DirectX 9.0c compliant card
Internet connection: Required for activation
Hard disc space: 8 GB of free space
Recommended:
Operating System: Windows XP with Service Pack 2 or Windows Vista
CPU: Intel Core 2 Duo
System RAM: 2 GB
Video card: DirectX 9.0c compliant card with 512MB RAM (NVIDIA 7900GT or better) or DirectX 10 compliant card (NVIDIA 8600 or better)
Sound card: Sound Blaster X-Fi (Optimized for EAX ADVANCED HD 4.0/5.0 compatible cards)
Internet connection: Required for activation
Hard disc space: 8 GB of free space
Q: What does the game look like?
A: Like this:
Q: This game looks so good, I want to give its creators as much money as possible.
You should get the Collector's Edition, which comes in an embossed steel case, and includes a soundtrack cd, a making of dvd, and a 6 inch tall Big Daddy figurine.
Q: Where can I get more information?
Check out the offcial site, or the cult of rapture (another offcial site), or the game's wikipedia page.
---
(Originally, a different post occupied this space. In it, I pointed to this video, and fawned over it.)
Post by: Smoke39 on September 20, 2006, 09:01:52 PM
edit: I'm refering to the original Deus Ex, not the vastly inferior sequal, Invisible War.
Post by: ShyGuy on September 20, 2006, 09:23:14 PM
Post by: couchmonkey on September 21, 2006, 05:52:24 AM
(Yes, this game looks tasty).
Post by: Ceric on September 21, 2006, 06:41:25 AM
Utopia goes wrong whats not to like?
Though from the screens I've seen and the things I read it might be a little to disturbing for my tastes.
Edit: I do have to say I have a hard time seriously believing this story. Not so much the story itself but there not being non-combatants.
Post by: couchmonkey on September 21, 2006, 10:34:53 AM
Watched the video, the game looks pretty nifty, but I found the guy was overselling a lot of it. Like he was really into the AI characters fighting each other, and it looks like the game does that aspect well, but at the same time, it's not like that's a brand-new addition to first person shooters (see Halo and Time Splitters 2, for example).
Nevertheless, interesting game. I might check it out sometime.
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 21, 2006, 11:21:07 AM
Post by: IceCold on September 21, 2006, 02:00:28 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 21, 2006, 03:21:15 PM
Post by: ShyGuy on September 21, 2006, 03:48:54 PM
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 21, 2006, 04:14:25 PM
Hopefully the demo just sucked and the game will get better. DX10 is a bitch though.
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 21, 2006, 04:21:23 PM
Post by: wandering on September 21, 2006, 05:10:34 PM
Quote
Nothing really looked all that new either, certainly not "redefining the genre..."
I think the newish thing going on here (and I could be wrong, I'm not all that familiar with the genre) is how goal oriented the npcs are. If you followed a running scientist in goldeneye, he wouldn't really run anywhere in particular, and would eventually just dissapear. If you followed a Big Brother in BS, he'd walk around until he found a tank with a little sister. And then the two of them would walk around until they found a dead body - possibly one you created. And then the little sister would harvest the blood, etc. The npcs aren't just given the illusion of goals, they actually act in ways that make sense for creatures whose sole purpose in life is to get tasty ADAM. Little sisters harvest the ADAM. Big brothers protect the little sisters. Splicers take the ADAM.
Knowing their goals, you can then manipulate the npcs to your advantage. You can trick the big brothers into thinking you're a little sister, for example. You want to do this because your goal isn't to figure out how to kill everything in sight - it's to survive and get as much ADAM as other resources as you can.
I find this interesting.
Quote
the game looks pretty nifty, but I found the guy was overselling a lot of it.
Agreed. ('You can even go into the bathroom!')
Also, and perhaps this was intentional, he didn't focus on some of the more interesting things going on. Like the dead body stuck in automatic door, ha ha.
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 21, 2006, 05:37:37 PM
In Oblivion, I can put a curse on an enemy and make him attack another enemy, leaving me safe. Same in Bioshock. In fact, everything shown today was basically Oblivion in a cooler setting and with guns. It's FPS + RPG....which is exactly what System Shock 2 was, which was what Deus Ex was (from what I understand, I never played that one). It's cool that it's a successor to those, in fact that's pretty awesome, but I didn't really see anything too new here. I don't know. I guess I'm just peeved at how the guy tried to sell the thing :P
Post by: IceCold on September 21, 2006, 05:38:47 PM
Post by: ShyGuy on September 21, 2006, 05:48:46 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 21, 2006, 05:52:39 PM
Post by: SixthAngel on September 21, 2006, 06:31:22 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: KnowsNothing
I was pretty interested in the game, but that demo was incredibly dull. Nothing really looked all that new either, certainly not "redefining the genre..."
My thoughts exactly. It looks like a good FPS but thats it. I saw better AI but nothing amazing. He also talked about how you aren't stuck in simple corridors like in other FPS games and then preceded to walk from one to the next with the extra area you could explore being a bathroom. I was exploring bathrooms back in Duke Nukem 3d, give me a more open setting. I was hoping for an Elder Scrolls type openness when he mentioned it and was sorely disappointed. Since the game is underwater I don't think there is much hope for later in the game either. I think the game looks good but if you say "redifining the genre" I am going to need a lot more then this.
Post by: wandering on September 21, 2006, 06:57:37 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on September 21, 2006, 07:07:00 PM
Post by: ShyGuy on September 21, 2006, 10:07:36 PM
Post by: KDR_11k on September 22, 2006, 01:40:27 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 22, 2006, 01:44:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Smoke: You may notice that that's a common trait among all early FPS games. Doom, Quake, Descent, all of them had level designs that had more exploration than today's fancy corridor level design.
How DARE you not mention Wolfenstein 3D that pretty much created the First Person Shooter genre
Post by: Smoke39 on September 22, 2006, 03:24:04 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KDR_11k
Smoke: You may notice that that's a common trait among all early FPS games. Doom, Quake, Descent, all of them had level designs that had more exploration than today's fancy corridor level design.
Yeah, you're right. That's a large part of why recent FPSs have been disapointing me. Duke 3D was just one that was mentioned, and that I've personally had a lot of experience with. A lot of people seem to use the excuse that levels need to be structured really restrictively in order to be able to tell a linear story, but games like Deus Ex (and hopefully Bioshock!) beg to differ. I mean, games like Prey and HL2 don't even tell very much story, and yet they had some of the most straightforward and boring level design ever.
VGR: What about Blood? Shadow Warrior? Jedi Knight? An exhaustive list of past, influential shooters wasn't necessary for him to make his point.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 22, 2006, 06:08:40 AM
.
Post by: wandering on September 28, 2006, 12:24:38 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on September 28, 2006, 01:07:41 PM
Post by: wandering on September 28, 2006, 02:38:59 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on September 28, 2006, 02:41:36 PM
Post by: KnowsNothing on September 28, 2006, 02:47:02 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 28, 2006, 03:37:47 PM
More gameplay, less FMV with intended violence to little girls...
Post by: SixthAngel on September 28, 2006, 07:29:30 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Any video that isn't gameplay can't be used to showcase the direction a game is trying to take... =\
More gameplay, less FMV with intended violence to little girls...
I was also a bit confused about why they chose to have the player try to beat the hell out of little girl with a wrench when no reason is given. They even offered that as a selling point to the game (the decisions are yours part). I was rooting for the big daddy to kill him the whole time.
Post by: Smoke39 on September 28, 2006, 07:53:38 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 28, 2006, 08:10:35 PM
Post by: Ceric on September 29, 2006, 12:30:48 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 29, 2006, 12:39:48 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on September 29, 2006, 12:53:44 PM
They're smart, but they're playin' with fire. Something bad happens, and everything spirals outa control and goes downhill.
Post by: wandering on August 03, 2007, 12:30:56 PM
Quote
These are the big challenges developers have been struggling to master for decades; narrative, emergence, a sense of place. If another game did just one of these as well as Bioshock, it would immediately qualify as a classic. When a game comes along that does all three, we can only be baffled and thankful. I spend my career, and my gaming life, waiting for a moment when a game just astonishes me, when I can't believe what I'm seeing, what I'm doing. Bioshock has five.
August 21 can't come soon enough.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 03, 2007, 12:36:32 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: wandering
So PC Gamer UK gave this game 95%, and had this to say:Quote
These are the big challenges developers have been struggling to master for decades; narrative, emergence, a sense of place. If another game did just one of these as well as Bioshock, it would immediately qualify as a classic. When a game comes along that does all three, we can only be baffled and thankful. I spend my career, and my gaming life, waiting for a moment when a game just astonishes me, when I can't believe what I'm seeing, what I'm doing. Bioshock has five.
Nice, I expect the game to be amazing. I just hope it isn't overlooked.
Post by: tiamat1990 on August 03, 2007, 11:55:04 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 04, 2007, 04:46:00 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: tiamat1990
Ok I really had no idea what the hell this game was about. I head everyone having an orgasm about it but I ignored the hype. Well I just stumbled upon a video in YouTube and HOLY ****!!!!!
Your character survives a crash landing in the middle of the Atlantic ocean and manages to swim to a lighthouse that is oddly sticking out in the middle of the sea. Inside is a small one-man bathysphere that takes you to Rapture. Rapture is a city made by an ex-Soviet citizen who created a super-capitolist city on the ocean flor encased in a huge glass dome. The city is spawling and filled with 50s-era sttyled buildings, but when you arrive it's in ruins. One of the focal points of the game is a substance called "Adam". It's a mutagen made from a sea slug that secretes pure stem cells. The question is this: How much of your humanity will you give up for power?
Gameplay terms, it's a sci-fi horror FPS with many ways to achieve an objective.
Post by: Kairon on August 04, 2007, 10:14:31 AM
But I've heard this game is good... I just don't want to hear it compared to Ayn Rand.
Post by: tiamat1990 on August 04, 2007, 08:31:02 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Sir_StabbalotQuote
Originally posted by: tiamat1990
Ok I really had no idea what the hell this game was about. I head everyone having an orgasm about it but I ignored the hype. Well I just stumbled upon a video in YouTube and HOLY ****!!!!!
Your character survives a crash landing in the middle of the Atlantic ocean and manages to swim to a lighthouse that is oddly sticking out in the middle of the sea. Inside is a small one-man bathysphere that takes you to Rapture. Rapture is a city made by an ex-Soviet citizen who created a super-capitolist city on the ocean flor encased in a huge glass dome. The city is spawling and filled with 50s-era sttyled buildings, but when you arrive it's in ruins. One of the focal points of the game is a substance called "Adam". It's a mutagen made from a sea slug that secretes pure stem cells. The question is this: How much of your humanity will you give up for power?
Gameplay terms, it's a sci-fi horror FPS with many ways to achieve an objective.
Yeah I saw his 15min video and the developer was just playing the same level over and over again. While that is cool (VERY cool infact)...the longetivity of this game worries me. It's like, they're spending so much time on ONE level. I don't know. I still won't be able to get it anyway, computer is crap and I don't have a 360 (and man do I want one...).
Post by: TrueNerd on August 15, 2007, 01:55:18 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 15, 2007, 02:50:51 PM
Even though my computer is only slightly over the minimum specs and I do not yet own a 360, I'm so tempted to get the Bioshock LE just for the Big Daddy figurine.
EDIT: Ha, my explanation is quoted in the OP.
Post by: bustin98 on August 15, 2007, 02:54:43 PM
Post by: JonLeung on August 15, 2007, 03:48:59 PM
Post by: TrueNerd on August 16, 2007, 10:04:01 AM
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 10:13:20 AM
Seems a lot like Doom 3 though
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 10:16:39 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
Me and my brosef played some demo the other night, it's pretty kewl.
Seems a lot like Doom 3 though
The game is nothing like Doom 3 besides the first person view. It trashes Doom 3 in about every possible way, whether it be art style, story, gameplay, and atmosphere.
Post by: ryancoke on August 16, 2007, 11:16:05 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 11:20:59 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ryancoke
they better port it to PS3.....
And have it run at 10fps.
Post by: Kairon on August 16, 2007, 11:44:31 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 11:48:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
GOTY material?
Well it definately looks that way but I can only go off the demo. The game is well rounded, and has some of the best atmosphere I've seen in a game this year. It is kind of funny, I was blown away when I seen the visuals but when I went to Gamefaqs people were complaining about how the visuals suck.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 12:23:57 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
The game is nothing like Doom 3 besides the first person view. It trashes Doom 3 in about every possible way, whether it be art style, story, gameplay, and atmosphere.
The graphics and art are amazing, but it's really just another boo! monster-in-the-closet game
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 12:31:50 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-RQuote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
The game is nothing like Doom 3 besides the first person view. It trashes Doom 3 in about every possible way, whether it be art style, story, gameplay, and atmosphere.
The graphics and art are amazing, but it's really just another boo! monster-in-the-closet game
Everything from what I've read this game is far from another boo! game, it appears to be more psychological then boo scary anyway. It requires you later on to make some very disturbing and quite unique choices. which I will cover up in spoilers.
There are various parts of the game where if you are low in energy you have to make the choice on whether or not to harm a child in order to get your energy. This brings you to the Big Daddy who is a virtually harmless character, and you must choose whether to murder it and sap the energy from the child
In addition that the game is extremely atmospheric and the myriad of reviews out already show this game is more than your everyday shooter, it is a unique experience.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 12:35:46 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 12:37:41 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
Have you actually played it yet?
I've played the demo. As I state I've also read the review that explain the mechanics of the game as well (not to mention the fact I've been following it pretty closely since the first gameplay footage was revealed). Not only that but the companies previous series, System Shock, is a highly regarded series that I NEED to try.
With all that said I think Metroid Prime 3 is going to be far better
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 12:44:02 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 16, 2007, 12:48:29 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
Have you actually played it yet?
Yes, and the comparison to Doom 3 is totally broken.
Doom 3's scares were monster-in-the-closet style. Bioshock's scare isn't that, but the fact that the enemies you face are the ruined leftovers of something that was once human. It's not having a zombie pop up behind you, it's having a horribly mutated man swinging a wrench wildly at you while screaming that he's not a bad person.
And the gameplay comparison is wrong, also. It's a spiritual successor to System Shock, so if that' any indication, you'll often have to conserve ammo and choose whether to fight or flee.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 12:48:52 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
So, as I was saying, it's a lot like Doom 3. No flashlight though, lol.
Doom 3 has nothing on Bioshock, the game is 50xs more engrossing (if the demo is any indication) and has a diverse environment to explore. Doom 3 was a cooridor shooter with no story, and was all about running around in repetitive cooridors. It had nothing like the plasmatic offensive weapon combined with normal arsenal, which can be used to develop different strategies. Not only that but the game supposedly keeps you involved throughout with consistent dialogue, making the world come alive.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 01:05:05 PM
- and I take issue with your statements! Please don't pee on my leg and and tell me it's raining, and don't tell me that these edgy, arty, story-driven ruined monster people don't come out of closets and say boo, because they do. But mostly don't pee on me :[
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 16, 2007, 01:11:14 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
I'm more than familiar with the content of Doom 3 and System Shock and pretty much every first person shooter ever, so I don't really need to be told about it, lol
Oh, sorry. I just, y'know, had to go. I hope those weren't new pants...
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 01:12:48 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
I'm more than familiar with the content of Doom 3 and System Shock and pretty much every first person shooter ever, so I don't really need to be told about it, lol
I'm sorry but only the boogeyman comes out of the closet, so you are WRONG.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 01:19:32 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 01:35:19 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
I'm pretty sure the scene where the alarm goes off, the doors lock, and the goons start pouring in qualifies as a monster in the closet scene. And maybe also the part where the demo ended with the dudes banging on the glass. I remember that same scene from Doom 3 where you encounter the first big bull demon, and that was a lot cooler then.
All I remember from Doom 3 was a cool final boss, and lots of running through metal cooridors shooting enemies.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 01:50:48 PM
"ohshitohshitohshit"
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 03:26:24 PM
I can't wait!
Post by: Smoke39 on August 16, 2007, 03:29:00 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 03:29:45 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Smoke39
Bioshock's available for preloading on Steam in case anyone's too lazy to go to the store on the 21st.
Supposedly the street date has been broken, I bet 2K is ticked off!
Naughty Toys R Us
I like the part where early copies are going for over $150 on ebay!
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 16, 2007, 03:39:33 PM
Post by: Mashiro on August 16, 2007, 03:41:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Smoke39
Bioshock's available for preloading on Steam in case anyone's too lazy to go to the store on the 21st.
Supposedly the street date has been broken, I bet 2K is ticked off!
Naughty Toys R Us
I like the part where early copies are going for over $150 on ebay!
Well they will make some money out of it at least.
(Right? Breaking the street date = fine to the dealers?)
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 16, 2007, 03:45:07 PM
Post by: UERD on August 16, 2007, 04:38:12 PM
Quote
(Right? Breaking the street date = fine to the dealers?)
I don't think so. Basically, the publishers try to make the retailers think that if they break the date, they won't let them sell the next blockbuster game. But it doesn't work, because the retailers know that the publishers need them to put out their merchandise :P. There's always legal action, but it's usually not worth it in a minor case like this.
Quote
I swear though people are insane to pay $150 for any game to get it a week early!
Someone sold one of those leaked copies of Harry Potter on eBay for like $250, and that's for a book that you'll finish in a couple of hours (as opposed to a game, which can take a time commitment of days to weeks). But if Starcraft 2 has a special edition that costs lots of money, it will be the first and last time I ever pay $100+ for a game (at least until next next generation, where all new console games will come on holographic chips that cost $500 to manufacture).
Post by: Dirk Temporo on August 17, 2007, 06:33:33 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
Sweet. Let me know what the multiplayer is like.
There is no multiplayer.
Post by: S-U-P-E-R on August 17, 2007, 10:20:28 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Dirk TemporoQuote
Originally posted by: S-U-P-E-R
Sweet. Let me know what the multiplayer is like.
There is no multiplayer.
I guess it was inevitable that that troll would fly over someone's head
Post by: Smoke39 on August 17, 2007, 11:45:20 PM
Post by: Kairon on August 18, 2007, 01:14:41 AM
Post by: Smoke39 on August 18, 2007, 05:07:56 PM
Post by: bustin98 on August 18, 2007, 07:26:03 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 20, 2007, 12:14:03 PM
18 hours to go! =|
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 20, 2007, 12:17:59 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Since I don't have my 360 connected to the internets right now (because here in my apartment my TV is downstairs, my router is upstairs, and I don't feel like dragging a cable down), I'm going to try the PC demo that just came out...
18 hours to go! =|
Didn't know you were getting Bioshock Bill.
Post by: Kairon on August 20, 2007, 05:03:47 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on August 21, 2007, 01:56:11 AM
I could buy a shiny new graphics card for a little over a hundred bucks, but considering I'm stuck with AGP and a primitive single-core processor I'm wondering if I'd be better off finally building a new computer. :/
Post by: UltimatePartyBear on August 21, 2007, 03:36:53 AM
Post by: ShyGuy on August 21, 2007, 11:09:37 AM
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 21, 2007, 11:21:50 AM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 21, 2007, 11:27:39 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
So I hear this games sucks now because it crops the image in 16:9 mode.
Quote
Originally posted by: Professional 666
What's that? Forced letterboxing on PCs?
The explanation I heard is that the game was developed for widescreen and in 4:3 it renders the areas that normally wouldn't be there. The reverse of cropping, actually.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 21, 2007, 11:34:27 AM
So much for the widescreen revolution.
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 21, 2007, 11:44:57 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Professional 666
Aha, so you REGAIN real estate?
So much for the widescreen revolution.
Yep.
Never really liked widescreens, personally.
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 21, 2007, 01:55:32 PM
I couldn't even play the game, so I guess I'll have to just make a gamble and jump into the 360 version without knowing whether I'll like it or not... =)
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 21, 2007, 02:00:41 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Well the PC demo doesn't run for **** on my computer, which runs Half-Life 2 (+ Epi 1) at its maximum settings at optimal framerate...Yay for unefficient PC software...
I couldn't even play the game, so I guess I'll have to just make a gamble and jump into the 360 version without knowing whether I'll like it or not... =)
Or get the 360 demo.
And I know how you feel, a full day of torrenting only to find out it runs like molasses.
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 21, 2007, 02:56:01 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 21, 2007, 02:57:49 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
But that'd require me either bringing my TV and 360 up here to my router or getting a really, REALLY long ethernet cable to take downstairs... =3
Shut up and carry it you sissy.
Seriously, do it. At the very least you'll be able to make a decision without risking $60.
Post by: ShyGuy on August 21, 2007, 03:00:17 PM
The gameplay (when you were actually playing not just observing whatever the game wanted you to see or listening to the radio man) was good, I get the Doom3 comparisons, the game is very dark and alternates between foreboding and frantic. Seems like a very good shooter, just not revolutionary.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 21, 2007, 09:52:26 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 22, 2007, 12:25:28 PM
I'm up to where you run into Dr. Steinman for the first time...It's a really good game so far...Probably not a 10, but this is definitely at least 9 material...
My favorite part about this game is that the enemies have little psychotic conversations with themselves and other enemies, and it really adds a lot to the atmosphere!
Post by: that Baby guy on August 22, 2007, 12:29:13 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 22, 2007, 12:44:50 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on August 23, 2007, 03:27:45 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 23, 2007, 03:34:20 PM
Post by: Smoke39 on August 23, 2007, 03:54:09 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 23, 2007, 04:34:31 PM
Back on topic, one thing I really like about this game is that enemies "respawn" in a really convincing manner...You could backtrack to an area and you might see an enemy enter into the room from another entrance, giving the illusion that they've just wandered in from another part of the city...(Or sometimes they might come in behind you a minute later...One time, I entered a room, ransacked some goodies, and turned around to find a Splicer coming in and being surprised by my being there...Neat stuff...)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 23, 2007, 09:33:20 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 23, 2007, 10:47:21 PM
Post by: Caliban on August 24, 2007, 02:53:44 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 24, 2007, 02:58:18 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Caliban
Even though I am not able to get this game at the moment, I still want to hear how good the soundtrack is for this gorgeous game.
The limited edition soundtrack is terrible, it only has 3 songs and they are lame except for Under the Sea.
Post by: Dirk Temporo on August 24, 2007, 03:44:55 PM
Commies, that's who. Deus Ex is an amazing game.
Post by: Mashiro on August 25, 2007, 05:10:32 AM
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 25, 2007, 09:27:12 AM
Post by: Caliban on August 25, 2007, 09:36:48 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Caliban
Even though I am not able to get this game at the moment, I still want to hear how good the soundtrack is for this gorgeous game.
The limited edition soundtrack is terrible, it only has 3 songs and they are lame except for Under the Sea.
12 tracks on that free download. /Ownage
Pro666, from what I read somewhere else (on kotaku I think), if you uninstall the game prior to reinstalling it you can install as many times as you want, what securom(sp?) does is prevent you from doing more than 2 installations for seperate machines.
Post by: Caliban on August 25, 2007, 09:49:33 AM
Post by: Ceric on August 25, 2007, 10:15:52 AM
Post by: Smoke39 on August 25, 2007, 11:10:11 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Ceric
You could just play the 360 version.
Unless you don't have a 360 or want decent controls. I wonder if the Steam version is free of this junk.
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 26, 2007, 12:41:19 PM
Post by: UERD on August 26, 2007, 03:38:15 PM
Highlights of the review, referring to the XBox and PC-exclusive title:
Quote
...Let this game cook in the oven just a little bit longer and wait for the superior PS3 version. Cleaned up textures, animations, AI, extra weapons, Home space, standard HDD and Blu-ray will make this flawed game into a perfect gem.
Post by: Ceric on August 26, 2007, 03:49:40 PM
Post by: Kairon on August 26, 2007, 04:21:21 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 26, 2007, 04:40:20 PM
"So which is the better version?"
Between the PC and 360 version? I have a really recent computer, yet the game runs at an unplayable framerate even on medium settings...If you can somehow get the game running at its max settings on your rig, and you prefer using the mouse, then I see no real reason to avoid it...But if your computer hates the demo and you have a 360, definitely bite for the 360 version...
Post by: ShyGuy on August 26, 2007, 04:44:55 PM
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 26, 2007, 04:53:05 PM
2.13 GHz CPU speed performance-rated at 4.80 GHz (need 2.13 GHz)
2 GB RAM (need 1 GB)
NVIDIA GeForce 7500 LE video card
256 MB Video RAM (need 128 MB)
Video Card 3D Acceleration (required)
Video HW Transform & Lighting [i[(required)
Vertex Shader Ver. 3.0 (need 3.0)
Pixel Shader Ver. 3.0 (need 3.0)
Everything I have passes with flying colors, so I have no idea what's up... =)
Post by: ShyGuy on August 26, 2007, 05:12:45 PM
The only thing that's really bigger than yours is the video card, so I'm guessing you have to upgrade. Or maybe you have a bunch of bloatware running in the background.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 26, 2007, 07:26:41 PM
What I have:
-4GB of RAM
-8800 GTX
-E6600
So my guess is that I should be able to run the game great, heck before I upgraded the RAM I could play Oblivion on ultra with smooth framerates.
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 27, 2007, 02:32:42 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
The only thing that's really bigger than yours is the video card, so I'm guessing you have to upgrade.
Too bad I have no desire to upgrade my PC for the same price as a console, especially when the console version is just fine and dandy at its max PC settings at a silky smooth 30 fps... =3
Post by: ShyGuy on August 27, 2007, 03:45:34 AM
Post by: UERD on August 27, 2007, 04:01:29 AM
Post by: ShyGuy on August 27, 2007, 05:32:32 AM
Post by: Svevan on August 30, 2007, 06:50:53 AM
And though the world is beautiful, it's just too damn dark. Every area has the exact same style, with dank wet corners, creepy music, and one isolated light illuminating important objects. And the best way to make my progress feel jilted and un-organic? Have a guy narrate to me every single flipping step I need to take. Metroid is better at this (though even it falls into campy description sometimes) and takes the idea of isolation far more seriously. Get rid of Atlas, and the game may have demanded some truly unique storytelling methods, born out of gameplay and visuals, not stupid audio diaries that are conveniently dispersed throughout the levels.
I know I'm only two hours into the thing, and hopefully someone will tell me that it gets better. The plain truth though is that I'm anywhere from 15 to 25% done with the game, and so far the coolest thing that happened was the opening plane crash and the descent into Rapture. After that, it has failed to capture any of the magic I was promised.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 30, 2007, 08:03:32 AM
And so,
is Bioshock (and surrounding consumer interest) evidence that the first-person-kill-things-and-not-much-else genre was and is still stale?
That masking the traditional, perpetual kill-things-and-not-much-else objectives with a new set of animations and pizazz is a guise that's good enough to win people over?
gamespot believes so, and they're elite enough to get Metroid lock boxes
Post by: Kairon on August 30, 2007, 08:04:59 AM
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 30, 2007, 08:08:51 AM
8.5 metroid ftw
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 30, 2007, 08:19:18 AM
Post by: Kairon on August 30, 2007, 08:20:26 AM
Post by: bustin98 on August 30, 2007, 09:11:27 AM
Hmm, I haven't said anything good about Sony either.... On no! I'm a plant also! And I haven't gotten my fill of sunlight today
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 30, 2007, 09:16:30 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: bustin98
GP is sounding more and more like a MS plant. Its been said before and I'm saying it again. I don't think there's been one good thing that's come out of her typing regarding Sony.
Hmm, I haven't said anything good about Sony either.... On no! I'm a plant also! And I haven't gotten my fill of sunlight today
I said that Warhawk was a good but shallow game, isn't that kind of positive? Lol. Regardless I got Bioshock for the PC!
Post by: vudu on August 30, 2007, 09:22:57 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 30, 2007, 09:24:35 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: vudu
Back in November she said she was going to make lots of money camping out for a PS3 and then selling it on eBay. Does that count?
Which I sadly didn't, stupid people all having the same idea ruined EVERYTHING. ::CRY:: ALso I think owning a PS3 counts for something even if it is basically my blu-ray and demo player!
Post by: Kairon on August 30, 2007, 09:26:55 AM
Post by: ShyGuy on August 30, 2007, 09:27:21 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 30, 2007, 09:28:57 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
One year from now, Bioshock will be Prey. Mark my words.
I don't recall Prey getting as high of praise as Bioshock!
Post by: Caliban on August 30, 2007, 09:31:52 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Die GP. Die.
I was about to post that too in regards to her killer7 comment.
Post by: Mashiro on August 30, 2007, 12:44:22 PM
Sorry.
Post by: Caliban on August 30, 2007, 12:48:42 PM
Post by: Svevan on August 30, 2007, 06:26:20 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I never played Killer7, nor will I ever play Killer7. Looks like crap.
Sorry.
Thanks for airing your ignorance to everyone.
Post by: Svevan on August 30, 2007, 06:40:13 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Evan if you were expecting MGS type gameplay, then you will be very dissapointed.
I wasn't expecting MGS type gameplay, who said that? I just compared the concept of multiple options during linear gameplay, which both games purport, but only one actually has.
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
The game feels like an interactive movie, not to mention the moral chocies you must make which WILL impact you later on.
I am sure the "moral" choices I make may impact me later, but so far I don't think I've actually made any - did I choose to put plasmids in my veins and pump eve into my bloodstream? No, the game forced me to do that.
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Bioshock is like Killer7, except instead of just style it has gameplay to back it up.
I don't think the comparison to Killer7 is apt, nor do I think it lacking diverse gameplay (which Bioshock lacks too) is in any way an insult.
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Also is it just me or is someone complaining about the narrative style of Bioshock being forced, while being a big fan of the MGS games a tad bit, um inconsistent?
Again, MGS and Bioshock are not comparable, especially when it comes to narrative devices. The two games are so wildly different, one never removes its first person perspective and puts dumb audio diaries and a disembodied voice in the place of any other valid storytelling measures, while the other uses cinemas and audio conversations, that take you out of the character of Snake, to tell its story.
There are some great sequences in Bioshock that are purely cinematic, like when you find Dr. Steinman or when entering the Medical Pavillion and the splicers try to bust through the glass windows; these very accomplished sequences only propel the individual story of how you're going to get where, or who is doing what right now. They do not ever speak to the history or backstory, that is reserved for the audio of the game, forcefed by a bland character-device. Half-Life did what Bioshock is trying to do (tell a story from first-person only), and did it ten times better, in my limited play time with both. Bioshock's actively cinematic parts are great, and it may have created a fully-fleshed world that I just don't get (yet), but it is hampered narratively by devices that are not organic, but tacked on out of necessity. MGS may have its problems, but I think its ability to make the cinemas affect the gameplay is unprecedented and unseen today.
Post by: Kairon on August 30, 2007, 07:04:23 PM
Wake me up when games play more like MASQ and less like Fable.
Yes. I said it. Fable doesn't have moral choices. Read the article.
MASQ, however, is AWESOME.
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 12:13:55 AM
Quote
Thanks for airing your ignorance to everyone.
No it isn't ignorance, I know the kind of games I like. Killer7 isn't one of them.
Edit: I know you like LOVE Killer7 but in no way shape or form am I interested in the game nor will I ever be. It just doesn't look fun in the least.
To elaborate, I'm sure everyone here had impressions on games before they purchase them. To be honest, my "gut feeling" about a game is usually right, especially when it comes to games I am not interested in the least in.
Sometimes I let people, reviews or other sources get the best of me (it happens every once and a while, usually stemming from me wishing I was wrong about my initial feelings about a game) but I was let down with Rayman Raving Rabbids, I was let down with Elebits, I was let down with Paper Mario on N64, I was let down by the entire PS2 line up I bought with the system (to see what I was missing back in the GC days . . . which was nothing apparently) and so on and on forth.
After a while you just learn to trust your instincts (unintentional reference to Starfox) and Killer7 is just one of those games I don't see myself enjoying so I don't plan to pick it up.
Everyone has their own tastes and I know what mine are and Killer7 doesn't appeal to any of my tastes.
I'm sorry that this comes off as "ignorance" to you but nothing will change my mind about that game or any other.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 04:43:37 AM
Post by: Svevan on August 31, 2007, 06:20:29 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I'm sorry that this comes off as "ignorance" to you but nothing will change my mind about that game or any other.
Quote of the year. I'm not trying to be mean, just pointing out that deciding something without any facts or experience IS ignorance. But the conversation's over unless you want to move to another thread (where I will promptly drop the discussion since you've stated there's nothing to discuss).
Post by: Dirk Temporo on August 31, 2007, 06:33:02 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Bioshock is like Killer7
lol no.
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I never played Killer7, nor will I ever play Killer7. Looks like crap.
Sorry.
Don't like Killer7? What's the matter? Too DEEP for you?
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 06:44:38 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I'm sorry that this comes off as "ignorance" to you but nothing will change my mind about that game or any other.
I just got how awesome this quote is!
Anyways, yeah, it's true that I'm not rushing out to buy some AWESOME JRPGs or something. I generally despise those games because of how much they've degenerated into interactive animes. And it's sad... I used to be SUCH an RPG fan in the SNES era... /sigh
Wait a second! Although I was avoiding anime for the longest time, I recently had Kodocha shown to me! Like, totally awesome! I might start watching anime again!
Post by: vudu on August 31, 2007, 07:18:36 AM
QuoteYou're thinking of Karl; Karl loves Killer7. Evan is just like any of us--thinks it's a great game, but doesn't necessarily want to give birth to Suda51's love child.
Originally posted by: Mashiro
Edit: I know you like LOVE Killer7 ....
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 07:19:50 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: SvevanQuote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I'm sorry that this comes off as "ignorance" to you but nothing will change my mind about that game or any other.
Quote of the year. I'm not trying to be mean, just pointing out that deciding something without any facts or experience IS ignorance. But the conversation's over unless you want to move to another thread (where I will promptly drop the discussion since you've stated there's nothing to discuss).
Ok let me back Mashiro up, Killer7 is a clunky, limited game that does nothing besides style. It is a wannabe on rails shooter that forces you to use a visor to see the enemies, all of which look exactly the same way. The story is a pseudo intellectual attempt at being witty but really feels like the writers were on LSD when creating it. Variety? Ha look elsewhere, it is perhaps the most limited "full blown" game I've played in years. Low budget look and polish? Definately. Sloppy control scheme? Exactly.
I find it odd when Evan says someone else is ignorant we he himself has hardly even played the game he is critisizing, just seems to be a double standard there. Personally I have no problem basing a game off preliminary gameplay but when you go around calling others ignorant because they may not like what they've read of the game, then you look a tad bit foolish. It is really funny watching people freak out about Killer7, it is one of those games that the elite like to throw around as great, even though the vast majority think it is limited and frankly a poor gameplay experience, that is the poster child of poor variety, especially when it comes to character designs (Oh wow, I get to shoot different colored enemies that look exactly the same, woopie).
Then again what I am doing arguing with people like Evan that think MGS's story telling is a masterpiece in design? That shows me right there that someone would rather watch a game then play it, so I consider their opinion null and void when it comes to games like Killer7 which has built a fan base through its purty art style and wannabe intellectual storyline. Bioshock is not getting the praise it is getting for nothing, and I'm sorry Evan or others can't realize that. The game may not be revolutionary, but it will redefine the FPS genre for times to come with its utilization of strategy (Mixing weapons with the plasmids), making moral choices (Saving or killing the little sisters which impact you later on), utilization of visual cues to suck you into the gameplay, fully interactive story driven scenes, or the extreme sympathy you have towards even your enemies, who are not mindless drones (Or in Killer7s case annoying screaming color coded idiots).
Oh but I better not offend the cult of Killer7, a place for people to feel special and actually think they are getting a complex story and AMAZING game. Though I think there is a bit insecurity because they feel the need to openly insult the intelligence of someone who is not interested in it. But if you must know Mashiro, here is the story.
-Hitman with multiple personalities hired to killer bad guy
-United Nations Party wants to take over the world
-US and Japan become at war, east vs west
-Lots of goofy stuff about killing his own team
-Bad guy is killed, both are resurrected 100 years later
Basically it is about the convenient plot device of someone being crazy and not realizing things about themselves mixed with Castlevania good vs evil every 100 years. This is obviously disregarding the torturous gameplay you must go through to get to it. Also, perhaps I am mistaken but didn't Killer7 have you collect diaries as well to give you part of the story?
Post by: ShyGuy on August 31, 2007, 08:40:01 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 08:54:55 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
I remember reading an early article about Bioshock in GI and I got the impression they were planning to make the plasmids optional. I think perhaps they ran out of time/resources to do everything they wanted to do.
That would have been pretty neat, maybe we'll see it in the sequel.
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 09:31:23 AM
As for my "awesome" quote . . .
Yeah how many of you on these forums are EVER swayed by anyones discussion? I'm only being honest, but I guess some people just wouldn't understand that.
All I am saying is I KNOW my own tastes, Killer7 doesn't look like a game I will enjoy and based on what I have read / heard about it I can come to the conclusion that I don't need to try it.
Sorry that someone doesn't want to try a mediocre title that people declare as "deep".
And to answer your question, I don't mind games that are deep, but being "deep" is one aspect of a game and isn't a buying point for me. A better argument would have been "what's wrong? don't like good gameplay and great visuals with a good story?" Sadly it lacks the first two selling points so . . . yeah pass for me.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 09:39:36 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 09:40:01 AM
In all honest was the story pretty decent? Yeah it was, though I thought it tried a bit too hard. A complex story is one thing, but a farfetched complex story is another. Now if it was a novel (I see there is a book of sorts) I may have been far more inclined to get interested in it, but as it stands, it is a chore to play, which is not what I call an engrossing experience.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 09:40:30 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
GP is currently trying to convince me to buy Carnival games. &P
Well I'll let you know how it is.
Post by: that Baby guy on August 31, 2007, 09:41:42 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 09:44:53 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
Ohhhh, when I get home, I think I'll be making GP a deadvatar, too.
I didn't die though!
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 09:45:02 AM
Quote
just pointing out that deciding something without any facts or experience
Who says I didn't have facts about the game? I read reviews, saw demos, saw video clips . . . it wasn't like I just thought of the title and said "no". I made an educated decision based on the information presented to me from various sources and came to a conclusion that this game wasn't for me.
Sorry for debunking your ignorance statement but it had to be done.
"Not to be mean" but condescending should be a word you become familiar with Evan.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 31, 2007, 09:49:00 AM
"Low budget look and polish? Definately"
^ These do not shake hands.
"is a clunky, limited game"
"It is a wannabe on rails shooter"
^ This is a rail shooter.
"It is a wannabe on rails shooter"
"the enemies, all of which look exactly the same way"
^ This IS a rail shooter, afterall.
"the enemies, all of which look exactly the same way"
^ Even the most critically acclaimed games have prevailing, standard enemy types that exist to the end of the game. But that's just a harmful, sweeping generalization you just made, like you conveniently forgot that enemy sets do get shuffled as you progress thru the game. n/m, you really did forget
"forces you to use a visor to see the enemies"
^ What a relief! They'd be hard to kill since they're invisible! Is clicking the L-trigger too much work for you? much harder than fetch questing, confirmed
"Sloppy control scheme? Exactly."
"It is a wannabe on rails shooter."
^ So let's see, just like RE4, you hold R-trigger to raise your weapon, aim with the analog stick, and press A to fire -- established FPS aiming conventions with a forgiving degree of turning sensity, since it did feel comparable to Wind Waker's sensitivity -- and we know that works since you've apparently beaten killer7. And it's a RAIL SHOOTER, so you mainly move forward -- press A to move forward, check. But we can backtrack -- press B to turn around, press A to move forward, check. And it's a rail shooter, so there's no reason to walk elsewhere or sidestep, strafe, etc., check. And it's a rail shooter, so all points and objects of interest are planted along the rail path, eliminating the need to walk off the rail path, check. Therefore we've got a rail shooter, minus lightgun peripheral, with some extra choices provided to the player. That's not sloppy, just mind-numbingly simple and unambitious.
"This is obviously disregarding the torturous gameplay you must go through to get to it"
^ You play all of killer7 and not Metroid Prime's 1-2 hour fetch quest? Right.
"Also, perhaps I am mistaken but didn't Killer7 have you collect diaries as well to give you part of the story?"
^ Yeah, clues and backstory were delivered (not exclusively) this way. I think it only has a third of the total text Metroid Prime provided in backstory scans.
I see what you're trying to argue but it feels like you're not realizing something. killer7 is obviously a rail shooter, yet you keep treating it like it was intended to be something bigger and ambitious, like the typical latest action-adventure on the market. It never was. It was a weirdo rail shooter, "all" the reviews and previews said, and being the media-aware gaming interwebber you are, this idea should've sank in before you began playing. Cuz it sounds like you're knocking the game, but more like you have issues with an arcade genre derivative that should never have been adapted to consoles [at the time].
I also think the tension HERE is between people who enjoy becoming proficient at games vs. people who casually enjoy games. I enjoyed killer7 as an easy, refreshing, amusing experience [this is my "casual"] compared to likes of name-taking challenges like RE4 and MP2E [heavy-hitters I enjoy "practicing" by revisiting the tough fights].
Regarding killer7's story, the people who dig it don't care much about the good vs. evil/political/east-west tension/terrorism thing. About a third thru the game it's apparent that stuff is not important. What we do like is the question of how much of the events actually take place, within its reality -- that's something that plays with our memory and expectations. But of course, the wacky psycho stuff throughout the game is also comedy gold.
EDIT: svevan should not have made that kind of a comment. and mashiro should've made that statement about sticking with "preferences" earlier. There's a bunch of people who were here years ago? wouldn't deal with RE4 simply cuz zombies and horror stuff were of no interest. That's fine.
Post by: that Baby guy on August 31, 2007, 09:51:57 AM
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 09:54:19 AM
Quote
"does nothing besides style"
"Low budget look and polish? Definately"
^ These do not shake hands.
Erem style doesn't mean it has to look good.
She's indicating it has a style too it and that's all. The style in this case is that of looking (in my eyes) simplistic without polish so I tend to agree with her.
As for her other statements I see where they come from, as some people on this forum make Killer7 out to be one hell of a game when all it is is your average shooter. Woopie-de-doo.
Edit: He's talking to GP.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 31, 2007, 09:54:24 AM
no-body.
Post by: vudu on August 31, 2007, 09:56:09 AM
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 09:58:50 AM
Quote
wouldn't deal with RE4 simply cuz zombies and horror stuff were of no interest. That's fine.
Ahhh see now, I never said I didn't give things a chance.
I NEVER got into the RE series UNTIL 4 because I saw the great scores it got and WHY it got those scores. Great gameplay (which enhanced the series far beyond it's pitiful roots), great graphics, amazing atmosphere and Capcom made what seemed to be an all around enjoyable game.
Just because I have preferences and gut feelings about games DOESN'T mean I don't keep an open mind to certain games just because of their past or just because they are new. I just tend to have a good idea of what I will enjoy and what I won't based on seeing the game in action, what is said about it and how I perceive the game to be.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 31, 2007, 09:59:26 AM
~~~~~
A lot of people here are big on "charm". A lot of people here find killer7's wacko style and story charming and amusing. The story takes itself seriously, but some have found it digestable and delicious unlike the way MGS handles itself.
killer7 was no winner in the reviews dur. it was more about taking a risk than giving it a chance. so the love/hate review statements are SPOT-ON.
Post by: vudu on August 31, 2007, 10:01:15 AM
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on August 31, 2007, 10:07:54 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 10:12:06 AM
Don't get me wrong, if you like Killer7 fine, but also understand there are reasons why people don't like it. Or in Mashiro's case, the game obviously is not for him and yet he is called ignorant which I felt was way out of line.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 10:15:27 AM
People don't think "walk left, right, forward, rotate," people walk FORWARD most of the time. Our impetus is only to walk forward, and subconsciously we handle direction. What about games where movement is controlled by just one button? Direction and all that other stuff is handled instinctually/intuitively, and the only actual discrete and explicit input needed is the command to "move."
That's what Killer 7 sort of does, and that's why I'm curious in seeing more rail-movement experimentations in the future.
Post by: vudu on August 31, 2007, 10:17:42 AM
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 10:20:24 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Don't get me wrong, if you like Killer7 fine, but also understand there are reasons why people don't like it. Or in Mashiro's case, the game obviously is not for him and yet he is called ignorant which I felt was way out of line.
As long as you concede that awesome isn't for everyone. And Killer 7 is awesome!
Seriously, I'm reacting this way because it's been implied that Killer 7 is a bad game. It isn't. It has flaws. So did Super Paper Mario. So what? The game is beloved by many because of qualities that exist, whether or not they appeal to you.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 10:31:37 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
I'd actually like to see more experimentation that simplifies movement.
People don't think "walk left, right, forward, rotate," people walk FORWARD most of the time. Our impetus is only to walk forward, and subconsciously we handle direction. What about games where movement is controlled by just one button? Direction and all that other stuff is handled instinctually/intuitively, and the only actual discrete and explicit input needed is the command to "move."
That's what Killer 7 sort of does, and that's why I'm curious in seeing more rail-movement experimentations in the future.
Interesting idea, but having to only press one button to move would detatch the player from the experience. Think of it this way, yeah we may walk more in a straight line but isn't it also true you like to have the freedom to move how you wish? If you are in a new area in real life, don't you want to explore it?
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 10:35:53 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KaironQuote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
Don't get me wrong, if you like Killer7 fine, but also understand there are reasons why people don't like it. Or in Mashiro's case, the game obviously is not for him and yet he is called ignorant which I felt was way out of line.
As long as you concede that awesome isn't for everyone. And Killer 7 is awesome!
Seriously, I'm reacting this way because it's been implied that Killer 7 is a bad game. It isn't. It has flaws. So did Super Paper Mario. So what? The game is beloved by many because of qualities that exist, whether or not they appeal to you.
It is not beloved by many though, it is more of a cult game then anything. The game was a poorly received game by both reviewers and the majority of gamers. To compare the polish of SPM to Killer7 is also silly, Killer7 was obviously a low budget title with constrained gameplay and repetitive design. To make it out like it doesn't have gameplay flaws that make its reception by the majority justified seems to be a bit absurb. What makes it even worse is when people utilize the hardcore vs casual label in regards to the game, which really has nothing to do with it. But I will say this, it is still better than Far Cry and Alien Syndrome!
Post by: Plugabugz on August 31, 2007, 10:50:28 AM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 10:51:50 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Plugabugz
Does having a rough (not unfinished or unpolished) game automatically make it bad?
No but it doesn't make it great either.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 10:54:03 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Kairon
I'd actually like to see more experimentation that simplifies movement.
People don't think "walk left, right, forward, rotate," people walk FORWARD most of the time. Our impetus is only to walk forward, and subconsciously we handle direction. What about games where movement is controlled by just one button? Direction and all that other stuff is handled instinctually/intuitively, and the only actual discrete and explicit input needed is the command to "move."
That's what Killer 7 sort of does, and that's why I'm curious in seeing more rail-movement experimentations in the future.
Interesting idea, but having to only press one button to move would detatch the player from the experience. Think of it this way, yeah we may walk more in a straight line but isn't it also true you like to have the freedom to move how you wish? If you are in a new area in real life, don't you want to explore it?
How do you explore a hallway?
Especially when you have one very key objective in mind, the world collapses into a one dimensional problem. You consistently go TO your room, not in the side door of the dorms, around a corner, around another corner, then turn left to the door, and finally get there.
In many ways, Killer 7's rail movements almost replicate the directness of movement that we had in 2D games. Just like the linear combat system or whatever it's called in Tales of Symphonia recreates a simpleness of movement (away, or towards) the enemy that enables players to function in that 4-player battle system.
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
It is not beloved by many though, it is more of a cult game then anything. The game was a poorly received game by both reviewers and the majority of gamers. To compare the polish of SPM to Killer7 is also silly, Killer7 was obviously a low budget title with constrained gameplay and repetitive design. To make it out like it doesn't have gameplay flaws that make its reception by the majority justified seems to be a bit absurb. What makes it even worse is when people utilize the hardcore vs casual label in regards to the game, which really has nothing to do with it.
I don't understand. Are we equally at fault when we proclaim our love for Fire Emblem? (Want a low budget game, just look at that beloved niche cult series, how many years and Intelligent Systems STILL can't do decent 3D? ... not that I'm complaining! ^_^) When we say we're excited for Battalion Wars? Heck, I still remember Eternal Darkness with fondness despite my willingness to call the game's ratings a symptom of fanboi over-hype.
Just because a game is cult does not mean that it instantly becomes okay to rag on it. It's okay to say it ain't for you, but to imply that the rest of us are demeaning ourselves by playing it?
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 11:05:07 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KaironQuote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Kairon
I'd actually like to see more experimentation that simplifies movement.
People don't think "walk left, right, forward, rotate," people walk FORWARD most of the time. Our impetus is only to walk forward, and subconsciously we handle direction. What about games where movement is controlled by just one button? Direction and all that other stuff is handled instinctually/intuitively, and the only actual discrete and explicit input needed is the command to "move."
That's what Killer 7 sort of does, and that's why I'm curious in seeing more rail-movement experimentations in the future.
Interesting idea, but having to only press one button to move would detatch the player from the experience. Think of it this way, yeah we may walk more in a straight line but isn't it also true you like to have the freedom to move how you wish? If you are in a new area in real life, don't you want to explore it?
How do you explore a hallway?
Especially when you have one very key objective in mind, the world collapses into a one dimensional problem. You consistently go TO your room, not in the side door of the dorms, around a corner, around another corner, then turn left to the door, and finally get there.
In many ways, Killer 7's rail movements almost replicate the directness of movement that we had in 2D games. Just like the linear combat system or whatever it's called in Tales of Symphonia recreates a simpleness of movement (away, or towards) the enemy that enables players to function in that 4-player battle system.Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
It is not beloved by many though, it is more of a cult game then anything. The game was a poorly received game by both reviewers and the majority of gamers. To compare the polish of SPM to Killer7 is also silly, Killer7 was obviously a low budget title with constrained gameplay and repetitive design. To make it out like it doesn't have gameplay flaws that make its reception by the majority justified seems to be a bit absurb. What makes it even worse is when people utilize the hardcore vs casual label in regards to the game, which really has nothing to do with it.
I don't understand. Are we equally at fault when we proclaim our love for Fire Emblem? (Want a low budget game, just look at that beloved niche cult series, how many years and Intelligent Systems STILL can't do decent 3D? ... not that I'm complaining! ^_^) When we say we're excited for Battalion Wars? Heck, I still remember Eternal Darkness with fondness despite my willingness to call the game's ratings a symptom of fanboi over-hype.
Just because a game is cult does not mean that it instantly becomes okay to rag on it. It's okay to say it ain't for you, but to imply that the rest of us are demeaning ourselves by playing it?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it the Killer7 supporters that were calling everyone ignorant and too stupid to understand the game. There is nothing wrong with niche titles, like Fire Emblem but still I admit that it has flaws that makes the game not for everyone (though to be fair the Fire Emblem series does what it sets out to do quite well).
At least those games you mentioned had something called gameplay to push it along and didn't get their cult following from a rapid fan base who thinks they are elitists because they like a story over gameplay game like Killer7, and feel the need to demean those that don't like it. It is pretty odd though, compared to most cult games, the Killer7 fanbase seems to breed some of the most arrogant, condescending fans around whether it be here, gamefaqs or elsewhere.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 11:32:24 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
At least those games you mentioned had something called gameplay to push it along
Wow. Okay. Stop right there. I don't know if I care to be equated with Oregon's reigning intellectual attack-dog Svevan (I'm your biggest fan Svevie! ::hugs and kisses:: Kick Roger Ebert's BUTT!!!) but I, for one, ENJOYED the gameplay in Killer 7. I've even put forward a defense for rail-movement in the previous posts. I think that the label of "condescending" definitely sticks when you get to decide what I DO and DO NOT enjoy, when others get to dictate WHERE and HOW and WHY I am having fun.
I've come to expect it from people debasing Wii Sports, come to expect it from people ridiculing the Wii's graphical output, but little did I expect it here. *shrug*
... actually, I shouldn't be too surprised. GP hates Alien Syndrome and everything it stands for!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 11:41:43 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: KaironQuote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenix
At least those games you mentioned had something called gameplay to push it along
Wow. Okay. Stop right there. I don't know if I care to be equated with Oregon's reigning intellectual attack-dog Svevan (I'm your biggest fan Svevie! ::hugs and kisses:: Kick Roger Ebert's BUTT!!!) but I, for one, ENJOYED the gameplay in Killer 7. I've even put forward a defense for rail-movement in the previous posts. I think that the label of "condescending" definitely sticks when you get to decide what I DO and DO NOT enjoy, when others get to dictate WHERE and HOW and WHY I am having fun.
I've come to expect it from people debasing Wii Sports, come to expect it from people ridiculing the Wii's graphical output, but little did I expect it here. *shrug*
... actually, I shouldn't be too surprised. GP hates Alien Syndrome and everything it stands for!
Hey you can have fun and not need gameplay doesn't mean it is for everyone (heck the MGS series is popular). Consider I"ve talked to more than once person who thinks Killer7 is lacking in gameplay but makes up for it their minds elsewhere is enough of a defense of the statement that Killer7 is not popular because of the game mechanics.
Not sure how you can stick up for Evan, because what he said to Mashiro was completely elitist and beyond condescending. Let's not even get into Dirk's comments, which were about as ridiculous as you can get. Like I said the Killer7 fanbase is obnoxious at best, elitist, yes. Out of all the niche titles I dislike the Killer7 fanbase the most, they are rabid, and perhaps the least open minded people around when someone has legitimate complaints about the game.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 11:46:49 AM
Quote
For instance, before Killer 7 was finished, Mikami told Suda to visit E3 and see what the US audience likes playing. Suda found that free-roaming style games were popular. However, Killer 7 was envisioned on rails; a set track that the player is forced to follow. He knew then that Killer 7 wouldn’t be popular in the US.
He asked himself and Mikami, “Should we change Killer 7 to a free-running game or should we keep it as a rail game?” Suda knew the answer: “I felt that rather than selling a lot, I went with the idea that I came up with originally.” Mikami told him to go ahead with his original idea, even though they both knew that the gameplay probably wouldn’t fly with US audiences.
Doesn't mean that a mere lack of popularity is a reason for condemnation.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 11:53:05 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
I think it's obvious that Killer 7 isn't popular because of it's mechanics. Observe:Quote
For instance, before Killer 7 was finished, Mikami told Suda to visit E3 and see what the US audience likes playing. Suda found that free-roaming style games were popular. However, Killer 7 was envisioned on rails; a set track that the player is forced to follow. He knew then that Killer 7 wouldn’t be popular in the US.
He asked himself and Mikami, “Should we change Killer 7 to a free-running game or should we keep it as a rail game?” Suda knew the answer: “I felt that rather than selling a lot, I went with the idea that I came up with originally.” Mikami told him to go ahead with his original idea, even though they both knew that the gameplay probably wouldn’t fly with US audiences.
Doesn't mean that a mere lack of popularity is a reason for condemnation.
You are right, popularity has nothing to do about it, there is much more to the game that ruins it for people. Take for example Beyond Good and Evil, that game wasn't popular but what made it different from Killer7 is that it was highly regarded from the get go.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:00:02 PM
1. Mashiro says Killer 7 looked like crap
2. Svevan called him ignorant
Is that really what this is all about?
3. Mashiro later backtracked to say that the game didn't suit his preferences, turning it into a subjective evaluation of whether or not he would seek to play the game
4. Svevan left, since there's nothing to argue about anymore now that Mashiro is taking a purely subjective stance
Oh, and here's the real funny part:
5. Golden Phoenix supports Mashiro by criticizing Killer 7 on several points(thereby inadvertently and almost certainly unwillingly providing an opening for Svevan to return to the conversation, which if he's smart, he won't &P)
6. Pro666 becomes reasonable for the first time in like, evar
7. I propose that rail movement is a quality worth exploring
8. Because I chimed in, the entire mess is now in my lap
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:01:09 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Kairon
I think it's obvious that Killer 7 isn't popular because of it's mechanics. Observe:Quote
For instance, before Killer 7 was finished, Mikami told Suda to visit E3 and see what the US audience likes playing. Suda found that free-roaming style games were popular. However, Killer 7 was envisioned on rails; a set track that the player is forced to follow. He knew then that Killer 7 wouldn’t be popular in the US.
He asked himself and Mikami, “Should we change Killer 7 to a free-running game or should we keep it as a rail game?” Suda knew the answer: “I felt that rather than selling a lot, I went with the idea that I came up with originally.” Mikami told him to go ahead with his original idea, even though they both knew that the gameplay probably wouldn’t fly with US audiences.
Doesn't mean that a mere lack of popularity is a reason for condemnation.
You are right, popularity has nothing to do about it, there is much more to the game that ruins it for people. Take for example Beyond Good and Evil, that game wasn't popular but what made it different from Killer7 is that it was highly regarded from the get go.
Interestingly enough, I have some reasons for viewing that game not-so-glowingly...
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:05:09 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
I'm sorry that this comes off as "ignorance" to you but nothing will change my mind about that game or any other.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote of the year. I'm not trying to be mean, just pointing out that deciding something without any facts or experience IS ignorance. But the conversation's over unless you want to move to another thread (where I will promptly drop the discussion since you've stated there's nothing to discuss).
Perhaps I am misreading but doesn't seem to be retracting his statement either but reaffirming it. Not to mention you forgot Dirk's post as well. In addition that, it isn't just about Evan, but the arrogant mindset that Killer7 supporters show towards those who didn't drink the kool aid. Really it reminds me of fans of indepdent movies, it is this superiority complex people have because they are anti-big budget, pro-artistic films and feel that people who don't enjoy or appreciate them are stupid or are not getting it.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:17:09 PM
Anyways.
Svevan mentioned once on a podcast (the one where he pwned the "is videogames art" question) that he dislikes the idea of people hiding behind opinions. I think he'd rather we all tried to find a fact-based arena to duke it all out in.
But there's no such arena if we're just arguing whether some people have preferences that shift one way or the other. The sense of negativity you detect is his disdain for the "opinionizing" of the subject at hand. Once things are at the "my opinion, your opinion" stage, there's nothing left to discuss, as he said. It can't even be argued that Mashiro is ignorant since later on, Mashiro illustrated how he had made an informed decision about the game. This was all one grandiose miscommunication.
Boy, I'm getting plenty of chances to make new enemies today, especially with playing amateur psychologist. This will not end well. /scared
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:21:17 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Svevan mentioned once on a podcast (the one where he pwned the "is videogames art" question) that he dislikes the idea of people hiding behind opinions. I think he'd rather we all tried to find a fact-based arena to duke it all out in.
But there's no such arena if we're just arguing whether some people have preferences that shift one way or the other. The sense of negativity you detect is his disdain for the "opinionizing" of the subject at hand. Once things are at the "my opinion, your opinion" stage, there's nothing left to discuss, as he said. It can't even be argued that Mashiro is ignorant since later on, Mashiro illustrated how he had made an informed decision about the game.
Boy, I'm getting plenty of chances to make new enemies today, especially with playing amateur psychologist. This will not end well. /scared
Funny how someone can critisize others for opiniosn when most of his posts are made up of exactly that. Everything boils down to opinion, and some things have to remain that realm. Let's say you like the taste of something and I don't, how in the heck are you going to argue that? The same applies to games or other forms of entertainment, people have different tastes, Evan obviously doesn't understand this can be possible. I really would not be surprised if he still considers Mashiro ignorant. Evan needs this little thing called being civil if he wants to get his point across, as of now he comes across as an insulting jerk at times.
Instead of saying something to the effect "Mashiro what exactly did you find not to your liking?" he called Mashiro Ignorant. Now if Evan is as smart as he portrays himself he would realize that as soon as you openly insult someone's education or intelligence that you have dwindled your chances of getting anything of substance, but instead put that person on the defensive.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:26:32 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:30:17 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Ian! This is your chance! Post now, and no matter what you say people will love you in comparison!
Funny you mention Ian, at least when he expresses his opinion he doesn't insult anyone. Evan could learn something from him. Though I hope Ian realizes we all just like giving him a hard time! I know I do. In fact this board would be pretty lonely without the mostly pessimistic Ian.
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:37:32 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:39:49 PM
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 12:43:15 PM
) I never backtracked. To me the game does look like crap. Which is where the miscommunication you speak of may have happened as people took this as me saying the game IS crap. Which just wasn't the case.Though to be fair most of my negativity of saying it looks bad should be taken literally as the visual style, to me, is terrible.
But yes enough arguing back to Bioshock discussion!
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:44:13 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
Just for the record Carry-On (
Though to be fair most of my negativity of saying it looks bad should be taken literally as the visual style, to me, is terrible.
But yes enough arguing back to Bioshock discussion!
Stop trying to keep us on the track!
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 12:49:08 PM
If I owned a 360 I would get it.
=)
However I am a tad confused, do you play AS a person without a suit of armor or as a person WITH a suit of underwater armor?
In the commercials "you" seem to get smacked way back into a wall or something and a bare arm is shown. That's why I ask. If so how do you survive under water?
Post by: Kairon on August 31, 2007, 12:56:25 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 31, 2007, 12:57:19 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 12:57:47 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
Lol, well I'll say this about Bioshock:
If I owned a 360 I would get it.
=)
However I am a tad confused, do you play AS a person without a suit of armor or as a person WITH a suit of underwater armor?
In the commercials "you" seem to get smacked way back into a wall or something and a bare arm is shown. That's why I ask. If so how do you survive under water?
Ah, I can see your confusion. You are not really in the water, instead you are in an underwater city with breathable air. Also it doesn't appear you ever get a suit, instead early on you inject yourself with this genetic substance that gives you the ability to use different special moves such as lightning bolts (which can be shot into water to take out a bunch of enemies), flame, and even the ability to move items like the force and throw them.
This is where your moral connundrum comes into play, in order to upgrade your moves you need a particular substance, and the only way to get it is to suck it out of these girl/creatures called the Little Sisters who are defended by Big Daddy, her defender. When you kill the Big Daddy you are given the choice, harvest her "energy" which will kill her, or let her live with a vague promise from a character that you will be rewarded. This is compounded the sheer terror in the Little Sisters face when you pick her up to make this descision. It will disturb you to say the least.
Post by: Mashiro on August 31, 2007, 01:20:28 PM
The gameplay does sound very interesting and the moral choice is something I always enjoy, I probably wouldn't kill them . . =D even if they are creepy . . . maybe . . . lol.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 01:36:53 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Mashiro
Thanks for the answers =D it makes way more sense now haha. The old school underwater gear the big daddys wear threw me off a bit.
The gameplay does sound very interesting and the moral choice is something I always enjoy, I probably wouldn't kill them . . =D even if they are creepy . . . maybe . . . lol.
I saved the first one, and I felt really good about the girl smiled and ran off laughing happily. It is touches like this that make the game such an experience.
Post by: UERD on August 31, 2007, 01:39:38 PM
Regardless, it sounds cool, and I'll probably pick up a copy in a few years, when I have a PC that is powerful enough to run it.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 01:46:40 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: UERD
So, I'm guessing this is the first game in which you literally get to eat babies. (Or close enough.)
Regardless, it sounds cool, and I'll probably pick up a copy in a few years, when I have a PC that is powerful enough to run it.
Yeah a good computer is almost a must, you won't get nearly as engrossed without it. It is kind of neat with the Big Daddys, they will not bother you if you leave the girl away (Yeah they may shove you away if you get too close) they only attack if you attack them or the girl.
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 31, 2007, 02:57:14 PM
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 31, 2007, 03:08:55 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
After playing 8 hours of Prime 3, I really don't think I can go back to this...It'd just feel like a step back in, well, everything (including the visuals, which I personally think are the weak point of the game...Yucky art is yucky...)
DON'T YOU DARE INSULT THE ART-DECO DESIGN!
I'm surprised, I thought Bioshock had pretty good art direction.
Post by: UERD on August 31, 2007, 03:22:04 PM
Be warned, it's a big file and contains spoilers. (But I've never cared about spoilers in particular.)
Post by: Sir_Stabbalot on August 31, 2007, 03:33:53 PM
Post by: UERD on August 31, 2007, 03:35:17 PM
Of course, my unupgradable laptop is unfortunately destined to be useful only for old games, school, and Starcraft 2 (because Blizzard usually keeps their system requirements down)
.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 06:00:01 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
After playing 8 hours of Prime 3, I really don't think I can go back to this...It'd just feel like a step back in, well, everything (including the visuals, which I personally think are the weak point of the game...Yucky art is yucky...)
Well not sure it would be a step back, just different, but if it is which game has more creative and unique art style, Metroid Prime 3 wins hands down (not to mention gameplay variety). With that said there was alot of attention to detail put into Bioshock's retro-futuristic looking society, and you could spend hours just looking over the level.
Actually let me change this, you are just ignorant Bill!
Post by: Bill Aurion on August 31, 2007, 07:01:22 PM
Unless you are one of the people that don't like the art, like me... =3
That said, the game is still really good...I'd probably give it a 9 overall (and MP3 a 10 so far...
)
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 07:24:05 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
"...and you could spend hours just looking over the level"
Unless you are one of the people that don't like the art, like me... =3
That said, the game is still really good...I'd probably give it a 9 overall (and MP3 a 10 so far...
You are still ignorant! You just don't like the art style because you are too stupid to understand it!
Post by: that Baby guy on August 31, 2007, 07:30:11 PM
Are you too ignorant to understand this?
I appreciate Bioshock's commercials for the music. That's about it.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on August 31, 2007, 07:48:45 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
Appreciating art has nothing to do with ignorance.
Are you too ignorant to understand this?
I appreciate Bioshock's commercials for the music. That's about it.
You are stupid and ignorant too. Yeah YOU.
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 01, 2007, 04:54:38 AM
Post by: Svevan on September 01, 2007, 08:16:36 AM
Let's talk about Bioshock. And for the record, since I can't say anything without getting attacked by GP, I only dissed on Bioshock's first two hours. I am open to what the game may have in store later, but so far I'm unimpressed. That was all my post was intended to be.
Furthermore, no more Killer7 talk in this thread, unless it pertains to Bioshock. I was trying to squelch that and it didn't work.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 01, 2007, 11:50:08 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Svevan
Sorry I wasn't here to stop this argument: I called Mashiro ignorant for dissing a game and saying he'll never like it without ever having played it. Doesn't matter if it was Killer7 or Superman 64, he made up his mind via other people's opinions, instead of testing their hypotheses by playing the game himself.
Let's talk about Bioshock. And for the record, since I can't say anything without getting attacked by GP, I only dissed on Bioshock's first two hours. I am open to what the game may have in store later, but so far I'm unimpressed. That was all my post was intended to be.
Furthermore, no more Killer7 talk in this thread, unless it pertains to Bioshock. I was trying to squelch that and it didn't work.
Odd that someone who accuses others of being ignorant doesn't realize that perhaps getting attacked was justified in that case. Sorry if you didn't realize it, but I only went after you, after your completely uncalled for condescending statements directed towards Mashiro. It seems quite silly to state that someone is ignorant who hasn't experienced something, so I take it that you feel the same about drugs or something of that nature? Maybe since you are a movie goer, perhaps watching something like Porn would be more applicable. If you don't experience it then you are ignorant and cannot make a decision on whether you are interested or not? You can learn fully what something is about through reading about it, or in the case of gaming by watching gameplay footage. Yeah you may not know EXACTLY what it is about but you will get a fairly conclusive idea if you would be interested in playing it or not, whether it is the genre, graphics, or even how it is designed.
I realize Evan that you think I'm out to get you, believe me I have better things to do, but when you get on your high horse and accuse others of being ignorant, openly insulting them when you could have had more tact. Then yes I will step in, regardless if you realize that perhaps you may have stepped over the line a bit. For someone who prides himself over trying to open up discussion, you sure like putting people, like Mashiro, on the defensive when you could have got him to defend his views without insulting him. You've accused me of it of getting hostile, but it is almost like you don't realize that your own comments put people on the defensive as well which is almost never a good way to get someone to open up about why they have their opinions.
Regardless I will stick up for people whom I do respect and consider a friend when I feel they are being outright insulted or being talked down to.
Post by: that Baby guy on September 01, 2007, 12:42:50 PM
But srsly, I do agree.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 01, 2007, 12:55:32 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: thatguy
Yeah, for one thing, she's also out to get me, Kairon, Mashiro, and Ian! She does have better things to do.
But srsly, I do agree.
Ok I change my statement, I AM out to get you three. So they better be looking over their shoulder!
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 01:26:57 PM
Nothing will ever knock Evan off his high horse btw, but that's cool.
BTW Anyone who hasn't tried Superman 64 can't call it bad cause they never played it. You ignorant people you.
Evan is so much smarter than all of us . . . thank you for showing me how stupid and ignorant I was Evan. You're the greatest. I wish one day I could be as smart as you. Really I do.
Post by: that Baby guy on September 01, 2007, 01:38:08 PM
pwned.
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 01:41:00 PM
Post by: that Baby guy on September 01, 2007, 02:21:34 PM
Post by: Sessha on September 01, 2007, 03:21:09 PM
I think I played that barbie game thatguy. My sister got that for Christmas one year. I remember driving a pink car and sadly dressing up barbie.
Post by: that Baby guy on September 01, 2007, 03:29:29 PM
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 03:41:08 PM
Guys I'm going out to get Superman 64, ET for Atari and Nighttrap on the Sega CD. I'll be back in a bit.
actually I can't even list Nighttrap on that list...since I did play it and it was awful.
Post by: that Baby guy on September 01, 2007, 03:51:24 PM
Post by: UERD on September 01, 2007, 03:58:18 PM
Post by: Kairon on September 01, 2007, 04:36:02 PM
It was one of the best reads I've had in years.
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 04:38:07 PM
Post by: Kairon on September 01, 2007, 04:45:35 PM
I'm an anime bah humbug.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 01, 2007, 04:52:40 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Sessha
I'm chiming in a bit late but I don't think Evan was completely wrong. Hearing about something and actually doing something are two different things. When you hear about something it comes with a person's own personal Bias. It's how they felt about the game and how much they enjoyed it or the faults they found with it. You can draw your own opinions from reading about a game and watching it but not in the same way that you actually played it. I wasn't that excited for Bioshock when it was released but I did decide to rent it. I logged 8 or 9 hours into the game and I wasn't too impressed. I didn't feel compelled to play it or find it earth shattering. I wanted to quit around hour 1 but I gave it the benefit of the doubt. I've never voiced my opinion about a game if I haven't tried it. Even if it gets horrible reviews I usually rent it. And GP attacking someone right back doesn't solve anything.
I think I played that barbie game thatguy. My sister got that for Christmas one year. I remember driving a pink car and sadly dressing up barbie.
Yeah never defend your friends against blatant rude attacks. Seriously you have to make deteriminations based on readings and watching videos, you cannot play everything, so you must deterimine what you may be interested in. Let's say someone doesn't like RPGS, are they ignorant because they don't want to play the next RPG and know it will not be something they would enjoy? Of course not, that was retarded to play something that you've determined, through previous experience with a related item is not in your realm of likes and dislikes. It is not that hard to analyze what a game is like through a combination of reviews, descriptions and gameplay videos, chances are you will know if you are interested in it or not based off that.
To wrap this up,it is Evan's seeming contradiction that really is at faut. He is someone that proports to wanting people to defend their opinions, yet most people know you don't do that through being rude and condescending. It is a contradiction that someone who complains about people not knowing how to defend their opinions, yet insults them which will in turn most likely put them on personal defense mode where nothing gets accomplished.
Post by: Kairon on September 01, 2007, 04:59:06 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 01, 2007, 05:01:18 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Kairon
Knowledge will never be perfect. It's up to each person to ensure that their knowledge on important subjects is as thorough as they can afford it to be. We shouldn't pretend to be anything more than humanly fallible.
Unless you are me of course!
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 05:57:18 PM
Then we can move on to how "Zomg Mashiro sucks for not liking Killer7! He doesn't like deep games! He has no SOUL! OFF WITH HIS HEAD WITCH WITCH"!
Come on you know you guys want to . . .
Post by: Kairon on September 01, 2007, 06:14:56 PM
Post by: Kairon on September 01, 2007, 06:47:01 PM
Actually, if you can find a $3 copy of Killer 7, you'll have spent less than I spent on this book.
Post by: Mashiro on September 01, 2007, 06:53:59 PM
(The Golden Sky, The Sapphire Sky. . . is there a Blue Sky and Red Sky version too ? ahhh I kid I kid).
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 01, 2007, 07:56:17 PM
Post by: Svevan on September 01, 2007, 08:17:57 PM
But for serious, as much as I love these discussions being entirely about me (no really, I hate it), let's talk about Bioshock.
The control scheme is nice I guess.
Post by: ShyGuy on September 01, 2007, 08:25:01 PM
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 02, 2007, 10:15:49 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuy
My Cousin has been playing Bioshock on the 360. I think the PC version looks a bit better, but that could just be the resolution.
Yeah the PC version does look better than the 360 one, but then again that depends on your hardware, I know DX10 adds some visual flare, even if it is limited. Regardless I think the game is gorgeous, and that opening scene was one of the coolest scenes I've ran across in gaming.
P.S. Not reading Evan's post, I choose to remain ignorant and will be the one to end this argument.
Update:
Guess it wasn't something to avoid
Post by: that Baby guy on September 02, 2007, 10:22:16 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Svevan
I don't think I ever derailed the thread, honestly. =)
But for serious, as much as I love these discussions being entirely about me (no really, I hate it), let's talk about Bioshock.
The control scheme is nice I guess.
I think you've got a CD stuck in your head.
Post by: UERD on September 02, 2007, 11:05:36 AM
Anyways, as I was saying the system requirements are too high for me. Also, they have the nasty copy protection that they've promised to remove in the future.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 02, 2007, 11:19:06 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: UERD
Because GP used her Borg-cyborg-assimilation powers to turn an XBox 360 DVD drive into a Flaming-CDs-of-Death-Launcher capable of launching Flaming-CDs-of-Death across the endless bounds of cyberspace to effect grievious bodily damage to an Internet person sitting at a computer thousands of miles away!
Anyways, as I was saying the system requirements are too high for me. Also, they have the nasty copy protection that they've promised to remove in the future.
Can you elaborate a bit more on the copy protection thing? I didn't notice anything terrible about it.
Post by: UERD on September 02, 2007, 11:38:33 AM
Quote
When BioShock was released, the client only allowed for two installations and required an Internet connection in order to activate the product. Due to criticism, this limit has been increased to five activations. After the five activation limit is reached, the user must manually activate the product again via telephone support due to a new version of the content protection system known as SecuROM.
2K Games has responded to the criticism by stating that a special-purpose pre-uninstallation utility that will refund activation slots to a user will be developed and made available in the future.[52] If the yet-to-be-released application is not used before uninstalling the game, SecuROM considers the player to still be using the game, and the activation is unrecoverable without contacting SecuROM and sending them a picture of the DVD and the booklet with the CD key in order to get a new key or deactivate old installations.
The SecuROM system has also caused problems with running specific utilities and other games that use similar protection systems, see Securom for more. Microsoft's RootkitRevealer software tool also identifies SecuROM as a possible rootkit due to the insertion of null keys into the registry that cannot be removed using the limited Registry Editor.[53] These keys remain on the system even after BioShock and SecuROM are uninstalled,[54] with SecuROM currently providing no means to delete the registry keys, instead one may use Microsoft's RegDelNull to remove the registry keys. However, according to Ken Levine what is installed on the user's system is not a rootkit.[55]...
The Bioshock demo also installs SecuROM.[57] The SecuROM software remains on the system with no option for uninstallation, even if the demo itself is removed.[58]
Ken Levine, lead designer for the game, stated that the game's copy protection will be removed at some undisclosed point in the future.[59]
Post by: Kairon on September 02, 2007, 11:46:30 AM
Good to see that Irrational Studios is doing the RIGHT thing and removing this horribly frightful security scheme.
Post by: BranDonk Kong on September 02, 2007, 04:45:53 PM
Post by: Mashiro on September 02, 2007, 06:04:03 PM
Older games with fewer reviews aren't represented well.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 02, 2007, 06:11:46 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Brandogg
Bioshock is currently the #3 game of all time on gamerankings.com
Now that I find ridiculous, Bioshock may be a great game but it isn't even close to the top 5 much less the top 10!
Post by: Dirk Temporo on September 02, 2007, 06:58:48 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Brandogg
Bioshock is currently the #3 game of all time on gamerankings.com
Now that I find ridiculous, Bioshock may be a great game but it isn't even close to the top 5 much less the top 10!
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
Post by: ShyGuy on September 02, 2007, 09:40:43 PM
Quote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
Post by: Kairon on September 02, 2007, 11:18:24 PM
Though I will say this: I'm sure Irrational entertainmebnt deserve the success. From what I hear System Shock 2 was a great game as well and really ahead of its time. It's nice to see that the rest of the world has finally caught up to Irrational Entertainment and they're finally getting the respect they deserve.
Post by: Luigi Dude on September 03, 2007, 11:03:42 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuyQuote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
I'll do it for him, Super Mario Bros 3
Any list that doesn't have that game as number one is a complete joke.
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 03, 2007, 11:04:36 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Luigi DudeQuote
Originally posted by: ShyGuyQuote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
I'll do it for him, Super Mario Bros 3
Any list that doesn't have that game as number one is a complete joke.
I'll do another, Link to the Past!
Post by: Kairon on September 03, 2007, 11:11:15 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: GoldenPhoenixQuote
Originally posted by: Luigi DudeQuote
Originally posted by: ShyGuyQuote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
I'll do it for him, Super Mario Bros 3
Any list that doesn't have that game as number one is a complete joke.
I'll do another, Link to the Past!
Mario 64.
Post by: Mashiro on September 03, 2007, 11:12:36 AM
(Mario 64, ALttP, and SMB3 are far better games than OoT IMHO so I agree with those above).
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 04, 2007, 05:33:45 AM
Super Mario World > Super Mario 3
Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island
Link to the Past
Star Fox 64
OoT
I would say that Super Mario World 3: Yoshi's Island is the BEST 2D platformer ever created...but I would rank World above it in Best games because it is more traditional and pure Mario.
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 04, 2007, 06:13:00 AM
Post by: Spak-Spang on September 04, 2007, 06:29:27 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Everyone already knows my favorite game, so there's no point in turning this into another poll thread... =)
Bill's favorite game: Anything with half naked Loli.
Post by: ShyGuy on September 04, 2007, 12:29:14 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Everyone already knows my favorite game, so there's no point in turning this into another poll thread... =)
"Mother" from Danzig's self titled debut album?
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 04, 2007, 05:53:54 PM
Quote
Originally posted by: Spak-SpangQuote
Originally posted by: Bill Aurion
Everyone already knows my favorite game, so there's no point in turning this into another poll thread... =)
Bill's favorite game: Anything with half naked Loli.
WRONG!
(Everyone should realize that I prefer conservative dress on my lolis...I especially like frills...Lots of frills =3)
Post by: that Baby guy on September 04, 2007, 06:08:29 PM
Post by: Dirk Temporo on September 05, 2007, 10:45:16 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: ShyGuyQuote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
1. Deus Ex
2. Killer7
3. Max Payne
Ocarina of Time was third in my list of favorite Zelda games.
Post by: vudu on September 07, 2007, 06:59:41 AM
A pretty hilarious four-minute review of Bioshock.
Post by: Bill Aurion on September 07, 2007, 07:40:17 AM
Post by: Mashiro on September 07, 2007, 10:23:23 AM
Post by: ShyGuy on September 07, 2007, 10:52:28 AM
Quote
Originally posted by: Dirk TemporoQuote
Originally posted by: ShyGuyQuote
This is just based on average reviews. Their number one is Ocarina of Time, which I find laughable.
.....
The only way you're walking out of here is if you name some other Miyamoto game as your number one.
1. Deus Ex
2. Killer7
3. Max Payne
Ocarina of Time was third in my list of favorite Zelda games.
Ah the Deus Ex maneuver.... Max Payne is a classic too. Okay, those are all good games you got listed there, and Killer7 had the definitive edtion on the Cube. Still, your Ninteno fanboy license is subject to a 60 day probation. THEM'S THE RULES
Post by: Svevan on September 07, 2007, 03:02:16 PM
Post by: Smash_Brother on September 07, 2007, 03:13:02 PM
Post by: NWR_pap64 on September 07, 2007, 03:17:41 PM
Post by: UERD on September 11, 2007, 12:13:22 AM
Quote
While opining on the GTA development cycle, Zelnick said, "I would say probably roughly an every three year [release] schedule would be optimal. ... I expect we would apply roughly the same strategy to BioShock, because BioShock is shaping up to be a very important franchise. I don't was to say more than that about BioShock because I certainly don't want to jinx it, but I feel awfully good about where that is going."
"We made BioShock with lots of time, effort, and care....NOW LET'S MILK IT FOR ALL IT'S WORTH!!!!! LOLOLOLOL!!!11!!!111!oneoneeleven"
Post by: SixthAngel on September 12, 2007, 03:21:06 AM
I haven't played Bioshock so this isn't an attack on the the game but the trend that it is following.
Post by: couchmonkey on September 13, 2007, 03:42:33 AM
Post by: UERD on September 13, 2007, 11:10:33 AM
Post by: decoyman on September 17, 2007, 05:21:58 AM
First things first: MAN, this makes me appreciate the MP3 control scheme. Now, I've played dual analog shooters before, but, admittedly, it's never been my preferred method (I'm a mouse/keyboard guy, myself). By the second hour in, I was eliminating the frustrations and slowly beginning to be able to move around pretty normally. But aiming was still giving me problems. With Prime 3, I was able to come in on Veteran and after a very short (10 minutes?) acclimation period, have my only frustrations be that the game was hard – ie, it was my fault if I wasn't doing well. Here, when I'm in the heat of battle, surrounded by splicers on all sides, I'm just annoyed that I can't respond the way I want. I feel like, with the Wiimote/nunchuk control scheme, I wouldn't have died a quarter of the times I died in this game so far.
You know, it reminds me of the transition from keyboard-only FPS controls to mouse/keyboard controls. Many people (myself included) were very, very capable at keyboard-only controls, and were leary of adding the mouse to the mix. It was out of my comfort zone, and I didn't see it as necessary when I could still beat all of the keyboard/mouse players that I played against with just my keyboard setup (this was in the Doom2 days =D). However, once I spent the time to develop my mouse/keyboard skills, I found it was truly the superior of the two, and allowed a level of precision and speed that the keyboard alone just couldn't provide.
NOTE: While the MP3 control scheme blows the Bioshock control scheme out of the water, I want to make it clear that I'm not trying to do a MP3 VS. Bioshock comparison. They are VERY different games in terms of pacing and style and direction, so they don't warrant a direct comparison, contrary to what some large sites seem to think (ahem, IGN). I'm simply making a comparison between control schemes here.
Anyways, back to the game. So, the NEXT thing (after the obsolete and clunky controls) that I notice about the game is that it has atmosphere. LOTS AND LOTS of eery, creepy, violent, surprising, moody and disturbing atmosphere. And this ties into the story as well, which really sucked me in. The way they slip you bits of information, and deliver the story in creative ways (blood writing on the walls/floor, the deserted/messy/bloody new years party scene, brief flashbacks, and of course the audio journals and Atlas on the radio) is amazing, and I kept wanting to fight the crappy control scheme just to see what was next. It's almost a survival horror FPS, and it rivals all the survival horror greats in this respect. Things will jump out of the dark. Lights will suddenly go out. You will be surrounded by baddies on all sides on your last vial of Eve, and you will be forced to run away screaming or meet your untimely demise.
Atmosphere also ties into the presentation, which overall is top-notch. Everything from the voice-acting (NPCs and enemies alike) is spot-on, and graphics and menus are all humorous and authentic-looking in their retro themes. The scripted events are really engaging too.
The gameplay (control issues aside) is intriguing. I'm having lots of fun using the various abilities you get, like lightning, fire and telekinesis (which is especially fun), though it seems like your gauge drains a bit too quickly for some of the abilities. I guess, though, that could be solved by upping my storage amount at those plasmid machines. I also really liked the strategy that these abilities add to the game. It makes seemingly insurmountable odds infinitely easier if you use your head a bit before charging into battle.
The one thing about the gameplay that's distracting and frustrating is the way you have to cycle through your weapons/ammo and abilities. If you have time to prepare, the added varieties of ammo and weapons give you a degree of finesse with how you go about fighting certain enemies. However, most of the time this wasn't the case for me... Say you're in a heated battle, and you suddenly need your shotgun (with a certain type of ammo), but you're on the wrench. You've got to either hit the bumper multiple times and hope you don't overshoot your intended weapon, or hold it down to choose (which takes you completely out of the gameplay for a short while). If you've also decided to change ammo, you're going to need to select that, and then wait for the painstakingly slow loading to finish before you can start busting caps again. It's totally jarring, and I wish they could've found some better solution. It's just too complicated, too many options, and – most of the time – it detracts from the experience instead of enhancing it.
On the other hand, the save system is great. You basically never have to choose "Save!" from a menu to ensure you keep your data (though I guess you can if you really feel the need). There are transparent checkpoints all over, and (from what I gather) you restart from little pods that are scattered around the levels. Seems like a great system.
I also really like the idea of choosing whether to save or harvest the little sisters, and that it affects you in a real way, from gameplay all the way down to different endings.
So... I'm not really that far into the game, but so far it's been really good. I'm pretty sure that for most of those few hours I played, my heart rate was going like I'd drunk coffee all day (a good thing). I'm impressed at the level of polish, and the mystery surrounding the story, the pretty-shiny graphics (yeah, I said it), and the various creative storytelling things they've done. There are just a few flaws that I can pick out (my major objection, the controls, could only be fixed by the game being made for Wii
), but they don't ruin the game's engrossing experience. If anybody has a 360, you owe it to yourself to check out this game in some form – rental, purchase, gift, whatever. Just find a way... the poor souls of Rapture need you! (I think... haven't finished the game yet!)
Post by: GoldenPhoenix on September 17, 2007, 08:04:44 AM
Post by: mantidor on April 30, 2008, 05:31:29 PM
Post by: DAaaMan64 on April 30, 2008, 05:34:17 PM
Post by: KnowsNothing on May 03, 2008, 07:34:22 PM
I really loved it because I was really interested in the characters and the storyline, and I thought the art direction and atmosphere were unbelievable. Plus, after I beat it, I fantasized for like a week about how two great movies could be made out of it.
the first movie would be about the downfall of Rapture, and the second movie would be an action flick that follows the game's events. It would be SO COOL to walk into the theatres for the sequel to see the entire city from the last movie destroyed, and all the characters from before trying to kill the protagonist and stuff. SO COOL. SRSLY. I need a life.
Post by: ShyGuy on January 01, 2009, 05:09:43 PM
Picked this game up on Steam for $5 so I can play through the whole thing. I think now that the hype has gone down and I've come to terms with it just being a corridor shooter, I'm enjoying it more. The guns feel really bad though.
Post by: NinGurl69 *huggles on January 01, 2009, 05:11:24 PM
$5 fits, no?
Post by: DAaaMan64 on January 02, 2009, 01:12:50 PM
Post by: vudu on January 02, 2009, 08:58:16 PM
Nevermind. Sale's already over.
Post by: mantidor on January 02, 2009, 11:37:06 PM
I'm getting it the other way, which seems to be the only way for us poor third world countries, not even when you are willing to give in to the overpriced original games can't you get anything good, so screw you HD gaming industry, I would love to see you falling down in flames.
Post by: DAaaMan64 on January 03, 2009, 12:33:49 AM
Sale ends today. After that, it goes back to $20.
Nevermind. Sale's already over.
AH DAM
Post by: ShyGuy on June 16, 2009, 02:43:54 AM
Post by: broodwars on June 16, 2009, 02:52:59 AM
How many little sisters need to be saved for the good ending?
All of them. From what I understand, there are 3 endings: 1 for harvesting all of them, 1 for saving all of them, and 1 for saving all but 1 (or presumably everything inbetween the two extremes).
Post by: ShyGuy on June 18, 2009, 11:53:30 AM
Post by: Caliban on July 24, 2009, 07:21:35 PM
Post by: ShyGuy on July 25, 2009, 05:31:35 PM
Post by: Caliban on July 25, 2009, 07:03:29 PM
Post by: broodwars on July 25, 2009, 09:54:02 PM
I'm at the end, last fight. I've enjoyed everything thus far. I do a lot of exploring, and the game does have this Metroid Prime feel to it albeit somewhat claustrophic but that's expected being underwater and all. I like the music, overall aesthetic, storyline, voice acting, and in terms of game play mechanics of course it could be better but for a console it's not bad.
Wow, you've even enjoyed the last 1/4 of the game after meeting Ryan, where the game takes a spectacular nose dive in quality (compared to the rest of the game)? I love Bioshock, and even I can't stand that last portion of the game (and the pathetic final boss in particular).
Post by: Halbred on July 25, 2009, 10:46:39 PM
Post by: ShyGuy on July 25, 2009, 10:54:41 PM
Post by: broodwars on July 25, 2009, 10:54:54 PM
Boy, I loved the final fourth of the game. Look, BioShock is all about the experience, more the art direction than the running and gunning. You find out where the Big Daddies are...*gulp*...manufactured, and the Little Sisters are conditioned to follow them around. It's kind of a disturbing section of the game.
It is a disturbing last portion of the game and some of the areas you visit are genuinely interesting (Fontaine's House for the Poor; Little Sisters' Orphanage; etc.). However, it's also the part of the game where suddenly only your machine gun, chemical thrower, and grenade launcher are worth a damn against the splicers. And your plasmids are completley useless, and it all ends with an escort mission (that favorite of gamers everywhere!). It's just a tedious section of the game that I never have fun playing, especially since the game has already climaxed with Ryan.
Post by: Morari on July 25, 2009, 11:12:56 PM
Post by: Caliban on July 25, 2009, 11:51:44 PM
Wow, you've even enjoyed the last 1/4 of the game after meeting Ryan, where the game takes a spectacular nose dive in quality (compared to the rest of the game)? I love Bioshock, and even I can't stand that last portion of the game (and the pathetic final boss in particular).
Yes, I've enjoyed every last bit of the game... except for the last boss, but I really want to whack him because I hate him too.
Boy, I loved the final fourth of the game. Look, BioShock is all about the experience, more the art direction than the running and gunning. You find out where the Big Daddies are...*gulp*...manufactured, and the Little Sisters are conditioned to follow them around. It's kind of a disturbing section of the game.
The whole game is disturbing.
However, it's also the part of the game where suddenly only your machine gun, chemical thrower, and grenade launcher are worth a damn against the splicers. And your plasmids are completley useless, and it all ends with an escort mission (that favorite of gamers everywhere!).
Heh I used the wrench 90% of the time for the whole game, and Electric Shock. Zap'em and whack'em.
The escort mission I found to be disturbingly endearing because you were helping the little sister get some adam, yet I had saved all of them, and she didn't really have to do that, but it's all for a good cause.
The gameplay however was severely linear and obviously dumbed down from previous efforts like System Shock. Given all of the weapons, interchangeable ammo, and plasmids you have access to, the game should have been more akin to Deus Ex in its layout.
"Would you kindly" is I think what made this game not have such freedom. Just by plot alone it was bound to make you go through a certain ordained linear path.
Although I do agree that the variety and characteristics of the weapons, ammo, and plasmids would be suitable for such a freedom of choice of where to go and how to go.
Post by: kraken613 on July 31, 2009, 04:10:20 AM
Post by: broodwars on September 22, 2009, 06:54:57 AM
Anyway, I have successfully beaten the game on these settings...though barely. The final boss fight is actually hard now, and I won with no med packs left and only a sliver of health. So yeah, according to this game I'm "Seriously Good at This", bearing "Brass Balls". ;) I've actually gained a much greater respect for a couple Plasmids in the past I've rarely if ever used: Security Bullseye and Telekinesis. There's just a simple joy in tagging a Big Daddy with Security Bullseye and then watching with glee as he gets picked apart by wave after wave of security bots (all while I'm snapping pictures of it all to boost my research on both considerably). Best way to deal with Big Daddies by far, and it's pretty much the only way to survive attacks by Security Bots late in the game. As for Telekinesis, what really can you say against a Plasmid you can use for no Eve cost (if you only carry an object but don't throw it with TK, it doesn't count against you) that allows you to grab items out of reach, along with being the only consistently effective means of disposing of Splicers throughout the game (via throwing explosive barrels)?
Well, that was an interesting experiment, but on these higher difficulties the seemingly-endless waves of splicers gets utterly nuts (on Fort Frolic I swear the damn things respawn every 3 seconds, and that's usually my favorite stage in the game). And let's not get started on how much Tenembaum needs to shut the hell up during the aggravating forced-escort mission at the end of the game. There's just no way not to lose half a dozen of your charges with all those splicers charging at you and your guns doing the damage they do. I still have a "Survivor Mode + No Vitachambers" run to do for my "A Man Chooses" and "I Chose the Impossible" trophies to get my 5th Platinum, but at the moment I don't know if I'm going to bother. This is one of my favorite games of all time, and that last playthrough just wasn't fun those last couple of hours. I really don't want to see what they look like on an even harder difficulty mode.
