Topic: SPOILER ALERT: MCU Thread (Quantum-Ant-Man-ia)

[Stratos]

Looks like we are in the Endgame now. Not seeing until Friday night so will be back then.

[Spak-Spang]

Spoilers ahead.

Just finished watching the movie.  Honestly it was fun, but predictable.  Everything everyone guessed would happen basically happened, with only one surprise death.  As for the movie itself, the End Scene was a mess.  Where Infinity War's final battle cleanly jumped from one character piece to another.  End Game tried to do that, but mostly failed.  Was it a good roller coaster battle, yeah...but it seemed like they had to JAM a scene with every character in a very short timespan. 

The best the movie had was the time travel.  So many throwbacks to the best and most classic scenes from the movies.  It was clever, fun and surprising how they worked the time travel elements into the movie.  It was the best part of the movie and made the event truly unique and special.  Not many movies pull off time travel this good. 

[Shorty McNostril]

That was awesome.  A truly worthy way of wrapping up the saga.  So many fan moments.  Several moments of applause throughout our showing.   I will agree the final battle wasn't as smooth as IW, but given they had heaps more characters to try and fit in I'll let it slide.  And the fan service was was absolutely amazing which more than made up for it.

[Spak-Spang]

That was awesome.  A truly worthy way of wrapping up the saga.  So many fan moments.  Several moments of applause throughout our showing.   I will agree the final battle wasn't as smooth as IW, but given they had heaps more characters to try and fit in I'll let it slide.  And the fan service was was absolutely amazing which more than made up for it.

Yes, I think the final battle definitely can slide.  Besides the final before the final battle was so great, that the fight didn't need it. 

I didn't mention it in my post, but I am amazed how this movie was able to capture the themes and feeling of several of the independent movies throughout this movie.  It tied bows around loose ends, and really helped give closure from almost every character.  The movies 2nd act is so strong, that it makes up for a slightly underwhelming 3rd act.

[Shorty McNostril]

Just got back from my second viewing. 

I missed this the first time, but Carol had her sash as well as her Captain Marvel haircut after the five year jump.  I'm so happy.  I was disappointed she didn't end up with it in her movie, but this is the next best thing.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Fat Thor

Looking just like Lebowski. OMG, that had me.

Now Thor truly is the "Everyman" character.
Asguardians of the Galaxy... that should totally be the name of the GotGvol3

I've heard it before, but it's a good name. They should run with it.

and I know there was no "mid or post credit scene"
But what most of the audience didn't know was that last scene with Peter Parker, is probably right where the next movie picks up. Might be a shared scene with the next movie.

I was actually really surprised with how quickly the main villain was dispatched in the beginning of the movie too. Thor lopped of Thanos' head, and I was like "ok, roll the credits" and pretended to get out of my seat. Left me wondering how they were gonna undo everything and make it make sense. I had heard about the time travel theory, but I was surprised with how well it was pulled off.

Bravo Marvel. Bravo Feige. Bravo Russos.
now bring me more MCU asap.

edit: Can I also just state that I wholeheartedly agree with Valkyrie when she says she prefer either of the other 2 over blended Hulk. Hulkallo was kinda weird, and never angry enough.

[Shorty McNostril]

We now have a dignified, gentleman hulk. He transcends the need to smash things.

[BranDonk Kong]

Professor Hulk is great. I thought for a second when Ancient One punched out Hulk's astral form that she separated the two beings. I wonder if that will lead to Bruce finding a way to do it later.

I was shocked when Black Widow took Hawkeye's place, but it makes me happy that he was able to be there for the return of his family, and plus he got to be pretty badass throughout the movie.

I screamed "YEEEAHHH" as soon as I saw Mjolnir pass Thor because I knew it was going to Cap. That may have been the best part of the movie, and of course when he finally said it. I thought for sure right before everyone started reappearing that Thanos was about to kill him...glad that it didn't happen so we got to see the torch being passed to Falcon. Of course this means no Bucky Cap, but honestly in the movies it would be pretty hard to reconcile that with Bucky being an assassin for so long.

[Shorty McNostril]

The one complaint I have about the "Avengers Assemble" call was the delivery.  I had been looking forward to that moment for many years and when it finally came it was just......limp.  He started off well with a good strong "Avengers...", then he came out with such a quiet, grumbly "assemble" that it ruined the whole moment.  It should have been a strong, authoritative captain's call to attention. 

[Spak-Spang]

Loved Gentleman, Hulk. 

[nickmitch]

The one complaint I have about the "Avengers Assemble" call was the delivery.  I had been looking forward to that moment for many years and when it finally came it was just......limp.  He started off well with a good strong "Avengers...", then he came out with such a quiet, grumbly "assemble" that it ruined the whole moment.  It should have been a strong, authoritative captain's call to attention. 

I wanted a long “Assemble” too. It took ten years for him to say it and it was literally at the climax of a 22 film run. But I will say it kind of fit in its own strange way.

I’m also glad they went through the trouble making sure they fix the timeline, and calling out Dr Strange as the chosen one or whatever was interesting.

I’m really wondering what they do with WandaVision now. Certainly won’t be a series taking place after Endgame. Same for Black Widow’s movie.

I really liked that Thor has a place with the Guardians, since the character has really come around since his first movie.

Also, did anyone else see some sparks between Rhodey and Carol??

[ThePerm]

Well I guess there won't be a Black Widow movie.

This had a very Return of the Jedi, Return of the King, Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End feel. It was the culmination of something. The movie had a lot of moving parts. The most moving parts.  Not everything was going to be satisfied. I'd say the movie had a bunch of plot holes, but they're more like messy plot devices. I'd make some different choices with the final battle. But the movie up until that point was great.

One thing I would change.
-Captain marvel would not ever carry the glove. I know she doesn't have nanobots to screw with the glove really, but she should have maybe got back together with the team earlier instead of being a weird outlier. Her holding the glove makes the audience think "why doesn't she just put it on?" even if she can't in the back of your head you think "Aww Carol Danvers that little bitch, her stupidity is why iron man died" A better choice: Have some other character get the glove over to Tony. That way it's not in the back of your head. She definitely could take it. On the other hand she's reviled and nobody likes her Deusx Machina stuff. If she had put the glove on the fans would hate it more. That's why that beat should have been rewritten with a another character. I'd have picked Rocket. He's got little hands.

[Spak-Spang]

1) Either A the Black Widow movie talks were to throw us off. Or it will be a prequel.  A Hawkeye/Black Widow origin story could be fun, but it isn't really needed.

2) I think Thanos' plan in End Game shows the flaw of the original plan. 

3) I am curious about the Time Travel stuff.  So the splintered into a new Timeline and everything that happened, happened.  But does that mean the infinity stones exist in the new time line still?  Or are they gone forever, since they returned them to the original moments in time, and those moments must lead to the old time line?

[Shorty McNostril]

3) I am curious about the Time Travel stuff.  So the splintered into a new Timeline and everything that happened, happened.  But does that mean the infinity stones exist in the new time line still?  Or are they gone forever, since they returned them to the original moments in time, and those moments must lead to the old time line?

Steve went back and put all the stones right back at the time they were taken so in the past all those alternate events in the past no longer occurred.

[Spak-Spang]

3) I am curious about the Time Travel stuff.  So the splintered into a new Timeline and everything that happened, happened.  But does that mean the infinity stones exist in the new time line still?  Or are they gone forever, since they returned them to the original moments in time, and those moments must lead to the old time line?

Steve went back and put all the stones right back at the time they were taken so in the past all those alternate events in the past no longer occurred.

If that is true, then the stones get taken and destroyed Doctor Strange will be very upset when Dorommoru (sp) decides to come back. 

[BlackNMild2k1]

Wasn't it rumored that BW movie was another prequel.... I guess it kinda has to be now that BW is dead.

And I'm pretty sure the Hawkeye show will be more of A Hawkguy with his daughter.

No idea what Wandavision.... Wanda discovering her reality warping powers and living her best alternate life!?

[UncleBob]

>I’m really wondering what they do with WandaVision now. Certainly won’t be a series taking place after Endgame. Same for Black Widow’s movie.

WandaVision could have to do with bringing back Vision's character.  No reason they can't write some reason to bring him back.

Black Widow could be a Prequel or could be a new character taking up the mantle.  Or a clone.  Which would be terrible.  I'd like it to be a two-part story, the first half featuring a prequelesque story with Johansson, giving us her origin while introducing a new, connected character that shares a similar but distinct background - and the second half being a "current" story where the new character becomes Black Widow in the wake of Endgame.

>3) I am curious about the Time Travel stuff. 

I kinda wish they had played it differently.  Basically,  Instead of calling it time travel, they should have said they were going to alternate but virtually identical dimensions within the multiverse, where time flows differently.  This would give them exactly what they were going for without as many issues arising by claiming it's time travel.

I am far more concerned with the missing five year gap for the dusted people and how that will be addressed going forward.  This is HUGE.  Like, say you remarried in those five years, then suddenly your spouse shows back up.  Or your older child comes back and is now your youngest.  If you were on a plane when you were dusted, did you come back in the sky and are now plummeting to earth?  If you were going 80 down the interstate, do you come back with your body flying 80 down the road?  Or are you standing still in the road and get smacked by a semi?  What happens to the "The Vanished" monument?  If I was born in 2002, snapped in 2018, and returned in 2023, How old am I?  Can I buy liquor and tobacco?

What the fudge does this mean for Agents of Shield?

[BeautifulShy]

Basically the way the timeline in how it works is it has the standard MCU timeline and then when they go back in time it starts an alternate timeline and things that happen within that timeline branches off into different paths at different points until they get back to the snap where it continues on from that point where the snap still happened but because Thanos was beaten in 2014 then it kinda continues from there along the main MCU timeline.   New Rockstars did a video better explaining it in more detail.

For BnM: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lQEv_V9UjHI&t=0s

[UncleBob]

Haven't watched that video, but, if Steve went back and spent a lifetime with Peggy in an alternate timeline, how did he end up as Old Man Steve on the bench in the "prime" timeline?

[BeautifulShy]

Haven't watched that video, but, if Steve went back and spent a lifetime with Peggy in an alternate timeline, how did he end up as Old Man Steve on the bench in the "prime" timeline?

It happened because once the timeline converged again Steve had lived a whole life and wasn't trapped under ice like in the prime timeline.  Plus I think the Super Soldier Serum doesn't make him immortal it just makes Steve live a long time so he would leave the main timeline where Bucky and Falcon were, return all the infinity stones back to where they were and then Steve would go to that alternate timeline and stay with Peggy and then go to the bench where he left those two but aged.

[UncleBob]

Why would alternate timelines converge?  Old Man Steve probably interacted with a LOT of people in the Peggy timeline over 70 years.  Did everyone in that timeline just disappear when converging?

Like, say Steve met a guy named Danny McGee in Peggy-timeline's and played chess in the park with him every Sunday for the past thirty years.

Would this Danny McGee stop existing when Old Man Steve 'convirges' into the prime timeline?  Would he wonder what happened to his dear friend that went missing suddenly?  Are they having an International search party in the Peggy-timeline for America's most well known American Solider?  Or did the billions of lifeforms in that timeline get snuffed out?

[ThePerm]

Yeah the captain America ending was the weakest part. 70+ years is a long time to be messing with a timeline.

Also, aren't there some lines that indicate Steve was semi-conscious when frozen?

And Falcon doesn't have super-strength. Where's he going to get a serum?

When the MCU started I had hoped they'd go really in depth into the whole super soldier program. They did for a little bit, but I had wished at the time Spider-man was involved so they could get Ozcorp involved.

List of places looking for a super soldier:
- Hydra/Nazis - Red Skull
- OzCorp  - Green Goblin
- U.S Government/ Dr. Bruce Banner - Hulk
- U.S. Government - Dr. Abraham Erzkine - Captain America
- Wakandan Government - Nature/Panther Cult - Black Panther
- Canadian Government - Various Weapon X scientists - Wolverine, Deadpool, Sabretooth
- Dr. Noah Burnstein -  Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, DareDevil
-Curt Conners - Lizard *accident

List of places building super suits
-Hammer Corp - A few bad guys
-Stark Industries - Iron Man, War Machine
-Toomes Salvage Company - Vulture
-SHIELD- Falcon
-Dr Octavius- Dr Octopus  *accident

If I were to redo Green Goblin's origin I'd make him be an experimentation with crossing Skrull and Human DNA

[UncleBob]

Exactly.  But had they gone to different, yet very similar universes within a bigger multiverse, they could easily just have said Old Man Steve jumped back to the prime universe at the end.

Saying it creates a different timeline every time you jump makes it overly confusing.  If that's the case, when they went back to 2012 the first time, that's one jump and should create one timeline and when Cap goes back the second time to return the two stones, isn't that a second jump?  Shouldn't that create another branch?

If they had done alternate universes, that would seem to really help the whole issue and give Disney an opening for the What If series.

[BeautifulShy]

I believe it was explained that they can't really change ones own past or memories but they break off into an alternate timeline that runs parallel alongside that timeline.

[UncleBob]

That's just... confusing.

Let's say I Scott Lang it and travel five years into the future.  Get married, have babies, then think "Damn, I should have invested in some stock five years ago."

So, I go back to the day I left and put $1,000 into the stock market.  *This* creates the new time line.  Then, I can go sit on a park bench, age five years, then I could meet up with my wife and kids from my old timeline?