Topic: Wii U in Review (News & Rumor Consolidation)

[Kytim89]

Nintendo could alleviate the Wii U's issues by simply upping the ante of their game development and hitting their core audience with quality titles. As for the 3DS successor, that system is not going anywhere for atleast two years. The Wii U and 3DS successors must be revealed at the same time. Nintendo is trying to close the gap between home console and handheld and the best time to that is right now with the 3DS and Wii U so that the infrastructure exists in the future. They need to get the universal system account going sooner  rather than later.

[BranDonk Kong]

Nintendo has about 26-31% market share in this new gen and people want them to introduce new hardware?

What? When you consider that up until 6 months ago they had 100% of the market share of this generation, that's a pretty pitiful statistic.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Nintendo could alleviate the Wii U's issues by simply upping the ante of their game development and hitting their core audience with quality titles. As for the 3DS successor, that system is not going anywhere for atleast two years. The Wii U and 3DS successors must be revealed at the same time. Nintendo is trying to close the gap between home console and handheld and the best time to that is right now with the 3DS and Wii U so that the infrastructure exists in the future. They need to get the universal system account going sooner  rather than later.

Ideally they would announce both end of 2015 and launch them both in 2016.

but upping the ante of their game development? I'm not sure what that means. Did you mean upping the amount of their games in development? or raising the stakes on the types of games they develop (genres & IPs)?

Boosting production at this late stage in the game wouldn't bear fruit till maybe 2 years from now.
changing the types of games they are making would probably take just as long if not longer.

But if they got started now, the successor systems should have an awesome launch.

[Kytim89]

Nintendo could alleviate the Wii U's issues by simply upping the ante of their game development and hitting their core audience with quality titles. As for the 3DS successor, that system is not going anywhere for atleast two years. The Wii U and 3DS successors must be revealed at the same time. Nintendo is trying to close the gap between home console and handheld and the best time to that is right now with the 3DS and Wii U so that the infrastructure exists in the future. They need to get the universal system account going sooner  rather than later.

Ideally they would announce both end of 2015 and launch them both in 2016.

but upping the ante of their game development? I'm not sure what that means. Did you mean upping the amount of their games in development? or raising the stakes on the types of games they develop (genres & IPs)?

Boosting production at this late stage in the game wouldn't bear fruit till maybe 2 years from now.
changing the types of games they are making would probably take just as long if not longer.

But if they got started now, the successor systems should have an awesome launch.

There is no doubt that Nintendo has accelerated their plans for their next consoles. However, it would cost them too much money to replace what they have right now. As for Nintendo upping the ante in their games, Nintendo needs to bring back all of their dormant franchises to the Wii U, which would include Metroid. The systems needs games and with the new Call of Duty looking less likely for the Wii U they need a hell of lot more than what they are churning out now, and no casual title is going to push systems.

Nintendo could build bridges for their next systems by extending olive branches in the present. They could money hat Rockstar to make a remake of Max Payne that is exclusive to the Wii U. Or they could do a Spec Ops sequel for the Wii U. They could bribe Metal Gear Reveangance 2 onto the Wii U. The potential is limitless and with the industry as cash strapped as it is having a five billion dollar war chest is a blessing one could use to their advantage.

[Stratos]

They could always work with High Voltage to bring a Conduit and whatever that Left-4-Dead clone they were working on was called. Their games were nice from a technical level but they need a creative spark that Nintendo is know to give to to 2nd/3rd parties.


I think we need to see a revival of the old partnerships Nintendo had going in the N64/GC days. They seem to have some good relations going with Capcom and Sega. They should turn that up. but also find some smaller studios they can guide along like they did with Silicone Knights, Factor 5 and Rare.


Monster Hunter and Dragon Quest are the big Japanese franchises. If they could get them onto the Wii U exclusively that would be a huge boon to their cause. Dragon Quest 11 and Monster Hunter 5 exclusive to Wii U? More likely a good timing for the next system as I am sure both will not be out until 2016 at the earliest.

[BlackNMild2k1]

Nintendo should be all over nurturing High Voltage just for the exclusive content.
Subsidize their cost a little, have a few exclusive FPS style games, westernized games and/or older themed games.

I'm still waiting for that monster game they were working on. It sounded good from what was originally shown. too bad The Conduit didn't do better and allow them to finish it in a timely manner.

[Stratos]

All the reports show that it is still coming...eventually. They just have to pay for the production themselves through licensed projects. So it is slow and steady.

[Ceric]

Dragon Quest and MonHun are exclusive at the moment.

[Stratos]

For 3DS. Imagine channeling that interest onto the Wii U.

[smallsharkbigbite]

Who said anything about dropping the 3DS? I said movie it down into the budget hardware category. It's successor would fill the higher end market need that the Vita is currently hoping to fill.

I just don't get this.  3DS is already budget and Vita is doing terribly because the market that wants high end console games buy a console.  3rd tier just doesn't work in consoles, nobody has run two consoles simultaneously. 

and I disagree on the Wii U launching a year sooner. I think that extra year could have made all the difference. It would have launched on the tail end of the faded Wii glory days instead of a full year after the last handful of dirt was thrown on it's grave. It might have reignited a little hype instead of trying to resuscitate a dead horse. That extra year could have made a huge difference, especially if EA was on board and all other 3rd parties that seemed enthusiastic before launch flop.

EA pulled out before sales tanked because of the failed networking deal.  Same thing happens a year earlier, EA is pulling out.  Nintendo is going on it's 3rd straight year of operating loss.  Wii momentum failed three years ago, so you'd have to release 2 years earlier than it came out to try to capitalize on the Wii market.  But I still see the same failure there as people who were interested in motion controls aren't intrigued by the Wii U tablet. 

[BlackNMild2k1]

Well, if Nintendo was gonna play the interim console, power wise, it would have been wise of them to launch early and take advantage of all the dev that would love to work on something even marginally more powerful than the PS360. it would have been 2 years of potential games and now plenty of devs with familiarity, not to mention the install base that might have grown and the interest that might have held had it launch only just 1 year earlier than it did. Maybe Metal Gear would have made it, and all those other games that "Wii just wasn't powerful enough" for.
It's all a game of what if's at this point, but I think things could have been very different had Nintendo not sat on their asses while the Wii faded into casual obscurity and launched, more or less, the same Wii U console we have now back in 2011 instead of 2012 (launching in 2010 would have been even better. jumping on the iPad train while it was still young.)
As far as EA jumping ship... I'm sure it would have been different if the PS4/XBO weren't right around the corner and EA knew that Wii U was underpowered compared to what those 2 were packing, so they were willing to make that power play. remember, it's a Game of Thrones, and Nintendo wasn't willing to play, so eventually the others have to choose sides that will position them best in the future. Timing is everything and Nintendo has been a day late and a dollar short for almost 2 decades. now

[Adrock]

If Nintendo released Wii U earlier than they did, I would be surprised if it even turned on considering what a mess it was at launch.

The only way that interim console idea works is if the successor of Wii U isn't a colossal fucky mess out of the box. An operating system that takes significantly less than 20 seconds to switch applications is a given. However, if it doesn't have universal voice chat day one, Nintendo shouldn't even bother launching the damn thing until it does.

[smallsharkbigbite]

As far as EA jumping ship...

 

EA was pretty much jumped ship already.  I think they made Madden for the Wii and that was about it at that point.  EA games have never sold as well on Nintendo consoles as Sony/Microsoft.  EA has been in constant financial pressure to improve.  Cutting Nintendo actually worked out really well with their financial plans.  I just don't see any way the launch Wii U sells more EA games than the mature PS3/Xbox360 market.  I still think the only reason that Wii U got any EA games was because they believed Origin was going to run Wii U online network and by the time they realized it wasn't the games were too far along to just cancel. 

[Ian Sane]

I'd say that the only reason to replace the 3DS at this point in time is if it's the console-handheld hybrid idea that replaces both the 3DS and the Wii U.  Since I'm in favour of replacing the Wii U at any time it's really just a matter of how long they stick with the 3DS.  I think giving it at least four years would make sense.

The Wii U in 2010, assuming Nintendo does a much better job with it, would probably have been a successful idea.  The Wii even gets four years which is the same amount the Xbox got.

With the Wii U I don't think losing money over the years is the big concern.  What Nintendo is losing is cultural relevence.  The longer they stick with a bomb the more damage it does to their reputation and my concern is that if they wait too long no one will care if they ever release another console or not.  Wait longer and NO third party will support it at all and the general public will pay no attention to it when it launches because they'll associate Nintendo with unsupported hardware, which the non-existent third party support will confirm.  I'm more concerned with losing the people that don't own a Wii U then those that do.  And the thing is I don't think the existing Wii U owners will be that affected.  They'll be mad but I'd guess that most Wii U owners are the most die-hard Nintendo fans.  If you own a Wii U and you're thrilled with it, then you'll stick with Nintendo through damn near anything.  I seriously doubt that turning off Wii U owners is much of a concern.  I would consider cultural and market irrelevence to be a much bigger concern.

[BlackNMild2k1]

I would LOVE if that hybrid idea came to life, even more so if it was my Hybrid idea.
I could be a true 3rd pillar with room for expansion.

But I doubt Nintendo sees it quite the same way I do.

[Adrock]

I don't really think Nintendo is anywhere near needing to worry about cultural irrelevance. 3DS is doing well and everyone knows their properties. Sticking with Wii U for the foreseeable future isn't going to hurt Nintendo because Wii U itself isn't Nintendo's problem. Nothing changes until they do a complete 180 on all their fucky policies and decisions. Nintendo can solider on with Wii U (though maybe not as long as they'd prefer), but they have to start now with how they conduct business with other companies. It's so weird that they think their relationships are even remotely healthy or acceptable.

[NWR_insanolord]

The worst thing Nintendo could do is rush a new console to the market without fixing the deeper problems and have that bomb just like the Wii U. They can't wait too long, but they need to take enough time to make sure they get it right. As Adrock said, the 3DS more than keeps Nintendo relevant, and even with just Nintendo's support the Wii U will get decent exposure, if not sales, in the console market.

[BlackNMild2k1]

If only we could be a fly on the wall of Nintendo's meeting... and have everything they say magically translated into English.

I know there is a lot going on behind the scenes (or so I hope) that we just don't know about.
But I would love to see the thought/debate/discussion process to which Nintendo comes to their decisions.

They have to be aware of what's going on and not truly be in a bubble. They have to have some sort of plan that just didn't work out as they planned and not truly just burying their head in the sand followed with comments like "we are not competing w/ X & Y console....." & "we are not concerned with what our competition are doing....".

Surely they have been trying to develop some game changer tech that just hasn't quite panned out yet and is putting the master plan on hold, forcing them to push out the incomplete picture of a product with compromises made to compensate for the planned feature.

I can only assume they are aware of what the industry players think of them and their tactics, and they are aware of how the other manufacturers do business that keeps the industry turning. So I can also assume that they are actively trying to find a middle ground between what every thinks they are and who they are trying to be.

I can only assume they are fully aware of the short comings of their outdated policies and practices and are always trying to find ways to update their ways without losing who they see themselves to be in the process.

[Ian Sane]

The worst thing Nintendo could do is rush a new console to the market without fixing the deeper problems and have that bomb just like the Wii U. They can't wait too long, but they need to take enough time to make sure they get it right. As Adrock said, the 3DS more than keeps Nintendo relevant, and even with just Nintendo's support the Wii U will get decent exposure, if not sales, in the console market.

With anything I ever suggest Nintendo do you can add "... and not **** it up" to the end.  The Wii U should be replaced with what the Wii U SHOULD have been.  With what a videogame console released in 2015 or 2016 or whatever year is expected to be.  Specs, price, online implementation, controller, marketing strategy, OS, account system, third party policies - all should be up to par.  And of course the games have to be there and with the proper resources allocated to them to have an acceptable release schedule while still offering a good product.

Obviously if Nintendo just rush released a Wii U 2 with all their assinine practices still in place it would be a huge disaster.  I think we're all hoping that the Wii U is the big Nintendo wake up call where they recognize all the stupid bullshit they've been over the last several generations.

Of course if Nintendo keeps their heads up their asses what difference does it make if the Wii U successor comes out in six months or 10 years from now?  Nintendo as-is will not make a console that people will want to buy.  They've gone so far off the path that if they were going from LA to New York they would currently be in Argentina.  Maybe that's a different topic: how many more console flops can Nintendo survive without making fundamental changes to their policies and corporate culture?  I think the time for change is clearly now but that doesn't mean Nintendo will actually figure that out or will actually act on it.

[Adrock]

I can only assume they are aware of what the industry players think of them and their tactics, and they are aware of how the other manufacturers do business that keeps the industry turning. So I can also assume that they are actively trying to find a middle ground between what every thinks they are and who they are trying to be.

I think that's precisely why Nintendo goes against the grain. Sony and Microsoft may look great to consumers and third parties, but they're playing a losing hand. Nintendo doesn't believe that business model is sustainable and I'm inclined to agree with them. That bubble is bound to burst. Nintendo's problem is that they have no filter. They don't look at the competition and pick the best parts. Nintendo just decided everything both competitors do is wrong. That's why they end up with things like Friend Codes and a Basic Set with 8 GB of solid state memory. It would be extremely beneficial for them to accept and admit the fact that other companies also have good ideas sometimes.

With anything I ever suggest Nintendo do you can add "... and not **** it up" to the end.

This applies to literally everything, not just Nintendo.

[NWR_insanolord]

Small point, but the Wii U 8 GB basic set doesn't look so bad when you compare it to Microsoft's entry level 360, which has 4 GB of flash memory, and also doesn't support USB drives (over 16 GB) like the Wii U does.

[Oblivion]

It's not a point at all, considering that Xbox is $200.

[Spak-Spang]

The problem for Nintendo is, that they are making the wrong decisions to meet the middle ground, and they have been quite foolish with HD graphics.  Truthfully, Nintendo would not be in the same type of problem, IF they were able to get the games created in the first 2 years of the Wii U out in one year. 

Nintendo should have been better prepared to launch games…and also be prepared to invest and provide the gamers with a variety of experiences for their platforms.  They don't have to risk things with new IPs…but use the IPs they have well. 

IPs and known characters are great…especially Nintendo's because they can be fit into almost any genre…but Nintendo is too careful with them.  I loved Mario Strikers for the Wii, because it presented the Mario crew in a more rough and cool fashion.  Imagine that art style with a Mario Paintball game.  It could be Nintendo's online multiplayer game. 

Nintendo needs to stop being safe, and take risks.

But further, I agree Nintendo shouldn't shoot for the moon in specs for consoles, but they shouldn't also look for the next big gimmick.  It was like Nintendo saw the gimmick helped the Wii sell, and decided this next gimmick would sell the Wii U…after all it worked for the DS.  However, some gimmicks catch on and others don't.

Nintendo used to be a company about refinement.  I feel the SNES was a refinement and perfecting of a 2D console and a 2D controller.  The N64 was in innovation console and the Gamecube was the refinement.  That Gamecube controller was an amazing controller, and although some games suffered for the controller, the vast majority were awesome with it.  Again the refinements were never about pushing the graphical or spec limits, but doing enough, and perfecting the experience.

However, Nintendo broke their own cycle with the Wii U.  There was no refinement of motion control.  No true refinement of online…just a new gimmick, and a few tweaks to the online structure. 

Furthermore, Nintendo didn't take risks indeed to meet or surpass what the competition did better than them.  Nintendo knew people hated Friend Codes, no universal voice chat, and many other standards….but Nintendo was too afraid of their family image…well guess what…nobody was truly worried about that.  And gamers would have embraced you more if you came to the table with more for them.  Nintendo needs to look at the industry and ask the hard questions….what ask the ways that Nintendo's uniqueness destroys our opportunities, and where does our uniqueness raise our opportunities?

The Blue Ocean strategy wasn't a bad strategy at all, but it could not be the only strategy.  It should have been an additional strategy. 

I do believe Nintendo is a crucial place in their history.  They have been declining for 2 generations, and then had a huge hit with the Wii….and the buzz for Nintendo was infectious, but then the Wii U has squashed that buzz, and the Wii is looking like a fluke now.  If Nintendo can not repair their relationships with 3rd parties, and can't revive their image as a home console next generation, I don't think Nintendo will have a console market in the future.   And the portable market is going to be harder and harder to compete in with Smart Phones, Tablets, and other devices demanding our time. 

[Soren]

My 258GB Basic Set is doing just fine.

However, Nintendo broke their own cycle with the Wii U.  There was no refinement of motion control.  No true refinement of online…just a new gimmick, and a few tweaks to the online structure. 

I'm pretty sure Nintendo refined the home console online experience from Wii to Wii U. Starting with an actual social community aspect (Miiverse vs. ?), down to the online store (Wii Shop Channel to eShop) and maybe even the online multiplayer (we'll see with MK8 and Smash Bros).
Maybe the problem lies with people expecting Nintendo's home console to refine online the way the SNES refined 2D controls.

Nintendo needs to stop being safe, and take risks.

You mean releasing a console with a second screen inside the controller is not risky enough? What about taking a shot publishing a new IP from a 3rd party developer? Or hey, what about bankrolling a game nobody else wanted?

[BlackNMild2k1]

Nintendo may take risk, but a lot of the time they only dab their toes in the water and are never willing to just dive in.

Like the Wii, the risk was a motion controller, but they only dabbed their toes by making a GC+ instead a HDlite machine and didn't include the M+ from the get go.

The Gamepad was a risk, but they didn't take the concept far enough to sell the idea entirely.
multiple pad support from the onset, multi-touch, semi-independence(?) & more features.

But the Wii U should have been the refinement of the Wiimote+, maybe adding a camera and losing the cord between it and the nunchuck. I think I had a perfectly plausible idea in the Wiimote 2.0 design I posted here some years ago, and there was more that could have been done with the concept, even if they also introduced the Gamepad into mix.